The Kevin Sheehan Show - Ranking the Redskins QB Options

Episode Date: March 5, 2019

Kevin and Thom review all of the offseason QB options for the Redskins and predict which path the Skins will take. Thom has some issues with how the Bryce Harper signing has been reported when it comes to the Nats. They talk about Virginia and LeBron James too. <p> </p><p>Learn more about your ad choices. Visit <a href="https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices">podcastchoices.com/adchoices</a></p> Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You want it. You need it. It's what everyone's talking about. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Now here's Kevin. You're listening to The Sports Fix. Damn it. You've been so long since he's been here. I talked right over it. I'm here. Aaron's here. Tommy is here. And he's back from another vacation. God, you've had more vacation than Carson used to get. This show's presented by Window Nation. If you're in the market for Windows, call 866.90 Nation. Or go to Wind Donation.com and tell them that we told you to call. Kevin, I won't be here next Tuesday. Of course not. I'll be in spring training. I'm going back down.

Are you really going back down? Yes, I am. Yeah, I'm going back down to do the show with Chad. You've decided that as long as the forecast is for colder than normal temperatures, you're not going to be here. No. So I won't be here next Tuesday. All right.

We'll enjoy that. But you can call in. I'll call in. Okay. Absolutely. If I remember the number. How was Florida? Oh, it was great.

It was fabulous. I mean, 86 degrees in sunny every single day. It'd be 80 degrees, but when I walk out of my hotel at 7.30 in a morning. I need a vacation right now. It was so good. I really, I need to, you know what? I started to talk. My boys have different spring breaks right now, so it didn't really sink up where we could all go away at the same time.

Maryland's got a different spring break than Penn State. My youngest son who's at Penn State, they have spring break this week. Who has spring break the first week in March? It's a bit early, don't you think? I would think so. Here's what I don't understand. Why do any of them or anyone else in your family has anything to do with your vacation? Do you want to know why? Because I actually like vacationing with them. I would rather they be with us rather than it just be my wife and I. No, I'm kidding. I love you, honey. You need to break the cycle of function. You're right. I do. I do. I need more dysfunction.

Yes. I need something different. I'm having a midlife crisis. I do. This is the moment he decides to open a sports book and completely change his life. There you go, baby. The problem is... Speaking of sports book. Kevin. What?

You know what I found in my wallet that I forgot about? A ticket, a winning ticket? The first day the Hollywood casino at Charlestown Sportsbook was open. Right. I went out to write a column about it. I remember that, yeah. I figured I should, you know, make a bet, see how the process goes and stuff like that. So I bet that the over under on the reds.

Redskins season wins was 6.5 at the book, and I bet the over. For 2019? Yeah. That's really interesting, because remember last week when I was trying to figure out what the over under wins were for the Redskins in 2019, and I couldn't find it anymore? No, no, no. No, I'm in 2018. Oh, for 18, and you took the over.

I took the over. You've got a ticket to catch. I just found it. Well, you usually only have a year. Like there's an expiration date on that ticket. Oh, I know. I know that. So you better get back there and catch it.

I'm pretty sure I'll be back at Charlestown soon. You want to go? Let's go together. Okay. Seriously, let's pick a night where we leave or an afternoon. We leave right from here. We go to Charlestown. Tell me real quickly.

March Madness. Huh? March Madness. March Madness would be good. I don't want to watch the Maryland March Madness game there, though. So whichever the Thursday or Friday. What Maryland March Madness game? In the, whenever, whenever they play their first tournament game.

Oh, okay. They're in the tournament. You realize that. Yes, I did. How are the casinos? I mean, I haven't been there. Well, the sports book, it's not huge. It's not Vegas-like.

I don't care about the sports book. The casinos are good. The alley with casinos, great. It really, look, and the library. Lots of dice tables, lots of card tables. Yes. It's a first-class operation. I know that's important to you because you're a first-class kind of guy.

Do they have a room for people like me to go? go to to play in? Yes, they do. Okay, good. Yes, they do. And by the way, they have live racing. I don't know if it's every night, but they have live racing. I love live racing.

Yeah, I'm sad. I hate simulcast. I love live racing. You know, it was, I don't know, it was six or seven years ago. I think I may have told you the story. Pimlico, I'm sorry, Laurel was still open. Laurel's not open anymore. Lawrence still open.

Man, you live in a bubble. I do. So Laurel, it was because I used to go, when I was younger, I went on Laurel all the time. That's where they want to put the preakness. I know. That's right. That's right. I'm sorry.

I was getting, where did they have Rosecroft? Rosecroft is. Rosecroft is still open. It is still open. Okay, that's what I was thinking of. Because remember, didn't you and I do something? We did a show. We did a show from Roscroft.

Well, this is seven or eight years ago. It may be 10 years ago. It's probably more like 10 years ago. I took the boys once one afternoon out to Laurel. Just to watch the horses running Tommy, I swear to God. I was one of maybe 25 people there. It was empty. It's not like it used to be.

I mean, when I was in college, we went all the time. I mean, we would go Laurel, we'd do Pimlico, then we'd go to Atlantic City for the night, and then we'd come back the next day. We had issues, lots of issues. Actually, now when you go to the track, it's like a daycare center. It's filled with parents with kids. Well, you know what? Who shouldn't be there.

Right. What, the parents have issues? It's not to G. Everybody. Tommy. There was no, like when I went, and this is again, 10 years ago, the degenerate factor, that wasn't even there. Oh, it's there. It is?

It's the Greyhound bus station, degenerate factor. Exactly, exactly. All right. Something very quick to start the show, and then we're going to get into something more about the Redskins overall efforts here in the offseason with respect to quarterback. And we're going to go through all the options. But I wanted to just mention there was a person in my life. a good friend of mine, who... A good friend? You have a good friend?

Yeah, I have a lot of good friend. I probably have more friends than you have, actually, when I think about it. Look at that. I got more friends than you, too. You can be difficult. I'm much easier than you. There was a friend of mine reached out to me and said, Jung Cooney never mentioned Ryan Tannahill yesterday. What about the report about Ryan Tannahill? And if you were following all the news this weekend, there was a report that, you know,

from a Miami reporter that the Redskins were talking to the dolphins about Ryan Tannahill, about trading for Ryan Tannahill. We did actually mention it yesterday, but it was brief. And the reason it was brief is because there is no chance in hell that the Redskins will trade for Ryan Tannahill. He has an $18 million cap number next. I think it's $18.7 million base salary and cap number next year. It can't happen. Now, if Miami...

So it's beyond... their level of stupidity, even beyond theirs. Well, they, I mean, they wouldn't be able to do it without just start, I mean, they'd have no, no money left for anything else. This is why they have the genius Eric Schaefer on board to figure these things out. But a friend of mine made this point, and this is why I brought this up, I think most of you realize that they can't trade for Ryan Tannahill. He did say, well, what if Miami cuts Tannahill? Well, that's different. Yeah. And he said, Tana Hill is much more in line with Jay

Gruden and the kind of quarterback he likes to coach than anybody else out there, Josh Rosen or any of the other quarterbacks that have been talked about. Tannahill really is Dalton and Alex Smith in the right situation. I actually totally agree with that. And I've always felt that way about Ryan Tannahill. I don't think he's great. Just like I don't think Andy Dalton or Alex Smith are great. But I think in the right system with the right coach, they can be very effective quarterbacks. I can buy into that. I would have. I would have. I would have. have preferred Dalton last year to Alex Smith, but you would have had to probably give up more and potentially, well, Cincinnati, I don't think was interested in trading him. But anyway, yes,

if he became available because Miami has to release him, which they will likely have to do, because they can't really trade Ryan Tannahill. So if they cut him, yeah, the skins could sign Tannahill to, you know, a one-year deal, bring him in and have him compete with Colt McCoy for the starting job. Which would make... That's a possibility. Which would basically say give them a quarterback who you think can be pretty effective in this system without having to give up anything in return. That's right.

That's right. Yeah, exactly. So if the dolphins cut him, that's a possibility if the Redskins haven't made a move yet on their quarterback spot. Tanna Hill, I will tell you, would not solve the one thing that I believe now is in play with the owner, which is we need a marketing jolt. We need some juice here in the off season. That is definitely in play. So this is what I wanted to do to start the show with you

because we haven't talked about the quarterback situation together. I did it yesterday with Cooley and JP. But I want to go through all of the potential moves or options that the Redskins have at quarterback. You mean scenarios? Scenarios, yes. And then have us guess on which one we think, you know, which route they will take.

there may be more than this, but I came up with five obvious options or routes to solving the quarterback problem, all right? Option number one is the, they don't do much option. Colt McCoy, they re-signed Josh Johnson, or another veteran journeyman quarterback, like a Brock Osweiler or a Gino Smith or a Josh McCown, somebody of that ilk to perhaps compete with Colt, but really more likely to not bring them in to back Colt up. And then they can, you know, either draft a quarterback in the third through seventh round, not the quarterback that they, you know, we, we deem to be the quarterback of the future, but just a developmental quarterback, or they sign an undrafted quarterback in free agency. All right. So that's option, option number one. Option number one is they don't really

do much option. All right, it's Colt, it's Josh, or it's Colt, and it's Osweiler, and they bring in a third quarterback because they draft him in the fifth round or they sign him as an undrafted free agent. Now, at least to have in training. Now, not to make my final judgment, but I kind of like that option, but that option is going to get you kicked out of Dan Snyder's office. I think right now it might get you booted out of Dan Snyder's office. More on that here in a moment. Option number two. Option number two is free agency for a legit competitor to McCoy, if not a likely starter in 2019. Teddy Bridgewater, Ryan Fitzpatrick, Ryan Tannahill, if he were cut by Miami. Bruce Allen did seem to indicate last week in that interview at Indy that free agency for a

quarterback was sort of in play. And Jay Gruden even said, look, you know, we can wait on this too and get somebody. And I don't know if that's a, we're going to wait until Bruce can nickel and dime Josh Johnson's agent a little bit more. Or, you know, you know, know, look, they do think they're close. We know that. So they may think Ryan Fitzpatrick on a one-year deal with Antonio Brown in a trade, you know, Antonio Brown via trade, Ryan Fitzpatrick via free agency on a one-year deal worth, I don't know, five, six, seven million for Fitzpatrick. The Fitzpatrick number is going to be interesting because it depends on if he's going somewhere to back somebody up or if he's going somewhere to start. But, you know, I,

They may think that Ryan Fitzpatrick, along with an Antonio Brown, gives them a legit chance to completely be different offensively next year. And you know what, Tommy? In terms of talent and ability and experience, if you threw Ryan Fitzpatrick together with Antonio Brown with Adrian Peterson and Darius Geis and Jordan Reed's healthy, and by the way, Jordan Reed plays better than he did last year, he didn't play that well last year when he was healthy

because he played a lot of games. I put that more on Alex Smith and the quarterback. than I do on Reed. But yeah, they would have a much improved offense. They would. I'm not saying it's a playoff offense, but they would have an improved offensive football team next year. It's hard to debate that.

You can't add a gunslinger like Fitzpatrick. He is a gunslinger. He can be an erratic gunslinger, but he's a gunslinger. That's right. And a guy out there running those balls down like Antonio Brown and not say it's going to improve your offense. So option one is the don't do much option, you know? option two is free agency for a legitimate starter or at least, you know, somebody that they think is going to compete with Colt and beat out Colt, like a Ryan Fitzpatrick or Teddy Bridgewater.

Option number three is to draft someone early. You keep Colt, but you draft somebody early. So whether it's at 15 or you trade up to draft Drew Locke or Dwayne Haskins or perhaps you trade back and draft Daniel Jones in the first. I think that's a reasonable option trading back. But option three is that they're going to draft their next quarterback, if not their starter for 2019 or at some point during 2019, and they're going to take somebody in the first or second round with the intention of that quarterback competing and starting for a job sooner rather than later.

That's option three, all right? You following along? Yeah, I'm with you. Option four is that they sign that free agent, like the Ryan Fitzpatrick or the Teddy Bridgewater, and they draft. somebody early. All right? So it's Teddy Bridgewater and they draft Daniel Jones at 15. Or they trade back and they draft Daniel Jones. Or in the second round, they take Ryan Finley. Or in the third,

you know, in the second round, late second round, they take Jared Stidham. So it's a sign the free agent to start, all right, in 2019, but draft somebody also. So you have some choices, which by the way is not a bad, you know, sort of direction that some teams like Philadelphia and recent years have taken. Yes. Where they bring in more and then they figured out when you have them all in there. And the rookie quarterback isn't going to cost you much. And a veteran free agent, potentially like a Ryan Fitzpatrick, may not cost you that much.

All right. So that's option four. Sign a free agent, a legitimate free agent that you think can start next year and draft somebody. And then option five is trade for Josh Rosen. Those are your five options. Option one that don't do much option. Option two, free agency.

for a Fitzpatrick or Teddy Bridgewater. Option three, draft somebody early. Option four, sign that free agent like a Ryan Fitzpatrick or Teddy Bridgewater and draft somebody early. And then option five is trade for Josh Rosen. Did I miss any? I'm sure you did. But it...

You're sure I did? Yeah, in terms of being kind to me and everybody else listening, let's leave it at five options. Okay, good. What's your answer? Well, one is out, even though I think one for a normal team would be a good way to go. That don't do much option. Right.

But, you know, I mean, they've got to have somebody show up at the stadium. I want you to choose what you think they're going to do. We can have the conversation about what we would prefer. Okay. But what do you think they will do? So you think one is out for them. I think they'll do five. Trade for Josh Rosen?

Yeah. Okay. Now, now the big question here is, what do you? know about Josh Rosen. I keep reading and hearing that if Josh Rosen was in this draft, he'd be at minimum the second highest rated quarterback in the draft. If that's true, then that's who you go after. Yeah. I mean, Coolly was on, did a film breakdown of Josh Rosen yesterday. If you miss that, listen to it. It was our longest podcast ever yesterday. We were over two hours. But the stuff with Cooley yesterday, not only on Josh Rosen, but on Drew Locke, I mean, Dwayne

Haskins was really good as well. So you think they'll trade for Josh Rosen. If they had him on the board this year as the second rated quarterback, that's important. Yeah. But more important is where they would have him on their overall board. If I'm the Redskins when it comes to Josh Rosen, I am putting him into the 2019 draft class and putting them grade on him for the board. Yes. Because if the grade is the second highest, you know, quarterback, but they've got 35 players rated ahead of him overall, well, then that's a second round grade, you know, and so you don't want to give up. You don't want to deviate from your board. Oh, I disagree with that. We've had this argument for you. I know. I know he's. I think this idea

of drafting best player available is ludicrous. I know. You and you and, but not general managers in the NFL. Well, no, there are general managers who recognize that you. You cannot find one general manager that would ever tell you that he drafts by need, not one. No, they won't tell you that, but they do. Okay. Well, that's stupid. It's a bad way to go. No, it's not stupid, Kevin.

It is stupid. It's dumb. It's dumb. I love when I do that to him, he gets so angry. Well, because when you use those technical football terms, I don't understand them. They're very, they're very, I go deep on technical terms. Tommy, context, all right? if it's really close, like you got a 93 on one guy and a 92 on the other,

and the 93 is a player that you've got the position filled and the 92 is a need, you take the need there. But if it's a 93 and an 83, you don't take the 83. I would disagree. I know you would. And that's why you aren't a general manager, and I probably wouldn't be either. All right, you want my answer on this? Yeah.

All right. Can I give you a little bit of a sort of preface what my answer is with a couple of things? So you want to introduce your answer? I want to introduce my answer. Okay, go ahead. The introduction to the answer goes like this. First of all, you know, all of these options that we've laid out are not within their control. Some of them aren't within their control.

And think about this because you'll remember this. These are players and teams that in some cases may have better options than the Redskins. Absolutely. And I will add to this. and I think you're going to like this, that negotiating with Bruce Allen isn't something that agents in particular prefer. Remember the poll?

Oh, yeah. That indicated that Bruce Allen? The least trustworthy. NFL executive. Yeah. All right. He was voted the least trusted NFL exec in the league. So it's not within their control situation,

unless they were to massively overpay for somebody or in a trade. I think desperation has. set in and I talked about this yesterday on the podcast as far as the business of the franchise right now Tommy I said yesterday that I think you know Dan now is looking around at Bruce and Jay and Eric and Doug and saying you numb nuts have cost me millions the last few years doing it your way we need a marketing jolt we need something we can sell and I think Dan's ready for some real action action, some real Charlestown action.

That's what I think. Some Hollywood action. Some old school Dan Snyder action? He needs some jerseys he can move, some tickets he can sell. They do think they are close, delusionally so, but they think they are close. Well, we don't know what close means. I mean, I think they may be close to being in an NFL franchise, but they're not quite there yet. They might think they're close to being a playoff team as opposed to a championship contender.

I would think that that's probably true, which, by the way, is bothersome in its own right. Well, in a way, most NFL teams are close to being a playoff team. That is true. That is 100% true. But they were many games out of the playoff spot two years ago. Yes, they were. And, you know, a game out last year. And other teams were pretty close as well.

I, first of all, because this is important, the Antonio Brown thing is interesting to me, because I think if they were the team to pull it off, and I don't know that they will be, but if they were the team to pull it off, and I do believe they're interested. Yeah, so do I. Then I see as the answer to our question of the five options, the don't do much option, all right,

which is option one, the free agency for a Ryan Fitzpatrick or Teddy Bridgewater option two, the draft somebody early option three. The option four is sign a free agent and draft somebody, and then number five trade for Josh Rosen. I see the free agent and draft someone option. If you're going to trade for Antonio Brown. With Antonio Brown.

No, or it's number four. I'm sorry? No, the fourth option. The fourth option. I would agree with you. I think, look, now, they're going to pay Antonio Brown, or are they just going to leave him with his contract the way he is? Well, they don't have to pay him.

But you might have. But you don't want that guy unhappy. I know. I wouldn't do the Antonio Brown for a lot of those reasons. Well, I would do it just because it's the Redskins. I know. I said that yesterday. You would love it. If it's a reasonable franchise, I'm not going to do it, particularly in their situation.

But I think what you're saying is you've got to have something to sell Antonio Brown in a way. And, you know, to have him, you've got to sell him a veteran quarterback that he's going to throw him the ball next year, that he believes will get him the ball. And that's not, look, as much as I love Colt, you can't sell Colt on that. Exactly. You know? That's a big part of it, that if you had an Antonio Brown, and Antonio Brown might get excited about a Ryan Fitzpatrick.

You've got to convince him. Yeah, this guy, we'll get you the ball. Yeah, he can get you the ball. So if you went Ryan Fitzpatrick, Teddy Bridgewater, in my preference would be Fitzpatrick of the two for one year. And you went on a one-year deal, you know, and you drafted somebody. Okay, so you're going to draft somebody early enough that that's your quarterback in the future. Yes.

Right, that's your quarterback of the future. But I think Dan would want Rosen. But I think, you know, Bruce and Doug and Jay and Eric and, you know, Kyle may be able to say, look, the Rosen tape ain't great from last year. You know, I personally, Tommy, I've been a fan of Josh Rosen. I think he eventually will become a good NFL quarterback. I do too. I don't, what you saw last year, it's hard to judge. I would never judge it on numbers.

You've got to judge it on what you know you think his abilities are. But I think that they will say he's too far off. It would be a big jolt, but we can't put him out there next year with this group and really expect what we could expect with Ryan Fitzpatrick. Fitzpatrick may not be as big a marketing jolt, but in combination with Antonio Brown is the marketing jolt. It would be. Brown's presence is what, and again, I think we're all overstating this because even, say for Kyle or Murray, which obviously is not going to happen. But even if it did, my instincts tell me that this fan base is so damaged that it's a long way from a marketing job. Oh, I agree with you.

But from their perspective, from his perspective, he thinks I'm going to go back to doing what I used to do, winning March, winning April, and let's get some tickets sold here, and let's get some 84 jerseys out on the racks and out on the website. Yeah, I could see that. But I agree with you. I don't think that that's going to answer their big question. Winning is going to answer that. And it may have to be multiple years of winning at this point. Yes, I think so. Now, the Fitzpatrick thing is interesting to me, because he can play.

Like, if you put some stuff around him, he's going to break your heart six, seven, eight times a year. He's also going to have some of those Ryan Fitzmagic games where he throws for four or five touchdowns in 480 yards, especially if you're. You got a couple of weapons. He had some weapons in Tampa. Oh, yeah, he did. All right?

So I also think for a guy like him, if you had, you know, some talent, like you were bringing in some talent, you know, this would be the opportunity for him to start. Other opportunities he's going to look at are going to be backup opportunities more likely than not. I don't know what it'll cost him. That's the one thing. And I was trying to figure it out yesterday. I talked to a few people. One guy said he could get $10 million for one year. and another guy said he could get

3 million with a bunch of incentives depending on the situation Let's talk about Ryan Fitzpatrick for a second First of all he's a smart guy He's an Ivy League guy Okay who's probably played in the NFL Longer than he ever expected Oh yeah okay

So at this point If I'm thinking with his brain I'm just thinking about how much money Can I make wherever it is I don't even care if I start At this point of my life in my career I just want to get paid the most money I can. So I think that's going to be his decision.

Whoever pays him the most. That doesn't, that makes sense. You know, he is, I didn't even check on his age. I mean, these are his prime, right now, he's on the tail end of his prime earning years probably. He's got to be in his late 30s, right? Yeah, he has to be. He's 35, 36. He's 36.

He's 36 years old. He'll turn 37 during the season next year. And he probably made more money last year. than he ever did. I don't think so. No? I don't think he made more money, not as James Winston's backup.

Right? There's no way he was making more money last year as a backup. So, you know what, that's a really fair point, which means that he's going to, that Washington may not have the most money. But anyway, whether it's Fitzpatrick or Bridgewater or maybe Tanna Hill after he gets cut, not for trade.

But, you know, from their perspective, and you draft a quarterback for the future. You know, you draft, somehow you figure out a way to trade back to 25 and take Daniel Jones. So now you got Brown, Fitzpatrick, Daniel Jones. They sign Landing Collins because he wants to play where Sean Taylor played. And, you know, you make a bunch of cuts to increase the cap availability. You add some young players via the draft. You sign Brandon Sheriff.

Well, they're going to extend him. And that would be a benefit for the cap in 2019. but that would be an off-season, I think they believe they could sell. I don't think the Rosen thing happens. I just don't think that the football people are going to look at Rosen's tape from last year and say, that's our answer. It may be the answer in 2022 or 2021, but it's not the answer in 2019. Again, on Rosen, if they really are interested,

the exercise they should be going through is put them on the 2019. 19 draft board. Exactly. Where is he? On our big board, where is he? Is he number 16 or is he number 87? You know, forget the ranking of

quarterbacks. Well, I think that's what you need to consider. I wouldn't because they've got so many other needs. And I think Rosen would be the best long-term deal, but you're right. They're probably thinking next year. What can we do?

Especially since if you really believe that Jake Gruden's job is in jeopardy, he's got to be thinking about next year. I think the Antonio Brown and Josh Rosen stories are an indication, and I mentioned this yesterday, that Snyder cannot do another year of the revenue number that they've done. I'm not talking about the TV revenues, all the other stuff that they keep, that he can't do that another year, and that, you know, Bruce is feeling some heat. You know, this is not a Bruce era. Bruce wants to nickel and dime. I don't know if Bruce is feeling

heat. He may not. Jay's feeling the heat. Jay's feeling the heat. But more importantly, this all, the root of all of this conversation over the weekend is an owner who is saying, I can't let you guys, you know, give me Pernell McPhee, Paul Richardson in Orlando Scandrick this offseason. Seriously. That's a good point. It's exactly what he's saying. I cannot, Bruce, I love you. You give me cover. You're my voice and face in league meetings and everywhere else. And we're good friends. I cannot do another offseason with Pernell McPhee, Stacey, Stacey, and Orlando Scandrick. Can't do it.

I can't sell any of that. He wants some action, and he's going to get it. He would really love Kyler Murray. But he can't get. No, he's not going to be there. He may want Rosen. I think they're going to talk him out of Rosen. I watched a bunch of the games yesterday.

Cooley did a film breakdown. I like Rosen. Cooley likes him. Doesn't love him. I don't, you know, I don't think he thinks that Rosen is the right path. And that's not to indicate that the Redskins are feeling that way, because I don't think he would know anyway what they're thinking right now. I think that the better option for them, I mean,

I think they're going to come to the conclusion that the better option is, let's go get ourselves some Antonio Brown and Ryan Fitzpatrick. You realize that the perfect guy for Antonio Brown would have been Joe Flacka. Oh, yeah. Would have been the perfect guy. Yeah. The perfect match. But Joe Flacco is not the good match for the Jay Gruden system,

and that's not where they want to go. And by the way, they can't sell Joe Flacco. I know. All right. What of these five options, the don't do much option, the free agency option, the draft somebody early option, the combination of free agency and draft somebody or the trade for Josh Rosen, which one would you prefer? I've got a preference, but which one would you prefer? Well, if I were running the franchise, and again, it's hard to say, unless you know how well, I would do one. or five.

And five would be based on how I have Josh Rosen rated. I think it's hard to judge Josh Rosen's rookie year. He was in arguably, you know, the worst coaching situation in the league with the Cardinals. He was the youngest quarterback in that draft class of last year. So he's probably the farthest away in terms of success and development from the other young quarterbacks that were in that class. If you really like Josh Rosen and you have a chance to pick him with the 15th pick in the first round

essentially at a minimum, I would do number five. But if you're not in love with Josh Rosen, I do number one. I stand pat and draft a quarterback maybe in the third round. I would not trade 15 for Josh Rosen. I wouldn't do it. What if you have him highly rated?

I just right now, without getting into all of the thoughts on the draft, I just think this is a draft where you can get a great player. Like nothing's a lock in the NFL draft, but you have a higher probability of drafting a great player at 15 than Josh Rosen in this draft. I just do. Josh Rosen, to me, I liked him as a college quarterback. I think he will eventually become a good NFL

quarterback. But there's still a really good chance he could also end up becoming Blake Bordels or Gino Smith or Brandon Whedon or Blaine Gabbard or Christian Ponder. I'm not, I can't imagine that they've got Josh Rosen or any team would have Josh Rosen rated as the 15th best player on their 2019 board. I don't think anybody would. If you told me that I could get him for a third or a package, of, you know, a third and a fifth. That's way too cheap. Then I might roll the dice. Look, for one thing, I think the Cardinals...

And then not draft somebody? I think the Cardinals are going to get a lot for them. I think it's... I don't know what they're going to get for them. You know what? It doesn't seem... Apparently, I didn't know this on yesterday's show, but apparently Peter King wrote that a third is what it'll take.

Is that what he wrote? Somebody sent me that on Twitter. wrote that Kurt Warner and an unnamed NFL general manager said, I wouldn't give up any more than a third round pick four. Okay. So that seems crazy to me. Seems crazy. But I would definitely, if it only took a third, that would be a no-brainer.

Because then you're just saying, all right, how do I rate him versus the other quarterbacks? Because if I really have him as the third best quarterback, and there are four that are gone, And I have them as a second round grade or a first round grade, and I can get him for a third. You might as well. And then you don't draft the other quarterback. But you still, if you trade for Josh Rosen, I think you still, because he's on a rookie deal, I think you still consider signing a veteran-free agent if you aren't sure about Colt. I think one of the things all of this says is that while Jay, not disputing that Jay likes Colt a lot,

the rest of the organization does not want to settle for Colt McCoy, not just from a marketing standpoint, because we've already seen this a couple of times now, including last year. I'm not sure you can put Bruce in that category. What do you mean? I'm not sure. Again, Bruce has been. Bruce wanted Alex Smith last year. I get that, but he's also been one of Colts biggest fans.

As a backup quarterback. Everybody's a fan of Cold out there as a backup quarterback. Okay. I just don't know that anybody other than Jay really thinks that they can do a lot. Did you hear Jay's comments last week? Yeah. about I could be ignorant, you know, about cold. He just, he's blinded a little bit by the fact that he's worked with this guy now for five years.

And the kid, I say kid, he's a first-rate human being. Yes. And a great teammate and a great guy in the quarterback's room. And he can do a lot of things. Of course, he never has the chance to do a lot of things. He can't stay on the field. Right. So, but again, it's hard to say what you would do because you don't know what people think of Josh Rosen.

If it were me, I do one or five. I think they'll do four because of them. What would you do? I'm going to stick with what I've been saying all along, which is I would blow the whole thing up this year. This would be the year. They're not doing it. You're not doing it.

You would do one. I would do one. I would do one. I would absolutely do one. And by the way, I would certainly think about drafting a quarterback this year. But that's only if I really, were convinced, but part of the blow-it-up option would have already begun with me, because Bruce would have been gone, and Jay would have been gone, and I would have had a new general manager,

and I would have had a new head coach and a new coaching staff, and we would have been building for the future. I would have taken the campaign for Alex Smith in 2019. I would trade a guy like Trent Williams, where I could get real value back, Ryan Carrigan, where I could get some value back. I'd cut all the guys that would create huge salary cap savings and look at nothing but young drafted players or young players in free agency and target 2020 as the first year I'm going to try to compete. It doesn't mean you don't try to compete next year. And it doesn't mean that it will work because Cleveland's really one of the only recent examples. And it hasn't worked yet. No, it has. Okay. Let's remember this. It has not worked yet. They haven't played a

playoff game to my, I don't think they have yet. I just, I would start Colt McCoy next year. I would re-sign Josh Johnson. If there weren't a great court, I'd take somebody in the draft as a quarterback, worst case, somebody that I thought I could develop over the next couple of years. And if I really loved somebody, like Daniel Jones or, you know, I'm talking about my new general manager, if he really loved, you know, Drew Locke and said, this is the guy. We got to give up next year. We've got to give up a second, a third, and we've got to give up a second, a third, and next year's third to move up to number six to draft them. You know, that's fine, if I can answer my quarterback for the future in this particular draft. But if I'm not convinced, I am just loading up on picks.

I'm loading up on young bodies. Trent Williams is not going to be around when I'm ready to compete. Ryan Kerrigan is, you know, not what, you know, most people think he is anyway. and by the time we get to the point of having a legitimate chance to compete, he's going to be into his early to mid-30s, mid-30s at that point, that would be my option. I don't think, now, if you told me that that's a separate conversation from, if you got Ryan Fitzpatrick and Antonio Brown and Landon Collins,

and you drafted well and you drafted a defensive, I don't know what they're going to have to give up for Antonio Brown. I wouldn't give up a first-round pick for Antonio, Brian. I said that yesterday. I think that there's higher risk of complete and utter dysfunction and 80 catch seasons rather than 110 catch seasons versus the opposite, which is he's a superstar for three years. I think there's a higher downside, more likely downside than there is upside. If you're betting, you're betting on dysfunction. Absolutely. But if you told me they're going to get Ryan Fitzpatrick, Antonio Brown,

Landon Collins, are going to clear some cap space, they're going to draft a big-time defensive pass rusher at 15 overall because they only had to give up a second to get Antonio Brown. I am going to tell you that they've got a chance to win nine games next year. They've got a chance to win nine games. That's reasonable. They're not going to, they're not a Super Bowl contender. They're not an NFC championship contender.

And I don't even know if, by saying nine games, they're a playoff contender. Right, exactly. But they will be much better than right now where I have them, which is a double-digit loss season. The six and a half. Yeah. Was the last year's over-under?

Last year's was six and a half? So I projected that this year's over-under is going to be six, six and a half, somewhere around there. I think that's where it's going to be, and I think that makes a lot of sense. You know, you're making a lot of sense. But I don't want that. I don't want that. I want option one.

I want all these idiots out of here, and I want to start over. But the problem is, and everybody's right, and whenever I go down this path, you all say, well, what makes you think Dan Snyder is going to be able to start over the right way with the right people? Nothing. Nothing tells me he would be able to do that.

So. Let me ask you a question. And this is just an aside to this. Did you talk about or did it entreat you at all in, who's the quarterback from Ohio State? Dwayne Haskins? Dwayne Haskins. that he mentioned that he's friends with Dan Snyder's son in a story? I did not see that.

He went to Bullis High School. Yeah. Well, uh... Yeah, Dan's son went to prep first and then transferred to Bullis and that's where he's been. I think he graduated. Is he done at Bullis or he might still be there? I don't know, but Dwayne Haskins mentioned that he's friends with Dan Snyder. This is the first reference I've ever really seen to, and I give Snyder,

credit for his to one of his children. I mean, he has kept them protected and out of the limelight. And, I mean, people have never even thought about that. But I thought that was interesting that Dwayne Haskin says he's friends with Dan Snyder's son. Well, I have heard that Dan's son is a great kid, great kid from multiple people who would have no, you know, no built-in bias at all. Is he ready to take over the team yet? What is he? 17 maybe?

I think that's probably right. Yeah. I, all year long, on the podcast, Dwayne Haskins, all the talk. I was from the jump.

I was like, I'm not a Dwayne Haskins fan. Somebody's going to make a mistake drafting him super high. Cooley did the film breakdown of him last week and then had it on the show yesterday. And Cooley thinks he has high. high bust potential.

And I agree with that. Now, no one else is saying that. In fact, he came out of Indy, and people are loving him. They love Locke too. I like Locke a lot more. Cooley apparently does too. But personally, out of all these quarterbacks, none of them looks like, you know, Andrew Luck. No.

In terms of like, can't miss. None of them do. My point is about bringing up the sun is this may be the only hope. for Redskins fans, sort of like a mixture of what happened in Dallas. But Dan's only 54, 55 years old. The kid's not going to take over or start running the team like Stephen Jones does at 18. Wouldn't you have to wait until he's at least 21? I think so.

I think so. I'm just looking. Is that, Bruce gets fired next year and Dan's son takes over his team president? It's possible. I mean, what would the reaction to that be? I really have. I mean, I've never, I mean, this is the first time I think his son or any of his kids, to your point, they've been kept completely out of the limelight, which is great for the parents. Again, I give them tremendous credit for that. Me too, but I have, I probably heard this Tommy no less than four or five times over the last few years, people who I know who have kids in school with him, that he's a great kid, great kid. I think Cooley knows him really well and says he's a great. I think he's named after Dan's father.

Yeah, Jerry. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, there's hope out there, Redskins fans. Wouldn't it be interesting to get his thoughts on the way his father runs the team? I, the Rosen thing, I'm going to make, we made our predictions, but one prediction I'm going to be adamant, and I'll probably be 100% wrong on. I don't think they're going to trade for Josh Rosen. I don't think they're going to do it.

In part because I think you are right in that the Cardinals are going to be looking for a lot more than I think anybody's going to be willing to give them. And here's the one thing that could benefit the Redskins in this process is that there's not really, it doesn't appear there's this big market for Josh Rosen. If Arizona is trying to move him. But I think Arizona would keep him for another year rather than deal him for. a third. Boy, that is egg all over your face. Not that they should care about that. I was thinking about this last night because I was reading something and somebody said, boy, the Cardinals would be super embarrassed if a year after drafting Josh Rosen, they traded him for like a second round pick or a third round pick. Not when you bring in a new coach. It's a clean slate. You have a new coach

with new demands, new ideas. You can easily chalk it up to that. Totally agree with you. But, if he really showed elite promise, we wouldn't be having this conversation because they wouldn't be drafting Kyler Murray. If they really thought, so I'm with you that, look, new people, new ideas, new offensive ideas, you know, new way. I mean, you change your mind after a year. And sometimes it has nothing to do with the player. And it has to do with the people who are making the decisions.

But if they saw in Josh Rosen in year one elite potential, we're not having this conversation. They wouldn't draft Kyler Murray. That's a good point. I mean, the only caveat is Kingsbury has this relationship with Murray. Yeah, but if the team saw that Josh Rosen last year was, wow, this is going to be the guy. You're right. They would have told Cliff Kingsbury before they hired him. We've got the guy for you.

Yeah. Or we'll go get somebody else to coach the team. That's a good point. So, you know, Steve Kimes, a pretty good general manager, has been a pretty decent GM in the league. They had a terrible coaching situation last year, no doubt. And I'm just, after spending a year with the guy, there would have been a, if he were really the next, if he were the chosen one, if he were the next great, you know, Aaron Rogers type, they wouldn't be. in the market of talking Tyler Murray.

A good point. Unless this is a, unless they really do feel that way about Rosen, and they're trying to generate as much as they can for the number one overall for another team that wants Murray.

I don't think that's it. I think they're going to draft for Murray. So anyway, all right, what else on that? Oh, I want to, so Antonio Brown, you'd love it as a reporter and as a columnist, I understand that.

But he wouldn't play for my team. Yeah, not me either. No way this guy played for my team. guy that admitted that he doesn't need football two days ago. This is the guy who quit on his teammates. Yeah. I mean, not playing for my team, but he's got Redskins written all over him. He's so good. No, he has Dan and Vinny Redskins written all over him. Yeah. Not Bruce. You know, Bruce, this is not a Bruce move. No. You know, Bruce, if Antonio Brown was sitting there and could be had for hardly anything, he'd still rather nickel and dime Paul Richardson's agent to get the best possible deal.

that's why I think this last weekend more than any other here in the off season is the first real indication that Dan is desperate, that Dan is frustrated and that the recognition of what kind of economic, what kind of business impact the last few years have had on his organization and where it's headed. Because Tommy, I guarantee you they are struggling to sell ticket number one for next season right now. You don't have to convince me of that. I know it. Yeah. So. And it's a long road back. I want to get Tommy's thoughts on Bryce Harper next. Real quickly, though, on Window Nation. It's time for winter and the crazy cold weather to end, but there's one thing that you need to do.

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me. Harley, Aaron, Eric, they're the best. They will take good care of you, I promise. 86690 Nation or windonation.com. All right. Since we last spoke, Bryce Harper signed the deal. It happened that afternoon. It did happen that afternoon. And I thought about calling you to have you on on Friday, but I just said, you know what, I'll wait till Tuesday so we can do it in longer form. All right. Were you surprised? I really, well, again, once the Dodgers, got reintroduced in it, you know, that got me all juiced up at the idea I may finally, you know, accidentally fall into having made the right call months ago by the Dodgers. And, you know, I give, I give Boris credit for in the last week or so, actually ginning up a bidding war by getting the Dodgers and the Giants involved in it.

You know, the two teams who were real rivals with each other. but no I you know looks one Bob Nightingale wrote in November that he was going to be in a Phillies uniform I tended to believe that was going to happen I mean and particularly after they did not sign Mani Machado the Phillies were not going to come away from this postseason with this off season without one of those guys not when their owner had publicly declared I've got all this silly stupid money to spend and he doesn't spend it on either of the two high-priced free agents once Macha got signed by San Diego, then I think it was inevitable that Harper went to the place that gave the most money and that was Philadelphia.

On the Los Angeles and San Francisco offers, Aaron and I talked about this on Friday, in many ways they would have looked better with the average annual on the Dodgers three million, three year for $145 million deal, I think it was, or three for $135, whatever it was, at $45 million per year. That would have made, I mean, saving face is such an interesting. conversation when you're talking about $330 million for 13 years. But there was a sense of what Boris and Harper were going to look like at the end of this based on this process that didn't go exactly the way they thought it would. And would they save face? And I just thought that a $45 million per year deal

with the Dodgers for three years or whatever it amounted to be would have been a true saving of face. More than the Philly deal, which included no opt out? I don't think it would have been. The no opt out doesn't really, I mean, mean a whole lot. If he's not happy in Philadelphia, they'll trade him at some. There's a no trade clause, too. But he can waive it. He can say, you know, he can waive it. He's in charge of that. Seemed like a pretty sincere long-term commitment from both parties, though, don't you think? Yeah, it did. The way the contract was structured? Yeah, it did. But it could change it in four or five years between between the the two of them uh you're right about the face saving this is why

that you know look boris is is such an egomaniac uh and the if you'll notice that the the trashing of the nationals offer to him back in late september didn't start until he signed his deal with the fillies you see that offer that the nationals made to him before he became a free agent served Boris and Harper well throughout free agency. Okay, this is, let's stop here because this is, this is, you have an issue with the way this offer has been described by many. Well, okay, we'll get to that. But my point is there was a, I mean, right out there,

there was this $300 million offer always hanging out there by the nationals that they made to him at the end of September. This meant that Boris and Harper. Is it September or November? The end of September. Okay. This meant that Boris and Harper, and I put the two together because Harper's no innocent in this, could go to all the other teams and say, look, that's the bottom line.

That's where you start from. We have a starting point. It's $300 million. But the perception of the starting point was low to begin with. No, no, it wasn't. It was. No, it wasn't. No, it was $300 million.

I understand what the number was, but the perception at that point in September. was still in the $400 million plus range. No, it wasn't. No one was saying $400 million in September. They weren't saying $300. Kevin, if that $300 million offer did not exist, where do you think teams would have started from? I don't know, but I don't know that it was as much of a help. Oh, it was a tremendous help. Okay. It gave them basically something that they could say, look, this is where you start. What about the team started and say $250 million? What about the deferred money portion of it? Okay. Well, I mean, that's part of the thing. You didn't hear anything. about how terrible this deal was that the national offer.

Which included, according to John Heyman, $120 million of deferred money. Which isn't true. That's simply not true. Okay. Okay. John Heyman is Scott Boris's hatchet man. Everybody knows that.

Everybody in the business knows it. I mean, Haman. Was there any deferred money? Yes, there was deferred money. How much? I'd say it was. was in real value, real money, it was, look, Bob Nightingale wrote in January that it was a $284 million real money offer. Okay. He did write that in January. Yes. And it was, and it was very close to that.

You know what's interesting is with the Nightingale report, you can correct me if I'm wrong, because you probably will. I don't remember that report, but I wasn't following it as closely as you were. That would have indicated at $284 million in present money, in present day money on a $300 million deal that there was deferred money. Yes, there was deferred money on the Scherzer deal. There's deferred money on the Strasbourg deal. I mean, this is the way Boris and the learners have done business. So Hayman's report was basically a Boris report.

Yes. Okay. That's exactly it. And it's criminal, not criminal, but it's embarrassing that other people in the media reported that out there, Sports Illustrated, the Washington Post. It was wrong. It was just simply wrong. And, but, but again, you got to look at agenda and, and whose purpose does this serve?

Once they signed the deal with Philly, then it was in Boris's best interest to diminish the nationals deal as much as possible in order to say, look what a great deal we got from the Phillies compared to what the nationals offer us. I understand that. So, I mean, so it was, but it wasn't in his best interest to downplay that deal until they got. got a contract signed. You didn't hear, you didn't hear word one added to Borough's camp about how bad the Nationals offer was. All right. This is good. Until they signed with the Phillies. I hear where you're coming from. I would ask this one question of you though. Do you, whatever the Nats offer was, and let's say it's exactly what Nightingale and what you think it was, and that the Hayman report, and those that jumped on the Hayman report about all of this deferred money, which made the offer,

not a real offer, not a serious offer, which is what Hayman tweeted. He said, it wasn't a serious offer from the Nats. But regardless of what that offer was, do you think it was an offer from the Nationals that the Nationals thought Harper would sign? No, I think they thought it was a starting point. Listen, when you negotiate with somebody, unless you're negotiating against yourself.

I understand. You start low, but you expect the other guy to come back. Did they expect him to come back? Yes. They did. And they never did. Because they didn't really want, because they really didn't want to sign a deal.

here. I mean, they, they maybe had, I don't know what their visions were, but Boris and Harper, I mean, again, if you're negotiating a contract, you're not going to say a month after you make an offer, I make an offer to you, and then you don't respond. And then a month later, I call you up and say, oh, that wasn't enough. Let me offer you some more money. I mean, you expect the response. Did they ever talk again? Did they ever? talked after the September offer. They talked when they went to Ted Lerner's house, like they do every December. Lerner goes out to Ted Lerner's house and Palm Springs House.

Boris does. Goes out to Ted Lerner's house. And I think that they expected, like it did in years past, that they would get an offer that, you know, would be like a Christmas present for them. And they didn't get that. And they never countered, never countered. with any kind of offer to the national saying, well, you know, that's a good starting point,

but we would consider this. You see, they didn't want to do that. They didn't want to make, they didn't want to put a target out there. I think you're, what if, what if they came back to the nationals and said, you know what, we'll take, uh, 10 years, 325 million dollars. And the national said, okay. What if Boris said, wow, you know, I, did I just, did I just,

screw myself out of more money in the market with other bidders? What do you think the Nats would have been willing to go up to? I don't know. I don't know that. Because it doesn't always work the way you have suggested that it works. It doesn't always. I'm not saying that there isn't always a lower starting point. And I think, by the way, that that is something that should be explored. I hear what you're saying and everything you're saying makes sense. But if that first offer was perceived to be super low, then they could, could have just said, we're moving on somewhere else.

But it wasn't perceived to be super low until they got the Phillies contract deal. Then it suited their purposes. I remember when we heard about that deal thinking that was kind of low. 300 million? Yes. 10 years, 300 million. The perception I thought, and again, I could be wrong. My perception was that most people said in the moment because there was this thought that, you know,

Bryce Harper was worth, that the deal was going to be worth a lot more than 300 million. hundred million dollars that it was low. That it was a low offer. For a guy who wasn't a free agent yet? Yes. Oh, no, just the opposite. Okay, so. The Nationals offer was perceived as a very fair offer.

Let me also just mention one other thing that you're not entirely correct on. More times than not, you're right on. But if the Nationals made that offer, and their true intention was, we want Bryce Harper here. We want to keep Bryce Harper. And they made that offer as a true starting point offer with the expectation or hope that would be countered by Boris and Harper. You know, Boris and Harper don't have to counter that offer. No, they don't.

At that point, you know, depending on the way it was received, they were going to go to free agency, and they were going to let the market speak. And, you know, the nationals, if they really wanted him, didn't have to wait for a counter, especially as this thing dragged on. Remember, it's dragging on much longer than anticipated. Yes.

So if the Nats had really wanted Harper, they could have gone back to Boris and said, we're upping our offer. That's not totally unusual, all right? You know, you can call bidding against yourself. You are bidding against yourself. But the issue is, do you want them or not? So if $300 million was our starting point, and this thing's dragging on, and it's clear they're not coming back to us, and we really want them,

it wouldn't be unheard of for the Nats to then go to Boris and to go to Harper and say, look, we've upped our office. This is our last offer, but we'll give you $3.25 for 10 years. What if Boris and Harper had taken the Nationals offer? The first offer? Yeah. They were never going to do that. But what if they did?

Would that be an indication that they didn't want him? Well, it would be, wouldn't that? Would that be a sign that say, well, we don't really want you, but we're going to pay you close to $300 million over 10 years. Rephrase. And other words. Ask the question again, because I'm not following. If Boris and Harper said when the Nationals offered them the $300 million deal said, okay, we'll take it.

Are the Nationals stuck with a player they didn't want? I don't think that the Nationals thought he'd ever accept that offer. But what if he did? But he wasn't going to. But what if he did, Kevin? Well, what if he was a female? What do you mean? No, what if he really wanted to stay in Washington?

It's not unfair for you to ask the question because they actually made the offer. Yes. So once you make the offer, if you are at risk of somebody accepting that offer, okay? And you don't make that kind of, you don't make that a $300 million risk for a player that you don't want. I would suggest to you that they had to make some offer or look in the court of public opinion as if they just let a superstar player leave. Yes. Based on their decision. And again, when they made that offer, the court of a public opinion was that's a reasonable.

offer. I disagree with that. Oh, well, you need to go back and check. Aaron, do you remember it that way? I remember it as a reasonable starting point, but nobody on the planet expected him to sign a 10-year-300 million dollars a deal. But that's not a reasonable starting point. It wasn't a low-ball offer? But the point is that there was nobody that was in that moment.

Nobody thought it would be accepted. No, nobody did at that point. Okay, that's my point. Yeah, but that's not the same thing as the perception that it was a low-ball offer. But the risk wasn't significant on the Nats part because they knew we wouldn't accept it. Well, it was because he could have accepted it. What if his wife said to him who supposedly wanted to say in Washington, saying, you need to take that deal.

Do you know what I think, Tommy? I think that there's aspects of this that are both accurate. I think that the learners in every business they've ever been involved in, including this business and remember when they were a, potential bidder for the Redskins in 1999. They pencil this thing out to the last nickel. I'm not saying that they didn't start lower, you know, from a negotiating standpoint, but they knew what their number was, and they weren't going above it for anybody.

And yes, the possibility existed that didn't Strasbourg sort of accept a deal pretty quickly and not hit free agency? And, you know, I guess that possibility with a Boris client existed, but I think they would have been fine had he accepted the deal, but they knew he wasn't going to accept it. And they needed to make an offer. They couldn't not make an offer, right? Yes. Okay. I don't know. Everything you said about the deferred money is interesting because there's no question that people took this Heyman report and took it as fact. A lot of people did. Right. And it was nothing but a Boris fairy tale. And it was a way to really belittle the Nationals'

offer. And why would that be? Yeah, no, I understand the motivation from Boris. I didn't realize that it was very little in deferred money. Not only did Heyman report that it was, you know, over $100 million in deferred money, he also reported that Major League Baseball may have had a problem with the contract because it was so much deferred money, including deferred money that Bryce wouldn't have gotten until he was 60 years old. Well, that's not simply not true.

All right. I mean, again, look, everybody in the business knows that if it's coming from Haman, it's coming from Bors. What do you think? It's the worst kept secret in the media. What do you think of, this isn't a unique take, I'm not suggesting it is, but one of the things that we had talked about in previous weeks is some of the reports that Bryce wanted a real baseball town, you know, wanted a real sports town. And on Friday, I just made the point that this was always, he was going to leave here. He wanted to find a place where it was much more important. He didn't want to look up into the stands in a thrilling playoff game and see two-thirds of the people left because it was too cold or too long or the metro was about to close and they were going to miss the last train.

I think that was a part of this. Do you? I think that's exaggerated. I think it's really exaggerated. Why? I mean, the last playoff series, the Metro came and went and nobody left that ball ballpark. And there were a hell of a lot of Cubs fans in the park. Nobody left that year before.

I think you're overblowing and exaggerating this now. The Cubs thing was the year that the Metro started to stay open. And by the way, when the Indians played the Cubs in the World Series, Cleveland was filled with Cubs fans. Fine. And Cleveland is... I think Bryce Harper is a huge sports fan. I think he recognizes the difference between a city like Philadelphia. I think Bryce Harper is a marketing fan.

And I think Bryce Harper markets Bryce Harper. And I think this is the perfect marriage. He's got the perfect agent in Scott Boris. The two of them deserve each other. If the Nats had made a $330 million, 13 year, no opt-out, no trade clause, would he have taken this deal or Philly's deal?

That's interesting. I think he wouldn't have taken either deal. I think he would have waited. He would have waited. So he'd still not be in spring training somewhere? Boris and Harper didn't something. their first contract with Washington after he got drafted until 30 seconds left in the deadline. In that words, like, there was 30 seconds left when they had to make the deal after they drafted Harper to sign him,

or else he'd go back into the draft the following year. He talked about in that one of the interviews over the weekend from Philadelphia's spring training, he talked about Philadelphia being a great sports town. He mentioned that a couple of times in the fans in Philadelphia. Philadelphia and how hardcore. I don't. I actually don't think I am. But besides that, how about the slip up on the DC line? No big deal. No big deal at all. I mean, I don't care about I care more about this notion that he sort of painted this idea that his decision to leave was beyond his control, that it just didn't work out. What does that mean? It just didn't work out.

You weren't an innocent bystander in this. Look, Anthony Rendon basically put it on the line. He works for me. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, you weren't innocent in this. Isn't it interesting, though, that the agent-athlet relationship, how many different forms it can take, because there are athletes, no question in my mind,

that totally rely on the agent to make all of the decisions for them. And that is why you've got so many bad contract decisions being made in baseball right now. That's why you have so-called free agents out there on the market. without jobs because they're getting bad advice from their agents not to take the offers that they get early in the process that's saying wait no there'll be more money to come along and then they wind up holding the bag I mean right now baseball has a free agency problem it's the union's problem it's the agents problem it's a it's an interesting personality human condition issue though because these players tend to be when they're signing these major deals younger

than older, and in terms of real business or life experience, naive. And the agents become this trusted person. No, no, no, you can't sign here. And the player may feel, Coley's told me this a lot. Cooley was not one of those players. He basically took control of his own thing and told the agent what to do. But he said there were so many players that he played with that just would do whatever their agent told them to do, whatever they told them to do. And that's why you've got guys in baseball. And maybe Bryce is that guy. I don't see him as being that guy. And again, this note, this ridiculous comment that he said,

from the minute I got in Washington, all the discussion was about where would I go? Where would I go? Where would I go? Like he was driven out of D.C. From all the talk about people. Well, you had Scott Boris as your agent. From the minute you arrived, you had the agent that takes almost all of his clients to free agency.

Of course that was going to be the narrative. Of course that was going to be the discussion from day one. But this notion that he was like Nationals, fans and media talked this into existence. It was ridiculous. You know what, though? He's not wrong that the minute he signed here, it was when is he going to be in New York as a Yankee? Why? If he had Pinkus McCoy as his agent, do you think that would have been a discussion?

No, I think, but wasn't he, didn't he sort of, he was a Yankee fan, right? Yes. So that was part of it. But Boris drove that. Boris's presence, whether, whether through, whether he meant it or not, but if you sign, if Scott Boris is your agent and you're the most heralded young player to come out, to come into the draft in decades, people were, I mean, the clock is ticking from the moment you arrived. All right. If you're A-Rod 2, you're going to free agency. Final few exits of questions here, all right?

Number one. Are the Phillies with everything they've done in the off-season and now adding Harper? Are they the favorite, or are the nationals the favorite in the National League East this year? I think it's a dead heat. I mean, I think you could have a team win 89 games this year in that division and win the division.

They're going to beat up on each other. Look, the Braves won a division last year. I know. I know. People forget that. I didn't do much, but they did ask, they did Adonelson. You know, the Mets still have great pitching, you know, and they made some changes. And the Phillies made some tremendous changes to their lineup.

They have to be considered a co-favorit, but the nationals are a much better team than the team that finished the season last year. Much better. Exit question number two. Are the Nats ultimately better off without them or not? and there are two ways to look at this, the roster and then the business of the nationals. Do you agree that there are two ways to look at it? Yeah, yeah, there are.

Look, if you have an ownership that is saying we're not going to spend beyond this amount of money, and then the Nats are top six or seven spender in baseball. Right. Okay. They're better off without. them if you're going to limit your spending. If you're working within a budget,

you can use that money in other places, which they did. And every place they use that money, they help themselves a lot. So if you're working within a budget, they're better off not paying him. From a marketing standpoint, obviously the impact he has had in Philadelphia

with the ticket sales and the jerseys is unprecedented, particularly with the jerseys. Right. and that is going to hurt the Nats maybe initially to some extent. But in baseball, more than as much as any other sport, individual players don't move the needle that much. Winning, it's much more of a team-oriented sales pitch as much as anything. So, I mean, while it will have an impact,

if the nationals are in the postseason next year, that stadium will be filled. and they'll be selling Juan Soto and Victor Roebois jerseys. Just keep in mind, not every postseason game's been sold out. I know you want to downplay that a little bit. No, they haven't been. Yes, they have been. No, you go back to that St. Louis Game 1 was not a sold-out ballpark.

You might want to check that. I'm pretty sure I'm right about that. I was there for that game one. The place was, you know, three-fourths filled. Okay. It was a day game. It was a 12-noon first pitch. That was the first playoff game ever.

Yeah, which should have been incredible excitement, right? Okay, so that's that if you're right, and I doubt that you're right. I was there for the giant game when the place was a third full at the end. The 18 inning game? Yeah, 18 innings. One of the most thrilling games in Major League Baseball history recently in the postseason. The 18 inning game, that's unbelievable. It was a third full.

You would bring that. Oh, I understand that. And I give them credit to the people who stay. Oh, you do? It was cold that day. Attendance was 45,000 for that. That's a sale out. Okay, but I'm telling you the stadium was,

not full. But they sold out. Okay. They sold out, but not everybody showed up. Maybe they were forced to buy all the playoff tickets. Maybe after your fifth beer, you didn't notice the Phil seats. You and I did the show from down there that day. We did a show from there, and then I thought we both stayed for the game. Well, I know I stayed for the game. I did too. Um, exit question number two or three, when we're on now, do you think Bryce Harper's career will continue to be up and down or he'll become consistently great. He has the potential to be great all the time. I think it's going to be up and down.

Lastly, will the Nats get Craig Kimbril or not? And how big would it be if they did? I don't think it's that big. A lot of people would disagree with me. I don't think they're going to get them. Aaron, do you think they're going to get Kimbril or not? I'm going to say no, because they seem to really want stay under the luxury tax and I find it hard to believe that they'd be able to keep

them under the luxury tax if they signed Kimbril. Okay. I want to get to a couple of other things, but first real quickly, Ferrisch, Chrysler Dodge Jeep in Fairfax. If you're in the market for something new, a Chrysler Dodge Jeep, Subaru, they've got a Subaru dealership as well. Give them a shot. They're right there in the heart of Fairfax and Fairfax Circle. You can find out all you need to know about Ferris at Farishcars.com. If you head out there, ask for Ralph Perk, Ralph's a great guy. He runs the store there. He's in there every single day. Great rebates right now. Highest of the year, they're trying to get rid of all their inventory. That means great deal opportunities for you. The Jeep Cherokee, the Grand Cherokee, the Wrangler, lots of inventory and great deals on all three of those vehicles.

Same goes for the RAM pickup. If you like this show, you've been thinking about buying something new, I promise you that you'll be taken care of. They will take good care of you out at Ferris. Just ask for Ralph Perkins. Right there in Fairfax Circle or Farish Cars.com for live inventory, live pricing, and their best deals. A couple of things real quickly. Virginia last night was Tommy, they put on a show in the second half of the game at Syracuse that was one of the great shooting displays of all time. They shot 72% from the floor in the second half, 10 for 13 from behind.

the arc, and they outscored Syracuse in the Carrier Dome, 47 to 19 in the second half. In the game, Kyle Guy went 8 for 10 from behind the ark, tied Jerome 5 for 6 from behind the arc, and DeAndre Hunter, 5 for 7 from behind the ark against that 2-3 zone. So 18 of 23, those three players, on three pointers. They were 18 of 25 as a team. You know, Virginia is to me a team that absolutely has a chance and should be favored to go to the final four. And I felt the same way last year. Can they, can they do this again? I mean, not this, but, you know, how much of an exception is this for them to shoot like that? Well, that's an exception for almost anybody. That's one of the, not that this particular one, but even come close to it. No, I mean, you know, they, they,

faced a zone and they are well coached and knew how to handle the zone and they just got hot and they knocked down everything against Syracuse. And when Syracuse sits back in a two, three zone and if you really know what to do against the zone, you can get open looks and if you knock them down, they're in trouble. And I've never seen though a half like that. Aaron, have you? Did you watch it last night? The way they went off and turned what was a two point half time deficit, at one point I think they were down five in the first half. And it was one of the, those games, Virginia was a five and a half point favorite. I actually liked Syracuse last night and thought this was an easy cover and they've got a chance to win this game outright. And it just,

it went from being this tight, entertaining game to a Villanova like, you know, shooting performance from the 85 championship game against Georgetown, which was incredible to watch. Can they do this against anybody? Yeah, these are great shooters. Guy and Jerome are great shooters. Quick release shooters too. I just, you know, the thing about Virginia in watching Virginia play, and it's some of the same things that I've said about Maryland, Virginia is much better. Michigan is similar to Virginia in many ways. They play this lower possession game, and they are going to out-execute you on both ends, and they're just going to bludgeon you to death over 40 minutes with, you know, ridiculous defense, half-court defense, an unbelievable half-court offense, but when you play

a lower possession game, it does give a lesser team more of a chance. I get that, but it's the way they play. What you described sounds like basketball to me. Oh, I know what you're saying, but, well, that's not true. The basketball, oh my God, I got to write this down because I want to tell you about this. But the way you described, that sounds like basketball. No, well, they shoot a lot of threes. That's not basketball for you. I get that. They made, last night, they were 18 of 25. Let's see what they were on twos. They made 18, threes, and 10 twos. That's not basketball for you.

But execution, half-court basketball, tenacious defense. That all sounds like basketball. I know, but when you say that, some of the best fast-break basketball in the history of the game was in the 70s. And in the 80s. In the 80s. 70s, too. I mean, well, especially in the ABA. Yes. But even in your era, when you played in the 60s, I mean, you had some really good fast break teams and some great guard play. I don't want to get into this conversation. The point here is I still will pick Virginia to get to the final four. I mean, I don't see many teams that, I mean, Gonzaga, obviously Duke's beat him twice. I think Gonzaga could beat him. I think Kentucky could beat him. I think Tennessee would be an interesting game for them. I think Michigan State would be an interesting game. game if they're healthy. They've got to get the big guy back. Michigan, Virginia would be a really interesting game. I think Purdue, Virginia would be an interesting, but there aren't many teams that can beat them. And so if they get beat early again and they don't make it to the final four,

if Tony Bennett doesn't get this team to the final four, I would be shocked. I felt the same way last year, and I feel the same way this year, even knowing that the way they play does make them vulnerable, more vulnerable than say a North Carolina or a Gonzaga when, like, Gonzaga is a little bit different, although Gonzaga this year is incredible. But Carolina, when they've really got the talent and the way they play, it's hard to upset them, you know? They've got a better chance of winning six than a team that plays the way Virginia does. But God, I love Tony Bennett. I love the way they play. And I just don't see anybody beating them until the final four. Well, nobody should. Definitely nobody should.

I just wrote something down because I've been meaning to get to this with you, and I almost forgot it. Is it about King Kong Bundy? No, I'm going to tell you this right now. It's not about King Kong Bundy? It's not about King Kong Bundy. You can mention him if you want. Go ahead.

RIP, King Kong Bundy, one of the great wrestlers in the early days of WrestleMania. Am I right, Aaron? WrestleMania 2 main event. Yeah. I mean, one of the guys who really was very entertaining, wrestler, a great storyteller, and I'd recommend to anybody, you go find some of the King Kong Bundy interviews that have been done recently, the stories behind the scene about wrestling, and they're great stories.

The Bundys from Married with Children were named after him. Oh, really? Yes. Oh, I didn't know that. There you go. All right. The other night, it was actually two nights ago, Aaron, I told you I got up super early. Yes.

And I started to watch Jason, Jason Rosen. Josh Rosen film, but there was something on NBA TV at the same time. The 1963 NBA Finals were on television, and it was the way the game was broadcast by, I think it was ABC. It was the live broadcast of it. 1963 NBA Finals, Celtics Lakers. This is why I bring it up. This was Jerry West. This was Elgin Baylor for the Lakers.

It was Russell Hablicek, Kuzi. um, Heinson for, you know, Sam Jones, Sam Jones, Casey Jones for the Celtics. So I'm watching this game. And you know how there's been all these discussions over the years about, you know, what would this team from this era do against this team from this era? Tommy, I swear to you. You know I love basketball and know a little basketball. I'm watching this. And I've watched a lot of old NBA, you know, games before, YouTube or NBA, whatever. And the games from the 80s, I understand that.

that there's a physical difference in today's game than the 80s games, but magic would have been okay in today's game. The 1963 finals, it was game six that they had on. It was the game in which the Celtics won and clinched at the LA Sports Arena. The forum obviously was not built at that point. It was the Los Angeles Sports Arena. Tommy, neither one of those teams would win the WCAC High School League this year. neither one of those teams from

1963. Okay. I swear to you, it was so, I'm watching this, it's the first time I've ever watched like an old game and said, oh my God, they're not very good at all. Now, Russell had something to him. I watched this for,

I recorded it and ended up watching most of it late yesterday, but anyway, to make my point, Russell, there was something to him clearly, like he was a force, especially with this group of people. Elgin Baylor, you could see, was quite an athlete, you know, for the day. Wouldn't look that much different than anybody today.

Jerry West? I mean, slow, Cousie is a ball handler. Everybody talked about what a wizard he was. Tommy, anybody in today's high school, some of these high school teams, they'd rip west of the ball within three seconds. Now, part of it is that there was no defense. And no one played defense back then. You can watch games from the 70s and see that there wasn't much defense.

Like there was no getting up on somebody and really defending. I don't know what you're talking about because I grew up watching the Knicks in Walfraiser. Wall Fraser is one of the best defenders ever played in the guard position. I know you think that and it's a way you remember it. I'm not talking about WALFrasier. That's 10 years later now. Yes. Okay?

Right? The 73 Knicks were in the NBA finals? Yes. All right. So we're talking about 10 years before. You know, and there's also probably, and you need to help me with this, we were probably very much in the early days of real sort of, you know, African Americans becoming a significant part of basketball. Of course you were. I mean, you saw a lot of it with the Celtics because of Red Hour back then.

And, you know, I'm not sure you could even dunk in the NBA then. Oh, yeah, you could dunk in the NBA then. Yeah, Elgin Baylor. Elgin Baylor was quite a long arm. armed athlete. I mean, you could see what people said about Elgin Baylor, but I'm telling you, it was horrible basketball to watch. I mean, it just didn't, to me, I could be way off. And I, and I'm probably exaggerating this because these guys were still 6-7, 6-8, 6-10, you know, so I'm watching it. But the ball handling was terrible. The shooting was good.

These guys could all shoot, but they would shoot uncontested, basically. There wasn't a lot of defense. Russell, you would see flying at somebody a little bit to try to block a shot. And Russell had this physical and coordinated thing where he stood out, definitely stood out. But Coosie didn't stand out. Hablicek didn't stand out. West didn't stand out. Not to me. Listen. Watching this from 1963. Watch, I mean, you saw the 76 NBA finals with a Phoenix in Boston. And you're going to tell me Havlicek doesn't stand out?

I'm talking about this. That's 13 years earlier. Okay. Maybe there's just a massive difference between the basketball in the early to mid-60s and what it became in the 70s because it did become more of a

up-tempo game of the 70s. A game of rhythm, a game of athleticism more. You had Dave Cowan's who was an undersized but running center on those Celtics teams with Havlicek. You had Wes. And Jojo White you had on those 70s teams? Yeah, you had Wesk bringing, you know, tearing the ball down and throwing it, you know,

halfway down the court within two seconds. Look, I know Jerry West is one of the all-time greats. I mean, he's the logo. He's the logo. He's the logo. But the ball handling was so exposed. Like today's players, the players in the, like Michael Cooper, who was a great defender for the Lakers in the 80s. I mean, really, he consistently won the sixth man of the year award.

He was the Lakers best defender, although Byron Scott was a really good defender too. On a team that were magic, that was not magic strength defense. But like if Cooper 20 years later had played in this game, he would average 12 steals a game. I mean, it was just, it was odd to watch. If the next time that's on, you have to watch it. Any of you that are listening out there, the NBA TV, the next time, I'm sure they'll show the 1963 game six finals again. And just, if you saw it, tell me what you think, because it was not what I would call

anywhere, nothing about that game resembled what we watched today. Nothing about it. The passing was decent. there was a lot more passing, a lot less dribbling, and the shooting, these guys could all shoot it. Like this, you know, but wow, the pace, there's no defense, the ball handling, it was crazy, crazy. Again, that's, you still had guys shooting set shots.

That's before I ever watched basketball, so I'm not going to. Well, you, I mean, you joined the Nixon 64, I thought. No, no, no, I came along in 68. All right. What are you looking up? You were looking up something. I'm trying to explain to you. you that that defense was not an afterthought later in that decade and that Walt Fraser

was one of the best defenders to ever play his position. And for the era, it's probably true. Look, the 80s didn't have a ton of defense. You know, people talk to me about the great 1974 ACC tournament final between Maryland and NC State. Some people call it the greatest college basketball game ever played. Right. It was the game that changed the rule for the NCAA tournament, which made it, you know, they called it the Maryland rule. Back then, only one team from each league went to the tournament.

And after Maryland was the number four team in the country, lost to number one NC State in the ACC final, 103 to 100 in overtime, then next year they opened up the tournament to more teams and more than one team per league. But that game has been on TV many times over the years. And there's a high degree of skill. but there was no defense in the game. Like, you know, that game and the way it was played could not be competitive. But there's no defense now. Oh, there's some defense.

Oh, there is not. No, different conversation. It's very hard to defend. And you're right. There's some teams like the Wizards right now who aren't even interested in defense. But the capability, you know, when you get to the postseason, remember I'm watching postseason games. Postseason baseball.

Well, Pell season basketball, NBA defense still is still in play. So I'm talking about a postseason game that I watched where there was none. In the 80s, if you go back and you watch a Lakers Celtics NBA finals game, compared to the postseason games, you know, now defense was optional even then. But, you know, the problem today is, let me make one last point, the problem today with defense is it's just not good enough to overcome some of the incredible skill in athleticism. given these athletes way too much credit. No, I'm not.

You know what? What you have is a class of prima donna athletes that never played defense from the time they were superstars when they were the stars that are seven-year-old team, never taught defense when they were in college since most of them were in college for a year or two, and have never been asked to play defense. And they still don't play defense. And that's the reason why there's no defense in the NBA. It has nothing to do with the skill of these brilliant godlike athletes.

that you want to god up. No, the NBA has, over the last 10 plus years, there are now 30 to 40 guys that no one can defend. The NBA stinks. The best defenders can't actually stay in front of them. They choose not to defend them. Okay, whatever. I just wanted to bring it up.

You don't think Kauai Leonard, when he really puts his mind to it, can defend? You don't think Rudy Gober is a really good defender? Okay. There's some really good defenders. Paul George, Dramon Green. I can do the same thing from the 70s. Come up with... Come up with a dozen.

Watch him defend. Come up with a dozen defenders. I can do the same thing. Okay, I brought this up just to tell you and ask you to watch it. You probably won't see it the same way I saw it. So I guess I'm asking those of you out there that are listening to the podcast that love basketball. The next time the 1963 NBA finals are on, tell me you don't think that you could put together a five to compete against those two teams. They were horrible.

It's horrible basketball. But for the day, I'm sure it was great. But these people that we think of like Cousie and West, Cousie and West stood out to me as they couldn't play. What I was watching, there's no way they could play in today's NBA game. No way. But, you know, that's not a fair comparison. I understand that.

I do. Because if you took those two players and raised them. On the same diet and the same exercise and the same workout and the same. Yes, I know. But you choose... Evolution. You choose... No, it's not evolution.

Evolution is not operating at 100 miles an hour. You know? I mean, but the way you think, what's the athlete going to look like 20 years from now, Kevin? Are we all going to be robo athletes? Different from... I don't know what it'll look like, but it'll be different than the athlete we see today. It will be slightly different. You know what?

That's fair. Because I think if you just go back 15 years, it's different, but it's not the different. between 63 and 83. The difference between 2003 and what we're going to see in 2023 is slight. The difference between 63 and 83 is significant. Significant. You can come up with the reasons why. I don't know what the reasons why. Maybe it's because the better athletes, the better players were integrated into the game more as we got into the late 60s, 70s and 80s. That could have a lot to do with it. Might have a lot to do with it. But I can just tell you this. Cousy, if you took Coozy from 63 and put them on the floor in 2019, it would be a joke, a complete joke.

Coach Thompson, that's Kevin Sheehan. That's Kevin Sheehan talking, coach. Last thing. The Lakers, did you know that in last night's game, they were chanting, we want Kobe? LeBron's having a difficult time in L.A. Yes, he is. This is really the first adversity. I'm not saying that the Cleveland teams that he played on that he took to the finals weren't incredible challenges that he overcame some of those teams.

I'm talking about this is the first disaster season for LeBron. He seems to be handling it so well. I know. Well, the talk of him sitting down the rest of the year, why is there even discussion about that? He's LeBron James. if LeBron's supposed to be able to carry an average to less than average team to the finals. This is a better than average supporting cast in some of the supporting cast he had in Cleveland, and he can't even get them to the playoffs.

Well, it speaks to the difference between the East and the West, for one thing. We're talking about the playoffs versus the title. I know. I mean, he took terrible Cleveland teams and took them to the NBA finals and 63 wins. Yes. 66 wins one of those years. But this is not good for the NBA. It's not good for the NBA for LeBron to be on a lousy Lakers team.

It wasn't good for the NBA in some sense for LeBron to go to the Lakers because like I told you about a year ago, when we were talking about this, it was going to hurt ratings. And it has hurt ratings because he's West Coast team now, West Coast player. It's hurt the TNT ratings I haven't even thought about that Yeah You know I Because what's interesting is What is the NBA finals

Like what will a Milwaukee I mean Golden State is Yeah They need Golden State They're a superstar God forbid it was Milwaukee Denver Yeah You know

But but Denver's really good Yeah but But I haven't LeBron not being the first game anymore On the TNT broadcast I know Is hurting them No I can see that

Yeah The Lakers last night, that was their third consecutive loss. They lost two nights ago to Phoenix, the worst team in the NBA, who, by the way, beat Milwaukee last night. Guess who played great. Kelly Ubrey is killing it in Phoenix. Phoenix, actually, the worst team in the NBA, has swept Milwaukee this year, the best team in the, the best record in the NBA. They're not the best team in the NBA. But Kelly Ubre has been playing incredibly well for Phoenix.

but the Lakers are now five and a half games out of the eight seed. You know, the playoff probability thing, one percent chance now they're being given. And so that's why this question about shutting LeBron down has come up. And LeBron said that would take a lot of convincing from Luke Walton on up, Rob Polinka, Magic, Jeannie Bus. Unless I'm hurt, I'm not sitting games. You know, he's had some injuries. the groin injury has kept him out of a bunch of games this year so far.

I'm very surprised. I thought the Lakers, and I thought before the season started, and then after watching them play for some of this season, when they were healthy, I would have never guessed that they would have missed the playoffs. I wouldn't have guessed that either, but I never liked that collection of talent out there. I was never crazy about it. But again, it's LeBron. I know, I know, and he's done more with less.

They are a bad defensive team. That's one of the things that's hurting them. And LeBron, there's this meme going around where Kyle Kuzma basically pushes him in the direction where he's supposed to go. And then the other night he took a ball from out of bounds and threw it against the backboard. And he had that's passed. Like it looks like he is. Giving up. Giving up.

Yeah. You know, and again, when has LeBron ever been in this position? Did LeBron miss the playoffs the very first year of his career in Cleveland? I don't we call. I mean, because he went to a Cavalier's team that was really bad. obviously in 2003 2004

uh here it is Tommy he missed the playoffs the first two years and then got to the playoffs in his third years I mean I know he's on the cavaliers

because they were stank because they stunk um this though really for the LeBron James that we know is going to be the first season where he's not a part of what everybody pays attention to yeah which is the NBA postseason

yes That's going to be pretty stunning. That's going to be very difficult for him. It's got to be. Oh, yeah. I mean, look, there's a lot to like about LeBron. I mean, I want to diminish him in any way. But it's going to drive him nuts to have to be like a spectator for the entire postseason.

You know, this also, and I'm just thinking about it because you and I love magic. And this is a bit of a stain on magic this year, this season. I mean, Magic needs to prove that he can build a championship team, which he hasn't done yet. No, he hasn't done yet. You know, I mean, we've seen that before. The star athlete doesn't always become the star front office guy. No, Jordan. I mean, Bird got Indiana, you know, Bird as a...

I mean, look, we saw it here with Wes. Yeah. And on sale, we saw it with Elgin Baylor, with the Clippers. Now, you know, again, I mean, ownership could come into play, but, uh, I mean, and the biggest example is Isaiah Thomas. I mean, the biggest glaring example of a front office failure and a Hall of fame player. So there's no guarantee. Last night in the loss.

As much as you down, I want to diss Jerry West. He is still the gold standard for player transitioning the front office. No doubt about that. He is. Yeah. Right? I mean, Ozzie Newsom's right behind him. But Jerry West is the gold standard.

Yeah, I'm just trying to think of who else is in that conversation. I'm sort of drawing a blank right now. I mean, Danny Aange, we thought, was well on his way to sort of becoming that in recent years. But the Celtics, you know, are really struggling, surprisingly. The Lakers last night, though, I'm looking at what point in the game. The We Want Kobe chanted, chants started when LeBron missed some free throws late in what was still, you know, a winnable game. LeBron's always sort of failed at the free throw line in big spots over the course of time but wow and i god and here and i've i've said this throughout the year because i expected them to

make the postseason and they're not they're not going to make the postseason they're too far out in a very competitive west but i would have loved to have seen him and rondo together in the postseason because there's there's not more basketball brain power IQ you know than those two and and rondo you know rondo's been playing great he had triple double last night yeah but you know we're not going to see it. We're not going to see it. And to your point, it's going to be a big, big loss for the NBA playoffs, which already, I know I love the NBA, and I know a lot of you don't, because you'll tell me why are you talking so much about the NBA? I love the NBA playoffs. I think you like the NBA playoffs, but it doesn't rate well. And without LeBron, it's really not going to rate well.

I mean, I like the NBA playoffs less and less in the Golden State area. You like a lot of sports less. No, that's not true. But I like the NBA playoffs in the San Antonio Spurs era, not so much in the Golden State War. Well, your spurs are going to be in the playoffs, more likely than not. Yeah. Well, that's good.

That's good. It's going to, actually, when we get there, it's going to be very, the East hasn't been, the East has been, the East is actually open for somebody other than LeBron to get to the finals for the first time and forever. and yet, you know, it's odd because the teams that you thought would be, I thought Toronto before the season, I picked Toronto before the season, and I think it'll be a Toronto Milwaukee final, but I did not expect Boston to be so, they've got issues.

They have issues, whatever. Nobody cares about this. No, nobody does, but let me just say, if you put your team in the hands of Kyrie Irving, you get what you deserve. You get what you deserve. I know. He's talented, but you can't count on them. And right now, the Lakers can't count on LeBron to play any defense.

All right, what else? Anything else? That's all I got today, boss. Any Redskins news while we were on the air? Let's just make sure that nothing broke while we were sitting here talking. I don't think anything did. All right, I'll see you on Thursday. We're going to do some draft talk. I've really not spent, I did with JP yesterday talking about the combine, but, you know,

there's a lot more that came out of the combine. The biggest thing being, I really believe that at 15, especially if the quarterbacks go quickly, the Redskins are going to have a chance to get a real impact player, especially on defense, if they stay at 15. So we'll do some of that tomorrow. Tom, you'll be back on Thursday. Thanks to Aaron. Enjoy the day, Tom. And look for that 1963 NBA Finals to watch. All right. Have a great day, everybody.