The Kevin Sheehan Show - Should Daniels Start Week 1?

Episode Date: May 2, 2024

Kevin opened the show talking about why he would be concerned if Jayden Daniels didn't or wasn't ready to start Week 1 of the 2024 season. ESPN'S Scott Van Pelt jumped on to talk NFL Draft, Jayden Daniels, the NBA Playoffs and more. And then Chris Spera/DC Grays was Kevin's guest to preview Thom's "Cigars and Curveballs" event on Monday night at Shelly's and to discuss Chris' college basketball career at Virginia on a team with Ralph Sampson. Download the PrizePicks app today and use code Sheehan for a first deposit match up to $100! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheon Show. Here's Kevin. My good friend Scott Van Pelt will be on the show with me today. That's coming up in the next segment. A show presented, as always, by Wind Donation.

Call them at 86690 Nation or go to Windonation.com. Mention my name for a free, no obligation, in-home estimate. this email from Witt to open up the show. You can email me through the show's website at Kevin Sheehan Show.com or the Kevin Sheeonshow.com. You can tweet me at Kevin Sheehan, DC. Witt writes, Kevin, I know how much you love Jaden Daniels. But the best thing that could happen to him is to sit and learn behind a player in Mariotta

who had similar talent coming out of college. Patrick Mahomes, Jordan Love, are perfect examples of patience is a virtue and a huge benefit for rookie QBs. So I'm going to answer this very quickly and bluntly. If Jaden Daniels doesn't start week one for this football team, I will be very concerned. Now, there's context that would make me less concerned. You know, he gets banged up. He's not 100% or he's injured. but Jaden Daniels isn't a quarterback drafted by a team with an entrenched starter and a team, by the way, that's good, like Patrick Mahomes was.

Alex Smith was the starter, the chiefs were good. Aaron Rogers Hall of Famer, the Packers were good. No one expected Jordan Love to come in and play with Aaron Rogers there. Patrick Mahomes, at the time, believe it or not, nobody expected him. to come in and start right away. Alex Smith was coming off a decent year. By the way, they got off to a great start to that season. Look, I did this several years ago when Dwayne Haskins was drafted, and I don't have all of the data in front of me right now, but I remember very clearly that if you were drafted in the top half of the first round and you didn't start in the first four weeks of the

season, I think it was, then pretty much you were a bust. Now, there were exceptions to the rule, and Mahomes was an exception to the rule, and there were a couple of other exceptions to the rule. But for the most part, if you were drafted really high, you were being drafted more likely than not to a team that wasn't very good. And if you weren't ready to play right away, it turned out that you basically were Christian Ponder or Jake Locker or, you know, Brandon Whedon, or, you know, the names, or Blake Bordles or, you know, guys like that. You just weren't, you turned out to not be worthy of where you got picked. Jaden Daniels is not coming in here behind a guy that's been here for a while and is

good. Marcus Mariotta was signed to be the backup for Jaden Daniels. By the way, you know, Dan Quinn's never had as a head coach, a rookie quarterback, you know, whether, you know, it was in Atlanta or anywhere where he's had any kind of decision-making ability. I mean, Seattle brought in Russell Wilson when remember they had signed Matt Flynn, but he wasn't the head coach. He was the defensive coordinator. But anyway, I was going to mention Cliff Kingsbury. when Cliff Kingsbury was the head coach in Arizona and they drafted Kyler Murray. You know what Kyler Murray did week one start? His first two seasons, he started 32 out of the 32 games.

By the way, his first game as in Arizona Cardinal, he threw for over 300 yards in a game that ended up in a tie 27 to 27. But Kyler Murray, I would actually suggest if we're looking at Cliff Kingsbury is potentially part of the decision-making group as it relates to Jaden Daniels, Kyler Murray was not as advanced as a passer as Jaden Daniels is. If there were reasons like, you know, this is square peg round hole right now, but he's so talented. figure out a way to get him on the field sooner rather than later. RG3 kind of fit into that category of not being ready to be an NFL pocket passer, but for him, fortunately, he had coaches that were ready to create around what he did do well right out of the gate.

I'd be very, very surprised, and I would be disappointed if Jaden Daniels isn't ready to start on this football team. Week 1. Marcus Marietta, by the way, Witt, who you would like to see start and have Jaden Daniels sit behind and learn from. And you mentioned that they had similar talent coming out of college, which, by the way, is somewhat true. They certainly had similar resumes, just outrageous production in college, Heisman Trophy Winners, and the number two pick in the NFL draft, both of them. Mario da went right after James Winston in the 2015 draft. Mario daughter started right from the jump at Tennessee is the number two pick and played pretty well his rookie season at times. He missed some games. I think he was banged up after the fifth game of the year.

But I went back and looked in his first two games for Tennessee, six touchdowns, no picks, was 34 of 52 for 466 yards in his. first two games. He actually did not run the ball much early in those starts in Tennessee. He did have a couple of games later in the year, including a game where he rushed for over 100 yards against Jacksonville. But no, I just disagree with you with. I think that Jaden Daniels is far enough along in coming out of a more professional style offense at LSU, playing a lot of football at LSU and before that at Arizona State. And I think ready in so many different ways, I don't think this coaching staff, who by the way, have never used words like rebuild.

They have used recalibrate. And recalibrate means, you know, they want to put. out a good product. And they want to get this guy going. If he's not ready to start week one, I think it's indicative of something that they didn't see coming with him. That would be my guest today. Again, some context could change the way I feel.

But I think Jaden Daniels week one, or I'll be concerned. Adam Peters spoke today. He spoke on Big 100. that is the flagship station that carries all of the Washington Commanders games. And he did his interview with them, post-draft interview with them today. And there was an answer that he gave that was interesting. He was asked about whether or not there were any opportunities to look to trade back. This is what he said.

I think you'd be surprised, really, in terms of the offers, we got, you know, really one solid offer. And it, you know, didn't even move the needle. I mean, it would have taken, it had to move mountains to get us off of Jaden and didn't really move the needle. And we were, like you said, we were really comfortable with where we're at. And, you know, it would have taken a lot. I don't think anybody would have given up what we would have taken to get us off of Jaden.

The one offer had to be from Minnesota, right? Minnesota had 11. They had 23 in the first round. The Vegas Raiders, the Denver Broncos, they didn't have the draft capital to move up to two. The one offer came from Minnesota. It certainly didn't come from the Giants. Washington and New York are not going to do a deal that high up in the draft. You're not going to give New York a free swing at the number two quarterback in the draft. So I'm guessing that the one offer that wasn't even close. but the one offer came from Minnesota. By the way, in that interview on Big 100, Adam Peters emphasized once again that Jaden Daniels was the number one player on their entire board. So that means if they had had number one,

they would not have taken Caleb Williams. They would have taken Jaden Daniels. If you trust what he is saying. I want to tell you real quickly about prize picks. It's an app that is as fun as you get, in Daily Fantasy Sports. I've talked about it previously. I'm going to give you actually a more than, less than play for tonight's NBA playoffs. But prize picks is the largest daily fantasy sports platform in North America. It's just you against the numbers instead of you battling thousands of

other players. You pick more than or less than on between two and six players and their stat projections with odds. Like tonight in the NBA in the biggest game of the NBA playoff so far, game six tonight in Philadelphia, 76ers down 3-2 against the Knicks. Jalen Brunson, who has gone for 47 and 40 in the last two games, his more than less than numbers, 33 points. I'm going to go less than 33 for Brunson, and I'm going to go more than 30 and a half points for Embed, who did not have a good game in Game 5,

even though his team won the game, but he was a warrior, man. He had a migraine, he's got a knee injury, he's got Bell's palsy, and he's out there 48 minutes. He didn't play great at times, but he did have a triple double, and he came up with some big plays in overtime. I'm going to go more than and expect Embed to have a big night tonight, and I'm going to go less than with Brunson. So less than 33 with Brunson, more than 30.

with Embed. It pays three to one. So 20 gives you 60 back. 30 gives you 90 back. You can do the math. 200 gives you 600 back. Prize picks. Download the app today. You can actually win up to 100 times your money on prize picks with as little as four correct picks. Download the prize picks app today. Use my code Sheehan for a first deposit match of up to $100. That's the prize Pix app, download that app today, use my code Sheehan, S-H-E-E-H-A-N for a first deposit match of up to $100. Speaking of the NBA, I got this from Zander. Zander sent me a tweet that I read right before the radio show this morning.

Thanks for wasting my time, Kevin. I decided to take your advice and watch the NBA playoffs last night. Two games, two blowouts, no drama at all. It's just one night, but I'd like to have those five hours back. Thank you. Yeah, Zander, you're right. Last night was not the night to push everybody to watch the NBA playoffs. I should have known that, but I was excited about the Nick 76ers game the night before, excited about two nights previous, the Nuggets Lakers game, but I should have known. The heat had no chance against Boston without Jimmy Butler. They just didn't have any prayer. I did think this

second game last night would be interesting between the Clippers and the Mavericks. James Hardin, who in game four, had 33 for L.A., and carried them in the fourth quarter in a game that evened up the series on the road. Last night, it looked like he had never played basketball before. And that's kind of been the story of James Hardin's career to a certain extent, right? Especially in the postseason, he has, you know, a big game, and then it looks like he's never played before in the two games that follow. Hardin had seven points on two of 12 shooting, and he was fumbling and bumbling the ball around like he was just learning how to dribble for the first time. It was embarrassing. I don't think the Clippers can win, just like the Heat had no shot without

Jimmy Butler. I just don't think the Clippers can win four out of seven against almost anybody without Kauai Leonard. I just don't think that'll happen. But Zander, my fault, my apollo, There is a game tonight that I would suggest you keep an eye on 76ers Knicks, Game 6 in Philly. By the way, Josh Harris, who owns the 76ers, he and the fanatic CEO, who is a shareholder in the 76ers, and the other 76ers owners, including David Blitzer, they purchased 2,000 tickets to tonight's game to keep Nick's fans from buying the tickets up. Nick's fans took over the arena in Philly for games three and four, and Harris bought up 2,000 tickets and is giving them out to first responders, health care professionals and others, 76ers fans, but to keep Knicks fans out of the arena. That story prompted several people to reach out to me to say, do you think Josh Harris will do that with his football team next year? to keep Eagles fans out of the stadium, to keep Cowboys fans out of the stadium.

No, I don't. And I don't think we should ask. I think $6 billion to take Dan Snyder out, we should just say thank you over and over again. You know what he should focus on is winning. Winning will change the crowd dynamic in Landover. Speaking of Landover and football stadiums, RFK Stadium is now available to be demolished. The National Park Service evaluated the potential effects on the natural, cultural, and human environment related to the demolition of Robert F. Kennedy Memorial Stadium, and they've determined, or it has determined, that the stadium can be demolished. I know it's an eyesore and it's been, you know, vacant and maybe even unsafe for five years.

But when they do demolish that stadium, we're going to do a whole show around the memories of that old barn. For most of us, many of you, me, our greatest sports rooting memories are from that spot. But can't build a new stadium on that land unless you demolish the old one. So perhaps some good news there. One more thing, the Nats had a really good win last night, 1-0-0. Trevor Williams and then four relievers, shutting out the Rangers to get back to 500.

They've actually been really impressive through the first 30 games. Well, they just lost the getaway game this afternoon in Texas, 6 to nothing to fall a game under 500. But still, last night, really impressive. Trevor Williams, three base. is loaded, no out jams he got out of. Scott Van Pelt

next right after these words from a few of our sponsors. This segment of the show brought you by Window Nation and their semi-annual sale. It's a big deal. Right now get 50% off all windows along with no interest for five years. Plus,

if you schedule a consult today, an appointment today, you'll get bonus savings on top of the 50% off all windows and no interest for five years. If you've got older windows, if they leak, if they get foggy when it's damp out or they get hot to the touch on a really hot day, your air conditioning bills are too high, your heating bills in the winter are too high, you're just paying bills, utility bills, that are higher than they should be. And by the way,

your home probably doesn't look as good as it should. Right now, Wind Donation's semi-annual sale is giving you an opportunity to change all of that. Replace your windows and you can do it by first scheduling a no obligation in-home estimate. Call them at 86690 Nation. Head to windonation. com. Mention my name and you'll get a free estimate so you've got nothing to lose. That free estimate will result in something that you can shop if you want to shop the deal. I don't think you'll find a better company with a better product or a better deal. If you've been thinking about new windows, give Windonation a shot. I promise you it will work out. 86690 Nation, Windonation.com. We are joined right now by my very good friend Scott Van Pelt from ESPN, the Scott Van Pelt Sports

Center every night with Stanford Steve. I want to talk draft with you to start here, but I want to ask you a question about just being at ESPN all of these years and being a part of this massive entity, which is draft coverage on ESPN. You're down here now. The show originates, for those of you who don't know, Scott's show actually originates from D.C. But still, your show follows up draft night. You've been around it. What's it like?

It's such a big deal. and I have such an appreciation for the astounding amount of work that goes into it on the production side. There are 460-some-odd cut-ups of video they do, so when they take some guard from Concordia State or whatever, here it comes. And, you know, Louis Riddick or Mel Kuyper, Jr., or Nick Saban, or Kirk Herb Street, or whomever is ready to just dive in and talk about. It's incredible. And so you sense the scale of it all when you see the hundreds of thousands of people,

and then you see the ratings that come out after the fact. It's just yet another reminder as if it's necessary that the single greatest attention getter in the country is NFL football. Yeah, it's crazy. You mentioned Sabin. He was on the broadcast with the college guys with Reese. Bill Belichick was on with Pat McAfee. What do you think of those two next year's analysts? They'll be great.

I know both of them a bit away from sort of coverage of sports, right? I've had time to be around them in settings where you get to see the very different men they are when they're not, you know, we're in a quarter of being asked questions about why you're on the third quarter. Like the football IQ is, as you would guess, just incredible. But then there's,

the thing about Belichick that blows people's mind is he's a charming, you know, guy with a smile on his face when he's talking to people that he signed up to talk with and is interested in the content. It's a, he'll be phenomenal on McAfee, guaranteed. And Nick will be great. will be great on game debt. I think he showed

a willingness to be critical. That's always the hard thing. Like, are you willing to be critical of teams and coaches and players? And I think that, you know, I don't think that Nick did it, you know, it was one guy, it was like MIMS, wasn't it the guy from Georgia, who he's like, you know, he didn't play a bunch in the game.

We played against the SEC title game or whatever was. He just made the point. Like, he didn't play. Like, he tapped out at some point. Don't know why. They'll both be great. Is Belichick just set for McAfee, or are we going to get him on a Sunday set or even in the booth? I'm not sure. I don't know what Belichick's role is going to be next year.

Do you? Nor do I. And I don't know for certain what he'll be doing with Pat other than what they kind of alluded to on draft night. That it sounds like maybe at Mondays you'll see him there. I don't know. I'm sure everyone's interested in having him in whatever role he's interested in. And that's just a matter of what the appetite is for signing up to do it. Yeah, I think we're just going to learn so much from the two of them,

especially in this first year where they really still know all of the players, all of the coaches, etc. I'm actually looking forward to them. what did you think of Washington settling in on Jaden Daniels? You can't see me. I'm just sort of shrugging. I hope it's right. And I mean, I talked about this with Steve on our podcast the other night about maybe just having some PTSD about trusting any quarterback that gets picked when you look at the 19 draft. And, you know, the only one that's still with the team that picked him,

Trevor Lawrence. And these are guys that came out of big-time programs, you know, fields. was at Ohio State. Jones was from Alabama. Obviously, Lawrence was at Clemson. they played in playoff games. They played big-time college football atmosphere. A lot of them.

And it just doesn't work. And in many cases, so I hope it works. All the commentary about the whole pop golf and Houston, like, whatever, it's just, it's just the fodder that's the fuel for what we all do. I mean, ultimately, he's either going to be able to do it, he can, and I hope he can, but I think anyone that says definitively that he or any of these quarterbacks that were taken, well, it's going to work in here is why. Well, you're guessing. You're guessing. And I'm just guessing if I say what I think will happen. So I just don't know.

I'm saying I hope that he's the guy. Yeah, I'm with you on that. But did you have a preference prior to the draft for Washington at two? Yeah, I think, I think of, once it was clear that the Williams wasn't going to be available, then of the two, that's, I like that better. But, I mean, if I'm picking, that's what I'd have done. But then you talk to people that are in the sport, and they're like, May's going to be the guy. And then there are other people like, nah, May's day, he's, like, when Belichick, just like, hey, his feet, footworks all over the place.

But, like, you know, that was a really interesting cut up where, you know, every, Every draft video is this five or six amazing plays that the prospect had. We could do just as interesting a 30-second clip of mistakes they made. And I found that interesting when Belichick was pointing at things that all these guys could clean up. But in the end, watching him at LSU this year, it was, you know, it was astounding. Then the question could be, well, he had two first round wide receivers on his team. how much of that had to do with him? Well, I don't know.

Panics was in the same boat. I mean, he had three guys that went the first three rounds at Y receiver. So, I mean, a lot of these guys are surrounded with the talent. And that's the direction that I'd have gone in the end. And I was, I guess, hoping they would, and they did. Somebody sent me this note, and I read it on radio today, and we took calls on it. And I'll just net it out. It was basically that,

Adam Peters, the new general manager, by picking Jaden Daniels, kind of put himself into a position where he can't be criticized or can't be praised because this person suggested that he was a consensus number two by the time we got to draft night. And it's almost like when Ernie Grunfeld, you know, this is for D.C. sports conversation purposes, when Ernie took John Wall at number one. I mean, there was nobody else to take. that was obvious, and that because he went with the guy that everybody believes should be picked

there, you can't praise him, you can't complain about it, it'll work or it won't, but that was the safe pick. What is your reaction to that? That sounds about right. I mean, there's a certain amount of slotting and grouping it takes over, and to this particular pick and prospect, that felt like that. that's what happened. And, I mean, it's just interesting, right? We're all allowed to grow. We're all allowed to get better.

I remember watching him. We played for Herm out of Arizona State and not thinking this was a guy that would evolve into what he became this year. But, you know, who he was playing for Arizona State, comparing that to who he was this year playing for LSU. It's kind of pointless to point it out other than just I didn't know then that he'd become this. But by the time we got to last Thursday.

night. Yeah, it felt like the group thinks said, well, that's just who you take here. And I mean, I don't know, there's this whole cottage industry of mock drafts and you know, how do you, how do your pick net out? Well, then, like, do we ever go, like we do with the grades are on draft that of how

close you came? Would we ever, do we ever go back and go, look, everyone was right, but none of them were right about whether they should have been picked there or not. And I mean, when it comes to quarterbacks, there's just so much intel through the years that say they don't get it right, no matter how much of the time and effort and all the resources they pour into it.

So, yeah, I guess that's probably it. Like, this was the pick that you were supposed to take, and now we find out if anyone was right. It's so funny that you just said that, because I had Warren Sharp on the show yesterday, and he does this thing where essentially he grades a draft, but it's not based on whether or not they got the right players or not. It's based on whether or not they got the right players at the right spot.

based on this consensus big big board that, you know, there's a couple of guys out there that create, you know, they go to hundreds of different evaluators and mocks and they create a consensus big board. And I asked him and I said, well, what does it look like for you three years after the fact? Like, and he said, to be honest with you, I've only been doing this for a little while. So I haven't really done an audit of, you know, what it looks like three years from now. Because three years from now, if the team got it all right, like every player right, but they picked three players too early and three players too late, I mean, who cares, really? Other than maybe draft value lost, you know, and you could have done something else with the draft spots? I don't know.

Nobody knows anything for three years. By the way, I think, you and I agree entirely on this whole, especially what we're doing, is creating draftic one that's just, who the hell knows? Nobody does. We don't have a clue. The teams don't know. They get it wrong 65% of the time. But real quickly on the question that I asked you,

I actually think Adam Peters is going to get praise or blame, you know, based on Jaden Daniels succeeding or failing, because I actually think there was a choice. I know that, you know, Schaefter was pretty sure. And a lot of the, you know, in the last week to two weeks, everybody really thought Daniels was the consensus number two, but there was a question. You know, Drake May was, you know, the selection of a lot of people. I mean, I know in our fan base, a lot of people preferred Drake May.

RG3 and 2012, Scott was absolutely the number two pick. It was him in luck. This draft, I think, after Caleb, Daniels May, you know, people thought McCarthy were all had positives, all had negatives. But anyway, what else from the draft stood out to you? I would assume what Atlanta did stood out. Sure, just because you've spent the money on cousins and zooming. You did that hoping it works. And if it works, and he's your quarterback for four years,

then you'd conceivably go into the fifth year of a guy you took eight, not having any idea if you're supposed to extend him or not. and it's just, I don't know, we certainly see year after year the number of quarterbacks who start games and you go, wait, what? This is this person starting an NFL game and in some cases they become all the team has to go with. So I guess we all understand the notion that having too much of that position is a hell of a lot better than not having enough.

but I didn't like most people seemed to understand it. And then I felt like there was a whole lot of twisting themselves into pretzels of people. They're like, no, no, I didn't like it at first, but here's why it's smart. Yes. Okay. Yes. I, I, that, that was odd to me. I think that the way that the depth at offensive line wide receiver and quarterback

seemed to push a great deal of depth into the second. round. It certainly seemed like there were a number of players at positions that you might not necessarily have gotten them in the second round. We're available as a result of just the runs on specific linemen and the Y-receiver talent. That really is what's become interesting to me, Kevin, is how that position, how ready guys are to contribute immediately that come from, in many cases, you know, big-time programs.

Ohio State's got a ton of them, and now Harrison just becomes the next. Presumably you plug right in and it is a thousand-plus-yard receiver right out of the gate. That's a trend where in the past three or four years in particular, it really feels like it's become emphasized. I want to go back to quarterbacks, actually, because you like me, and we talk about this all the time. We love Saturdays. We watch a lot of college football.

You talk to a lot of college football. of people in this sport. If we assume that out of the top six, just like the 2021 draft, but let's go with a slightly lower percentage and just say three of the six are not going to be on the teams that drafted them. Understood, we don't know anything. And it's impossible. But just gut feel based on what we both watched, you know, for an entire few years with some of these guys. Who are the three that are still on their teams? Three years from now. Still on the teams? Yeah, still on the teams three years from now. Three years from now. Williams. I'll go Williams, Daniels, Pennix. I mean, Pennix has to be on the team in

three years pretty much, right? Because in three years, it's the third year. It'll probably be his first year starting. Okay. That adds actually a unique wrinkle to this group because Pennix probably won't play for a couple of years. So maybe we should have said four, but whatever. It's just odd to use the first round pick in the National Football League like a developmental player as if you're taking somebody from Lithuania and the lottery in the NBA. They're just going to stash for a couple of years and then they're going to show up and like, oh, who's this guy? Here's the second quarterback question from the draft. Of the other QBs, and the next one didn't get selected until the fifth round, Spencer Rattler. I think a lot of people thought he might go earlier.

Rattler to the Saints, Jordan Travis to the Jets, Joe Milton to the Patriots, Devin Leary to the Ravens, Michael Pratt to the Packers. One of those guys ends up being a starting quarterback three years from now. Who is it? Travis, four state kids. Yeah, that's a good one. do you think if he hadn't broken his leg well they obviously would have been in the playoff but do you

where would he have been drafted I don't know it's interesting that I mean God knows that the NFL talked themselves into it you know like you ought to they don't typically have to squint too hard

to see it in somebody so the fact that that the injury knocked him this far down the grid indicates that he wasn't going to be, certainly a first day pick, but a second day pick, maybe. But I don't know, that that position is so overdrafted. The fact that he fell as far as he did was interesting to me.

I don't know if it was out of sight, out of mind saying the fact he couldn't test the way you want to. I don't know. But I mean, I felt like there were, I mean, you go back to that game with the guy the Washington took that. opening game of the year in Orlando. I mean, it was a duel between the two, and his team got the better of it. Right. All right. His defense was horrific, though, but that's another story.

Oh, my God, awful. So the NBA playoffs, it was funny the other day we were talking, and you said, you know, you had producers and stuff talking about the rundown, and it was all draft, draft, and at some point you said, can we actually work in a conversation? about a game that has an outcome. That's what you wanted to do. Can we talk about games with outcomes? Yeah, games that matter, right?

I mean, well, we can leave April baseball on the back burner for now, but I mean, we got Best of Sevens going on the ice and in basketball. So, yeah, we, you know, we got this. Right. So let's start with the two games, well, the game tonight that people are looking forward to. Nick 76ers. Who do you like and who do you like to win the series? I think the Knicks win the series.

I just, I think the one thing that's interesting in Legs pointed it out the other night, Brunson is spectacular, but they're so reliant upon him. Yep, they are. That it's problematic, whereas Philly's got two clear scoring options in Embed and Maxie. but I just I think New York they're clearly kicking themselves you just can't let series continue when you basically got them dead to write

but I mean they've got two to win one and the last ones at home up they got to have it I wouldn't shock me until we got it back there but they I just think the Knicks are better the game last night between the Clippers and the Mavericks what is it about James Harden that just you know that something like this is probably going to happen in a postseason game or series?

He was so god awful, a game after he was great. And we've seen that with him before. Why is that? I have no earthly idea. I mean, I've been here doing SportsCenter in some form or fashion for, you know, more than 20. years. And in that time with Hardin, whatever you've said about him, you being anyone out there, whether it was high praise that he's great, unique talent, a gifted score, an impactful player, you're right. And if you say he disappears at the worst possible time and is an absolute

liability and has horrific shooting nights in the most important times of the year, you're right. it's amazing to me how he can be all of these things. It happened last year at Philadelphia. It had 40-some-odd, what is, 43, I want to say it was in a game at the Garden against Boston. And then when push came to shove in the end, he was horrible. And Paul George was bad last night as well. I don't understand it. It's why the critics have all this ammunition.

and last night just adds another layer if you want to point to exhibit whatever this is. But as you said, look, the game before when it was winning time after that giant lead evaporated, he was tremendous. So I don't understand the lack of consistency in terms of his impact on these big games. I don't know. And when it's bad, it's really bad. Like there were moments last night where it looked like he couldn't dribble the basketball without losing it. is odd. Are you looking forward to Denver, Minnesota, as much as I am, and who do you like?

I like Denver just by default. I think that the two-man game they've got with Murray and Donuts, excuse me, with Murray and Yolkich, obviously, is ruthless. Porter Jr. is such a great score. I think the defensive Minnesota is going to really be stressed, but the defensive of Minnesota is exceptional. And this is a great, great coming out stage for Anthony Edwards. And it was you that made the point to me that I talked about, I think, on the pod

that this is a guy that's a superstar. But the world's a big place, right? They don't all listen to your pod or mine or your radio show or watch Sports Center. And the world at large that's more casual consumers of the sport are in for a treatise. they're just kind of learning about who Edwards is, because he's got it, man.

He's got that everything that a great player's got. And he's fun to watch, just the aesthetics of it all. So I like Denver just by default. I mean, it feels a little early for Minnesota to get over that hurdle. And through the years, there's always a bit of a learning curve. There's always a bit of a process. And when Edwards was all with me the other night, you know, I was asking about trying to close out Phoenix.

And he's like, I don't know. I've never done it. Don't ask me about closing out. I've never done. I have no idea what it is. Well, now they have. Now they finally won a series. But it's always instructive to me that that's, you've got to win four, man.

They won a quarter of the games that are required to be champions. Yeah. What's interesting about them, like, NBA fans understand that there's always this, there's this period of time where dues have to be paid and you've got to, you know, sort of progress, and then you've got to lose. and then eventually you win. But a lot of those, you know, whether it was Jordan or, you know, any of the other players that have come along that it took them a while,

you know, LeBron, this team, the Timberwolves team, is so good defensively. Like they're an exceptional team defensively. And I just wonder if that matters and maybe gives Anthony Edwards in his first swing at it a better shot of advancing. Yeah, that's fair. And you also have guys that aren't new to it in Connolly and Joe Bear. You have significant impact players at two key positions who've been through plenty of battles, just not, you know, at this stage with this group.

But that'll be really interesting. It'll also be interesting just from our business's perspective to see a playoffs advance with no LeBron, no staff, no Kevin Durant, you know, what kind of numbers do things do? Not that that's nothing other than just interesting feedback to me about what. what kind of consumption the playoffs get absent those older stars. But eventually, like, this is going to become, like, you're going to have to replace all those guys, you know, sooner than later. So that'll be just an interesting bit of information,

just, you know, for the sports media geeks out there. I think Minnesota, by the way, is the city, sports city, that's had the longest drought in terms of a championship. It may be even participating in a championship series, because Washington broke that with the hockey. It would have to be the twins, obviously, that did it. Exactly. All right.

Thanks for doing this, as always. I'll talk to you later. My pleasure. Thank you. This is a record, by the way. Just one of all the Kevin's listeners out there to know that when he reaches out, we'll just do 15 or 20. Normally about an hour, 10.

You say that all the time, and it's true, but it's not always my fault. No, I ramble. I'm not even saying you ramble, but it's because you are excellent and you get on a roll and I think everybody likes to hear it, so I don't want to cut it off. With other people, I want to cut it off much sooner than letting it run, you know. So there you. I'll try to do worse hit. No, I appreciate it. Yeah, try to do it.

Try to do a bad job. Have a harden-like existence. One really good appearance, and the next one not so good, and I'll cut it short. Today was excellent, by the way. What was wrong with Van Pelt today? He's just awful. Just a complete, he was just a conscientious objector. Well, you've done that before.

I haven't even run those ones. Have I? No, I'm kidding. All right, I'll talk to you later. Have a good time, my friend. All right, up next, we will talk about Tommy's Monday night event at Shelley's back room. with a former teammate of Ralph Samson's at UVA. We'll get to that right after these words from a few of our sponsors.

This segment of the show brought to you by our good friends at Shelley's back room, the best cigar bar in town, 1331F Street, Northwest, and the site of Monday night's Cigars and Curveballs event. Tommy's annual event, 6 to 8 p.m., I'll be there, Doc will be there. many of us will be there. You'll get to meet perhaps Mike Rizzo, Davy Martinez. The Nats are playing great baseball right now, and it's all for a great cause. It's in support of the D.C. Gray's a nonprofit organization whose mission is to provide opportunities for college baseball players to develop skills and give inner city youth a chance to learn the great game of baseball. Tommy will be back

from his trip to Ireland. He gets back, I think, Sunday night or Monday during the day. I don't know. He will be there Monday night perched in his chair overseeing the festivities. Joining me, though, is somebody who's very instrumental. He does all the work. Tommy just puts his name on it to a certain degree anyway. Chris Spira is the general manager of the D.C. Gray's

and is a good friend of the show and is a big part of the night on Monday night. First of all, you know, I've never asked you about this. I may have asked you about this, but you played basketball at UVA, right? Yes, that is correct. I was a, I'm old enough, Kevin, that the non-scholarship JV programs still existed. And so did you? And so, yeah, so I did that. Mark Ivoroni, you remember Mark, the 78 UBA grad, and then was our grad assistant,

my first year there in 1980. Ivaroni was the grad assistant, was the coach of the JV program. It was a very short season, 10, 12 games. And then when the season was over, there were a number of us who essentially hung around as practice players, the most notable of whom you probably remember him, was Kenton-Eadlin. and Jenton and I were in the same class. And so we started out together, and Kenton was a lot better than me.

And he earned a scholarship and ended up becoming a starter and was really the linchpin of the team in 1984 that knocked everybody and made it to the final four. Yes. So let me just be clear on this. You were a JV player. You were not on the varsity team with Ralph Samson, Jeff Lamp,

Jeff Jones, et cetera. After our JV season ended, I practiced with those guys. Oh, you did? You practiced with them. Didn't yet. We were essentially, there were three or four of us who, after the JV season ended, we were essentially practiced players. But still, that's awesome. You were practicing with, you know, a couple of those years, the number one team in the country. No, that's correct. It was an exciting time to be there.

Sometimes they let us sit on the bench. Sometimes they let us dress. Sometimes we sat behind the bench. Didn't get to travel that often. Everybody asked me if I got to go on the dreaded trip to Japan with the infamous lost to Shamanaut that was on the return trip. And, of course, everybody forgets that Virginia beat Houston in Japan.

And the loss to Shamanad was essentially the boondoggle part of the trip where they stopped in Hawaii and picked up this game. Huh. And they ended up losing. But everybody remembers the Shamanaut loss, and no one remembers the victory over a really good, you know, Guy Lewis team in Houston. Yeah. With Elijah Juan and Drexler.

But wait a minute. Was that the year, was that Ralph's senior year? Yes, that was it, that was the 82, 83. Yes, so that was the year that UVA played Georgetown at the Capitol Center. Correct. That was the battle against the Ewing. Yeah. I mean, that was a massive event.

I mean, you would never get that in college. basketball nowadays. I mean, back then, that game, I'm going to guess, was played in November or December. It was at the Capitol Center. It was a made-for, you know, massive TV event. It's Patrick against Ralph. Probably

number one against number two or something like that. I forget what the teams were ranked. But, yeah. I remember we were number one at that time, and Georgetown was certainly top ten. Yeah. And I don't remember who

won that game. Who won that game? Well, I remember, and it was Virginia. It was Virginia. Virginia won the game. Yeah, but the most notable thing was, my recollection is that Ewing goaltended the first shot of the game. Yeah. He was trying to send a message. Well, like he did in the championship game against North Carolina in 82, he goaltended the first two or three shots. Yeah. Yeah. And that was the year that you guys lost to Shamanad. And you're saying it was on a trip back from Japan. Correct. That Virginia and Houston were paid a bunch of money to go play a game in Japan.

And then the stop in Hawaii and the ensuing game against Shamanaut was on the back end of that trip. Got it. Wow. One of the biggest upsets in college basketball history, actually. I mean, it doesn't get the attention that, say, you. you know, the 83 final, by the way, NC State beating Houston, or Villanova over Georgetown gets.

But at the time, I mean, you know, Virginia is the number one team in America, and they lose to a team that nobody's ever heard of, and it was a Division 2 team, right? They were Division 2. Division 3. They might have been NAA. They might have been NAA. They might have been unaiated. It might have been NAA.

They might not have had an NCAA affiliation. I can't remember. It was a long time ago. The one thing about the 83 season, I always like to say that's the season where Virginia won the national championship because NC State wasn't going to make the tournament but then had a run in the ACC tournament and Perry Gannon stole the ball from after a post entry to Ralph that led to the winning basket and then they won the ACC championship that qualified them toward the tournament. and then in the round of 16, we lost to him again in the NCAA tournament. Well, that's a nice, you know, I guess after all these years, it's somewhat of a healthy way to look at it. I mean, the bottom line was NC State needed to win the ACC tournament in Atlanta that year. I'll never forget it, and they beat UVA in the final,

and they get into the NCAA tournament, and yes, was it the round of 16? I thought it was the Elite 8. It might have been at all. Yeah, it was the Elite 8 and NC State beat Virginia again ending what it was devastating. I mean, it was Ralph's opportunity to win a national championship. He went to the final four as a sophomore. Remember when you guys lost to North Carolina in Philadelphia in the semifinals. But it was kind of a foregone conclusion going into that tournament that Virginia and Ralph were going to make the big run.

and win the title. And the irony is you guys went to the final four the next year without Ralph. When there was controversy about Virginia getting in at all, my recollection was that was my fourth year. But Kenton Edelon, who I had referenced earlier, Kenton had broken an orbital bone and under his eye. And so he missed the beginning of the season, and we started out very poorly.

and then when he came back, we won a few games. I think we ended up regular season 17 and 11, if I remember it, right? And we're sort of a controversial at-large bid at 17 and 11. Yeah. But ended up beating Indiana in the round of eight. It was funny. I was watching a game a couple of years ago, and the former Indiana player Dan Dockich,

was doing the game. Right. And he was just filling time, whatever. It might have been a Virginia game, and it was likely that we were losing by a lot. So he was just filling time. And he was talking about that game, that elite eight game.

And he said, you know, he was quoting Bobby Knight. And he said, you know, Coach Knight after the game, he said, you know, we were prepared for Othell Wilson. We were prepared for Rick Carlisle. We didn't lose to them. We lost to Kenton bleep in Edel. because that was

Kenton Kenton scored I think the last five points of the game was he stole a ball stole a pass made a layup

made a free throw and that and that sealed the game so it was interesting that Kenton actually just fairly recently and very tragically passed away

and we had a memorial service for Kenton back in February we were very fortunate it was over the NBA All-Star break So Rick Carlisle, who's now the coach of the Pacers.

But Rick was there, Ralph was there, Ricky Stokes, Dan Merrifield, for five or six guys that they were able to come back. And Craig Littlepage, who was one of our assistant coaches. Coach Littlepage was there. And Coach Littlepage and Rick Carlisle spoke so eloquently. Kenton was one of my best friends because we started out, you know, as non-scholarship guys together. And then he was local here to the Alexandria area where I live.

And I think the people that were far less impressed with my comments than they were with Coach Little Pages and with Rick Carlisle. But be that as it may, it was good to see those guys, albeit in a sad circumstance due to the passing of one of our teammates. But that's not why you had me on. No, it's not. But I wanted to just add one quick thing because. Sure. like these, you know, this is in my, you know, wheelhouse, ACC basketball in the 80s.

And that year, when you guys beat Indiana to make the final four, and I just pulled it up because I remember you played Houston. What I did not remember is that you lost an overtime against that Houston team with, you know, Elijah won. I'll tell you the play, Kevin. Yeah. So we're up by one, and they're trying to get the ball to Elijah on, and Kent Evelyn is locking him up, and they cannot get the ball to Elijah on.

And somehow the ball ends up in a very rushed fashion because they couldn't run their play. It ends up in the hands of Larry Mishaw. Oh, he was a badass. Mr. Meehan, Larry Mishaw. But, but he was a bad ass. it was not part of the play that Coach Lewis had drawn up, apparently, and he rushes up a shot.

And it's an air ball. First year center, the Valley Hood recruit who was replacing Ralph, Olden Pollanies. Olden did not box out Cadillac Anderson, who got the air ball

and stuck it back to win the game by one. Wow. Well, I mean... In my mind, it was in Seattle. It was in Seattle. Yes, Seattle. Final score 49-47 in overtime. And the next game for Houston was the loss to Georgetown in the NCAA final. Yeah. That was the coach Thompson and hugging Fred Brown.

Exactly. Right. After Fred Brown had thrown the ball to James Worthy two years earlier, actually. Yeah. Correct. Wow. Well, what was it? One more. So what was it like to be around one of, I think, the greatest college basketball?

college basketball players of all time, Ralph Sampson. I will tell you this, that my first year, high school player, my father was in the military. I graduated from high school, from a Department of Defense High School in Heidelberg, Germany. You send a nice letter back to the school. I'm so old that my recruiting tape was actually a tape. It was a real-to-reel. And sent it back to several schools. At the time, Jim Laronnego is one of the assistant coaches.

Got a nice letter back at our APO address saying, hey, yeah, thanks for your tape, but no thanks. But we have this non-scholarship program and we want you to participate. And when you register, it will be disinformation. But you, wait, you were in high school in Heidelberg, Germany. That's correct. And was there good basketball there? My recollection is that there were at least 12 military bases that had athletic programs. And we would play them.

And then I also was able to play outside of our high school season for the university sports club, which the athletics in Europe are very, very different. It's more like recreational sports here in the United States. They're not tied at all to academic structure. And so like a youth sports program that you might have registered your kids for, they will continue to be your sports provider through high school age, through college age. So these sports clubs sort of serve the purpose of school. elastic sports here.

Got it. That's how they do it in most of Europe. It's unrelated to the academic system. Right. So I was able to play for my high school. Heidelberg Lions, Go Lions, and

then was able to play for the University Sports Club in their men's beat, which was up to age 20, I think it was 20 or 21. Again, this is 1979. It was a while ago. Yeah. So, all right, so you send your tape to UVA.

They don't have a scholarship for you, but they've got this non-scholarship opportunity. So continue. Correct. And I apologize. My son's dog is hanging out with us, so we got the dog going. That's fine. So, yeah, so the nice letter back from Coach Laranaga, who was an assistant at the time. Coach L

is a very nice letter and they follow through when I register I have a packet of materials that gives me information about where I'm supposed to be and when what I'm supposed to do

and so the backup center at the time is 1980 was a guy named Lou Latimore and Lou was a big guy about 610 and he comes by my dorm to get me co-said I had to get you

It was some fall workout. And at that point in time, Lou Latimore was the largest person I've ever seen in my life. Six foot 10, 260 pounds. And then we go into the, there was a, this building no longer exists, but there was an annex called The Cage,

which is next to the University Hall, another building that doesn't exist. And anymore. And we were going to work out there. You walk in and there is Ralph. and I'm six four and that dude is a foot taller I'm looking like his chin

yeah his neck I'm holy smokes and on that team Jeff Lamp was still there Lee Raker was still there and those guys were just big and strong they threw people around

and yeah I was one of them so anyway yeah it was definitely like not a you're not not in Kansas anymore, Toto. All right. We got sidetracked there, but that was interesting to me and maybe some of you.

That's a great era of college basketball, and UVA was front and center to that period of time, and Chris was part of the team. All right, let's talk about Monday night. Six to eight, Shelly's back room, 13th and F Streets, Northwest. It is a great night. One of my favorite nights of the year, Tommy does such a great job, and Chris is such a huge help in putting on this event. Tickets are available at D.C.grey's.com. You can get tickets at the door, too, if you decide last minute to come down. But why don't I let Chris kind of take over and talk a little bit about the event, maybe a little bit about D.C. Grays and some of the auction items that will be available on Monday night.

Well, Tommy, as you know, as your longtime partner, is beloved in the local athletic community and the relationships that he has, both among writers and broadcasters and athletes and executives. And it's amazing. And it's really through the force of his personality and his connections that he brings in these things. And there's all sorts of sign numbers. memorabilia. I believe I've seen a Juan Soto autographed bat. In prior years, we've had a great relationship with Dusty Baker and Dusty even after he left the Nationals sent us autographed materials. I would expect there'd be more Dusty Baker autographed memorabilia this year. Dusty's son, Darren, actually was a gray. He played for us. Dusty's last year as

as the manager of the team, Darren, was with us. I'm trying to remember there was a Joe Gibbs autographed autobiography. Yep, a Riggins picture, you know, of the run. There's going to be a lot there for people to bid on. And more than that, it's just going to be a great night. And that's really the fun of it, is the ability to, to see you, to see Doc, to see Tommy interact with those people.

Now, Kevin, you'll remember. And there are times when that interaction, and that's a little tension to it. You may remember a few years ago when we had one of the folks who bought a ticket, Mr. Rizzo was there and he bid on an autographed Mike Trout Team USA jurors, as I recall. Right. And Mr. Rizzo ended up being the prevailing bidder. And someone from the peanut gallery, someone who paid money and was at the event appropriately. There was nothing inappropriate about them being there.

But they sort of shouted out, well, I'm glad you got the jersey because you didn't draft him. Or something to that effect. That wasn't me, was it? No, no, no. Okay. Play an important part in this story. You may remember this. I, it was very, very awkward.

And, you know, Mike Rizzo was a guest. And, you know, he's not going to come to the event if he's going to get heckled by, you know, some guys. And you, you were standing pretty close to me in my capacity as the auctioneer. And I turned to you and I said, damn it, see, and I told you no angry callers. And everybody started laughing. And you were a really good sport about it. And, um, and you sort of put up with my nonsense. is you do each time you come to one of these.

But then when that person who had made that comment to Rizzo, each time he bid on something for subsequent auction items, when I called on him and said, $400 from, I didn't say the guy in the blue shirt or I said, angry call him. And the guy really kind of dug it if he was angry caller for the rest of the night. And then it was actually kind of nice because at the end of the evening, Mike Rizzo came up to me and he said,

I appreciate how he handled that. And again, you want, it's so cool that through Tommy's connections and the friendships that he's forged and the respect that he has in the community, that he can get these people to come, right? But we want them when they come to be, you know, not to feel threatened and not to feel like this is sort of open season on it. I thought that comment sort of crossed the line about not drafting Mike Trout. Well, the good thing about Rizzo, Mike is, first of all, he is fierce and competitive, but he's also got a great sense of humor.

And so he's always awesome on those nights. I hope he shows up Monday night because it's always good to catch up with him. And, you know, actually, now that you remember, you remembered one of those events and stories from it, the 2019 event, Davey Martinez showed up to the event. And the Nats, if you recall, that season really were struggling right around the time that he showed up. And I just remember somebody saying something like Davy, this was really brave of you to show up with the team having lost like four in a row or five in a row or whatever it was. He had a great sense of humor that night. And, of course, that was the year they turned it around.

They started, I think it was 19 and 31, something like that. And ended up in the world series. They were always referenced the 19 and 30. Yeah, exactly. But at the time of the event, when he came, they were 17 and 28. Is that what it was? Yeah. It's not, that's not what turned it around.

It was coming to the D.C. Gray's event that turns the season around. No doubt. No doubt. But an interesting story about that night, Kevin. Yeah. is that Davey was there. He had Mike Rizzo was there. But Davey had two of his nephews with him.

And as you know, at the events, I always have a bunch of old jerseys and tics and stuff that we give away. Right. And I had given jerseys to his two nephews, who, you know, their teenage kids who love jerseys. And they didn't, you know, I'm sure they have, their uncle has given them official MLB jerseys, but these were cool and they liked them.

So Davey comes up to me and he says, you got another jersey? I'm thinking, what the heck? Why on earth would the manager of the nationals want a D.C. gray's jersey? And he says, I figure I could just take it back to the clubhouse and I can just get the guys to sign it. But of course, you know, they're 17-20.

So they win. And then the next season is the, you know, pandemic shortens season, and everybody sort of forgets about it. But then Davey tells Tommy, hey, I got that jersey. All the guys signed it. And so that became an auction item. I believe it was last year, a gentleman bought that. Right, I think it was.

For a significant amount, he was a great fundraiser for it. So a little bit about the gray is just to sort of fill in the blanks for some of your listeners. Yeah, please. We don't charge admission to our games. And when we run our youth programs for, which are targeted for youth in the underserved areas of a community, where we sort of give them the opportunities you typically associate with the suburbs, you know, paid coaches and the ability to go to tournaments and things like that, we fund all that. And we fund it all through donations.

And so the money that we raised through Tommy's event is crucial, not just to putting the college team on the field, but more importantly to being able to help fund those programs for for young athletes in Ward 7 and Ward 8 and other areas where they may not get the same opportunities. One of the things that's, and look, my son was a Division 1 baseball team, but we had the means to do the things that, you know, send the kids to showcases and having a pitching instructor. you know, playing on a travel team and the type of things that kids do to prepare themselves to play collegiately. And kids from underserved communities don't get those chances. And what we hope to do through the graves is to try and create a little bit more infrastructure that doesn't cost so much for them so that they can see what that's like and see if they can generate, you know, a love for baseball. Right.

So they can go on and get a chance. We actually had two years ago, we had a young man who had come up through our youth program and then had gone on to play collegiately and came back and played for the collegiate grades. So being able to see that circle, that cycle get completed. A young man who plays for our youth program, earns a spot on the college roster, and then comes back and plays for our collegiate team, was just so rewarded. It's awesome. DCGrays.com.

to find out even more about this incredible organization. And Monday night, 6 to 8 p.m. Shelley's back room, 13th and F Streets Northwest. The donation is $100. It includes three cigars, appetizers, and an auction of sports memorabilia, game tickets, and some of the merchandise and things we've been talking about. And the bar will be open.

It is a cash bar, but it will be open. And we will be there pretty late if memory serves well. It's a fun night. You can get tickets by going to DCGraise.com, but you can purchase tickets at the door or two if you just want to show up. Chris, thanks. Appreciate it. Kevin, Kevin, thank you for doing this,

but also thank you just overall for your generosity towards our program. You've been a huge supporter individually and through the pod. and I can't thank you enough for the support that you've given us, and it means a great deal to both the organization and to me personally. Well, if Tommy weren't a part of it, I think I'd even be more generous. Thanks, Chris. Appreciate it. Part of your contribution is putting up with him again.

See you on Monday night. Take care. Thank you. All right. That is it for the day. Tomorrow, Chris Cooley will be on the show. he's got a film breakdown of Ben Senate, the tight end from Kansas State.