The Kevin Sheehan Show - Trade Talk + Belichick To DC?

Episode Date: November 2, 2023

Kevin and Thom with a bit more on the Sweat and Young trades. The boys discussed Mike Florio hearing Washington will make a run at Bill Belichick in 2024. Thom had his Commanders-Pats prediction and Kevin's "You Heard It Here First" bold prediction was a major college football upset on Saturday.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Cheehan Show. Here's Kevin. Tommy's here. I am here. The show, as always, presented by Window Nation.

Call them at 86690 Nation or go to WindowNation. com. Mention my name and they will take good care of you. You'll get a free estimate. If you've been thinking about new windows, now is the time to call 86690 Nation or Window Nation. Tommy, we got some really good reviews. Rate us and review us if you haven't done it on Apple and Spotify.

Subscribe to the podcast. That helps follow us as well. This from EDood, my go-to podcast, he gives us five stars. I love Kevin and Tommy. A great rapport between the two of them. Excellent sports analysis and some TV and movies thrown in for good measure. And Tom's travel adventures are cherries atop the same. Sunday. Thank you, E-Dood. From Marky Mark, he writes, where the hell's

coolie been? Exclamation point. Yeah, I talked to him the other day. He's just not paying attention right now. I cannot get him to pay attention to the football team here. But it doesn't mean that he won't this weekend. So we'll see how that goes. The wrestling season has started. And so he's coaching wrestling for one of the junior college powerhouse wrestling programs in America out in Powell, Wyoming. So we'll get him on soon, I promise. Jay Gruden will be on tomorrow. We had Santana Moss on the show yesterday. I love Santana Moss. He's one of my favorite former players. Just one of the nicest people ever and was really a good player for this franchise during, you know, some bleak years, although a couple of those Gibbs years were good years.

How are you, Tommy? How are you doing today? I'm doing great. You're right. Santana Moss was one of the things that at the time Redskins fans could point to and feel proud of. Always, yeah. They could say he plays for us and feel good about that. And when your team is bad, you really treasure those kind of players. Yeah, I mean, and he had so many moments. Like, there weren't many moments. during the Dan Snyder era. But the Monday night comeback in Dallas in September of 2005, down 13-0, Mark Brunel to Santana Moss twice. I mean, he was on the receiving end of two incredible late-game touchdowns

in one of the real memorable Redskins Cowboys games, not just of the Snyder era of all time. you know, and he had some memorable plays. I remember when he caught the hitch and took it to the end zone in overtime to beat Jacksonville, 36 to 30, I think it was. And he's great, too, because he's got a phenomenal memory of all of those things and is a very good storyteller. So if you miss Santana yesterday, we always end up talking about other things, not just the topic of the day, which was the trade yesterday, but we always end up talking about something else.

Well, let's get one topic not of the day out of the way, because I wanted to share this with you guys. You know, we do walking down memory lane better than anybody. We do. Okay. We do. In fact, listen, the reality is we do everything better than everybody. Okay. Okay.

But this is a little walk down memory lane I came across on the Internet. Do you remember beef steak, Charlie? Yes, I do. I do remember beefsteak Charlies. They were everywhere in the 80s. Yes. They were usually beefsteak charlies in a mall or other places. I think there was one in 10.

And listen to these prices. Like a boneless sirloin, 499, filet mignon, 799. But that's the food. That's irrelevant. That really doesn't matter. The deal with beefsteak trolleys was it was all the beer and wine you could drink. I don't remember that. Oh, yes. I remember that.

I would have remembered that. I would have remembered that. All the beer and wine. Why are you bringing this up? I found it online somewhere, just breathing through some stuff. What do you mean? Like, they're still around? No, there's an old ad. Somebody posted an old ad. Okay. For a beef steak, Charlie.

And that was, look, in a fraternity in Miami, after fraternity, meetings on Sunday night, we headed to B-Stake Charlie's, and we basically drank them out of existence that night when we went. Yeah. All the beer you could drink. I don't remember that. I think there was one in Tenly. If I recall there was one in Tenley, there may have been one on, like, M Street, too, or in Georgetown, maybe?

Think about that. Anyway. All the wine you could drink with dinner. Yeah, no, I mean. Thing about the possibility. I can't imagine it was good wine. But still, yeah, I mean, you're seeing these prices. What's the year?

I mean, what do you... I think it's in the 80s somewhere. I don't know where the year is here. Hold on. Let me just... It's in the 80s. That was their heyday. Beefsteak Charlies.

Beefsteak Charlies. Look at this. Here's a story called Beefsteak Charlies, and it's in the Washington Post. February 18. 1882. Oh, it's just a kind of review. Prices, the entree, 699 to 1599. Kids 12 and under eat for five cents on Sundays from one to four when accompanied by an adult for ordering dinner. Reservations not required. Credit cards are all accepted, Tommy. So what do they say? I stopped in at the Bethesda branch.

All right. The Bethesda branch I'm going to guess was on Wisconsin Avenue. On one cold Sunday. Yeah, okay. I'm not going to read the whole story, but there's a story here about it. Oh, there's a K Street branch. I said M Street. Actually, I meant K Street.

I remember the one on K Street. I think there was one in Tenley, too. Doesn't say it here. Okay. Beefsteak Charlies. Blast from the past. Anything else? No, it just brings up a lot of fond memories of when drinking beer for free meant I wouldn't fall asleep after the second pitcher.

Yeah. I don't, it doesn't say in this story, by the way, free alcohol and free beer, or all that you can drink. I'm looking at the ad right here. That's incredible. Now, I remember it that way. That was the attraction. I can tell you this. You know, in 1982, they weren't concerned about anybody being bombed and getting into their car and driving home.

That was pre What really started it was Mothers Against Drunk Driving That's what really started the I mean, I can remember I mean It was not a big deal when I was in high school Drinking and driving

It became a bigger deal when I was in college And later on Oh I look at In East Troutburg One night a cop stopped me And I was drunk I was clearly drunk Yeah

And I went to school with his daughter. So he parked my car and drove me home. Yeah. Well, I'm surprised he didn't just say, hey, wake up, just be alert. Just do your best, try to get home. All right. Let me just read something real quickly from Christian. Christian sent me an email. Kevin, your outrage and disappointment about the leaks that came from the commanders about Chase Young were appropriate. I'm a psychologist, and I believe you had it right. This was an insecure. cover your own, you know what, move by the team. As you said, it was like Dan and Bruce were back in the building and things hadn't changed.

However, your passion should have been equally directed towards Chase Young. From my seat, he played a big part in his own demise here in Washington. He flashed as a rookie and thought he had arrived. From that moment, he was more interested in being a star off the field than on it. Missing one or a few voluntary OTA sessions is fine. missing all of them when your team captain isn't. The tone was set with his coaches early on. For teams to succeed, your most talented players have to be the most committed.

He never was. I agree with you on the leaks, petty, insecure, and small. But we knew most of what was leaked yesterday anyway. Thank you, Christian. You can email me, by the way, and Tommy, through the show's website, the kevin Sheehan Show.com. You can tweet me at Kevin Sheehan, D.C., tweet. Tommy at Tom Leverro. I mean, I know that what was, I mean, I think Christian understands this,

and I want to get your take on this too, Tommy, but I know what was leaked to, you know, Mike Silver and to Standig and to everybody, and all of us were getting texts and calls. I mean, Tommy, they were falling all over themselves on Tuesday to leak all of the stuff about Chase Young. I understand that a lot of us have heard a lot of that over the years, but that was not the point. The point was that, you know, they were insecure and they cared about what everybody thought, and they ran the bus over them on the way out of town. And I just thought that that reeked of Dan and Bruce, and I was hoping things would change. And I would not probably say, no, I wouldn't say that the owner, the new owner, had necessarily anything to do with it. Ron was asked about this, by the way, yesterday.

David Aldridge asked him about the leaks and the information on Chase, you know, and Ron, you know, acted like it was very disappointing that that stuff got out. That was very disingenuous. Yeah, I thought so, too. I mean, Mike Silver is Ron Rivera's boy. Exactly. Yeah. You know, Mike Silver worked.

Ron hired Silver when he first came to the team because Silver was out of a job to do some writing for Redskins.com. Yes, he did. Yes, he did. Yes. So that was obvious where that from. I don't have the same issues that you do with it. One thing, because it's probably true. That's fine. I acknowledge that. Truth counts for something. I acknowledge that. You know?

And also, I'm betting that there was a lot of resentment among that coaching staff at Chase Young. and when you build up those kind of resentments, you pay the price. Yeah, but it's still low road. You would agree with that. You know what? It may be low road, but I think they knew what they were doing when they got on that road. I don't think they did. I think that they figured that, okay, you know, this guy, you know, we invested in him,

we drafted him number two, we made him a team captain, and he never acted like any of those. Then why didn't you do something about it while you had them? See, that's my problem. That's a good point. First of all, the low road, when you say they knew what they were doing, what they were doing and whether or not they knew, you know, they thought about it, they were covering their own ass, as this guy Christian said. They were concerned about what people would think about getting basically a fourth round pick for Chey Shung.

I mentioned this on the podcast yesterday. On Tuesday afternoon, I got a call. saying, what do you think the reaction to this trade's going to be? And I said, well, why should you care? Don't give a shit about what anybody thinks, your fans, the media. If you think this was the right thing to do, do it and let it stand on its own. But no, they couldn't do that. They wanted to, they wanted to create, by the way, it was already out there because they had told people all along for the last two years that this guy was difficult to coach. Ron pretty much said it multiple times, you know, in press conferences about maturity and adhering to the scheme. I just think that

to leak that it's addition by subtraction and to talk about how, you know, he was undisciplined and was looking for splashy plays and wasn't coachable and all the stuff that they leaked to Mike Silver. I just thought it was Bush League. You're not going to change my mind on that. But I know. But I acknowledge, I acknowledge it's, I'm pretty sure it's all true. And yes, I think that what I was going to get to after what had me going there to start with is this. It's cowardly, in my opinion, to rip him anonymously on the way out. when, as you just described, there was some pent-up frustration, pent-up however you described it.

Well, you should have coached him harder then. You should have coached him for three and a half years. You shouldn't have given him, you shouldn't have made him captain. You shouldn't have let him play, by the way, more snaps than any delinement over the last month. If he was such a subtraction, if you're adding so much by subtraction, why has he been playing so much? Why was he coddled? I mean, you benched Forbes this year. You should have benched him.

You should have coached him harder. That's what I would say to that. If you were so frustrated that you had to anonymously leak, you should have coached him harder. It is a cover your ass thing. I think they were angry, maybe in part that they had to cover their ass, that they had to basically deal him because he was disappointing. But you're right. they didn't want to answer those questions while he was here.

So they didn't want to bench him and answer these questions. Yeah, well, that's cowardly. You know, and by the way, you probably, I mean, he was out injured for all that time, but you probably hurt your team. If you really didn't think that you, if you really think you're adding by subtraction with him being traded, you hurt your team every time you put him on the field. But people make allowances for number one and number two draft picks all the time. I don't know.

I did, by the way, it's unfair Christian for you to say that I didn't, I did not let Chase off the hook at all. I understand that Chase Young is very responsible, you know, even at 24 years old for his own demise here. I'm not taking him off the hook at all. I was more upset yesterday about just the. the feeling that we were right back with Dan and Bruce in the front office with these anonymous leaks smearing this guy on the way out of town. And it's like I just didn't understand the point. And Tommy, you know, Tommy's point is probably spot on in that there's a lot of pent up, a lot of built up. And Christians point, they're covering their own ass. And I got a call. They were concerned

about what people would think. I wish they wouldn't be concerned about what people think anymore. and just do the right thing. But really, in thinking about it, that, you know, it's just, it's not only low rent, it's cowardly to rip this guy when you had him in front of your face for three and a half years.

You know, you should have coached him better. You should have coached him harder. And if he didn't respond, then you should have cut him or you should have traded him earlier. And I understand he was injured, but you should have definitely benched him. You know, if this, if...

So anyway, what, what? I know what you're saying in that they shouldn't care what people think about them. And in terms of personal courage, that would be fine. But I don't think you can operate like that in this day and age, unless you're Bill Belichick. And Bill Belichick, who wasn't two and six. Other than that, I think you better care what people are saying about you because it can drive your business. Okay, that's fair.

But if you're going to care, then operate in a way or respond to caring about what people think in a different way. Because what they did yesterday or two days ago backfired. No reasonable person. They're not good at communicating. I mean, no reasonable person sees these anonymous quotes about this kid and think. Oh my God, let me go buy some tickets. They were right all along. I'm so glad they got a fourth rounder for them.

End of the third round, but compensatory end of the third round. Here's something for you. Oh, I didn't mention this yesterday, and I was reminded of it after the show yesterday. I had asked Ben standing on radio like week two, week three. Why is Chase Young standing up in Montez Sweat? Why is Chase Young in a two-point stance and Montez Sweat is in a three-point stance? He said, I have no idea. It's a good question.

I'll ask. And it never got asked. But somebody reached out to me recently and told me it's what Chase wants to do. Chase feels more comfortable being up in a two-point stance most of the time on certain calls or whatever. Oh, yeah, and they don't like it. And so I haven't mentioned that. but they were not thrilled by it, apparently. Again, another example will then make them get down in a three-point stance.

You're the coach. Okay. There is another point of view here to consider. If Chase Young was the talent that everybody thought he was coming out of Ohio State when Rivera drafted him with their first pick in 2020, and if he's a generational talent, which he probably is not. But in the beginning, if he was, should you relax the coaching and pretty much kind of let him do what he wants to do?

I love your point of view. I love that point of view. When the first, in 2021, in the early portion of that season, when they were talking about gap integrity and adhering to the scheme and maturity, I said exactly what you just said. I said, you know, sometimes when you have, you know, a generational type of talent like Bill Parcells had with Lawrence Taylor, maybe you can't be as rigid with that player. Maybe sometimes it's just go get the quarterback, you know,

and let him and turn them loose. but to your point, certainly post-injury, he may not be that generational talent anymore. No, he may not be that, but in the beginning. Yeah. Until he got hurt. I mean, you know, I would say, I was thinking back, it's just so reminiscent in many ways of LeVar Arrington.

LeVar Arrington's the most physically gifted football player I've ever seen. Okay. I think he could have played fullback in the NFL, let alone linebacker. Right. But he had the same issues as Chase Young. He thought he was a star, and on the field, he didn't accept coaching well. Now, you know, because he just felt like he wanted to get the quarterback, you know, because he felt like he could impact every play.

And sometimes you have to let them express, as Davey Johnson would say, let them express their talent. Right. I think sometimes it has to do with the coach, too, because Marty Schottenheimer got him to play the way he wanted him to play. It's funny because I think there's so much truth to that. And I think like a Gibbs, I think of Gibbs, right? Gibbs let Dexter Manly be Dexter Manly.

Let Gary Clark be Gary Clark. Let John Riggins be John Riggins because he was smart enough to understand these people are so good at what they do that I'm so much better off being relaxed with them and having them perform for me than trying to be rigid and losing them. And so, okay, I'm going to quickly make this just about a personal experience

because it's one of my, I'm telling you, one of these days, there's a friend of mine who coaches high school basketball. The two of us have decided one of these days we're just going to write a book, and maybe you can help me. You know, like I helped you get the screenplay submitted wherever, the treatment or whatever.

But it's basically just going to be, every chapter is going to be a parent story. You know, coaching kids, and it's going to be a parent story because there are so many of them to go around. But I'm going to tell you one real quickly. I was coaching this team, I don't know, it was probably like 15 years ago.

And I had a kid that was very talented. He went on to play Division I in college basketball, actually in the Ivy League. And every other kid I had on the team just wasn't very good. I mean, it just was not a very good team that I was coaching in this particular moment, but I had this one kid. And in one particular stretch of games, it was eighth grader.

He had like 39, 34, 29, 35 in like four straight games. And we won two of them and lost two of them because we were not very good. And after one of the games, I walk out into the parking lot and there are like five parents standing by my car. Coach, can we talk to you for a little bit? I said, of course. Is it typical that one player takes almost all of the shots? And I said, no, it's not.

But on this team, it is. On this team, this is what we have to do. And then I proceeded to kind of go down the list of the kids, their specific sons. And your son is an incredible defender. He's really good for us as a screener. Your son over here is super high IQ. He's a great passer.

So I built up their kids, but I explained to them that on this team, one player was going to take the majority of the shots, but it was the way it had to happen. That isn't exactly what you're talking about. But yes, they should have been more flexible, perhaps. But I don't think we're dealing with you. If he was as good as we all thought he was. If, if, yes.

I think he certainly showed some flashes his rookie year. But I don't know. The bottom line is, that coaching staff isn't that kind of coaching staff. No, they're not. Parcells. I don't see Jack Del Rio being that kind of guy. Yeah, Parcells probably would have just said, yeah, we got a problem with this one. But look at how good he is.

Let's just turn him loose. 99, it's third and 10, go get the quarterback. 99, just go get the ball. Maybe that was it. But that wasn't this group. You know, the ultimate example of Gibbs doing what you said he did, more recent, is Clinton Porter. Clinton, he do that on Sunday,

Clinton Porters would post and do what he had to do to win the game. Right. Okay. Monday through Saturday, was not a big particular concern for him. Yeah. Yeah, you're right. And as it relates to Chase Young, maybe they would say,

yeah, he wasn't that good as it turned out. And so we couldn't have him just, you know. The bottom line is he ended up playing a lot and freelancing a lot anyway. And the truth of the matter, as Ron likes to say, is it didn't generate a lot of results, not after the injury. And he's had some good games this year. And you can't say it's not like he was the lone wolf on that defensive line.

Look at the guys who were right next to him. It's not like he was being triple-teamed every play. Right. Maybe Kyle Shanahan and that group out there, Steve Wilkes, will handle it differently. You know, with him when he gets out there. I mean, I was, look, I was. dead wrong. I mean, I was rooting for them to lose to the Giants that year so that they

would get the number two pick and be able to select Chase Young. I thought, watching him at Ohio State, this was the next big defensive player in the NFL. Well, you weren't alone, obviously. Yeah, and that but clearly,

you know, he has some, he's got a lot of the blame to take upon himself. And maybe getting out of this town will help. Who knows? Yeah, maybe it will. In my column in today's Washington Times, which I write about Chase Young, and you can read it on

Washington Times.com slash sports, you can find it on my Twitter and Facebook page as well. I borrowed one of your comparisons. I didn't give you credit for it, of course. You never do. But I borrowed the other day when you were talking about expectations, you know, and you mentioned Max Crosby? Yeah, for the Raiders. That's a game changer.

Yeah. That's a game wrecker. Right. I think a lot of people thought they were getting that when they drafted Chase Young. Yeah, we did. How about this? He's got to go down as one of the all-time franchise draft busts in history. And think about this list, right, just from this century.

LeVar Arrington was taken number two overall. RG3 was taken number two overall. Actually, was Chris Samuels 2, and LeVar was 3? Whatever it was. I think it was. Now, LeVar was 2 and Chris Samuels was 3, I think. And RG3 was 2, and then Chase Young was 2. I mean, LeVar was injured.

LeVar had issues, but a lot of it was injury-related. But LeVar had some seasons here. The Marty season was a good season. He had the Marvin Lewis was Spreier season. Yes, he did. So he's not on that list of all-time busts. No, I don't put him on that. He was disappointing, but not a butt.

Yeah, because like with Chase Young, you're right. I mean, the expectations were so high. And I don't put it all on him either because I do think that injuries really ended up playing a role. And by the way, I think if Marty had stayed, LeVar would have turned into that player here if he had stayed healthy. But injuries were a big deal. But anyway, Heath Shuler. is the number one all-time bust draft choice for me. Taken number three overall in the 94 draft.

He just could not play at all. Couldn't play at all. Couldn't learn the offense. Couldn't remember the plays. Couldn't call the plays. Gus Ferrat, the seventh round pick that year, same draft, ends up starting midway through that season,

and he ends up having the long career. I think Schuller's number one on the list of the all-time. franchise busts in terms of the draft. But Chase Young, he's up there on the list. He might be number two. Would you put Desmond Howard number two? I mean, Desmond Howard was a massive disappointment. He was picked fourth overall, I'm pretty sure, in the 92 draft.

It was after they were champs. And, you know, the famous line from Jeff Bostic, he's asked by a reporter after practice when Desmond Howard finally had reported. So how did Desmond Howard do? And he said he can't play. And the reporter said, well, he's hurt. No, no, he can't play in this league because he can't get off the line of scrimmage. Like, you know, the veteran players knew the first practice.

And by the way, Bostic wasn't wrong. He did not play a big time wide receiver in the league. He was a very good kick returner, you know, for the Packers. But, yeah, Desmond Howard's. up there, no doubt. Desmond Howard, Chase Young, Keith Schuller. I mean, we're talking about high picks here because Andre Johnson, the guy that they traded into the first round to take in 90, whatever year that was, 97, 96 from Penn State to tackle, never actually played, I don't think, in an NFL game, and he was a first round pick. RG3's up there. Josh Doxon's up

there. But he was picked later in the first round. 22nd overall, I think. Chase is, he's top three. Top three, top four. You know, it's just still amazes me. That 2000 draft where they drafted Lavaire Arrington and Chris Samuels, one after the other. Yeah. That's a franchise changing draft. Yeah. You have two

franchise changing players because Chris Samuels was announced he's probably the top three tackles in the history of franchise behind with Shea and Joe. No, Trent. You know? Trent, I think,

well, it's fine. You can keep Chris Samuels where you've got him. He was a great left tackle, no doubt. Right. Okay. When you draft those guys two and three and you have what they had to show for it,

That's just stunning. That's really stunning. I know. Well, that was, you know, that was the Snyder. That was Snyder's first draft. Because when he took over the team in 99, they had already drafted. And Charlie had made the big trade with, you know, Mike Ditka, you know, that landed him champ Bailey and, you know, that pick. And that draft, the number one player in the draft was the Penn State kid that played with Lovar Arrington. Oh, God.

God. Courtney Brown. Courtney Brown. Courtney Brown. No. Oh, Corky Brown. Courtney Brown. That's right. Yeah. And so that, yeah. And I still wonder, like, with two and three, why they took LeVar first and Samuel's third or, you know, second and Samuel's third rather than the other way around. I think I've asked Charlie that before. I think I've asked Charlie because Charlie was in charge of that draft.

in 2000, right? Yes. Or not? Yes. No, he was gone by... He was gone by that. As soon as Snyder took over, he fired, darling. Right, right, right, right.

Yeah. Yeah, so what's his face was helping out? Well, Vinnie. Vinny, Vinny was in charge of the draft, but they had somebody else that actually had the general manager title in 2000. Really? Yeah. I think so. I don't we call that.

It was Vinny. Who am I thinking of? I don't know. I don't know either. I don't know either. Vinny was in charge of that draft. I'm trying to find the name. I'm looking forward that I can't pull.

Seems to be an issue here today. Although I did pull Courtney Brown out of my ass there. Yes, he did. Okay. What else on the big trades? Well, they're going to play them. When did he play the 49ers? The second class came in.

a year? Yeah, something like that. Oh, I know what I wanted to do. Here's what I wanted to ask you. Did you see, because you mentioned Mike Silver. Mike Silver and I talked about it yesterday in the podcast. He was hired by them in July of 2021. He had been with the NFL network. He had been a long time NFL insider reporter and was a friend of Ron Rivera's. They both went to Cal. He had a big relationship with Ron. And they hired him when he was out of work to come work for the organization. He basically wrote for the website. He was part of the podcast. And as a I mentioned yesterday, he was actually the on-field television reporter for the preseason games that summer. So, you know, his tweet or his article in the Chronicle, San Francisco Chronicle, included the line that, you know, Chase Young,

according to several commanders, coaches, and other organizational sources, was viewed as an undisciplined player who developed bad habits, such as deviating from assignments in an effort to make splash plays, et cetera. So Grant Paulson, quote tweeted, quote, retweeted, Mike Silver's, you know, tweet of that line as part of the story. And Grant, you know, wrote Silver worked for the commanders a couple of years ago. Friendship with Rivera dates back to their time at Cal. And when he says something about what Washington thinks, you can take it to the bank. Well, did you see that Mike Silver responded to that with a fist bump emoji?

Did he really? Yes. So he was saying he liked Grant's tweet? I think so. It was a fist bump. Yeah. Emoji. I mean, to me, when I saw that, I'm like, are you serious?

Like, you just basically, even if you didn't mean to, which I think he did, but you just basically confirmed that Ron was the source for all these quotes about Chee Sheng, right? Yes. Yes, he did. You're right. I mean, I've had Mike on the show before. I mean, I had him on when he was working for the team. I had him on before he ever came to the team when he was just an NFL. I mean, that wasn't, maybe he meant something different, but that wasn't very bright, was it? No. No, I don't know what he was thinking when he did that. but it speaks to everything still in the bill.

This is why I wrote after the game Sunday, fans would just as soon fast forward the rest of the season, get on to the new coaches and the new general managers. And just, you know, because there's a sense that you're still carrying Dan Snyder's baggage, even though there's a new owner. Yeah, it's time. It's time. Although I really believe, and I haven't seen or heard the Jack Del Rio or Eric Bianamy pressers from today because they speak today.

And actually, I did see Kime tweet something that Del Rio said about Chase Young. He said something, here it is. When that pick was selected, nobody envisioned it would go the way it has in terms of mistimed injuries, whatever, and ultimately end up being traded. Not exactly what we were all anticipating. great young man, wish him the best. That's what they should have, you know, said officially and not leaked anything. Great young man wishing the best. Anyway, what I was going to say is I think out there there is this feeling defensively anyway.

You know, I don't think they really wanted to trade Montez sweat. They just got an offer that they couldn't refuse. But they, I think they think they're going to be more productive now with Chase gone. You talk yourself into that mode? Am I talking myself into it? Or what do you ask you? No, I don't mean you. Yeah, right.

I mean, if you're an organization that just suffered a loss of talent, okay, isn't there a tendency to talk yourself into the mode? Well, we'll circle the wagons and we'll be stronger. Yeah. No, no, no, you're right. Yes, I agree with you. I think that they feel and have felt all this year that they are much better than their record indicates. And that defensively it's been disappointing, clearly.

But now maybe on defense they feel a little bit better about things. I mean, you know, they did say it's addition by subtraction as it relates to Chase. I think they're also very optimistic right now in the moment after last Sunday about Sam Hal. And look, those guys are, you know, they know what their fate is, but they would love to change, you know, the exit narrative on them by, you know, somehow winning, you know, five of their final nine or what would they, they're three and five right now. They've got nine games left, so they're going to have to win six of their final nine to get to nine and eight and probably a playoff spot. I don't see that happening. But I could see him beating New England on Sunday. Oh, Sunday's a win.

Oh, that's got victory written all over. Hold on. Don't give me your final score yet. That comes up in the next segment. I can't wait to hear this. It's got victory written all over it. Really? That's exactly what you said about the Giants game.

So that concerns me. Let's get to that. Tommy's prediction. We'll get to some other things as well right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Tommy, I found the name that I was looking for that I couldn't pull. Joe Mendez is who I was thinking of. Joe was for a brief period of time in the early to mid-2000s, actually had the VP of Football Ops title.

He was working with Vinny and with Pepper Rogers, who was in the organization, as well. But it was Joe Mendez was the name I was trying to pull. And he was more of the salary cap guy at the time. Tell us about Shelley's. Well, you know, it's what? November, today's November 2nd, right? Right. Okay. Whether we like it or not, commercially, everybody's in a Christmas mode right now. Right. You know, I know Thanksgiving's coming up, but you see Christmas decorations out there. I walked by a place I saw Toys for Tots Box for Christmas out there. So people are getting ready to be in the Christmas mode.

And if you go down to Shelley's, you'll see it's a great place for Christmas parties. Yeah. You'll see a lot. You might walk into a place where they have two different rooms, and in the other room, they could be having some kind of Christmas party. That's a regular occurrence at Shelley. So it's a great place. have a party. But if you want to throw your own personal party for a family member or a friend,

here's a great Christmas gift, gift cards for Shelley's Backroom. You can go online and buy gift cards from Shelly's from $5 to $500. Okay? It's easy to do. You just go to shelley's backroom.com, fill out the information. You can make it personalized a card. And this way, you're giving your friend, your loved one, whatever, a chance to experience Shelly on your dime for Christmas. Shelly's backroom, 1331 F Street Northwest in the district. Great idea. Really good idea. So before we get to your prediction, Bobby Knight passed away yesterday at the age of 83. You know, I'm not a Bobby Knight expert by any stretch of the imagination.

I had Gary Williams on the show this morning. Gary coached against him when he was at Ohio State all of those years. But I thought, you know, other than understanding that this was, as everybody said about a million times yesterday last night and this morning, he was a very complicated figure. I think we all understand that. He was a great coach. Like, as a basketball person and someone who loves the sport, Bobby Knight's teams were just. you know, incredibly well-coached. They were incredible man-to-man defensive teams.

You know, as Gary mentioned to me this morning, and it's something I didn't even know, I just knew that they ran motion offense, you know, five-man motion offense, as well as anybody in the country during his years at Indiana. And Gary said basically, you know, it was hard to kind of scout them because it's not like they ran plays.

They didn't run plays. They had, you know, a motion offense with rules within that offense, but Gary pointed out, you know, his idea essentially was, you know, his best players took the shots, period. You know, if you weren't one of the better offensive players or shooters, you didn't get to shoot. You know, you got to set screens. You got to pass. You got to hit the offensive glass.

And his 76 championship team with Kent Benson and Quinn Buckner and Scott May is the last undefeated college basketball team. their 75 teams some people think was even better, but Scott May got hurt, and they won the National Championship going away beating Michigan. But I was thinking, other than asking you for your thoughts on Bobby Knight, but I wanted to have a conversation about, you know, kind of where Knight ranks just all time on the list of American sports coaches, because he's on the short list of the greatest American sports coaches pro or college of all time, regardless of what your feelings are about him. He's in a...

He's probably in the top 10, top 15, on anybody's list. But anyway, tell me what your thoughts are on Bobby Knight passing away. Did you ever have a chance to interview him or cover him? No, I've been in press conferences with him. And, you know, look, complicated to me is a synonym for asshole. Okay. I'm sorry. But that's what it is.

That's what people say when they have to apologize for your behavior, even though they love you. They have to walk around and apologize for you. Yeah, he was complicated. Great coach. You know, I've never, when I make a list like a Mount Rushmore or something similar of great coaches, I generally never include college coaches. I put them in their own category. Why?

So I just do. Okay. Because, you know, I just, I mean, one is coaching kids and the other are coaching men. So maybe that's why. But Bobby Knight is probably one of the top three college coaches in a history of college basketball. He had a huge impact on the game. You know, there's no denying that. And, you know, you can't, you're not, you don't have to deny the talent to have a lack of respect for the way he handled himself.

And I know there's countless stories about his compassion, about how he reached out to people, how he would help people. Like I've always said, good deeds are not a deodorant. Okay. They don't wash away the bad. Okay. So, I mean, I thought he was a bully, but an absolute great coach. Okay, fine.

Where do you, like, give me right now the top three coaches off the top of your head. of American sports. And by the way, like I was just thinking about it as I asked you the question before, I am sure that there are great coaches in sports that we're not even considering. I think what we're considering is basketball and football, probably men's football, college and pro, men's basketball, college and pro, even though Gino Oriama and Pat Summit and probably a few others could be considered.

But if I ask you to tell me right now who that top three American sports coaches of all time pro or college are, give me your top three. What are the first three that come to mind? I would say Red Hourback, Bill Belichick, and Vince Lombardi. The first three that would come to my mind, because I wrote him down before I pulled up a list, Wooden, Lombardi, and Belichick. And the funny thing is that's what I wrote down, and I don't agree with what I wrote down, because I actually don't know how great of a coach John Wooden was.

I know what I've read and I've read a lot of books about Wooden. And I know what people believe he was. But it just was such a different time and UCLA was in a different world. And like I personally think Dean Smith is the best college basketball coach that I've ever seen. in my lifetime. And Wooden is just barely in my lifetime, you know, at the end of his career. Like Dean Smith was the best strategy, you know, strategy, innovator, everything. I wrote Lombardi down, but I didn't see Lombardi coach.

Don Shula, to me, in my lifetime of watching football, is probably the best football coach I've ever watched. I just think he could do it with his against yours. and yours against his. And he just seemed to always have teams that were better than what they should have been, including, by the way, his 72 dolphins, which was a good team, but it's not the greatest team of all time. But they went undefeated. And then, so I wrote down Shula and Dean Smith, even though the first things, I wrote down Lombardi Wooden and Belichick. Belichick is

I mean I don't know people Oh I can't believe we haven't gotten to that story yet Because I dismissed it so much on my radio show today Did you see what Mike Floreo discussed about Belichick to Washington? All right we will get to that Yeah so let's be clear about this Yeah I may be wrong about this

But Mike Floreo said that people around the league believe This is what commanders you're going to do He said the chatter. He didn't say this is what the commanders are thinking. No, he didn't report it. He made it very clear that he wasn't reporting. We'll get to that. I'm glad that we remembered, because I did not have it written down for the show.

We will get to that, I promise you. So those are your coaches. Our back. Yeah, you know, a lot of it has to do with legacy and impact, you know, years after they coached. Yeah. And that's our back in Lombardy to me. Sure. Yeah.

I mean, I'll tell you what you've said to me before. Paul Brown's influence on the game, right? This is you who always claims that Paul Brown has to be on that list. And that his influence. Well, Belichick does. Belichick talks about Paul Brown all the time. Yeah, I know. Look, Coach Thompson used to tell us about a great basketball coach named John McClendon.

Yeah, right, of course. North Carolina. Probably should get consideration on any top ten list of greatest coaches of all time with the impact and influence he had. And Eddie Robinson at Grambling, very impactful coach as well. Right, true. 100%. in fact you know the list that i just pulled up he's on that list Eddie robinson's on a lot of these lists uh here are some of the people so this was a um

this was a list put together by sporting news not that long ago all right so here it is here's the list number one on the list is wooden number two is Lombardi number three's bear bryant Number four is Phil Jackson, five Shashefsky, six Shula, seven Scotty Bowman, eight Casey Stengel, we didn't consider baseball rock either, red hour back nine, Nick Sabin 10, Bobby Knight 11, Newt Rodney 12, Pat Summit 13, Paul Brown, 14, Dean Smith, 15, Joe McCarthy, Tommy, 16, Belichick 17. and then the Red Sox. Yeah. Paterno 18, Hallis 19, LaRusa 20, Chuck Knoll, Pat Riley. Joe Gibbs comes in at 23. Popovich 24, Walsh, 25.

And then Eddie Robinson's 26, and then the list goes on and on and on. It's actually a list of the top 50 greatest coaches of all time. I'm trying to see who else is on this list. Parcells comes in at 37, Woody Hayes, 31. Landry, Tom Landry, 27. Man, Cowboy fans would hate to see Tom Landry all the way down at 27 behind a lot of NFL coaches. All right. Anything else on this? Joe McCarthy and Casey Stangle both had seven World Series titles. Wow.

They're their names. That's unbelievable. And you know what? You know who needs to be in a conversation? Who? The guy who won the World Series last night. Bruce Bochie. I was happy for him. Four World Series titles. Two different leagues now.

I had that scheduled for our final segment today, but we can talk about it now since we're going to replace that with the Belichick story. But that game last night, I mean, Zach Allen pitched so incredibly well. Like that was a really exciting watch to watch him go out there. And at the same time, by the way, of all the, he's getting through all of those innings with runners in scoring position in almost every inning. It was actually really a great game until it wasn't, you know, at the end. But Texas wins it in five.

You know, the former senators, Frank Howard Senators, finally won the World Series. 11 years in D.C. And then since 72 in Texas. Amazing that they've been there since 72, and this was their first World Series. Not a great world series, huh? The first game was a good game.

Yes, it was. Extra and England by the Rangers. Yeah, that first one. All right, we'll get Tommy's prediction. We'll talk about the Belichick story, and we'll do a you heard it here first to finish up the show right after these words from a few of our sponsors. This segment of the show brought to you by MyBooky.

Go to mybooky.orgie. Use my promo code, Kevin D.C., and they will give you a cash book. bonus on your initial deposit. New England right now, three and a half point favorites over Washington. We'll get Tommy's prediction here in a moment. I do not have a Thursday night football smell test pick, although I do like the Titans a little bit tonight against the Steelers, even though we'll see whether or not Will Levis can back up his first performance from last week tonight. And we don't know about the quarterback yet. We don't know if Kenny Pickett's playing or not. Go to my bookie

use my promo code, fair point spreads, fair totals, fair money lines, great prop bet opportunities, and fair pricing. You're not paying, you're not overpaying, excuse me, on losses. MyBooky.ag, you've got to use my promo code, Kevin D.C. All right, Tommy, give me your prediction for Sunday, because it seems like it's going to be Washington big. I like a Washington win. All the pure are going on right now with the trades. I think there is a circle of the wagons mentality after a team goes through something like this,

and it's like a shot of adrenaline that can boost them. And I think they're in, we'll show you mode right now. And they're catching a Patriots team that I think they're. just lost their best pass receiver for the year. They lost receiver. They also lost Matthew Judon. They've got a bunch of injuries, yes. Yeah.

Yeah. And, you know, they're only two and six. So, I mean, I tell you what, if they lose this game to the Patriots, then you better start looking at your high draft picks because the rest of the season, it's just

going to be one big white flag. Okay. 29-20, Commander Swin. Oh, I thought it was going to even be more convincing. 29 to 20. I'll have my prediction tomorrow. I don't love your prediction, I'll tell you that.

But, you know, who knows with the NFL. I mean, I love it in that I hope you're right. I don't have the same feeling about Sunday that you apparently have. All right, so Mike Floreo, pro football talk, was on, actually, he's now done this with several different people. But basically, I'll give you the quote. I caught wind over the weekend of some chatter in league circles with this notion that when the season ends, the commanders will trade with the Patriots to get Bill Belichick. Everyone is out. Jason Wright team president, Martin Mayhew, general manager, Ron Rivera head coach, all out, he said. And, you know,

he said that Josh Harris is going to approach Robert Kraft at the end of the season to try to get Belichick. So, Florio, I mean, come on. I mean, how many times it's been right as it's related to our team over the years? I mean, he had Lamar Jackson getting traded to Washington multiple times when it was so obvious that they could not pull off a trade like that while the ownership was still in flux last March, April, etc. That's just the most recent. But what's your reaction to this? Well, I mean, as I understand it, he's reporting that people are talking about this. He's not saying that the commanders are.

People think that this is what the commanders are going to do. Right. People around the league. Yeah. It will be a real interesting, a remarkably interesting off-season, you know. Another reason to fast forward the regular season, because the off-season is really going to be off-the-charts. Yeah. Between the draft, what, $90 million in salary cap money that they've got available,

salary cap space to sign free agents, and the candidates that will be available for the coaching job. I mean, you know, if you believe Florio, Belichick will be available, and Jim Harbaugh will likely be available as well. And, you know, do you want an owner to go about, quote, I'm not sure what the right way is, but the right way is the owner hires the next hot shot general manager in the league, and that general manager decides who's going to coach the team and then goes to the owner and says, I pick this guy, you know, why don't you interview him, tell me what you think? like Bobby Bessertz did with Cook when it came to hiring Gibbs.

You know, that's like the right way to do it. But certainly, if you want to speed up the process and hype up the interest, Belichick or Harba'll do it for you. A couple of things. Number one, I don't think this is the way they're going to go. I think they'll go the general manager route, you know, hiring somebody off of the, you know, 49ers, Ravens or Eagles, you know, out of one of those front offices and, you know, whether it's that guy, Adam Peters or, you know, I think he's in San Francisco, the guy Bargonsie and Kansas City, whatever. They're going to hire, I think that's the route they're going to, they're not going to give the job to a 72-year-old guy and give them all of the decision-making authority. He's not a 72-year-old guy.

He's the greatest coach that maybe in the history of the league. Hold on, I'm getting to that. So I don't think it'll happen. I mean, I just don't buy this. I don't buy the chatter. There may be chatter, but I don't think there's anything to it. I just don't think that's the way Josh Harris would proceed. Now, as far as Bill Belichick goes, I did this on radio this morning,

and we took some calls, and then I was checking, you know, Twitter just in between that last break to look at some of what people were saying. I can't believe how many of you out there absolutely dismiss it as something that you wouldn't even think of. It's one thing when we were talking about, you know, the poll that the junkies did like two weeks ago, Eric Bienemy or Bill Beechick and Bienemy like had 70% of it. I mean, you like you 70% deserve to be ridiculed for that. It's a laughable answer, especially a few weeks ago. But if you wouldn't consider Bill Belichick, I mean, what are you talking about?

Of course I would be intrigued with the idea of Bill Belichick. Would you talk to him? Would you have a talk to him? Of course I would. Of course you would. He's one of the greatest coaches that's ever lived. What if he sits down and says, look, I have something to prove? You know, you go out and pick a personnel guy to make the personnel decisions.

I'll coach him up. Yeah, I mean, so, I mean, I understand people who would say, look, I understand he's the greatest ever, and there's something that would be, you know, somewhat intriguing about that. But my preference would be general manager comes in, hires the next young hot shot, and we've got a guy here for the next 10 to 15 years. You know, I understand if that's the way you're thinking. I'm not knocking that thinking. In fact, it might be the path that I'd prefer

because I would be concerned about whether or not Belichick still had the fire. Now, if you said what you just said, if he said what he just said in the interview, I'd say, let's put together a five-year deal right now. And by the way, will you help me pick the personnel person? I don't understand the idea, the idea that you wouldn't want Bill Belichick.

Like, has our fan base been that traumatized that they can't think straight? I mean, seriously, like, we will, oh, no, no, no, we don't need Belichick. We don't need Belichick. We're going to go find the hot shot new guy. Let me tell you something. The hot shot new guy, more times than not, doesn't work out. They're going to do it the right way. The right way.

I don't have, but again, I want to be clear, I don't have a problem with somebody who says, I just would rather not go down that route because probably you're only going to have them for five years. And, you know, I want the general manager and I want the young head coach and I want, you know, I want something that has a chance to be here for a long period of time. That's fine. And by the way, I would also be, I mean, as much as I'm intrigued and as much as I'm mocking those who wouldn't even consider it, like I don't know where that would come from, how you wouldn't even consider arguably the greatest coach that's ever lived. Oh, well, because he can't do anything unless he's got Tom Brady.

But my point is I'd want to know what you just said. I'd want to know that he is, you know, that he's 72 about to, you know, feeling like 50. Like he wants to basically slay the rest of the league. And he is fired up and he's just as sharp as ever. Yeah. You know, absolutely. Look, we just saw last night a guy who was out of baseball, come back and manage a World Series championship team that had lost, that had only won 68 games

the year before, and that had spent a ton of money to change things around. If the Rangers two years from now, if Bruce Bochie is gone and they're no good anymore, you think this World Series is going to mean less to those people? Right. No, you're right. Now, I mean, you know, you do want to take into consideration things like Belichick's record without Brady and Belichick here in the last couple of years and Belichick, the personnel guy who has clearly let down Belichick, the coach. Because I don't think. You take that out of the equation. Yeah, if you take that. The personnel, he's taking it off the table.

Don't worry about personnel. Yeah. We're going to find the right person. They're going to head up personnel and I'm going to coach the team. Yeah, of course I'd be interested. I mean, I don't, what am I missing here? This is a bit different than the Aaron Rogers conversation, which I was all in on Aaron Rogers. But I said specifically, I need to know he's healthy.

I need to know after sitting down with him that he still got the fire in his belly. You know, that he still wants to because he's only one year removed from back to pack MVP's. Um, yeah. And let me point out, one other thing is if you truly believe that this roster has talent. Yeah. Why wouldn't you want a coach like Bill Belichick? And we're not talking about a complete turnaround here. We're talking about some, if you believe this team has talent, then we're just talking about some tweaks and adjustments.

from Rod on Twitter. This was following the radio. This is a resounding F-no. If Harris turns into Snyder 2.0, I'm done. First of all, let me just make sure everybody's clear on something. Bill Belichick would never, ever have come to D.C. with Dan Snyder here. Snyder could have never in the last 10 years following Mike. Following Mike could have never attracted anybody anymore. But if you're talking about, you know, Dan going out and hiring Mike Shanahan and bringing Joe Gibbs back and Marty Schottenheimer, yeah, that's like almost earlier, Dan, to me.

Yeah. I don't want BB from 7PR. Who's going to develop Sam if Belichick comes in from Jay? No more dinosaurs from Fire Ron Rivera. GM first from Stephen. I don't disagree with the GM and the GM hiring the coach. If you gave me the choice right now, I definitely, I mean, I think that I probably would say,

I don't know, I need to be in the room to hear Belichick. I need to know if he's still the same Belichick, because that is a big part of this. But I can't believe how many people just absolutely wouldn't do it. Hell no, from Greg. Why would we want him from Cron? I don't... I think it's an indication of how damage to the fan base is.

From G, I don't get why you keep calling people crazy for wanting E.B. over B.B. as Belichick, if Sam and E.B. continue to progress together, E.B.'s continuity with Sam, plus new front office sounds better than 70-year-old Billelich, who isn't coming without full personnel, which he's been terrible at lately. Yeah, look, take the personnel off the table and let's just talk about him as a coach. Look, I don't want to get into the Eric B. Enemy thing. I'm rooting for Eric B. Enemy, and I think he's last week, and there have been some weeks where

it's been like, wow, okay. And yes, Sam has progressed, you know, progressed, is the wrong word. He progressed last week. The week before he was terrible. So from the week before he progressed, let's see what happens the rest of the way. No, I don't know that I would definitely say yes to Bill Belichick, but I definitely wouldn't say no to Bill Belichick, which is apparently what some of you all would do. But that's what makes these sports arguments fun. All right, let's finish up this show with you heard it here first. I've been waiting to hear what the big announcement was going to be. You got it, right? Heard it here first. My you heard it here first, bold prediction for the week, Tommy.

Maryland beats Penn State on Saturday. That is a you heard it here first on the Thursday show with Tommy. I promise you the Terps will be in the smell test tomorrow plus the eight and a half now. That line opened at 11. It's down to eight and a half. Everybody talking about Maryland's, you know, last two. games and how disappointing the season's turning out to be. Maryland beats Penn State outright Saturday in College Park for the first win over Penn State since their first year

in the Big Ten. I think Maryland's got a real shot. I really do. Penn State can't score. And Maryland's the best offensive team. They may have faced all year long at this point, including Ohio State when they played Ohio State. Maryland beats Penn State. That's my bold prediction. What's yours? My bold prediction is West Unseld will not survive the next two months as head coach of the Wizard. They will have to fire this guy because this team is worse than even, even tanking could imagine.

Did you see what Jordan Poole and Kyle Kuzma did? night. I did. Down 20. They were down 20, and they did the alley-oop stunk off the backboard. He threw it, lobbed it off the board. You know what? Somebody I know who knows basketball, and I had a high opinion of Jordan Poole,

and I'm not ready to dismiss it. But they said he's got a lot of Nick Young in him. Nick Young, good one. They covered last night against Atlanta. They were getting nine and a half. They lost by nine. The, yeah. You know, I saw Draymond Green interviewed after the Spir,

after the Warriors beat the Kings last night. And he was just, he was talking about how the chemistry of the team is so much different this year than it was last year. And it's all, and everybody understands if you follow the NBA, he's talking about Jordan Poole not being on the team. team. And keep in mind, you know, like they added Chris Paul to that roster. And Chris Paul is not the most well-liked guy in the NBA. He's a great player, but he's, you know, often been described at times as a difficult teammate. So the fact that, you know, Jordan

Poole's gone and they love the chemistry so far, the Warriors do, and Chris Paul's there says all you need to know about Jordan Poole. And, um, They're just going to, you know, if you're a Wizards fan, you want him to play well, you want him to really score, you want him to shoot a decent percentage so that there's some trade value at the deadline. You know, that's kind of why you brought him back in the deal as a trade ship. All right, Wes Unseld doesn't make it through two more months, and Maryland beats Penn State Saturday. Anything else? I got nothing else for you, boss. All right.

Back tomorrow. You can talk about all the motivational speeches and phrases and devices in the world, but the greatest motivator of all is your ass on a bench. There is no better motivator. Ass meets bench. Bench retains ass. Ass transmits signal to brain. Brain transmits signal to body.

Body gets ass off bench and plays better. I mean, it's a hell of a sequence of things that takes place.