The Kevin Sheehan Show - SVP On Buzz & Willard

Episode Date: April 2, 2025

Kevin opened the show with Ovechkin, the intro press conference for Buzz Williams in College Park, and the latest on Bengals' defensive end Trey Hendrickson. ESPN's Scott Van Pelt jumped on to talk about the Terps hiring Buzz Williams and his conversation with former Maryland Basketball Coach Kevin Willard.  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheyenne Show. Here's Kevin. Carlson walks the line. They flood that far side. Carlson steps in looking for the deflection.

Scal. Alex Ovechkin. Four tallies to hockey immortality. That is a layup. What a passing play. There's wife in the house celebrating that goal. The fans celebrating here. Boston. It's as loud as I've heard for a visiting team. They're not here to really watch their team.

They want to watch the Washington Capals and they want to watch Ovi. How nice is it to hear the voice of Craig Lachlan back in the booth on the call with Joe Beninati last night for Alex Ovechkin's 891st career goal. He's three away from Tyne Gretzky, four away from the all-time NHL. record. The show's presenting sponsor is always, Window Nation, 86690 Nation, windonation.com if you need new windows. Mention my name, I promise you, they'll take really good care of you. Scott's going to be on the show with us today to talk about the hiring of Buzz Williams and what went down prior to the hiring of Buzz Williams. Scott Van Pelt, next segment, probably the final segment of the show as well.

So you heard Locker describing the Boston fan reaction to Ovechkin's first period goal last night. I think you're going to get a lot of that down the stretch here. Now, Boston stinks. They are pretty much out of the playoff picture. I think they've got the worst record in the East. They've lost like nine games in a row. Boston's got great hockey fans. They were there to sort of witness this historic chase.

I think you're going to get a lot of that over the final five road games that the Caps have. Now, if he sets the record before their fourth and fifth road game, you won't get it. It'll be over. But they play five road games out of their final eight tonight at Carolina. Now, Carolina is a really good team. They've got the second best record in the East. But I bet if he scores tonight that there is a warm, you know, embrace of that. Carolina is not going to catch the caps in the standings.

They're 11 points behind Washington in the standings. They play two road games against the Islanders. They play a road game against Columbus. And then they finish the season with a road game in Pittsburgh. Imagine if it comes down to that. We've talked about that before. I had Joe B on the show, radio show, I think, maybe a month and a half ago. And I said, what if it came down to the final game of the year at Pittsburgh

and he broke the record on the ice of the biggest arch rival. He said that Pittsburgh fans would totally respect that moment. And there's a healthy respect among the organizations. There's a healthy respect between Crosby and Ovechkin. That would be pretty wild. I know most people would love to see them do it at home. And still, based on the pace he's on, and he's on a ridiculous pace. He's got five goals in his last eight games.

he's got now 38 goals in 58 games. He's fourth, tied for fourth, for goals in the NHL. If he had not missed that chunk of the season, he may be the leader in goals scored at this point. But he's still, I think, on pace to break the record, either Saturday, April 12th, I'm sorry, Sunday, April 13th, at home against Columbus, or Tuesday, April 15th, on the road against the Islanders.

That would be the game before the season finale at Pittsburgh. History, man, we're going to witness it. It's going to be really cool when he gets to, let's say he gets a goal tonight, and now he's three away from the record, two away from tying it. That makes every game moving forward must watch because he could do it that night. You know, he's already had multiple hat tricks this season. So he's four away from breaking it, three away from tying it. The Caps won last night.

They've got the best record in the East, the second best record in the NHL, one point behind Winnipeg, who's played one more game. It's also becoming a little bit more clear in terms of the potential opponents for the Caps, because it's kind of bunched up, and it was bunched up even more recently for the final wildcard spot. The Caps is the one seed, and that's what they're going to be. they'll play the de facto eight seed or the second wild card team. And right now that would be Montreal if the season were over. But, you know, very close behind Montreal are Columbus and the Rangers. So Montreal, Blue Jackets, Rangers, among those three teams,

you'll probably get the Caps first round opponent in the NHL playoffs, which start two weeks from this coming weekend. Remember, the Caps have not won a playoff series since winning the Cup. So two other things real quickly, and then we'll get to Scott. The first of which is Buzz Williams was introduced today as Maryland's new head coach out in College Park. To be honest with you, there's nothing significant sound clip-wise to bring to the show. He was, he's a great communicator. had a sense of humor talking about his family.

And, you know, there's definitely this kind of preacher element to his communication style, clearly very bright. And there just wasn't anything, you know, overly significant in terms of new information from the presser today. So other than that, I would just say a day later, I kind of feel the same way. I think Maryland did a really good job considering the circumstances to land on somebody like Buzz Williams with that resume. I still wish that they would have thought much bigger and at least taken, you know, a huge swing at a guy like Chris Beard. I don't know if he would have come. He may end up taking the Texas A&M job. But I've found it interesting over the last three hires, Turgeon, Willard, and Buzz Williams, that Maryland hasn't thought. bigger. In 2011, they did think Sean Miller first, but in 23 years ago, I was advocating for

Patino. I was fine with Kevin Wildard. I thought Kevin Wildard was a really good coach at Seton Hall. But I thought that Patino would be a big swing for a program that could use not only big winning, but a big personality to really reinvigorate the fan base. And this time, Buzz Williams is a hell of a coach. Don't get me wrong. And given the situation they were in, I think they did well, really well. But I just would have wanted a bigger swing or even an out-of-the-box swing, something I talked about with Jeff Herman the other day. You know, a Luke Murray, the assistant at Yukon. I certainly would have thought, you know, about something like that. And I was going to support anything because I'm a Maryland guy. And if Dwayne Simpkins had gotten a job with just two years

of head coaching experience, I would have thought, man, those people that were looking at this thing, Gary probably in particular, really thought that he had what it took to be a great head coach, even though he hadn't done it for very long. Buzz Williams can coach, man. I went back and watched a couple of the games this year, not the entire games. Definitely an excellent defensive coach. Teams play hard, they play physically, they rebound. You know, the game that they got beat in the tournament against Michigan. Michigan, you know, heard them on the glass like they did against Maryland. They had a 10-point lead Texas A&M did in the second half and blew it. I think the issue is that there are, you know, some nights where they are offensively challenged. That's been the

case with his teams at Marquette, Virginia Tech, and Texas A&M at times. And so hopefully, you know, the money will bring really good offensive players, and that will be a spot in which he grows and evolves and, you know, becomes even better. Look, I think Mark admitted this. I think Kevin admitted this. They became better coaches in the Big Ten. You know, both of them were defensive first coaches, and they both got better as offensive coaches. And maybe we'll see the same thing from Buzz Williams at Maryland. There's no doubt, man, he's going to win. His teams play hard. Yep, there is this short stint history where he's not at a place very long before he is looking for his next place. That happened at Marquette, Virginia Tech, and Texas A&M. You know, I don't think Texas A&M fans are shedding tears. I had somebody on that covers Texas A&M in College Station today, and he said, look, he is a developer of men. He's a tremendous leader, but in the people that loved the way he represented the university, they're upset.

But some of the basketball people probably are excited to see what comes next. And I think you could probably go back and find that to be the case at Virginia Tech and maybe even at Marquette as well. But he is a good basketball coach, exceptional defensive coach. He wins, and I think he will win at Maryland. I do. And, you know, in terms of the long-term nature of everything, everything's so short term now in college sports anyway.

If you told me right now he's only going to be in college park for five years, but the five years included four tournament years, two to three sweet 16s, and at least one legitimate final four national championship run, I take it and say good luck in your next job. Let's go find the next guy. Yeah, I am, you know, I'm looking forward to also the possibility that 2025, 2025, 26 is not going to be a throwaway year. It's got to keep Rodney Rice somehow.

More with Scott coming up momentarily. The other thing that I wanted to mention, there's a pretty big story today regarding Trey Hendrickson. So Trey Hendrickson, the sack leader of the last two years in the NFL, plays for Cincinnati, got permission to seek a trade. He has not found a trade for the Bengals yet. The Bengals reportedly are looking for a first and more. Washington, one of those teams that has reportedly had significant interest in Trey Hendrickson,

but not at that price. And so the executive in Cincinnati's organization, Katie Blackburn, she's the executive vice president of the Cincinnati Bengals, said during the NFL league meetings yesterday, quote, about Hendrickson, I think he should be happy at certain rates that maybe he doesn't think he'd be happy at. I think some of it is on him to be happy at some point. And if he's not, you know, that's what holds it up sometimes. So, you know, it takes him to say yes to something.

And also, we have all the respect in the world for him. So she's kind of taking shots at him at perhaps being too picky, too demanding, maybe not exactly understanding is worth, but then she says we all have the most, you know, we all have respect, all the respect in the world for him. So Hendrickson went on Pat McAfee today and said, in reaction to that, first off, yesterday was April Fool's Day. So the one thing I was hoping was that this was an April Fool's joke

in terms of her comments. I called my agent, found out it was not a joke, And that was a little disappointing because the communication has been poor over the last couple of months. Hendrickson said that the Bengals have not communicated with his agent directly about his contract saying that, quote, that it has been something that's been a little bit frustrating, closed quote. More from Trey Hendrickson. We're on the DN National Football League Street. The market value for that is going up like it did for wide.

receivers last year. Where I fit in on that road is all up to discretion. We're willing to talk about those things. With the market continuing to go up, I'm not going to apologize for that because I've been basically asking for the same thing every year to be solidified as a Cincinnati Bengal for life, closed quote. Interesting stuff, man. Obviously the two sides, Hendrickson and the Bengals at odds over his worth. Now, part of that speaks to a desire and even a willingness to do a deal with the Bengals and stay in Cincinnati. But you wonder if there are any bridges that have been burned. Hendrickson's ready to go into the final year of his contract, and he's looking for a massive deal. He wants to be

right up there. You know, I'm sure with Miles Garrett at this point or something just short of that, especially by the way with Cincinnati who just paid Jamar Chase the largest non-quarterback contract in the history of the game. And they paid T. Higgins as well. Anyway, I don't know how this plays out, but the two sides appear to be at odds and not seeing things. eye to eye. So we'll see how that shakes out between now and maybe the beginning of the draft or maybe something happens after the draft. But I would think that if picks are involved, that Cincinnati wants this to happen before the draft, if they go the path of trading him, I really thought once they signed Chase and Higgins and were able to structure the contracts in a way that

created cap space for the upcoming season, that they would certainly want Trey Hendrickson back. All right, Scott Van Pelt, after these words from a few of our sponsors. This segment of the show is brought to you by Window Nation. If you need new windows, my recommendation is Wind Donation. And right now, for every four purchased, you get four free. You buy a house full of windows. You get a free entry door. I trust Window Nation.

You should as well. They've got over 20,000 five-star reviews on Google. 96% of their installs do not require follow-up service. Windows come with a lifetime warranty and they'll save you big money, not just on the purchase. Call them at 86690 Nation or head to windownation.com if you need new windows. For free with every four you buy, no money down, no interest, no payments until the year 2027. 86690 Nation windownation.com. As promised, Scott is with me and the press conference.

Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on. I got to go buy some windows. There you go. You don't have to buy windows, but if you did buy new windows, and I think actually, Window Nation was a possibility for your new windows at your house. No, no, I just, I was compelled by the read. I was compelled by the read.

So, sorry, sorry, I didn't interrupt the where we. Yeah, go ahead. Mock me, if you will, but, you know, I have bills to pay. Listen, and again, call window nation, everybody, immediately. And you know what? The Wind Donation people, you know who they are at heart in terms of fans? Terp fans. Terps. Yep, I know it.

Big time Terp fans. Harley is a massive Terp fan. His brother is a massive Terp fan. Aaron actually really, really a huge Terps football fan. So there. All right. The press conference was a little while ago. He was introduced.

Buzz Williams was to the, local DMV and to the Maryland community. Let's focus on the here and now. We'll go backwards a little bit, but just your reaction to the hiring of Buzz Williams to be our next basketball coach. I got text after text yesterday, Kevin, from coaches who competed against him.

Names people know, talking about Buzz. No one's going to outwork this guy. I've been friends with him for years. he's quirky, he's different, he's going to win. Like, that's one I just read. He's a different kind of cat. He's, you know, his manner of speaking is almost sort of like a pastor,

and he's passionate. He pours himself into the work. He's won everywhere he's been, all right? Wanted Marquette in the Big East, one at Virginia Tech in the ACC, He wanted A&M in the SEC. And I think if you're concerned, you say, well, it's kind of a, it's been a fast burn rate, and he goes to the next place quickly. And I mentioned, excuse me, Kevin, on SportsCenter last night when I discussed it,

I said, I spoke to TIRP fans about, like, hey, listen, guys, whenever he's been, you should know that first. And I said, if I could speak to Buzz, I'd say, hey, man, you've had a rep for a guy looking for a new hill to climb when you're still climbing the hill you're on and I would just invite you to stop climbing

and settle down here and let Terp fans get behind and climb together because he's been a winner and he comes with really really really solid credentials from all those that compete against him

so I mean if he wins that's all that matters you talk about winning the press conference but I don't give a bleep about that I truly don't

if the guys I wins games next January and February, and you go into March on a line somewhere. That's all anyone gives a crap about. So I don't know. I'm rambling at the moment. Stylistically, is there a coach that you would compare them to? It's a great question. I mean, I think it's, I think it's OE and in the fact that they're going to defend and rebound.

I mean, I think they might have led the nation offensive rebounds this year. Now, part of that, they didn't shoot well. But they rebound the hell out of the ball, and they defend. I mean, it's physical and, you know, defend and board. And so, I mean, I guess, you know, is as high a praise, I think, as you can give, this is a guy that wins, you know, the league this year, and it's been in the final four a ton and all the rest. But I think it's along those lines.

I think it's, I don't think fans get. fired up about the idea grind it out 63, 58 games. So I hope it's not that. But I also think after the way it ended where Maryland couldn't get a rebound against Michigan, Colorado,

state, or Florida, if you told me, all right, they're going to board you, they're going to really get after the rebounding portion of the game. I'm like, all right, I'll take that. So, I don't know. I think that that's the first thought I have. You know, what's funny is that

the game in which they got eliminated, the Michigan game. They got out rebounded. They gave up a bunch of offensive rebounds. And we went through that, you know, the week. Was it 43 to 17? Because that's what it was. 47 to 18, I think, was what it was with us.

But no, it was not that. But he essentially after the game said, you know, for us to win, we've got to rebound better and we didn't rebound well enough. Yeah, I mean, I think you nailed it. Grinding, tough defense. but at times offensively challenged. And you know what? We lived through that during at least the first portion of the Turgeon era,

with the exceptions of the mellowed team and certainly the team in 2020. But we had a lot of those teams that won more than they lost, but not necessarily exciting basketball. I would ask you, and then I'll answer it, do you care how you win? no I but no but and like it'd be it'd be fun if winning didn't feel excruciating I mean if we're just being honest right if you like that that's what was so fun about the

so much with this team this year did was they just made shots and it's fun to see the ball go in the bucket now if you have one more than the other team obviously yay but if the process of the 40s minutes of game time and two hours of real time are just this excruciating exercise. That's not a ton of fun. So I guess I am saying I kind of care. I'd rather win while playing more

higher scoring up tempo. But I think that's probably a common refrain. Is that how you feel? Yeah, I mean, this year was certainly a lot easier than last year. But in some ways, I don't care how they win. And I enjoyed some of the tough, grinded-out teams of the mid-teens, late-teens, early-20s. I mean, the year after 2020, when he had lost all those guys and they went back to the tournament and, you know, beat Yukon before losing the Bama, I mean, that was a tough, you know, grind-out team. And they won. And, you know, I felt like it was an over-achieving season. So maybe it's more or less, I like it when I feel like they're getting the most out of what they have.

But no, I'd rather see shots go in. But one of the reasons I asked you that is, and we haven't even talked a lot about this specifically, the program has become, for the lack of a better description, more bandwagony in terms of the support. It's just the nature of how the market's changed. And, you know, you and I both probably think the move to the Big Ten has something to do with that. not a lot of March success. You know, I wonder from a business standpoint, what's more important to have a team going into a season that's perceived to be great so that you can really generate some excitement and fill the arena up and be highly ranked, even if you end up with a second round exit in March? or this year nobody thought we were any good until they got on a roll after the Big Ten,

one and three start when everybody wanted Willard fired, and it came very late in this season. You know, you'd like to have both, but it's really important, I don't know, from my standpoint, in looking at trying to get people to be more into Maryland basketball, that off-seasons into regular seasons look more like they have, you know, when the team was filling up the arena each night. We haven't had a lot of those seasons recently. No, I think it needs to be the former more than the latter. I think you need to kind of have, maybe it's an apropos way to put it.

You need to have buzz going into the season, and that's going to be hard to do anymore. I mean, look at this year. People didn't know who Kobe Gillespie was. Rodney Rice hadn't played because he'd been injured. Derek Queen was exciting because it was a local guy that stayed home when he was five stars, but like what five, like the McDonald's All-American game used to be a thing. It was on last night, and I don't, I don't know

how much people are invested in that. So a high school guy that comes in with all that, you know, acclaim that only does so much. This season, Kevin, I mean, I was super vocal about it on social media on the podcast, I do with Steve, just imploring people get out in support because you say it's a bandwagon town. I agree, But the bandwagon slow to get filled up in college park. There were a couple of really good nights there.

You know, the Michigan State game, most notably, that that building felt like a great building, and it was. But I think you need to kind of get people on board ahead of time and sort of start the process of getting the bandwagon filled rather than having it happen mid-season. And, you know, they did lose some games excruciating, like, close losses. and it prevented them from having maybe even a higher seed that they could have had. But as it is, they ended up like ranked like 11th, I want to say, in the regular season.

And it still didn't feel like the building was, you know, as great as it could be. And there's a million reasons for that. You know, there's just, there's attrition over time, and it happened to the commanders. And it's just, there's a lot of things. But I think you need to start with it rather than try to build it because it's hard to get it. to get it filled. Yeah, I think your point's a good one, too, because it's really hard to create that buzz

when you don't have any clue as to what your team's going to look like, and it changes so much year to year, and it's so... Every year. For every team. Yeah. I hate it. I hate it, too.

You know, but I still think it's possible, but somehow you've got to go into these seasons ranked top 10 in the country. You know, the last years where they had sold-out arena, as before the season started, were some of those mellow years in Diamondstone when they were preseason number two or number three. And, you know, they came back the following year, preseason number nine or whatever, and you had filled up buildings, even though ultimately he didn't go far enough in March.

Right. And anymore, even more so now, I guess I should say, like those preseason rankings are just complete guesses. True. I mean, North Carolina was preseason top 10. Yeah. They didn't finish the season ranked. and they're like should they have been in, should they have not been in?

I don't know. No need to argue it, but they weren't very good. At least they didn't win games. Kansas started the season number one. They were seven seed. They didn't win a tournament game. I mean, you're guessing as to are these guys any good? I mean, sometimes you're going to guess right.

Like Duke's really highly rated. Well, they're really good. But you just don't know from year to year because there's so much turnover. And, you know, as it is right now, you know, the line last year when Caliper, got introduced at Arkansas. And he said, well, I met the players. There are no players because he didn't have a team.

And I mean, Buzz is, I guess, in sort of the same situation now. I looked at just the last couple of years. It looks like he schedules in the non-conference aggressively. This past year, they played Ohio State. They played Oregon. And they played three big 10 teams. Oh, four of them.

They played Purdue as well. Purdue also, yeah. Last year they had Houston, they had UVA, they had Ohio State. I mean, I think that can be a big part of getting some early buzz and some early crowds, too. Because, you know, go back for us to December, Marquette was actually, you know, a decent crowd. Yeah, no, that was a good building. It was a Friday night, you know, I mean, you and I, we laugh about it, but it's, look, it's the reality. I mean, that was like a Friday 8 o'clock game, so it was kind of the sweet spot where you didn't have.

to deal with the Beltway at rush hour and all that, all the BS that we, you know, are the realities of living in this area. But yeah, I think scheduling your wrestling would be good. And obviously, winning is the recipe and always has been. So why do you think it's been, you know, high burnout, you know, short kind of expiration date on his three previous stints? I think there's an intensity to him, this work ethic, this, you know, relentless sort of drive to try to be excellent. And then again, there's just eccentricities, and he's a different, he's a different kind of cat. And, you know, I think it is interesting.

At Virginia Tech, well, no doubt football is king. at A&M, even more so although they've got dough for days and they may take a big fat swing at Chris Beard but then that would just turn into an arms race between them and Ole Miss and then obviously at Marquette

you don't have football so that that's a hoop school but I I would be guessing if I said I don't know him well enough Buzz and I just transparency like we've we've texted back and forth for years he's a he's a closed guy he's always been interested in my whole pocket square tie thing, so we bonded over that many years ago.

And I'm not kidding. Yeah. That's a true thing. You love your pocket squares. They always look sharp. I've worn him forever. Yes, you have. Long before it was a thing, I've always done it.

And so I've known him for years, and I've always, you know, I've always gotten on with him. But I also know, like, Buzz is one of one. So what were the reasons why you look for a different place? I mean, at A&M, you know, maybe he felt some of the, the same frustrations there that Kevin did. I'm completely speculating, but perhaps it's that. And, you know, maybe he benefits now from arriving at Maryland on the tail end of what,

you know, Kevin was asking for, which was a bit more support. And, you know, ironically, it came after the fact, but I know some folks that kicked some significant contributions into, you know, the NIL fund. So there'll be more for both to spend, but I don't know. I don't know. I guess it's a really long-winded answer. as to why that happened. But you would hope after a guy left after three years the way he did

that, you know, Buzz could settle in here and make it home and win, and everybody will be like, hooray. You know, over the years I've learned from, you know, not only you but other people about how as much as the outside world-viewed Maryland is a big-time basketball first school and a top-tenth-ish, top-15-ish job, there were inherent issues for multiple coaches in a row. On, you know, late last week, and I think you and I talked about this, I know we have, I suggested that maybe the, you know, chaos of the last week and a half two weeks may ironically result in a job for the next guy that's much better than the previous guys,

which would be Kevin, Mark, and even Kerry to a certain extent. Do you think that there's truth in that? I'll start by not answering it, but saying what I hope for, and I really hope so. I don't, it has to. This has to be a reckoning for Maryland to ask itself, well, let's see, Mark Turgeon decided in early December, I'm done, and let's face it, you and I know what that was about.

he felt like Damon didn't have his back and was going to fire him at the end of the year anyway, and he was done. And that was an AD-related thing. And in this case, you know, Kevin clearly had issues with that and what the perceived shortcomings and support. And it was related to the exact same thing. And so this is an opportunity for Dr. Pines and everyone in College Park to, rather than lash out and be angry at whatever.

happen, look inward, and say, all right, how can we be better? Because I think everyone understands, and if they don't, they need to, that they need to do better. And so this search for an athletic director is imperative to get that right. And you hear a word used a lot anymore when coaches are introduced to the place. They talk about alignment. And what they're talking about is president, athletic director, fan base, coach, boosters, are we aligned? And it seems that what this most recent episode is brought to the light for the public to consume is that there's a lack of alignment or a perception of everybody kind of garden their space on the block. And that's, you know, that I think would become pretty exhausting.

And so this has to be the time that Maryland's athletic department gets its self-aligned and does a great job finding a great candidate that wants to do all the things that use all the resources that are available as a result of being in the Big Ten to make Maryland great across the board athletically. Before I get to my slight disappointment that we didn't think in swing big, at the same time, this was a really difficult situation with a very short time frame. Borderline impossible. So that goes into my reaction to the higher.

I want you to describe the challenge and then to land on a guy with this resume. Yeah. Okay, well, the challenge, you have a coach that leaves in the manner in which he does. You have an athletic director who precedes the coach in leaving, which is its own, I mean, Damon manages to use the cover of Kevin to sort of sneak out the door and doesn't get any ire or anything. but like, okay, that was a fun trick. And so you have no athletic director. You have a coach that leaves. You have this deadline coming about agreements as a related to spending this NIL money that has been collected,

and you need someone on the case because the portals open, and if you don't have a coach and everyone leaves, you're doomed. And so, I mean, there's only so much I'm comfortable discussing, but I know a lot of people. I know all the agents that matter that have all the coaches that matter. I know a lot of the coaches. I know our president.

I know our boosters. I know I'm involved in a sense that I'm trying to just say, listen, here are some people that I believe you should speak to. here's some people that are open to having conversations but I'm not in the room and it's not my job to be in the room but I'm also conflicted because I care so damn much and I don't want to just stand back and watch the ride without trying to get the hands on the wheel if it's helpful

to direct it not directed to a hire other than just directed to a conversation that could find out if it could lead to a hires that makes sense yeah of course but you know I and I think I think it makes sense for everybody listening, yes. Okay, so I find myself in this really weird place where it's because of the job I've had for all these years, you know these people. And it's like I'm not trying to tamper with their lives, but you can ask, you listen to the agent. Look, you can clearly see our situation.

I realize we don't have an athletic director. There's one coach I have who's a buddy. I say a buddy. Someone I know well, you know, text throughout the season, like, hey, man, you want a really good job, and we know each other well enough for the big. Kind of coaches kind of like to know who their athletic director is going to be. And I said, yeah, I get that, but I'll sort it out for you.

You know, I mean, we're joking, but I'm not. Like, he said, yeah, man, Merrill is a great job, which, by the way, he did. He said, of course, it's a wonderful job. But, like, from the outside looking in, there's a certain amount of, like, whoa, it seems a little radioactive, right? there are things about Maryland that make it appealing but the circumstance at the moment

made it really I think kind of tricky so it was an incredibly unusual and challenging thing to try to get right and again

I'm not in the room as these conversations are going I believe Maryland said that they they analyzed like 30 different candidates I believe that's what they said and so I know a lot of names had been provided I mean, some that I know a lot of our fans are interested in, like, just name the names.

Like a guy like Luke Murray at Yukon, who's never coached a game. That would seem to be a, that's a little bit of a, maybe it's a non-starter. But in the same breath, you say, well, everyone's looking for the next Todd Golden, who had all these, you know, sort of advanced ways of looking at offense and did a lot of great things. And three years later, he's in the title game. But he had been a head coach. he had been a head coach at San Francisco. He's in the final four.

He's not in the title game yet. Did I say title game? I've been final four. He's the Florida coach for those that don't know, Todd Golden. My mistake. Sorry. Then you have someone like Tony Skinner, another guy who I know well,

who I know is passionate about Maryland basketball and coached at Maryland, did a wonderful job at George Mason. Like, there's a candidate that you can consider. So it's like there's all these different people that are in the mix. And then you have, and I'll just say this. Like I know Chris Beard and I understand what happened at Texas. And I also understand that the respect that he has within the coaching community among his peers,

there is saying that guy right there, if you could talk to that guy, you couldn't get a better coach than Chris Beard. And so, you know, that's a swing that I think a lot of Maryland fans. And I would raise my hand and say, I'd love to see you take a swing just a swing, just at a conversation and just try to vet out. What happened there? I mean, where are you now to take the coaching out of it? But then is this a job that's appealing?

I don't even know if you have the money to get down that road as it relates to him because, you know, they've got a lot of money in the SEC. But that conversation between those two parties, I don't believe happened. But they had to try to put, they tried to put. They tried to have to put together a list, and it would have been like speed dating, but not speed dating to say, hey, you want to go out. You want to go to Uncle Julio's Thursday. Hey, you want to go out and you want to get married on Saturday. Literally, that's the situation you're at.

Yeah, and you know, you kind of went through the follow-up on the thinking big, but you, that's what I said in, you know, on the show yesterday and even today is that given the circumstances, to end up with a Buzz Williams with that kind of resume, you know, nine times out of ten, you probably don't even have that as an option. And there are reasons that he was available, too, which you have to consider. But you kind of answered the question, you know, and I've said this to you a million times, I wanted us to think big after Gary retired. I wanted us to think big three years ago in the way of Rick Petino. And Chris Beard would have been number one on my list. And I have no idea if he would have taken the gig or not because of, you know, southern, you know, locales that he might prefer and big money.

But anyway, you said something to me that I shared with everybody the other day, and I think you've shared it as well, is that at least somebody along the line here recently referred to Maryland still as a Monday night job. And that is good to hear. I think it's much less than what we used to think it was, but it's still Big Ten, tradition, arena, fan base, DMV, recruiting, the whole thing. So, you know, you don't have to tell everybody who told you that, but I know that that made you feel somewhat better about the gig, too.

I'm not going to tell you who said it, but I'll just say this. It would make you feel good to know who the coach was that said that, okay? they would make you feel good to know who viewed the job through that sort of lens. That Maryland is, that's a Monday night job, and don't let anybody tell you it's not. They're like, okay, you don't have to tell me. I'm the one that might need to convince everybody else that it's not, for whatever reasons that they might hold against it or say it's not what it once was. And the whole top this or that job anymore, here's what matters.

And it's largely, I think the reason that Kevin, I mean, there's a lot of reasons. that Kevin went back to Nova and back to the Big East is what I mean. And you're atop, whatever job you are based on what your donor's threshold of being willing to dig in their pocket is. It's that simple. And I think that for all the people that are convinced that you're a poverty program or something, well, no, actually, that's not even close to being accurate. And part of the reason NIL was slow to get going was that Kevin was very anti-that. that didn't think it was that didn't didn't i don't think initially realize how critical it would be

and then they suffered through a year where they you know the last season where they just couldn't make shots and were so jemir dependent and um then to his credit it was like well we're not doing that again and they were more active in the portal hit home runs and it had the season that they had um but the nil uptick is uh has been i'm happy for the people that work their ask off to try to raise money because at the 11th hour, a bunch of it came in. And so it's not like Maryland doesn't have that. They have that, and that's what's important now. But then you do have the tradition.

You do have the recruiting base. You do have a fan base that win the buildings, right? It's one of the best there is. Everybody heard his O'Reave about that night. By the way, how about Holloman? He's in the portal. The guy that hit that shot that night. Is he?

Yeah. And when the portal, had a brutal, had a brutal game against Auburn. I think he was over 10 from three. tears. But I mean, that guy's a, you know, I appreciated the passion of that guy.

I think it reflected who Michigan State is. That has nothing to do that we're talking about. Anyway, I don't know where we were other than the... Well, let me just... The job is...

The job is still, is still seen as appealing. And I think in a different climate, with an AD and without having sort of the clock ticking as loud as it was, you know, maybe the search could have been different, might have been different. I don't know, but to land on a coach that if he wanted out of A&M,

that's part of the reason why he's available, but his resume is a hell of a lot better than the fans that are just mad who want to be predisposed to be mad about everything anyway. The guy that's 100 in the ACC, the Big East, and the SEC is a guy that's one. By the way, as great as this year was from Maryland, as much fun as we had? What line are we on? Same line as A&M for. there you go so you know i just want to clarify for people and i mentioned it yesterday but the monday night job thing for those of you that don't aren't really into college basketball the championship games played on

monday night and so the monday night job reference is you can win a national championship you can be playing in that monday night game at maryland all right two more i want to finish it up with a question about the future and a question about the past i'll start with the past is in the immediate past how much fun was this year to watch this team? I loved it. I loved it so much. It was, it was,

it felt like what Maryland basketball was supposed to feel like. If games felt big, teams made shots, I was thrilled to see, you know, the nights where Queen tapped into all of the, his basketball genius and was putting it all out there on display.

and you're like, gosh, this guy has something special. And, you know, one day it would be Miguel, and then it would be Rodney, it would be Jacoby, it would be all of them, whatever. It was such a, it was such a blast. It was a joyride. And I was thrilled for them. I was thrill for Kevin and the staff.

And I was thrilled for the fans. Like, it was fun. It felt like Maryland basketball supposed to feel. And, you know, look, you run into Florida, and, like, four is better. They're deeper. They got, like, nine or ten guys that they can cycle in, and it was going to take,

something outrageous to knock them off, and Maryland hung for 20. And then, you know, I don't know what role sort of the cloud of questions played in what happened in that 20 minutes. Maybe some, but more than anything, it was just Florida was a better team. But it was really, really a joyride. And I made it a point to get out there as often as I could. saw a bunch of games, took the fam out. And it was, I had a blast watching Maryland basketball this year. One other one related to this year's team, because we will, as Maryland basketball fans, we always debate on the past. Joe Smith or Derek Queen, better freshman season.

Joe Smith. Why? Joe Smith. More important, when it happened, where Maryland was, how it helped launch the, trajectory. You and I were in the cap center that day were Simpkins hit the floater at the end, and you know, he outplayed Othella Harrington, and

that was like a national wait a minute, who is this dude kind of a thing, and he went one. You know, Queens, probably a lottery, definitely a lottery pick, I think, based on things, but I think, I think also

Kevin, the the fact that it was so shocking how much better he was that anyone knew. And Queen, Queen was, and this isn't a matter who is better,

but I mean, in terms of this season, I think that Smith was a revelation that it was a just shocked people, including us, whereas Queen was the guy that lived up to what you thought

he could be. And, you know, he hit a forever shot. You know, the irony of which is, had he missed it, it might have been better for Maryland.

Right. Because Kevin would have, Kevin would have taken the job, and then Medved would have been available, and you could have tried to steal him from Minnesota. You know what I mean? Think how messed up that is what I'm saying. But as fun as that one singular moment was, you know, it would have advanced the speed at which things inevitably ended up the way they did.

You know, with Kevin going to Nova. All right. More to go with Scott after these words from a few of our sponsors. This segment of the show is brought to you by MyBooky. If you're looking to bet the final four, my recommendation is to go to my bookie.orgie. And use my promo code, Kevin D.C. You'll get a cash bonus on your initial sign-up when you use my promo code, Kevin D.C. So extra money into your account to wager with.

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Then you've got Dallas at plus 680 and the Giants at plus 2,800. So Washington clearly the second pick in the NFC East, not a surprise, but Philly's at minus 143, so you've got to wager $143 to win $100 or $14.30 to win $10. For Washington, you bet $100, you win $196 if they win the division, far different than it was this time last. year, that's for sure. MyBooky.ag. Use my promo code. Kevin, DC. All right. The idea that maybe next year won't be as horrific as some thought, how much is next year in play? Who are they going to get? Who's going to be on this team? What are you? I'm allowed to cuss, right? Yeah. What are you fucking joking? What am I? What am I? A wizard? Yes. I want to hear how you think...

Well, then give me, give me your... Give me what you're hoping happens over the next week or so. Well, I did notice that the big man that played for Minnesota who transferred to A&M pain. Pain is in the portal with a do-not-contact tag. Now, that typically means the guy knows where he's going. Perhaps he could come with Buzz. to college park. That would be a great start as a big man who's really, really talented and plays

incredibly hard. I have no earthly idea if that's in play. I would love for them to say to Rodney Rice, Rodney, how much would you like? You know, his father's been very vocal about wanting how much he enjoys being home. I believe that they were hoping it might be Tony Skin, who by the way, you know, it could be a great coach of Maryland someday. That's a guy I like a lot that I'll continue to support him at Mason. I'd love for, you'd love for Rice to stick around, and I think

I mean, Gillespie has been presumed, you know, quietly people for the last month have been saying he's going to Tennessee for a giant number. Well, now maybe it'll be Nova, but I don't think there's any chance that it's here. And then the rest will be, you know, you'll have to get

seven or eight guys from who the hell knows where. And You know, they'll put on the Maryland uniform and we'll cheer for them, and hopefully they have important games to play in the springtime. But I don't have the foggiest idea of what the roster would or could look like. I know on Erman's board, the Inside Maryland Sports Board, there were some people linked some players that had been linked to going to visit A&M when Buzz was there. and I don't know,

could they be convinced to come visit College Park? I hadn't known the names of the players because they weren't guys that were on Maryland's radar because we were sort of stuck in this limbo spot, but I don't know. I have no idea. But whoever they are,

I know you, me, and all the Maryland fans are listening to us, we'll cheer for them and hope that they, you know, hope that they can have a fun season. I mean, what else can we do? Talk to you later. doing this. Wait, wait, wait, wait. I have some important. I want to, I do want to mention. Okay. Because I think it's important. Full transparency, you know Kevin and his

family, so do I. You and I both had things to say about how this ended. I got a phone call last night from Kevin, and I'm not going to get into what was said specifically. Fair to say that, you know, voices get raised on both sides. at times, because I'm sure he wasn't thrilled about what I had to say. And I made it clear that, you know, I thought I spoke on behalf of Maryland fans that weren't thrilled with how it ended. But we also had a lot of last, and we're able to share the affinity that we have for one another. And, again, I'm not going to get into the specifics other than to say that he sincerely enjoyed

being the coach of Maryland. And I believe that this ended because of what happened from the frustration of what happened with the athletic director. And not knowing what was going on and being, you know, thinking this is the guy who's your AD and then all of a sudden he's out the door. And that was really leaves a guy in a spot where you, you don't have any idea who your boss is going to be. And that coincides with an opportunity that comes in a conference that you know well

and a job that's got great fun. These are my words, not his. And so I just, I get that our fans have a lot of anger in their hearts. I know I was angry about this, the way it all happened. but I also think that we can lay our arms down here and pitchforks and say that the guy and his family on the way out all the best in what comes next, you know what I'm saying? You can like the person and not like the way something happened, but I just, I'm just going to say I'm glad I had that conversation with Kevin and I appreciate him calling me.

And I wanted, you know, our fans to know, like, I don't know that they give us. shit that he called me. What do we, what do they care? Maybe you don't, but I did. I did. And so I'm, I'm glad that that conversation happened. And, you know, I don't, I don't like how it ended. And look, I wanted him to stay because I liked him. I think you and I both said that. Yep. I think, you know. I thought he was a good coach. He is a good coach. Well, because he is. And, and I thought he fit Maryland, because as I said from the beginning, we all know 10 guys just like a ballbuster from Jersey

right that is a sports guy and one of us and now he's not anymore and that's okay that's okay it's a bummer how it all went Marilyn's going to cheer for Buzz he's going to go to Villanova

but uh I just I wanted it out there that that happened just so people didn't think that I'm sitting around you know seething about him and or and all the all of what transpired. Look, you said it, and I said the same thing, to each other the last few days. A, life's too short to be that level of angry as some people are.

And B, you know, in this world of college sports, especially, it happens all the time, and the coaches, they have every right to try to better their situation if the one they're in isn't, you know, to their liking. And there were things that he had to deal with that a lot of fans have no idea and had no idea. Until, by the way, the last couple of weeks. And at the same time, at the same time, there was a better way for him to exit. And at the same time, it was a look-in-the-mirror moment for Maryland because it wasn't just him. It was two coaches who I know most of those message board people that you say, hate my

guts don't think could coach a lick. Most coaches actually think they're both excellent coaches, and they lost both of them because they didn't want to be here anymore. So, you know... And now, but the one thing is, I think that was related to somebody else who's not here anymore, and I'm not going to throw anything anyone else under the bus, and just we wish everyone well who's not here anymore. This is a chance for Maryland to get it right, and they have to, because this kind of stuff is beneath an institution that's this great, and it's beneath

a fan base that cares the way that ours does, and so pull the rope in the same direction. This is the thing that has to happen as a result of this. But I do want you to know, Kevin, I think that the way you handle the interview and a lot of the coverage

that you had in the situation, I think some of those people, I don't think they don't hate you as much anymore. I think they're coming to see I think they're coming to see some of the greatness in Kevin Shee. I really do. I don't think so. But as you know, I don't really care.

You're plugging away. You're going to win those posters over. You just keep your head down. Yeah, I'm really interested in winning the posters over. I just don't want you to post anymore. I've been begging you for how many years to stay away from that. Yeah, you used to. I don't. I'm not involved. I know. But for all of those years, you were involved, what would I say to you? Just what are you doing? What are you doing? You're a grown person. You're an adult. Stop this. Hey, hey, but hold on. Hold on. All that, all that is, all those places are. Passion.

No, and, well, yes, passion, but it's also just Twitter. It's all Twitter is. All Twitter is is the comment section. That's all it is. And I know you don't do a lot of that either. But, no, I really think, Kevin, you should feel good about it. Oh, okay. You're winning. You're winning them over. Really appreciate that. You know what? You know what's so ironic about this? is that you and I have always loved the, you know, almost unhinged passion of our basketball fan base. You know, going back- A bunch of mutants. Yeah, but going back so many years of Long Island, Jersey, South Jersey, Philly, Eastern Shore, Dundalk, Baltimore, and that's what this inferiority complex, this

backed into a corner, being treated like the red-headed stepchild of the ACC for all those years. There you go. We embraced it. We loved it. Loved it. And I still do love that part of it. It's still the best building on its best night, maybe, you know, certainly in the top three or four. And part of it is because the other team feels it.

It's that guttural, that real, you know, bloodthirsty environment. It's one of the reasons I love it so much and we've both been a part of it. But man, there is sometimes with the reaction to basketball coaches. Look, Gary went through it, you know, getting stuck on the Sweet 16 all of those years and people wanting him out before he made a final four in a national championship run. But there's just an element at times that it's like, God, be realistic. I mean, one in three in the Big Ten, and these people were screaming for him to be out. They don't want him anymore. It was a bad hire.

He can't win on the road. He can't win close games. And now they're, then they were really upset that he was thinking about leaving. But I'll also add, I know it's not unique just to Maryland. Any passionate fan base can become, at times, a bit. unhinged and a bit kind of, you know, unrealistic about what this situation is. And by the way, sometimes it's because they just don't have all the information. Honestly, honestly, though, I think it's important, and no one will care and they'll tell me to

fuck off, and that's fine. It's an invitation for the university looking at the mirror, but also, like, you've got to be real about what are, what's the, where are we? Like, what are we as a program, you know? and my guy, Sanford Steve, like, he loves it. He loves it here. He loves Terps fans, but he's just like, who do you all think you are? Right, I know.

You had a two-year window. A two-year window. Well, that's not. That's not true. No, I'm talking about, I'm talking about as being a Final 14. Right. That's only happened twice in our life, and you all run around and want to act like you're this blue blood that's above it all.

And it's like, man, there's a lot that's really good. about it a lot. But it's imperative to be real about. We're like the guy that was the, you know, the quarterback in high school that looks in the mirror and you've got a bald head and a gut, and you're like, nah, nah, I'm still the guy. I'm going to take the homecoming queen home tonight. Like, are you, buddy?

Like, I'm not saying we're fat and sloppy and old. I'm just saying you've got to be realistic sometimes about the space you occupy and then figure out how can you be the best version of that and how can you get the program back to the place where everybody wants to be. So, I don't know. Look, we're part of it. We love it. We just want to see it be the best version of what it can be.

Yeah, 100%. I mean, by the way, I just want to make one thing clear. I never want us to lose that sort of on-the-edge passion. You know, I don't want it to be Duke or UVA blue, you know, blazer orange tie crowd. I'd never want to be a part of that, not a part of that, but, you know, like that. I would never want our fan base to be that kind of a fan base. I enjoy the kind of unhinged, you know, environment that, you know, we get on those special nights, the passion that Maryland basketball fans have, which can,

be a bit, you know, over the top at times. I do love that. But what you just said is true. And, you know, maybe it wasn't true 20 years ago. Maybe we were who we thought we were 20 years ago. But it's been two decades since that. You know, I'm, it has been. So, all right. So, let's let's get back to, let's, maybe we got a coach that can make it a Monday night job again. You know what I mean? I would invite people wherever you, wherever you find yourself, on this, you know, conversation and how you feel about how one thing ended and the thing started. It's like all that matters is if Buzz can get a bunch of folks in here that can win games. We throw our voices and our weight in our pocketbooks behind it and try to support our

university. You know, that's what we've got to try to do. So I know you do. I know I do, and I know a lot of the folks listening do. So there we go turps and nobody else. Rodney Rice, stay home. All right. I'll talk to you later. Thanks, brother. Scott Van Pelt, everybody. I had no idea that he was going to talk about his conversation with Kevin Willard last night. All right. Done for the day. Back tomorrow with Tommy.