The Kevin Sheehan Show - Record-Breaking Russ!

Episode Date: May 11, 2021

Kevin and Thom today opened with Russell Westbrook's record-breaking night and how last night will change his legacy. The boys talked Washington Football, Aaron Rodgers, Kevin's "Mock Schedule" tease, and Jordan Zimmerman's retirement today from baseball. They also finished up with a few thoughts on the status of F.P. Santangelo in the Nats' broadcast booth.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheehan Show. Here's Kevin. The podcast today brought you by MyBooky. Go to MyBooky.orgie. Use my bonus code, Kevin, D.C.

And they'll match your deposit halfway up to $1,000. How about this, Tommy, as a prop bet put out yesterday. The odds on Tim Tebow playing a game in the upcoming 2021 season. No is my. is 500. So basically, my bookie has the whole Tim Tebow playing in Jacksonville as a tight end as a long shot, even if they were to sign him. The comeback on that, him playing a game is plus 350.

Plenty of, yeah, go ahead. I think we kind of forgot over the years because we forget stuff as a people, not just you and me as a people. I think we forgot how bizarre Urban Meyer can be sometimes. He really can. I mean, his whole exit from Florida. Right. And then reappearance at, oh, by the way,

the place that he loves more than any other place, Ohio State. He's a strange cat. And I don't, I predict failure big time for Urban Meyer in the NFL. Yeah, I would never predict big time failure for him, because one thing, he may be a different guy, but one thing he's been very consistent about is winning everywhere he's gone pretty much. That's what he does.

He wins and he wins big when he lands somewhere. I, you know, this whole thing seems weird. 33-year-old guy, you know, failure on multiple fronts and professional careers since, you know, that one playoff game against Denver. He should have tried this when he came out. This is what a lot of people thought he should do. But anyway, my bookie, my bookie.ag, use my promo code Kevin D.C.

Already lots of NFL prop bets for next year. And certainly the NHL playoffs getting ready to start this week. And the Caps will face the Bruins in the first round. And you'll be able to bet NBA playoffs here soon enough. Speaking of the NBA, actually before we get to the NBA, I took yesterday off. I took Friday off too. now I ended up doing a podcast, a short one on Sunday morning.

Friday was not for the reasons of not feeling well, but I know I've made a big deal over the years of really never missing days because of being sick. And I think, you know, you can count them on one hand the number of days that I've missed my radio show in particular for being, you know, sort of legitimately ill over the last 15 years. But I had no voice Sunday night. I was out, Tommy. The pollen was terrible. I was taking Benadryl.

I was popping them like M&Ms. And I was out of it and had no voice. And if I had gone on the air yesterday morning or done a podcast, it probably would have been fun. But it would have been indecipherable in terms of the words being spoken. But I remember I was like that once when we were doing the radio show. And I mean, because of the pollen and my throat was just. the congestion.

And actually, Chuck, in the middle of the show, Chuck told me to go home. I don't remember that. Yeah, it's like I was talking with razor blades in my throat. Oh, see, the only time I remember you being completely tongue-tied and being unable to speak was the Brooklyn Decker appearance on the show at the Super Bowl that year. Yeah, I couldn't remember Dennis Dugan's name. That's your favorite, that's your favorite explanation. nation, whatever the hell that means.

That certainly wouldn't have explained the sweat, the sweat beads coming off your poor. You know, we have a lot of really good stories that have grown over the years and don't necessarily reflect the way they actually unfolded. But that's the beauty of having spent so much time together over the years. Yes, it is. We can remember them the way we want to remember them. At a certain point, you get to the age where no one's even going to argue with you, even if you're wrong.

Anyway, so Russell Westbrook last night. Before we get to Westbrook. Yes. And there's a lot to get to you there. But I have not watched any new episodes of Marr of East Town. Yeah, I watched. I've watched them all. I have not caught up on because I am obsessed.

with the handmade's tail. Yeah, you told me about that. I don't watch anything else now. I mean, I have to, I can't wait to watch the next episode of it. It's so remarkably compelling and good. I'll get around tomorrow of Eastown, but so, I mean, and I enjoyed it, but it's not even in the same ballpark as the handmade's tail. Okay.

So, so I mean, Jesus, I mean, there's just so many things. The other night, my wife had on a, show called Atlantic Crossing. Are you familiar with Atlantic Crossing? No. Okay. There is, I don't know if it's old or if it's new. I think it is new.

I could be wrong about that. It could be an old series. Somebody can correct me on that. But basically, I caught it as she was watching an episode. It may have been the first episode. It may have been the eighth. It wasn't the eighth episode. But it appears to be, because I caught the last like 45 minutes of an hour-long episode,

it appears to be a borderline documentary type about Norway during World War II. You know, you forget about some of the Scandinavian countries and the invasion of Hitler and in Germany. into many of those countries. But it seems to be that that is the story. And the Norwegian queen or crown princess who's married to the crown prince, I guess is, I don't know. I don't know what she had a relationship with the Roosevelt's is all I know. So if anybody is watching that and can tell me if it's old or new,

I'm looking it up now and I can't find the date that it started. But I can't wait to get back to this particular show. But real quickly on Mera Vestown, episode three hated it. Episode four on Sunday night was pretty good. Okay. We've only got three left. I mean, I'd like it if you catch up. I'm in for the series.

I mean, I'm in for it. Yeah. There's a lot going on. I mean, it's very busy. It's gotten very busy. Handmaid's Tale has certainly got. gotten in the way. Speaking of must watch TV, let's get back to the guy you can't take your eyes off of when you're watching the local basketball team play. Yeah. So, you know, the first

thing I would just ask you before we get into him in more detail, as far as Oscar Robertson's record of 181 triple doubles, like, did you ever consider that prior to last night or prior to the last couple of weeks to be on the short list of the so-called unbreakable sports records? I don't know if I can honestly answer that. I mean, because I don't want to say no because I may have. So I'm going to say I don't know. I mean, it seemed like a remarkable accomplishment, but I know in basketball, if somebody wants to do that and they're really good,

and depending on the team like they play for, they can do that. I mean, you can accomplish that goal. If you're a good basketball player in the NBA and you play on a team without a whole lot of people to share the ball with. 47 years, Tommy, this record stood. I know. I know. I mean, this is by definition, really, whether people viewed it this way or not, it is clearly, based on the years, one of the true records that has lasted that's had an incredible shelf life.

You're right. You're absolutely right. But I will be honest with you. I mean, to me, I, so, you know, I'm a huge basketball fan, and I've certainly known this. to be, you know, a big deal record over the years because of these Oscar was Mr. Triple Double. I'm not going to tell you that I knew the number before this year. That would be a lie. I didn't know the number before this year. I know 56, DiMaggio's hitting streak. I know Ted Williams, 400, you know, the last one to bat 400. I know 100, Wilts 100 point game.

but I'm not going to sit here and tell you that if somebody had asked me a month ago or a month and a half ago, Oscar Robertson has the all-time career mark for triple doubles. Yes, I would have known that. What's the number? I would not have known what the number was. No. Well, in basketball, like you said, I mean, some of the numbers, you know, there's only one sport, really, where the numbers are seared into our heads and that's baseball.

Yeah. You know, in football, everyone knows Emmett Smith is the all-time leading rusher, but nobody remembers what that total is. Right. So, you know, there's certain numbers that may pop into your head like Johnny Unitas had thrown a touchdown pass in 47 straight games or something like that. You know, there's certain unique, and this would be a unique number that might stick in your head. But basketball, you know, we just don't remember the numbers like we do with baseball. only one, really. Wilts 100 is the one you remember.

Yes. Yeah. A unique moment. So with that said, you know, as a lifelong hoops guy, and you are too, you love basketball and have a historical sense of basketball, I do remember the first time I really knew of a triple double. And, you know, it was probably my father talking about Oscar Robertson, but really I didn't see Oscar play. You did. I didn't. What I remember is my favorite player, Magic Johnson,

and him going through, you know, triple doubles after triple doubles. And that's when Oscar was brought up because Oscar was the comp for Magic. There had never been a player that had played point guard like Magic had, with the exception everybody said, of Oscar Robertson. Now, he was smaller than Magic. Magic was 6869, you know, and Oscar Robertson was 6-5 or 6-6, whatever it was. And Magic was a fast break, you know, I mean, he was just an incredible leader of that, you know, L.A. 80s fast break. But that was my first sort of introduction to the importance of triple doubles, how hard they were. And there was talk of, you know, Magic Johnson will one day break the mark of, you of Oscar Robertson. Well, not even close. Magic, you know, ended his career with 138. That was 43 short of Oscar,

and now it's 44 short of Russ. But that's really where I remember thinking about triple doubles. You know, I certainly remember like Daryl Walker for the bullets, you know, had a bunch of triple doubles. And Jason Kidd, you know, had a bunch of triple doubles. But really, before Westbrook, it was Magic and Oscar. That was it. Yeah. Yeah. Right? Because these are hard things to do. Triple doubles aren't easy, even for the greatest players in the history of the game. LeBron only has 99 in his career. I mean, he's 183 short.

I'm sorry, 83 short, 83 triple doubles short of Russell Westbrook. And I'm thinking about players that would have had more opportunities for assists, rebounds, and points. You know, Larry Bird's only got 59. Anyway, it's an incredible accomplishment by one of my, you know this, even though I was questioning the move early in the season when he was clearly hurt and wasn't playing well. You know for years I've loved Russell Westbrook and I love people who compete like him. And over the years I came to the conclusion, probably with you several times.

he's so incredible and he's a marvel and he's one of the all-time great competitors, but it's hard to really win anything of note with him. You know, Kevin Durant, they tried, they lost the 3-1 series lead to Golden State, and Kevin Durant left to join Golden State and won two titles. You know, it didn't work with Hardin. It didn't really work with Paul George, you know, briefly in O'KC or Oladipo or anybody. And I think one of the biggest reveals for me about Russ this year is how many times people like Scott Brooks and Tommy Shepard and others who have had experience with him in the past,

specifically Brooks have said the narrative that he was somehow a team killer or not a good teammate was so off that if you ever talk to any of his teammates, he was demanding and not every player is up for demanding, but that he was a great teammate and that he had the best work ethic and he was a natural leader. And I actually think you can see that on this team. Like, I don't know that everybody understood that about them. You can see that on this team, can't you? Yes, you can. But being a leader means recognizing having a sense of court presence.

You know, you're right. He sounds like he's a great teammate. I mean, he came, he got traded to, you know, the Washington Wizard. I mean, he got traded to the basement. He didn't mind it, though. He was not. No, that's what I mean. He never, he didn't Hem and Hall.

He didn't pout. He went out and seemed to he played harder once he was healthy. Mm-hmm. And changed the whole personality of the team. I give him tremendous credit for that. Obviously, he is, is not a malcontent. But, you know, he, I mean, you have to control your talent in, in, situations and he's been unable to do that.

He is fun to watch. He's great to watch Tommy Shepard won that trade nine times over, it looks like. The trade with John Wall, who isn't even finishing the season for Houston. But we've had, I mean, we, Washington basketball fans have had fun players to watch before. And it hasn't gotten them where they need to go. There should be, I mean, the novelty act of watching a great player perform should not be the goal of this organization anymore. Yeah, I don't tell you what, I don't know that this organization has ever, I mean, obviously Elvin Hayes and West Unseld, we understand that. They were champions. They were first ballot hall of famers.

You know, that first list that came out at the end of the century, top 50 NBA players. of all time. They were both on that list. It's been a long time since Washington's had a star like Russell Westbrook. And by the way, an accomplishment, I don't know that any D.C. sports athlete ever has

accomplished as a member of a D.C. team what Russell Westbrook accomplished last night. Seriously. I mean, I might be wrong about that. But, so you bring up to me the thing that becomes

really difficult when it comes to talking about Russell Westbrook. I love, I think this guy's 182 triple doubles and the fact that he's a first ballot Hall of Fame or that's not even in debate. Okay, the conversation about where he ranks on the all-time point guard list, I want to get to here momentarily because I think it's an interesting conversation. But every basketball person has always had the same thoughts about Russell Westbrook. Like, it's amazing. He's a marvel.

He's a competitive badass, maybe with no equal over the last 10 to 10. 12 years in any professional, major professional sport. He is, you know, by the way, he's not just recently decimating, he's not just eking out triple doubles on his way to breaking this record. He's killing it. Like last night he had 21 assists. Like these aren't like, you know, oh, he had a triple double to an idea. 13 points, 11 rebounds, and 10 assists.

Last night he had 28, 21, and 13. the night before he had or Saturday night 33 19 and 15 he's had two games in his last five where he's had 21 or more assists he's had two rebound games of 20 plus rebounds in his last 10 games it's really amazing like he isn't just getting a triple double I mean he's only he almost had a triple double in the fourth quarter alone last night. He had 10 points, had 11 points, 10 rebounds and six assists in the fourth quarter. So anyway, back to the quandary or the dilemma about discussing his game, is that he doesn't have a title. He's only been in one championship series, and they lost 4-1, and Kevin Durant was the best player on the team. although actually if you go back to that series, and I remember it distinctly, he was much more the alpha.

He was much more up for it than Durant was. He's had a very, you know, not a very decorated postseason career, and this sport is about what you do in the postseason. It always will be. You know, this is the sport where players are, you know, sort of measured based on the championships. Not so much in the NFL. It's not fair in the NFL for a quarterback to be. But it is more so in a basketball environment where there are only five players on the floor at any time.

And so the dilemma is this, what you said, Tommy, so many times two incredible plays are followed up with, how does a guy of that stature even make that decision? How does he take that shot? How does he try to dribble through those four players that were standing there waiting for him? Because, by the way, John Wall was very similar, just not at the prolific level of Westbrook. You know, two incredible plays followed up by an ultimate head scratcher, which you would, you know, as a basketball person, you would say, it's just not smart. I've always said.

And you would think he would have out at some point outgrown that. I had Tommy Shepard on the show today, and I said, you know, I'm paraphrasing here. I forget exactly how I asked the question, but I basically said, so where do you want him to improve? Because what I've always said about Westbrook, and Legler and I have had this conversation many times on the air and off, because he's been a huge Westbrook fan as well, but finally came to the conclusion that he was just never going to win anything of significance. And the reason is he plays at a speed and an energy level that he can't dial back when it needs to be dialed back. And in the postseason, the NBA is a different game. It becomes more of a half-court game, not always, but more often than not, it becomes more of a half-court game, both offensively and defensively.

And you've got to sort of slow down. He can't slow down his mind or he can't. he can't slow down physically. Now, what he has done recently, which I've been very impressed with, he's really gotten hot as a shooter. He has gone through bouts of his career where he's almost looked like he's had the yips, shooting jump shot, shooting free throws, shooting threes. At one point this year, he was like at 50% from the free throw line. Now, let me see where he is, because he was, I think, at 52% at one point from the free throw line. And right now he is shooting 64.9%. So he is real. I mean, to move it from where it was to where it is now,

he's knocking down free throws. He made two the other night to win the game and then had the block shot against Indiana, which was incredible the way that game finished. And I would have been, two months ago, I said no chance he makes both of these. Could you shoot better than 64% free throws in NBA? Oh, God. It's not a great number. No, it's a terrible number. Yeah. Well, I don't know if I could do it with the pressure of being in the NBA and standing out there, you know, at my age and in my condition.

No pressure. You're just standing. But let me just – I'm just – let me just tell you something. I was – this was before the pandemic. I was in a gym, and the game I was in ended and the gym emptied and I just sat there. And I've done this before. And my kids will tell you I've done this before. I think I made 74 in a row.

and then I and I think I was 90 but but then missed a bunch and ended up like 93 out of 100 like I had one of my sons just rebounding and kicked and I've made I've gone on stretches where I've made like 30 you know 30 in a row 30 but okay so 64% is 74 in a row good number no it's not a good number but if you're asking me if I could do it in a game I was I was always the one thing I could always do is I could always shoot it but I and I was always a very good free throw shooter But I, in a game with NBA players, probably not. I'd probably soil myself. It's just like standing in a playoff.

It's free throws at the foul line, no big deal. So, anyway, the game last night real quickly. I don't, Tommy Shepard sort of said I thought he should have driven it. Scott Brooks said I thought he should have driven it at the end of the game. Gary sort of said the same thing. I had a different take. I watched that last play multiple times. First of all, you know, I didn't have a problem with Scott Brooks saying get it to Russ.

Let's push it off the block shot and rebound in part, Tommy, because, I mean, look, I love Scott, but I don't know what kind of play they would have drawn up even if that, after advancing the ball. It's not their strength, you know, structure and plays and the whole thing, last second shot. So the ball in Russ's hands with forward momentum was okay with me. Atlanta, to me, just did a phenomenal job of getting back on defense and then cutting off every driving lane. And then they basically crowded him with two players. It was really hard.

I don't know that he had an option other than to pass it or call a time out. But Bertons wasn't in the game because they had taken him out for the defensive possession because, you know, the idea was if you get a rebound, we'll call time out. advance the ball and we'll try to win it that way, putting Bertons back in the game. But when Russ kind of got it, you know, Brooks said go. And in the moment, I remember thinking, yeah, let's just see if he can get, you know, see what he can do with it. But Atlanta did a great job of getting back and settled for the jump shot.

And look, between him and Bradley, end of game situations, not very good. By the way, they had another one of those end of half situations where they didn't know that Atlanta had a foul to give. You got to know that. You know, their end of game and end of quarter and end of half situations, it's been this way for a few years. It is not the highest of IQ at the end of these situations. And some of that's on the coach and some of that's on the players.

But you got to know at the end of the half. Team had a foul to give and Russ is waiting for the clock to roll down. It gets to three seconds. He gets fouled. Now you only have three seconds. You've got to go earlier. Make them commit the foul earlier so you get time. Anyway, here's a...

You know, yeah. All this fawning over Russell Westbrook, let me just give you a little perspective on this. I had just Googled this before and came to a website called lineups.com. And they came up, and this is in July of 2020. The 50 top point guards of all time. Russell Westbrook is 20 on the list. Well, that's what I wanted to get to next.

20 on the list? 20. Well, that's absurd. That's ridiculous. When was this? Okay. When was this? That's July of 2020.

Okay. Well, but... Ten months ago. Well, this is a perfect lead-in to what I was going to say, which is prior to last night, and I don't know if last night will change it. I have a feeling it will. Prior to last night, the truth of the matter is, as great as Russell Westbrook's been over the course of his career, you know, statistical, you know, just it's been amazing what he's

done statistically over the course of his career. And to me, over the last several years, I've always said, of course this guy is a first ballot hall of famer. He was a league MVP. He averaged a triple double. He's now, you know, and then he had another triple double after that. And over the last couple of years, I'm like, stop it. He's a, he's an absolute first ballot hall of famer. Okay, well, Sheehan, where does he rank on the all-time point guard? list. Well, there's a couple things about this. Number one, and Glenn Consor was on with me this morning, and he pointed out, you know, the point guards of today aren't like the point guards of yesterday. I mean, it is really a positionless sport, and he's right about that. But Westbrook

does have the ball in his hands an awful lot, but not every possession like, you know, Isaiah would have had as an example, or Magic would have had. You know, there was a day, Tommy, if you were the point guard, when you got a rebound, you look to get the ball to the point guard. if you're pushing it or if you're just walking it up and you're going to run a half-court set. The point guard had the ball in his hands. Isaiah had it in his hands. Magic had it. James Worthy wasn't taking over possessions as the point guard like Bradley Beale does or like LeBron does or a lot of other players.

But anyway, with that aside, he is a point guard and he's on the list of point guards. And 20th is ridiculous. But over the course of a while now, like I've always thought, Well, I mean, magic's number one. Yeah, I mean, I think he's up there in the conversation of the greatest player. You and I are both bad guys. You and I agree on that. Yeah.

So magic to me is number one in terms of the greatest point guard. And, you know, and then it's like in recent years, you know, if you view Steph as a point guard and you have to, because Clay was the shooting guard, Steph is in the conversation. I know Oscar was a point guard by, you know, position. So Oscar's clearly in it, and Isaiah's in it. And then Stockton's in that conversation for me. And by the way, Iverson and Nash are in that conversation. And then, you know, and I'm not saying that all those guys that I just ripped off are in front of Westbrook.

But like after Magic and Curry and Isaiah for me, then Westbrook can start to start. to be a part of the conversation, but I'm probably, you know, like Chris Paul's never won anything. So I don't know that I can put, even though I love Chris Paul as a real point guard. I love Chris Paul's game. And by the way, I think it's Taylor made for the postseason, even though he's never had postseason success. Jason Kidd got to the NBA finals. Iverson got to the finals. Nash was an MVP twice, right?

Was Nash a two-time MVP? I'm not sure. Stockton was just a great point guard. Phenomenal. My point is that Westbrook's in this next group of players and always has been. Like, Magic and Isaiah and Steph for me, and if you want to put Oscar in there because it was a point guard, I get it. Like after that, that's where Westbrook would have been discussed with, you know, Jason

Kid and Stockton and Nash and Iverson and Chris Paul, who am I forgetting. But now, after last night, I think he might, I think people will start to think differently of him. Let me give you who is ahead of Russell Westbrook. What's the name of this list? Lineups.com. Lineups.com. Okay, just go ahead and give it to me.

And they've got Westbrook. That's the 20th greatest point guard. of all time. That basically makes this list a joke. Okay, wait a minute. Okay. Number 19 is Dennis Johnson. Okay, DJ one more. DJ should not be in front of Russell Westbrook on the greatest point. Could Russell Westbrook have done on the Boston Celtics what DJ did? That's not the point. Yes, it is the point. No, it isn't. The point is postseason success. Well, no, DJ was part of one of the greatest teams of all time. And by the way, he was a hell of a

defensive point guard. DJ did. Yeah. Could he have done it? Yes. No, he could have. Yes, he could have. No, he couldn't have.

But that gets into the other part of the conversation. That doesn't mean that Dennis Johnson was a better point guard. I mean, let me think of like an old-time point guard. Norm Nixon could have done, you know, what Dennis Johnson did. Is Norm Nixon greater than Michael Westbrook? Michael Westbrook. I don't think Norm Nixon could have done it. Is Kenny Smith?

Kenny Smith was on a top. title team is a point guard. Is Kenny Smith greater than Russell Westbrook? No. Okay. DJ isn't either. Who else is ahead of him? Dave Bing. Dave Bing is ahead of him?

Lenny Wilkins, Tony Parker. I can't speak to Lenny Wilkins as a player. Tony Parker, hmm. Now that's interesting. Tony Parker... When Marty Wilkins retired, he was second all-time and assist behind Oscar. Lenny Wilkins was? That's a player. Yes.

A nine-time All-Star. Tommy, Dave Bing. I mean, Dave Bing was great in Detroit, obviously came back here to finish up his career in that very, very interesting trade where Kevin Porter got dealt to Detroit for Dave Bing and Dave Bing came home, one of the great high school players

in the history of the city. Tony Parker is interesting. I think Tony Parker was just a phenomenal point card, a phenomenal make-people better player. And, by the way, could score, too. who else is on this list? And I mean, this is ridiculous. Walt Fraser is ahead of him on this list.

Okay, so I have a question for you. You obviously were a huge Nick fan, and I only remember Walt Frazier in the back court with Earl Monroe. That's what I remember. I don't remember Earl Monroe as a bullet. I only remember him at the very end of his career as a Nick. Was Earl Monroe, were they sort of interchangeable in the back court? You know, what was interesting,

thing about what was the big story about Earl Monroe with the Knicks was, you know, he had to have the ball because of the bullets offense. Earl had the ball almost all the time. I mean, he, everything went through Earl. He was clearly, even with, even with Wes, Unseld, being such a force. And there was this notion that how could Earl share the ball and diminish his role with Fraser? And that's exactly what he did. He did do that. I mean, Fraser had the ball more. But I think Earl's scoring average dropped, I think, at least 10 points a year, a season when he went to the Knicks.

You know? Yeah, I mean, I just, I mean, my very, very, I mean, barely a memory of Walt Frazier is him as a shooting guard, like in taking a lot of jump shots. Well, he did the same thing with the Knicks, too, but he didn't get nearly as many shots. Right, so you're saying that Walter Fraser was a scoring point guard. So where is, well, as opposed to like a coozy or somebody like that? Yeah, I mean, literally it'd be hard. If you, if you did a list of just the like 19, you know, the prior to 1990s traditional point guards. And it would go back before.

I mean, shit. Nate Archibald was a scoring point guard. Nate Archibald, like the league, scoring and a sense. Yeah, so the point guard position is always scored, unless you're talking, I guess, about Coozy in that era, where they weren't allowed to shoot probably. Oh, your job is. Oh, Jason Kidd was not a big score. No, he wasn't, but that's because he could not shoot.

Right. You know, and look. Jason Kidd is ahead of Russell, Westbrook on this list. Well, I think that that's debatable. but Dennis Johnson isn't Dave Bing and Lenny Wilkins I mean come on Is Nate Archibald ahead of him on this list?

Yes, he is. Okay. I'm not saying this list is right. Where's Alan Iverson on this list? Alan Iverson is ahead of him. Alan Iverson is 10th on this list. Who's number one on this list? It better be magic.

Magic. Okay, who's number two? It's magic, Oscar, Curry, Isaiah, Stockton. Okay. Nash. Okay. Those are the top six. So, look,

We could sit here and do this for an hour, but the bottom line is my point was is that he has always been shorted in this conversation that we're having right now. He really has been. He's never been discussed in that upper tier of the greatest point guards. I mean, when I've discussed him with friends or whatever,

he's in that group that you can have a conversation about after Magic Curry, Isaiah, and I guess Oscar, you know, but a lot of people say, well, no, Stockton got to two NBA finals. Nash is a two-time MVP. Jason Kidd got to the finals. You know, Alan Iverson got to the finals. I mean, hell, Gary Payton got to the finals. You know, one of the greatest defensive point guards of all time.

Gary Payton is ahead of Westbrook on this list. He is. What number is he? Gary Payton is number 11, just behind Iverson. So Iverson's 10. So I guess my Again, let's cut it off here. My question to you... Well, wait, let's not cut it off because I didn't tell you who number 99 is on this list.

Who's number 99? Kevin Sheehan. Okay. Is there really a top 100 list? No, there's a top 50. Okay. The point is that will last night change the conversation and change his legacy? I think it will.

I think it will too. I think that this... And I think if he was, if he was undrecognized before, I think he'll be inflated now. Maybe. Yes, maybe. Like if all of a sudden this list that you're reading from lineup.com a year from now is redone and Russ is like number six or number five after being number 20, well, we'll know.

But, you know, he's still. still is 32 years old, and if he can stay healthy on this particular team, if it comes back intact for the next few years, they're going to win a lot of games. I mean, they're going to win 45 plus games a year. They're going to be in the postseason, so he's going to get more shots at postseason series. And who knows, maybe, you know, he'll have a breakthrough with Beal as a better, you know, running mate with him. Obviously, Beal's nice to rant. They did this. with Gilbert. They won 45 plus games a year and they made the playoffs. I know. I mean, it's wizard's limbo. Yeah, it's wizards limbo. And you know what? I would expect, because I do really feel,

you know, going back to the earlier part of our conversation, I do sort of feel like Westbrook has a limitation when the game slows down and that that is a big reason why he hasn't had the postseason success. You know, they, and I could see that coming even in the play-in round. I could see them, you know, I think people are going to be excited that they have a chance to play their way into the top eight, you know, especially with the way the East is looking right now with Boston, the injury to Jalen Brown, and, you know, they're tanking anyway. And the Wizards still have an opportunity.

The Beal injury actually is, I mean, we're not talking enough about the Beal injury. The Biel injury is a hamstring, soft tissue injury. This could be more serious. Hardin's been out 15, 20 games with a hamstring. So they have to- That's what sideline Jarn Wall for the rest of the season, a hamstring. They have to get Beal back. And if they somehow could play their way over these final three games,

Charlotte's got a brutal schedule into the number eight spot. Then they're in a double elimination situation. And they would play their first game against Boston, who is depleted now. and they haven't been playing well anyway. I would like to see a best of seven against the 76ers. They'd have, they're just so bad defensively. I mean, last night, Tray Young, he's really good, Tray Young.

And they've got, they've got a coach who couldn't spell it if you put a dictionary in front of them. None of his teams have ever defended. They just haven't, not here. And, you know, I fear with Russ this has been so much fun, and I love, I do love him, and I love watching him, but, you know, I can see, you know, the game's slowing down and all of a sudden, you know, a couple of bad possessions. And the wizard, you know, Scott Brooks's offensive system is more concept than structure. And so there are going to be a whole lot of, you know, three and four people standing around watching Russ or watching Bradley. and it won't end well that way. You've got to have more than that when you get to the postseason. But anyway, it's been fun, and he is...

It has been fun. I'll grant you that. It's been a lot of fun watching him. He's really quite remarkable as a competitor. I've never seen anybody with more energy start to finish. Never seen anybody try harder. I mean, maybe people that have tried as hard. It doesn't include me, of course. Well, I mean, you show up just before it starts and you're out the door as it's winding up.

Yeah, but when I'm there, I'm trying real hard. Okay. Bradley Beale got into a spat with Kent Baysmore. Hey, Brad, seriously, man, this is sort of beneath you. I loved Kent Baysmore when he was in Atlanta. I wanted the Wizards to sign him as a free agent. I don't know if there's a beef going back between. They had that great playoff series with the Hawks and Baysmore.

It was really good in that series. But for those that missed it, basically Baysmore had, when Beal went for 50 and didn't play the overtime because he injured his hamstring, Steph that night went for 49 and 29 minutes. And Kent Baysmore basically said, my guy got 49 and 29 minutes. And the other guy is basically blowing out his hamstring trying to beat him. And it was a bit of a shot, but not like a serious shot. Well, my God, Beal and his wife last night on Twitter, they were, I mean, it was unbelievable the way they were hurt by this, by this commentary by Baysmore. Hey, Brad, you're above that, dude. You've got to be above that.

I think, look, I think part of he felt, he's felt that he hasn't gotten recognition, you know, because, I mean, the whole thing with him and Wall, not making all-star teams and not making Olympic teams. We went through all that. Yeah. You know, where they were being disrespected. So I think he's got a little bit of a complex about it. I understand it. He tweeted out, you don't know why I go out there and play, and it damn sure ain't for another man's approval. You was straight lame. I think he's calling him lame, but he says you was straight lame. Then he said, it's funny you say that because You man's, as in Steph, admittedly checked my numbers before the game, but I'm chasing. Then he sent out a gif of a clown, and then it just kept going with his wife going, I mean,

hey, Brad, you're in the scoring, you're in a scoring race with Steph fucking Curry. You've had an incredible year. You had 50, and you weren't even healthy the other night. Kent Baysmore? I mean, the dude barely even plays. Why? Why? God, why so often are these athletes of today so sensitive? Like, this is just... It's not the athletes. It's the generation.

It's the generation. And it's social media. And it gives them the opportunity to respond and be heard right away. But you know what? On some level, and I don't want to be overly critical of Bradley Beale because he's been a phenomenal player. And by the way, a phenomenal guy in this you know, community. And he's smart and he's thoughtful in the whole thing. But you got so upset by this and you're sitting there tweeting and that becomes a story on the night where your teammate sets the triple double record. Like that should have been the story. And oh, by the way, your team lost the game. Yeah. Like, and you didn't play. You know, he's bright enough

that I bet you that he woke up this morning and said, Maybe shouldn't have done that. And a lot of young people have no idea that they just did something that was stupid or made him look sort of a little bit selfish but definitely sensitive. Kent Bazemore, although that dude in Atlanta, he had a couple of good years. Turned it into a big contract, too, if I recall. I want to say that he made like $90 million in Atlanta when he became a free agent that year. That might be a lot. Whatever.

Tom wrote a column about Aaron Rogers. More on that next. All right, you wrote a column about Aaron Rogers. I've talked a lot about Aaron Rogers. You and I talked about Aaron Rogers. Yeah, I mean, basically it's what we've talked about. Yeah. The column.

Before we get in, and I'll let you describe the column, I just wanted to tell you real quickly. So all three boys are home right now. I don't know how much longer that's going to last, but they're all home. And that means the dinner table has been, you know, very lively with conversation. and last night, my youngest son goes, did you say that you would trade Chase Young for Aaron Rogers? Seriously? This is my youngest son.

My middle son immediately heard it and said, yeah, like we both pack his bags if it was for Aaron Rogers, and my youngest son goes, I'd never trade Chase Young for Aaron Rogers. And I just said, well, let me, first of all, tell you that I wouldn't want to trade Chase Young, and maybe you wouldn't have to trade Shishung. and maybe you wouldn't have to trade Chase Young for Aaron Rogers. But if it came down to Aaron Rogers or Chase Young, as my other son said, I would help

them pack because Aaron Rogers makes you, and I think I mentioned this on my weekend podcast, I talked to Eric Zimney. Eric is the executive director and chief odds maker for all of the Hollywood sports book and casinos. And Eric's become, you know, a bit of a friend and he's been on the show. I texted him last week, and I just said, if Washington got Aaron Rogers, where would they be? And he sort of backed up my sentiment, and that is they'd be the second pick in the NFC to win the NFC championship behind Tampa. But he said it would be closer than you think.

And the reason he said that, he said, because they would, Washington would have a better chance of winning their division and a weak division with more wins, potentially. so he goes, you know, Tampa would be at like plus 250 and Washington would be at like plus 300. But I promise you, anybody out there that thinks that Chase Young without Aaron Rogers, but with Ryan Fitzpatrick, that Washington is like going to be the second pick to win the NFC championship. Like, this isn't even a conversation. But go ahead.

Tell me about your call. I mean, I get that. You know, I've had somebody asked me the other day, would you trade Chase Young? And I said, yes, I said, you know, I mean, we've seen great defenses with great defensive players finish eight and eight multiple times over the years. It does not, without the quarterback, it doesn't get you where you want to go. So, I mean, it's what we talked about on the podcast. I would consider it.

I think it would be a failure. I called it. I said if they don't, if Washington does not. If Aaron Rogers is traded someplace other than Washington, that would be a failure for me of the Washington front office. I said if Ryan Patrick, Kyle Allen or Taylor Heineke is the starting quarterback for Washington football for the start of the 2021 season and 35-year-old Rogers is starting for any team other than Green Bay, it would be front office malpractice. Well, if they don't And if he's not in Washington, it's not front office malpractice if they tried hard to get him And he just didn't want to come here

Well, I mean, that's that's you can try as hard as you want But if you know, if Green Bay is refusing to trade him to an NFC team You can't switch conferences to land him So there's a lot that could be out of their control But I would think that he would I mean, the fact that, and one part of the reason in my column was the fact that people are talking, I mean, guys like Stephen A. Smith, guys like Bill Barnwell are talking about the actual idea that Washington would be a good landing spot for Aaron Rogers. I said it's like winning off the field

for this team. You know, no one would have actually considered that at what, that the MVP, the league would be a good fit in Washington. This is progress in a way. You know, I said that Washington has transformed from a toxic wasteland to the land of milk and honey. Well, skim milk and splendor, perhaps. Yeah, I... That people are even considering it.

It's a testament to what Ron Rivera has done, in changing the image of this organization. Yeah, because I think that, well, look, they won the division, and I know they were seven and nine, they won the division, and the talk of, well, not the talk of the league, the talk of the division really was sort of Alex Smith for a while, but really Washington's defense and the fact that everybody sort of looks at this and they've got a couple of weapons on offense,

and if they can solve the quarterback thing, they're set up to win, but so is Denver. And Vegas, maybe to a lesser degree. Denver's roster, I love for Aaron Rogers. I think they immediately, of course, they're in the division with Kansas City. That's the problem there. So, you know, if they don't win the division, they're playing on the road to get to the Super Bowl with Aaron Rogers, rather than playing at home at mile high or whatever it's called now.

If they don't get them, you know, it's not going to be an indictment. What would be an indictment is if they didn't try hard. You know, the Matt Stafford thing gave me real confidence that these guys really do have a sense of what they have and what they need and that, and understanding that, you know, this, you know, building it the right way thing that people love to refer to as if that's a way. really, you know, the only way to do it. In fact, the other way to do it, just find your quarterback, even if you have to, you know, you got to have the quarterback. And thinking that you're going to strike gold in the draft in two years after you've built it the right way is just it's fool's gold, because it's a long shot that you'll end up finding that guy. Now, maybe you'll find somebody good enough and you can get to the playoffs and you can win a playoff game here or

there. Maybe even, you know, like Denver did with an older Peyton Manning, you might be able to make a Super Bowl or like Philadelphia did with Nick Foles, you know, sort of get a little bit, they got a little bit lucky there. They were lucky to survive the first game against Atlanta. But Aaron Rogers for the next three to five, four years, are you kidding me? Yes. It's an absolute, it's been dumbfounding to me for the last week or week and a half that we've had this conversation that a lot of people have pushed back on it. Not a lot. I mean, that poll that I did last week, two-thirds said, of course you would do the deal.

but a third, you know, said that they wouldn't, that they want to build it the right way. Well, I want to, right now it's been built to a point where if you added Aaron Rogers, like right now, you don't have to think about the future, about 2024, and maybe contending after you might have gotten a quarterback. Next year, you're going to be a legitimate contender to make it to the Super Bowl for the first time in 30 years. Yeah.

Unless you want to say that 2000 was a good year. And I pointed out that. But this is a brief. There should be a sense of urgency in getting him because this notion, this franchise image change is a fragile one. It can change back in an instant. I mean, there were a couple years ago, Jay Gruden was the head coach of this team, and they had just traded for Alex Smith coming off a career year in Kansas City. Now both of those guys are out of football. Okay, so this can change.

You have a moment, an opportunity here, a window to, if you're Ron Rivera, to propel your status, you know, the Joe Tory plan to propel your status as the man who saved Washington football to a legendary level. If you're the guy that can get Aaron Rogers here. And if you miss out and you're going into the season with the three stooges as quarterback, you have a high risk for opening up the door again to chaos. Yeah. Look, I don't know that someone like Aaron Rogers of his current stature even thinks it's a good enough place for him right now. And it's the best it's been. So he still understands who owns the team. And I guarantee you.

But that's the one thing I pointed out that he's never played for an owner. He's played for the socialist team in the league. The Packers. Yeah. You know? He's never had an owner. Just because they're publicly owned doesn't mean they're socialist. Well, compared to the rest of the NFL.

Okay. And he's never had an owner who would want to be his best buddy and who would say, oh, Aaron, you're great. Aaron, do this. Yeah, Aaron, here's my yacht. Here's the keys to my yacht. Aaron. You know, he's never had one of those. Who would he call for a quick heads-up if Washington was involved in the potential trade conversations? Who would he call about, you know, this place?

Alex Smith, probably. Yes. Probably called Alex. That wouldn't be a good phone call. Maybe not anymore. No. Yeah. No, Alex Smith, in case you haven't been paid attention to all the articles upon him leaving did not leave a happy camper.

He probably knows Trent Williams from some Pro Bowls being on the same Pro Bowl team. Oh, these are not good conversations. I know, I know. All right. When we come back after this, next break from one of our sponsors, tomorrow is mock schedule day.

Everybody's doing a mock these days. More on that next. So the NFL schedule comes out tomorrow night. It's the first time in years that they've actually had. a definitive schedule release date and time. Typically, Tommy, in the past, we had to guess when it was coming out, and even the networks were on standby. Usually the week, you know, following the national championship game in college basketball and the first week of baseball, it usually

came out that week or the week after. And like the NFL network and the ESPN in recent years have been told that it's sort of standby and wait because we're going to tell you basically, the morning of that we're going to do the schedule that night. I don't know why that is, but this year they have a definitive time, which is tomorrow night and day tomorrow night, to release the NFL schedule. It's obviously become a big deal over the years as everything. Well, it's become a big deal thanks to you. No. The mock schedule may have become a big deal because of me, but most people won't know that. Most people came up with the idea maybe on their own. I will tell you that, I think I started this.

I think it was actually 15 years ago with Riggins on the Rigo show because that was where I came up with, by the way, I'd been doing mock schedules for my own pleasure for years. So judge me if you, if you might. But I'll never forget, Rigo said, you want to do what? And I said, I want to do a mock schedule. This is what I do. He goes, all right. And Rigo was always up for anything.

But as I started to do it, like even he got a little bit confused. He said, wait a minute. Is this the real schedule or not? And I said, no, no, no. This is a mock schedule. Like everybody does mock drafts. I'm doing a mock schedule. And then he just sort of rolled his eyes like, I think it finally occurred to him as I was doing it on the air what this was.

And they just sort of shook his head and said, okay, well, that started a tradition. I obviously did it with you for years. And then somebody, hold on, I'm looking for this tweet. that somebody sent me this morning. Here it is. Sheehan, everybody's now copying you on your mock schedule. Remember how upset you got when Cooley tried to do it? I do remember that. Cooley, I explained to him what the mock schedule was, and I was doing it the next day, and he said, okay.

And then when we got to the mock schedule comment, he said, do you want to go first or do you want me to go first? Oh. I said, excuse me? I said, what are you talking about? He goes, well, I did one too. I said, no, you're not doing one. This is my thing. Absolutely.

This isn't your thing. This is my thing. And he's like, well, what do you mean? I love the idea. I put one together too. I've heard you do it in the past. I want to do it. I want to do my own.

And I said, well, do you think I've come in here on Tuesdays and Wednesdays with my own film breakdown? That's your thing. This is my thing. And so anyway, literally like he, after I finish mine, he starts to put his out and I'm like, no, no, no, no, no. And he's just talking right through me. It was actually funny. But I remember being like, no, that was my thing. Anyway, fast forward.

Everybody's doing one now. Yes, they are. You should have patented this or done something to gain control over this because people are profiting off your front. foolishness. Well, I don't think they're profiting because I've not, I've not profited from the foolishness. Actually, somebody reminded me of this that for years, no one was doing it and everybody was mocking it. Like, you mocked it, everybody mocked it.

Whatever. It was fine. It was a thing. It was a bit. But, like, even, you know, people would be like, he did a what? A mock schedule? Who cares? Well, anyway, I remember, and somebody reminded me of this, the St. Louis Rams, somebody that covered the Rams, did one, like 10 years ago maybe.

And somebody reached out to that dude to say, hey, man, you know, that's not your thing. That's Sheehan's thing. And the guy said, well, you know, whatever. And I'm like, and then somehow, like, we reached each other at me, but on social media, I'm like, dude, have at it. You know, it's imitations, the sincerest form of flattery. I'm not imitating you. I didn't even know you were doing it. I said, of course.

I didn't mean it that way. I'm meaning the fact that somebody else came up with this idea, and I'm not the only dope doing it, and now somebody else can be, now, here we are 10 years later, and everybody's doing it. Like, JP apparently put one out, Russell's got one,

they're all doing it. And so people are asking me on Twitter, do you care? No, because it is sort of flattering that people have somehow enjoyed this to the point where they think they will enjoy it themselves and that their own audience will enjoy it. That makes me happy. But I'm saving mine for last.

You're such a big guy. You're such a big-hearted guy. Well, what am I? First of all, you can't patent a mock schedule. And even if you did, where's the value in the patent? I would think that your staff could be able to come up with a formula for that. Once I said, I get a nickel for every time you put out a mock schedule. Okay, I'll give you a nickel.

I mean 500 bucks. Oh, no, then I won't do it. Like, I mean, and then I could have owned it. Well, that would be part of the reason to do it. It's to keep other people from doing it. So you have exclusivity. Here's the thing that will bother me. The one thing that will bother me is if people actually start judging these mock schedules

based on accuracy, based on hit rate. Because it's never been about hit rate. Now, don't get me wrong. when I put together my mock schedule, and by the way, I've already put together my mock schedule, and I'll have it on tomorrow's show. I'll have it on the radio show first tomorrow morning, and then I'll have it on the podcast when the podcast comes out. But I'm always trying to create the schedule that I think the NFL schedule makers and trying to do it in the way that they would be thinking about doing it.

And I take, you know, sort of recent scheduling, like how many years in a row have they closed at home or opened on the road or, you know. Now, national TV appearances are going to be way up this year because they were zilch last year with the exception of the game that got flexed in the final game of the year. That was their only primetime game of the year. Their only national television game of the year, like truly national TV was the Thanksgiving Day game against the Cowboys. I will tell you, I've already teased out one of the games. I think they're going to close the season at home against Dallas. And I don't think they're going to play the Cowboys on Thanksgiving this year. There have just been too many Washington, Dallas, Thanksgiving games in recent years, and the Cowboys have some really good potential opponents for their Thanksgiving day game at home. What I will tell you is what I've said before about this schedule. It's really, it's brutal on paper, and you know I'm not a schedule guy, but I don't know that any team in recent memory has faced the quarterbacks that Washington is scheduled to face. At home, Brady, Mahomes, Russell Wilson, and Justin Herbert. By the way, James Winston

and Dak Prescott, too. But I'm talking about like the elite quarterbacks, Brady Mahomes, Wilson at home. And you can start to think about Herbert is pretty damn good after one year. On the road, Josh Allen, Aaron Rogers, by the way, if he's not in Green Bay and he gets traded to Denver, Washington still plays at Denver, so they would still get Aaron Rogers. And Matt Ryan, I mean, Matt Ryan's not elite, but if you take Rogers, Josh Allen, Russell Wilson, Patrick Mahomes, and Tom Brady, that's five of the top six or seven quarterbacks in the league they're facing. How many MVP do you think there are between all those guys? Yeah, Brady, Mahomes, Wilson. Has Wilson won an MVP?

I don't think he has. No, he hasn't. He has not, which is remarkable. Did Matt Ryan win an MVP? he did, didn't? I think he did, yes. And then Rogers, yeah, no, it's amazing. So they have, you know, as long as these players are playing those particular days

and are healthy and the teams are decent, they've got quite a schedule. And also great opportunities for some prime time matchups, like Washington and Tampa and a playoff rematch, you know, could certainly be a primetime game. Washington and Dallas in Washington, Philly, Washington Giants are always

you know, potential primetime games. You know, the Washington Green Bay game. If it's Washington against Rogers, that, you know, Rogers is going to have plenty of opportunities. Don't get me wrong. Atlanta also has a London game

this year, so keep that in mind. Washington could end up playing in London against the Falcons. I don't think that's going to happen, but it could. So there are a lot of interesting things, and I'll have it out tomorrow. And as far as, you know, everybody in their mother now doing a mock schedule, I actually think that's kind of cool because if I were still here doing it by myself

and having people just mock it, those people that mocked it all those years, many of them are now doing it. So, anyway. There's a bit of baseball news. Okay, let's do that. And I think we should get to this FP Santangelo thing. We'll do that right after this word from one of our sponsors. You said there was some baseball.

What's the baseball news? Well, the news is that former Washington Nationals pitcher Jordan Zimmerman has announced his retirement. He had signed in the offseason with the Milwaukee Brewers, his hometown team, since he grew up right near there, and tried a couple of relief stints, and it really wasn't working for him. He's never been the same pitcher since he left Washington after 2015, signed as a free agent. with the Tigers for five years, $110 million, had all sorts of arm problems after that. But here in Washington, he was better than Strasbourg

for the years that he was here. Well, I mean, I'll never forget because I was at this game, the 18-inning game against the Giants in the postseason. and the game that he pitched and when they pulled them out, when, you know, when they, when San Francisco. Matt Williams went out and took him out. Yeah. And that tied the game.

It was Sandoval who tied the game, if I recall, in the ninth inning. And then, you know, another nine innings later, it finally ended. God, was it cold? It got so cold in that playoff game. But that was just a. gem of a playoff game. I mean, it was, it was, it was, it's a, he was such a good pitcher. And I, I followed him those first couple of years in Detroit. So he's just had injury issues. Yeah. He's also the guy, the guy to pitch the first no hitter. Right. For the Washington

Nationals as well. I remember in 2009, you know, and he was another guy who had to go through Tommy John surgery, uh, before Strasbourg did. In 2009, he was put Boston. The Red Sox came to town, and that was a big deal. The Red Sox coming to Washington, you know, in interleague play. And I remember the stadium was packed and Jordan Zimmerman pitched against the Red Sox. I think they won Washington did. Yeah.

I remember David Ortiz raving in the post game about what an impressive young pitcher Jordan Zimmerman was. And he probably, you know, if he has stayed healthy, he probably would have had possibly a Hall Fame career. As it was, after 13 years, he retires with 95 wins, 91 losses, and a 4.07 ERA. But with Washington, he was 70 and 50 with a 332 ERA in seven years. I just pulled up the play-by-play from that playoff game, that famous 18-ending playoff game. So I did have it right. it was Sandoval.

But remember, he entered the ninth with a shutout and a three-hitter going. His pitch count was 100. He struck out Duffy to start. Blanco got him to fly out to center. And then he walked panic by five pitches, and they yanked him and put Drew Storren in. I know. Posey singled, and then Sandoval doubled to tie the game with Posi getting thrown out at home. Remember that?

He got thrown out at home. If not, San Francisco may have won the game in nine innings. Obviously, that's had an opportunity in the bottom of the inning. But I remember that next stage is saying, are you kidding me? And I think you were all for it. Well, you don't know what the manager knows. No, I wasn't. I was not.

Okay. I mean, it was a bad idea. I had no confidence in Drew Storen. Right. Zero. Right. Matt Williams apparently disagreed. Drew Storn had some rough postseason moments here.

All right, so F.P. Santangelo basically was accused of sexual harassment and sexual assault. The athletic story sort of broke it down. You know, my thing on this, and I'll let you weigh in, is, you know, he denies it. So it's he said, she said, I don't know anything about this. I have no idea whether or not it's true. All of these things, you know, the two people involved and maybe some others, they're the ones that know. What I did find interesting last week, and I did notice this,

is that he was yanked on and off the air a lot last week. Like he was off the air, and then he was back on it for that Atlanta series, then he was off it, then he was back in for the beginning of the Yankee series, then he was off it. And it appeared as if the Nats were saying to Massen, take them off, and Massen saying, we're okay with it. And then when another allegation came up, then they pulled them off and then they said, you know, directed all inquiries to Major League Baseball.

So did you follow that aspect of it or not? Yeah, a little bit. I mean, and I'm not sure that that's true that, you know, Major League Baseball is investigating this. I'm not sure that that's accurate in terms of, well, look, Masson is a mess. Well, the NACS clearly turned it back to Masson. Yeah. Because the state is a mess right now. Now, they're there, I mean, it's an organization that's in disarray.

Regional sports networks themselves are really hurting these days. You know, a few years ago, they were a gold mine. Now they're, now they're hemorrhaging Uers and and Massen's never been a well-run network. And now it's just, so there's always a lot of confusion and chaos when it comes to them. You know, he's not a big Tom Levero fan. No, I told this story this morning. I told this the story this morning. I've told you this before, obviously.

And you can shed more light on it. But I've asked FP to be on the show two times. The first time was met with I will never, ever go on your show as long as Levero's on it. This was, you know, how many years ago? I'm like, whoa, okay. And I forget what the explanation I remember telling you. I remember what it was, but go ahead. And then when I was doing the show with Chris, I called them again and I said, hey, do you mind, are you available to come on tomorrow?

I will never go on your show. And I said, well, Tom's not on the show anymore. It's Chris Cooley and I. I will never go on your show. That was it, which was kind of assholeish, to be honest with you. Yes. You know, I mean, so I don't remember. I think, actually, I do remember it now.

It just came to me. who did you what player was it adam done that you absolutely ravaged in a column Mike Morse Mike Morse you ravaged in a column and that's what he said and I said well you know it's not a Mike Morse situation anymore and he said I will never go on your show so he may not have liked me very much either so I don't know what the reason was yeah I savage Mike Morris who was with the Giants then after he left Washington because Morse ripped, you know, criticized the Strasbourg trade

to reporters in San Francisco. The Strasbourg shutdown. Okay, the Strasbourg shutdown. You know, Strasbourg shut down to reporters in San Francisco, and I thought that was kind of gutless of them. And I admit, you know, I may have went over the top in my criticism.

What was your credit? What was the over-the-top? Well, basically I called him an idiot, and I pointed out that he literally was no, as a dummy when he was here in Washington. He wasn't the smart, you know, the sharpest pencil in the box. And I went too far. And if I had that column back, I would write it a little bit differently.

All right. But that's what it was. It was the Mike Morse thing. Okay. Yeah. I remember that it was because you had just eviscerated a certain player. I thought it would make it. Yeah.

And, you know, I have no opinion about FP1 way. the other. I like Bob Carpenter. I've always enjoyed the telecast. I don't think he's bad. I don't particularly like him one way or the other. Doesn't mean a whole lot to me. You know what? I've kind of liked him. And I know a lot of people that don't like them, you know, friends of mine that I'm like, oh, no, especially people who really are into, you know, analytics in particular, they don't like him. I have sort of enjoyed the broadcast for many years with him and Bob. I think it's been a pretty decent broadcast. And, you know, I remember saying this to somebody who's a good friend of mine who's a big baseball guy. I said, you know, it's not Jim Palmer learning, you know, when you

watch. But I think FP's pretty good. I think he's really good in the game situation stuff. And this guy said, no, no, he's not. I'm like, well, I, I, I, I, I, I, never had a problem with him on the broadcast. You should have reminded that guy that he replaced Rob Dibble. Yeah. Who was an absolute, who had to rally to be a moron. Right. And Ron Darling before Dibble, right?

No, Don Sutton was in there after. Yeah, and Sutton was great. Mm-hmm. So, again, I have no idea whether, you know, how accurate these stories are. I mean, the statement that I thought the interesting part, though, Tommy, back to what I said before, was the statement from the nationals was, quote, late last week, we were made aware of allegations of conduct by F.P. Santangelo that are inconsistent with our values as an organization. We alerted Massen and revoked our approval of him as a member of our broadcast team. Massen assured us that they would investigate these allegations thoroughly.

After Massen notified us that their investigation was complete and that F.P. should be reinstated. additional posts appeared, additional accusations, I guess. Once again, we notified Massen and revoked our approval of F.P. As a member of our broadcast team indefinitely, moving forward, we will refer all questions regarding this investigation to FPs employer, Massen. Like, it's not our issue. This isn't our fault. And then Massen pushed it back onto baseball.

So everybody's passing the buck here on this. You know what? I don't know anything about these allegations. And you just root for the truth to be the outcome. And that's what I do in these situations. But based on recent history, I don't know that we're ever going to see him back in the booth. That would be the betting odds right now. I would agree with you. Absolutely.

Anyway, all right, you got anything else? I got nothing else for you, boss. All right, I'll be back tomorrow, and I will have the mock schedule. We'll go through it game by game.