The Koerner Office - Business Ideas and Deep Dives with Chris Koerner - Your First Million Might Be in One of These Ideas⏐Holdco Bros. Ep. #215

Episode Date: August 29, 2025

Beehiiv is the newsletter platform I’ve used for over a year and a half because their data shows you exactly what’s working. Get 30% off three months at ⁠⁠beehiiv.com/chris⁠___Check out my newsletter at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠TKOPOD.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and join my new community at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠TKOwners.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.___HoldCo Bros are back! In this episode, Nik and I talk about some surprisingly profitable business ideas. We start with weddings as a service, where one guy built a $3M/year business without owning a venue. Then we get into how you could create your own Texas Snacks by reselling merch from local tourist attractions like Lambert’s Café or Big Texan Steak Ranch. We also go deep on the insane potential of Drive a Tank—an experience business that feels like real-life Call of Duty. And finally, we break down why Meta’s AI-powered ads are working better than ever and how to take advantage as a small business owner.Learn more about Nik here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://linktr.ee/cofoundersnik⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Share your ideas with us:[e-mail]@cofounders.comEnjoy!---Watch this on YouTube instead here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠tkopod.co/p-yt⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ask me a question on or off the show here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://tkopod.co/p-ask⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Learn more about me: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://tkopod.co/p-cjk⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Learn about my company: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://tkopod.co/p-cof⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Follow me on Twitter here: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://tkopod.co/p-x⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Free weekly business ideas newsletter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://tkopod.co/p-nl⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Share this podcast: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://tkopod.co/p-all⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Scrape small business data: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠http://tkopod.co/p-os⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠---

Beach Wedding as a Service. $1,500 to $3,500 per wedding, and he's doing $3 million a year. This does not have to be on the beach only. Outdoor weddings? Two-thirds of all weddings. It's growing. People want to have their weddings outdoors. No way.

Effectively, you just become the white glove provider of setting up their experience. Each location has over a million dollars a year of net profit. Oh, my gosh. You're telling me you can't do something like this in any city. These guys do tens of millions of dollars per year, per location, and they do not sell on. mine. No. Like, it's a no-brainer. There is this business in Florida, Fort Myers, to be exact, and it is called Gulf Beach Weddings. This guy started the business with $20,000. It does $3 million a year. It's very profitable. It's a wedding service. Weddings as a service, but it's not a

wedding venue. There's no venue. He basically knows all the beaches in Florida, all the beautiful beaches, which ones have required licenses to have a wedding, which ones don't, which ones have a good sunset, the right angle, which ones don't have too much seaweed or wind. He knows all that stuff. And then you go to him if you want a beach wedding, you give him three grand. He's going to give you a hundred chairs to rent. He's going to give you 100 pictures or whatever. He's going to give you a wedding arch, some vows. It's a beach wedding as a service, a package. $1,500 to $3,500 per wedding. And he's doing 100-something weddings a year, $3 million a year. Where is it?

So a thousand weddings a year. It's in Florida. Fort Myers. Sorry, I don't know where Fort Myers is. The Panhandle, North Florida. Gulf Beach Weddings is the business. Well, what's crazy is I didn't realize this until you and I obviously were friends and you were like Destin, which is right there on the Gulf as well.

He's like, you were like the most beautiful beaches in the world. White sand looks incredible. Warm water. No freaking way. You're like, yeah, it's incredible. You're the connector for that area where it's like, I don't want to take care of anything. tell me what to have my wedding and I'll rent from you. Yeah, and outdoor weddings, two thirds of all weddings.

10 years ago, it was 40% and it's growing. People want to have their weddings outdoors. Yeah, it's a big business. That's why luxury outdoor wedding trailer bathrooms are a thing because of all these outdoor weddings. You don't need those if you're getting married in a church. Oh, I've seen them. I feel like you could do this in another market. Basically, the framework would be going, yeah, go and find some type of popular

destination for people to come to. Vegas comes to mind, right? It's like, oh, a bachelor, bachelorette party. You could do a service where you're like, I'll arrange everything for you, the hotel you stay at, the parties you go to, the clubs, blah, blah, blah, just super white glove. But there's probably destinations like that in every single state. And effectively, you just become the white glove provider of setting up their experience. It's all experiential.

Yeah. It's a mobile wedding venue. Like, you want to get married in a national park, a state park on a lake, anywhere. beautiful outdoors next to a canyon. You know a guy and he knows all the places. He knows which ones are good in the morning, which are good in the afternoon, where their book,

which needs a license, which doesn't. This does not have to be on the beach only. It's like weddings as a service. And I love this idea because how much, like we've both talked to Alex with the wedding venue guy. It's a million dollar facility that he had to build from the ground up. You don't need that with this.

No. Dude, weddings as a service. That's pretty, that's pretty amazing. Wow. And it's a dump for you. It's a dump for you service.

Oh, Oh, you're into sass? I'm a waska. I'm a waska. Huh. Huh? What? A waska.

That's so good. I'm so excited for this. I know you've told this story before, but I'm going to bring it back up. So, have you ever heard of Bucky's? I'm serious. This sounds interesting. So there's this, this is coming called Buckees. And it's basically like the Disneyland of gas stations.

And I know that sounds weird to people who have never been to a Buckees, but Buckees are an experience. They've got tons of selection. great food. They've got merchandise that is that is unique only to those Buckeys and they have a cult following. And so in the year 2020, there's an enterprising entrepreneur who was trying to buy Bucky stuff online. They don't have an e-commerce store. What the freak? And so he just decides, I'm going to go to Buckeys. I'm going to buy everything at full retail and I'm going to resell it. And he starts his company, yada, yada, yada, years later. He's got a company called Texas snacks.

They work with Buckees. And that entrepreneur was Chris Turner. Do you ever measure like how many units of things that you've sold to people. Hundreds of thousands, yeah. Hundreds of thousands, yeah. I mean, so you have tons of skews. You literally have a warehouse. It's a crazy business because they're not giving you favored nation status. You're going like everybody else.

You're buying stuff off of the shelf. You're paying full retail price at the checkout. This isn't like you send your order to the manager and the manager looks at it and puts it all together and then you meet them at the cash register. No, your team goes, they pick, they pull, they pay, they walk out of the store. They take it to your warehouse. You list it. You've got thousands of skews.

Yada, yada, yada. But it's an amazing business. The reason I'm bringing it up is because I think that there are little buckies like this around the country. And I found one of them. And I wanted to talk to you about it. This is called Big Texan Steak Ranch. Have you ever heard of this? I've eaten there.

Amarillo in Yellow, Texas. So this is in Amarillo, Texas. Big Texan Steak Ranch has this thing that they're famous for, where if you eat a 72 ounce steak, you get it for free. Now, if you're doing the math in your head, do you know how much 72 ounces of steak is? Yeah, four pounds? It's four and a half pounds. Oh, my gosh.

It's a lot of freaking steak. It's a lot. It's a lot. So this place first opened up, it was on like historic Route 66. It's huge. It gets 500,000 visitors a year. Roughly 75% of them are tourists. Obviously, it has the 72 ounce steak.

They've got merchandise that they say. sell. They've also got an RV park attached to it so you could actually stay there. There's a motel attached to it so you could stay there. Here's the craziest thing, though, that I read about it. They sell over 250,000 T-shirts a year online. Holy K. Online? No, no, no. Excuse me. I lied. I lied. 250,000 T-shirts a year. I don't know if it's online or not. I just know that time they sell. Probably mostly in store, which means half of every person that visits there buys a friggin T-shirt. which probably close like I would say their average ticket price is $20, right? That like increases their average ticket price by 50%.

So I was doing the research and just based on the volume of people that are going there, their one location restaurant grosses between $16 and $20 million a year in revenue, which is one of the highest grossing single location restaurants in the world, $16 to $20 million in that one location, right? Then you add on the merch. and the shirts and the RV and all the other crap, this is probably if I were to guess, a $30 to $40 million business.

You're blown. Amarillo. Every time we drive to Utah, which is at least once a year, we drive by that place. I've eaten there. I stayed at the hotel right next to it. I had no idea it did that much business.

You're blowing my mind. And I do think that there are like examples of this in, in other states, right? These like hidden gems. But why can't you start a Texas snacks for the big Texan steak rant? Why not? Maybe they sell online.

I do not know. My broader point was just there are these types of beloved tourist kind of attractions in different states. One of them being that you and I stopped at, I don't know if you knew this or not. But remember the crater that we stopped at in Arizona, Winslow, Arizona? That's privately owned. That's crazy. I thought Joe Dirt owned that. Crater, hardly know.

Anyways, like, there's a ton of these types of. beloved tourist attractions in each state. And who knows? Maybe 10% of them aren't online or maybe 20% of them are. Who knows what it is? But just when you're on a road trip with your family, yes. What is? Sorry.

That was so good. That was so good. Okay, go. Go. So, good news, bad news. Okay. Bad news. Big Texan ships online.

Okay. That's fine. That's fine because it's not the only restaurant like this. good news is I found another restaurant that's probably even bigger because they have multiple locations I've eaten there a dozen times if anyone's been to L.A. before lower Alabama. Okay. L.A. You've eaten at Lambert's Cafe. Okay. I'm sharing my screen here. One of my favorite restaurants, it's an experiential restaurant, if you will. Lambert's Cafe, home of the Throde-Roles, as in Throadrolls.com.

It's like a big home style restaurant. It's right on the way to the beach in Foley, Alabama, hometown of Julio Jones. It's not who you know. It's Julio, the wide receiver from Alabama. Thank you. So dumb. This restaurant has a line out the door 24-7. It's like 25 bucks to eat there.

It's family style. They bring around black-eyed peas. Not the, not the-the-black-ey-peas are there? Don't bust out into song, please. Fried chicken, dumplings, whatever. but they throw these massive head-sized rolls across the restaurant at you. You put your arm up and they go, throw rolls, and they'll throw it to you. It's the whole shtick.

And the kids catch it. There are these massive rolls. That's their whole thing. And there's one in Branson. There's one in Lower Alabama. And there might be a third one. These guys do tens of millions of dollars per year per location. And they have T-shirts and they do not sell online.

No. They do not sell online. line like it's a no brainer it's a no brainer that could also be very interesting as well as you know what a 3PL is you had a 3PL third party logistics party logistics company this would be similar but like effectively you could reach out to this company and be like look just throw it up on your website I'll do all the on demand printing we'll we'll take care of the fulfillment you don't have to do anything what it's almost like a licensing agreement all day all day dude they have three locations and they own RV parks next to their location just

like this place in Texas, but they don't sell their t-shirts online. That's insane. Someone needs to run a deep research prompt and find all of the, the throat rolls, the Lambers cafes, the big Texan, all of those of the world and start your Texas snacks of those. That's an idea. I love that. That is an idea. It's a great idea, too.

And anybody who's like, actually, you can't do that. Oh, I'm sorry. It's already been done by somebody on this podcast. No, actually people's here. Okay. We don't do actually in the comments. Uh-uh. If you mentioned liability or insurance or actually in the comments, block forever.

It's funny, Nick, because you know how many times I've had the conversation about this Bucky story and they're like, Chris, but what else could you do that for? And they start thinking and like, did you have for Trader Joe? And it's like, nope, can't do it for Wawa. Can't do it for Trader Joe's. I thought of that, tried it. Nope, nope, nope, nope. But I actually think for this, I've never thought of a restaurant, Nick.

This is all you. I think this is a doable idea. Looks like we're married. After 19 years of best friendship, you now have my approval for the day. Chris, what is one thing that every guy loves? And don't say what I think you're going to say because I'll answer it for you, breaking stuff, blowing stuff up and demolishing things. When somebody asks you, hey, I got to knock down a wall at my house.

You want to come over? The answer is always yes. You followed up with a question. You're like, how many sledgehammers do I need to bring, right? I just found this company. It's pretty freaking legit. I'm going to share my screen. It's really difficult to know what they do.

So I'll just tell you the website. The website is driveatank.com. What do they do, though? I haven't quite figured it out yet. I'm still looking on the website. But this is a company in Minnesota where all they do is rent out. I'm going to open this too, new time. Oh my gosh.

Dude. My testosterone is going up by the second. Look at this. They're just renting out the experience to freaking go to war, basically. You're driving a tank around. You're shooting crap. There's a shooting range and they have different packages. Check this out down here.

Look at this. The drive of tank packages. Okay, two passengers tells you how much it is. Oh, a single car crush add on? Yes, please. Actually, I'd like a double car crush add on. 850 bucks. Actually, I'd like to fire the 50 cow.

Is that cool? Can I fire the 50 cal on top of this on top of this freaking tank? Obviously, there's an unlimited package where I don't even want to know what you can shoot. Let's just say, the most dangerous game is a movie that has now come to life at this place. Have you ever seen that movie? The Most Dangerous Game? I don't think so. Yeah, they hunt people.

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Look at this. The World War II. Dude, this marketing is so good. The World War II package. The Vietnam package. The modern warfare package. So you're like, obviously the guns. My dad left me as a child package.

I'm just like, dude, what else? My dad never came back. from buying milk package. Dude, I love this. We were all just talking about the guns that we're going to be shooting. Okay, here's all the guns that we're going to be shooting.

Some of them are World War II, Vietnam, modern warfare, whatever. And then this line, hey, are you looking for something a little more flashy? A little more flashy? More flashy than riding over cars in a tank? And then it gives you the extreme package,

apparently. Chris Vector shooting 1,200 rounds rounds a minute. It's insane. This is like this is insane. So and then obviously at the same time they offer accommodations. Not only do I think this business is just freaking cool. I'm going to scroll back up to the videos that they have up here. Like I would go and do this. How fun of a freaking boys week would this be just to go play war basically? Yeah. But yeah. I don't know of any other companies doing this in other states. There's no way that there wouldn't be demand for this in a state like freaking Texas or Idaho or Georgia or any state that just has a lot of.

a good old southern boys that want to go shoot stuff and blow crap up. Why couldn't you start one of these? Why could this not be in every state? Why could there not be an experience like this? Other than federal regulations or state regulations, but beyond that, why could you not? I mean, it's stopping you. I interviewed a guy that has a heavy equipment business for kids, right? In Houston, outside the mall where kids can get in there and play with an excavator.

Each location has over a million dollars a year of net profit, like net profit. Oh my gosh. You're telling me if you can do that for kids in Houston, you can't do something like this for men in any city. Yes, these are just grown children anyways. What's a tank cost? A thousand bucks. Just kidding. Let's get Shannon on here.

You can do this with one tank. Yes. Or you could buy a tank. Or you could start small and be like, all right, I'm just going to focus on shooting cool guns. All right, cool. I got a 50 cow somehow and just give people the opportunity to shoot a 50 cow. I guarantee that crap. hurts. Every guy who's listening to us right now that has like gone to war is like,

these cissies wouldn't last five seconds. You have no idea. These guys, these guys make me sick. He's like, they're like, wait a second, you want to pay money to shoot? And I got shipped to Fallujah without my own consent. It is a very weird social commentary on the fact that we're willing to spend a lot of money so we can go shoot guns while some people are freaking drafted and sent against their will to go fight overseas and other countries. Anyways, beyond that point. Did you find out how much a tank is? Yeah, you can buy a T-72, but I don't know what that is. We won't even pretend like we do for $50,000. That's not that much, dude. According to one source on the internet that has not been vetted yet. That's not,

I mean, we were just talking about renting out RVs last week. And I have to imagine that the like price per hour on a tank is going to be worth a lot more. Uh, I mean, Obviously, it's going to cost a lot more to run, right? But like the video that they're showing, they're off-roading, they got some obstacle course sets up. They're riding through water. Oh, my gosh. There's this guy on YouTube that my son and I will watch.

Like, now it comes up on my feet all the time. And he shoots different caliber of guns at a target to see how strong it is. So he'll be like, all right, we got a steel plate today. Let's see how it does. And he's like, all right, starting with the 22. I'm starting with 50 cow. And then, you know, he works his way up to this is pretty cool. And like, you just get to see.

And he's got a guy behind it, which is a dummy. And so if it shoots through it, you know that it got messed up. And at the end of video, he goes, yeah, yeah. And that's the end of the video. What is that? I freaking love. It's good. But like, that's me and my son who literally watched that every single day when we see

those cool videos come up. Yeah. You're telling me if I saw an ad that was like, you want to do this 30 minutes away with your son? It's a no-brainer. Do I? Like would you do that or go skydiving? I would rather do this.

Thank you. I'd rather go Rocky Mountain climbing, but sure. I asked Chad, GBT, how much to buy a fully functional used and old but working tank. And it says, I can't help you with that. It's just not allowed.

Dude. You're lame. D-E-I overload, bro. Jamie, pull that up. Okay, Jamie to pull up. Is he pulling it up?

He's pulling up. 50,000. All right. That's a really good one, Nick. You did your homework. today. Thank you. Let's see if I can match it.

Okay. Okay. All right. So can I say one more thing? Yeah, please. Drive a tank. Actually, I'm not going to even going to say it. I'm going to show you it.

And I want to get your opinion on it. This is Drive a Tank's YouTube page. Oh, we're waste. 85 subscribers. Guys, get with the program. You should have millions of subscribers. But they joined December 14th, 2012. So they're a new account.

They joined like during World War II. What are we talking? talking about. Is this Neville Chamberlain's channel? They've only had seven videos and 20. This is, we're going to go on on the side here. This is the perfect example of a business not understanding

necessarily how big their market is. I guarantee a couple of videos that pop off on this. You're going to get people booking from out of state to come in. Like, you'll be booked out the wazoo if it's, Just even a couple of these videos went viral. Dude, you know what I'm doing? If I'm an enterprising entrepreneur, as most people listening to this are, I'm going to

reach out to these guys. I would and say, hey, I want to drive you business for free. And I want to be able to film anything you do at your business. The only caveat is I'm going to own your YouTube channel or I'm going to own a YouTube channel and I'm going to film all of your content and you'll get more leads. You'll get more business from it. And I'm going to own the YouTube channel. This could be a hundred K a month YouTube channel, like for sure.

Easily, dude, 100%. Just YouTube channel. Look at this. If this is true, if this description is true, the only place in the world you can drive a tank and shoot a fully automatic machine gun under one roof that is not owned by a government entity. If that is true, that's in their description. Okay. Like, I'm sorry, you are leaving so much money on the table. So much money on the table.

If that is true. I just love the only place in the world where you can drive a tank. Oh, wow. That's actually crazy. And shoot a fully automatic machine gun under one roof on a leap year only that is not owned by a government entity with a baby boomer that was born in Nebraska. It's so specific. It's those sports stats football season's coming up. This is the first time that Tim Tebow has won in Death Valley on a Friday afternoon.

Like what? Well, and Jerry, with that catch, if Deshaun keeps that up for the rest of the season, he's on pace for 10,000 receiving yards. Well, this is just the first quarter of the first game. I know, but if he does that every quarter of every game for the rest of the year, if you amortize that out, think about it. If he plays for all seven years of college. Oh, my gosh. I love that.

That is so true. Yeah, you break that down. You only place in a world you can drive a tank. Oh, really? And shoot a fully automatic machine gun. Oh, okay. That's all right. Under one roof.

Wait, so it's indoors. That is not owned by a government entity. Hold, I don't. I'm not mad. I'm that math meme right now where it's like, uh, trying to do the math on it. Well, here's another one, drivetanks.com. Okay. Not to be confused with drive a tank.com.

It looks like a very similar website. This one's in Texas. I knew it would be in Texas. Dude, I was surprised this one was in Minnesota. First of all, their marketing looks way better than drive a tank. Yeah, because drive a tank probably came first. And these guys are like, we could do that so much better. $3,200.

There's Drive-A-Tank Orlando. Oh, they were in a Mr. Beast commercial and a Dude Perfect commercial or video. Oh, I guarantee that company's freaking crushing it then. Yeah, yeah, they're crushing it. They've been in a Dude Perfect and a Mr. Beast video. No way. Yeah. See, that's how you do it.

That's how you do it. I still think this Minnesota company, like I don't understand, to your point, again, what's the downside to just point shoot, upload, point shoot, upload. They don't even have to do any editing, really. I guarantee their YouTube channel would grow if they were just consistent, even if they were all like portrait videos that were placed on, you know, the 9 by 16 video. You know what I mean? Like, they would still blow up, pun intended.

Dude, yeah, they have 116,000 Instagram subscribers and 13,000 YouTube subscribers. I wonder if it's the same. can't be the same company. Yeah, I doubt it. Did you see, I think it was last week of the week before, Meta, parent company of Facebook, came out with their quarterly earnings? No. It came out, and they freaking crushed it.

Like, crushed it. Year over year, their ad revenue is up 21%, which is insane. Their ad impressions are up 11% year over year. The average price per ad that they're making is a, up 9% and their daily active people. Take a guess. I want you to guess how many daily active people does Facebook have across Instagram and WhatsApp? 2.5 billion. Okay. 3.5 billion people. That's crazy. It's like 50% of the world is a daily active user, which is insane. The thing in particular that I was just like most blown away by is the impact that AI has had.

What this says here is with AI, meta has been able to boost their ad conversions by 5% on Instagram and 3% on Facebook. And they're only getting better because they're using AI. And I just thought that because they're getting so much better, you're seeing it in their quarterly performance. Not because they're using AI to like cut workforce. course, they're using AI to make their product better. And if you're a small business owner, you need to be using Facebook and Instagram, meta ads. You're going to advertise your budget. You're going to be more likely to use it for the first time and or you're going to increase your budget, your daily budget. I was just talking to a guy. He has a business. It's a home

services business. I don't want to out him. And he was like, yeah, I tried to use meta. It doesn't really work. But let's let's say that it's a home services business that washes windows. Okay, let's just say that's the business. It's like, yeah, I tried it. I had an ad agency. doing it, but I didn't really see any results from it. What would you say to somebody like that? Okay. This is maybe a terrible analogy because I hate golf. But imagine someone's like, oh, I hate golf. I went to a golf course with a club and I hit it and I sliced it. So golf doesn't work. Like what? Did anyone like, did you ever take lessons? Like golf works for millions of people. Like you sliced it once so you don't like it so it doesn't work. Therefore, it's broken for everyone

for your whole industry, like, dude, you can't just write it off like that. He was using an ad agency that was like, oh, I had an ad agency that was doing my meta ads, my Facebook ads. And I was like, how long did you do it for? Did you, like, do you know how they were A-B testing it? And this is, you know me. I don't know Jack about this stuff. The stuff I know is basically picked up secondhand from you.

And he was like, I don't really know. I mean, they tested some stuff. And I was like, were you in the ad creative? Was it a video? Was it a picture? Was it just text? Like how were you actually using it? And obviously he didn't have any answers for me.

But I've heard repeatedly over and over and over founder led Facebook ads are the best converting ads to have somebody local who owns that company and is advertising there. And yet there's still they're still coming. Like this guy owns a home services business that washes windows. You're telling me that people needing window washing services aren't on Facebook. They're not going to convert. Like it's probably the best place that they're going to be. Right. You're going to have conversion.

Right. obviously there are always going to be different industries that are better for Google versus Facebook or whatever. I would say net of net, like a home service business is usually going to be better on Google because it's higher intent traffic. People are ready to buy right then. But there are so many examples of home services crushing it on Facebook. You just have to do in the right way. You need instant form leads. Like you need videos, never pictures, ever. You need to be focused on planting seeds, not on converting right away. Whereas with Google, you want to convert right then because they're hot right now. Oh, that's interesting.

You kind of think of more as for home services brands, Facebook as like a brand building or brand brand awareness campaign or retargeting. You put a pixel on your window cleaning website and then people find it from all over the internet. And then Facebook is going to like basically put a little tracker on them for the end of all time. And then you can retarget your ads to the people that have already shown interest in your website. They've already been on your website. So retargeting campaigns are one of the most effective campaigns because it's it's high intent people that already know and recognize you, but we need like seven touches before we convert. Why do you think it is so much harder for small businesses?

Not harder. Why do you think it's so easy for them actually to say like, well, Facebook doesn't work? Are they just not testing enough? Like what's the threshold at which you actually can be successful on Facebook? They're probably just not desperate enough. Like they have other customer acquisition strategies that are working fine and good is the enemy to great. right? And so it's like they just don't really need it enough. Whereas if that were the strategy

that they started with or the marketing channel that they started with and really took the time to learn it themselves, like I don't really suggest people hire agencies before like learning how to do it themselves. Like we hire an agency to be the silver bullet. But I like hiring agencies once I know enough to hold them accountable and to actually know if they're doing a good job or not. Because it sounds like this guy didn't know what questions to ask the agency to even discern that. I had a buddy of mine. I was just talking to you yesterday. And we were talking about something else.

But he was like, you should hire an agency. He was talking to me. He's like, hire an agency, but tell them up front. My goal is to fire you in three months. And I'd like you to loom everything that you do for me so that I can learn how to do it. And I was like, dude, no agency is going to take you on. He's like, you're telling me an agency is going to refuse $10,000 of work just because you're being up front with them. They're probably going to think, oh, that guy's not actually going to do it.

but at least you're being up front with them and you're you're like accelerating the learning curve while they're doing the work that you need done anyways and I just thought that was a really cool kind of approach to it and yes there probably will be some agencies that say no to you but I think you'll get more yeses than no yeah all right what you think please share it with a friend and we'll see you next time on the Kerner office