The Kevin Sheehan Show - The Meaning Of 56-14

Episode Date: December 28, 2021

Kevin and Thom today with more on Washington's 56-14 loss to the Cowboys on Sunday night and whether or not the team will have any bounce-back ability. They discussed a lot of Ron Rivera's Monday comments regarding the quarterback decision for Sunday's game against the Eagles and more.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheon Show. Here's Kevin. Tommy's here. I'm here. The podcast today presented by Window Nation.

You've got just a few days left to take advantage of this incredible deal they've got going on right now. 50% off all styles of windows. 50% off Bose, Bayes, double hung, and sliders. And a house full of windows right now for only $99 a month. It's an incredible deal that ends December 31st. Call them at 86690 Nation. Go to windownation.com. Lower your upcoming winter energy bills.

Take advantage of my relationship with Window Nation, which will get you a free estimate. They won't push you at all. You can do whatever you want with that estimate. You can shop it. Call them at 86690 Nation. Go to Window Nation.com. Mention my name.

They will take good care of you. So, Tom. How was your Christmas? Very low-key. Very low-key and quiet. I mean, it was happy. I mean, look, I don't know where you are at this stage, but I'm at the stage of my life that if I pretty much want something,

I just go out and get it. Yeah. So you don't want anybody to get you anything? Yeah, but I came up with a list of books. You know, I got to hold back on buying books because I always say to myself, you need to read the books you have. before you buy more books.

So I figured that, well, I'll put a list of books up. And if I get them, that'll be fine. That way up, I won't be spending money on them, at least in one sense.

And I got all the books I asked for. What books were you asking for? Well, I was asking for the biography of Tom Seaver by Bill Madden. I was asking for, a collection of column writing by Steve Lopez. Used to be a news columnist

for the Philly Enquirer and the LA Times. I like reading collections of columns, books like that. For inspiration and whatever. Bill Plashky, the great sports writer for the L.A. Times, he has a book of his columns.

I asked for that and got that. there is a woman named Marie Oh, what's there? What's her, what's her, ladies? God, oh, my, I'm throwing a point now. Marie Colvin. She was a war correspondent for a newspaper in London during the Middle East conflicts.

There's a movie out about her. I forget the name of a movie. I think it's on Amazon Prime or Netflix, a great film. And after I saw that movie, I started reading some of her stuff. So I asked for a collection of her work, and I got that as well. That was my Christmas. Very low-key. So I'm with you.

I don't like getting gifts, but I get gifts anyway. Christmas to me is, you know, the gift-giving stuff is for children. My wife and I have kind of a disagreement about that. She continues to, and it's lovely, don't get me wrong, and the boys are excited, but she continues to treat Christmas morning like she did when they were seven and a years old. So there are lots of gifts for each of them, and to me, like, I just have gotten past the point of there was nothing better than when, you know, there's, there is nothing better than Christmas morning for young kids, you know, that's the best. But I have, you know, I have college-aged and,

you know, older, you know, sons at this point. So I enjoy, you know, Christmas Eve and the dinner and we had, you know, we had a group of 11 at our house for Christmas Eve. I enjoy, you know, that stuff. But every year, there's like one gift that some gives me. This year it was my son who gave me this gift, which also, by the way, was a collection of writings. This was the 20 best sports writing stories of the year. You were not in there. I wish you were. I don't know if you submit any of these, or I don't know if the author of the book knows you well enough. But people like, you know, the people that would people, the people that here locally would know names of, you know, Kent Bab from the Washington Post, Tom Verduci

from Sports Illustrated. But Tommy, I think I've told you this before. Chuck Culpepper, who writes for the Post, I just think every single time he writes, and I'm paying attention to the Post, which I don't every day, I read it and I would say 80% of the time, I'm like, that was great. And the other 20% of the time, I'm like, that was really good. And I was involved with this one gift to the point where everybody said, are you going to open your next gift? I'm like, not right now because I was reading Culpepper's story about the 50-year anniversary of the Marshall plane crash and everything around it.

And I find him to be, what do you think of Chuck Culpepper? I'm just curious. I don't know if we've talked about him before as a writer. What do you think of him? He's a great writer. Sometimes he could use an editor with some balls. Like, what does that mean? He said, love with his language too much.

You know? I mean, sometimes, at some point, after the six or seven paragraphs, you want to know, what the fuck am I reading about? But you think he's a great writer? Yes. It's interesting. I think he's a beautiful writer. I'd leave it up to you to decide whether or not he's a great writer.

He is. You can't deny. He's a great writer. I just think that some of his stories, he's too in love with his own language. Well, not like Sally. I mean, Sally uses literally words in her stories that I'm talking about grad students are going to occasionally need a dictionary or a thesaurus to look it up. I mean, and I love the way.

Sally writes. Sally's in love with words that don't necessarily need to be used to describe what she's trying to describe. I mean, to me, Sally, like you in many ways, is phenomenal when she's writing angry or when she's writing emotionally. And then, you know, whereas you, it's the easiest thing in the world to read. And by the way, that's a compliment. I'm complimenting you on that.

It's very digestible. you're to the point, you're witty, you're biting, you're attacking, but you don't have to stop in the middle of it and wonder what that particular word meant. Culpepper, I think, writes very emotionally and in a moving way. You're right. You're absolutely right. And again, he's a writer's writer, as we like to say. I just think sometimes I've read his stuff, But after like 50- or six paragraphs, I still don't know why I'm reading this. Right. You know, I think, look, this is always an argument.

The business, I'm not in love with editors. Trust me. You know, most of them are people who couldn't do what we do. That's why they're back at the office working as editors. But sometimes you need somebody to say, okay, this is nice if you're writing for your sports writer, but you're writing for 500,000 other people that are going to read it. Right. They need to know why they're reading it too.

God, you know, that analogy is similar to what we've done together in Sports Talk Radio with program directors, you know, or, you know, producers, but more times than not program directors. And sometimes it's like, okay, I get it. You know, you don't want the music to run very long. the T's to be more specific. You want to reset. But sometimes, you know, the person that's been doing this forever has a real good sense of the audience, you know? And that's what you're trying to appeal to. Not necessarily the mechanics of doing it right. Because not all, you know, sometimes it doesn't matter,

you know, if the mechanics are right or if the, the way, the technical way in which you're doing the show is right, because it's the content that wins out, you know? And I don't know. Whatever. I understand what you're saying, though. But anyway, I was immersed in this book and read his story. And then I read another, what was the other story I read? It was a Jason Stark story from The Athletic. Jason now writes for the Athletic, doesn't he? I think he does.

Yes, he does, yeah. Yeah. And I just sat there for about 35 minutes and completely checked out from Christmas morning. But you know what? That means it was a really good gift. I don't like the gifts that are like, okay, great, a shirt. Woo, that's wonderful. And I'm not being unappreciative. But like you said, I'm at a point in my life where I can go get what I want whenever I want it.

You know, I don't golf. I smoke cigars, but my son doesn't like buy me cigars because he doesn't want me to smoke cigars. So he refuses to buy them for me. And, you know, if it's, if it's, I drink beer and I buy my own beer, you know, so it's a limited, there's a limited group. You've got to come up with something. Like my son did come up with something pretty cool.

And I saw them advertise a while ago, and I thought that'd be cool to have. it's a drinking mug made from baseball bats. A drinking? So is it wood? Yeah, it's wood. Okay. And it's thin, like a baseball, like the end of a baseball bat, the thick end. And it's hollowed out.

And it's got a team insignia on the side. And it's a drinking mug. And it's pretty cool. What was the team insignia? Which team? Well, he got to die. He got the Dodgers. It doesn't say LA Dodgers.

It just says Dodgers. Oh, okay. Because it's the Brooklyn Dodgers for me. So that was a nice present. Yeah. And that's something that I would like to have, but I'd say, well, I don't really need it, so I'm not going to buy it. You know, I got enough things to drink out of. Right.

But it was thought. I enjoy it. It was thoughtful. Yes. Yeah. What did you get your wife? Uh, I mean, a couple of things. Um.

Okay. You know. Was she happy? Yeah, I mean, do you want to know specifically what I got my wife? Well, just one thing. One thing that she seemed to like the most. There were some noise-canceling sleep headphones that I got, Apple headphones. I got her a scarf, one of those scarves that you can't believe how expensive they are.

I mean, I don't. I mean, I understand brand, you know, Air Miss. and, you know, all these different things. But it just is amazing sometimes to me, you know, when she'll say, because I'll always say, what do you want? Nothing. And she says, what do you want? And I go, nothing.

It's the same thing every year. And then maybe two weeks before Christmas, you know, she'll say, all right, if you really want to get me something, get this. And so I'm always amazed at the price of things. that just don't seem like they should be that expensive. But, you know, supply and demand, I guess, or certainly if there's demand. Did you think you should be in the scarf-making business after buying that? I'll tell you what, it wouldn't be a bad business to be in, I guess.

The margins have to be high, but I guess I don't know. I don't know anything about the scarf business. I don't know anything about, you know, the Hermesses and the Louis Vuittons and all those high-priced places with these things that look like you could probably go to, you know, Amazon and get them from some other, you know, off brand, and they wouldn't look that much different for, you know, a fifth of the price. But that's not, I guess, the point. I, you know, whatever.

You did good, though, because the scarf is sort of like an intimate thing as opposed to a device. That was good. Well, thank you. I, you know, there's, the Christmases have come with, like, the jewelry thing in the past. And I don't know, kind of ran out of ideas there. And I said, you know, she goes, no, I don't need anything. And we have a good friend of ours who is a jeweler and a really good one.

And I would say that, you know, for so many Christmases in a row, I would just call them up. And I'd say, hey, Gary, what do you got? And he'd be like, well, you know what? She's probably going to like this because whatever. but I didn't do that this year because she was like, no, no, no, no. And, you know, we've been renovating a home for the last long time. So, you know, we didn't want to really spend significant amount of money on each other. And I don't want to do that anyway.

She's probably already pawned that jewelry by now, right? Well, I hope she got a good price for it. You know, usually do not get good prices for it at pawn shops. That's for sure. Okay. We are, you know, sitting here on Tuesday to 28th. We are roughly 36 hours removed from one of the most lopsided defeats in the history of the Washington football franchise. It was the biggest disparity, margin of loss against the Cowboys and their long rivalry.

Ironically, last year, Washington's, you know, 41 to 16. win in Dallas on Thanksgiving Day. Their 25-point win was the biggest disparity the other way. You know, Washington last year had a 22-point win and a 25-point win against the Cowboys, totaling a margin of victory of 47 points. And the Cowboys had a 42.1 and a 7-point win this year, totaling a margin of victory of 49. So last year and this year, not much different, but the game Sunday night certainly seemed different for a game. a lot of reasons. Before I get into some follow-up to my, you know, game take and thoughts on the game from yesterday, I want to hear yours. Well, I mean, you know, and I mentioned this in my

column in some ways. I mean, Dallas was far healthier, okay, in every aspect than Washington was. And that was obvious from the start. They had all their, most of their defensive studs. They had their offensive weapons, including in Pollard back. They didn't have Pollard. I don't think the first time that they played. So I guess you knew it would be a mismatch. But let me personalize this.

When I used to wrestle in high school, sometimes I go out there against the guy, and it'd be like, you know, I'd go out there saying, how long can I survive this ass kicking? Can I put up enough of a fight that I won't be ashamed when I walk back to the bench and have to look at the coach? And a lot of times that wasn't the case, you know? Sunday night, that was the case for Washington.

You knew you were going to – I think you had to know. You were going to get your ass kicked. You had to know. I mean, but were you – you're going to be able to put up enough of a fight that people would say, well, you know, they gave it their best. You know, it was tough circumstances. They weren't going to win, but they didn't embarrass themselves. They didn't embarrass the team.

Well, none of that happens. Like against Philadelphia last week. Yes. Yes. Exactly. Now, Philadelphia has a far tougher pass rush. I mean, the pressure on Heineke was just paid for the watch. And, you know, you and I have said this.

This is the way you get, you basically, you know, disarm this guy. If you're worried about it, you got to bring pressure on him. I mean, you know, I mean, and the cowboys with their great front were able to, to do that. And, you know, Philly, like I think the next game, not to get ahead of ourselves, I think the next,

the Philly game could be competitive, because I don't think Philly can bring the same pressure that Dallas did. But, yeah, they, they, you know what, if that was me, and I was in a wrestling match, I wouldn't have gone back to the bench.

I would have just walked out of the gym. Yeah, I, um, you know, I think, I listened, I watched actually his press conference yesterday and there was a lot to it, you know, and not trying to psychoanalyze it. I mean, just the words were, there was a lot to that. I think the, you know, trying to read body language, et cetera, you know, I think there's a certain fatigue to him right now.

I actually had this thought in watching it yesterday that, I mean, he's not going to get fired, okay? for those of you thinking that, you know, he could lose the final two games, they could go six and 11, and Snyder's going to fire him. That's not happening. You know, he signed a five-year deal. I mean, they don't, you got to understand that this organization financially will never, you know, an NFL team's never going to go broke, obviously. But Washington's not doing great compared to the other 31 teams in the league. Their value is still very high, even though it's come down. But that's different. That's what somebody would be willing to pay. Their top line revenue that doesn't include their TV cut, their 132nd of the TV cut, has just dropped significantly.

So they're not thrown away three years of big money to Ron Rivera. People aren't buying tickets. You know, sponsors aren't jumping for the chance to be with the organization. They're almost like we used to say to Poconos, there were a lot of people who were land rich in the Poconos. They didn't have a lot of money, but their land sure had a lot of value. Right. And, you know, you can borrow against that, which Snyder has kind of done to buy out his shareholders. Anyway, one of the, there was a lot that Ron said yesterday, including about the quarterback situation, which we will get to next segment on this show.

But he was asked if he worried that this wasn't just a bad game, but rather than the direction that the team is headed in. And he said, quote, no, this is a bad game. This ain't a direction. I'll tell you that right now. You look at the way we played the previous two games and in our circumstances and you would say, yeah, that's a hell of an effort. Or at least I'd like to believe somebody would look at it and say that was a hell of an effort. What happened last night, meaning Sunday night, could we have played better? I think so. Could we have done things better? Yeah, I think so. But it didn't happen that way. So we live with it, closed quote. When he said, no, this is a bad game. This ain't a direction. I'll tell you that right now. I agree with that statement.

Now, let me just tell you, I don't know what the direction is, but it's not 56 to 14 Sunday against Philadelphia and 35 to 7 in the Meadowlands against the Giants. This is not 2009, the Jim Zorn 2009 closeout. Or 2019 under, you know, even old coach Cal, who actually had them playing pretty well there. But, you know, he also very much came to the defense of his players in a couple of quotes yesterday. He was asked if, you know, using COVID and injuries is an excuse.

And he said, well, you're going to sound like that no matter how I try not to. It's like when you hear somebody rant about the way they played, they quit, they didn't want to play. No, that's bullshit, he said. Those guys wanted to play. Those guys did everything they could to get back. They got up at five in the morning and came here and tested before six o'clock so that their specimens could get sent up to a lab and checked. That tells me these guys wanted to play. That tells me these guys wanted to be here.

Guys wanted to come in and do extra work when they weren't able to. We had to do a lot of this stuff virtually. And I talked yesterday on the show about being outplayed, being out hustled, being out-coached. All of those things were true. They were also outclassed the other night. But I also said, and some people took exception to this because they thought I was somehow defending the team, that the context of this is the last week and a half to two weeks of a shit show. I mean, they're not the only team going through it. I understand that. But lots of COVID losses, lots of injury losses, lots of inability to practice, lots of inability to prepare. and then a team captain gets into a tragic accident on Friday night where the female passenger in the vehicle, 29 years old, dies.

There was just a lot going on. And I know enough about the NFL. And I say this all the time, and I've said it for years. I think if you bet the sport, you have a different perspective about the sport. I'm not saying it's a better perspective, but it's a different perspective. And how long that you've known me have I said, If you get into recency bias with the NFL, you're going to lose a lot of damn money. Because it is week to week.

If you're not one of those two or three or four gold-level franchises top to bottom that seem to be able to overcome adversity on the regular, if you're not one of those five or six teams that has an elite Hall of Fame kind of quarterback, it is week to week. And things change and they change quickly. just as they did after a two and six start and then after a four-game win streak. And now everybody's convinced that what they just saw is what they are and is the direction they're heading in. I'm telling you that it isn't.

And I think I'll be proven right on Sunday because I don't think they're going to get their ass kick Sunday. And I went back to- And I went back, Tommy. I don't either. And let me just say, now, if it was Zorn, maybe Jay, there's certain moments. in time in this franchise's last, you know, 20 plus years that I would have said the wheels are coming off. It's very obvious. But they're not. And they didn't last year. And they didn't at two and six this year. And personally, I'd be surprised if they came off at six and nine off of a 56 to 14 loss.

I went back. People are going to say, God, man, you really love Rivera. It's not that I really love Rivera. Okay, I like Rivera and I like who he is and I like what people who have played for him say about him, his former players and the sense I get from his current players. And I think it's a different situation football coaching wise than it's been. I don't think he's an X's and O's genius. I think he's a little bit old school. I don't think that this is, you know, this is not an elite coaching staff per se, but I do think it's a coaching staff that can motivate and a coaching staff that makes sure that the wheels don't come off. You know, by the way, that's not what I'm looking for either. I'm looking for wins and I'm looking for a Super Bowl contender, but I also know.

Yeah. That's kind of the point here. I mean, I agree with everything you said. I mean, I think a Ron Rivera-Overe coach team, for the most part, is never going to bottom out because he'll get them to play too hard over the course of a season. Okay? But that shouldn't be the standard. That shouldn't be the goal. No, and I'm not saying that it is, but as long as Dan Snyder owns this team, and as long as they don't have an elite franchise quarterback,

then you're looking for kind of small victories, which you didn't have many of over the last, you know, you haven't had many of over the last 22 years. And you had a wheels coming off situation possibility with the last coaching staff, certainly with the Zorn group. Hell, it happened with Mike at the end of 2013. But I went back because Ron Rivera said something, and let me just find the quote,

because he essentially said, this is going to happen in this league. He said, here it is. He said, the message is we've got two games left to play. Let's go out and play it. You lose a game, okay, whether you lose it by one or you lose it by, what did we lose it by? 42. It's a loss. Sure, it was a big score, but at the end of the day it happened, it's going to happen. You play this game long enough. You're going to have these kind of defeats. How you handle them, now that's important. How you come back, that's important. That will talk about what our character is. That will talk about where we are more so than anything else.

That to me is what's really important. Now, at 2 and 6 when they lost to Denver, I said to you, the rest of the season is about how they respond to Ron. That's what I'm looking for. Is he the right guy? Is he going to keep the wheels from coming off or not? Well, they proved that he could do that. They won four games in a row.

And now you're kind of back in that situation to a certain degree, but I wanted to just go through something because I did a little bit of research late last night. I went back and looked at how many times he got his ass kicked like he did on Sunday night. And what happened? You know, we've talked about his record

at the end of years in December. It's been phenomenal. You know, I think he's won 64.4% of his games before this year in December. You know, so in 2019, his last year in Carolina, They got beat in San Francisco 51 to 13 and ass kicking. The next week they came back against a good Tennessee Titans team won the game 30 to 20.

Then shortly before he got fired, and by the way, that team was at 5 and 3 with Kyle Allen quarterbacking it, you know, after Cam Newton was essentially gone for the year. They were 5 and 3, and they got run by Atlanta, 29, 23. Why are you breathing so hard right now? I'm not. There's a heavy breathing going on, and it's a distraction. So stop it. It's you. No, it's you. No, it's you.

It's not me. So are you listening to me now? Can I go through these? Yes. They got run by Atlanta, 29, 23. 29 to 3 by 26. 29 to 3. The next week they went and faced Drew Brees and the Saints in the Superdome, and

they had a 28-yard field goal for Joey Sly, by the way, to take the lead with under a minute to go, and he missed it. And then their kicker kicked a long kick at the gun, and they lost 34-31. In 2017, the Saints blew him out by 21. The following week, they went to Foxborough and beat Brady and the Patriots. 33 to 30 is a near 10-point underdog. In 2016, they got beat 40 to 70. at Seattle. Next week beat Philip Rivers and the Chargers 28 to 16. In 2014, they lost 38 to 10 to Baltimore

and then beat Chicago the next week. They lost 45-21 at Philadelphia, lost on a long field goal at the gun the following week, and then lost by 18 to Minnesota, and then won five in a row, including a playoff game. In 2013, they got beat 31-13 at New Orleans and then won three in a row. The point here is when he says you play this game long enough, you're going to have these kinds of defeats, how you handle them. That's important. He's suffered some big-time defeats. I mean, 51-13, 40 to 7. You know, they've gotten run a couple of times in every single time at Carolina, every single time they came back in either won or put together a winning streak or they lost literally at the gun on a field goal against a decent team.

So I, and by the way, the other thing that's pushing me in this direction is the point spreads three and a half. Philly is a three and a half point favorite in what won't be a road game, as we know. And by the way, the odds makers understand this. The odds makers have adjusted, you know, Washington's home field advantage, point spread, boost. They don't get what anybody else gets in the league anymore because they don't have a home field advantage. They get a little bit of, they probably get a point, point and a half, something like that. They don't get the typical full three you get for being at home because they realize there's no advantage to them crowd-wise.

In fact, there is a disadvantage more times than not, and there probably will be unsuccessful. Sunday against the Eagles. By the way, how pathetic and sad is that? I mean, Washington. Washington is the one place in the league where literally the odds makers don't give them full credit for being the home team. Look, there are other teams late in the year where they know there's not going to be a crowd, so they factor that in. But for Washington, it starts from the jump. There are three and a half point underdog at home against Philadelphia on Sunday. Washington just lost 56 to 14. The Eagles have won six of eight. They're currently in the playoffs. They have to win this game. I'm telling you, Sunday, I expect a really good effort from this particular team because of the head coach,

his staff, and the kind of players that he has in that locker room. It's not a group of coaches and players that I think are going to contend for the Super Bowl anytime soon, they're so far removed from that. Further removed from that probably than we thought before the season started because the defense really isn't, based on the results this year, what we thought it had the potential to be. Maybe the biggest disappointment of the year is that the defense isn't going to be this juggernaut defense more likely than not. We thought it was going to be just three months ago.

It's not. more, right? I mean, maybe the biggest disappointment in terms of what we learned from the season so far is, you know, the sweat, Chase Young, Payne, Allen. Allen's terrific. That it's not going to be the Chicago Bears of 85. Did you see what Doc tweeted during the game Sunday night at one point? Maybe it was around halftime. No. He tweeted, did Montez Sweat make the trip? God. Anyway...

Everything you said is right. Everything you said is right. But I also think that based on what we saw on the sideline, contrary to, you know, the team's position on this, that it's being held together with Fred. And it could fall apart real quickly if they turn in a similar first-half performance against Philadelphia. You said something to me a couple of weeks ago, and I think it's applicable to what you just said. I don't know that any of the people that cover the team and any of the people that are columnists of the team or anybody that pontificates about the team, I think everybody's much more distant from knowing whether or not that's true right now. You made the point that not being able to have access to players in the locker room has been an advantage for Rivera and the team.

There is nothing based on what I've seen from afar that tells me that that dust up, which wasn't pleasant to watch. I mean, you know, it also got blown up because it's Sunday night football and it's national TV. If that had been a one o'clock game on, you know, Fox, it isn't the story that it is. Personally, I don't think that was a big deal. I know that Allen and Payne are friends, good friends, and they have been for a long period of time. I think it was the fraying of nerves, the week and a half of just uncertainty, of tragedy, of all of these things, and then all of a sudden you're getting your ass kicked, and you can't stop anybody for the second straight game. And I'll tell you this.

I don't know what you felt about this, but I think I said this yesterday in the podcast. I'm not sure why Al and Chris felt like they shouldn't emphasize more that pain stuck his finger in John's face. You know, in most cases, that's going to get a pretty emotional reaction. Teammate, friend, or not. Every time. You scream at me all you want.

You put your finger into my face or you spit at me or something like that. You're going to get punched. Yeah, every time. So, I don't know, I just kind of think that that is not an indication that the wheels are going to come off here. But you might be right. Unless you think, I mean, that's the thing. It depends on what you want to believe or what you think, whether this is the direction or not. Look, I think they'll play well against Philadelphia, like you said.

I think they can compete against the Eagles. I don't think it'll look anything like the Dallas game, but if it does early, I think what they have is very loosely held together. Look, I mean, remember the week before, Jonathan Allen reamed out the defense in his post-game comments. You know, maybe Dron Payne thought he was talking about him. Maybe this is a carryover from the week before,

and maybe this is something that's going to fester. And what you don't have, you know, people gave Washington PR credit, you know, the cheerleading squad out there at Ashburn, gave him credit for presenting Payne and Allen in the post-game press conference. Actually, I was kind of, I was kind of surprised by that. In years past, they wouldn't have done that. I don't know what it really had. You know what? In years past, you could, you could, you had access to them in the locker room. Okay. Well, that's true. But I mean, in years past, if you didn't. have that access, they weren't going out of their way to help anybody out.

But go ahead. But you did have that access. And what you didn't have is, you know, the post-game moment where players are far more empowered to speak out their frustrations in front of their locker, even before a crowd of reporters, then they are on a stage in a press conference. So what you got was the script. You know, we're brosures. brothers ain't no big deal.

You know, this is brothers fight. You know, it's almost verbatim the same thing, word for word. That two of them said to try to explain it. So they were, again, saved. And it's not like they're doing something devious here. They're following with the COVID protocols. Every team is in the same situation. So I'm not trying to say they've just been,

out of all the harmful effects that COVID has had and particularly for this team this year, the one slight benefit is that it has protected them from the fractures being voiced publicly that Jack Del Rio talked about a week ago when he said they have not fractured. I mean, there's no Josh Norman

standing in front of his locker after, you know, reading about Jonathan Allen's comments the week before, you know, sounding off about it in the post-game interview. There's none of that, and that has helped Ron Rivera. Well, look, as it relates to Sunday night, there weren't enough of their regular players to know whether or not they had fractured or not. You know, they just wasn't on defense and enough of their regulars. But it was good that the fight, Tommy, took place on those benches that were warmed up

and logoed, though. That's for sure. that was something that I spent some time on yesterday. And I look, as always with this organization, you know, the football operation, I hope, is kind of separate. But I think we have found out in the last week, week and a half, it really isn't from, you know, the numskulls on the other side of the building. I mean, this bench thing is, you know, it's not, it's not as embarrassing as 56 to 14. but it's embarrassing. This was really stupid on every level.

And Ron wasn't, I don't think, consulted on this. You can go back and listen to my interview from Friday with him. He certainly never admitted that it was him and that he had approved any of it. That was ridiculous and dumb. And another indication and another tell that the owner is never that far removed from you know, football related things. And then, you know, the guy that, you know, I know I know a little bit and I've had multiple conversations with and he's very bright, you know, I think your advice to Brian Lafamina

probably would have been the same to Jason. It's like rent don't buy. He's actually too good in high quality of a person, I think, to be in this organization for a long period of time. But he did something stupid. Did you see the picture he tweeted out on Christmas night? You didn't? No. Go look at Jason Wright's Twitter. He tweeted out on Christmas

night a picture of a snowman and Santa Claus peeing on a cowboy's helmet. He's the team president. Can you imagine if Bruce had done that and then they had lost less than 24 hours

later, 56 to 14? I mean, I think, you know, I think what he's trying to do, and what I've noticed about him, is he's really trying to connect. He's trying to become a part of, you know, this, you know, rivalry or, you know, you know, but you and I have talked about this a lot. And I'm going to sound repetitive because I mentioned this yesterday. But for some reason, whether the people are new in the organization or they've been there for a while, they attach themselves to this percentage of the fan base, which is really tiny.

And it's the percentage of the fan base that they think is much larger and kind of reflective of the fan base that thinks that the team does nothing wrong. They don't think anything's wrong other than they've just had some bad luck. They like the owner. Well, I don't know if they like the owner,

but they think it's just more or less bad luck. And they're the ones that show up to the draft day party and buy, you know, beer for $25 for a $16. announcer. They show up at Harvest Fest. They show up on the road at these parties the night before games. And God bless them. They're really loyal. And they are the last of the spenders on the franchise. This franchise for you and I have been not in it, but closer than most of our listeners have been to it for a long time now. And it's remarkable what they think. And, you know, You know, I think there were people in that part of the fan base that shows up at Harvest Feast or Harvest Fest in the Draft Day Party that thought the tweet was funny.

And then there are the people that I would suggest he really needs to learn from. And that is the people that used to own all of the club seats and the suites and used to buy all the advertising that don't want anything to do with the organization anymore that probably looked at that tweet and said, I would never participate with these people again. Like I said, stop. Here's the thing. There's nobody, and I don't know Jason right from Adam. I've never spoken to him. But we know part of the problem with Dan Snyder, part of many problems,

is there's no one to tell him no that this isn't a good idea. There's no one, and I don't know if there's still anyone in this organization to tell people, you know, this isn't a good idea. I mean, you know, to do this. I mean, every, all good organizations have a person or people who will do that, who have who command enough respect to an authority to get away with it. Well, that's a position that doesn't exist. That's what they do.

They need to create a job title where I'm the person who tells everyone else this is wrong. Yeah, and I have had several conversations with Jason. He's bright and he's not, you know, this is not the place for him, you know, to settle in, not with this group of people. He's higher quality than the group of people that he's, you know, working with right now. But what an opportunity, right? You know, it's tough to turn down the opportunity that he got. But, you know, the hostage statement about the Sean Taylor, you know, Jersey retirement thing. And who knows, Dan may have seen this and sent it to him and said, you should tweet this out.

The problem is that nobody in the organization knows who to get good advice from. You know, they rely on Huckleberry, Burgundy, and Gold on Twitter, you know. They rely on these people that they run into at the draft day party or on the road in Charlotte at the Saturday night thing. And these people, God bless them, because they're loyal. They're not going to tell Jason or Dan, Dan's probably not going to listen to anybody anyway, what really is going on here and what has gone on here and why the top level revenue generating customer is gone. You know, you may never get that person back, but you've got to learn from that person, you know,

and I suggested something that, you know, some of you thought was spot on and others thought it was a little, you know, harsh. but trust me on this what's coming next is another way to sort of memorialize and remember Sean Taylor that's a never-ending go-to move for them this is part of the issue this is separate from football but at the same time

it's the stuff you know the benches and the the mishandling of the Sean Taylor thing the picture in front of the porta-potties the you know the owner in a hoodie the the people stop all over the Sean Taylor thing in the stadium, including, you know, Pat Mahomes' brother. You know, all of this stuff is why... It's all connected.

It's connected. It's all connected. Because you get this stuff out there, and then it's like, yeah, no, I don't think I want to come there. I got a better option. This is what I've been saying for the last couple of years. You know, if it's a media controversy, it's a controversy because the media, because of social, media in particular is such a powerful force, and I'm not talking about myself. I'm talking about this big blob of media entity that if you're not prepared on the athletic side of the business to deal with the media, it's going to hurt your product.

Yeah. It just is. They just keep getting terrible. They either don't take advice. They're not willing to listen. We know that the owner has never thought it was his fault. So why would he seek, you know, real advice? But I do, and I've said this for how many years, Tommy?

How many years have I told you that I've been at several of these events? I've hosted or been a part of a lot of these events. And I'm always blown away at the response from the people in the organization. They think it's reflective of their fan base. And I've said to key people before, that's not. I've had the, you know, occasion to say, yeah, this is fun and these people are great. I mean, look at the, you know, hog snout noses and the sunny and Rigo jerseys. And, you know, and I'm telling you, there was a point there, Tommy, in like the mid-2000s to like maybe 2015,

where it was basically the same people at every event. event, especially towards the end. And I appreciate their loyalty, but they bathed themselves in it. They immersed themselves in those people, and they convinced themselves despite the dwindling attendance and the dwindling television ratings that those were the people that they, you know, that had it right, that those were the people that they needed to lean on. And it just wasn't because those people never and haven't thought that the organization has done much wrong. It's the people that were, you know, again, spending big money on suites and club seats and were business partners of the team. They're gone. Why are they gone? You got to learn from those people. I mean,

it's a big number. You know, there are a lot of people that you and I both know, and a lot of people that I used to spend a lot of Sundays with down at RFK or even the new stadium, a new stadium, even FedEx field and they're gone, but you can learn from them. And how do you get those people back? I'll tell you one way you don't get them back. You don't get them back by building a stadium in Prince William County. That's for sure. Nothing is more reflective of being detached from what they've lost than the prospect of a stadium in Prince William County. One less caveat about Jason Wright, who I've never spoken to. but I've read his comments, including the one short way after he was hired, that he said in an interview to front office sports.

Quote, speaking of the Snyders, they shared, I shared, and I think a transparency, authenticity, and the acknowledgement that we had shared values and a shared vision of what makes a good culture and a good organization. That made me incredibly excited to jump into a partnership with them. He didn't have to say that. Sounds like a McKinsey man with his next big consulting job. That's what it sounds like to me.

Transparency. Your tongue should fall out of your mouth if you use the word transparency with this organization. Yeah, so true. Transparency, not the word that should be used to describe them. Certainly not these days. No, that's just that is, you know, a consultant's, signing on a new client, and they're going to say everything that's nice about that client and how all of their views kind of align synergistically.

Anyway, all right, we're done with this part of the conversation. What about the quarterback conversation? Ron Rivera had some interesting comments about who will start and who will play against Philadelphia. We will get to that part of the conversation right after these words from a few of our sponsors. This portion of the podcast is brought to you by MyBooky. Go to mybooky.ag or MyBooky.com. They will match your initial deposit dollar for dollar up to a thousand bucks. Use my promo code, Kevin D.C., and if you deposit 1,000, you'll have $2,000 in your account to gamble with.

Deposit 500, you'll have $1,000. Deposit 250, you'll have $500. I think you get the point. Lots of football. Boy, lots of bowl games today. So far today, from what I can see, all of these games are on. Tuesday, December 28th, there are five bowl games today. And there have been some mixing and matching to make some other bowl games work,

like the Sun Bowl. Miami dropped out, but Central Michigan jumped in after the Arizona Bowl canceled. It's a wild, wild bowl season. If you missed my interview with Gene Wong from the Washington Post, who covers college football. It was at the end of yesterday's podcast. Interesting economics when it comes to these bowl games. I mean, if they don't get played, they don't get any money.

I mean, including the team that was totally healthy, they don't get any money either. Anyway, mybooky.ag, mybooky.com for a safe, reliable, fair way to bet. Even if you've got a place already, use MyBooky, take the free money from them. They're going to double your first deposit if you use my promo code, Kevin, D.C. So Rivera on the quarterbacking thing, this was interesting. He said, first of all, he was asked, I think, by Ben Standig,

what he thought about Taylor Heineke's performance after watching the tape. And he said, quote, I thought Taylor missed some opportunities. I do think he got a little bit rattled and started throwing off his back leg a couple of times. He had a couple of opportunities that I know that if he could have really stood tall in there, he'd have completed those. The very first throw was unfortunate because he had Terry. If he could have put that one to the sideline, I think Terry makes that play. I think that's a big play.

Unfortunately, he hung it out. It stayed more to the middle. If that ball gets to the sideline, it's either a big catch for Terry or in completion. So then he's asked by Ben on if he thinks he will make a change at quarterback. And if not, why? And he said, no, I think, again, we will play. He said, no, I think. Again, we will play Kyle, probably.

But we're going to stick with Taylor right now. We will play Kyle, probably. And not as an indictment of Taylor or anything like that, but just that we also want to make sure we get a really good look at Kyle. And so Ben followed up. Well, does that mean Kyle comes in in a relief role? And Ron said, quote, we'll see. We'll see.

But right now we're going to start Taylor against Philadelphia, and we'll see. Closed quote. That was a weird exchange about who the starting quarterback's going to be. I mean, he says it's going to be Taylor, but then he says Kyle's going to play. Well, what does that mean? Are they going to alternate series? I don't think so. Does that mean that Taylor's got a short leash?

Probably. Does that mean that Kyle's actually got a chance and he's not saying it to start Sunday. I think there's a chance of that. I'll tell you what, I said this yesterday. I'd start Kyle Allen Sunday against Philadelphia. I don't know that it's going to make that much of a difference, but at this point, he's bigger, he throws it better. Let's just try something new. I mean, it's not because I feel like there's such a great chance that the results are going to be much better, but I don't think they're going to be much worse either. I think if Kyle Allen had started all 15 of these games, there's 15 and a half of these

games, is that what it is? I think they'd have basically the same record. But, you know... I don't know. Maybe. You know, it's interesting. Rivera's comments to the questions about the quarterback, it was like what he was saying was, I'm going to do what you're saying, but you're not speaking it in the language that I want you to speak it.

So what? You're not using the language I want you to use. Well, what do you think he was saying? What do you think he was saying? That he's going to, he's going to, I think he's going to, platoon them. I don't think so. I don't. Okay.

But the very least, I mean, he's not going to take Taylor Heineckee out of. he's hot. Platooning just doesn't work. No, it doesn't work. I think it's probably more likely than not that Taylor's on a super short leash Sunday. And then if they've got nothing to play for in the final week, he'll probably start Kyle Allen against the Giants. I think that's what it means. Wouldn't it be funny?

Wouldn't it be funny if they lost to the Giants again on the final week of the year in a game that they've got no business losing? Well, if there's nothing to play for, these games don't matter. You've made a bigger deal out of the... Yeah, but the Giants are bad. Washington's not good. No, I know. I mean, the Giants have a terrible quarterback situation right now. I mean, good God.

Do you know, I don't know if I mentioned this in the podcast yesterday, they attempted 44 passes in their game Sunday in Philadelphia, and they completed 23 of them for 108 yards. That's got to be a record for passes. attempts in yardage. Has to be. I've never seen a box score where the two quarterbacks were 23 of 44 for 108 yards. I just have never seen that.

Wow. It sounds like a Mark Brunel game when he was in water. Remember, there were a couple of the playoff game where they had whatever was less and 100 years passing in one. Yeah. And they beat Tampa. Yeah. That three yards sideline pass.

I just, wow, boy, by the way, as I'm just sitting here, you know, right now, the Eagles are having some COVID issues. The Eagles, this is just from Tim McManus, who covers the Eagles for ESPN. The Eagles are keeping quarterbacks, Jalen Hertz, Gardner, Minchu, and Reed Senate. I don't even know who that is, in separate rooms at Novacare Complex amid the surge in coronavirus cases across the country. The Eagles currently have eight players on the COVID-19 list, including Derek Barnett, Ryan Carrigan, and Teron Jackson. You know, meantime, Washington, if you look at their updated list, basically everybody's off it now.

I mean, this is the wild card down the stretch with every single NFL game. I mean, last night, New Orleans had to start in book, the Notre Dame guy, at quarterback, against a really aggressive defense. It's fun to watch Miami defensively. Sometimes I wish over the years, you know, it's been so long since Washington's had a really good defense, right? You know, I think we thought last year and this year would be different.

And so many of those games, I would go into them saying, God damn, Hazlitt or Minusky or Barry, whoever it is, just go down swinging. Just send everybody. And that's what the dolphins do under Brian Flores. They've got some athletes defensively, too. But they just come after you and they give you different looks. Now, you know, they had a rookie quarterback last night.

The Saints had no chance last night. Just like Washington really with Garrett Gilbert really didn't have much of a chance, although they were only down three late in the game. But this is the wild card down the stretch, you know, is who's available to play in these games? And by the way, we've gotten some key injuries. Jimmy Garoppolo could be out for a week or two. He's got a thumb UCL tear and fracture. The NFL season's been great,

but it's getting marred here at the end with all of these impacted games by more than just the typical injury bug. When you go into the playoffs, and it's still an issue, then it's really going to be magnified. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, Philly got Washington, you know, totally compromised, even if it was two days after the originally scheduled game.

And now Washington may get Philly in a big game for the Eagles in a weird situation. And the truth is, and I hate to bring up playoffs in Washington in the same sentence, But if Washington wins on Sunday, they won't be mathematically eliminated. They'll still be mathematically alive going into the final week. And if they win and you get teams like Minnesota to lose to Green Bay, which seems pretty reasonable, you know, that's not, you know, a crazy thought. You've already knocked the Eagles down a game by beating them directly. you know, you potentially have the 49ers without a quarterback against Houston, and Houston just beat the Chargers.

The Saints, who knows what their situation is going to be. I mean, we could be sitting here a week from now talking about Washington controlling their own destiny. Actually, I don't think that's possible, actually. But we could be talking about, you know, beat the giants, and if one or two things happen, they're the seven seed. I'm not going crazy here. I'm just looking at the NFL playoff picture, and it's nuts, and there's a lot that's unpredictable about Washington just lost two games that I think they may have lost anyway fully healthy.

Because personally, I think Philadelphia and Dallas are just better teams. I think we've seen enough to know that Dallas fully healthy is not just better, but much better. And personally, I think Philadelphia is better than Washington. and I felt that way for several weeks, and I thought the game at Philly was going to be tough anyway, even if they had gone and they're healthy. But maybe now it's Philadelphia's turn and Minnesota's turn

and San Francisco's turn to really take the brunt of this and maybe Washington's gotten through the worst of it. It doesn't mean that they're a good team. It's just going to be weird the way this thing plays out. Anyway, on the quarterback front, personally, I'd rather see Kyle Allen Sunday. No disrespect to Taylor Heineke and no expectation that it's going to be a lot better. But Kyle Allen does throw the football better.

He just does. I'm not saying he's a better quarterback. He just throws it better. He looks more like a quarterback that on third and eight from the pocket is going to have a chance to complete a pass against pressure. But he's not great and he's not the answer. So there you go. Well, let's remember, like his coach, when Taylor Hineke has had his back against the wall, he's responded. So I would expect a strong response from him coming off that game against the Cowboys.

Ron Rivera said one other thing. The last question of yesterday's Zoom press conference with the beat. He was asked if the changes he made to the front office in the offseason were geared towards finding their quarterback of the future. And he said, quote, I think it is part of it. It's a big part of it, to be honest, because the biggest thing, and it was one of the first questions that I was able to get answered when I got the job in Carolina. One thing that Marty Herney and I did together was we sat there and we said, we have to be able to identify who our franchise quarterback is.

We were fortunate that we had the number one pick. You want to point to it, sit there and say, well, look what's happened in Cincinnati Mattie when they had the number one pick referring to Joe Burrow. You're able to answer that question right away. So is that something we want to do now? Yeah, most certainly. You want to be able to say that when we get into the next season that we feel that we have who that guy is going to be. That gives you a chance that really does.

You look at the teams that are all right there in the race and you sit there and say, look at who they have. Right now the most obvious ones are Green Bay in Tampa Bay, you know, in Kansas City and, you know, and he goes on and on. He said, but, you know, basically the gist of it is, we'll see what happens this offseason. There's lots of questions and there's lots of things that are going to happen, whether it's through free agency or through the draft on our roster. But, you know, they're moving on from their current situation. I mean, anybody that's still hanging on the possibility of them, you know, tearing up Taylor Heineke's current deal and doing a long term, you're delusional.

That's not going to happen. It doesn't mean that Taylor Heineke's not going to be back next year. And it also doesn't mean that Taylor Heineke may not be back next year and start some games if they draft a young quarterback early. But he's not the answer. I had several people say to me, you know, after that four-game winning streak. You know, you always said they got to identify it early with Kirk and they got to get him signed. That's what they need to do now. They can't let him get to the point where he becomes too expensive.

I mean, seriously, like, I loved some of the stuff he was doing, and I was open-minded, not close-minded, but I was never, I never had a mind that went in the direction of tearing up his current deal and giving him a long-term deal. I don't know what anybody could have seen that would have told you that, oh, yeah, he's it. And he's not it. And they know he's not it. So this off-season is going to be an interesting.

interesting one because quarterback is top priority. There is not a close number two for this franchise in the off season. No, there's not, but one of the many depressing things, if you're a Washington football fan, is there seem to be so many more needs. They're not a quarterback away from a 10-game season. Well, it depends. If they hit, you know, if they hit the lottery on the quarterback, and I'm not talking about lottery in terms of pick selection, although there's not even a lottery, you know, in the NFL. But if they hit the lottery, they hit the home run, you know, you, I mean, what if, what if the next Justin Herbert's there?

What if the next Joe Burrow is there? You know who the most impressive quarterback of the 2021 NFL draft quarterback classes so far right now? The dude that got taken in the third round, Davis Mills, he's really, you know, really. played well for Houston. You know? I mean, you had, I mean, Lawrence, Zach Wilson, Trey Lance,

you know, I think Fields has had some moments. Obviously, Mack Jones has had some moments, but you can see the limitations here recently. And I'm not saying that Davis Mills has been better than Mac Jones this year. But in the last couple of weeks, he has been. He was taken in the third round. You know who he looks like?

Because I watched some of that game on Sunday. He's Kirk Cousins. He sees it, balls out quickly. He's very accurate, but he's not going to make a lot of plays off schedule with mobility. I guarantee you there are guys looking at Davis Mills right now saying like guys like Kyle Shanahan and, you know, a guy like Stefansky where Mayfield, I don't think is the answer. And they're like, if they come back next year and they, they, don't make a significant quarterback change in Houston,

then we'd like to see, we might make a move for Davis Mills. Cooley loved his film, said this guy is going to be a pro quarterback. But whatever. Okay. What else do we have? Well, I got something I wanted to talk to you about. Let's do it right after these words from a few of our sponsors.

Don't forget to subscribe to the podcast if you haven't done that. rate us and review us, especially on Apple and Spotify, that's a huge help. All right. What did you want to present to me? Was it a dilemma that you had? Oh, no, it's a little bit of a dilemma. I'm working on my column for the end of the week. And, you know, this time of year, a lot of people do list columns or, you know,

greatest moments of the 2021 seat of, you know, the year, things like that. but it was a very forgettable year in Washington Sports, save for the women's soccer team win in the championship. There was a lot not to remember about 2021 in Washington sports. It wasn't a particularly good year. So I'm not going to write about the top moments and most memorable moments of 2021. And sporting news gave me an idea something to steal from them. they did a list of the 50 greatest seasons in sports history.

You know, like overall sports? Yes, overall sports. 86. I'm just throwing out years. Like, I just don't, no, no, no, no. Athletes, by athletes. Oh, by athletes. The greatest single season by athletes.

Oh, my fault. Okay. Yeah. And they picked, uh, they picked, uh, Joey Otani, who just played, you know, this year, as the greatest season in the history of sports. They picked Will Chamberlain's 1962 season when he averaged 50 points a game and 25 rebounds. That was number two. It's still crazy.

And Wayne Gretzky's 92 goal season in 1982, 22 points, was number three. So I'm using that, and I'm going to come up with a list of the 10 greatest seasons in Washington sports history by athletes, you know, on team sports. And I've got like this kind of compiled. And, you know, I'm not going to talk about it just yet. But my issue is the Washington quarterback debate here. I've got Sunny Jurgerson, 1967. He had completed, he led the league and passed completion, 288, led the league in attempts with 508.

That was 57% completion rate, which back then was good. He threw for 3,747 yards led the league, had 31 touchdowns and 16 interceptions. That's his best year in Washington. Was 67. Art Monk would have to be on the list. Oh, here, Aramonka's on the list. His 84 season set the record. Yeah.

Go ahead. That sunny season, and my debate is between sunny or somebody near and dear to our hearts, RG3 in 2012. Oh, man. 258 completions, 393 attempts, 67%, 3,200 yards, 20 touchdowns, 5 interceptions, 815 yards, 815 yards, yards rushing, seven touchdowns rushing. Doesn't he have to be on the list of top ten seasons of all time? We're just talking about quarterbacks?

Well, no, not just quarterback. Overall athletes. But I've got one space, just pretend I've got one space left. For a quarterback? And it's between those two guys? No, for any athlete. Okay. Forget about, just keep it simple.

Which one of those seasons is a better season? Why aren't you including Joe Thaisman's 83 season? Because it's not as good as either of those seasons. It's not? He was an MVP. I know that. They were unstoppable offensively in 83. It's close.

But this is your choice. No, this is your choice right here. These two. I'm not looking for you to write the story for me. I mean, what did Sunny's season, great season, produce? I mean, it didn't produce anywhere near

what RG3's season produced. No, no it didn't. You know, so I would have to say, even though, like, this is not a conversation about which quarterback was better, obviously. No, it's not. RG3's 2012 season was really spectacular. I mean, and it was...

It's got to be. And it was also, you know, people think, you know, I'm in the tank for Mike and his staff. But man, do they get a lot of credit for it? I mean, they get so much credit for it. They did something that was out of the box thinking, creative. You know, they took the best of what he could do. They pioneered a new formation. They really went hard on dual threat quarterbacking in the NFL.

But, yeah, the impact of that season and the results of that season, it's probably him. Yeah. But I just don't know that those would be the two that I would compare. But you asked me to pick from those two. One lesson. Yeah. Okay. I'm asking you to pick from these two in baseball.

In 1969, Frank Howard scored 111 runs, had 175 hits, 48 home runs, 111 RBI. drew 102 walks and had a 296 batting average in 161 games. Harper, 2015. 153 games, 118 runs scored, 172 hits, 42 homers, 99 RBIs, a 3-30 batting average, which is a better season. Harper's season, because it led to a lot more. I mean, you know, Frank Howard's season was 69, you said? Okay. Well, you're not, I'm just talking about individual accomplishments, not what they led to.

Well, let's just put it this way. That's the one that I remember. I don't remember Frank Howard's 1969 season, which would have been with Ted Williams, right? Yes, 48 home runs, 111 RBIs, a 296 batting average. Well, Harper's home runs are pretty close. RBIs are a little bit less. His batting average is much better. And, you know, what was, did Howard have an OPS number or not?

I don't recall. Okay. Okay. You know what? You convince it's Harper. Okay. Sorry, Frank. I really feel bad about this.

By the way, Harper's MVP season in 2015, so much better than his just recently completed 2021 MVP season, which was a, So Harper's on the list. Sure. How many MVP seasons in sports? I mean, Ovechkin's going to be on there somewhere for you. Yes, obviously. Oveckin, it's just hard to pick which season.

He's had so many of the greatest, of great seasons. Right. But, yes, Ovechkin is there. Well, I'm sure, is Sammy Ball going to be somewhere there? Absolutely. He's on the list. Yeah, Art Months, 84 has to be on there. Yes.

Art Monk is on, okay, that's enough. That's enough. You've accomplished what, you've served your purpose. I'm done with you. I know, but I'm more interested in having a deeper conversation about this because I want to see about the other thing. Well, when I write about it and you read about it, then we can talk about it. Will college seasons be a part of it or not? They may be.

Well, I mean, there are a couple of college seasons that would be very high on the list. Uh-huh. Do you want me to not give them to you? Yeah, go ahead. Well, Patrick Ewing was, you know, a player of the year in college football. If you're going to count Ralph Samson as local, which you shouldn't. Dominant season. And Ewing, you know, you know, um, youings, you know, um,

Ewing's senior year in particular, I think, would be on your list. Of course, they didn't win the title that year. They lost to Villanova in the final. But I would imagine that Patrick, was Patrick the player of the year, his senior year in college basketball? I think he was. I don't know. I don't know. But he averaged 14 points a game his senior year, 14.6 and 9.2 rebounds.

It's not making the list. Was he a national player of the year? I thought he was. Yeah, national player of the year in 1985. Are we done for the day? Do you have anything else? I think we're done. I got nothing.

That's it for the day. Back tomorrow.