The Kevin Sheehan Show - Sam Howell Talk + No Nats Sale

Episode Date: February 20, 2024

Kevin and Thom with a solid set list today. The boys opened with the Nationals not up for sale anymore. They then played the organizational view of Sam Howell if he had been drafted much higher. The first encore was Thom's stories and memories of Lefty along with Kevin playing his favorite, 'why the momentum is building for Jayden Daniels'. The second and final encore included a Sheehan/Loverro duet on the NBA All-Star Game.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheon Show. Here's Kevin. Tommy's here. I am here. The show presented, as always, by Wind Donation.

Call them at 86690 Nation or head towindonation.com for a free in-home estimate if you mention my name. Lots of really good ratings and reviews have come in. Tommy, you'll talk about Lefty and your thoughts. that you tweeted a lot about him, you wrote a column about him, but many of the reviews, lots of tweets about the Lefty show that I did on Saturday with Scott, but a lot of the reviews came in off of that show, but I'm not going to read any of those. They were very nice. Five stars, really enjoyed the show about Lefty, share the same memories that you have about Lefty, but I want to read two really good reviews that really deal with Tom's career outside of being a columnist

and a podcast co-host. This from Peter and Gatorsberg, Sheehan and Levero, best radio podcast couple. The best thing about this podcast is the relationship that Kevin has with Tom. They have a genuine love-hate-love relationship that is a joy to listen to, but enjoy it while you can. This Sammy Panama guy seems legit. So Tommy's probably about to be whisked away to a totally different level of stardom. Good luck to you, Tom. Thank you, Peter and Gathersberg for the five stars and the review. I'm concerned as well. Is tomorrow night the big night, Wednesday night? Wednesday night, tomorrow night, live at Kenny Dees. Sammy Panama on Elwatusi Records will be there. recording Tommy Purifies Great as fifth.

What are you going to play tomorrow? Give me this set list. Well, I'm going to go back to lawyers' guns and money because that got such a great reception on that. And then I might go to cry like a baby, and maybe after that, tossing and turning. You've done tossing and turning before. that one. Yes, I had.

Those are my solid hits right there. Cry like a baby. Tossing and turn and things like Cool jerk. I may do a cool jerk. I did that last year. So that's pretty much it. I'm going to play, you know, like it's like radio. You play the hits.

You play the hits. Is there a ballad in your repertoire? Not really. I mean, I did Jimmy Buffett. once a pirate looks at 40. And it wasn't as bad as you might think it would be because that requires some level of actual singing

as opposed to yelling at the mic. But it wasn't that bad, but I haven't done it in a long time. And there's so far there's been no demand for anything like that. All right. Well, Nikki's also concerned about potentially losing you. Nikki gave us

five stars, said Love the Show and wrote Love the Show have listened to you guys for years. There's one looming question that has been swept under the rug. In capital letters, Nikki writes, where is Tom's movie deal? Question mark. So did Howard Gutman ever help you introduce you to the right people in Hollywood?

Because he is certainly well connected. I sent him my screenplay. And what happened after that? absolutely nothing. You know, your influence carries a lot of weight, buddy. Have you reached out to him to ask him? I've seen him since then. And, you know, look, to be fair, the strike held up a lot of stuff.

Right. The, you know, the writer's strike. Yeah. Yeah, that held up a lot of stuff. And to be fair, also, Howard has his own projects that he's interested in. So he's going to push those before. he's, you know, going to push mine. So it's just a...

Look, it's another potential avenue. But, you know, here's what I've done. I try to avoid trying to get an agent. Okay. I've tried to do this myself through various contacts, and that isn't getting me many places. Would an agent help? An agent would help, but, you know,

it's not easy getting an agent. You just don't say, hey, I want to hire you to be an agent. That's not the way it works. Okay? The agent is almost like a movie producer. They look at the script and they say, yeah, this is good stuff. Okay, I'll take you on as a client because the agent doesn't want to waste his time. His or her time with something that's not going to produce 15% of revenue for her or him.

Right. So it's not, it's just, I can say I want to get an agent, but that's a whole new challenge right there. They have to find an agent that actually likes the stuff. Yeah. And sometimes it has nothing to do with being good, you know? It sometimes it has to do with what's hot at the moment. You know, it sometimes has nothing to do with quality. Look, we've seen enough movies to know that a lot of times it has nothing to do with quality.

Right, of course. You know, I know I've told this story before. I'm pretty sure I've told this story before, but it's one of the great, well, I don't know if it's one of the great. I bet there are so many legendary stories about getting scripts done, getting scripts read and then getting movies done in Hollywood. But I told you this story about Brandon Lang, right? Did I tell you that story or not? Oh, yeah. Yeah.

And the movie, two for the money. Yeah. Two for the money, exactly, which includes McConaughey and De Niro and Renee Russo. Brandon Lang, for those of you who don't know this story, was for years... Pacino, not De Niro, Pacino. I'm sorry, Pacino, exactly. That's okay. A lot of people get them mixed up.

So for those that haven't heard me tell the story before, Brandon Lang was this sports tout, you know, a guy that sold picks for betters to bet on games, you know, and he did this before sports gambling was legalized. I mean, the sports tout business has become even bigger now with legalized sports betting. I saw the story this morning that $11 billion was bet in 2023. But anyway, Brandon had, was just one of these, you know, hundreds, thousands of dudes that did this, you know, in the 80s, 90s in early 2000s, except that he hit on a hot streak that became really kind of noted in the sports tout industry. He picked 23 straight Monday night football games with the spread correctly.

Do you know how hard that is to do? Now, I have no idea what his Saturday and Sunday records were going into Monday night, but the Monday night game, when he got on a run of like seven or eight in a row, all of a sudden people were paying big time for the Monday night pick, which he would sell either as a big package or separately. But anyway, long story short, Brandon was also a golf caddy at a lot of big places like Riviera in Los Angeles, where they just played the Genesis Open. The RIV is one of the legendary golf courses and golf clubs in the country. and he was a caddy there.

And he had this idea for a movie and had written, you know, just whatever they call them, treatments or whatever they call them, you know, the initial. Yeah. And so he was caddying for a big Hollywood director. It was Renee Rousseau's husband. I don't know his first name. He ended up directing the movie, two for the money. But he was caddying for him.

And the story goes, and it's been corroborated by Renee Rousseau's husband and others, that they got to the final hole and this guy had a big putt and it was for big money. And he said to Brandon, I think it looks like it's like, you know, a half a foot out right to left. And Brandon said if you hit it there, it's going to go off the green. The put's actually a left to right put. And gave him the line. He made the put, big money putt. Brandon said, I don't want you to tip me.

I want you to give me 10 minutes to pitch you on a movie idea. He got the 10 minutes and they made two for the money, which was essentially a movie about Brandon Lang and the sports tout business. So, of course, you don't hang out at golf courses. You're not a caddy. You're not even a golfer. So it won't be the golf course where you find the person that falls in love with your script. You'll have to do it. No, it won't be.

It may be once my recording gets out there, it may be, you know, a fan. It may be some high-profile fan who likes what I do like Sammy Panama does. Right. And I haven't even talked to Sammy. Sammy may have movie contacts, too. I think he's got a lot of contacts. This may be the biggest home run, you know, meet and greet of all time for you. I mean, you get a recording contract and you get the introduction to the guy that's going to do your movie.

Yeah. I'm very optimistic about tomorrow. You should be. All right. So I think we should start with the Nats ownership announcing that they're not going to sell the team. I had Chelsea Janes on the radio show today, and it wasn't that she was knocking the report. she did say that there were a lot of people in ownership in the learner family that were not expecting Ted to say what he said yesterday. I'm sorry, Mark to say what he said yesterday.

And that, you know, essentially, if anybody got to the number that they've been looking for, which is $2.4 billion, they'd still probably sell the team. But it's not actively being pitched right now. But anyway, everyone knows what the market is. Everyone knows what their number is at this point, and they'll sell if they get their number. Right. And they didn't get anywhere near the number, although Chelsea told me that Ted did offer, I mean, I say that they didn't get near the number. She said at one point Ted did offer $2.2 billion as part of maybe the Carlisle-Rubinstein bid, that that was a $2.2 billion bid, which was, you know, $200,000.

$200 million short, which is not close for the learners. What's close for the learners is $2.4 billion. For the learners, it could be 20 cents difference, and they fight it. The learners are notorious for squeezing every penny out of every deal. And look, I've said all along that Mark Lerner did not want to sell the team, and other family members want to sell the team. So it doesn't surprise me that there's a little bit of surprise within the ownership that he would come out and say this. But, you know, his words don't necessarily back up his actions because he hasn't treated the team like a guy who's interested in owning a major league baseball team.

Maybe, you know, like a AAA team or a double A team that's not as expensive to run, but not a major league team. So do you think if they had never put the team on the market and had been, had made that step by, you know, hiring an investment bank to actively seek a buyer for the team? Do you think that if they had never done that, that they would have made different decisions with respect to the actual team? No. No. No. I mean, they got, they took, he's been losing money for a few years now. They were dealt a bad hand in COVID in that they never got a chance to capitalize on their World Series championship,

whether through turnstiles, whether through corporate sponsorship and advertising, I mean, you know, there was never even a celebration at the stadium, really, actually, of the World Series championship. Right. So they, but you know what? A lot of people in this country got dealt with a bad hand when it came to COVID. You know, no one told it a bait sale for these people. And they never, and not just on the baseball team, but I wrote about this a couple years ago. Their real estate business took a huge hit.

Right. I mean, you know, the corporate office space that they have in the district is just, it's been devastated. You know, so they've taken a big financial hit separate from the baseball team. And so I don't think putting the team up for sale would have made any difference. Plus, there was the massive dispute going on. And that was legitimate, but also a convenient excuse for saying. we can't spend the money because the Orioles have our money to spend. Well, they've got Orioles money now.

I think that, I mean, that situation has been settled in terms of what was owed. And if that money has changed hands yet, I don't know. But for all intents and purposes, that's their money now. And they're still spending like misers. Yeah, it's, I guess my reaction yesterday was at least, at least Ted's not buying the team. I mean, I know that's a very simplistic thought in the moment that I heard that they weren't selling the team. Apparently, you know, they've been thinking about, you know, pulling it for a while.

I mean, they're not going to sell it unless they get the number. The truth is they're better off not selling it right now until a lot gets cleared up. And in terms of the team, it starts to make progress towards the postseason with a better looking roster, which people think is possible, you know, in the next two years, et cetera. But I don't, I would rather have Ted Lerner and family own the team than Ted Lianzus. I can't argue with that. I mean, I can't argue with that at this point. I think Ted Leonis has become toxic in the sports community in this town right now.

And I don't really see fans embracing him if he turned around and purchased the nationals. So I tend to agree with you. You know, but, and we don't know who the other bidders would have been to even decide, well, it would have been cool. If that guy owned the team, you know, the only one we ever really heard about was Ted. I want to make sure that I'm clear on this. I just don't want Ted Leonces to own the Nats because I don't want, I think it's fair to say, a very average owner at best owning three of the four professional teams.

I don't think that, I think there are probably reasons why that isn't healthy for the fans of the three teams. And it's not like he's a great owner. So I would rather wait for somebody else that potentially could take that team to a different level than my expectations would not be super high with Ted owning the team. Look, the learners have in the past proven that they will spend and we'll see what happens if with this young nucleus if they start to, let's just say they win 81 games this year. Let's say they go 500. You know, do you think they would open up? Do you think they would open it up and go after whatever Mike Rizzo wants him to go after to try to contend in 2025 if it was obvious that they were on the cusp?

It's not as simple as that. Part of the development, and I wrote about this in my column, part of the development of young players is particularly at this stage, it's to surround them with veteran players and not veteran players off the street. but veteran players who are good baseball players. So you want that done now? That's part of the development. So you want that done now?

I mean, they need a veteran starting pitcher on that roster now, a quality veteran starting pitcher now, not a year from now. They need it now. Because, again, that that 81 number, they're not going to get to that this year. I'll guarantee you that. But if they were a little bit more competitive, If they spent over $100 million on their active roster instead of $60 million, which is what they're spending, you know,

they might have enough to get to 80 games or 81 games. And then in September, you're playing wild card games. You're competing for a wild card. I mean, the Arizona Diamondbacks. Yeah. And the Marlins got the wildcar last year with 84 wins. You know, so that's important. It's important for these players, these young players that they talk about development,

to be in September playing competitive games and not another September where everybody's thinking about their golf game as soon as the season's over. So they needed to spend now. And I can guarantee that the front office felt the same way. Did you see the Anthony Rendon comments? Yeah, you know, I feel bad for him because I like him. it's nothing new. He said it before,

but he was really good when he said it before. And then that's were good when he said it before. Now, you know, he's been hurt. He has not played well when he's been active. He's costing a lot more money for a team that's been an underachieving disaster. For those that... For those that don't know... For those that don't know...

Let me just mention what the comments were because not everybody rest. him. Anthony Rendon on the eve of spring training, he's with the Angels. Remember, he signed that seven-year, $245 million deal left the Nats. Nats didn't, you know, I forget what the Nats offer was, to be honest with you, but they clearly didn't want him as badly as maybe some of the fans did after 2019. So we went and took the big deal from the Angels. He has essentially produced nothing since signing with the Angels. It has missed the majority. of games that he could have potentially played because of injury. And he said yesterday, as far as baseball goes, it's never been a top priority for me.

This is a job. Now, there's context around that, and I've heard the sound. He talks about, you know, it's faith, my family, before job. A lot of people say that. But he said it in a way in which it turned into a headline. And when you're not playing well, and really in his case, when you're not playing really at all, because you're injured, you got paid all of that money. It just is not a good look, and clearly, I don't think he really cares.

People have pointed out that he said, like you did, that he said things like this or similar to this when he was a gnat and playing at a high level, and nobody really cared. But I guess the thing about Anthony Rendon is people in that organization and people who really covered the team on a daily basis have always thought, well, this is who he is. is. It's not that important to him. He's just super talented when he's healthy anyway.

He's talented regardless of health, but he's productive and gets the most out of his talent when he is healthy and playing. I always loved Rendon. When he was in Washington, he was the Nationals for a while after Desmond, Ian Desmond left, the Nationals representative to the Youth Academy was Rendon. So he worked with these young kids at the Youth Academy. My feelings with him have always been good. I understand that he's uncomfortable talking to the media because, you know, because, you know, if he really blurt's out what he really thinks,

this kind of stuff happens. And I feel a little bit bad for him. I mean, he's a rich man, okay? And so I don't feel that bad. but it's turned out to be a bad situation. And then that's, you know, it looks like they dodged the bullet. I think, like there were so many memories of Rendon during the postseason in 2019.

But for me, one of the most indelible memories, unforgettable memories, was the Clayton Kershaw sequence in game five in the Dodgers series. When, you know, he came in and he, struck out, he struck out, I forget who he struck out. It may have been, who was our center fielder that year? Was it Eaton? Was Eton the center fielder?

I think he might have been. No, Victor Robles was playing center. Okay, well, Eaton was in the outfield. I think it was eaten. Yes, he was. It could have been somebody else. But anyway, Kershaw comes in and gets that big strikeout. They're up two runs.

I think it was four to two. if my memory serves me correctly. And then Kershaw comes back out and Rendon and Soto go back to back to tie the game. And there is that image of Clayton Kershaw all alone in the dugout. Like, oh my God, what just happened? Remember, because he had left the inning prior getting eaten, I think it was. And then in the place is electric, Dodger Stadium's electric. and they're six outs away, and Kershaw comes out, and it's Rendon Soto back-to-back.

And eventually, obviously, Kendrick had the grand slam in the 10th to win at 7 to 3. It was actually, so that means the score was 3-1, my fault. It was 3-1 in that moment. Rendon had some big moments, though, you know, for this team. He really did. He was the first-class hitter. One of the best hitters in the National League when he was on his game. Yeah, for sure. All right. I want to read something to you. I got it today right before the radio show started. It came from Jack, and Jack wrote the following. He wrote, Kevin, be honest. What would we think of Sam Howe if he had been a top 10 pick, which at one point he was supposed to be taken in the top 10.

instead of a fifth rounder. My answer, optimistic and excited to see him with Cliff Kingsbury. So I think this is one of those hypothetical off-season conversations that actually is interesting. From this standpoint, Tommy, that if he had been a higher draft choice, I think a lot of fans, if not the team, new management, old management, would consider him as a starting possibility much more seriously. And they would look at things like the offensive line and Eric B. Enemy

and come up with excuses for why it didn't work out over 17 games. I want to remind everybody that the year that he came out, and I went back and looked this up because I just wanted to see how unique it was, the 2022 draft in which Sam Hal fell to the fifth round, was one of the most uninspiring quarterback drafts of all time. It was the latest a draft has ever seen a quarterback taken in 25 years. Kenny Pickett was the first to be taken at number 20 in the first round. It had been 25 years since Jim Drunken Miller was selected 26th overall by the 49ers.

It was also the first time in 22 years that at least two, quarterbacks didn't go in the first two rounds. So this was a bad quarterback draft with teams that needed a quarterback, but didn't like any of them. I mean, outside of Kenny Pickett and Malik Willis, really, you know, there just weren't any quarterbacks, maybe Desmond Ritter. Nobody liked any of the quarterbacks in this draft. Not that they're always right on that.

I understand that. And just like when quarterbacks get drafted low, they're not always right. But my answer to Jack's question would have been, I wouldn't, it's hard to know exactly what the answer is without really trying to put yourself in the position today of saying, Hal just finished a dreadful season and he was the number six pick in 2022 overall for this team. But I think my answer would be, I'd be disappointed, I'd be concerned, and I wouldn't hesitate on pulling the trigger for a quarterback that I'd. I was in love with a high ceiling in the upcoming draft. But I think, Tommy, that if Hal had been a much higher pick, like a top 10 pick, and I think, by the way, Jack, differentiating between top 10 and first round is important. Because teams are less patient on number 25 in the first round, number 20 in the first round.

Look, the Steelers are already talking about, you know, replacing picket versus a top 10 overall pick. That's a big investment, and they're willing to give a longer leash. But I think my answer would be the same as it is today, which is I just didn't see enough from Sam Howell to believe that Sam Howell's the starter, regardless of where his position was in the draft. If he had been a top 10, I think I still would have felt that way. Look, the perception might be different, but the only perception that matter, are the guys that run the football team, and I can guarantee you that if the old ownership still own the team

and he had been a top 10 pick, he's going to be your quarterback next year. But you have new ownership that owns the team now, and they have no, with a new general manager, who has zero investment in that draft pick and that quarterback and has a chance to pick his. own quarterback. So I think he'd be,

as far as new management, they could care less. They're going to go get their guy. So I think it really, I mean, that line depends on who owns the team in terms of the perception of them.

If Ron Rivera is still calling the shots, Sam Howe, and he picked them in the top 10, he ain't going anywhere. I totally agree. with you. Totally agree with you. There's a new sheriff in town, and they're going to pick their guy, and they have no investment, personal or otherwise in Sam Howe. So in considering Jack's question, if we look at the fans as one group, the howlers would still be howling. All right?

I think the howlers definitely backed off at the end of the year and realized that at the very least he might not be the answer. I think we at least got that out of the howlers by the end of the year is, okay, maybe, just maybe he isn't a franchise quarterback. But I think Jacoby Percette kind of shut them up a little bit. Well, maybe that was it too. But if he had been a top 10 pick, the howlers would still be howling and they'd be blaming this past season on everything. Then you've got what the new group would say. The new group would not have felt the pressure that Sam was a top 10 pick. They didn't make the pick, as you said.

Now, if the old group were here, and I threw out this hypothetical, too, on the radio show this morning, what you did, which is, let's just say that Ron had picked Sam top 10 in 2022, and that that was his second year coaching, and that actually he was heading into his third year this year, and they didn't fire him. They were going to give him at least the fourth year here. well there's no way they would be taking a quarterback not if they had selected sam in the top 10 what they would have done what they would have done is they would have replaced eric bianamy and they would have said we got a new offensive coordinator we're really excited about the guy that

we hired and we think it's you know that along with all of our draft picks and the cap space we have we're going to build a nice team around our guy you know don't look over here those the the 2020 season where he was statistically, you know, near the bottom and a lot of key categories, look over here. We're going to address all the issues we had that didn't allow our top 10 pick to thrive. So, yes, I agree with you on that. Look, here's the thing. One of the reasons it's an interesting question is because draft position does matter in our conversations.

And it matters in their conversations, teams conversations as well to a certain degree. Draft status matters. It's one of the reasons I spent a lot of time talking about it during the offseason last year. A, I wanted to emphasize what a long shot it was based on history that Sam Hal is a fifth round pick would end up becoming what some of you thought he already was after the Dallas game. But B, when you don't invest heavily in a player with a high draft choices, you don't give him as many chances to succeed after he's failed.

You give him fewer chances. High-level investment, meaning high first rounders, especially a quarterback, they get more chances. They just do. Whether or not it's the right thing to do or not, they just get more chances. So, yeah. Thank you. Here's the other thing. Here's the other thing I would say to them.

Smart, you know, where he wound up being drafted, smarter people than all of you didn't think he was that good. They could be wrong. But smarter people than you. I know it's hard to believe for some people that there are smarter people than you out there. but this is their business and they make mistakes but collectively the NFL decided he was a fifth round pick no doubt it was kind of what we talked a lot about during the offseason when we had the howlers essentially telling you to get on board or get out you just couldn't do that based on what

the rest of the league that knew a lot more than we knew essentially since said in what was a terrible quarterback draft in 2022. There's a story out in New York, Connor Hughes, who covers the Jets for, I think it's the Daily News, I forget. He's suggesting that the Jets should trade for Sam Hal, that the Jets have to address backup quarterback, which they do. My suggestion to them is they should sign Jacoby Brissette. That would be my advice to them.

Don't trade compensation for a guy that is probably a backup quarterback and probably better than the backups you had on the team last year. That's true. But if I were going into this 2024 season with Aaron Rogers coming off in Achilles with a very good roster and a chance hopefully to contend with Rogers being healthy, I would ensure that I have a veteran backup that can play like he did with Cleveland the year before. And I would go after somebody like Jacoby Burset or even Gardner Minchu. Sam Hal would be down the list because you have to trade for Sam Hal to get him.

It is interesting, and I know we've talked about this previously, I do think there is an outside chance that Sam Hal is not on this roster next year. I think that the powers... He's not the ideal backup quarterback for a young rookie coming in. Exactly. Exactly. And if you draft a quarterback at number two,

it's a new offense, it's not like Sam can help him with the scheme from last year. You got the guy on a rookie deal so you can afford, let's just say, Jacoby Brissette for another one-year deal at $8 million. Yeah. You know, or whatever, if it's a little bit more and you've got to commit to two years, you could do that.

And then I'd throw in, you can be comfortable that Jacoby Brissette, starting if the young kid isn't ready right away, that you can function, which at times they didn't do with Sam Howe. Right. So there's a, there's a chance. there's a chance that Sam Hal isn't on the roster. There's also an outside chance that they don't like any of the quarterbacks in the draft enough to spend number two overall.

And they put off quarterback. I think that that is a remote possibility because I think there will be a quarterback there too, whether it's May or Daniels that they like enough to take. But you know, you never know. what happens between now and April 25th. What if they just all get together after spending all the time looking into all the quarterback candidates and they're like, eh, I mean, if we can't get Caleb Williams, then we're not interested.

And then at that point, you got Sam Howe on a rookie deal. You definitely need another quarterback, somebody like a Jacoby Brousset, a veteran quarterback that would compete and you turn it into a real competition. And you probably draft somebody to it. point. I'm giving you worse case. I don't see that happening. I see them drafting a quarterback at number two. All right. We have other things to get to. I wanted to get your thoughts on the passing of Lefty-Drusel. And we've got more coming up right after these words from a few of our sponsors. This segment of the show brought you by MyBooky. Go to mybooky.orgie. Use my promo code,

Kevin D.C. You'll get a cash bonus on your initial. deposit. Big game in college basketball tonight, Tommy, and it would fit the smell test if I were doing a smell test. UConns won 14 games in a row. They're the unanimous number one team in the country. They're the defending national champs. They are now the favorites to go back to back. They blew out Marquette on Sunday, 81 to 53. Marquette was ranked fourth in the country. They had come into that game on an eight-game win streak. I mean, it was a beatdown. None of their games recently have been close. Their last three games, they've won by 25, 36, and 28 points. They play Creighton on the road. Cratons ranked 15th in the country. And at my bookie right now,

Yukon is just a one and a half point favorite. I will be on Creighton tonight for the maximum allowed. Craton over Yukon tonight. Just, you know, Do with it what you please. Don't play Yukon. If I can't talk you out of Yukon, if I can't talk you into Creighton, don't play Yukon. Just stay off the game. Maryland's a seven-point dog tonight at Wisconsin after their loss over the weekend to Illinois, which was a highly entertaining game.

And probably the death knell in terms of any chance Marilyn has to make a run. MyBooky.ag promo code Kevin, D.C. So I did an hour on Lefty on Monday. I followed up with a few more minutes on yesterday's show. You've written about it. Tell me, I mean, you and I had that. I think it was my favorite. That one, Coach Thompson and Sunny were my favorites in terms of our lunch with a legend episodes.

But you covered Lefty. What did you think? I got to spend about eight or nine hours with Lefty one day. because we were going to do a book together. I remember. And I went to his place in Bethany Beach and spent all day Saturday with him with a tape recorder on and interviewing him. So I've got so many good lefty stories. Now, the book didn't happen, but I still, I mean, it was one in a days I'll never forget.

Listen to the lefty tell these stories. How long ago is that? How long ago was that? I'm not sure. Was it after our lunch with the legend? 2013. Okay. So right around that time.

Yeah. Yeah. 2013. So, and he was great, you know, great storyteller, remarkable. And I wrote a call about, you know, some of the stories that he told in, for Monday's paper, about when he first came to Maryland, how he, you know, saw Cole Fieldhouse used to be for boxing. Yep. And they had set it up in a way where the fans weren't that close anymore.

And he went and he went and found the bleachers, the seats that they had for boxing, and set them back up so the fans would be closer. You know, the whole UCLA of the East, how he took out an ad in the Washington Post, like a full-page ad with four of the best players in the DMV's pictures on it, said we're coming after these guys. You know, he wound up only getting one of them. But, I mean, he did think that nobody had done before. And I pointed out the story about when he was hired that Jim Kehoe,

the athletic director, sold him on the idea, in part, that Vince Lombardi was going to be here coaching the Redskins. Ted Williams was here managing the senators. he would be part of that kind of group, you know? And the reality was he was the coach at Davidson at that time. He wasn't really in the same class as Vince Lombardi or Ted Williams. No, but he had built a powerhouse at Davidson, but yeah. I know that.

But outside of college basketball fans, nobody knew who he was then. Okay. But the irony is he wound up. having the biggest imprint and having the biggest presence in the Washington region of those three. Right. Through circumstances. You know, Vince Lombardi died after coaching a year, and Ted Williams left when the senators left for Arlington, Texas.

But lefty was the one who wound up with the biggest impact, changing not just Maryland basketball, but all college basketball in the DMV. So I wrote a column about that, but I have so much more. So, I mean, stories about Bill Walton and David Thompson, you know, and Pete, Pete Maravich, then I'm writing another column basically later on this week that's going to have more lefty stories. You know, I'll give you one. When they were going to play Walton and UCLA, this was the same time when they came east to play them at Cole Fieldhouse. Well, Walton didn't play in the game at Cole.

He played in the game of Pauley. Okay. That was it. That was it. Yeah. But at the time, the bullets were working out at Cole Fieldhouse. Right, right. Because this was until the cap center was being built or something like that.

And lefty asked West Unselled if he could work with Len Elmore about, you know, basically going up against Wall. if he could show him some work with him a little bit. So Wes told Glen Elmore, when I'm playing Kareem, when he goes up, I just step on his foot a little bit. Really? Yeah. That's what he told him. He said, so you should step on his foot whenever you get a chance.

That's what Wes told him. So there's stories like that, too, and that'll be in my next column. But he was, he had so much. and so much enthusiasm for life. And he made – I mean, his players stayed in touch with him. He was on the phone all the time talking to his ex-players, and some players who had never even played for him. Charlie Scott, who he thought he had recruited at Davidson,

and who wound up at the last minute going to North Carolina, Charlie Scott used to talk to lefty all the time. I know. Yeah. Charlie Scott's son would still talk to lefty. You know, it's just he had these connections with his players that went on for decades, and they loved him. I had Tom McMillan on the radio show this morning, and he referenced the relationship between Lefty and Charlie Scott.

Charlie Scott, you know, after not going to Davidson and going to North Carolina, And one of the reasons was he became North Carolina's first black scholarship players. So in essence, he broke the color barrier in Chapel Hill. And he was a huge recruit for Dean Smith. But Scott ended up beating Davidson with a shot at the buzzer in the elite eight, keeping lefty from going to a final four with Davidson. That was at Cole Field House, I think. Yeah, I think it was.

Yeah, because that night, was the night he slept at Jim Keoh's house and was offered the job. And Kehoe told him, I need to know by the time you wake up in the morning, because if you don't take it, I'm offering it to Morgan Wooten. Morgan told us that story when we did the Morgan Wooten lunch with a legend about how close. I mean, it was within basically an overnight from Morgan Wooten getting the Maryland job, which was always the job that he would have taken. It was the college job that he actually would have.

taken. You know, you mentioned that Lefty kept in touch with his players and that he was always calling his former players. It reminds me of this story that Scott once told me. Scott is still friends with Keith Gatlin after all these years. Keith was the starting point guard at Maryland during the bias years, and Gatlin relayed this story about how one morning he woke up to a phone call from Lefty, he answered the phone and he said, hello, and he said, Keith, are you up? And he said, coach, what's up? Everything okay? And he said, yeah, I just want you to turn on ESPN Classic. We're beating the hell out of Carolina. That's lefty. That was lefty. Absolutely. That's great.

There are so many of those stories out there. Oh, by the way, you know, when you mentioned Walton playing in College Park, he actually didn't play Maryland in College Park. He played Maryland at Pauley in the beginning of the 73-74 season. But I thought for a moment maybe Walton had played a final four at Cole Fieldhouse because they had, you know, the famous 66 Texas Western game at Cole Fieldhouse. And then they played the 1970 NCAA tournament at Coalfield House when UCLA beat Jacksonville, but Walton was not on that team. That was the Twin Towers for Jacksonville, Ardus Gilmore, and a very unknown seven-footer named Penbrook Burroughs. That name I don't know. I remember that Jacksonville team.

Anything else? Nothing else. It's just that I always talk about the gifts I've been given in this job, and one of those gifts was getting the no-lefty. I mean, I don't want to be repetitive from Saturday show or yesterday show, but there are other things that I've thought of since those shows. So Tommy knows how hard I pushed to get Lefty to do the lunch with legend show. I mean, I called him for three or four years straight, and he kept saying no, and eventually we got him. But after we did that show, I would hear from Lefty. all the time. And when I say all the time, it was not unusual for me to get a call from lefty

like once a month before he got into the Hall of Fame for a few years. Because getting into the Hall of Fame was so important to him. And by the way, it was important to everybody that was a big Lefty and Maryland fan that he get into the Hall of Fame because he deserved it. And I think the Len bias aftermath and the lend bias death sort of tainted Lefty's legacy. And it was the reason he hadn't gone into the Hall of Fame. But, you know, I don't know if you remember telling me you telling you this during the years, but I'd get a call, you know, before our show, Kevin, it's Lefty. What's up, Coach?

Do you know, and he would give me the name of some reporter somewhere? And I'd be like, I don't think I know that person. Can you try to find that person's number? They're keeping me out of the Hall of Fame. Like it was like just a list of people over like a two-year period. Do you know there was this woman who was an ESPN college basketball person? Her name was Dana. I can't remember the last name.

Do you know her? She's keeping me out of the Hall of Fame. None of these people are keeping Lefty out of the Hall of Fame. But he was so, so intent on. making sure that he could pitch anybody that didn't think that he was a Hall of Famer, which he did. You know, I told this story to Tom McMillan on the show this morning, and it was a story that Lefty told us.

Lefty told us that he thought Bobby Knight was one of the people that was keeping him out of the Hall of Fame. And the reason for that was Hank Iba was Bobby Knight's guy. Hank Iba coached the 72 Olympic team that lost to the Russians in that very controversial final where the Russians got like three opportunities to score a game-winning bucket and they finally hit on the third chance. Tom McMillan was an Olympic player on that 72 team. And lefty criticized at that time Hank Iba publicly for the style of play and said, if I'd coach the team, we would have played my style of play. of basketball, which is more up-tempo getting out and running rather than walking it up and playing

a half-court style, and we would have beaten the Russians by 30. Well, Knight never forgot that comment, according to Lefty. And he always felt Bobby Knight was not a lefty fan and was in part an influence in keeping him out of the Hall of Fame. I don't know if that's true or not. So McMillan said, you know, it's funny, I've never heard that story. before. But it makes sense because lefty would always say, you know, that the style of play that Hank Iba employed during those Olympic games was the wrong style of play to win gold medal. But, yeah, lots of... It wouldn't surprise me if that was true, if that contributed to it.

You mean Knight? I mean, I could see Knight doing something like that. Yeah. Yeah, but thank God he got in. And, you know, there is, you can find that Hall of Fame speech, you know, on YouTube. And McMillan reminded me his 90th birthday celebration. There's a big YouTube thing on that. I've watched that before, too. It's so good.

So many memories, you know. You know, I don't know. And he always knew, though. He knew a lot more than he acted like he knew. That's for sure. All right. We'll finish up the show with a few other things right after these words from a few of sponsors.

All right, Tommy, tell us about Shelly's. Well, I'm going to talk about something I've never talked about before. There's so much to talk about so many good things when it comes to Shelley's back room at 1331 F Street, Northwest, in the district. I'm giving you the address because of what I'm going to talk about. You can pick up food there from their great menu. You can pick up an L. Diablo burger. You can pick up a grilled salmon sandwich.

I mean, Philly cheese steak, they have all this great food available for pickup at Shelly's. You know, it doesn't take that long to get it. By the time you get in your car and get down there, it'll be ready for you. But here's the downside of that. If you've never been to Shelly's before and you go in there to pick up food, you're going to say, wow, this place is great. You're going to look around, and you're going to say, why would I leave? You know, why would I go back with this food?

I'm going to eat it here. Okay, but if you've been to Shelly's before and you're just looking for some pickup food sometime from their great menu, give them a call, or you can go online at shelley's backroom.com. Every time I pull up the Shelly's menu when you're doing the Shelly's read here, it's the worst time to pull up a menu that looks this good

because I'm starving. I haven't eaten lunch. The last time I ate was coffee and a yogurt this morning at 7.15. And so I'm looking through all of their, first of all, their appetizers are incredible. And we've had those before. You love their chicken tenders. But their burgers are outstanding. And the El Diablo burger looks like a really good one.

Shelly's back room, 13th and F Streets, Northwest. Speaking of dinner, yeah. Last night, we went to one of my favorite places down here, McGuire's Irish pub. You know, it's a huge place. And they have like all kinds of sports stuff and interesting other stuff. They have moose heads and strange-looking statues.

A little eclectic looking. But they've got a whole thing. section of the restaurant that has nothing but Notre Dame sports memorabilia. And of course, prominent in that is Joe Disman. The pictures of Disman are all over the wall, autographed pictures from Joe because he has a place down here in Destin. Joe does. So we went to McGuire's last night, and this is the place, Kevin, where it had dollar bill stapled all over the wall. Oh, yeah. Right. Okay.

Yeah, the one where you put my phone number on it and put it up on the bathroom wall? Not the bathroom wall, just the wall. Oh, just the wall. Like at a booth. Yeah, you just, you got hammered by hundreds of number. And put my cell phone number on it. Jeez, that was great. The best part is that you actually admitted it to me.

That was, that was great. All right, what? What about McGuire's? Well, looks awesome. Well, I, last night, I went back and I stapled another dollar bill. to the wall that I think you'll find interesting. That's all I'm going to say. Please tell me that you didn't.

Does it have anything to do with me? I'm not going to say anything more than that. Why? You admitted it before. Why won't you admit it now? Well, because I don't think it would be a good idea to admit it. Really? But does it have anything to do with me? Oh, everything has to do with you. You know that.

I've gotten a couple of weird things. calls here recently. You'll just, I tell you what, when I post the podcast on my social media today, I'll post a picture of the dollar bill. And you can see for yourself. I got a dollar bill for you.

What else do we have today? I mentioned to you that Doug Farrar, who is a very good NFL evaluator, worked for USA today. their NFL editor, gave very high praise to Jane Daniels. And it's a huge Jane Daniels fan. I know you are too, right?

Yeah, big fan. And I've noticed since the Super Bowl last week that there's definitely a lot of Jaden Daniels' momentum discussion anyway about him, you know, being the number two pick after Caleb Williams, even some people who have said, you know, could he be the number one overall pick. I think it's a result, Tommy, of people focus now on the offseason, the drafts specifically. And a lot of these people that are now focused on it aren't college football fans. They don't watch a lot of college games. And if you just turn on Jaden Daniels highlight reel, the 15 to 20 minutes worth of highlights from the season, it is a wow tape. I mean, the actual tape, the game tape, wow tape. I mean, it is an electrifying season. We have a lot of the game tape. We have a lot of

haven't seen many seasons like the one that Jaden Daniels had. I'm not just talking about, you know, 40 touchdowns, four picks, and all of the rushing yards. I'm talking about the nature of the way he got those results. I mean, just one electrifying play after another. So I think people have gotten around to it. And not that, you know, Caleb Williams doesn't have an electrifying, you know, tape to look at. And Drake May, by the way, he's a really good quarterback, too. And he's got some big time plays. But Jaden Daniels just every time you, you know, you watch one of these games or you watch tapes of the games or you watch his highlight reel. It's just an amazing, almost Reggie Bush from high school kind of, kind of tape. But, you know, we'll see if he checks all the boxes on all

of the other things that we won't really know about, but the teams will. All right. And anything else? I got nothing else for you today, boss. Okay. I'm just looking through my notes. I mean, I talked briefly about the All-Star game yesterday. You don't have anything on that, do you? Well, I don't have anything that I haven't said for the past couple of years about that product.

About that All-Star product? I have nothing to say. You know, no, the NBA product. It's just the evidence just presents itself on a nightly basis. Well, that's not evidence of anything. anything. That's not a game. Okay. Well, that's not a game. That's an exhibition. Let me ask you a question, because you don't watch the NBA.

You don't actually think that an NBA game that gets played tonight looks like the All-Star game from over the weekend. No, I do. I don't. But all I know is when Magic and Bird tell these guys, I have a little pride, and they turn in a performance like that, it means they don't give a shit. About the All-Star game. About anything. except themselves.

Well, Bird and Magic were talking about the All-Star game. I know what they were talking about. That's true. They don't give a shit about the All-Star game. But that does not, that's a completely different subject than actual NBA games. Okay. Okay. Of course it is.

Well, of course it is, yes. I mean, I know you're saying that, I know you're saying that sarcastically, but if you actually think that there's similarities between the game. Did you see what Adam Silver said? Sunday night and an actual NBA game, you're just, that's ignorance. Did you hear what Adam Silver said?

They're going to start using AI, artificial intelligence, to create movies, to, like, turn NBA games into movies. They're trying to figure out anything they can come up with, so you don't have to actually watch a game. Well, people don't have, People like you have issues with the games, the actual games. What you watched on Sunday night was not a game.

It was an exhibition. And you're right to say you've been saying it for the last several years. Everybody's been saying it for the last several years. That's why I was kind of surprised at the reaction. Part of it was because you had 211 points scored by the East. But this game has looked like this for seven or eight years. this ceased being a competition years ago. This is a skills exhibition.

People see it as a manifestation of a bigger problem. Well, they shouldn't. There's no reason that they should. Now, people who just watch that game can fool themselves in their own mind that that's where the game's gone. It's not, though. I don't think that's what we're talking about here.

Okay, well, what are we talking about? That they don't care? I think we're talking about people who just turned into the All-Star game and said, oh, my God, this is terrible. The NBA stinks. I think we're talking about people who have watched the NBA for years and see when it's evolved into, you know? Yeah, but that's not a conversation that is weighted one way or the other. That's a heavy debate between people that either love it and think it's much, better than it's ever been, and then people that don't love it because they think it's much

worse than it used to be. The All-Star game is a slam dunk conversation. It is, it's just not a game. It's not a competition. What my issue is, is that people want it to go back to being a competition. That'll never happen. It's just never, you're never, why not? Because you're never going to get to put that horse back in the barn. And actually, players. Why not? Because it's a break for the players during the course of a season, and they're not going to put themselves at risk by competing hard in an All-Star game. It is a different mentality. All those dummies for years, all those players that did for years were dummies? It's not that they were dummies. No, it just was a different time, and they didn't think about it

in the way players think about it today. If that's your overarching point that players think It's not my overarching point. Okay, well, what is? To keep, I've got to stop putting words in my mouth. I've told you five times. I'm not going to repeat myself. Well, repeat it because I think you keep getting confused. No, I'm not getting confused.

It is a manifestation. What we saw is a manifestation of the way these players play the game of basketball on a regular basis. How? This was a blown-up version of it. I'll grant you that, but still, on a nightly basis, you see players that don't care, players that shoot trees, you know, irresponsible shot selection, you see it on a regular basis. The game sucks.

See, that's debatable about the actual NBA game, but it's not, there's nothing the other night is a manifestation of. The other night doesn't resemble anything that you would have watched in an NBA game, game tonight. Nothing. It's not even close. And that's part of the problem. No, you said that it's a manifestation of the game itself. It's not even in the same universe of an NBA game. There's no manifestation of an NBA game into what we saw on Sunday night. Sunday night was not a competition. They're two totally different things. Tonight, when they play games, They will be competing to win the game. The other night was an exhibition.

A handful of them will be competing. Others will just be glorifying themselves. Well, you've probably had that many, you know, in lots of different generations. Not everybody's out there. I mean, Anthony Rendon doesn't like baseball at all. He's still out there. The game is different. There is no doubt.

And for you, it sucks. But for others, it's better than it's ever been. For me, I understand the difference between today's game and yesterday year's game. I enjoy it. I enjoy it a lot. And I really enjoy it in the postseason. And as far as the skill goes, forget about the talent and the physical evolution and all of that, this skill has never, ever been better.

Shooting, ball handling. That's your opinion. But it has nothing to do with what you saw on Sunday night, because that wasn't a game. Greg Popovich agrees with me. Gino Oriama agrees with me. There are people, great coaches,

that have said the same thing. They are athletes, or better athletes, more skill, more talent, And that has added up to a game that's not as good. Yeah, but they didn't say it as what you saw the other night was somehow linked to the games that they're talking about. They're just two different things altogether.

That's not basketball what we watched the other night. That wasn't a competition. It's a showcase. The NBA considers it their showcase event. It was a showcase, all right. Well, a lot of people did like it. I think a lot more people didn't like it, but I personally think it's because they viewed it in the context of what's going on here. Why isn't this, you know, an actual game other than the clock and the scorekeeping?

Well, because it's not been played as a game for seven or eight years now. There's no, nobody defends, nobody tries to stop you from scoring. It's a skills competition in the framework of a game with a clock and the score being kept. that's what it is. They're not actually playing a competition. But that wasn't, listen, that wasn't a conscious decision. And that's not what Popovich or Gino Oriammer are talking about. That's what the game has evolved into.

The players don't have enough prize to be able to put on a performance. Well. Other than self-granted size. But it's not, they don't think of it that way. They don't think of it as a competition. Yes. I know that. Okay.

So it's not about pride. It's that they're approaching it differently. I think it is. If you don't think about it, that doesn't mean it's not about pride. Of course it is. If this is a skill, if this is an exhibition, an exhibition of skills, then Damien Lillard should be very proud of himself. He literally pulled up from half court twice and made the shots.

He's one of the greatest shooters. Well, he and Steph Curry are the greatest shooters. we've ever seen. Curry is the greatest shooter we've ever seen. Lillard's probably in the conversation. So I don't know whether or not they felt pride or didn't feel pride or whatever, but I guess my point to you is, why even talk about the All-Star game in relation to NBA basketball, other than that there were NBA players out there, just like they could have been, you know, handing out turkeys at Thanksgiving. Let's pretend it was a movie like Adam Silver wants everybody to do.

I'm going to get you into the NBA playoffs this year. Yeah. Maybe I'm going to be in Hollywood recording songs by then, buddy. They're going to be so good. And I'm going to have to get you out of rehearsal to tune in to Nuggets versus Clippers game four. All right, we're done for the day. I'm back tomorrow. See you.

That was fun, buddy. And I think we see Willis coming out. There he comes right now. Six feet ten from Grambling. The captain of the next, the most valuable player of the NBA.