The Kevin Sheehan Show - Redskins And Tone Deaf Together Again

Episode Date: November 28, 2018

Kevin addresses the Redskins move to claim Reuben Foster off waivers. Joe Theismann joins the show with his thoughts on the Foster decision and a lot more including Colt McCoy and the Skins' chances at a playoff run. Chris Knoche is a guest on the show to preview tonight's Maryland-Virginia game in College Park. Kevin does some "NFL Buy And Sell" with an interesting AFC playoff pick. <p> </p><p>Learn more about your ad choices. Visit <a href="https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices">podcastchoices.com/adchoices</a></p> Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You want it. You need it. It's what everyone's talking about. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Now here's Kevin. I'm here. Aaron's here. This show's presented by Window Nation. If you're in the market for Windows, call 86690 Nation or go to Window Nation. And tell them we told you to call. Joe Thysman will be on the show today. Maryland is ranked 24th in the nation and Virginia is ranked number four. They play tonight in College Park. I expect Xfinity Center. to be lit tonight for the first time this year. Virginia, only a three and a half point favorite. Seems fishy. Smell test. Chris Nakke is going to be on the show, and we will preview the game together. So, in the past,

when the sports-related conversation and controversy spills into the every other life conversation and controversy, because of something a player or a team did is doing, and it sparks outrage and universal criticism like yesterday when the Redskins signed Ruben Foster. My immediate thought, almost always in this situation, in these situations, my default is contrarian. I'm always thinking about the other side to see if I have legitimate passion or belief that the masses might be wrong. Look, the Reds,

Skins were the only team in the league to put a waiver claim in for former 49ers linebacker Ruben Foster, a player with three arrests in the last two years, two domestic violence arrests, one where the charges were dropped, and then with the same woman just this past weekend on Saturday night, another domestic incident and arrest. The other arrest was a marijuana misdemeanor possession arrest. But this was also the player, if you recall, who had an altercation with a high. hospital employee during the 2017 scouting combine, which just happens to be a rather important week for a college prospect. That behavior, along with other behavior, pretty much scared teams off from Ruben Foster, who was a projected mid-first-round pick in 2017 and went at the very end of

the first round to San Francisco. So my immediate default position is always contrarian. Maybe everybody is wrong on this. Maybe the outrage is misplaced. Maybe they're missing something. I know one thing. The media masses rarely know the entire story within 24 hours. And I don't either. I don't have all the details. I don't think the Redskins have all of the details on this story. But I'm always looking to buy when everyone else is selling and I'm looking to short when everyone else is buying. That's pretty much the way I bet on sports, aka the smell test. And that has sort of worked out over the years. It's even more my default position when it comes to many in the media hoard who aren't just outraged, but personally offended, which is really what you saw on social media yesterday.

There was personal offense in this particular situation. I've just found over the years being in the media that most of the people I know in the media are really good at what they do, and most are really good people. I've got a lot of good friends, but most haven't had much day-to-day logistical professional exposure. They tend to be naive in many ways to all of the variables involved in these decisions that some of these teams make in these situations. I was surprised initially that Maryland took DJ Durkin back. It seemed like the wrong PR move, and every columnist in talking head in the country was outraged beyond what seemed even appropriate for the matter. Paul Feinbaum called it the worst thing he had ever seen in four decades of covering college

football, as if to say that Jerry Sandusky molesting young boys over multi-decade was not as bad as bringing DJ Durkan back. Hyperbole like that always puts me in pushback mode. Like, let's just calm down here for a moment. Like Paul Feinbaum was ridiculous. He should have been embarrassed by his comments. I love Sally Jenkins. I think she's the best columnist that I follow. I think she's the best writer, the most provocative writer,

although I love Chuck Culpepper too. God, just read some of his college football stuff in the post over the weekend. But Sally basically indicted the entire university. That was exaggeration. She said essentially your life was threatened, if you attend the University of Maryland. That's why I said to Tommy during the Maryland thing that while I wouldn't take Durkan back

and I was surprised that they initially did, I also considered the other side that people like Tommy and Feinbaum probably didn't consider and that is, you know, Maryland's going to be stuck with the day-to-day consequences of this decision. Tommy isn't, Sally isn't, Feinbaum isn't. They're not necessarily privy to the financial fallout of Durkin's firing.

the fact that people will likely lose their jobs, innocent people that have been working at the university because of budget shortfalls associated with this decision. There's a lot that goes into these decisions. And the people that have to live with the day-to-day consequences, they can't really worry about what the outside world thinks. Everybody will say, well, that's PR tone deafness. And yeah, I tend to agree that you've got to consider that because that's a business hit too. when you take a public relations hit, that's a potential huge revenue hit. So all of that has to be considered. But anyway, I'm getting sidetracked here.

Don't get me wrong. The Maryland thing, I ultimately was very surprised that they took them back. And then obviously the outraged media influenced Maryland and a governor and others into making a different decision. I'm not saying that the media, by the way, is always wrong. The Duke Lacrosse case, the media response was wrong. On a much lower importance level, the Brady Deflategate everyone was wrong. So many were so outraged and they jumped to the wrong conclusion. They didn't cheat any more than Indianapolis cheated on that day.

I don't think immediately in the aftermath of this Rubin Foster thing, though, as much as I would love to think that the masses could be wrong. think they are wrong on this one. So let me cut to the chase there. Look, the Redskins know a lot more, hopefully, than the team's statement reflected, but maybe they don't. Maybe they have information that will fully exonerate Ruben Foster. Maybe one of the Alabama players or several of them on the team know the real story of what's gone on in this on-again, off-again relationship that's been volatile at the very least, if not criminal. It's possible. I mean, it's possible that the Redskins are giving a young man a second chance because they know much more than we know right now. Of course,

they wouldn't consider this if he didn't have talent. They loved him coming out in the 2017 draft. I was pretty convinced, and many of us on that draft night, Cooley, Clinton, Portis, and others, were convinced that they were going to take Ruben Foster at 17 overall. Jay loved him, loved him. but Jonathan Allen fell because of the arthritic reports about his shoulder and the Redskins pounced on a top five talent in Jonathan Allen at number 17 overall so they didn't have the chance to draft Rubin Foster. Although I do remember some discussion about the Redskins potentially trading back up into the end of the first round because they loved Foster so much. But the 49ers drafted him. But they loved him. And it's the only reason they signed him yesterday.

football talent. They think he can help at a position where, by the way, they need some help right now, inside linebacker. Now, he's not going to be able to help anytime soon. He's on the commissioners exempt list until the league does their review of this. Doug Williams, the guy who now has to speak on all of these matters, because there's recognition, I believe, within the organization that putting Bruce Allen out there for almost anything results in few people that have season tickets now remaining wanting to continue to keep those tickets. I mean, he is Satan to Redskins fans. Nobody wants to look at him and nobody wants to hear from him. So good on the organization for recognizing that and pushing Doug out there on all of these matters. Of course, they spelled Doug Williams name wrong on the

press release, the initial one. No, they didn't. Yeah, they left out the second eye in Williams. That's why they put out, I don't know if you're on the mailing list, but they sent out. They sent out one and they sent out another one like two hours later and no one quite realized why until they realized in the first one, Williams was spelled wrong. Oh, God. I mean, the stories about some of the people

in their PR department that I could share with you, the limited ability and the limited sort of sense, emotional IQ is just beyond belief in a professional organization that generates, you know, $400 million a year in revenue and is part of a league that generates $10 billion in revenue. It's beyond me at times. Everybody just shakes their head at times about this organization and their public relations

ability. But Doug is the organization's only front office person with any positive connection to the fan base. So he gets to tell us about all these things. His quote yesterday was, The Redskins fully understand the severity of the recent allegations made against Rubin. If true, you can be sure these allegations are not. nothing our organization would ever condone. Let me be clear, Rubin will have to go through numerous steps,

including the full legal process and investigation and potential discipline from the NFL, as well as meetings with counselors associated with the team, before he will ever have the opportunity to wear the burgundy and gold as a player. Close quote. It's not a bad statement from the team. I heard people mocking that statement. I mean, were they mocking it that Doug was making it? Not Bruce.

I don't really know. I think the kind of the honor of putting on the burgundy gold that in retrospect. That was the mocking part. It was that and it was also the, you know, you have to be, you know, you have to be clear of allegations to get this. Meanwhile, they're still paying his paycheck while these allegations are going on and are choosing to do so. They claimed them off waivers, which means they did claim his existing contract, which means they will be paying him even if he's not playing. But they're not, this isn't, they didn't sign him to a multi-million dollar contract extension. Okay. So reports surfaced late yesterday, by the way, that the team's decision to claim Foster was not unanimous.

I actually found this to be interesting. Les Carpenter and Kareem Copeland from the Post reported that it was Bruce Allen who masterminded the deal. Look, there's no masterminding, masterminding this deal. They were the only 30, they were the only team of 32 willing to take the shot at this, which should tell you something, by the way. All they had to do is claim them off waivers. And just following up on what we were just talking about, it's important to note to all of you who believe that somehow they just signed him to this long-term contract

or built a statue to him, that all they did was claim them off waivers. They did something that we see all the time in sports, teams taking PR risks on talent. It happens all the time in every sport. I just don't think it should happen with this organization. More on that in a moment. By the way, I would imagine that the new guy,

the guy brought in from the league to ensure that these PR disasters were finally kept to a minimum. Brian Lafamina, and I like Brian. I've sat with Brian and talked to Brian multiple times. I bet he either didn't know about this and is pissed off about it, or he was the one that thought it was a bad idea. By the way, think about this. Not consulting him is not a very good sign for Brian Lafamina. and worse than that, ignoring him isn't a good sign at all. Really isn't a good sign. I'm sure he's thrilled right now to be here. That didn't take very long, did it?

No. I think Tommy had that one back in September when he urged Brian to rent, not buy. Chris Russell, by the way, just tweeted out. To add to this from last night, told this morning that key personnel people and some important assistant coaches are not on board with acquisition of Foster. What matters, Jay Gruden, Bruce Allen, and Dan Snyder approved it. Yeah. So let me get back on point here for a moment. I always love to find the other side of the masses when it's a reasonable side to take. I'm always hoping to find that the position of the other side is reasonable. And it's a position that I'm truly passionate about and I believe in because I love to go against the media avalanche. There's a case to be made here that it doesn't matter what they do from a PR standpoint. Think about it from this perspective. They are so hated right now. and so despised as an organization by so many, that they can't win for losing when it comes to the way people think of them.

And that the only thing that they can do to get out of this mess is to win and to win big. And if they believe taking a player that can play a position where they need help, inside linebacker, will result in winning more games, and there's no roster downside, no football downside. They don't owe them anything at the charges stand. It's not like this is a salary cap risk. They may have decided behind closed doors. Dan, Bruce, and Jay, hey, everybody hates us anyway. And we just talked to John Allen and Duran

Payne and Ryan Anderson and all the Alabama guys and they're going to be a great support system for him. And we believe he may even be innocent of all of these charges. And damn it, he can sure help us win. We loved him coming out in this draft. We know what the reaction is going to be. It's going to be outraged from everybody in this environment of 2018. But they already hate us. They already think we're losers. The only thing that's going to fix this is winning, so be it. Perhaps that's their thinking on this. As much as I'd like to go contrarian and sit here in the studio today

and tell the tale of being totally for this move, I can't. I have felt for a long time now, and I'm a lifelong fan. I've recognized, like many of you have, but even more so, because I know many of the people involved. I've been involved in a radio station for many years that was owned by Dan Snyder, and we were the rights holder, at least in contract, we were the rights holder. The organization is, we've known this for a while, the organization is truly limited from an intelligence standpoint. They're arrogant, and that combination has consistently bit them in the backside, gotten them in trouble.

And the results have followed. games lost trust, diminishing support. Here's the bottom line. Ruben Foster has been arrested three times in two years. One year. No, it's about, it's, the 28th 18th is this is the third time he's been arrested in 2018. No, but the two domestic and the marijuana, the three arrests are over almost a two year period now. Because one of them was in 2000, in, maybe in early 2017. whatever. It's three arrests in a very short period of time. I don't care if all of them have circumstances that the team has learned will exonerate or paint a totally different picture of this guy. One arrest? Maybe. Three in a short period of time plus the scouting combine incident. No effing way are you signing him. For this team with the ticket selling issues that they have, with the interest level issues that they have, you can't do it. It doesn't matter what you think you know about this situation. And really and truly,

let me get to this. I don't think they know that much about it. The words of a few 22, 23, 24 year olds who are friends with him that say, hey, we know, we know Rubin and, you know, we know the circumstances. He's a great dude. You're rolling the dice if that's your information. I mean, that's not the only information you need. Friends that are 22, 23, and 24 years old, and not experienced in public relations and in business, I hope you didn't sign this guy because John Allen and Duran Payne told you, believe any of that shit he's a great guy how tone deaf can one company be who the hell sits down at a meeting yesterday or the day before and says we have a major ticket selling problem we have a major credit credibility problem in our community and in

our marketplace when it comes to almost anything we do from the plethora of negligent football decisions we've made over the years to the off-field dramas with alcoholic general managers and suing season ticket holders and all of it. Who the hell then says, hey, let's sign a guy that just got arrested over the weekend for a second domestic violence charge in the Me Too era. There is one team in the NFL that could have done this yesterday and somehow gotten away with it. And that team is the New England Patriots. New England could have done it.

And people would have sat back and they said, oh, they probably know something that we don't know. Or they've got a culture there. You know, they've got a culture that can deal with this. There's one team in the NFL that absolutely shouldn't have done this yesterday. And that team is the Washington Redskins because they don't ever get these things right. They don't have the culture to welcome in somebody that has this past, whether it's exaggerated or even wrong or it's completely right. You know, yesterday, I mean, I loved social media. Like, everybody's tying this into the Washington football team,

because not only are they dumb and tone deaf, but of course, they're racist too. You know, so in this meeting where they decided to do this, and it sounds like there was pushback, who was the guy that said, hey, Dan, all the stuff is just going to come out again. We're going to have to deal with this for a few days. And what's the upside here? What's the real upside? Is he really that good?

I mean, do we have Dick Butkus here? Is this going to be the greatest middle linebacker or inside linebacker? How sure are we that he's going to equate to wins? Because if we're not totally sure about that, there's no decision here. Like if we're not signing Lawrence Taylor or Butkiss or, you know, in recent years, inside linebackers, Patrick Willis, if we're not signing that guy, what are we even talking about this for? because all the stuff, the tone deafness, the racist, the stupid, all of it is going to come up here.

And you know what? All of it's been right. It's beyond me. Perhaps they knew what the reaction would be again. And they said, we don't care. We're going to get called all these names and all of these things. But, you know, the reality of the last 25 years makes me believe that we just throw this one into the bucket of dumb. Like, this is just another one that goes into the bucket of dumb. I want them to beat Philadelphia. I do. I'd like to see them win three or four more and play a playoff game. But I'm not sure that before yesterday began,

they could have done anything riskier to their current dilemma, their ticket-selling dilemma, their lack of fan interest dilemma. I don't think they could have done anything riskier to that than sign Rubin Foster three days after he was arrested for the second time in a short period of time for domestic violence. But wait, but wait, they may have hit the Daily Double yesterday. Did you see this?

Did you see the Sean Taylor commemorative doll story? I didn't see this until last night. Somebody sent me the Dead Spin story. The Redskins apparently yesterday on the 11-year anniversary of Sean Taylor's tragic passing, the Redskins were selling on their website. Sean Taylor commemorative dolls. The price tag, I think, was somewhere around $25, somewhere around there. Here's what I don't know in the Deadspin story does not address,

and maybe they addressed it. I thought I read the whole thing, but I didn't see it addressed. Was this the first day that they made this doll available, or has that doll been available for a long time? I don't know. I can tell you this, that after Deadspin printed the story, the Redskins pulled the Sean Taylor doll off their online store. I don't even know what to say about this.

I mean, first of all, the doll doesn't even look like Sean Taylor. But then again, do dolls ever look like players? But even if they thought this was somehow a way to honor him, did anybody say that charging for it and making money off the anniversary of his death was a bit uncouth, was a bit inappropriate, that wouldn't really feel right? I mean, seriously. As Deadspin points out, Dan Snyder is the only person who made money off of the 9-11

commemorative hats that the team sold. That's different. That's even different than this. You know, the 9-11 game on the 10-year anniversary that they played against the Giants at FedEx Field was actually a day done very right by the organization. I remember that day. There was a lot about that day that really felt right, felt as a remembrance, as a proper honor and remembrance of those. But this wasn't the 10-year anniversary. This was on the fifth year anniversary, a bunch of teams put out like, you know, never forget hats.

Everybody else was giving the proceeds to charity. And the Redskins charged for it. Well, not charged for it, but they kept the proceeds. No, they kept the proceeds. Yeah. This Sean Taylor-Taylor-Dall thing, if yesterday was the first day that this became available, honestly, I don't even know what to say. This is, it just goes in the bucket of dumb, you know. It's just consistently happens.

It makes it hard. You know, I know I talk to a lot of you people. It makes it hard for those of us that were weaned on this football team. And remember the good old days and the winning days. in the days of class. It makes it hard, man, to hang in there. I'm a sucker for it, I guess, because on game day, you know, everything else sort of gets washed away and it's like, let's beat the cowboys. Let's beat the damn giants or eagles. But they're just not very bright. They haven't been very bright. And the worst combination in any person or any company is dumb and

arrogant. It's the worst combination because the mistakes that completely, that get made over and over and over again, they don't think they're mistakes. And so they don't learn from them. All right, let me tell you about window nation, because one thing I've learned about window nation over the years is that they sell some damn good windows and they are a great company to work with. Harley and Aaron and Eric all listen to the podcast. If you've been thinking about new windows. I promise you as someone who has had Window Nation install windows in my home that you can't go wrong by giving them a call. Times running out. Window Nation's deal of the years right now. This week is the final week. This week right now is the final week for buy two windows, get two windows free,

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wins to start this season. And there's one in particular that stands out, and that was the last one. Their win Friday night over Hofstra, where they had 90 points with six and a half minutes to go in the game and finished with the highest point total, I think, in Turgeon's career in college park, 104 against a team that was thought to be a pretty good team coming into this season. I thought it was one of the more impressive performances we've seen from this team in a long, long time, a bit surprising to me. What was your takeaway from it? I have no argument with any of that, Kevin. I think that, you know, they also played a team in Marshall, but he came in undefeated and very confident.

What did I say? I said Hofstra. I meant Marshall. Thank you. Marshall. You know, you know, they came in believing that they could win. Marshall did. And I had a chance to visit with their head coach, Dan DeAnne, who was basically, you know, said,

if we do a couple of things well, we'll be in great shape in this game. And I did visit with him after the game. And his worst words were out of his mouth was, my goodness, what a ass kick it that was. But he, and Maryland got it going midway through that first half, and it was probably the best performance by Anthony Callant, you know, the junior point guard that we've seen in some time. He was just phenomenal in the first half, including drawing a foul with a second to play in the first half to get three free throws. All of a sudden, that 12-point lead goes out to 15. and, you know, Marshall's in the rear view the rest of the way. So it was as good a performance as you, I think you could expect from a team

whose core is really very young and seems to be improving every game. What I've loved from this team so far this year is what I believe to be, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, a conscientious effort to play faster, to use their athletes and, you know, while it's young, still some, decent depth on this particular team to wear out teams with some pressure and to look to run at every opportunity they can. Do you think that this is part of a new thought process with this coaching staff with this particular team this year? Because it isn't what they've always thought of in the past. Well, I can only hope. I've seen them practice a bunch. And that's

where, you know, that's kind of a lab, as you well know, that's where decisions are made and formulas are implemented, and they have made a conscientious effort to do that at every practice. So I'm hoping that's the case because it sure makes the games a heck a lot more entertaining, whether it's Maryland or anybody else. I like it with teams go up and down. The one thing I worry about a little bit, Kevin, is, you know, I think that sometimes in the grind of a conference season, And I think sometimes coaches, you know, human nature takes over and you sort of revert to the norm, you know. And I hope that's not the case because this team seems to be really well equipped to play that kind of game. And it certainly helps Anthony Callan, you know, who out in an open court is a, you know, it's like just impossible to find him and to stay in front of them.

So I'd love to see it. I hope that's the case. I love the direction of the arc, you know, of these first six games. games and you know tonight's you know obviously it's a lot different test and you're playing against the team that wants no part of going up and down the court none so it's uh we'll see how that goes yeah it's a true contrast in styles tonight if maryland's new but way of playing is to try to play fast and try to increase the possessions in a game you know over the years i i rarely miss your post game conversation with with the coach i think you always and i've told you this many times before

I think you do a great job in that moment, which is sometimes a difficult moment to have him in the locker room after the game. But so many times after some of these grinded out big 10 games, wins or losses, he's made a consistent comment over the years. He said this league really scouts well. They really know your stuff. And when I hear that, I always think, well, look, if you can get stops and take it off the rim and not have to run your stuff and you can get out and transatlap. transition, you eliminate that as a problem. And so I hope that that is truly an emphasis. And we've seen it in these first few games, but you know the comment that he's made that no less than a dozen times with you over the last few years about how well this league scouts and how hard it is

to run your stuff. Yeah, the other thing is that if you do change the way that you play, which he has. I mean, some of the half court sets are the same and all that. But if if you do change your style of play, then other programs, other schools no longer have a book on you, you know, quote-unquote books, you know, where they, you know, they know exactly what you're doing and when you're doing it. So I agree with you. I think it's healthy for this team. It fits this team. I think it's good for Mark Turgeon to be outside the box a little bit.

I think it's, I think there's so many benefits to this. And I just like the hundreds of possessions in a game. I think it would benefit this team, given the skill set that they've got with the young guys. So they seem to be really embracing it, Kevin. That's also part of – I think why they're playing so hard and having so much fun is I think they like the style of their plan, too. I think they've embraced this whole thing. You know, let's press more. When we get it off the room, we've got two dynamic rebounders, the dynamic interior.

players. Let's get it and go. All right, let's talk about some of the players before we get to the game tonight. Bruno Fernando's been a beast in these six games, but, you know, it starts for real tonight and with conference games starting over the weekend. How much better is he, as you've watched him courtside than he was a year ago? Yeah, he's, I mean, he's a different guy. He's a little inside baseball for you. After their Hofster win, I walked into the Hofstra locker room.

I know the coaching staff, and the head coach looked at me, and he's the first thing out of his that he said, I had no idea of Bruno Fernando was that good. And while his skill set has come a long way, he's worked on his game. You know, it's been said, one of my NBA friends likes to say that sometimes a player's best ability is his availability. And Bruno has kept himself out of foul trouble and in games. He's been available. And when he's on the court, I mean, he's just got such a privilege.

presence in there on both ends. He's the reason why, for instance, the guy like Eric Iyala, it gets a lot of three-point looks because you have to account for Bruno when he's got the ball in his hands. Somebody's going to be open if he's able to make a decent pass out of there. And he's done it. Bruno's learned how to play, making the right choices. He's come miles. Tell me, and for those that we'll be watching tonight for the first time, and we know a lot of the people will. Tell everybody about the three freshmen, the three key freshman, Iyala, St. Smith out of Baltimore, Mount St. Joe's, and Wiggins out of North Carolina. Give me strengths, weaknesses, and how far along all three of them are?

Well, Eric Ayala is a, you know, he's a little bit of an older freshman. He looks like he's 30. He does. He plays the game with a lot of mocks. He's sort of a kind of a, kind of a, throwback style point guard a pass first guy. But over the course of the last couple of games, he's knocked down a bunch of threes. He's found himself open, getting more assertive and more confident. And he's also taken a lot of pressure, a lot of ball handling pressure off of Anthony Cowen, which is one of the reasons why I think Callan has exploded over the last few games as well. Aaron Wiggins is sort of a prototypical wing at 6'6 long. Very good defender. I think

very much an underrated defender. You know, he's had some good games. He's been a little spotty, a little inconsistent, as you would expect, maybe out of a freshman, but he's getting a lot of important minutes. He seems to be one of those guys, too, that loose balls and long rebounds kind of find him. Sort of an intangible value there. I think he's going to be a very good score wearing this uniform this year, and, you know, for a couple of years to come, for sure.

I think he's shown himself to be really, really, really. really capable. And then Jalen Smith is a five-star guy. You know, it's no secret that, you know, he's one of the premier high school players in the country last year. And he's had a couple double-doubles. I mean, he's, he, I think if you asked him, you know, he would tell you that he hasn't played nearly up to his capabilities this year. He hasn't started games particularly well, but he just, it's unbelievable how he can, how he can collect, just pile up statistics. You know, he's a very, very good natural rebounder. He seems to get fouled regularly.

It's got to improve that free throw shooting a little bit. Well, both he and Fernando have to do that. It's so early in this season, I think that the more they get to the line, the better they're going to shoot. I watch them shoot, and structurally, the shot is fine. I agree. Shot is fine. You know, he's got a nice release.

He's going to be fine. But he's, I think he just gets better and better all the time. He hasn't even shown his three-point shooting ability yet, and he can knock it down. I worry sometimes if he goes into a game and knocks down four or five threes, you know, the NBA guys in attendance are going to start writing furiously, and, you know, he'll be there for a cup of coffee in College Park. He's that good.

He's got a ways to go, but he's really something. Yeah, for those that, again, that'll just be tuning in tonight for Maryland's first big game of the year, ranked 24th in the country against number four Virginia in the ACC Big Ten Challenge. Jalen Smith, Stick Smith, his nickname Stick Smith, was a projected first round pick before he ever played his first college game this year. He was somewhere in the 15 to 30 range of most mock drafts. I'll tell you what, from what I've seen so far, and the conference season and February, March, et cetera, will tell the tale. But Bruno Fernando looks to me like there's no chance he would go after the end of the first round.

No chance. If people haven't seen Bruno Fernando in person, this is the guy, Ritnaki, that looks the NBA part. He's a monster physically. It's crazy. You stand up close to him. I interviewed him after the game the other day against Marshall. And it's just so impressive physically, how big this guy is, how imposing he is. He's a wonderful guy, great personality. And by the way, to your point about sticks and Bruno, you know, I mean, I know how the NBA thinks, and they're all about upside, you know, what this guy's going to be like in a couple of years. And the NBA, we've got a lot of NBA traffic at games these days. But, I mean, you look in terms of their abilities right now. I mean, Bruno's so much better than sticks is right now.

And yet you don't see Bruno anywhere close to the sticks on some of those draft boards. it's kind of maddening but I get it I know how that game is played I just as you were speaking I I just pulled up NBA draft dot net which puts out you know updated mock drafts all the time and Jalen Smith is projected number five overall to the Knicks and bruno Fernando is projected 18th overall in the first round to the 76ers so I mean of course the order of the draft is a true projection, as are the players, but, you know, sort of updated. Now, this is dated November 12th. So this is from a couple of weeks ago. Yeah, that's higher than I've seen.

Me too. Me too. Much higher. Much higher. I was just curious because I hadn't looked at it in a while. We'll get to the game tonight here in a moment, but I will say this. I've been an Anthony Cowan fan from the beginning. He played a lot of minutes last year, as we know. There wasn't enough help, so there was a real focus on him. from the opponent defensively. But Naki, he is one of the fastest end-to-end guys in the country at that position. And even though he is slight and not very big, I think he is and can be at times a tenacious defender.

Well, I think that's where he's getting bigger and his game has developed. He's got much more range this year than last year on his three-point shot. But I think that's one of the areas where he's really improved this year. And it may be, back to the original point, and maybe because he's getting more regular rest during games. But he's been an absolute bulldog on defense. Marshall came in with their senior guard John Elmore average in 23 or 24 a game. And he couldn't do anything against Anthony. He was up in his shirt the whole time.

Obviously, it's a team game defensively. But Anthony has been the guy who's covered the lead guard defensively. He's done a really good job with that over the course of the first six games. He's got his work cut out for it tonight against Virginia, but he'll be fine in that. And then I think on the offensive, and what it looks like Maryland is sort of want to do on offensively is if they get a rebound, they look for Callan as the primary outlet, primary point guard to push it up the court. Like you said, I mean, it's just warp speed when he gets the ball. And if they're walking it up, it's more likely going to be Ayala that initiates the offense. And that's kind of working for them right now.

You don't see that system very often, but for right now, they seem to have evolved that way. All right, let's get to tonight. Virginia's loaded again. D'Andre Hunter, if you haven't watched them play, is a legitimate star in college basketball. And we know this style that they play in the way they want to play. They want to play a game in the 50s, and Maryland, hopefully this year is a team that wants to play in the 80s. give me your thoughts on the matchup. Is it a good matchup or a bad matchup for Maryland tonight?

Well, I mean, it's a home game against the top five team. You've got to be excited for the opportunity. I don't know that it's a great matchup necessarily for Maryland, but it is the opportunity that presents itself today, and you have to seize it. They've got a bunch of veteran guys. You mentioned DeAndre Hunter, who is an NBA lock. I mean, I think he's going to be really good.

he's almost right now one of the things that surprises me, he's almost 50% from the three-point line, shooting the ball really well. They're just so well coached defensively. They do it as well as anybody. They have a wealth of size that they throw at you inside. And I think the biggest variable in this game for me is how it's officiated.

And, you know, foul trouble. Maryland cannot afford to have a guy like Bruno Fernando and foul trouble against this team. You have to have them on the court. I, you know, the way the game is whistled is a big part of it because UVA kind of clutches and holds and grabs. And, I mean, actually, they're just a very physical team defensively. So the way it's administered is a big part of this. Who's making shots?

They have a veteran back court tied your own, Kyle guy. Those guys are good players. Maryland needs to have a guy or two step up and be able to knock down threes consistently against this team. Because otherwise, they're going to play gaps. they're going to eliminate a lot of drives to the basket, eliminate second shot opportunities. You're going to have to make a couple of jumpers for sure against this team. I think about their last meeting when they played them in the first ACC Big Ten game

when Maryland's first year in the Big Ten in 2014, and they did not call it closely. And Mello just was they beat them up in that game physically. And Maryland had a very difficult time running off. against Virginia. I know they're two totally different teams now, but when you said that, I thought back to that game, and I think you're right. I mean, Maryland, first of all, it would be great to be able to get stops and increase the pace of the game if they can. But Virginia, Virginia, for whatever reason, it doesn't matter who they play, they just don't let you,

nobody gets back on defense in the history of college basketball than Tony Bennett's Virginia teams, right? I mean, it's almost impossible. to get a fast break opportunity. And, you know, there are, it's a lot easier to slow a game down than it is to speed it. Yes. And they're, they're masters of that, masters of the craft. They know what they're doing. Back to that game that you're talking about, Mellow Trimble got beat up.

That was sort of the first time I had seen Virginia's Malcolm Brogden up close in person. Right. And, you know, he had such great size. And he was so physical as the opposing point guard. And it just seemed to me in that game, and I love me some Mellow Trimble. He's one of my all-time favorite Terp players. But it seemed like that game was sort of an older brother, taking the younger brother out to the court and then, you know, let's go.

And just sort of took him to the woodshed a little bit. Well, you know what, Chris? It played out, right? Brogden's in the NBA, a highly productive player in the NBA, and Mello isn't. Sometimes you do know. Well, Mellon's in Australia making some good money. I know.

Yeah, your point is well taken. Yeah, and Brogden could have been or maybe was, working of the year as first. He had a great rookie season. He's a pro's pro. Yep. All right. I'm looking forward to tonight.

I mean, I remember Coach Thompson once said to me, because I got all excited about a Maryland win, you know, eight, nine years ago in November. He came in one day, and he just said, boy, November doesn't mean anything. You got a totally different team in more. March. And, you know, his point was well taken because I don't know if there's a sport where what you do in November and December, it matters, but it is, it typically more often than not isn't

even close to reflective of the type of team up or down that you'll have in February or March. It just, it never is. While I absolutely agree with you on that, I just feel like this is a team right now, Maryland, that needs a little bit of certification, you know? Yeah. And I think that from just sort of an intrinsic value, a win in this game, while, you know, the value is very fleeting. I mean, honestly, Kevin, you have your first Big Ten game this Saturday.

I know. If somebody told me I could pick one of these games to win, I would probably pick the Big Ten game because at the end of, in February and March, that's going to mean a lot more, maybe mean a lot more than Virginia. I'm not sure. I wouldn't. It is November. I wouldn't. I want tonight. I'll take tonight for Penn State. I mean, look, this is, I mean, you know how I feel. I feel like we should have never left the ACC.

And I miss these games, and I'm excited about the matchup, and I'm so glad it's not Pitt or Syracuse or Louisville. I'm glad it's Virginia, and I hope one day it can be Duke in this game or North Carolina. Well, it has been North Carolina. But this would be a huge, huge March chip to get if they can win. Yeah, I would agree. Okay, so flip it around here. Give me a prediction. I like them tonight. I like their chances tonight. For one reason and one reason only the line is really short. It's like they're begging you to bet Virginia in lay three, three and a half. So Vegas, yeah, it's only three and a half. Yeah, it's only three and a half. So I like

Maryland's chances tonight. I got to run because I got Joe Thaisman standing by. We're going to talk about Ruben Foster. Yeah, who. But I will see you tonight, and thanks for the time, as always. I really appreciate it. All right, let's bring in Joe Thysman, who is making hopefully the first of more than just one appearance on the Kevin Sheehan Show podcast. And I've always loved talking to you about this team.

And I always like waiting because you're very, and I'm optimistic too, because I always want them to do well, but you're always very optimistic before the season. starts. And I always like catching up with you typically midway through the season or as we get into this stretch, the closing stretch, to get your thoughts. But on a day like today, and when I asked you to be on, I didn't know that they were going to sign Ruben Foster. But I think we have to start with that. I've already weighed in on it, Joe. I think that for this particular organization, this is, you know, not the smartest of moves from a PR standpoint for an organization that's got a ticket selling issue now and, you know, in an interest level now to a certain degree, what do you think?

Well, I think it's, to me, as you said, an interesting signing. Obviously, I don't think Ruben Foster will probably see the field this year. I think based upon the history with the NFL, I find it interesting that he's on a list, a commissioner's list, that says he gets paid, but he can't player practice. I don't quite understand that concept where you get paid for not showing up to work. We would all love to have that. Wouldn't we, Kevin? I mean, there was a person out there listening that would say, I'm not going to go to work or I've done something that doesn't allow me to go to work, but yet I'm going to get paid. So I don't understand that at all. It is a very curious signing to me. I think he has, obviously, he's dealt with a lot of issues and listening and

reading Doug's statement about talking to a lot of the players, guys from Alabama, you know, sort of vouching for him as an individual. I think at times when you go to the players on a team and ask their opinion about another player, I don't know whether you necessarily get the true picture or you get friendship evaluations or you get guys that only knew him at another period of time. So to me, I was a bit surprised, shocked to be honest with you, when I read that the Redskins actually signed Ruben Foster. But obviously there are others that have looked into it,

doing some reading this morning. The Eagles inquired about him. And to be honest with you, like I said, I'm not sure he's going to see the field over the next five weeks. And if he did, what type of a player would he be? Because, you know, he is in somewhat of a limbo state in the national football. I found it as a very surprising sign, to be honest. You know, when you said that when you go to young people, players in the organization,

and in this case, all of those guys are very young. They're 22, 23, 24 years old, you know, John Allen, Duran Payne, Ryan Anderson, etc. All the Bama guys. I totally agree with what you said. if that's the basis for signing a player, going to young people who are friends with this person who tell you, no, no, no, no, he's really a good guy. That is risky territory. But beyond the football side of it, Joe, and you're right, a lot of people have jumped to the conclusion that they just signed him to some sort of long-term contract. And I said this earlier, like they built a

statue to him already. That's ridiculous. They claimed them off waivers. But with that said, we both know, all right, that this organization is in a tenuous spot with respect to people like me who were lifelong, born and raised fans who lived through the good days, and many of those people have become apathetic. We've seen it at FedEx Field, and they're in the ticket selling business now. This is from a PR standpoint, Joe, at the very least, a huge risk because of the backlash. Do you agree or disagree? I agree with you. And I think, you know, sometimes I think every organization, every organization has to ask one question. You know, you, and the question is, what do we stand for? Who are we and what do we stand for? And that's the question you have to ask yourself when you bring people into an organization, whether it's an athletic organization, whether it's a charity, whether it's a business. It doesn't matter what it is. But who are we and what do we stand for? And I think that's the question that will be asked. But then again, you know, the Dallas Cowboys added Randy Gregory, right?

And, you know, the suspensions that he has had. You know, teams make decisions on players for certain reasons. Listening to the explanation that Doug gave, you know, I scratched my head a little bit. Like I said, if you're going to talk to other players about other players, you're probably not going to hear somebody saying, you know what, he's not worth it, he's this person, he's that person, a bunch of negative stuff. You're probably never going to hear that. I think you have to step outside the organization and look at it and say, okay, I'm looking at it from the outside looking in. What do we stand for?

Who are we? We have enough issues. I thought DJ Swarendger made a great point in his, after the game over there, about doing the little things. the Redskins have a virus called and I think it's you know I would say that it is a I'm going to try and strip the ball virus instead of tackle you virus Josh Norman does it all the time he wraps one hand around the receiver and he tries to strip the ball instead of just tackling people but it's not just us it's an epidemic in the national football league you see defensive backs trying to body block running backs forget it wouldn't you kidding me the art of tackling has disappeared because nobody practices it. This is a lousy collective bargaining agreement when it comes to product on the field.

And if I was a player, I would like coaches to teach me how to play the by position. But it's a different age, it's a different time. And I think that, you know, I thought DJ Squaringer was very candid and honest about this football team. They don't do the little things right. Tackling is one of them. this is a defense that was, you know, doing really great. And all of a sudden you get, you know, Amari Cooper goes, what, 100 plus yards and two receptions

because people don't know how to tackle because they're interested in trying to strip the ball away. Just do the basics, for goodness sakes, and just, you know, play basic football and get on to the next play. You have a guy at an opportunity. But everybody wants to body block somebody to the ground today. They don't want to tackle anybody.

All right. So I want to get to the team in the games that they play in the games that they're going to play here down the stretch in a moment. But I want to go back to Ruben Foster one more time because maybe I'm reading this wrong from you. You and I've had so many conversations over the years, and more times than not, you know, you as the quarterback of my youth and as a true, you know, burgundy and gold redskin,

have defended the organization even at times when it's been difficult to defend them. I'm reading from you that this one is more than just a head, scratcher that this one you would not have done. You know, Kev, I knew you were going to say that. And my response to that is, I don't know enough about the details. And I listen to other people in my position in an interview, made comments and statements. And I've done this in the past where I don't have sufficient information to be able to make an

evaluation of a situation. But yet I have done it. I did it with Kishon Johnson. I did it with Ricky Williams. I made statements about those individuals, not understanding the circumstance or the situation or the individuals of what's going on. I don't know exactly what Doug has done. Doug's made a decision of adding Ruben Foster this football team.

Evidently, it's comfortable for them. I find it very curious and unusual to do it at this stage under the circumstances under which he is going to be allowed to either not participate or participate or whatever situation he's going to be. And he has legal issues to deal with. That's a fact we know. What they're going to be, what the outcome is going to be, I don't know. Like I said before, I mean, if you talk to, you know, you talk to teammates about a guy,

and, you know, they're very seldom when you see somebody saying, no, he's not worth it. So, you know, I'm not avoiding the question. I'm just saying I'd much rather have the facts. and know exactly what's going on before I make a statement. But I do find it a very curious signing. I know what you're saying, and I actually said that. It's like so many times the media, you know, horde that jumps all over these things,

they don't have all the information, and I usually don't have all the information, and yet many times I've been sort of definitive sounding, in my opinion, without having all of the information. The one thing that I would say in this particular case is the information we do have. You have, I have, you know, NFL fans, have Redskin fans have, is that this team's had an image problem. And it was very predictable

what the PR backlash would be. And so then you ask yourself, even if you have all the information, is the juice worth the squeezing? Is it worth the risk? Well, I don't see, see him, I don't see him as a part of this football team this year. And so basically what you're doing, I mean, if you want to step back and analyze it even a little more deeply, is I don't see him. I don't see him. I don't see him as a part of this football team this year. I think he'll sign a contract, obviously, that will have, I'm sure, morality clauses at it. The policies in the NFL exist. There are things that he's going to have to do if he wants to continue to play football. There are commitments that he's going to have to make if he wants to play football. So to me, this is really not a signing in

2018. This is a signing for 2019. But it's a PR back. flash today. Right now, right now, right now it's yeah, it's like why. People are saying why. And that's, you know, that's the responsibility of Doug and the front office. You know, they made the decision, not us, Kevin. All right. Before we get specifically to the team, you know, everybody, again, the Alex Smith injury against Houston when we saw it, everybody had the flashback to you on that November night against the Giants on Monday Night Football. And, you know, your reaction to it, everybody went to your Twitter again. I don't know if that's as much activity as you've had on your Twitter account, but I can't imagine that any football fan didn't immediately think

of you. What was your immediate reaction when you watched it? I, you know, it's funny. I never saw my injury. I saw my injury 20 years ago. I know. You told me that. I remember you telling me. And in Alex's case, you know, Robin and I were sitting, my wife and I were sitting there watching the game. And all of a sudden, you know, I see the pile of people and then I look at the TV and there's Alex's Lake. And it was like it was gruesome. It was unnerving for me. I turned to Robin and I said, that's just like mine.

And I looked away. And even now as I talk to you about it, you know, there's this image in my mind that I never had. I never had the image. I saw my leg get broken, like I say, 20 years later, but, you know, to see Alex in that situation, first of all, my heart went out to him because I know what he was going through. I feel terrible for him. And the coincidences that happened regarding, you know, the break 33 years ago and the one for Alex is, you know, I played 167 games.

He played 166. The score was the same. The place on the field was similar. I mean, if you were to lay down all, what? the chance of all these things happening. You can't even come up with odds. I know. It would be so crazy.

I thought of the score. I thought of the score immediately because I remembered it was 23-21. Of course, the differences would be RFK versus FedEx, and the Redskins with Jay Schrader coming in in relief that night won the game against the Giants, and the Redskins lost the game to the Texans. On Alex Smith, let's start there as it relates to the team. why was this team struggling offensively to have any consistent sort of ability to move the football and score points with him?

Personnel. We don't have any receivers who can separate. You know, you look at the teams, you know, I mean, I think number one is we don't have any receivers who can separate. Number two, the continuing shuffling that has to be done in the offensive line. Kevin, you and I have talked about this. I have a theory about playoff teams. If you look at the teams that will be in the playoffs, look at how many starts their offensive linemen get.

You'll see a very large number. You won't see a lot of movement in the offensive line. Everybody will have played a lot of football, and you can develop and establish some consistency up front. We don't have that. I think our defense has played well. I mean, the Texans are on an eight-game win-stream. And if it's not for a 102-yard interception, we'd probably beat them.

I mean, and, you know, and it dropped a pass. I mean, we had a couple of plays. We are not a good enough football team to make a mistake or two in a game. It almost has to be flawless football. And that is, you're asking the impossible. That's why every game should be close. Every game is going to be a fist fight. Three interceptions against the Dallas Cowboys,

no interceptions for the Dallas Cowboys. it's an eight-point differential. And by the way, some horrible officiaries. I mean, absolutely atrocious. What's amazing to me is the ref, the guy that wears the white hat for people who don't know who it is, he has one job. And that's to watch the quarterback.

Colt gets his head yanked around. No flag. And the league says, we're going to protect the players. No helmet-to-helmet-contact. Jordan Reed gets absolutely lit up. who's looking at what? You know, that bothers the living daylights out of me.

Don't just give it lip service and say, we're going to protect the players. And that should have been, that should be a call that comes from New York, okay? Maybe the official was at a bad position, maybe he didn't have a bad angle. I'll grant that. But if you see that in New York, you buzz down and say, that's helmet to helmet, 15-yard penalty. Why can't you do that? That was horrific.

Now, that probably... At a critical time of the game. Well, I mean, they were going to still at that point need an on-side kick. I thought the not calling the hold on Mo Harris on the interception was worse. And really the one... You know, whenever there's the conversation about officiating, you know, you can always say, well, yeah, that happened in the second quarter, that happened in the third quarter, whatever, they had plenty of time to overcome it.

You know what? You know what they didn't have time? No one can argue is that... Josh Doxon was interfered with on that bomb at the end of the Houston game, and it would have led to a chip-shot walk-off field goal attempt. Maybe Hopkins would have missed a 30-yarder. He did in London two years ago, but more than likely, the probability is the Redskins would have won the game,

and the league admitted that they missed that call. How do you miss that call but call holding on Josh Norman with no contact virtually, you know, a possession before? That was ridiculous. because they leave it to the officials to interpret what they think is a rule. There's too many interpretations in a world. You know, I mean, how many times have you seen offensive linemen wrap their arms around the neck of somebody and it doesn't get called?

And how do you evaluate hitting your quarterback? So far this year, I go back to the Buffalo Bills' New England Patriot football game where number 55, I don't know who it was for the bills, had Tom Brady wrapped up at the six-yard line, wrap and let him go. And Combrady runs in the end zone because of an interpretation by a player of what he thought the official might do. Mike Zimmer had it right, right from preseason.

He said these rules, this particular rule, is going to cost games, it's going to cause coaches jobs, and it's going to cost players money. And he absolutely nailed it. But, you know, it's the national football league. It just keeps rolling on. Well, no position. I'm sorry, we made a mistake. And, you know, no official loses a job.

No, no official lose. Have you, when's the last time you heard an official fired for a lousy job? Right. Well, I'll tell you what, they've got a lot of new lead referees this year. A lot of, I don't care. Forget about lead referees. I'm talking about if you make, if we make mistakes in our business, we don't have a job. It doesn't apply.

God, let's hope not because we make mistakes every day. But you know what I'm talking about in the world. I know, I know. When we play, we lose our job. But, I mean, I just wish there was a way that there'd be more consistency. No matter how you call a game, and Bill Parcells used to do this, Bill Parcells used to chart officials. Some let you get away with snuggling. Some let you get away with a little gravity.

You know, he used to have an idea of what the officials would call inside a game. Because they're all creatures of habit. And they, you know, you develop a pattern. It's just like scouting another team. You scout the referees. What do they call? What do they call on a consistent basis? What do they allow?

This is all part of what people don't think about this in the world of football. That's how the minutia of this game oils down to. The little things that you look at inside the game. What do officials call what they don't call? There's no consistency, Kevin. And that, to me, is the biggest issue and problem. If there was consistency, then guys would be. know how to prepare. But there's no consistency.

I don't disagree with anything you just said. I don't know how feasible it would be to have New York overrule a lot of these calls and what that would lead to in terms of the product. Not a lot of them. I didn't say that. Not a lot of them. When you're stressing

safety and you have a blatant hit to the head. Yeah, that one I yeah, it was an obvious miss. There was no debate. There was video conclusive video evidence that Jordan Reed was crunched helmet-to-helmet defenseless. This to me would happen probably, I would say, I would guess maybe it would happen in the course of a season, maybe 20 times. Maybe.

I mean, they, you know, they stop, they stop in review after every touchdown. By the way, I think they should flip it around too. When there is a helmet-to-helmet defenseless hit that's called, that's incorrect, they should flip it the other way because I think we see a lot more of those. I think more times than not, they're prone. Now you're getting, now you're getting, now you're getting into too many weeks. Okay. Anyway, all right.

We've made the game three hours and 15 minutes. Exactly. Let's get back to this team. Before Thursday, before the Thanksgiving Day game, were you optimistic about Colt McCoy leading the offense? And then where are you now? I still am. I still think Coke could lead this offense.

I think I don't think there's a big, there's a big difference between Alex and Colt. I think they both basically run the offense in a very similar fashion to the way Jay wants to call the game. We want to be able to run the football. We want to be able to shorten the game. You know, like I said, unfortunately, you can't miss big plays. You can't miss big throws.

And, you know, Colt found out you can't squeeze a ball into places where there just isn't any room. I mean, you have to, there's things you need to do. do with the football on your hand. You need to be decisive and you need to be smart. If it's not there, don't try and squeeze it in. I think Colt was rusty. Let's face it. When's the last time he played football? What was against the Dallas Cowboys, about 2016? Yeah, a couple of games after that, yeah, when they got shut out by the Rams. I mean, I think he was just rusty. I think these 11 days will serve him more than anybody on that football team. And it also gives some offensive linemen

who basically are new to the system a chance to understand more. Our biggest problem offensively is the fact that Bill Callahan has had to work with so many different guys up front to get them ready in a very short period of time. I mean, we go through mini-cans, we go through OTAs, we go through training camps, and then all of a sudden you're without your best offensive line and Trent Williams for two or three weeks. You lose your left guard. You lose your right guard. Your center's moving over here.

Your right tackle somebody, you know, who was probably like Babe Lofitberg was for me on a beach somewhere in Mexico, and he's flown back up. I mean, you know, you really, like I said, I always look at playoff teams. The first thing I look at, obviously the quarterback play is important. But the next thing I look at is the amount of starts that the offensive line has had. And if you look at ours, it's a new combination almost every week. All right, let's talk about these final five games.

I think if they win three of them, they'll advance to the postseason, perhaps even as a wild card. A lot of people think the NFC East is so bad, but the truth of the matter is there's still a possibility that you could get to. Well, they've got to win the next two. Forget about the five. Because you've got Jacksonville and Titans and then finish with the Eagles. You need the division wins.

That's it. You have to win. You need to beat the Eagles. You need to beat the Giants. By the way, the Giants are no push-off. Not even close. It's a talented offensive football team. They should have beat me Eagles.

They had them down and let them up. You know, they put up 360 plus yards in the first half and, what, 81 in the second. Yeah. I love it that you're putting up the warning flag for the giant game already, because I've mentioned that that game, to me, is the game that's going to be very difficult to win at home. I mean, Monday night's going to be difficult, too. I just don't see that Philadelphia has all of a sudden turn the corner here, Joe. They were down 19 to 3 in that game.

You just mentioned it. They gave up 346 yards and a half to the Giants. And then the Giants inexplicably decided that the one guy that got in the lead, they weren't going to let touch the ball in the second half, their own guy, Sequin Barclay. Do you feel the same way about the Eagles that there's still something that's not right there? Yeah, they have not hit a stride. And this is really where it starts.

This is where you'll start to see tremendous separation. I mean, for us, you know, we're basically tied with the Dallas Cowboys. I think the Cowboys will lose tomorrow night to the Saints. I mean, I don't think anybody expects them to go out and beat them. I think the Saints are just an explode. The Saints are the best team of football. Yeah, agree. Their offense is making their defense great.

And so in that case, I mean, the Eagles are a good football team. They have a lot of good football players. Defensively, they haven't played near the level they played a year ago, and that's, I think, been the biggest difference for them. But these two games are basically what determines. an opportunity for the playoffs or not. I think the Titans are going to be battling. What the Texans did to the Titans is, you know,

what a mobile quarterback could do. Look what's happened over in Baltimore. I'd be surprised if, you know, the Joe Flacco, Lamar Jackson situation, harkens back to Colin Kaepernick and Alex Smith in San Francisco. Is John Harbaugh going to sit down a guy who rushed for 117 yards and basically has changed the landscape of that offense and put Joe back there who doesn't move around, who hasn't had a particularly good year anyway.

And you're probably transitioning going forward. Now at a critical time of the year, are you going to go back to Joe? I'd be very, very surprised if he'd be back. I think the reports are that, you know, Jackson's going to get the start this Sunday in Atlanta. Flacco's still, you know, this hip injury apparently is serious. The one thing I would say to you about that is we bounce around here, but that was on my list, actually, of things to talk to you about. is that they beat a Cincinnati team that's in free fall and they beat the Raiders.

Now they're going to go to Atlanta, and Atlanta's capable, we know, offensively, and then they've got to go to Arrowhead. And you know so much about this position. I think we've had this conversation before about Flacco, that clearly he's not an elite quarterback, but he's had very big clutch games, end of year, and in the postseason for John Harbaugh over the years. and I sort of felt like if he was healthy, they were going to go back to Flacco. You know, maybe they would have, I don't know, but this is the thing you have to remember.

If he doesn't play this week, he will not play it in three weeks ago. Now all of a sudden you're going to start him against the Kansas City Chiefs. That doesn't make sense to me. You know, Lamar continues to continue to grow and Marty's going to continue to continue to expand the offense. Morning Wing, yeah. Marty Morningwick, yeah. Marty morning where he's going to continue to expand that offense. Joe Willough have been gone three to four weeks now.

You're getting ready to play the Kansas City Chiefs who you really have to match point for point. Yep. Ballimore's defense is really, really good. Yep. But, you know, I mean, what they're doing out there with Mahomes and all that speed, it's hard to say you're going to hold them to under 30 points. Let me get to figure out a way to put points on the board.

Let me get to the Saints real quickly because you brought them up. We're sort of done with them. Do you think the Redskins are going to win three? of their final five, the right three, and be in the postseason or not? I think they can, yes. I think Cole McCle will play a whole lot better than he did, and I think this offense will, it's got to generate more than 20 points. You know, you're not going to win many football games. I mean, that's what we're average, about 20 points. Yeah. We've got to, you know, you've got to get to 28, you know,

points if you're going to win, and I think they can do that. I really do. I tend to agree with you. I think the offense has a chance to be more potent than it was, although the turnover probability is higher. On the Saints, I don't know that we've ever talked about this or I've ever asked you about this, but I have always felt that the way you played was similar to the way that Drew Breeze quarterback's team. Have you ever in your own mind thought when you've watched Drew Breeze

that there are a lot of similarities with the way you played? I think, well, first of all, I'm flattered that you say that. Thank you. I didn't say you were Drew Breeze. No, no, no, just to be in the conversation, I appreciate that. The reason why I do find myself looking at the game in a similar way that Drew does, I had a chance. I'll tell you one little story.

Well, explain first why. He's very decisive with the football. He gets the football out of his hands. He gets it into the hands of the people that need to. That's the way I felt like I was coached. That's the way I tried to play the game. So from that perspective, I look at Drew and what he does. and that I admire tremendously.

And as I talk to young quarterbacks around the league, I basically tell them, look at Drew. Watch Drew. Watch how quickly he makes a decision and gets the ball out of his hand. He doesn't get somebody, you know, he'll roll out a little bit, and he may have a corner and he may have a guy in the flat. If the guy in the flat's open, he's going to throw it to him right away.

A lot of young guys, they want to push the ball down the field and then come back late to the flat, which is too late. But he just gets the ball out of his hands. and that's basically the way I played the game. So in that regard, it's similar. Back in 2006, when Sean Payton took over, I believe it was 2006, when he took over the Saints, he asked me to talk to the team. And we were in training camp.

We were doing a pre-season game. And the guy sitting right in front of me was sort of a stadium smaller, like all our meeting rooms are. Drew Brees was sitting right in front of me taking notes. And I walked out of that meeting and I was like, man, This kid just, he just wants to be great. He wants to do all the little things that you need to do. I was thrilled to see him.

I was thrilled to see him accomplish the things that he's done. It's exciting. He, to me, is the MVP of the league. Nobody else should enter into the conversation. I don't think that's going to change much going forward. And like I say, the decisiveness is what I see. See, let trust your eyes, get the ball out of your hand. That's our job.

We're facilitators. That's the job of a question. quarterback were managers and facilitators. And that's what Drew does so exceptionally well. You know, the 83 season, the year after the Super Bowl over the dolphins, the year in which the Redskins set the record for points in 114 games and the two losses were one-point losses to Dallas and Green Bay on Monday night games. I, that was, I mean, the Chargers had had some real explosive teams, you know, in the years leading up to 83. But that that team, Joe, was unstoppable offensively. It was a miracle it seemed like when you guys were forced to punt.

Jeff Hayes probably had the least amount of responsibility and activity on that team that year. I'll tell you what's really funny, Kevin. What's really funny about that is when we sat in meetings and prepared for teams, there wasn't a question in our mind, in my mind. It wasn't a question of whether we were going to win or lose. The only question I had was how many points we were going to score. That's how explosive I felt like we were. I think New Orleans feels like that now. I think Kansas City feels like that now. I think the Rams feel like that. But the difference in the 83 football team, it wasn't our offense to a degree it was. Turnover margin. But the giveaway takeaway ratio was plus 43. Now, you can explain to people at some point what that is.

It's basically how many times the defense takes the ball away, how many times the offense gives it up. We were plus 43. Go through the last, go through the history from 1983 to today. Go through all those years. Nobody's ever been close. And see what the highest ratio is. It's in the 20s, maybe. Yeah.

Very often you end a season with the number one team being plus 18 or plus 19. But it's usually in the 20s. But of course. Who we were. Yeah, you were, but you also. We had Mike Nelms, we had Mike Nelms returning kicks. I mean, you know, it was the most complete football team. And if we had won Super Bowl 18, probably would have been considered the greatest football team,

greatest football team in history at that time. And even might even stand the top one or two today. Right. But, and this is why I wanted to go towards the Saints as a conversation, because I personally, now, I don't see any chance. You could always have injuries between now in the postseason, significant injuries like to the quarterback, but assuming relative health for New Orleans, I don't see how anybody other than the Rams even remotely come within two touchdowns of the Saints in the Superdome in a playoff game. I think they can go toe to toe with them.

The Rams can, but no one else, right? I don't think so, no, especially in the game. You know, basically they're playing for home field. And it's, is the other thing you have to understand. Sean Peyton is ruthless. He's ruthless. I mean, the score to be 47 to nothing, he's still going to try and put points on the board. He just, he runs a machine and it's, he runs, he closes offense like Joe used to call us. You know, our whole thing was, we're going to be the aggressor. We're going to set the tempo. We're going to set the, you know, we're going to be the ones constantly in your face. We're not going to give you a chance to sort of gather yourself. You know, you, and, you,

How often do you see Drew Breeze come to the line of scrimmage, like a lot of other quarterbacks, and look around. And, you know, that ball is snapped with 18 seconds to go. We're coming at you. And then now all of a sudden, you add wide receivers. You add a running back. That's another thing that gets overlooked. This is a very complete dynamic football team with playmakers at the right position. And they're better defensively than most people think with playmakers defensively.

you lose the concept of what their defense is because their offense is so dynamic. That's sort of what we were talking about regarding our 80s. But the problem with the 83 team, and if we're comparing the teams, is that there was this incredible plus minus ratio, which, you know, still today, no one's ever come close to it. But there was a secondary issue. You know, Anthony Washington got picked on by quarterbacks that could throw the ball down the field a little bit with good receivers.

like Cliff Branch in the Super Bowl as an example. I mean, the defense, there was a reason that they were called the Pearl Harbor crew is you could throw the ball against them. Lynn Dickey did, Danny White did, Joe Montana did, and then... But they couldn't outscore us. No, everybody but one team. And that's, then the Saints are better defensively. You know, I could do this with you forever, but I can't continue.

I can't have an hour-long interview because you've got, Hell, you've got breakfast to eat. Yes, I've put off breakfast for you, and then you held me up for 15 minutes. I'm sorry. Now, this is 10-minute interview. I don't even know what time. I know. I think we've done this many times before where we've gone way past the point of doing something.

I always appreciate it. You know that I, and hope to talk to you soon. You're welcome, Kevin. Take care. All right. Thanks to Joe Thysman for joining us. There was a lot I didn't get to, but, you know, I know when I had Joe on radio that it was going to be a two-segment, you know, interview

because he'll get going and it sparks other thoughts. And I didn't get to a lot of the stuff that I'm sure you wanted me to get to. Like, what's wrong with the running game? What's wrong with the defense the last few days? Are there going to be wholesale changes at the end of the year if they don't get to the postseason? I don't know that Joe's going to answer that anyway. He probably wouldn't. But it was good to get his thoughts on Ruben Foster.

And what I did find interesting is Joe's fallback. position most of the time is to really be protective of the organization and the brand, etc. But I think you heard it with Joe, even though he says, I don't have all the information, but I think that even Joe was very surprised and taken aback a little bit at the signing of Ruben Foster. Let me take a moment to tell you about Ferrisch Chrysler Dodge Jeep in Fairfax. They should be on your list if you're considering something new. Go to ferrishcars.com right now, and you'll get their live inventory and best deals. Farish makes it easy.

I've been friends with Ralph Perkins and Kevin Farish for a decade plus. They're smart. They know what their customers want. They make it easy for them. I promise you that if you give them a chance, they won't disappoint. Their sales team experienced, most of their salespeople have been there for 20 plus years. Their service department is the best. Right now, plenty of inventory on the lot.

Whatever you're looking for, you'll likely find it. It's that time of the year where Ferriks, has a lot of inventory, and they want to get rid of it by the end of the year so that they can get the new shipment of vehicles in after January 1. And that means great deal opportunities for the consumer, for you. So if you head out there right now, the Jeep Cherokee, the Grand Cherokee, the Wrangler, there are great deals on all three of those vehicles, maybe the best deals of the year. Same goes for the RAM pickup as they try to clear their lot of their inventory between now and the end of the year. If you like this show and you're thinking,

about something new, I give you my word that you'll be taking care of. If you go out to Farish, ask for Ralph Perkins. He'll put you in touch with the best salesperson. They're located right there in Fairfax Circle. Ask for Ralph. He's in the store every day. Tell him I sent you. You can also find out everything you need to know about Farish. All of their live inventory and pricing is online at ferrishcars.com. Let's finish up the show with a little NFL buy and sell. Are you buying or are you selling? by yourself. All right, I'm going to buy a few things. I'm going to buy somebody that I bought the other day. I'm going to buy Philip Lindsay, the running back in Denver. He is, to me, a star in

the making. He was undrafted out of Colorado. Denver has, in Philip Lindsay, who's not a big dude, he's like 5-8 and 180, something like that. Philip Lindsay right now, this season in Denver, is averaging 5.8 yards per carry. He's got 780 yards. on the ground, 5.8 yards per carry, already six touchdown passes, and that's going to lead me to this second buy. I'm going to buy Denver down the stretch here as a team that can make a legitimate run to the postseason in the AFC. They are five and six right now. They've got the Bengals, the 49ers, the Browns, and the Raiders, their next four games. Now, the Browns at home, it's not going to be an easy game, but they can win against Cincinnati, San Francisco,

the Raiders and the Browns. That would put them at 9 and 6 going into a season finale game against the Chargers. And there's the possibility that the Chargers in that final week may have already been a wild card, the number five seed locked and loaded in that spot, and they may not be playing for anything. More likely than not, if they're in the division race, they would have to win that game against Kansas City. If they go to Arrowhead and win, the Chargers, that is. But Denver is an interesting team to watch the rest of the way because of their schedule and because of the way they're playing. They've gone back to back and beating the Chargers and the Steelers,

and they had a walk-off field goal attempt to beat the Texans three weeks ago. And the last time they played the Chiefs, they played them competitively. And that was on the road at Arrowhead, a 30-23 game. So actually, I'm going back even further. Here are the Rams last six games, the Broncos, excuse me, the Broncos last six games. A 23 to 20 loss at home to the Rams, 23 to 20. Then on a Thursday night, they blew the Cardinals out 4510. Then they went to Arrowhead and had a chance losing to Kansas City 30 to 23.

At home against Houston, who's won eight in a row, they had a field goal attempt, a walk-off field goal attempt to beat them, but the field goal went awry and they lost 19 to 17. Then they beat the Chargers on the road, and then last week beat the Steelers. Denver, with the schedule they have the rest of the way, is an interesting team to watch in the AFC as a potential wild card team at 10 and 6. They could get to 10 and 6 by running the table here against a very weak schedule. I'm also going to buy the Seattle Seahawks, and their playoff opportunity is a wild card. They've played very well of late.

They beat the Packers. They beat the Panthers. They had a chance against the Rams. Remember, they had a chance against the Chargers. It's almost like we're talking about the Broncos when you talk about the Seahawks. They have the 49ers twice and the Cardinals left among their final five opponents.

That's nine wins more likely than not. So now they've got the Vikings and the Chiefs, both at home. If they get one of those, that's 10. that's a wild card spot in the NFC. They're playing well, Seattle is. They're also, I think we have to say after all of these years, they're well-coached.

They are a well-coached team. I know that they have committed over the years a lot of penalties, penalties of aggression more times than not. I like Seattle right now to be an NFC wild card team. It certainly looks like they're playing well and that their schedule with four of the five at home, and the 49ers twice in the Cardinals, would lead any reasonable person to believe that they will get to nine,

if not 10 wins. What am I selling this week? Oh, I'm buying one more thing. I'm buying Kirk Cousins Sunday in Foxborough against the Patriots. I'll spend more time on that on Friday. I just have a feeling that he's going to put up a, big day, and they are going to score a lot of points in Foxborough. That's another buy.

More time to talk about that later in the week. I am selling the Philadelphia Eagles. I've thought about this a lot. I'm just not buying the Eagles. The Saints have hammered everybody. They lost it home to the Cowboys a couple of weeks ago. They very easily could have lost in London to Jacksonville. The giant game was in many ways a giant self-inflicted loss because of the way they called that game in the second half, only giving Sequin Barclay five touches in the second half after he had rolled up basically all of their offense single-handedly in the first half.

I'm just not buying that the Eagles have figured it out. I think the Redskins have a really good chance to win Monday night. I do, and I may be delusional on that. And I don't think the Redskins are great right now. I'm not suggesting that. But I think that this is a matchup more so than even on Thanksgiving Day. Of two average to maybe slightly above average teams. Best case.

I think the Redskins can go there. I like them as a seven-point underdog. I don't think it'll be a smell test pick. I just, I like them personally to keep that game close and to have a chance to win the game. All right, thanks to Chris Nocky, thanks to Joe Thysman, thanks to Aaron, who produced it. I'm going to the Maryland game tonight.

I'll have a lot on that tomorrow. Tommy will be in as well. I'm sure he will have an opinion on Ruben Foster and the Sean Taylor commemorative doll. So tune in for that. Have a great day.