The Kevin Sheehan Show - Terry McLaurin 'Frustrated'

Episode Date: June 5, 2025

Kevin and Thom today with a ton of options on the menu of excellence. The boys opened with several appetisers which included: follow-up to the "1-point" football conversation from yesterday, 1970's references, surprised by reaction to the ESPN Trey Hendrickson trade scenario, Marshon Lattimore, and more. Then the guys got to the report today that Terry McLaurin has " made it clear to the team that he's frustrated with the lack of progress on a long-term deal". They talked Nats, made NBA Finals picks, and handled the Aaron Rodgers to Pittsburgh breaking news all the while responding to Mike Florio's claim last week that someone told him that the "Commanders knew they were going to get their asses kicked" before the NFC Championship game against the Eagles. Plenty for all on today's show!  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Here's Kevin. Tommy's here. I am here. The show's presenting sponsor is always Window Nation 86690 Nation or WindowNation.

com if you need new windows. I am going to start with something that I'm not sure how you're going to react to. It is reaction to something that I talked about on yesterday's podcast. I actually kicked the podcast off yesterday, Tommy, with something that Pete in Potomac sent me, which I found fascinating. I bet you won't, but there were a lot of people that were as interested in this as I was, and I got several tweets and emails about this. So I'll net it out real quickly.

Pete and Potomac linked me to an NFL rule and also an expert. explanation about the rule that would actually produce potentially long shot a final score of something to one, you know, 10 to 1, 17 to 1, 35 to 1. I never knew that a team could end up with one point in an NFL game. Did you? No, I did not. Are you even interested in this topic? I am curious about it.

Oh, okay, that's good. For somebody who loves to learn, sometimes you are like, I have no interest even before the conversation starts. So basically there's a rule in the rule book that says on what they call a try, which is an extra point kick or a two point conversion attempt. if that play were to end up in a typical safety, you know, with somebody getting tackled in the end zone, either end zone, the other team would get awarded one point. So let me try to explain the possibilities here. So a team lines up to kick an extra point, right? And it gets blocked, and the ball goes flying backwards, 25, 35 yards.

And the holder runs back, picks up the ball. He's trying to make a play, and he's trying to avoid getting tackled, and then eventually he goes so far back, he gets tackled in his own end zone. Well, the team that was trying to stop the extra point and ended up blocking it is awarded one point. Now, not a safety. Not a safety. One point because it's a try. It's a point after touchdown kick, or it's a two-point conversion. Here's maybe a more, you know, possible, even though it's a long shot description of how this might play out.

Two-point conversion gets intercepted and the guy starts returning it because, you know, if you return a two-point conversion for a score, it's two points. And just before he's about to get inside the 15-yard line, he's stripped from behind, the ball comes loose. and the cornerback, I'm sorry, the wide receiver that chased him down, picks up the ball. Now he's trying to run in the other direction, but runs backwards into his own end zone and gets tackled. That would be one point to the team that started off in the defensive position against that two-point conversion. Now, it also works the other way where if, let's just say, the guy that intercepts it on a two-point conversion comes, you know, out to the 15-yard line, then circles back and gets tackled in the end zone, then the team attempting the two-point conversion would get the one point.

But they can't finish with one point because obviously the reason they were lining up for the conversion was they had just scored a touchdown. But if it works the way I described it before, where the defensive team ends up tackling the kicking team or the two-point conversion team in their own end zone, they get one point. And if they don't score the remainder of the game, they end up with one point in the game. I thought it was an impossibility.

It's still a long shot, although the two-point conversion interception return, a lot of you guys sent me more plausible scenarios than some that I threw out yesterday, where the guy gets chased down. We see that happen all the time, fumbles, and then it gets picked up, and then that person gets tackled.

in the end zone. But you could end up with a final score of, you know, 35 to 1 or 28 to 1 or 24 to 1. The most relevant question is, has it ever happened? It's never happened. It's never happened. What are we talking about here? Well, what we're talking about is something that I don't think, and based on the response, and I'm going to read some of these, I don't think a lot of football fans knew that that was possible. Like if somebody came up to you and said, Is it possible for a team to just score one point in a football game? Yesterday, before I read this, my answer would have been no. That's impossible.

The fewest points is zero or two. It's impossible to end up with one. Well, now we know it's not. 13 times, Tommy, the offensive team has stopped the defensive team for a safety. You know, after, let's say, a blocked extra point gets picked up and the guy runs back in the end zone and gets tackled. 13 times that team's been awarded a point, but they already had six to start with

because they were attempting to try. Right. So now, when your wife asks you during a football game, is it possible to score just one point? Yeah. Can tell her? Yes. Right.

Yes. Yeah, I'm trying to think there was something really that my wife said a few years ago. It's hard to believe that it never happened to the commanders. If there was a play where it might have happened, you might have thought it would have been swinging eight. Yeah. This from D Manley-72, he writes,

FYI, you said that a score could end up three to one, but it can't. They only get to one point on an extra point try. So the least amount of points would be a six to one final. Yes, you were right. Right, and I did say, can you imagine if a game ended up three to one? But to your point, D. Manley, 72, and it didn't occur to me when I was talking about this yesterday, that's impossible. Three to one's impossible, two to one's impossible, four to one is impossible, five to one's impossible.

Six to one would be the, with a one in it, would be the lowest scoring possibility because the team was trying the extra point, which meant that they scored the touchdown. This should be your staple question whenever you have somebody on the show of note. Like, let's say you have Dan Quinn on the show. And you say, coach, do you know it's possible to always score one point in an NFL game? Yeah. You'll be mesmerized by it. Yeah. This from Dimitri.

Dimitri writes, I can't wait to pull this trivial fact with my friends. FYI, this site logs all the recorded final score combinations ever for the NFL. There's never been a game to end with a team scoring just one. But my experience with these things is that once you breathe life into the extreme rareness of a situation, it will undoubtedly then occur. Let's hope so. By the way, the link that you sent me, Dimitri, scorgami.com. I am very familiar with that in all of the different scores.

Plus, on pro football reference, you can basically, you know, you can put in any final score combination to see how many times it's happened. That's why every once in a while, you'll get a final score, and the NFL will report, you know, via ESPN stats, that that's the first time that that score, final score, has ever happened. There were others here. This from Michael. Michael writes,

Kevin, I love the show. Enjoyed your discussion yesterday about the unlikely scenario where a team could finish with just one point. Rather than having the kicking team or offense backpedal 98 yards to be tackled in the end zone, which I don't see ever happening. What about if on a try another defender following the play tackles that player into the end zone for the one point score? Still not very likely, but maybe marginally more possible. Oh, I thought I understood this when I first read it. get oh oh i'm sorry i missed reading part of it i missed reading part of it i missed

went too far yeah he no no no i just missed i missed a sentence here on a try the defensive team were to recover a fumble or intercept a pass run it all the way down the field attempting to score two and then right at the end in a play reminiscent of leon lett in the 93 super bowl the defender runs out of guess get stripped just short of the goal line yeah that's what i just described is a two point conversion that's the most plausible, Michael, you're 100% right. That is the most plausible. You know, a two-point conversion that gets picked or a block field goal that's getting returned and the guy's almost towards into the end zone for, you know, two points on a two-point conversion play and he gets

stripped from behind. Yes, that would be the way it would happen if it were to happen. there were a lot of others that I won't bore you with but people seem to enjoy this. I enjoyed it. I just would have never. Can you imagine, do you watch Jeopardy? We've talked about this before. Do you guys, do you and Liz watch it?

I haven't watched Jeopardy since I was a kid. Let me just mention that Jeopardy Masters week is going on this week, which is, you know, the chance. champions of the year, those questions are so much harder than they are on a regular night. But can you imagine, like, you know, football for 100. Can a game end with a team having just one point? No. What is no? It's a Jeopardy question.

Absolutely. I used to watch Jeopardy when Art Fleming was the host. Art Fleming. I think I remember that name. My parents and my grandmother watched that show religiously, which is why... My father did. Yeah. Art Fleming, 1964 to 1975, and again, from 78 to 79, he hosted it before Alex Trebek, I guess, took over.

And now the guy... I started watching Jeopardy, I remember during the summer. You know, I'm like a sophomore, junior, high school or something like that, or even younger. And my dad, who worked nights, would be watching Hollywood Squares at 1130 at Jeopardy at 12 o'clock. And I'd watch both of them, and then I would head out to the park for today. I do remember Paul Lind and Hollywood Squares. But who was the host of that show? Peter Marshall.

Peter Marshall, sure. whose son played, I think, Major League Baseball. Really? He La Cotte, I think, was his name. Huh. Yes. Okay. You know, now that we're into the 70s here, just for a moment, this just made me think of something from last week.

So at one point last week, and I'll save all the gory details, but, you know, anesthesia can be very constipating. especially when you're on a lot of other drugs after what I was on last week. And so my mother says to me, just get milk of magnesium. And I said, what do you think I'm going to run down to people's drugstore and get milk of magnesium after you've watched Lawrence Welk? They don't make milk of magnesium anymore. But here's the most hysterically funny thing. I had emailed my doctor, the surgeon, and he writes back milk of magnesium.

Get out of you. I swear to God, they still make it. I had no idea. You know, they still make it. Now, let me just tell you I had something in the house, magnesium citrate, nitrate, magnesium citrate, nitrate, whatever it was, that I ended up drinking basically. Because I got to the point where I was like, this is a problem. And I drank like the entire bottle.

And let me just say, Tommy, it worked. It worked. It worked very well. It worked for about 18 straight hours. Very well. Oh, must have been fun in the Shee and household. It was quite the week. But anyway.

While we're still in the 70s, one last thing. since we're talking old school. I have a column running into Mars Washington Times about the Frederick Flying Cows, who we talked about on Tuesday. Right. The minor league basketball team. The 1970-style basketball, throwback league. Old school type of basketball.

And one thing I forgot to mention while I was at that game, okay, there were a lot of kids at this game, the Fred's Flying Cows. one NBA jersey in the entire crowd. One. And it was the Sean Kemp jersey. Sean Kemp, Jersey? Yes. Was it one of Sean Kemp's 18 kids?

And Sean Kemp, I don't think so. Sean Kemp, Jersey. That was the only basketball jersey in the whole crowd. I thought that was interesting. No Kobe jerseys, no LeBron jerseys, nothing like that. With Sean Kemp. I mean, I guess that's strange. You know, that you've brought up Sean Kemp.

So my boys just, they, they come, I mean, they laugh a lot harder at the old NBA highlights that they watch than I do. I enjoy them. I just understand the difference. But you know, you know who they love watching highlights of? Sean Kemp. They're like, dad, tell me. The Sean Kemp highlight reel is insane. But I always point them in the direction of Dominique Wilkins.

I'm like, Sean Kemp was 611. You know, Dominique Wilkins was 6667. Dominique Wilkins, to me and Sean Kemp, these are two dudes that would never look out of place in 2025. They dunked like the best, you know, dunkers in the game today. Sean Kemp, though, it's funny because maybe that's why a younger kid had a Sean Kemp jersey. I think a lot of the YouTube highlights, I think younger people are like, who was this guy, Dad? Who was Sean Kemp?

That may be. Yeah. Where my NBA life is these days on YouTube. Yeah, I know. That's a shame. But I like it too. I fall into those deep dives. Dominique, to me, and I always, of course,

they've watched so much Lenn-Biase during their lives. They can basically name every Lenn-Biase dunk from every game and what the game meant, because I'll sit there and give them the whole thing. Lenn-Bius and Dominique Wilkins in that era, and you've got to throw Jordan into the conversation as well. Drexler was incredible. How about Tom Chambers? Do you remember the dunker Tom Chambers was?

Yes, absolutely. He was a beast. Yeah. But he was also a guy that was 6-11. But Bias and Dominique, and I know I've said this many times before, for those that have never heard me talk about this, and I know Tommy has, I remember John Thompson, coach came in when he heard me talk about this once, and he said, that's the right comp.

When people used to say that bias was going to be the next Michael Jordan, that's not what he was going to be. He was going to be the next Dominique Wilkins and maybe even better, because he was not a guard. Michael Jordan was a two-guard. Len Bias was a small forward, like Dominique Wilkins was. Len Bias was not a ball handler, you know, and was not going to be capable of being an off-guard.

But the two of them, their dunking styles, were identical. And they were the first. I mean, you may say it was Connie Hawkins or, you know, Dr. J. Look, Dr. J is one of the greatest dunkers of all the time. Excuse me. What? I think the coach almost rose from his grave. you took this long to get the julius serving.

I just said Dr. Jay. I know. I'm sitting there thinking, I mean, the ultimate guy, Dr. Jay. Well, don't you remember? David Thompson right behind him. Well, don't you, well, the thing about a D.T. And look, he's the greatest college basketball player I've ever seen in my lifetime, but he couldn't dunk in college.

You know, they had outlawed the dunk in college. Right. But he was a phenomenal dunker in the NBA, you know, Dr. Duncanstein, Darrell Griffith. But bringing up Dr. Jay, I'll never forget when I said to you one day many years ago, Dr. Jay's overrated, in my opinion. Coach came in from the bullpen and sat down and opened up the mic and lectured me, along with you for about 30 minutes.

And I didn't say Dr. Jay was bad. Dr. Jay is an all-time great, the whole thing. But he's not for me like a top 10 player of all time. We don't have to go down that. I was going to say that bias and Dominique were among the first dunkers, bias in college, Dominique, and the NBA, that the head was level with the rim when they dunked it, and they tried to drill a hole in the floor by dunking it with so much force.

Dominique also had ridiculous hanging in the floor. the air ability. Remember how, and Dr. Jay did too. Remember how long Dominique could hang, you know, in the air? And Sean Kemp had some of that too, but anyway, what else do you want to say about 70s basketball, or 80s basketball? No, that's it. That's it. It was just, read my flying house column, tomorrow's Washington Times, and I just forgot to mention the last time we talked. That's something I took note of. I thought it was interesting. There were no NBA Jersey six, except for Sean Kemp in there. Well, I can tell you this.

By the way to find out, open their conference finals, playoffs Friday night against Raleigh. If you're implying that young people don't like the NBA? No, I'm not. I'm not.

But it was, I'm not. I'm not doing it. Here's what they like. They like watching NBA highlight. Well, you say that about every young person. the kid. Well, because it's true. The Athletic just made a deal with the NBA to show highlights on their website. Why? Because nobody watches games anymore.

I'm not disagreeing with that. There's definitely some truth in that. But there was no ulterior motive, except the uniqueness of not being an NBA jersey in a crowd at a basketball game, except for one. Because I would guess that NBA fans skew much younger than football fans. Yes. That's my guess. I don't know that for fact. I would guess that I think that's reasonable.

And when they grow up to be adults and they have like taste and judgment, they move on to other sports. This on the day that the NBA finals begin, which we will talk about for at least a minute or two, where we preview it and pick it on the show today. I'm going to get to the Terry McCorn stuff if you saw that news from just a little while ago. By the way, Scott was on the show with me yesterday, and he went down to Oklahoma City this morning because he's going to be doing his show following every NBA finals game. He was actually excited about it because he had not been to a game in Oklahoma City, and it is very, very collegiate-like. I mean, it apparently is just an incredible environment.

It certainly comes across that way on television. All right, this from Jonathan. Jonathan was following up on the conversation yesterday about Seth Walters proposed trade on ESPN.com that would send Trey Hendrickson to Washington, for Johnny Newton, a third rounder, and a seventh rounder. He writes, Hi, Kevin, I love the show and all the analysis of our beloved football team.

I'm a bit irked about the persistence of our fan base, which continues to implore that Adam Peters trade for Trey Hendrickson. Many of the pundits are pushing for this as well. Oh, that would include me, John, because yesterday I would be all in on the trade proposed by Seth Walder. It seems quite obvious to me that he isn't a player that suits what they need. The criticism of Hendrickson is that although he is a phenomenal pass rusher, he is vulnerable against the run. That combination is precisely why the team let Dante Fowler walk and does nothing to advance our overall mission of supplanting the Eagles and stopping Saquan Barkley.

Think about how atrocious Cincinnati's defense was last year with Hendrickson's pass rushing, his proficiency at rushing the passer barely made a dent. And think about Fowler, who was able to get a decent amount of sacks, but was a major liability against the run. Why would we give up assets for that? And then he goes on and on and on. So this is so interesting to me. Not as interesting as the one point possibility. But yesterday on radio, I took calls on this for two or three segments. I got a lot of feedback yesterday on this, and it was overwhelmingly, actually the opposite, John, of what you suggested. And that is, I felt, based on the response from people that listen, is that overwhelmingly

people don't want Washington to trade for Trey Hendrickson. They agree with you. That is my observation based on hundreds of responses after the radio show and podcast. yesterday. This is interesting to me, Tommy. It's two mindsets and it's a mindset that a lot of people in our fan base have had and even after last year they haven't gotten out of. They don't like to swing big. They don't like to think about now. It's all about the future. It's all about unrealized potential versus, you know, a given in this case. I mean, remember, Yeah, go ahead.

I've talked about this before. Yes, you have. I see it in other sports. People like invisible players. That's what I call them. They're players that don't really exist yet. And that way, they can't fail. There's only promise, you know?

And I'm sure part of it is that, you know, that the fan base is damaged. But I don't think I think it's beyond that. I think it's generally this idea that everybody is a general manager at home. everybody has evaluated, you know, all these young players, and they think they know who's going to be the next, you know, stud. So they're more interested in evaluating young players than it seems like arguing about current players. So I get that part of it. And specifically to Washington, and this guy makes a pretty good argument, you know. I would make the trade, but he makes a good good.

case. Look, I think there's a total, there's a reasonable case. But I think you have to have a longer term mindset because I think the two go hand in hand versus the mindset that I have, which is

I'm trying to win the Super Bowl on Jaden's rookie contract in 2025 or in 2026. I'm going for it. And by the way, the team for the most part, even though the moves they have made have actually satisfied both the short term and the long term because Tunsell is still got years left.

Well, Debo is a one year. We'll see what happens beyond this year. But there was not a lot in compensation given up. Latimore, the picks for him. Even the drafting of another tackle in the first round with a major asset, you know, a first round pick asset. But I, that's not where I am right now. You know, it started for me when the season ended,

let's go get Miles Garrett. He's not available. But let me just, to your point, the one that you just made, totally reasonable argument. I also totally am with you that you've got to figure out a way to be a better run-stopping team. Although I said that every week from about week four on last year, and they still won 14 football games with being one of the worst run-stopping teams in the league. But ultimately, Sequin Barclay, the first time he touched the ball, went 60 yards with it. and, you know, they could have probably rushed for 800 yards in that game if they had wanted to.

So I think you have to figure out how to get better against the run. But let me just say this to you, Jonathan. You make a good case, and I don't have a problem with your viewpoint. It is steeped, I think, very much in a longer-term view. Now, you know, point out that Trey Hendrickson's vulnerable against the run, etc. He's not like super vulnerable against the run. He's just not, he's not Miles Garrett or T.J. Watt in terms of the overall, but he played more snaps than anybody did on Cincinnati's defense. So two things about what you said. First of all, let's not even bring up Dante Fowler's name in the same sentence with Trey Hendrickson.

They're not comparable. Tray Hendrickson is a superstar pass rusher. He is an unblockable pass rusher. He is a player that keeps offensive coordinators up at night trying to game plan for that player. Okay, so that is not, Dante Fowler and Trey Hendrickson are not in the same category. Number two is this. Yes, Cincinnati's defense was bad, but you know what? They went nine and eight with a bad defense and an unbelievable offense. without Trey Hendrickson, knock it back two games. I mean, it would have been much worse.

You know, you can say that he didn't elevate the defense and carry it. That's not what happens in football. A quarterback can carry an offense. There's no defensive player that can actually carry a defense to being great. It can make it less awful. Trey Hendrickson had 17 and a half sacks. a major impact on a season for that defense. It was terrible, but it would have been much worse. I, yesterday before the show began, I watched because I was trying to find a highlight of

Trey Hendrickson to incorporate into the podcast yesterday. And I just ended up watching 17 minutes of Trey Hendrickson from last year. People go watch him from last year. This guy is unblockable. I mean double teams, triple teams, chipped. It doesn't matter. And the bottom line is quarterback and then somebody who can get to the quarterback. That's what you have to have to win a Super Bowl more times than not. I think you got to stop the run too. So I'm with you, Jonathan, and I've harped on that all offseason. But on third and eight, when you are up 2723 in a game against Justin Herbert or in a game, against Patrick Mahomes, you need a pass rusher to close out that game. And right now, based on

their roster, I don't see one. I love Frankie Louvo. I liked the way Dorrance Armstrong ended the season last year, but I don't see Trey Hendrickson on this roster. And for me to give up Johnny Newton, who I love, I think he's going to be a really good player, but it is unrealized. And then a third rounder and a 2027 seventh rounder, it wouldn't take me long to respond to the offer. Let me think about it. Yes, we will do that deal because I'm trying to win the Super Bowl in 2025 and 2026. And if you want to talk about his age, he's 30. Pass rushers age pretty well. not quarterbacks necessarily, but like sometimes left tackles, they're around. You know, especially once they get to that point where that's all they're doing,

but look at Kaleo Mack at 34 years old. We've got plenty of examples of pass rushers being good well into their mid-30s. So I would do it, and I know you'd have to pay them. I can't believe their reaction's been so one-sided against it. But it's the same reaction. Yeah, go ahead. I think part of it is, because, you know, there may be a little bit of gunshiness with the fan base,

because the Lattimore deal has not worked out so far. It's early to make a judgment. But, you know, the risk of a veteran player like this, especially a veteran older player, is that, you know, you might get hurt. It might not work out. I think the Lattimore deal is kind of turning some people off. The Latimore situation is a whole other deal. We haven't talked about it.

We did the other day. We talked about the OTA absences. Of course we did. And then he missed again yesterday. I'm actually now, you know, put me in the category of being irritated by somebody who doesn't have enough self-awareness to know that he's done nothing here. He's actually done the opposite of anything good. He's been, he was a disappointment. Now, you know, not all his fault, injuries acclimating.

But how, like, I know we talk about this every year, but how are you a new employee somewhere? It's a new company. You haven't established yourself. And in fact, you actually disappointed everybody. And 87 out of the 90 people show up for something voluntary. And one of the three that doesn't is you. It's just not in my ability to fathom that. But again, I would make the Henderson trade.

I would too. that trade, yes, that's a trade I would make 100%. I just, I think that, you know, I still want to be better stopping the run. And, you know, I want, but you give me that dude on third and six, third and seven, third and ten. And maybe they don't get into enough of them, but he is dominant. On a bad defense that couldn't stop the run and couldn't do anything, he's still got 17 and a half sacks. So, all right. You want to get to Terry McClorn in the news on him?

Sure. All right. Let's do that right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey guys, who's hungry? I've got an idea for you. How about a pizza from one of the most iconic pizza places in the village or a cheese steak from one of Philadelphia's best? I've talked about Goldbelly before, but please check it out. goldbelly.com. It's a site where you can get the most iconic famous foods from restaurants all across

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warning Monday night football week three last season. The Jaden Daniels coming out party in that unbelievable throw to Terry McClorn for the touchdown that gave Washington the 38 to 26 lead at the time they would hold on and win the game 38 to 33. Terry and the team may be at odds as it relates to his contract extension. Let me mention that this segment of the show, is brought to you by our good friends at MyBooky. If you want to bet the NBA finals or if you want to bet the NHL Stanley Cup finals or if you want to look ahead to the NFL futures for the upcoming season, MyBooky is the place to bet on sports.

Go to mybooky.orgie.g or mybooky.com. Use my promo code, Kevin, D.C. And MyBooky will give you a cash bonus on your initial deposit. Oklahoma City, a nine and a half point favorite in game one. I love the Thunder tonight. I think they are going to roll to an easy win. But if you want to bet it, you can bet it. The Pacers, you're getting a big comeback nearly plus 500.

They are a major underdog in this series. Go to mybooky.orgie.org.com and use my promo code, Kevin, D.C. All right, so the report from just a few hours ago came from Jordan Schultz. Look, I'm not going to tell you that I know much about Jordan Schultz. I think sometimes it looks so official, but I was told sometimes he's right, sometimes he's wrong. I'm not here to audit his reporting over the years. But he put out something a few hours ago. sources, Commanders All-Pro wide receiver Terry McClorn has made it clear to the team that he's

frustrated with the lack of progress on a long-term deal. As I previously reported, McClorn unexpectedly left voluntary workouts after initially attending, and it remains to be seen whether he'll report for mandatory mini-camp. Real quickly, Tommy, and then I'll let you weigh in and then I'll follow up. I think Terry McCorn's going to sign a long-term deal, and I'm not a bit concerned that he won't, and that he and the team won't come to an agreement. But there are some very interesting aspects

to the Terry McCorn contract extension, and I'll get to those in a moment, but what's your reaction to this? Well, it sounds like agent posturing. I'm sure that's the only person that's the only source of this information is coming from the agent. And it may be to choose things along, who knows. I'd be surprised if I was a commander's fan and disappointed

if Terry McCorn is not a scheduled team activity that is considered mandatory. Just as an FYI, he missed mandatory minicamp three years ago because he didn't have his contract extension. did, and he was fined like $93,000. I forget if it was forgiven or not. I don't know if the NFL can actually do that anymore. But yeah, he was, did not attend mandatory minicamp in June of 2022. He didn't sign his contract extension until June of 2028. And Ben Standing reminded me this morning. He said it was kind of a big deal because that was the Carson Wentz summer and they hadn't played together yet.

Obviously, Jaden and Terry have played a season together. Yeah. So, I don't know. Do you, I think, I don't know. Okay. Would you rather, would you like this not to be happening? I think things like this always happen. But would you rather, it wasn't happening?

Yeah, but I could say that about a lot of contract negotiations with athletes. It's like deadlines make deals. So you can't argue it's no big deal if you wish it didn't exist. Yes, I can. There are degrees of wishing that I didn't exist. I don't think it's a big deal at all. This is Terry McCorn, we're talking about. As you said, with the OTAs, it's like he's built up enough equity.

It doesn't matter if he's there or not. I don't think it's going to mean one thing that Terry McCorn hasn't shown up for anything voluntary or mandatory before training camp begins. Now, you want him there when training camp begins because it's training camp. And, you know, you've got Debo Samuel. He's new and it's year two of the system. You'd love him to be a participant for, you know, at least the bulk of training camp. But even if it got to training camp and it wasn't done and he held out for a week and missed a preseason game,

I wouldn't sweat it that much. Oh, come on. I wouldn't. Not with this player. Not at all. Here's Tommy where I think this is interesting. Terry at 30 years old are about to enter his age 30 season is an interesting case because he's such a great guy. He is lauded in all corners of Ashburn's buildings. He is the ultimate team player. He's the opposite of diva wide receiver. He's also very, very, very, good, but he's not elite like some of the, you know, a Justin Jefferson, Jamar Chase. And you look at, and I was doing this earlier this morning, you look at perhaps what he is

hoping to get. And if he's shooting for like a top five salary, for the team, if he were 26 or 27 years old, it's a no-brainer. You give it to him. But there's only one player that's older than him that is in front of him right now. And that's Tareke Hill in terms of average annual at $30 million per year. Terry off the deal in 2022 is at $23.2 million a year. And there's only one player in front of him that's older.

Wide receiver Terry McCorn is a great player. He proved last year for the first time in his career having a real quarterback. having an actual NFL starting quarterback, how great he can be. All, you know, his record year touchdown receptions 13, he was outstanding. The conversation about where Terry ranks is, it's the most optimistic you can be now after seeing him with a first-rate quarterback for the first time in his career. But, man, you know, for Washington to view him in a top three to five salary would make him easily, the highest paid receiver at 30 years of age or older in the league.

And I think we saw the team extend Sam Cosmy last year, but that's different because Cosmy's super young. This is an interesting case to see how the team handles it. What if we learn that, you know what, even with a Terry McLaurin, they're willing to play hardball? Is that a good thing or a bad thing? I think it's a good thing in some ways. How can it be a good thing on one breath and on the other breath?

You're saying that they need to do everything they can do to win right now, right now. Oh, I'm not going to let it get to the point where Terry McClureen isn't playing football for me this year. Don't you think he knows that? Yeah, I do. But what I'm saying is, you know, even maybe, you know, look, you're right. You need Terry McLaurin this year, no doubt. Okay, I can see that point. What I'm interested in is just to see how they handle these things,

because this is a first for this new ownership group, this new general manager, this new front office. This is a very interesting case. I mentioned earlier today, and I don't have a lot of examples to cite, but it strikes me that when you get older players in that second or third contract negotiation, and they're good players and maybe even great players, that it seems like those are the deals that take a while to get done. A younger player, that deal gets done.

But look at Trey Hendrickson in Cincinnati, no deal. Now, he is wildly underpaid, you know, a relative to... And the Bengals, you don't want to operate like Mike Brown. I'm not... You don't want to operate your business like that. Agreed. But you also have to be careful in that you love... love this player, you need this player, but you want to get the, you want both sides to win the

deal. Yeah, you do. And Peng, he's not Jamar Chase. He's not Justin Jefferson. He's not AJ Brown. I think he has the team, the advantage over the team in this. Because I don't think the team can afford to do anything that would endanger that would result in them taking a step back this year. And I don't think they will. And I, look, I don't even know if the report is fair, but it's interesting to sort of consider, it's interesting to sort of consider that this is one of those, this is a tougher contract extension discussion.

And to your point, you've actually made a great point, not that you don't typically. But Terry's really got them, you know, by the you know what's because they're trying to win the Super Bowl this year. And Terry is arguably the second most important player, certainly in the top three or four most important players in the conversation. But what I'm saying with respect to him is he's just an interesting case because he's entering his, his 30s, and we have this conversation about Terry McClure every summer. Where does he rank? Where does he, you know, and, you know, our fan base, a lot of people who have, you know, wanted Carson Wentz to be the starter and Sam Hal to be the starter. Also think Terry McClorn's a top five wide receiver. He's not, people. He isn't. He's top tenish, though, you know. PFF did last week.

they did their tiers for wide receivers. They had a tier one with A.J. Brown, Justin Jefferson, and J. Mar Chase. I personally wouldn't put A.J. Brown into Tier one. I think it's Jefferson Chase and then there's a drop off to the next tier, which A.J. Brown would certainly be near or at the top of the next tier. Tier two, they had Amonra St. Brown, Pooka, C.D. Lamb, Niko Collins in Houston, and Tareke Hill. And Terry was in their tier three with Mike Evans, Drake London, Malik neighbors,

Garrett Wilson, T. Higgins, Brian Thomas, Jr., Devante Adams. Now, he was listed as the second guy in Tier 3, which made him the 10th best receiver in the game. That's sort of where I would feel like he is. So are you going to give the 10th best receiver in the game who's also on the older side of these receivers that have been mentioned that have certainly gotten the big deals recently? And are you going to give him $35 million a year or $33 million a year? that's pricey. Can he get to 30?

Yes. And then, you know, you do the old, what, you know, Field Yates said to me many years ago. You know, today's overpayment is tomorrow's bargain. And I love that saying, and that would be what you would do. But you can't, this is not a Jamar Chase, Justin Jefferson, or even a C.D. Lamb conversation. CD Lamb is 25 years old.

Terry's 30 when the season. And the season starts. So it's an interesting conversation, and we'll do more on Terry and where he ranks. I think actually the PFF thing is pretty spot on. The interesting thing is there's so many receivers behind him that are young that this time next year we might say, oh, no, no, no, that guy is elite, you know? Um, anyway. All right. Uh, want to talk some NBA playoffs and make some predictions? Sure. And some that's baseball, too. I want to talk about the Nats as well. We'll do that after these words from a few of our sponsors. It can be hard for men to deal with hair loss, even though it's common. Luckily, I'm here to provide you with a solution, so you don't even have to talk about it. Through Hymns, you can restore your hair by accessing their personalized hair loss solutions. Hymns provide you with convenient and quality access to a range of hair loss treatments that work, all from the comfort of your couch.

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today at Hems.com slash sheen. That's H-I-M-S-com slash shian for your personalized hair loss treatment options. Hems.com slash S-H-E-E-H-A-N. That's H-M's H-N-S-H-N. Results vary based on studies of topical and oral monocidil and phenosterite. Prescription products require an online consultation with a health care provider who will determine if a prescription is appropriate. Restrictions apply. See website for details and important safety information. All right, Tommy, tell us about Shelley's. You know, last night I was at Shelly's back room. I went to the Nats game, and then after the game, I headed to Shelly to have a smoke.

It was a beautiful night. So I sat outside. I sat outside. So just like I always do, I saw a couple people in there who were good friends of mine and had some different conversations. And it was almost like we were doing the podcast because we were arguing about, we were arguing. about the whole the no-shows

for OTAs. We were talking about the NBA finals. You know, just like we're doing now, we were doing last night with my buddies

at Shelley's back room, except it just seemed so much more fun to be sitting outside on the street, smoking a cigar, drinking, drinking a,

you know, beer and doing it. It didn't seem like work. Not that this seems like work, okay, but that really didn't seem like work. But that's the kind of conversations that you can have at Shelley's backroom. Anything from politics to sports to basically, you know, your wives and husbands at home.

You always find interesting people to talk to at Shelley's Backroom, 1331 F Street, Northwest in the district. You can find out more at shelley's backroom.com. You went to the Nats game last night. Yes. Can I ask you something I'm looking for this, and I can't find it? I should be able to find it somewhere. Typically, they produce this somewhere. Oh, here it is.

On my phone, the game popped up final, and I'm like, man, that must have been the fastest game of the year. Because I like, yeah, it was actually two hours and 11 minutes. We've seen faster games since, you know, the new rules and stuff. But, you know, a 2-0 game in which McKenzie Gore's mowing everybody down is going to be a fast move. game. How good is he at his best? He's one of the best left-handers in the league. I think he's an all-star. He doesn't have a winning record. He's now three and five. But he's leading the league in

strikeouts. Yep. He's got an ERA under three. So, I mean, I think he's an ace. He's a legitimate number one. And he's fun to watch. Yeah, you know, he's obviously destroying it right now recently. He's lowered his ERA in his last three starts from 3.67 to 2.87. As Tommy mentioned, he leads all Major League Baseball pitchers in strikeouts. I had seven more last night. But occasionally, man, he gets bombed. You know, there are nights when, you know, you look at it and he's like out of there in the fourth inning

and he's given up, you know, 10, 11 hits. four or five runs, but him at his best, it's impressive. And you just mentioned, I mean, can he be an All-Star with his ERA and strikeout count? Of course he can be. But this is a team that already has two locks, don't they, in Abrams and Wood? One lock in Wood. Abrams are probable. And I think Gore would get picked.

I think Gore would get picked. I mean, I wouldn't surprise me in the least. I'll give you to last night, Gore put the first three runners. The Chicago, who has a very good offense. They're a good team. I think they lead the league in runs. So the first. Yeah.

So the basins were loaded with nobody out. In the first? And yes, in the first. Yeah, yeah. And their rookie stud, Pete Crow Armstrong was up. Gore strikes them out. more strikes the next guy out and then gets the third guy out. I don't know, on a ground ball or something like that.

We had the basis loaded with nobody out, and he pitched his way out of it, and then he never looked back after that. So, yeah, he's fun to watch. And I'll tell you what about the NACS, and I can't quantify this, Kevin, but I swear by it in all sports. if you are at the game, you get a different sense of a team

than you tend sometimes through a TV screen. And my sense is that these NACs are tough. They're a fighting team. They fight for everything, and they never give up. I mean, they have a lot of spirit for a young team that has, you know, that's with a losing record. You know, you can argue about Davy Martinez whether you think he has the bullpen right. You know, every fan base thinks their manager mishandles the bullpen all across baseball.

But Davey has these guys playing hard, never quitting, and you can sense that the way they play. I mean, there's no give up. And, I mean, that'll carry them. That'll carry them. I think over 162 games, I don't think they have the offense to sustain a winning record. But right now, they're a competitive team and they're getting offense from different places as a result. Like they brought up Robert Hassel recently, Rookie, and he's played well for him. James Wood is an all-star.

He went over three last night. but he's not just an all-star. He's a superstar in waiting. That guy is. Oh, yeah. So I felt pretty good about the Nats last night. You're playing a very good team in the Cubs, and I think they'll make some noise before they eventually fade.

They're making noise right now. They've won five out of their last seven. They're three games under 500. They're a game and a half in front of the Braves. They're in third place. Yes. The problem, of course, are the Mets. and the Phillies, and typically the Braves.

I know the Braves have been injured. We didn't have a chance to do this last week. We would have. What did you make of Ken Rosenthal's article about the Nats and the criticism that he had for Mike Rizzo? Some of it was legitimate. They've struggled in developing some of their talent, their own homegrown talent,

particularly when they were drafting low, you know, not drafting high, when they were winning every year. And they were drafting low. On the other hand, he may have made the trade of the decade when he traded Soto for what we're talking about could wind up being three All-Star. I know, the three players, right. Yeah, three of the five. Yeah.

You know, and they've got some young players who are coming up in the system, who are showing a lot of promise. And infielder named Seaver King looks good. So I think it was a hit and missed piece. There were some hits, but there were also some misses as well. For those that missed it, Ken Rosenthal, who writes for Tommy the Athletic? Yes. Yeah.

He wrote his story titled, Nationals Remain Among MLB's Bottom Featers despite lengthy rebuild. And there's a portion of it where he says a perhaps even bigger problem is the team's failures in player development, as well as amateur and international scouting going back more than a decade. aid failures that that president of baseball operations, Mike Rizzo's, can mask only so much. Look, they're the fighting gnats right now. They are, they're certainly competitive and I think, you know, offensively for sure, they've got a lot more power than they did last year and maybe even more than people expected. So, all right, NBA. And speaking, you know what? And that's weren't the only baseball team in town that won last night.

Who else won? The D.C. Grays won their opening game last night. They did? They won 12 to 11. Nice. And they beat the mighty, but as the big train in the process. Wow. That's a big game, right? Yes, that's a big game.

Yeah. I mean, the big trainer to the Yankees of the Cal Ripkin League. You know, so any time you can get a win over them, that's good. The gray's home opener is tonight, and I will be there at the home opener. I'm wearing a D.C. Gray's 3-quarters zip right now. I've got so much D.C. gray's stuff in my closet. I mean, I have hats. I've got shirts. I've got, you know, pullovers. There is, I've said this, and I think people actually love it. I mean, it's all for a great, you know, cause. effort and team and the whole thing.

But the logo, if you're just a D.C. guy, it's a great logo. And the color scheme is great. So I like a lot of the gear. You know, I thought you were actually going to say, not that they're local, but I did notice, you know, two nights ago, that the Orioles all of a sudden have gotten it together. Like they were, I think, the worst team in baseball. Actually, second worst to the White Sox.

But they've won something like six in a row or something like that. Oh, the Rockies, right. The Rockies are terrible. I know, but the Orioles have to dig themselves out of a hole with the Yankees and the Red Sox and the Tampa Rees and Toronto Blue Jays had in them. There's no coming back from that. Their season is over. All right, the NBA playoffs conclude with the final series of these playoffs. The NBA Finals, Oklahoma City, the 47th biggest market in the United States against Indiana. They play in Indianapolis, the 25th largest market in the United States. This is the two small market matchup teams of all time in the NBA. But I don't care much. You know me. I'm into this. I don't care how many people are into it. I'm going to watch it. I don't think a lot of people are

going to watch it. I'm excited about it. You know, I did talk earlier today on radio just about this. idea that, you know, when the NBA changed some of their, you know, payroll and cap rules, you know, a decade or so ago, it did make it more interesting. We've seen much more of, you know, a diverse set of winners, you know, and this is going to be the seventh consecutive year with a new winner that hasn't won in the previous six. You know, we just didn't have that for so long. It was always, you know, dynastic, you know, runs. Golden State, heat, you know, we can go back forever. And, you know, there's a lot of discussion about how this is given every market, you know, a chance to believe that they can be the next Oklahoma City or Indiana.

Except one. One market. Yeah. But, you know, I think what still applies to this sport, is until proven otherwise, you still, no matter how you do it, the way Oklahoma City did it, which is kind of similar to the way the wizards are trying to do it, you know, breaking it all down, tanking, losing a lot of games, accumulating a lot of picks, making a lot of picks, using those picks as, you know, assets to acquire players. That's what Oklahoma City did with

Gilgis Alexander. No matter what you do, you still, you still, have to have a bona fide superstar to win the whole thing. If Oklahoma City wins, it will be 21 consecutive NBA finals where the winning team had a top five player in the NBA, or certainly a debatable top five player. I know a lot of my friends think that Shea Gilgis Alexander is not a top five player. Well, he won the MVP, so it's debatable. You've got to go back to the 04 Pistons to find a team that did not have a top five-ish superstar leading the way. If Indiana wins it, they'll break the trend, you know, because I don't view Tyrese Halliburton as a top-five-ish kind of a player.

He may be on his way to becoming that, although I'm not necessarily sure. he's top 10, top 12, I don't know about top five. So no matter how you do it, you still have to end up with the alpha superstar until proven otherwise. And the wizards are going to have to be really good. Will Dawkins came from Oklahoma City. He's a part of what Oklahoma City is doing right now. And Tommy, I've said this to you. This is an effing great basketball team defensively.

They are all time, you know, when you look at advance numbers in terms of what they are capable of and what they've produced defensively. I personally don't think the Pacers have a chance to win this series. Now, they have a better chance than the Knicks. I think the Knicks would have been swept in four easy games. I'm picking Oklahoma City in five games. Could Indiana get two? Yep. The key to this series is Indiana has to play fast.

It's the way they play well and they play fast, Tommy. This is, you know, Showtime Lakers fast. 73 and a half percent of their possessions when they cross half court, there are 20 or more seconds left on the shot clock. But to play that way, you have to get stops and you have to get rebounds. Even though against the Knicks, they ran a lot after made buckets. Oklahoma City doesn't do that. They're not giving you five layups.

and transition after a made bucket. If they can't play fast, the majority of the time, they've got no prayer. But you're going to see a game in this series that is going to resemble not in defensive prowess, but in final score, an ABA final, Tommy. There's going to be a 138 or 135 to 131 game in this series. But I think much more so you're going to see 117 to 97, 197. to 106. And I think Oklahoma City's as good a defensive team as I can remember watching in the NBA, and it's not just with a couple of guys. They got nine guys that all defend, and they can switch

everything, one through five, which makes it nearly impossible to get anything easy in the half court. If Indiana has to play half court basketball, they've zero chance. I love Oklahoma City. I think they are a joy to watch play defensively. And I really like SGA. I think he is a true superstar, and he's an old school superstar. Much of it comes from the mid-range. This is a guy that gets to the rim, that gets to the free throw line, that knocks down a lot of mid-range jumpers. I think they win this series in five games. I agree with a lot. I agree a lot of what you said. time I've seen, and I've probably seen these two teams a few times, because I like Rick Carlisle, the Indiana coach.

Well, you're right about Oklahoma City. Of the teams that were in the playoffs, particularly Oklahoma City, is one I can probably stomach enough to watch. Indiana's fun to watch too, Tommy. I mean, you mentioned it. They are well-coached. Rick Carlisle does a great job. and they've got

Seacom's one of my favorite players in the league. And Halliburton is really good. I mean, if you want to watch, you know, a player that will remind you of just a shorter version of like Mo Lucas. Remember how what a badass Maurice Lucas was? Oh, God, yeah. Watch Lou Dort. Now, there's different because Dort's a 6-3-6-4 guy,

but this is a middle linebacker on a basketball court. He is so good defensively. Alex Caruso, he's the one champion on this team. He was on the Lakers' bubble team in 2020. What a defender he is. Chad Holmgren, what a defender. What a rim protector he is. They're fun to watch.

This is a much better final than the one that I didn't think we were going to get once that series started, but I'm glad we're going to see this rather than the Knicks. Although I'm sure the NBA would have preferred the Knicks in the final. Yeah, this is a minor league baseball world series. Yeah, it really feels like it. All right, I got one other thing to finish up with. Well, I got one thing. There's so breaking news.

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Tommy's right. There is some breaking NFL news as we are in the midst of recording this podcast. We'll get to it in a moment. This segment of the show is brought to you by Window Nation. Window Nation's got a great deal going on right now. It's buy four windows, get for free, with a free entry door when you purchase a house full of windows. And you don't have to pay anything for two years. No money down.

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that he was going to just string them along and leave him at the altar. I'll just say what I said all season long and especially at the end of the season. Anybody that thinks the Jets had a terrible season just because Aaron Rogers of Aaron Rogers did not watch football last year and did not watch the Jets. Rogers wasn't Aaron Rogers from his prime or MVP Aaron Rogers, but he was damn good at the end of last year. He and Devante Adams were cooking at the end of last year. I don't know what he'll be at 41 years old, 42, whatever he's going to be.

He could fall off the cliff. But if he plays like he did last year, Pittsburgh will have their best quarterback they've had since Ben Rathosberger in the lineup. That's my thoughts. years. Well, I mean, you know, the Steelers have been very on Pittsburgh-like this whole this whole post, this whole off-season, you know, the trade, trading pickets away, trading for DJ Metcalf, the whole, you know, holding out that Aaron Rogers would hopefully sign with them. It's very on Steelers-like the way they've been doing business. They play in a division where two teams, the Ravens in particular, and the Bengals, are powerful and have some semblance of stability.

The Browns are a mess. I don't think this is going to work out very well for everyone involved. I think they'll struggle at times, and when they struggle at times, I don't think Tomlin will. be able to keep the nastiness away? I think it's got a chance to work. I mean, part of that is because I went hard last year that Aaron Rogers doesn't stink. If you're watching the games, Aaron Rogers, a lot of those games, he looked like Aaron Rogers.

Their defense was horrible and their kicker literally lost three football games last year with missed kicks. You know, you look at that. you look at that team. They're going to be really good defensively again. They're going to get T.J. Watt signed, I would guess. They added one of my favorite running backs in the draft, Caleb Johnson from Iowa. They've got a big time, you know, tight end in Friermuth.

And they got Metcalf, you know. Who are their other receivers? Let me pull up our lads real quickly. Yeah, Robert Woods. Yeah, I mean, the rest of their receivers are not great, but you've got a, I think they've got Jalen Warren coming back. He played really well at times last year. I don't know.

It's going to be interesting. It's going to be very interesting because Pittsburgh really has had quarterback issues since Ben Rathusberger, you know, really started to tail off because of the injury. So it's been a while. And I think that even if, you know, even if I would place Aaron Rogers, say, at 15 or 16 among starting. quarterbacks in the NFL, like in the middle, that's still a lot better than what they've had. A lot better than what they've had. So, and he's, Tomlin's been able to figure out how to win nine and ten games without a

quarterback for several years. They'll be an interesting team. Hey, I wanted to finish up with something that we, you know, obviously didn't get to last week. Did you see what Mike Floreo from pro football talk said about Washington's mindset entering the NFC Championship game against the Eagles? No, I did not. He said last Friday on his show, quote,

The day of the NFC championship, someone I know who is very well plugged in said, the commanders know they are going to get their asses kicked today, and they are just kind of bracing for it, closed quote. I just, I just, I just don't believe that Washington, after winning 45 to 31 in Detroit, beating Tampa 23 to 20, a month earlier, turning the ball over five times and still beating the Eagles 36 to 33, felt like they were going to get their asses kicked heading into that game. That just doesn't make any sense to me at all.

No, that doesn't add up. That's not this group. I don't see that. That's not your quarterback. I doubt the quarterback thought that. There's no way that Dan Quinn or Kingsbury or Joe Witt Jr. or Jaden Daniels or Bobby Wagner thought they were getting their ass kicked. Look, Florio, you know, I'm not going to get into over the years, but we all know as Skins fans, he had it out for the organization for years.

He would be going hard on the organization, especially under the old name. I just, is it possible somebody said, yeah, I talked to somebody on their training staff and he thinks they're going to get their ass kicked. Maybe. I can't imagine professional football players on the role they were on would have thought, yeah, we just kicked this shit out of the lions on the road, and we really don't think we got a chance today. There's just no way that that was anybody's mindset.

I would agree. It doesn't head up. I mean, first of all, competitive athletes rarely, I would imagine, have that feeling, although Kuhli used to share a lot of, oh, I knew we were going to get our ass kick that day. Like being truly honest. Like, if you were an 8-9 division-winning team that won a home playoff game and then went to Philadelphia in week two and we're 50, point underdogs. Maybe some players would have felt that way. That's just not the context of what this game was. Everybody thought they had a chance. I picked Philly, but I said going into that,

I think Washington's got a chance. Wait a minute. Did I pick Washington? I may have picked Washington. Did you pick Washington? I forget what our picks were. I picked Philly, I think. I definitely thought Washington had a legitimate chance to win that game. I really did, heading into that game. And the game itself, and I've said this many times, it was closer than the final score indicated. But the final score was pretty ugly. All right. Anything else?

I got nothing else for you, boss. All right. I will talk to you on Tuesday. Enjoy the rest of the week and the weekend. I'll do that, boss. You too. Back tomorrow with what should be a guest-heavy show. I think we'll have Kymon, Legler on,

and maybe a Washington player on tomorrow's show. Until then.