The Kevin Sheehan Show - Rob Ryan and Trading Up

Episode Date: January 31, 2019

Kevin opens the show with a brief recap of the Wizards impressive win over Indiana and then he gets to the Rob Ryan hire by the Redskins. He talks about trading up in the draft for a quarterback and whether or not the Redskins should do it. Thom joined the show. They talked Skins, Maryland investigation cost, Goodell press conference, NFL Hall of Fame, and Bryce Harper. Kevin finished up the show with memories of the Redskins Super Bowl 22 win 31 years ago today. <p> </p><p>Learn more about your ad choices. Visit <a href="https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices">podcastchoices.com/adchoices</a></p> Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You want it. You need it. It's what everyone's talking about. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Now, here's Kevin. All right, I am here. Aaron is here. This show is presented by Window Nation. If you're in the market for Windows, call 86690 Nation or go to WindowNation.com and tell them that we told you to call. Tom will call in a little bit later on. I've got a lot of things to get to before Tommy joins us. We're not going to do Super Bowl trivia today. Aaron and I were sitting here and we just decided we're not ready to do it really and we've had some issues with the phone lines when we have multiple calls on the phones. So we'll try to do it tomorrow. So for those of you that really wanted me to do it, I apologize, but we'll try to do it tomorrow, but I'm not going to promise that we'll do it tomorrow. But anyway, I also wanted to mention that Cooley will be on the show tomorrow. So we'll have Cooley on from Atlanta where he is down there. and he'll come on the show.

Help preview the Super Bowl. We'll talk about the recent coaching changes within the Redskins organization and maybe even a little bit more about him. So tune in for that tomorrow. Real quickly, out of the gate here. I thought the Wizards played one of their best games of this season last night. I thought they were really impressive. And I know Indiana is struggling, you know, without Victor Oladipo.

I think they've lost three or four in a row. They're in big trouble. but I thought it was one of the cleanest games I've watched the Wizards play, certainly the cleanest first half that they've played. I mean, they were really good in that first half last night. They passed it well, they shot it well, they defended well. They only had, I think, four turnovers in the first half. They got a little sloppy at times in the second half. They had a big lead in the game. Indiana really never threatened. I think they got it to 10 late in the third quarter, but that was it. But it was really impressive. You know, it was impressive. also on national television, if you didn't know that,

the Wizards Pacers game last night was the ESPN main crew game too with Breen and company at Capital One Arena last night. It was on locally as well. It was. Jimmy P. was doing the pregame stuff with Chris Miller. That's always a great watch. And Buck and Kara were on the call as well. Jeff Green, you know, and I mentioned this two weeks ago, I think. I said, I want Jeff Green to be more consistent

I want him to pick it up. They need him because he went through, you know, a brief rough patch, a couple of games didn't play well. He was great last night. And he came off the bench. Otto Porter started last night. He was back in the starting lineup. More on him in a moment. But Jeff Green, 23 points, five rebounds, six assists, two block shots. He was outstanding last night. They all were, really. Now on Otto Porter, he hurt his toe last night. Who knows how long he'll be out with the hurt? We know this about Otto Porter. He's not a guy that handles pain very well. He's not what any of us would call a tough guy. We've seen enough of Otto's career now to say very comfortably, he's a nice

player. He can do a lot of good things. He's versatile, but he's not a killer. You know, he's not the toughest of competitors. He's not a super passionate, energetic, win-it-all-cost guy. You know, He's not a max player, obviously. Not that this is a revelation. I would try to move him next week. Don't get me wrong. I don't think he's useless. I've never said that about him. I think he's more helpful than not helpful. And he is a good third, fourth guy, you know, if you've got two superstars or two superstars and a really good third player. You know, he's more of a fourth guy. Let's be fair here. I mean, he's not really a third spoke, you know, on a really, you know, fast wheel. He's not. He, my preference, I'd move him for one reason and one reason only. My preference for big money

is stone cold, die at all costs competitors. And that's not auto. It's never going to be. Those things are more innate than learned. One interesting note on the game last night, Aaron, I don't know if you saw this. The Wizards are now seven and two in the second game of a back-to-back, but one and eight on the first one going in. That doesn't make any sense. No, it makes absolutely no sense and probably just completely random. Yeah, they've got another three back-to-backs this year. They get Milwaukee Saturday night at Capital One. The Greek Freak missed that game a few weeks ago when they were in town and the Wizards won it. He'll play Saturday night. All right, Rob Ryan got hired by the Redskins to be their linebackers coach.

He hasn't coached since 2016 when he was in Buffalo as the assistant head coach defense. That's pretty much the lead defensive position there. I think Dennis Thurman may have been his defensive coordinator in Buffalo. But anyway, he was in New Orleans four years before that working for Sean Peyton. You remember why he got fired from New Orleans, right? Yeah. The Redskins put 47 on him. It was the Kirk Cousins, RFK, Kirk Cousins, FedEx Field, 47, 14 game.

where they just annihilated them. That was in 2015. Yeah. Of course I lead with Kirk Cousins on that. He had a phenomenal day. Look up Kirk Cousin's stats from that New Orleans game because it wasn't just stats. He won the game.

But then again, I mean, that'll completely ruin the narrative that he beat anybody like Drew Brees in an actual game. It probably didn't happen. Back to Rob Ryan in all seriousness here. I don't care about it stats from that game. I know they were great. his last two defenses were god-awful in New Orleans, 31st both years in 2014, 2015.

He's been a defensive coordinator, if you count the Buffalo year, 13 times. Just three times has he had a defense ranked in the top half of the league. So 10 out of 13 years, bottom half of the league, and 3 31st out of 32 team finishes. The last time he was, a linebackers coach, New England, early 2000s with Belichick. So I didn't know this, and I didn't remember this actually, until I read it yesterday.

But after that one season in Buffalo, he interviewed for the Redskins vacant defensive coordinator job to replace Joe Barry. But the position went to Greg Minusky instead. The Redskins interviewed several people this year, as we know, you know, Todd Bowles, among them. They did not talk to Steve Wilkes. We know that they wanted to interview Greg Williams, but they kept Minusky. Kirk Olivadati, who was their linebackers coach, left for a similar position in Green Bay. And Ryan was out there and available, hadn't been employed since 2016. And the Redskins play a three-four defense and Rob Ryan's coached a three-four defense before. So let's have him in

as the linebacker's coach. This is really simple. All right. He was hired. He was hired. more than anything else because he was available. And it was probably getting down to too difficult to find somebody else that would take it that was at least qualified for the job. The best thing about his resume is that he worked for Belichick and worked for Sean Payton. Both of them seemed to be fine with Rob Ryan. That's it. You know, he's never been great at what he's done.

He hasn't coached linebackers since the 2000s. doesn't mean he can't. He's got a ton of energy. He'll be a great soundbite, a great quote. I will try to get him on this podcast at some point, although the Redskins really aren't helping out with that stuff these days. But that's okay. We don't need them. But I'll try to get him. Look, in Ryan, they may have Minuscke's replacement on the staff if the defense falters. I wouldn't bet on it, but nobody should be overly excited about the hiring of Rob Ryan. The Redskins are in the midst of one of the real difficult off seasons in franchise history, you know, with respect to the injury, to Alex Smith and the cap hit that they, you know, the cap issue that will come out of that. The coaching staff, everybody wanting to leave

or for the most part, a lot of people wanting to leave, nobody wanting jobs here unless they had no other options. It's not a real feel-good situation. There's not a whole hell of a lot to be glass-half-full, you know, optimistic about entering 2019. But it is the NFL and anything can happen. And hell, between now and next season, they may pull off a big trade, move up, and select Dwayne Haskins or someone else at quarterback. And that's where I wanted to go next, because John Kime wrote a column the other day that I was going to get to yesterday. and we just never did because Jimmy Patsos was so great. He's one of my favorite people,

and if you missed that interview with Jimmy, it was long, but it won't seem long, because he's so interesting, he's so smart, so positive, know so many people, has so many stories, and we ended up talking Aaron yesterday for over an hour, I believe. And I'll do it again soon. I don't care what anybody else thinks, because he was great and I enjoyed it a lot.

And I think a lot of you did, and a lot of you told me as much as well. All right. Kime wrote a story the other day that the Robert Griffin III trade provides lessons for the Redskins that they must heed entering this 2019 offseason, specifically the 2019 draft. And John wrote that the Redskins aggressively moved up in 2012

to take Robert Griffin the third, but it's a scenario that they should not repeat this spring. John writes one of the issues is like in 2012, they have a cap space issue. Now remember in 2012, and John points this out, he knows this, that the salary cap penalty was imposed after the trade for Robert Griffin III. Mike Shanahan said, and John had this specific quote in his story on ESPN.com, Mike Shanahan said no way we would make that trade if we knew we were getting the cap hit. that you couldn't upgrade your team after the following year

and with the salary cap penalty. So the Redskins sent the two first rounders, the second round pick to the Rams, moved up to number two overall, ended up taking Robert Griffin the third. And John thinks that this is not something that should be repeated and they should learn from that lesson. I don't agree entirely.

I don't agree entirely with the overall idea that teams shouldn't move up in a draft for a quarterback. I'm fine with it, actually. In general, I'm fine with it. Now, I'm not fine with it when it comes to this organization. And I'll get to that in a moment. I was actually fine with it in 2012. I was a supporter of the trade. I knew it was expensive. I knew they were trading away their future, their immediate future. I had no idea about the salary cap penalty. And if I did, I would have never advocated or supported the trade as someone as a fan of the team. And I was doing sports talk radio at the time, but I was in favor of the trade. I remember specifically what a controversial

topic was it was. I remember at the station there was one person dead set against it, and he turned out to be right. Zabe was dead set against it, thought it was absolutely ludicrous to trade that much away for, you know, a quarterback where it's such a crapshoot to begin with. I was in favor of it. I was wrong. I was wrong because they did it for the wrong guy. And everybody knows that now for the most part. And it was the organization too, and the salary cap penalty that was coming that you didn't know at the time. But I still am a believer that if you are convinced that you have identified the guy, the guy at that position, you do it. Andy Reid did it in 2017 for Patrick Mahomes.

You think the chiefs made a mistake there? You know, the bills did it last year to select Josh Allen. Eagles traded up for Wence. Eagles traded up for Wence. And Rams traded up for golf. And Rams traded up for golf. But, you know, the Mahomes thing came out of nowhere. No one was expecting them to do that.

The Bills did it for a quarterback that not everybody was thrilled with, but I thought Josh Allen at times looked like the real deal last year. Didn't Arizona, they did it last year also for Josh Rosen. They traded up. I think so, yeah. Wasn't too far up, but yeah, they traded up. I think if you have the right. guy, you do it. It's worth it if you have the right guy. Now, everybody misses on the guy that

they're convinced is the right guy. And that position, you know, there's a lot of misses on. You know, the misrate, though, on first rounders and second rounders doesn't just apply to a quarterback position. You can miss with the following year's first round pick that you traded away. You could miss on that next year on a left tackle, on a corner, on a wide receiver. I don't, as a general position on this, I don't have a problem at that position if you think you've got the guy to go up and get them. Now, as it relates to the Redskins, I don't like the idea. I think volume of picks in an organization like Washington is better strategy than less picks for a potential game changer at quarterback. And the reason for that thinking is this.

who do you really trust right now in this organization to get it right? To get the player right? To get the trade compensation right? Who do you trust to really get that right? The answer is nobody. You know, if they take nine to ten players in the upcoming drafts, staying put at 15, or even trading back and picking up players, they'll stumble into, you know, a few hits.

You know, volume drafting for an organization like Washington is probably the best strategy because you'll stumble into three or four players. You know, if they draft in the first round at their normal spot over the next three years, they'll hit on one to two. You know, they'll hit on one of them. Volume drafting for organizations like Washington who are ill-equipped to identify, evaluate, identify, and then come up with the right trade to go get a player. Volume drafting is really the best way to go.

That's where we are with this group right now. You know, as fans, if they trade it up to 10, gave up or traded up to five, gave up a first to do it, or gave up a this year's second, next year's second, and a fourth to do it. I don't have the compensation chart in front of me.

I mean, I think I'm fairly close. I might not be. Yeah, moving up 10 slots would be about that. Yeah, so as fans, could you really trust a trade-up for Daniel Jones or Drew Locke? You know, if the quarterbacks all get bunched up and it's obvious, they're going to go early. I don't think any of us would trust them on this. You know, the other part of that, too, you have to keep in mind is that if it happens,

it's probably happening in part because Dan and Bruce have fallen in love with somebody. They have decided after meeting with somebody at Indy, oh my God, this is our guy. He's a star. You know, I mean, to hell with his footwork or to hell with his release or his anticipation throwing, you know, or is, you know, feel in the pocket. They don't understand that stuff. But this guy's a star. This guy's our guy. We got to go get him.

You know, once Dan falls in love with somebody, then you've got the whole Griffin situation in place. the empowering, you know, of a young person getting in the middle of that person getting coached. You know, preferential treatment, star treatment by the owner. I don't trust this organization to do it. You know, I don't. It doesn't mean that if they did it, that they would definitely fail. You could stumble into Daniel Jones or Drew Locke trading up for either one of them and getting it right. Dwayne Haskins, getting it right.

there isn't what you would call a, you know, a great quarterback, a can't miss quarterback in this draft in terms of the evaluation of quarterbacks from all of the, you know, from all of the draft people. You know, there's no Andrew Luck in this draft. There's no, look, the Luck Griffin thing in 2012 was, hey, it doesn't matter if you have the second pick. You're going to get a great quarterback. You know, the Griffin thing could have worked out better. I don't know that it would have ever worked out the way we all hoped it was going to work out, even though it looked that way in 2012 during the season. The injury obviously wasn't good. And there was a warning about the injury before. He had had an ACL injury at Baylor. But if the owner had stayed the F out

and given his coach full authority to coach the player instead of getting in the middle of that relationship by empowering Griffin too much, it would have worked out much better. It would have worked out so much better for Griffin, you know, being coached by Mike and Kyle and Sean and Matt. It would have worked out so much better for Griffin. Look at it now. Look at all the coaches that have left that have gone on and McVeigh working with quarterbacks and Kyle working with quarterbacks and Matt LaFleur. I mean, Griffin was in a dream position, dream position. and unfortunately his immaturity was vulnerable to an owner that was also immature and was very much into relationships with stars

and he empowered him to the point where the coach couldn't coach him anymore he empowered him so much that the player thought he was the coach thought he had more power in the organization than the head coach One of my favorite lines from Mike in one of our first conversations on the air after he had been gone for a year or two, it was 2015, I guess, was that the, is when he said to me, he said that Robert Griffin the third, he said, I had to have the ability to bench Robert and to threaten to bench him and have him take it seriously. and it was never going to be taken seriously because all he had to do was pick up the phone or walk into Dan's office and say, do you know what Mike just said to me?

It was really a dysfunctional situation and it started late in 2012 when Griffin got hurt initially against Baltimore and then Kirk Cousins didn't run the Zone Reed in Cleveland. That was, and it's been documented, we've talked about it many, many times, That was the beginning of the end for a lot of things. But anyway, netting it out, I'm not generally against trading up for a quarterback.

I just don't think it's the thing that this organization should be doing. I think that it's probably wrong for this particular organization. Wind donation real quickly before we get to Tommy. They like this podcast, Harley, Aaron, Eric, they listen all the time. If you've been thinking about new windows, I promise you is someone who has had Windonation install windows in my home, you can't go wrong by giving them a call. Home show season is just getting started. So is the home show savings opportunity from Window Nation.

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thoughts about it. You should have a seventh, eighth, and ninth thought about it, too, because I swear to God, last night was one of the coldest nights I can ever remember. I know we've been colder. We didn't set a record here locally. I think it was too below at Dulles. I don't even know what the temperature was at Reagan. When I got up early this morning, Tommy, really early, it was three on my car on my car temperature reading but here's the thing that's been awful about the last 24 hours the wind it's not just been super cold it's been windy it is brutal here but it's going to get better i mean if you if you take an extra day by the time we get to saturday and sunday it's going to be 50 on sunday yeah i know i know but uh i got to get back because i've got commitments

tomorrow and you know look it i i understand how tough it was for you but wasn't it tougher for the guy that you paid to go out and start your car for you yeah i mean he really was miserable he was miserable um it was uh it really has been cold here i mean the whole country i mean i i'm i'm sure i have not even looked to see has our president been tweeting about global warming recently of course he has what has he said oh he says you know wish we had some of that global warming or something along those lines. Anyway, yeah, you missed the coldest of it. If you get back tonight, I think tonight it's only going to be in the upper single

digits to low teens. It's actually going to feel... Yeah, I think it's supposed to be 15 degrees when I land. It'll feel balmy, seriously, compared to what it was late last night and early this morning. And then I'm looking at the forecast right now, Sunday, mostly sunny, 52, Monday, sunny and 55 and then we get some rain but temperatures in the 50s through Wednesday. I have looked at the long range for those of you that are interested in this and you know it's not going to stay warm. Let me just say it's not going to stay warm and more likely than not we still have some pretty good chances for snowstorms and certainly beginning in the middle portion of February if not like next

late next weekend is a possibility too. Well, if it can hold out until February 17th, that's what I'll be backed out in Florida again for spring training. Oh, my God. You got a good gig. You got a good gig. All right, a couple things have happened since we talked on Tuesday. First of all, the Redskins hired Rob Ryan yesterday to be their linebackers coach.

Hallelujah, baby. He's your kind of guy. Absolutely. Absolutely. He's my brother from another mother. He looks like you. They must not have been able to find anybody else is all I can. I mean, because he's been out of work since 2016. You know, he hasn't worked for the last two seasons.

They didn't hire him to be their defensive coordinator in 2017 when they hired Minnowski. And Tommy, this is just the situation right now. They have more people that want to love. leave than want to come. You know, so they've got to find the Hortons and the Rob Ryans who really haven't been doing much recently to take jobs. Do we know if he was calling bingo games? We don't know if he was calling bingo games. We don't know if, but he was out of football for two years, right? Yeah, yeah, he was out of football since 2016. He didn't coach in 17 or last year at all. So this may have been a shock to him too.

But really, what he's doing is, you know, for years, he was in charge of the lunchroom. Now he's a server. Right, right. The problem with the server... He ran the defense, and now he's got to take orders. The problem with the server is that you end up eating too much of the profits as you're bringing it out to the table. But anyway, so that happened. and Kevin O'Connell got elevated to offensive coordinator.

You know, we were talking about that as a possibility on Tuesday. That happened. I made the case on yesterday's show that I believe that, you know, Sean McVeigh, and this isn't, this is what I think everybody's conclusion is. I'm not trying to make it out to be somehow a unique position. But I do think that he's a potential head coach candidate a year from now for them. I think one of the reasons they didn't want him to go. go is they didn't want to lose the next Sean McVeigh. And Tori Smith, who played with him in San

Francisco, essentially said he's the next Sean McVeigh. Well, if Matt LaFlor can get hired as the head coach of the Green Bay Packers on basically a flimsy resume, why can't Kevin O'Connell? Absolutely. I could see that. Yeah. So that's what you've missed the last two. two days. I want to be, yeah, go ahead. And if he is a head coaching candidate, Redskins fans next year will be up in arms about hiring him here and firing Jay if they don't already fire Jay at that point, you know, thinking he'll be another Sean McVey and leave the building.

And if he's another Sean McVe, he'll realize that this is the last place he wants to be a head coach after having spent a couple years here, so he'll be gone too. Yeah, I, you know, there's so much it can happen between now and this time next year, or end of December next year, but the odds right now of Jay Gruden being the coach in 2020 are less than 50-50, you know, at best they're, I mean, the, it's probably like a one-and-four chance that he's the coach in 2020. I don't even want to speculate on Bruce because it this point, I just don't know if anybody can guess properly on Bruce because of the relationship he is with Dan and the fact that he's such a security blanket for Dan. But I just cannot imagine if they,

you know, they're going to need to, I said this a year ago, so I'll probably be wrong a year from now. But if I were posting odds, and I'm sure the odds are out there already, I just haven't looked for him in terms of first coach to be fired next year. But I would, I would guess that it's, that there's a one and four chance that Jay Gruden's the coach in 2020, that there's a 75% chance he's not. So anyway. That probably may be. But, you know, yeah, that may be.

Did you see the Maryland story about how much they spent on the football investigation? I mean, can this whole chapter get any sleesier? I mean, you know, just when you think it's safe, That's when people, whether, you know, I think they should or not, are feeling a little bit better maybe about Maryland football with Mike Loxley there. And then you're brought back to this reminder of how ugly that whole chapter was in the state of Maryland, not just the college of University of Maryland, that people profited off of the investigation into the death of a football player. All right. I want to start with this. You felt like they needed to have an, you felt very strongly about investigation with outside people, right? Yes. Okay. So they put together a group to conduct this investigation into the tragic death and the football program, Durkin's Future, et cetera, the whole thing. How did you think they were going to get that done? Did you think they would be able to get that done?

for free? I didn't know Bonnie Bernstein was going to be one of the investigators. Come on. Where's the disconnect there? She pocketed $118,000. Well, they wanted her to be a part of this group. Well, you know what? That's what I mean. The group was tainted from the start. Why? It was Maryland. It was Maryland boosters. Well, it wasn't all Maryland boosters, Tommy. No. No, it wasn't. No, it wasn't. But there shouldn't have been any. They had, for those that haven't seen the story yet, Maryland spent $1.57 million on the investigation into the football program.

And there were, you know, several people in that investigation that were brought in from the outside to participate in that investigation and sit on a special commission as part of the investigation that build more than six. six figures apiece for two months of work. Now, much of the investigation's legwork was done by a Baltimore law firm, DLA Piper. They charged the university $636,772 for their services. The eight commission members each charged an hourly rate of $650.

Charles Scheler, the DLA Piper attorney who served as the commission's point person, build the university system for $283,855 for himself. And then Ben Leg, a retired federal judge charged $161,000. Alex Williams was also a retired judge charged $155,000 plus. And then here were some more interesting ones. And you mentioned Bonnie Bernstein. Bonnie Bernstein, who is a Maryland graduate, for those that didn't know, remember she was a journalist and part of CBS sports for a long period of time.

She built the university. She was on the commission. She billed the university $118,463. And then Tom McMillan, who is a former Maryland basketball star, former member of Congress, billed 58,000. Bob Ehrlich, former governor, $40,000. And then Doug Williams, and I knew he was on this commission. he billed the university $30,550.

It sounds like McMillan, Erlich, and Doug didn't get the Bonnie Bernstein program, which was unfortunate, or they just didn't put in the same number of hours, which is probably more likely. Well, you know what? They didn't have to ride Amtrak from New York to do the investigation. Apparently, it costs a lot of money. No, it doesn't cost that much money. That can't be...

Thousands of dollars. That can't be where... Have you seen her audit of her... Was her invoice audited? I've seen mentioned that part of the billing was for train rides back and forth from New York. Yeah, in the article it says $2,600 for each train ride, which presumably also includes, like, she was on the clock while she was riding the train is what I assume the prices were.

Her hourly rate. Fourteen train rides to and from New York, where she is based, billing about $2,000. $600 for each. So it's a three-hour, depending if she was on the fast train or the slower train. I mean... Oh, wait a minute. What train do you think she was not?

Of course she was on the fast train. Okay. Doug Williams had a car service drive from Asperin to Baltimore and back, which resulted in a 407... Okay, let me get to the point, because I'm getting bogged down in minutia here. I just wanted people to have a sense of what the

story was. If you're going to put together a commission and you're going to ask outside people to participate in that commission, then you have to pay them. No one's going to do it for free. Nobody's going to take time out of their lives, Tommy, and by the way, in many of these cases, perhaps, time away from their job to do it for free. So I saw a lot of people talking about the cost of it. I mean, we can, you know, you can be critical of how much they paid certain people, and you'd like to know what they did before you really were super critical about the payment, because I don't really know what their responsibilities necessarily were, and they weren't really, you know, explained in great detail. But you weren't going to get it done for free. They were going to charge money for this. You said outside people.

These are not outside people. Most of them are. No, they're not. Yeah, they are. No, they're not. If they're in a state of Maryland, they are not outside people. If you were truly picking a transparent investigative team to look into this, you're not hiring anybody with any connections to the state of Maryland to investigate a state school. You're just not doing that.

I mean, it's a conflict of interest. Well, we knew who... I'm not going to get a legitimate look. Did you have this problem when they were investigating in terms of the people that were on this commission? Yes. Yes, you've got to hire you. I mean, part of the whole problem with the George McNair investigation and what's happened since then is you have to get people as far away from Maryland to school, the sporting program. the football program as possible to get a fair look into what happened here and how bad it was.

Because the people who I talk to for the most part, connected with Maryland sports or the school in any way, always have like an asterisk as far as what happened here. Not that what happened to Jordan McNair wasn't tragic, but the, implications in what it meant. I still don't think most people connected with the school really understand what happened there. Look, I just don't. I, you know what? I just don't understand. I mean, like, again, I just don't think people realize from the outside looking in how toxic the University of Maryland look to the rest of the country. And, you know, people have moved on per per my prediction, because I don't think we've mentioned it until.

this report. I guess, look, we're talking about two different things. You're talking about the makeup of the investigation of the commission to oversee the investigation, and I'm more stuck on the problem that people seem to have with the cost of it. You know, when I saw the number, it didn't seem super expensive to me at first, and then I saw the reaction of all the different, you know, to Bonnie Bernstein and various others that were billing these, you know, you know, you. you know, to many people, these outrageous amounts of money, which really, you know, is probably commensurate with the time that they were spending. Like, it wasn't ridiculous that Bonnie Bernstein had she given that many hours to this process was paid that. That's what, that's what, that's what,

that would be my take. And, and then, you know, I, I, I read a little bit further in the post, in the post story yesterday about the cost of these investigations from other universities. The Penn State thing cost $23.5 million. Now, that's, you know, I, I read a little bit further in the post, in the post story. Now, that was a lot different. I'm not going to suggest that it was that it was you know apples to apples. But even the North Carolina, you know, academics scandal costs the University of North Carolina $18 million just in legal bills. So I, this was not like this outrageous sum of money spent to investigate the football program was really the point I wanted to make. Okay, I get that. I think I think some people were offended by Maryland.

people pocketing the money. I think other people were infended by the pathetic results that came out of the investigation, which resulted in the Board of Regent deciding to keep DJ Durkin, which lasted one day. Right. It's like, here's our report. This is our recommendation. Great. We did it. Oh, no, we're not going to take the, we're not going to take your recommendation. By the way, if you miss this story, Wallace Lowe, who was going to leave in June, I believe, is now back for another year as school president, which, you know, that was part of the whole fallout, too, is him, you know, basically dying on the vine and saying, you know,

take me with it, you know, in June. But apparently that's not going to happen either. He should be gone and Damon Evans should definitely be gone. Gone. They play Wisconsin. The whole borderie is. They play Wisconsin tomorrow night in a ranked matchup. That's all I care about right now.

I, uh, it's true. This stuff, the only thing that set me off yesterday when I read it is when people started reacting about how outrageously expensive it was and how could they spend that much money and how could they spend this on this person and that on that person. Well, that's what it costs. No one was going to do this for free. And then when the post story, you know, went into further detail about the cost of some of these investigations and commissions at other places, it's like they got a bargain. for what they did. I think people would say that they didn't get a bargain, that it was a waste of money. Well, considering that they didn't take the recommendation, they could have just fired Durkin from the get-go and not paid anything.

I don't think I've said this before, and I don't think we've talked about this before. But the reminder that Doug Williams was part of this commission, why was Doug Williams a part of this? Why would one of the senior people in an NFL organization during the season take any time to do something like this? I felt that way when it came out. I don't think I ever said it. I don't think we talked about Doug in particular. Some of these other people, retired judge, retired federal judge, Bonnie Bernstein, I don't even know what Bonnie is doing anymore. McMillan is a retired congressman.

He may be working too. I don't know what Governor Ehrlich is doing, but Doug Williams is a senior VP in an NFL team that was in the middle of a season. Why was he taking one minute to spend on anything other than Redskins business? Well, you know, here's a possibility. Maybe they gave him a cell phone to use as part of the investigation. since he's limited as to how much he can use the cell phone, the Redskins. It doesn't say in the story that they gave him the cell phone. But seriously.

You're right. It's absurd. It's ridiculous. I mean, are you with me? If I were Snyder or Bruce, I would have said, Doug, you're here helping us run our business and our organization. We're in the middle of a football season. Yeah, 100%. I mean, but the fact.

Why aren't you out on the street looking for help for it? The fact that he went and did it and presumably got approval from Bruce and Dan to go do it just speaks to, I think, on some level, his importance in the organization. I may be completely overplaying that. I'm sure I'm exaggerating it. But I remember thinking it at the time, and then when I saw that, you know, he got paid for this to him, like, what did Doug Williams need 30,000 bucks to go spend, you know, four or five, you know, eight and I don't even know how many meetings he was present for and how many hours he spent on this. But it just doesn't seem to be like if I'm the owner of the Redskins or the team president of the Redskins, what I want my senior VP of football personnel to be doing.

Are they called? Great. Tell them you can't do it. You're working. You're employed right now. That's great that they'd like you to sit on that commission, Doug, and you'd be great on that commission, but you're not, we need you here every day. We need you here focused on our business. I don't know. And don't answer your phone. Don't answer your phone because we just made another trade, and we'll tell you about it, and we'll tell you about it later,

but just don't answer your phone because they're going to ask you about this trade that we just made, and we don't want anybody knowing about it yet, including you. The Super Bowl is on Sunday, And it's funny, we're here on Thursday, and I really haven't spent a lot of time this week talking about the game. And I am actually excited about this game. I don't know about you. The Super Bowl is very anticlimactic, I think, most years. You know, it's not our, your football season almost ends with championship Sunday.

You know, this past Sunday, there's no football. You've got to wait two weeks for one game. All of this buildup, I couldn't care less about. I do miss being at the Super Bowl with people that I work with, but I don't miss Radio Row, which you know I thought was the biggest joke and the biggest waste of time. And it was. I still can't believe. Yeah, but I used to get a free tie every year from Steve Young when he would be counting Van U.S.

I mean, some of the things that they, I mean, hey, Willie Lanier is coming by and he's pushing, you know, Rainex or. or we got, you know, we got, I mean, it was one old football player after another that you and I or Cooley and I had no interest in spending part of our show talking to. That's not true. Some of them, some of them we were excited about, and some of them proved to be better than we thought going in. But for the most part, they were duds. Listen, I got a chance to talk to Deacon Jones on Radio Row. For that I'll forever be grateful for. And Brooklyn Decker.

Brooklyn Decker was our all-time favorite. But also, we remember, we had Floyd Mayweather on. That's right. We did have Floyd Mayweather on. That was the one that was memorable for me, because it's somewhere on YouTube. Somebody sent it to me a couple of years ago. Because I got him a little bit upset when I said, when are you just going to fight Pachial?

This is a joke that you guys. guys are sitting around, you know, waiting for this thing, that we're all sitting around waiting for this. This is the only thing that anybody wants to see, and he got really animated. And somebody sent it to me like three or four years ago, because it was on YouTube, you and I sitting there interviewing Floyd Mayweather. But that was a fun interview. That was a great interview. You know who my favorite interview was? He was on Radio Row every year, so it was fun the first time. And then after that, it was like, okay, enough. But Michael Haynes is still one of my.

all-time favorite NFL players. I think he's the greatest cornerback that's ever lived. And he was really good and interesting and smart and had great stories and remembered everything from, you know, those Raiders, when he was with the Raiders in particular, when they beat the Redskins in the Super Bowl. But Radio Row is a waste. Last year or the year before, I forget the last time we were there. I want to say that 40% to 50% of the tables were manned by a producer and no radio talent because everybody realized the cost of it was not worth it. But we did have some fun times, South Beach.

Dallas. Yes, yes, we did. Remember Dallas? Dallas. Dallas, where we were in a local prison. staying over for accommodations. And then the ice storm that froze the entire city for a week. The first night we get, first of we check into that hotel, the motel, we were like,

where did they put us? And that night, it was one of the worst ice storms. It was a Monday night. We got in on a Monday, I think. Or maybe it was Sunday night, you know, because I can't remember if we were there for the whole week or not. and that thing shut down the city for the entire week. But somehow we made it every day. I had to drop you off at the front door every day

because you couldn't walk on the ice. No, no, I couldn't have done that. And we basically, I remember going on the air Monday morning and saying now I know what it's like to do time. That's exactly right. That was your whole thing all week. Now I know what it's like to do time. Because that place...

Unbelievable. I mean, they had a cough there all the time. They did. You're right. They had a cop there all the time. I mean, Carmine and Sapienza with the accommodation. It was Carmine more than it was Chuck. I mean, Rick was as cheap as, I mean.

But seriously, like, it was totally unproductive to stay in some of the places that they put us. You didn't see the place, though, in Phoenix that they put us, that when we got there, all of us refused to stay there. They had checked. Really? It was a crack-infested motel about 25 miles outside of Phoenix. And Kooley and I got there, and we immediately said, it ain't happening. There's no possible way. And I think we called Chuck up and, you know, we made our own reservations at another place. It wasn't high end, but it was at least safe and a little bit closer.

But it was always amazing to me, these people. It's like you could have spent an extra 30 bucks a night and we could have been a block from Radio Row. You know? Yeah. Like, seriously. But anyway, nobody cares about that rant there. The Radio Row thing, though, I don't miss that at all. I do not miss being there.

Especially, I mean, Atlanta, next year it's in South Beach. I know. Next year, next year it's in Miami. Maybe, maybe we can. Well, even that, though. When it's in Miami, it's not really in Miami, Ken. I know. Maybe we can take the podcast to Miami next year.

Maybe we can take the podcast to Miami next year, and I'll get us the best accommodations. Okay? We'll stay in the W. We'll stay somewhere really, really nice. I'll probably have to book it now, and then we'll figure out how to haggle them when we get there down to a better rate.

You know people, Kevin. I don't know that many people. You know people. Who do you like in the game? Okay. I don't care how many times they've, lose in the Super Bowl, I'm never picking against Bill Belichick in the Super Bowl. I'm revisiting for my column tomorrow the 1991 Super Bowl between them and the Bills

and what he did as a defensive coordinator for the Giants to enable them to stop the most high-powered offense that we had seen probably since that Redskins offense of 83. in that bill's offense, that's for 51 points in the NFC championship game. That's the Raiders. And they held him the 13 points in this Super Bowl. And it was all Belichick. And I'm right. And I say, you know, people say he's won five Super Bowls.

I know he had two rings as a Giants defensive coordinator. I think that 91 Super Bowl is on his watch. I give it to him. I think he's got six Super Bowl rings as a head coach. I mean, because it was such a brilliant game plan where basically he said, we're going to let Thurman Thomas run for 200 yards if he wants to. But we're not going to let Jim Kelly and that no huddle offense beat us. You're remembering one part of that, though.

You're not remembering one part of that. And that is that offense dominated the time of possession. I think they had 40 minutes of time of possession of that Super Bowl. if my memory serves me correctly, with OJ Anderson, with Otis Anderson ending up getting the MVP. I mean, they dominate. Oh, yeah. Kelly never, now look, when they had the ball, it was an incredible defensive job. But the game was dominated by the Giants' ability to move the football and to dominate time of possession in that game.

There were no turnovers in that game, if I recall, not one. And it was dominated by the Giants and their ability to control the club. clock and control the football and keep it away from Jim Kelly. I'm just pulling up right now the Super Bowl box score from that. But if it wasn't for Belichick's defensive game plan, the Giants would have been playing catch-up football all afternoon. That's totally fair. And it wasn't like they weren't getting the ball and Belichick's defense was shutting them out. But when the Giants got the ball, they were keeping it away from Kelly and Thomas and company. Here it is. The time of possession in that game, the Giants ran 71 plays

to the Bills 55. 40 minutes, 33 seconds for the Giants, 19 minutes, 27 seconds for Buffalo. Look, they work hand in hand. I mean, you can't dominate time of possession if your defense doesn't get the ball back for you, but then again, you can't dominate time of possession if you don't make first downs and churn the clock when you have the ball. And the Giants did that. But you turned the Buffalo team inside out. Yeah, you did. It was an offensive juggernaut, and they were reduced to, they were brought to their knees.

I mean, their strength, you took away their strength. You're always going to win usually in a game like that. Keep in mind in that game, Buffalo had a 12-3 lead. The Giants came back from 9 down in the, to win that game. They were nine down late in the first half. You know, that was, it wasn't like the Giants got on top, and then the bills were pressing. Look, you're not wrong. Belichick was brilliant, but the giant offensive, you know, clock, you know, churning offense was really, really impressive.

They had long drives in that game where the clock was just rolling in that game. That was, and that was Jeff Hostetland. It was Hostel or notice? And at that point, how old was Otis Anderson at that point? Like 32, something like that, right? Yeah, something like that. He was Adrian Peterson age, actually, I think. Yeah.

How old was he in that Super Bowl? My fault. Yeah, he was 33. 33 in that Super Bowl. Yeah. But. So, again, Super Bowl, I'm picking Belichick. You know, I was surprised at how they fell behind so quickly last year.

how he got caught short in terms of the matchup last year. But, you know, the young genius versus the old genius, I'm going with the Patriots and Belichick. I'm going to have my pick tomorrow, but I like the Rams, I think. I think I like the Rams. I think the Rams, the one problem that the Patriots have always had when they've lost in the postseason is interior defensive pressure, the kind that Donald and Sue can generate.

And in fact, some of the, you know, the Miami teams that have given Brady trouble over the years, some of those teams, you know, Sue was on, and he was a big part of that. That to me is always the key in watching the Patriots play. It's like if Brady gets pressure up the middle where he's got to get off of his spot, he has trouble, the Patriots have trouble, they are vulnerable to losing the game. If the pressure is coming from the edge, he never has a problem with edge pressure. Never. Balls out before the guy ever gets there before he turns the corner.

He sees it or he steps up and makes a throw. It's that, you know, Justin Tuck interior pressure that, you know, throttled him in that first Super Bowl game that really got to him and bothered him in that first Super Bowl game. Those are the teams that do it, and the Rams are capable of that in this particular game. I like their chances. I do. Look, if that makes sense.

And it wouldn't surprise me if that's the way it unfolded. I mean, I don't necessarily think that it felt Belichick victory as a walk. I just am not going to pick against that guy. Just not going to. But you're right. What you said makes a lot of sense. Yesterday. I have to agree with that.

Yesterday, Goodell held his annual Super Bowl week. press conference and, you know, a lot of it was about the blown call in the Ram Saints game. And, you know, he had a ton to say about it. He said, it's a play that we should be called. We're going to make sure we do everything possible to address these issues going forward and see if there are improvements we can make with instant replay or anything else. I understand the emotions. We understand the frustration the Saints feel. Whenever officiating is part of any kind of discussion post game, it's never a good outcome for us. We know that. Our clubs know that. Our officials know that, but we also know our officials are human.

I disagree that it's never a good outcome for them. It never hurts them. It never hurts them, these controversies. These controversies become legendary. They become games that we remember because of a blown call or a bad call, and it never seems to hurt the league. You and I don't think we've had this conversation in great detail because I think I've done it when you've not been on the show. But I am not in favor of replay for subjective penalties.

I'm not in favor of that. I am in favor of it. But I think that the league has to invest money in a system and constantly tinker with that system to make sure it's almost like a fail-safe mechanism. In other words, it's only used in the extreme circumstances. Look, your argument against using replay in a worst case scenario shouldn't be the worst case scenario if you can overturn those calls. It doesn't have to be that way. You know, so, I mean, the league has to think this through

and come up with a system in place where the best, that they can, it can't be abused. Goodell said... Yeah, go ahead. I'm sorry. That may cost them an investment of personnel, extra personnel, to make sure that doesn't happen. You know, I've heard people say,

well, coaches are going to, you know, call a challenge on every pass interference with two minutes left. Well, the coaches don't have the challenge. This is not their call. This is a call that's done. someplace else and I don't know how you set it up but but to deny technology because you can't come up with a system that limits the amount of abuses

for it then that's on you you should be able to come up with something there are a couple of things that he said that I wanted to just read real quickly remember the the rule book that the rule book section that empowered Goodell to overturn a result or order the game to be picked up from the point where the call was made in the sense of in the event that it was an extraordinary unfair event I think is what it was or unfair act somebody asked him about that in the press conference yesterday and he said that was not a consideration ever he specifically said it was a complaint by a team over a judgment call and the clause in the rulebook does not authorize him to act in those particular situations.

He also said with respect to, you know, instant replay in these particular situations, he said there have been a variety of proposals over the last 15, 20 years, should replay be expanded. It does not cover judgment calls. That was a judgment call. The other complication is that it was a no call. Our coaches and clubs have been very resistant. There's not been support to date about having replay. having a replay official or somebody in the league's officiating department in New York,

throw a flag when there's no flag. They have not voted for that in the past. It doesn't mean that they won't do it now. It's something that we're going to put in front of the competition committee to see if there's an answer. But he said, you know, my role is just to make sure that the competition committee understands this and analyzes it and then takes their recommendation. Anyway, I personally don't think anything's going to come of this. I don't. I think that they've got to get, what, three quarters of the teams, typically in these

competition committee rule changes to vote on it and to get it ratified. I just don't see this call being the one that changes the view. I know that people feel that way in the moment, but by the time they get together and start to meet on this stuff, it's just going to look like one of those, you know, and we've gone through all of them. There have been plenty of them in the past that we refer to when we think of memorable games that were blown by officials, balls. I get that, Kevin. I think this one resonates farther. I think people who don't like replay forget what the world was like in the NFL, in big games in the NFL without replay, and how egregious and how horrible some of the decisions that were made, how costly they were. This was reminiscent

of the days when there was no replay period. I think this one's going to resonate a lot. little bit more. And I got to tell you, I am rooting just for, look, I generally root for chaos, and I know it has, you know, zero chance of happening, but I am rooting for any lawsuit that the NFL would lose in a case like this, where a judge would say, you've got to go back and play the game. How could that ever, how could that be a ruling on a private business? I don't know. I'm cheering for it a thousand percent. Yeah. You know what, I said this the day after, and I'll just say it again because this is the way I really feel. I'm not in favor of it, but if it happens, I'm not going to be, like, incensed that they've added more replay to the game.

It just seems to me that we're going to create more problems than it's worth. All right. Tomorrow also, Tommy, is the Hall of Fame vote. There's 15 modern era finalists right now, and they meet Saturday in Atlanta. Would you prefer to do it this way? you're a Hall of Fame voter, you get to vote from your own home. There are no meetings for this that you have to attend, right? Right. I mean, I think, look, the Baseball Hall Fame voting gets roasted all the time, too, but I think it's a much better system where basically you're sent a paper ballot, and you've got the names on the ballot, and you check them off, and you send

it in. There's no closed-door room where people are making the case. for one candidate over another. And, you know, and right now, most voters make their ballots public. That doesn't happen with the Pro Football Hall of Fame. So I think that, I think this system is really warped. And I think it hurts candidates. I think it hurts candidates like the guy, everybody in Washington wants to see in the Hall of Fame, and that's Joe Jacobi, who belongs there.

Right. And he's not, you know, he's not eligible for this anymore. for the modern era. Now he goes as a senior committee member and that's very competitive. It took Jerry Kramer almost 50 years. I know. From that famous

block in the ice bowl to get into the Hall of Fame. So the, you know, they've got 15 modern era finalists. They meet tomorrow in Atlanta. They trim it from 15 to 10 and then from 10 to 5

and then the remaining five finalists are voted on individually, just a thumbs up or thumbs down, a yes or no, and they got to get 80% yes to make the Hall of Fame. To me, there are a couple of locks here. Champ Bailey, I think, is an absolute lock to get in tomorrow. Ed Reed is 100% in tomorrow in my view. And I think that was the list for me. Was there another one?

I'm going down the list right now in terms of absolutely in. Oh, Tony Gonzalez, I think, is in. So Gonzalez, Reed, and Champ Bailey, I think, are the locks to get in. You don't have a problem with either one of those three, right? No, no, I don't. Steve Atwater is still on the ballot. I don't think he was a Hall of Famer in my view. Tony Bisselli is on the ballot.

I actually think that Bicelli is a Hall of Famer. I don't know if he'll get in tomorrow. So, Isaac Bruce is among the 15 finalists. I, you know, the receiver thing, it's really funny when you go through the receivers. Some of the receivers that are in with the numbers that they have, whether it be a Lynn Swan or even to a, you know, a lesser degree Michael Irvin's numbers. Remember, we were comparing those with Art Monks for a long period of time. And Gary Clark. Yeah.

Gary Clark's numbers compared to Michael Irvin. Isaac Bruce was never a first team all pro, not once, and made just four Pro Bowls, but he had eight 1,000 yards seasons, and he's 13th all time in catches. You know, to me, Isaac Bruce is not a lock hall of famer. Like, I don't think, I gave you the three that should be in. I don't even know if I'd vote for Isaac Bruce next year. Alan Fanica, he was a multi-year pro bowler, you know, with the Steelers, you know, primarily.

And I would be surprised if eventually he doesn't get in. Tony Gonzalez is a lock. Steve Hutchinson's on the ballot. I don't know if he is a pro bowler. I'd have to look at his numbers. Edgern James is always one that's interesting to me because people that played in that era and, like, you know who loves Edgern James?

And I know he's a Miami guy, but Clinton Portis thinks Edgern James was great. Cooley, I think, thinks Edgern James was vastly underrated. Like, players really thought a lot of Edron James. He was a first team all-pro selection once, but made four Pro Bowls. He's 13th, all-time in rushing yards. It's going to be close for him. People that played seem to have a higher opinion of him than writers and fans. Tie laws on the ballot, again, again. Apparently Belichick and Brady wrote letters for him. Five Pro Bowls, two first team all pros. He's pretty damn close to being one. John Lynch is not in the Hall of Fame yet. Boy,

he played like a Hall of Fame player to me. I thought the way he hit and the way he played the position was Hall of Fame worthy. Kevin Mawai, I think, is going to be in this time. I think there's a good chance he's in. And then Richard Seymour. I don't necessarily. necessarily consider him to be like a guaranteed Hall of Famer, but he was a three-time first team all pro, and he's another guy that Belichick and Brady wrote letters for. Yeah. Okay. I'd be a generous Hall of Fame voter. You always are, right? Generally. Yeah. You know, so I would vote a lot of those guys and just a handful of the night. And let me just point out, again, talking about the process.

We've had two idiots representing Washington football players in this process. We had Dave Elfin, who didn't even cover football for years, still making the case for candidates. And Art Monk got in on his watch, but it had nothing to do with him. And now we've got the chief clown, Larry Michael, of all people, making the case for candidates when they come on. Well, there's no candidate he's making a case for it. I know that. But he did last year for Chobby, and it was a big turnoff in the room, from what I've heard,

a big turnoff. So it's a screwed up system. It's a screwed up system, I guess. I don't know. Not like us. We have a great system. I mean, when Redskins are involved in the final ballot, I'm usually very involved in in looking through all the candidates,

and I haven't spent as much time this year. But just, you know, it's one of those things that when the player's name is mentioned, as a football fan, as a hardcore football fan, you have an immediate reaction. Hall of Fame, yes or no. Hall of Fame career, yes or no. Champ Bailey, obviously. Ed Reed, I mean, faster than any one of the three that I said should be in.

Gonzalez, Champ Bailey, Ed Reed. Ed Reed's among the two, three, four greatest safeties in the history of the game. not debatable. I do think that Tony Gonzalez, like thinking about his career, he's a Hall of Famer. You know, he was, he was the best at his position,

or certainly one of the two or three best at his position, for a long period of time. You know, his... Yeah, I agree. And Champ Bailey was truly a lockdown corner if there is such a thing. And, you know, the Hall of Fame portion of his career

was much more so in Denver than it was here. It's a shame that he couldn't have had that career here. As much as I like Clinton Portis personally, and I've told him this to his face before, I think he was a ridiculous trade. The Redskins should have never given up Champ Bailey in a second rounder for Clinton Portis. That was a bad, one-sided trade.

It worked out to the extent that Clinton Portis was a very good player for the Redskins during the course of his career here. But you don't give up running backs for corners. You know, you don't give up, you know, great running backs for great corners. And then on top of it, throw a second rounder into the deal. Yeah. You know, this was the beginning of, this was really the beginning, Tommy, in 2004.

Not that we didn't have an inkling that Snyder and Vinny were pretty bad at player and roster management at that point. But when they made that trade and Vinny Serato crowed about that trade, I, I, there wasn't one person that followed the NFL that thought that Denver didn't completely fleece the Redskins in that deal. Like, no, wait a, wait a minute, who got the second rounder? You mean the Redskins got the second rounder for Denver? They got the, they got a, they got a shutdown corner. So they gave up, no, the Redskins gave up the second rounder. Now, we know. Yeah, but, but, but that was, wasn't that a Joe trade? Wasn't that a Gibbs trade? Well, it was, no, Vinny was, Vinny was very involved in all.

Joe wanted Clinton, but Joe wasn't good at that stuff. He wasn't good at that stuff when Charlie and Bobby were running the organization. That wasn't his area of expertise. And when Joe came back, it was made clear that Vinny was still going to be a part of the organization and was going to be in charge of player acquisition, obviously with Joe's input, clearly, and significant input. But we know now, in hindsight, insight and after the fact that the Redskins had to deal Champ Bailey.

And there's a lot of stories and a lot of reasons why we won't go into him. But they had to get him out of this particular area. They had to trade him. And Denver had him, you know, had him where they wanted him, as they did multiple times. Anyway, what else you got for me? I got nothing else. I guess I'm coming back. Yeah, come back.

You know, they could also, they could cancel my flight. You know, I can only hope. They can't use and you stay? Well, you can just pretend that it got canceled. You don't have to, I mean, just pretend it got canceled and stay a day extra. By the way, there is some news on Bryce Harper, and I just want to share that with you. Apparently, he's going to meet with the Padres. Yeah.

What do you mean, yeah? Well, they've got a T. You haven't mentioned Padres before? No, no, I never have. And I don't think that will happen because they're a long way from winning. And they have an idiot for a general manager, by the way. But geographically, that would make sense. Since it's in the southwest portion of the country

and Bryce being based out in Las Vegas. I see the geographical connection. I don't see any other way he winds up with the Padres. Do you refer to California or San Diego as the Southwest? Well, I used to refer to it as the Northeast, but somebody corrected me and said that's the southwest part of the country. Yes, in this case, I would. I know. I just, I'm not saying you're wrong.

It's just that whenever I refer to the Southwest, I'm always thinking of like Arizona, New Mexico, and California is like California. Southern California and Northern California. Like San Diego, I refer to as, yeah, it's in Southern California. I don't refer to it as it's in the southwest part of the United States. The southwest to me means more Arizona, New Mexico, maybe West Texas, maybe Nevada. I don't know. Well, I was trying to connect his Nevada route to San Diego. All right, I was just, I was curious if more people referred to San Diego as being part of the southwest United States or just being in Southern California.

I think this was an isolated incident, and I can guarantee you I'll never do it again. Well, you certainly, at least you didn't refer to them, refer to San Diego as being in the Northeast. I'm glad you didn't do that. All right, get out of here. I'm done with you. Go enjoy the final day of warmth and sun. And when you get back tonight and you get off the plane,

just remember it was much colder last night than it was when you land tonight. Okay. All right. Thanks. All right, boss. He's going to be cold when he gets back tonight. He's going to be really cold when he gets back tonight. Ferrisch Chrysler Dodge Jeep will keep you warm.

They're located in Fairfax. Head on out there. Ask for Ralph Perkins. He's the best. They're located right there in Fairfax Circle. When you get there, tell him I sent you. If you're thinking about something new or something used, just give them a shot. You know, if you're interested in a Jeep Cherokee or a Jeep Grand Cherokee or Jeep

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Do you know what you were doing exactly 31 years ago today? Well, Aaron probably was barely even alive. I was alive, but probably in a crib or something somewhere. I was watching Super Bowl 22. Redskins, Denver. 31 years ago today was the Doug Williams Super Bowl. And it's one of my favorites because, you know, at that point, the Redskins had just won one Super Bowl. They'd gone to back to back in the 82 season and the 83 season, beating the Dolphins in Super Bowl 17 and then losing to the Raiders in Super Bowl 18. And then for the next couple of years, you know, they were fighting to get back to it. They had lost to the bears in the playoffs at home in 84, and then in 85 they didn't make the postseason. 86, they lost to the Giants in the NFC title game after beating the Bears on the road. And then in 87, the 87 season, they got into the playoffs. That was the year of the replacement players that came in and did a great job for them. The Redskins

had to go on the road to beat the Bears in Soldier Field. Then they beat the Vikings at home in the NFC championship game, and then they went out to San Diego to face the Broncos. And it was a game in which the Redskins didn't appear ready at the start. They were down 10-0. Doug Williams dropped back to throw late first quarter, stretched out his knee on a slip-up. turf out at Jack Murphy Stadium.

Wasn't a great turf, great field situation out there. And he came out, two plays. Jay Schrader came in, took a snap, got sacked, and then threw a ball over the middle that was dropped by Kelvin Bryant on like third and 28. And, you know, we didn't know whether or not Doug Williams would be able to come back in. But when he did come back in, it was the start of the second quarter.

It was 10-0 Redskins. The Redskins had done nothing. Doug at that point was, like four for 10 for like 30 yards throwing the ball. And then this play from first and 10 early in the second quarter from their own 20 started the greatest quarter by any team in NFL history. For the Broncos show, the whole playbook in the first quarter, lead 10-0. And Washington now at the 20-yard line, their first possession of the second period. And William, Sanders beats touchdown. Sports fans.

And that started, that was Al Michaels on the call. It was actually, I think, no, it wasn't ABC's first Super Bowl. I was going to say it was their first Super Bowl. I think they actually did the 49er Dolphin Super Bowl after the 84 season, the January 85 Super Bowl. But anyway, it was Al Michaels, it was Frank Gifford, it was Dan Deirdorf on the call, the Monday night crew back then, the ABC Monday night crew, And the Redskins with that 80-yard touchdown pass from Doug Williams to Ricky to Ricky Sanders started what would become the 35-point second quarter, 35 points on 18 offensive snaps in five consecutive drives.

It was a show like none other. They rolled up 360 yards in the quarter in that particular game, and they went on to blow Denver out 42 to 10. The numbers in that final game were amazing. The Redskins totaled 602 yards of total offense in that Super Bowl against Denver. And you have to understand it, all of it basically came in three quarters. 602 yards essentially, you know, 95% of it in three quarters. They had 280 yards rushing. Timmy Smith still, the Super Bowl record holder, with 204 yards on 22 carries.

All right, 22 carries, 204 yards. Doug Williams was 18 of 29 for 340 and four touchdown passes, all of them in the second quarter of that game. Doug had three, I'm sorry, Doug had one interception in that game. That came in the first quarter, four touchdowns en route to the Super Bowl MVP. It was an amazing display. It was a dominant performance. They did whatever they wanted to do from the second quarter on.

They were the underdog in that Super Bowl. They were three, three and a half point underdogs in that Super Bowl against the Broncos. And they came through 4210 winners. And then I asked Aaron to cut up two post-game interviews in the locker room. The first one is with Jack Kent Cook. And for those of you that remember, you remember that Doug Williams was the first black starting quarterback. a Super Bowl. And a lot was made of that during the entire buildup in San Diego before Super Bowl 22. Well, Keith Jackson, the great Keith Jackson, who was the great college football announcer

on ABC for decades, was the locker room interviewer. And he was there to talk to Jack Kent Cook as Commissioner Pete Roselle handed him the Lombardi Trophy. Well, here we have the leader of our new America's team, owner Jack Kent Cook, and Jack obviously was a Cinellane performance by the Redskins. That second quarter, incidentally, most valuable player, Doug Williams, scored more points. He was the main driving force, of course, in the second quarter, than we ever scored in one quarter in the 68-year postseason history

of the National Football League. Hale the Redskins. I tell you paid it's a tribute not only. to a black quarterback, but to a very great quarterback. We mustn't forget the Ricky Sanders and all the rest of the great performances, the Timmy Smiths and so on. All I can say is that I'm terribly proud to have won two out of three Super Bowls, and the entire credit goes to Joe Gibbs, to Bobby Beather, the assistant coaching staff, and a magnificent band of football players. I hope to be in a Super Bowl next year.

Well, I know the commissioner doesn't really full. in love of that word dynasty, Jack, but you guys ain't doing bad two out of three in the 80s. I hope that there is the beginning of a dynasty here, and I have every reason to believe that perhaps we may suspect one. Thank you, Keith. Well, you have had your NBA champions, you've had your NFL champions. I mean, my gosh, how long can this go on? Well, it depends on how long I'm going to live, I think. I've got another 25 years perhaps than me, and I hope that we have many more championship for Washington. There's one thing before we bring in Joe Gibbs

that I want you to have some mention of, and that is the man who owns a ball club who had the courage to go to his checkbook and pay $475,000 for a backup quarterback. It was very easy to do because it was the essence of wanting to win so badly.

Had it been $875,000 or a million $875,000, I would have said the same thing to Joe, but I would have said, quite a little bit reluctantly, but nevertheless I would have said it. Go ahead, Joe, and get him. It's the greatest thing that's happened to us to have Doug here. He's coming over here. He's a good friend of mine. He's a good friend of everybody on the club, and he's a real leader. But the best leader on the club is my dear friend Joe Gibbs, our head coach. That stuff, we were going to cut it off

a couple of times, but I just wanted to keep letting it run because there's so much there. I mean, Jack Ken Cook was a character. I mean, he was quite the character. But the telling Keith Chacks, first of all, the conversation about a dynasty, okay, the Redskins had been to three Super Bowls at that point in, well, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, six years. Three Super Bowls in six years they had been to. And had won two of them. They were, along with the 49ers, the dominant teams of that era. And then the discussion about, you know, I don't know, I'd love to be a part of a dynasty, but it depends on how long I'm going to live. Hopefully I'll live for another 25 years.

I think as Redskin fans, we can all agree. We wished he had lived for at least another 25 years. That means he would have passed away six years ago. And we would have had more winning, I'm sure of it. And then $475,000 for a backup. I would have been a little bit reluctant to do a million. What's the rookie minimum now in the NFL? It's more than that, right?

I think it's like 600. I think, yeah, 600 about. No, actually the rookie minimum is 480,000 for year one, 555 year two, up to 705,000 in year four. Anyway, that was good stuff from Jack Kent Cook. Now, what happens is you hear Jack Kent Cookie yells for Joe. He's like, Joe, come on over here, good boy. Keith Jackson begins his interview with Joe Gibbs. I feel very humble right now from a reskin standpoint. I feel very humble and I'm just thrilled to be a part of this. Thank God I have a chance to work in an organization like this, have an owner like this, and all those things that support me, the coaching staff and our fans.

And it really was a team effort for us. So I appreciate it very much. Somebody had to put all the nuts and bolts and pieces together and I just have to say nobody's done it better in the 80 than you have. Well, I think it's a tribute to our organizations from top to bottom. and starts the big boss and Bobby Bethel gets the players and John Cook and everybody in our organization, Mr. Cook feels the same way as the fans and our coaching staff that Mr. Cook got for me. And I'm probably the most dependent guy out of all of them.

And I just very thankful. Thank God, like I said, that I have a chance to be a part of this. And we're thrilled. Everybody in a race and an organization, I'm the most thrilled for everybody that got to enjoy it. Mr. Cook is too. All of our fans and everybody that came out here. That's a great job. All right.

So that was Gibbs with Keith Jackson afterwards. You know, going down, everybody in the organization and thanking the fans multiple times, which is what Joe always did. Long time ago, 31 years ago today, the Redskins beat the Broncos 42 to 10 for their second Super Bowl win in six years. Their third Super Bowl trip in six years. And they had another one that would come four years later after that. What a run that was. And, you know, yesterday, we, you know, yesterday, we.

We missed the anniversary of the Super Bowl 17 win. I just, I blanked on that, the Rigo win in Super Bowl 17 in Pasadena. There was another anniversary one year ago, trading Alex Smith. Today's the, that's right. Was it yesterday? I think it was today. I thought it was 31st. I think it was the night of the 30th.

Okay. Anyway, we missed the Rigo Super Bowl, but that's the all-timer. That's the all-time play in organization history. You know what? We'll send you out on this Thursday afternoon with the Super Bowl 17 run, as called by NBC Sports. Everybody's heard the Herzog call forever with Sonny and Sam. This was the Dick Enberg, Merlin Olson call of the Rigo touchdown in Super Bowl 17, which was, all right, now 36 years ago yesterday.

Back tomorrow, we'll do the whole Super Bowl preview thing. Cooley will be on this show. Have a great day. Like a couple of expectant fathers, Shula pacing the sidelines, Gibbs, irritated. There's Bill Ernst Parker. Of course, he's made his defensive call. Let's see he'll win this battle with strategy. Riggin.

He's going to go all the way unless Blackwood can catch him and he can't.