The Kevin Sheehan Show - Take Tee Off Washington FA List

Episode Date: February 18, 2025

Kevin opened with thoughts on another bad night for the NBA and its joke of an All-Star game. Kevin talked about the NFL news today that the Cincinnati Bengals plan on using the franchise tag on WR Tee Higgins for a 2nd consecutive season. Hall of Famer Gary Williams jumped on to talk about red-hot Maryland who beat Iowa 101-75 for its 7th win in the last 8.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheon Show. Here's Kevin. Wind Donation is the presenting sponsor of this podcast. Call them at 86690 Nation or head towindonation.com if you need new windows. A quick show today on this President's Day 2025.

Gary Williams will be with me and we'll talk college basketball and the Terps in particular who got another win yesterday. Outscoring Iowa. in the second half by 30 to win by 26 in College Park. Maryland moves up to 20th in the country in both polls after winning for the seventh time in their last eight games. Gary Williams will join me later on in the show. So I'm going to confess something because I promise that I would not watch any of this, I think on Thursday's show with Tommy or maybe on Friday's show.

but I did watch some of last night's All-Star event, scrimmage, exhibition, whatever that was. I wasn't going to watch. I turned on SNL's 50-year anniversary show, and I thought that that was kind of insufferable to watch. Kind of boring, not really that funny in most spots. Watched it for about an hour, and then I decided to give the All-Star game or whatever that thing was,

the tournament, the mini tournament between three NBA teams and, you know, a rising stars G-League, you know, combination team. The whole thing concocted, you know, after the NBA players last year treated the All-Star game like it was a horse contest. And, you know, they got urged by a lot of people in the league, a lot of former players last year to take the thing a little bit more seriously, but they couldn't. And so Adam Silver came up with last night's, you know, whatever that thing was. I watched, you know, more of what I saw last year except in short form. It was not a basketball competition.

It was more of a skills exhibition, which is what we've seen the last few years, except last night they played a game to 40 with no clock. The players didn't take it seriously. Winning the exhibition appeared to mean very little. Steph Curry fired a few half-court shots in the, I guess they called it the championship game. He did make one of them. It was, you know, Mattador, get out of the way, defense. It was another kind of disrespectful mockery of the higher-ups in the league that had been trying to get the league's all-star players to stop chasing

everybody away from this weekend and from this game. It was once a marquee league event. You know, it was even considered a traditional, you know, sports event, you know, not to the extent maybe that the midsummer classic is in baseball, but there was a time that the NBA's All-Star game had a place with some stature, you know, on the sports calendar. Not anymore. You know, the league stars couldn't be bothered with what their employers and fans wanted. So we got something last night that before it even ended, Kenny Smith on the TNT broadcast said, quote, I think they're going to change the format back, closed quote. You know, for the NBA, they should hope that there's enough interest left to see if Kenny Smith is right.

like to worry about whether or not Kenny Smith is right, to care about whether or not Kenny Smith is right. Last year was the second lowest rated All-Star game ever on television, eclipsing the worst ever, which was the year before. Last year, they had a marginal gain in audience because they went back to the East versus West format. I would imagine last night did not do very well. The TV numbers are not out as of the recording of this podcast.

In addition to it not being a competition, again. The thing was constantly interrupted with Kevin Hart and the TNT crew kind of congratulating each other for, you know, God knows what. Look, I'm a huge fan of the TNT studio show, always have been, the show with Ernie Johnson and Chuck and Shaq and Kenny, but they were asked to interrupt the proceedings last night because I guess the short form nature of these scrimmages were just too short. so they needed more time to run the commercials? I don't know. The whole thing was a mess from the start.

I didn't see it from the start, but I did a little bit of reading today, and there's not much in the way of compliments that you can find about last night. But assuming the audience hated it, disliked it as much as I think they did, the NBA better hope that anger is the emotion rather than apathy. You know, it's possible that this event has been. burned enough customers, you know, chased enough fans away that indifference is the emotion rather than being pissed off. You know, anger means they've got another shot at fixing this, I guess. But if people have moved on from caring, they should move on. You know, I don't care. But me not

caring is not as big of a deal as, say, a younger audience. My youngest son, who is an NBA fan, Last night, I asked him once I turned it on, are you watching this? And he said, what? And I said, the NBA All-Star thing. And he said, oh, my God, I forgot that that was on. He's a fan of the league. How about this from Draymond Green before last night's game? He was not an All-Star, by the way.

Dramon Green said, quote, I had to work so hard to play on Sunday night of All-Star weekend. And because ratings are down and because the game, bad. We're bringing in rising stars. That's not a fix. I never played in the rising stars game. My first two years, I didn't touch that game. And these guys get to touch the all-star floor on Sunday night? I mean, he also called the product boring right now, the overall NBA product. I mean, this is a look in the mirror moment. I'm not saying specifically for Draymond Green, but for the players. The reason there was a need to fix it was because the players turned the game into a

non-game. Last year in particular, a selfish, completely detached moment for many of the league's players and Adam Silver couldn't risk it again. So they tried to come up with something. How about this quote from Kevin Durant? Quote, I think when you get events like this All-Star Weekend, we don't worry about the competition. It's just more about celebrating the basketball family and the community around this time. It's a cool time, closed quote. You know, give Kevin Durant some credit for at least being honest, you know, that this is

about them, not about anybody else. You know, the best players in the game getting a chance once a year to be together and celebrate each other. I would imagine that they have a blast together. You know, so good for him, good for them. I would suggest let them take the week off, celebrate each other next year, just don't subject the rest of us to it. You know, that is a within the league and within that all-star community,

you know, it's an exclusive kind of group there. You know, call it NBA celebration weekend. Put it on the e-network. You know, do something where, you know, they celebrate their All-Star status with each other. You know, maybe they put cameras and wireless mics, you know, into the mix, and they do it at a high-end restaurant or a club. And people who are interested in the conversations back and forth and the good time that the All-Stars are having and celebrating each other can watch and the rest of us can move on.

I mean, things change. Things don't last forever. Not everything does anyway. The NBA All-Star game, I think, is on the verge of becoming a thing of the past. There's still money to be made, so they'll continue to attempt to do it, but maybe do it in some sort of entertainment show, celebration show format. I'm being serious about that because nobody's interested in what they're putting out there in terms of the product, the basketball product. And really, the truth is the NBA should focus much more. on fixing the big problem that they have. And that is their actual competition product.

You know, the regular season is really tough to watch. I personally, as many of you know, I really like the NBA postseason. It's completely different than the regular season. It's a completely different product. The regular season is horrendous. So, you know, ditch the All-Star game. Let the players have the week off. Let the All-Star players, you know, do a, you know, televised celebration.

Put on, you know, put it on the, what's that, the movie network or the Stars Network. Is that what it's called? Or VH1. Let them celebrate their own. You know, let them do that. And deal with the real problem. You know, focus on the real problem. The game from October through the end of March,

is really difficult for a lot of basketball fans like me. By the way, there was some talk after the hockey event this weekend, which apparently went very well, was super intense. I'd be lying to you if I told you I watched any of it live. I saw some of the highlights I read about it, but that the four-team-four international squad tournament that they had, that it could inspire the NBA to do what they've discussed in the past, which is do an all-star game where it's international stars versus American stars.

I wonder whether or not there would be enough to fill out an entire international team because you'd have certainly eight or nine legitimate international all-stars. Do you have 12? Who knows? And would that rob two or three American all-stars of, you know, earning that? label for the weekend. I'm not personally interested in this, to be honest with you, because I doubt it would work. I think there was a time where I would have been interested in something like this, but it's not going to work more likely than not because the NBA players of today, they've made

it very clear. This is not a weekend in which the majority of them intend on being a part of a competition. This is a new, you know, group of players who could not care less about magic and Bird and Michael and Kobe in the way they approached this. You know, it was a mid-February spectacle, but they also respected the, you know, the competition part of it. And that's not what this group in majority want to do with this event. They want to celebrate each other, as Kevin Durant said. They don't want it to be a competitive event. So we'll see. Maybe that'll be the last gasp attempt at it next year.

All right. There is some breaking news from the NFL that I am looking at right now right in front of me. So I will get to that next. And then Gary Williams will join me in the final segment of the show. We'll get to all of that and more after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey, guys, prize picks is the place to go to for daily fantasy sports. I have the prize picks app. I'm one of the over 10 million members at prize picks

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but they'll give you additional cash, a bonus to bet with on top of whatever your deposit is. So use my promo code to get it. They've got everything you need for college basketball between now and right through the NCAA tournament. Some of their draft prop bets are up. The favorite to be the number one pick in the NFL draft at MyBooky is Miami quarterback Cam Ward. He's minus 141. I guess I'm surprised that he's that big of a favorite. Abdul Carter, the pass rusher from Penn State, is actually the second choice to go number one overall at play.

plus 220, and then it's Shudur Sanders, the Colorado quarterback at plus 450, and then Heisman trophy winner Travis Hunter, plus 500. Cam Ward, I think, is the best quarterback in the upcoming draft. I don't think he's anywhere near where Jaden was this time last year, or even Caleb Williams was this time last year, but I do like Cam Ward. I think he's going to have a chance at the next level. A lot of what he does really well translates to today's NFL, but I am surprised that he is that hefty of a favorite. I mean, it's not an overwhelming favorite by any stretch of the imagination, but he is minus money at minus 141 to go number one overall. Go to my bookie.orgie.org, use my promo code, Kevin, DC. So the breaking NFL news this afternoon, the Cincinnati Bengals are going

to use the franchise tag for a second consecutive season on wide receiver T. Higgins. This is, I think, important information for many of you who either have him at the top or near the top of your Washington free agent wish list. T. Higgins would have been the number one free agent on the market had he hit the market as an unrestricted free agent, but there are many reports out there, including this one from s.i.com that say the Bengals will place the non-exclusive franchise tag on T. Higgins for a second straight season. The tag window officially opens tomorrow at 4 p.m. It lasts for two weeks until March 4th at 4 p.m. So they have two weeks to place the non-exclusive franchise tag on Higgins. Now, a lot of the reporting is indicating that this isn't for

him to play 2025 under a one-year $26.8 million tag salary, but that they believe they can get a long-term deal worked out with T. Higgins to stay in Cincinnati. Apparently, he has a new agent, and the Bengals plan to sign him to a long-term deal. Now, keep in mind, Jemar Chase is going to get a long-term deal in this offseason. Jamar Chase is probably going to break the bank. Justin Jefferson signed the largest deal in history of the sport at wide receiver. Last year, $35 million annually is the average. I think most people think Chase's deal when he signs it to stay in Cincinnati will be very close,

if not exceed the Jefferson deal. But imagine they've got two receivers next year at $30 plus million a year. because I do think that T. Higgins' market value is close to $30 million a year. I like T. Higgins a lot. I think he's a star, a stud receiver with maybe the best pair of hands in the NFL. But that offense was prolific, and Joe Burrow expressed when the season ended that he wanted both of them back. And at least according to the reporting, it sounds like Cincinnati's going to make a run at keeping him in the first step in that process. is giving themselves some time to get a long-term deal worked out. Now, keep in mind, the non-exclusive franchise tag does mean that another team can come in and make an offer.

And if Cincinnati doesn't match it, well, then you've got to give up compensation, up to two first-round picks or something less than that if negotiated. But this pretty much kind of takes him off the table for most, unless Cincinnati, Addy were to rescind the tag before the tag deadline. I guess that's a possibility as well if the initial talks don't go well. We'll see what happens. But I think some people did expect this. I think others are surprised by it. Yeah, it's really a mechanism for them to allow for more time to try to work out a long-term deal. So what does that mean for watching? Washington in the wide receiver market. You know, again, my preference is defense first.

But, you know, when you look at what's out there in free agency, he was the top guy overall in free agency at any position. You know, there have been discussions about Cooper Cup and Debo Samuel being available. Samuel would be by trade. Cup would probably be a release from the Rams. You know, there's some discussion about Tyree Kill potentially being available via trade. I don't know. At 31 years old, he's.

He's been injured a little bit here and there. Has he lost a step? Is he the right culture fit for Washington? You know, there's a possibility somebody like Devante Adams could get released from the Jets, you know, especially if they start a rebuild. He's got a lot of money left on the deal that he signed with Vegas. I think it's close to $70 million over the next three years. Would Washington be willing to go there?

Look, you know, he had a very good end of season with the Jets. with Aaron Rogers. Over the final, I looked this up over the weekend because Bill Barnwell wrote about sort of the receivers and mentioned Devante Adams. Over his final six games, all right, over his final six games, he had 41 catches, averaging nearly 90 yards per game, and he had six touchdowns. I mean, prolific down the stretch. Down the stretch, considering how bad the Jets were. He had a nine-catch, 198-yard two-touchdown performance against Jacksonville. He had a nine-catch, 109-yard day and a touchdown against Miami in an overtime loss.

He had seven catches for 68 yards, six catches for 88 yards in a touchdown. I mean, Devante Adams would be a phenomenal ad for a team that is a Super Bowl contender or believes that they are a Super Bowl contender. But a lot of money, and he's 32 years old, about to become 33 next year. And who knows? Maybe Aaron Rogers ends up somewhere. And that team signs Devante Adams. That would be really irritating for sure. In terms of other receivers, you know, Washington, if it looks to the draft,

Luther Burdens a guy that could be there towards the end of the first round, I guess. Amecca Egbuka, the receiver from Ohio State, could be there at the end. end of the first round. The top guy McMillan from Arizona will be long gone, at least according to most of the mock drafts. And he, actually, I'm a big fan of Luther Burden. If you want to look up a really good tape of a guy that's going to be a big time, I think, slot guy. I would think that Burden's going to be more of a slot receiver in the NFL, although he's pretty versatile. But he's, I don't even know if he's six feet. He's probably like 5-11, 5-10, something like that. but number three for Missouri.

Look up his tape. He is exceptional at creating space and then really good after the catch. That would be an exciting guy to put on the field with Terry McLaren. But again, my emphasis is on defense. I mean, they've got the chance to do everything, and it's not that I'm not thinking about playmaking players on offense at running back or a wide receiver. But, yeah, so T. Higgins, that's the news.

You know, pretty big news today. I don't think everybody's shocked by it, but the idea that Cincinnati more or less is apparently going to go down the road of trying to keep him and chase together, they should. I mean, Cincinnati went nine and eight. It was their defense that was the problem. They were a prolific offensive football team last year. You bring those guys back.

Joe Burrough stays healthy. You know, you got to think Cincinnati's got a chance if they can just add a couple. a couple of pieces. They don't lose Hendrickson as a pass rusher. They just have to get better on defense. I mean, they're like our team in many ways, except they were in the AFC North, and they were in the AFC in general. I mean, what were they last year? They were the number one pass offense in the NFL, right? I think they were. Had to be because Burrow was the leading, yeah, They were easily the number one pass offense in the NFL. And overall, they didn't rush the ball well, but they were a top 10 offense in a lot of advanced statistical categories.

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details and important safety information. This segment of the show brought to you by Window Nation. If you've been thinking about new windows, I just ask that you give Window Nation a chance to come out and give you a free estimate. That's all. You'll learn something from it. You'll find out which windows are the most inefficient that really need to be replaced. that are really costing you money with higher heating bills in the winter, higher air conditioning bills during the summer. Right now, Windonation is going to give you 60% off on your purchase. That's 60% off on all windows and all Windows styles with no payments and no interest for two full years.

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You know, I mentioned to you before we started to record that it's been a while. I have not had you on, I'm pretty sure, this year. and the reason for that, Gary, is that I haven't talked college basketball that much until the football season ended, but you know this living here. I mean, this was an unbelievable season for our football team, and, you know, I think we were all consumed with that. Were you following Washington season? Oh, yeah, that was, it's amazing what a team, especially the commanders, you know,

with their history year, going way back, how much that means to so many people. And the great thing that I found out was when people are really fans, they might not have been happy for the last 20 years or whatever, but as soon as they turned a corner, started to get good, things were going well, they really got excited again, and it was just great to see for the area. Speaking of getting excited, it's pretty exciting these days to watch our basketball team. I know that you're fired up about it too. You were there yesterday for the win over Iowa.

The Terps outscored Iowa by 30 in the second half to win by 26. They've won seven of their last eight. I said the other day on the show, and maybe I'm getting a bit carried away, but with the way they've been playing, I think what I'm watching is a team capable of making a deep, deep run in the NCAA. tournament, like a final four kind of a run. What do you think? I definitely feel their starters, as long as they don't get tired, they can stay healthy, things like that. That's as good a starting five as I think you'll see because I've

been watching the game is pretty close. And, you know, the combination inside with Queen and Reese, very few teams have that. I haven't seen many teams in their country with their ability to pass the basketball, Queen especially. He's a great passer, interior passer, which is really hard to, you know, pass around that lane area. He made a couple passes last night. We're just, you know, guys in the NBA can't make those passes. I mean, they're just sensational. Now, he doesn't, you know, he's a freshman, and people forget that. I think sometimes that he's young, and he's not as consistent with those things as you'd like to see him right now. But at the same thing, he's a freshman.

same time. In the Big Ten, I don't think there's a better freshman in the Big Ten than Queen. And, of course, Reese is really, I think, because of the attention put on Queen, Reese has kind of been there playing great, really improved from last year, improved a free-throw shooting, all those things, and not getting much attention, which is fine, because, you know, it's nice to be a little under a radar until you get to the NCAA tournament. Then you want the attention. But the team, the combination of inside, play plus the ability to shoot the three, which they had none of that last year in terms of shooting the three, has really made a difference in the team.

And, you know, when they're on their game, I think they play as well as anyone. And one of the things I really like as an old coach is their pace of play. I don't think anybody is going up and down quicker than they are a little full-court pressure to put pressure on the other team, make them work. last night I thought with the you know Iowa I guess

Iowa was up four at half time they had made every shot it seemed like they took in the first half and all of a sudden the fact that Maryland had the pace of the game up where they wanted or two those same shots didn't go down the second half and that might be Maryland's defense but it might also be

the fact that the legs weren't there for Iowa because they had some guys who could really shoot the ball in the first half of that game you know you've told me several times over the years. You can't win six in a row in March if you can't score. You've got to be able to score. And your comment just about the pace, I know in watching this team, how pleased you've been in watching the pace of this team. I mean, is this the best scoring Maryland

team we've seen since 2002? I think so. And there's stats back it up. You can't shut off any Anytime you're playing against a team where you can't, you can shut down one guy. Well, you could probably do that if you have a good plan defensively. But when you have two or three guys with the shooting threats that they are on the court all the time, it's really difficult. And, you know, you get cautious on defense. You're afraid to lose your man. You get cautious transition defense.

You know, you worry so much about getting back on defense, you know, an offensive rebound. You worry getting back on defense, so you're not as aggressive going to the defense. the basket with the ball. And you never know what area wins games for you. But I think the pace of play, both offensively and defensively, that Maryland puts out there this year, it's really causing problems for team. And you know, you look at their net ranking and things like that, whatever, I think they're 20th today in the AP, but I think they're a much better team than 20th in the country right now. Yeah, they're 14th in Ken Palm. They're 14th in the net. They're 20th in both polls and all of the advance numbers certainly see it the way that you see it. They've got a top

20 offensive efficiency team and a top 20 defensive efficiency team per the Ken Palm numbers. I was going to, I want to ask you about some of the players, but two things before we get to that. Does the lack of scoring off the bench concern you? You know, I always felt if your bench guys could rebound, play defense. knew the offense well enough to get the ball to the right people. There's a reason why you have five stars. Very rarely do you have a six-man that's as good as your starters. You know, you'd like to, but, you know, there's a reason the first five are out there.

And so as long as play doesn't slip, in other words, it might be one less three-point shooter coming in. But as long as the level of play doesn't slip, and you can keep that pace going, then those guys are doing a great job. I think the, you know, I mean, how many guys you want to score in double figures? I mean, you've got five. What are you supposed to do? Have seven in double figures? Right, right, right.

Yeah. So, you know, that doesn't bother me at all as long as there's no slippage in play. The defense is good. The rebound is good. The ball gets to the right guys that can shoot the ball. You know, so what? And, hey, college basketball now, those commercials, 16, 12, 8, and 4, every half or at least three minutes by the time the ball's put back and play.

And they're probably a little longer than that in the NCAA tournament. So I think you can get away with playing five, six, seven guys without too much of a problem. Of course, foul problems, you know, can come up at any time. And that's the wild card in the NCAA tournament. You never know you get a crew that you haven't seen all year. All of a sudden they start calling everything tight. and maybe the bench has to be more of a factor in that situation. You averaged, your team averaged 85 points a game.

You were the third leading scoring team in the country in 2002. This team's averaging 83 and a half points per game, and they're currently the 14th leading scoring team in the country. Now, their efficiency numbers on defense say that they're a good defensive team. They were not a good defensive team in the first half against Iowa, But tell me what you think of them defensively. Is it good enough to hold up over six games when we get to one and done in March? Yeah, I think so.

You know, you have to be careful. You have to make sure that you don't fall asleep defensively against Iowa. They're a little different. You know, you have to pick up really early against Iowa because they're going to launch three from all over the place. You know, Iowa's always played that way. and so you have to pick up early against Iowa. You can make some mistakes against some teams. But that's, you know, and this is just personal.

That's why I think you have to try to run every time you get a rebound because you put pressure on the other team, and that pressure isn't just physical. It's mental pressure. They have to worry about getting back the whole thing. And all of a sudden, if you walk the ball up court, well, they don't have to worry about that stuff. You know, they're going to be back in time,

and they'll set up their defense or whatever. but Iowa comes right after you. I think it took a while for Maryland to adjust to that that they put the ball up so quickly, but once they did, and the combination of wearing down the team because of Maryland's pace, you know,

showed up in the second half. I mean, they go from scoring, where they get 51 the first half down to 24 or something like that to the second half. Yeah. It just, you know, it's incredible,

but that's the way it works. You know, if you can wear a team down, that's probably, there's no stat on that. You know, so people, you know, they're so stat conscious nowadays, but there's no stat on that. You know, you just, you play your game and you hope you're wearing the other team out as the game goes on. I said last week that Derek Queen's the best freshman basketball player at Maryland since Joe Smith.

Do you agree with that? Yes, the only guy, I'm just talking about the guys I coached now. The only guy I'd say was Grievous Vasquez. He was great. He was one of those players that really got better as he progressed in his career, where please come in. And, you know, he's just stepped it up right away. Now, he's still a freshman, and there are parts of his game

that bother me a little bit sometimes and things like that. You think he can do more, but all of a sudden, you look at the stats at the end of the game. Yeah. You know, the guy's got double doubles all over the place. and, you know, I'm there criticizing for maybe one pass he didn't make or something like that. So he is a throwback player. He is not a leper.

I wouldn't consider him, you know, a guy that gets two feet over the rim, but his knowledge, his ability to use the Eurostep for a guy, 6-10, all those things make him different. And see, I always like players that were a little different, like a Vasquez, for instance. You know, that's how Queen is. he's just different than a lot of guys because he's not going to just muscle you at 610. He's not going to go out at 610 and shoot threes,

but he's going to beat you by the way he plays, and he can take over a game. He's getting to the point now where they run a thing where they get him the ball right at the top of the circle, and they get the other four guys spread who can shoot on the three-point line. And when he goes to the basket, it's really hard because if you help on him, he's going to find it open three-point shooter. And I think he's the real.

reason for, even though he doesn't shoot threes, he's the reason for the success of a lot of guys shooting threes because you have to help on him when he puts it on the floor. Yeah, I thought of Gravis. Mello Trimble was obviously the freshman year he had was sensational. Very good. And I thought of Gravis, and obviously Steve Blake started, you know, for you from day one. But in terms of the overall impact on the game, I mean, Joe Smith was, you know, the freshman of the year. I don't think Derek Queen's going to be the freshman of the year, but he's got a chance to be the freshman of the year in the Big Ten. And like you said, he's starting now to get to the point where, like,

they just kept feeding him last night, and he just kept creating. How about that little one-foot, you know, step-back fallaway shot that he shoots? Like, it really is, it's old-school, almost yokech-like. Yeah, you're going, where did that come from? Well, you know where that came from? That came from Europe. America move. That came from Europe. And, you know, he's smart enough at 19.

Okay, I'll take that. I'll put that into my game. I'm going to work on that. You know, and get good at that. Well, when he does that, you're talking about a 6-10 guys stepping back. Yeah. You know, it's not like a 6-foot guy stepping back. And so it's unblockable. You know, if he can make it, it's going in because you can't block it. Well, and he's got a great soft stroke, too.

I'm actually surprised he's passed on some of the, open looks he's had from three, because remember in the Purdue game in December, he knocked down a couple of them. I think he's capable of shooting the three, do you? Well, I think that's, you know, if he comes back next year, I think that would be something that I'm sure you'd see, but we've got enough three-point shooters right now when the Carter's right on the court where he would be the fifth best three-point shooter. And so, yeah, you know, I'm not sure that, you know, Coach Wilford wants to take a lot of threes, but like you said, if he makes one, that really creates problems because now you've got to go all the way out, you know, past the top of the circle to guard it.

How about the improvement of Julian Reese? Like it starts at the free throw line. That's the obvious thing to everybody. But just as an offensive player overall, I mean, he's become a playmaker. He knocks down that mid-range consistently. Did you see this kind of improvement coming? I was concerned because I didn't see a big jump as junior year. You know, I was worried that maybe, you know, players level off, you know, which is fine. But he's gotten so much better, like for the things you said.

You can see the confidence in him. It built, you know, from December on. He's just become a very confident player. He always thought before when he'd miss a shot or have struggled to free throw line of it really affect his game. But now he's got that confidence thing gone where, okay, miss, but I'm going to make the next one. That's not a problem. Yeah. You mentioned the shooters. Gillespie, Rice, and Miguel, I mean, they're deadly,

and it just spaces the floor incredibly. Is Gillespie the most important player on this team? Well, I think in terms of the way a coach wants to have his team play, yes. In other words, he's really quick in advancing the ball in transition. He puts tremendous pressure on the defense because he's a very good passer, but he can also stop and hit the three if they just fall back on defense or if he penetrates. People forget he finishes over the rim. I think the difference between Gillespie and a couple of the other point guards, his size that you've seen the last, say, 10, 15 years, the difference is he finishes over the rim

where I think the rest of those guys were really good, but they finished under the rim. So he's not afraid to take it in there and transition. And his ability to pass, if they do help off of them, you know, just creates all kinds of things for the players. And to me, that's the key to the whole offense. Gillespie leading the way. But at the same time, all those guys look for each other right now. You would think with some of those guys being outstanding shooters,

they'd be a little selfish, but they're not. They're very open to giving the ball to a guy that has, You saw it last night a lot when, you know, there'd be a double in the ball, be swung around to the other side. Well, the one guy would catch it, he'd be kind of open, but he had a guy in the corner that was way open, and that guy would get the ball every time. And I think that's been the key to their success offensively this year. All right.

How are you handling this portion of the schedule? They've got five games left. They are clearly in the tournament. Now it's about working their way up in the Big Ten standings, improving their seating. How are you communicating the importance of these games to the players? Because seating is important once you get to March. It is.

And what you just said is what the players are hearing. And it's as a player and as a coach, you want to hear all good things. But as a coach, you have to make sure the players understand that all those good things will be bad things very quickly if you lose a game this time of year. And so that's your job. You can't be a nice guy in practice. You have to get on

them for making mistakes in practice just like you would in November, that type of thing. And see, they know they're good by now. You can't shake their confidence. If I'm a coach, whatever I say in practice, I'm not going to shake their confidence because they know they're good. They've beaten enough good teams to know that. And so

you just want to keep it right there. You don't, you don't want, you don't necessarily have to get better, but you want to keep it where you are. And you want to take that into the Big Ten tournament and into the NCAA tournament. I always sold the team in the NCAA tournament that, hey, we don't have to play better. We got here for a reason. You know, we just have to play at that level, because I think sometimes you get the in the NCAA tournament, you think you have to play great, but you just have to play the way

you play. But these guys, I think the key is, how do you stay? current. In other words, we're talking about the Big Ten tournament, the NCAA tournament. Well, you can't even be thinking about that as a team. You have to think about like what? Southern California

California next game. Well, that's all you can handle. That's all you can do right now is beat Southern Cal. You can't worry about Michigan, Michigan State, you know, the teams you've got coming up. You've got to beat Southern Cal. You can't afford it. You're going to be probably a 9 or 10 point favorite in that game.

And so you have to win that game. That game would be considered a bad loss because you've gotten good. And so now, you know, you have to take care of business in the next game. What kind of team is the team that will give Marilyn the most trouble? You know, I don't know the teams that well, you know, I know Michigan has the two big guys and things like that. The teams are, I think the teams are going to, what they're going to try to do, I think down the stretch here is really bad. recent queen, see how much contact they like. In other words, last night, Iowa did a great job in the first half, but they weren't physical inside at all. There was nothing going on physically

inside. And so if I was playing Merrill, and I think that's, I test Queen especially because he's a freshman, hadn't been through it yet, and just see how he responds to getting bounced around a little bit. And, you know, it might cost me some fouls, things like that. But at the same time, you have to figure out a way to win if you're playing against Maryland because you're not going to win a shooting contest against Maryland. You know, most nice Maryland's got better shooters than you do. And so, you know, what else can we do? You know, what can we do? Well, you know, we might be able to disrupt their offense because you take away their inside guys and all of a sudden the three-point shots get tougher because you can be up on those three-point shooters tougher because the inside

guys aren't a factor in night. And so right now, you don't see many teams better than Queen and Reef inside. I mean, that's just the way it is. I'm looking at the Big Ten. You know, name a front line that has two better inside players. I mean, Michigan's got the two big guys, you know? Yeah, that's the team. Yeah. So is Reese and Queen. Right. I agree. You mentioned it. Like, they're ranked 20. but it's really not representative of how well they're playing and I think what their potential is. I mean, you had teams that were ranked in the top, you know, 10 consistently. And it was about, you know, playing your best heading into this time of year.

This team appears to be doing that. There's something about watching this team where it really seems like they're almost impossible to guard. Well, I think the way they, you know, this is a credit to, Kevin Willard, the way they play, they're going to take advantage of any mistake you made. If you don't get back on defense, they're quick enough, and they're used

to advancing the ball quickly after a rebound. You know, some teams they'll try to look to see if the team makes a mistake getting back, but Maryland just takes it down every time, anticipating you make a mistake. And there's a big difference in solid play with that. And I

just think there's there's so many things when you play Maryland to prepare for. You know, you've got to worry about their pressure defense, okay, number one. Number two, they switch everything a lot of times. Well, how are we going to handle that? They're a very good passing team, and they can make three. So all of a sudden, when you want to spend this time, a year and hour and 15 minutes in practice getting ready for somebody,

you've got to spend two hours on the floor getting ready for Maryland, and I think that's a terrific event. The other thing I was thinking of, Maryland lost in the last, I guess they're only lost in, what, their last eight games was at Ohio State. We lost in the last second shot that went off the glass, basically. They had a 17-point lead. You dropped from 18 to 25. Are Maryland people upset about that? I mean, I was really upset about that because you look at teams like Kansas is still in the top 25.

Yeah. They don't belong in the top. I don't care how good they were three years ago. They don't belong in the top 25. And here's Maryland. We lose seven spots. for losing on the last second shot away from home. I know.

And, you know, I asked Kevin Willard about just, you know, being ranked because they, when they moved into the polls that week and they were ranked 18th, I actually had them on right before the Ohio State game. And I said, you know, with Ken Palm and with net rankings and with everybody kind of understanding that sometimes the AP and the coaches poll really don't reflect necessarily what the tournament field will look like, do you care? And he said, yeah, we do care. It's something that, you know, so it sounds like you do too. Oh, yeah, hey, the average fan, all that Ken bombs up, that's great, you know, but the average fan, they look at the polls. They come out today or whatever,

you look at them, and I'm looking at that, and I'm going to, as a former Maryland student and player, forget the coaching thing. I'm just really upset. I'm looking at our student section. I hope those guys are crazy about that. It's something like that happened because it doesn't happen to every team. You know, there's teams that aren't almost invincible. Once they get into the top 25, they won't vote them out, you know, no matter what. And I think that's been a fight we've always had in Maryland. And I think Willard is continuing the fights.

Well, what is that that's a pre, it's a bias. It's basically allowing big brands. like Kansas and Carolina and Duke and Carolina stinks this year, to absorb losses when it comes to rankings much better than the field, the rest of everybody. And we win seven games in a row, and then we lose one, although they're not that good. You know, I mean, Kansas loses two out of three,

and they're still in the top 25. You know, I mean, it just doesn't make any sense. But, you know, it's good because that puts the old chip on the shoulder. You know, I'm sure Kevin Willer's using that. you know, with a team as much as he can, so it's not all bad. Well, think about it. If they hadn't blown that lead in Columbus and Thornton hadn't banked in the shot and somehow Maryland won that game, they'd be right now close to the top 10.

They might be in the top 10 right now. I think they would be. And that's really the way they're playing. Well, you look at St. John's. Yeah. Okay. Latino's doing a great job, obviously. Right.

But at the same time, they've got eight. wins in that league because they play everybody twice in that league. That bottom four? Terrible. Horrible. Yeah, and they're rated, what are they, this week? 11th. Yeah, although Seton Hall beat Yukon over the weekend. I don't know how that happened. Well, but that's what I mean. You know, how good is the Big East? And yet, I don't think, I don't think the people who vote, and I've always felt this way, not just recently,

in the AP poll, there's some great ballots, I'm sure guys really do their homework, but there's some guys that basically mail it in. Okay, who, who, lost, who won, doesn't matter if you play in the road, who you played, but they're just mailing it in. You know, oh, Merrill and lost Ohio State, well, then they have to drop. You know, and that's what you get with some of the voters, and it's a problem. It's always been a problem. Did you have a vote in the coach's poll back in the day?

Yeah, back in the day, they had the old CBS coaches poll. Yeah. And I could have a vote in that, and, you know, I tried to, you know, it was okay, but it was kind of tough because you had some friends in coaching that you were, you know, if you didn't plan, you were kind of root and form, things like that. You know, I'm sure there were some coaches that had the assistants

fill out the poll, you know, because they didn't have time or they didn't think they had time. So, I'm not sure that was a great idea, but I think you could put together a pretty good committee. If you want to do start your own poll, you could

put together, say, 25 people, maybe a couple former coaches, maybe, you know, some media people that really, you knew they were really like a Dick Weiss-type, you know, basketball guy, Bob Ryan, you know, all those guys, his vintage guys. They do a good job with that poll, I guarantee. I told Naki something last week that I'm going to tell you because, you know, for many years, you know, I mean, a bunch of us just hated being in the Big Ten and really missed. And you missed it too, but you were always much more.

pragmatic and understood the financial part of being in the Big Ten and how necessary it was, etc. But I'll tell you what, I'm glad we're in the Big Ten now. I feel like we're a member of the Big Ten. It's year 11. And the bottom line is the ACC stinks. It's just, it's the Big Ten, the SEC, and the Big 12, basically in all of the sports. And like you look at you look at the.

ACC basketball, say right now. Yeah. You got Duke, you got Clemson, and you can throw Louisville as the third best team. But after that, I don't think anybody deserves to make the NCAA tournament, and maybe they will because it's the ACC in their tradition and all that stuff. But, you know, you look at two your teams right now are trying to get out of the league, Florida State and Clemson. I don't know where that's going to go if they can get out of there.

And then you look at Carolina, all of a sudden, there's report this week. they've spent a lot of money, just checking the waters of different situations. And so, you know, you look at that leg, if Duke and Duke this year, just Duke, if they weren't in the league in basketball, what else would you be talking about football or basketball in the ACC right now? I mean, it's just, it's gone to where it's, I think they got a little cocky in thinking that, well, ACC basketball has always been one of the top one or two in the country. And, you know, other teams, you know, that they've been proactive,

what the Big Ten did, what the South Eastern Conference did, what the Big 12 did. That's the way it goes. Pack 12, same thing. They got cocky. Oh, we're going to get a really good TV contract. Well, how'd that work out? It didn't happen. And so they got raided, you know, and people forget, the ACC blew up the Big East in terms of football.

Right. You know, they took kids. They took Boston College. They took all those teams. And yet, we were the bad guys. going to the Big Ten. While all that was going on with Big East football, those things being stolen by the ACC. So, here we are. I would still love to have a rival in the league. I don't feel like we have a rivalry like we had in the ACC. I'm not just talking about the Duke games. I'm talking about, you know, Carolina and State and Virginia and the feeling that we had. And it takes a long time. I'm curious, do you think there's a chance? Because I read that story about North Carolina as well. Is North Carolina a possibility for the Big Ten?

I would say yes. Them hiring Belichick and football, they might be looking a little bit in that direction. I kind of read that into that story that Belichick goes in there. And, you know, he's Bill Belichick. He's going, hey, I don't want to play this crap. I want to go into a conference where we're playing, you know, and I can recruit guys that, you know, complain to Big Ten or whatever. So it'll be interesting how that works.

But a school like Carolina, and for the ACC, they almost can't afford to have Carolina not be good in basketball. I mean, it's that important to that league, and it's always been that way. My first three years in Maryland, 89 and 92, Maryland, or Duke won the first two years, and Carolina won the third year. They won national championships. Well, that's probably not going to happen anymore.

You know, you've got to have a conference that's based on depth. And you look at the Big Ten basketball this year and football, for that matter. There's depth. You know, there's depth in the league in the Southeast Conference. Same way. You know, they're the best basketball conference. Would you ever think anybody would say that the Southeast Conference is the best basketball conference in the country?

Well, I mean, it's the impact of football. Yeah. And it's just how it's gone. And, you know, my point is, Those leagues had the ability to look ahead, look into the future, where I don't think the ACC did that. I don't think they just complained about Maryland going to the Big Ten rather than, oh, oh, why is that happening? You know, what's going on here? You know, and that's what happened.

Right. Last week in the coaches poll, the SEC was ranked one through four. It was Auburn, Alabama, Florida, and Tennessee. I don't think, Gary, I've ever seen that before. one conference, the top four spots. In all of the great years of the ACC and Big East, I don't think four teams were ever one through four in the rankings. I mean, Duke is really good.

They're ranked third. Have you watched them at all? They're actually pretty good. Yeah, they're very good. They've got more than Cooper Flag. You know, he gets so much attention. Deservidly, he's a great player. But, you know, they've got other guys that are –

they've got another first round. The other kid on the perimeter. is really good. He's, I don't, I'm blanking on his name, but he's, he's a first-round pick also. And so, they're good. In 1980, in 1985, I was coached in Boston College. That's the year of St. John's Villanova and Georgetown went to the final four. Well, you were in the sweet 16. You were in the sweet 16. Yeah, we lost in the last second shot, unfortunately. Another last second shot. Andre Turner from Memphis, yeah, hit the last second shot to beat us. not that I remember or anything.

Yeah. Well, we are coming up on 15 years this March from the worst ending of any sports team that I root for ever was corduicious. You know, what's wild about that is that 15 years. Tom is probably as good a friend as I have in coach. Right. And I won't tell you what, but I texted him after that he got his, he became the all-time winning his coach in the Big Ten.

And he texted me back. The stuff he said was really funny, you know, about how it is coaching now is compared to, you know, 10 years ago, whatever. But he just turned 70. He's getting up there. I know. So, I mean, he's interesting how long he coaches. Right. That was a pretty dramatic win, too, because they were getting their ass kicked in the first half of that game.

I'll tell you, I'll tell you that, that's been typical. There's teams forever. They don't quit. You know, you think you haven't beat? You don't have them beat. They come back at you every time. time. And that's to his credit. You know, he's had all different kinds of guys playing for him, great teams. You know, here's the other amazing set about the Big Ten. His team in 2000 is the last

time a Big Ten team won a national championship. Is that amazing? Well, they don't count. Unless you count us. Because, yeah, we want to. They don't. I know they don't. We were an ACC team. But yeah, I know. The ACC doesn't count us anymore, either, by the way. but I put it in the context of the last time a current Big Ten team won a national championship, it was Maryland. They weren't a big ten team, but that's the last time a team in the Big Ten won a national championship. It is kind of amazing. By the way, that 85 tournament with the three Big East teams in the final four,

by the way, Kentucky was the other team in the final four. You know, Villanova's run that year started with a huge upset of Michigan in the second round, which got him into the Sweet 16, where they faced Maryland in the Sweet 16. And Len Baez, Gary, I don't know if you remember this or not. You were the coach at BC. Len Baez had the worst game of his career in the Sweet 16. He was two for 16 from the floor, and Maryland lost by three. Final score, 46 to 43.

So Nova got by Maryland, and then they beat Carolina. in the Elite 8 before going on to the final four. Yeah, I think, you know, being in the league, Villanova played at Pittsburgh the last regular season game that year. They got beat by 30, the last regular season game in March. They got beat by 30 going into the NCAA tournament. Crazy. And, you know, it's just that game against your town,

Well, no, I saw, I was in person at that game. In Lexington, yeah. That can't happen. You know why it can't happen because it is shot clock. Of course. You know, it's not going to happen anymore. I said Kentucky. Memphis State was the other team.

They beat you guys in the Sweet 16 and then they beat Oklahoma. To get to the final four. That's who beat us. Yep. All right. This was fun, as always. Hope all is well. And I will see you at a game here coming up shortly.

We have to play golf one time. We'll do that this summer. That would be nice. All right. Thanks for doing this. Okay, Kevin. My pleasure. Legend, Hall of Famer, Gary Williams, everybody. All right, that is it for the show today. Back tomorrow with Tommy.