The Kevin Sheehan Show - Super Bowl Scraps; Way Too Early Skins' Pick

Episode Date: February 5, 2019

Kevin and Thom opened the show talking about the Super Bowl, the Patriots' dynasty, and the SB TV ratings. They also talked about the boycott of the Super Bowl in New Orleans and if their fans are taking things too far. They discussed the "Way Too Early NFL Power Rankings" and the Redskins' place on that list. Wizards and Bryce Harper conversation on the show too. <p> </p><p>Learn more about your ad choices. Visit <a href="https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices">podcastchoices.com/adchoices</a></p> Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You want it. You need it. It's what everyone's talking about. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Now here's Kevin. You're listening to The Sports Fix. All right. I'm here. Aaron is here. And Tommy is back from another vacation. How are you? Look at my arm. It's a lot better now than it was. I saw you tweet that picture out. What happened? Well, I gave choices on Twitter. That's the first Twitter poll I've ever done. Really? Because you've done a lot on Twitter. Yeah, but it's amazing you haven't done a poll before. I've never done a Twitter poll because I don't generally care what people think. That's true.

So, but I gave a Twitter poll between the choices were fighting, drinking, typing, or lifting my suitcase. Lifting your suitcase is probably how you got it done. Yeah, but fighting would have been the best story. Well, you have that Irish piece of you in you, and I know that. And I was in New Orleans and I was drinking. I know, but you know what? You're also on vacation.

And so you confrontations. even if the guy is a total a hole isn't something that I would guess you were looking for. And you were with Liz. Yeah, I was with my wife too. Now, now, somebody could have said something to Liz that was inappropriate that got you fired up. We had a great time in New Orleans.

It was a great time, but, uh, but no, this was just lifting my suitcase. Okay. Well, you,

uh, very uneventful. You, you have some ugly looking bruises. Is that what happens when you get to your age? Yes. Yeah. You're about to get one.

Uh, I bet. I am. All right, I wanted to start the show, first of all, by saying that this show is presented by Window Nation. If you're in the market for Windows, call 86690 Nation or go to WindowNation.com. That's 86690 Nation or Window Nation.com and tell them we told you to call. I got this tweet that I wanted to read because it was one of several that expressed the same sentiment about my show yesterday, about the Super Bowl. It came from Kevin on Twitter. Kevin, you thought the game was riveting?

You are a sucker, and then there are seven exclamation points. Did you see your sacred TV ratings? We're Super Bowl in years. 13 to 3, 13 to 3, 13 to 3, and it just trails off. That's the tweet. That from Kevin on Twitter. You can tweet me at Kevin Sheen, D.C. You can tweet Tommy at

Tom Leverro, that's a T-H-O-M-Livero. And Aaron, our show page, which we should probably start pointing people towards, is at Sheehan podcast, right? Correct. Yeah, we don't talk about that enough. And Aaron tweets updates on the show from that page, so follow us at Chian podcast. And do you have a Facebook page too? We do have a Facebook page as well for the show that Aaron manages also.

First of all, I don't think I ever referred to the Super Bowl yesterday's riveting. I've never heard you use the word riveting. Actually, I think I've used the word before, but I didn't call it riveting yesterday. I admitted that most wouldn't enjoy it, and most would deem it to be very forgettable. 13 to 3, 3-0 and half-time. I get it. And the TV ratings proved it, Tommy. Lowest rated Super Bowl since 2007 was the Super Bowl on Sunday.

So most did not think it was a great game. I did enjoy the game, and I want to get your view on. on it in a moment. I thought it was what I called it yesterday. This would be something that you would write perhaps in a column. I thought it was a masterpiece of the mind. And I don't hate the Patriots like so many. I'm in awe of the Patriots. And you know, the other part of this thing, and I spent a little bit of time on this yesterday, the game was close. You know, it was 3-3. I get it, but it was tied up in the fourth quarter. There was drama in the Super Bowl.

What else do you want? I mean, it wasn't like it was a game marred by mistakes. You know, it wasn't a poorly played game. No, it was not like the Super Bowl five, the Colts. Cowboys. Jim O'Brien. Jim O'Brien field goal, which was filled with mistakes and interceptions and fumbles

and just a bad. played Super Bowl. This was not like that. Look, I kind of agree with you in the sense that I was marveling at what Bill Belichick had done. Well, you had just written the column on his best Super Bowl whenever, which is when he was a defensive coordinator in 1990.

And this, this is, this goes, you know, if they put that game plan in the pro football hall fame, this should go right next to it. I mean, I'm marveling at the second most potent offense in the league. In NFL history. Being held to zero points in the first half and three points for the game. So I'm like you, I'm marveling at what Belichick is doing more than paying attention to what the Rams were unable to do. Right.

Now that said, Tony Romo, who we all agree is a very sharp analyst, had these words to say. This is hard to watch. Did he say that? Yes, he did. I quoted him in my post-Super Bowl. I didn't hear that. This is hard to watch. Eight punts?

It's hard. That's hard to watch. No, the punting thing, he was definitely, I actually thought he was having fun with it, which I thought it was a pretty decent broadcast. I thought it was a very good broadcast. Again, I'm a big fan of his, and I thought he did a good job. But it was right. At some point, it was hard to watch.

You know, the TV ratings, obviously, they were affected by the game. But I might want to point out to everybody. that the TV ratings for the Super Bowl have dropped every year for the past five years. They've been going lower and lower. Part of that is they still haven't gotten their arms around people watching the game in a way other than traditional TV. I don't necessarily think less people are watching the Super Bowl.

I just think, again, the frustration of being able to measure a true number is becoming more difficult. Since 2015, the Super Bowl ratings have dropped every year. Yeah. And actually, what else was a problem? Yeah, since 2015. What else was a problem? The ad revenue was down from last year, almost $20 million, $25 million, and $40 million

from the year before. Again, that money is going someplace else, maybe to digital, maybe to YouTube. I mean, there's so many choices when it comes to viewing, when it comes to sponsorship, when it comes to advertising, that it's hard to measure success anymore. You know, I just pulled up the page that lists every Super Bowl with television ratings. Do you know what the highest rated Super Bowl of all time was this? I didn't know what it was. This surprises me.

It was the January 1982 Super Bowl between the Bengals and the 49. Really? Yeah. Was that a bad, I mean, because the Bengals got, wasn't that a bad weather? No, it wasn't a bad weather. That was the Ken Anderson. They had beaten the chargers in the bad weather. Yeah, the, yeah.

Yeah, in the minus 59 windchill game at Riverfront. So maybe was there bad weather, not at the Super Bowl. That Super Bowl was in a large part of the country then to keep people indoors? Well, remember that Super Bowl was the Super Bowl in Detroit, wasn't it? Wasn't it? Wasn't it the Detroit Super Bowl, the first one? It may have been. I think it was.

But my point is, you know, bad weather will keep people indoors. Yeah. And it was the first time a Super Bowl was held at a cold weather city. It was very cold, snowy weather in the Midwest and Northeast. Well, there you know. So people stayed home. Yeah. Everybody stayed home and watched football that day.

That makes sense. Right. I wouldn't have guessed that game, though. No. I would have guessed a game with the Cowboys back. You know, also, you've got to look back at that time. the highest rated Super Bowls. Actually, you know, 2015, and you said since 2015, they've gone down.

But the 2015 Super Bowl, which was the Super Bowl between the Patriots and the Seahawks, is the... That's almost 50, I think it was. What do you mean almost 50? Super Bowl 49. Yeah, I know that. But it was that, that's the fourth highest rated Super Bowl watched of all time. Yeah. So we've had a really...

recent Super Bowl that is in the top five of all timers. But you really do have to go back, you know, a lot of them are in the 80s and 70s when you didn't have a lot of options. Right. You know, a lot of options. But anyway, the... So, I mean, it wasn't a good game. But again, if you, and we agree, I have a tremendous admiration for the Patriots and what they've done. I am in awe of Bill Belichick's genius. and not just the genius of his football genius, but the genius of putting on this persona in public of a guy who can't be the same guy in private.

He just can't be that guy. I mean, to some extent maybe he is. But he isn't. We've heard people that know him, and I say know him, but from people like Tony and Mike Wilbon and people in Scott, Scott has spent time with Belichick before. They say he is an incredibly engaging, smart, interesting, good guy. I'm in awe of the persona.

It's almost like a wrestling character that he's come up with for all these years. Well, it's, you know, from the get-go, I think, look, it may have developed into this persona, but from the get-go, the intent was competitive advantage. He never wanted to give away anything. Yeah. Anything. Yeah. I mean, no distractions, no noise.

nothing but the process that leads to winning. If the game had been 10-10 going into the fourth quarter had gone to overtime at 13 to 13, would it have been a memorable game? I'm just curious at to what point would the, Tommy, this was not what I would call a great defensive game. It was a great defensive strategy game, as we've just described. And that's why we're in awe of Belichick and the Patriots. particular, but Wade Phillips had a great day too. But, you know, it was the fact that it was,

you know, the score was so jarring in terms of how low it was. Like three to nothing and then three to three going into the fourth quarter and it's setting all of these records as you're going throughout. You know, it's the second lowest scoring half. The lowest scoring in Super Bowl history through three quarters. The only Super Bowl in history that didn't have a touchdown through the first three quarters. But what if it had been 10-10? Like what if each team? team had scored a touchdown and it went into overtime at 10-10 or 13 to 13. I think we weren't that far away, I guess is my point, from having it perceived much differently. You know, you sound like Broussela and talking about the Redskins being close. Kevin, nobody, you're right,

it was one pick six away from being a Rams, for the Rams being ahead for most of the game. Well, the Rams were driving. You had a game that was tied and then it was 10. a one score game. I'm just saying if it had been 1710 and the Rams were driving late or it had been 13 to six and they're driving late, I think a close game in the fourth quarter of the Super Bowl, I actually felt it in the moment to be more dramatic, I guess, the most did. But I don't think anybody had it. I mean, I actually, I heard Tony Romo again actually remind people, you know, I mean,

one play and the Rams are ahead in this game. I don't think people ever had a sense that it was as close as the score was. I just think people watching it thought, well, I mean, the Rams can't do anything. They just can't do anything. And inevitably, and it's almost like the fourth quarter being a championship fighter in the championship rounds. They know the fourth quarter usually belongs to Brady and Belichick. So there was almost like a sense that, you know, that even though it was a three nothing game, it seemed like it seemed like a massive thing for the Rams to overcome.

It just never seemed close, even though it was very close. I disagree. I never felt like it was one-sided. And statistically, it actually was for much of the game one-sided. I never felt that it was one-sided. I always felt that the Rams had a legitimate chance to win the game. And, you know, when they were driving down 10-3, you know, you had a touchdown pass, dropped.

Yeah. That would have tied it. Yeah. You had a terrible penalty against the center. John Sullivan in a 3-3 game in the fourth quarter off of Gurley's best play of the day. And we got to talk about Todd Gerling. We do have to talk about it because it still has not been explained yet. I have not read any explanation as to why.

But I wanted to continue on this subject a little bit more because you did write a column last week about Belichick and maybe his crowning achievement in a Super Bowl, which was what they did to another all-time offensive football. team, the Buffalo Bills, in the 1990 season, 1991 Super Bowl. And I said yesterday that I didn't find it to be a great defensive game, like one of these games. And I, you know, that I love defensive football. I love hard hitting. I hate that it's being legislated out of the game. I thought the call on Roby Coleman early in the game on that hit behind the line of scrimmage was a terrible call. I think that's the thing that threatens the game more than anything else. From my standpoint, is, legislating that kind of play out of the game. But that's a different subject, and we've talked

about it before anyway. But the greatest defensive game ever, and it's one of the greatest postseason games of all time, is the season that you wrote about. And that was the NFC championship game that year when the Giants beat the 49ers at Candlestick 15 to 13, a game that featured one touchdown and seven field goals and two great football teams. The Giants, the 90 Giants and the 49ers of 1990. The 49ers were 14 and 2. The Giants had Jeff Hostelert, quarterback. Because Sims got hurt right near the end of the season.

Against the bills, actually. Against Buffalo, exactly. Good memory. The game in the regular season that those two teams played on a Monday night in early December, seven to three, the 49ers beat the Giants. was a riveting game. You can have these low-scoring games be compelling. And I'm not trying to push Sunday on anybody. I enjoyed it for the strategy, for Belichick, all the things we've talked about. It was not a game that was, I understand why it will be forgettable. Giants Niners in 1990,

that's unforgettable. That's an unforgettable football game. Heavyweight matchup. I mean, the 49ers were were a super bowl, a multi-super Bowl champion. The Giants had already won a Super Bowl three years before. The Rams are still the new kid on the block. That's true. And they were going against the all time. I'm talking about the type of game, though. I'm talking about the type of game.

But the perception of a score of the 49ers Giants is going to be different than the perception of the score of the Patriots Rams because while both teams in the 49ers Giants game, you know, have a certain stature, the Rams don't have that stature. I mean, really, they don't. They've been around for five minutes in terms of the Los Angeles team, in terms of Sean McVeigh's team. You just reminded me, too, the expectation of Sunday's game was a shootout.

You know, you had a 56 over-under number. You know what the over-under number was in the 49ers? Giants game. I went and looked this up earlier this morning. What? 36 and a half. Really? In that NFC title game. Well, they'd played a 7 to 3 game a month earlier. Yeah. But I've seen great, and all of you have seen

great defensive games that you remember. And that one in 1990 is not just one of the greatest defensive games of all time. It's one of the greatest postseason games of all time. It was a great defensive game played cleanly. I went back and looked at this early this one.

One turnover in that game. Really? And only like, I think there were 10 total penalties in the game. And really the turnover was when the 49ers were running the clock out, up 13 to 12 late, and LT got the strip of Roger Craig. They recovered it. And that set up Matt Barr's fifth field goal, which was the game winner that sent them to the Super Bowl. You know, you mentioned, by the way, the 80s and the 90s, was there a better era for the NFL?

I don't think. The 70s were pretty good. The 70s were really good. Steelers and Cowboys. I mean, you know, I was talking, you know, I was on with Andy yesterday. We filled in for Chad Duke yesterday afternoon. And Andy was talking about how the Patriots, in, you know, the 85 Patriots that went to the Super Bowl and got hammered, that the Patriots had pretty much stunk up until then. I had to tell them.

I said, Andy, the Patriots of the 70s were a tremendous team that kept running into the Steelers. the Raiders. That's right. But I mean, Steve Grogan, Raymond Claiborne, you know, Leon Gray, John Hanna, those were great Patriot teams. No, the Patriots were a, were a double-digit winning team. Mosy to Tupu? Yes. Yes. So for much of the 70s. Tommy, one of the most controversial games of the 70s. And I mentioned this after the Saints Rams' NFC championship game when I went down the list of other very controversial calls or no calls that ultimately decided who went to the Super Bowl. Not all of them were in the championship game, but the year the Raiders beat the Vikings

in the Super Bowl and ended up finally beating the Steelers in the AFC championship game. In the divisional round, they were trailing the Patriots late in that game at the Coliseum at Oakland Alameda County Stadium. They were trailing 2117. a fourth down place. Stabler got hit through an incomplete pass and it was a legitimate hit. It was not roughing the passer. It wasn't late.

It got flagged on Ray Hamilton and the Raiders took it in, got a first down, took it in for the and they ended up going on to playing in the Super Bowl and winning the Super Bowl that particular year. So my Patriots didn't, no, you're right. The Patriots seem for the 70s are good.

The 70s were great. The 70s were great. But you know, for the... But if you're a red Well, the 70s were good if you're a Redskins fan, too. They were good for the Redskins. Yeah, but the 80s, I think the 80s and the NFC were much better. Oh, yeah. And 80s and 90s, because the Cowboys and the Vikings and the Rams and the Redskins were good in the 70s, but they weren't the Steelers, dolphins, and Raiders.

No. No, they weren't. You're right. You're right. The AFC dominated the 70s. The AFC dominated the 70s. And then the 80s, when you had the 49ers, the Redskins, the Bears, the Jews. Giants. Cowboys were still good. The Rams were good. You had an incredible decade. And then,

you know, Philly got decent, you know, here and there. Anyway, so, oh, the other thing on the TV ratings, did you see New Orleans? What happened in New Orleans? They had like half, basically half of the national ratings. New Orleans last year is a city in a Super Bowl last year that It's a football town. That featured the Eagles and the Patriots. All right. Last year, the Super Bowl did a 53 rating in the city of New Orleans in the New Orleans market. This year, the Super Bowl did a 26.1.

They boycotted the Super Bowl in that city. Well, did you see the front page in the New Orleans Times Picayune? I did not. It's all white. The whole front page is all white with bold face type in the middle of the page. Super Bowl question mark? What Super Bowl? That's their front page.

That's the whole front page. You know, this thing's gotten out of hand. Well, no, Kevin, I don't think it has gotten out. Oh, it's ridiculous. I think you underestimated the impact. It's embarrassing. No, it might be embarrassing the people who underestimated the impact of the call. I'm not saying that the call wasn't bad.

The call was terrible. It's a terrible blown call. The reaction to it was ridiculous. I think it's fair and legitimate. Oh, come on. Hey, Drew Brees. Breeze was, I'm totally paraphrasing here right now. I just read something.

where Drew Brees said his biggest gripe was how the league stayed silent for so long. Silent? What are you talking about? They did. Al Riveron called Sean Payton after the game. Publicly. Oh, who cares? Oh, it was terrible.

Kevin, give me a break. The league was embarrassing. The league, the league. And Goodell was embarrassment. The league called Sean Payton after the game to apologize to say they got it wrong. And that story was made public in five minutes after the game ended. Kevin, the league showed a lack of leadership by not publicly. I hate Goodell.

I think he's a moron. This thing was terrible. Totally exaggerated. Oh, absolutely. I know you, look, you've carved out that little island for yourself, and you're going to stick to it, even when all the islands around you are saying, this was horrible. This was egregious, and it deserves all the reaction it's getting. It was one of the worst blown calls in NFL history.

It's the kind of call that. It was the kind of call that sparks all of these conversations. We saw it after the Music City Miracle with people in Buffalo threatening to sue and bring legal action against the league and the whole thing for the travesty of the Music City miracle. We've seen it before. It's not as new. It's not this unique experience. I'm not going to debate the fact that this particular call was a blown call was about as bad

a blown call as you'll ever see. I'm not debating that. I'm just debating that the reaction is just over the top. And, well, number one, it's not totally unique. Number two, it's gone on a little bit too long. It's a little bit too much. And the complaints that the league didn't respond in an appropriate way, and I'm the first to bash Goodell in the league on stuff like this. I think they get it wrong 95% of the time. In what instance, in an NFL game, Have you ever heard that before the coach even leaves the locker room after the game, the league has called him to apologize? I've never heard it before.

Publicly, Kevin, that league needed to speak. By who? The league? Well, Sean Payton was the first that made it. But who? Did the league do it? Yeah, the league said that they called Sean Payton. No, that where's the public statement by the league that says they called Sean

Peyton and apologize? Once it was made public by. Sean Payton and the discussion was wow They didn't abdicate their responsibility to speak to a decision that the whole country saw. Okay, what did you want them to do? You've got to address it. You've got to say this is a horrific call

and we are going to put something in place to try to minimize these calls from ever happening again. Simple as that. Okay. So let me back up. Did you find it unique that the call came so quickly from the league with an apology to the head coach and to the owner of the Saints. It means nothing

unless the league speaks publicly. It means nothing. You mean the fact that it was immediately made public by the head coach. I think there was something in there were Al Riveron or somebody else. Nobody. Nobody from the league. I'm going to go find I think there was more league

reaction than just utter silence. But the silence the true silence would have been had they never addressed it with the team that was that felt the sting of a terrible blown call. But it went beyond the locker room. Didn't you just see what happened in New Orleans?

And they didn't owe a public comment? You know what? That's why I think it's an overreaction. I can tell you this. If I were a New Orleans Saints fan, well, let me put myself into their shoes. I would have been so pissed. And I would have been calling for everybody's head

had it been the Redskins in a similar situation. There's no chance in hell you would have gotten me to boycott the Super Bowl. ridiculous. You're just depriving yourself. Like I don't, I never understand self-buttonishment. I think those people woke up Monday morning feeling pretty good about their decision. Okay. Well, you know what? For most people, they didn't miss, I wish they had missed 40s. I wish they had missed 38, 35 in overtime. I do. Like an all-time Super Bowl. I just, I'm going to go back and I'm going to look to see exactly where the league responded and how they responded. I know Goodell didn't respond until the Super Bowl press conference.

Which is the only person who counts. In an official, you know, league release necessarily, but I do believe that their head of officiating was involved in some sort of comment publicly. After the game, he said basically he was mealy mouth and said he really didn't see it. No, Al Riveron called Sean Payton. Yeah, but speaking to reporters, a pool reporter? Okay. It was pathetic. All right, whatever.

You know what? To me, whatever. If the league didn't respond and they were totally silent, I still think the reaction was ridiculous. And the thing that I think bothers me more than anything else as a longtime NFL fan, I just hate when people make it out to be they, this is the first time it's ever happened. And we were the ones that were screwed more than anybody else. Go talk to Minnesota Viking fans about Drew Pearson pushing Nate right in the back and catching the Hail Mary pass. Okay, but Kevin.

Cowboys went on to the Super Bowl that year. It shouldn't have gone on to the Super Bowl. Kevin, the point is, and this is why you and every NFL fan should be saying today, I am a Saints fan. And this is why, because you just mentioned some of the other teams, some of the other plays that have gotten, fans have gotten screwed over, teams have gotten screwed over. You don't change that unless you push the envelope,

unless you go so over the top that the reaction can't be ignored. Well, my position on this is the same. If you just accept it, in terms of what comes out of it. As business as usual, then it will always be business as usual. My reaction is the same today as it was the day after the NFC championship game in terms of what comes next. If they put rules in that allow teams to challenge subjective penalties, I'm not going to be overly pissed about it. And if they don't, I'm not going to be upset about it either. I would prefer that they don't.

I'm saying you don't give the teams the options. These are decisions that are made higher up. Without Riveron? You want to trust that moron? Well, you've got to come up with the sit. Again, I'm not going to just throw my hands up and say, oh, we can't do anything because you're not smart enough to come up with a system with a fail safe to keep something like that, or at least to minimize something like this from happening.

And it's not a challenge that you give the coaches because they'll abuse. it. Well, you limit their ability to abuse it, obviously. With a maximum number of opportunities to challenge something like that. You just don't do it. It's not their decision. Well, this is how this should have went. Somebody representing Goodell at that game should have called down to the field and said, stop play right now. Oh my God. Got Goodell on the phone and said, this is what happened. and it later it took 10-15 minutes. Look, if I was Sean Payton,

Sean Payton should have pulled his team off the field. Oh, my God. Really? I mean, he didn't even kick up a fight. Can you a, now that would have made the game memorable. Should have pulled his team off the field. That would have got a call to the commissioner. Boy, that's, you know, that is.

That's what I would have done. Pulled my team off the field. You just walked right off the field. Off the field. And you know what would have happened? Your team would have been forfeited by the league. Yeah, yeah, sure. They're going to forfeit the NFC championship game.

No, Goodell's on the phone, looking at the call, and that call is reversed. I'm going to tell you this. First of all, I don't trust Goodell or anybody to do anything the right way much of the time. But if I'm in charge of the league and if I'm the other 30 owners, 30 owners watching a game, and somebody pulls their team off the field for any other, for any reason other than, like, safety, like you're in a road environment and it's getting out of control and people are throwing bottles at your players, whatever. One of those situations and you pulled your team off the field, I'd make sure to forfeit that

team because it would never happen again. It would be the first and last time it happened. And it would be an absolute, you're done, the game is forfeited, the Rams are going to the Super Bowl, we're not even going to play in overtime. And yeah, the fans are going to have a problem with this. But I think a lot of people would understand. Oh, my God. Kevin, the credibility of the league would have been damaged almost beyond repair.

By Sean Peyton, taking his team off the field. No, by your reaction. No, that would be my reaction. I would make sure it would never happen again. And, you know, that would be the point of pulling the team off the field. I would make sure. To make sure. To make sure.

To make sure. Let me be clear on that. Not that the call would never happen again. Those are human beings making calls. But if Sean Payton took his team off the field, you know, stop with this human being stuff and humans make mistakes. That would be, that would be a precedent setter for me. It would happen one time, one time only, never again forfeit the game.

Now, back to what you were saying. Of course there is a way to figure something out. I'm not suggesting that because it's a subjective call, because it's human judgment, which apparently you don't like that the way that that was described. I'm not suggesting that there's not a fix in here, that there's not an answer. Of course there's an answer somewhere. I just personally, to use your favorite expression,

I just don't think the juice is worth the squeezing. Because I think what will happen is you're going to end up with more controversy on some of these calls than less controversy. You're going to end up with calls that non-calls that become calls that were subversy. objective and have varying opinions, and I just don't want it. I'm not going to have a problem. I'm not going to watch less football if they put that in there. I just don't think it's necessary.

I think what we saw in that particular game was it's not a once in a lifetime. It's a, you know, we've seen it a half dozen to a dozen times over the last 50 years of NFL football. That's pretty rare, though. Somebody got really screwed. But that's rare. Yes, it's rare. That's why I wouldn't really address it that much. And by the way, every single time it's happened, every single time it's happened, the game's grown in legend.

These games have become legendary and unforgettable. It costs people. It costs people money. It costs people jobs. It's never hurt the league. It's never hurt the league. But it costs people money. It costs people jobs.

And it costs people their legacy. Well, I just would like to hear Sean Payton and Drew. You know what, you know what Drew Brees should have done? He should have played better. He sucked in the NFC championship games. Look, I don't want to argue this again. What? But did you hear what I said?

I don't want to argue this again. Okay. Oh, really? Okay, good. Well, you just ensured that this is going to continue for another 10 minutes. But Sean Payton should have ran the ball three times and kicked the field goal. Oh, God. You know, you know what?

On that particular point, you know, over the years, we've known each other and we've worked with each other for 12 years now. Yeah. Something like that. when it comes to things that I believe you to be expert in, baseball, a lot of different things that you're expert in, you know what I usually do? I just sort of sit back and I ask questions and I listen and I'm like, I learned something. And then for some reason over the years, when it comes to the very few things that I might be expert in, you argue and debate it all the time. And I'm just going to tell you, is this a marriage argument or what? Why? I don't know what it is. This is a marriage argument here, buddy. But it really, over the years, like, there have been times when I've left the studio and I've been like,

you're dead wrong. And for whatever reason, like, there are only a couple of things, you know, basketball and basketball strategy and game clock management is one of the things that you know I know. and I am telling you in that particular instance that you are wrong, and I laid out the reasons you were wrong, and you still just will not. Because you didn't lay out the reasons why I was wrong. Yes, I did.

I mean, your premise is the Rams are going to, with a minute left in the game, the Rams are going to march 35, 40 yards down the field and kick a field goal. Yeah, 30 yards, they would have been. Okay. Absolutely. I mean, because the alternative that they wouldn't do that or that they might fumble or they might get penalties and get driven back or any of the other possibilities apparently don't exist.

No, no, no. Look, I'm not suggesting that it's not a debatable topic. You know, we're going back in time here. You realize that? We've gone from the Super Bowl to the NFC championship game. We're going to go to the Monday night 54-51 game, then we're going to be Chiefs Patriots, and then we're going to be the Alex Smith game where he broke his life.

It's just like reversing the clock. You know, very soon we could be back to Leonard Hearns one. Yes, we could. No, my point to you on that particular day is the same that it is now. You think, and some others think, people that don't understand this stuff, and you don't understand this stuff. The dummies and this stuff. Thought it was such a clear, obvious thing for Sean Payton to line it up and run it three times

and kick the field goal and leave the Rams with a full minute, a full minute with Greg. Greg Zerline is the kicker to tie the game. Oh, my God. Oh, my God. The horror. Yeah. The fear, the horror. Right.

Oh, my God. Which, they would have likely done. It's better than 50, 50 they would have gotten in field goal range. And all I'm saying is, right when they lined up to run that first play, I'm like, you got to think touchdown. And I was thinking right with Sean Payton, you got to think touchdown or first down. How did it work out? How did it work out?

What do you mean? How did it work out? work out for them. Well, they ended up losing the game in overtime, but they would have, but they had it, but they were going to try to win the game there with a touchdown or a first down. They couldn't run the clock out. There was going to be a minute left and the Rams were going to have the ball. I get that. So the game was going to go to overtime had they not scored a touchdown more likely than not. With the timeout or without a timeout. No. Okay. You're right. It's less likely without a timeout. I will grant you that, but it wasn't that much of a stretch. And the

other part of that is, is the play they ran on first down was a total safe play. It's a completion 95% of the time, and Breeze threw a bad ball. There's no such thing. He threw a shit, he threw a shitload of bad balls in that game. Drew Breeze, you know, for all the complaining and all they, we got screwed, we got screwed. They easily could have lost to Philadelphia in the, the week before because he didn't play great in that game. He didn't play great over the last month of the season. Yes. So the Rams were the better team that day, period.

Let me throw us a life preserver here. Okay, good. How far back are we going to go for the life preserver? No, no, no, no, no. What? Todd Gurley. Let's start on Todd Gurley. I don't know what the answer to that is.

Well, I compared it in a way to Malcolm Butler. You had a player who was essentially held out of the Super Bowl. Yeah, but there was some issue. there. Yeah, but we never know what that was. I know. And we don't know what happened. I mean, one of the mysteries of last year was why Malcolm Butler was benched.

One of the mysteries of this year is why Todd Gurley wasn't used more. And there's no real explanation. I mean, they insist he wasn't hurt. And when he ran the ball a couple of times, he didn't look hurt. I mean, I just can't fathom how you can have an offensive game plan facing the Patriots and not be throwing to Todd Gurley out of the backfield. The one of the weaknesses the Patriots have defensively is defending against backs, you know, with the past out of the backfield.

And that girl he was not used is inexcusable. And Sean Payton, Sean McVey looks like an idiot for sitting there and saying, well, he was okay, you know, it just didn't in the game plan. God only knows what his explanation is, but it's bad. There was the story of Butler, and I just, I remember that there was something, and I couldn't remember what it was. But he skipped the opening night of Super Bowl Week with a supposed illness. And so there was something going on there with Malcolm Butler's Super Bowl Week. There's nothing been going on that we know of with Todd Gurley going into the UFC Championship.

No, no. I mean, my point is you have a player who is seemingly healthy, who could have helped you win, who wasn't used. It's strange. It's not just a player. It's the best, arguably the best offensive skill position, non-quarterback skill position player in the NFC. And the guy who's going to take the pressure

off your young deer in the headlights quarterback. Yeah. I don't, I guess we're going to find out at some point. At some point. Well, Kevin, we never really did find out what happened. No, Malcolm. I'm just reading. Which is an amazing thing for the Patriots and Bill Belichick.

I'm reading from the story. Malcolm Butler, when he signed with the Titan, said, I was never given an explanation from Belichick. But there was, he missed an event early in the week. I know that. But we don't really know for sure what happened there. And again, it's

a testament to what Bill Belichick has built in that here we are a year later. And the player has never ripped Belichick. And no teammates have ever come forward and said what happened. It's stunning. It really is. It's called a culture.

I mean, you know, the C.J. Anderson performance against the Cowboys, you know, I think C.J. Anderson got the carries late in the season when Gurley was hurt. Yes. Right? So there was clearly like he had a massive game against the Cardinals. He went for like a buck 70 against the Cardinals. I think that was either the third to last week of the season or the second to last week of the season. and then Gurley also didn't play in that finale against the 49ers, and C.J. Anderson went for over 100 yards again. Very impressive. And so, hold on, I'm just going to pull this up real quickly because I want to see what C.J. Anderson did.

I mean, okay, here it is. Go ahead. The final two games of the regular season with Gurley Hurd, C.J. Anderson off the street, 20 carries 167 yards against Arizona and a 31 to 9 win. and then 23 carries a buck 32 against the 49ers, and it was a 48 to 32 win. They needed both of those games. Remember, they were still teetering potentially on losing the two seed, right?

Aaron going into that final week, the Rams were still... Yeah, there was a chance they could. There was a chance if the Bears, I think it may have been the Bears that were pushing them. Yeah, if the Bears had won and the Rams had lost. And then with Gurley still may be compromised health-wise, He went 23 carries, 123 yards against a really good defensive team, 5.3 yards per carry against the Cowboys. I mean, if you want to just look at it and say, look, we had a hot guy,

that's fine. The problem with that is in the Super Bowl, C.J. Anderson only got seven carries. Yeah. Look, I mean, one of the things that Sean McVeigh said after the game, and it seems simplistic, but it's true, is he got out-coached. He got out-coached to the point where, Even the dummies could see it. Yeah, you know, I don't know that the dummies could all see it.

I think what you saw was you saw an offense that was completely confused. Yeah. You know, but most people can't explain why. You know, they couldn't explain that the Patriots had shown so much man. And here they were playing quarter's coverage, zone coverage, and using various players in different spots. And, and, you know, I think you could tell that they were confused by the pass rush, if nothing else. What Cooley said on Friday, he said, you know that Belichick is going to try to take away the play action game and the boot game.

And so you have to have a counter to that. And he thought that the counter to that would be really trying to run the football in a similar way in which they did against Dallas. They didn't, though. You know, he, I heard somebody else say this last night. It was an ex-player on NFL network, and I don't remember who it was. but he said McVeigh's biggest mistake really was very simplistic. He just needed to go back to what he did against Dallas and be stubborn running the football. Because Goff is a dropback guy without play action and without boot.

This was not their strength. And the Patriots forced them into playing the way that they didn't play during the regular season. And, you know, Belichick used the Matt Patricia plan from the Lions. game. Did you hear about that? And I talked about it on the podcast yesterday, that everybody thought, well, it's probably the Bears that he studied to get ready for the Rams. The Bears were the one team that completely

shut the Rams down. Right. He didn't. He used Matt Patricia's game plan from Detroit's 30 to 16 loss against the Rams, a game that I remembered because I had the Lions plus 10, and it was 1613 early in the fourth quarter, and they

lost 30 to 16. You remember the losses. But he said that, that that game plan got Goff out of the play action and the boot game, forced him into a dropback guy, and he had one of his worst games of the year, even though they won. They won on a couple of turnovers, too, Detroit turnovers. But anyway, I don't know where we were going with that.

Well, I mean, the Todd Gurley thing. Yeah. But the Belichick, getting to the Belichick game plan, I mean, you have to really step back and say, I mean, admire the brilliance. of a guy whose defense played a certain way all year. And then before the biggest, most important game of the year, he says to his players, oh, we're going to change this.

We're going to do this differently. And I read some accounts where the players were scratching their heads early in the week of practice saying, are you sure? Oh, really? Yeah. Boy, I would imagine that nobody scratches their heads with a game planning. Because it seemed like there was just something they had done pretty much all year. Do you remember where you read that?

That's interesting to me. I don't remember exactly where I read it. So defensive players were questioning? Defensive players were saying, I mean, we're kind of surprised. And they were saying, okay, you know, I mean, they were caught off guard by it. Now, as the week went on, everyone bought into it. And also, I forget where I read, they were fully prepared if it didn't work. during the game to go back to what they were doing.

They're always prepared for something that doesn't work. I mean, you're going into the biggest game of the year, and you're changing what got you there. That takes such guts. Yes, you know, some of the greatest coaches in history, you know, have done that. I mean, look, in this town, George Allen went to five defensive linemen in a playoff game against the Green Bay Packers in 1970. because John Brockington was their only offense.

And he put Manny Sistrunk, I think, up there as a fifth defensive lineman, and they shut down the run and they won the game 16 to 3. Joe Gibbs changed a lot of things. You know what Joe Gibbs was really good at in the postseason? He became a risk taker in his biggest games. Over the course of his career as a head coach, he was never what you would call like this massive aggressive, like risk-taking gadget play guy until the postseason.

Yeah, you're right. You know, Daryl Green on a punt return on a pass across the field, you know, that got called back in the 49ers' NFC championship game because of a penalty. Rigo throwing a half-back option in that same game. Brian Mitchell on a fake punt in a playoff game against Minnesota. Some of these things you just sort of remember, Gibbs in games against the Giants in particular took some big risks. like out of character things because he felt like in this particular game, we got to do something. Yeah.

You know? No, that's a good point. You're right. The great ones always think outside the box. But I give Josh McDaniels credit to for this success. You know, that was an offense Sunday that was completely confused through three quarters. And then for whatever reason, on that go-ahead drive, all of a sudden, they make a couple of tweaks. And now Brady totally sees the zone and throws the Edelman underneath.

and then totally sees when they go man and he throws to Grant deep. Yeah. You know, and the touch on that, the touch on that Gras was beautiful. Incredible. Like, you know, I don't even understand the conversation about the, I actually, that's not true. I do, I do understand when people look at people like Aaron Rogers and they watch Dan Marino or John Elway. John Elway was my number one, number one for all, for a long, long time. And see some of them were athletically gifted, um, quarterback.

play the game. I understand why people will say, I think that if Brady, if Aaron Rogers had been in New England, they would have won seven or eight. I can understand where that argument's coming from, but at this point, for me, there's no doubt anymore. No, there's no doubt for either. This was a legacy game for Brady and Belichick. Do you think they needed this one? I think their legacy was cemented a few years ago. I don't think it was cemented. Really? I think now it's beyond debate. I really do. I mean, for Belichick in particular, but I mean, I think this was a legacy game. It's the all-time NFL dynasty. It's not close.

Where would you put it in terms of professional sports dynasties, the Celtics of the 60s? The Yankees. The Yankees of the 20s and 30s. The Yankees, well, the Yankees rule for 40 years. Yeah. Now, there are circumstances why they did. I get that. And I think it's harder in this day and age in the NFL to keep a dynasty together as long as they have.

You're competing with 32 teams all trying to get to the same place with a salary cap and free agency. So while I think the Yankees and the Celtics, they're 11 out of 13 championships, and maybe the Montreal Canadians to a lesser extent, are all in the conversation. Save for the Yankees, I think the Patriots might be the second greatest dynasty of all time, because of the difficulty in maintaining a dynasty over the last 18 years. I think that the big difference in these conversations about, you know, Belichick versus other coaches and other sports, the Patriots versus other teams and other sports, Brady, etc.,

is that this is the one professional sport that is built and designed for it to prevent this. Yeah. You know, baseball's not built to prevent a dynasty. The NBA certainly is not. I don't know necessarily about the NHL, but you don't end up. I mean, you've had dynasties in the NHL. You had the Islanders of the 70s. You had the Edmonton teams of Gretzky in the 80s.

You had the Penguins of the 90s, et cetera. But the NFL, you know, even before the salary cap, you know, you had dynasties, but you still had a league where you had a draft, where you had roster limits. The problem is you didn't have pay limits, which is why the teams that were willing to spend, like the Redskins. Like the Redskins and the 49ers and the Dolphins. You know, the Redskins were not the biggest spenders of their day.

I went back and looked at this last week because somebody said that the Redskins were the biggest spenders. They were like fifth. In the 91 team had the fifth highest payroll. And the Niners really spent. The Dolphins, Joe Robbie, that whole group really spent. spent. There were other teams. But anyway, the NFL, it's not supposed to happen. And it's not only that, this, since, you know, over the last 20 years, it was really not supposed to happen

with everything that's been built into the sport with respect to roster management, which means that front office and coaching is so important. And if you take that into account in terms of the Patriots dynasty, and you add in the fact that the league has tried to do everything a can to screw them. To screw them over. I know. And it still hasn't worked. I know.

You know, the thing that we didn't mention, as we were talking about Belichick, and I just had this written down and I wanted to mention it, is that what's really amazing, wasn't just what they did to the Rams in the Super Bowl during this run, but it was that they shut out the chiefs in the first half. They took the two highest scoring teams in the biggest offensive year in the history of the NFL. Two teams have played a 54-51 new wave. Here it comes. Get ready for this. And both of those teams couldn't score a point in the first halves of the games. You are so right. Now, they did score 31 in the second, you know, the chiefs did. And not only that, you know, let's not forget,

you know, what team was on a big time role, you know, offensively at the end of the year, except against the Ravens. The Chargers were rolling offensively. Yes, they were. You know, Philip Rivers and that offense was unstoppable, and the Patriots hammered them, 35-7 at half-time. Yeah, you're right. Now, part of that was their offense and the dominating way in which they played offense. Here's the, well, go ahead. Say what you're going to say. Then I have an exit question for you.

One other thing about the Super Bowl. John McLaughlin exit question. That's right. Well, nobody's got to remember that. Whatever. And Andy Pollan brought this up when I was on with him yesterday. I think it's pretty good observation. This has become the family picnic.

for the Patriots. That's Super Bowl Week. Yeah. I mean, because he's, I mean, that's the first time you ever saw Belichick with his granddaughter,

holding his granddaughter in his arms. No, I think we saw that. I don't remember seeing that before. I think we've seen that. I think we've seen that before. I don't remember seeing that.

Brady up there on the stage with his kids, it's almost like, you know, I mean, these kids have grown up where this is the norm. This is what,

this is what daddy does every year. He goes to the, Super Bowl. Daddy, are we having the family picnic again in early February? Where is it? Oh, we're going to have it in Miami next year. Yeah, it's, um, my exit question is how much longer will this continue? Brady says he's playing for four more seasons until he's 45. You know, Belichick hasn't shown any signs of wanting to hang it up. I think Gronk might retire. Yeah. But, you know, they haven't had Gronk for all of this. No. You know, so, I mean, I said yesterday, the on the show, it's not ending.

It's going to continue because they own better, they acquire better, they develop better, they coach better. They win better than anybody has ever done it. They're going to figure it out again, and they're going to be back playing in another Super Bowl here in the next two, three years. You know what's interesting? Maybe next year. How this is like, for people who don't want to see that, there's one hope, and it's going

to become the new rivalry in the AFA. It's going to be the Patriots versus Pat Mahomes. Yeah. I mean, everyone sees Pat Mahomes as the only salvation to keep the Patriots from keeping, from continuing to return to the Super Bowl. He's going to be seen as the savior for people who want to see somebody other than the Patriots. They're favored to win the Super Bowl. They're the favorite right now.

The chiefs are the favorites. Because of the quarterback. Because of the quarterback. Yeah, 100%. even though their head coach, who I think is a really good head coach, and trust me, over the last 17 years or 20 years of the Dan Snyder ownership era, I would have taken Andy Reed for all 20 of them, you know, even though it may not have produced a Super Bowl,

just like I loved Marty and it may not have produced a Super Bowl. But it would have produced a hell of a lot better than what we've gotten over the years. But the, I, that's a, you know, the AFC might be that maybe the Patriot it's rallying call for the next few years because they were such an underdog this year. You know, they were so counted out, which was a joke. We're still here. They were favored in 18 of 19 games this year. And they're the second favorite to win the Super Bowl next year going into the season.

But maybe it's that, you know what? Hell, to hell with Mahomes. Let's keep him from winning a Super Bowl the next couple of years. Because if they play the Chiefs in the postseason next year, even if it's at Arrowhead, are you going to doubt the Patriots? Nobody doubted him in the AFC championship game. Absolutely not. I'm with you.

There were a couple of things that came out after the Super Bowl and various sites that I want to get to. Rankings, way too early power rankings and stuff like that. I want to get to the Wizards as well. That was interesting last night. But real quickly on Wind Donation. Wind Donation really enjoys this podcast, and I thank them for that. Harley's a big sports fan. Harley and Aaron are brothers.

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86690 Nation or windonation.com. Get two free windows for every two you buy. There's no limit plus 0% financing, no interest for five full years. 86690 Nation or wind donation.com and tell them that we sent you. So ESPN yesterday came out with their way too early power rankings. Where are the Redskins? Well, we'll get to that. The Rams are won off of that Super Bowl performance.

The Chiefs are two, the Saints are three, the Patriots are four. They're undervalued. The Chargers are five, the Bears are six, the Colts are seven, the Seahawks, say Texans 9, Ravens 10. I'm going to make a prediction right now that when we get into the season of NFL predictions, you know, June, July, that the Texans are a real chic pick to win the Super Bowl in 2020, 2019 season 2020, even though they really, really played poorly in that playoff game against the Colts.

I just still look at that team and I see a ton of talent. I think, and you get to Sean Watson and what will be really his second full season. But anyway, the Redskins were the Redskins. Let me first give you the NFC East teams in order. The Eagles are 12. The Cowboys are 13. And then you get- I'm surprised the Cowboys aren't ahead of the Eagles.

And then you get the Giants at 21. The Redskins are 25 in the NFL. And there are only two NFC teams. teams projected to be worse, and that's Detroit and Arizona. That makes sense. And the Redskins have the Lions on the schedule at home. So this is what I've said since the end of the season. It doesn't mean anything.

These predictions are always in this particular league, unless you're picking the Patriots. They're always so, you know, completely irrelevant because of the things you can't predict that we all know, injuries and the breaks and all of that. But the Redskins, I really felt, are going to be universally picked dead last in the division going into the 2019 regular season. And among the worst teams in the NFC, and this early look has it there. And this is what it was written. Who did this? Oh, well, each of the beat reporters wrote about their own team.

So probably John Kine was the contributor for this. And John writes improved health, wait, that was also a reason for optimism last year. and that didn't quite work out too well as 26 players spent time on injured reserve. But here's where it helps now. The Redskins' offensive line should be in a better spot with a healthy Brandon Sheriff and both tackles, Trent Williams and Morgan Moses, not coming off surgeries as they were last year. Pair that with the excellent young talent along the defensive line, Ionitis Allen, Payne, and the Redskins have some optimism,

but it will be muted until their quarterback position is solved just like off-season last year. I mean, you know, somebody made the case to me. I'm going to find it on Twitter. He was trying to make the case that it's not all doom and gloom that... Kevin. I'm listening. You have to take medication to believe that it's not all gloom and doom. You know what?

You know how on the side of a pack of cigarettes, there's a surgeon general's warning? Yeah. Okay. And I've reduced myself to doing this because, I mean, I don't take enough stupid pills to be able to not to face the reality. Is that when we're discussing the roster, when we're discussing draft choices, when we're discussing all the great defensive coordinators that they now have on their defensive coaching staff, when we're discussing all that. and saying, well, if they do this, and if this happens, and if that happens, I mean, if you're going to be honest, you have to say to yourself, based on the evidence that has been presented to you, you can choose to ignore it, that it doesn't matter who's coaching this team.

It doesn't matter who they draft. It doesn't matter who they sign in free agency. It doesn't matter because they are incapable of success. with Bruce Allen and Dan Snyder in charge. Was that a revelation? Well, are you trying? No, but I'm saying if we're going to discuss, you're about to bring up a guy who says it's not all gloom and do.

Did you get the same tweet too? Well, no, I mean, look, I get people on the radio station that want to say, well, if they draft this guy and if they draft Kyle or Murray, or if they do this or they do that, And I keep telling them, it doesn't matter. And it's maddening for them. And it's frustrating. But it's the truth. Yeah.

Okay. I didn't wake up and take my delusional pills, my rose-colored glass pills this morning. I didn't do that. In fact, I don't even own them anymore. Because I've gotten to the point where I totally agree with you. A reasonable person, even if you're a die-hard fan, which I have been my entire life,

There's just too much evidence that says it's just never going to work. And when I say that, I always come back to one thing. But the NFL, the way it's built, is for even the worst of franchises, the most incompetent of franchises, which the Redskins clearly are. There's no debate about that. The Redskins' front office ownership incompetence. At the highest level in recent NFL vintage, I mean, we are talking about truly one of the worst run franchises in all of sports. Now, put that aside, because the NFL still, look at the Cardinals, what the Cardinals were with Bill Bidwell.

Oh, I know. For a long period of time. You have the opportunity for the accidental successful season. And even in the Cardinals case, you actually had a bit of a mini run. Now, you had to have Kurt Warner as the quarterback. You had to have Larry Fitzgerald land in your lap. You're right. There's a chance for the accidental level of success.

Yes, you could end up with the accidental level of success. Now, the difference between, you know, an organization like the Cardinals who were so poorly run, so cheap Bill Bidwell was, right? That was his, that was his MO forever, is that he just was never going to spend. A terrible owner. Right. But, you know, they went to a Super Bowl, and they should have won that Super Bowl. Super Bowl. Could have won that Super Bowl anyway. But was his son in charge by then? Probably.

Mike Bidwell by then. I think that's his son's name. I think Bill, I think when they got to the Super Bowl in that year. Okay. What year is that? Is that the 2009 season? The Cardinal Steelers? 2008, 2009. Yeah. So I think Bill Bidwell was still the owner then. But I guess the point is, is that in the NFL, anything can happen. And I've made this statement the same way for years, that I don't want a good season, I want a good franchise. Well, the good franchise I'm not going to get. As long as Dan Snyder owns the team, I'm not going to get a good franchise. So I have now eliminated that as a possibility.

But the good season is still in play, even with a bunch of stumbling, bumbling idiots. Yeah, it is. Like the Redskins. It is. I guess because I measure success more like you do. I would prefer to have a great franchise, but that's not going to happen. with this group. It's not. Right. Unless there's a, again, an epiphany at some point, and he wakes up one day and says,

I'm done. I'm going to sell the team, or I am going to go hire somebody, give them the contractual autonomy to run it, and I'm just going to be the chairman of the board and the owner, and I will have nothing to do with any of this. Maybe he'll take a three-hour tour on his new yacht. You can take a three-hour tour of what on his new yacht? But the, but the, the, the, the, season, having a good season, is always in play with any organization. So, back to what this guy tweeted me. Bill, don't we have some hope next year that, you know, if we're adding Geis, Ruben Foster, and number 15, it's like adding three first round picks to the roster next year? Yeah, that's true. Like if Geis ends up being a real deal, now he was not a first round pick, he was the second round

pick. But, you know, a lot of people felt like he shouldn't have been a second round pick that he had first round talent. I thought that there were several running backs in front of Geis. Geis was not my favorite running back in the draft, but he's a good running back. And there's hope that he could become a real, you know, upper level running back that they haven't had until Adrian Peterson for several games this year. Ruben Foster is a talent. No matter what we want to say about the whole Ruben Foster incident, that's separate from he's a legit talent, you know, an inside linebacker, Like he's got superstar talent. And then you add number 15, and if it's a quarterback,

and that quarterback all of a sudden becomes Patrick Mahomes in two years, and then you add to that, John Allen, Duran Payne, Matt Ionitis, Brandon Sheriff, other young players on both the offensive line and defensive lines that look really good. Like, what if John Allen, and it's not crazy to suggest, what if John Allen, who, by the way, is coached by very argument, and debatably the best coach on the staff in Jim Tom Sula. Okay.

What if he becomes Aaron Donald in year three or just slightly below Aaron Donald? What if Duran Payne becomes one of the best nose tackles in the game? There were signs that this dude can play. But you have brought up all the possibilities of what could happen without bringing up all the possibilities of what could go wrong. I know I can get to that that's a longer conversation I understand what can go wrong and that's always going to get in the way look what did we say when we sat down for one of these one of the first podcasts we did from tony's restaurant chatter in September we both said you know what we think they're going to be much better in defense they got a chance to win you know nine games maybe you know a wild card team but what always happens with this team the the thing that we don't see coming how it's coming, but we know there's a legit chance somehow that Dan Snyder, Bruce Allen, et cetera, will screw it up somehow. The aura of self-destruction.

Yes. Yeah. So, I mean, I just think that, yeah, you might get the occasional successful season for this team is 10 wins. Well, they haven't had 11 since 1991, yeah. Yeah. No, I know, look, when we're talking about the season, you know, the season, you know, the season where everybody's healthy. You get every break, which by the way was really this season to get to six and three.

Yes. I mean, we may have just wasted the really good opportunity because everything seemed to be coming together, not in a, in the way in which they could have ended up nine and seven or ten and six. They had a lot of things going their way this season. But, you know, when you talk about the season with a bad organization, you know, that bad organization had that year. Remember that year? you usually do say it was 11 or 12 wins, not 9 or 10 months.

But anyway, we've got plenty of time to do that. I have no idea, and I didn't learn anything last week from the Radio Row interviews with Bruce Allen about what they're going to do or not do moving forward. I think they've got a coaching staff that was put together half-assed because there weren't a lot of people, Tommy, that wanted the job and there were more people that wanted to go. I think that that is an underrated right now storyline going into 2019 is the fact that you had coaches on the staff wanting to leave. Some did. Some could not for reasons of contract, being under contract. You had openings that were filled by not first choices. You have a defensive coordinator who was clearly that they clearly tried to replace. And now it's is going to be your defensive coordinator anyway because they couldn't find somebody to replace him.

You have a head coach that appears to be entering a lame duck season, but I would have guessed that this past season was a bit of a lame duck season to a certain degree, because I thought if they didn't make the playoffs, he was gone. Yeah, but as long as, as long as there's a list, a long list of walking wounded, we're told you can't judge the coach. But if you, true, but if you, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, if, right now we fast forwarded to a season that was three and 13. Would anybody be that surprised? And I would point back to what I'm saying today a year in advance. And that is, this coaching

staff situation is really dysfunctional. What happened here in the off season was dysfunctional. It was trying to replace and having it reported that you were desperately trying to replace your defensive coordinator. You had coached. Because leave for lateral jobs, not for promotions. Right. For, you know, Olive Addi, Kotwika, et cetera, leaving for jobs that weren't promotions. You had others, trust me, that wanted to leave, that didn't want to stay.

And now all these guys are supposed to come together and figure it out and coach them up in 2019. And let me point out, in the middle of all that. And by the way, it's not a great staff to begin with. Right, right. And in the middle of all that, you have. introduced one of the biggest personalities in coaching in Rob Ryan. Okay? I mean, a guy who...

You had to hire a linebacker's coach, and he was the only one available. Well, he called the Redskins. Well, I understand that. Because I'm sure he realized nobody wants to go there, but I want to work. I haven't worked in two years. I'll take the money. But my point is, that guy, you put that guy in the equation. It's not an indictment on Rob Ryan.

He's a big personality. he's going to have an impact in the in the coaches room it might be negative it might be positive but he's not going to be invisible so his presence will have an impact one way or the other you're probably right i mean you know when you think about it they haven't had on the staff big personalities no i mean callahan maybe not but he's not a big personality he's apparently not the easiest guy to communicate with, but he's not a big personality. And I'm not talking about what Rob Ryan says publicly. I mean, again, he's an assistant coach, so he's only going to get to talk.

He's a position coach, too. So he's only going to get talked to the media once a week, probably unless he wants to talk some more. You know, he probably will. Hell, he'll probably get a radio show. But I'm talking about behind the scenes. That guy's presence is going to have an impact on a roster, on a coaching. staff that's already hurting. It's a hurting coaching staff and you're introducing him to it.

It's going to have an impact. Going into this season right now, if you are hoping for the one out of, you know, 10, one out of five where, you know, they can contend for something, win nine games, backdoor their way into the playoffs. You just have a lot of things working against you this particular year, even more than most years. You know, you have a coaching staff that was put together with, you know, you know, major dysfunction with guys on the staff that don't want to be there, guys that left,

guys that you had to settle for because the guys you wanted didn't want it, and then guys you had to keep that you tried to replace, a head coach that clearly looks like he is in a win or else situation, and, oh, by the way, you don't have a quarterback. And you still have Bruce Allen calling the roster shots. Yes. By the way, one quick aside. The thing that came out of the Radio Row interviews last week, which also came out of the interview that he did in Mobile at the Senior Bowl, that I really find galling in so many ways, is his political, you know, very disingenuous attempt to make himself, to minimize his personal role in all of the decision making.

And the way he's been doing it recently is to talk about how good. Jay has been working hard to build out his staff. You know, he's mentioned that in Mobile, then the two interviews last week that I heard about how, well, no, no, Jay's, you know, doing all of the interviews, he's picking, you know, putting together his staff, and he thinks he's got a really good staff now. It's this subtle way in trying to put into people's minds

that he's not really involved. Yeah. It's so disingenuous. It really is. And it's not accurate. According to every person that I know that would know, he's intimately involved in a lot of this stuff, coaching staff hires.

I will tell you this. I am absolutely, I'm 90% sure that if Bruce Allen weren't involved in helping to fill out a coaching staff and hire coaches, you know, by the way, we saw Dan Snyder interview Todd Bowles, right? We know that that actually happened without, Greg Minosky was not in the room, people, if you really believe that. But, you know, if this were true that Bruce really had a very minimal sort of overseeing role and gave autonomy to the head coach and to the personnel people, then Bill Callahan would not be on this staff.

Would not be on this staff right now. He just wouldn't be. Wow. And so I, you know, not to mention the fact that Doug Williams, may have actually known about the Alex Smith trade a year ago. And, you know, it goes to the whole pushing dugout for the Rubin Foster thing, which to me, you know, ranks up there with the gutless handling of Scott McLuhan where they buried him anonymously in the post story.

Not that Scott McLuhan shouldn't have gone, you know. Two different issues. Two totally different issues. And you and I, I think, were on different sides of this. and I think I was closer to the situation and realized Scott McLuhan should go. And he needs help, first of all. But the way they handled it was just low rent, per usual. Which I think was the way Bruce Allen saw it happening from the moment he hired Scott McLuhan.

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You know, I think it was interesting and for people who are listening. You notice Kevin said that Ralph really is a good friend of Kevin's. And he has to put that caveat in because I think people have a hard time believing Kevin really has good friends. You know, you've said that a lot over the years. And I know you are joking because you know me, but, you know, more people come up to me. Oh, get out of here. how difficult is Tommy to get along with? And I'm like, not at all.

He's the best. Now, there was a time in our relationship many years ago where you were a bit high maintenance. And you actually still are a bit high maintenance. But I love you for that. I told you what most of the things that people come up to me and say after they've talked to me for a while. And they always say, you're much nicer in person than you are on the radio.

Yeah. Well, Tommy really is. Although I will just warn you. He does have a list. And if you get on that list, you're never getting off of it. I guess I was one of the few people that watched The Wizards last night. They're terrible. I don't want this team.

I didn't, I almost tweeted out like something about Ted when he said on TOP last week, you know, hey, if you get into the playoffs, anything can happen. First of all, you're not going to get into the playoffs. Secondly, there's nothing good that can happen if this team. team gets into the playoffs. There are players that I like. You know, I love Trevor oriza. You know, I like the way Satteransky plays. I'll tell you, the guy that actually has played really well for them, and he played great last night, is this guy Jordan McCrae, who I remember at Tennessee. And Aaron, I have no idea where he was before they signed him recently. But he actually

gives him something off the bench that is, he's a good player. He's a decent player. But anyway, This team's not going anywhere. And what did I say, Aaron, yesterday, that every game they lose, they give up a buck 30 or more, right? Sounds right. 137 points to the Hawks. Unbelievable. Oh, my God. You know, the Hawks do have some good young talent.

Trey Young's going to be a good player. Kevin Herder's a good – he's going to be a good player. That's amazing. Collins got hurt last night and only played like 15 minutes in the game. but had like 15 points in 15 minutes. Hold on, I want to see exactly what John Collins had last night. I loved him at Wake Forest. Last night, Collins played 17 minutes for the Hawks

and had 15 points 11 rebounds. Oh, my gosh. In 17 minutes before he got hurt. They had nine players in double figures. Now, Kevin, I think you're underestimating the playoff run the playoff push that's going to come when Dwight Howard returns. Was there some news on that, Aaron, on Dwight Howard? I thought somebody sent me something, and I didn't follow up on it.

My fault. I don't think I've seen anything about Dwight Howard. He's the invisible man. Can they move him this week or not? I guess they could. To who? What? A G-League team?

Trade him to the G-League? Capital City Go-go. Here's what I wanted to say about the game last night. We should go. We should go. Have you been to a go-go game yet? I have not. We should go.

Okay. All right? Because I won't go to as long as that weasel still in charge of PR of the Wizards. But I don't think he's in charge of the go-go. Stop with him. He's a good guy. I don't think. No, he's not a good guy.

No, he's not a good guy. You know what? Now you're proving. You're not easy to get along with with everybody. You know what? But I don't think he's in charge of the go-go. Somebody that we used to work with. So we used to work with, and I will not mention his name, once said about you, he's an acquired taste.

And I didn't necessarily agree with him, but anyway, what I wanted to say about the Wizards game last night is it's the kind of loss that if Ted were on TOP today, after losing to the Hawks last night, giving up 137 points, with the trade deadline still two days away. It's end of business Thursday, the trade deadline. So he might feel differently. That's not, this is what the Wizards have done over the years. They've lost to bad teams at home that they shouldn't lose to. And I don't even know who they should and shouldn't lose to anymore. They were a seven and a half point favorite last night. I actually liked them last night.

Don't ask me why. But it's the kind of game that you, you know, makes you think, okay, you know, we've lost these games at home before, but we also had John Wall. You know, or we had John Wall getting healthier. There's no future. No. There's no future right now. There's nothing, there's nothing but dead weight and albatrosses.

The only future is if you think John Wall is going to come back healthy and that Wall, Beal, I can't even stand watching Otto Porter anymore. And he's the sweetest kid. I still refer to him as a kid. Remember some of the times we had him on, it was just, it wasn't great. But that's beside the point. I can't I can't fathom that a guy that helps you as little as he does to big winning, like the chance to really win big.

He's not a tough enough competitor for me for that money. He's part of a big three though. Ted's new big three. Matt's money. He misses on that stuff. You know, the Wizards. I think Ernie misses on that stuff. Oh, I think he misses on the different.

between a badass competitor and a guy that's just talented and gifted. Hence, Dwight Howard. I think he misses, period. You know, just misses everything, period. The Wizards spend a lot of money on players, Kevin. They're one of the highest payrolls in the league. I know that. That's unbelievable when you think about it.

The Maheen Me deal doesn't help. Now, who made that deal? Oh, God. There's nothing to watch here anymore, Pete, boys and the girls. There's nothing. I mean, how many games do they have left? They have 29 games left. Let's go to a go-go game.

I'm not going to a go-go-go-game. Yes, you are. If I'm going to games, I'm going to, right now I've got a couple of high school games in the next week, two weeks that I'm going to go see. I'd much rather go see a really good high school game right now than a go-go game. I'm going to have to insist now that you and I go to a go-go game. All right, let's go. And I'll figure out when. Okay.

All right. Have you seen the new arena yet? I haven't. I've heard it's great though. All right. A friend of mine, a coach friend of mine said it's a really well-done arena. So being in the sports commentary business, we should go see the arena, shouldn't we? Okay. Okay.

All right. You picked a date and we'll go. Okay. Anyway, I don't even know, like I'm getting out of the business now of checking to see if the wizards can actually make a run. Let's stop talking about the wizards. Okay. Let's finish this up with a brief discussion about. about one thing.

What? Is Price Harper ever going to sign with a team? That was what I wanted to finish up with. No? No, that was my next thing for you, is that Jim Bowden says there are a bunch of mystery teams. Don't even mention his name. Okay, so where, my God.

When is he going to get signed and by whom? Well, I mean, less than two weeks before pitchers and catchers report, I have no idea. I think, I mean. Why don't you have sources on this? Who has sources on this, Kevin? I don't know. I want to see you break a big one on this one. I'm not going to break a big one on this. I'm not part of the Bryce Harper Cabal.

Okay? I've called them the Minister of Fun too many times in a column to be taken into Scott Forrest's confidence. So it's not going to be. Look, Bobby Nightingale, who I think is very plugged in. How far away are we from spring training? Again, we're less than two weeks from pitchers and catchers. Okay, so he's got to sign in the next two to three weeks. Next 10 days.

Well, does he? Is this going to be like a football situation where someone waits to sign? until after preseason or in the middle of preseason? I mean, I'd said to you last week or the week before that to me, like the big story here is just the lack of interest. Yeah. Or the lack of this massive market is a better way to put it. There's not,

there's clearly not a fight where the numbers are escalating. The biggest problem for both of these guys, Machado and Harper, is they entered into this without the three biggest spenders in baseball taking part. Yankees, Red Sox. And Dodgers. But I thought you said the Dodgers won. And they cleared room to do it with Puege and Kemp. But they've made other moves that indicates they're not in it anymore.

Okay. So it's kind of hard to have a record contract when you can't get the three biggest spenders involved in what you're trying to do. The logic says he's going to wind up back in Washington. That's your logic now? Well, yeah. Not Philly, not San Diego? Not a mystery team? Let's say the Phillies offer him $350 million.

We know the nationals have offered him $300 million. Over 10 years, 10-year period, both deals. Are the nationals really going to let Bryce Harper walk away for $5 million a year? Because that's what you're talking about. That's jump change. I mean, the difference between $300 and $350 million over 10 years. Do you think they'd match that deal? It didn't sound like that they would.

be willing to do that. Well, I think they said that because I think at that point, they thought Bryce Harper would be over $400 million. I think that's what they thought at the time, that by the time it was all said and done, that Bryce would have $400 million offers on the table. I think the fact that he probably won't and maybe has a contract offer that that's doable for them to match, I think changes everything. You like this guy, John Hyman, right? No, I don't. I don't like him. Who's the guy you like? Bob Nightingale. John Heyman is a Scott Boris lackey.

Okay. Because Heyman tweeted out here at least 18, you're still checking in. Let me just back up on that for a second. You're going to discredit that. No, no, no, no, no, no. John Heyman, I shouldn't say he's a lackey. He's a very good baseball writer, okay? And that was unfair for me to say.

He has the confidence of Scott Boris. And in other words, when Boris wants something out, everyone in the business knows he goes to Haman. Okay, so that's all. Okay. That's my point. Who goes to Jim Bowden? Nobody.

Because he's a joke. He's a fraud. He's a liar. How many other things do I have to tell you about him? According to multiple sources, there are indeed mystery teams in on Bryce Harper that the public is not aware of. I could have said that. And as many texts, emails and phone calls I've made, I still can't find them. but he then hashtags Braves, Cardinals, Astros, Giants, Angels, Yankees, Blue Jays.

He's a fraud, Kevin. With question marks and then he says, I give up. He's a fraud. I could have put that tweet on. Yes, exactly. He's a fraud and a liar, and if you take Bowden seriously, then you're a fool. How will Nat's fans react to Bryce Harper if he comes back and signs the $300 million deal? I'm just curious as to what you think the reaction will be.

I think it'll be very warm. Look, I think it would be a win for the city as a sports town. I do too. If Bryce Harper stays here for the next 10 years. I think Bryce Harper more than anybody else has made the Nats relevant. Their winning has made them relevant. Yeah. Their contending has made them relevant.

But, you know, there have been contending teams that haven't been as relevant as the Nats. And I think it's Harper. I know that they've got the pitchers in Strasbourg and Cherokee. I think you're right. That's what I hear from people more. Look, I was talking to a guy the other day. He says, if they don't sign Harper, I'm not going to back any games. Can he play quarterback?

He probably can. So you're now predicting the Nats? I'm not predicting anything. I just say logically, if we're talking $350 million on the table, I don't see how the learners can let them leave for $5 million a year. Now, maybe through all this, both these guys will wind up signing three-year deals for $100 million and try this again in three years. You know, maybe that'll happen at some point.

Maybe these guys will just say, well, I'll sign for a lot of money for a short-term deal since I'm not going to get the money I want over eight, nine, ten years. So short-term deals may be in place as well. All right. Let's move on to a couple of other things and then we'll wrap it up for the day. First of all, I wanted to mention that So the Doug Williams column that you wrote, you know, I totally agree with that. And I feel that it was just weird that he was involved in the Maryland investigation.

And I thought about this further. And it's really, you know, people have really been hands off on Doug in the conversation. I think people are very sensitive to. Well, he's a franchise icon. He's a franchise icon. He's beloved. You know, we just, you know, we just, you know, We're talking about the anniversary of that Super Bowl a couple of days ago.

But most people in the know realize that he is really not significantly involved despite the title. Right. And so when people say Doug Williams should be elevated, like let's get Bruce Allen out of there and let's elevate Doug Williams. I guess the point that I wanted to make is that's never going to happen. Unless there's like this desperation for nostalgic feel-good PR from Snyder. And he does sometimes go the nostalgic route. Yes. But it's not going to happen.

There's nobody in the organization. I don't want to be overly harsh because I like Doug. And I think Doug's got a good talent evaluating eye for, you know, offensive players in particular, competitors, people. But that organization doesn't respect Doug Williams as a senior decision maker in the organization. They don't seem to. No, they don't. And let's remember, because I'm not a Redskins fan, people were not banging down the door to hire Doug Williams as a talent evaluator.

No, they weren't. Okay? I mean, it's not like he's got this lengthy background of front office experience in terms of being a talent evaluator. So, you know, I mean, look, he gets a pass and he's earned a pass probably because of what he's done for this organization on the field. But my point is that legacy gets diminished as long as he's connected to this franchise in this way now. It's the legacy, I mean, the Ruben Foster thing made him look, made him look bad. Yeah, but people that know, know that it wasn't Doug's decision and he shouldn't have been out there. there doing that interview with Doc.

Right. But still, he was, he did. And again, you have a group of fans now who root for the Washington Redskins who never saw Doug Williams playing the Super Bowl. All they know is Doug Williams, the front office executive for the Washington Redskins, who look bad in the Rubin Foster interviews. That's probably true outside the market. Yeah. Outside the market. There are probably people that felt that way in the moment. And you know, Tommy's column, because I didn't really set it up properly, basically, you know, we had this conversation last week on the show when the story about all of the different, the financial, the financial compensation for those that sat in on the commission in the investigation of the

Maryland football program, Doug Williams was part of it. And we question as to why during the season Doug Williams would be participating in that. Yeah. You know, and Tommy wrote a column on it. And it's like, it's because they probably more likely than not didn't care that he was gone from the office doing this. Yeah, and the pushback I got on that column, Kevin, is pretty amazing. How so? The pushback from people who said, it's no big deal that he spent 47 hours over two months on business other than the Redskins. I mean, you know, in my job, I have plenty of time to do stuff. You know, people have interests outside of work.

And these people have no idea how an NFL franchise works. No idea. Look, I mean, that is probably true for most lines of work. And maybe even Doug has enough free time to do it. But as an employer, you're in the season. Yes. This is some of the best moves the Redskins have made over the last few years when McLuhan was here in particular. We're adding players.

Look, the best move, Redskins made all year was a Doug Williams move. Yes, the Adrian Peterson. But I just, I think it just speaks to, hey, do you all mind if I do this? No, we don't mind. I mean, because he's not, again, I hate saying this because I like him so much and I like him personally and as a fan, he's beloved and he's an icon and he's all of those things. But, you know, the Alex Smith story, you know, going back a year ago almost to the day

about him, you know, being told not to answer his phone, you know, by Bruce Allen is, you know, that is, that's real. It's sort of the way they view him. And so he's not going to get elevated in this organization. You know, I don't see Doug Williams running this organization. Some of you have suggested that to me. I don't see that happening. And to be totally honest, as a fan, I don't know that I would want that to happen. I do want Doug involved. in looking at all these quarterbacks, though. During this particular offseason, I probably would want his opinion more than I would want Bruce Allen's opinion.

Yeah, I would agree with that. So there's that. The last thing I wanted to get to was did you hear the Kyler Murray interview with Dan Patrick last week? Not only did I hear it, but you watched a video of it too because... I haven't watched the video of it. Okay, because that's an important part of it too. Why? I mean, because he looked.

He looked like... like a high school kid on David Letterman. In other words, like, uncomfortable, goofy, slumping, not taking anything seriously. The look matched the audio. The video matched the audio in how he came across. It was a bad look. It was a ridiculously embarrassing interview. Is it a game breaker?

It's not a game breaker. But if you were interested in Kyle or Murray before, you. You have to get some answers now as to why that happened. Just so everybody knows he was non-committal in the conversation about baseball versus football. He was flippant. He was uncomfortable. He said few words, and some of them didn't necessarily make sense at times. It was an awkward, weird interview, and Dan Patrick kept pushing.

I thought Dan Patrick was soft on him. I thought for somebody in that particular situation, if you're in that, situation and he's a young he's young all right he's the Heisman trophy winner I know he's had experience in this stuff and he was clearly uncomfortable um you know he was unprepared it was unprepared and he was uncomfortable and it became awkward and weird but I thought Patrick pushed he didn't just he didn't switch subjects no he didn't switch subjects at one point and I'm paraphrasing you're not really helping your situation here I would have ordered him off the set his dad was standing right there screaming at him. No comment. I'm going to watch it. No comment. His dad,

I mean, in shades of RG3, his dad is screaming off, you know, off the set. You could hear him yelling, no comment. No, when Dan said, what about it, dad? Because the father clearly was having an influence on what the kid was saying. It's the kind of situation. Look, in this day and age, I say it all the time, and you see evidence of it all the time, media. affects everything from the front office to the football field. This guy is going to be your face of your franchise, your CEO on the football on the football field. If you're a team that's interested in Kyle or Murray,

you have to bring him in for an interview and you got to say, hey, what happened here? And if you're happy with the explanation, you move on from it. That's fine. But you got, you got to get an answer for, I mean,

it would have been easy to say, look, I love baseball. I love football. I have a real difficult decision. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's, I'm fortunate to happen to be in a situation where I have these choices. Uh, I'm still weighing my options.

It would have been easy to say. Instead, he, he came off like as, as, as a, as a moron. But you know what I, and in watching him get interviewed during the course of the season a couple of times, none of those interviews done with, you know, I'm trying to think. who did him. I don't think it was Herb Street. Somebody before that playoff did a lengthy interview with Kyler Murray and it was I thought it was much more impressive than it was unimpressive. So it could have just been a bad moment. Sometimes we get way too wrapped up in judging people

in their worst moments. But you have to explain that moment to somebody because you can't have that's fair. You can't have that guy. The guy that we saw that guy can't be the face of your franchise. Yeah, because it speaks to, you know, a lack of confidence, a lack of leadership, a lack of quick thinking, maturity, maturity, a lot of those things. So you do bring him in and you play it and you say, what happened? What happened here? You know, and maybe he says, you know, my father was over, you know, overwhelming. Maybe that was it. You know, or whatever it is. And what's, what's if he says that? You say, next. Yeah. Well, I don't know if you say,

next. To me, I'm still watching the tape, and I'm watching his games. And I'm not, you know, and I'm going to be there for the pro workout. In this town? Because haven't gone through the father and son situation? I understand that. I understand that. I actually think that he has some things, we've got time to get there, but there are some things he does to me that are more impressive than what RG3 did in college. I think he's got better anticipation. There's just some things in terms of the way. I'm not down on him as a player.

I'm not down on him as a player by any stretch, not at all. The one thing you could see about RG3 at Baylor is he was a track star in a football uniform. He was a straight line fast guy. And I always use the basketball comparison when it comes to this. And I have no idea if he's a good basketball player or not. But people that know what I'm talking about will identify with this, that there are really good athletes who are physically strong, physically fast, physically quick that can't play basketball because they have no vision, they have less coordination. Like their coordination is dwarfed by their overwhelming speed size strength.

And I personally, if I were looking for football players and looking for skill position football players, I want guys who can play basketball. Did you see the video out there of Pat Mahomes playing basketball? I bet he's a good basketball player. He's got incredible vision. You know, RG3 didn't have that vision. It was, man, can this dude, you know, he can run a 4-340. He can run a 4-4-40. And he had a big arm and he was strong and he was a workout warrior.

but you could see the dude as a basketball player playing a pickup game coming down on a three-on-one fast break and dribbling it right into the one defender. You know, that's the kind of thing he had where Kyla Murray is different. I agree. You can see the overall coordination, vision part of being an athlete. I'm not down on him as a player at all. I'd be very interested in him as a quarterback prospect. but I'd want some answers.

Okay. I think that's it for today, unless you got something else. I got places to go, people to sick. Yes, you do. You're very important. So you go do your things. I've got a couple things to do today. Thanks to Aaron and thanks to all of you for listening.

Tommy will be back Thursday. I'll be back tomorrow. Lining up a guest or two for tomorrow show. It seems like it's been forever since we've had a guest. Am I right about that? Oh, we had Cooley on Friday. I guess I don't really consider him to be a guest. necessarily. But anyway,

all right, enjoy the day.