The Kevin Sheehan Show - Rivera/Wentz Combo Ranked

Episode Date: May 25, 2022

Kevin went through a bunch of NFL and NFC East prediction stories including one where the new combos of QBs and Head Coaches were ranked. There are 17 new QB-HC combos this year....where did Rivera and Wentz rank on that list? Then, JP Finlay/NBCSports Washington & 106.7 was a guest on the show. JP brought up (didn't report) the potential PUP list players for not only training camp, but the regular season as well.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Chean Show. Here's Kevin. Is it possible that when we get to the regular season opener against the Jacksonville Jaguars, September 11th, that there is one to two Washington commanders on the Pupplest,

on the physically unable to perform list? J.P. Finley brought it up. He didn't report it, but he brought it up in the course of a conversation with me that you will hear coming up here shortly, J.P. Finley on the show today. We haven't talked a lot about the Pupplist and perhaps being without a key player or two when the regular season starts. But that will come up in the conversation with J.P. coming up shortly. The NBA game last night, the Mavs and the Warriors, it was another one of these one-sided blowouts in the NBA playoffs. There have been 21 of them so far, 20-point-plus wins in the NBA playoffs. They are nearing a record for the most 20-point-plus wins in the history of the NBA playoffs.

Now, last night's final tally was 10, but the Mavericks were up by 29 early in the game. the fourth quarter. The game was never in doubt. They stave off elimination. They're down three games to one. There are lots of theories as to why we're seeing so many blowouts in the NBA playoffs. I don't buy any of them. There is this theory of, you know, basically it's become a make-and-miss three-point league and there have been a bunch of nights where teams have made them and the other teams missed them. Well, you know, there have been many playoff series over the years where you've had both teams making them or both teams missing them, and that results in a close game.

You know, there's the theory of if you're down 2-0, you know, which have been a few 2-0 series leads, this series last night that resumed was a 3-0 series lead that maybe the team that's up, you know, it doesn't feel the pressure of winning. I don't buy that theory because in many cases, the team down 3-0 feels like it's over and they go into the night pretty meekly.

I don't know what the reason. for all of these blowout NBA playoff games is, but I don't think it's making it very entertaining to watch. You know, I'm tuning in to these games, and then I am tuning out when they are over, and they've been over early on a lot of nights. Tonight we've got a game five in the Eastern Conference finals with the series deadlocked at two games a piece. It's in Miami, and the Celtics are one and a half-point favorites. By the way, Ava Wallace from the Washington Post ran into Bradley Beale the other day, and Beal did say that he is leaning towards signing that five-year, $246 million contract extension,

that max contract extension, which would pay him $49.2 million per year. Tommy had that first. Tommy reported that probably like a month ago, maybe even long. than that, that he had sources that were telling him that Beale was going to sign that deal. Before I get to more sports in this opening segment, including some NFL topics, which have kind of popped up, some of which include discussion about the Washington commanders. Last night was one of those nights, you know, where pretty much everything, sports, for sure, took a backseat to a heartbreaking news story.

19 children, as of now, at an elementary school in Texas, gunned down by an 18-year-old nutcase. Two teachers were killed as well. It all happened, according to the latest reports, in one classroom, a fourth grade classroom, as the gunman barricaded himself from police and then killed most of and injured the rest of those that were in that one classroom.

classroom. This is a place where you come for sports, and this is what we usually do, 90% of the time. I mean, certainly Tommy and I, and Kooley and I, will go off on non-sports tangents, and occasionally we'll discuss some of the topics of the day. I'm just going to say this. I don't know enough about guns. I don't know that much about guns. I know a lot of people with guns, and I've listened in on debates in certain settings about the Second Amendment and about gun control laws. I've read some over the years about a lot of these, you know, so-called common sense gun laws. But I'm not an expert. I would never profess to be. I just know that when I see the pictures of these adorable eight, nine, ten-year-olds who went to school yesterday morning with,

In many cases, they're loving parents dropping them off. I just know that yesterday at a school in Texas, that shouldn't be for those young kids a setting that turned out to be the last day of their lives. Because some 18-year-old was able to legally purchase two assault rifles, and according to the latest reports, 375 rounds of ammunition. You know, I am willing to be patient, always have, except for sports, been patient to wait for the facts in situations like this. Because for all I know, you know, a lot of these common sense gun laws or even potentially very

strict gun laws wouldn't have stopped something like this. I don't know if that's true or not. But it just doesn't make any sense to me that an 18-year-old should celebrate his birthday, by having access to purchasing two assault rifles and 375 rounds of ammunition. That doesn't make any sense to me. I read this, I read some of the memories written by some family members about their lost young children yesterday or grandchildren. This was one of them that struck me. It included a picture of eight-year-old Uzziah Garcia. He was killed in that classroom. Yesterday, his grandfather, Manny Renfro, wrote, the sweetest little boy that I've ever known. I'm not just saying that because he was my grandkid. He recalled Uzziah visiting him during spring break and described how they had enjoyed playing football together. And the grandfather said, we started throwing the football together and I was teaching him past patterns.

Such a fast little boy and he could catch a ball so good. There were certain plays that I would call that he would remember and he would do it exactly like we practiced. Closed quote. Closed quote. You know, there were so many of those stories that you read. That was the one that struck me. I guess maybe because of the football and the sports reference. But just the idea. that he had just seen him on spring break, which was just a few weeks ago and that he was, you know, and you can see it in the picture

and all their pictures. It's just, it's heartbreaking. I don't know what else to say. I just, I don't understand why most normal people wouldn't say, okay, there are guns per our Second Amendment

that makes sense for things like hunting. Things like being able to protect yourself and your family, in your own home. Obviously for our police and our military. But there are guns that should not be accessible by normal citizens. Because for the most part, and again, I don't know anything about guns. But reading and being in a setting multiple times over the years with friends and family members who are, you know, gun owners. even the hardest core of people that I know that are, you know, vehement about Second Amendment will say,

no, these kinds of guns are just for killing people. And I know that's oversimplifying it. But these kinds of things, I don't know why they're available to normal citizens. I don't, but whatever. Let's move on. I saw this thing on ESPN this morning about Terry McLaren and about projected contracts for a lot of the players that right now are looking for new deals. Brad Spielberger from Pro Football Focus wrote the story. I think Brad is more for PFF kind of a cap guy.

I think I've had them on the show before. And I think that's my memory of Brad. and his expertise, his specific expertise. But he talked about the Terry McLaren situation, and he wrote, while the commander's decision to trade for quarterback Carson Wentz was met with a lot of criticism, he will undoubtedly be the best quarterback McLaren has worked with so far in the NFL. And that's worrisome for opposing teams, considering how productive McLaren has been to start his career.

Since 2019, McLaren has garnered 139 targets where the pass was deemed inaccurate per PFF charting, the third most in the NFL over that span. And his 22 explosive receptions of 15 plus yards on such passes ranked second. These are actually numbers that I didn't and haven't seen before. 139 targets where the pass was deemed inaccurate per PFF's charting. The third most over the NFL. I mean, look at the quarterbacks he has been playing with, not very accurate and not always on time, as we saw last year in particular.

And 22 explosive receptions of 15 plus yards on such passes ranked second in the NFL. His 17 contested catches on such passes rank number one in the NFL. Maybe some of you have seen these numbers. I have not seen these numbers. Despite his surroundings, McClorn's 86.6 receiving grade, since 2019 ranks 13th among all wide receivers over that span, trails only A.J. Brown from the 2019 draft class. And then Spielberger writes about off the field, McLaurin is heralded as one of the leaders,

et cetera, et cetera. And he writes, Washington should commit big-time money to a player who may only get better with stronger play at the quarterback position. And his contract projection is, five years, $15 million, that would put him at $23 million per year with 53 of it. So less than half of it, but $53 million of it totally guaranteed over a five-year deal. Now, the AAV of 23 million per year would put him, according to SpotRack, it would put him, And if you missed the conversation with J.I. Hallsell yesterday,

J.I. projected somewhere in the 24 to 26 range when all was said and done for Terry McCorn. But $23 million would put him behind five receivers on the AAV list. Diggs, Brown, Hopkins, Adams, and Hill would put him in front of DJ Moore. But of course, there are more receivers coming up here shortly. but I still believe that they will get a deal done. I think they'll get a deal done before training camp. I think they'll get a deal done that's probably similar to what Spielberger's projecting. The spot rack number came out to be like just over 24 million as an average annual,

a four-year, I think it was $96 million deal. But McLaren's going to get a big offer, and then it's just going to come down to whether or not they can hammer it out, hopefully in time for training camp. And if not, then we can have the conversation about why not? You know, is it that Terry McClorn wants to get to free agency? Well, you know, he's not practicing right now on the voluntary stuff. We'll see if he shows up for the mandatory stuff without a contract. We'll see if he shows up for training camp, which would be mandatory without a contract. He could demand a trade, but as Jay I told us yesterday, it gets very harsh in terms of the penalties for holding out.

He's under contract. Not for a lot of money, $2.7 plus million for next year. They've got to get Terry McLaren signed. He's the kind of guy you want to be on this team, when this team, if this team is, you know, competitive in terms of, you know, a playoff team and maybe, you know, maybe a contender. There were a couple of other things that I wanted to mention. So there was a story on CBSSports.com ranking the divisions for 2022 in order of best to worst. Now, the NFC East has pretty much brought up the rear in any of these rankings of divisions for a while now. Let's see where they landed on the CBS Sports.com NFL divisional power rankings.

list. All right? AFC West, I think we all understand, that's the best division in football. I mean, we know the quarterbacks. Mahomes, Herbert, Russell Wilson, Derek Carr. The Chiefs, the Broncos, the Raiders, and the Chargers. The Chargers really look loaded and ready to make a big move this year. And the Chiefs may be taking a... step back. Obviously Denver's a lot better. And the Raiders added Devante Adams to play with his college quarterback Derek Carr. The AFC West clearly is the best division in football. Number two on this list was the AFC North with Cincinnati and Cleveland and Baltimore. A lot of people like Cleveland this year with Watson in the lineup. And I've got something on that

as well here in a moment. A lot of people like the Browns to have a chance now with a real quarterback. You've got Baltimore. They need to be healthy. You've got the defending AFC champions in the Bengals. And then you've got the Steelers, you know, with a brand new quarterback in Kenny Pickett. We'll see how that works. Is that division better than the NFC West with the Rams, the Super Bowl champion Rams?

with two playoff teams, including the NFC runner-ups, the 49ers. There was a story today, Kyle Shanahan, saying still, the 49ers plan is to trade Jimmy Garapolo when he recovers from his injury. I'll believe that now when I see it, because if you've been paying any attention to the Trey Lance discussion among the 49ers reporters, it doesn't seem like there's a whole hell of a lot of confidence in Trey Lance right now. But you've got Seattle in that division is the team that really you would expect to take a major step back losing its quarterback of the last 10 years, Russell Wilson.

The NFC West is ranked as the third best division. The AFC East is behind them. You know, you've got the Bills, you've got the Patriots, both playoff teams last year. You've got Miami. They were a near playoff team last year. They've added Tarek Hill, you know, to go with Jalen Waddle, and we'll see whether or not Tua, you know, if Tua is the right guy for the dolphins. They're certainly going to roll out. Mike McDaniel is Tua this year to see if it works. Teddy Bridgewater was signed to potentially be that backup. But, you know, Hill and Waddle, they added Cedric Wilson from the Cowboys.

They've got Gaseki at tight end. They added Chase Edmonds from Arizona. They added, I think, Rahim Mostert and Sony-Michel. You know, they've added a lot of talent, and they were already good defensively. Mike McDaniel in his first year, you know, it's similar to a couple of situations, you know, like in Philadelphia, not that there's a first-year head coach,

but there's a second-year head coach. They look pretty good, but there's the question about the quarterback, and I think that's what you can. say about Miami. So anyway, the dolphins come in on that, I'm sorry, the AFC East with the Bills as a Super Bowl favorite, the Patriots and the Dolphins come in as the fourth best division. Is the NFC East coming up anytime soon? The NFC South is fifth with the bucks and saints being considered as playoff contenders in the upcoming season. You know, this should be a step-back year for Atlanta with Marcus Marriota, and Carolina still doesn't really have a quarterback

solution other than Sam Darnold. By the way, somebody tweeted me the other day, or no, somebody, was it Brendan who shared it with me? Somebody shared with me that somebody said, why would you listen to Sheehan about anything? He's the one that desperately wanted Sam Darnold to be the quarterback last year. No, I didn't. I didn't desperately want Sam. I'm Darnold. I just said in the guy that I desperately wanted last year, assuming that we couldn't get, you know, any of the biggies, including Deshawn Watson. And I'm talking about 2021 was Matt Stafford. That's who I desperately wanted. But when that fell by the wayside, we started talking about everybody. And I said, yeah, I'd take a flyer on Darnold for, you know, a third rounder or a second and a third. And that would have been pricey for him. But I liked Darnold coming out of USC. I won't, you know, that's true. I like Darnold a lot coming out of USC. And I'm still not completely out on Darnold. Obviously, they weren't very good last year,

but I wasn't desperate to trade for Darnold. Matt Stafford was the dude that I really liked. You know, after, you know, the Dishon Watson, Russell Wilson, Aaron Rogers conversation, I'm talking about going into last year was over. The NFC North is the sixth ranked division on CBSSports.com's NFL divisional power rankings. And they're expecting the Packers to take a step back. I mean, Aaron Rogers certainly doesn't have the same weaponry.

He doesn't have, you know, arguably the best receiver in the game. The Vikings with Kevin O'Connell, will that be, you know, slow to take? maybe, but they are loaded offensively, you know, especially getting Irv Smith back at tight end to go with Thielen, to go with Justin Jefferson, Dalvin Cook. They've had offensive line issues there. They've got to get those fixed. But an offensive head coach in Minnesota, I think is going to benefit them. They have a chance to be very good offensively. But, you know, you never know. I mean, their offensive line was a problem. and has been a problem in Minnesota.

I think Detroit and CBS Sports writes that, you know, the lions are still years from competing but heading in the right direction. And then you've got the Bears with Justin Fields. The AFC South is the seventh rated division. So that puts the NFC East, if you knew already, that there are eight NFL divisions in the last play slot once again. I don't know. is the AFC South actually better than the NFC East?

The AFC South has Tennessee, Indy, Jacksonville, and Houston. And I don't know, I think maybe their best team, if it's Tennessee, if you believe it's Tennessee, is better than any of the four teams in the NFC East. Maybe. Is Indy better than any of the teams in the NFC East? I think Matt Ryan's going to really provide a boost for them. I do. But I think I'd take the NFC East as a whole over the AFC South. The NFC East comes an eighth in these NFL divisional power rankings.

And it's just written that it's still the NFC least for me. None of these teams have displayed a recent pedigree to be anything other than horrible to mediocre best with any consistency in recent years. There's not a legitimate Super Bowl threat in the bunch, although I think the Eagles are going to be better than some think. The Cowboys are in decline. The commanders always stink, and the Giants are mired in a rebuild. No, I think the NFC East right now has three teams, two teams in Dallas and Philadelphia,

that are pretty well-rounded. Philly's big question mark would be a quarterback. Dallas's big question mark would be, you know, at head coach maybe, But also, you know, did they lose too much offensively? And I think Washington, as I've discussed, you know, several times now over the last couple of weeks, there's a lot to be excited about when it comes to their offense. And I think their defense is a massive question mark entering this season.

The Giants are in the, you know, in the midst of a rebuild. It's going to be really interesting to see what happens at quarterback in New York. I think one of the reasons that Brian Dable brought in, Tyrod Taylor is that he doesn't believe in Daniel Jones. They didn't pick up the fifth year option. You know, this is going to be a tough year if they've got to go with either one of them and not confident in either one of them. But if one of them emerges as competent, they do have Sequin Barclay and Kenny Gulladay

and Sterling Shepard and Cadarius Tony, even though they tried to trade him. Darius Slayton, you know, a very much improved over the last couple of years. courtesy of the draft offensive line. And then they've got defensive talent with a new defensive coordinator in Martindale from Baltimore. But it's a new, you know, coaching situation, and you sometimes have to give that some time. So there is, you know, an opinion about the divisions. I, to be honest, I can't see the NFC East being that much higher than seventh of all of the

divisions in the NFL. I mean, I definitely would rank the AFC West, the AFC North, the NFC West, and the NFC north ahead of the AFC East. I think you have to put the NFC South just because they've got a Super Bowl contender and a team that should be a playoff contender in the division. Right now, you can't, you know, if you're being objective, you say the NFC East Division winner will be the lone NFC playoffs. team. And in the AFC, you could say that Tennessee and Indy are going to be playoff contenders. But I don't know. I look at the NFC East objectively, and I would say Dallas and Philadelphia are both going to be playoff contenders. Remember last year there was a feeling that there would only be one and there were two in the postseason. But the NFC, the AFC South is pretty comparable

to the NFC East. By the way, CBSSports.com also. wrote a story about the NFC East. It was burning questions for the upcoming 2020 season. The Cowboys' burning question was, is this Mike McCarthy's swan song? Dallas better get to the postseason and win at least a game, or Mike McCarthy is in trouble. For the Eagles, is Jalen Hertz truly their quarterback of the future? I think he's going to prove to be the quarterback of the future. If he isn't, they're going to have a chance with multiple first rounders next year. The Giants, big question of 2022, can a shiny new regime revitalize Big Blue? Wouldn't surprise me if the Giants build towards something positive this year,

but certainly not a playoff contender. And the question for Washington, the last dance for Carson Wentz. And essentially it is, this is the last operational. opportunity for Carson wants to be at least perceived as a full-time starter. So you have that. There was one other thing that I was reading this morning, this too from CBSSports.com. Just reading lots of NFL stuff this time of year. This was a story that ranked the 17 new combos of head coach and starting quarterback.

of the 32 NFL teams, more than half of them, 17, have a new head coach quarterback combo. And Cody Benjamin from CBSSports.com ranked the combos heading in to this year. He wrote, we're ranking all 17 of the new head coach quarterback combos. A few clarifiers, he writes. A team just needs one new starting quarterback or a head coach to qualify. We're ranking the duos, not the respective teams. It's just the combination of quarterback and head coach.

And he said, this is a 2022 ranking, a 22 ranking more than like a draft. This is more about what they expect this year, not what they expect way down the road. So the number one new head coach QB combo, Brady and Bowles. Number two, Russell Wilson, Nathaniel Hackett in Denver. Number three, Deshawn Watson and Kevin Stefansky in Cleveland. I don't have a problem so far with any of those pairings being ranked in front of Wence Rivera, because Wence Rivera is on this list somewhere. Four is Matt Ryan and Frank Reich, and I have been reading.

about Matt Ryan so far in OTA days and about how he has really taken over that locker room. That's coming out of Indy from multiple places, and it's almost like they're trying to make the point that they have a real leader in the locker room. And who knows, for those of you that have been, this is an Ursa thing about Wents and Indy, which is, I think, pretty naive. but if you really believe that, this could be, you know, coming from those that are trying to make Ursa look good. But Matt Ryan, Frank Reich as a new quarterback head coach combo ranked fourth. Kirk Cousins, Kevin O'Connell come in fifth.

Derek Carr, Josh McDaniels come in sixth. So far, I don't have any issue with any of those six being rated ahead of the Rivera-Wenst combo. Next on the list, though, here we get into an area in which, you know, I think you could have seen, and they're not there, but you could have seen a combo of Rivera and Wentz come in seventh place. Because in seventh place, Lawrence and Doug Peterson, the first round opponent, the first week opponent for Washington. Then Pickett and Tomlin in Pittsburgh. How does anybody know anything about Kenny Pickett at this? point. Then, Tray Lance and Kyle Shanahan in San Francisco is number nine. Number 10 is Tua and Mike McDaniel. I would have had them higher. Number 11 is Justin Fields and Matt and Matt Eberfluse, the new head coach in Chicago. And then 12th on the list of the 17 new head coach QB combos is

Carson Wentz, Ron Rivera. What's written here by Cody Benjamin, Wence is essentially on his last shot to lock down a permanent QB1 gig. The concern is he's just too volatile. His highs are genuinely admirable, but his lows can sink in offense. Rivera certainly helps keep the team grounded with his proven leadership, but he's not exactly a model of recent success either. It's been a half decade since he won more than seven games. They came in 12th.

I think you could have made the case that they should have been higher. James Winston, Dennis Allen in New Orleans, 13th, Daniel Jones, Brian Dable, 14th in New York. Gino Smith, Pete Carroll. Actually, I think that's Drew Locke and Pete Carroll at 15. Marcus Marriota, Arthur Smith in Atlanta, 16, and then Davis Mills. And I almost forgot about this, that Lovie Smith is the new head coach in Houston. So there you go. So May 25th, Washington, NFC.

East and more prediction stories, which more likely than not will look terrible by the time we get to, say, October or November. One more thing before we get to J.P. Finley, Andrew Brandt, who we've had on the show several times, writes for SI. He wrote a story yesterday or last night about the Deshawn Watson discipline nearing an end, meaning the NFL is getting close to coming up with a a punishment for Deshawn Watson. We had heard or read maybe last week that there was a possibility that this may not happen until all these civil cases were settled, which would have meant 2023 would have been the

first opportunity for the NFL to discipline Watson. But Brant wrote that NFL investigators spent time last week with Watson, indicating that the end of the 14-month investigation into his conduct is not. and Brandt wrote, in my experiences with the NFL personal conduct cases, the last interview from the league has almost always been with the accused. After interviewing Watson, Lisa Freel, who conducts these investigations for the NFL, will report her findings. A disciplinary officer, a former judge jointly appointed by the NFL and the NFLPA,

will issue discipline with any appeal to be heard by, you guessed it, NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell. Under the new CBA, he is no longer judge, jury, and executioner. Now he is more simply the appellate judge. I forgot about that, that he's no longer the guy that's solely responsible for doling out punishment on players. This is now done with a disciplinary officer, which is a former judge jointly appointed by the NFL and the NFLPA. they'll issue the discipline. And then if the player doesn't like it, they appeal it,

and then it's Goodell, who is the appellate judge. Andrew Brant wrote, as I have said repeatedly in this space, I expect a long suspension for Watson. There is NFL precedent under this commissioner of six-game suspensions for both Ben Rafflesberger and Zeke Elliott for sexual misconduct with one woman each. I would expect a six-game suspension to be the minimum given to Watson.

And remember, there were no criminal charges against Elliot in particular. And I don't think that there were criminal charges. And if they were, they were dropped against Rathosberger. I forget specifically how that went. But Andrew Brandt, expecting six games to be the minimum for Watson and for that to be coming to a conclusion here soon. All right, J.P. Finley next right after these words from a minimum. few of our sponsors.

Don't forget to subscribe to the podcast. It doesn't cost you a thing. Rate us and review us, especially on Apple. That's a big help. J.P. Finley, everybody knows J.P. J.P. covers the team for NBC Sports Washington. He also co-hosts a radio show on our sister station, 1067, The Fan, with Brian Mitchell, 10 a.m. to 2 p.m. every day.

you were out for OTA day number one yesterday, which is the one day that media members were allowed to attend this week. Give me your top three takeaways from the first day of OTAs. Number one, I mean, by far the most important thing I saw is Curtis Samuel. He looked good. He looked like everything Washington fans thought they were getting last year. He was quick. he had really good feet.

He was making cuts in the rain looked bouncy. And afterwards, he talked about, you know, last year I was scared to use my speed because I just didn't know my leg would hold up and now he feels totally fine. And I think, you know, as people kind of talk themselves into being really excited about

his offense, I think Samuel's a huge part of it if it's going to really work. And it was really good. He looked better yesterday than his. at any point I ever saw last year. And it's a bank, but that to me was the most important takeaway of a day where you really shouldn't take too much away. The second I would say is just seeing Carson Wentz out there.

And, you know, when you have really good tickets to a baseball game and you hear kind of like that pop when the pitcher throws it, and it hits the catchers' mitt, like, you can, You can hear the difference when Carson Wentz kind of really let one rip rather than what we've seen over the last couple of years, arm strength-wise. And I think that's just going to make such a huge difference in kind of their quick passing game, both to the edges and tight windows over the middle. And then number three is got to be the absences.

Not that Terry was expected. I mean, not just not a surprise, but fully expected. But still, not team McCorn out there. jarring. And then in the Chase Young thing, it didn't shock me. I knew he'd been back and forth to Colorado all off season. But I was, the optics, I kind of thought after the way Ron talked about it, and Jack talked about it, that he would be there.

And it's optional. He has the right not to me, especially if, you know, he's been in communication with them about rehabbing his knee. But there were other hurt guys that were there. Logan Thomas was there. Chase Rie was there. The Montes select thing, I've checked in on it a little bit. I really have been told that it was nothing.

I also saw Montez like 10 days ago at the hockey game and talked to him for a few minutes. And I know that he's been around throughout the offseason. But, you know, that's three of your four best players, not at OTA. And that is notable. Right. The hockey game in which the defensive line minus Chase. shung all went together, like a week and a half ago. You know, so I don't know.

Maybe it's just, I'm at this point where it's like all that I care about is what happens on the field when the season begins. It's not that I've turned coolly or Doc or Bea Mitch, who have all, you know, over the years kind of, you know, minimize some of this stuff. although I remember Doc saying last year, you know, leaders, captains, you know, don't give any reasons for, you know, employees or teammates or opponents to question them. And that was the biggest issue he had with Chase Young, that if you are a true captain, you don't give people reason to question you.

You know, now your performance really does matter because they'll come back to these things. By the way, these OTA days, which many teams have many players miss. But in this town, you know, because we turn over every rock to find, you know, reasons why they continue to lose, we tend to, in our own bubble, obsess about this. But I wanted to get into this a little bit more because they did set an expectation level that Chase Young would be there, you know, at the end of March. And he's not. And he's working, he's rehabbing in Colorado. And I've been told that that wasn't.

necessarily the preferred rehab route for the team, even though they don't believe it's going poorly. They think it's going fine. But their preference would have been to do it differently than do it out in Colorado with the guy that I think did, or the group that did Von Miller's rehab. And it just seems to me that what's become clear, and I want to know if you agree with this, that Chase just kind of has his own way of getting himself ready. It's not the way the team would agree with, but ultimately he better perform on the field. Yeah, I think that's totally accurate. And I don't think it's tough because a lot of people are like ready to draw these conclusions that like, you know,

Chase isn't listening and he's a jerk. I don't think that's the case either. But if this pro football coaches and front office people want to control every little thing. So of course their preference is you to do their rehab in the business. building where they're around and know exactly what's going on. And so, yeah, their preference certainly would be for him to be in Ashburn doing all this stuff. And, you know, maybe if you're chased, you wonder, when did they hire Al Bellamy?

They didn't even have a head trainer. Like, who's going to set all his stuff? You know what I mean? Good point. Yeah. There's got to be a little bit of give and take on this. But I do think it's a... funny, man, because if you look back in last year, the expectations were high, this, you know,

this defense could be all world, blah, blah, blah, and everybody was cool with those expectations until they came out and was terrible in the first half of the season and opened two and six. And then there was this talk of, oh, you know, the expectations were too high and if people could have just let us settle in. And now they've kind of done it again, talking about we expect full attendance and, you know, this is really important to us. Now they don't have full attendance. Now they've got to walk that back.

I mean, we kind of all said this throughout. Sometimes I think the staff might be better off saying less. Or I think it sounds toothless if you're going to say, yeah, we expect them here. And then they're not. They're like, oh, well, it's okay. Like, kind of make up your mind. And if people want to be, like, I think fans will get frustrated with coaching staff or with the players. I'm not sure any of that is wrong, but you've got to keep in mind this is all optional,

and it's late May, and they don't play football until September. It's all optional, yes, but the team captain being the only guy last year not to post for one day didn't make them happy. And so moving forward. Understandably. Yeah, no, yeah, of course. So it's very possible he's going to show up here today or tomorrow or for next week, and all will be fine, and Ron will be able to say, well, I didn't tell you I was expecting

him for every single day. I just, you know, expected him for OTAs. But to your point on things like this, they've got to be a little bit careful, in part because previous regimes overpressed and under-delivered consistently, and really it's better not to set any expectations at all. And they set the expectations that they're going to have everybody here and they're going to have Chase Young here. And he wasn't here on day. day one, and he's doing his own thing.

The only other question I have about, two questions on Chase, do you have any sense as to whether or not his teammates are frustrated with, you know, perhaps another set of offseason voluntary activities where they're all there and he's not? That's number one. What do you, do you have any sense as to what, you know, John Allen and Drummond? We'll get to Dron in a minute. And Montes Sweat and the others think about this.

I really don't think they are upset about it. Maybe on some level there's like this theory. You know, I think maybe Chase kind of does his own thing, like with some regularity and isn't necessarily like one of the guys. But that room has changed significantly this offseason anyway. I mean, John Allen and Matt Ionite, if we're kind of. of their own, like, duo, and then there was the rest of these guys, and that's gone now. And, like, Shuttle and David Bada were kind of like the class clowns, and now Settle's gone.

Like, it's just, I think it's, like, I think it's probably different than it's been, but I think Chase is just kind of a guy that does his own thing and keeps a pretty tight circle, and I don't think anybody begrudges him for it. If he doesn't post for any of these, do you think that the, coaching staff will be pissed once again, even though he's coming up a serious injury. The only thing I wanted to say, like, I agree with you.

They should just say less and promise less. But like, there is an alternative to, if you're going to set the expectations, hard asses about it. And just say, like, yeah, we're disappointed he's not here. And let that become a thing and see what happens. Because last year, clearly, I think everybody,

involved, including Chase, had to be disappointed with his play through eight games before the injury. I mean, I looked at the stats yesterday. You realized in eight games, he had four quarterback hits. Yeah. And I don't think, I don't think Sacks can always be the end of all. The quarterback hits is just applying pressure and getting there. You don't even have to bring him down. I mean, that's, there's nobody that could be happy about that.

And yet, right before the injury, we started to get some fairly veiled shots and some sources, but like there seems to be an extreme reluctance to perhaps take him to task on anything. And at some point, maybe that's necessary. I don't know that this is the point, but like if they said we want full attendance and then they don't get it, like there's nothing preventing them from being like, yeah, we're disappointed. Yeah, I mean, you know, they can't outwardly say we need him here because it's voluntary. Right. can't do that. By the way, I think you made a really good point, and I didn't mention this

yesterday on the podcast, but I talked about it today on the radio show. You know, their head trainer, Ryan Vermillion, was carted off by DEA agents last October. Curtis Samuel had, you know, a very interesting journey through this injury last year. You know, it's not like Washington's got this reputation of being the place to rehab a serious injury, not yet anyway. So him doing this in Colorado, even if that wasn't their preference, you know, he's looking out for himself in this particular situation. You know, there's also this thing, and I remember talking about it last year, when you have a talent like Chase Young, you know, and I'm not saying he's LT, but I'm going to use LT as the example of, you know,

many times Parcells and even Belichick said, he didn't play the scheme. He didn't do what we told them to do. and finally we realized him doing what he wanted to do worked out better. And I don't know if that's Chase Young's ability or talent. But I remember last year when we were hearing adhering to the scheme and doing your job and maturity, I was just like, maybe you've got a player who's not a do your job player. Now, if that's the case and they want that player to be that, it's not going to work very well for them moving forward. and they shouldn't have drafted him.

I agree with that. I think there was some stubbornness on both sides last season, especially early on if you go back and look at that Bill's game where he just rushed outside upfield every time and Josh Allen just calmly stepped up in the pocket, said where he was vacant and picked the team apart. But at the same time, their refusal, so I put that on Chase.

and I don't know who the person that helped him work on developing that stutter step was, but I don't know why you would take, like, his athleticism and explosion off the line is such a weapon. I don't know why you would want to dumb that down, but I don't know why you would want to, like, diminish that with the stutter step move. But I also don't understand what the hell took until Chase's injury to start blitzing a little. Right. Go look at their third down, go look at their third down numbers last year. They ranked 31st in the league. They gave up almost 50% of third down conversion.

And we can talk about the secondary all we want, but the biggest key on third down defense is pressuring it. They weren't doing it. Create the pressure. Like, get outside of your box and do something else because you're getting torched. And I recognize maybe they thought they should be getting more from the front four that they just weren't getting. But it's still on the staff to try to come up with new.

I think that Chase Young, Chase Young's specific you know like fumbled second season or whatever you want to say, like he wasn't good. The numbers, the film, all that would tell you he wasn't performing to his

ability. Like, to me that's on Chase. But the defensive line of the whole and some of the some of the troubles they had as a group, like that falls on coaching to me. Yeah. It's going to be interesting. I think the next

Look, this stuff is, these days are really for, I think, you know, a smaller portion of those that are really interested in the team. But I do think that the team's reaction to it will be interesting if he doesn't post. But let's move on to Duran Payne. What are you hearing about Duran Payne and him at least walking off for a little while, even though, you know, he came back? But, you know, is this a situation or not? So my last thing on Chase, I think the thing fans should be paying the most attention to is the Pup list. Is he going to open camp on the Pup list? Like, what matters is his availability for week one, and that should be the concern.

And I'm not entirely convinced he's going to be available for week one. That's my far bigger concern than OPA. Whoa, okay. Hold on, hold on, because that's the first I've heard of that, that Chase, you know. I'm not saying he won't be. Yeah. I'm not saying he won't. But you think there's a chance he won't be?

of what they said. He got injured in November. That can often be a year-long injury. Right. I think the Pup list to open camp is our first real hint at what's going to happen. So that's the first date I really care about with Chase is July 27th or whatever it is. Here's what if you're rooting. And maybe, I mean, better in mini camps, mandatory. That's mid-June. But they might move that up like they did last year. So that's another little real window to look at. Here's another thing that if he's not ready, if he's on the Pupp list,

if he's not ready for just let's say the early portion of the season. I wasn't considering that. So that's an interesting piece of information. And I know you didn't say that he's not going to be, but there's a chance that he might not be. Then you get into whether or not the rehab, which wasn't their preferred rehab, was the reason for it. And that could really create a situation.

I hope he's ready to go. love his talent and I'd like to see the continuation of what we saw his rookie year. I hope they coach him to get that out of him and I hope he's receptive to whatever, you know, makes sense for the team as well. By the way, on the publicist conversation, do you expect Logan Thomas will be on that? And what is your guess on Logan Thomas for week one in September? I think you've got to think he's going to be on the public. I mean, he blew out his knee in December. And so Chase, Chase by late July will be,

Chase for week one would be 10 months removed from blowing out of me. Logan would be nine months removed. And I hope people can point to Adrian Peterson and that some of these guys are able to return really fast. But not everybody does. Yeah, how'd that go? I mean, I just, I think, I think we got to set perhaps, reasonable expectation. So yeah, I mean, if I had to guess what the Puff List looks like, and I almost don't want to say it because I don't want it to like end up on Instagram or

something, but I think you've got to consider to open training camp that Chase and Logan are on there. They blew out their knee in November and December. Yeah, I mean, the headline of this podcast is going to be, trust me, it's going to be, it's going to be Chase Young starts training camp on Pupplist, J.P. Finley. Which nobody is saying. It doesn't matter. Duran Payne, is it a situation or not? So my read on yesterday was, I didn't get the vibe anybody was angry.

And I checked in on it afterwards. If he's mad about something, I know that he went in the building. I know that he went and lifted weights with his teammates and then went to meetings. that to me now is there a situation where he's not going to do on field work while he's in a contract

situation and it's optional I can see that for sure I won't be stunned if he's not getting in team drilled um like it's funny like the fan base seems totally supportive of Terry McClorin waiting to get his contracts sorted out before he's back

right Duran's in the same boat like he's going into the last of a deal. John Allen skipped a week of OTAs in situation. So I think it's normal if Duran is not thrilled about his contract situation. I think it's fair to say that. I also think, let's be real about, like, I know we're all dancing around, like, oh, will they make an offer?

Like, the writing's on the wall here, man. Like, they paid Allen. You're probably not going to pay two interior defensive lines in north of, say, Iran doesn't command John money, but he's still getting 15 million years or something. And they just drafted the kidnaptles. Like, I don't think we need sourcing and, you know, deep reporting on some of this. And I think Ron's going to say, like, oh, you know, no doors closed. We're still working to figure everything out.

But, like, are we? Does anybody really think that? Like, just kind of use some logic here. So I get why Durand's not thrilled about it. But I think the best thing he can do is, play well, get a fat boy contract next year. And I think that's kind of the game plan, but I didn't see anybody getting angry yesterday.

So you don't think that he's going to demand a trade or the team's going to decide to trade him? If you're going to demand a trade or decide to trade, the time to do that was before the draft. Yeah, I understand. But, you know, you could have injuries. You could have an opportunity before the trade deadline during the season if the season isn't going well.

I think you and I both agree, because I think we've talked about this, I think we have, that this is kind of not that it's an all-in year, but this is a year where they need to be competitive. They are expecting to be competitive. They're expecting to contend. And without Duran Payne, they're really thin. You know, now you've got Phil Mathis in the starting lineup as a rookie on day one, a 24-year-old rookie, but a rookie. So I think Duran Payne's going to play for them, but I'm wondering if there's a possibility

Durant says, you know, I mean, see, the big difference between he and Terry McCorn is he's making $8.5 million in his fifth year option. Terry's going to earn $2.7 million. Yeah. And this is the first year Terry's making, you know, over a million dollars. Exactly. They're totally different. I guess my thing with Ron, could at some point, the season bottoms out and they want to trade them, sure. Could at some point he say, get me out of here, I want a new deal. I guess. I don't see it happening, but it could happen. But Geron Payne for this team has way more value than a fourth or fifth rounder. And I think that's why it wasn't traded at the draft.

I remember we had Garifolo on the radio the day before the draft, and he said, you know, yeah, Payne's a guy that they'll certainly take calls on, they'll maybe even make calls on. But you can get for him versus his best. value on the field this year. And that's like to getting into a possible compensatory pick down the road. At some point you can't always be building for the future because this staff knows they need to win this year. Yeah. Yeah. So your conclusion is Duran Payne's going to play for the $8.5 million this year and then more

likely than not be with somebody else in 2023. Yeah. That's how I see it. What did you make a... Is that how you see it? Yeah, I think so. I'm disappointed by that because I have felt for the last couple of years that Duran Payne had as much talent as anybody on that defensive front, not named Chase Young, and that, you know, it's been a consistency issue. It's been, you know, there have been probably some of those issues of how much does he love it, how hard does he work at it? Does that lead to the inconsistency? There have been moments and there have been games. where he's been the best player on the field for them. And then there have been other games where he's been invisible. I just think that he's extraordinarily gifted and talented and explosive and athletic.

I mean, I remember when Jack Del Rio got here in 2020, he was the one that Del Rio pointed out as being really excited to see on the field and to coach. But, you know, they have the issue of all of these guys and paying all of these guys. And, you know, at this point, I think we still believe they're going to pay Chase Young. And we believe they're going to have to pay Montez sweat. In fact, that's one of those things actually. I was thinking about the other day, JP. It's a weird thing.

Like, I think they really like Montez. And I think Montez really has a lot of talent. And you could do somebody like Montez early and maybe, you know, if you're convinced he's a guy you're going to want to sign before, you know, you're going to pick up that fifth year option of 23. and then you're going to want to keep around. That's where you start thinking ahead a little bit on somebody like him. But anyway...

We haven't seen them do much of that. Yeah, except for, you know, Carrigan and Jordan Reed or whatever. But that's a different, you know, administration. That's a long time. I know, I know. But, yeah, on Duran Payne, I guess I'm just...

I'm disappointed that we didn't see a guy turn into what I thought he was, which was a top five talent. at that position, potentially? I tend to agree with you. Until last year, I made the argument that I thought he was better than John. I think he also gets asked to do a lot of different stuff.

And last year there were plenty of times where he was taking on doubles and that freed up John. I think, I honestly think, for the defensive front style they want, they inherited players that weren't necessarily good fits. I think that's certainly why you see Matt Ionitis gone, maybe even Tim Settle because he's more of an inferior fast rusher. I think that's why they drafted this kid, Matt.

They want a space eater, and they want somebody that let Holcomb and Davis run around. And I think Payne could have done that, but I think he's too talented to be a space eater. And I think he probably knew that, and that maybe led to some of the inconsistencies and frustration. All right. You're getting ready for a radio show, but I got a couple more real quickly. First of all, just your reaction to the Del Rio reference to the gun. that didn't post for phase two last year, the secondary guys, and that led to a rough year on past defense. And then Ron doubled down on that yesterday, saying, you know, that group of veterans

that missed, you know, some of that off-season activity was a sore point. And yesterday, they were really excited. You could hear their communication. Just this interesting take on why they were so bad as a past defense last year, attributing it to. off-season phase-2 activities. What's your reaction to this? Dude, I hear spin. I hear nothing but spin, honestly, and maybe that's overly harsh. Why are they doing it?

I don't know. Dude, go back and look. When did they sign Bobby McCain? When did they even sign him? Yeah, it was after phase two, wasn't it? Right. So, like, he ended up starting every game for you. Is that part of the problem?

That's when you get signed them. What do you want him to do? And then you also had, I believe, a ton of that stuff was COVID-driven because you had guys that were or were not getting back so they could or could not come in. Well, landing college has hurt. Right. Like, I just, dude, you're telling me that workouts in April and May are the reason nobody could jump on a Hail Mary from New Orleans

week five. I have a real hard time believing it. Nobody jumped in the end zone on James Winston's throw. You know, the other part of that is that they're getting themselves in trouble here a little bit because if the pass rush sucks again next year, they're going to have to call out Chase Young

for not being at OTAs, although he's hurt, obviously. But they, you know, they didn't have a pass rush last year, and they didn't call him out for it. I don't know. It's weird. Last thing, It reminds me of, you know, though, I think it was a Jerry Tarkhanian quote. I don't remember who it was, but there's that old, like, NCAA quote about Kentucky gets in trouble so they suspend Ball State.

Right, yeah. Cleveland State, yeah. You know where you need more production. And the second season wasn't good enough either, but I think that all goes hand in hand. Last question for J.P. Fenley, a personal question. In all seriousness, let's just say in 2028 a new stadium. were to open up in Woodbridge, and that you've got like a different role altogether. You know, you're a media television star at ESPN, but you're still living in the market,

and you're doing NFL stuff, but you're available Sundays to go to games. Would you go to a game in Woodbridge if you didn't have to? You're far too kind with the description. But I don't know, man. It's going to be, I think we've got to be realistic that, There's going to be traffic problems wherever because our area has bad traffic and an NFL game creates traffic. But that area is really, really tough. I mean, dude, like, it impacts me wanting to go to the beach with my family just to drive from here to Fredericksburg.

Like, it impacts a lot of decisions I make regardless of just driving to a football game. I wouldn't rule it out. Like, I've, you know, I've driven the, I drive to Baltimore to go see Orioles games and whatever. I don't want to say no, because I think if in 2026 they draft the next Joe Burrow and all of a sudden they're winning 14 games a year, I think I'd be way more convinced. It's a tall order, though. I mean, you and I live pretty close to one another. I think in a lot of ways, one, I think they're just trying to get Virginia and Maryland to start bidding against each

I've been told that pretty clearly. But two, I think they also perhaps seen kind of the evolution of their fan base. And whether it's capitulating on north of the Potomac River, people say it's Maryland. Maryland and D.C., dude. Like, you've got to put those two together.

It's really locking in that your fan base is Virginia, and it's probably, like, Fairfax, down to Norfolk or whatever. Yeah, I don't, I shouldn't have even asked you that question. I should have asked you a better question, which would be, would you have gone to a game last year if you didn't have to? Because that's really more the issue. The bottom line is if the product is what it is in 2027, 2028, it doesn't matter what they build. And the location will matter, but, you know, what they're offering in terms of a team will probably matter as well.

Although Jason Wright's told me many times they're trying to build a business that is, losing resilient and there are examples of that working in other markets. Whatever. I think it could, like, I think you could, like, whatever fans that currently drive from Pennsylvania or, you know, Howard County or the eastern shore, like, whatever fans you may lose from there because it becomes too far, I think you could also gain from Newport News and Roanoke and Charlottesville.

Like, I think that could be a wash. I think the bigger concern they have to really ask themselves, and I don't know that they want to, is like, how much of this fan erosion is just permanent? Like, whatever was, this if you get a nice new stadium with bars and restaurants and a hotel next to it, like, I don't know that, I don't know that whatever was at 100 will get back to 100. You might only have 85 of that left.

Yeah, I don't even know if it's that high. I think what it is, though, and I think this is why, you know, and I agree with you, I think they're using it to, you know, push Maryland. And I still think there's a pretty good chance it could end up in Maryland. But, you know, I think they believe that perhaps a younger fan that hasn't committed yet to an NFL team exists more in Virginia than it does in other areas. and that's one of the reasons that they would be interested in a Prince William County because in many ways with this new brand and everything else,

they have to build a fan base from almost scratch again. It's not that there isn't, you know, untapped potential from people that used to be fans because there is. But you're right. There is a percentage. I think it's higher than you think of people that, you know, just are done. But who knows, how we'll feel, you know. Yeah. And if they ever get good, it could change everything.

It could. If Carson Wentz ends up as, you know, 2017 Carson Wentz, and this whole thing goes bananas, who knows? You know, it could change. Do you like the blue course or not? I do. I love it. They didn't, the front nine used to be like nice but kind of just bland. And six was an awesome hole.

Now the front nine is awesome, but six is kind of not my favorite home. That's my only real quarrel. It's hard. We're talking about the J.P. Finley's home course. That would be congressional country club, the iconic congressional country club. And the major change turning the blue course, the famed blue course into for all intents and purposes, you know, a links course by cutting down every single tree. And it is hard.

It's brutal. You know, you and I are about the same. level, even though your handicap is higher. You've done a much better job with handicapped management than I have. But it's hard, man. It's hard hitting driver and hybrid on every hole. Yeah, I mean, it's long as hell, but I was kind of hitting driver on the, I mean, so to me that blue course is defined by like 14 through 18, and all those holes are hard as hell, and all of them are long, almost all of them are long into uphill elevated greens

except 18, which is downhill into a damn lake. So I think I think 10 and 11 are so much better. I love 11. I love 10. I love 10. It's just, it's such as it's like one of your signature holes.

Yeah, I love it, man. And it's both 10 and 11 before were like for me 10 before was I had to hit a hybrid, which I have no chance of stopping on a shallow green. What is it, what does it play from the member T's? It's like 135. It's like you no longer carrying the water. It's now like a little peninsula kind of reaching out towards the 18th. And the green is crazy. So depending where the flag is,

you know, it's still really hard. But I like being able to try to hit a, you know, pitch of which it is, onto a part three. And then 11, I like way better because you should just be able to, if you could hit a good drive and hit a good three wheel, you can roll it up there. Now there's a creek cutting through. So you have to, it kind of reminds me of the tin lock holes where you have a split fair way.

You have to decide when you want to go, when you want to cross it, and you want to play it up to left side. And it's just, it makes you think a little more, which I enjoy. And it gives me more opportunity to spray it one direction to the other. All right. Let's play soon. I owe you around. Thanks.

Hold on. Can I tell you a quick story? Yeah. Speaking of golf? I was going to text you this, but then when you said, come on the pot, it was perfect. So last week, I went up to the beach. I went up to play a couple rounds and golf.

And you saw Tony? I did. Did he mention this to you? He called me and left me some rambling message. I haven't talked to him about it yet. But what was it, Tommy? So you know, Monty from Starboard. Of course.

Rojovis Country Club. I just met Monty for a drink after he had played around. They had like a member guest, but not their big member guests going on. And I was just having a cocktail. He was like, oh, do you want to say hi to Tony? And I was like, yeah, I'd love to, but, you know, I don't really know him. Like, I don't want them to pretend like we know each other. He was like, ah, whatever, just come over here.

So we go over there, we're talking, and he couldn't have been nicer. He was eating dinner, so I wasn't really trying to interrupt him. But he couldn't have been nicer. We chitchap for a minute or two. And I think Monty kind of mentioned radio, but whatever. And then at the end of it, he looked up and it was like something clicked. He's like, hey, you're Sheehan's boy, aren't you? He said that?

Yeah, that's what clicked. I think we've had some conversations about you before, and I've told him what a good guy you are. It was very cool, honestly, because it made on some level, Mr. Tony knows who the hell I am. So it was very cool. Well, let me just tell you, as you know, being down there, it's much better to know Monty than it is to know Tony. It's much more advantageous.

And Monty listens to the podcast every once in a while. So Monty, everybody knows. It's much better to know Monty from the Starboard than to know Tony. Monty is America's greatest host. He's a great host, and it's a great place, and it's a lot of fun. And so, wait a minute, I want to be clear on this. Did you play Rojobith? No, I didn't get up there until 637.

So we played a couple neighborhood guys set up a tournament. We played Baywood Greens on Friday. Of course. It's beautiful, dude. I've never been there. Yeah, gorgeous. Cripple Creek on Saturday, which is great. Yeah.

They got some construction going on, but it was really great. We were appreciative to be able to get out there. So it was fun. All right. Well, we'll get out soon. you know, the golf, of course, when we play is really just the appetizer to whatever. Secondary to the Cito. Secondary to whatever comes afterwards. All right, be good. Thanks for doing this. No problem. Thank you.

All right. Thanks to JP. We're done for the day. Tommy will be back tomorrow.