The Kevin Sheehan Show - What's Possible...This Year?

Episode Date: October 1, 2024

Kevin and Thom today with a menu of excellence which includes answering the question....what's possible for the Washington Commanders this year? Kevin had some "upon further review" thoughts on the win in Arizona. The boys also talked some baseball, the greatest defensive college players ever, and Pete Rose.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it, but you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Here's Kevin. Tommy Sear, I am here. It is Tuesday, October 1st. We are already in the 10th month of the year, and the Washington football franchise known currently as the commanders are 3-1.

They are in sole possession of first place in the NFC East, and their quarterback is the talk of the sport right now. Good morning, Tommy. How are you? We are recording a little bit early today because Tommy, he's a busy guy. He's always got stuff planned. Can't wait for me to do the radio show. He's got to get it out early.

You know, you've got people to see. I'm going to Baltimore today to see the wild card game. That's right. That's right. I knew that. I knew that. I'm glad. Yeah.

And your boy is throwing out the first pitch. Who's that? Scott Van Pelt. I did not know that. Are you kidding me? I swear, and I talked to him last night. He didn't say anything. Oh, my God.

You need to take him the test. Oh, my God. He's thrown out the first pitch. I swear to God, I did not know that. I'm writing this down right now, so I will call him to see. Because, you know, Scott was a good pitcher in high school. It was a very good pitcher in high school. So he'll be fine.

Well, then I would expect him to throw from the mound and not in front of the mound then. Yeah. Now, I talked to him right before he went on for countdown last night before the Monday night games. He didn't say anything to me about that. That's awesome. I can't wait to see this.

So, by the way, real quickly, the Mets Braves game, the first game yesterday, was unreal. Oh, I watched that. Yeah, so did I. I watched the last three innings, which is all you needed to watch. So I knew the circumstances. For those that weren't following it, the Mets and Braves played a double header yesterday.

This was not a play-in game, although it turned out to be. It was still the regular season. They had had games rained out, and they played a double-heder in Atlanta yesterday. And the situation going in was if each team only needed to win one of the two games to clinch a wild card berth. If either team got swept, they were out, and Arizona was in. and the first game, I turned it on. It was three to nothing Atlanta. I was about to turn it off, and all of the sudden, the Mets explode for six runs in the eighth inning.

And then in the bottom of the eighth, Atlanta comes back with four runs to take the lead seven to six. And then Lindor, homers in the ninth, with two strikes and an out with a runner on. Marte got on on a base hit. and they took the lead eight to seven, and then Diaz, who they brought in in the eighth to try to get five outs, and he gave up four runs, or I guess two of them were actually attributed to him, they kept him in there in the ninth. I couldn't believe it, and he retired this. Actually, I think he gave up a base hit in the ninth, one base runner. An incredible game. Now, it was great. It was great. So intense. And you know what? I had no problem keeping Diaz in. Really?

I thought that was the right move to make yet. But he got lit up in the A. He was their best chance at that point to still close the gate, to still get a win to keep the brave from scoring at that point. You know, I mean, this is your guy. What good is he going to do you in the playoffs if you pull him, if his last outing is that eighth inning debacle? No, I think I was all for that move.

The problem is, if you don't pull them, you might not be in the postseason. Right. I mean. That's true. Well, you had a chance to win. See, that's the thing. You still had a chance to win game two. Yes.

Which would have gotten you in the playoff. And let me just real quickly, though, with respect to Diaz, when he gave up the single in the ninth, they were going to pull him, and he talked him out of it somehow, and then he got the last two out. So good for him. But I think. that while the drama of this first game was riveting, it really was over the final inning and a half. I mean, you had 12 runs scored in an inning and a half. I would assume,

I mean, I know Atlanta won the second game to clinch a wild card spot as well. I'm going to assume that Lindor and a lot of the starters didn't even play for the Mets, or did they? I don't know. I didn't watch the second. Because Lindor was hurt. Lendor's been hurt. I mean, the prudent thing to do would be to rest everybody in that game, too. I mean, I know that's not, it takes away from the competitiveness if you're at Diamondbacks sitting in whole watching. But that's the way it is. That's the hand you're dealt.

I mean, I am assuming that whomever the Mets were going to pitch in game two if they needed to win it, that they clearly didn't pitch that guy and saved him for this. next best of three, right? Yeah, because they got to play today. Yeah, they're playing today. In fact, in fact, not only are they playing today, well, no,

it's the Braves who won the second game. They had to go to San Diego last night. They had to fly to San Diego. They're playing the Padres in the final game of the quadruple header today. Yeah, baseball playoffs, October 1st. Here we go. Best of threes with the top seeds

waiting. And look, these best of threes and then these next rounds, it's a short sample, short snapshot of what these teams are in these short series. Anything can happen. We saw Arizona get to the World Series last year. But Philly and the Dodgers awaiting in the National League and the Yankees and the Guardians that would be Cleveland awaiting in the American League. This should be good, though.

So you're going today. And they're playing the Royals who, along with the Tigers, you know, eeked out those other two wildcarts. spots in the American League. Right? They did. Yeah. And they've got maybe the MVP at a league and Bobby Witt Jr. Yeah, Witt Jr.

Yep. All right. Speaking of Witt Jr., Joe Witt Jr.'s defense was a little bit better. It wasn't great, though. I'm still concerned about this team defensively. I don't think anything on Sunday really can get me off that against that team. But let's get your thoughts. we have not heard

Tommy's thoughts. He wrote a column about Jaden Daniels. He is smitten with Jaden Daniels, as we all are. But what did you think? Well, you know, I, the defense which we were talking about historically bad

before the game, I think you have to feel that it's flawed now. Maybe significantly flawed, but flawed. I mean, you have to give them credit for pulling to for pulling together for that performance. You know what?

They had four sacks on Kyle or Murray. You know, Murray just didn't look like the old Kyle or Murray. I mean, I thought we'd see a lot more running, a lot more movement other than from running away from defenders. But we didn't see much of that at all. I was kind of surprised at the way Arizona approached the game. Yeah, me too. You know, so I just thought Kyle Murray would be a bigger factor, and he wasn't. I don't know why that was.

I don't know if that was the offensive play calling or the defensive, you know, shutting him down. But I'm going to give Joe Witt and his group and Dan Quinn credit. And I'm going to give the whole coaching staff credit because I think a lot of people, rightfully so, feel like, okay, he's coaching. just know what they're doing. They seem to, and this is a big departure for what we've seen in the past, especially the last few years, which I think if you're a commander's fan, you've got to be, I mean, there's a lot to be angry about over the years. But really, ever since Kirk Cousins left, they have wasted time with this organization. The whole time,

what, seven years now? They've just wasted that time. It's just a waste. Gone forever. They never seriously had a chance to do anything in any of those years. And it was always a cluster, whatever. And, you know, always with coaching that didn't see them to know what they were doing, and particularly the last group. And that would make me angry a little bit because now we're seeing,

we're seeing what smart people can do on a coaching staff. And, I mean, you say to yourself, you know, these aren't the only smart guys in a league. How, why couldn't they get their own smart guy? Well, Tommy, I mean, the answer for all of the years before this year is that if they had somebody in the organization with brains, the owner and whomever else was by his side just got in the middle of it and messed it all up. So, I mean, we've been talking about, yeah. To see what's happening now is, I guess, you know, reaffirmation of what we knew, and which I think would bring up a whole new wave of anger if it was me.

It's not a new wave of anger for me, because you're asking essentially a fan if it's a new wave of anger. It isn't. I think it, remember, anger subsided. And apathy took over. And that's the problem is that we're now going from apathetic to interested again. And hopefully from interested again to legitimately excited and passionate again. But the passion was gone. And so, and I'm not saying for everybody, but for a lot of us, it was gone.

It got sucked out of us over 25 years, but especially the last seven, eight, nine years. You know, once the RG3 Shanahan Coaching Group, when that thing fell apart and we started to learn some of the reasons why that was it. I mean, I say that, and we described all of these various rock bottoms, you know, along the way. You know, the Zorn thing was a massive rock bottom. The Shanahan thing was another massive rock bottom. The mishandling of the contract saga with, you know who.

you know, the franchise tags and then the throwing them under the bus and then they're not trading him. I mean, just repulsive. But to me, what is really drawing me to this isn't what you're describing, even though that should be the foundation for this, a general manager, a head coach, like a normal traditional, you know, functioning NFL organization. And by the way, a very experienced head coach with great leadership skills, a general manager who was super sought after to be a lot of teams general managers. And, you know, I'm not saying the books have been written on either one of them, but I'll tell you one thing. The one decision that they had to get right more than any other through four games looks to be historically right. But there's a long way to go on that.

But for me, for me and I think for a lot of people who have now, oh, wait a minute, they're good, it's because of the quarterback. You know, Quinn and Peters will take the ride along with Jaden Daniels if there is a ride that we're at the beginning of. But this is about number five and his brilliance in the first four games and what it means to not just a team but an organization. The confidence, you know, I used your line yesterday, and I think it's the Ernie O'Corsi line. I think that's who you always quote about, you know, when we got onto the bus with Unitas, you know, we knew we could win. And Washington now has that for the first time in a long, long time in a league where it's even more important to have that guy. And that guy, from all accounts, isn't just really good on the field. he is a gem off of it.

Here's what Jeremy McNichol said. What about that guy? You know, Austin, who? What? What about Jeremy McNichol? Oh, I know. I know. Yeah, I've got something on him here.

Yeah. Coming up. Well, he's had a quote after the game about Jane Daniels. He leads us on the field and off the field, McDaniels said. So we're going to rally behind him. Yeah. Like I pointed out my column today, the coaching staff gets a lot of credit for pulling things together after their games so far this year. But it's Jayden Daniels who's lifting all boats.

It is Jaden Daniels who's lifting all boats. And there have been other really good performances. But when you have a quarterback playing at this level, you're right. It is that rising tide lifting everything. And it's fun to see, man. It is fun to see because there is so, you know, I don't even like thinking, you know, I've talked about this the last several shows. I don't want to hear or have a conversation about what he's going to be.

Imagine what he's going to be in this team's going to be in 25 and 26 and 2027. No, this team right now has a chance to be a pretty good team this year. The defense is still a limiting factor, yes. but this team can win more games than it loses and make the postseason. Oh, yeah. With this kind of quarterback playing this kind of offense. Well, that was the gist of my column. Yeah.

Anything seems possible now. Anything seems possible. It really does. You know, and he's the one who makes it possible. You know, like Austin Echler, I mean, a lot of rookies, based on the way Echler played the week before and how he's played so far this year, you would think for a rookie quarterback, Echler would be a security blanket. Except this kid doesn't need a security blanket.

He's not insecure back there at all. No Austin Echler? No problem. You know? Right. True. He's the one providing the warmth for everybody else. You know, you just reminded me of something, though.

And it's not apples to apples. But just the idea that they lost a player last week and, you know, they were going to feel the loss on Sunday. and the other guy came in and McNichols and there was no drop-off. You know, the 82 Skins, which was the first Super Bowl championship team, they lost Art Monk at the end of that regular season, that strike-shortened regular season, and it was a big, big blow to that team heading into the playoffs. And Alvin Garrett came in and had a monster postseason

in wins over Detroit, Minnesota, Dallas, and Miami. and there wasn't much of a drop-off, and they were just as productive. It was kind of a team of destiny. But, yeah, I mean, this has been fun. I mean, even the biggest believers in Jaden Daniels, and I would put myself right in that group. And even, you know, those of us that thought there was a chance that he would be, you know, better sooner rather than later.

I mean, none of us could have expected this. I mean, this start is well above what was reasonable to expect from even a guy who had one of the greatest seasons. I think I've ever watched from a college quarterback, but it's been fun, that's for sure. All things seem possible. You know, they really do. I mean, the idea, look, I don't want to get too far ahead of everything, but it's hard not to project two weeks from that. now that Ravens Commanders Showdown in Baltimore.

Go ahead, say it. You know? Go ahead. Say it. Not to put... What? Were you going to say a preview of the Super Bowl? No, I wasn't going to go that far.

Okay. No, no, no. But the idea that that that game would be so dramatically important, providing they get past the Browns, and even if they don't, it's still an important game. But... I'm sure that, you know, NBC would love to flex that game to a Sunday night game, but apparently they can't because CBS has already laid claim to it,

said that, you know, they're not going to allow that game to be flex from what I've read. Yeah, that's it. It's CBS protecting Baltimore, Washington. I forget how many games a week CBS and Fox get to protect. John Orand would have the answer to that. as of now, it's Cincinnati and the Giants a week from Sunday on Sunday night football. I was looking at that schedule. Tampa and New Orleans play in the Fox 1 o'clock window. Maybe that gets flexed. But I was also looking ahead to Washington's schedule to see what games might make sense based on the current Sunday night scheduled game. There aren't that many

opportunities. Like when they play the Bears, you know, Caleb Williams versus Jaden Daniels, It's Dallas and San Francisco on Sunday night, so they're not going to swap out that for Washington and Chicago. And then they play Pittsburgh on November 10th, but Detroit plays Houston on Sunday night football. That's a pretty attractive matchup, you know, based on the quality of the teams. I had to go all the way to Sunday, November 24th. They host Dallas at 1 o'clock. The problem with that one is, A, it could be a game that 5.5.5.5. protects and B, the Cowboys play four days later on Thanksgiving. So I don't know if the league's

going to push Dallas into the Sunday night window and then have them play on Thursday afternoon. They've got them scheduled at 1 o'clock versus, you know, a possible 815 or 820 kickoff. There are flex opportunities later in the year on Monday night football, and even Thursday night football is now a flex date. You know, they've given themselves. a lot of schedule flexibility, but yeah, that's the reason for Baltimore, Washington remaining at one o'clock. By the way, that's fine by me, although I'd love to see Jaden in another, you know, primetime spot. I want to ask you something because you've mentioned something on the show today already. You've used the phrase, anything is possible. So I'm going to ask you, and I'll answer it

as well, but I'm going to ask you for your answer first. When it comes to this team this year, what is possible? I think a division title is possible based on what we've seen from the Eagles and the Cowboys so far. How many wins? The Eagles could have a new coach by the time the commanders play them. How many wins? You know what? I'm going to go with you now, baby. 10 minimum. Yeah, that's my answer too. A division title. I see a division title and a playoff win because as a division champion, you would have a home playoff game. Look, if you finish in the top two seeds, you could potentially have two home playoff games. But I don't see them there. I'd love to think in terms of 11 wins for the first time since 1991, but I'll stick with my preseason prediction. of 10 and 7 and call it a division title and a home playoff game that they win. You know, you get there, and it's January, and you got a quarterback who's the best quarterback in the NFC playoffs? I mean, you're certainly not going to in that moment say they can't do it.

But I did look something up, which I thought was interesting. No rookie quarterback has ever won a Super Bowl. No rookie quarterback has ever started a Super Bowl. How about this? Only five quarterbacks have started in a championship game, NFC or AFC title game. Sean King in 2000, Ben Rafflesberger in 2005, Joe Flacco did it in 2009, Mark Sanchez did it in 2010, and Brock Purdy did it in 20203. And he got hurt in that game and they came in with Josh Johnson. He got hurt and Christian McCaffrey was taking Wildcat snaps in Philadelphia. in that NFC title game. But here's the thing that all five of those teams had with those rookie quarterbacks.

Great defenses. I mean, really, really great defenses. Pittsburgh's defense with Rathosberger in 2005 was the number one defense in the league. Tampa's was top three. Baltimore's was top five. The Jets were top three. And San Francisco's, I think, was like sixth or fifth somewhere around there. that's not what Washington has.

I still see this as a limiting factor to, you know, championship aspirations, even if Jaden continues to play at this level, I think that that's what is reasonable at this point. You know, division title, playoff win, and, you know, when we get there, certainly subject to change. You know, the other thing, and I think I tweeted this out during the game on, Sunday. It's like it was sort of tongue in cheek, but I said and wrote that at this point, the only concern is how will he handle, you know, the cold weather in December and January, you know, as if, like, assuming there are going to be big games. This is a California kid, Tommy. This is a kid that played at Arizona State and then played in the bayou. I don't think he's

ever played in a cold football game. And I'm being serious here for a moment. I mean, we understand that this league, you know, December and January football ends up being much different than September and October football. You know, now, some games get played indoors, a lot more, you know, in this day and age than back in the day. But Washington doesn't have an indoor stadium. And Washington is a cold weather climb. So, you know, not every quarterback is built for every weather condition.

But, yeah, what's possible? Division title. And a home playoff game. And let's just hope that it's a mild day for our quarterback who we have no idea what kind of bad weather quarterback he is. That's right. That's a good point. I have another question for you. If what we say is possible ends up being the outcome, they win 10 or 11 games, they win the division, they win a playoff game, they have a star at the most important.

important position in the sport. What happens to the name? What happens to the brand? How does that get handled by ownership? That's an interesting question. Can the holdouts hold out if it's fun the roof for this team again? I mean, can you sit on the sideline and say, you know, I hate the name while everyone's partying, you know, and you're on the outside looking in and you want to be in the party, but you can because you took a stand. No, but that's, see, that's not it. It's not about taking a stand. It's about not feeling it.

And so they're either going to feel it or they're not going to feel it. And my guess is... We're not talking about some abstract concept here. What you're feeling is excitement for a team. If they're excited for a team, then and they want to embrace this team with the current name and the current uniforms, etc., then their emotions will have changed. People aren't sitting out and not, you know, paying money to go see games or not

watching this team because they're taking a stand. It's because they don't feel it anymore. It's not, you know, hey, this is a protest. I want the name back. No, it's that they don't feel it anymore. They don't feel like it's their team. The emotions went away. They died out.

And they died out. They started to die out even before, you know, the name was lost and the new name and new uniforms were introduced. You're either going to get it back viscerally, emotionally, or you're not. From a team standpoint, though, Jaden Daniels wins. The offensive rookie of the year finishes third in the MVP vote. voting. You win 11 games and you win two playoff games and you're in the NFC title game and you lose to the 49ers. And then you're going to change everything. And by the way, it'll probably take two years before the change takes place anyway. And then the change, by the way, is not back to the Redskins and it's not, you know, with the old logo.

It's to, you know, whatever it is. And I know that uniform-wise, that they, I do believe that uniform-wise, they'd like to bring something back that represents something similar to what we had before, if not exactly what we had before, minus the logos on the helmets. But, no, I think it would be interesting because this is such a difficult dilemma for them to begin with, for all of the reasons we've talked about before. And in many ways, it would make their life a lot easier. I don't know how many people would be back. This is what we've always talked about is, what if they won, what if Jaden Daniels was great? What if they went to the Super Bowl or went to the NFC championship game?

You're going to tell me that all these people won't be back, and I've said all along, I have no idea. I don't know what will happen. I know some, like I do know a lot of people that are still checked out. They just found other things to do, and their emotions towards this team died. Can they be resurrected with a player and a really good team? and by the way, an organization that seems to be a really good representation for the city from a people standpoint? I don't know. Interesting.

I'm into it right now more than anything else because of the quarterback. Look, it may come to the point where, you know, those who feel disconnected from the franchise who remain so, so what? I mean, Jane Daniels is the next big thing in the NFL, not just in Washington, but the NFL, they will have a whole new fan base to attach to this organization. Tommy, I think from their standpoint, they would totally be nodding. Yeah, Laverro is 100% spot on. So what? Because we paid $6 billion for the team.

they got it right with this kid. He's a superstar in the league. We're going to have a really good team for the next 10 years. And for those 45 to 85-year-olds that checked out emotionally, the lifetime value of having you as a fan isn't worth what the 18-year-old kid that now loves Jaden Daniels and has bought five of his jerseys, all of the alternates and everything else, means to us from a business standpoint. So I've always thought that that would be an interesting conversation to have with them.

What am I or people that are older that feel detached? What are we really worth moving forward? Our value is just not as great as my three boys are to them. See, I'm not sure. It's measured in different ways. That 18 to 35-year-old graphic, you know, demographic is unreliable. and does not generally invest in, like, quote, your foundation, your season ticket base.

You know, they like to make their decisions as to what they're going to do on a weekend from weekend to weekend, okay? And the ones older are the ones that say, yeah, that's my team. I'm committing to my team. I'm buying season tickets. So I am curious as to see how that plays out because while everyone wants to clamp on to this new generation of fans, it's a volatile group that they can't count on. Maybe. It's interesting.

You know, I think if ownership we're listening in on this conversation, they would just respond with, yeah, give me that problem, please. give me the problem of having a winning team with a superstar quarterback. We'll figure it out after that. And I know that there are people listening. I know this. I had a couple of callers bring it up today. Just the idea that if they end up having a big season, this is going to change the mindset of ownership.

That ownership right now does intend, and I believe this to be true, to do something eventually with the name and with the associated brand, but this would just give them kind of an easy out to do nothing. We'll see. We will see. Here's the thing. At this point, the guys that are coaching the team, the guys that are playing for the team, the guys that are in the front office, and even the men and women who own the team, are not rooting for a bad season so that it's easy.

to change the name or to change the uniforms. And it becomes less difficult to move forward with, I think, what they'd like to move forward with. They're not rooting for that. They are rooting for whatever right now generates a lot of excitement and a lot of revenue and a lot of the fans coming back, or as we've discussed, you know, a whole new slew of new fans. All right.

That's enough for that. Enough name talk for the day. got more to get to and we will start that process right after these words from a few of our sponsors. Out of all the things we do to maintain and protect our homes, getting up on a ladder to clean out the gutters is the last thing anybody wants to do. Whether you're tired of unclogging gutters or you don't even know what your gutters look like from above, it's time to upgrade to a permanent solution with leaf filter. Right now you can save up to 30% off your entire purchase at leaffilter.com slash Kevin.

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Promotion is 20% off plus a 10% senior or military discount. One discount per household. All right, guys, best time of the year is football season. It is back. NFL Sundays, college football Saturdays, football on Monday night, Thursday night. and of course the glorious grind of fantasy football lineups. This is where your inner GM comes alive,

setting the perfect fantasy roster, screaming at your TV and making sure that those last-minute waiver moves work out for you so that you're a hero versus the guy everybody ridicules in the group chat. But listen, while you're over here making sure your fantasy team is dialed in, don't let your personal grooming become the guy that gets left on the bench. Let's be honest. Nobody wants to fumble their grooming routine.

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The performance package 5.0 Ultra doesn't stop at grooming essentials. It also comes with two free gifts. The Boxers 2.0 Midnight Bravo and the Shed 2.0 toiletry bag, premium gear to ensure you're always ready for action, whether at home or on the road. Get 20% off plus free shipping with the code Kevin DC at Manscape.com. That's 20% off plus free shipping with the code Kevin DC at Manscape.com. Stay on top of your grooming game and be ready for anything this season throws your way. Tommy, tell us about Shelly's. Well, I tell you, I don't know if Jayden Daniels is a cigar smoker or not. He probably isn't. But if he is, I could tell you that,

he's got a cigar on me waiting for him at Shelley's backroom anytime he wants one. You know, I've always talked about how Shelley's is a hangout for, you know, celebrities and sports figures as well. A lot of ex-redskins players, you know, have been in Shelly many times over the past. And I'd love nothing more to see Jane Daniels in there. celebrating a home win with a nice, you know, coheba at Shelly's, but I've never seen, unlike Joe Burrow, I've never seen Jane Daniels with a cigar in his mouth, and I'm not necessarily encouraging him to go down that path. But there's a cigar waiting for him as Shelly's, and there's cigars waiting for you

at Shelly's back room, too. Not on my expense, okay? You'll have to pay for these cigars yourself, but you'll be picking from the best cigars available. Shelley's backroom at 1331 S Street, Northwest, in the district, they go out of their way to make sure that they have on hand from the list of the best top 25 cigars

named by Cigar Officinado Magazine. That's the Bible of the cigar business. So they're going to have the best selection available to you. They have people who work there who can help you pick the right cigar for you, or else if you know the cigar you want, go find it on shelley's backroom.com. They have their cigar menu with their list of available smokes.

Who knows? Maybe they'll have a Jane Daniels cigar, actual name of a cigar. Like they used to have the SJ9 for Sonny Jorgensen years ago. Yeah. You know, maybe Jane Daniels look at his own name for cigars. He's in that territory or, he's heading there. And as far as I'm concerned, he's got one on me. Shelly's back room at 1331 S Street in the district. We got this from Rick in Missouri. Rick writes, gave us five stars on Apple.

Please rate us and review us if you haven't done that, especially on Apple. Such a big help for us. Also, follow us on Apple and Spotify. That's a big help as well. But Rick in Missouri writes, he gave us five stars. With no particular tie to D.C., I listened to this pod daily, started a few years ago, enjoy semi-regular guests, but always look forward to Tommy, Tuesday, and Thursday to see what quarrel ensues.

One item, though, you talk Maryland sports a lot, but never mention Randy White. He was the most dominant college defensive tackle I saw until Nidama Khan Sioux came along. they were both unblockable. Thank you, Rick. That's always interesting to me that nobody with D.C. ties,

nobody with D.C. sports fandom listen to this podcast. And we have several people. Several people have reached out over the years and said, I found you. I was in D.C. I was listening to you and whatever. But let me just mention.

First of all, I have mentioned Randy White. There's no doubt I've mentioned Randy White on this podcast. Not Rick that you've listened to every single show over the years. Randy White is the greatest football player in the history of Maryland football. That is, I don't even think that's a debate. Randy White was the Outland Trophy winner. He was the most dominant linemen, defensive linemen in the country during his years under Jerry Claiborne.

And then Randy White was a dominant defensive tackle in the NFL with, unfortunately, the Dallas Cowboys. Let me just tell you, Tommy, I remember, you know, being so, Randy White was just unbelievable. But I just remember Randy White going to the Cowboys, and it's like, I can't root for Randy White. I was like a little kid, and I was saying to my dad, dad, he's not allowed to go to the Cowboys, is he? But, you know, he was in his era, Tommy,

in that Dallas Cowboys flex defense, he was one of the best defensive linemen in football. I mean, he was dominant. You're absolutely right. I had the good fortune of having Randy White as a guest on my old Cigars and Curve Balls podcast that I did for a couple years, and he was a great guest. And I tell you what, he loves him from Joe Jacoby. Oh, yeah.

Who he went up against many times, and he thinks Jake should be in the Hall of Fame. He looks forward to the day that he can share the stage with Joe Jacoby in can. But I agree with you. I mean, growing up, there were two great defensive players I remember in college growing up. One was you green

for the University of Pittsburgh. You know? I mean, he never turned out to be a great pro, but he was his dominant a college defensive player as I've ever seen. And then Randy White. And he did turn out to be a great pro as well,

a All-Fame professional. Yeah, you know, thinking about great defensive college football players, I thought of Charles Woodson, but the other name that jumped into my mind was LeVar Arrington. LeVar Arrington was a star college football player, and everybody thought that LeVar Arrington was going to be the next L.T. I mean, he was... I agree with you. 100%. LeVar is on that list.

LeVar is on that list of the most memorable defensive college players of all. all time. Charles Woodson obviously won the Heisman trophy. And Dion was super popular as a defensive player in college, but I think LeVar was the guy that everybody could not

wait to see at the next level. Look, I spent some time with LeVar after he got drafted up at his house, spent a couple of days with him up there. You got drafted by Washington. Yeah. And listen to people tell stories about him. And I was convinced that if he

wanted to play fullback in the NFL he could have. Yeah. I'm actually totally convinced that if Marty Schottenheimer stays on his head coach after 2001, that Marty coaches LeVar Erington up to be his version in Washington of what he had in Derek Thomas in Kansas City. Now, LeVar had injuries that he dealt with, but if he had stayed healthy and he had been coached by Marty throughout his career, he would have been a star. player. I'm convinced of it. I just remember being really pumped up when they drafted him,

and that I felt as a Skins fan, after all of those years of having to deal with Lawrence Taylor, that the rest of the division was going to have to deal with LeVar Arrington. That draft, Chris Samuels and LeVar Arrington. I know. A great offensive lineman, a great defensive player. How do you go wrong from there? You know what it was like? It was like the Ravens when they drafted Jonathan Ogden and Ray Lewis in the same draft. Yeah. How do you go wrong from there? Well, you hire Marty Schottenheimer and he wins eight of his final 11 games in his first year with Tony Banks at quarterback. You're one of the toughest, the most physical defensive teams in the league at the end of that year.

You just have to go find a quarterback and you're going to make a several-year run of winning 11, 12, 13, 13 games a year and being in the postseason, and the owner decided he wasn't having enough fun. Yeah, yeah. And one of the other owners was upset that Marty had taken his parking spot away from him. Parking state. Anyway, rate us and review us on Apple and Spotify. So a couple of things real quickly. So after Sunday, Jaden Daniels flew up the odds charts on the MVP odds.

I'm looking at MyBooky right now. Go to mybooky.ag. Use my promo code, Kevin D.C., and they'll give you up to $1,000 on your initial deposit. You can bet all these NFL futures. I'll give you the rookie of the year, offensive rookie of year odds in a moment. But here are the guys that are currently ahead of Jaden Daniels. Patrick Mahomes, Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson, C.J. Stroud. Sam Darnold, Brock Purdy. That's the list. He's 7th right now in the MVP odds. Seventh. Now, it's really close with Burrow, with DAC, I don't know why, with Aaron Rogers, with Baker Mayfield,

but he is right there. We're talking MVP, not offensive rookie of the year. MVP, the offensive rookie of the year odds updated. He's now minus 109. All right. So he's the favorite. Malik Neighbors is next in line at plus 285. So he is right now a solid favorite to win offensive rookie of the year.

The last time, and I mentioned this on the podcast the other day, the last time a rookie won the league MVP was the first time they gave out the MVP, and that was in 1957 Jim Brown won the MVP as a rookie in the NFL. Do I think he's going to win the MVP? I don't. I think, you know, some of the guys that we just mentioned, Josh Allen is certainly having one of those kinds of years. Mahomes is always going to be a possibility.

Lamar is going to be a possibility. Hell, I was looking to see what the odds were on Derek Henry, and he's moved way up as well. But it's just, it's kind of a quarterback award, you know? Yeah. Crazy. I wanted to mention real quickly, Tommy. I went back and watched a lot.

I have not watched the defense sort of all, for whatever it's worth. But there were a couple of things that I found very interesting. First of all, I really, you know, you mentioned McNichols. McNichols is an outstanding pass protection running back. And I'm wondering if that's the reason they kept him more than anything else. But it wasn't because he's got great vision and great feet. Both of the runs that he had for touchdowns are really good feel runs.

Now, the first one's blocked up exceptionally well. The second one is a cutback, and he does such a great job with his eyes. I thought, like you thought, they were going to really miss Echler. They didn't. But this guy, we saw on the touchdown pass to Terry McLorne against the Bengals, the pass pro pickup that he had, two more unbelievable pass pro pickups, minimum, from the game. But the play that I wanted to talk about, just to let everybody know that I'm not blind to Jaden occasionally making a mistake.

So I do think he threw late on the touchdown pass to Terry McClureen, but it was a touchdown pass. But the interception is really interesting because it's not there. I don't think his reed should take him there. It's cover two, and yes, there's that seam in between cover two, but it's too tight. It's not wide enough. And I'm surprised that he threw it. And I think Terry was surprised based on what Terry saw that it.

through it. It's not a good throw either. But what really is disappointing about that play, because he's really been super patient, you know, in the pocket. That's a first and 10 play. And so, you know, you see a lot of shots in this league happen on first and 10, you know, with play action. And by the way, it's play action sort of zone read, but they're in pass blocking. This is not an RPO. They're not run blocking. And it didn't, it was, it was an okay fake. But they've, They're flooding, you know, this cover, too, with four under, with four receivers. And Jeremy McNichols, after the play action fake, is such an easy checkdown for 20 yards. You know, it's at least 15 yards, if not more than that.

I'm really surprised he didn't go to that. I don't know why he didn't. I think he just was starting to feel it a little bit. They're up 14-7. The ball's at midfield. it again. It's first and 10. You know, people have been talking about, you know, we've got to take more shots. We've got to give Terry

more chances. And I don't mind giving Terry, you know, 50-50 balls. He's proven in his career. That may be what he does better than anything else is contested catches. But this is like too tight, I think, on the cover too. And my God,

Jeremy McNichols on the checkdown, is running for 15 to 20 yards. And so I, I love the aggression. He was feeling it in that moment, but it was not, I don't think they would say, the right read, although I'm sure, in an encouraging way, we love the aggressiveness, we love that you're giving Terry the shot.

I don't think Terry thinks he's going to get it based on the coverage. And then it's not a great throw. Like this would have been one, if that is really hummed in there low and kept out of harm's way, it's probably incomplete. but they're sitting back waiting for this. And so that would be one play that I'm sure,

and the result was the worst play of the year for him. But I'm just surprised that he actually threw that. But we finally got to see how he responded. Yeah. Yeah, we talked about that last week. Yes. We hadn't seen like this was one small response as opposed to a bigger response. But he came right back.

and put 28 more points on the board. Yeah, although the next drive immediately was the first punt of the season. Right. You know? Yes. But he did respond. It did not say, oh, in other words, it was not in his head. Yeah, I don't think that's really what we were discussing last week.

I think we were discussing a stretch of bad games where he's starting to take some heat. Right. But we are talking about a response here. It's a small level response. True. Yeah. All right. Anything else on the game from Sunday?

Cleveland's this Sunday. Miles Garrett, I think, he played. He had two sacks, but he got banged up, I think, at the end of that game. So we'll see what his health is. Obviously, that would be massive if somehow Miles Garrett was out. He was injured going into the game last week, has a bunch of things going on, but he played and he was dominant in that game, even though they lost it. The next two weeks defensively, the coordinator, Jim Schwartz and what he has talent-wise in Cleveland, and then just Baltimore's defense in general, these are two big-time tests the next week for the offense. This is going back to Tampa.

It's not week one. You don't have the week one, you know, trying to figure it out things. so I would expect them to be better. But this is not Arizona's defense. This is not, you know, the Bengals banged up defense. This isn't the giant defense. These are two excellent defensive football teams. And then you got the issue with Baltimore being able to, you know, run for 280 yards or more.

By the way, you said something in the opening segment, and I just wanted to emphasize it. How Kyler Murray against this defense only rushes the ball once for three yards is beyond me? I think that Washington benefited from a real poor game play call game for Arizona. Now, the defense had something to do with it. I don't want to take all credit away from them and just assign blame to Arizona. But this little guy who's 5 foot 3 is not a pocket passer. He is a guy that has to get out on the edge. he's a guy that's got to be involved in the zone read game he's a guy that makes plays off

schedule not on schedule he can't see over the line of scrimmage and yet for some reason on a third and one and a fourth and one they had him in shotgun throwing from the pocket i mean that's insanity you're just asking you're asking to either punt or just turn the ball over on downs um he's not impressive to me i've been off kailer murray for a while There are games when it's like, oh, my God, that little guy just ran around for nine seconds before throwing a touchdown pass. They couldn't catch him. It's like a game of tag. But he's just not a guy that you can win with traditionally or any sense of traditional sort of drop-back passing.

All right. I want to hear your thoughts on Pete Rose passing. We'll do that after these words from a few of our sponsors. Hey guys, I have found a product that I want to tell you about that works if you've got congestion. I have congestion primarily due to allergies in the springtime and then in the summer and fall. It can be all consuming that kind of congestion, hard to focus, hard to think, snoring, issues sleeping. But Navaj nasal care has been a game changer for clearing my congestion quickly. Navaj makes breathing easy, easier. I found the solution. You've got to try this. Navage uses smooth saline flow and gentle patented nasal suction to clear nasal passages. I just hold up my Navaj nasal cleaner to my nose and press start. It's easy. It effectively unlocks and flushes as mucus from my nasal passages, and it's fast. Works as fast as 30 seconds. Navage is drug-free. It uses 90.

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Tommy is a Hall of Fame baseball voter. He's in my book a Hall of Fame baseball and boxing and sports writer. So your reaction to Pete Rose passing away yesterday at the age of 83 years old? Well, you know, it's a sad story. And, you know, you can't tell the story about Pete Rose without talking about how he's not in the Hall fame, because this is what everybody wants to talk about. He's got one of the most revered, if not the most revered record in all sports with 4,200. 56 career hits the most in the history of Major League baseball.

But the thing that kept Pete Rose out in the Hall fame was Pete Rose. Okay, and it wasn't just betting on baseball. It was his continued behavior after he retired. And his continued cluelessness about his, you know, about his position and what he needed to do to get back into good graces of the game. It's a complicated story. Like, you know, I mean, I really think that Pete Rose is part of his symbolism, like fans fell in love with him when he was a player, is because he represented a style of play that at the time when baseball players' salaries were skyrocketing and players were going on strike. You know, here you had Pete Rose, Trale Hustle, you know, running down the first base for a walk.

okay, you know, sliding head first, getting his uniform dirty. So he became the symbol for people about what they loved about the game. It's ironic because nobody cared about money more than Pete Rose. I mean, P. Rose wanted to get reinstated. He was banned from baseball in 1989 by the commissioner of baseball after they found evidence. He bet on baseball when he was manager of the Reds and bet on his own team. a charge that he denied lied about for 15 years

until he finally came forward in a book that he made money off of. He finally admit he bet on baseball. So, I mean, he was banned by Major League Baseball. Just real quickly, for people that don't know the Pete Rose story, he was not betting on baseball when he was a player. He bet on baseball.

We don't know that. manager. We don't have evidence for that. Okay, but he did not, he admitted to betting on baseball as a manager and betting on his own team. Right, because that was the evidence that they had. He admitted to the evidence that they had. I'm sure he bet on baseball when he played. I mean, it just didn't kick in when he was a manager. And this guy used to hang out at racetracks when he was a kid. Okay. Fair enough. So, you know, so in 1989, he was banned by, by the commissioner, A lifetime ban, and in 1991, I think it was 1991, two years later, the Hall of Fame passed a rule saying if you've been banned from baseball, you can't be on the Hall of Fame ballot. So Key Rose was never on a ballot to be even voted on for the Hall of Fame by writers.

So writers never even had a chance. What would the result have been? That's interesting, because he was beloved by writers because he liked writers. he never turned writers away he always had stories for writers he was never scared of them never worried about what he had to that what he said would get him in trouble

which is part of his problem uh that's interesting i think i don't think he would have gotten in because he needs 75% to get in the hall of fame and that's a lot of friends okay so uh i don't think he would have gotten in

and and as a result he's never been on the Veterans Committee ballot, I'm not sure the veterans would vote him in because he was not particularly well-liked by people other than his teammates. I had a Major League, a Hall Famer tell me that the only reason he wanted to get reinstated in baseball didn't really have to do with the Hall Fame.

He wanted to manage again because managers were making $2 million a year. And he wanted that more. money. So I know people, he's a beloved figure, people will rally around the idea that, you know, he should be in the Hall of Fame. His artifacts are all over to Hall fame. His uniforms there, his back's there, he just doesn't have a plaque. And I don't see that changing after his death. As Shulis Joe Jackson is a far more sympathetic figure. And they wrote, they wrote songs, they made movies about Shrew as Joe Jackson.

He's not in Hall of Fame. The guy who was involved in the 1990 Black Sox betting scandal. So if he's not in, I just don't see Rose ever getting in, period. Tommy, 17-time All-Star, still the record for the most hits ever in the history of baseball, 4,256 hits. Most games played in, most at bats of all time. where does he rank baseball-wise in terms of the greatest hitters of all time? Well, you know, he doesn't rank high. He doesn't.

You know what was ironic? I mean, high, I mean, not top five, not top ten. Right. You know? What's ironic is he got voted to the 1999 MasterCard, all-time baseball team. Okay? He got voted to that. Frank Robinson did not.

Pete Rose put up some great numbers, but he wasn't the player, Frank Robinson was. Is Ted Williams the greatest titter of all time? When you're asked this question, who's the greatest titter of all time? I would say Ted Williams. I mean, considering the numbers he put up while missing five years in the service, you know, as a war hero during World War II and Korea, and he still put up these tremendous numbers. Yeah, Ted Williams is considered the all-year.

all-time best home run hitter. Ty Cobb is right up there. Ruth is up there. Ruth had a career batting average of 3-42. Okay? Tony Quinn. Tony Quinn? He's up there. Rod Carew? Yes, these are all guys.

What about Barry Bonds? Well, Barry Bonds, Barry Bonds was a steroid user. I understand that. He was one of the great hitters of all time. But he was a steroid user. You'd have to consider him as one of the great, Willie,

uh, hitters of all time. Willie Mays, one of the great players of all times, as opposed to great hitters. Yeah. You know? Yep. Willie Mays may be the greatest player of all time. And then you have to include the Negro League players now. You have to include Josh Gibson, you know, when you're talking about the greatest players

of all time. Oscar Charleston. So it's a complicated thing, Rose's legacy is complicated. but he was his own worst enemy. I just found something. Ted Williams in 1994 ranked the top 20 hitters of all time, and Pete Rose was not on the list. He went Ruth, you know, he did not include himself.

He went Ruth one, Garrig, two, Jimmy Fox, three, Hornsby, four, DiMaggio, five, Cobb, six, mutual seven, Joe Jackson, eight, Hank Aaron nine and Willie Mays, 10. Frank Robinson was 18 on the list. All right. One other quick thing. Look, one of the things, two things, real quick. Yep.

He bet on baseball. He bet on his own team, okay, supposedly never to lose, only to win. But he bet with mob bookies, okay? Okay, so he had, these are the kind of connection. Yeah, no, you're right. That baseball could not afford to have. Of course. And then there was a whole other incident where he was accused of a, of a, of a, a,

A young woman accused him of having sex with her when she was 14 and 15 years old. He denied it. He said, I had sex with her when she was 16. He was in his 30s. Yeah, that's crazy. 16 that's the legal age in Ohio. So, you know, that doesn't help his case either since part of the criteria of elections in all-famous character integrity. All right.

I just wanted to mention real quickly because you got to run in. I got a run right now, but Dekhambi Matumbo passed away yesterday. He's one of the great defensive players of all time. He's the greatest shot blocker, certainly of all time. He also was one of the... No, no, no, no. Bill Russell? Will Chamberlain, Bill Russell.

Yeah. He didn't keep shot blocks back then. Right. But I was going to, I actually was going to say that, you know, actually Elijah one actually leads all time on the list. my guy. But I was going to actually, I meant to say DeKambi Matambo is the all-time

greatest college and Big East shot blocker of all time. But he's one of the great shot blockers in the history of the game. But he also was an incredible humanitarian. And people at Georgetown are crushed by this. And they essentially say he's one of the most important alums in the

history of the school. Basketball or no basketball. Anyway. Did you have anything on him? Now, everything you said, I echo. Washington is number 10 in ESPN's just released power rankings. So that means we've got to do power rankings on Thursday. All right, back tomorrow.

Thanks, Tommy. Thanks, boss.