The Kevin Sheehan Show - Trent vs. Redskins

Episode Date: March 27, 2020

Kevin and Thom today on the latest on Trent Williams vs. the Redskins. Trent's agent, Vince Taylor did an interview on WJFK radio yesterday in which he said that "Trent has never made demands on a contract". They also talked about Roger Goodell's memo to teams about the NFL Draft. A local sports legend passed away the other day. Kevin shared his story. Also, Jameis Winston is different than perhaps you think. <p> </p><p>Learn more about your ad choices. Visit <a href="https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices">podcastchoices.com/adchoices</a></p> Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You want it. You need it. It's what everyone's talking about. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Now here's Kevin. You're listening to The Sports Fix. Did you pick up on that yawned, Aaron right there? Did that get picked up? Well, let's just leave it in there. Yeah, I just yawned. It's better than coughing, which is what Tommy was just doing moments ago. And you were too. I was. You're right. I know what my cough is from. Do you know what your cough is from? Yeah, absolutely. What's it from? What's yours from? Do you have the rona? No, I don't have the rona.

Okay. Do you have the rona? No, I've got allergies. There's no doubt the pollen today. It's a beautiful day. It's warm. And it's an allergy cough. I know the difference.

Well, I don't know the difference because I've never had the rona. I mean, who knows? Maybe I do have the rona and I'm asymptomatic. You know, because a lot of people apparently, you know, have had it or have it and aren't getting any symptoms. Well, coughing would be a symptom, so that wouldn't be asymptomatic. That's true, but I don't have, at least I don't feel like I have right now a fever. I don't have shortness of breath. Both of those things could develop when I leave here.

I'm going to knock on wood, as I say that. But I don't think I have the rona. Do you, you don't think, what is your cough from? Just your bronchial issues of the last six years? No, I have hours as well. Okay. Did you have something else going on too, which is why you couldn't join me on the podcast yesterday? Are you okay?

Do you have gout? Did you tell the doctor off? Well, I didn't tell the doctor off. The doctor, I was having another attack in my right foot. It was swollen and it was very painful. From all those ass kicking as you keep giving people. I know. Not as painful as it was in Florida, but it was painful.

And she said, well, she wanted to see me right away because she wanted to see it, you know, to be able to evaluate it in its full glory. So she did. She looked at it and she said, yeah, that's a gout. Did you say I told you that the other day? Yeah, kind of. but I understand why, you know, I mean, my foot looked normal the other day. Right. And she just wanted to see it just to make sure.

So she prescribed some medicines, including steroids again, to calm it down and put me on some kind of gal medicine. So we'll see what happens. It's fine today. Absolutely fine today. Am I right about what I'm going to say that being on a steroidal medication right now can weaken your your immune system? I have no idea. Okay.

So she... I think it's strange. I think it's strange into you. Okay. I thought that I read that anybody taking sort of steroids in prescription meds, that it can actually impact and weaken your immune system right now. And no one obviously wants a weakened immune system right now. Right.

I hope I didn't worry you unnecessarily. Listen, anything you say when it comes to medicine does not worry me in the least. That's fair. But may I make a recommendation? No. I'm going to do it anyway. When we're done with the podcast, I would like you to call her, and I would like you to ask her whether or not the medication you're on impacts your immune system in any way. you do that for me or not? I'm just curious.

I'm not going to do that, honey. You're not going to do that? You can't just... No, dear. Okay. I'm not going to do that, dear. All right. Very good.

That's fine. That's fine. I think I might be right, and some of you can just tweet both Tommy at Tom Laverro and me at Kevin Shee in D.C. As to whether I'm not right or wrong. Don't tweet me about it. I'll block you if you're tweeting. You will not accept tweeted medical advice.

Will you tweet out a picture of your foot? Well, it's okay now. It's okay now? It's normal now. Okay, good. Well, that's what's most important. That's what's the heroine. Bring it back to normal. And it allows you right to go out for some of those walks around the home,

around the community home that you're in. Yes. How is everybody in the home? Everybody in a home is okay. All right. Hanging in there. Do it okay. We only got what?

Half a year more to go. Do you think that that's true? I don't know. Nobody knows. I don't think anybody really knows. That's what I mean, I just think that, I think the risk is that for people that it's, I mean, like you said, you can be a carrier and not have it. You can be asymptomatic and not have it. So people, I mean, like the areas that we think are healthy now, all it takes like, I mean, geographic locations that we think are not a problem now, all it takes is a couple of people to travel in that area, and then it starts getting spread around.

So, I mean, while I felt like I kind of had a handle on what was coming, I have no idea what's coming now. I think that that's really what my position is. It's like, you know, I read, I watch the, you know, the growing debate about whether or not the virus will have more impact, negative impact on this world or the economic depression that we could be approaching would have as much, if not more of a negative impact on, you know, certainly our country. and I understand that debate, and I'm open to both sides. To me, I just don't know that you can definitively say where this thing is going. And I think that, like, Dr. Burks, who, by the way, she's very impressive. You know, as is Fauci. And by the way, I've been very critical of the president's press briefings,

which have been anything but brief. The last two days have been massive improvements because, in part, he's done, 20 minutes instead of an hour and a half and then got in the hell out of the way and let Birx and Fauci handle it. She's very impressive. But, you know, I sat there and I listened to her yesterday and I can do the math of understanding that the one number we do know are the number of deaths associated with coronavirus. And the number that we don't know, but has to be higher, is the number of infections. And therefore, the fatality rate is going to keep going lower as we find out about more of the infections that either we didn't know because they weren't tested or we

are just learning about because they were primarily asymptomatic. So I understand that some of these numbers and some of these wild speculative numbers about fatality rates being in the three to four percent range are probably more likely than not going to be wrong. With that said, what Fauci keeps talking about and has talked about the last two days, which is, you know, preparing for the second wave of this next fall and next winter, you know, I think is a bit ominous, you know, and making sure that we have treatments in place. And, you know, there's lots of progress on that. And hopefully having a vaccine at that point ready to go. So there does seem to be a lot that isn't known, even though, I mean, she essentially admitted they don't know

the number of infections, you know? They don't know the exact number. And I can understand why. I mean, there's a lot of people that have had this or have it and don't know they have it. You're absolutely right. I can't wait until Easter Sunday when we all go to church. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I don't think personally as much as I've been, you know, certainly just observationally critical of the communication and the leadership in this, I don't think he's going to go against the.

medical and the scientists and stuff churches with people or encourage people to, no, he can't because ultimately the states will have the final say in this. But I just don't think that publicly, if we get to Easter week and Fauci and Brooks are saying it's irresponsible to encourage people to fill churches on Easter Sunday, I don't think he'll do it. I don't think he will either. That's too much of a political risk as well. Well, yeah. I mean, it's more than, I mean, what you've heard from Birx and from Fauci is that during these task force meetings, they've gone much better than perhaps the press conferences or press briefings have gone with respect to him, you know, not arguing with the science or the medicine,

him being very supportive of it. So, I don't know. But, you know, I think your original point stands. I don't think any, I think the one concern would be that, Nobody really knows. Like I said to you, I think a week ago, my CDC neighbor explained to me that with MERS and SARS, that the health community still, to this day, doesn't know why either one died out, that there's not a medical explanation for it.

And there's so much unknown with viruses. What they do know is that it's highly contagious. It's a surface spreading virus, which is always a significant concern. and that, you know, even though the death rates are low, it doesn't mean that the next wave of it won't be higher if there is another wave. Yeah. We don't know. But we never know.

You know, we go through life thinking we make our plan. We're so certain about what we're doing, but we never really know what's around the corner. I'll tell you what, I think right now, for people, it's really getting to the point for families who have hunkered down all over the world and our country and our state and our areas in which we live in and around the area where it's tough. I'll tell you, my guess is it's toughest on those parents with younger kids. You know, younger kids who would have been in school, younger kids who, you know, It may have, you know, out of a routine now, my kids are older, your kids are much older.

It's so much easier for me than, you know, a mother and father at home or just a single parent at home with young kids. It gets challenging when you now have to essentially come up with stuff for them to do, you know, 18 hours or 16 hours a day rather than, you know, seven or eight, you know, if they're not in school in particular. I can't imagine how that would be. I really can't. I'm trying to think back to my kids and trying to keep them under control. And I just can't imagine that life. That would be much more stressful than what I'm going through now. No doubt.

Like, I've got older boys who are at home, and the biggest challenge really is, what are we going to do for dinner tonight, you know? And coming up with an answer to that one. Now, fortunately, you know, and I hope this continues to be the case, you know, I'm working. You know, I'm in a studio by myself, except when Aaron comes in for the podcast and we're more than six feet away and we're all washed up and we're all, you know, we're all hand sanitizer down here. But at least that takes up. I mean, thank God, you know, I'm able to work.

And I feel for those of you that aren't, I mean, it's awful. I understand that economically and otherwise. But, yeah, I mean, it's... If I had kids, I think my cable bill every month would be $600. Yeah, because of the movies you'd be buying. Yes. Yes. Yeah, exactly. Anyway, also, you know, before we get started on some of the news of the day,

I do, if I haven't said this already, because the numbers for the show have been really, really great, which I can't begin to tell you how much I appreciate that and Tommy appreciates it and Aaron appreciates it. Absolutely. Because some of you have said some very nice things about how it's great to be able to listen to the podcast that it's a nice sort of diversion, if you will.

Well, being able to do it, you know, is a great diversion for us too. So it's been great. So I appreciate all of that. All of us do and we obviously wish everybody the best and the best of health here. All right, there's been a lot of news here regarding Trent Williams. Every single day, it's like the gift that keeps on giving. And yesterday he went on with your radio station, went on with Grant and Danny on WJFK,

1067, The Fan. And there were several things that... Actually, I think it was his age as that went on. I'm sorry. God, I did that this morning. Trent Williams didn't go on. Vince Taylor. The agent went on. Thank you very much.

Went on. This follows, you know, his statement that he put out the other day through Adam Schaefter. It follows a long, you know, tweeted out thread from Diana Rusini about things that she had learned with respect to the Trent Williams Redskins situation. We went through a lot of that yesterday in the day before, or yesterday and on Tuesday. And yesterday, Vince Taylor went on radio, local radio. and there were many things that he said during the course of this interview. There was one particular part of what Vince Taylor said on JFK yesterday that I want to get to that gave me more, maybe a lot of clarity on the way I feel about this right now.

And I'll get to that in a moment. But some of the things he said included that Taylor said that when Trent was in the hospital, you know, after the surgery on his scalp, in Chicago. He said no one came to see him. And remember when we first heard about that, you know, a lot of people, that was part of Tommy, remember when everybody was pro-Trent in this situation. And by the way, it would be easy to believe, right? Because the Redskins are a horrible organization with horrible people. And, you know, that's terrible. How, you know, why didn't, you know, people from the organization, you know, visit him? Well, you know, John Kime, Ben Standing,

a few others reported well after the fact that actually the Redskins head athletic trainer, Larry Hess, who everybody, including Trent, had a problem with, was in Chicago for a full week during that particular surgery. So someone from the organization was there, that he had spent several days with Trent afterwards. It was also reported that Snyder, Bruce Allen, and others in the organization reached out multiple times and were never, you know, responded to during that course of time. It also was said by the agent that the meeting with Ron Rivera that's now been reported multiple times to have been very short with Trent Williams, 10 to 15 minutes in length, that Taylor said yesterday that Trent was off put by it because he essentially said,

look, man, you've got to come and improve yourself, you know? And it wasn't like, hey, how are you doing? How's your family? You know, we want you to be a part of our plans. And apparently Trent was also upset that Ron Rivera had met with other free agents before meeting with him, including a guy like Greg Olson, who had played with Rivera. You know, remember, you know, Trent's under contract. Some of these other guys that he may have had conversations with are actual free agents. But here's the part to me that gave me clarity, Tommy.

And it's this particular line. First of all, he talks about the contract and says the money that, been reported that Trent's asking for is nowhere near what the reports have been, that he's not looking for $20 million or more per year. But here's the line, all right? Quote, the contract has never been the holdup. It's never been about the contract. Trent has never made demands on a contract, closed quote. If that's true, Well, then what are we talking about here? Come in and play.

What are we talking about if it's never been about a contract? The guy that you wanted gone more than anybody else that you distrusted that you said was a major reason for the holdout, Bruce Allen, is gone. Larry Hess, the head athletic trainer, gone. The guy that you profess to love, Dan Snyder, which has been mentioned multiple times, is still here. And he went out and he hired a coaching staff and a head coach that is widely respected as a great players coach.

So what are we talking about here? Get in and play. You're under contract. Okay. We're still back to the same situation here. I mean, I wouldn't believe anything that came from either side at this point. I wouldn't necessarily believe, well, I do believe that trend, obviously, you know, what was going through a lot with the cancer situation.

But other than that, any of the reports, about Larry Hess being there for a week? I mean, has Larry Hess said that? No, Kime and Standig reported it. Right, well, where do you think they got it from? They probably got it from Larry Hess and somebody from the Redskins, I guess. But I actually think, I could be wrong about this, but I think Trent did actually at that October press conference admit that Larry Hess was there.

I think he did. Why would he do that when he would say the office? Well, because they're completely and they haven't been on the same page. Why would Trent, you know, allude to, you know, a discussion about a new contract? And the agents say yesterday, it's never been about the contract. Well, that's because that's ridiculous. It's ridiculous on both sides. My whole point is Ron, the Redskins still have not gotten their arms around this thing.

They still have no control over this thing. even though they have control over Trent. It's still an issue. Here we are, what, you know, eight months later, nine months later, and Ron Rivera could have taken care of it right from the start. He could have either gotten a handle as to what was this all about right from the beginning, and he could have met with Trent early on the biggest issue that really the Redskins had to deal with last year and say to him and either, you know, tell him, we want you, but we can't do that, you know,

we can't give you a raise or something like that, or at least have a handle on the situation so he could say to Trent then, look, you know, we're not going to, we're not going to pay you that much moving forward. We're going to do everything we can to trade you. Or if you want to go ahead and work out a trade, that's fine. He could have done that two months ago. you know i mean this is what's what's the best thing for the organization is to have put this behind them and they did nothing to do that and only exasperated it um i agree with you and i said as much

and have said as much with you that if it had been me i would have reached out to trent it would have been one of the first things i would have done okay it would have been but you know to be honest with you for him to be overly sensitive about not being reached out to first. I also have a problem with that. I would have done it that way, but you know, Ron Rivera has a mountain of a challenge here in changing a culture. Okay, so it had, you know, a lot of priorities when he first got here, you know, hiring a new coaching staff. And by the way, you know, addressing the players that don't have contracts next year before addressing potentially the players that do have contracts right now, which Trent will

Williams has. Again, I think I would have done that, but I also have a problem with Trent being overly sensitive to the fact that it wasn't done. Remember the Jerry Brewer story, Tommy, where Jerry Brewer referred to Trent Williams as being super upset about them drafting Jaron Christian in the third round? I think we're learning that Trent Williams is sort of highly sensitive to not being, you know, paid attention to in a certain way or dealt with in a certain way. And all I'm saying is if you're going to have your agent go out there and say this isn't about a contract, you know, the contract's never been the hold up, it's never been about the contract, Trent has never made demands on a contract, then what are we talking about if we got

rid of the people that Trent didn't want? Why is it, why does he demand a trade now then? Because Ron Rivera slighted him by not calling him early enough? That's ridiculous. Kevin, I mean, you know football players. You know athletes. There's so much. Tom Brady wanted to get out of New England because after three Super Bowls, they drafted Jimmy Garoppolo. I mean, this is what the greatest athletes do.

They're very sensitive. I mean, Jordan, it was what drove Jordan. I mean, Michael Jordan. He was very sensitive about everything. So the fact that Trent does not act like a normal person like you or I might act, it goes with the territory of who they are. And most of these guys are prima donnas. Some much more worse than others, some more manageable than others.

But, I mean, look, nobody looks good on this thing. And I think the pick side is just doing what Bruce Allen did. I think everyone who tell all the fans who take this personally are missing the point. The point is, what's the best thing for my team? What's best for my team? It's like the owner needs that. What's best for the organization? Every day he wakes up in the morning.

And, I mean, to be offended by Trent William at this point, it misses the point. You know, what do you care with Trent? Well, the Redskins aren't offended. Trent's offended by Rivera's handling of him so far. Right. According to his agent. Redskins fan, what do you care what Treg Williams thinks at this point? You just want him gone. So, you know, a couple of things. Number one, I don't believe the agent. Let's start with that.

So when I say that the agent's statement gave me clarity, it's like, if you're going to say that, then come in and play. Don't give me this bullshit about Rivera not treating you in a certain way. You've gotten what you wanted. You got Bruce Allen gone. You got Larry Hess gone. You know, it's not about money. so let's go play football and we'll assess at the end of the year. But of course it's about money, and of course it's about the contract. And I think what's a big problem for Trent here, Tommy, is that the owner, the agent in his discussions this week, both through Adam Schaefter and now through JFK, sounds desperate to change the narrative again, and he's not doing a good job of it.

A year ago, this was all pro-Trent. Now it's pro-team. in part because Alan's not there and in many ways the Redskins are going to be given at least the benefit of the doubt for a while. And by the way, this waffling back and forth about medical, money, you know, I think people are starting to see through it. So I know you believe it's like time to move on because you don't need the disruption. I think what we're hearing from his agent is they really need an end of this thing

because the longer it goes on, it's not good for his client. You know, they're losing leverage by the day, and they're losing the PR battle in this as well. You know, Trent Williams, I need to mention something real quickly because I got this wrong. And J.I. Hallsell, our good friend, former agent, former NFL executive. You know, I got with him yesterday, and he actually came on the radio show this morning. But basically, I said earlier in the week that the new CBA basically was incredibly more. punitive for holdout situations, that if you held out for more than five days, that your contract would essentially be delayed, all right? And Trent would come back with still one year remaining

on the contract if he were to hold out. It's not true. It is much more punitive on players holding out, and I'll get to that in a moment. There were very confusing summaries of this portion of the new CBA that actually confused some agents and teams as well. But with that said, I should have read the fine print. And the fine print says that Trent's accrued too many seasons, so he's not impacted by this. If he were to hold out and then come in by week 11, I think it is, like he did last year, then he would get credit for 2020 season.

So now, as a practical matter, Trent Williams can't hold out again. He can't sit out a second year and then expect to get some sort of big deal in 2021. You know, he's got to play football this year. you know, whether it's with the new team that he gets traded to or it's this team. Like, I still think the Redskins have a ton of leverage with the exception of the Redskins need some clarity on their left tackle position too. You know, it's like, are we going to go out and sign somebody else, Jason Peters,

or who, by the way, is represented by the same agent, or re-signed Donald Penn? You know, you can't go out and get Jason Peters as long as Trent Williams counts on your book, you know, on your cap. So the Redskins need some clarity to this as well. But I guess one of the things I wanted to point out is that, you know, the PR narrative, I think, has changed on this, Tommy. I mean... Why would Trent Williams at this point care about the PR narrative? That's not the same thing as the industry narrative.

I'm sure that inside NFL offices, you know, while they don't like a player who does something like, this, they roll their eyes and they say, well, it's the Redskins. What do you expect? I'm sure that still goes on, even with Ron Rivera in place. The same guy still owns the team, so I don't think this hurts Trent Williams at all with any front offices who would want Trent Williams to play for them. And that's the only audience this agent cares about now. They're just going to make, like, more difficult for the Redskins now. Something they should have done initially, like, when this first started, instead of trying to lay low and speak to surrogates, they're going to make life more difficult for the Redskins, which is going to decrease the Redskins leverage as we get

closer to whatever a season will be to the point where I think the Redskins don't have no choice but to trade them for whatever they get. I so disagree with that. First of all, I don't see it being disruptive to the Redskins right now. In fact, every time that agent speaks, I think it helps the Redskins. Secondly, with who? With who? With who? With who? With who? with its customer base and its fan base. And I think secondly... What does he care about that? I'm sorry?

Why would the agents care about the Redskins' customers and fans? Well, I'm saying that the team doesn't care about this being continued to be put out there because it's not at this point changing the way people feel about them. I think people are actually more pro-team now than they are pro-player in this confrontation. But the team can't function from a football standpoint. Why? Why? There's nothing going on right now anyway. You just explain. They don't have an answer at left tackle. Yeah, but they don't have to come up with the answer today.

I'm saying that the only aspect of this that is uncomfortable for the team is at some point they're going to have to make a decision on left tackle. And I agree with you that that does put them a little bit at a disadvantage, but I think the overwhelming disadvantage is sort of, you know, with Trent Williams. Trent Williams needs once a new contract and wants to play football now. year and doesn't want to play here. I also disagree with you with respect to whether or not this is hurting him in league circles. I think all of the reporting, Albert Breers reporting in particular, about him asking and wanting delusional money is turning teams off to Trent Williams. Now again,

his agent basically contradicts all that in terms of what they're asking for, and he says it's not even about contract. And it's never been about the contract. But all of the reporting, you know, Albert Breer most recently is that he's hearing it's 100 percent. The reason of deal that hasn't been done is 100 percent because of what Trent Williams wants in a new deal. There's a lot of, you know, clearly, both sides, it's like, it's hard to really decipher

what's going on here. The agent says it's not about money. The reporting is they're asking for too much money. The team is saying that go ahead and seek a trade, we're open to it, and then the agents saying that they're turning down the trades that are available, and they're essentially outrageous in terms of their demands, which John Kime has said is a second round value, which doesn't seem that outrageous to me.

But I don't know that the league is right now blaming the Redskins for this. I'm sure they did a year ago because it was Bruce. I don't know that the league is looking at this saying this is all on the Redskins? I think the only thing the league cares about is can Trent Williams play. I think that's the only thing Front Office executives will care about. I don't think they could care less about any of the posturing. And I think, in fact, if I'm an NFL front office executive, I'm thinking this guy is just doing what everybody else that's tried to get out of Redskins Park

is doing at this point. I think the Redskins did not lose the reputation they have the day Ron Rivera got hired. I don't know. I think Ron Rivera being here and Bruce Allen being gone at least for a moment until proven otherwise. Fair enough. And more likely than not, it will be proven otherwise, that they may be viewed differently by the rest of the league. I think Ron Rivera is a highly respected guy in this league. And, you know, when it comes to whether or not he can play, that's part of this issue too, right?

Trent Williams sat out the entire season last year. The last time he played was 2018, he missed three games. In 2017, he missed six games. And in 2016, he got suspended for four games. So it's been a while since Trent has played at a super high level consistently. And then he held out last year. You know, the bottom line is this agent hasn't done Trent Williams any favors with the amount of money he's lost. He should have reported last year and gone straight to injured reserve. That seems to me

to be out of all of the discussion about this, the biggest mistake, two big mistakes. Bruce not trading him when he should have, and Trent listening to his agent about not reporting. Trent should have reported, gone straight to injured reserve when there would have been a legitimate reason for him to be on injured reserve after multiple surgeries to his scalp in the off season and not lost any money. And I agree with you on both of those counts. And the minute he got here, started banging the drum about wanting to leave. The minute he got it, he should have been doing it from Redskins Park every day.

The problem he's been... Instead of being quiet about it and let the occasional word go out through one of his friends. The problem is if he had gone that route and been banging the drum, they would have answered the call, which they did, which is getting rid of Bruce Allen and getting rid of Larry Hess. And now where are you? Now they've done what you asked him to do. So now what's the issue? Well, we know what the issue is. The issue's money, even though the agent says it's not. Look, I think if he banged the drum from day one, it would have become so untenable that they would have dealt them. They just would have had this. And at this point, and here's the other thing,

You know, you keep saying the Redskins, you know, just, you know, go ahead and sit out, you know, we'll just play without you. I mean, that, they're not paying him, but they're carrying his salary on their cap hit. Yes, they are. And that's money that could be used to sign a free agent. No doubt. So that's hurting the team. Well, that's what I said. That is the one thing working against them right now is not only carrying that number, but the sort of uncertainty around of that.

very important position on their team. You know, so without, if they move on from Trent, if they get what they want, say a second rounder or the equivalent thereof, two-thirds or, you know, a fourth and a player or something like that, and they're able to move on from him, then they now can go solve that problem, which is, you know, signing Jason Peters to a two-year deal or resigning Donald Penn or whatever they would do, you know, to come up because I don't think this guy, Cornelius Lucas, is the answer as a starter. He might be. Maybe they think differently about Jaron Christian. I have no idea. I think that the idea that you have and that others have, you're not alone on this, that it's just time to move on and take whatever you can get,

is sort of this notion of Trent represents the past, not the future, let's move on. The problem I would have with that is that what you get back for Trent does represent the future. and a second rounder is a hell of a lot better than a fifth rounder. And so I would at least wait this out until the draft, because when you get to the draft and teams, and that's only another month, okay, that's only another month, because Goodell has pushed forward with the draft and is not moving the date on that. I would wait until the draft when teams may say, you know what, that left tackle that I was hoping to get in the draft I didn't get, now I will give up a second rounder. And it might be a 20-21 second rounder,

Tommy, but I would wait until the draft hit the very least if I were the Redskins. Okay, I get that. I understand that. And I don't know what the cap hit is for Trent Williams next year. I'm thinking it's around $10 million. Well, it's nothing next year. You mean in 2020? I mean, this coming year.

Oh, it's $12.5 million if he plays. I think it's $14.5 in total, something like that. Okay. So, I mean, basically, is that amount of money that you can spend for the next year, worth the difference between a second or a third round pick? Well, the Redskins right now have plenty of cap space. That's the thing. You never have enough.

You never have enough. You can have more. The Redskins have roughly 30 million. They're sixth now after the signings of like Cody Latimer and some of the others recently. So they've got the sixth most cap space. Obviously, if they had gotten the Amari Cooper deal done, which is, The big swing they took, they'd be near the bottom of cap space, but they have plenty of cap space. No, you're right.

It's not like they want to carry Trent's salary without him playing. I understand that. But I also don't think... So is that worth the difference between a second or third round pick? You'd say, okay, we're going to eat that $12 million because we're not going to accept the third round pick instead of a second. Again, I would... Today, I would personally, I'd call up the agent and I'd say, you just went on local radio yesterday and said it's not about the money. It's not about the contract.

That's awesome because we'd love to have Trent Williams play left tackle for us. So can we just agree that this thing is over and Trent's going to come in and play for us next year? Like, I mean, wouldn't that be your answer after listening to the agent yesterday? Like, so what is the holdup then? that Ron didn't call him at a certain time? Let's get Ron and Trent back together and let's work this thing out. We thought it was all about the money all along. This is great news.

We thought you guys wanted $25 million a year. And so did Ron, which is why Ron was so short with your guy. But if you're saying locally and publicly on local radio that it's not about the contract, hey, let's make this thing happen. I'd call their bluff on that. I'd do it in a public setting. I'd say, let's have this conversation on the Team 980 or on the Kevin Sheehan Show podcast. Again, I mean, the public relations battle is not the battle that's being fought here anymore.

I know, but I think the agent went on the air, and they're more aggressive now just because they want to, they want to create more dissension. Even if the dissension is against trend oil, it's still dissension. Yeah. It's just nonsensical sort of like again, I mean, you can't come on and essentially say it's never been about the contract. And at the same time, by the way, talk about the dollars that we've been asking for and have been reported aren't anywhere near. Like, which is it? Or is it not about a new contract or is it about a difference in, you know, what they claim they'll pay you and what you want? I mean, this guy is not handling it well for his client.

That's, I think, very obvious. And at the same time, the Redskins didn't handle it well last year. They should have traded him when the trading opportunities were probably most advantageous for them. You know, I think it's about the money. I think the agents flat out lying in the radio interview. I think that they want a new big deal and they prefer it with a new team because they're done with team. I bet you if the Redskins went back to him tomorrow and said, hey, we'll pay you, you know, we'll give you a three-year contract extension. You know, we're 20 million, 21,

22 million per year that money might solve all of these issues. But I'm sure he wants to move on. What's the difference between a second and a third for the 14 million or whatever on the cap number next year? ask me after the draft. Okay. I have no problem with them waiting to after the draft. I mean, that makes sense. And by the way, I mean, I'm thinking most of the information about Trent what he's asking for has come from Redskins Park. And my guess is they're just as likely lying as Trent Williams agent.

Well, that is your default. And you certainly haven't been wrong in the past. And I, you know, I'm not going to say. They both be lying. They both could be. Everybody could be lying. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I read from Barry's column earlier because Barry sort of had the same reaction that I did with respect to the agent saying it's not about the contract. And he's like, you know, well, then jump on board. And he said, Rivera's presence and Allen's absence put Washington in a different position than it's been in more than a decade. It's possible now when controversy arises that the franchise is actually in the right. The default mode for so long has been, how are the Redskins messing this up? And no doubt there will be cases of that to come because the owner remains the same chaos, remains the same, and chaos seems somehow baked into the DNA in Ashburn. But he said, Rivera's here to fundamentally

change the culture. We can debate given Snyder's presence whether that's possible, but he should at least be allowed to try with his best players and his best leaders on board. Williams, as much as anyone should understand that change was needed and desperately, if it has never been about the contract, why not jump on board? I'm with you. The problem is it's always been about the contract, and I think the agent was more likely than not being fully, I think not being honest at all on that radio. And again, as much as I think that, you know, Ron Rivera,

everybody needs to be behind what Ron Rivera does at this point, because I think he's earned the benefit of the doubt moving forward. With his strong reputation around the league, I still think that he mishandled. He could have handled this better from the start to maybe avoid lots of this. All right. Okay.

What did I want to get to next? What did you make of the league announcement from Roger Goodell? It was a memo to all the teams, excuse me, that Goodell, that somehow Adam Schaefter obtained. and basically the draft is going to stand put April 23 through 25th. It's going to be obviously a much different draft. It's not going to be held in Las Vegas. Teams are not going to be able to gather in, you know, war rooms as of now.

And Goodell served a warning to all 32 teams. He wrote in the memo, quote, public discussion of issues related to the draft serves no useful purpose. and his grounds for disciplinary action closed quote. There's been already several general managers around the league that have asked that the draft be pushed back. Mickey Loomis, the GM in New Orleans on Peter King's podcast, said, I'd be personally in favor of delaying the draft

so that we can get some of the work done that are scouts and our personnel people ordinarily do. And then just the logistics of trying to conduct the draft with not having access to your draft rooms and your offices creates a lot of logistical problems, closed quote. Goodell also in this memo said, quote, everyone recognizes that the public health conditions are highly uncertain and that there is no assurance that we can select a different date

and be confident that conditions will be significantly more favorable than they are today. I also believe Goodell writes that the draft can serve as a very positive purpose for our clubs, our fans, and the country at large, and many of you have agreed, closed quote. A lot there. Obviously, I think the headline is the draft is standing put in terms of the dates, and then, you know, Goodell warning teams that public discussion of issues related to this could be grounds for disciplinary action. What do you make of it? Well, first of all, I'm sure his late father, the senator, would be very proud of his son putting a gag order on people saying they'll be punished if they talk about the lease business.

It's a private business. I know. I know that, but it's never a good look, and it's never a good practice to do that. And if you're a good boss, you don't usually have to do that. The second thing is, I think, you know, I don't particularly care. If I'm Goodell, I don't particularly care about. and how it's difficult their work or job is going to be. I don't care.

I don't care. You know, your life is tough. Your job is tough. Everybody's got a difficult situation to go through. Make it work. I think he's right that, you know, the league was right about free agency. They didn't push that back. Yep.

And I think it worked out well for the league. I think it worked out well for sports fans who had at least some kind of diversion to talk about. And I think if they properly, and I can't imagine them doing otherwise, And if I were to the NFL, before the draft, the first thing I would put on is my league doctors explaining how the league is conducting this draft to be health conscious, to be aware of the restrictions at hand. I would literally go on TV and explain our, gee, we're only allowing one, I mean, people are going to be sitting so much apart.

They're going to be in different locations. We're not bringing draftees. And I would explain the steps that the league is taken to make this as safe as possible before the draft even began. Yeah, basically, the draft that we're going to conduct is similar to the draft that we conducted back in 1958. This is what we're going to do. He did say, or this story outlined, that general managers are concerned basically with several things. Number one, that, you know, the team facilities are closed. There's not going to be any time or ability for player physicals or gathering psychological testing

or getting further verified information about the players and that there's not going to be the typical war room. You know, but, I mean, they can create a virtual war room, can't they? With technology? I mean, I agree with you. I don't care about their problems, and they all have the same problem. If you're sharing in the same burden, then nobody has an advantage or a disadvantage. Unless, Thomas, let me just point this out, unless in certain states, you know, there are, you know, there's more ability to sort of convene in groups of 10 or less, you know. I don't think that'll happen by April 23rd.

Well, we've already said we don't know what's going to happen. The point is what I don't think you'll have been by April 13th. a team in a certain state, let's just say the Packers in Wisconsin, have the ability to do more per their state, you know, lack of shutdown or rules or whatever, they have the ability to do more than, say, you know, the Giants and the Jets. Well, then if that happens, then I don't think it's going to happen, then the NFL has to make sure everyone plays by the same rules. They can't give the Packers an advantage in how they prepare for the draft

just because they have less restrictions. Right. You've got to have a uniformity about how the draft is conducted for every team. Yep, I agree with that. I agree with that. That makes total sense.

But again, I'm okay with it moving forward. With those steps, I'm okay with, I just don't like Goodell's, you know, strong arm about shutting people up, but I'm okay with it moving forward. And I'll watch it. Oh, my God. More people are going to watch it than ever before.

What do you mean watch it that we'd have nothing to talk about in the next month if it were delayed? So, yeah. So I'm okay with it, given certain conditions. All right, I wanted to get to this, you know, radio station team 980, DC Ultimate Sports Star bracket that Aaron and I have been talking to. And we're down to the Sweet 16 now, Tommy. So I think now we get into some heavyweight matchups here. And you can weigh in a little bit. But for those that haven't voted, you know, the polls are open for the Sweet 16 voting at Team 980 on Twitter and the Team 980.com as well.

It's actually been a great idea. It's been a lot of fun and it's been a tremendous reaction to it. We're into the Sweet 16. All four of the number one seeds have survived to the Sweet 16. Joe Gibbs easily, he trounced Ryan Zimmerman in around a 32. Walter Johnson crushed Braden Holteby in a round of 32 to get to the Sweet 16. Darrell Green beat Joe Thaisman pretty handily in a round of 32 matchup. And then Alex Ovechkin blew out Morgan Wooten in a round of 32.

He's into the Sweet 16. And actually all of the two seeds advanced as well. Sugar Ray Leonard beat Russ Grimm. Rigo beat Gary Clark, Tommy, after beating Clinton Portis. Scherzer took out Joe Jacoby, and Sammy Baugh knocked out Dexter Manly. Some people thought that Dexter would have a chance there. So the Sweet 16 matchups are Gibbs and Patrick Ewing in a one-four matchup, Art Monk against Sugar Ray Leonard, Walter Johnson against Gary Williams, Sean Taylor did beat Alan Iverson, and he's matched up against Rigo, which will be a very

interesting Sweet 16 matchup. Nicholas Baxter took out Elvin Hayes. He's matched up against Max Scherzer. Daryl Green against John Thompson. Thompson took out Bethard. Sunny beat Brian Mitchell. He's matched up against Sammy Baugh, the two greatest quarterbacks in Redskins franchise history. And how about Strasbourg beating Wes Unseld? So it's Alex Ovechkin against Strasbourg in a Sweet 16 matchup. What's interesting about this is that younger people have made their presence felt with like Sean Taylor, Steven Strasbourg, Alex Ovechkin, Nicholas Baxter, and a lot of the older people with Walter Johnson and Sammy Baugh and Sonny Jurgensen have sort of made their presence felt.

But Gibbs against Ewing, I don't think, is going to be close, Tommy. I think Gibbs will advance there. Monk and Sugar Ray Leonard. I'm surprised Sugar Ray actually, I mean, I'm glad he got through all of this, but I don't know. Art Monk just took out Anthony Rendon. That's a good Sweet 16 matchup. Yes, it is.

Yes, it is. I like these matchups moving forward. And I agree with almost everyone that moved on in the way you described it. I'm so happy to see that Walter Johnson and Sammy Ball still have a presence. I knew you would be. Yes, absolutely. Because they're only two of the greatest players in the history of their leagues, respectively. How do you feel, though, about like Stephen Strasbourg taking out West Unseld and Elvin Hayes being ousted by Nicholas Baxter? Who's a greater D.C. sports figure? Elvin Hayes or Nicholas Baxter. They both are champions.

I would say Baxter Really? Elvin Hayes didn't play his whole career with the franchise The West was beaten by who? Strathburg Yeah

That's a tough one That is a tough one I'm going to say I agree with that one too Strut Maybe I'm dealing with the immediacy of The moment there Even though obviously

I saw and loved All West Unself's contributions. But I think the baseball team means more, especially since it returned baseball to D.C. after there was so much absence. I think the presence, I think accomplishing something on the national is bigger than accomplishing something on the Bullets. Yeah, I don't have a problem with Strasbourg over West.

I think Elvin Hayes, his career is a... a much more prolific career than Baxterms, and he won a title two. And by the way, participated in three NBA finals as a Washington bullet. So I did vote for Elvin Hayes against Baxter, but I'm not necessarily surprised about Baxter advancing. Elvin Hayes is a long time ago, and he's not a long time ago Redskin. The long time ago Redskins advanced, and Walter Johnson did as well. But the long time ago bullet slash wizards did not advance in this bracket. You know, Aaron and I both, before it started, predicted Gibbs and Ovechkin easily into the championship.

And I still feel that way. And based on the vote totals, they've both annihilated their opponents so far. Ovechkin beat Ali Krieger and then took out Morgan Wooten. Gibbs took out Oli Colzig and then Ryan Zimmerman. I still think that they are the prohibitive favorites to make the final. And neither result would shock me, Ovechkin winning or Gibbs winning. I predicted Gibbs would win. Gibbs is going up against Patrick Ewing, who beat bias. I think Gibbs will easily get through that.

Monk against Sugar Ray Leonard is interesting. We're going to find out how much power Sugar Ray has and how much of an understanding sports fans have in the area. because Sugar Ray Leonard is one of the all-time great fighters and Art Munks a Hall of Fame and a champion. Walter Johnson against Gary Williams, I mean, Walter Johnson's arguably the best overall player on this list. He probably is.

Yes. You know? He probably is. I think he wins over Gary Williams. And then really the one that I think Aaron and I are most interested in because I think Aaron has felt Sean Taylor's got a chance to make a deep run into this. Rigo's matched up with Sean Taylor in a Sweet 16 matchup. Oh, I think Rigo crushes him.

I do too. Let me see where the voting is because we're now into the voting right now. Actually, it's early in the voting right now. Where's Rigo? I don't see the Rigo matchup. Do you? Aaron? Yeah, I got it.

Hold on. It's, uh, let me quick, please. Sean Taylor's up 5446. I told you, Sean Taylor's going to be an unstoppable force in this tournament. Yeah, that's a bad sweet 16 matchup for Rigo. The voting's still early. And by the way, that's a tight voting right now. Very tight because the other matchups right now are sort of one-sided.

Daryl Green's got a big lead on Thompson. Jurgensen's got a big lead on Sammy Baugh. Gibbs has a massive. lead on Patrick Ewing. Scherzer's got a big lead on Backstrom. I don't see the rest of this. Where are you seeing the rest of this? What's Ovechkin's lead?

Where's the Ray Leonard? Where's the Ray Leonard-Leaderick, Aaron? I think Ray wins that one. I bet you Art Monk does. Do you see it, Aaron? Yeah, it's Art Monk's dominating right now. Yeah, that doesn't surprise me. What about Ovechkin-Strasbourg?

I think Ovechkin wins that one. I do, too. but I bet that one's a bit closer than we think. No, no. Ovi, we're a runaway right now. Really? 87%. Yeah, but Gibbs has the biggest lead right now over Patrick Ewing. I mean, Patrick, Patrick Ewing is the, it's amazing how many incredible athletes there are.

What about Walter Johnson, Gary Williams? Quickly, give me that. I didn't see that one. I like Johnson. Gary Williams over Walter Johnson right now. Coach Gary! Let's go. All right.

Who do you think Gary would vote for? The thing is, is that I don't think Gary's got a prayer against either Sean Taylor or Rigo in the elite eight. I'll tell you what, Aaron, you're going to probably be right. I mean, and then it would be Sean Taylor against Joe Gibbs in a final four matchup. That'd be unbelievable. That would be fascinating to see. I think Gibbs would win that one, but. I think the finale, the final contest, is gifts against Max Scherzer.

Really? So you think Scher takes out Ovechkin in the final four? Yes. Yes, I do. Nah, I don't see that one. You might be right. I mean, Scher has won by big. Ovechkin, he's won by a lot. So is Scher, but Scherzer had tougher competition. He had to take out Brenda Freeze and then Jake in the second round. You know, Ovechkin went up against Morgan Wooten. Look, Morgan Wooten is a legend, but there are more people interested in the Redskins and voting the Redskins through than Morgan Wooten, I think, in this thing. Anyway, at Team 980 on Twitter to vote on this and follow

it. Same with, you can do the same at the team 980.com. All right. I wanted to take a moment here. First of all, there are two, you know, we usually don't do a lot of obits on this show. Sometimes we do, but only if they impact us for the most part or the audience. Curly Neal passed away yesterday at the age of 77. You know, a Globetrotter, a phenomenal ball handler, one of the greatest of all time. I just remember, you know, my father taking me to see the Globetrotters virtually every year. And if it wasn't my father, it was part of a birthday party for somebody, you know, the Globetrotters. But I wanted to mention the passing of somebody else, Tommy, that many listeners out there will know this name, and many of you won't.

But I ask you to listen anyway because I think he was an important figure for many reasons. Louie Luce, Louis Luce passed away Sunday at the age of 81. For those of you that know the name, you know that he is considered by many to be the greatest, all-around athlete in the history of Washington, D.C. He was a football, basketball, and baseball all met at Wilson in the 1950s, in the mid-1950s. And I grew up, Tommy, hearing Louis Luce's name. My father knew him, was friends with him, my uncle, my aunt, you know, my father went to Carol, grew up in the same area that Louis Luce grew up in, same exact age.

my uncle went to Gonzaga. You know, I grew up hearing, and you know, you and I have talked about this before, I grew up listening to all of the stories about the great high school athletes and sports teams in this area. My father went to Carol. He was a part of Carroll basketball before the teams that John Thompson was a part of, you know, Monk Malloy, Hoover, George Leftwich, you know, those of you that know what I'm talking about, Carroll's basketball team of 58, 59, and 60 is considered to be the greatest high school basketball team of all time. They had a winning streak of 55 games, and they produced some of the greatest players.

And of course, in John Thompson, you know, one of the great players and coaches of all time. Monk Malloy is the president of Notre Dame. George Lefterwich is considered to be one of the two or three greatest players to ever play. He went to Villanova, got in a car accident. Many people say that he would have been a great NBA player. But that's not the story. I got sidetracked here. Louis Luce played at Wilson.

And he's one of the only people to ever have been a three-time first team All-Met in basketball. There aren't a lot of them. Three-time All-Metrepolyton in basketball. He was an All-Met in football and All-Met in Baseball. He played for the Redskins for a year, played in the Pittsburgh Pirates, organization for a few years. My father said that while Elgin Baylor is considered to be the greatest basketball player ever from the D.C. area, Louis Luce, isn't far behind, but Louis Luce, he thinks, is the greatest baseball player to ever come out of this area. He passed away Sunday at the age of

81 years old. And John McNamara, who wrote this book, The Capital of basketball, you know John, who passed away in that horrible shooting, you know, in Annapolis. the Capitol Gazette newspaper in Annapolis. John, man, I would run into John at Maryland basketball games, Tommy, all the time. We would sit there and talk Maryland basketball and D.C. High School basketball. He was putting together a book, and he and I would talk about D.C. high school sports. Oh, I have it. I've already read it. It's a great book, the Capitol of Basketball. Gary Williams wrote the forward to it.

I mean, look, we've all got a lot of free time. I would urge you to go out and get that book, the Capitol of Basketball. If you're interested in D.C. high school basketball, he takes you through every decade of it. But he wrote in the book about Louis Luce, in particular the relationship that he had with Dunbar's Willie Jones in the mid-1950s. And this is really the significance. Louis Luce, you know, again, those of you that know the stories about him know that he's one of the greatest, if not the greatest, all-around athlete to ever come out of this area. He was white. Willie Jones from Dunbar was black. And McNamara wrote basically two pages on their relationship, and I'm going to read some of it for those of you that haven't read the book.

And Tommy, you haven't gotten the book yet, have you? No, I have not. But you knew John well. I didn't know him well. I knew him. I couldn't say I knew him well. But, I mean, we talked in press boxes and stuff like that, yes. So anyway, here's the part that I was going to read to you. He writes, basketball, you know, in talking about this decade of the 1950s in D.C., basketball was undeniably a vehicle for bridging the gulf between blacks and whites. White kids who played pickup ball with black kids at Turkey Thicket or somewhere else were less likely to look upon blacks with suspicion and vice versa.

That was certainly the case with two of the city's biggest stars in the mid-1950s. Wilson's Louis Luce and Dunbar's Willie Jones. Both were picked by the Post and the evening star for their all-met teams in 1956, and the two had become thick as thieves by then. Even though Luce was white and Jones was black, they shared a great deal. Both were talented, outgoing, and as their friends would tell you a little crazy. And my father last night when I told him that he had passed away, my father shared a bunch of stories about how he was definitely a risk taker and a little bit nuts as a teenager. But anyway, McNamara continues. Every sentence spoken by them or about them seemed to cry out for an exclamation point. Luce was a multi-sport star

earning all met honors in football as well as basketball and baseball. He was as dangerous of running back in Kickreturner, capable of taking the ball the distance at any time. On the basketball court, he played with much of the same way, barreling down the lane to score without the thought of his own well-being or for anyone who stood in his way. He said for this book, quote, I dropped my shoulder and just drive to the basket. They couldn't stop me. Back in those days, they didn't call charges. Closed quote. By the way, Tommy, you know what that reminded me of? Remember when we did the Morgan Wooten lunch with a legend? Yes. Remember he told us that offensive fouls, charging fouls, they weren't called. And that, you know, he's sort of in some

way took credit for taking the charge and getting referees to start calling it. Remember that? Oh, yeah. But anyway, Luce in the book says back in those days they didn't call charges. He writes, Luce burst upon the D.C. basketball scene. He scored 32 points as a sophomore in the inner high championship game leading Wilson to the title. He said in pickup games, Luce would drive the ball to the basket leading an incredulous Elgin Baylor to cry out once. Man, what's wrong with you, Luce? You must be crazy. Jones was no less colorful. He was six feet tall, one of the best shooters.

Says about himself, Willie Jones says, I was the best shooter you've ever seen. He scored 45 points in a high school game, an average 29 points a game his senior year. given their personalities, McNamara writes, it wasn't surprising that they became fast friends. The vast difference in their backgrounds might have raised eyebrows, but they paid no mind to such things. Luce lived in well-to-do Chevy Chase, the son of a teamster's lawyer. Jones grew up on Lamont Street, Northwest, not far from Howard University.

His father worked as a railroad dining car waiter, but the two young men were more alike than different. different. Luce said, because he's black, he's not as good as you. I was never prejudiced against anybody. Jones said about their bond. It was very uncommon back then. It shows you the strength of athletics and respect. We were good athletes. We were cocky to a point strong in our convictions, so you couldn't say things that would intimidate us. In fact, Luce and Jones went out of their way to demonstrate their friendship, convention be damned. Neither one-minded stirring the pot a little bit. If people saw the two of them hanging out together off the court and didn't like it,

well, that was tough luck. When Jones needed a car to take his date to the prom, he asked to borrow Luce's car. Lou was only happy to oblige. Afraid Luce might be reluctant, Jones offered to bring the car back the next day just to put Lou's mind at ease. And Luce said, don't worry about it. I'll come by and get it. He didn't go by and get it for another week.

years later loose downplayed that incident of him loaning the car reluctant to make too much of the gesture but in 1956 not many white kids from Chevy Chase were loaning their kids, loaning their cars to black kids from Lamont Street. Jones said, I don't think many people today run across that kind of friendship. He never displayed any of that prejudice with me. He was genuinely and truly my friend. So that was from John McNamara's book. My father and my uncle for years told me stories about him, Tommy.

My father said, and he was telling me last night, he said, Louie was the first guy that would bring black players from the playgrounds that he would be looking for good games. Like he would go down to Turkey Thicket or Berry Farms or wherever to play in games to find the best games. And then he would bring those players. and he essentially, my father said, was in part responsible, not solely, but was a big part in sort of integrating some of the white basketball playgrounds, you know, sort of uptown, if you will, and that he was, you know,

fearless when it came to that sort of stuff. But anyway, a lot of you, there was a huge email going around with a lot of people my age who also grew up, you know, hearing the stories of this particular athlete. He passed away at the age of 81, so we wish his family the best and say rest in peace. But some of those stories about that time and that era are sort of interesting, don't you think? Oh, absolutely. Particularly for me, who isn't from this area, and I didn't move here until 1983. So every time I hear a story about these guys, you know, locally we all had our guys wherever we grew up,

who were like that. And I got to tell you, Kevin, be honest with you. I never heard of this guy until today. Yeah, I know. And a lot of people hadn't because when you think about the greatest basketball players, and that's the sport in this area, right, beyond any other in high school sports, you hear Elgin Baylor, Dave Bing, Adrian Dantley, Danny Ferry, and the list goes on and on. But people who are of a certain age will tell you, and John Thompson has mentioned his name,

Louis Luce's name to me many times when we used to work at the station, and he would say, Louis Luce is up there too, man. But everybody would say about him that were around then, that in terms of the best all-around athlete, that there were very few three-sport first-team All-Mets. You know, that's a rare thing, and he was a three-time first-team All-Met basketball player, which there's a short list of those players. in the history of the city. Well, he should be known better than for his accomplishments.

He should be more celebrated then for doing that. Yeah, yeah, for sure. All right, that's basically it for the day. Bruce Ariens, by the way, says no Antonio Brown to Tampa Bay. Remember, Brady was the big one, was the guy that wanted Antonio Brown badly, but Bruce Ariens put that to an end. I can't imagine that Antonio Brown ever plays NFL football again.

I would agree at that point. That may be the best thing for him, to be honest. It might be. You know, there's some guys that can't get right with their issues while they're still being adored as a superstar athlete. Like the two conflict with each other a lot of times. The one thing about Tampa, I thought that was interesting. I don't want to talk about this for long.

But I was taken aback at how glowing the praise was for James Winston as a teammate and as a person coming out of Tampa. I know. It was something I wasn't aware of. You know, I was only aware of the usual public narrative that have been negative for the most part about James Winston beforehand. But people in the Tampa community, not just teammates, raved about what a great character in person he is. And I'm a little surprised.

You know, he should get credit for that. And I think, you know, ultimately a team that winds up with him may wind up with ultimately a guy who comes into his own at the right time. Aaron and I talked about it on the podcast. I happened to have been the day that Brady was signed. I was listening to Rick Stroud, who covers the Buccaneers in Tampa. And he was on with Mad Dog on Mad Dog Radio. And I came in the next day, and Aaron and I were talking about it on the podcast. And I said he was raving about what a – how –

respected and beloved he was by his teammates and the coaching staff and the community. And we're talking about the new coaching staff, that Bruce Ariens and the coaching staff and Byron leftwich, they loved James Winston. Look, you're right. The narrative about him, especially after that incident in Publix, was never that. It was the opposite of that. However, if you go back to when James Winston first started playing at Florida State, what did we hear about him? Unbelievable leadership ability.

an incredible dynamic, charismatic guy that everybody gravitates towards. When he was first leading Florida State, you know, into, you know, the national championship situation. But I agree, Tommy. I sat there and I listened to that interview and I'm like, wow, that was an eye-opener for me. The guy kept going on and on about, you know, James is so respected. Players love him. They're going to be devastated that he's gone. Yeah.

And you're right. The talent is unmistakable. Okay, the problem is he throws too many interceptions. Apparently that's the only problem with him. But a guy like that, if he's all they say he is, he's going to figure it out at some point. Yeah. He will. And he's going to be really good.

I think you're right. For whatever reason, I've always been a fan of watching him play football. To me, he can make, physically, you know, talent-wise, he's way up there, you know, and he's always been the guy that absolutely moves on from his last throw. You know, he's got that short memory, the cornerback memory, the quarterback that throws interceptions, he doesn't care, he's going to still throw after throwing three picks, he's still going to throw it into a tight window to try to make a play. And maybe he's got to grow out of some of that, you know, and maybe he will. You know what? It'd be a great story for him to end up catching on somewhere, coming into his own in terms of a football player, and, you know, continuing the more recent narrative of him being, you know, a tremendous leader and well-liked and well-respected and all of that. I mean, he was the number one pick in the draft. And that year, the number one and number two guys right now, the number one guy doesn't have a job, and the number two guy, I don't know, is he going to be a starter or backup in Oakland or Vegas? I think he's a backup. I think he's a backup for now.

Yeah, probably. All right, everybody stay healthy. Enjoy the weekend as much as you can. We'll be back on Monday.