The Kristian Harloff Show - 2023 Comic Book Movies And TV Shows: A Year In Review!

Episode Date: December 29, 2023

Become a Patron!: https://www.patreon.com/TheBigThingShow 2023 was an interesting year for comic book movies and TV shows to say the least. There were some really bad ones. But there were a lot of good ones as well. Some of the bad seems to drown out a lot of the good that there were. But because of the fact that it wasn't all sunshine and rainbows, instead of a best of this year, we decided to do a recap of everything that was. So in this episode, Kristian, Winston and Coy will go over the list of all of the comic book TV and movie properties and give their thoughts of what was the best and what was disappointing. #DC #DCU #Marvel #MCU #Comics #Movies SUPPORT THE SHOW HERE: AG1: http://www.DrinkAg1.com/BIGTHING ROCKETMONEY: http://www.RocketMoney.com/THING JOYMODE: http://www.UseJoymode.com CODE BIG THING OUR MERCH STORE IS LIVE: https://www.teepublic.com/stores/the-... FOLLOW KRISTIAN + FIND HIM ON CAMEO https://cameo.com/kristianharloff TWITTER https://twitter.com/kristianharloff FACEBOOK https://facebook.com/harloff INSTAGRAM https://instagram.com/kristianharloff AMAZON WISHLIST: https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls...  

What's going on, everybody? Welcome back. It's Friday. It's Capes and Cal's Big Thing. We were going to call this the best movies and TV of the comic book genre. And then we realized it just wasn't enough good ones. So we said, well, wait a minute. As you saw when you clicked on this video, let's just do the comic book TV and movies recap of the year of 2020.

Before we get into any of that, that thing floating around right there. That means you want to be part of the conversation every week, whether it's this show, any other show I do for Monday through Friday on The Big Thing. We hope you'll be a part of it. We are approaching $200,000. And I say that even though we're at $11,000, we got there fast because you guys are part of the conversation. So help us get to $200 by clicking that button, buddy, buddy, button. Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Anywhere Podcasts are found. I got Winston.

I got Koi. We got the whole crew here. everybody. Let's do it. It's capes and cows. Here we go. Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen, capes and cows. Me, Christian Harloff, Winston A. Marshall, Poissonrejandro. It is. Capes and cows back with us here today on the show. Man, oh man, Winston, we finally got this computer going. Finally. Finally, man. God knows how long. It's funny because what, a couple weeks ago, we were just, like it just really hit the fan. I was here for a little bit

trying to help sort it out and it sounds like the answer was, what did you end up doing with the other one? I put it in my room. I put it in my room and it actually is very beneficial. The computer is great. The other computer just couldn't hold what we're doing here. But what I've found now, I put it into my room, to my wife's dismay. I put it in the room, but what it allows me to do

now, like sometimes it'll be late at night. I'm like, oh, I can edit that and touch that up. I've got to do it in the morning. Just not OBS. Anything else working great. No, OBS works fine. It's not the OBS. It's the amount of, like, you know, the cameras and stuff they were doing, and all the different things. Yeah, it was too many things were plugged in, but now

I can edit at night. I don't have to worry about it. There's something I need to touch up. I need to make a thumb to you. You don't have to be out here. No. If anything, she should be happy, because then if it's like, baby, go check out of baby. That's what I told her. And she didn't realize that she just doesn't want me in her space, and I get it. She had so much space before.

But now. That area was, it's her, it's her space. But I'm like, but I also said, but I also told her, I said, Your computer you're working on is dog shit. It's horrible. Does she use that one now? She's using that one now. That's what I told her. I said, I'm going to set this up for this morning.

I said, come on, admit it. This computer's better. And she was, it's faster. And I'm like, come on, man. That's literally better. That's the whole point. She's acclimating. She'll get settled.

It is. The thing I set up her profile. I said, I'm never going to bother you ever again because you have your own profile. So, I mean, last night, because I put up my top 10 best movies. And I told her, I said, if you want, if you want, she wanted to go. She wanted to take a walk. This one kids are off school. So she wanted to take her walk.

So I'm like, if you want to be able to, you know, take a nice long walk in the morning so I can record, you don't have to edit in the morning. Let me just edit tonight. I'll do it in the room. Kept up for an extra half an hour. So she's like, I didn't get to sleep. I'm like, come on.

It's nothing right with you, woman. Is it because of sound or because of the light? The light. I understand. She was, she was bothered by it. But I was like, listen. Yeah. You know, me and your wife are friends.

Like I'm friends with your whole. family man at this point. You want me to buy her a night mask? Because like, you're out here trying to make a living for her. I am also considering showing her this. And then I quickly said no. Yeah, because you're going to get me killed. No, not that.

That's my concern. I'm worried for Winston's the safety. She's not here to defend herself. That's true. That's a one side of model. I'm good with that. Now that you've done your top 10, do you agree with my assessment? I was, it was a maybe not strongest in like since 99, but like a

strong year in cinema. It was definitely, I didn't disagree that it was a strong year. But you interpreted my tweet as stronger worded than it was. Because I think we moved back to it looks the actual phrasing. We actually, no, what happened is you admitted this when we in our lost episode, which there may be a possibility of recovering. I don't know that. How? Jonathan

showed me a trick yesterday through OBS that it's possible to potentially recover it. I'm going to see. I haven't tested it yet. I love we just dumped like the unreleased tapes. We have like three episodes that were like shot through the years. I want to see if I can actually do that. But but no, so what you said on that show was, in your tweet, it was very definitive saying it was the best year in cinema.

That was about Star Wars. I said the last shot I was best. But I said a great year in cinema. Because we checked the tapes on both and I was very careful in my phrasing. There's a lot of really, there was a great year. There was a lot of good movies. There's a lot of really good movies, but nothing that, you know, to me, like all time stuff. But I will say, I did go back after doing my list and saying there was a lot of stuff that I really loved this year.

I think there was more in my top like 20 this year. that be not wiggleable, whereas a lot of years it's like, oh, I like that. It makes my top. Whereas this year, it's like this is in my time. It's such a definitively good year for me. No, I feel that. I mean, there are some best of all time in this year. Same.

So, like, I think that, and I'm probably going to catch a little bit of flag for this, but I think that Guardians is up there in the conversation for the best closing to a trilogy. Ever? Yeah. It's in the conversation because how many, how many trilogies actually do not stick the landing? Because, like, the only one. I can think of that genuinely did a great job. I just

is Return of the King. That's the only one I can think of off the top of my head that completely. Gen. I did a good job. It's good. I think Guardians 3 is better. I love, I love Return of the Jedi. I think it's incredible. But I just like, I just thinking about it. How to Train Your Dragon.

Yeah. The before trilogy. I would agree with you. It's for as far as trilogy is going. I think the before trilogy, Guardians and How to Train Your Dragon are the ones that lead to mine. Before sunrise, before sunset, before. Yeah. The Ethan Hawkins. Oh,

too. It's a white people movie. Prepare. It's the whitest movie, but prepare to love again. Ever. Yeah. Watch me and the girlfriend. Fall in love again. It's beautiful.

It's like going on a vacation. Have you ever seen like the child? What's the one, boy? No. The boyhood, right? Boyhood. Yeah. You ever seen boyhood?

Nobody know about it. So it's that, but it's about two people and it's over the course of three decades. And they film it every 10 years and it's about a relationship. Okay. Okay. So it's another. Okay. Got it.

So similar format to what you're aware of, but like it's about love. It's beautiful. There's a lot, yeah, but yeah, for sure. It definitely stuck the landing. It was in my top 10. Across the Spiriverse, I think, is my favorite comic book movie. Well, let's go there. Let's just start with it.

Start positive. Here's how it works. If you watch the episode that I did with Dan Merrill and John Roker last year and this year, we essentially have like this big list and then we bounce back and forth all three of us and we pick one from the list and we just talk about it for a little bit. This is going to be similar except one of the things is, that we're going to probably land on a couple of bad movies and we'll probably or bad TV shows and we'll talk about maybe like why and we're just not here to just kind of throw you know

turd bombs at it but we're here to kind of discuss it maybe the disappointment and how we felt about it maybe going into it and I will say I know there's a couple of top of my head that maybe myself and coy don't like that Winston really likes or vice versa you know so that's kind of the point of this we just want to cover the everything um in review for this year so Coy, you started us off across the Spider-Verst. It was in my top 10. It actually came in at number 10. What is it about this movie that you thought was special?

Did it work? What say you? So into the Spider-Verse, I consider a revolution in animation. And I think that a lot of movies can evolve animation, but I think this was revolutionary, the first one. And then I didn't know how they'd keep that bar or elevate it. And I do feel like across the Spider-Verse is another revolutionary step in animation. All of the things the first one did, they could have just,

evolved that style. They could have just made it a better version of that wonderful, life-changing style. But instead, it upped the game and exponentially increased what was going on in the different universes. It explains multiversal theory really well. The first one does an impossible task and that it explains quantum theory for kids. The second one does an impossible task in that it really does a multiversal hat trick by being not just the trolley problem, not just explaining canon events, but doing all of that while moving two narratives forward. I consider this and incredible Miles Morales story, whereas the first one was a great Miles Morales origin. This is his own story. He's his own man. But it's him accepting that is his own man,

while also giving us a lot of really good Gwen. This to me is where the first one was anyone can wear the mask. This to me was what it means to actually be Spider-Man. Like he's accepted he's Spider-Man. Now it's what that is. And the reason it's, I think, my favorite comic book movie is the moral compass of ever. Ever? The cross- Across Spires? Yeah, I think ever. Because to me, comic books are a morality tale where you connect to a certain hero because of their archetype. And I will totally admit that I've always been a Peter Parker, like, diehard. Stan. Yeah, like Peter Parker is who I grew up on.

And Miles, I was in the comic books like, oh, he's a new guy that has a couple new powers. And I like him, but I'm not, I didn't connect as much to him because- Did you need to cut to me for half a second when you said? Because I was like, he's a cool guy and I like him. and then you just cut to the ear and just looking at him like this. But he was another legacy character a la, you know, like Kyle Rainer or Connell, these characters I love, but I didn't connect him as much as the character I grew up with because how would I? It's not the character I grew up with.

The first Miles movie made me go like, oh, I feel for Miles Morales in a different way. This one cemented him as, oh, I get Miles Morales as Spider-Man. It's not just, oh, I get that character. I get why he's loved because that's an easier thing to do. it's, oh, I feel as strongly for a character that I've loved since I could read. And that's an impossible task. So all of that plus the music, plus the animation style, plus the fact that the first one felt like it was a comic book come to life.

This one felt like my imagination come to life. This one felt like someone was seeing inside my mind while I read the comic and hallucinated wildly at colors in this palm of my hands. It's so special. And I also think it's a really good example of artists getting to flex. Like every artist in this film, whether it's the Gwen universe that feels like all those colors that like elicit pure emotion or the the 299 universe that they literally made mcgale o'hara have lines um accentuating the edges of his face just beyond his face because the future is not

set yet there's little visual cues to even the characterization that are genius so every time i've talked to anyone that's been a part of this movie well whether it's the directors the producers the writers they always have another thing that like they add a little nugget to so i think living in this age of easter eggs and like a little behind the scene stuff you it does get exhausting for me like the TikTok vacation of movies. This one does it with more heart so the Easter eggs feel important instead of feeling like they're trying to get people's attention. So, Coy, cover this entire

movie. Yeah, I guess I won't talk about the one black superhero movie this year. I would just leave that to quote. You go ahead and appropriate this one black hero real quick. Can I take credit for him? I'm teasing. It is

it is by far and away. It made my top five of the year. I kind of fluctuate, depending my mood as to where I'm at on my top five movies, period. As far as superhero movies, though, it's probably my number one. If I'm being, if I'm being honest, I thought that it was absolutely phenomenal. I think it is all parts of a trilogy are hard to land.

I know we were talking about, you know, Guardians being a great final part of a trilogy. But I think when we think of solid trilogies, most of the time movie number two has to knock it out of the park. Sure. So like the Dark Night is what really cements the Dark Night trilogy. Empire is what really solidifies Star Wars. Like I would say in Indiana Jones it's more Raiders

than it is, than it is Temple of Doom. So that kind of flies in the face of it a little bit. But sometimes, I think most times you're right. Yeah, for sure. And I think what this movie does absolutely is that it sets up, we think, what is going to be, again, the end of a trilogy. And they set it up really well.

And as Coy was mentioning, the characters that we kind of fell in love with in the first movie, they're not really even front and center, minus Miles. And really, Gwen Stacy is kind of the one that's really focused on in this movie. And it works. They still focus on Miles, obviously. They still tell the story with his parents. They still show the dilemma that he's having to leave you on this cliffhanger. Some people got upset with that.

I think it plays into what we're about to see. And I think less people have a problem with it. Right. But, yeah, generally speaking, if the second movie shits the best, bed it is signs of this trilogy ain't gonna make it you know what I mean and like I it's so don't use that statement when we're talking about Aquaman oh the thermal like huge he got it I can't wait I can't wait for Alka Man after I don't make a billion I don't think you got it I think he got it though I got it you got it it's sarcastic

did you get what I was saying about Aquaman 2 being so important I guess I didn't get it I guess I didn't get it guys joke Jesus could just right over See it to enjoy. Found it. But how many movies have we seen that the second the second one kind of put a cabash on whatever they were doing? So like Wonder Woman came out the gate swinging. And I know the DCE was on a down swing,

but 84 was so bad, three stalled out hard as they were figuring out if they were going to go with James Gunner. You know what I mean? Like same thing with Shazam. Who knows? If Fury will get to it, if Fury the gods had been fire,

there's a possibility that, gun is like, okay, how do I figure it out? Because we've already talked about how Blue Beetle is still going to be apparently a part of this in one way or another. But that seems like that's completely gone. Yeah, there's a lot of... Well, we'll get into all. I think there was a lot of luster lost with Majority Reloaded

before Revolution. I know they both did financially well, but that's a good other example. Reloaded Hurt Revolution. Yes, it ended fine and it technically was one giant movie they split into two because they released them in what, like June in October or something like that? Yeah. I know it was like one was a Christmas, so yeah.

Okay. I think it was Mayans and whatever. Whatever it was. But that being said, the fact that across Spider-Verse was this good, people are kind of foaming at the mouth for beyond the Spider-Verse and how this all wraps up. You know what I mean? Let alone has peaked people's interest now in the idea of a live-action Miles Morales. I also believe that this movie is what also Spider-Man 2 was the video game was going to be big regardless.

I think that just boosted that even more where all of a sudden people gave a shit and like, you know, like folks that were like, yeah, Spider-Man was good. They were like, I really- I also think it's landing the Logan villain better. Like in Logan, they have like man versus self as that great visual representation with the clone. I love that multiversally, we get the, if you don't have someone trying to guide you through your life, you don't have this candidate of that happened to you, how you can easily slip into becoming the prowler. How like those powers can go awry.

And I also love that the meta narrative of Donald Glover, who inspired Miles Morales, ends up playing the prowler live action, which ends up reflecting all of this back to us. It's the most meta-cami. It's my favorite came of all time. So you missed it, man. we were talking about this and I was talking about Donald inspiring Miles and all that

and I was like, y'all talked to Koi because he was the one that even put me on game on how this went down the rabbit roll. But I said that and someone in the comment was all like, that's not what actually happened and it's not whatever, whatever. I was like, well, a quick Google search

will tell you. That actually, this is exactly what the artist was saying was like seeing him in a Spider-Man outfit and community and then everything that happened was like, yeah, that makes sense. I'm going to model up here. Yeah, Brian Michael Bendis has been on record

and so many people are like, actually, and it's like, okay, let's check the take. Check the tips right there. Well, check the tape to see that we've all talked about this for a bit. We've all talked about how much we all loved it. And most, it's on a lot of people's list as it should be. This is a really, really solid film.

It does get me excited for the third one, which I think is 2025 right now, 26. It's not 2024. I think it's undated. Because like we saw through the strike how through to the wire they were on the first and the second one. Yeah. So I'm hoping. this third when they take their time to breathe.

Yeah. All right. So that's that one. Now we're going to bounce to Winston. Winston, you can take a TV show. You can take a movie. What, say you? Okay.

Then I, I'm going to go for probably my favorite new property this year because there's a lot of season twos and a lot of sequels. It is technically a spinoff, but I'm going to go with Gen V. We haven't really had a chance to really break that down yet.

We haven't. We really haven't. I would make the argument that this to me was top, I'll say top three superhero anything this year. And for me, definitely, I would actually put it above Loki. I loved Loki. I loved Loki. But I think there is something to be said about taking something completely new.

Yes, it is a spinoff. But you're essentially introducing all brand new characters. and you already have a very high pedestal with the boys to be able to still capture that feeling but give it to me in a different kind of package. Like, I'm always thirsting for something new. It doesn't mean I don't want sequels and follow-up seasons. I'm always just looking for a new something.

And how many spinoffs have we seen that happened that are trash? You know what I mean? Like friends being probably the biggest sitcom ever and Joey was awful just as an exhibit. You likes Joey. No. He's got the one Joey DVD. I like Drake Dameiteo.

That's about it. Fair. But like to come into this to find such incredible ways, people are constantly bitching about wokeness and whatnot. To take something like the idea of being non-binary and to explain it through the medium of superpowers and the struggles that this person is going through as they're doing that, not only to be accepted by their parents. their society, what sort of, like, that is one of those ways in which you're able to deliver

whatever kind of, like, social message you want, but to not beat somebody over the head with it. You know what I mean? It's served the story. Absolutely. And so I think that is when media is at its best, when you find a way too high, because, like, I said that about Black Panther, is that there's things for everybody to love about that, but there is a conversation that's then had about blacks versus Africans, how all that stuff, you know what I'm saying?

And so any show that can do that, and is also entertaining, and also has you at the edge of your seat, and can anchor to something. So, you know, I won't say any of the characters that are coming into the boys, but there's a massive cameo that happens in the boys where when it happens to go, oh, my God! And it then made me want to tell everybody

if you like that you have to watch GenVee. Well, because they did shared universe better than Marvel did the show. Yes, they did. And it played well. I felt like what they also did is if you watched Gen V for the first time that's added its entire universe and they were mentioning things in the background of what happened, you wouldn't be lost if you never watched the boys. Yeah. You'd just get benefits if you did.

Exactly. And you understand the world a little bit more. But you, like, there's things that they mention products that they mention, you know, characters that they mention, things that they show in the background. You're like, oh, yeah. But if, but you wouldn't be like, what's that? And Marvel is in that place of like, well, what the hell is that now? Because they've been doing it for so long. I mean, to be fair, to be fair to them.

But they did it in such a way that they introduced these characters. And I didn't know because I thought when I saw the trailer for it, I said, the worry that I have for this show is the fact that they could be playing on when the boys can run into those raunchy moments. Yeah. And the kind of shock moments, you're going, okay, that was out of control, but it fit the story. And in the trailer, they were showing those moments. And I'm like, are you just doing that? because you want people to watch. Maybe they were, but it also fit the story.

Oh, yeah. And it played in like, I cared about all the characters. I cared about the back. It's going to be a consistent theme of any movie list that we do, anything we talk about, make me care about the characters, and then I'll care about the world. And the other thing that's always interesting, the reason why there are so many stories surrounded around teenagers and young adults

happens to be because that's that point in our life where we tend to be the most unsure of ourselves. and that makes for compelling storytelling. So like the fact that you have this, you know, multiple, I'm not going to get into specifics, but multiple superheroes that have been the course of tragedy within their family and with their lives and them having to cope with that.

And what does that mean about them? Are they monsters? Are they actually like just really good people that are lost? The fact that you have one character that in order for her to shrink or to grow large, she either has to binge eat or go throw up. So you're dealing with eating disorder type stuff. And then what that means for her, and everything. It's just so

it is such a well-woven tapestry that we'll talk about Loki and Loki is phenomenal. I'm not taking that away. It's just from the standpoint of you're giving me something brand new that I know very little about because it's just loosely related to the

boys and it worked. I also think in relating to what you're saying about being a teenager and how what they upheaval of that time, it's also one of the best users of shared universes to do the different perspective that comment do so well where season one of the boys really establishes this amazing corporate feeling where it's like we're the hierarchy looking down at humanity and everyone in that even the

not so arrogant as homelander soups they have that like oh we're the betters and the x-men always has the brotherhood versus x-men like that perspective this does such a good job to have the every man looking up and have have the soups as this above them thing so i was really impressed at the shared universe feeling like a new perspective of a thing we were already four years familiar It also, and this is something that a good spin-off, especially if this is running concurrently, needs to do, it deepened the boys. It made, it puts so much context to a lot of stuff in the boys that only then made me more geared up for season four. It set it up really well. And I think that the other thing that that show has the benefit of doing, because it's essentially a satire of everything that we've seen in superhero movies and superhero shows, it allows you to take all elements from every unit.

You can have your Batman, you can have your Superman, you can have your blade, you can have you can have whoever you want and put it in there, just don't call him that so you don't get sued. But you pretty much have it and you've got like, you know, warped Superman, you have like, you have warped Flash, you have everything, you have warped Ant Man, you have it all. And I think that they do it really well and it's that kind of rated R feel that you can have serious moments and still have these kind of just out of control moments. But I think that putting it in a college is essentially like it was the expert. really was. And it sets a high bar

for what they're about to do with the X-Men. It also sets a bar of, hey, guys, we've matured as an audience. Please stop giving us all this kid stuff. Have kid stuff, but not all kids stuff. Stop giving us empty calories. Well, that's what it is. That's more so what it is. That's fair. That's good point. But that's why X-Men, the animated series back in the 90s, works so well. Like, yes, it was kind of the adventure of the week. There were some through lines

and all that. But it was Logan genuinely like diving into him really being a loner like that. It really is rogue and her just desperation to connect with somebody and you can't, you got those things. And we got that at a Gen V. And then on top of that, like, obviously the X-Men have some adults there. It tends to be more kids that are being trained at the school. This, again, by having college-age kids, we all got into nonsense. Take your college nonsense and then amp it up with superpower.

Right. 100%. All right. So, so far, what do you think of the two choices we've talked about thus far? We've gotten to some positivity. I'm sure I won't stay that way. But we're going to stay there so as long as we can. but a question is for you guys throughout this entire episode,

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That's rocketmoney.com slash thing. Rocketmoney.com slash thing. All right. Thank you to our friends over at AG1 Rocket Money and of course Joy Mode. I know my friends to my left are very excited that Joy Mode is back. So we are, Winston and Quay, were like,

wait a minute. You didn't tell us because they're like, they're going to be asking for people. Seriously. Immediately. Where are the packets about it? Pretty sure it's the holidays. It's New Year's in like a couple days.

It's about that. You know how I ring in the new year? Yeah, I see so joyously. This is not. Slay bells ring, are you listening? Someone will be listening. This is not, and this is not a sales. Not gonna be a silent night.

It's not sales. This is like, this is what I had here at three in the morning. Do I move out of package here? Anyway. So make sure guys that you, if you want to support the show, that's how you do it. Get one of our wonderful sponsors, the link in the description.

I always pin the sponsors as our top comment. All right, I'm going to go here, and I will switch it up a bit. And I'm going to talk about something. I'll talk about something I liked, didn't love, but liked. And it is based off of a French comic, and that's the killer. That's David Fincher's movie with Michael Fastbender. I enjoyed this movie. I enjoyed it.

This is to me the definition of a streaming film now, which is bizarre when you think of David Fincher, where David Fincher was like, you have to go see it in the movies. You have to go see it in the theater. Would I have enjoyed seeing this movie in the theater? Sure. Is it must viewing in the theater? No. It's a Netflix movie.

And very much so. You can tell it's made for Netflix now. There's these things. I guess this whole conversation with Roxy and Brett a few weeks ago about what the definition really is of a streaming movie, though, too. Because there are certain movies that you can put in the theater with a $5 or $10 million, $20 million budget, and it'll probably make you some money enough to warrant it being in the theater. I don't think this is one of them. This is a movie that people are. going to watch because it's a fun that you're paying $15 a month for Netflix you're like okay

let me sit down and I'll check this out and it's a great performance by him it's great performance by Tilda Swinton as always yeah but it's like the inside of the mind of this killer and how he works and then like something kind of happens that makes him change and how brutally is I liked it I liked the movie a lot I just didn't I you know it's Fincher I love Fincher and I wanted to love it I haven't seen the film yet okay I haven't seen it but you've seen it yeah I have I was actually wondering how much people would like it that aren't obsessed with David Fincher. He's my favorite director. David Fincher is the director that I will see anything he does. I think he and I have the same

sense of humor. Every time I hear an interview, I'm like, yes. David Fincher is my favorite director by a comfy margin. However. And, oh, no, no, ties to him this. I'm like Alien 3. But this film, I feel like was a commentary on Fincher. The movie itself is about a man whose attention to detail causes him problems that repeats himself and has this rhythm and pattern. It almost felt like David Fincher spoofing

the concept of David Fincher movies. It felt like someone who made Fight Club apologizing to the wrong fans of Fight Club. Like the people that love Fight Club are two paths and some of them, the louder ones of them, have ruined Fight Club. And this movie felt like an apology from the man who made it. And I love that. This movie felt like

a commentary on being overly analytical and what it means to like not live your life, but to plot your life. And it felt like what Fincher's like on set. I'm lucky enough to have, I worked on the social network. So I got to see my favorite director in his element of all the things you've heard. And some of it's exaggerated. Some of it's very true. But it's really fun to watch a movie that feels like a commentary on the director. But I don't know if I didn't know any of that stuff, if I'd have enjoyed it at all. I can't

remove that knowledge from myself. It's like when I watch a comic book movie, I can't go like, oh, I can't not know that Easter egg. So I don't know my level of joy if I didn't know it. And this was Fincher. If you watch this show, you'll know what I'm about to, how I'm going to finish this sentence. I watch She was my wife, and she bailed. She bailed on it. Like, she was just like, I don't know. It's just not. But she was getting bored, right?

It's very funny, but I don't know if it's funny for everyone because of how subjective all humor is, especially this humor. Like I said, the fight's hilarious. Best sound design of the year for me. I enjoyed this movie. I enjoyed that one fight in the kitchen. It's great. I enjoyed this movie.

But like I said, it was a movie that, to me, I was very much so always looking forward to what's the next David Fincher movie going to be? It was because of seven and, you know, as you said, Like Love Zodiac, the game. It's so, so, so the game. I love the game. Oh, too, so slept on. I watched the game recently with my wife,

who loved that movie. But I was expecting something like that. It's not that. It's not that. It's a very, it is a very cerebral thing because you, because, and it's slow. But I, and I don't mind it for that. I just thought, you know,

I think I wanted it to be great. That was good. It's in that panic room zone for me. Yeah, it's like, I'm really glad it exists. won't be on a lot. Right. And that's fine.

I think that's totally accurate. All right, let's go back to you, Corey. Now, so you got TV, you got film, what do you got?

You know, I'm going to go with the conclusion to the trilogy there. I feel like I want to stay positive. Well, it's funny. I was going to do J.D. I'm not even kidding.

We're going to talk about it. It was just really funny. We're both like, oh, these things. I adored Guardians of the Galaxy 3. I feel like this movie came out of a really weird time

where it kind of missed its window of best of the year list because I don't hear it talked about a lot. of the year as well as best comic films. Only two movies in the comic book space made my top 23, because it's 2023. I'm doing it top 23 like a monster. But only two comic films got even close,

but they both made my top five. And Guardians 3, I think not only is one of the best thirds of a trilogy, but it does something that's really, really hard to do beyond the trilogy element. It takes every curveball of a shared universe and enhances the film. I think Guardians 3 is going to be one of those examples of like, oh right, James Gunn should run a universe because he had not planned for what happened to Gamora to happen to Gamora. It made this movie better when the elements of Star Lord Gamora got a complete monkey wrench thrown at them.

He did not plan on certain characters having the twists and turns they had in the Avengers movies, having people have their own expectations of, say, Star Lord, but it enhanced the film for the better. So to me, not only was it a fun commentary on the Times, having a villain who wants to just reboot, remake, and recreate things in his own image, even if they don't need to be, that was amazing for a third film in a trilogy in a shared universe. Oh, he's playing like Bob Sheapec, dude. No, no, I literally didn't think about that. A live action, Disney, everything, as made by the High Evolutionary. Yeah, that's crazy. Yeah, when I, I mean, I don't know if it was intentional, but I don't think James Gunn does much unintentionally. To me, when I looked at the High Evolutionary, I'm like, so the bosses that fired you from Guardians 3, re-hire.

you after they shouldn't have fired you. Now, not only are you working for the exact competition, but you're going to make the villain of this movie Disney itself. Love that. So it's a genius commentary on our current society, which I think superhero movies should be when they can. It's also a really, really strong team film. It also has an incredible hallway scene,

which is a great bar for Marvel, that one-taker action sequence. And most importantly, it's impossibly emotional. I was so invested in these characters all the way in. We've had them forever. it's hard to keep leveling up how important they are to you. We've lived with them for like, what, nine years? I was wrecked by this film.

And it's another example of what animation can do. Guardians of the Galaxy shows that your lead, being an animated raccoon, surrounded by live-action human beings, can make you more emotional than some of the best Oscar films this year. I think I loved my stroke. Bradley Cooper's better in this. You heard me.

That's crazy. You heard me. He's great. He's better in this. He's a raccoon. And he made me cry. He didn't make me cry, Bernstein. Meistro was an honorable mention for me and this is number six for me. I thought

Carrie Mulligan lapsed circles around him of Maestro. I don't disagree with that, but he was still phenomenal. He played a better raccoon than a better composer. You're a crazy person, but I respect every Oscar person right now is just fuming in the comments. Yeah, he was he was great involved. He's incredible both talk about a little bit more. I just thought it was funny. He prepared six years for one. But you talked about you liked you liked the other movie better than this one, but, Spider-Ver's better than this one, but you still like this. They're very 1-A-1B to me.

Right. And I think the thing that was able for me to differentiate them out, starting with the good, I love drilling home the message of what healing looks like, and especially in the case of like when you lose one family, that the only thing that can really fix that is to find a new one. Sure.

And that really got drilled home. here that every single one of these characters has had there and we've seen that throughout these trilogies their families have been violently ripped from them for any number of reasons whether by their own uh you know their parents being monsters so both ego and thanos or uh you know the idea of just being robbed of it drax's family being killed uh rockets family being killed by the high evolutionary etc and really how important that is to find those new people that make you whole they really drilled that point home at the end here about, you know, that's what, the fact that they

even argue multiple times about, like, that's my best friend. Actually, you're my best friend. You know, like, there's a couple little moments like that that were hilarious. My only negative for this film, and you got, is Warlock. And you guys feel differently. No. Who feels differently? I thought you both

liked out of Warlock. I didn't mind them as much as others, right? And I didn't think it was the right movie. He was the weakest link. Oh, yeah, definitely the weakest. I want to go back to the tape because I feel like y'all had said that you really liked what they did with him. I like Will Poulter. I think based off of what he was... I was okay with what they did with him. Maybe

I'm not as negative. I might go rewatch it and see what happens. But I say all that to say, Will Poulter is great. I thought what they gave him. That was great. I just hated the direction they took the character. I thought it did not fit. I understand you're trying to add some levity to what is the darkest of the three

films. He became... He became the problem I had with Guardians 2 is what he became. Like, just like, oh, just put him in there for comic release. he doesn't really have much substance to him. There's not a lot of... He's just kind of like a dopey kid, and it didn't work.

But that being said, this movie, to me, is one of my favorite Marvel films, and it's my favorite out of the Guardians, all three of them, because of everything you guys just said. The emotion, and obviously, and it is also because I cared so much

about the characters kind of through the first two movies, through Infinity War, through Endgame, through all of that, and I cared about their... Through the Christmas special. And I cared enough, that we got to this spot and Rocket, who they've been teasing,

and there's a moment that actually, and it's the reason why I think I like Guardians 2 more now than I used to, there's a moment that, what's his name, Michael Rooker Yandu, has with Rocket in the ship, he's like, I know you, because you're me, boy. And he has this whole thing with him, and it's so relevant to this movie, that whole scene, and that tied into it.

And as you said, the emotion of this movie. It's incredible what they're able to do with a non, There's no rocket there. We'll go into what if at a certain point here, but it actually just because it ties into what we're talking about, when you talk about canon events and the things that can shape you, literally, if Peter did not touch Yandu's heart like that, that's where you end up with that what if episode

and things go drastically a different direction. It is so important to find those anchors that make you whole and that can help you heal and come back. And I feel like especially in this day and age, There's so many situations where we've all been in, like, some of the darkest moments in our life between the pandemic and everything that's been going on in the world. So to see that even if an entire world is blowing up around you, if you have your family, if you have your friends, that you can make it through anything, I think that's why this movie was so high for me. I totally agree. All right. Winston, let's stay with you, man.

So we got a... You want to stay with some positive? You want to go with some farts. You know, I always believe in the compliment sandwich. You start with, like, a good thing. Yeah. Then you hit them with the meat and potatoes of why you don't effed up and then you come back on the other side. So let's go with something that was kind of crappy.

Okay. I'm going to go with secret invasion. Oh, yeah, secret invasion. Right. I, this hurt my heart for a number of reasons. Marvel TV, the Disney Plus TV shows have been kind of on, have been teetering. They're either really good. They're very mid or they are off.

There is no kind of in between with that they fall under one of those three categories. And for this to have started very strong and set up a very, like, thrilling kind of spy homage and all that kind of stuff. I was like, okay, this is going to be good. And every episode has just got progressively worse and progressively worse and progressively worse. And what a lot of people, I didn't feel this way about Shee Hulk, but what a lot of people felt about Shee Hulk where it was last year, right? I think. Yeah. What is the time?

I think She Oak was last year. Must have been. But either way, what everybody has been said about She-Hulk and how they felt about a coach is going to check. You should. Because if it was this year, that's a major one we forgot. Okay, good. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was just the end of last year.

That's why. This is what I actually felt about secret invasion. And the thing that sucks, from an acting standpoint, there are some incredibly acted moments in this. I think that Samuel talking to his wife and that kind of back and forth was actually a very solid masterclass of a two-person scene and really kind of tapping into emotional depth. But that didn't save it from all the other bullshit that was going on, including making Super Scroll literally the most powerful person in the universe, making another one. And it's just so great about this. Yeah. Listening to you talk about it, I have no idea what you're saying because I only watched two ever.

episodes and bailed. Oh, dude. And those are two best episodes by a lot. It's like hearing you talk about all this. I'm like, oh my God, I'm so glad I didn't subject myself to the rest of this because I never finished it. I was going to go back. I probably will go back and fix it. Everything is just like what? The first two are great. Yeah, and that's funny and I bailed after the first two. Yeah, so if you didn't like those two. No, it's not that I didn't like them. I just didn't care afterwards. And I didn't mind them because Amelia Clark, by the way, who I loved the Game of Thrones, this and solo, oh, Cole wasn't that bad. Didn't do well. That solo and this movie and this show,

she just can't catch a break as far as the big... And Terminator. And Terminator. Remember she was in Terminator, dude? She's been in so many franchises at their wrong point. Well, sometimes, to take it to sportsmen, sometimes you're just in the right, you're on the right team and the right thing, and I think for Game of Thrones,

I'm not saying that Amelia Clark isn't a good actor, she is. Yeah. But DeNaris was so spot on for her that it might be harder for her to catch another role. She's also Alex Rodriguez playing for the Yankees, maybe. I mean, playing for the, oh, how dare me? She was also, Alex Rodriguez playing for the Rangers. It's the one time I've ever been like,

wait a sports thing. When he played with the Rangers, they weren't good. I understand. That's what I'm saying. I understand. So like, so when, so she and. Yeah, I'll give you one. When was the last time you were in a World Series?

2009. Sock it. 27, 27. You're like the Cowboys right now. 27. It's been forever. 27. So, but it's a.

Five. Five. This is what Koi hears. You guys are actually speaking one of those Star Wars languages and I'm trying to read the captions and I'm like, I think that relates. Yeah.

I shabada let it out of Aft. Sports. Sports. Sports. Sports. Sports. Sports.

Sports. Sports. Sports. Can't turn it off. Is that our first case in Kelsey? You broke it. Oh, man. It's the holidays, guys.

But it just, it was bad on so many levels. There's this weird level of retconning that was happening. I understand kind of where you're going with the whole roadie reveal. The amount they've messed up war machine at this point. Not only, not only did they retcon his emotional impact of endgame, but they also, that was the first show that I realized how unimportant it was that he got paralyzed.

Yeah. When anybody might have hit. He's a parallel. Like, what they could have done. with that arc, they could have made stronger by Jake Gyllenhaal movie, but with someone in the MCU. They could have actually, it's Don Cheadle. How do you not let one of the best actors alive

act? And they did in this show, but not in any way that had you wait. Would you mind if Kevin Feigy got up and said, we're going to rename this show and call it Just Kidding? I would ask him to and I would like the movie to be Quantumania and the show to be Just Kid and TV. Because if they could make Quantumania

and this retcon, please and thank you. All right. Well, let's keep on because that one's not not the best. Not great. All right. So I'll stay with the not so great. Winston just mentioned it.

Let's go with Ant Man, quantumania. Now, I think out of the three of us, I disliked this least. There's a compliment sandwich. This is the way that I said. I stand by what I said out of the theater reaction. I walked out.

I saw it with my daughter and I said, look, this movie for me, I enjoyed it because it was a new science fiction movie with the way that they played is very different from the other two but it's science fiction but what i will understand a lot of people are not going to like this movie because the end is the end is horrible the end is so sloppy and especially when you see the way that they minus the the obvious legal problems and everything too but they that didn't do kang any justice in the way that he was defeated by ant man and the ants it just wasn't it just didn't work but i

thought there was a lot of stuff that did work for me but i was like this is so like like over CGIed that people are going to not love this. And it, it showed. It showed in box office. It showed in critical response. And it also was a kind of a wet fart when it came to, we're giving you Kang. Here's Kang.

And then Kang, it's like, I remember when we saw the trailers and we were like, oh, what's he going to do with time? It really does anything. Nothing. They put him in the quantum realm. He's like, I don't have time power. So I'm like, the conqueror of time? They had an opportunity.

And you and I have talked about this. They had an opportunity because the whole thing with Scott was that his relationship with his daughter. Time lost? Time lost. Perhaps they used that element. That he could have dangled that in front of him and he doesn't. And it's such a lost moment. Instead of threat, sorry.

No, no. I was going to say, instead of threatening him, I will kill your daughter. Literally go, I will give you your daughter. And that, and let's show that Kang as a conquer isn't just a violent care, but he's manipulative. Yes. If you do, my God, the emotional death. You know he who should remain, he who remains would have absolutely done that. And that character way more effective than Niscang.

To me, the thing that Wanda Vision did so well was establish a beautiful arc for a character that has a duality to her in Wanda. And the thing that kills me about multiverse is that they completely drop the ball. That is well documented. We all talk about that. I don't think enough people are acknowledging that Quantummania has two leads. Kang and Ant Man and in one decision

they get rid of Ant Man's relativity of size by putting him in the quantum realm so the Ant Man nature is gone and null and void and unimportant they neuter Ant Man by putting on the quantum realm and at the same time they have a villain relate to time

and they have him have no conquering of time you literally take your two leads in this film and make them useless They also kind of... How did they manage to like you if you look at it on paper Kang versus Ant Man is genius because of the elements of Paul Rudd being this at this point was like our only father in the MCU.

We have obviously Tony Stark has a young daughter, but we don't really get to see him raise her because he's passed. We get, I know, spoilers for end game. We have Thor who has a daughter by the end of love and thunder, but that's not yet present in Ant Man. The only parent of an Avenger at this point is Paul Rudd and they waste the opportunity to relate what it feels like for a parent to miss out on raising their child while. simultaneously take away his powers, while simultaneously invalidate the already most laughed at Avenger by trying to give him the biggest scope movie and make it be useless.

If you take out quantum mania in the greater pantheid of the MCU, it's irrelevant because the end of the film is like, did that happen? It's such, it hurts me. Well, it seems like there's a lot of rush stuff too. When we talked to Katie O'Brien, there was stuff that she found out like the day of when she was, she thought she was filming a fight scene or she was filming something else. And it was, it seemed to be very rushed. and part of the overall problem that Marvel was having It was the scheduling move flop flip flops, right? They flop when it was coming out.

Because what was supposed to come? The Marvels was, yeah. Which showed it's a, the Marvels and Quantumania changed how I review movies. Like you guys have known me for eight, nine years. I am always positivity first. I can't make movies, so why should I be ripping them apart? I couldn't do this thing, who am I?

I hit a point with Quantumania where if I stayed blindly positive or to compliment sandwichy, I realize that I'm a voice that is, is people are listening to about this particular subject matter. And there is a point where if you say everything is good, nothing is good. And there is a point where if you say everything is good,

they don't learn their lessons. Quantummania and the Marvels single-handedly, double-handedly changed how I approach my reviews because I can't sustain this. I can't survive another quantum mania. I'll give both a non-sports and sports analogy about this. My dad loves the saying that even the D-student in med school becomes a doctor. So yeah, they may be a doctor, but that doesn't necessarily mean that

they're a good one. That's genius. I love that experience. There's another one as far as just like anybody in the NBA is good enough to be in the league. They are some of the top players in the world. That doesn't mean if you are the bench rider that you're not still trash relatively speaking and you should be striving to be the best. And that's a situation where you saw with a number of things this year, but we could say about quantum media, there's plenty of good find in the film. I agree with it being that sci-fi epic. I love that element of it. It feels like the type of movie I would love to get

stone. It just got lost in itself. It got lost. And my biggest gripe, I think above all else, I know you guys said, Kang being attacked by the ants, we've debated that back and forth. I understand what people are upset about that. Why is the movie called Ant Man and the Wasp? And the wasp is non-existent. Well, she has like this moment.

She has the mirror moment. She just pops up. She literally is mirror. No, and they also negate, like, Janet. Because, like, She's like, she's not a great person. Right. You're like, oh, there's this wonderful love that he, this guy's been trying to get you out of the quantum realm for years. I used to bang Bill Murray for a little bit, but I was lonely. It's like, then get back to me.

Try to find out what you're talking about. Well, I give her to, dude, that's decades. At that point, she thinks she's not leaving. I guess it was the way that she said it to him. She's like, deal with it. I sat on his face. It's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it's like, it wasn't a lot of tact behind it. Yeah, I don't blame her for sleeping with him.

Right. I blame her for. how she tells him. It's more so like, honey, I need to talk to you. Yeah. But I like, look, he's like, yeah, and you know, same thing from the same with me. And he tells her. And there are no repercussions at the end when they clearly go off to take over Bill Murray's job of running the town.

And there's like, okay, we're just going to ignore that. Like there's nothing. There's a lot. It's not good. We're going to be here for six months. All right. So now we're moving. And we'll go to the next one.

Coy, you're on the clock. What do you got? I like being positive. Loki. Loki season two. Loki season two is my favorite. Marvel TV show. Loki season two, I think, did a really wonderful thing where it not only was a sequel, but it also used time in a way that I've been wanting the multiverse to do, where it filled

in things. I think one of the great things about Infinity War and in game is they make Dark World better. They make other properties better by the way they kind of like play with time. When you've got this beautiful woven tapestry, Marvel's been going for 60 years in the comic books and the movies have been going for 15. I think that this is one of the great long form narratives of, mythology. We've mythologized these heroes. Loki went, oh, mythology, let's make a mythological show about it. And it did it with the rules they've established.

It played around with Sony's rules a little bit. It did it with incredible conversations like the first season did. It literally made Loki the god of stories in a way that I wasn't expecting in a way that used the comic book, but also use the medium of television. It played with every single actor's strengths. It used the powerhouses that are Justin and Aaron's directing prowess to make it both eerie and voyeuristic and made it a thing that you were kind of confused but never felt dumb. It's really hard to make something that keeps you on the edge of your seat and make sure that

you're confused but doesn't make you feel condescended to. The show is so smart, it makes you feel smarter, not so smart it makes you feel dumb. And I think that's a really wonderful thing that narratives can do when you have a team that actually writes the whole thing. You can tell this wasn't made with additional photography in mind. This didn't have reshoots. This was a tight, taught story that was told masterfully, and that's what Marvel used to be.

So Loki Season 2 gives me hope for the future. All right. So the thing with Loki is what they did is that it was almost like a six-hour film, right? And what it did the, I think the pure definition of using what you have for streaming, it's like the beauty of streaming as opposed to like network television back in the days. Network television says you got 22 episodes, make it work, lost season two. And they're like, what do we do? We don't know.

low-key season's just like we need six we need six episodes how long are they're going to be one's going to be 47 minutes one's going to be 52 one's going to be 53 but it's going to be enough to tell our story that is prime storytelling doesn't matter if it's 42 minutes doesn't matter if as long as you're telling me the right story as opposed to well 32 minutes

because george says do it faster quicker stop that just do a story that you can develop the characters if it's 42 minutes and you still develop the characters I'm cool and that's exactly what loki season two did And it also, to me, put Loki in the conversation of most important MCU character right next to Tony Stark. Yeah. And best arc right next to Tony Stark.

That's what I'm saying. Because of what he ultimately does and what he has to do. I only disliked one episode. And I think that we're in the minority. Yeah, the second one. Yeah, the second one. Most people enjoyed it. I thought it was a very good through line.

I think it told us right. I felt like they were the only part of the Marvel storytelling team that actually was paying attention to the idea of the going, we're doing a multiverse thing. and this is what's going to play. They also gave a great out on how to deal with Kang potentially, well, now leaving. So whether he gets recast or not, or whether they have set it up well enough in this story to say, we'll figure that out and we can figure it out either way. They also have a great dynamic between Tom Hiddleston and Owen Wilson, one of the best buddy cop dynamics in a very long time. Had a great arc to his character.

There's so many different people that were doing great. I only had one acting problem in the whole story was the one guy, the pruning guy, oh, the deflectors, or whatever that guy was saying. The helping security guard, he's terrible. Other than that, Winston, you love the two. Loki was phenomenal.

I mean, you guys have kind of hit on all the points, so I won't stick on anything. I'll just say that I'd love seeing Selvey again. I thought that that was beautifully done. I think adding the additions of Jonathan Majors and of Kihui Kwan, Obie was amazing.

Obi was a great character. And so it was really cool to see all of that. And let it alone, I love me a good like montage, like a leveling up montage. We need a montage.

Montage! That's exactly how I felt about Loki once he finally figured out how to deal with his time slipping. And then all of a sudden it's like, well, how long have you been learning quantum physics, a thousand years?

Like let's just whatever. It just doesn't matter. Like, I love that. And as we mentioned beforehand with, with Kang, this version, he who remains was the most terrifying in season one. And he was just as terrifying returning in season two. Some people have an issue with the Victor Timely of it all. I actually thought it was a good counterbalance. I like it.

I thought it was perfect. I did too. But I thought it was a good counterbalance overall. But I think that this show is the best Marvel show thus far. I think it's the only show, and it's twice now to stick the landing on its seasons. Yeah. The only. I love Wanda Vision, but I did not like episode six, and I know a lot of people have retroactively

enjoyed it more, but it still went from a ship of Theseus conversation to like a punch the problem conversation. And Loki never did. Totally fair. All right. All right. Compliment sandwich. So I'm going to go positive here.

I'm going to go Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles mutant Mayhem. Other than the fact that I thought that the animation style was. I love it. I love it. I like the style of the movie. I loved it. I thought that this is some of the best that we've ever seen the turtles. And specifically,

and I appreciate the fact that Seth Rogan really was kind of helming that and really focusing on that, because this is the same dude that, you know, was working with Apatow to, like, make Super Bad. So he obviously understands the idea of that weird, awkward teenage phase and what all that means. this to me is the most teenage that the Ninja Turtles have ever been

and I'm talking across all media platforms that I've seen I have loved the Turtles since I was like in diapers I think that they're absolutely incredible they've always kind of felt more like they were in their 20s and just from the standpoint of like yeah there was some teenage stuff there and yeah there's some of that energy but there's a little more maturity there I think one of the most brilliant things that they did for this film is to go cast four unknown actual teenage boys.

You don't need Star Power for it because the Star Power is the Turtles. Absolutely. And because they're also kids, because they're teenagers, like Coy was talking about this when we were off camera, they were out here bonding. They were out here just getting a chance. And in one room recording. Exactly. That was one of the most genius things in addition to casting them is of letting them play

in a sound booth together. And the same room together. And that's exactly how teenage boys act around, especially brothers will act around each other. You're just riffing off, joke off or joke off to joke off to. And that can't help it if you record one. And then, oh, I like that. Right. Yes, and.

Exactly. And so for me, to bring that kind of fresh take to it, I thought was so good. And then to then couple it with some veteran actors in Ice Cube, in Jackie Chan, in Seth Rogen and his role, John Cena, like a lot of cats in there to kind of give you that element, it just grounded all of it. And so to also have that unique story of the turtles and the shredder isn't immediately what we're. we're talking about. I also thought it was great. So overall, love this movie. So I liked, I liked it. I think that, I think we're in three phases. I think that you loved it. I liked it and I think you thought it was okay. Yeah. Yeah. And so we're and I think that they did, I do agree with you though that I think it is the most, both television and comic accurate

the Turtles have ever been the, all the villains for sure, the way that they played of the humor was there. And the new twist on April O'Neill where it all, it all, it all, it all, worked. Like I said, I took my 12 year old loved it. She's 11 at the time. My 6 year old did not like her. Why? She was just kind of like, I think she thought it was boring. And she did. And she was like, she just, I

think it was a little too. The humor was kind of going over her head. I think so. And she was just like, you know, she was, yeah, she was out. Because when I bring it up to her, she doesn't want her, she doesn't like me to talk about it. But, but I like that. Seth Rogen really knows what he's doing. as far as producing right now with comic book accuracy. The last thing,

and then, Koi, I want to know your thoughts. I also love the fact that, like, for them actually being the first time out as superheroes

and, like, doing that, they genuinely don't know what they're doing. And so there's something really liberating about somebody that is legit trying to figure out

their powers, their fighting style, whatever. So, like, all of a sudden, they're in their first fight, they're like, oh, my God,

oh, my God. And then Raff realizes how strong he is. And he's like, oh, oh, like, it just, it just,

It just really worked for me. So Oppenheimer is in my top 10, but it's not in my top five because I can see why it's one of the best movies made this year. But it's something that I just like wouldn't watch often. Like it's just so full of dread. Like the performances are amazing. The movie's technically perfect. Like all those things are there. But a favorite implies rewatch for my list.

Sure. I have a similar thing with Turtles where I can see the talent. I can see how the writing's great. I can see how the casting's good. I can see how the animations. It's just something. It's something I didn't connect with as much as I wanted to. So my experience of it is like over there.

Yeah. But while I was watching it, I just, I don't know what it was. Maybe I had bad chicken that day. Like maybe I just wasn't feeling it. And like, for me, it was one of those interesting things where I walked out going like, huh, I'm glad a lot of people will love that. But I didn't. And that was an interesting experience because I love the turtles.

But I can see I want this to make a lot of people's top 10. It just did Mickman. All right. So that actually is a great segue into my next pick. because I felt the same way. I want this movie to be great. I want people to love this movie. I want people to really respond to it,

and I hope it blows up, and that's Blue Beetle. And it didn't do that. But what it did do is it did what I hoped it would do, and it made everybody go, as in the same way they did with the Marvels, then it was on the Mandalay right there. Watch out for her. The same thing they did for Sholomeh,

Edewena, who was incredible in this movie, such a likable dude in general, so likable in the role. and what same in the similar way of what the marvels, excuse me, where Ms. Marvel did for TV show was made you connected to the family. That's what Blue Beetle did well. What it did poorly is the same stuff

that I think that a lot of these superhero movies do is they're repetitive by the numbers, comic book story. We've seen a million times over that I couldn't give a shit about. I was like, okay, it was great to see him out the powers. I've seen it. I like the guyver element of it too. Like that stuff is great, but I've just seen it so many times.

what's special about this movie and what's special about it is the family what's special about it is the performances and the the the jokes between the family and the love and the where i thought that the the grandma um spy kids thing was going to be too over the top for me worked for me it but the stuff that didn't was like okay here's susan sarandon the the the paint by numbers villain with the paint by numbers hanschman with the what's the cockamamie story of the reason why the villain who cares um it's bad like kind of lex luther type thing um but but I cared so much about it and it looked like you were mentioned before with James Gunn. I think that Sholomehita was so good.

I think the difference is not just the performance, though, of when they saw the movie and said, oh, this is a decent movie. That's why we got to keep it around. I think it's because it's not an established part of the former regime. That is where the other ones were, where you were mentioning, like, if those other movies done well, they would have been in a dilemma that I'm sure they would have liked to have been in, but these movies, Flash and all these other movies made a lot of money. They would have probably been in a dilemma like, well, what do we do?

people still want to watch these. Let's figure out a way to make it else worlds. That's why he said, well, keep the door open. They only said that if they were going to make money. The fact that they all ate crap, easy for them to shut the door on, but they don't want to shut the door on this character because it wasn't established to the other ones.

So I'm glad he's coming back. I want to see how they... What did you think of Blue Beetle? I mistakenly put this in my DCEU ranking. I apologize. A lot of people corrected me. This isn't in the TCU, but I was thinking of this year's movie,

so I weren't to include. I liked Blue Beetle, but it's an interesting thing. Actually, Maestro keeps coming up because I watched it last night. Maestro also had the thing where I liked the second two acts more than the first.

And usually a movie, I have a hard time recovering. Usually a movie starts strong for me and then it kind of dwindles because of like whatever reason in the second act. This one's the opposite. Blue Beetle, I thought,

much like Maestro, I was having trouble connecting and then something happens in the late first act where I'm like, oh, oh, I'm in. And then I had fun with it. I did think it was fun.

And I know that word has become a negative as far as reviewing stuff. Oh, it's fun. This was, Fun, but not in a bad way. I just didn't feel like it reinvented the wheel in any way. And that's okay. But as we saw with movies like Into the Spider-Verse, like that reinvented the wheel and was fun.

There are times that I would like things if they can to, you know, achieve more than just fun. And this one was just fun. I'm glad it found its market. I think Blue Beetle is a character that will be, you know, well-utilized going forward. I do think I think the big reason they, I don't know how much of it was additional photography. but it felt like they consciously made it not DCEU with some of the shots and some of the things.

And I'm wondering if that was during the gun regime change and they're like, we love this Sholo kid. Let's add a different scene here to separate this here. It was made for streaming originally. Yeah, that's true. It was made for streaming.

And then they pushed it. I think that absolutely it is. And I think also because they looked and they said, this is a good movie. Let's put it out there because I asked Sholo when he was in here. I said, you know, were you guys nervous that you're going to kind of get

bad girl? And they were, you know, they thought it was potential that they were going to do it. But I think because people were really responding, and I think James Gunn probably saw it too and said, now you've got to release this kid's performances really. I mean, it's my number six of the whole DCEU. Like I had a lot of the DC. If it was, it's my number six of the post-Snyder era. Of the DC.

Yeah, DC movies. But yeah, it's high for me. It's just not, you know. It's not one of the best. It's not yet. It can't be any higher. Where do you go with it? I loved it.

I'm a big fan of Sholo as well. I think he crushes in Cobra Kai, and he really brings that charismatic energy here. And it's been interesting to watch him since obviously he started Cobra Kai relatively young to see him kind of... I feel like a proud older brother. I'm sitting here being like,

look at my little homie out here growing up and doing big things. Do you ever watch the Parenthood show? No. Oh, man, he was in Parenthood. He was getting that show, too. So my first introduction for him was Cobra Cye, but then that must further cemented for you. And so, like, I, I just thought it was really well done.

Anytime you have George Lopez in and you just let him just kind of rain free, that's always like a fun element to add. But yeah, I thought the family dynamic was super good. And I can't wait to see what he does with the next. All right, Coy. So it is now on you, my friend. What do you got? All right.

Let's talk about the DCEU. We talk about Blue Beetle, which is DCEU adjacent. But we got three DCEU films this year, which is crazy to think that we got four D.C. films in one year, something I think a lot of is dreamed of five. years ago happened and it happened with a thud. I want to just talk about all three? Let's do three. Okay, let's, uh, okay.

So we got Shazam 2, Flash 1 and, uh, Aquaman 2 as a unit. Um, I personally of those and, and it, it shocks me to say, uh, like Flash the most. Um, I don't know how high the bar is there, but that is my favorite of them. Uh, I do think Flash got a lot of crap because of everything surrounding it. I do think it got a lot of crap because of, and fairly, it got a lot of, because of, and fairly, it got a lot of crap because of the special effects. I do think some of Muscietti's vision was to have the unreal special effects in the sequence of the actual speed force, but the issue became that same imagery was reflected in the babies

outside the speed force. That same imagery happened at other points of the film. So his explanation for it did kind of have a kickback there. So I understand people not liking the special effects. What I like about the film is the heart of Barry Allen is so clearly on display. So for me, the reason it's higher than Shazam 2 or Aquaman 2 is the heart of Shazam 1 was beautiful and so vibrant and wonderful and childlike. And then the second film, which I like more than most, definitely had issue where it felt like Zachary Levi was playing a 9-year-old, not the now 15. You know what he was doing?

17. It was supposed to be 17 at that point. It felt 9. Well, because his younger version was playing it very well. Yeah. Like Asher Angel got the memo. Yes. So the heart became disjointed there.

And then Aquaman 2, I felt like really felt like we'll talk about Aquaman 2. That said Flash to me, the heart of the film really was there for me. I felt Barry Allen's connection to his mother, that scene at the end. I felt that the thing he was fighting for was so impactful. I felt the connection between him and Michael Keaton. I'm not as big of a Michael Keaton Batman fan as most of the world. I think I went to a fat man beyond and Kevin Smith said he watched Flash four times and he's seen all the Michael Keaton stuff six additional times.

There are people that watch this film as the Keaton cut. I enjoyed the relationship more than I'm just a Keaton diehard Batman, but I still, for the first time, felt that magic that I think a lot of people feel when they watch the 89 Batman. I've always been a bail Batman guy. I get that magic when I experience that. This movie did the thing where I was like, oh, I retroactively connect to these movies that weren't as big a part of my childhood as other people. So that's a near impossible task. And most of all, in addition to the heart, it felt like a splash page in a comic book where Civil War was the first time I felt that we got that double panel spread and the airport scene was like,

they're doing it! And yes, it got bigger and bigger with Endgame. But the first time for me was Civil War. This was the first time it felt like a bunch of artists jamming. So like Jim Lee is doing this corner and Cassaday is over here and McFarland. And it felt like one page of many artists because it felt like the Flash. Because it felt like Mushietti channeled Burton. channeled Snyder, channeled his own

Muscietti style, and to me, the directing was really special. CGI aside, to feel like a beautiful medley of multiverse. And that was really special to me. Yeah, so I want to kind of echo most of what you said, to be honest with you, too. I think I definitely like the Flash the most out of the three of them.

I think that the Flash did suffer from the bad special effects. I love Andy Muscietti. I thought his explanation for that was garbage. I think I'm going to be not as nice as you were. I think it was garbage. It was, yeah, well, we meant to do bad special effects. Well, then that's a bad choice.

That's a bad choice. Because the babies look awful. I've seen the movie three times. And the beginning of it is a lot for someone who's never seen it to get through. Not only for the fact that there's babies in microwave. I mean, that was funny. The jokes are funny. But the beginning of it is, it's kind of unnecessary to really get into what the core of the movie is,

which is the emotional story with Barry and his mom and his dad. dad and and and I thought as you mentioned with Zach Levi what Ezra Miller did very well was play an 18 year old Barry and I believe there were two right as where Zach Levi was the worst part of that movie and I which is detrimental to the lead of a film right so when you have when you have him doing that and then the ending of the movie because of the CGI because it to me was just kind of like a mess it was a mess of a soup that didn't, I was so invested and I loved all the Keaton stuff and I loved all that stuff. I was so invested in what they were going to do with Sasha Kaye and how they were playing it

and I think she wasn't given enough to do. I agree. She was a highlight, but didn't have. There was no development really to her except we got you out. Okay, humanity's not as bad as I thought. I'm going to help. Now I'm dead. It's really is.

So I. How? So would you pump yourself in the head? I stabbed myself in the eye. I think that I actually had that on video. I think you're on the line for that. How did you stab yourself with what device? Because he said that and it's like, and now you're dead.

I said, yeah, and then I just, because of that, I just said, but either way, though, I think what they did very well was the emotional core goes to a single for safety. But we got to a place at the end that I, you know, because the emotion, some of this mom is so good that I, I did enjoy it. I like that movie. And I am one of the defenders of that film for sure. Also one of the best multiversal jokes in that we're living in this deep multiversal soccer. right? We're four years in, like I get multiversal humor. The actor stuff.

Dude, the back to the future thing. It was hilarious. It was hilarious. It was really good. Because it's such an inside cinema joke that works on multiple levels. If you get the joke, great. If you don't, then you discover it a thing. And it's kind of like you were saying with GenV it only enhances. It enhances it.

And so, yeah, and then Shazam too, as I say that, Zach Levi wasn't, his, the choice, and I don't know if it was a directing thing. I don't know if it was him lending that he wanted to do the same thing he did for the first one, even though the character is age. I don't know what it was. I didn't

hate the movie. I didn't hate the movie. I thought it was in joy about. Helen Muran was doing some fun stuff. I thought that all three of the ladies were doing a fun thing. All the kids were so great again. Yeah. It just, I didn't care enough. I felt like it was just Zach Levi wanting to be a superhero

and then just being Zach Levi and just like, oh, I'm going to play this as a kid and not really playing into what Billy was. So I think that hurt it. I can't even remember what the hell the story was. to be honest, I think back about it. I just remember leaving, going, I didn't hate that movie.

It's fun. As you said, this is kind of a trope now. It's fun. As far as Aquaman, too, it's a bad movie. It's a bad movie. And we just covered it recently in depth.

I haven't said anything yet, though. No, you haven't. That's why I'm excited to hear what you're going to say about it. Because for me, it's just not good. Is it the worst movie ever? No, but it's just terribly written.

It's terribly written movie. And it is just the, unfortunate that it is the end of the DCU, that that's the last movie. I think that had it been the Flash Raven Shazam being the last one, probably would have a better taste in your mouth. They also both have an ending.

Right. The Flash and Shazam. This movie just stops. This movie just has credits. It doesn't have an ending. The post credit scene's embarrassing. Whereas Flash felt like a kind of a resolution. And so does Shazam in its own way with the tree and everything.

But yeah, it's the weirdest of the scheduling. All right, Winston, where do you go with all three? So ranking the three of them, For me, it goes flash Aquaman Shazam. Really? Okay. In retrospect, I really didn't like Shazam too. And I think part of what's coupled with that, I didn't expect much from Aquaman.

The first one was fun, but I didn't emotionally tie to anything. I wasn't expecting really anything. And then to hear people like you guys and other reviewers and other audience members be like, the hell was that? I really had no expectations. And so I even text you guys at the end. When I got out, I was like, I didn't hate it. I didn't like it.

I'm indifferent, which is its own level of like not a good thing. If you're indifferent about something, a lot of people say that like hate isn't the opposite of love, it's indifference. So there's that. However, with Shazam, I think what pissed me off about it so much is the first one is so good. Yeah. And it's funny, bad writing.

you can't always escape, but I feel like there's something specific about an acting job being so off that it just took me. The fact that the narrative is that both versions of Billy are the same person just in different bodies,

and it was so not the case. I could not be jacked into that movie. Everybody else, I love that the family's getting involved, they finally tell the parents, I love the little moment. It's almost like you get disappointed when Shazam shows up. That's the problem. problem. That's horrible. On top of the fact that, like, I loved how in the first one

you got both. You got a lot of Asher and you got a lot of Zachary Levi as far as who he is as a superhero and who he is as a kid. In this, I don't know if it's budget. I don't know if it's because Zach's the star. It was all Zach like 80% of the time and you didn't see Asher. And again, with Asher playing the

character better, that made it even worse. So the fact that every time he was on screen, I was like, blah. Versus Aquaman, look, there is a lot wrong. You're right. The little the angel mirror coming down to save him from the thing and you know

just all sorts of stuff that that movie has issues with but again it is the same as Aquaman 1 if you go and look at it it's just kind of the adventure throughout the world and Aquaman being Jason Mamoa and Jason Mamoa being Aquaman and just like whatever

and like the person he's riding with is kind of annoyed by him but they're kind of charmed by him by the end it was essentially the same film just move characters around slightly. So it doesn't, whatever. You know what I mean? And then the flash, I think that there is so much actually good there at the core. There's just little things throughout is why I think it did as poorly as it did. And I don't think that Warner Brothers

did themselves any help by being this is the greatest superhero movie of all time. That is why I think people slam this so hard. It's both. Because it's like, show me. What did you show me? It's bullshit. I spent money on that for what? You don't recruit Tom Cruz to make a statement for that movie. That was such a way. You spent over 300 million. You put up with everything that Ezra was doing because of this. And you're going and telling everybody it's the greatest superhero movie you've ever seen. Bad move, yeah.

All right. Well, look. I think my issue is I was bored in Aquaman. I wasn't bored in Shazam. I think that's why they're different for me. I felt really bored. But the difference is I would rather be bored and just be like, whatever. Because that's how I felt about Black Adam versus being actually pissed off, being like, dude, you're not, that's not the same.

So I can understand that. I can understand that if you if the, like the performance bothered me for sure. Obviously with all three of us to talk about, but not enough to where it just was ripping me out of the movie. But if you ripped you out of the movie. I felt gaslit the whole time that I was like, I'm supposed to believe that this is, this is the same right here. Yeah, I think this is the same. It's not the same. It's not the same. It's like that it's like that video of the guy that goes and uses the the, the, the, he's like, oh yeah, this is my ID.

And it's, and so why kidney uses the. And the black guy's looking at and he's like, come on. He's like, what, that's me? He's like, yeah. That's how I felt if it's a body switching situation. Because like, why do people love Freaky Friday? Because I genuinely believe that Jamie Lee Curtis is in Lindsay Lohan's body and vice versa. You know, it doesn't get enough credit.

The change up, I think, is the best body swap comedy. Jason Bateman playing, right? Jason Bateman always is that like calm guy. And for him to play the Ryan and for Ryan to finally get to like show how good he Change up so slept on. Jason Bateman's in tons of those types of movies. Another movie that's really good that no one saw is the Switch. I love the Switch.

Oh, the Switch is so good. And people are finally coming up in Game Night. Finally. And Game Night is decent in the theater. It's decent, but like those three comedies, all exceptional. All right, so we're covering a bunch here. And now, Winston, you're on the clock. What do you got?

Yeah, I'm going to go ahead and I'm going to talk about something I don't think either of you maybe saw so we can make a quick. Scott Pilgrim takes off. Is that a comedy? I'm halfway. Yeah, it is. Halfway. Do you like it so far? I love it.

It's great. But I'm taking my time, which is why I'm halfway. Take your time. So, yes, it is a comic. And what I really love about it is, again, they really tap into all of that nerd culture that has always been inherent in Scott Pilgrim. So the video game elements, the comic book elements,

and the fact that they took it and made it in anime and really kind of dived into that, added all extra level of stuff there. But I think what is so brilliant about the show, you found a way to both tell a completely brand new story and yet at the same time provide continuity and to continue the story from the film. And that's the one thing

because this is the type of thing that you would want out of a multiversal story, to be honest with you, or a time-traveling story, is the idea of, oh, this is actually all connected somehow. And like you think, I'm not going to spoil for you.

Tell it, I'm like, I'm going to. I feel like I suppose it. No, no, no, nothing, nothing at all. Just the idea of when you have any, if time, multiverse, whatever, it's all somehow connected, that's the only thing that you'll eventually see is that it is all connected. And that, to me, was done so brilliantly because you're like, where, okay, this is just only to be brought back in. And I thought that the performances were so good.

I thought adding extra layers to the characters that you're, how far in are you? I just got just came back. Okay. So. I think I'm two left or less. Cool. So then the second episode with the league has their meeting.

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm through there. That, by and by itself, we don't really get time to spend time with the X's. I like that they incorporate some of that, but in a new continuity. Like the stuff that's in the manga, they couldn't include,

gets used here, but not in the way that it's in the manga. So if you've read the manga and seen the movie, you still have new stuff. Exactly. To get more time with the X's because they are interesting characters,

they're all very weird. Based by the original. All yeah. All original cast. And man, I forget. I remembered how much I love Chris Evans as the character, but I think it's my favorite performance. This was a reminder

as to why Chris Evans is in my top five working actors. Because when he goes for it, he goes for it. And it's... When is he not though? What is he not going for it? That's why he's in my top five? That's why he's in my top five. The only one and I haven't seen it was maybe ghosted.

I heard people said that that movie really wasn't good, but it sounds like he was good. The movie stinks, but he's... I haven't tried it yet. It's bad. I didn't watch a whole thing. I bailed. I have so many. I have to watch that it's one of those where I'm like, okay, when we're into the new gear

and I'm not chasing the best ofs, I need to see that and like a few others, but goes today. But either way, I know you guys don't have a lot to say about it because you haven't seen it at all and you've only seen part of it. I can't recommend it enough. So definitely if you're a fan of the original Scott Pilgrim, go watch Scott Prolgram takes off. I think I'm going to second everything you just said and to add to that. It is also a really fun use of the inside Hollywood snarkiness in that the show knows. what it is in relation to Scott Pilgrim,

but it also knows what it is in this era of comic continuity. So I think it's a really genius, not meta in the way that we've taken meta, but meta in a fun commentary way on things. Oh yeah, that's what I'm saying. It's like, there's a lot of Hollywood stuff that doesn't feel so inside baseball that you feel like you have to live here like we do,

but it's stuff that if you follow pop culture, which if you're watching the show, you probably do, you'll get another layer of Scott Pilgrim you might not have gotten before, which I was really impressed by. Okay, so Scott Pilgrim, check that one out. That's on Netflix, right? Yep. Okay.

All right. So then I think where I'm going to go here, one that I don't think you guys have seen. Maybe I'm wrong. One piece. Now, I think One Piece is based off manga. It's a huge manga. So I guess that counts. Yeah, yeah.

So you guys have not seen it yet, right? Nope. Okay. So basically what I'll say, because I've given my thoughts on I did full-on watch-alongs that I was going to start because I saw the trailer. I said, my daughter will probably like this. And people said, you'll probably like this. So I'll check it out. And I loved it.

And one of the things that I actually, the reason I stuck with it the most, and I've said this before, and I want to say it again, the fan base, we have so many fan bases that are so toxic and so horrible and so like, you know, gatekeeping, not this fan base. I have never been more accepted into a fan base over the where if you mess up a name, they laugh with you. If you mess up something else, they want to help you out. They want to tell you like, oh, watch this. I couldn't believe it. Like every episode, oh, we're so glad that you like this. We'd love you see you talking. I can't wait until you meet this person.

Can't we just see this? Dude, I had a friend of mine who is a diehard, One Piece fan, like, been there since day one and found Capes and Cowles because he saw you, and he goes, you know that Christian guy? Bro, he loves One Piece. I love One Piece. I'm like, yo, calm down. People love it, yeah, and I found it, and I found One Piece, and I love the fan base. It's my favorite fan base out of anything I've ever covered.

Wow. One Piece fan base, and I love the show. The show is just so, again, the word fun, but it's also, just the characters. I just feel good watching it. I just feel really good watching it. Monkey DeLuffy, who is the main character, such a positive light. I call him Chris Van Bleet.

It's how Chris Van Bleet is the same way. I feel like Monkey DeLuffy would look like Van Vleet's Twitter page if you followed wrestling. But either way, it's just such a really good show. I can't wait for it to come back. The fact that there's so much lore and there's so much to pick from it, you would absolutely love it. Yeah, I want to check it out.

I just, it's so, I want to read it, and it's so long. Watch the show. No, no, no, just watch the show. Thousand-plus episodes as far as the anime, the manga's gone on forever. Don't do that, don't do that. And I don't want it because I like, I like the fact that I found it. You're discovering it. Yeah, and I like to find out the, you know, all the things that I don't know anything about.

Like, it definitely gets bizarre. And it definitely, you can, it just to me, from what I heard, it's the most accurate kind of adaptation from, as where we got an adaptation from a video game in Last of Us this year, we got a pretty accurate you know, transfer from animation, from anime into live action. So the kid that plays the lead just signed on a con I'm hosting. And I'm really, yeah, so I might be watching it so I can interview him and like catch up. But I love that there's a new pop culture thing. It's the first time there's been a con that I'm hosting that a new piece of pop culture came in where I was like,

I don't know that name and that's exciting as opposed to like, oh, got to watch 82 years of Battlestar Galite or whatever, you know. This is great. This is great. I like there's a new thing. is my point. So that's my pick for that one. We'll move on now.

Coy, what you got? I'm going to go with positive while I can because I know we're reaching the point where we're going to talk about some stuff I didn't love as much. But man, I loved what if season two so much more than I expected. I did not like what if season one that much. I completely own that. It's in my bottom five Marvel properties out of the 40 or whatever we have now. I just didn't connect.

And then when it didn't land as relevant, it was even more painful because they had Captain Carter in Multiverse, but it wasn't the same one. They had Sorcer Supreme, but it wasn't the same one. I was just like, okay, why did we do that? And what if in the comic books is the big swings. Like the reason that what if comics exist is to do huge swings. And I felt like the what if season one show was like,

what if Peter Parker took algebra instead of trig? And I was like, okay, I didn't care. Like I didn't care about the what they were positing. I was like, okay, what if Mary Jane had red hair? You thought the Ultron one was red hair? Wow. I felt, I felt, what? Yeah.

What I hate about that episode is it meant nothing. Well, that's, yeah. Considering that they really set, that they made Ultron awesome. I take it back. I like the Ultron one. The Ultron one was an actual age of Ultron. I take it back. I like the Ultron one, and I like the Sorcerer Supreme Finale.

The rest I didn't really connect. Zombie one and the Thorpe Party one. I'm with you there. So for me, it wasn't what I wanted what I have to be because of my love of the concept. If you have a concept where it's like, hey, we've got all. of the biggest actors alive in properties right now. And we're doing animated so our budget restrictions are different. You're playing with the medium of animation so you can make stuff that's above and beyond.

Two of your eight episodes feel like you actually flex that muscle. Those two I did like, season two is the opposite. Season two for me is, hey, we've got genre bending. We're going to do a diehard episode. We're going to do a Blade Runner episode. But it's true to the characters. Episode one, I'm going to talk about the beginning of the season, so I don't spoil anything. Episode one is so good at genre bending like season one,

Season one, Phase 1 of Marvel is, where it's, oh, let's do something new and different. We haven't really had a noir sci-fi epic in Marvel. Oh, now we do, because Nebula is the perfect character for it, and it makes you go like, oh, right, this whispering monotone delivery of Nebula is perfect for Blade Runner. And then the second episode is taking you on a journey that's much more akin to the comic books of what the 80s Avengers were.

Third episode gives you that Christmas special. I love Iron Man 3. It gave me shades of that, and it brings back Sam Rockwell, the most slept-on character in the MCU. And it's the whole season's like that. The whole season just levels up, and it takes big swings at this point. This week, the Hela episode is dropped by the time we were watching this. And it's making Hela as nuanced, I'm trying to let's give me the thing away, as nuanced and layered as Loki. In 30 minutes, it makes her that interested.

What's interesting about this is Winston and I had a chance to go see the first two when they, It was technically one and three. It was technically one and three. So we saw two episodes. It was one and three. And we were on the opposite page on the first one. I loved the first one with Nambula. I loved that.

The Blade Runner's side of it was amazing. And then the third one, the diehard one I thought was fine. I thought it was fine. I thought it got a little goofy. Things are more like the first episode. Yes. I thought it got a little goofy for my taste. But I started watching the second one once they aired it on Disney Plus with the Star Lord.

Yeah. Love that episode. And it's the best Howard the Duck. I mean, episode one is the best Howard the Dock. Yeah, yeah, by a large margin. There's a lot of that in the season where it's like, oh, that's the best point. If you're telling me that it stays more consistent to that first episode, then I'm, I can't wait to watch respect because I did like season one. Okay.

So this is going to, I just, my biggest bummer with season one was that it had nothing to do with the multiverse. The Mad Max episode is the best Tony Stark I've seen since Iron Man 3. It was pretty great. Okay. Yeah, right. It was pretty great. Okay. So that was the voice though, because the voice. Dude, he's so good.

Because I didn't like him in the, in the diehard one. Oh, it's the same guy. I, because he doesn't, he's not a sound like. He's a sound alike, which I like. Okay. He's nailing the energy not trying to sound like Downey Tivian. Is that, is that actually Goldblum or is that somebody else? Oh, it's a little.

Okay. Full, full tilt, gold bloom. Good God. So that's a thing. If you look at the out of the theater reaction for that, I haven't seen Blade Runner. Like, that was just not something that I grew up on the way you guys did, similar to like Indiana Jones.

that just, so I didn't have that connection to it. And while I do like noir stuff and I do like sci-fi stuff, I found myself pretty bored in that episode personally. There were cool things about it, but I just, it was whatever. I didn't, the diehard one was fine. But same thing, I was kind of like a little bored. I was like, oh, fun Christmas romp, whatever. So I went in being really concerned that season two was going to be a flop for me.

And so I immediately did not rewatch one. I jumped to two, and I loved it. It was good. And then everything after that so far has been phenomenal. So I'm at the new character, the Native American. Cahori episode. I think it's like six or seven. So I'm about there.

So I'm working through it. But there's a great storyline going right now with Captain Carter. I don't know where all this hate is coming from. I think I thought that that there was a beautiful marriage of Winter Soldier and the Black Widow movie. Oh, my God. It feels like phase one and two where it's like we can assemble a new team all the time. And it'll feel like these are the characters you've loved, but it's doing it in a new medium. Like there's a new Avengers team half the episodes by the way the storyline lands and I feel like this is whatever

You've been waiting for in the multiverse saga where it's like what if we could do this and the show's called what if and to me I think the reason I struggled with the first season was just because this is what I wanted that to be and I think that people that aren't as familiar with the comics The first season's not bad. It's just I think I went in with two high of expectations for and this is hitting those and this is hitting all of them for me. Okay, good to know This is probably like like Marvel's 45 or whatever installments this is like like low first, high second tier. Wow. Like it's, I love this. Okay. We got what, three left? If that. Yeah, there's three that we could cover.

So Winston, go ahead. What do you want to? I'm going to take this one because I know y'all ain't got nothing nice to say. I'm going to take the marbles. What a nice guy. I, look, we've talked, we talked this to death. You can really go back and watch our reviews on this and whatnot. The things that I did love about the film, I love the chemistry between the three ladies, thought they did a great job. I love

Imman Volani, just period. She is crushing it and the relationship she has with her family. I thought it was nice for them to tie as much of that back as they could. I think that that helped anchor certain parts of the movie. I don't get as deterred by the musical scene or the cats. I know

Christian hates that with every fiber in his being. Fact! Big villain problem. Didn't really love that. The only good thing about the villain is, and then this was brought up to me by my girlfriend where she was like, that's exactly what ladies would do. It would be like, come on, girl,

like we can work this out together. It's fine. Fine. And the minute she stood up, she's like, nah, like it's immediately ready to backstab. It felt very reality TV to me, and I love that.

So that was very funny. And I enjoyed that. But like the moments that it really missed for me, I feel like the moment you lose lieutenant trouble through the other dimensional portal, I'm looking for a full breakdown from Bree. And it was very momentary. That's a moment where she can completely lose it.

And it is Ms. Marvel is the only reason she can calm down. And like there is kind of like a, but like that, that emotional weight would have done, I think it would have changed a lot for all three of us. Yes.

If you would have some like that. Well, you have Brie Larson, who's a really good actress and you don't give her enough to do in that moment. I thought she's better in this movie than she was in the first one. I actually agree with everything

you said as far as the performances go. The performances in all three, the chemistry was there. I don't think it was written very well. And that scene that you're talking about that, I think we needed. with breaking down after your friend is, I think that's a direction problem.

I think that's a writing problem. I think that's a producing problem. I think that's a major problem. And it's, the funny thing is, it's not, what makes it even worse. It's not even when your friend is gone.

That is her niece. For all intents of purposes, that's her daughter. Right. There's someone, especially when that really is the emotional through line of what you're setting up in this movie.

Yeah. I think they kind of drop the ball in the X-Men moment. I think that you're seeing so excited and then it's like CGI beast, which is just like, anytime you're supposed to be locked into it and you're like, oh, that looks like a cartoon.

That's not good. I think that there's a lot that did wrong. I think that's very similar to Aquaman. I think that they're very similar. The writing is not very good. It's kind of thrown together, and it is very much so a kind of like, all right, we're done with the way that things used to be run.

Let's move on now. It's insane how much they parallel. Two directors I like making sequels to billion-dollar films with casts I enjoy. It's crazy how parallel they are. because both of them as stories that on paper I can see working. Both of them, I love the idea of Aquaman not wanting to be a king

and his brother being someone that fought for the kingdom and wanting to be king and how they understand each other more. Great on paper. The Marvel's is a story about Captain Marvel coming into her own and the actress getting to play the character more like I identify with her ass. But the story being her being responsible for an atrocity and coming to terms with that is humanizing and impassizing an impossibly powerful character.

You, the Marvel's, the universe, Marvel doesn't know what to do with Captain Marvel because she's so powerful. They just keep having to be like, let her over there because she's like, she's so O-P. So you humanize her by showing a horrible thing she did that she has to come to terms with.

Instead of letting an actress that's in room, the room, is it room or the room? It's room. Because the room is the other one. Hey, Mark. The story of her coming to terms that would humanize her and allow her power set to work better

and also to humanize her for the audience that has chosen to make her their biggest enemy is all logical as a story element. But then you write the movie and you've got Lieutenant Trouble being the daughter that she never got to be there for and Miss Marvel being the daughter that she's taking on because she idolizes her and they don't give a single moment of that. There's a montage where they half interact but the moment where Lieutenant Troubles through space and they have that moment to connect, you don't let them connect. You needed to take that memory dream sequence technology. that they use and that you get to see some of that, you needed to dive deeper into that.

All of that. Because if I remember you get into Lieutenant Troubles, flashback of like her mom dying and all that kind of stuff, and she's like, no, I don't show this. I don't want to see this. Like, because then it goes into Carol. Yeah. And what she did, you need to.

The whole movie is, don't show this, don't see this. The whole movie is like every time there's, and then the directing is sweeping and moving cameras. Finally, they let her director move a camera. But they edited it by committee. So all the movement and emotion. movement, both of them get chop sueyed. It really bothered.

What I will say also, one of the things I want to bring up is that during our review, all three of us talked about, like, at the end, with the movers, and it was like, where they're moving to the, where they were all wrong. Yeah, they're moving. But wait a minute. So we're all, we said that they're moving Carol to the, but we thought they were moving into the house.

The family, yeah. They're not moving. I was like, well, she's a super, why should hire them? Get movers. You can literally pick up. each piece and put it back there. Why? Yeah. So if that's the case, that's even worse writing.

It's like, it's one thing if they're, if the whole family is moving. Maybe they're just there to hell. But what? Wait, but what is she, is she flying them? Or did she pay for their flights? Did they drive? It's like, hey, man, Bruce bought the farm back for Clark. You don't remember that. Did they end of Batman? Bruce is human and has cash. Yeah, Bruce, he solves problems with money.

That's his whole thing. That fits his character. It didn't explain it. Okay, fine. First of all, see, they blew up the house, the house. is gone. So what's the deal? They don't have a house anymore? Is she helping out with them? No. No, she's moving. She's moving. So she's not moving them in. If she is moving in the

problem, because why in the world will they move from Brooklyn to Louisiana? And if she's having them move her, how's that working out for them? What's their life like when they go back to their non-home? Right. So yeah, sure, we don't have a house, but we'll help you move into your house, even though you could literally pick each one up if you wanted to, buy your hand and fly it back and forth in seconds. stupid writing, really bad writing. Either way, no matter what it is, whatever it is. Anyway, it's not good.

All right, let's move on here to, there's only a two. The one thing I'll mention real quick, and even though, because Winston put it on the list, and I said, yeah, it started out as a toy, and then they made a lot of comics, so I think it's, and that's the last Transformers movie. Yeah, I liked a lot. I like, to me, it's Bumblebee, this movie, and the other people are like, what are you talking about? The first one, you got to understand something. I'm a, I was a, the first Transformers movie that the animated is my favorite still. Sure. It's, so the 86 or whatever else.

That to me, like, it was, is the perfect Transformers way. I love it. Um, I don't like that first Transformers movie, Michael Bay because it's fine. It's, yeah, most people love it. Most people love it. I don't. Because the second you have Optimus Prime dancing around a house and the father doesn't know that a big robot is bouncing up and down, I'm out. I'm out.

That's your Zachary Levi. Yeah. People. That is. That's great. Peeing on the house. Peeing. Robots peeing.

I'm out. Michael Bay is not funny. I don't know who told him he was. He's got to stop trying to be funny. But that's another, the bumblebee to me is the most accurate to the Transformers. Bubblebee is my favorite live action. But this is second.

This is probably second because where I said, I cared about the human characters more than I have in other Transformers movies. There's a lot that it's, it's, There's a lot of the stuff that I don't necessarily love about. And I thought the end is very loud and a lot of stuff is going on where it's hard to kind of keep up with which Transformers are fighting who and you kind of get lost in it. But I thought Stephen Cable Jr. did a really great job overall in giving me, you can tell he's a fan of the franchise. So, yeah, I thought it was, it is a forgettable movie, though. I just said I liked it a lot and realized I haven't thought about it again.

So I liked it a lot in the moment. And I think the soundtrack is super authentic. to the world they built, which doesn't always work with that much needle dropping. Like needle dropping can either really work or really pull you out of it. I thought this really worked.

I also think that it made the city a character, which I always love when a genre film can make a city a character. I think that's why I love Miss Marvel. I think it's why I love Spider-Man is because New York is as much of a character as Mary Jane and Jersey is as that's as much of a character as Kamala.

But the movie itself had to be very formulaic. So while I left very happy and while I enjoyed the performances and the spectacle, I haven't thought about it since because it had to be like, check, check, check. Yeah, I mean, look, man, all I know is is better than Shazam 2. That's true. It is better than Shazam.

I will give you that comfortable. I think I could comfortably say it now looking at the list that we've talked. Shazam 2 is my least favorite of all of this period. Everything, wow. Out of everything. All right. Well, look, there's a ton on there, and I'm going to end with this because I know my friends have been waiting and patiently saying, okay, we're making our list. You got to watch this so we can talk about it in depth.

Invincible, Season 2. Did you finally watch season one? haven't watched more than season one. Two episodes. And here we are, at the conclusion. He is acknowledging it exists. Hey, but hey, we finally talk about Gen V. now that it's relevant four months later.

By 2026 when he watched Invincible Season 2, we get to. I loved watching my friends talk about this show. Here we go. I mean, look, Invincible, I wasn't expecting them to split this season. So my only beef is we're just kind of getting the ball rolling. You got Spider-Verst, the people that didn't know Spider-Verst. the people that didn't know Spider-Vers was spent. Well, the difference there is,

that feels like a complete movie. It does to me as well. This doesn't feel like if you go on winter break for like a TV show, that that's what this felt like. I felt like I'd just be like, it felt like cool. Act one is over. Here we, wait, what? Where the, is it?

Also, four is a hard. That's a whole, unless it's only going to be eight episodes. Yeah, I just got it. But what I've seen so far has been amazing. I loved getting more with Alan the Alien. I love Invincible trying to figure out I don't want to ruin anything for Christian or anything like that but having to figure out how to be different than Omni Man.

I think like seeing all of that and while I haven't really read all those books all the way through what I have gotten so far, the only thing I noticed we're moving a lot faster in the show than we were than we were in the books. So that's interesting but there's a lot of fun stuff coming up that I'm really looking forward to. Season two does a really good job playing with time as well, by the way.

Just so if you think that they've covered stuff they might not have, I think they're doing a thing where they're jumping around the books. So as much as it feels like they're accelerating through the books, I think there's going to be things in the second half that happened earlier chronologically. Which part of this, we also should mention that this is also should include Adam Eve, which was like a little bonus special that also came out this year. But we could just say it's all part of season two. Yeah, I agree with that.

But I think overall it is a reminder of what you can do and you have premium animation. that's R-rated. It's a great example of adult animated mediums. I want more of this. I used to really struggle with animation because I couldn't connect with the characters. And I loved cartoons as a kid. And then I really struggled in that middle time, like in your late teens into mid-20s where you're like, and a lot of people felt deeper in animation that I felt completely out of it. I really had trouble connecting. I didn't hear voice work as like a human element. And then the story didn't feel like it was something I was in. It felt like something I was watching. The last few years really starting to Spiderverse

five years ago, I've really found a new love for animation in that it's a medium that can do more than live action. It's something that can tell different stories. It can tell them bigger and Invincible for me as a great example of maturing that in the same way the boys is a great example of maturing up live action.

So Amazon is quietly kicking so much adult ass to make me love adult content. They're kicking us out of the studio. I know. It's the idea just to close out for me with Invincible. It's the idea of you can do brutal, you can do rated R, but that has to be earned because that can't be the focal point. Agreed.

And every time a brutal death happens in this show, whether it is just the villain of the week or it's an important character, it is so earned that it is jaw dropping. And we're not desensitized to it yet somehow. It's like often and yet we're still like, what I've seen so far of season one, which I really enjoyed. I just have to get back. And I will, I promise I will actually finish it. But it's just a matter of one. This is the thing all over again. No, I know.

No, no, not for this. This is because this will be, this will happen. It's just a matter of I was trying to catch up with everything. The movies are so many movies. But I've done a lot of it. So, all right, guys, that's it. That's our list. Super epic.

Close out of the year for capes and cows. Big thing. We covered all the movies and TV shows that we wanted to cover. So I ask you guys inside of the comments here, what are your thoughts on any of the stuff that we talked about? What were your favorites of the year? What did you love? like, what you dislike? Would you agree with the song? Would you disagree? All of those comments help us have a conversation. It helps the show. So I'd like to thank my friends here today,

starting with Winston A. Marshall. Where can I find you? You can find me at the Swaggy Blurt on all the platforms, man. I've been doing my breakfast a.m. News again. I'm doing a fun thing. I've got a couple episodes that I had already recorded that I didn't get to put out, so I'm going to put those out. But I'm going to be doing one where essentially, since I started that in the middle of the strike with my broken leg, there was a bunch of stories that happened at the top of the year. There was a part where I wasn't working on it. So I'm actually going to be doing a lot of jokes, kind of an extended episode of that of stuff that was missed throughout 2023 because this year, man. So please come over at the Swaggy Blur. Check it out. Come say what's up. And I'll see you guys back

here in 2024. I love the year and wrap up joke thing. That's genius. And also I've heard some of them because we heard some of the man. I've heard them playing around with them because I was driving Winston a bit during that time. So I've heard some of these jokes. And they're great. So check them out. I'm going to be doing my year in wrap up of movies. reviews and TV reviews and stuff over on my own YouTube and also posting them to TikTok shorter. I personally saw 175 movies so far. I'm probably going to see about 190 by the time the year ends. So I'm doing a top 23 of 2023 and only two genre content things made it.

So if you want to see what I talk about beyond capes and cowles, 21 non genre things made my top 23. So head over to my YouTube's at Coychondro or my TikTok at Coydandro. And you guys, I love, I love, love, love doing this stuff with these guys. So thank you for a year of generally positive comments. I know Christian only has to delete some of them. So I appreciate you guys being a mostly welcoming audience. And it means a lot that we've built this channel. Like, you know, 100,000 is a lot of people.

And now that we're at like 111, that's more than a lot of like towns. So it's really cool that you guys are here with us. So I want to thank you for a year that sucked so much for having a bright spot here and sharing time with these guys. So thank you. All right. So as Coy said, thank you guys for being part of it. Thank you for being part of a big thing, capes and cows, everything that we're doing here.

I really appreciate it. Yes, we are at about 111 right now. We're trying to get 200. So if you're brand new to the channel, you haven't hit it yet, please hit that button. We do a lot of this and more Apple Podcast, Spotify, Patreon, super helpful enough. Obviously, those sponsors, man, if you can get one of those sponsors today, do it and let the English see you do it. All right, thanks for joining us on the show for myself, Winston and Coy. It's Caps and Cows, and we'll see you in 2020.

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