The Kevin Sheehan Show - Zoomed, Rivera, & Rivalry

Episode Date: October 22, 2020

Thom's theory on why Jeffrey Toobin got Zoomed opened the show. Then the boys got to WFT talk including the state of the Dallas/Wash rivalry, Ron Rivera's "cut-off" memory, and Thom's pick on Sunday's game. They also picked their top 4 teams in the AFC and NFC while Thom simultaneously asked Kevin for a favor.  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

You don't want it. You don't need it. But you're going to get it anyway. The Kevin Sheehan Show. Here's Kevin. It's a sports fix Thursday, Tommy, from the Fortress of Solitude. Frederick. I'm here in this studio in Bethesda by myself.

Once again, one of these days we are going to be reunited in the same studio. Although I have a feeling that you, for the rest of your life, will be in a fortress of solitude. Have you, I'm just curious, have you gone in at all when you've done the Chad hit in the, you're still doing that, right? Yeah, I do that every Wednesday. But do you do that via Zoom? I do that via phone. Okay, via phone.

Just a regular phone call. I have not been in the studio there since March. Since March. Okay. I have not eaten in an indoor restaurant since March. I would warn you that on the Zoom call. especially the ones that include video on versus those like the one we're doing, which is a video off Zoom call. The reason we do video off is we did find that doing video on on a podcast, actually there were some issues with the audio.

I'm sure we can get those fixed. We haven't really looked into them because this is an audio medium, even though we could be looking at each other right now if we were doing Zoom video on. but I would urge you not to go Jeffrey Tubin in a video on Zoom call. That is one of the more bizarre stories. And, I mean, how, seriously, how desperate and how ready to go do you have to be to be taking care of yourself on a Zoom call? I mean, come on, man. The attraction there has to be the danger element.

Oh, the risk element. It's got to be. Oh. What else is the attraction? That's something that you can do, you know, in the confines of your home with no one watching. There's got to be the thrill of the risk. That's great. You know, I never quite understood that.

Yeah, I mean. But I can't think of, I mean, this is one of the more respected journalists in the United States. And I'm sorry, but now he's on the bar. Alper. He's his, no, he is. His career, yeah, I know that. If you want to be a wacko, he's not. No, no.

That's not true. I, I've watched him a lot. I've watched him a lot over the years. I've watched him a lot over the years. And he is the supposed legal analysts. And I think his politics very often get in the way of his legal analysis. I think he's good on television. What word did I say?

I don't know what you said. What word did I use to describe him? Journalist. You see, because he don't listen to me. See, I've read his stuff. He's very smart and very good. But now he's gone to Marv Albert route. He's never going to be taken seriously again.

Wow. I mean, no one's ever going to look at him again and not think of him, you know, choking his chicken. Unbelievable that he would do that on a Zoom call. You know, when I first heard the story, story a couple days ago, I thought, well, I would bet a lot of people are jumping on Zoom calls, maybe in their boxer shorts, you know, or their underwear or, you know, whatever. But he had, he apparently was full-fledged, naked, and taking care of himself. And maybe it was the risk and the thrill of, I wonder if I can get away with this. Well, guess what? You didn't. The other story,

before we get to anything sports related, is this Rudy Giuliani thing in the Borat film? First of all, when does this new Borat film come out? I think it comes out tomorrow. It does. Or Saturday, one or two. It comes out in the next day or two. So apparently, Sasha Baron-Cohn,

who is brilliant, and I've seen all of the movies. It's funny about all of his characters. I actually think Borat's my least favorite of his characters. My all-time favorite character of his was Ollie G, which was the show that he, you know, obviously launched, became famous with. And I'm telling you, Tommy, it was one of those deals where, you know, I always say that you and my good friend Scott are the same. And that is, if you don't discover the show, then you don't want, no matter how great it is, you're not going to watch it, because you have to be, you've got to be the early adopter. If you're not the early

adopter that it's just not good enough. Well, when that show first came on, I don't know, late 90s, probably. I'll never forget after like the first episode, Van Pelt calls me and he's like, you got to watch his show. And I watched it and the two of us like we were early adopters on Sasha Baron Cohen and Ollie G and all of the other characters. But if you haven't heard the Rudy Giuliani story, apparently he was, you know, he was, you you know, basically doing some sort of, you know, gotcha on Giuliani, where he sent

um, uh, Borat, the character, his teenage daughter, um, pretending to be a television reporter into sort of seduce Giuliani. And Giuliani apparently, you know, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in a hotel room with it all cameraed up, um, starts to undress. And, and, uh, and, and, uh, and, and, uh, and, and, and, and, Actually, Borat comes in screaming, she's only 15. And says, she's too old for you. And then Giuliani quickly sits up and appears startled. And anyway, he claims, he claims he was. He's been married.

He's been married, what, three times? A lot, right? At least, yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, he has some relationship issues, obviously. You know, I met Rudy. at Shelly's back room, my cigar bar, about five years ago. And we had a pretty 10, 15 minute conversation.

Really? And I got to tell you, Kevin, the elevator doesn't go all the way up. Yeah. There's something not there anymore. You know, he may have been, look, this was a prosecutor that destroyed the mob. Oh my God. In New York City. It's clean New York City up.

And then, by the way, became a hero during 9-11. I'm not talking about, yeah, which all was phony bullshit. But the mayor, I'm not talking about him being a mayor. I'm talking about him being the prosecutor that basically destroyed the mob. Right. But that guy, that guy's God. That guy's not there anymore. Yeah.

I don't know what you meant by the whole thing on 9-11 being bullshit. But he was a strong. presence and a fearless, you know, leader during that time. He was a phony. How so? He was a phony. How so? I mean, all those first responders down there working in that area, not being told about the dangers involved, the long-term risks involved to them, you know, that's one of a number of things.

Yeah. Well, I mean, those are mistakes. I mean, how was he a phony? I thought you were like saying, like, the big bravado and the toughness and the leadership stuff and was somehow phony. He made mistakes. There's no doubt about it. Okay.

Okay. Is that a better way to describe it? Yeah, I guess. Okay. You know, I'm looking this up right now because I didn't know if this was true or not. He was named the Time Magazine person of the year in 2001 for that. Anyway, you know, the thing about Giuliani, I think over the years, for me, he's just so outrageously arrogant.

And there are a lot of people on both sides of the aisle that are outrageously arrogant and to me sometimes overly so and overly ambitious in many ways where it's almost a turn off. But whatever. Anyway, he claims, right, doesn't he claim that he was just taking the mic off? Yeah. Something like that. Something like that.

I don't think that he's been busted in the same way that. Tubin was busted. No. Not yet anyway. I don't think so. But, I mean, again, you know, that guy, we talked for 15 minutes about boxing in the garden in the 1940s and the 1950s. And just the, there was no connection.

I mean, and it was pretty scary, actually. This guy, this guy had the president's ear. Why would he see in Shelley's? Was he just in town and wanted to, he's a big cigar? He's a big cigar guy. He used to go to Shellies a lot. Okay. Arnold used to go to Shellies when he was in town.

You know, if he wanted to smoke cigars, once D.C. passed the law stopping the restaurants from allowing it. Right. So a lot of guys used to smoke cigars at the Capitol Grill. Yeah. You know, places like that. Well, once they weren't allowed to do that, they all wound up at Shelley. Sure. Sure.

And, you know, various places around town. but Shelley's has been your spot and is the cigar bar of note in downtown. As you know, owned by my former next-door neighbor of many years ago. He hasn't sold it yet. Bob hasn't sold it yet, has he? No. No, he hasn't. How's he doing?

He's doing very well last I heard. Very well. Well, tell him I said hello because he's no long. He hasn't been my neighbor for many years now. They sold the house a few years ago. Anyway, real quickly, before. we get into a conversation about baseball, football team, and other things. I have an early smell test. I'm not going to wait until the end of the show. I don't know why.

I feel like I've got to mix up the delivery of this, maybe change the mojo a little bit on the smell test. It's brought to you by... You have a rough year? So far, yeah, definitely. It's brought to you by MyBooky.ag. Go to MyBooky.orgie.org. If you're looking for a reliable place to bet on sports and other things, they're taking a lot of election bets. They've got a ton of election prop bets. They've also got a casino, an online casino, an online racebook. They've got it all at MyBooky.ag. But if you go to MyBooky.orgie. You can make a deposit up to $1,000 and have it matched by MyBooky.org.com if you use my

promo code, Kevin D.C. That's K-E-V-I-N-D-C. And again, if you put in $300 or $100, they'll match it up to $100. It's $4. free money to play with, and that's a good deal. You're not going to find that deal in a lot of places. Fair lines, fair pricing. I've mentioned that many times, and a trustworthy place. MyBooky.orgie.ag, use my promo code, Kevin, D.C. I just want to get this out. I got to change it up a little bit instead of waiting until the end of the show. And tomorrow, I might even do the smell test just to start the show. See if that works. You know, when you're a gambler, Tommy, there's a lot of superstition. There are a lot of superstition. There are a lot of,

Have you ever seen the movie used cars? I have not. Oh, you should watch it sometime. It's with Kurt Russell, early Kurt Russell. It's very, and Jack Warden, it's very funny. Oh, really? And there's a character in there that's really superstitious. And they bet his friend bets all his money on a football game and they're watching it in a bar.

So this guy does. And his friend, he had bet against the other team. So he had betted against his friend and didn't know it, but wanted his friend to win the money. So he did everything he could to create bad luck for himself in that bar in that moment. So he would lose the bet so his friend would win the bet. But, I mean, like he threw a chair at a mirror. He, you know, turned over soft shakers. I mean, there's all kinds of stuff.

So, yeah, I know how, I mean, it's a funny moment about how betters are. I think my favorite betting superstition scene or scenes is De Niro in Silver Lining's playbook, which I actually really enjoyed that movie. I don't know. Did you see that movie or not? Yeah, I've seen it. And actually, I'd like to see it again. I've been meaning to watch it again because there's a lot.

I forget about it, but I remember how much I liked it. Well, Bradley Cooper's in it. Jennifer Lawrence is in it. De Niro's in it. De Niro plays Bradley Cooper's father. Bradley Cooper's wing nut. He's, you know, suffering from all sorts of things. And he starts to date Jennifer Lawrence in a very odd relationship that turns into a beautiful relationship. But anyway, they're all in Philadelphia. They're big Eagles fans. And, you know, De Niro is just constantly, you know, betting games and talking about, you know, you got to be here,

you got to sit here. You can't, you can't ruin the juju. Like, it's all about, the juju and keeping the right kind of, you know, mojo going. And, you know, they're talking about games against the Cowboys or Washington. Like, it's the whole NFC East thing with the Eagles games. And eventually they put together this huge parlay bet. I'm trying to remember exactly what it was. It involved the Cowboys and the Eagles, and he's betting the Cowboys. And it involves this dance contest that Bradley Cooper and Jennifer Lawrence are involved in. I love that movie. And De Niro plays the old, you know, football fan betting on his own team way too much gambler that is, you know, totally superstitious about the whole setup.

Like, you know, what kind of food we're going to have and where everybody's going to sit and you got to be here, you can't be. What do you mean you're not going to be here watching the game? If you're not here watching the game with me, the Eagles can't win, you know, all that stuff. That movie, that movie might be 10 years old now. Yeah, I think it is. Yeah. I liked that movie a lot.

Okay. My smell test... Go ahead. My smell test pick involves the Eagles game tonight. They're playing the Thursday night game. The Eagles and the Giants are playing the Thursday night game. The Eagles are laying four and a half against the Giants. Big, big Tommy NFC East matchup.

I mean, this is huge. All of these NFC East matchups the rest of the way are big and important. I really like the Giants tonight. the four and a half. The public's on Philly. For what reason, I have no idea. I think they just perceive the Giants to be a terrible team that barely hung on to beat a really terrible team on Sunday in Washington. And I do think a lot of people just assume now that Dallas is imploding that Philadelphia will be the team to win the division, but they're more injured than anybody. I mean, everybody. Miles Sanders is out tonight. Zach Ertz is out tonight. And I said,

this on the podcast on Monday and somebody really took me to task on Twitter and I didn't respond but I think I responded with Cooley yesterday. I said that the giants aren't terrible and somebody, you know, of course, took that as, you think the giants are good? Really? What, you're an idiot? I didn't say the giants are good. I said the giants aren't terrible. There's a big difference. In this division, not being terrible, may be just good enough to win the division. And I don't think the Giants are the worst team in the division. I actually think in some ways they may be the team that has a chance to make like a mini

run to 5 and 11 and have a legitimate chance to win the division. That's crazy because nobody sees it with the Giants. I actually think Daniel Jones, I like them. I think they're better defensively than people think. They're not a good team. They're a bad team. but among four bad teams, they may be the least of the bad. I have a feeling we're going to see some of that tonight.

I think the Giants are going to win the game outright, but the Smeltest Pick is the Giants plus the four and a half tonight. What were you going to say? Well, I like the Eagles because they played the Steelers and their Ravens pretty close. Two excellent teams. And I just think they're talent eventually, even though they're hurt. I think they have enough talent to beat the Giants, who I understand what you're saying, the Giants execute like a professional football team.

A little bit. Yes. Yeah. And, you know, they don't do that in Washington. That does not happen. No, although the truth is that Washington executed more like a professional outfit on Sunday than they have much of the first five games. Except for the fumble. Yeah, I mean, look, the Baltimore game, you're right.

They had a chance to tie late, no doubt. They were also down by 18 points going into the fourth quarter and we're getting their ass kicked. But I think Philadelphia, I think what Philadelphia has is they are the best coach team in the division. They have, you know, championship heart and pedigree. Like, you know, they've got a lot of players that have won a lot of games and won playoff games and won a Super Bowl. They have the best quarterback in the division, even though, you know, he's,

not great right now, but I don't see them being very effective without Sanders and Hertz. I just don't see it. They just don't have any weapons. Now, Deshawn Jackson may be coming back tonight. I do think that they're good on defense, though. But I think the Giants just faced a, you know, a team up front defensively that's decent in Washington. I think, look, I think Philadelphia is going to eventually figure out a way to get to 6-9 and 1 and win the division. But I bet the Giants finished second in the division. That would be my guess right now. Anyway, I like the Giants tonight plus the four and a half, specifically for the reason of the public's on them, the sharp monies, the public's on Philly, the sharp monies on the Giants that

opened at six, it's down to four and a half. And maybe it's because, Tommy, of what you said, maybe the public likes Philly because they're like, oh, they almost beat Baltimore, and they almost beat Pittsburgh. And they're only four and a half against. the Giants. So I like the Giants tonight. There you go. Okay. Okay. Well, before we start talking football and stuff that people might be listening to this podcast to, let's get back to the entertainment world for a second because I have a favor to ask you. Okay. Okay. I know that, you know, you being such a high roller and such an important figure that you've got lots of important friends and contacts. You've done this to me before. You know, I know. I know. I

know this. Yeah. And I, I need your help. What do you need help? Because, uh, I've got these two screenplays that I've finished. And I need to get them in the hands. Haven't you already asked me this? And I don't think so. People in the entertainment industry, important people. You have, I don't need, I don't need you to get them made. I just need you to help me get them in the hands of people who can get them made. Who the hell? And then let them decide. You have asked me this before. It rings very familiar. Number two, who the hell would I know in Hollywood that would get a screenplay red? You know people who know people. Stop it. I don't know anybody that knows anybody. You're not thinking this. You're not thinking this. What do you think? I can call like Tony or Scott or

or somebody like that and say, hey, who do you know in Hollywood? I've got I've got Leverro's screenplay. He's written it's going to be really good this is this has this has Oscar written all over it what if I sent you one of them I would love to read that I that I'd be very interested if that's the favor would you read one of my screenplays I would love to do that no no no no no that's not that's not a favor that's me doing a favor for you let you read right you're providing free entertainment right right or wasting a lot of my time it depends on you know the favor is you helping me get this in the hands of people who can get the made. Do you remember when you wanted to write a book about Lefty?

Yes. And then I put you in touch with Lefty, right? Yes. And what happened on that? Lefty kneecapped me. He did. He did. I went down to his place in Ocean City one Saturday afternoon.

We spent hours talking. Not in Ocean City in Virginia Beach. No, Bethany. Oh, you went to his place in Bethany, okay. And Bethany. We had, you know, and we spent hours talking and we got along great. And, you know, he told me about this other guy in North Carolina who was bugging him to write a book. And I forget what it was about, but it wasn't quite about Lefty, but Lefty was going to be involved in it somehow.

And I tried to explain to Lefty that I could produce for him a better book that would help. him, this was at the time when he's trying to get in the Hall of Fame. Yeah. I said, this, I mean, the book is a ticket that gets you on talk shows. It gets you, I mean, written about,

you know, I said that that's the point of the book. The point of the book, and he, here he was worried about the money. I kept explaining to him, you're not going to make a lot of money on a book like this. I said, that's not the point. The point is what I just told you, you know, is the doors that

a book like this would open. And, you know, he bought it all. And then two weeks later, he agreed to do the book with the other guy. And have you ever seen that book? I haven't seen that book. Who was the other guy? Did you even know him? I don't even remember his name.

And nobody has ever heard of the book. And no one has ever seen the book. So I rest my case. You know, it's so funny. I know I've told this story before. But I love this story because you were with me. I know the one you're going to tell. Yeah, and when you mentioned that Lefty wanted money, and it just reminded me of this, when Tommy and I did, when we were hosting our show together, we did this thing for, I don't know, four or five years called Lunch with a Legend.

Many of you remember it, and those of you who didn't, I'll explain what it was, about two to three times a year, maybe twice a year. We basically did a two-hour show at Morton's downtown in Connecticut Avenue, sold tickets to it with a local sports legend. We did a lot of different people over the years. We did, you know, we did Sonny Jurgensen. You know, we did Mike Wilbon. We did Dexter Manly. We did. I did Jim Palmer.

You weren't there for that one. That was one of my favorites. Gary Williams. John Thompson. Richie Pettabone. The list goes on and on. And there were two people that basically, we got to the point where there were two people left that we really hadn't done. We hadn't done Sugar Ray Leonard and we hadn't done Lefty Dressel.

But I had been trying to get Lefty for the five years that we had been doing it. And every single time, he's like, what are you going to pay me? And I would say, we're not paying anybody, coach. It's like an honor. We sell tickets. It'll be, you'll pack the place. You know, it'll be two hours of you telling stories. And would you pay Gary Williams?

Would you pay John Thompson? And I said, we didn't pay him anything. And he said, well, that's because they lived there. So anyway, to make a long... The other person we never did get was Sugar Ray Leonard, which we tried to get. Yes, we did. It just never worked out. He was interested in doing it.

I know you talked to him and I talked to him. He was always interested to do it if he had been in town. Right, if he had been in town. So anyway, make a long story short. basically lefty you know he's the all-time salesman an all-time recruiter somehow he wrangles some money out of us to come up and do this from his Virginia Beach House and you know we're going to pay for his transportation we're going to pay for the hotel and we're going to pay him to do this and so I remember one of the conversations saying to him when I made the offer and he goes well you know

that that's not good enough And I said, do you want me to come down there in my station wagon and park it in front of your house until you say yes like you did with Moses Malone? And he goes, all right, I'll do it. That's a good one, Kevin. So anyway, after all the wrangling and we end up, you know, paying him, it's our show started at 12 noon. We're all down at Morton's. And he was required to show up at 1130 because there was a cocktail hour where he would, you know, talk to all the people. By the way, that event, remember Tommy?

It's sold out in minutes. That was one of those that we packed the house within an hour of announcing that Lefty was going to do this lunch with a legend with us. And so it's 1130. He's not there yet. And we're upstairs and, you know, I don't know, maybe Chuck was the program director. And he said, where is he? And I said, I don't know. And then all of a sudden I look at my phone and, you know, it's ringing and it's lefty.

I'm like, coach, we're left. we're lefty where are you Kevin I can't do it unless you come up with another $500 and I just said Are you kidding me and he said Yeah I'm just bullshit you

I'm on the elevator coming upstairs And he He gets off the elevator and he walks in And he looks at me and he's just lave he said I got you and I said yeah you got me You got me good he's all right where do we go now What do we do next? He was Remember how good he was and what a

great storyteller he was. Oh, we got, we got so much mileage out of that. Isn't that the one where he told the, Dean Smith? He told the story about being naked. He told that story. You tell that one. I don't remember the details of it, but I remember it was, the post wrote about it. He got a lot of attention.

Well, the one that, he wasn't naked on a Zoom call. No, no. The one I remember is when, because Dean Smith had just passed away, I'm pretty sure it was shortly after Dean Smith had passed away. And he said, you know, I call, you know, I've been calling Dean once, you know, once a week for the last couple years. And he's really, you know, it may have been before he passed away. Dean Smith had, I think, dementia at the end of his life.

And he said, just, you know, he doesn't know what he's talking about. And he said, but now that, you know, Dean sort of out of it, or maybe he had passed at that point. I forget. He goes, I can tell you some Tom McMillan in Dean Smith stories. basically, you know, he accused Dean Smith of being, you know, a cheater. You know, he said that Dean offered Tom McMillan's brother, you know, a job at a big-time job, got him a big-time job at a bank down in Chapel Hill to try to get him down there.

And, you know, Dean Smith apparently all McMillan wanted was, I think, his own room. And so Lefty, as they were about to make the decision, and it was right before school was going to start, lefty basically went into one of the dorms by himself, went to one of the kids were already in the dorms, he said, you two, you're out of this room. And nobody, you know, the RA didn't know, nobody in dorm control knew. And lefty said, you go to the dorm people,

you tell him, Coach Drizell needed this room for Tom McMillin. And, you know, and he called up Tom, and Tom was heading down. He said, just stop by. Tommy, I got your room for you because McMillan was heading down to Chapel Hill, basically to commit to Dean Smith. And when he got to campus, he had Tom McMillan his own room, which meant, and Tom's right there and then said, all right, lefty, I'm coming, I'll play here. And he never went to Chapel Hill. Do you remember that part of the story? And I'm sure I'm butchering it to a certain

degree, but he basically went into one of the dorms and through two people, through two guys who were roommates out of the room, and who knows where they got relocated. It could have been a Delphi for all I know, but Lefty was phenomenal that day. You asked me for the Sonny Jurgensen one that we did. I went and looked for it for you about two months ago because I was going to surprise you and I was going to make a copy and send it to you because I knew you thought I had forgotten about it and I hadn't forgotten about it. It's on one of my big lists.

I keep a list of like a things to do list, like all these things on the list was... All I'm asking to you is to be added for the things to do list with a new thing to do. I know. Well, I've had on that list, you know, get a copy of The Lunch with a Legend with Sonny Jurgensen to give to Tommy. And Tom, I swear to God. And I don't think I've told you this. like two months ago, I'm looking for all of those shows.

I know I had them somewhere, and I couldn't find them. I could not find them. And then what really upset me about it is that the one that I did with Coach Thompson, which you were not there for, I don't know why you weren't there for that. I think it was before we started doing the show. No, no, it wasn't. We started these things together. I don't think I ever did them without you.

Well, I didn't do Jim Palmer way. Yeah. No, Tim Palmer was before you and I started doing the show. Okay. Maybe that's true. Maybe that is true. And I went to look for the one that I did with Coach Thompson because that was really memorable for me. I mean, he was just phenomenal for two hours. And I couldn't find any of them. So I think they're- You know, what were we thinking, not keeping those? I mean, we're sitting and talking to these great people. And, you know, we're just treating it like business. as usual. The first thing we should have done is make sure we both had copies in this thing. I had copies made of them, and I have them somewhere, but where I thought they were, they weren't in my home. So my next move is to probably go into the attic to see if there's like a box with a bunch of stuff.

I don't save very much, as you know, you know I'm a minimalist. I don't save a lot of things, but I know I saved all those. I know I saved the one with Sunny, Lefty, Thompson, and Gary. I know, and Palmer, I know I saved those because I think the, my, look, the, the sunny one you and I did was so memorable for both of us. And one of the things we loved about it is how much Sunny loved doing it and how much he enjoyed doing it as well. And, and, and, uh, but I, Palmer was incredible.

I've never done one of those things. a longer interview with somebody with a better memory of just every detail than that Jim Palmer had. He was incredible. And who loves to talk about those things? Loves to talk about those things. Such a good storyteller. Yeah. And then Coach Thompson was the other one that was very memorable.

And I can't find him. I'll find them. Anyway. Well, now I've given you something more important to do. But I don't. If you could convince Lefty-Riselle to basically, do what he did for peanuts, then you can help me get my movies made.

You know what else? He ended up not taking the money for the hotel because I guess Maryland put him up in a hotel and paid for it. I do remember that? And he was like, well, you all don't have to pay for the hotel. I got that taken care of. You know, it's amazing we got people to do that for nothing. I know, I know.

I mean, because the radio station made money. The radio station did make money on those events. Yes, they did. But we're asking these people to do it for nothing, and they did it. That's so amazing. Well, you know, it was CJ's idea on this thing before he, you know, C.J. was the one, I remember he came up with the idea, and he's, you know, he would always be coming up with ideas that he thought would be good programming, but that the station could make money on.

And the station did make money, and we did convince all those guys to do it for nothing except for Lefty. Lefty was the only one that required that we pay them. but he was great. Anyway, before we get to the Washington football team here, I wanted to... So you're going to help me out. I mean, I want you to send me this... You know what?

I'll help you out if I think the screenplay is any good. Oh, then it's a lock. How am I going to help you with something like that? Anyway, I wanted to mention something real quickly. So the Raiders have some COVID-19 stuff going on. Trent Brown was tested positive, and then they sent their whole offensive line home yesterday. Now, last week we had a bunch of these late in the week, too, and every game got played last week. Yeah.

Every game was played. But here's one of the things about the Raiders game this week that would be very interesting, and that is they are the Sunday night game against the Buccaneers. It's a good Sunday night game in Vegas, Brady, and the Buccaneers against the Raiders. By the way, I think the Buccaneers are really good. And anyway, just reminded me, we'll do NFL power rankings today because it's your favorite. No, we don't have time. So if for whatever reason, this ends up being another game that gets postponed because of COVID stuff.

I mentioned yesterday to you or two days ago, did I mention this? Mark Murphy, I'm scattered here and I realize this. I'll get focused here in a moment on what I was. going to say. But Mark Murphy, the team president of the Packers, admitted at some Packers virtual fan event that the NFL's contingency plan allows for a Super Bowl in March. Did you read about that yesterday or not? Yeah. I did not. So they have the ability in Tampa to play the Super Bowl on March 7th. So that's, you know, they're going to get this season in, even if they have 18, 19, 20 weeks of regular season before the playoffs start. Anyway, the Sunday night game would

be interesting because the NFL bailed on the Thursday night game last week because they had to play that Bill's game on a Tuesday against Tennessee. They were scheduled to play the Chiefs on a Thursday. They moved that game. And they didn't move another game into that Thursday night television slot. I promise you, Tommy. there is no chance the NFL will leave the NBC's Sunday night spot black. It's not going without a game. That is their prime time window. This happened 17 years ago when they started the Sunday night games on NBC.

It became the replacement for Monday night football. Sunday night's the most watched game of the week typically. And NBC's gotten a great package, and they've gotten the flexibility issue. with the flex scheduling over the years. So I think, and I haven't read this anywhere, if there is more today about the Raiders and COVID-19, and there's a possibility that this game could be postponed, the NFL is going to move another Sunday game into the Sunday night's slot.

First of all, they've got the flexibility to do that because there aren't any fans. They're not really impacting a lot of people by moving the time of a game by six or, you know, six hours or three hours. So I started looking at the possibilities. And this is where it gets interesting for Washington football fans. It's a CBS double header week, which basically means that the two CBS 425 games aren't moving. 49ers Patriots and Chiefs Broncos. All right. Those are the two, that is, this is a CBS double header week. They're not losing those games. By the way, Denver could be a snow game. It's going to be cold and snowy in Denver over the weekend. So they also have, in their one o'clock window, the biggest game of the weekend,

two undefeated teams, the Steelers and the Titans. That game is not moving to Sunday night. CBS is going to want that game. So what you start to do is you start to look at the games on Fox. It's not their double-header week. And here are the games on Fox on Sunday. Lions Falcons, not interested for Sunday night game. Packers versus the one in five Texans. Now, Aaron Rogers in prime time is better than no game, but still, it's not an intriguing matchup. Panther Saints is a pretty big game in the NFC South.

I guess that's a possibility. And then Seahawks Cardinals is their 4 o'clock window game. They have to leave that there because the markets that don't have a Fox 1 o'clock game have to have a Fox 4 o'clock. game. Anyway, make a long story short. The other Fox game is Dallas, Washington. And even though both teams are terrible, Dallas is a huge draw. They always are. And now that they're imploding from within, there's even more of a storyline there. If the Raiders, I'm telling you right now, this is my guess. If the Raiders end up having COVID-19 issues today or tomorrow, if it's a

It wouldn't shock me if they move Dallas, Washington to Sunday night football. So there you heard it first. That's a wild way out there prediction. And I understand that most of you are like, why would they want two terrible teams? Well, because the Cowboys are a draw whether they're terrible or not. And there aren't many other options for the Sunday night game because of what I explained as it relates to the networks and the CBS Double Heather Week. So anyway, aren't you happy I went through that?

You know, I think you make some sense. I think there's some logic to it. Especially, I'm assuming there's a World Series game that night. Not only is there a World Series game on Sunday night. It's Tampa Bay against Los Angeles, and then the current Sunday night game is Tampa Bay against the Raiders. If the Bucks and Raiders do play Sunday night, and more likely than not they will.

So what I just went through was probably a worthless exercise. What do you think will do? Which game? Tampa Bay Raiders or Tampa, L.A. in the World Series? Which game will do a bigger number in Tampa? Oh, the football game. Yeah, I think so too. I know.

It will. I mean, already, this is the lowest ranked World Series so far after two games. Yeah, but apparently it's done the league championship series game seven. Yeah, I know. Did much better than the NBA playoffs. I know. But now we're LA versus Tampa for the World Series and it's tanking among viewers. How about just Tampa?

You know, NHL Stanley Cup champions, potential World Series champions, and the Buccaneers are a legitimate, legitimate threat to go a long way this year. It's just like Miami. It's a terrible fan market. I know. Terrible. Yeah. It's a it's a it's a it's a lousy fan base that you know barely supports their teams when they're good.

I can't speak like that for the hockey team. For some reason, the Tampa Bay Lightning, that's an aberration. That that fan base seems to be passionate and loyal and fills that place up all the time. So I can't speak to them. But the baseball and the football team, lukewarm. I told you the Mark Malanson story, right, last week? I don't think so. I didn't tell you the Mark Millanson story.

No, why? Did you see him somewhere? No, I must have told Cooley. Those of you that have heard it, you're going to hear it for a second time. I'll try to shorten it up. But what reminded me of that is my friend who lives in Tampa, who was up in D.C. with his wife two weeks ago, friends of ours. You see, you have friends. This is what I mean.

You have friends. He's a huge Tampa Bay Lightning fan and was super excited. about, you know, the hockey team winning the Stanley Cup. They were really into it. And he said that Tampa really got into the lightning winning the cup. But let me just tell you real quickly the Mark Melanson story. Of course, I've already ruined it by asking you if you, you know, if I told you the Mark Malanson story.

Long story short, my buddy says to me we're at dinner a week ago Saturday night. He said, he's texting with somebody. I'm like, who are you texting with? He said, I'm having artificial grass. turf installed into my backyard. Apparently that's a thing right now. And I'm dealing with the guy at the company and we're just coming up with a date. And he said, and then he goes, actually, this is a funny story. And he starts telling me the story. He said, I, you know, ended up getting introduced to this company. I found them online and somebody else had used him. So they were really

good. These two guys come out to the house to make the pitch a few months ago. And they were big dudes and they looked like athletes. And I said, are you guys athletes? And they said, yeah, we're baseball players. And then one of them was Mark Malanson. Who's going to install grass in the backyard? So, I mean, I've already ruined, you know, the payoff on the story, but that's because I already did by asking you if you remembered if I told you the Mark Malanson story.

But anyway, so my buddy said, oh, okay, and just figured they were minor. league players. Doesn't say anything. And they start haggling back and forth. And he gets to know this guy, Mark, Mark's like, nah, I can't do it for that. And my buddy goes, you know, I got another company that I've been talking to. I'll get back to you. So my buddy calls him back and said, look, this other company, your competitor is going to do it for 20% less or whatever. And he said, Melanson gets really, really competitive on the phone. And he goes, I'm telling you right now. I am telling you right now. You are not going to get a better product than the product you're going to get with me. There is no chance you're going to get a better product.

But I'll tell you what I'll do. I'll match his price anyway. So anyway, my buddy goes, all right, we'll go with you guys. And so they were working on install dates. And this is before game six of the league championship series. And it's Saturday night. and he's texting back and forth with Melanson about an install date for the following week. And I just thought that that was hysterical, that the Braves closer who's in the national, by the way, this should be a column for you.

The Braves closer who's in the National League Championship Series is while in the midst of, you know, the bubble and the, you know, pitching it to go to the World Series, he's negotiating deals for turf installation down in Tampa. He owns the company. He owns the company with family members. This guy must be for family members then. Because this guy has made $77 million. I know. I know. I know.

All right. Let's get to some conversation about, I actually want to do it. Dallas Week, right? It's Dallas Week. We're so excited. We'll get to that right after this word from one of our sponsors. A reminder that if you have. Have not subscribed to the podcast.

Please do that. That really helps us out. Also, if you haven't rated it or reviewed it in a while, that would help us as well. Much appreciated. Some of you don't get the options depending on where you're listening to the podcast and how you're listening to the podcast to rate it and review it. So that's not a problem. But if you do have that option to subscribe and then rate it and review it, if you can do that,

that's helpful. Also, if you miss Cooley yesterday on your first. his defensive film breakdown. Go back and listen to it yesterday. It was really, really, really interesting about Kendall Fuller, playing some safety, about some of the defensive linemen, but the part that got a lot of attention was him suggesting that the team should try to trade landing Collins before the trade deadline. That was, he does not think Landon Collins. I think it's been pretty much universal on Landon Collins that he has not played one. well this year.

Another one of those players that the owner is in love with. There you go. In part, Tommy, because, you know, he loves Sean Taylor so much. Remember, he wanted Sean Taylor's number. And that's, yes, they did. Yes, I do. He did not get the number. Fortunately, he did not get a jersey.

From the owner. Signed by Sean Taylor from the owner as a present. That's nice. I mean, there's nothing wrong with that. Of course, number seven. did not survive the way I think a lot of us maybe wished it would have. Joe Thaisman's number seven. Did not.

So you want to talk about the rivalry, huh? Yeah, Dallas Week, baby. The rivalry that's become a cliche, as you described the other day, and which I ended up doing a radio segment on, because I think I agree with you. I think that it is, it's really something that isn't, I'll concede this point. It could be great again, but it would require both teams to, you know, behave, perform like real NFL

franchises, which doesn't seem like, you know, it's right around the corner. Like I do think it's simmering, like a Washington-Dalice thing, if it came, like if both teams got really good, it would blow up into a big deal again. But as we speak today, I'm not excited about Dallas Washington this week. And I haven't been excited about Dallas, Washington a lot in recent years. I don't think it'll ever be what it was, even if both teams got good. I think if the Eagles and Washington were both good at the same time, it would be just as big. I think if the Giants and Washington were good at the same time, it would be the same.

it would be the same thing. Dallas and Washington would just be, at this point, would just be two division rivals who were good competing against each other. I don't think it's ever going to be what it was. I'm convinced it'll never be what it was.

Because the players, I guarantee among the players, it will never be. The Dallas-Washington rivalry from the 60s through the Joe Gibbs era, that whole That was a real thing with the players.

That was deep. And like Charlie Taylor once told me, down to the bone. But can't you basically say that about most pro sports now because players change so much? And they're just not as invested in the same things that the fans are invested in, in part because they're not going to be there for as long as they used to be. I mean, this is an old conversation about that. I realize that. But here's the difference. Here's the difference.

The Giants and the Dodgers play each other eight times, 18 times a year on the West Coast. The Red Sox and the Yankees play each other 18 times a year. That will fester. That will continue always to fester the rivalry. It's just, you know, it's just twice a year. It's just not enough. I mean, really, the Dallas games that really made the rivalry were the playoff games. Yeah, I mean, I just, I think rivalries in general, other than those that are in college,

the college rivalry thing is never going to die. People, you know, those things are woven into the fabric of homes and relationships. And by the way, not only do those teams play each other every year, these things turn into a weekend. It's not just three hours on a Sunday. It's a weekend event every year. And by the way, it doesn't really require both teams to be super good for still to be super intense. I mean, Army Navy hasn't meant anything on a national level, but it's still big. I mean, there have been years where some of these rivalries, like in recent years, Florida, Florida State, you know, haven't really impacted national championship discussion, but are big. I think in the NFL, I think that it's, it's, uh,

It's not that it requires both teams to be really good, but if you go a long period of time with both teams not being a factor in the division or in the league, it'll fade. Look, Green Bay, I've used this example with you before. When you take the post-Lombardi era, they went the 70s, the 80s, and half of the 90s. I mean, basically 25 years, a quarter of a century, of being irrelevant on the NFL scene. They were never a championship contender. They may have gone to the playoffs once or twice, and that was it during those eras when Bart Starr was coaching them and others, Lindy and Fonty and others before, you know, Holmgren showed up and Brett Farrv showed up. And they had intense rivalries in the 60s in their division with Chicago with Detroit, with, you know, those two. teams in particular, but really with Chicago.

You know, the list of rivalries in the NFL, Chicago and Green Bay still ends up near the top. But that game during the 70s and the 80s wasn't a big game until that year where the Bears became really good. But it lost its luster.

Chiefs Raiders lost its luster. That's nationally. That's nationally. Within the communities, I'm betting that the Bears and the Packers were always a big game. I'm betting. Washington is not a big game anymore. I'm betting you.

I'm betting you that Raiders fans and Chiefs fans, like Cowboys fans, you know, Cowboys fans will say at times, no, the Eagles are a bigger rival and they have been for years. Well, the Raiders, the Raiders is not a fair comparison because they've moved to two different cities. Okay, but before they moved to the recent city, Vegas, they've always been the Raiders, whether they were in Oakland or L.A. I mean, they were the Raiders, and it was the Raiders of the AFC West and they were a California team and the Chiefs Raiders in the 60s and 70s was a big deal. You could argue.

The Oakland Raiders. I understand that. Well, they've been the Oakland Raiders in a lot of recent years. Bottom line is that the Raiders and Broncos, when the Chiefs suck for a long years, many years became a much bigger rivalry even to their fan bases. And you're speaking on a national level. And I'm saying in Kansas City, no matter how bad the Chiefs were, the Raiders game was always big rivalry. And now in Washington, the Dallas game doesn't mean anything. Well, I think it means

about as much as it may be meant to Raider fans when the Chiefs weren't very good or when the Raiders weren't very good. And that, you know, in the, look, the Washington- Dallas rivalry is always going to be something that people know about. The players thing is obvious. That's happened in every rivalry, except for those where players stayed for a while. long period of time. Like, just think about the NFL right now. What is the best rivalry? Like, what's the best rivalry right now? Like, give me the NFL rivalry. Sears Ravens. That's the one. Yeah. There isn't another one. Right now, there really isn't another rivalry that you can point to and say, wow, you know, over the last 10 years, those two teams hate each other.

There isn't one. Maybe 49ers and Seahawks. I mean, that was brief. That was fleeting. Yeah. Now, you're right. You know, I mean, so you just don't have. But again, I think we're talking to different things.

I think in the communities, particularly in the NFC North, I think in Minneapolis and Green Bay and Chicago, those rivalries have never diminished. I think the NFC East, in terms of the divisions. in the NFL have the longest standing most heated rivalries. And I know what we're saying. So the Bears and the Packers have been around since 1920. And Washington and the Giants since the 30s. Right.

You know, I don't think. So isn't it Bears Packers followed by Washington versus the Giants in terms of the longest series or the most games ever played in the series? I think that's what it is. I think the Bears and Packers have played the most times the Giants in Washington and skins have played the second most times. Whatever. What's the point here?

It's not a big game. It's not an important game. The fan bases and it has nothing to do with the pandemic because this has been this way in recent years. It's not the same. It's become almost something that, you know, the significant majority of both fan bases just don't have as, it's not that they don't have any passion for it,

they don't have real passion for it. If they, you know, there have been a couple of games. There have been two games, Tommy, in this decade. Two in the last 10 years that really mattered. Think about that. The 2012 season ender between RG3 against Tony Romo for the division at FedEx Field. Right. And that was sort of a flukeish matchup.

That was a flexed game because Washington made that late season run. And Dallas was eight and seven in that game. Washington was nine and six. Washington won the game, won the division, and we know what happened a week later against Seattle. And then the 2016 Thanksgiving Day game, when Washington had destroyed Green Bay on the Sunday night, 42 to 24, and they were 6-3-1, which, believe it or not, that's the best record they have had through 10 games in this entire century, 6-3-1. So they were six, three and one in that spot at that point. And through 10 games, and Dallas was 9 and 1. You know, going into that thing.

That game, to me, was anticipated. And my God, Dallas in that stadium on that Thanksgiving Day, it was lit up electric. And it was like, wow, the rivalry is back. Both these teams are good. This is a big game. It's on Thanksgiving Day. Prescott, Elliott, and they won that game. 31 26, but it was a really, really good football game.

I think that is still the highest rated Fox game of all time, a regular season game in the NFL with the Dallas-Washington game in 2016. Other than that, I mean, there just haven't been any big-time matchups. That's the problem. If you don't play important games, you know, the rivalry is going to be diminished. it's not going to be eliminated completely, but it's going to be diminished. In my view, you think it's done for good.

Yeah. I tell you, I think, no, I think a rivalry can be resurrected, but the rivalry that you grew up with, that's never going to happen again. I don't know if any rivalry is going to happen like that again. I mean, it's hard for that to happen. I think the Giants and the Dodgers has remained just as hot

on the West Coast as it's always been. All right. And I would guess Red Sox Yankees the same. Most of your best rivalries in sports are in college. Duke, North Carolina, and basketball, and then a bunch of college football rivalries. Really, I mean, I haven't looked at a list of the top ten sports rivalries, but I would bet you half of them are college football games.

Probably. Yeah. Oh, I'll be, I mean, because the players come and go, the players coming and going doesn't mean anything. I mean, you know, I mean, if you're an alumnus, those ties don't disappear. They stay with you. Exactly. Yeah.

Exactly. I'm just looking to see if there's like a quick, like recent list of the recent rivalries. You know, like I still see, you know, Lakers Celtics popping up. I mean, really? Yeah, I know. Lakers Clippers is more of a rivalry now than Lakers' Celtics. Celtics. Right.

Anyway, whatever. There's the Wizards and the National Championship team. That's always a big rivalry. What? The Wizards and the NCAA national title. You mean you're Wizards versus Kentucky? Yeah, remember that? Yeah, I do remember that.

All right. We got a lot of mileage out of that, didn't we? We did get a lot of mileage out of that. I want to talk about what Ron Rivera said yesterday. We'll do that when we come back right after this word from one of our sponsors. All right, I wanted to get to this to sort of finish up the show. I do want your thoughts on the World Series. We'll do that as well.

And then we'll finish it up for the day. But some of you already know what Ron Rivera said yesterday. For those of you that don't, let me give you the context for it. Remember a few weeks ago after Dwayne Haskins had all the turnovers against Cleveland, and the coach, you know, immediately backed him after the game. And then it was the following day during his Monday press conference where he said, you know, there are guys in that locker room that are playing well enough for us to win.

There's a cutoff point for me. There is. And he was referring to Dwayne Haskins. He had been asked about whether or not there's a time in which, you know, he would cut off, you know, if Dwayne could get to the point where there'd be a cutoff point and he'd move on from Dwayne. And he said there was. And if you go back and listen to that soundbite from back then from just a couple of weeks ago,

it was September 28th, so it wasn't that long ago. Rivera really was very adamant that, you know, there's a point in which you got to move on. You've got to cut bait, basically, a cutoff point. Well, yesterday, he was asked about Kyle Allen in the same way. you know, would there be a cutoff point for Kyle Allen like you had for Dwayne Haskins? And this is what he said. Cut off point for Kyle Allen like you did for Dwayne Haskins? I didn't have a cutoff point for Dwayne Haskins.

I made a decision based on what I was watching and what I was seeing. And that's what happened. Okay. So with Kyle, there's, you know, I'm going to go as long as I feel that I can. And again, it's about watching him and seeing what I'm. am I seeing what I need to see or not? Again, there was no drop dead that if he wasn't doing, you know, if this didn't happen here or that didn't know.

What I was looking at was watching him and watching and looking for growth and a progression and a development, that type of stuff. That's why I made the decision I made. I had no cut off. So anyway, that was yesterday, him not remembering that he had mentioned that he had a cutoff point for Dwayne Haskins and then talking about Kyle Allen. And that got a lot of attention among, you know, the media group and the fan base, because let's be fair here, it has been very confusing.

Ron Rivera has been mixed messaging. He's been reversing course on philosophies. He is saying one thing one day and coming back and doing a 180 to next. This has been going on for a while. Now before you answer, however you want to answer this, I watched this Zoom call last night. And one of the things that I noticed is I noticed that Ron Rivera was struggling a little bit. He had a spit cup and he was spitting, you know, every 60 to 90 seconds into this cup. And I didn't, and I was like, you know, at first I was like, he's not chewing, is he?

and I looked up just side effects of chemotherapy, radiation, proton treatments, etc. And some of the side effects are very thick saliva that you need to spit constantly. So this is, I'm assuming, why, you know, he was spitting. And it was, you know, is big, thick, white, you know, spit exactly what I read with respect to one of the side effects to chemo and what he's been going through. And I just sat there and I watched him. And his press conference yesterday was shorter. He looked a little bit tired. And I just thought to myself, Tommy, look, this guy, he came into this organization and he had his eyes wide open, but he had no idea what he was heading into.

No one ever does. But for him, you know, immediately it became not only just the normal dysfunction. It was the name change. It was the Washington Post story after Washington Post story. And then all of a sudden he gets cancer. And I just, I was watching this and I had heard all the criticism yesterday afternoon. Listening to my station, reading, you know, various accounts from some of the beat reporters about how, my God, this guy just can't get it right. I mean, he just said this a month ago.

he had a cutoff date for Dwayne and now he doesn't have a cutoff date for Kyle and doesn't even remember saying it? Like, I just, at this point, whatever, what are you going to do? Are you going to bail on him? This season is a lost season, people. I just kind of came to the conclusion that he probably should have taken a leave of absence. And even if it was better for him not to, because, you know, doctors will say, well, you want somebody to stay busy. You want somebody to stay focused and working and distracted, etc.

Well, that's fine for him and good for him. But this is a professional football organization. On public display. On public display. And he has really looked completely out of it. You know, not just the football decisions, it's really these pressers that I know over the years we've nitpicked, you know, a lot of them. You know, Callahan last year and a lot of them. But this guy is, you know, there's no debate here.

There's no real, you know, litigation of this thing. He's saying one thing one day and another thing the next. He's got a philosophy early in the season of the long game of research and development, and then all of a sudden it's time to win the division. He's all in on Dwayne. How can Dwayne, you know, learn if he's not out there playing? And then it's, we got a cutoff point. And then the next week he's benched.

So it's, you know, he has the right to make all those decisions. It just would be better if they were communicated. And I wonder how these messages and how the communication is happening with his football team. Because it wouldn't surprise me if there's a lot of confusion with the football team too with what's going on. Look, Alan was better than any quarterback that's played this year. I mean, I just, I don't want to debate that with anybody. It's just not debatable. Was he good?

No. Was he, is he the future of the franchise? I don't think he is. But was that team a professional offense Sunday versus what it's been for the most part through the first five games before it? Yes, it was. So you can kind of see what they see in him and what they'd like the offense to be and how they'd like to be more competitive offensively.

but man, I just kind of feel like this guy needs a break. And this is, you know, this is what I said from the beginning. I mean, when people were praising him for his courage, and I'm not trying to diminish that, I'm saying, no, this is, this is not right. This is uncomfortable. This is, he's putting himself at risk by doing this for a number of reasons. And like you said, it's a lost season. Whatever he wants to accomplish, he can still accomplish when he comes back, you know, from all this and is healthy again.

You know, I mean, this is just another year in limbo for this organization. And if he wants to start his culture change when he comes back, they won't miss a beat. You know, the culture will still stink when he gets back. So it's not like it's going to change without him. So, I mean, I've been all along saying that he shouldn't be coaching right now, that they should put it the clipboard in the hands of voodoo jack and, you know, play the cards are dealt week to week. Obviously, behind the scenes, you know, he's going to have decision-making opportunities

and things like that. But yeah, this is not good for the organization. and I don't think it's good for him to be in such a high-profile position while he's going through this. I don't think it serves anybody well. I mean, he really seemed oblivious to the whole cutoff thing in the discussion that he just had less than a month ago about Dwayne. And that's an indication. He's not, he's just, he's off as he justifiably should be. Like, I mean, look what he's going through.

And again, like, I understand he's the head coach of the football team, and it's time maybe for somebody else to make that decision for him. I don't think anybody else is going to make that decision for him. No. Okay? I think right now, you know, Ron's in charge. He is in charge. I think he had to play Dwayne and give it a good old, you know, college try on Dwayne.

But he's gotten through that. Now, Cooley said yesterday something that was interesting as he was suggesting that they should try to trade Landon Collins before the trade deadline. He said, you know, I think it would be the right move, but he goes, they'll never do it because the owner loves Landing Collins. So, I mean, again, if that's true

and that's the reason they won't move Landing Collins, but let's just say the football people wanted to do it, well, we're doomed. It's just never going to happen. Yeah, you see, this is the big, you know, no one likes to talk about this, because it's like being hit over the head with the hammer every time you raise your head and you just choose to ignore being hit over the head with the hammer while it continues to hit you.

But the big unwritten story right now is the owner's reaction to his guy being benched. We just don't know. Nobody knows what that is. No, we don't know what that is. I, I'll share this with you. It's sort of part of what I told everybody yesterday I would go try to research a little bit more about, which was the name change thing and whether or not they're close to the name change thing. You know, you saw Jason Wright admitted. Oh, yeah.

Yeah, I read all that. So Cooley's point yesterday is, look, you know, one of the reasons they may not be changing that name is because it's a lot more attractive to a prospective buyer of this franchise to be able to name the team, which is true. And so he said, keep that in mind. And he has felt, I think, intuitively that, more than intuitively, I think he has felt that that is in play. I have not heard the same about the owner either being forced to sell or deciding to sell the team. But he's right. Like if they name the team Red Wolves next week and then he was forced to sell a year from now, it wouldn't be nearly as attractive to a new owner if the new owner didn't like to name Red Wolves.

So anyway, besides that, I had a couple of conversations yesterday about just the cost. It is millions of dollars to change a brand for a professional sports team. Is it tens of millions? Maybe, but it's certainly high single millions. And you may say, well, it's the NFL. That's a lot of money to do it twice in two years. They don't want to have to do it twice. They're going to take their time on this, and they're not apparent.

according to a conversation I had, they are not down to like two names. They're going to try to whittle the list down to like three or four and then pursue, you know, the viability. A lot of what will cost in this process is market research. You know, once they get it down to the couple of names that they think are viable, then they got to do a bunch of market research on these names. It's a long process. Anyway, I use that as a way to getting to this. I don't think. I don't think. I don't think the owner is given up on Rivera anytime soon. I don't even think the owner believes

that and really even understands what Rivera has been doing here publicly in his pressers. I just don't know how much he's truly paying attention to the day to day right now. That may be, but on Sunday he's out there watching his football

team play. Probably. One day a week he's paying attention to the football. And he did last week and even the week before, at least, you know, turn on the television or maybe from the suite or wherever he was watching, say, hey, where's number seven? Yes. What happened to him? Yes. Look, as far as that, again, that's what we don't know.

We don't know the owner's reaction. I don't want to get into the whole name thing except just to say, and it shouldn't be any surprise. It's bad business that they were not ready for. for this. I mean, when he bought the team, you know, he should have sat down and said, well, you know, I'm no dummy. I know what this organization has been through over the years with the name. I don't plan on changing the name, but if somebody puts a gun to my head, let's be ready with a plan B. 15 years ago, he could have done the same thing. Ten years ago, you know, in the midst of declaring that, I'm never going to change the name and you can print that, he could have said to

So, well, you know, the NFL may force me too. So I better have a plan B. So let's do some research and come up with a plan B. Okay. I don't think that's unreasonable. But the plan B would have had to have included a lot of market research and a lot of money spent to have something teed up and ready to go. Just so you know that. This is not an inexpensive endeavor.

I get that. Even before you start to change out all the stuff. signage and everything else. But they can't keep it Washington football because they keep it Washington football. It's a constant reminder that they had to change the name. Well, Neil and Rockville thinks that Washington football is a way of them, you know, keeping people referring to them as the Redskins and the Skins. That if with a new name it means, then you really have the chance to move away from

Redskins and Skins. Washington football team, people are still referring to them as the skins as the Redskins. I personally, as I've told you from the beginning, FC Washington would, in branding Washington is what I would do. I don't have a problem with that at all. I just don't know. I don't even care. Whatever. Here's what they can't do. They can't like get into a position where they force something and then they have to change it a year later because now you're no different than teams like in the NBA, like New Orleans and Charlotte, you know, that seem to always have new names every five, ten years. You know, so you can't be that either. You got to get it right.

I don't think that most people really have a sense of what goes into this. I'm not saying that your point that this should have been done years ago in preparation for the day that they lost it, or at least to be prepared in the event that they did, and they could move much quickly, much more quickly on it, much quicker on it. I think that absent of that, people need to understand. Like the people that were critical of a football team, you don't have a name? No, you can't change a name that quickly. It's impossible.

It's impossible to do it that quickly, which is maybe to your point why they should have done it 10 years ago and had it teed up and ready to go. But they didn't, clearly. What did you think of the World Series, the first time? two games. I haven't talked to you since Kirschaw won and then the game last night. It's all right. It's all right. You know. I loved Kurtzhawn's performance the other night. He was great. It's fine. So we know that Kerrshaw can be great in the postseason when he has 10 starts during the regular season. If he has 28 starts, maybe not so good.

Right. Wow. There's a trade that just happened. Just popped up. Yes. Yes, the Ravens just made a deal. The Vikings just traded In Gokwe, whom they acquired him from Jacksonville right before the season started. They traded in Gokwe, who is a legit pass rusher, to the Ravens for a third round pick and a conditional fifth round pick. What did the Vikings, the Vikings traded a second and a conditional fifth to get him before the season started. So they lost out on one round there. Yeah. That's really interesting. That's really interesting.

God, the Ravens are loaded defensively. But it also is an indication with the Vikings at 1 and 5 that they are going to be sellers here before the trade deadline. And I think a lot of teams are going to be sellers before the trade deadline, in part because it's rare to see as many teams with basically records at this point that you're not. not going to turn around into a winning season unless you're in the NFC East or into a playoff season unless you're in the NFC East. There are nine teams currently, nine that have zero or one win. The Jets have zero and then you get the Bengals, the Texans, the Jags, the Chargers, Eagles, Giants, Washington, Minnesota, and Atlanta. They're all out of it, basically. All completely out of it. So we may see a much more active trade deadline than we have in the past with many more sellers.

And we've talked about Washington being a seller, you know, guys like obviously Haskins, maybe a Collins, Carrigan, Moreau, Anderson, the guys that aren't under contract next year. The Vikings at one in five and very disappointed to be one in five just dealt a player they just traded for. Yeah, I know. So they have given up on the season. The local baseball team made a deal. They signed Josh Harrison, the guy that they had signed. during the season, who played pretty well for them. Yeah, he did.

He had 278, played five different positions for them. So they signed him to a deal. And he was a very popular player, apparently, within the clubhouse. All right, you want me to just give you my power rankings because you don't have them ready? Oh, I've got my power rankings ready. I just don't feel like describing it. I'll tell you what. Instead of doing power rankings, tell me.

Tell me who the two best teams in the AFC are and the two best teams in the NFC are. Two best teams in the AFC are the Chiefs and the Titans. Oh, not the Ravens, huh? No. Okay. Not the Steelers, huh? No. The Titans.

I think the two best teams in the AFC are the Chiefs in the Steelers. I think they're the two best teams. but any one of the four mentioned Tennessee, Baltimore, Kansas City, Pittsburgh. At this point, none of the four are merging as the AFC champion and into the Super Bowl will surprise me. None of the four. What about the NFC? Who are the top two teams in the NFC? Oh, Seattle would be one.

And I got to think about the other one. I think you're talking to. I think Seattle's one. defensively they're not very good but I'll stick with Seattle and to me Tampa's too. I think Tampa's going to be really good and continue to get much

better. They were my that was my NFC championship pick before the season started Tampa versus Seattle. I like Tampa too. I was going to say to Packers but obviously you know

since Tampa just handed them there once yeah I would agree with you on Tampa. Tampa and the Hawks, and I think the Bears are actually legitimate for real. Their defense is really good, really good. Anyway, okay. What else? Anything else? Or did we cover it today? Yeah, I like the Washington football team to come away with a victory on Sunday. Oh, yeah, give me a prediction because you didn't give a prediction last week. Somebody mentioned that. Yeah. So what's your prediction? I'm going to say it's 27 to 20 Washington football wins.

Oh, my God. Entering the buy, the hope, entering that by week at two and five, potentially tied for first place? It'll be... Absolutely. Oh, people already be talking about the rematch on Thanksgiving and the rivalry being renewed. The rivalry will be back. All right, thanks. Send me that screenplay.

I would like to read it. It would be, obviously, it would be your pleasure to provide it to me. Actually, I'm not going to send it to you now. I would want to read it. What's it about it? Yeah, but I'm not, I'm not going to say, I'll just tell you, one is about a woman who played baseball with me, the first woman to play baseball with major leaguers. And the second one is a rock and roll, civil rights, professional wrestling story. Would the first one be, you know, sort of a league of, was it a league of their own?

Was that the movie with the, yeah, no, this isn't that. Okay. This is a day. I'm not going to send them to you now. I want, why? Well, because you wouldn't tell me if you didn't like them. Of course I would tell you. I would absolutely.

You don't think I would tell you if I didn't like them? No, you wouldn't. Why do you say that? I just don't think you would. Because you don't think I'd want to hurt your feelings? Yeah. I've hurt your feelings before. I know.

But this is important stuff. All that other stuff. That wasn't important stuff. You know, that is. true. Nothing that we've done together in the many, many, many years that we've done stuff together has ever been important. Nothing's really been important. And this is to you, so I would treat it accordingly. So please send it to me. I'll think of that. Okay. Have a great day, everybody back tomorrow with Cooley to preview Washington, Dallas, and the rest of the NFL weekend.

Again, Giants plus four and a half tonight. I like that. See you.