The Kevin Sheehan Show - Raptors and Dragons

Episode Date: May 13, 2019

Kevin opens with a quick follow up to the Friday interview with Vinny Cerrato, then gets to the Nats and NBA Playoffs. JP Finlay/NBC Sports Washington joins the show to talk Redskins' Rookie Mini-Camp. Kevin and Aaron finish up the show with a Game of Thrones recap. <p> </p><p>Learn more about your ad choices. Visit <a href="https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices">podcastchoices.com/adchoices</a></p> Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You want it. You need it. It's what everyone's talking about. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Now here's Kevin. All right, I am here. Aaron is here. This show's presented by Window Nation. If you're in the market for Windows, call 86690 Nation or go to WindowNation.com and tell them we told you to call. Game of Thrones recap coming up at the end of the show. I did wait. I did wait until the end of the Toronto Philadelphia game to watch. In fact, I didn't start watching it until about 10 o'clock. So I stayed off Twitter so I wouldn't see anything. But I did have a sense, Aaron, last night and early this morning from a few texts from friends, that not everyone felt the same way that I did, which is,

and I'll just give you my headline. From my perspective, I liked it. Some nits to pick, but overall, I thought it was damn good. I mean, we're going to get to it later on in detail. Do you want to give me a headline for the way you felt? I would say, felt better after sleeping on it, have one huge problem. Okay. All right.

So there you go. Big T's for Marin for later in the show. Spoiler alerts, the appropriate spoiler alert before we start talking about it will be provided on this show. Plenty of sports to get to. If you read the post sports section this morning, you'd probably expect me to lead with soccer. DC United beating Sporting KC 1-0 Aaron. Very exciting. It took up much of the sports section's front page.

No NBA at all on the front page of the post this morning. None. Two game sevens. Nothing on it until you get to page D6 in the sports section. Look, they know what they're doing. They know who they're trying to attract. I'm not about to tell them how to run their business. I would never do that.

I probably would, but I'm not going to do it now. I like several people at the post. I do. Feinstein told me as recently as a year ago that I was irresponsible if I didn't read the post sports section cover to cover before doing a sports talk radio show in this city. He did. He actually did.

That, by the way, what he suggested to me just is not true. You do not have to read it to do a sports talk podcast or radio show or anything else. First of all, this newspaper is outdated already by the time you get it. Anyway, by the way, the Nats got two of the four in L.A. No offense errand to speak of. They nearly got no hit yesterday by Dodgers lefty Ryu. They go three and seven on this big road trip. Were you paying attention to the no-no he had going into the eighth?

Yeah, a little bit. I wasn't actually watching it, but I was following it. Yeah, it was sort of going on while other things were going on, basketball, but they're seven and a half back of the Phillies after this three and seven road trip. Anybody getting fired? Right this second? No, but I still think it's very much. I said Memorial Day last time. I still think that's very much in play. Well, I mean, one of the big issues clearly still deals with their inability to score enough. And they had Soto back yesterday. And they had Rendon back yesterday. And they've had Rendon back for a few games now. Just not enough offense

for this baseball team right now. They got a good start from Strasbourg the other day. They got a decent start from Scherzer, but they end up three and seven on this trip, and maybe the two of four in Los Angeles. Two of the losses, by the way, came via shutout yesterday and on Saturday, I believe was the other shutout.

But they get the Mets here for, I think, seven of their next 10. The Mets are ahead of them in the division. In fact, they're seven and a half behind Philadelphia, but they also fell further back of the Mets and Braves who got on a little bit of a winning streak over the weekend. I think they're four and a half back now of Atlanta and three and a half behind New York. So there are three teams in front of them, and the Nats are 16 and 24. So there's that. J.P. Finley is going to join us in a bit. We'll talk to him about Redskins mini camp over the weekend. I wanted to say three quick things. We're going to get to the NBA here, I promise. I wanted to say three quick things about the Vinnie Serato interview on Friday. I got a lot of, I mean, I'm sure you did too on our Twitter page. A lot of feedback on the Vinicirado interview. And I appreciate all of it.

I really do. Three things. One, I did not think he was eating while doing the interview. I can't tell you how many people said, real classy, he was chewing food while he was answering your question. in doing the interview. I never heard that. I went back and tried to listen to it. I never heard that. Did you? There was some shuffling in the in the background. I don't know if he was in his car. He was in his car. There was some noises. I could see how it would sound like he could. Okay. I don't think he was eating. He was in his car driving into work. I never heard that. The second thing I wanted to mention was

he was reluctant to go deep into things. I definitely got that sense. Aaron and I sat here. and we looked at each other as we were recording this interview. And we could tell that he was pretty reluctant. I think some of it is that he doesn't want to crush Dan. He liked Dan, even though they haven't talked in a while. He still likes Dan. I think some of it was me. You know, I put things out there and he, and I had the sense when I was doing the interview on Friday,

and I could have been wrong, but I tend to have a good sense of when to really push somebody and when if too much pushing or being too aggressive could end it. And I did have that sense at times that it was a little bit uncomfortable. He was uncomfortable. I talked to him afterwards, and I don't think he was as uncomfortable as I thought. But there's no doubt he was reluctant to sort of go deep into things. Anyway, I did have that sense. So those of you that said, man, he just, he wouldn't go far enough on certain.

things, I felt the same way. Lastly, and this is the thing that stuck out more than anything else with me from the interview with Vinny on Friday's podcast. If you didn't hear it, go listen to it. Because it was interesting. I mean, there was a lot about the past, but the thing that stuck with me was something about the future. And that was that he sort of admitted or certainly knows that there have been a lot of stories about Dan running the first round of the draft this year. and that Haskins was Dan's pick. And he made the comment, he said, Dan is always right, never wrong.

It'll always be someone else who will have to take the blame. I'm paraphrasing at this point. Somebody will have to fall on their sword for Dan. It was right around the 27-minute mark of the podcast, if you want to go back and listen to that whole section from Friday's podcast and listen to it about the 27-minute mark where he started to talk about Dan and the, you know, Dan's handling of the first round of the draft,

that stuck with me because this is the root of the organization's problem, the narcissism. By the way, also Bruce's narcissism, Dan and Bruce, both tremendously narcissistic. It'll never allow them to admit mistakes. It'll never put them into position to make them feel like they should take accountability for mistakes. because they don't think they're the ones making the mistakes. It's always somebody else's fault. I've mentioned this many times going back to late in the season. And I know Vinny is talking in part about just the process of,

hey, you've got to take one for the team. You know, it's the owner, can't let him be the bad guy. You've got to take one for the team. But Dan really doesn't think he's done anything wrong in running this team. And Bruce doesn't either. So if Haskins works out, Dan's going to be there to accept congratulations. And if it happens, and I've said this multiple times since that draft pick, it could be his finest moment as an owner. I think it would be. If Haskins turns into

Ben Rathlisberger, it will be Dan Snyder's finest moment as the owner of the Redskins. Because he told everybody in that room, F off, this is who we're taking. Now Vinnie, when I brought that up, said, no, hiring Joe Gibbs was his finest moment. And for sure, that's number one on the list right now. You know, it's a short list of really fine moments for the owners. Short list, very short list. But Joe Gibbs, after the Spurrier disaster, was a stroke of genius. It didn't lead to a championship, you know, but let's be honest.

Two playoff trips in four years with one playoff win, an actual playoff win, would seem like a miracle now. So Joe Gibbs had the most success here, and Dan went and got him. So that was his number one to date, positive contribution. You know, it was Dan's biggest success. And keep in mind, we're talking about Dan's biggest success of being hiring a coach that went 30 and 34 here over four years. Under 500, Joe Gibbs was. But I do agree that Joe was Dan's best move as on.

owner so far. But understand what Vinnie was saying. Dan made the Haskins pick. The football people, you know, weren't terribly happy about it or behind it. By the way, as an aside to that, I want to be clear about something that some of you have sort of extrapolated out to be a different meaning when I have said the football people didn't want Haskins. When I've said that the football people didn't want Haskins, they didn't want Haskins at 15. I've made that clear. It's not clear to everybody, so I just want to emphasize it. I'm not saying and haven't said that the football people didn't think Haskins was worth something. You know, late first, second round, they just didn't think he was worth it at 15. They didn't like any quarterback, not named Kyler Murray, at 15. And as I've said

before, I've said this before, if they hadn't taken him at 15, they actually may have gotten him later in the first where they got sweat. But it doesn't mean that if they had, let's just say the football people had a second round grade on Haskins. All right? Let's just say that that's true. It could be true, by the way, that the football people had a second round grade on Haskins.

That doesn't mean that they don't think he can play. Andy Dalton was a second round pick, and Gruden made him work really well. But anyway, I just wanted to make sure that all of you, I think most of you have understood this, but not all of you. you, but I want to make sure that all of you understand that when any of us say Dan wanted him more than the football people wanted him, it didn't mean that the football people didn't like Haskins. They just didn't like Haskins there. That's not the grade they had on him. But back to what Vinny was saying. Dan is going to take credit if there's credit to be taken. And it will be

Jay Gruden's fault if there is no credit to be taken on this. Period. End of discussion. Dan will never take blame for this if it doesn't work out. Jay Gruden will be long gone if this doesn't work out. That's the reality of this. And that creates an interesting dynamic to all of it. You know, you watch Jay and Jay wants to win, but he also,

now has the owner's prized jewel at quarterback that he needs to develop. So a lot of stuff going on there. I really do hope that Haskins just comes in, soaks it all up, is coachable, stays focused on getting better at football and being coachable. He has talent. no one will dispute that. He's got some real talent. And he's only played one year of college football starting, you know, with the exception of the year before when he played some at the end of the season. So there's plenty of room for all of us to be optimistic about the potential growth. He could turn

into something so much better than any of us who were not Haskins people ever thought. I've left open the possibility that because there was limited play, that two, three, four years from now, he could grow into something special. Physically, he has all of it. On minicamp this weekend, Jay did have some good things to say about him over the weekend. There were no red flag quotes from Jay, so all is well right now. J.P. Finley, in a bit. We'll talk to J.P.

About Redskins' mini-camp, rookie minicamp. Let's get to the NBA playoffs. And I want to go in order, chronological order, starting with Friday night. because Friday night was spectacular. It was one of those moments in these NBA playoffs. And for a particular team and a particular player, Steph Curry, it was a big moment to throw on to the long list of moments that will define his legacy.

Zero points and completely discombobulated in the first half. 33 in the second half. And the Warriors move on, and the loser rockets go home. I heard, by the way, they're working on a report that details how they had 5.3 points taken away from them in that game 6, and that the wrong team has advanced to the conference finals. I hope they do produce one of those reports that says that officiating custom game 6.

Nothing Steph Curry did. Steph was amazing in the second half. Clay Thompson was amazing in the first half of that game on Friday night. they won essentially two games without Kevin Durant to close out the Rockets. I know Durant got hurt in the third quarter, but we know what happened in the remaining part of the third quarter of Game 5 and in the fourth quarter of Game 5. And we saw what happened in Game 6 on Friday night. They won that series without Durant. Durant was huge in the early portions of the series.

I'm trying to take anything away from them. But a lot of people didn't think that that would happen when Kevin Durant went out with the calf strain. in the third quarter in game five. And not only did it happen, it happened immediately. They shut it down in game six on the road. And how did they do it? They did it with championship heart. I know that sounds cliche, if not corny,

but it is something. And when you're watching it, you know you're watching it. Draymond Green, Clay Thompson, Steph Curry, Andre Aguadala. Igadala, by the way, had five threes in that game. Five! Andrea Godala, five huge threes, championship threes, five of them in a game six on the road. Sean Livingston, champion, 11 off the bench.

Guys that hadn't played much, but have had some of that championship stuff rub off on them, played well. Quinn Cook, Jerebko, Kevon Looney was so valuable to this team in this series. That team just has it. Their coach has it. Steve Kerr didn't call him effing giants. Aaron after the game on Friday night, he just called them giants. And he's right. Again, I know it sounds like cliche to talk about heart and championship,

heart, but there's something about that championship thing that's cool to watch. They just have a belief that comes with having done it four times. didn't matter that there was no Durant. Didn't matter that Curry had dislocated fingers. They have it. And you know who doesn't have it? James Harden doesn't have it. Dan Tony doesn't have it.

Houston's owner guaranteed they'll be back and they'll win it all. Not playing the way they play. All right? Not playing the way they play. Their best player on Friday night was Chris Paul. And do you know what Dan Tony did during the biggest stretch of the basketball game. He took Chris Paul out of the game. Two and a half minutes from the five and a half minute mark until like the two 10 mark, somewhere around there.

I'm sorry, the 310 mark. Chris Paul, who was the best player for Houston on Friday night, was out of the game. That made no sense to me. During those two and a half minutes with Paul on the bench, with four fouls, by the way, not like he was in terrible foul trouble. And who cares with five minutes to go in the game. They went from a tie game at 9797 to a five-point deficit. Warriors took a 102-97 lead, never looked back. Couldn't believe that nobody picked up on that. Didn't hear the announcers Friday night's ABC crew talking about it.

I don't think anybody asked Antoni about it. Their best player Friday night was Chris Paul, and he left the game, was taken out of the game, for the biggest two-and-a-half-minute stretch of the fourth quarter. order. Dan Tony, Harden, all of them. They're going home. They went home. They're done. Their best opportunity lost. The only way they get to a title series is if Golden State breaks up, you know, Clay Thompson leaves, they get hurt, they get old, they get bored. But Friday night was one team is a champion and the other is the furthest thing from it. And it was spectacular to watch

Steph Curry hit some of those threes. The one in front of PJ Tucker on the sideline in front of the Houston bench to give them a 107-102 lead, I think it was, was ridiculous. And that was shortly after he had his fingers hit again and he was trying to shake it off. Wow, Friday night was unbelievable. To yesterday. The first game, Denver hosting Portland in a game seven. DJ McCollum was amazing. And the part of the McCollum going for 37 in a game 7 for the Blazers win in Denver

was the thing that amazed me and is probably a really good sign and maybe a telling sign as to why Portland can compete in this next series is that Damian Lillard didn't mind at all deferring to McCollum. No crazy ego in a big spot. He deferred to the player who gave them their best chance to win. Lillard at one point was one for 12. He ended up three for 17 hitting two huge threes in the fourth quarter. One of them after a great steal.

He was really good in the game other than shooting-wise. He was three for 17. He had 10 rebounds. McCollum was 17 of 29. By the way, you want to know how to win a game 7 on the road? Have your starting backcourt combined for just one turnover for the entire game. One.

Lillard had it. McCollum didn't have any turnovers. For as much as the two of them handle the basketball, not to have a turnover for McCollum and just one for Lillard is impressive. As a team, they only had four turnovers in a seventh and deciding game on the road. Their bench was great.

Evan Turner played really well. And Zach Collins, For those of you that have listened for a long time, Zach Collins was one of the guys in the 2017 draft that I loved, that I thought eventually was going to become a great pro, in part because he was a badass competitor. And he was awesome yesterday off the bench. 7.5 rebounds, 4 block shots in 23 minutes.

So much so that both Mark Jackson and Van Gundy, both spent two minutes talking about him. And one of the things that Van Gundy said and Mark Jackson agreed with, and I'm not in love with this crew. I love Breen, and I like Mark Jackson fine. Mama, there goes that man. Don't love that all the time. I'm tired of that.

And I'm tired of Van Gundy saying, you know what the NBA should do is if they're going to, if they're going to foul him at the half court line, they should get five free throws, like just all the stuff. that he comes up with in the middle of a big game, and he's coming up with the dumbest ideas you've ever heard. But he said something about Zach Collins. He said, the players you can trust in these kinds of games,

seventh and deciding games, is you have to trust your best competitors, the guys that won't be afraid in this spot. And then he said, some of the players on your team and you know who they are, they are not fierce competitors. I mean, he's talking about performance. professional NBA players.

And he said, you know who your real badass won't back down, won't be afraid in a seventh and deciding game, and you know the players who will more likely than not back down, will pass on a shot. And that's in Jackson said, and Zach Collins is that guy. He told his story. He said, I met Zach Collins' father at a game. I think he was talking about, I don't know, it was a college game that he played in again. or another game, and he said his father almost got into a fight with somebody in the crowd.

And he said he knew where it came from. And Zach Collins is going to be a really good NBA player. Really good NBA player. He was great. Anyway, Denver blows a 17-point lead, and Portland moves on. And then we get to last night. It's off the ladder. Defended by Simmons, is this the tiger? Kevin Harlan, I think he was.

was Greg Anthony on the TNT call last night. That, do you know that that is the first ever in NBA history, buzzer beating game winner in a game seven? That's amazing to me. It's incredible to think about. I've never heard of anything. I would have never guessed that. I would have thought that it would have happened at least five times in the past

with all of the game sevens in NBA history. Jordan's game winner over Craig Elo, Cleveland was a fifth game five. It was a fifth in deciding game. So that was when they played that first round best out of five. First time ever for a buzzer beating game seven shot. And that one, four bounces on the rim before falling through. It really was an amazing shot the way it bounced around. It really, you know what, forget the fact that it was the first game seven buzzer beater of all time. I can't remember a game ending on a shot that bounced on the rim four times like that and went in. That game was great. It was so good that I, you know, I delayed my Game of Thrones watching

last night. And by the way, before that game started, my one son who was at home, he's home from college, he's a big Game of Thrones guy. He's like, we're not, we're not waiting until the end of the game. We'll record the game. We're watching Game of Thrones. My other son, who's not into Game of Thrones said, you guys are crazy. I'm watching the game. And so when the game became so good and it was approaching 9 o'clock, I'm like, we're watching the game. I'm watching this game until it's over. We're recording Game of Thrones. Stay off Twitter. Don't, you know, don't look at your texts. And so we won't know anything. And we didn't. We didn't know anything by the time we watched Game of Thrones. But that game was spectacular. There are a couple of things from that game that I thought were really

interesting, you know. And it sort of dovetails off of what Jackson and Van Gundy. we're talking about the competitors versus the guys that are not as fierce. I thought Toronto, first of all, I thought there were several points during that game where I thought they were going to lose the game, especially that 16-0 run in the third quarter where Philly took, I think, a five-point lead, 5550, I think it was. I thought Toronto was going to lose the game. And the reason I thought they were going to lose the game is I could not believe how many of their players were tight. It, Siakum passed on so many open shots. Lowry passed on so many shots.

Green, Gasol. You know who was the most aggressive guy not named Kauai Leonard in that game for them? Was a guy that's not had a good series at all. Van Vleet came in and was super aggressive. He was 0 for 5, but got to the free throw line a couple of times and made some free throws. Like he was up to the task. Like he was up to the moment. They only played, by the way, seven players in game seven.

Just seven players. Pals, the other guy that will usually play, didn't play at all. Abaka was phenomenal off the bench. Abaka was ready for game seven. Had 17, eight rebounds, and a couple of massive defensive plays. But they just kept looking for Kauai Leonard. And you know what? It wasn't one of Kauai Leonard's best games, shooting-wise. Now, he was really good in the game. He was 16 of 39.

Remember, he had been shooting, I think, for the series going into that game close to 60% from the field. He went 16 of 39 in this game. He had 39 shots. The most shots ever in a game 7, I think I read since Connie Hawkins had 40 shots. in a seventh and deciding game. I would have thought that someone like, I would have thought Jordan would have had 39 shots or more in a seventh and deciding game, especially when you think about some of those game sevens

before he won a title against Detroit when they lost and he was going out with 39, 40 points in game sevens. I would have thought he would have had 39 shots. The most since, I think I read this since Connie Hawkins had 40 shots in a game seven for the Lakers. but Kauai Leonard had to. No one else wanted to take the shots. So many times I thought he missed shots

because he was forcing the action because no one else wanted it late in a shot clock. He missed a couple of shots that were halfway down and came out. And then he missed a free throw that gave Philly a chance to tie it on Jimmy Butler going end to end. And I thought Butler at the end for them was the key. I will never understand why Philadelphia did not run better half-court offense, specifically using Joelle Embed on the post, he was constantly out on the perimeter.

Use them on the post, run their – they had three or four possessions there late in the game where they either got a terrible shot or a shot-clock violation. I think they had two fourth-quarter shot-clock violations. I, you know, not impressed at all by Philadelphia's half-court offense, not at all. And actually, Toronto's wasn't great, you know, but I think in part it was because guys were passing on open looks and deferring to Kauai Leonard, who is in this postseason my favorite player. He's always been one of my favorite players, going back to when he was in college and I wanted the wizards to draft him instead of Jan Vesely. He's always been one of my favorite players.

I said last year at this time, I would trade my entire team if I were the Wizards. My entire team, I would offer San Antonio for Kauai Leonard. And I would. And he's showing everybody why. He's a top three, four player in the game. You have to have one to win a title. You almost have to have one to get to the finals, but you certainly have to have one to win it. He had 41 points, not his best shooting night, good defense, eight.

rebounds, three assists, three steals. He was forced into some turnovers, late shot clock situations because people passed on shots. And then that last spot, 4.2 seconds left. I mean, you know, there were opportunities. A couple of people, I had a friend of mine text. He's a coach in the air. He said, terrible double team on Leonard there at the end. And it was. Now, it would have been hard had Embed really tried to close him off from getting to that right side of the floor because you would have risked potentially Leonard splitting the double and getting a mid-range shot to end it. I mean, the shot they gave up to Leonard with Embed on him in the corner and him fading away from 21 feet, you know, if you're Philadelphia, you don't want Kauai Leonard taking that last year.

shot. I actually thought they were going to use him as a decoy, and I thought Lowry would end up driving and trying to create something. Leonard could have hit Siakum, who was open by himself off the double or the attempted double. But he, you know, great players, you know, they get to a spot and he talked about after the game. He said he was very frustrated at missing that free throw that would have put him up three. He was frustrated at missing that other three-pointer, that step back that he was short on and he said that the arc wasn't right and in in kawai shoots you know relatively speaking a fairly flat shot but he's talked about afterwards he said i needed more arc on that last one than i had had on the previous one and i knew if i got more arc fading away that i'd have a chance at it

and he did get a shooters bounce four of them four bounces and it went in uh i don't know what you do if you're Philadelphia. I mean, Embed was very emotional after the game. I'm sure there have been memes created with him coming off the floor, bawling his eyes out. It's a tough loss. You know, he played well in the game. This was not a game where, you know, he was over on the sideline coughing and being too sick. He had 21 points, 11 rebounds. I just thought he wasn't used properly. I thought he could have dominated the game from the low post much more than he could from the perimeter. They had some terrible possessions. Terrible possessions. Butler's the badass on that team. Reddick is also fearless, you know, when you talk about guys on that team. Simmons is limited,

but, you know, he's very good. Tobias Harris missed a wide open three that I think would have given them the lead late, you know, sometime in the fourth quarter. That was a big miss because it was a wide open look, I think, off of some imbid action. But anyway, Kauai Leonard, who was the best player in this series, and has been arguably the best player in the postseason, obviously Janice and Durant before he got hurt, and now, you know, Steph Curry in clutch time and McCollum, you know, you got some possibilities here. Milwaukee, Aaron, is a big favorite in this series.

You know, there are minus 335, I thought I saw this morning. Yeah, 3.30, I think, yeah. I, you know what? I think that's right. I do think that that's the right. I think they should be favored. They've got home court advantage. They're coming off a four-game sweep, totally rested.

They've got the best regular season team with 60 wins. Actually, you know what? I'm looking at this now. It's down to minus 300. I thought I saw minus 335. I definitely saw minus 330 earlier, yeah. So I'm seeing minus 300. I'm also seeing the minus 290.

So maybe there is a lot of action on the Raptors. The Warriors are an overwhelming favorite. What is the deal on Durant? When's Durant coming back? He's supposed to be evaluated sometime this week, but no say as far as winning. That game is Tuesday night. Game one of that series is tomorrow night. I'd be surprised if he was around for the first couple games. And then game one of the Eastern Conference finals is Wednesday night.

You know, and just thinking about Toronto, the team that I picked to get to the Eastern Conference, to get to the NBA championship before the playoffs started out of the East, you know, going into this series, they're going to have to play differently than they played last night. You cannot have Kauai Leonard shooting 39 shots and having players pass on a lot of open shots. I thought that that was really interesting. I guess I didn't expect Lowry.

I mean, I know Lorry and Drozen never could get through this spot and they always lost this game, but there were too many shots passed on. Kauai Leonard had, I think it was, 16 more shots in that game last night than in any other game in the post. season that he's played in so far. He's got to, he's got to get more help, has to get more help, because Janus will get a ton of help. He's got a lot of places on that team to turn,

you know, Middleton, et cetera. I would like to think that Toronto could win it, but I would not bet on them to win this series now. You know, I felt good about them before the playoffs started. After seeing Milwaukee and seeing last night with them, you know, what happens in a seventh and side in game sometimes is different than what happens in game two or game four. You know, there's less tightness, you know, less big moment, you know, chokeability, you know, potential. But I think Toronto's guy, they've got to get, they got to get what they got in game four of that series.

In game four of that series, when they went to, went to Philadelphia and one, Leonard was 13 of 20, ended up with 39 points. but Lowry, you know, had 14. Gassol had 16. Seacom, was that the game four? Yeah, game four was the one they won, and they got balanced scoring. Abaka got 12 off the bench. You know, their game five, when they blew Philadelphia out,

they had, and they blew them out in that game. I think they had all five starters and double figures, and Seacum let them. That was the game that Leonard wasn't great in. He was seven to 16. So anyway, I think I like Milwaukee, but I'm rooting for Toronto. And then I do like Golden State. Man, Barclay is absolutely sold on Portland in that series.

I'm not buying it. I mean, here's the one thing you've got to consider with Portland. Number one, Lillard and McCollum, yeah, they're better than Wall and Peel. Remember that argument, you know, about their backcourt versus this backcourt. they both have point guard skills. They both are totally comfortable with the ball in their hands, creating their own shot. They don't need anybody else.

That last, you know, they went one four flat from a column, and he scored to give him that three-point lead late in Denver yesterday. That's not what any other backcourt really is. You know, even the great backcourt's Curry and Clay Thompson. Clay Thompson's not a, let's clear it out, and Clay's really good at creating his own. own shot. He can, but he's not, I'm not saying that Portland's back court is better than Stefan Clay Thompson. I'm saying that their back court is better offensively in terms of each

of their player's ability to be their own shot creator. They don't need anybody else. Anyway, yesterday was great. Two game sevens and both of those games were awesome. Quick word about window nation. It's graduation time, not just for schools, but it's time for your home. to graduate, up to new energy-efficient windows from Window Nation. And as a graduation gift, all window styles 50% off. You choose, bays, bows, double hung, wood, vinyl, any size, any color, all custom-made, and all at 50% off. Window Nation's massive buying power is a diploma in deals, and they'll pass the savings on to you. It gets even better. Make no down payment with no payments and no interest for 12 full months. And if you call Windonation,

this week, take 50% off every window plus get free, yes, free blinds with the purchase of a house of windows. New windows save energy, improve the look and value of your home, and you can do it now for 50% off with no down payment, no payments, and no interest for 12 months plus free blinds. Call wind donation today for a free in-home estimate, no risk. They'll come out to your home the next day, they'll provide a quote valid for a full year. The school year's about to end, and so is the this deal. Hurry, call 86690 Nation today. That's 86690 Nation or go online at WindowNation.com. 86690 Nation or WindowNation.com and tell them that I sent you. Let's bring in J.P. Finley from NBC Sports Washington. Talk about Redskins mini camp this weekend. First

chance to see Dwayne Haskins. You heard what Jay Gruden said. I read what Jay Gruden said, and we're going to play some of it perhaps later on in the show. But what do you think the big takeaway from rookie minicamp was when it came to the quarterback? He's a rookie. He's a rookie. Everybody knows he has armed talent, and I think plenty of that was on display, but he made some bad throws, and, you know, he's throwing the guys that are never going to be on NFL fields,

and he's just trying to take it all in. Rookie minicamp is really like orientation. You know what I mean? They just want everybody to know who the coaches are, where the offices are, where the training rooms are. It's just trying to get them acclimated before real OTAs start, certainly before, you know, mandatory minicamp, which, Kevin, I don't know if you've seen it. They switched the schedule around this year.

It used to be all the OTAs led up to mandatory minicamp. Now they actually have minicamp a week earlier. So there's going to be some as close to real practices as we're going to see before Richmond, and that's not that far away. It's only about three weeks away. Yeah, that'll be interesting too. And I think what you said to start is the big takeaway is that he's a rookie. They're all rookies.

And by the way, they're competing against primarily rookies in this rookie minicamp, not veterans. So, you know, just, you know, I'm going to be big into listening to Jay because I think Jay, you can certainly read between the lines with Jay, and very often you don't have to. And I think basically, you know, he was saying to us, look, it's, he's a rookie. He made some really good throws. He can spin it. He talked about how great he spins it, which is, you know, I think something that no one debated he could do coming into the NFL. Who did you, did you sense that the coaching staff was overly impressed with anybody that they saw this weekend or that they were all just rookies?

I think Montez Sweat is a guy that really shows just stepping on. the field, the size and the speed and everything. Really, you can tell he's got a lot going on and can help them right away. And I think, you know, it was interesting that the linemen, the two drafted O'Leymen, didn't get a lot of the work that all the other guys got. But I think there's going to be undrafted guys, especially on O'Line, that can push. You know, this guy was a young guy, Chee-D-O-Kiki. I hope I'm saying that right.

Tennessee State that started at LSU. You know, the guy on my podcast, Mitch Tishler, loved Cheaty, was really impressed by his footwork and his stroke. And I'm not convinced Eric Flowers makes this team. It's not like he has some sort of guaranteed deal that they can't do away with him. I think there are kind of back-end roster spots available that undrafted guys can push for. I think safety is another one. The undrafted guys they got out of Washington, Jojo McIntosh, I think, has a lot of tools that could be pretty intriguing. I think at working minicamp, honestly, the goals for the coach exam are probably make sure

none of the draft picks get hurt and get a good look at a bunch of other guys. Because the draft guys, they've scouted for months and they know that. Yeah, that's true. And one of the guys that they liked and they were happy to get in the seventh round, the corner from JMU, Jimmy Morland, there were a lot of things that sort of indicated to me a couple of quotes here and there that they think this guy has the, the, the, the, the, the, the, mentality, the attitude, the competitiveness to have a really good shot at making this team, not to mention, as we know, there are opportunities at Corner if you can step up.

Absolutely. I think, you know, it's funny. I was talking with Cooley about him, and Cooley was watching a film when I ran into him at Redskins Park, and he just makes plays, and he's not, you know, the biggest guy, but I think you're telling me he can't meet out Danny Johnson or maybe Greg Stroman, And those guys can certainly improve in a year. But I think he could absolutely make the team, and certainly the mindset, kind of the attacking ball hawk,

six pick sixes in college. When you look at his numbers, and I know it was Chang-U, but Jane U plays pretty good football. I'm watching them. I'm guessing you watch them on occasion, too, Kevin. I don't think I watched any of that level of college football. You don't watch the FCS playoff? I don't think I watched one FCS.

playoff game. There may have been one game that I turned on because it was a snow game somewhere, I think, in the Dakotas or Montana or somewhere, I don't know, but I didn't watch much of it. I know it's very good football. Don't get me wrong, and that they may have found a gem. I mean, one of the things that I think it was Kime and I were talking about late last week is just that, you know, in the wake of a draft that had so much excitement attached to it, primarily because of the first round, but I think others. I mean, I'm excited about watching Bryce Love, and I think Kelvin Harmon, you know, has a shot.

I really liked him coming out. I was surprised that he lasted until the sixth round. But, you know, if you just go back, you know, some of the people are getting excited about are fourth, fifth, sixth, and seventh round picks. More times than not, they don't make the team than make the team. And the conversation is like, each one of these guys is a steal.

That's how it's going to sound in May, Of course. Odds or that's not how it's all going to pan out. That's right. I agree with that. Big picture on some of the things that we've talked about in the past, just wondering if there's any update on it. Anything new on Brandon Sheriff, Montaigne-Nicholson, or Colt McCoy?

None. Neither on the first two. Sheriff, I don't know that no news is good news in that situation, but until I hear something that it's not going well or a lot of times these contracts just pop up out of nowhere. And I think they legitimately have until Labor Day weekend before it becomes a real problem. I do think if Shelf gets into the season without an extension, I wouldn't sign at that point. I would play it out and then they got to franchise meet or I'm going to free agency. And the money for guards is through the roof.

I think that doesn't, they still have plenty of time, though, between now and then. The Monta situation, nobody has a word to say about it, and that's on record, off record. I think the team wants to see where Monta is legally and mentally, and then they're going to kind of make their decision. Let's be honest, Monta's crime, getting in a fist fight outside of a bar, in the terms of NFL crimes, is starting to be. In the terms of real-life crimes, really isn't that big of a deal. Obviously, you know, the guy he beat up might feel differently, but in terms of the legality of it,

that's not something that would cause you to miss a season or to miss six games or anything. So he's under contract, like barring something crazy, maybe the team's just assuming he'll be back and he'll be good, but we haven't seen it yet. And what was the last from Colt? I don't know about the... The Colt situation, I mean, he should,

should be up here. The media will be out there for OTAs next week. And that'll be the first. If he's still not there next week, you really start to wonder what's going on. You tweeted something out late last week about a sleeper corner.

Dion Harris. Who is he? And are they going to sign him? I believe they signed him to the thing for everybody to remember is right now they're operating with a 90-man roster. So there's, you know, 37 spots of wiggle room. But he is a guy, I can't remember where he started. He ended up transferring.

He played at one of the Dakotas, Kevin, your favorite schools. I think he played at North Dakota. But he's a guy that I'm not pretending to know much about him, but Mel Kuiper, you know, McShay, those guys all liked him. And he was on those top 300 lists but wasn't drafted. And, you know, they obviously need help of corner. They're looking far and wide. If you consider their, you know, they signed Dominique Rogers Carmardi

a year after they wanted him last year and couldn't agree to terms. And the guy retired in the meantime. And they're still bringing him in and giving him a shot. So I think they know they need to be better. And as much as Stroman and Johnson maybe showed flashes, last year, I don't think they were very good, especially the second half of the year. You know, one guy they really like to emerge is Adonis Alexander, and it's a name we're not hearing more than often. I saw him at the park a few weeks ago. He looks every bit of the part.

I mean, he's big and strong and physical. He's just got to, you know, kind of translate it all in the field. You know, I'm going to tell you, I'm going to say something to you right now, and I don't want you to take it the wrong way, and I know you won't. But because you, you You are one of my favorite people to have a conversation with about this football team and other things, by the way. By the way, that was a good win for us on Friday night, taking the Warriors on the Money Line. JP actually texted me late, right before the game tipped and he said, am I crazy to think that the Warriors on the Money Line is the right play? And I swear to God, I had just had a text exchange with Van Pelt, actually.

and I said, everybody is talking about Houston forcing a seventh game. I think I'm going to play the Warriors on the money line, and he goes, everybody's on Houston. So it was right after that. But anyway, I'm- The contrary in play. Yeah, exactly. So, you know, I love talking to you about a lot of different things, but I'm just sitting here, and I'm talking to you about minicamp, rookie minicamp, and I'm going to tell you that it bores me.

Like I just asked you about Dion Harris because you tweeted something out about him. Seriously. I'm being serious. I wonder, I think sometimes, and I'm at fault for this and I think everybody is, look, if there's a major storyline, and clearly Dwayne Haskins more than anything else is a major off-season storyline for this franchise, it has, and I'm not going to use the word invigorate, because I don't think it's invigorated the majority of the fan base, but it certainly has brought to life a few in the fan base. And people are going to pay attention to this.

I think more likely than not when we get to the regular season games. But I do think it's interesting sometimes that those of us that are really in it spend time talking about things like rookie minicamp when I would guess that 95% of the fan base couldn't care less. I use this analogy. It's kind of shoveling cold. I don't care that much. I thought what, I don't know if you saw what Adam Gase did with the Jets this year.

He didn't even have rookie minicamp. He literally just had him in for meetings and to learn the building. And that's really what they're doing. It is an opportunity for a lot of young guys to work out an NFL facility, and that's got to be really cool. But this is not an important weekend on the NFL calendar. I mean, honestly, of all the events, this is probably the least important on an NFL It's so far down there.

They have 60 guys there, maybe 10 of them are making the team. The only big news. You know, I guess I'm sort of waiting for that tremendous, honest moment from Gruden, either very optimistic about a certain player or not. and we've gotten those every once in a while, so we didn't get that from over the weekend. We didn't get a serious injury from over the weekend, thankfully. And the bottom line is, and I talk about this every preseason.

These preseason games in the midst of training camp, yeah, there are battles, but there's nothing more, I'm not saying it's boring to everybody. I'm not going to speak for everybody. I would never presume to do that, but for me even, someone who has been in all of the minutia of this footwork, football team during the off season, I just tend to check out when we get into a conversation about roster spots 45 through 53. And that's in August. Especially in May, right?

Yeah, and that's in August. It's boring. No argument here. I think because there's Haskins, it gives it much more life and use. You know, anytime you have a high rookie pick like that, but beyond that, man, imagine if they had taken a guard or somebody at 15, I mean, we wouldn't be talking right now. You'd be talking to Tim Legler about the Nuggets. Do you know how possible it is that somebody like, let's just take Terry McClureen as an example, ends up having a two preseason games where he catches five balls for two touchdowns in one game and then six balls for, you know, 95 yards and a touchdown in another game.

And then we barely even see him on the field to start the. season. That's how meaningless preseason games are, that that could potentially happen. But anyway, I don't even know why I'm bringing this up. I was just sitting there listening to myself ask you about Dion Harris or whatever his name was and thinking, who the hell cares about that? I do think the Haskins thing and listening to players and coaches, Jay Gruden in particular, talk about him and sweat, I think is what I will be. paying attention to most between now and sort of the middle portion towards the end of training camp.

Absolutely. And I think I think McLaurin can actually matter this fall. You know what I mean? Oh, I'm not saying that he can't. Yeah. But I think, you're right, man. It's Rick and Mnichamp. And it's great.

It's a good part of the, it's good for the players. And it's, you know, it lets us get a, from a TV standpoint, and let's just get a lot of video on God's BD, but it's not exciting. I can't pretend that it is. I mean, for all the... And I think the coaches would tell you that. I mean, I think the coaches officially would tell you, hey, man, they need this work. It's exciting.

You know, Dave, you know, week one starts today, but if you got them off to the side without a microphone, they would tell you that it's not a big deal. Yeah. If I had a nickel for all the people that thought, you know, Matt Brown or Keith Marshall or some of these players, you know, at this time of the year, through training camp, you know, if you listen to people talk about it, we're going to be really good players. All right, you know what? I'm done with you.

So I really, I appreciate you coming on and we'll talk when they get into OTAs and certainly if there's big news. And, you know, I'm not even, you know, I even wrote a note down to myself this weekend that I'm not even going to mention or spend any meaningful time talking about the fact that the quarterback purchased to Bentley and drove it and got his own logo on it. And got his own logo on it. Yeah, I mean, so what if he can play, right? So what if he can play? Exactly. All right, all right. The happen to stuff for all builds and ebb and flow, and he plays well as well as much matters. Exactly. All right, have a good one. Thanks. All right, JP. It's never a waste of time with

JP. And don't anybody think that that's what I was saying. J.P. and I are good friends. And I love conversations with him, but I asked him to be on because I'm like, all right, we'll talk about mini-camp. And then I'm just sitting there listening to myself, talk about Dion Jones and whatever. And I'm like, okay. And I did make a note to myself. I did over the weekend when I read the story about the purchase of a brand new Bentley. Haskins got a Bentley and then I guess embroidered his clothing brand.

Yes, he's got a clothing brand. I'm already called Kingdom of Pride, and he's got a logo, and apparently the logo was embroidered into the seats in the Bentley. But I read about it, what? This is RG3 all over again, and anyone who doesn't see that coming is just fooling themselves. Okay, hold on for a second. It's not yet. It's not yet, because this guy actually is a pocket passer and can really spin it, as Jay Gruden

talked about. But I made a note to myself. I'm like, I'm not going to get wrapped up into this stuff yet. I'm not because it doesn't mean anything. There are big personalities and there are people that are very high levels of confidence is required for that particular position. And we have seen many super confident players at a very young age succeed. So I'm not going to spend any more time on that.

I don't, I'm not, it does not have RG3 written all over it for me yet. I mean, I would have to start hearing things. Well, between, between the draft party and that interview with his dad, with the newspaper, and there's things adding up here. The $50 a head draft party? Yes, that one. The one where he wanted to spend the draft with friends and family, but he charged people $50 ahead. And sold t-shirts.

To get into the bowling alley. Yes. He can spin it. He can spin it. Yes, he can. And we're going to, we're going to follow. even though training camp and OTAs and mini camps before them tend to be boring for most of it

and very meaningless to what his future or what the team's future will be, you know, unless there are significant injuries. But I think one of the things to pay attention to is just to listen to what is said about him. You know, we would have never known about Robert early on. Do you know that, This is true, too.

I was a big RG3 guy early on. I made a bet with a good friend of mine, Joe Preston, and Joe listens to the podcast. I made a bet with Joe after, I forget at what point in the season. It was during that seven-game winning streak, you know, where they got to the playoffs. And I made a bet with him that RG3 would lead the Redskins to a Super Bowl, not necessarily Super Bowl win, but would lead them. Actually, I think the bet was to would lead them to an NFC championship game, that this particular quarterback would lead them to an NFC championship game. I was super high on RG3, and I was fooled. And late in that season,

and certainly right when that season ended, some of the things we all in the media started to hear were shocking to a certain degree. They really were, because this guy seems so savvy and so media friendly and connected in such a a personal way with the media people i sat down with rg3 and did an interview with them i think after um i'm trying to think it may have been before the 2013 season no before the 2014 season uh was my one-on-one sit-down but i had had conversations with him in the past we had had him on the podcast no podcast we had him on the radio show but we're fooled so maybe if your gut-feas or you're gut-feas you're fulled so maybe if you're gut-fear feeling about Haskins is here comes an RG3. Maybe we'll get fooled. Maybe Aaron, you'll get fooled

on this one. It's very possible. I'm going to tell you what I'm going to do here, though. I'm going to reserve judgment until I see this dude play, period, in regular season games. Nothing he can do in training camp or a preseason game is going to tell me anything about him. Now, things his coaches say about him, things his teammates say about him, they can certainly be illuminating. That can be really good information, but I'm not going to make my own judgment until I see him play regular season games. Again, I'll go back to what I said last week. I think it is about between now and when, and the time he starts playing in regular season games, I think, you know, you can read Jay Gruden. You know, Gruden basically said he can really spin it,

making progress, but has some things to work on. But he wasn't over the top, you know, in terms of giving you an indication that he had a long way to go. And he wasn't over the top and giving you an indication over the weekend that he was really close. It was sort of right down the middle. And by the way, Jay will be good at this for a while until he really feels strongly one way or the other. And I don't think, and I've said this from the jump, I don't think that Jay's feeling about Haskins before the draft will influence the shot he gives him or the way he coaches him.

Jay moves on. He's going to go along to get along and he's going to move on and he's going to make the best of it. And if he sees a guy that all of a sudden blows him away, he'll be excited about it. He will absolutely be excited about it. And one of the things that Jay has said before, Mike Shanahan has said before, Gibbs has said before, you cannot fool the locker room. If this dude's ready to play, you cannot fool the locker room. If he's not ready to play, you can't fool his teammates.

When RG3 and Kirk Cousins were battling it out, it was apparent to everybody that RG3 was not the right decision. And so Shanahan got to the point where he understood he was going to lose the locker room if he didn't play the guy that gave him the best chance to win. If this guy is the best chance to win, Jay's going to know it, and the players are going to know it. And we're going to know it. And by the way, the best guy, the guy that gives him the best chance to win doesn't mean they're going to win a Super Bowl with him. Again, the competitive landscape is Case Keenham and Colt McCoy. That's what he's up against.

You know, that's hardly murderers row that he's facing. But we'll follow it. We'll follow it. I just, on the rookie minicamp thing, I guess I just got to the point there with J.P. where I'm like, you know what, I don't really care at this point whether or not Kelvin Harmon made a couple of fade catches in the back corner of the end zone in seven on sevens because it just doesn't mean much. Quick word about launch workplaces in Bethesda. Launch workplaces is a beautiful new office space right there in the Massachusetts Avenue corridor. So if you're in that Bethesda Upper Northwest Chevy Chase area or even right over the bridge in North. Northern Virginia, and you're looking for new office space or you're working from home and

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with our Game of Thrones recap. All right, there's your spoiler alert. All right, I said this at the beginning of the show, and I have not really immersed myself in the reaction to the pentultimate episode last night. I liked it. I have a few nits to pick, but I liked it. I am curious, just before we get some,

started, what was the general reaction to the episode last night, which really at times was incredible cinematic? I mean, the shots of Kings Landing being torched by Drogon and Danny were amazing, just amazing. But what was, I'm just curious, what was the general reaction to this episode? And I'll tell you why, because Scott, who doesn't watch it, texted me and said, Are you as upset as everybody else? And this was late last night, and I didn't look at my phone until the show was over. And I go, no, I liked it. A lot of people were very upset with it.

Is it because of Dineris gone mad? I think there were a lot. I think they thought overwhelmingly a lot of the beats in the episode were unerned, were just they did it without having the bill to it, without having the action to it. I think that was more than anything. Yeah, a lot of people just didn't like it. They felt that that wasn't, which I actually disagree with entirely. but they felt the De Nairus thing was not set up well enough, was not done well enough. So we've seen the potential of her becoming her father for three episodes now.

Forget three episodes. Let's make this. And this is something that has really bothered me because, you know, going back to when she gave the nod to kill Vassarian back in season one. True. Over and over again. Although he was a horrible person. And again, but that's the thing. But we saw the potential.

she had that bloodlust in her from season one and off to, you know, her thing was, I'm going to bring it to them with fire and blood. You know, a lot of this has just kind of depends on how you view DeNaris. If you view DeNaris as, you know, overall a good person and overall a person who wants to help, then yes, I can see why some people were upset by it. But, and I was going to get to this a little bit later, the one thing is that DeNaris from Moment one, had this vision that she was the rightful ruler of Westeros, that the people were clamoring for her,

that she was going to be this, you know, this welcomed hero. And as much as anything, she's realized over the past two seasons that her visions that she's had since she was a child are completely wrong. Yeah, well, I mean, certainly here over the last couple of episodes, she has had this sense that, that Westrose isn't hers, that it's more Johns.

I mean, John's beloved, and she, but she was beloved. I mean, I want to go through sort of chronologically what happened in the show, because I think that we'll touch on everything if we do that. And it starts with, with Veris and the execution of Veris. And by the way, the look John gave. Yes. You know, was an indication of perhaps what was to come last night in this particular episode. I love Varys' line.

I hope I'm wrong. I hope I deserve this. Yes, exactly. So you then go from there to, you know, setting up for the battle. And before we get to that, we get Jamie who, you know, we never see get caught and we never see get, you know, get shackled. And Tyrion goes in to set Jamie free. And by the way, that was one of the most emotional scenes in the history of this show. Yes.

Tyrion and Jamie and Tyrion saying you're the only one that didn't treat me as a monster. I would have never survived if it weren't for you. That was a real tear-jurker moment. It was for me. And I mean, two of my favorite people on the show, and Jamie has obviously had this incredible arc of being horrible and then likable, and then we thought on the verge of being horrible again. And I do want to make one thing clear to make sure I'm clear in my mind.

Jamie rang the bell, right? Don't you think? No. No, no, no. Well, then who did? I mean, the soldiers threw their swords down. I understand that. The bells were ringing all throughout the city.

It wasn't just one bell. Okay. That was a surrender from everybody in the city. Jamie promised Tyrion that he would ring the bell. I don't think he ever got there. How do you know that? I don't know that for a fact, but it doesn't, I mean. Okay.

It was an area that was vague for me. It was vague, but it doesn't fit. Like, it didn't need it at the time. Well, where was he running? He was running to get to Circe. He was running to get to the beach to try to get to that back route up. That's true. And he, by the way, that was the most unrealistic part of the show is that somehow

Uron washes up right where Jamie is that. That was too much of a reach. I wish that that part of it. I did want Jamie to kill Yaron. I actually wanted Yara to kill Yaron. And by the way, Yara was not a part of last night's episode. And I think she's out. Like, what is she?

She's just going to rule the Iron Islands? I was going, well, I have a theory on that going forward, but I'll save that for the end. I mean, it would be crazy if somehow Yara shows up next week and ends up on the throne. That's clearly not going to happen. But I'm surprised that she hasn't become a more central figure after Theon freed her. She went back to the Iron Islands and she's just sitting there on the Iron Islands. That's it? I guess so.

From her? Yep. She doesn't even know that her uncle. is now gone. And by the way, that whole fight scene was just too unrealistic. He'd beaten the shit out of Jamie, had Jamie dead to write, and then somehow Jamie's able to, you know, grab a weapon and kill your run. I thought that actually that was the most disappointing part of the show. Unless you feel like the way Searcy died was the most disappointing. Is that your biggest thing? Searcy and Jamie as a whole, I thought, was really poorly done. Being buried in the rubble. I, and I'll just get to. it now. Between her being, A, I understood what they were going for with, you know, she's not more important than everybody

else. She is, uh, you know, she died just like most of the people there, just died, you know, buried under Rebel, nothing special about her. I understand, I think that's what they were going for. I just think that it, that was she, it deserves something better. And even bigger than that, I,

the whole Jamie thing really bothered me. I feel like the whole, his whole arc was almost meaningless. Like, there was no reason. Looking back on it now, there's no reason for him to ever leave Circe's side. He did nothing in the north. The going there and coming back serves nothing for his character or the purpose. He did, well, he took Brienne's virginity from her.

But we may never see Brienne again for all we know. No, we're going to see Brienne next week. Maybe we will, but that's not going to be a big story point. I think that that was really disappointing. And of all the stuff, I thought that was the thing that's the thing. they really, really botched. Especially since, you know, I think that's, I think I agree with you because at the end of season seven, when Jamie leaves Searcy and the mountain doesn't, you know, she doesn't give them the order

to kill Jamie and Jamie heads north and we see the, you know, that snow flore is falling from the sky and we're expecting a much bigger deal from Jamie and we really didn't get it. We got the, we got the thing with Bran, which was odd. we got the obvious, you know, night with Brian. He would have been better off staying in the north and helping finish off whatever was coming next, maybe finishing off Danny. Here's what I want to know.

So he has that meeting with Brandon. And Brian says, you know, we need you for it. Jamie did nothing. Well, you know who's done nothing? John's done nothing. Well, John's done nothing too. And you know who did nothing last night, except run around is Aria.

Like, I thought Aria was going to come to the hound. I was expecting Aria to show up at the hound's defense there. which, by the way, was a pretty good battle, but them dying together isn't what, put it this way. I'm okay with that. Nobody won that bet. That's a push. Yeah, I'm very much okay. The Clean Game Bowl. I'm very much okay with the ending of it.

I'm okay with that in general. I thought that was fine. It just with everything going on around it, it got overshadowed a little bit, which is a little bit of a bummer, considering we've been waiting for this for seasons and seasons and seasons. It's the rushing of everything into six episodes. biggest problem with and even the complaints what's really they're dancing around the complaints they're making details it's just you couldn't do this in this short of time you needed an extra a few episodes here and there to let things breathe you know i i think to have been really

dissatisfied with the episode certain things that happened in you know what i would say completely unreal or unbelievable ways um we wouldn't have gotten there. Like Jamie's fight with Uron, if they had Uron killed Jamie, it would have been Game of Thrones-esque in that that's a bit unpredictable. You know, the Uron kills Jamie right there

and that's it. That's it of Jamie. But Jamie had to work his way back to Searcy. Jamie had to make it past. Or Jamie had to fulfill his promise to Tyrion, which is what I was thinking. And I didn't know that he would fulfill his promise to Tyrion, but that he would, you know,

please ring the bells because you're, everybody's going to die. And, you know, remember when Jamie said, well, she does have, you know, she's got the iron fleet. And, and Tyrion goes, the iron fleet's going to be destroyed. Yeah. But if he had just died right there, we would have never seen him reunite with Circe, where

they said, you know, all that matters is us. Yes. Right before, I'm assuming they are dead. Certainly that's the assumption. If they're not dead, that's a big problem, too. That was unsatisfying because I think, you know, and I do understand if there's a complaint because people wanted to see whether it was Tyrion or whether it was Sonsor, whether it was Aria. They wanted to see somebody who had taken the brunt of Seerce's evil actually Duren. And nobody, you know, Deneres and Drogon did, essentially, by destroying King's Landing, which I guess was, it was not a shocker for me that,

that DeNaris went bad and that she went her dad and she's now the mad queen for all intents and purposes. Yeah. Somebody, a friend of mine mentioned, do you think it was just the dragon getting revenge? No. No. No. No. Did you see the look on her face after the bells rang?

Yeah. If you want, here's, I think, the one complaint. If you want to complain that they did that poorly, that it shouldn't have been, you know, she had one. and then she goes on the rampage, I think there's a complaint to be made there. Kyburn's death was the best. Oh, it was awesome. The mountain's killing of Kaiburn was the best.

It's like, you know, when, when Lansel and that whole crew show up at the Red Keep, and he says to Circe, tell your man to stand down or there will be violence, and she says, I choose violence. Yeah, and for Kaiburne to be killed by his own creation is perfect. Just perfect. And by the way, then the mountain,

And the hound let Cersie walk right by both of them down the steps. At that point, I didn't have, I thought Cersie was going to run into Aria, didn't you? Well, just because Aria had gone back, no, I didn't think that, but I did, I thought something would happen with Jamie. I thought something would happen with Jamie or something would happen otherwise. Not what happened. There were a couple of things there towards the end. I was expecting potentially, although, you know, I thought about it afterwards, and Aria did say goodbye to the hound. She said, thank you.

And that scene between the two of them was great. And he used his first name for the first time. Exactly. He used Sandor for the first time. And so she says it, by the way, with all hell, you know, breaking loose around her. And a very soft voice, Sandor. And somehow he was able to hear her. Yes.

And he turns around. It echoed. Come on. Yeah, thank you. And in the hound's way, he acknowledged, you know, you're my girl, basically. But I thought there was a chance that she might come save him. I thought there was a chance that Circe and or Jamie were going to run into Aria, and that maybe the hound was going to take care of the mountain and come back,

and it was going to be the hound and Aria against Cersie and Jamie. Them getting buried under the rubble, I understand why that would be unsatisfying for some. I didn't find it to be totally unsatisfying. To me, the most, the thing that really upset me, the most was the Uron Jamie fight. I thought it was just totally off. Everything about that fight, Uron's reactions to it,

everything about it was off. But anyway, I did enjoy it. I did enjoy it. I mean, the Hound Mountain fight made, I think it was sort of what we were looking forward to. It was pretty good. Yeah, you know, again,

the only thing that was the problem is that it got kind of overshadowed with everything going on, that I feel like there should have just been, you know, five minutes focused on them basically. But otherwise, like, especially them ending up, you know, they died, they fell into a whole thing of fire.

Perfect for the hound. Absolutely perfect. Circe, Jamie, the hound, the mountain, Kyburn, Uran, Varus. That's the list. That's the list. From last night. Yes. What about the moment when Greyworm sees that Danny's.

started to go mad and he you know throws the spear through one of Cerssey's army guys up front and John gives him that look there's that look between yeah I mean we're setting up now for John and Tyrion and Sansa

and Aria if she makes it back God how did she survive what was with that horse at the end well so I first thought that that was maybe the carving with, you know, Davos and Shereen, like I thought there may have been a connection there. And I, for a moment, thought it might be Davos, but it's not. It's not. No, I'm pretty sure that was either the mother or the girl that she was with there.

So, you know, they're all heading back north now. Is that what we're going to get or is? I think they're just regrouping outside of what's left of Kingsland. Well, we have to, and we've got to end up at Winterfell again. I don't think you have to, I think that Winterfell can come down to them. Okay. Because don't forget, I think, you know, Varus was sending out those letters at the beginning. Yeah. My hunch is he was sending it to all the great houses.

My hunch is what we're getting is we're going to see all of the great houses unite against Deneres. Now, to what extent? Here's the funny thing. Like, looking at the last episode and looking, what are we trying to get to? What is this? Well, somebody's going to have to take out the drug on. because right now it's advantage de Nairis. It's advantage of theirs.

But what are they ruling over? Like the Red Keep is destroyed. The Kingsland is destroyed. The Iron Throne might be destroyed for all. Well, yeah, we didn't see a shot of the Iron Throne still standing. I mean, the Red Keep was destroyed. So at the very least, the Iron Throne is buried in rubble. Now, maybe it survived the Buried in Rubble, but it's buried in rubble right now.

I'm wondering if this is all leading to no one's sitting. on the Iron Throne. They are going to, you know, these seven kingdoms are going to become the seven kingdoms once again. You remember, we also saw, remember the Mad Kings explosives underneath. Yeah, that was interesting. I wasn't sure if that was the Mad Kings.

Whatever was left over from what didn't blow up. It was either that or it was, you know, because Circe was messing around with wildfire as well. So it was one of those two things. And it wouldn't surprise me if it was the Mad King's stock. Yeah, because he had, you know, I hated the sparrows. I hated the high septum.

That was my favorite Searcy moment because I was actually rooting for her. So what do we get next week? I mean, it's everybody turning against Danny now. It has to be. Yes. Yes. I mean, I don't see clear. Tyrion and John, every close up says, oh, my God, we were wrong.

Yes. We were wrong about her. So Tyrion survived somehow. I certainly didn't expect Aria to die there under rubble or fire. That's not how she goes out. Yeah, no way. I did, you know, I did like it. I thought that was great to show it and get to see, you know, closely, basically firsthand,

what it was like in those streets with the Drogon flying overhead. I thought that was great. I know some people had problems with it because it made her look too panicked, too scared. But quite frankly, she's an assassin. She's not used to dealing with mobs of people fleeing a dragon. So I had no issues with that at all. And it was beautifully shot. I mean, I would think that John right now has to be the favorite to end up on the throne.

If there is even a throne left and if it even becomes important. Is that satisfying right now? If it's just they kill DeNaris somehow, John sits on the throne, is that a satisfying conclusion at this point? Personally, I just don't know if we end up with the Targaryen in any way, sense, shape, or form on the throne. Do we have a throne? Maybe Gendri ends up. being a Barathean. You know what? That might be the most satisfying thing possible at this point. Maybe Sonsa ends up on the throne. Is that over the roof? She's been the one in this final season that's been right about everything.

You know, and if there was a king's landing, I would be all for that. But right now, just anyone, you know, if the conclusion is, you know, here is Sonsa start. They can move the throne to Winterfell and call Winterfell to New Capital. That just seems so unrealistic. I'm just one, like, that's what it's going through my. head right now is that it's set up in a position where we only have one episode left and I just cannot figure out what would be a truly satisfying ending. In just thinking of, because I'm just taking this, this path here for a moment in my own mind about, you know, Sansa being Queen Sansa on the throne. Yes. There's no bloodline for it, you know, with a stark.

Correct. Um, there, but she, while she does not have the blood for it, she has every other quality for it. She is empathetic, but she's tough. She's really smart. And she would have her cousin and her sister and Lady Brienne as her, you know, inner council, which everybody would be comfortable with. And by the way, Tyrion, she may marry Tyrion. Yeah, I just, it's hard to, because again. I'm starting to think that that's my lean right now.

You know what, it's a, it would be as satisfying as anything. It's just, again, I can't shake the fact that King's Landing is no more. It's amazing. Like King's Landing is no more. It got destroyed. So what are we doing here? I mean, it was basically Chernobyl at the end of it. Have you seen that series yet?

I watched the first episode. I haven't watched it, but no, that literally was nuclear winner. Yeah. The other thing I thought of, too, is that Circe in this final season really was insignificant. Yes. Like her, everything about Circe's character in this final season, you know, other than the stuff.

She had like 10 lines. Other than the stuff with Uron, you know, that was it. Which is surprising because Lena Hiddy's been, I mean, one of the top three or four actors on this show from the jump. And that's one of the reasons I had so much problem with her ending and with Jamie's ending because it deserved so much more. I had a problem with Uron's ending. I wanted to do.

him, I wanted it different. I had no part. Your honor was such a weird, he was a character that almost didn't belong on the show. He didn't fit. He didn't fit, but he had caused so much pain and havoc. And I really wanted his, I wanted his

nephew and or niece to take him out. Yeah, but you know what we also could have, if he taunted a little bit more about getting, you know, having sex with Circe, if that was really... Well, he did. He said to Jamie. He said it once, but it almost, you know, you didn't get a pained facial expression from Jamie or anything like that.

If it was about that, then I think it would have hit a little bit stronger. But yes, I mean, the whole Uron thing, but I just thought Uron as a whole this season was an out-of-place character that didn't really fit anywhere. The other thing, too, and I'm just looking at my notes, is that Danny and Drogon stared at Searcy and the Red Keep and destroyed the city in front of her instead of going right to her and destroying her. But then again, if they had done that, then we would have had no

Khyburn scene, no mountain scene, because they would have all gone with her. But yeah, I mean, I thought that was important because I thought that, you know, if we're going to, you know, DeNaris is truly mad, then going to the keep, going straight to the keep is a perfectly rational,

you know, if they had rang the bell and she had gone up and flown right at the keep and destroyed the keep and that was it. Yeah. That's not a mad move. No. That's a perfectly, it's ruthless, but it is a perfectly rational move for her. What, you know, her realizing these aren't my people, I don't care about them, this isn't my city, I don't care about it, I care about one thing, I want to bring fire and blood. And these people are going, you know, these people hate me because I'm an outsider, fine, I hate them too.

That was the big move. So she kind of had to do that. It's going to, next week's going to be interesting just to see where all of it takes. takes place and how I hope we get more of the setup next week for what I am guessing will be the war with Dinaris and Drogon and what's left of the Dithraki and the Unsullied and Greyworm will be obviously by her side as well but I'm expecting that Tyrion won't and John won't you know and I want to see the setup for that I'm curious to see if you see the other I'm curious to see, you know, Sonsa coming down, obviously.

You know, they randomly... And saying, I told you so? You, you, they randomly mentioned the Prince of Dorn a few episodes ago. Yes, they did. So I wonder if you see that happen. I wonder if you see Yara come back. And you have kind of the seven kingdoms united against Denehras. You mentioned that, you know, Varus's notes that he sent out perhaps to, to every, to every ruler in every place that they'll, we'll see them get the message.

and they'll say, we're in with John, you know, or whatever. I don't, I can't wait for the, for the final. Last night, I mean, it wasn't that I was totally satisfied, but I was totally entertained. Yes, it was, it was, for what they were doing, it was well done. There were just a few beats that were off. Yeah. And I guess if the bells had rung and Dineris had just said, okay, that's it. It would have been, it would have been nothing left in the episode.

I think the better way to do it to have less backlash would have been, you have it go on a little longer. You have her start to destroy the city. And when she's like as she's destroying the city, you know, based that she felt she needed to, then the bells start ringing and she kind of ignores it. I think that might have played a little bit better than the, okay, I'm hearing the bells.

Now I'm going to start going on the rampage after I had already won. For those that didn't see it coming, though, you haven't been paying attention to the show. Yeah, that's a dumb argument. She has been merciless with people that she deemed to be her enemies. Yes. And she had that speech beforehand that, you know, the slaves and Marine helped me overthrow them. These people aren't.

These people are afraid of me. So they're not my people. Yeah. They set that up. Yeah, they did. And the other thing that needs to get some conclusion to is Tyrion basically setting Jamie free. And that's not going to make her happy. Although ultimately...

I don't think he's going to go back to her, so I don't think it matters. Okay, there you go. I don't know. Everybody's going to have their own view on it. I think going into this final season, we knew a lot of this was going to be rushed, and a lot of it would be they wouldn't be able to pull off all of it. But I think for the most part, they've pulled off a lot of it. And I still think in every episode, other than the one that we couldn't see, because it was too dark, that there have been moments that were spectacular.

And for me, last night, Tyrion and Jamie was an incredible final. moment between the two of them because they, Jamie was, you know, everything to Tyrion and the only person that really loved him in his family. And Tyrion's been such a great character. So we've got another episode left of him. Really, the only thing that's surprising to me through the first five episodes is that only Searcy really at this point has, not that they would save him.

them all for the final episode, but I thought we might get a more significant death or two before we got to these final two episodes. We had to wait until this fifth and final episode to get to what I would call a major character death. Yes, yes. And it was Searcy. Yes. And Jamie. Sircy and Jamie. All right. And by the way, I think more people would have predicted that Searcy would have been the first of all. I mean, because if she had ended up on the throne or ended up, you know, going longer, that would not have been satisfying, although I've always enjoyed her character. I think it would have been more satisfying than the way she went out, honestly. Yeah, it was a little bit odd. All right, thanks. Have a great day back tomorrow. Tommy will be back with us on Thursday. He's spending, I think, a couple of extra days over in Europe. He's having a great time, I believe. Have a great day.