The Kevin Sheehan Show - Wizards' Draft & Alex Smith Speaks

Episode Date: June 21, 2019

Kevin opens with the NBA Draft and the Wizards' selection of Rui Hachimura. Hall of Fame coach Gary Williams calls in to discuss the draft and more. Alex Smith did his first interview since his injury with FOX-5's Angie Goff. Kevin discussed that and then finished up talking with MASN's Mark Zuckerman about the Nats' sweep of Philly and their upcoming series with Atlanta. <p> </p><p>Learn more about your ad choices. Visit <a href="https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices">podcastchoices.com/adchoices</a></p> Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You want it. You need it. It's what everyone's talking about. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Now here's Kevin. All right, I am here. Aaron is here. This show's presented by Window Nation. If you're in the market for Windows, call 86690 Nation or go to WindowNation.com and tell them we told you to call. We'll do some Nats later on with Mark Zuckerman from Masson. They swept the Phillies last night. And starting tonight, they've got a huge series with the first place, Braille. in D.C. and the weather should be fine all weekend long. So we'll save that for later in the show. Gary Williams will be on the show as well to talk about the draft. I'll get his perspective on a lot of the players, but certainly on Hachamura, the player the Wizards selected. Gary's good friends with Mark Few, the Gonzaga coach, and he pays attention to Gonzaga, so we'll talk to him in a little

bit as well. The Wizards got two players in the draft last night. At number nine, the first ever Japanese player to be drafted, Rui Hachamura, a 6-8-230-pound power forward out of Gonzaga. He was a first team all-American, and he was a big part of a team that at one point was ranked number one in the country and was one of the favorites to get to the final four and win the national championship. Probably on paper, Mark Few's best team at Gonzaga. Part of that was because of him. Part of it was because of Brandon Clark. They just had a very good team. By the way, just to get this out of the way right now, this is a huge deal for Japan. Hachamura being the first ever Japanese player to be drafted into the NBA is a huge deal for Japan.

By the way, he's got a Japanese mother, if you're interested. His father is from a West African country called Benin. But this is a huge deal in Japan, and make no mistake, the Wizards are going to become a favorite team in Japan with gear all over the place and Hachamura Wizards jerseys all over the place and the franchise is going to benefit from that. Now, I have no idea for sure whether or not this played into the decision, so I'm going to move on from this because A, I don't know, and B, Hachamura is a good player who wasn't overdrafted, you know, according to most experts and most mock drafts. It's not like he was incredible.

incredibly overdrafted. He was right there in the mix to be a lottery pick, you know, leading up to the draft last night. Now, my view of Hachamura is this. First of all, and we, you know, I did a very lengthy draft preview yesterday that really irritated Tommy. I loved the fact that that irritated Tommy yesterday. I said that I, I like them, but I don't love them. I like a lot of people more, including his teammate Brandon Clark, who I really liked, and liked a lot more. than Hachemura. That's just me. You know, Hachamara became a guy that we as college basketball fans really became aware of as a potential first-round NBA pick. And I talked about him during the course of the season on the

podcast. But when he broke out in Maui last November, they beat Illinois, they beat Arizona, and then on the night before Thanksgiving, they beat Duke when in the moment, early in that season, people were talking about Duke as an unbeatable team. Remember, they had opened the season by annihilating Kentucky. And that was an upset that night. Gonzaga was ranked what, two or three that night? Was that a number one versus number two matchup? It may have been. I don't think it was number one versus number two. It wasn't. I think it was one verse three or one versus four, something like that. And Hachamura was great in that tournament. And he was great against Duke. He averaged 22 points a game in that tournament, shot like 56, 57 percent from the field. He looked

apart that night against Duke in particular, and it became clear that night that this guy was in the mix to be an NBA first round pick and perhaps even a lottery pick. So it's not like people haven't been talking about Rui Hachamura all year long. He's powerful. He's got long arms. He's one of these guys who has nice, you know, short mid-range feel and a shot. But the reason that I like Brandon Clark Moore, if we're in other players, which I'll get to in a moment. You saw a lot of Gonzaga this year. We had a chance to watch Gonzaga a lot this year because they were rolling through people in that league. There was a point in that season where Aaron, remember they were beating teams in that league at one point by like an average of

40 points a night? It was crazy. They lost to Tennessee, by the way, early in the year after beating Duke. And then they got on this role in league play and just annihilated people in their league. Nobody came close until St. Mary's beat him in that championship game. So they had been on this role. And then if you didn't know this, they got to the Elite 8 and they lost to Texas Tech.

In a game in which Hachamura missed some key free throws in that game. Ended up with 22 points. And I think I pulled this up last night. It was like seven or eight rebounds, something like that. But anyway, I liked him. But I loved Brandon Clark, and I talked about Brandon Clark on this show yesterday, that I thought he was perhaps the best athlete in the draft, the most explosive, had the highest motor, relentless competitor.

I just think he's going to be a really good player. And by the way, he's going to end up in Memphis. Memphis had a great draft. Memphis has a team to watch here over the next few years, because they got, in my view, they got a player that is more likely in my view, just my opinion, to be a future NBA MVP in John Morant, than even Zion Williamson. Again, just one person's opinion. And then they got Brandon Clark. And so they've got some guys on that roster that can finish. I was looking at their roster after the Conley deal. Jaron Jackson,

Jr., from Michigan State, who they drafted last year. You talk about long-armed athletes. You finishers with a guy like John Morant with Brandon Clark and Jaron Jackson Jr. You know, they're not going to be good next year or the year after, but four or five years from now, because NBA, young NBA teams don't win. You've got to figure out the game. You've got to physically mature. But that team's got some guys that can run the floor and finish with a point guard who is, will be one of the best passing point guards and scoring point guards, both in the league in my view. So yeah, I think Memphis is one of those teams to really keep an eye on. So I really liked Brandon Clark and talked about them on the show yesterday.

And I also mentioned that I thought that, well, I thought it was strange that Cam Reddish was dropping. I thought Cam Reddish was really intriguing. And if they miss on Cam Reddish and Cam Reddish turns out to be a star and Hotchimer or a dozen, and that'll be the debate more than anything else, I think, because I wasn't interested in Nasir Little. He was one of the guys I wanted them to steer clear of Romeo Langford, too. Fortunately, they didn't go for either one of those players, and the Sear Little really dropped to 25.

This was the guy that, you know, a lot of people thought could be, was probably going to be a lottery pick and slip to 25. It was one of those scenes, by the way, all night long, the cameras on him and his table, and it always breaks my heart for these young kids, they're built up by so many of these people around them. And this is like a major disappointment thing when they don't go high enough. And the funny thing about it, as adults, we can all recognize this,

is that this draft is celebrated by families and players as this end conclusion accomplishment. And it's not. It's the beginning of something. Now, yes, they're going to get a rookie contract and they're going to get paid. But after the taxes are taken out and everything else goes every which direction, they, to create generational wealth, they got to be really good. And they got to get the next contract. And then the next contract would do it if they're really good when they become a free agent.

But I always get sort of uncomfortable seeing this night celebrated as like this incredible accomplishment. It's like when the high school players announced their college solace. elections. I mean, that's even worse because they're not earning any money in most cases when they make their college choice. But you feel badly for the people that end up dropping in these drafts, NFL draft, NBA draft, because they have had these expectations and there's this sense of probably internal disappointment and there shouldn't be. This means nothing. And where you get drafted means nothing, maybe contractually in this first deal. Certainly first round is guaranteed money. Second round isn't. But you got an opportunity to go out and prove everybody wrong. It's what you do

from this point forward that matters for a guy like Nasir Little. Anyway, I didn't like him as a prospect personally. I didn't like Lankford. There were a couple of guys I didn't like. But it wasn't that I didn't like Hachamura. I just liked other guys more. I think they perhaps would have been better served to take Cam Reddish there. I already mentioned Brandon Clark in that particular spot. By the way, Aaron, one of the other things I talked about yesterday was I could not believe that Cam Johnson from North Carolina was being thought of as a late first round selection. To me, he looked like the best shooter in the draft, either he or Tyler Hero, and at 6'9 with his quick release, he looked like a lottery pick to me. And he got picked 11th overall.

Shocked a lot of people. It shocked me too, but I loved him as a player. So if the Wizards had been the team that reached for Cam Johnson, a lot of you would have said, oh my God, he got mocked at the end of the first round. What a joke. I would have actually applauded that because I think that he looks like he's going to be a big-time NBA score. Who the hell knows? But that's just the way I sort of viewed him. I also said to you, and have said to you all season long, that Grant Williams is one of my favorite college basketball. basketball players from Tennessee. And most of the mocks had him somewhere super late first round or second round. And he went 22 to Boston. So I'm glad Danny Aange and company recognized Grant Williams as not being a pogo stick jumper or super athlete or super explosive, but as one of the smartest, highest IQ players in the draft with an NBA body already at 6-8-245-250. I think he's going to be a very good NBA player.

Now, if the wizard had taken Grant Williams at number nine, that would have been a bit of a reach with some of the other players on the board, but he's a player I like. Ty Jerome got picked in the first round at 24 overall by ultimately Phoenix, and we'll get into the whole, you know, the guys wearing the hats of the teams that drafted them, but are not the teams that they're going to play for. It's so stupid.

Well, we'll get to it right now. Why doesn't the NBA? just if their league year doesn't start until just before free agency, why can't they create a window in which trades are allowed to be finalized before the draft so that when you're watching the draft, which it's a television show, we can watch the draft and when a player gets picked by a team, it's the team that he's going to play for. I don't know why that would be so hard.

This is a big whiff on their part. It's so stupid. So for the show that, that I do in the afternoon. I was trying to book someone after Memphis made the trade. I get the Memphis radio broadcaster, and he has to say, oh, if the trade goes through, here's how it affects people. I don't understand that.

I really do not understand that at all. But anyway, you know, netting it out on Hachamura, I like him. I didn't love him. I would have, you know, Cam Johnson, Cam Reddish, any of the Kentucky guys. By the way, PJ Washington went at 12. Tyler Hero went, I think, at 13 to the heat. And then a guy that I really liked in this draft, Kelton Johnson, didn't go until the next last pick of the first round. Went to the Spurs at 29 overall. I think he's going to be a very good player.

And I would have thought about him at 9. It would have been super early based on where he went. But I think really in this draft, after 3, after R.J. Barrett, there wasn't, in order that would have embarrassed anybody. There wasn't a player you could have taken at any level that should have embarrassed anybody. It's a total crapshoot, even one through three. Maybe not in this draft, but certainly after three in this draft it is. And we'll find out on all these guys. You know, basketball's funny. It's like, you know, these guys are so young and it takes so long. They are physically, you know, not, in many ways, not up to it for a few years.

You know, certainly psychologically and mentally, the maturity you have to have. to have to now be with grown men traveling 41 dates out of the year playing 82 games having all this money and everything that goes with that it's just an older person's league and it always has been so for a lot of these players we're not going to know for several years as to whether or not they had impact we do know this looking at this NBA draft you know going back is that somewhere in the neighborhood of about seven to eight out of ten players picked do not have significant impact in the league that most of these players five, six, seven, eight years from now won't be playing in the league. It's not the NFL draft. It's totally different. In the second round,

the Wizards took Admiral Schofield. They traded back into the second round. They bought their way back into the second round, which a lot of people thought they would do. Ben Standing was on here the other day and said, look, they only have five players under contract. They've got to take somebody in the second round. I think they will buy into the second round, and they did. And they took a 6-5-240 pound. That Tennessee team, by the way, was thick with grown men like for college basketball, right? Because they drafted, ultimately, they drafted a junior and a senior.

You know, they didn't draft, you know, two freshmen, which, by the way, is, you know, they're not drafting in their mind's eye projects. I think all of these guys are projects to a certain degree. But Schofield was on a, you know, another. Tennessee and Gonzaga were two really good college basketball teams this year. And Schofield, in his senior year, you know, he really, he was a very good player on a very good team with Grant Williams and Jordan Bone. And, you know, a team that I felt was well, well coached. Look, rarely do you look at a second rounder and say,

he's a lock to make the team, but you probably say that about Schofield because the wizards need bodies. They need bodies that they can get under contract for, by the way, a low cost. Anyway, we'll see how it works out for Admiral Schofield, but a competitor, by the way, and an athlete for sure. A couple of other quick thoughts on the draft. back to sort of the first round of this draft. I personally think that Kobe White is going to be a perfect fit in Chicago. If he had gotten to nine, he would have been a guy that I would have not had a problem with the Wizards taking. When Culver was taken at 6 and a lot of the talks started with Kobe White to Chicago,

I was a little bit disappointed. I was sort of hopeful that he might be there at 9. I do not know what the Wizards thought about him, but as I'm watching the first round develop, that was the guy. I was like, come on, have him slip. Let's get a point guard. Because we all like Sataransky.

He's fine. He's not a starting point guard in the NBA. They need to find another guy that can really move. And Kobe White can really move. And by the way, can just shoot it a lot better than John Walcan as an example. I was surprised Jackson Hayes got picked that high. Personally, I thought that was a way. way too high. But when we got to nine, I was surprised by Hotchimer until somebody tweeted it out

before the pick was made. I thought at that point, I really thought there was a really good chance they were going to take Cam Reddish, or take the French 18-year-old who had been mocked to them in so many ways, who ended up with going to the Pistons, I think, at 15 overall. By the way, I mentioned Alexander Walker from Virginia Tech at the very end of my very lengthy Warren Peace Tolstoy draft preview yesterday and said I liked him a lot too. And he went much higher than I think most people thought he would go. Went to 17 overall in this particular draft. I think he can be a really good player.

I mentioned Ty Jerome. How about Dylan Wendler, the kid who lit up Maryland in the first round of the tournament. Maryland won the game against Belmont. A lot of people like this guy. Another incredible shooter, quick release shooter. I was surprised Jordan Poole went in the first round. I liked Jordan Poole at Michigan. I didn't think he was a first round player, Aaron.

I don't know if you did or not. Kevin Porter, Jr., who has a chance. I mentioned him on the draft preview, was the final pick of the first round going to Milwaukee. And then you got into the second round, and at that point, I don't know about you. I was just curious as to where Bruno Fernando would go and whether or not the Wizards would buy their way

or try to trade their way into the second round. And Bruno Fernando went, you know, overall, as the 34th overall selection, and good for him. You know, he's going to end up playing for the Hawks in Atlanta with Kevin Herder. And they traded up for him, too. And they traded up for him, so they really liked him. And, you know, I have some concerns about Bruno at the next level. And I know during the course of the season, somebody tweeted this to me yesterday,

said, you were in love with Bruno. Yes, as a player for Maryland, I was. And I liked his NBA prospects. But as the season went on, I became. became a little bit more skeptical about him at the next level. He has the body, man. If you've ever seen Bruno up close, this dude is huge and just at 610, 240, and let's just say that he gets bigger and stronger with the wingspan, the whole thing. I just would, I would have loved to have seen him be more aggressive offensively. I also would have loved to have seen him have more of a green light

as a shooter at Maryland. And I hope that he gets a chance to stroke, you know, really shoot the ball. I think he's got a great stroke and could have a great mid-range game, and I actually think he could be a good three-point shooter as a stretch four. I do think that. Carson Edwards went as the third pick in the second round. I do have some concerns about Carson Edwards. Great college player. Incredible college score. I wonder at, you know, whatever he is, 5-11, 6 feet, 185 or whatever. He is a relentless shooter, and it's super aggressive. Didn't shoot a high percentage, by the way, but God, did he have a tournament run? And let's face it, as far as Carson Edwards goes, remember, you know, he looked at one point like a lock to be the Big Ten player of the year, and then not so much, and then got into the tournament and got on a role like we haven't seen.

It was one of the great individual tournament runs we've seen in recent tournament history, and that put him into play, because he was a junior. He actually, even though it seems like Carson Edwards was at Purdue for five years. he had a year left, went early, so he gets picked in the second round. And then Bull Bowl, a guy that some people thought could get picked as high as like top 15, didn't go until the second round at 44 overall. And remember I mentioned Isaiah Roby yesterday. He was one of those guys. I kind of liked it and thought that somebody should take a chance on him in the second round.

The Pistons did. And actually went much earlier than I would have guessed, but I'm glad he did, because I think he's got real NBA potential. By the way, we forgot about Ziggy Bresdikis from Michigan in the year that he had as a freshman, so confident. I think he's got a chance to be a good player. Didn't mention him yesterday. Amir Koffi, another guy I mentioned, didn't get taken.

Kyle Guy did. So did Mary L. Sheaak, you know, who was a Virginia guy that went to Iowa State. They both got picked in the second round. And that was essentially it. I mean, in terms of the teams, I thought Atlanta had a good draft, and I think Memphis has had a really good couple of days here. I think they are building what could be a very interesting NBA team, not next year or the year after, but three, four, five years down the road.

If John Morant turns out to be what I think, you know, he could potentially be, with guys like Jaron Jackson, Jr. and Brandon Clark, who they drafted, I think this could be a good team. And, you know, they picked up a couple of other players in that trade for Connolly as well, including wasn't, who was part of that, who came in that deal? Didn't Jay Crowder come in that deal the other day?

I think it was Jay Crowder. And Grayson Allen, maybe too. Grace and Allen came as part of that deal. Their team, I think, you know, to keep an eye on. And obviously New Orleans has had an incredible last few days as well, especially if you just conceded the fact that you were going to miss out on having Anthony Davis sign a long-term deal there. Again, I'm not a big fan of the NBA draft.

I watched it last night. Most of these players will not have significant impact as professionals. It's just the way it goes, whereas the NFL draft is much different. And I just don't understand why we can't get these trades finalized before draft night, or even finalized during draft night. Why can't the players walk up and be drafted by the team that drafted them and wear their hat. I don't understand that.

I will say this, though, man. Last night, a lot of guys looked drip. Didn't you think a lot of guys looked drip last night? I had never heard that term until Maria Taylor and others were talking about how drip everybody looked. Was that a term you were familiar with? I had heard it before, yes. You had?

Yes. You're acting like that I'm a complete old, you know, out-of-touch guy that I had not heard that term. Well, not that you haven't heard it, but just hearing it coming out of your mouth was... But this was something you were very familiar with. I don't know about very... I had heard the term before, yes. Were you surprised that it was used so often last night? I'll be honest, I watched a good chunk of it at a bar, so I wasn't hearing a lot of it, so...

I can't tell you how many times the description drip, which apparently is a synonym for swag, which is a synonym for those of you that don't know what either means. You look really good tonight, man. really pulling it off tonight. There you go. You know who's not drip right now? Me. Gary Williams is coming up here shortly,

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for 12 full months. Call 86690 Nation or go to windonation.com. That's 86690 Nation and mention that you heard about Windonation on this podcast. All right, let's bring in Gary Williams, Hall of Fame coach, Gary Williams, former Maryland basketball coach and a frequent guest on the podcast and on the radio show before. And I was just thinking about you this morning because I know Mark Few is one of your better friends in coaching, and so I'm expecting that you probably watched Gonzaga enough this year to have an opinion on the Wizards picking Rui Hachamuro. What did you think?

Well, if you play for Mark Few, you're going to know how to play. I think that's a big thing now, and I think Golden State, obviously so much talent, but those guys knew how to play. You know, you look at Green who played for Izzo. You look at a guy like Curry who got to play for McKillop down at Davidson, one of the better, you know, mid-major coaches out there. And, you know, it means a lot when you know how to play, given your talent. And against Duke and the Maui Invitational, I thought he was the best player on the floor.

He had a tremendous game. That was a great early college basketball game. And then I saw him play a couple times during the season. season in the NCAA tournament, and I don't think he quite played at that same level, but it's there. And I think sometimes you get into the season and you get a couple guys in your team that are thinking about the NBA and, you know, funny things can happen. But I just think overall, you know, for the ninth pick, he's really solid and I think

he can contribute. And I think that's what you're looking for. Yeah, you know, I feel exactly the same way you do. And I said yesterday, in sort of previewing the draft, that I actually liked a lot more. I like Brandon Clark off that Gonzaga team as a pro. I just, to me, he is, and by the way, I think he would have been your type of guy because he's just high motor, relentless, you know, relentlessly competitive, you know, and just fearless. And Hachamara, I thought it was a good player, but I just thought Clark was better. And the way you described it, I didn't describe it, but you're totally right about this, that early in the year, and I mentioned the Duke game,

it became clear that this guy looked like a potential lottery pick. But later in the year, at times in watching him, he looked awkward as a basketball player, dribbling sometimes without his head up and not seeing the floor as much. And to me, that's always a little bit of a red flag that he doesn't look like the most natural of basketball players. I agree with that. And I think you want to see improvement during the year. I don't care what year you are as a college player. You want to see it in teams and you want to see it in individuals.

And, you know, I always look on into March, you know, for the NCAA tournament. Like, okay, what teams have gotten better, what player is really coming on strong? And that team usually does pretty well in the Incidably tournament. And so he – but the thing is, once you're drafted, once you're done with college, you also look at that as, okay, here we go. You know, this is my future, you know, and I've had guys tell me after they were drafted, they were really going to work hard, getting great shape to be ready to go with the pros. And I feel like, well, how about playing for us in great shape?

You know, don't, you know, why now? But really, that attitude is out there where I think these guys, and he seems like a mature kid, that these guys understand this is their profession now. This isn't, you know, playing in front of great crowds. or anything like that. This is what you do for a living, and it's a great way to make a living, and you know, you take advantage of it.

Yeah. I mean, you know, that's right. I mean, they're getting paid and the mindset and the mindset of the people around them is, all right, now this is serious stuff. You're getting paid now to go play as if it weren't serious when those players were playing for you. Who did you?

Go ahead, I'm sorry. No, no, go ahead. No, I was just going to say. It's a different mindset. And it takes a lot of maturity in college, I think, to really focus on the moment. If you're good enough to maybe have a chance to be a professional player, especially nowadays with the social media and your friends and all those people that are telling you how good you are, it's really hard to understand what you have in the moment. Yeah.

We didn't talk before the draft, but who did you really like in the? this draft and, you know, were there players that you thought teams might be making a mistake if they took them, you know, in the first round or too high? Yeah, I was wondering the third player from Duke, who I guess he went 10th in the draft, what's his name? I'm blanking on his name. Cam Reddish. Yeah, I was wondering about him, you know, I didn't see a motor there that is a typical Duke player, you know, that just goes all the time. And, you know, that type of thing. And maybe because he was playing with Williamson or, you know,

whatever that he didn't, you know, it was hard to, you know, be compared to those guys. So, but, you know, and that's the thing. I don't think anybody was sure after the first three or four picks last night. So these guys, they're going to separate themselves by their attitude, effort, all those things. People, you know, the analytics are fine. I mean, you know, you can measure guys. you know, all that, how they shoot the ball and all those things. But what separates players that are really even,

and it looked like there was a lot of players from the way everybody was talking before the draft, but were really even. So if that's the case, then the other stuff separates you, your heart, your determination, your teammates, you know, if you get with good guys on your team, all those things matter. You know, I think one of the things that we're seeing, too, is that you can't have enough shooters at the NBA level. I think personally that's why a guy like Cam Johnson from North Carolina flew up and went earlier than most people thought.

I loved him. I loved watching him play at Carolina last year. He's six, nine. The ball gets out of his hands quickly. I mean, he's a stone cold, you know, shooter. And, you know, the kid from Kentucky, Tyler Hero, who can just knock it down from anywhere. You know, even, you know, even though Ty Jerome can create a lot of shots in a lot of different ways, you know, he's a shooter. The other kid from Virginia got drafted in the second round, Kyle got. but I thought that that was an interesting thing last night too and I think that's what you look at with Cam Reddish is that he can flat out shoot it but there must have been

you're right though there must have been something about him because remember early in the season he's a top three top four pick and he went 10th but there must have been something there with him I just think the way the NBA has set it up say in the last decade the shooting thing has become the most dominant factor.

They don't care if a guy's undersized if he can really shoot it, no matter what the position is, as long as he can really shoot it. I mean, you're looking at guys, you know, a lot of guys that are around six feet say they're six feet and they're not quite there. You're looking at guys in the NBA now that are, you know, six, six one, that they can shoot. You know, they can really shoot the basketball.

And I think that's a key in the three-point line. Obviously, he has a lot to do with that. And, you know, the philosophy, in the game that there are no bad shots. If you're a good shooter, they want you to shoot the ball. There are no bad shots. Transition one on three, that's a good shot if you're open. Right.

You know, if you're somebody's underneath or, you know, get your lane right so you can angle to the basket for a bounce past and a dunk. But those days are done, I think, in the NBA. Yeah, they are. Who is the best pure shooter that you ever coached? That's pure shooter. I'd say there's two serruna's Chesa Cavages and Drew Nichols would be my two. At Maryland anyway.

I mean, how good of a stroke, though, did Mike Jones have? I know that he didn't have necessarily. Mike, if you wanted to do a video and show a kid how to shoot a jump shot, you would do Mike Jones. And he had ranged at the day. look like he was shooting for 15 feet. He could shoot from 30. In practice, we'd mess around at the end of practice. He'd go out toward half-quarter, you know, say 35 feet.

And he'd go up and shoot a jump shot like a normal player would shoot from 15 feet. And it just, the whole extension, his elevation on the jump shot was incredible to go with it, too. It was picture perfect. And, you know, he wasn't the player, you got a lot out of him. It was obvious, you know, he wasn't, he was not a good ball. handler, which really hurt him because it really prevented him from being a guy that could create his own shot. But, you know, off of that flex that you used to run and he'd come off one of those

screens and turn and face, it was money. Yeah, and he, you know, a lot of players work really hard on their game. You can tell a player what he has to work on, but, you know, a player has to want to do that. And Mike, he knew he had some ball handling deficiencies, but he just didn't work. enough at it because I thought he could have been a pro. I really did. He was a McDonald's whole American, you know. I mean, he was, you know, and he was a sprint champion in Massachusetts. He was really, there's a guy that had a lot of athletic ability that he didn't put into his game. And it's a shame because you hate to see guys waste talent. I know we're getting sidetracked here for a moment, but did you know, I mean, I thought Steve Blake,

turned into a really good shooter, you know, towards the end of his career with you. I mean, he hits some of the biggest shots, obviously. We've talked about the Yukon game many times. But did you think he would become as good of a three-point shooter in the NBA as he did? No, I think, you know, there's the opposite of a guy that got to the league and didn't feel that he had accomplished anything by just making the league. His goal was to play. And he knew. He knew. he had to shoot the ball better in the pros than he did in college, even though he did make a lot of big shots for us. And, you know, to stay in the league 13 years, I don't care if you're 610, 6-2, whatever, that's an accomplishment because, you know, all the injuries, all the new players that come in every

year. And Steve always had the fight to prove that he was good enough to be there. But if you look at some of the teams he played on and, you know, players he played with, including Kobe Bryant, who I saw written that Kobe Brian said Blake was his favorite player to play with. So that's pretty interesting. Yeah, he,

yeah, that is interesting. I've never seen that quote before from Kobe Bryant about Blake, but he had you know, he had those long arms too, which made him a better defender than I think people thought he would. And I love what you said also about because I had mentioned it earlier in the podcast today that last night when you're watching

the draft, the thing that's always bothered me. It's the same thing with high school recruiting is there's this sense that they've just accomplished something that is almost a conclusion. And it's like, no, this is just the beginning. I mean, this is the beginning for you. You've got to go out and play well and prove it and get additional contracts because, you know, some of these rookie deals at the end of the first round or second round deals, once the taxes come out of it, it's not as much as they think it is. Yeah, you know, it's great that the players celebrate that they get drafted, especially guys after the lottery picks.

But at the same time, you know, there's always people who win your job and you have to go in their understanding that where you are right now is not going to keep you in the league. You know, if you're Zion Williams, and yeah, he's going to be there a long time. But just about everybody else, you better keep working because you see it all the time. These guys fade. Kid Morrison talking about Gonzaga is a good example. Right.

He was a lottery pick and he just didn't make it, you know, for whatever reason. And, you know, that's what you guard against as a player. And hopefully all these guys are telling you how great you are because you got drafted will also tell you that you have to work very hard. Yeah. Where are you on Zion Williamson? Do you think he's a superstar at the next level? Until I see him shoot in the NBA, because the NBA will keep.

him from getting, yeah, everybody says, well, he can take anybody to the basket. Well, yeah, in college, you can, but the NBA's a little different. They've got a lot of strong guys there that don't weigh 285 pounds, but they're still really strong, and he's going to have to open up the defense when he has the ball by shooting the ball. And he'll get points. In other words, he'll always score because of his ability. And the thing he can do that I think I'd, you know, overload, I don't know,

not overlooked, but, you know, it wasn't talking about enough, was his ability to pass the basketball. I mean, you see some of the blocks he had as a defensive player. Yeah. Some of the, you know, moves to the basket were just overpowered guys. They were incredible. But I saw him make a couple skip passes that not many people have that type. That's almost like a Magic Johnson type of vision for a guy, six, seven, six eight. Speaking of vision, Gary, I don't know how much of John Morant you saw. I didn't see a lot of them until late in the season.

when Murray State was playing in their conference tournament, and then obviously in the two games they played in the NCAA tournament. But that guy, to me, just looks the part as a guy that sees the entire floor, sees things happen before they happen, is a great passer, makes everybody else better. And he just, to me, looks like the guy, and I said this on the podcast, that if you told me that Zion Williamson or John Morant became a future NBA MVP, I'd pick Morant, that he looks like a star. And I know it's hard to

predict right now, but what did you think of him? Well, first of all, I think that position is a star position now in the NBA. That's so true. Point court position. And so he's going to have a chance to show his skulls. I mean, you trade like Memphis did to open up that position completely, even, you know, before they draft the guy, it's just a statement of how they feel about him. And, you know, he is one of those guys that can do it both ways. His passing, I thought he was the best passing point guard I saw this year, but he's a scorer, too. I mean, he's got that mentality.

I remember playing against Chris Paul when he was a Wake Forest. When Chris Paul was young, he was incredibly quick, just like Moran is. And he had that ability, if you did double team, to find who he had to find for them to score. And I think when you bring that, as long as you don't forget that you're a passer as well as the scorer, then you're okay. The other players accept you very quickly. And I think that's your job as a rookie coming in at that point where position when the veteran players are looking like, hey, you know, it's unbelievable how they've catered this guy coming in. And so he better give me the ball when I'm open, you know, because guys are selfish, you know, guys, especially scorers. They want the ball, obviously, you know, so they can live up to their rep and their contract.

You know, you brought up Chris Paul, and it just made me think of a specific game when you were coaching Maryland against, I think it was Dino Gaudio was the coach, and Chris Paul was playing for Dino Gaudio that year. And I think you guys played him in a tournament game, and you threw a zone at Gaudio, and he had no idea what he was. to do with it. And I'll never forget. It was the turning point in the game. And you had a lot of those moments where you, you know, you figured something out. And by the time they figured it out, the game was already over. But some of those weight teams, I thought actually Skip Prosser was a, was a good coach. And obviously died. Prosser was a very good coach. I don't think he ever got a chance to really show how good he was. Another guy like that when I was coached, Herb Sindak.

Oh, yeah. He was always overshadowed by, you know, Dean Smith and Mike Shoshchevsky, which is understandable, but at the same time, Sondack could really coach. And that was where he was, he did his best job at NC State. In other words, he went to Arizona State, had Hardin playing for him at Arizona State, and then he's at Santa Clara now.

And I always thought that he could coach with anybody. And one of the great trivia questions is where Herb Sindak went to college. which was Carnegie Mellon, which he might be the only... Pretty hard to get him to come out of Carnegie Mellon. That's right. You had to get in there first. You know, it's funny that you mentioned him. ESPN's been running this series about... It's called Chasing Ghosts, and it's basketball programs that had legendary coaches,

and the programs, for all intents and purposes, have never been the same. And they did NC State the other day. And they essentially said, you know, it's never been, it's not been the same since Valvano. And they have a program that's won two national championships, but you've got to go back to the 70s and 80s to find it. And I thought Sendeck, and I'll never forget it, he took that team and that program to five or six straight NCAA tournaments and then got rid of them. Nobody ever talked about it. You know, they, it was just always Duke and Carolina down there. And if you're at Wake Forest, you know, it's like Skip Rosser.

You know, if he's coaching in a different state, people are saying what a great coach he is and things like that. And that can happen. It can happen to you. And it's like in Belbano was a very good coach, but at the same time, you know, he had some problems at NC State, just like a lot of coaches do during their career. Yeah.

I think it's an interesting conversation, by the way, to have about programs that sometimes their fan bases elevate them to a level that they really aren't. And I think, you know, with NC State, you know, the fan base, because they've won two national championships, sometimes the fan base thinks that they should do better than Herb Sendeck, you know, or do better than somebody that they have. I actually like the guy Kevin Keats that they have there right now. But, you know, we've talked about that as Maryland fans before. And sometimes in our own mind, we elevate the program to a little bit. level that maybe is a little bit higher than it is. But to me, it's always been a top

50, you know, you, you, you obviously with the national championship elevated it to being maybe not a blue blood with Carolina, Kansas, Duke, and Kentucky, but it was at the next level. I always thought of Maryland, we could be good enough to play those same. I mean, the commitment those schools make administratively, um, their basketball programs are incredible. And that's a big part of your success. I think that's one of the overlooked things is how's your administration? How do they feel, do they do everything they can to assist you?

In other words, Mike Shosheski, he's earned it. But he, you know, he walks in the office and all he has to do is get ready for practice. He doesn't have to put out fires. He doesn't have to, you know, fight getting a kid in school, anything like that. And, you know, it does make your life a lot easier as a coach when you have that, you know, as part of your program. All right. We talk draft and we talk to what like we usually do about a lot of things that we weren't intending to talk about. But it's always fun and I always enjoy it and I always appreciate it.

I'll talk to you soon. I mean, I know we were going to play golf at some point this summer. Yeah, that hasn't happened yet. We'll do that. Scott's going to be in town at some point soon, so we'll figure it out and get out there. Sounds good. All right. Thanks, Gary.

Thanks, Kevin. Appreciate it. Always great catching up with Gary. Always enjoy it. And, you know, talk draft a little bit. But as I often do, I digress into Maryland basketball stories from the past, which Gary loves talking about. There's nothing better than being with Gary outside of like an interview environment. He loves and always, you know, for guys like he.

him, you run into guys all the time that just want to talk about, you know, certain games and players and get stories. And Gary's always so generous with his time on that stuff and never seems to tire of talking about it. I've felt this way for a while. I think he has really missed coaching since retiring. And probably as recently as maybe just a few years ago, if the opportunity had been the right one, would have tried to figure out a way to get back into it. But anyway, thanks to Gary for spending some time with us today. Quick word about launch workplaces in Bethesda. If you've got an office right now that you need to move out of or you're working from home and you live in the Bethesda area, upper northwest D.C. area and you're looking for a new place. I want you to consider launch workplaces

in Bethesda. They've got flexible and affordable private office solutions so you can get work done. It's a beautiful new space, fully furnished offices. They've got conference rooms, co-working desks. So if you just want to come in one or two days a week to use a desk or if you need a conference room. They've got high speed internet, a cafe, parking, and plenty of it, and it's free. Get more work done today by moving your office to launch workplaces in Bethesda. Call today for an exclusive free two-day trial, 240-86714 or go to launchworkplaces.com. That's 240-860714 or launchworkplaces.com. All right, there was a story that sort of broke while we were, while we've been recording this podcast.

And Aaron brought it to my attention, and I want to read some of the quotes from it. But it is right now trending here this morning is the top story on ESPN.com. And it's about Alex Smith. Fox 5 here locally. Angie Goff is she a reporter or an anchor on Channel 5? I don't know. I'm assuming she's a reporter. Maybe she's an anchor.

I'm not sure. I think I knew who Angie Goff is, but I'm not sure if she's a reporter or an anchor, but it's not really meaningful. She got the interview on her podcast. It's called Oh My Goff podcast, and she interviewed Alex Smith. And I want to read some of the quotes from the story. She sets it up by saying Smith feels good enough now to at least consider returning, even if multiple hurdles remain and the team views the possibility as a long shot. And he said to Angie Goff, quote, that's the plan. There are steps I've got to conquer before I get there.

Learning to run again. That's a big one. I'm already throwing. Throwing isn't a problem, but dropping back, moving around, change of direction. The steps I'm at now are lifestyle steps. I'm still working on playing basketball with my kids and running around after my daughter. Those are things I have to conquer anyway. until I get to the point where I'm walking on the field.

I'm looking forward to it. I'm excited about the challenge. The stronger I get every week, the more I do, the more hopeful I am that that's a real possibility. In talking about the injury, by the way, in those first two, you know, quotes that I read through, the fact that he says he's still learning to run again. Obviously, that tells you how far off he is. And he still has to wear that external fixator, that contraption,

around his knee for another four to six weeks, which would put him in that contraption that he's had. It would mean he was in it for seven and a half months. But the fact that he's talking about learning to run again, and these are lifestyle steps that he is trying to get back to the point where he's healthy enough to play with his kids, these are the things you typically hear from someone who is not super confident about a return to professional football. he said to Angie Gough from Fox 5, he said the last three months have been life-changing, and he specifically talks about the first four months after the injury being, quote, really, really hard, just to be in a wheelchair as long as I was.

When you have independence and lose it, that was the hardest part. He credited, by the way, the effect of that external fixator, the thing that he has around his knee, he said that, quote, this thing is going to save my leg, save my bone, allow me to heal and walk again and hopefully play football again. But he said, quote, I'd be lying if I didn't say

that there were mental obstacles. There are things with my leg I don't trust yet. I feel I'm quite a bit further along than I think. And then he finishes by saying, quote, it's crazy looking and it sucks what happened, but at the same time people out there have it way worse. Life happens, and for me I feel like this is a time for being tested and having a challenge in front of me and how I can handle it, closed quote.

So good job by Angie Goff at getting that interview with Alex Smith, because that's really the first we've heard from him since the injury, Aaron. I'm pretty sure. Yeah, it is. But, you know, as a lot of us have been sort of told off the record that it's a long shot that'll ever, well, first of all, it was like next to zero chance of playing in 2019 and a super long shot of ever playing again. And, you know, I think some of these quotes indicate that, although I'm sure he'll give it a run.

And everybody, you know, who is a football fan and a Redskins fan wishes him the best. Clearly, the Redskins, you know, are moving on. I mean, they drafted the quarterback that they hope is starting in 2020. and then for the next 10 years beyond that. I mean, that's what they did in this draft is they drafted their franchise quarterback because they clearly cannot trust and don't view Alex Smith as a guy that's going to be able to come back and play at a high level. But, you know, obviously I think all of us just want him to get back to the point where he's healthy

and from a lifestyle standpoint, as he said, it's not a major factor for him. Okay, quick mention about the podcast. on the Kevin Sheehan Show.com. So I know I mention this all the time that if you're not comfortable on your iPhone or any phone listening to a podcast that it's really easy to listen to it on the website, I urge you to do that too every once in a while

because we also blog there every once in a while on the website, the kevin shiann Show.com, but it's also in many ways, Aaron, it's easier to fast forward and rewind than it is on iTunes or any of the other podcast, platforms and somebody brought that up to me yesterday because I was out on the golf course and they said I've never listened to the podcast on iTunes I've only listened to it on your website it's very

easy and I just find that actually it's much easier to rewind and fast forward through um personally I think it's easy to do on iTunes but I get it because you can really take a chunk out of it with your you know with your mouse by just you know scrolling ahead and clicking so check it out on the Kevin Sheehan Show.com occasionally uh if you will, but we still prefer that you subscribe on iTunes, rate us, review us, that works out best. All right, let's bring in Mark Zuckerman, who covers the team for Masson, Nats tonight, with the first of three, a huge three-game set with Atlanta downtown. Before we get to that, Mark, you know, I'm glad that they ended up getting three out of the four games, and I think actually

they could have potentially gotten all four in. I don't want to spend a lot of time belaboring, you know, whether or not these rainouts and the suspensions were worthy or not. But they got three out of the four in against Philadelphia and won all three. And I thought won all three impressively with, by the way, one of the more memorable pitching performances in recent, you know, Nat's history with the Black Eye game, I guess they're calling it now, with Max Scherzer. You surprised that they were really in many ways dominant over the three games that they actually got in against the Phillies?

I was impressed, very impressed with it. Now, I mean, the Phillies came into this kind of reeling themselves. They've got some issues, and certainly the Nats caught them at a good time. But it's tough to win to sweep any doubleheader. I don't care who you're playing. To win two games on the same day is never easy. And then to come back the next day and win, and like you said, it was pretty much convincing fashion.

I know the games were close, but it never really felt like they were in danger of blowing it. So this is a different team And, you know, it's a little too early to get too excited about it But I think what stood out to me is if you think back over the years Whenever they've had one of these big series Where they're maybe trying to get back in a race In the years that they didn't make the playoffs And you said, okay, well, here's their chance

They've got to do it now where else it's not going to happen They've more often than not fallen flat in those series And so for them to seize control back here win all three games play well in all aspects win it pretty convincingly I think it says something about this team that they are not nailing it in that they are determined to try to get themselves back in this thing

a long way to go we'll find out more this weekend because the Braves are a much better team and playing much better right now but that was a really good important statement I think that they made at least in relation to how they compare to the Phillies at the moment Yeah, you know, you're right. Some of these games were close, obviously, but I don't think they trailed in any game,

unless it was the first game, the day game, where no one was there. Maybe there was a first, there was. I think they were down one or nothing, but then they scored it right away. Yeah, scored right away. So they're within two games of 500 now, and they're clearly climbing their way back into this thing, and they can, you know, obviously climb their way much back into it this weekend. What do you attribute this stretch going back to when they lost the four in New York against the Mets? Because it's really, and I think at that point they were 12 games below 500.

What do you attribute this run to? I know healthy bodies offensively has been a big help, but what else? It's really, I think, a combination of everything. Yes, the lineup is much healthier and that makes different. Not just in the offense, but their defense is so much. better, in part because you have Trey Turner playing shortstop every day. Anthony Rendon, healthy,

playing third base every day. Brian Dozier playing a much better second base for them. The outfield playing much better. Think about how many games they lost early on where you said, boy, if they had just made this one player if they hadn't botched this one play, it might have

been a different outcome. Well, now you're talking about games that they're winning in part because of plays they're making in the field. Last night was a great example of it, a couple of plays at the plate to throw guys out. So that's a big part of it. The back end of the rotation has been much better. I know Fetty wasn't so great by the night, but in the bigger picture, he's been better. And Anabel Sanchez has been phenomenal since coming back from his hamstring injury. So that's a thing. And then the bullpen is stabilized. I'm not going to go out and say it's a good bullpen yet. But Tanner Rainey has really stepped up

and showing that he could be a reliable setup, man. Wander's Sweral when used, I think, properly not overused as showing that he has the stuff to be effective. So I think it's a combination of all these things. And just from an attitude standpoint, look, they could have folded after that New York series. They absolutely could have. I don't think anybody would have been surprised if they had.

Instead, they bonded together. And they said, this is not who we are. we know we're better than this. And instead of going out there and now trying too hard, which I think was really the problem early on, everybody's feeling the pressure and just trying to do too much. They're just trusting the fact that they are good players, that they have the ability to win games.

And you're seeing just a much more relaxed and just competent team out there than we saw for the first two months. The Phillies have not necessarily been very competent recently. anyway and Bryce Harper is having obviously a subpar season so much so that they tried him last night in the leadoff spot and I know that the Nats tried that a few times with him, you know, at a necessity on occasion and I guess for sort of experimentally at other times, you probably remember specifically when they did it and the reasons why. But you know at this point, you know, what kind of team do they have? Do you still consider them a contender?

They're still a couple of games ahead of the Nats, I think. What is it at this point? Is it three games ahead of the Nats? Something like that. Three up of the Nats, yeah, and I think a half game out of the wild card. So, look, I think it's important to look at teams in different ways here. We're seeing them at their worst right now. This is not who they're going to be.

How much better are they? Well, but that's now the question. So I think the lineup has a potential. will still be very good. Now, Andrew McCutcheon loss is huge. Yeah, right. And this is what's set up, ultimately, why Harper was leading off last night, because they tried Gene Secure there and didn't work out. They don't really have someone now to fill that role. So they just decide to pump everybody up a few notches, and now Harper's hitting first and Hoskins second. So that was big. And they've got their own bullpen issues. They've got back of the rotation issues. And I think the most surprising thing,

We spent all spring talking about who's going to sign Craig Campbell, who's going to sign Dallas Tyco. And the Phillies were this team that had all the money in the offseason. They spent a lot of it on Harper, but they still have plenty more room to operate. And you thought, boy, they're going to have to come away with one of these two guys because they had a need in both departments. And then they didn't get either of them.

And psychologically, that's got to be a demoralizing thing for the guys in that clubhouse. You know, there's still opportunities for them to try to improve their trades. But I think they blew a chance there to help themselves. out. The Braves are playing really, really well. The nationals are now playing well, and there's a lot of pressure in Philly. This was supposed to be the year it all came together, and at the moment, at least, it's not. I still think they're going to be in this thing. They're not going to fall apart completely, but they're finding out that it's not as easy as maybe they thought it would be. What's going on with that fan base as it relates to Harper right now in the contract that he signed?

Is there a lot of pressure? Is he feeling it or not? yeah I think he is but he knew what he was getting into when he signed there so he'll say all the things about hey they can boomie it's okay I get it I understand and you know he hits a home run and they're all on their feet and they love the guy so I don't think it's that but certainly and I think this was a fear all along with him just we've seen him over the years we know how he responds to different types of pressure I knew he's going to come out with his hair on fire this year he's going to try to make everything happen.

And you can even see it happened on the basis. He got thrown out twice. That third at home, yeah. Making the final out of an inning, just trying to make things happen. And again, kind of like the nationals when they weren't going well earlier this year, that's the last thing you want to do. You need to just trust yourself, trust your teammates. Don't try to do too much.

So I'm not surprised that he's maybe putting that pressure on himself to do a whole lot. But, you know, in the long run, he's going to be fine. And now is he going to be that MVP player that we saw from a few years ago? Maybe not. Maybe he just doesn't have that in him. But I also know from watching him over the years, when he goes bad, he goes really bad. But when he goes good, he goes really good. And there's going to be another good stretch here at some point as it starts to get more comfortable at the place.

Yeah, those that are weighing in on this deal already as if it was the worst deal of all time, they still have more than half of their games left in his first year. Of 13. Yeah, and we've seen him start hot, then sort of struggle in the middle portion of the baseball calendar, and then, you know, really ramp it up towards the end of the season. I'd be surprised if he doesn't end up having a statistically, you know, not a Bryce Harper MVP year, which was clearly at this point the aberration, but a much better year than we see right now, maybe hitting somewhere in the 265 range with a better-on-base percentage that he has right now,

which, by the way, I think is okay his on-base percentage. But I would be surprised if he doesn't get on one of those runs. He's too good not to. Yeah, I agree. And if you remember last summer at the All-Star break, I want to say he was hitting 213. Oh, I thought it was even, I think it was 209 at one point. I think he bought him out there and then maybe, yeah, something like that. And then, you know, he finished close to 250.

So it got locked because the team wasn't playing well, and his numbers were so bad early on. But he had a very good second half last year. Yeah, I do think he's going to go on one of those stretches here at some point where it looks more like the guy that we remembered. Let's talk about Max Scher's performance the other night for a moment. You know, that was one of those games that I ended up just sitting there compelled by it to see him in the way he looked in the fact that he was pitching and it was a big game against the Phillies and all that added up. How, I mean, I don't want to exaggerate what it was, but is it a game, you know, that was? worthy of sort of having a nickname to it, which I've seen some people calling it the black eye game. Was it that compelling to you? You're there every night? Yeah, it was. And now, you know,

maybe we get caught up at the moment a little too much, make a bigger deal out of it than it was. Here's what was kind of funny to me. Afterwards, Max was trying to downplay it. He's saying, I wasn't really in any pain. It looks a lot worse than itself. But then two seconds later, and about three lockers over, we go to talk to Brian Dozier, and he calls it one of the most impressive things he's ever seen and says Max is probably the best pitcher of this generation. So Max may not have thought it was a big deal, but the guys in that clubhouse sure did.

That sets a tone for everyone else. Look, whether it actually affected his performance or made it any harder for him to pitch, I don't know. But let's not lose sight of the fact that he put together a huge start against a good team in a game that the nationals felt they needed to win against reset the tone here and show that they are legitimately getting back in this thing. So that was a huge start for them. And, you know, if I could have put it, you know, top two or three Max Scherzer starts?

No, I mean, there's no hitters, a 20 strikeout game, you know, 300 strikeouts last year. But it definitely goes up there, and it's something that we're all going to remember when it's all said and done. And it made for just a pretty cool moment. I think it was a good convergence of everything coming together on that night. And he relished it, you know. He doesn't mind the spotlight like that. I'm not saying he'd milked it because he doesn't do that.

But he likes that spotlight and he likes to rise to the occasion. And he likes to show everyone that he will go out there and do anything for his team when maybe others would not have given the way that he's. look. What I loved about it, too, and you touched on it, is that, you know, in this day and age that we live in, there are a lot of athletes that would have, you know, tried to turn themselves into heroes for going out there, looking the way they looked. And as you mentioned, and Tommy and I talked about this yesterday, his response was, you know, trust me, it looks a lot worse than it actually is. I don't really have any pain. And what he does, and it's a lesson for a lot of these people.

Watch Max Scherzer. He lets others do the talking for him. You know, you went to Dozier, and Dozier said one of the greatest pictures of our generation or whatever, let other people do the talking for him. I love this guy. And I believe him, actually, that he probably wasn't in anywhere near the pain that it looked like. Black eyes tend not to be painful, you know, but there was some swelling there. but I just love the fact that he didn't take advantage of the moment to make himself out to be some sort of, you know, martyr for going out there.

Yeah, and look, he just views this as this is his job. And the most important thing he can do is show up for work every day. And that doesn't just mean the fifth day when he pitches, but all the days in between, everything that he does to prepare himself for it. And so in his mind, could not take the mound when he was supposed to. And look, let's be honest here, they very easily could have started Feddy in that game. have started Austin Voth, who was called up as the doubleheader extra man. Because of the rain out, Scherzer did not have to pitch. They easily could have pushed him back to tonight and had him pitch against the Braves.

But his mindset is, this is my job. I'm supposed to do this. I'm setting an example for everyone else. If I don't go out there, then I'm not doing what I'm supposed to do. And so that's just the attitude he has, and it is infectious. It certainly rubs off on everyone else. All right. So tonight Dallas Keikles pitching for the first time for the Braves, and you've got three. This is a big series. You know, we've talked to, you know, in the past over the years about, you know, May and April and how important games are.

And, you know, again, they're not even halfway through their schedule. But for mid to late June, this is a pretty big series. They've got an opportunity to, you know, continue this momentum and then have from a number standpoint at the end of this weekend looking up and saying, wow, no, we're now legitimately in a race, you know, approaching July in the All-Star break. How will they match up with this Atlanta team that they're facing right now versus the team that they faced a few weeks ago on the road where they won two games in Atlanta? Yeah, I was going to say they've already beaten them twice, the only two times they faced this year, but it was a little different circumstance. I think they faced Kevin Gosman, who's been terrible, and I'm blanking on the other one. But that was a little bit.

better matchup for them. Right now you're talking about you're not going to have Scherzer, you're not going to have Strasbourg in this series. I thought, I'm sorry. You do have Strasbourg tonight, right? Yeah, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. You're right. Strasbourg tonight. Straser's supposed to pitch last night. Strasbourg tonight, Sanchez has been good, and then somebody has to be called up, probably

Joe Ross for Sunday. So you don't have Max, you don't have Corby. So Corbyn Campa Sunday? Corbyn't think that they would bring him back on short rest. Okay. I'd be surprised that they would do that. You never say never, but I don't think they're going to do that. So, you know, it's a little bit not ideal. And then the Braves have, you know, Kikul, who's going to be fired up tonight,

Fultenevich, and then their top rookies, Soroka, who's starting on Sunday. So it is a tougher matchup. The Braves are playing really well right now. Now, all that said, the Nationals have won their last, I believe, five games against the Phillies and Braves. They're overall eight and five against those two teams, something like that. So, I mean, they are showing that they can compete with the teams that are ahead of them in the division.

Here's an opportunity now, given how much better they're playing, to come out and say, however many games they win this weekend, to say, hey, we are still on par with you guys, or maybe even better if they win a couple of games, and just sort of remind the Braves that, hey, you know, we're not out of this thing. You don't have this thing locked up. They're going to see them a lot over the rest of the season. There's still 17 games between these two teams. There's going to be a lot of opportunities for them and try to make up the ground.

But I think this weekend is more about sort of the statement potentially that you can make, as opposed to the practicality of, well, how many games back. But they're not going to be in first place at the end of the weekend. That can't happen. But they can send a statement to say, hey, don't forget about us. We're going to see you plenty of times over the rest of the summer. Yeah, I mean, I think this is one of those weekends. they could be four and a half back on Monday.

They could be 10 and a half back on Monday. But I would think that, you know, it would be really important from a psychological standpoint to win this series, to win two out of the three this weekend because that puts them in a pretty good spot sitting there six and a half back with. As you mentioned, still a lot of games left to be played head to head and otherwise.

Thank you for doing this, especially on short notice. I always appreciate it and enjoy it. And we'll talk soon. Thanks, Mark. My pleasure. Thanks, Kevin. Follow Mark on Twitter at Mark Zuckerman. Mark's really good at what he does, knows the game, and is there with the team virtually every game. Big series. I'm going to pay attention to it and watch a lot of it, I think, this weekend against Atlanta. Thanks to Mark, thanks to Gary Williams. Thanks to Aaron. Back on Monday, have a great weekend, everybody.