The Kevin Sheehan Show - Ovechkin's Record Setter!

Episode Date: April 7, 2025

Kevin opened with Alex Ovechkin's record-setting goal yesterday passing Wayne Gretsky as the NHL's all-time goal scorer. Some Skins' news, Final 4 and Championship game thoughts along with two "Smell Test" picks in the opening segment as well. Al Koken/Monumental Sports jumped on to talk about Ovi's 895th goal yesterday in New York. Jimmy Patsos joined Kevin to talk Houston-Florida and a lot more.  Go to https://zbiotics.com/SHEEHAN and use SHEEHAN at checkout for 15% off any first time orders of ZBiotics probiotics.Try hims.com/SHEEHAN for your personalized hair loss treatment options.  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheyenne Show. Here's Kevin. Send in Wilson on the flank. Cross-Eight Sovetskin. Fires!

The chasing days are done. Alex Ovechkin is the greatest goal scorer in the history of the NHL. An all-time DC sports individual record-setting moment. A perfect call by Joe Beninati with. Craig Lachlan by his side on monumental sports. Alex Ovechkin, number 895, he becomes the all-time NHL goal score. The show's presenting sponsor, as always, is Windonation. If you need new windows, my recommendation is call Windonation, 86690 Nation,

or go to Windonation.com. Mention my name, they'll take really good care of you. Al Koken will be with me in the next segment. He was there, of course, yesterday working on the broadcast with Joe B and Craig Lachlan. Al Koken, next segment with much more on number 895. Jimmy Patsos, after that, on the national title game tonight between Houston and Florida. His thoughts on the Maryland situation as well. I've got two smell test picks coming up before the end of this opening segment.

hit on Houston Saturday night pushed on the total, but 13, 9, and 2 now overall for the NCAA tournament. I will have thoughts on the two final four games, the championship game, and two smell test picks. Coming up shortly. Alex Ovechkin, the greatest goal scorer in the history of the NHL. Alex Ovechkin, the greatest team sport player in the history of our city. He was that before yesterday. He's, of course, still that today. I would say that Daryl Green is probably next. If we consider just players from the last 50 or so years, if we go way back 100 years, and we're going to include Walter Johnson and Sammy Baugh, there might be a debate as to who number one is between Walter Johnson and Dovechkin, specifically, definitely a debate on number two. I'll save that part of the conversation for tomorrow with Tom. Meantime, to be honest with you, the moment hit me more than I thought it would.

Friday night was so tense as he scored 893 and then tied Gretzky with goal 894. So many chances, you know, so much drama in that game as he got to 894 and had an opportunity to break the record with what would have been a hat trick at home. You know, he was pulled from the game by Spencer Carberry, per OV's wishes, it was reported on and confirmed, when Chicago pulled the goalie at the end of that game with the scored four to three. He did not want to break Gretzky's mark with an empty netter. Instead, Ryan Leonard scored his first NHL goal to make it five to three, and then Chicago put the goaltender back in, and OV went back in. and had another chance or two.

Can you imagine if he had done it on Friday night? That crowd sounded incredible on Friday night, at least through the television. But he ties Gretzky at home on Friday night, and then seven minutes and 26 seconds into the second period. He gets $8.95 on a power play. History made, perfect setup by Tom Wilson. Ovechkin fires one past a goalie that he,

he had never scored on. History will record the goal at seven minutes and 26 seconds of the second period, assisted by Wilson and Dylan Strom. The goaltender, Ilya Sorokin, becomes the 183rd goaltender, Ovechkin has scored against. It happened on the road, but it didn't sound like it. USB arena in Elmont, New York, in front of Islander fans, yes, but plenty of Caps fans who made the trip as well. I've heard it described anywhere from 40% to 60% caps fans. We'll ask Al about that, but those Islander fans in attendance were there to witness history, and they embraced the moment appropriately. It was so memorable, a moment that most hockey people said for many, many years would never happen. When Gretzky passed Gordy Howell, they said this was an unbreakable

record, but not so. Ovechkin's 325th power play goal, also a record, ends up setting the record for goals. Scored, a roaring crowd when it went through, chance of OV, OV, OV, and then, you know, a couple of really incredible moments or memorable moments after the goal. You know, we had this ceremonial stuff, which lasted, you know, 20, 25 minutes. But I thought, the moments immediately following the goal, first watching him belly flop on the ice. He has a childlike quality to him. I saw that T.J. Oshy had said looked a little bit like some of those fountain leaps back in 2018, but watching him congratulated by everybody on his own team,

and then the entire Islanders team lined up as if it were the end of a playoff series. such a great tradition in hockey after a playoff series, but you got that after the record setter yesterday. So many moments during that 25 to whatever, you know, however long it took after the game, I thought that the video screen messages were interesting, including the one from his mother, which was in Russian, of course.

And I thought that at least I, thought of it this way. You know, there's been a lot of conversation over the years about, you know, how hockey would, you know, handle a Russian breaking the great Gretzky, the most popular player in the history of the game, Wayne Gretzky's goal scoring mark. You know, especially after the, you know, the discussions about the relationship between Ovechkin and Putin, but I I thought one of the things that was really cool about the moment is that, you know, any thought of, you know, jingoism or patriotism, hardcore, that really applies to international events. You know, the Olympics, international events like they had during the season this year with the Four Nations.

He's just a player, you know, and he's a great one, and he is a well-liked and popular player. And so the appreciation for the sport, the moment, the player, that took center stage over anything else. Not that I was expecting anything else. I think it's been made very clear in recent months that this would be the reaction when he broke the record. But I guess it's just a reminder that sports in so many ways is such an – it's the equalizer. You know, in terms of, you know, merit, number one. But number two, when it comes to these games, they're incredible diversions. Sports are great diversions from so much in the real world, including today's stock market,

which, as I am recording this, has not closed yet. So we'll see where we go. But anyway, you know, as his mother gave that message in Russian, it just reminded me of that. But an incredible day, an incredible player, all time for our town, no doubt, even though the sport itself in our town has always, you know, has always been, you know, not second or third fiddle, sometimes fourth fiddle to the sports that came before it. In more recent years, certainly much higher up on the list. But it's never been in terms of the mass following what our football team has been. but he stands alone in terms of the greatest team sport athletes, the greatest team sport players in the history of D.C.

A quick shout out to one of our sponsors, Zbiotics. They have a product called Pre-Alcohol that allows you to go out, have a few drinks, and then wake up feeling great the next day. Zbiotics.com slash Sheen to learn more and save 15% off your first order. There was some football team news today. Washington added longtime NFL receiver and recent position coach in Miami, Wes Welker, to the staff. His role is going to be as a personnel analyst.

He'll be working with both the personnel staff and the coaching staff. The connections are that Welker and Cliff Kingsbury were college teammates at Texas Tech. and Welker and Adam Peters, their paths crossed in New England, Denver, and San Francisco. Ben wrote today on Twitter, Ben Standing, that Welker was Debo Samuel's wide receiver coach for his first three years in San Francisco, and Welker was the one who stayed on top of Debo's training when weight became an issue. Wes Welker added to Washington's. staff. All right, some basketball talk and then a couple of smell test picks to finish up this opening segment. First of all, both final four games were great. I mean, the first game between

Florida and Auburn, I mean, really two words describe that game, and that would be Walter Clayton, three words, Walter Clayton Jr. What a performance, 34 points for Clayton Jr. In back-to-back games, Clayton Jr. went for 30 in the Elite 8 win over Texas Tech, and then 34 in the Final Four win over Auburn. It's the first time that a player in the Elite 8 and Final 4 has gone for 30 or more consecutively since Larry Bird did it in 1979. I think Walter Clayton, Jr. is a legitimate top 10 pick. Worst case, maybe top five by the time we get to the draft, even though every mock draft has him towards, you know, the end of the first round. I love his size, his athleticism, but what I really love about him is he's got that super quick release on his jump shot,

which is deadly. It is Curry-esque in terms of the release. I'm not putting him in Curry's class. Okay, I'm not. You know, I said, I think, last week, there's a little bit of Damian Lillard in him. There's a little bit of Steph Curry in him. I just look at him and I think this is a guy at the next level, if he's got his head together, that is going to score a lot of points at the NBA level. But that was a very good game.

You know, before this tournament started, I thought that Duke was the best team, and I thought Florida and Houston were right there. And I thought there was separation, those three teams and everybody else. As the tournament went along, I became even more enamored with Houston and thought that Houston was the best team. And last week picked them to beat Duke and then win on Monday night against Florida, which I will hear momentarily. But Florida is one hell of a team.

They are deep. They've got a superstar player. They are well-coached. Auburn, I felt like towards the end of the season was floundering a little bit. They got it together during the tournament. but it was too much of Walter Clayton Jr. Martin and Howe off the bench, man, he was outstanding as well. So Florida, in the national championship game to face Houston, and that was the game of the two on Saturday night. What a basketball game. I'll keep it short here, but I think Houston had more to do with them winning the game than Duke did losing the game.

Did Duke make mistakes at the end of the game that cost them a nine-point lead over the final two minutes? Yes, they did. Deadly mistakes. But I thought it was Houston's 40 minutes of defense, of offensive rebounding that just essentially wore Duke down. That's what I thought could happen. I thought Houston had the men in the game more so than college players, you know, players that had been around a while, the relentless defense in offensive rebounding and trapping and double teaming, that is, you know, the hallmark of a Kelvin Sampson team. They never give up, never give up.

64 to 55 with just over two minutes to go, and it wasn't over. Now, personally, in the moment, I thought it was over, and Duke really impressed the hell out of me in this game. I thought they were outstanding defensively. Both teams really struggled at times to get good looks, even though they knocked him down. But it seemed like everything was contested. The big difference in this game was Houston's rebounding. They outrebounded Duke 42 to 31. They had 18 offensive rebounds. And that's been the story of Houston. By the way, Florida as well to a certain degree. But 18 offensive rebounds. They had four offensive rebounds, two steals, and a block shot in the final two minutes of that game.

That, or final three and a half minutes of that game, that was just their relentless athleticism and defensive personality and aggressiveness coming through and wearing Duke down. Duke looked exhausted. By the way, Houston was tested, and they expended a ton of energy. But you even saw it on Cooper Flagg's final shot, pulling the string a bit short, fading away. They were tired at the end. Proctor missing the free throw. Duke struggling and turning it over on an inbound pass. I thought it was more about Houston than Duke, but Duke contributed.

And there were moments in this game that were true. troubling from a coaching standpoint. First of all, they had a 14-point lead with, you know, 10, 9 minutes to go, whatever it was. They had a 9-point lead with just over 2 minutes to go. You know, they had that technical call on Houston that seemed to be a moment. But really, I thought there were a couple of moments in the final minute 14. First of all, after that free throw after the technical foul on Tuggler for reaching out of bounds on a pressure, full court. Duke had it up six with the ball, and Houston chose not to foul, which was the right move. And they played good defense, and you could tell that Duke was tiring offensively.

And Tugler got a block shot on a Kineppel drive, and they came down and they knocked down a three. His flag sort of flailing defensively went by the head fake, sharp knocked down the three. it's down to 67-64. Then a big mistake, man, the in-bounds play. You got to have a play called. It can't be Operation Get Open, especially after a timeout. Duke had time to rest. James had the entire baseline to move,

and they didn't have a play to get the ball in-bounds to a free-throw shooter. I never understand that. It happens all the time. At the NBA level, as much as at the college, level. You're up three. The other team's got a foul. You've got to get the ball in bounds against pressure. And by the way, not just get it in bounds, get it in bounds to a really good free throw shooter. There are lots of ways to do it. He had the whole baseline. You could have jumped a player out of bounds, thrown it to him and thrown it in. They had no plan to get the ball in. It was

turned over. They backed out to shoot a three missed it, but there they were. Offensive rebound dunk and all of a sudden it's 67, 66. And then by the way, Duke threw a, it into the corner into Canuple and he got trapped. You never throw the ball into the corner where they're trapping because you got the sideline and the baseline. Now he made a good play. He was able to get the ball to the middle of the floor to Proctor and they fouled Proctor. And Proctor was a 68% free throw shooter and that's where the controversy came in.

He missed that free throw and Cooper Flag got called for the foul over top of Joanne Roberts. I thought it was tickey tack. You don't call that there. However, for those that are saying Duke got screwed with that call, I think it actually benefited them. Joanne Roberts is a 63% free-throw shooter. At times in his career, he's been a horrendous free-throw shooter. 63% by the way for his career from the free-throw line is 12% better than he shot last year, 51.1%. He shot 50% in his second year.

52% in his freshman year. He did shoot 68% in his third year, but he was terrible last year from the line. 63% isn't very good, and it was one-in-one. I mean, I think if Duke's got to play defense after a rebound, I don't think they get a stop. They certainly don't get a rebound at that point. If Houston misses, sending Juan Roberts to the free-throw line in that spot with a one-and-one may have been Duke's best chance to win, but he knocked down both.

of them. Pressure free throws. And then Duke, you know, after they missed, they went to Cooper Flag. Flag faded away, looked tired, pulled the string on it, good defense. Then after the two free throws by Cryer, Duke had one last chance. I don't know why you throw it the length of the court with 3.7 seconds left. That is a 50-50 situation in terms of who's going to come down with the ball. You have time to throw it into the back court. Houston has a history of not out three, I think they could have gotten something much better. But really, really compelling watch, I thought, the Houston comeback against Duke. And I was thrilled because I picked Houston.

I had them plus the five and a half. The game ended up falling right on the 137 number. All right, let me give out two smell test picks and a pick for tonight with a final score. So there are two plays tonight. The public is on Florida, giving the one and a half. So Houston plus one and a half. And the total's at 141, and the public is pounding the over right now. So I'll take the under 141. So Houston plus one and a half. I actually thought the line might go off at, you know, something like Pickham. So I was a bit surprised really to see Florida.

slightly favored, which is why I'm a little bit surprised that I'm giving out Houston, but there is more public action on Florida than Houston, and there's some sharp action on Houston as well. That could change before tip off, but I'm giving it out now. A lot of this action for the game tonight will come in after I record this podcast. I doubt the action's going to change on the over. I think the public will love the over. They do right now. I think they'll stick with it. The number is 141, so I'll go under 141.

Houston plus 1 and a half, under 141. 13, 9 and 2, so even if I lose both of these, I'm guaranteed a winner, but let's win both of these and end up 15, 9 and 2. I like a game that is hard fought.

We may see two tired teams tonight after the Saturday games, both of them, that were in, you know, absolute knockdown dragouts, especially Houston, and here we are 48 hours later. But I like Houston something like 68 to 63, kind of like the score that I predicted for Duke. I think I predicted 6560 for the Duke game. Something like 68, 63, Houston, tight game, hard fought.

Florida's bench, the benches are going to be huge tonight. I think the keys are rebounding and specifically Florida and Houston and the number of offensive rebounds they get, I would bet Houston ends up with more. But whoever ends up with more offensive rebounds, and I think probably more made threes. Like the team that knocks down, you know, one or two more threes in this game probably escapes with the win.

Should be a great title game. I think ultimately Houston and Duke were the two best teams, but Florida's right there. I mean, they're tremendous. and we're seeing what should be a great championship game. All right, when we come back, Al Koken, who was on Long Island yesterday for OV's record-setting goal. We'll get to him after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey, guys, if you've lost your hair, it doesn't mean that you can't find it again.

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details, and important safety information. We're going to try to force it until if he's open. Here is Obatchkins. We came into the show with Joe B. in Locker's hometown television call on Monumental. What you just heard was the national call on TNT. I'll leave you heading out. of today's show with the local radio call described by John Walton. This segment of the show is brought to you by Window Nation. Al Koken's going to join us here shortly.

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Joining me right now is long-time sportscaster, sports broadcaster, capitals, expert analyst. I don't know. I mean, we've talked about this before. You've had so many different gigs over the years since coming to D.C. in the mid to late 1970s from the great town of St. Louis. By the way, Tommy and I talked about St. Louis for about 30 minutes on a podcast recently, and it's just coming to my recollection that I don't think I mentioned your name. And I should have.

You're the only person we really know from St. Louis. And I spent a good deal of time with your partner the other night at Capitol One Arena talking about my praise for the podcast. And yet, you dismiss me like that. You know what it was? It was a conversation about comedians. There are a lot of comedians who are from St. Louis. and somehow it started with Tommy saying something about St. Louis and entertainers,

and I said, speaking of entertainers, Cedric, the entertainer is from St. Louis, and then we went through the list. And I ended up... Nicky Glaser, of course. Yeah. And I ended up asking Tommy if he knew what toasted ravioli was. He had no clue. But of course you do.

That's a St. Louis special to. Great. Great special. By the while, I'll give you another little interesting little sideline. Nelly and I went to the exact same high school, University of City High School. Really? It's a few years apart. You big Nelly?

It's a few years apart. Big Nelly fan? Big Nelly fan. And the lunatics, the same lunatics, Nell and the same lunatics. Awesome. Yeah, the list included several people from the office, Tommy's favorite show and my all-time favorite show. Nikki Glazer is from St. Louis. She's very funny.

Red Fox is from St. Louis. I'm forgetting somebody else that is a big name. Diller is from St. Louis. I didn't know that. Yes, from Webster Grove, Missouri, where my dad grew up. John Goodman is from St. Louis. And then there's some favorite, you know, all-time actors from St. Louis, too, including John Hamm. I think John Hamm is from St. Louis.

He's definitely from St. Louis. In fact, he was, speaking of the office, Ellie Kempner, he was, L. Kempner's one of his teachers, one of her teachers at John Burroughs High School. Ellie Kemper, Jenna Fisher, and Phyllis are all, I forget Phyllis's last name in real life, are all from St. Louis. How about that? Look at us.

How about that? Yeah. How about that? And speaking of my high school at one time, Tennessee Williams actually attended my high school again, just a few years apart. Wow. I mean, what other singers? I'm looking up singers from St. Louis now. Do you remember this song, Backfield in Motion by Mel and Tim? No.

There you go. Mel and Tim from St. Louis. I know you've heard Backfield in Motion. So I didn't know Ike and Tina Turner were from St. Louis. Did you? Yes. Yes. Well, Ike is, if I'm not mistaken, I think Tina, I'm not mistaken, Ike is from St. Louis, and I think Tina was born elsewhere. Okay. Yes. Cizzo's from St. Louis.

And Chuck Barry was born in St. Louis? All right. Yes, sir. Yes. All right. Well, enough about St. Louis, because Alex Ovechkin's not from St. Louis. No. All right.

But he fit right in because he could dock down some toasted ravely over if you wanted. I bet he could. All right. What was it like to be there yesterday? Kevin, it was truly incredible. And I've got to add in not only yesterday, but Friday. Friday night at Capitol One Arena was one of the best events I've ever seen in my life. And it's funny because I know there are a lot of fans that are disappointed that he didn't get to do this at home.

And yet in many regards, there was that celebration, tying the record with Wayne in the house, and then the teammates celebrating him being able to celebrate with the fans. It wasn't like he scored one at home and two yesterday. The fans in Washington who were in that building definitely got a taste of a real true celebration. And I think it was great that the league embraced it the way it was, but I'm telling you, Friday night and yesterday combined two occasions I'll never, ever forget the energy and the atmosphere, and credit to the Islander fans.

And they knew what they were getting, and they knew what they wanted. You saw the ticket prices, right? Those were final four, you know, championship game type of ticket prices. So anybody who was in the building was getting there to see the record. They weren't there to watch the Islanders and Capitals. They were there for one thing and one thing only, and they got what they paid for. You know, as you're talking, you know, just about Friday night, great night to see him tie it. But I was thinking because today on the radio show I mentioned, you know, when they won the Cup in 2018, they won game five in Vegas, Ovechkin on the road for 895.

But I'm also thinking about that run in 2018. know they won game six in Pittsburgh, you know, the overtime game winner to finally beat Pittsburgh, but didn't they win game seven in Tampa? Yeah, they won, yeah, they won game six at home, and then game seven in Tampa, and dominated in game seven, came right out of the gate and four nothing or seven. A little out of the water. Yeah. So really, like, the most memorable franchise moments of all time, actually, you've all happened on the road with the exception of, 894 on Friday night.

That's exactly right, and he got, you know, 800 passing cord out in Chicago against the Black Cogs, ironically, then, you know, tying the record against the Black Cogs but got it done at home. Yeah, you're absolutely right. It is odd to see because there's been so many bone-crushing defeats at all. Right. That you would like to have one of these spectacular moments, bring a cup under the ice, bring, you know, bring the commissioner down to, and Wayne down to welcome you to be

the all-time leading goals scurred. Like that at home. But yeah, you're right. So many of these big moments have happened on the road with this thing. What is the biggest game seven win at home? Flyers? Ooh. I would think one of the Flyers wins and then I think what would kind of come into the realm of that.

I just know that one of the early, that early breakthrough against the Flyers. Yeah, exactly. You know, the Dale Hunter goal happened at home, I think, was one of those things that the franchise, that's when you could really kind of see the franchise turning the corner because they had only just recently started to get into playoffs and had had no success. And that was the first time you could actually kind of see them as like, hey, now this is not only a team that can make it, that there's a team that can maybe do some damage once they're in there. That Dale Hunter goal, I think, was a real seminal moment and at least giving you a sense that this is a different

type of group moving ahead. And then, you know, the Bruce Boudro teams and things like that It's been interesting because, as you know, the thing I've always admired about the capitals, and it's been, you know, kind of laughable in some regards, but they've been there. With the exception of a couple of years, they're at least the team that gets in the playoffs. Now, do they disappoint you more times than not? Absolutely. There's one of our favorite talk show hosts call them choking dogs more often than, but, yes, they're not. But I'm glad they were the first of the Washington teams to break through, because at least year in and year out for the most part,

they've at least given you the chance to believe in the playoffs where the football team can make it and then disappear, the basketball team can make it and then disappear. Same with the baseball team, great championship. They haven't been heard from since. The capitals at least have been there, and I think that's something that should have been applauded, and I'm glad they finally got rewarded for it in 2018.

Well, let me jump ahead to a question that I was going to ask you, since we're talking about the team results right now, What would yesterday have been like had 2018 never happened? I still think it would have been special because the league was embracing it and Wayne was embracing it. I think if it had been more of a local story, then it would have had a little bit of a hollow ring to it. Kind of the same way I think this chase has gone on in the midst of an outstanding year. If this was a dismal year, I think we'd be kind of looking at this as a side show. as a one-trick pony situation.

When is he going to get it? You know, because you don't pay attention to the team. The fact that there's been that duality, he's been a major factor in a team that has been outstanding for the most part this entire season. 2018, no doubt, helps. But I really do believe yesterday because of the way Wayne Gretzky approached this and with open arms for a long time. There's no 1972 dolphins in any of this, right?

I mean, the league has embraced it. Wayne in particular is embraced it. I think that yesterday still would have been special because of that, but I think this season combined with that and with the Little Oaksa accent of 2018 just really makes Ovi the great center of attention, and you can see him on one of the pedestals of one of the greats in the game. Yeah, that makes sense to me. I think the big difference is we would still be, you know,

asking the question, will he be able to finally, you know, you know, it shed that 10,000 pound weight off of his shoulders, which he was able to do now, believe it or not, seven years ago. It's crazy. It is crazy. I do think, though, it has helped in the regard that he's been able to stay as consistently good as he's been. I think it would have maybe weighed on him more if it still was if he, listen, he got tired of the questions about this, about when are you going to break it, when are you going to break it. If it was still coupled with when he ever going to win the big one, I just don't know if he still would have had the joy and the energy to do it the way he's done it

since 2018, which is how he's had to do it because, you know, if he's just back down to a 30, 35 goal level, which is still outstanding in the National Hockey League, as opposed to the 40-plus goal level that he is every single year, I think that would have taken a toll on it. So I think 2018 definitely helped him just get back that energy and that drive to continue to do this. So Friday night, he was not on the ice when there was an empty net possibility at four to three to break the record. And I think we have found out subsequent to that that he did not want to be on the ice for an empty netter.

You've already described kind of the scene on Friday night, which sounds like it was about as electric and is fired up as, you know, it would have been for a game seven of a playoff series. So take me through kind of how you saw it happen on the power play, you know, which obviously 325 on the power play now. That continues to increase his record. But just give me your thoughts in that moment because it's not one you can plan for. It's not like an at bat in baseball. It's not like a carry in football. It just, you know, it's abrupt. It happens suddenly. So your reaction in that moment was what? Well, immediately, as soon as you get the power play, the atmosphere in that building changed.

The buzz all of a sudden started. Now, they had to go to commercial, so that dissipated a little bit. But once they got back to play, everybody was on the edge of their seat. I'm looking at it and just waiting and watching. The other thing that was so fascinating to me again, you kind of just touched on a little bit. Everybody knows where he's going to be on the ice for the most part. and you've got to know what's coming, the goaltender, the team he's playing against that. Everybody knows what's coming, and yet he still did it.

That, to me, adds just to the element of just how great he is, because you could design anything you want. There's no scottery board needed. You've got it. You can't let him do that. And yet, they found a way to get him the puck, and it was behind it. It's not usually in that situation where he gets the one-timer, which is kind of like right between where he sets himself up.

You know, like if you're team, the ball right in the middle, that's kind of where he likes it there. He had to reach back for it, and then the wrist shot was just unbelievable to beat a really good goaltender. It was great the rest of the day. So I think that just added to it the fact that A on the power play, but B, sort of from his office, but still found a way to make a difficult shot land. I've heard the crowd described in many different ways yesterday, but I'll let you describe it. Oh, no question about it. It was just every time he touched the puck. It was in the same way the other night in Carolina.

Any time he touched the puck, you could just hear that electricity, that murmur. And one of the funniest things to me was on Friday night after he'd scored the two. And you mentioned he had glorious scoring opportunities to get the hat trick and get it all done. And people were booing Spencer Knight the gold did her making a save, which was so funny because, you know, I mean, the poor kid, he was so happy he didn't give up 895, but he did give up, too, but he made one spectacular save that I thought, you know, this was it. Rock it off his shoulder, made a couple of other really good saves, and every time he made a save, boo-hoo, boo, which I've never heard in my life of a golden-in-bued

for just doing something normally routine. But that's kind of what everybody was invested in. They couldn't wait to get that next one. And any time he touched the fuck, it just felt like, okay, this is going to be it because he's got that magic when he gets that. When he gets that feeling, when he gets that big moment atmosphere, he always seems to deliver. It's just unbelievable to watch. We were going in there thinking, you know, we can get a hat trick. Who thinks that about a hockey player?

It's impossible to get one, let alone three, and yet logic goes out the window when you're talking about this guy, and particularly in these big moments. Yeah, I was talking more about just the split, like how much Caps fans, you know, how many Caps fans made it in there versus Islanders fans? Oh, yesterday? Oh, I would give you a good 30%, maybe higher. It was unbelievable how many Capp fans made it.

It was really phenomenal. But as we talked about earlier, the Islander fans who were in there were looking for this as well. Sure. They wanted to be a part of history as well. So they were really engaged. They were very patient during the ceremony, There was no call, let's get this going.

I think they all wanted to be a part of this scene, and they got what they were looking for. Before you got him, and I watched that interview, did you have kind of a favorite moment from, you know, the ceremony that took place after it? I just loved the way he made sure. Obviously, he was going to thank a lot of people, but he really was all about his teammates. Yeah. And the fact that Nick Baxter was in the house was so special to him. And that, I think, has been a really interesting dynamic. And those guys were so close, but there was also times when, listen, you know,

as Nick joked about, you know, the big thing with Ovis, you've got to remind him every once in while. You're not as open as often as you think you are. And Nick saying that in just, but I can tell you, you know, from my time, cover in this team, there was some time where there was some tension there. Some of it had to do also, too, because Nick was, you know, very defensively responsible. And there was a lot of times when Ovi was chasing out of his own looking to go the other way when, hey, dude, you can come back and help him get the buck defensively before we can go on offense. So, you know, it wasn't always perfect, but there was such a great symmetry between the two. The fire of Alex

of that sort of coolness of Nick Baxter had that perfect combination, and that's why it works so well. The skill set, obviously, but the two different personalities meshing together was really something, and for Alex to really, he even said afterwards, you know, when he saw Nick and new Nick was in the house, it almost brought him to tears, and I thought that was a really special thing that not only did he want to include all of his teammates knowing that they had a great role in this, but that one teammate in particular, Nick. back from, I thought that was really, really special.

The way you described it, I mean, it's like a wide receiver going back to his quarterback. I am open. Throw me the ball. You know, but it leads into something I wanted to ask you, because I had Joe B on radio today. And, you know, he said at one point during his career, not that he would ever say that Ovechkin lacked humility. And by the way, that stood out to me, too, not only in the ceremonial stuff, but in the

interview with you, it was all we, we, we, nothing about I, I, I, I. He was all about everybody that sort of made this possible. But was there a point in his career where it was more about numbers and less about the team? In some regard, yes, because I think he, a lot of times, particularly early in his career, the way a lot of players do kind of define themselves by how many points can I get, how many goals can I score? And it really took a lot of coaching. I think Barry Trotz was the one guy who ultimately got through to him to say you've got to be a more complete player

forever going to make this thing work. And you can also say, well, the team isn't successful if he's not scoring goals. And I think he kind of took that as this is how I can make the team better. But in this sport and in any sport, particularly basketball, as great as Michael Jordan was offensively, he always one of the toughest defensive assignments. Kobe, one of the toughest defense assignments. Those are the guys who kind of separated themselves from just one-note performers, and I think OV had to understand.

And we talk all the time about, oh, he got so many empty-net goals, well, at some point the coaching staff had to trust him enough to say, we're going to put you out there not just to pad your stats, but because we believe you now can prevent somebody from scoring, and the bonus for you for doing that, you get a chance at an empty net. that I think it took a little time also for him to kind of understand this is how I can also get more points and more goals if I do a better job defensively. So it took a little while in his career.

I don't want to say it was a selfish thing as much as it is. Some young guys kind of define themselves on, well, this is what I do best. So this is the only way I can help the team. It took him a while to understand there's other ways you can do it as well. Why is he so good right now, especially when at the end of why, last year in that playoff series and that 4-0 sweep against the Rangers, he looked like he was old in that series? The first half of last year, he looked that way.

And then he got the All-Star break. He came back rejuvenated. He had a fantastic rest of the season. I think the entire team kind of hit a wall a little bit. They had expended so much energy, Kevin. Remember, every game they played last year down the stretch, you had to win. You had to win. You had to get points.

They expended so much energy to get in that I think at some point everybody just kind of hit a wall, unfortunately, at the wrong point. The thing, though, that's always separated, I think him from everybody else is the exuberance that he has for the game itself. And he never, ever seems to go into a game where you can just kind of think he, he kind of floated around tonight. He's always hungry to score, and that hunger has always been there. And because of that, every game he, he's, you know,

he plays, you know, he may not be successful every night, but every game you don't ever see him kind of taking the night off. And I think that has always been something that's carried him. The joy of playing, the fun he has, you know, the first words out of his mouth when I asked him about, you know, what, you know, can you put into words what this means when he tied the record? He said, well, it's fun. And that, I think, has carried over for his entire career. You watch him when he scores, it's a great celebration. When his teammate scores, he's he's even happy than they are. And I think that has been something that you've seen from the very beginning.

I'll never forget his very first game. I mean, he goes on his very first shift in the National Hockey League, he goes chasing behind the net, hits a defenseman from the Columbus Blue Jacket named Marat Cushie, and just absolutely, excuse me, obliterates him. And then, oh, by the way, scores two goals, including one on the one-timer. He basically turns around and tells the Washington fans, this is that. You can see this for the next 20 years.

Unbelievable that he still can do it. The pace that he's on, I mean, had he played all 82, he may have ended up with right around 56 goals, which was his second best year all the way back in 2009. I mean, it's incredible. What about number 900, which is possible? He's got five games left. I don't know if they're going to rest him before the postseason.

But, you know, getting five goals in the final five games would be pretty amazing. that even be ahead of the pace he's on right now. But that could be another unbelievable moment before this season's up or certainly early next year. No question about it. And again, he does have one more year in his contract. So how many does he produce? You would expect at some point the reality would fit in. But as you mentioned, at 39 years old, he's now third in the National Hockey League in goalscored,

with 16 games missing because of a break. broken way. It just doesn't compute logically, but hockey logic goes out the window and you're talking about this guy. All right. So you think he'll come back next year? He's got a contract. I do believe there is going to be some interest because he, earlier on in his career, he did kind of intimate that I know he wants to play one year in the KHL in Russia. So we would think that would be after next year. Okay.

But again, there are, you know, listen, he's not Tom Brady eating avocado ice cream, right? He's eating a footlong subway sub and flaming on Cheetos on the plate. So we get the fact that, you know, that this is not going to be an off-season in a hyperbolic chamber and things like, okay, we get that, a hyperbolic chamber. Yeah. But it still does take a lot to get him, you know, to be able to play. There is wear and tear on that body. And at some point, I don't know, maybe during this off-season at some point he can say to himself, you know what, I've accomplished so much, I just can't physically want to continue to have to do this

to get ready to play hockey again. I don't know. My guess, though, would be because he's having a great time with this group, and this group, you know, needs to play better than they're playing now. But if they make any kind of good playoff run, you know, what's to say he doesn't come back? next year with the idea of, hey, I'm coming back to a team that's got legitimate Stanley Cup hopes, and why not be a part of that again? So I think there's two folds on this. The physicality that this game has taken on him and does he want to go through it again versus the joy he's having playing the game of hockey and playing with now still a very good hockey team.

Talking about the team, and you just refer to it, I mean, it would be great to see them make another run and for him to get a second cup, that would just add to this already incredible legacy. But they've not been playing well. They've lost five of their last seven. A lot of the odds makers, Alan, I've talked about this, actually really don't seem to view the caps as a significant favorite. They're somewhere like the fifth or sixth favorite overall, the second or third in the Eastern Conference. Why do you think that is? Well, I mean, I think lately they, as you said, haven't been playing their best hockey. My question is, how much of this gets stacked up onto they've had nothing to play for for

months now? Right. They've been unchallenged in the Metropolitan Division, unchallenged in the Eastern Conference, and it just kind of just the idea of you go through this season. And every other team seems to be, you know, challenge to either make the playoffs or hold a playoff spot or get into the second seat. They haven't. And I wonder how much of that is just that human nature of, you know,

we just don't have a challenge. So, yeah, it's tough to get up for these games. Now, that being said, they're down to the wire now. I think the fact that this is behind them allows them a really great opportunity to refocus and get themselves ready. Thursday night to me is going to be an interesting barometer. They kind of got embarrassed the other night in Carolina, and then there was a lot of physicality fights afterwards.

They played the hurricanes again at home on Thursday. Let's see a playoff-style performance. Then you'll give me a little better idea. Are you ready for what's coming up in a couple of weeks? Last one, because what's coming up in a couple of weeks, probably a week from Saturday or a week from Sunday, will be game one more likely than not now. It looks like Montreal will be their first-round opponent.

Is that a good matchup for Washington? I kind of look at it. Yes, it is in the sense that Montreal is a team that, you know, like a lot of these teams racing to get in, they're going to be playing their best hockey. But they're also a team without any playoff experience for the most part. The thing that would worry me is if a team like the Rangers snuck themselves in there, I don't like the Ranger team, but I really respect the Ranger goaltender.

And I don't know if Sam Montaubo or Lucas Obesh is that type of guy who can individually steal a series from you the way an Ilya, Igor Schisturkin can for the Rangers. So in that regard, I don't see the goaltending obstacle. Now, anything can happen. One of these guys could stand on their head. We've seen that time and time again. We know what happened 2010. Yarras off a lot.

I'll all that. Yeah. I just think it would be a more beneficial matchup to play a more inexperienced team without the elite-looking goaltender that it would be to say, against the Rangers or somebody like that. Al was there yesterday history for not only the National Hockey League, but certainly for our town in terms of a moment. Thanks for doing this. I appreciate it.

At Real Smoking Al on X on Twitter. Give him a follow. Thanks, Al. Kevin, let's play some golf this summer, all right? Let's try to do it. I think we tried to do it last summer, and I can't remember why we didn't, but we'll do it this summer. You got out always happy to be with you.

Smoking Al-Koken, everybody. Up next, Jimmy Patzos, who will join me. We'll talk college basketball and the Maryland situation right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Guys, personal experience with a product that I want to tell you about, it's Zbiotics and their product called pre-alcohol. Let's face it, after a night of drinks, most at our age anyway, don't bounce back the next day like we used to. You either have that choice the night before of, do I have a drink or two, or do I pass? Because I don't want to feel badly the next day. Well, there's a surefire way to wake up feeling fresh after drinks with friends. It's with pre-alcohol. Zbiotics pre-alcohol was invented by PhD scientists to tackle rough mornings after drinking.

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Zbiotics is backed with 100% money back guarantee. So if you're unsatisfied for any reason, they'll refund your money, no questions asked. Remember to head to Zbiotics.com slash Sheen and use the code Sheehan, S-H-E-E-H-A-N at checkout for 15% off. What a game Saturday night in San Antonio. Both games were exceptional at the end of Houston coming back to beat Duke 70 to 67. They've got Florida tonight in the National Championship game. If you want to bet the national championship game, MyBooky is my recommendation. Go to my bookie.orgie.com. Use my promo code, Kevin D.C. MyBooky will give you a cash bonus on your initial deposit. Right now, Florida, a one and a half point favorite, the total at 141. Plenty of prop bets, prop bets galore. Everything you need for tonight's national championship game you can find at MyBooky. Go to MyBooky.ag and use my promo code, Kevin, D.C.

Joining me right now just back from the Final Four with the championship game ready to take place this evening is my friend and one of my favorite conversations that I, get to have on either this podcast or radio. Jimmy Patsos, long-time college basketball coach, head coach, assistant coach for Gary in the early days, does a lot of work for monumental sports, a lot of work for Under Armour. He's all over the place. He is a man about multiple towns, typically, and he's just getting back from a fun lunch. And we will talk about the Maryland situation, but let's start with the, the hoops that are still going on. Two great games on Saturday night sets up Houston and Florida.

You typically go with who your friends are and who you know the most and you wanted them. But first just tell me about the two games and we'll start with why did Florida win? Florida won because Todd Golden and his staff have been the best team since January 1. no one talked about them until February but Florida is really good and Clayton Jr. who started Iona Iona was my nemesis at Mac. When I was in the Mac at Loyal and Sienna, Iona used to get guys that

dropped down. Now the opposite, Iona's now getting guys that play well that move up and become really good players. Clayton Jr. is one of those. And I will tell you this. Florida can coach Florida can play up and down. The rigors of the SEC have prepped them. Auburn just didn't have a good matchup with him,

even though they were up eight or nine, they couldn't put him away in the second half. Arbor was up and Duke was up in both lost, which is rare. But I've got to give Florida credit and ha. He makes shots. I think all of a sudden he's a pro. He makes free throws.

Well, then all of a sudden he missed a free throw, but it didn't matter. They had the poise and the size. That's the two things. But Clayton can make shots like that, Kevin. And that's a Juan Dixon-like. When you have a guy like that, whether it's J.J. Reddick, or Juan Nixon or Michael Jordan, or whoever it is, Clayton Jr. just keeps you in games.

You're never out of a game. He makes tough shots. He makes pressure-filled shots. And I wanted out Auburn because Bruce Pro's underarmor Bruce Pro's my friend, Bruce Pro's to Boston. Bruce Pro's sort of a comeback story. But it was Florida. It just you could feel the momentum of Florida. And I thought Florida had the best crowd.

The Duke crowd is back. You know what I mean? The Duke Mob is back. I could feel that in the airport. Auburnum used to because I was in Atlanta with them in the Sweet 16. I know that Houston's close. I think Houston is actually going to be much more there tonight because the way the games played out, their three-hour drive.

But Florida has surprised me with their support. The number of people, how they get you into it? Yeah, you forget they won back-to-back with Billy. None of them. But my surprise of San Antonio, Kevin. was the energy in support of the Florida Gators. You know, I was looking through mock drafts a few weeks ago. Walter Clayton Jr. wasn't in any of the first rounds.

Now I'm seeing him towards the end of the first round. Who does he remind you of and don't, and do you think he'll be a good pro? It's close. I value winning. Derek Queen was 27th a month ago. He's 18th. He's up to 4 or 5. because of the shot, no, because he affects winning.

The more you watch him, the more you like him, the more you realize. I don't think Clayton Jr. is Shaggildes-Alexander. He's not that tall. Could he be Jalen Brunson? Maybe. Jalen Brunson gets it into the paint. He's coming back for the next this week. He's not the most talented guard.

He's not the biggest guard, but he sure does a lot of things well. He helps you win. Paulo Bancarro became the number one pick by helping Mike Schoefsky get back to the final four. They weren't very good in December and January. from Seattle, Bishop O'Day, Powell Bankero starts to take the team over and wins. When a guy can take the team over,

Scooney-Penlet Ohio State, I say that because he's a Boston kid. There's Ben Stories, Al Horfrey, Joe Keem Noah, they made their name because Florida won. Clayton Jr. wins. Derek Queen helped Maryland to the Sweet 16. Derek Queen affected winning.

He beat Villanova in December with 20 scouts there in the Prudential Center. winning matters and winning plays matter. And that's what I want to really miss about Derek Queen in Maryland was he made everybody better and made winning plays. What I have to watch with Clay Jr. Morris, does he make other plays better?

I know he makes winning plays, but on the biggest stage, and they got lucky to get there with the foul shots from Texas Tech. Right. True. You know, he did the Jimmy Valvano. They followed twice and it worked.

But in general, they've handled Yukons. they haven't had an easy run. Texas Tech was really good, like our run. They had to run into Auburn, Perennial number one, and beat them. And Auburn knew them and played for the fourth time, et cetera. They've done a good job for it. But I like Kelvin Samson because he's old school.

Kelvin Samson helped me keep my job. I was going down to the, this is for the story part of the segment, to the BP oil spill. Charles Barkley and Mark Godfrey had a golf tournament and they invited us all down. I sat next to Kelvin Samson on the plane, and I told him my troubles that Loyola,

They couldn't turn the program. Yeah, we saved the program from 1 and 27 to 15 wins and all that. How do I get the next level? He sent me the bubble. The bubble is an offensive rebounding genius. It goes over the basket. You play games with it. You have fast breaks.

It's just a mentality you have to have. And your kids are going to go hard. They're going to hate it sometimes because you get really dinged up in there. But his team uses the bubble. He sent me the bubble. You saw the offensive rebound dunk. You saw them hit the glass. They're tough.

They're warriors. and they have everybody back except one. I love Cryer. I love L.J. Cryer, but they have everybody back in a rarity because this is about, nowadays it's who can you retain. I just left a good friend of mine who has a lot of influence at the Ravens. Most important

thing, we got Ronnie Stanley back. We have number eight Lamar Jackson. Number eight of Alice of Etchen breaks the scoring record because he stayed. You've got to keep your good players. You got to keep your important players. That's what Houston is teaching us. Duke taught us that you can have

freshman. Florida thought of that you can go all over the board and have a different mix of kids. And Auburn sort of has the older guys that are veterans that came from someplace else once, but have now learned to stay because they're making more money at Auburn

than they could in the NBA. Four very different programs. I bring that up, Kevin, because that's where we are. This is year three of the NIL. Why did Kevin Willough leave? You can ask me that. Was it more NIL money? Maybe. Was it more comfortability? Maybe.

Was he one of the more stable, just a basketball school that just cares about one thing? Maybe. Maybe he was upset about the way some of the things went. But at the end of the day, coaches are leaving, players are leaving? Who can keep their coach? Who can keep most of the players? Who can keep

regular kids coming in from lower division? Lower division one and then keep them while they get better? Or are we going to have AJ store that what? The four high school and four colleges and everywhere he left, They all said the same thing. Thank God he left.

So, I mean, in other words, like, what are you looking for in your program? And that was the discussion of Stan and Tony. Yeah. You're the best, because it's one question, and we cover, you know, multiple topics.

But I'm going to go back to the original question because I just want to finalize the thought process on Clayton Jr. I would take him if I was the Wizards with the 25th pick. Well, I think they have the 20th. But Clayton Jr., to me, has that lightning quick release. I'm not going to say he's Steph Curry.

I'm not going to say that he's at that level. But I think that there's a much higher upside with him. Because you tell so many great stories, I'm going to tell you a story that I've never told you, but I think I've told on the podcast before. So when the Wizards hired Flip Saunders back, you know, in 2007, all right? God rest of soul. Yes, God rest of soul. We did, Doc and I were doing a show together at the time, and we did the show from, you know, at that time, MCI Center. And we had Ernie on the show. We had Flip Saunders on the show. And after the show, Ernie hung out with us. You know Ernie. Ernie's a great dude. And he sat there and talked with us for a while. And the draft was coming up. And it was the 2009 draft. So it was 2009. I said 2007. It was 2009 that that's a lot. they hired Flip Saunders. Anyway, I'm having this conversation with Ernie, and he tells me it's too bad we don't have a top three pick

because James Hardin is going to be one of the all-time great scores in the India. Very few people do that. I know. And I said, really? I said, God, man, he's kind of bulky. He's slow. You know, the whole thing he said, James Hardin's going to be one of the great all-time scores in the history of the league, but we can't get up that high.

And I said, what about Steph Curry? that lightning quick release. He said, yeah, but who's he going to guard? So he got one right, and I got one right, and I'll never forget that conversation. They ended up trading the pick to Minnesota for Mike Miller and Randy Foy. And Minnesota took Ricky Rubio, and then I think it was the guy from Syracuse. Hold on.

Johnny Flynn, Johnny Flynn. Johnny Flynn. Yeah, so he took those two guys. So I think our guy is way better than Johnny Flynn. I just, when I watch Clayton Jr. Camarne Rosen was in there, Drew Holiday was in there, Jeff T. Yep. Yeah.

You don't know. And look, J.D. Davidson is the MVP. MVP of the G. League for the Celtics. He left too early. Clayton stayed. I'm glad Clayton stayed and it's going to be better. J.D. Davis was a guy that was a McDonald's guy, went to Alabama, a second round.

He's just going to name the MVP in the G League. So we're talking about how. What do you tell these young guys? It does matter when you leave, the short money versus the long money. I just think Clayton, the Wizards could use a combo guy. Jordan Poole is playing extremely well. He really is. He's got a great attitude and he's playing well.

But he's a little on the older side. Not yet. He's getting up there. I just think he's a top 10 pick by the time we get there. That's, I'll leave it at that. If you win tonight, it's going to be close. Well, look, it only takes risk. And the immortal words of Rob 80's my former lawyer.

There's 350 schools. We just got a fool one at the highest. I fooled two. But as he said, Zach Giddy gets one team. Only one team like Zach Giddy. But it was a team that picked him ninth that now has John Moran healthy.

Desmond and they needed this. They needed a center. I want Queen to go to the Wizards if they don't pick one or two. You know, I don't tell the Wizards what's do. Will Dawkins is doing a really good job. Michael Wings is tight. That thing. I think they're doing a very good job. Right. Balaqulibali is really good. Can he shoot it? We'll see. There's no doubt Bob Carrington's solid, two, three, one, two, three, sort of a backup.

You know, SARS exceeded expectations. He's a five-four. They need a power guy. Because Keesham George is the guy that's surprising me the most. And AJ Johnson can play, but he's really skinny. What is he? They need a young power guy. So take Derek Queen. Well, we need Cooper Flats. We need Cooper Flack. We need Cooper. flag. That's who we need. Flag and Harper are one and two. That's locked up. After that, my place is Kevin. You're right. After one and two, there's a huge wall.

Right. Okay? And it's, what do you need? So that's when you should pick what you need. But I like what Ernie was saying. Bernie didn't think Steph Day and Steph Carr was going to make it. Clearly I did since I double teamed him. Okay. Yeah, you're pretty good. Well, you quadruper teamed him. I didn't like Joe. I didn't like Johnny Flynn, blah, blah, blah, blah.

was Gilbert going to be as I loved Gilbert Arena because I recruited them in high school. So there's always a different way of looking at things. But I want to let everybody know. Everyone likes Clayton Jr. down in San Antonio. Houston's going to flood the place tonight. Calvin Samson's good old school coach that had to go through some stuff in Indiana. He did his penance. His teams play really hard and tough and they find ways to win, but Florida is what to know.

So, Jesse, I know you know the answer to this, but, you know, Clayton Jr. became the first player to record 30 or more in an elite eight and final four games. Since who? Al Wood. Boy, that's a good guess, but that's incorrect. Okay, that was my thing. Alwood, Alwood, I... Alwood, I... Alwood remember in that semi-final when they beat Virginia, I think, had 30-plus.

That was, you know, prior to the Indiana final, which was... Do you remember the significance of the Indiana-North Carolina final? in 81? What happened on that day? No, tell me. No, tell me. Reagan got shot earlier in the day. One block from my DuPont Circle apartment. The Washington Hilton. I'm on 20th and ask. Look it up, folks.

One block away. No, I'm not giving you the apartment number. Coaches will be upset. That's the guy who lives there. That is crazy that that's the day Reagan got shot and rushed to GW Hospital. Yep. March 19. Who had 30? Who had 30, Isaiah? Larry Bird, back-to-backy, lead eight and final four. So you can tell me who they beat in the elite eight. They beat DePaul in the final four, right, before Michigan State?

They did before Michigan State. That's right, 79, okay. Yeah. By the way, can Clayton be Isaiah Thomas if he plays the point but can score? Isaiah Thomas, I know he was the happiest guy to be around. Always nice to me, but man, was he a good player? Oh, my God. So good.

I'm sure we've had this conversation before, but I always say that to me, the best combination of a ball handler and shooter in one body is Steph Curry. But Isaiah would be number two for me. Best combination of shooter and ball handler in one body. Isaiah, if he had had the green light and threes would have been a big part of the game, he would have been a prolific three-point shooter. It still won two titles. And by the way, he had bird at his prime staring him in the face.

It quickly turns the corner into Jordan. his prime. And you know, it's funny, Kevin. For those listening, each year, could do a show on many things, many topics, and we're going to be all over the place, but it always comes back to what, basketball winning and bartending. By the way, tipping, make sure you tip your bartending, tip you're doing short promise. My new thing is to give the 20 before the thing, before we start here's a $20 bill, so we all know we're on the same page. Do you know what you get great service? Jimmy and I were talking about that. We were talking about that because we both tip, we both said

we consider ourselves to be, you know, generous tippers comparatively. Why? Because we both worked in restaurants. I worked in restaurants throughout college and shortly after. And you did too. Yeah. Well, that was one place. Isaiah Thomas, and this is where the SEC is going to be funny,

because does it prepare you? Because Isaiah Thomas and the Pistons have to go through Larry Bird, five year in a row finals, and that ain't easy with Dennis Johnson Parish in them. They finally get there. They start to exert their power, win to, after losing it, and after they lose to the lake is in the first one. Yeah. Because I say, he's got a bad echo.

And they turn the corner, and there's Michael Jordan staring at them in their own division. So, like, forget about the conference. Whereas sometimes these guys don't have an easier ride, like the Celtics last year. The Celtics could have the West is turning into a gauntlet. We were talking about this, which is so everybody knows. We have a luncheon with 250 coaches on Friday. There's Jeff Jones and does his party on Thursday night. It's an annual 50 coaches.

Brian Odom, Dave Odom, Lane Odom. Holy Odoms. It's a whole array of people. And then you go, and then Friday night you have your husband. There's a lot of basketball talk. There's a lot of coaching acumen. There's obviously the changes in the game, the NIL. But there's still real basketball talk.

And one of the topics, Kevin, was, and it got proven. And Gary Williams, who I would never speak for, forever. I love Gary. I'll do anything for Gary. He's the smartest guy I know. He's the greatest coach I know, and that's true. But I wouldn't speak for Gary. However, Gary Williams says Duke got in trouble because they didn't have enough close games because it didn't come from a tough enough common. Some people said, Arbor and Florida, they're beating the crap out of each other in the FCC. 14 teams made the tournament. Texas got fired for making the NCAA because they're in the playing game. That SEC is like

an NBA. So, like, is that better? Or is Houston coming from, like, the Kansas, Texas Tech League, but not too much? And then there's the Big East that limped out this year because it was a really bad bottom half. And I hope Georgetown gets better at Cooley's a friend, but they didn't get better. You know, they're in the crown. Whatever that is, it's a show on Netflix in a basketball. So on Netflix is a lot better than the basketball of 20 people. Okay, I like the idea. But you're talking about it. does the highest level SEC prepare you better?

The Big Ten is really tough. And maybe that was one of Willard's things. And this is just conjecture. Maybe Willard's like the Big East is better. We know every team we play. We play 20 games against 10 teams twice, not going to Nebraska. Don't travel across the country.

We know where one of the... Is Villanoe of one of the better jobs in the Big East? Come on, everyone. That's pretty easy to figure out. He now has one of the best jobs in the Big East, which sent five out of 11 teams to the end.

CAA, which is enough. These times, I'm just giving everyone a wrap up of what was being talked about at the final four. These are not my opinion. It's just fact. Right. And the ACC has to get better. And some people were right.

They said the ACC didn't prepare Duke enough. They got pressed and didn't know what to do. The ACC wasn't enough of the gauntlet. They won games by 20 points. Blah, blah, blah. And all of a sudden, it showed up. So that's the kind of stuff that everybody, in case you're wondering what happens at the Final Four.

Well, that's kind of what we do. I'm interested in definitely the Maryland part, which we will get to here in a minute to finish up. But back to the game tonight, I actually, I considered, you know, Duke in not being prepared almost in the same way. I mean, this is more of me taking a shot at my old league and your old league, which is like Duke was almost like Gonzaga of old. You know, they hadn't played anybody since November or December. But I'll tell you what, man, the first three quarters of that game, Duke was so good defensively. I think Houston just wore them down. And I thought the whole game was just incredible to watch, start to finish.

Like you, I love Kelvin Sampson. I don't think he's ever gotten the proper kind of credit for being the great coach that he is. But I think- Final four is Hollis-Price in those guys who Oklahoma. Remember that? They were a tough team. They worked us that year. Yeah.

Almost had to play them in the final. Indiana beat them in the other semifinal. But what I'm saying is, I do think, after watching Duke on Saturday night in particular, that they were good enough to win this thing as long as it wasn't Houston they faced. Look, they had a bad four minutes, but we had a bad minute in Cole Fieldhouse 30 years ago. They got it right back. Yeah. So how'd that feel?

Yeah. So, look, Proctor, Norris. not only dribbles, not only misses the free throw, and I lost the game against Lehigh with a player and will not game, who will not be in my will, just put it that way. And to this day, I'm like, it wasn't flag foul, it was the mission. Just make the free throw. Oh, by the way, Procter dribbled off his leg a minute before that.

By the way, who got the technical foul? I had a very smart coach call me this morning. A very smart coach. We're talking about something else. Remember this is NIL. I'm on the McDonald's committee. God bless Joey Wooten. I do a lot of different stuff.

So if you have these random conversations, when they said, Jimmy, that thing was at 14 or 13, and the guy got the technical, they took a shot, and they made a shot. It was like a six-point swing. Whoever got that technical, was it fair or unfair? It doesn't matter.

Was it too much referee? Doesn't matter. The referees are in play. And that was huge, because that thing might have ballooned to 20, and we both know no one's coming back from 20. That went back to 7 or 8 and kept it in you. They weren't ready for the press.

The pass to the middle was the bad one that the guy stole, had took the three, and then get an offensive rebound dunk. But flags move at the end, maybe you get to the basket. Proctor dribbled off his leg and missed a free throw in the last minute. And I think Procter's a very good player. I don't know him. I'm sure he's a wonderful human. I'm not taking a shot of this character, but I don't miss coaching that.

Off your leg with seven seconds on the shock lock under a minute, and then you missed the free throw? Thanks a lot. How much do I pay you? Can I get it? 10% back from that. Pompter, you've got to make the free throw. We're up one, my man.

Can you make one to put us up, too? I mean, you went up there and missed it after you dribbled off your leg. Like, no offense, that's not your finest last minute. No. You know, though, I focused. I like the kid. I focused at the beginning of this show and talking about that game, which I really loved. Because when we got to last week, I picked Houston to win the whole thing.

I just think they – Oh, wow. That's awesome. I just think they wear – I think they wear you down. And I don't understand this. It drives me crazy, but when you have to get the ball in bounds, you've got to run something to get a free-throw shooter open when you know you're up one, you've got to get it in, and they're going to foul.

You can't take the ball out underneath the basket, either which they did. First of all, he had the whole baseline. They had different people taking the ball out. Gary Wams rule was the four-man, don't touch it. The four-man takes the ball out from October 50. ain't until the last game of the season, the four men takes the ball out. Well, he had the old baseline. They had a free pressure set, and that's not practice fault.

They didn't use it. It seemed like he got open enough, but I would have just got something for flag, where instead of posting up like you did, you've got to be running towards the inbounder, as you said, set a pitching you open. However you do, look, we've pressed every day. I try to get coaches and the young coaches today. Every end of every practice, we have a thing at our end. Okay, I'll go slow.

at IMG, we have the young kids come down, 64 boys and girls. We have a pressing session every session for 10 minutes. Why? Because you're going to get pressed at the end of every game, and you're going to press if you're down. So why don't you practice pressing? We did it at Maryland because, hey, it was fun. We had this cool game, the pressing game. I'll leave it alone.

But everyone got to shoot a free throw, and you had 55, full quarter, 51 run and jump. But I don't know. Maybe Duke, whether they boarded practice, you're not going to press at the end. They couldn't get the ball in. They couldn't get it to the right people. Then they gave up an offensive rebound after a guy dribbled out to take a three. Where was everybody?

Kevin, all this comes back to the same answer that you just said. Was this lack of preparation because they were winning every game by 20? That's what I want to know. And there's no answer, but that's my rhetorical question. I will close with this. Do you dokees out there? The boozers are good. John Shire did a magnificent job this year.

I like him. you know, I like Pearls. Pearl's my favorite. Calvin helped me. John Shire's been nothing but nice. I really don't know Tart Gold, and I'm jealous that he's such a good-looking dude, but that's how it goes young and good-looking and skinny. But he's supposedly a real mention, too. People like him.

But John Shire quietly did the greatest job this year. I don't know if he got enough credit for that, for managing all that, for winning all that. The ACC will be back. Miami has a new coach. I have a feeling Will Wade's going to be pretty good at NG State, just how he rolls. Virginia's going to get stable,

and that will help the ACC stuff. But there was a really bad situation at the end of the ACC was bad this year. I didn't get tested much. I thought that really heard him, and it showed up the other night. All right, let's go to Maryland. But real quickly, just picked the winner tonight.

I don't need the, just Houston or Florida. I got Houston, 68, 62, Houston. Oh, my God. It's the Reed Getty's Five Samajama, Elvin Hayes, Revenge, Benny Anders. We found him in Detroit. They saw the 30-for-30 the other day.

it's time for them. Houston, what a great program. People forget, and we know this because Georgetown beat him, and NC State Derek Wittenberg beat him. It was like B.C. lore. That's had an unbelievable program, and what guy Lewis did,

and people forget how good Elvin Hayes was, another great bullet. Right. Leading score ever. Like, Houston's had a lot of heartbreak, and I think maybe that comes to an end and they win this year. I mean, average minds think alike.

My final score prediction in the opening segment was 68-63, Houston. No, it was not. And I did not hear that. I know you didn't. You couldn't have because I recorded it. All right. I am going to interrupt my conversation with Jimmy.

I'm going to make an edit, meaning I'm going to save the rest of it until Wednesday. Per usual with Jimmy, it's such a great conversation, but it tends to be on the long side. So if I were to run the rest of it, the show would be too long today. And the rest of it deals only with the Maryland situation. Kevin Willard leaving, Buzz Williams being hired, and I can easily run it on Wednesday. It won't be dated at that point, so I will do that. Tomorrow, Tommy will be with me. On Wednesday, part of the show will be the rest of this conversation from today with Jimmy Patsos about Maryland.

So with that, I'll wrap it up for the day. Enjoy the game tonight. Back tomorrow with Tommy. Carlson will make his way to the. neutralized, dropping it for Dylan Strong. He and Chickren will team up and glide through center, right side to Wilson, centered up. Ovechkin has it. He scores. He scores. Alex Ovexton, scores 895. There's a new goal-scoring champion, and his name is Alexander O'Fekton. He has done it.