The Kevin Sheehan Show - Top 10 WRs + Gutman + Sands

Episode Date: July 17, 2024

Kevin opened with the "ESPN Top 10 WR List" and Terry McLaurin's lack of standing anywhere on it. Howard Gutman/Former Ambassador to Belgium called in from the south of France to talk Commanders and lots more including the world's nicest playgrounds for the rich and famous. Steve Sands/NBC & Golf Channel was a guest from Royal Troon in Scotland talking British Open and more.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheehan Show. Here's Kevin. The show's presenting sponsor, as always, is Windonation. Give them a call at 86690 Nation or head to Windonation.com. Mention my name for a free in-home estimate.

Two guests on the show today. We are going to go to the south of France to talk with our good friend Howard Gutman. and from there we will travel in Europe northeast, yes, northeast, I think, to Scotland. I know it's north of the south of France, much further north, about as far as you can go north in that part of Europe would be Scotland. I guess you could go further north in Russia and in some of the Nordic countries, but I don't have a map in front of me.

I just know that from the south of France to Scotland is north. I don't know if it's northeast or due north or northwest. I'm going to guess northeast because the U.K. is as far east as it goes in Europe, right? Maybe Portugal? I don't know. All right. That's where we will go to talk to Steve Sands, who will be on the course, I believe, at Trune, where the British Open, begins tomorrow. And with Steve, of course, typically the conversation goes to sports.

And with Howard, sometimes the conversation veers off from almost anything to anything else. But he will definitely want to talk about the football team. He is, remember, an advisor to Mitchell Rails. But I'm sure we'll get into some story or some acting job or some place that he worked. is that will be very interesting. It always happens that way with Howard. We start the show with this from Christopher. Kevin, am I nuts?

Yes, please, on Brandon Ayuk, and he writes that in all capital letters, especially if you're right that it can be gotten for less than a first round pick. Let me just add, I think he can be gotten for less than a first round pick, but it would depend kind of on the demand for Ayyuk, And there have been reports since the report yesterday that Brandon Iuk had requested a trade from the 49ers that multiple teams have expressed interest in Brandon Ayuk.

But I would guess a second rounder plus a mid-rounder because primarily you've got to pay him in addition to trading for him. If he had two years left on his deal and an option, it might require more compensation. But anyway, he continues. He was number one in yards per catch last year, number one in yards per target. Of his 75 catches, 68 were either first downs or touchdowns. And he has built in chemistry with our rookie quarterback. Why is this even a question? Because he put out some videos on social media.

Give me a break. I'm sick of losing. If Daniels is the right guy, it'll be. easier to know for sure if we give them Brandon Ayyuk to go with Terry and everybody else. So, look, no, you're not nuts. And no, this isn't really even a question in terms of what Brandon Ayyuk would provide to you on the field if you only had to give up a second rounder and a fourth rounder, even if you did have to pay them. Those of you that argue just wait a year, I mean, you're probably, you're probably

going to have another high draft choice. There will be more receivers, although next year's class is not as loaded as this last class at wide receiver as of now. Those things change. And just pick somebody in the draft and have that guy on a rookie deal and it'll be

Jaden's second year and they can grow together. I hear you on that and it's not a bad strategy, but remember Ayyuk is a proven commodity at this point. You could end up with, you know, a receiver that hasn't worked out in draft by picking them in the draft.

Like not all of these receivers turn out to be great, just like quarterbacks taken in the draft. Do you remember Jalen Rager picked one pick ahead by Philadelphia, ahead of Justin Jefferson? It's a bit of a crapshoot on all of these guys. But I don't dismiss those of you who say, I'd rather not spend the money. I'd rather not spend the draft choices. We're years away. Let's pick one next year when we're picking likely in the first.

the top five or the top ten. And right now, based on over-under totals, Washington would end up with kind of a top-five, top-seven pick if it turns out that way. But no, Christopher, you are correct on what he would provide on the field. You're not crazy. If Brandon Ayuk came in and he was, you know, the guy that we've heard he's been in San Francisco, really good teammate, work ethic, the whole thing, I've been a little bit turned off by the way he's handled his contract situation so publicly and the way he's kind of used Jaden Daniels

in this football team. I haven't loved it, but I know what he is on the field. I've been a fan for a while, and he is a top 10, you know, top 8 to top 10 receiver. He is in that second category after the elite group of receivers. More on that coming up in a moment. It's, you know, and Adam, it's not going to happen. First of all, let me just emphasize that from my initial take. It might spend my take all along, but after he officially asked for the trade, the 49ers aren't going to trade them. It's nuts to think that they would trade him.

They got a Super Bowl to go win. But if Adam Peters, who knows him about as well as anybody else in terms of teams that might be interested, and there are teams that are interested, if he said yes and he went for it, I'd actually feel really good about it because he knows. the player so well. But anyway, segue into another list that ESPN put out today. ESPN.com has been putting out their top 10 players at each position based on league execs, coaches, and scouts who were polled for this. Jeremy Fowler has spearheaded this by at ESPN. This is, I don't know how many years in a row they've done this. And today's list was of the wide receivers. You know, the position

in the league that has become as important as any other position, not named quarterback. It's the highest paid position now that isn't quarterback. Jeremy writes before I get to the top 10 honorable mention and others receiving votes. He writes, the competition at wide receiver knows no rival. The NFL's deepest position breeds new stars every year. Greatness can come from anywhere. This year's top 10 features a bevy of former first rounders and three gems from the fourth and fifth rounds of years past. Putting up 1,000 yards isn't enough to crack the elite. 27 different receivers surpassed that threshold of 1,000 yards last season. Fittingly, 28 players earned at least one vote from league scouts, execs, and coaches in this year's top 10 wide receivers,

which featured a cheetah racing for the top. I think that means to re-kill. In fact, 1,400 yards might not even get you the honorable mention on this list. 1,400 yards might not get you on the honorable mention on this list, which left out plenty of big money stars. So here it is. The ESPN.com top 10 wide receiver list based on not, you know, analysts or reporters, but based on front office execs, coaches, and scouts.

League people. Justin Jefferson is one, Terik Hill is two, and Jamar Chase is three. I think those are the three best receivers in the league. I would put them almost in any order and be fine with it. I think I'd go Hill just because he's the most feared, you know, player in the league with the ball in his hands offensively, in terms of of skill position players. But I'm fine with Jefferson Hill

Chase top three. I think I'd consider Devante Adams for that very elite group, but I think those are the three, and then the next group is kind of a second tier. Number four is C.D. Lamb. Man, that's high for C.D.

Lamb. For me, last year, he was 10th, and I thought that was too high. He was great last year. You know, he led the NFL in receptions with 135. He finished second. behind Tariq Hill in yards with 1,749 yards. He's their number one option. Teams knew that DAC was going to be throwing to him,

and he still had an incredibly productive year. He's better than I thought he was. I was wrong on him. Last year, I said at number 10, I said, I don't think next year he'll be in the top 10. Wrong. He's in the top 5. He's number 4.

Devante Adams came in at 5. I mean, he's still a brilliant receiver. He just needs a quarterback. AJ Brown 6, Amon Ross St. Brown 7. Here's a guy last year who was honorable mention, and I remember specifically saying, this time next year, wouldn't surprise me if the dude cracks the top 10. Amon Ross St. Brown is a star. He's at 7.

8 is Mike Evans. Evans had a good year last year. He's still a big, you know, catch radius, you know, big time receiver. Made Baker Mayfield look good last year. big games when it mattered too. He's 30 years old, but he came in at 8. Stefan Diggs 9, remember he's in Houston this year. And then Brandon Ayuk was 10. I've seen Brandon Ayuk in some of these receiver things ranked, you know, 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th. I think he probably, for me, would be ahead of Evans and C.D. Lamb on this list. I'd have him probably at 8.

But he comes in at 10. Here's what's written about him. This was a front office exec, quote, more downfield production, huge jump in yards per catch, quietly has almost 300 career catches, excels as a blocker, lower body ability as good as anybody, closed quote. This was from an NFL personnel evaluator, quote, premier route runner with open field juice, closed quote. So that's your top 10.

So where does Terry McLaren come in? I mean, I would not have guessed anywhere in the top 10. But I would have guessed, prior to seeing this, somewhere around 15, give or take a spot or two. You know, maybe 16. That would be top half of the league exactly. So the honorable mentions are, and they're listed in order of votes. So Cooper Cup was next after IUC. He was actually tied for IUC, with IUC.

So they actually tied for 10th. So Cup is listed as 11th here. Debo Samuel 12, Garrett Wilson 13, Jalen Waddle 14, Devante Smith, 15, Nico Collins in Houston, 16, Amari Cooper, 17, DJ Moore in Chicago, 18. Terry McClorn didn't even make votes-wise the Honorable Mention list. Then you move to the also-receiving votes list, and they list. in order of how the players got votes. So D.K. Metcalfe was the first.

That would make him the 19th best receiver, according to the polling here. Keenan Allen was after that. He would be 20th, and then came Terry McLorn, which would, based on this evaluation and polling of NFL people, execs, coaches, scouts, would make him the, 21st best receiver in the NFL. Just a lot of great receivers in the NFL guys. I know that a couple of years ago, some of you thought Terry was a top 10 receiver.

I think a couple of years ago I thought Terry was certainly somewhere between 11 and 14. I think last year it was probably closer to 14 than it was to 10. And there are just too many really good receivers. And let's face it, it's not his fault, but he's had a clown show of quarterbacks since he's come into the league. And you could look at other guys and say, well, what about Amari Cooper? What about Nico Collins before last year? Well, nobody knew who Nico Collins was before last year. What about Garrett Wilson? You know, he didn't get to play with Aaron Rogers last year. What about a guy like Mike Evans recently? Of course, he did have Tom Brady. And what about Devante Adams here recently

in L.A.? In Vegas, excuse me. Yeah, I mean, it is. is what it is, and it's subjective, but it is expert subjective, and this is just where kind of most people in the league view Terry McLorn. Would they view him differently if he were in Dallas playing with Dak Prescott, and I'm not even going with the elite quarterbacks, or if he were in Minnesota playing with Kirk Cousins, I mean, Justin Jefferson wouldn't be number one had he played somewhere else. So, although he's really good, anyway, there you go.

It comes out every year, and I thought it was interesting to look at. So two more quick things before we get to Howard Gutman and then to Steve Sands. Alex Sarr, the Wizards first round pick number two overall, the first of the three first round picks that they made in the draft. a few weeks back, had one of the worst shooting nights in the history of the NBA Summer League. In fact, if it had been a game in the regular season, it would have been one of the worst shooting performances in the history of the NBA in the regular season. Last night in the Vegas Summer League against the Portland Trailblazers, Alex Saar,

their 19-year-old 7-foot, 220-pound, you know, future, you know, they're hoping he'll be a future impact player. He went 0 for 15 shooting the basketball and finished with zero points in the game in just under 30 minutes. It was the most field goal attempts by a player without a make in a summer league game since 2017, that according to ESPN stats and information research. If it had been a regular season game, SARS 15 attempts without a field goal would be tied for the second most in NBA history. He missed two free throws and was 0 for seven from behind the arc. People, he's 19, all right? It's Summer League. This is not a pick that was made with the expectation that Alex Saar would be a major contributor at 19 or 20 years old. It's about what he

projects to be based on the Wizards group at 23, 24, 24, 24. five years old. I actually said, I think maybe with Tommy yesterday or a previous podcast, because I did watch the first Summer League game, I think he's got a decent stroke, shooting stroke. I know that, you know, he shot 31.5% from behind the arc in the Perth League that he was in, but he has a decent stroke. That would not, I guess, have been reflected last night. I didn't watch the game.

Maybe everything was halfway down and didn't go in. But that's a rough night. But he's 19. Let's relax Wizards fans. They didn't blow it because he was 0 for 15 in a summer league game at 19 years old. Lastly, yesterday I mentioned that my prize picks, my Daily Fantasy Sports prize picks for the All-Star game, was over on Bryce Hartford.

Harper's 0.5 total bases, more than on Trey Turner's 0.5 total bases, and more than Juan Soto's 0.5 total bases, I won that. Pade 5 to 1. Bryce Harper had a hit, Trey Turner had a hit, and Juan Soto had a two-run RBI double that actually put the American League on the board. Paid 5 to 1. If you're interested in the best and easiest way to play daily fantasy sports. Download the prize picks app. It's the largest DFS platform in North America. You pick against the numbers. It's you picking more than or less than on between two and six players. Their stat projections with odds. And I hit last night with three players, former Nats going more than on all three, and it paid five to one. I'm not going to tell you what I'm not going to

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Today's show is going to be an international show in terms of where our guests are located. Steve Sands is coming up in the next segment. He'll be phoning it in from Trune in Scotland. But right now, joining me is, of course, our good. friend Howard Gutman, the former U.S. ambassador to Belgium during the Obama years. Howard has a radio show. It's called As I See It on WRVA in Richmond and on the Odyssey app. Howard and his son Colin host the pregame show for commanders games on Richmond radio as well, or the post game show. excuse me, the post-game show.

And Howard is joining us from the south of France. You really do get around, man. I mean, I think this is probably, you and I first started talking on this podcast or on the radio show maybe five years ago now, four or five years ago, because you and I were communicating via email. And I think almost every time that I have talked to you, you have not been at your home in D.C.

You have been in many different locations, and right now you are calling me from where? From Santerpe. Well, Kevin, I love Bethesda. Yes. I love the area, but as between Bethesda and Santerpei, what the heck, right? It's beautiful there. I've never been there. I've been to Nice.

I've been to other areas, Khan. I've been to, I've been to Monaco. I've taken that drive up the coast. to that little enclave, but I've never been to Santa Pace, so tell me about it real quickly. So it's smaller than these nieces like a town. Yep. It's basically got beautiful beaches and a small town shop at, way overpriced restaurants, way overpriced shopping. But why do you work?

If not just, and I work from anywhere, as you know, I did my radio show from Cyprus last week. I was in Cyprus before Intrapei. And then this Saturday I'll be the morning Joe Biden from Central Pay. So that's, you know, what the heck. And then the consulting I do from anywhere and the trip started with business meetings in Belgium. You love Belgium. I do too. As you know, I think that may have been the first time we communicated.

But I'm just curious, though, where you are this time of year, isn't it ridiculously crowded? There's a lot of publicity that's ridiculously crowd. I actually think it's a little less crowded than normally. But you know, you know how to avoid the crowd. So you make, for where we had lunch today, we made reservations three months ago. Wow. Because if you made reservations two months ago, you would not have gotten a lunch table. So you just have to plan ahead.

So tell me about the lunch. where was the restaurant that you needed to make reservations three months in advance? Kevin, you are killing me. I will never live this down. So it's called Club 55 Sank on Sank. And it's filled with hundreds of beautiful people and me. So I come from Whitestone, I come from Whitestone Queens. I'm the son of an illegal immigrant.

But, you know, I can, I've been a U.S. ambassador. I have lots of friends who spend time in the south of France, and so I usually meet people when we're down here and we have lunch at Club 55, which is, you know, you can imagine. I won't give myself more grief by going on. Well, no. When you're in a hole, stop digging. I better stop digging.

I'm going to make you dig a little bit more. What did you have? So I did not have the $27 year of, corn. I did have a $34, 34, $34, so $38 salad, and Ysla. And Michelle had prosciutto and melon for probably $35. But you go for the atmosphere. You go for the atmosphere, not for the value. Well, you know what? If you're going to do that, you have to have a cocktail or two, cocktail or three, just to not worry about it. You know what? When you're on vacation, and you're there on business, you really can't worry about price, right?

When you're on vacation in particular, my mode of operation, especially when you go with family or friends, if you start worrying about it, you should have worried about it before you committed to it. I'm going to give you the other secret of getting older. Yeah. There comes a point of time when you figure out you're actually spending your kids and your grandkids' money. because it'll probably be left over. So that's $34 for Soundisla. Maybe about $3.00 of the eggs was mine,

and the rest came from my son, Collin & Chase, and my grandson Archer, because that money would have gotten left to them, and I ate it this afternoon at Club 55. There you go. Club 55 in Santa Fe, South of France. Am I right to say that Santerpe, first of all, I want to say that there

was like a suntan lotion that was called Santrape. Am I right about that or not? There could well have been. It was made famous by Bridget Bardot, but again, I don't think most of the listeners, the ones who want to hear about Johnny Newton do not want to hear about British Barreveau. I don't care about Johnny Newton. I care about your travels right now. It's interesting. I promise you to many people listening. The other thing I remember about it, I've never been, but are all of the beaches or is it just that some of the beaches are topless? I mean, they are in Nice and in other places in the south of France as well. But is that like the hub of topless beaches in the south of France?

Well, for example, probably 15 years ago it would have been, but today there won't be anyone, either at our hotel pool or even at the lounges at Club 55. Please do not ask me what two lounges and an umbrella cost. the Club 55 on the beach. Before tip. Yeah. But there wouldn't be any more because I think the women have spent too much money in their bathing suits to take them off.

You want them to be seen. You are definitely hobnobbing with the real, real elites of not Europe, of the world. Which, by the way, let me ask you. Like, when we're talking about the south of France or we're talking about, say, the Italian, you know, a Malfi coast, what is the spot for the truly wealthiest of wealthy and the most famous of famous? So everyone's got their own, you know, their own group on that, their own, their own Alex. Some of the very wealthy Belgians will be the Spain. click and so they'll be in the hills north of Porto Bonnouce. Some will be a cap-for-a, which is between Nice and here on the French world.

Younger ones might be in the Bifa in Greece or Micahnoe, even. So everyone's kind of got their own. For me, I am the son of Gittman Mogulovina. Yeah, a Holocaust survivor and illegal immigrant into America who went to public schools in New York City and worked his way up. So I'd go to them more like you'd go to museum. I go watch where they were. I didn't grow up that way. And for me, I can have a business meeting I can do.

But, you know, as a U.S. ambassador, I hate to say this when you visit Monaco, I was at Monaco three times twice for the Grand Prix and once for a dinner next to Prince Albert at Monaco. So, you know, that's a long way from Whitestone Queens. But it's, but it's, I never forget my roots. If you ask me whether I'd rather have dinner with Prince Albert of Monaco or be back in time, as I will for training camp, it will be back in time for training camp because that's still the loves and passions. But it's an interesting world and fascinating people to meet, some doing business with, some doing good with. And all interesting, whether I meet a prince from the Middle East or a Wall Street tycoon or some European prints, for me, it's all like being in the museum. Is Monaco the most expensive place in Europe? Yes, and the reason is it's basically a tax-free zone.

Right. So if you've got, depending if you're in Belgium, if you've got earned income, you might move somewhere where they don't tax earn income as high, but only capital gains. If you're in France and capital gains of the problem, you might move to Belgium. But everyone ultimately moves to Monaco. I'll tell you what you find in Monaco. Kevin, I love your dear wife. If, God forbid, someday she were gone and you were still around, Monaco consists of the wealthiest women between age 70, and 100 who were married to these wealthy men, but they died 30 years before the women.

So it's like an elderly widow community where everyone's worth 200 million or more. And so if you're tired of working at some point, you find yourself single, just kind of move to Monaco for a weekend. You'll be a kept man. We were there many, many years ago, and I just remember it being such a fortune. It was very pretty, and I remember what's the name of the famous hotel where it's basically black tie to gamble? It wasn't black tie. You did have to have a jacket, I remember. Why am I blanking on the hotel?

Is it Hotel to Perry? No. I'll tell you when I had my most interesting experience in Monaco. It's the hotel from the Bond movie. I'm blanking. Whatever. Continue. Sorry.

So when I was a special assistant to Bill Webster at the FBI in 85 and 86. Right. And by that point, I was 29, 30 years old, and I had he made two nickels. I was still paying off school and law school loans. But Michelle and I were taking our two-week vacation, and we were going to Nice and Monaco for the vacation. And Bill Webster at the time, the head of Interpol rotates every two years or something. And this two years, Bill Webster was not only the head of the FBI, but the head of Interpol.

and so the number two at Interpol happened to be the chief of police from Monaco. So Webster, when you heard Michelle and I were going, called his friend who was the chief of police at Monaco and said his special assistant is coming there to keep an eye out from me. We got met at the airport by a woman dressed in an evening gown who looked right out of a James Bond movie, and she was actually an inspector in the Monaco police, and she took us to the opera, which was closed. But the roof retracts from the casino. There's a famous roof that retracts 30 years ago.

It's either nightclub or the casino or the opera. And although it was not in session that night. Is your wife helping you remember this or not? Michelle hears me fumble here and says, gives me this look like you've seen it many times. So it's either. There's a famous retract. roof, and there I was 29 years old. I was not the number two most important person in the FBI,

but they gave me an armed guard like you could not imagine, and we spent one heck of a weekend in Monaco. So if you're ever a special assistant to the director of the FBI in 29, you've got a better tour than a former ambassador. I think it's hysterical that you were an assistant, whatever you were to Bill Webster and the FBI, just a few years after you were basically, you know, handling the numbers for Steve Rebell at studio. 54. I mean, you've just had one of the most incredible lives in terms of the different people that you've worked for and worked with over the years. Well, I'm not dead yet. There's still time. Let me tell you that one, which is, when I got

into the FBI, you had to fill out the background check. Right. And, and this was, you know, attracted Interpol. There you go. And I had gone to college in the 70s, and when I got to the form, it said, you know, drug use, marijuana and other drugs, and I put never on the form. And the agents doing the background check call me in and say, look, Judge Webster wants you to be a special assistant. We cannot funk you.

But you went to Columbia University from 1973 to 1977 and Harvard Law School from 1970 and you had to smoke dope. There is nothing wrong with having smoked dope in college, but you fail if you lie in this form. I had to then explain to them that when I was 16, I got my first job for the drug kingpin of the world, Steve Rebell. And the reason I was trusted to be his right-hand man was because I was the only one he knew he could trust not to get high

or not to do quayloods when everyone else is doing. So I had gotten all my panache from when I was 16 and would be in my drug years being the geek. I was the one cool nerdy geek who didn't use drugs. And finally they bought the story, which was true then, remains true today. But yes, my Steve Rebell Association led to the non-drug use, which allowed me to get into the FBI as a special assistant for two years for counterintelligence and counterterrorism.

Well, explained. All right. We, oh, one other thing kind of on this subject, because you mentioned, some of the places, certainly in Europe, for the, you know, ridiculously wealthy and famous. What would you say those areas in the U.S. are? Would it be like Aspen? Would it be, you know, Palm Beach? It's Aspen. It's the Hamptons. It's Palm Beach. It's the Hamptons. It's Palm Beach. So, in fact, a lot of the people you will see here will have a place in Palm Beach as well. And so for the winter, they will go to Palm Beach.

So in the Republican world, it'll be, it'll be, the Hampton's probably East Hampton, Palm Beach, Nantucket. In the Democrat world, Martha's Vineyard. Right, of course. More south than Palm Beach. And then maybe Southampton. You know, so, and then Aspen, Vail. There we go. Sun Valley, Idaho.

Yeah. Jackson Hole's become that. Jackson Hole, for sure. Yeah. Not anywhere near where we live. Give me Bethesda anytime. Give me Ashburn. Give me Bethesda. And I'm delighted.

Yeah. Well, you've missed, I don't know if you know this, but you've missed three consecutive days of 100 degrees or more, which, by the way, And I have not mentioned this on the show today. It is the hottest stretch of days, according to the Capitol Weather Gang, since the Dust Bowl in 1930. Now, I have not done any research on this, but because you are incredibly knowledgeable about a lot of different things, I thought the Dust Bowl was a Midwest thing, not a D.C. thing. why did Capitol Weather Gang say

hottest stretch of three consecutive days since the Dust Bowl in 1930? I'm not saying you were around for it. Trust me, I'm not saying that you were here for it. I know you weren't. But wasn't the Dust Bowl like a Kansas thing? I always think it's those severe dust storms they get in the Midwest.

So maybe we have. added in Washington in the 1930s. Maybe we did. That's one that's got me curious, and I just wrote it down. I'm going to look into the dust bowl of the 30s to see why it affected Washington, D.C. All right. Been a while, I think, since we've talked, and we're certainly not talking as regularly as we were over the last few years, because we have, based on everything that we see,

a normal functioning professional football team in town. So I'll just start by asking you. I mean, Howard is a good friend and an advisor and has been to Mitchell Rails, who is the second largest shareholder and owner of the Washington football franchise, currently known, maybe not forever, but currently known as the commanders. But give me your overall thoughts. I think the last time we talked was probably right after Adam Peters and Dan Quinn were hired. But tomorrow, rookies show up at training camp a week from yesterday on the 23rd.

The veterans will be in and we'll be counting down the days to the regular season. So what do you feel in these days about your favorite team? Look, it's July, and we all recognize that all that counts is the record, and no one could predict the record. But at least at the process, it feels fabulous that they're a grown-ups in charge. And, you know, you just watch from a distance, and you can tell if this is the product

and look at the process, it must have happened. And you've got to be excited. So even some of the small clues and some of the, first of all, the assemblage of talent, both in the offices and then an effort to change it over in the field. but the offices, we are now attracting the best and the brightest, which means three things. For example, last week we hired Scott Fitterer from the Panthers.

Just a couple days ago, yeah. Just a couple days ago. And before that was Lance Newmark. So in the general manager's office, Adam Peters now has Newmark himself and Fidre, any of whom could be a GM for a team. That means Peter felt confident enough that he was delighted if he could get more talent in to bring people who could one day be his replacement.

Fiddera and Newmark, who could have gone anywhere, wanted to come here and work second fiddle to Peters rather than try to have their own shop because they can feel something's important here. and Josh Harris was willing to pay for what some would say is redundancy. So we brought the guy, the person to the front office who'd been in the league for 20 years. And we've now got Rogers and a new guy on contract administration. There is redundancy. That means Harris is not counting nickels there. We are attracting talent.

And what that means is they plan for corporate succession. If someone, you know, if Fitter gets the next job or Newmark moves up, say Newmark moves up next year and gets his own GM, Fitter will slide in. And so someone's planning, they're planning longer term. Second, I was amazingly encouraged by what we saw at the draft. And Colin and I were out in Detroit and had a blast. It's a great thing to do the experience, and I'd love to, if it comes to Washington, that'll be fabulous.

but you saw a few things that have to encourage you first, that use of the term commanders tag, I don't know how many people were being to do. Four or five hundred players were analyzed. They gave 20 commanders tags, and it wasn't 20 top, you know, first rounders. It wasn't the best players necessarily. It was players of a certain type, you know, the heart and the leadership,

and the first one in and the last one out of practice and the kind of person. The person you know is going to make your team in the clubhouse better together. And they had given 20 commanders tags, which means they have defined who they want to be, what they're looking for, and they've done that based on a history of success. And they ended up with a lot of people of their draft picks who had been in that 20 before, and yet to the outside world, they all got credited for having a terrific draft. Now, I don't know if these people will be bussed.

You know, Jordan McGee all of a sudden is Lawrence Taylor. You know, there's a fifth round graphic, but they hear people talk. Graiest linebacker in history, we don't know what will happen. But we know that they had an idea of the type of player they want. It's not going to be the guy who comes in that, you know, we signed for too much money, comes in out of shape, rips off from our money and leave. That is not what's happening anymore in this locker room. second, you saw the role of the owner in the draft process.

And it wasn't to say, hey, you know, in the first round, we could take a quarterback who played with my kid at Bullis. I'd really like to take him, forget your draft boards. It was to ask questions like, well, this person get playing time, and then being taught it and being taught why or how when we drafted Ben Shannot. And he asked whether he would play with Zach Erch on the roster. So you could actually see owners are there. They put $6 billion in, but they're not interfering. We have adults running the process. And to me, the best thing was, you know, you can tell when you're kind of desperate to get some wins to have a good enough show when you draft for need.

Like, you know, we need a tackle, and we could use an outside cornerback. these people did anything but draft for need. So our strongest position was our interior defensive line, and they took Johnny Newman in the second pick, and we must have more Buffalo Nichols, slot corners, everybody's a tweeter, but we took Mike Sandysville on the third pick,

even though we had Juan Martin, even though, you know, that's the position we were deep on, because they were the best players on the board. And what history told us is, great organizations, draft great players, regardless of their immediate needs,

and then two years later, they are great teams. And we had the maturity to do that. So I just think what we're seeing from them. The other thing is, I was one of the idiots, along with every other pundit who said, oh my God,

if we don't hire Ben Johnson, well, maybe we'll get Bobby Sloick, or maybe we'll get Mike McDonald's coach, because they're the hot guys of the minute. And the difference between, me and Adam Peters was, Adam Peters had the judgment,

the sense to know that if you have a stand-up, well-respected guy like Mike Quinn, you're going to end up attracting Anthony Lins and Brian Johnson's, and, you know, people who could,

Ken Norton's, people who would go anywhere. For quarterback coaching, we've got David Bowiebara, Pritchard, Anthony Lynn, Brian Johnson, we have more talent and experience.

I can't tell you it translates into W's, but you might as well build an organization right when you can, if you can afford to, and you have the patience, you have the long-term vision, and you have supportive owners, and that's what I see happening. By the way, on the quarterback front, the guy that I've heard multiple times is as impressive as anybody out there is this guy, David Blow, who was just in the NFL, played for the Lions, who was in that quarterback room, and apparently he is really, really impressive. Right. So you're a long way away, but it doesn't mean that you're not keeping up with what's going on. The story of the last 24 hours is that Brandon Ayuk officially requested a trade from the 49ers. So I'll ask you, what do you think will happen? How do you think it'll play out? And how would you like to see it play out? So Adam Peters knows Brandon I, better than anyone, and that's great. But for me, I'm in the Denton Day School, which is...

That's my producer. I want this guy in my locker room. This personally is using us as a stalking horse to try to get a contract out of them, and I don't really appreciate it. I have no doubt he'll end up with the 49ers. What we are is the difference between $17 million a year and $20 million a year by courting us. and I have a feeling that look,

if we can get a steal, if you get him for a fourth round and you pay $19 million, you'll put up with it and you hope that his friendship with Jay and Daniels makes Jay and Daniels better. In the beginning,

I was much more encouraged because this franchise is about our quarterback. It's about Jay and Daniels. He's a success. And anything you could do to surround him with familiar faces who will up his game,

game, it's worth it. But that took me, you know, the first couple weeks when we were talking about it. But at this point, we don't want the drama. We don't want to chase. You know, would you do the two-first and the this because you've got to get them? If you're that desperate, we're not, I don't think we're one player away from the Super Bowl. So build it right. Now, do I know whether John Dodson's going to pop back or Dammy Brown all of a sudden

going to learn how to play? I don't. and Brandon Iyke's a great player, but it has to be on the right terms. It has to be with the right attitude. And right now I don't see either of them. You texted me something that was interesting because I don't think I've thought about this. You said, I think the most important signing of this offseason may prove to be Sam Hartman, the Notre Dame quarterback who was Wake Forest for several years before that,

who Washington signed. and, by the way, paid as an undrafted free agent. Why? So if you're watched during the training camps just starting now, but in the mincamps and that's happened before, if you just kind of stood afterwards, I've seen twice now. After practice, one time I said after practice,

Jane Daniels and Sam Hartman come out finally when they've changed with a basketball, and they're going to play hoops together. And there was a photographer there, and Sam starts giving Jay and Hey, hey, hey, hey, do you know this is the star of our team, Jay and Daniels, and they're giving each other a hard time the way you do with your buddies. And you can tell what's going on in the quarterback room

just by watching their interaction, and they're going to play hoops together. There are two young guys. Sam Harmon realized, has to realize he wasn't going to get a starting position in the NFL, but he has a lot of upside and can learn. And by the way, he has a quick release also. If you watch the four of the Marietta Driscoll, Hartman and Daniels on the sideline, and they spread them across and each throws to a receiver, two of the wrist snap, and then the other two kind of wind up and pitch.

But they're both learning, they're both growing, and there is camaraderie in that quarterback room that would play basketball. I guarantee you, Kirk Cousins and RG3, we're not hanging out after practice playing basketball. And since your franchise is what happens in that quarterback room, I think long-term, we might have our starter and our backup. Mario is there for education, but I don't think he's going to, you're not going to have long-term success with Marioza throwing passes,

but you need a backup. But you need a backup who doesn't threaten the starter, but admires him, and you need a starter who's not scared to come after your throws interception and look at the pad with the backup and talk about what just went wrong. And I think that that relation is clicking great. Plus, someone had the sense that they didn't have to take, they didn't have to use a draft pick to get him, but they'd have to pay a premium. And that just means they understood this market well.

and so it just tells me again that grownups are running the team really knowledgeable grownups. So I would look for that relationship for a long time. What's the latest on the stadium you're hearing? Well, you know, they are, there's a lot of noise in my two favorite love, sports and politics. So you've got Danes in Montana and Chris, all of a son Chris Van Holley. who was a D.C. lawyer with me for his entire career. All of a sudden he's a Maryland senator, which meant, you know, we can't lose, you can't lose the commanders from Maryland, so he's throwing problems up.

I suspect the period they're looking at is the lame duck session, somewhere between November and January. Why? To make moves. Because I just think politically it's a lot easier to get things done when, when, look, If your party's running in Maryland, you've got something before election days. Right after election day, people can get things done. And if you're a, you know, you don't have to worry about for next election until the next election cycle.

So I would look for some clarity, just politically, not from any conversation with Mitch or anything, just some clarity there. And if it doesn't come, you know, eventually, it's going to have to come. You've got some hurdles on whether you get, whether you can get out of Maryland. You've got hurdles on whether you can get RFK right with Danes and whoever gains is a guy, chief, whatever.

You know that he wants to recognize. But I think we have pretty smart businessmen who are working the issue as well as we work. They're also working on other things. They're working on, you know, stadium naming rights and general branding generally. But right now, you know, the most important is to get a winner on the field. The second most important is get the stadium done.

And then they've got to get, you know, they're still replacing sponsors that got lost in the Danny era. And, you know, and they're working that on the business side, but they're still also filling out their ranks. you know, we all see the transition that occurred at the general manager's office, but on the administrative side, things are changing as well. And again, I'm taking utter delight. So on the press side, the person now in charge of the press, Sean de Barbary is, I think the youngest vice president of a team in the woods.

He is. Yes, Sean is. Yeah, and Samantha Scott, Fretashi, who works with the press every day, here's a novel thing. Can you imagine our football team has press administrators who like the press and who the press like? It's always been over, you know, you can't talk to him, you can't talk to him, they can't, and now they facilitate each other. I think Sean and Sam have a smile when Kim or Nikki or, you know, Sam come into the room, as opposed to, uh-oh, they're going to try to week this or that about our owner, or I've got to,

it used to be a mentality in that front office to protect ownership and the players from information getting out instead of facilitating the press. It's a happy time at practices. It's a happy time at any of the rallies or the like. People are actually enjoying working with each other, which has got to help ultimately on the field. Just because I know he occasionally listens to this, Sean, and people have heard me criticize the PR department for many, many years because it was third rate for a long period of time. But Sean DeBarbieri was elevated to VP of Football Communications youngest in the

history of the NFL. And Sean is really, really good at his job. I'm not kissing up. I don't do that, but he really is very good at his job. All right, last one. And I'm going to read this to you, because I read it on radio this morning. I got this from, I got this from Daniel. Daniel writes, Kevin, I'm a PR consultant with a specialty in crisis handling. I hear you on why the team hasn't said anything about the name yet. And what I've said Howard for months now is that they got to get through this stadium thing.

They don't want to muck it up. They don't want to get any politicians that may be, you know, in favor of the RFK site bill in the Senate, et cetera. they want to get the stadium path cleared and done. So he said, I hear you on why the team hasn't said anything about the name yet. I understand that the stadium back to D.C. is in limbo, but can't Harris, as in Josh, just tell everybody, and then he puts it in quotes as if he's a PR guy writing the release for Harris, we've heard you, and while we've had lots of important priorities that needed our attention immediately,

we know this is an issue for our fans and we're going to address it the way we do everything. And that is with lots of hard work, lots of information gathering, and that will lead us to the right solution. We can't tell you more than that right now, but we know that this is a big deal to a big part of our fan base and it will be addressed at the appropriate time. And Daniel writes, why can't he just say that? Would that be a risk to stadium talks? So I'll ask you, how would you answer Daniel's suggestion? So by everything they do, they handle it at the right time. But in that phrase, you have, you know, that's the out that makes sense. What is the right time and what is handling it?

It's a little bit like the Heisenberg principle. The more you, the close you get to it, the more it changes. So I can tell you it makes no sense on the Sheehan rationale is completely right. You would be nuts now to start pissing anybody off about anything when you're trying to get a stadium deal. You're trying to get stadium naming rights deal done. You just want people to – you don't want to lose a single vote based on what you're doing on those. So it makes no sense to do it now. What happens if while we're getting this stuff done, the commanders go 15 and 2 and win the Super Bowl this year is the commanders?

Are you then going to go back to the statement and say, oh, the first thing I'm going to do after our Super Victory is the commander has changed the name? I don't know. But I can tell you, it makes no sense to do it while the stadium is out there. We've got to get that settled, and we have politicians on all sides of that looking for excuses to be angry at us. So give them no cause. We're signing sponsors and stadium namers in like they're signing, and give them no cause to give anyone a problem. inherited commanders, just like they inherited Ron Rivera. They have to tell you they'll deal with Ron Rivera in good time.

They went the year, and they dealt with Ron Rivera in good time. You can tell these people aren't forgetting. It's not like they don't know. They will figure out, but the answer, no one can know the answer until the appropriate time comes. The right facts are gathered as of that time, and the best judgment can be made. But the sequencing is everyone would agree. First thing I do is get the football talent right by getting the best people in the front office.

You've got to figure out the stadium that has negives, if the name could have negives on that. And you've got to get your sponsorship and your base, your financial base in place, and you don't want to do anything negative about that as well. And so I think they're handling it perfectly in all in good time. Yeah, I think that the one thing that I would say in response to Daniel's note is that, you know, you have to also be careful about building up expectations and perhaps not being able to deliver on them because, you know, of logistics, of cost of everything else. I would also say to you, a priority for them is also to attract a lot of their fan base back. in an emotionally attaching kind of way, which is currently detached. And that would lead to, you know, new revenue.

That would lead to tickets. That would lead to jerseys. That would lead to a lot of things. I believe, and you don't have to comment on this because I know you're close to Mitchell, but it would be incredibly naive to think that they haven't thought about this, that they haven't done some work on this. but I believe that we will hear something when we get a stadium resolution, whenever that is.

You said maybe during the lame duck session, which by the way then puts us, I was going to mention this to you when you said it, puts us into the first quarter of 2025, which means you don't break ground probably until 2026 or later that year. We're not going to have a new stadium wherever it ends up until 2030. They have put money into FedEx because the one thing they understand is not quick at your best. It's going to be a while.

Yeah. That's for sure. Did you have an answer to the first part of my discussion there? I think between us, we've covered it well. Okay, well then I'll end on this. Where are you going to dinner tonight? And when did you have to make that reservation? So because we ate at Sank on Sank for lunch, we are just walking on the port and grabbing

crapes in a half hour. And it took no reservations, and it'll probably only be like a $15 crape. That should be five bucks, but at least it'll be a little better. You're the best. I hope you're well. Travel safely, and I will talk to you when you get back. All very best. Take good care.

Howard Gutman, everybody, is the absolute best. Rate us and review us, especially on Apple and Spotify, if you get a chance, it would be a big help for us. Up next, Steve Sands, talking golf, and I'm sure a lot more from Scotland. We'll get to him right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey, guys, most of us are interested in our mental and physical well-being to a certain degree. And with that in mind, I'd like to welcome and introduce a new sponsor to the podcast. The new sponsor is Unified Healing, Unified spelled UNI-F-Y-D Healing. It doesn't matter if you're a big-time world-class athlete or just a somewhat athletic podcaster like me.

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That's unified spelled unifed-y-d-healing.com slash sheen. No material or testimonies on the Unified Healing website are intended to be viewed as medical advice or a substitute for professional medical advice diagnosis or treatment. Always seek the advice of your physician or other qualified health care providers with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition or treatment and before undertaking a new health care regimen, including EE system. Talked a little bit about Brandon Ayuk today. The 49ers at MyBooky are plus 255 to win the NFC championship. Next up is Detroit at plus 550.

So the 49ers are a sizable favorite to get back to the Super Bowl once again. Now, the overall Super Bowl favorites at MyBooky.ag right now are the Kansas City Chiefs. Just barely, though, they are plus 540 to win Super Bowl 59, and the 49ers are plus 580. I don't think there's any way Brandon Ayuk is getting traded. The 49ers have a chance. and a legitimate chance to win the Super Bowl as they did last year, as they did the year before. And he was a big part of the run to the Super Bowl last year. All of the NFL futures opportunities are up at MyBooky.

Just go to MyBooky.orgie.org. Use my promo code, Kevin D.C. You'll be playing with house money on your initial deposit because you'll get a cash bonus on your initial deposit. when you use my promo code, Kevin D.C. They've got all of the week one lines up. Washington still at MyBooky is a four-point underdog at Tampa Bay on Sunday, September 8th, the total in the game at 41 and a half. The season opener is just 50 days away. I'm talking about the NFL season opener. 50 days away, the Chiefs at Arrowhead open up against the Ravens in a rematch of the

AFC title game, and MyBooky's got the Chiefs as a two and a half point favorite. MyBooky.ag promo code, Kevin, D.C. Jumping on with me right now, where he is on the 18th hole at Trune in Scotland, readying himself for four days of coverage of the Open Championship, or as some refer to it, the British Open, is Steve Sands, our good friend from NBC, the golf channel. He'll be on the coverage that starts very early tomorrow morning on Peacock and goes to USA and eventually we will be on NBC over the weekend. But I wanted to start real quickly with the event that you did last weekend, the American Century Celebrity Golf Tournament. I watch it every year.

I watch some of it every year from Lake Tahoe. And you've said to me in the past, it's one of your favorite weekends of the year, right? It's just fabulous. It's a gorgeous place, Kevin, obviously. Yeah. In the summer when everybody's 98 humid, it's absolutely perfect weather out there.

And you're around all those stars and celebrities, man. What's not to like? It's a great, great time. Who do you like seeing every year? And then is there somebody this year that you met for the first time that you were excited to meet? I mean, you're around big name stars and athletes all the time. But I'm just, you know, this is like a combination of entertainment and sports and probably even some media. And maybe, I don't know if there are any politicians in this thing.

but who are you excited to see every year, and then who did you see this year that you hadn't met before that was fun? Well, you know what I met for the first time was Taylor Twelman, the soccer guy from Maryland. Yeah. University of Maryland guy met him for the first time. What a good guy. Good player too, right? Oh, man, really good player. He could have a chance to win that thing if he ever really started to play a bunch leading up to it. but we'll have to wait and see, but who knows how that plays out.

He's a very good player. More importantly, just a really good dude. So that was cool. You know, I don't know, there's just so many people who go out there every year. I love seeing, you know, Marcus Allen. We joke around about that run, you know, in Tampa, when he beat it in the Super Bowl all the time. I love seeing Brian Erlocker.

It's great to catch up with T.J. O'Shee. Met John Carlson for the first time. He played out there for the first time last week. got a chance to meet, you know, Washington Capitol in John Carlson. You know, Steph Curry wasn't there this year because he's going in Paris with Team USA trying to win a gold medal. He was a defending champion. It's always great catching up with Steph.

It's just, there's a long list. I mean, I love being around Charles. I've known Charles Barkley, you know, probably 30 years. So we always make sure we grab dinner with some people and have a good time. And it's just a blast. It's cool. You know, I'll tell you one thing else that's cool. I don't know. Maybe it's because I'm born and raised in Washington. It's awesome seeing Joe Seismund.

It's just great seeing Joe. He's so talkative. He's so enthusiastic. Looks great. Sounds great. We talk a lot about the skins. I talk a lot about Jaden Daniels. We talk a lot about all the games we went to with kids and all the stuff with him. And, you know, Joe's such a nice guy. And when you get him going on not just, Joe, but on the skins and on everything that has something to do with him, he gets really, really engaged and enthusiastic. It's a lot of fun to be around him, too. By the way, John Carlson is just apparently the best dude. I know several people who have gotten to know him.

And is he a good golfer? I mean, a lot of these hockey guys are really good. I think he might eventually end up being good. was not his week, per se. But I tell you what, though, what's interesting about that week is, is you're talking about some serious, serious talent in sports and entertainment. People are uber competitive, ultra-successful in what they do. Take them out of their element, and they get nervous just like anybody else would be.

But you can see the competitors come out of them, you know, once they get going in this competition. It's a lot of fun. It's hit and giggled. No question about it. They're also trying their best. So I think John eventually could be a very good player when he retires and concentrates a little bit more on golf and not just hockey. But, yeah, he's got game hockey.

They have that motion, Kevin, you know that. It's just that natural motion. The only real difference is T.J. told us it a couple of years ago, when you hit a slap shot, when you hit a shot in hockey, you lean back on your back leg. Whereas in golf, you've got to turn. So you've got to make a little bit of an adjustment there. So kind of like Joe Pavelsky, you know, a tremendous NHL player. Right.

He's come really close to winning before. Some other hockey players have actually won the American Century Championship. But it's kind of a natural motion, especially once they get, if they're a right-handed player, you know, get to their left side and golf because they stay on their right side when they're shooting the puck. Yeah, I've also noticed with the hockey guys more than the baseball guys who are also excellent golfers, typically. the hockey guys have a very short back swing typically. Oh, yeah. Yeah, I mean, if you just think of a shot, whether it's a wrist shot or a slap shot hockey,

just think about the compact motion and everything like that. I'll tell you the other reason that hockey players have a little bit of an advantage on the other sports, you know, they have summer off. They don't play in the summer. You know, it's not like, you know, like, for instance, you know, the summer league is going on in the NBA. There is not of that in the NHL. There's, you know, the Olympics in the summer.

You know, the Olympics for the hockey are obviously in the winter. So they have a chance to actually get going in the offseason with their hockey. And that's another reason that hockey players are really good at golf when they decide to make that transition. Real quickly, one more on this. Because Marty Fish, who has an incredible story, by the way. There was a, I don't know if it was a, 30 for 30 or it was an HBO sports doc or whatever it was, maybe a Netflix show. As a professional tennis player and at one time, you know, a top 10 guy, you know, competing

against Federer and Nadal in some of these finals and big spots over the years, his story is an incredible one. He suffered from major anxiety and panic attack disorder to the point where he actually bowed out on the way to the New York Madison Square Garden. I think they called it the Masters end of year or whatever in a match against Federer in the quarterfinals. He couldn't play it. Literally couldn't play it. But anyway, he is an incredible golfer. And I think, was this his second win? Second win, maybe? It was a second win. I can't believe I left him off the list. He's one of my favorite guys ever

of vetted sports or entertainment. He's just a wonderful guy. And by the way, it's the Untold story, Breakpoint is the documentary that Marty Fish that they did on Marty Fish and it was just incredible. If you're a sports fan, which you must be if you're listening

to your show, and you happen to like tennis at all, it is a great story. Marty really opened up about it. You learn a lot about guys like Andy Roddick in there. Right. What it was like in that era.

The relationship. I mean, you come away thinking, I told Marty this. I came away. away from that documentary thinking, wow, Anirotic is a way better dude than you think he is. Like, you know, you don't realize how good of a guy is, how good of friends they are, and he came across very, very well in that documentary.

And they dive deep into, you know, the mental aspect of what Marty Fish, you know, was going through when he was one of the great players in the world. By the way, that match against Federer was not at the Masters. That was at the U.S. Open at Flushing Meadows. Was it really? Yeah. couldn't finish. Yes. I mean, it was a quarter or 70s against, I think it was a quarter against Roger, and it was, I mean, the Marty Fist story is, if you're a sports fan, you like

sports docs. You've got to watch that. That was absolutely great. So I just looked it up, of course, you nailed it. It's on Netflix. It's called Untold Breaking Point. And it is so well done. And I don't even think you need to be a fan of tennis to enjoy this. Yeah. Absolutely. Not only do not need to be a fan of people. The mental anguish that he was going through at that time and just what he was trying to get himself through to be able to go play at the highest level.

And Marty Fish was a great, great player. He just couldn't get past himself. In fact, I just, speaking of Federer, I just watched on the flight over here, one of the things because it was a 100-hour flight, the new Roger Federer documentary. Wow, the last 12 days. Oh my gosh. Have you seen that, Kevin?

I have not seen it. Oh, I'll watch it now based on your recommendation. You will cry your eyes out for the last 30-year- 45 minutes. I mean, I'm sitting on an airplane. You're our buddies, Stanford Steve and I were joking about this because I'm a crier. He's a crier. He watched it. I watched it.

We both are ball in our eyes out, and we both saw it on an airplane, and both of us had people sitting next to his go, are you okay? Oh, did you fly over with him? No, I didn't fly over with Steve, but I was watching. I was watching the documentary, and I was listening to Steve talk to that documentary, and we both were crying about it. I'm going, and I had the woman next to me. He's going, excuse me, sir, are you okay? I'm like, I'm fine. I'm like, ball of my eyes up. It was the Roger Federer documented the last four days. It's really, really, really good. Oh, interesting. Well, the reason I brought Marty Fish up, and it just reminded me of that documentary, is you get asked this all the time.

about these guys that are really, really good. And by the way, aren't near 50 years old yet. How old's Marty Fish? Is he in his late 30s? Is he 40 yet? Yeah. If he's in his 40s, he's in his early, early 40s.

Yeah. He's young. He had nine birdies in his second round and shot basically the equivalent of 65. Like, you've seen a lot of these guys out there. And listening to the broadcast, and I was listening to you guys, I think I heard people essentially say this guy could do it on the senior tour for sure. Do you agree?

Is he maybe the guy that's come along that you could see playing for a living at some point in his life? He'd be the only one. And I still don't think he's good. I think here's why. It's a huge difference. And you know this, Kevin, because you play a lot of golf. we all have friends who are scratch golfers or something like that. That's a different deal than what these guys are doing.

And Marty still, I mean, Marty's a tremendous player. He had nine birdies. It's a 65 on Saturday. I shot 69 on Sunday at five birdie. At 14 birdies in the last two days, 19 birdies for the week. I mean, that's in three days. That's an amazing amount of birdies. He's a tremendous, tremendous player, Kevin.

but there is still a big, big step from a guy like Marty Fish, from a guy like Tony Romo, from a guy like Rick Rodden, who was a great golfer after retiring. And, you know, I mean, a guy like Mark Rippin. Remember what he did at the Kemper open? Mark Rippon won the American Century. Mark Rippon can really play. And it's just a different level.

It really is. It's just a complete different level. There's no way Marty Fish could compete. He played the 3M Open on the PGA tour a couple of years. ago. You know, Steph Curry won this thing last year. He's a tremendous golfer, a round of scratch golfer. And he played in the Corn Ferry Tour event, and it's a different deal. It's just so different. So if there's anybody out there right now who could do it, it'd be Marty. But Kevin, it's a big, big leap from what he's doing in this genre or at home at Bel Air in California,

then it would be to go out against the PG-Tor Champions Best. Those guys are playing a different sport. Same game, different sport. know what you're saying is 100% true, but I want to know what the reasons are. Is it because when you play in these tournaments, T's, pin locations, course, or is it because the, I mean, I just looked up Marty's handicap. He's a plus three. All right? So, like, what is the lowest level professional player on the PGA tour? What is he? A plus six? Oh, yeah, by four, plus six. There's three shots there, but also, you know, look, a couple of times around a Marty Fish is going to hit a ball, you know, sideways.

You know, something like that we do. It just doesn't happen on the PJ Tour champion 50 and above. It doesn't happen on the PJA Tour. Yes, they get a shank every once in a blah, blah, blah. But they basically hit it on the screws, you know, pretty much every time. The other thing is the whole locations are much more difficult. The green speeds are much, much faster. The rough is much, much thicker.

The golf courses are much longer. I mean, Edgewood Tahoe is a terrific resort course, awesome place. Not sure if you've ever played there, but if you've ever gotten a chance, if you ever get a chance to go out there, go do it and play, it's a lot of fun. But it's less than 7,000 yards at almost 8,000 feet above sea level. If, like, Peter Jacobson, okay, for instance,

he's the analyst with me last week in the booth, Peter is in his, you know, deep into his 60s now. He told me, he goes, I would never make a bogey out here. And he's not being, he's the most humble guy in the world. He's not showing off. He's saying, yeah, because we talk about it all the time. Hey, can this guy play? Can this guy play?

Oh, yeah, they can play. You know, put him in a tournament situation against the best players on a PGA tour or the best players on a PGA tour champions, which is 50 years old and above. Completely different conditions, Kevin. I mean, it's just a different deal. But Marty is a very, very good golf. No doubt about it. All right.

Let's talk tomorrow and the rest of the weekend as we have arrived at the final major of the year. First of all, do you like where we are now with this being the final major in the middle of July? Or would you prefer to go back to the way it was before, what, five years ago, four years ago, when it six years ago, whenever it was they move the PGA? Would you rather still have the PGA left in August? Me personally, yes. I don't like that the golf season, golf major championship season,

ends this soon before football begins. I liked the PGA in August because it kind of led up to that one or two weekends just before college. Then the NFL begins the week after Labor Day. But I understand why golf wants to do it in the calendar. It makes perfectly good sense from a golf calendar point of the year.

Augusta, you know, you have the players in March, in April's the Masters, in May is the PGA, in June is the U.S. Open, in July is the Open Championship, and then in August is the FedEx Cup, the regular season to end, and on they go. I understand that. I just think it's just a little too early. I don't start a training camp yet in the NFL, and golf's going to end on Sunday, as far as major championships is concerned. I prefer it in August.

I also think they have more opportunities to go to different places for the PGA championship, in August. You can't go up to northern Minnesota and play at Hazeltine. It's tricky. Last year's weather in Rochester was very tricky for the PGA Championship. It's that kind of thing. But I prefer the calendar ending a little bit deeper, closer to football, that one last shot of, you know, Glory's last shot was what they used to call it the PGA Championship. I also thought that was pretty cool before really getting into football. Yeah, I mean, the other thing, too, is all due respect to the FedEx playoffs. A casual golf fan pays attention to the majors.

They don't pay attention to the FedEx playoffs. Correct. But I tell you one thing, the players' championship, the players' championship belongs in March. It never belonged in May in the first place. The golf course is built wind-wise in North Florida to be in March, not in May, completely different conditions, completely different wind. And also, it allows the PGA Tour's flagship event, Kevin,

to be the first big golf event of the year. They always hated being two weeks before the Masters because it was always in their estimation or a warm-up to Augusta. They didn't like that. And they moved it to May. That didn't work. So they moved it back to March,

and they moved it before the NCAA tournament. You know, it's early in March. So it's usually the weekend now of the conference, you know, championships. And that's helped a little bit. But I still think, I understand all of that. And I totally am with you on a FedEx Cup as far as the playoffs go in August. But I don't know.

There was something cool about August and the PGA championship could be one last shot of the major before football started. Yeah, it was always, you know, it was always a weekend in which, you know, the preseason football games were going on, but you had a major championship. And, you know, sometimes if it was at Southern Hills or, you know, you had some heat issues, you know, there was a lot of that. but it almost seemed to be like the last big event before football season started, and before the U.S. Open and tennis, if you were a tennis fan, started.

But anyway, all right, so tell us about Trune. Awesome spot. 11th Open Championship, you know, Tom Wast and Tom Weisskopf. They've had some great, great finishes here. It's a layout that is just perfect for Link's golf. It's not goofy. It's not tricked up. up. There's nothing, you know, there's going to be some humps and bumps and bumps and some funky bounces and stuff like that. You get that at Link's golf here here, but it's not anything that's tricked up. It's right there in front of you. It's right on the west coast of Scotland. The weather can be really nasty here. There's that famous Elsa Craig, that huge stone that sits in the middle of the sea just on the left of the golf course. And the saying around here shows you how bad the weather is. I mean, it's the best weather you can have here is July. Usually the weather's not great.

here. And the saying about the Elsa Craig is, you'll hear this a lot this week on our air, is if you can't see the Elsa Craig is raining. If you can see it, it's about to rain. That's usually how it goes around here. But the golf course is awesome. A lot of history here. I think the greatest round of golf ever played in the history of major championship golf was the last round of the last time it was here. Henrich Stenson's 63 to be Phil Mickelson by too. To beat him by three, he shot 65, Henrik shot 63 on Sunday to win. It's a great, great golf course.

It's tough. I do not think anybody's getting into deep into the teens. I think 10-12 under probably will win, especially if the wind blows and it's supposed to blow a little bit tomorrow. That back nine coming in, that wind makes it very difficult. And if it does pick up and it's in their face like it's supposed to be. Now, who knows with the weather, but if it's supposed to be, now who knows what the weather, But if it's supposed to be that way and it comes out that way,

I think 10 or 12 under is going to win this thing. Let's talk about some players. First of all, how's Rory's state of mind after what happened in the U.S. Open? You know, I was talking to his dad this morning, and his dad said to me, he's a really nice guy, Jerry McElroy, very nice guy. And he said, the media worries more than he does.

The media is more concerned than he is. And I think that that bodes well. for him after what happened to him at Pynters, Kevin. You know, one of the things I love about sports, talking about Marty Fish trying to get through, you know, his demons, you know, in his head, trying to become the best player he can be in tennis or any other athlete or any other walk of life. One of the most amazing things to me about professional sport is watching the best of the best and their resolve.

I think we're about to find out what Rory is made of. You can curl up and just go away after what has. happen at Pinehurst in the U.S. Open the way he finished with three bogeys in his last four holes, blowing a two-shot lead, and not even getting into a playoff, losing in regulation, to a guy who did not make a birdie the last four holes. You had a two-shot lead on the 15th case. So I think it's going to be the other way. I think Roy's going to play well, and I think he's in a good frame of mind. He's playing well. He knows it. He took some time off, kind of, you know, get over it a little bit, and he did, and he played okay last week, and I expected him to play

well this week. I saw the comment where he said, you know, after Pinehurst, I, you know, had 10 to 15 missed calls from media members, and I decided I needed to get rid of my phone and get a new phone and a new phone number. Yeah. I mean, I'm sure he was inundated with calls from everybody reaching out to say, hang in there, right? I mean... Yeah, exactly. That's what that. Did you hear the Tiger Wood story, Tiger sent him a guy. You know, you're a big-time guy. I text you, you ghost me. That's a guy. Stop it. Never. Kevin Sheehan. That's that work. Yeah, right. Imagine being Tiger Woods and being ghosted. The Tiger, about a week after the U.S.

open sent him a really nice text. They're very good friends. Yeah. And he sent him a nice text. Ghosted. Well, not really. He declared, he disclosed yesterday, Rory did, that he changed his number. And he didn't tell anybody. So here's Tiger Woods. getting ghosted. Can you imagine Tiger Woods getting ghosted? And Rory kind of laughed about it, so to Tiger. But yeah, I think he'll be okay. You know, again, resolve, resilience. And that's part of being

a professional athlete. It's part of life, part of being anything in life. And I think I think Rory's going to step up to the plate this week. Maybe he won't win, but I don't think he's going to go away. I think he's going to play well. He's going to be on the leaderboard. It wouldn't shock me if you want a second Claire. I'm glad he didn't win this past weekend

because I think at that point, he would not have won. And I do want to ask you about Robert McIntyre here in a moment. But what was I going to say? Oh, Scotty Schaeffler, again, a significant heavy favorite, but not like he was at Pinehurst. But I'm assuming you think if he plays his game, he walks out of, you know, he walks off the course Sunday with a win. I do. I think he's better than everybody else right now. So if he plays his best, I think he's going to win. He's in an interesting spot, Ken. A lot of guys take the week off before major championships. Some people like to play the week before majors,

and people don't like to play. He could have it one way or the other. Very rarely do you see somebody at his caliber takes four weeks off. He hasn't played since the U.S. Open. I mean, that's a long time to go without playing competitive golf. You can't replicate this at home in a golf cart or even walking or hitting balls or, you know, playing with your buddies at home.

back in Dallas. It's a totally different deal. So he's coming into this with zero reps in the last month. Now, it's great to get away. It's great to get refreshed. There's no question about it. He's way smarter about his own game and body than any of us. It's just an interesting tactic to take, especially at this stage of your career when you're young. Normally, you would see kind of rest yourself as you get older. He's in his 20s. And it'll be interesting to see if he has any rust. Think of like this in the NBA playoffs or the NHL playoffs if you have a sweep or you win in five

and the opponent it wins in seven and you've got like nine days off between series. In a team sport you always think, oh, you know, maybe there's a little rust in game one and usually that's the case. It doesn't really mean anything. But in golf if he gets, you know, just a little behind the eight ball tomorrow because he's just

a little on the rusty side, just a little bit. It'll be interesting to see whether or not he comes out guns blazing as opposed to coming out a little bit slow because he hasn't competed in almost five weeks. Well, is the reason he's got a newborn at home and he's just spending more time at home? Well, it could be. I think that's one of the things, but I also think he just needed a break. He's played a lot of golf. And when you are Scotty Sheff or you're number one in the world

and you are playing so well and you're getting asked and tugged and pulled in millions of directions every single day, it must be awfully nice to go home and just chill with the family. But yeah, he's got, you know, Meredith is doing great. Now there's son Benis doing great. But I think he just wanted to go home and chill out, get away for a little bit. But, you know, he's ready to go. I'm not saying he's not ready. I just think it's an interesting tactic to take, especially with the way he's been playing.

He's playing so great. I think if he plays well this week, he's going to win because he's that much better than everybody else right now. But I'm waiting to see if he gets off at just a little bit of a slow start because it's been a while since he competed. So tell everybody a little bit about Robert McIntyre who is Scottish and he won the Scottish Open last week. He's a lefty and he's been playing well and what his chances are. I mean, I think he is a revelation to a lot of people. I think this time last year, I think the casual golf fan had no idea who he was. I think people who do what we do didn't know he was.

He hasn't come out of nowhere. I'm just messing around. He was on the Ryder Cup team late last year in Rome. He got to win earlier this year on the PGA tour for the first time in Toronto, in Hamilton, right outside of Toronto, the RBC Canadian Open.

His father was on the bag that week, really emotional time. He had come out and said, listen, I'm really lonely here. I'm by myself. I don't have any family or friends. You know, I miss my people at home and everybody on the around him who I'm so close to.

So his dad flew over to Canada ended up cadding that week. just to hang out with his son, and he ended up winning. And now he goes and wins his home countries open. He's won a national championship two times in a row. You know, the Canadian Open and the Scottish Open, and he's from Scotland. Now, it's so difficult, Kevin, to win back-to-back in this sport. It just doesn't happen that often.

I would have liked his chances more this week if he came close and didn't win last week, but you're never going to turn down an opportunity to win your national open. So McIntyre is going to be a big-time favorite amongst fans here in Scotland this week. He'll get a lot of love. Let's see if he's still hung over from Sunday and Monday night, because he said he was going to have a big, big time after winning his National Open. But he is a tremendous player. And now that he has everything sorted out in his personal life and he's feeling much better,

he's performing at a much higher level. And, you know, people forget, Kevin. We talk about this all the time, on and off the end. These guys are athletes, and they're amazing, but they're also human beings, and they also have lives. You know, they miss their friends. They miss their girlfriend. They miss their wife. They miss their children.

Their parents, someone got ill. Things happen in life, and you don't realize it unless you're really close with these guys. And I talked to Robert that week at the Canadian Open and talked about his father being there. We kind of were joking about what it's like life on the road. You guys are kids? You know, I'm 55 years old. I've been doing this for 34 years. years, you know, and he's just getting going. And he just found himself, and he's got a lot of confidence,

and he is a tremendous young man. I hope he plays well. He is going to receive a big, big ovation on the first tee tomorrow. How does Bryson's game fit this course? You know, I think Bryson's game fits any course. I think Valhalla, where he came close to Anderschopli, when he lost by one there, a huge wide fairways could hit it anywhere. Big ballpark, perfectly suited for Bryson. And then you go to the U.S. Open. Same type of thing. Even though it was a U.S. Open, it was a different type of U.S. Open venue.

You could spray it a little bit and not get so punished in that thick rough. You got a lot of breaks at the U.S. Open, but breaks is part sports. So there's nothing wrong with that. He certainly earned it. This week, the rough is a little bit up because it's been a very wet spring and early summer here in Scotland. so there's a little bit more rough than usual at an open championship. So you've got to find the fairways here. And if he sprays it a little bit like he did at the U.S. Open,

those breaks might not go your way the next time. So let's wait and see how Bryson does off the tee. The short game of the putting, certainly there, the iron's certainly there. But if he puts himself in a little bit of trouble off the tea here, Royal Trune, which you can this week, that will not bode well for Bryson. but I fully expect Bryson to get back into the fray and play well this week. I don't expect to the fold or go away. I just don't know if this course is perfectly suited for him this week.

What's going on with Victor Hovlin all of a sudden in the last few weeks? Changing its swing, trying to get some distance, trying to move the ball left to right, right to left, you know, trying to get that whole game in order for the entire calendar. year and all the different major championships and all the different places he played, he kind of got lost in the shuffle there with that. And he has not been playing up to a Victor Hovlin standard. He was the best player in the world almost a couple of years ago when he won the FedEx Cup.

And he has kind of gone away a little bit. He's still a huge name. He's going to be fine. But he's kind of working through getting his swing back to where it was. He changed it. Golfers are always doing that. It's not like football. You throw three picks.

You're still going to throw the ball the same way. You know, I used to joke, Chuck Person is not about to not start shooting just because he goes 0 for seven in the first half. Shooter never stopped shooting. Exactly. And in golf, these guys are always trying to tinker and always tweaking and always trying to improve. And sometimes it catches up to him.

Happen to Martin Kimer years ago when he was number one in the world, and it happened to Victor Hobble. I think Victor's going to be fine, but he's trying to work his way back to where he was. It's an interesting thing that he's gone through. He's a really nice kid, by the way. I think it'll be fine. All right, two more. Tiger, just give me your thoughts on him playing here.

The Colin Montgomery stuff was great. For those that missed it, Colin Montgomery suggested that he should hang it up. He should retire. And you can tell everybody what Tiger said yesterday. I'm trying to be nice here. you and I have won as many PJ tour events and major championships to Columaccombe.

Touch your trap. I mean, what do you have your mind? I mean, when you're telling Tiger what you should do? And, you know, of all the people of Tiger's era to be telling Tiger what to do, that'd be like Mickelson doing that.

You know, it's just not going to happen. And Tiger kind of half laugh and kind of a half like, Get the hell out of here. What are you talking about? So, you know, should he retire? I don't disagree with Mott, by the way. I mean, it's painful to watch. Let me just tell everybody, though.

The line was, he said, as a past champion, I'm exempt until I'm 60. A Colin is not. Correct. Yeah. So he doesn't have the opportunity to make that decision on whether or not to play the open. Correct. All right. Go ahead. Look, here's the deal.

Tiger has earned the right to do as he wishes. That's the first thing. You have to keep that in mind. This is not some gold guy just kind of limping around here. This is a guy who was the best player of his generation, and he earned the right to be here. Okay? He hasn't been given anything here.

He was given an exemption to the U.S. Open, which opened the door for the conversation that Monty was talking about. I just don't think it should have been Monty. saying it out loud because Monty doesn't have the respect from the guys of his era the way he thinks he does. He'll put it that way. He never wanted a major. Never wanted the United States on the PGA tour.

A tremendous player in Europe, tremendous Ryder Cup player, but not on an individual side in the biggest event. He was close at Congressional in 97. Was close. But Ernie got him. He was close a bunch of days. He should have won a wing foot. He should have won a lot of times.

He just never got one done. It's tough for a guy like him to say anything about Tiger. But I don't know why he would even go that route. But Tiger, look, guys are an ultra-competitive, great athlete. It's not easy to walk away from that when you still have the ability to do it. It's not like football where, you know, the GM and the head, the coach, the GM, the personnel people, the owner say, you know what, we're done now. It's not like that. In golf, they let you hang around.

and they let you hang around because you earned it. And it's not like that in a team sport. So I have no problem. You know, look, Willie May is playing with the Mets and O.J. Simpson playing, you know, with the Rams, right? Joe Namath was with the Rams, right? And, like, you know, Brett Farr bouncing around the league. There's all kinds of examples of players playing too long. But you tell me what you would do if you're an athlete and you're in your late 30s

or in this case you're late 40s with Tiger. and you've earned the right to be there. No one's telling him he has to go. So he'll make that decision on his own, as painful as it is to watch at times, Kevin, and not being able to see him finish tournaments or miss the cut and not compete against the best. I don't know why he wants to continue to keep doing that

at this particular level, but he has earned the right to do it. So I am not going to say a word about. Any chance he can play well at Trun? No, he's not going to play. I mean, yeah, he can play. play well, sure. But over the course of four days, Kevin, it's not going to happen anymore over the course of four days. It's just too much on his body. It's not the game. His game is five, but he's rusty

because he can't play it often enough because his body won't allow it. So it's, it's tough. All right, finish up with this. Give me your best bets. Give me the guys that you like this weekend. Oh, man. I really like Moracalla. I really like Tony Fienow. I really like Tony Fienow. I really like Akshay Batia, there's one from off the board. The thin guy. Yeah, the thin guy. He is then. You know, I just think that you've got to keep it in play.

You've got to have a great short game here. And Kalamorekow keeps it in play. You know, I think Rory's going to play well. You know, the last time he really coughed up a major was he's a different person, different era of his career. But 2011, the Masters, the back nine, the next major, speaking of the major championship, schedule, the PGA that year was in August. So the next major after he blew that Masters on the back nine on Sunday when he had that four-shot lead was congressional and he won by eight.

He's a different person now. He's much older now than he was then, and the scar tissue situation was a lot different. But I think Rory plays well to sleep. And Morikow, I think, Tony Fee now, and I think Akshay Batia would be my darker horse. Thanks for doing this, as always. Enjoy the weekend. You're missing, well, you're missing brutal heat where you live in Orlando, but you're missing really brutal heat here in D.C., record-setting heat over the last. I mean, Valerie was telling me, you know, we spent our summers up in Ocean City and Dewey,

and Valerie was telling me that even at the beach today, it's like, not a million degrees. It's like, wow. It's not a million here. I can tell you that. It's 62 here, and I walked out with four layers on this morning. It was pretty funny. 130 a.m. Thursday morning on Peacock, the coverage starts, and it moves to USA from 4 a.m. to 3 p.m., then back to Peacock. That's the schedule for the first two days, and then it goes to NBC at 7 a.m. on Saturday and Sunday. Steve will be a part of the coverage all weekend long. Thanks for doing this. We'll talk football next time.

My pleasure, Kevin. Talk about it, Steve Sands, everybody. Following Howard Gutman, I thank them both for today's show. Back tomorrow with Tommy.