The Kristian Harloff Show - AEW, Star Wars & Best WRESTLEMANIA Match w/ Frankie Kazarian

Episode Date: February 24, 2022

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What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to the big thing. I have really enjoyed it. It's funny because you guys know how much I was talking about that I didn't want to do digital interviews anymore. And I didn't want to do in-studio stuff because of the vibe. And then I want to beat my own fucking words because I've gotten so many great guests recently. And some people that I couldn't have gotten in studio. And today's no different.

Frankie Kizzerian is here, ladies and gentlemen. And you know him. He's the first ever AEW tag team champion has been around. And he's, I think, one of the guys instrumental in all the AW success. When you look at any of the guys that are that were there when the thing started, that is a badge. That's a badge of honor. And they're making punk rock right now, AEW. So we're also going to talk to Frank.

Frank's got a band and they have a song called No Mercy. It's his band, Gutter Candy that we're going to talk to him about. And he's, well, he's already, I was talking to him. beforehand and he's very much singing a lot of my language we're going to talk 80s wrestling on this show we're going to talk about cobra kai on this show we're going to talk star wars so you know you know how i'm going to i'm going to geek out on this one for sure but before you do that i got to ask you you got to show some class just a little bit just an ounce that's all i'm asking for an ounce of class and you got to do that by subscribing and hit the notification

button do that and patreon hit it up man i see n lives on there three months three three three times a month. We got the rewatch of the thing finally. I told you. Finally going to do that. Some bonus episodes, all of it. But enough about me. It's the big thing.

It's Frankie Gazzarian. Let's do it. What's up, everybody? Welcome back. I'm excited, man. Let's do it. Let's get right into it. He is the first ever,

AEW, tag team champion of the world. AEW star. Franki Gazzarian. bring him in. Yo, what's up, man? What's going on, Matt? How are you? It's good to have you, brother. I appreciate it. Because we've been talking kind of back and forth for a little bit. And finally, and you were so kind to be able to, I know you were traveling, you were doing some stuff and we were trying to get this done. And the fact that you were able to do it, I appreciate coming on today. Oh, my pleasure, man. We first started talking literally months ago and then

tried to put something on the books in the last couple months. And it just, because of traveling and scheduling and just all types of stuff just got pushed back and back. But I'm glad we finally both had a day to do this, man. Really looking forward to this. Same here. And I'm going to, it was funny because I always ask my guests before they come on, like what they're watching and it can be anything. And you said to me, which was music to my ears, you're like, I watch when I,

I watch 80s wrestling. And I go, dude, that is, that's my, that's, that's what I fell in love with. That's the reason. And we haven't really had an opportunity to speak. My audience is, is bored to death with the fact that I wrote for WWE very, very, very, very, very briefly. But it was the golden era that got me into it. And I just over the weekend watched the 1989 Royal Rumble with my daughters.

And it was the first thing. And it's like playing an old school video game, man, just watching all those classic wrestlers. Do you remember that one pretty well? So 89. So that would have been the third one. Second, right? Isn't it the second? I'm sorry, second.

Yeah, because the first one was USA and 88 before four. That's right. Hacksaw Jim Duggan. Yep, Hacksaw Jim Duggan on USA Network. I remember watching on the USA, yeah. Only 20 guys, I think, not 30. Was it 20? And then they moved to the 30, and that was like, that was like that.

And there's no music for people when they get announced. It was just a crowd either booing or popping or whatever. And just waiting. It was I, I've geeked out. I've seen that one so many times, but I geeked out watching it again because it starts off with Axe and Smash going after each other. And that, I remember watching that as a kid. did and they did have entrance music because that was that was the pop it was first it was it was

you know those rick derringer chords and it was like and howard finkle and now the man who do number two and those and just i remember freaking out like oh my god these guys have to fight each other yeah and that was what that set the tone that set the tone for the royal romo going forward for the next 30 years you know it really did and i think that the other thing that really set the tone was the excellent commentating by Jesse Ventura and Grilla Monsoon, who set it up is like, are they going to do it? Are they going to go at it? And like, their answers your question are going right at it. And then they're beating the shit out of each other. And then number three is Andre. And it's like they, and they just turn around and they dropped them. And this got

to a point where Andre, because remember for a long time, it was like impossible to drop Andre. And then everybody started dropping Andre. Warriors started dropping Andre. Like everybody started dropped on Andre. But but yeah, man, just watching the legends of all the bad news brown. Like Ronnie Garvin comes in at one point. It was, it was, it was something special. For me, those paper views and those Saturday Night's made event, it's comfort food. Yeah. Just hearing Gorilla Munsoon and Bobby or Gorilla Monsune and Jesse or Vince and Jesse, it just,

it brings back such comforting memories. And it's just stuff I go go to on a regular basis to this day. I love that. I mean, it's, it's to me, it was, it still is my favorite, my favorite time. Yeah, there was, there was superhero type, you know, cartoonish stuff about it. But I, I dig it. And I, and I just thought, that's why I got to be honest, why when, when AW was announced, when it started. Because I had an opportunity, like Jericho came in and Cody came in when I was a collider.

And I, and I talked to him and Ryan Satin was at Collider for a while. And I was talking to him about all the stuff that was coming out with AW. And I said, what I'm excited about was more or less like the old school kind of down to the wrestling side of it and it seems like there's more power to the wrestlers which i really like and there's more freedom i mean you're there do you agree that that's that's that's perception is reality yeah i mean you have a direct line with the boss which is not always the case in pro wrestling um you know you if you have something on your mind if you have something creatively that you would like to get out there or pitch you have a direct line uh it's not like you have to go through channels

there's one guy you can go to and he's willing to hear you out, which is great. And we have since day one, AEW's emphasis has been on the in-ring product. And that's what a lot of fans were missing with other pro wrestling. So we tried to write out the gate, you know, set the tone with that. Did you know, did you feel like from the second that, because you were there from the start? So like, did you know that, yeah, this is going to be something special or is or it was like, hey, I got to take the gig right now because it's, it's what's in front of me or it's a little mixture of both. No, I knew.

I was fortunate enough to be kind of in on the ground floor before there was a ground floor. Like in the early developmental stages, like a long time ago. And no, I knew this was going to be something special because of the players involved, because of Tony and his knowledge and his passion for the product because of the potential television partners involved. You know, I was at a point where my contract was coming up and I could have stayed with Ring of Honor. I could have gone elsewhere. But I chose to put all my eggs in this basket. That's how much I believed in it.

And yeah, and all the other guys that I mentioned, the first nine guys assigned were, you know, like Cody and Kenney and the Bucks. and Jericho and CD and Sky and myself. And with that, just those guys alone and Tony and everything he had in plan, I was I was all in, you know, pun intended. Yeah, that's awesome, man. So did you, and so how did, but how did you get involved with those guys in the first place before all that too, which is just from just from being around it and making relationships? Yeah, I've, I've known the young bucks since they were fans.

You know, the young yokes used to come to independent wrestling shows that I was on early on. And when they first started, became friendly with them because they were SoCal guys. And what they've done speaks for themselves. But once they reached, you know, they came to TNA for a bit and we kind of reconnected there. And they went off in Japan and blew up and became sensations. And we reconnected in Ring of Honor. And Ring of Honor, we became traveling partners and really, really good friends. And same can be said for Cody when he came on. and Kenny and and and and uh and uh and uh adam page and basically was through r o h where we all kind of we all kind of form this bond and and jericho too like jericho once he came on board he was just

he fit right in yeah he really i mean you could tell i mean i remember talking to him beforehand and i have i have a pretty good relationship in general now too and just the passion for and you know him he just he doesn't he says he says what's on his mind and kind of and gets out there and promotes he doesn't bullshit you know he's he talked about a w and what it could be and the reason and why he went there in the first place. And it certainly has translated to that and what you guys are putting out there. So it's really, it's really pretty special to be involved in that at the moment for sure. Yeah, it's, it's cool, man.

It's, it's so crazy to look back on how much the landscape has changed in pro wrestling. When you look back even five years ago, but like 10 years ago, it's completely different. Like the business has changed and evolved. It's such a quick pace. It's almost hard to keep up with, man. it's like streaming almost right it's like there's like there's like there's so many streaming because look and and you and i did you i mean did you follow pat i mean obviously golden era is our thing too and then i i fell out of it for a bit and then i got when i was in college i got back in

through attitude era and all that um but throw so and the reason i bring that up is because during that time the wcw the mother night wars and everything that that was going down do you get i mean obviously competition breeds even better product, right? And that is clear by what's going on today. But do you get nervous at all? Or do people get in with both you guys, with the AEW getting nervous because you're like,

okay, look, let's, yeah, we got a momentum right now and we're doing really good. But let's, let's not follow like the sins of the past. Let's, let's, because there's a lot of new people coming in. There's a lot of people coming in. There's a lot of contracts there are of wrestlers that are available now. And, and so as someone in the company, are you looking going, okay we got to let's let's just stay the course because we don't want you know it is ww is a beast and right now you guys are you guys are the hot you guys are the hot thing there's no doubt about it

yeah i uh personally like i i understand like all the contracts and you know a w signed a lot of people and i understand the philosophy on why they sign those people but i if it were me running it and it's not i would be hesitant to sign that many people because of things that have happened in the past right because you've you've seen companies companies that had, you know, 150 guys under contract and only 50 were being used. You know, obviously that's a decision they've made and that's the way they want to conduct business. And I respect that. But yeah, I mean, you've got to be careful because you have a lot of guys, a lot of tech.

Look at all the people that we brought in. I mean, they all speak for themselves. They're all stars. They're all incredible wrestlers. But you do have to be careful that, you know, you're going to have a good portion of guys that are capable and are good and our favorites of the audience that they're just not going to see because because there's only two hours of television time on Wednesday, one hour on Friday and the various shows on YouTube.

But they seem to be handling it all okay for now. And again, that's not for me to judge, but that's just me personally as an insider looking from the outside. I could see how that could get a little muddy. Well, that's why I asked because it's just one of those things that you guys, it seems like right now it's doing. it right and you always worry like okay there's this momentum but you speak of that how they bring people in you actually had an opportunity when when christian came in for his match what a match that was by the way

phenomenal match really great match and then you hit the flux capacitor it looks like it's gonna it's going to go down and then you know it just it was such a great a great match and it kind of you just you what i liked about that match was that you could really tell two guys two pros who just knew how to not trying to one up each other like really selling it to the craft proud, making sure that it was, you know, putting each other over. And I thought it worked really well. So it just, it just kudos to that. It was a great match.

Thanks to me. Christian is, first and foremost, a very good friend of mine. And I was thrilled that he came there. He and I had chatted about AEW before, before that. And I had, you know, I had basically sold them on it and told them, you know, how, you know, all, all the really cool things that were being done and how it was run so professionally and to be chosen as his first opponent was was an honor for me you know he he thought that would be a good idea Tony thought that would be a good idea and I was thrilled and

and yeah to be his first man not only his first match of the company's first match in seven years yeah which that anybody that's ever done this can tell you if you take seven weeks off it's hard to it's hard to step back in seven years that's a lifetime and he didn't miss a beat and I'm not I'm not saying that because he's my friend and a mentor and a peer and someone I respect. I'm saying that as someone that has done this for 24 years. He did not miss a beat. It's unreal how he did it. Well, yeah.

And speaking of like long layoffs, it's funny because like a week before Punk came in for that, I had him on this show. And I didn't, people are like, you're going to ask him? I'm like, he's going to tell me he's going to ruin the surprise and tell me, what am I asking for? I'm like, that's silly. But he shows up a week later. So speaking of someone who was out of the game, for a long time.

This is a guy who's, do you guys, you're watching backstage, you know, just kind of, because it's a massive moment. It's one of those, like everyone's watching that,

that episode. Everybody has eyes on it. People that hadn't even, hadn't watched wrestling in years are tuning into it. And it was a, it was one of the make or break moments for AEW, and it worked out tremendously. But are you guys in the back kind of like biting the nails going,

hi, this guy, let's, let's hope he still got it. I mean, I wasn't. I, you know,

I kind of, when I'm there, I do my own thing. that day. I mean, we are in Chicago. I mean, all the stars aligned. I knew that was going to be the perfect storm of something really cool happening. And I, a lot of times I'm off doing my own thing.

Sometimes I'll go and watch from an area kind of in the crowd where I can't be seen, but I can see. And I watched and I, you know, all the cliches, you could feel the buzz and the electricity and his music hit. And the place came unglued. they again, AEW gave the fans what they wanted. And it was certainly, it was a special, a special night and a special reaction for everybody there. I can't imagine how special it was for him after being gone so long and to come back and to hear that type of ovation. But yeah, there were people, there were wrestlers and people like in the back cheering up. You know, it was, it was.

So that that shows you right there that it struck accord with people, not only the fans, but wrestlers and various personnel backstage. And the other thing that I thought has been tremendous was the fact that and as an old school fan like myself is that Sting, man, the fact that Sting's able to do what he's doing,

I mean, he's 60 years old. And he's, it's incredible. And when, and I, I talked to Bobby Moynihan and we were talking about how he's, he's on the show, Mr. Mayor now with, with Ted Danton. And I asked him, I said, because, you know, he's been around forever, on Saturday Night Live, everything he's doing, but it's still Ted dancing, and he's sitting there, like, working with him, and I

do you ever kind of, and I asked him, do you say, oh, my God, that's Sam Malone from Cheers. So when you're sitting there talking to Sting, are you like, oh, my God, it's Sting, you know? I've had a relationship with Sting for a long time because of being in T&A together for a long time. And, and he's always been a class act. I've had the opportunity to wrestle him several times and just always been nothing but the coolest guy, the most humble, giving individual. Again, when he's in there with you, no ego.

He knows who he is. Just honestly a joy to have in the locker room. And it's funny, when he debuted, I remember that night I wrestled Jericho in a singles match, and he had the big surprise entrance. And I saw him right there before, shook his hand and Stinger. And he's just like, look at us. We're both still here. I just can't, they can't, I can't stay away.

And, you know, and it's, it's funny because for everybody that criticizes, like, oh, he's, you know, he's 60 years old. Who gives a day? He's sting. Sting. And I equated to like, when you see somebody like a Sam Elliott come on screen and he's in the role of a badass, you believe the Sam Elliott could beat somebody's ass because he's so convincing. Like, so I'm like, you go ahead and throw that age stuff right out the window. Because when Sting comes up and he's in that paint and in that gear and in that trench coat, he's still sting. I don't care what year or what decade it is to be.

honest. A hundred percent. He's made that game work for a long time. And it's iconic. I mean, it's iconic. He, and even, you know, he's, he's talked about it after the crow came out and what he, was do. But like, at this point, you don't even really equated with the crow as much. You just equated with Sting. And yeah, he really has done it. Yeah, really, it's, you know, younger fans, when you say the crow character, they, like, what is that? Because the crow came out in, what, the 90s? Yeah, like, 94. So it's like, yeah. So, like, yeah, so like, they say the crow character. as a crow character that's just sting like we all know like my generation knows it as the crow character yeah because crow was a hit movie and became big after brand and lee's passing but uh yeah it's just

that's the sting character a good portion of eyes don't know the surfers sting other than archival footage it's weird to think that but we got to i love me too me too but we got to see that transformation and for a almost a couple generations of people now all they know is this is this quote-of-quote crow character sting. It's wild. Yeah, it's wild. I just, I remember my, my favorite stuff was like him versus like muta and all that stuff back in the day. Those were like, ah, and him joining the horseman and flare and all that. Oh, it's great moments. Stings, but Stings is an icon, man. But, um, yeah, so, so tell me, Frank, when you got involved with, in wrestling and, and when was that? Was that, that, was that, that was that early 90s or? So the, my gateway into professional wrestling, you're talking about

when I started in the business or when I started watching. When you started, well, I know you started watching more like the 80s and stuff because golden, but like when you first started training, was that like mid-90s, late 90s? So I got into the business in March of 1998,

24 years ago. So yeah, so I moved from here, Yucca Valley, California to Malden, Massachusetts to be trained by Killer Kowalski. So I started March of 98, which will be 24 years.

How do you do that, though? How does that even happen? How do you just find, I mean, because you know, you can find Kilkelowski. How do you get involved with it? So back then, this is the early days of the internet, but I, when I was researching, did not have the internet. So there was a couple books you could send away from, from the after mags on how to get

in the wild world of pro wrestling. And one of them was written by Paul Baer, Percy Pringle. And basically what it was was just like what to do to get into wrestling and, you know, where you get boots and how you conduct yourself. And on the back, there was lists addresses of wrestling schools, which I was like, what? There's wrestling schools? I didn't even, I was like, okay, I guess there is because that's where you learned to do it.

Yeah. And there was a couple that caught my eye. There was three of them. And one was the Hart Brothers camp in Calgary. One was the power plant in Atlanta. And one was Killer Kowalski's because I knew Keller Kowalski had trained Big John Stud and Triple H and China, Perry Saturn and John Kronis. so I actually um also I also wrote a letter to WWF when I was uh god probably 16 17 as uh in care of

tito Santana because Tito Santana was and is my favorite wrestler asking if Tito Santara Santana had any aspirations of training people neither is to say he never got back to me but anyways uh did you ever meet him after that no I met him I've met him one time at a at an independent show and it was years ago and it was kind of like passing and it was i i didn't get the chance to really like say hi this is who i am and thank you for so if i ever get that opportunity again i will i kind of regret that so hopefully i get the chance to say okay man thank you because like you were my first favorite pro wrestler and still are my favorite um but uh yeah hopefully i get that opportunity but anyways i met brett heart and brett had

actually recommended koalski school to me which i thought was odd since uh i was like why wouldn't me why wouldn't you recommend the heart camp and knowing what i know about that now i do understand why so yeah that was brett's recommendation to me and that's that's that was like the gospel for me so that's man can i ask what you when you say knowing what you do about it now as i'm certain you said you said knowing what you do about it now you just the heart camp like i mean you know like jericho can probably tell you a lot of stories like he showed up you know like his stories like he showed up on the first day and one of the hearts was there on it was Bruce or Keith and and they never saw him again. And there wasn't a heart camp. It wasn't,

it wasn't stew in the dungeon teaching people. It was, you know, I don't want to say it was a scam because some amazing guys came from there. But it wasn't, you know, it wasn't what it was advertised. So, you know, it was, it was not, you know, you weren't learning the heart way, like, there was, there was like a manual that the hearts had given. And that was their curriculum. And that's how they learned, but it wasn't like, Kowalski school was killer Kowalski teaching you what to do. So that was the difference. And the heart camp, you know, a lot like, again,

a lot of really talented people came from there, but it wasn't, it wasn't as advertised. Understood. Okay. So this is something that's very important. To me and to all of you, you got to be able to secure you guys, the audience, me, people I work with. It's very important to do that in order to make

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So make sure that you go and you do that. NordVPN. So when you're training and so do you know right away, like you always hear like, do you fall in love immediately or did you have to like get your ass kicked a bunch of times to kind of want to come back and do it and say, all right, let's let's keep on this thing. Fell in love immediately and got my ass kicked a bunch.

So the actual wrestling part of it came natural to me because, I mean, I'm, I was always an athlete, but I just, pro wrestling was so ingrained in me that they would just show me something and I would know because I've watched so much. Like I was obsessed with it. So like the actual physicality of it came natural to me. Taking the bumps to everything, yeah, it hurt like hell. And you have to get used to like even hitting the ropes like bruises or ribs and stuff. But like, but yeah, that all that all came natural.

Like taking the bumps and the moves and the transitions and all that. but back then you know late 90s it was still very protected and when new guys would come in you almost had to go through a oh okay do you really want to do this and and training consisted of getting getting the shit kicked out of you man like like a lot but I would not trade that for the world because that you know yeah that's what you hear I had I had Booker on recently. We were talking and I had asked him. I had said, do you think it, it is a lot easier now to break in than back then. He's like, absolutely it's easier now because there's just so many places, whether it's the internet or different play. I mean, look, he's got reality of wrestling. There's all these things that are that you have a chance to break through. And what you're telling me is the way I've always heard the stories of like the old school way. It's like there's a few places. They would beat the piss out of you in order to do it to also to haze you, but also toughen you up to say, okay, because you can be in a match like this, man. You're in one of those old pros that have been around for a bit, and you think you're calling your spots one way,

and that old pro might change it on you in a heartbeat, and you've got to go with it. Absolutely, yeah. And like, you know, there was the blow-up drills and the ass kickings and all that. And I saw guys come and go, not just in the school. Over the course of my career, I've seen so many guys come and go, and so many guys come in that looked like they had a ton of potential,

you know, physicality-wise and everything. and just couldn't, couldn't cut it. Sometimes, you know, like I tell a lot of people when they ask advice, like you got to have a thick skin to be in this business, a thick skin. You cannot let stuff bother you because you are going to go through a lot of stuff, a lot more mentally than you will physically in the long run. Yeah, a lot of people, just the same way it is in movies and television and theater, you know, you have to be a mentally pretty,

strong individual to have longevity in the entertainment industry. 100%. I mean, and you got to have, it's not, it's not just about the tools, right? It's about,

it's about being savvy. It's about, for longevity, it's about being savvy. Because there's, you look at, like we just mentioned, like a guy like Stink,

you know, like you've, you've got to really know the business inside and out to be able to last that long. And, and, and yeah, so it makes a lot of sense.

And also coming from, from the old school camp that he comes from. But, talking about the old school. So let's, and this could actually, it doesn't necessarily have to be an old school answer, but who do you,

who's your, and the same questions that I asked Booker Tee, and you mentioned Tito, other than Tito, favorite wrestler all time, other than Tito. Yeah, so Tito, Tito is actually the first wrestler I ever saw on a, because my first thing I ever watched was Ressor Many won, and he's the first match.

So maybe that has a lot to do with it. But so I always gravitated to guys that had that style. So early on, yes, the Hulk Hogan's and Roddy Piper's were attractions and I enjoyed watching them, of course. But like when I saw like the macho man, I'm like, okay, he does a little more cool things. And when I saw guys like Brett Hart and Davey Boy Smith and the Dynamite Kid or Ricky Steamboat, like I immediately grab it. I always say I gravitated towards the intercontinental type wrestlers because that's, those are the matches I looked forward to most. The Kurt Hannings and the Brett hearts and the Kerry von Eric when he was there for a bit.

And like I said, the Tidos and then, you know, like those type of guys. Like I always, I guess, yes, the smaller guys at the time, but the guys that I thought were having the coolest matches. It's a crime that Mr. Perfect never got the main title. It was a crime. I couldn't agree more. Him and Rick Rood, another guy that both, you know, if they were around in today's wrestling environment, they would stand head and shoulders above pretty much everyone out there based on. look ability speaking skills like it just yeah you're right the crime is a crime and i was watching

as i was watching at 89 rumble it was it was actually pretty pretty magical to watch because there's a very young shaw michael's that pops in in there and like him and kirk heading are going at it and you're just like people like when you're watching in 89 you don't realize what you're watching you don't realize it that's yeah like and you're just like they like they don't make them like that anymore like kirk henning he's i mean he's that guy should have had a title run for a very long time. Right. And getting back to what you said earlier about how back then it was, you know, a lot more theatrical and cartoonish. But oddly enough, people bought into it a lot more back then. You know, I mean, I know it's, it's worth 30 years, 35 years later and, you know, kind of the

wool's been pooled and everybody knows what it is. But, uh, even with all those cartoonish figures and and the theatrics and the and the glamour of it, like people bought in to everything they were giving them 100% I remember and I'm sure you do as well like when Hogan and Savage went at it at WrestleMania 5 like that was before as you mentioned before the the curtain was pulled and and but it was also before the the big steroid case and all that stuff too and people still it was and it was before the sports entertainment moniker was even put out there so it was that Hogan versus Savage WrestleMania 5 that I remember the hype on that being just as big it's like a Tyson fight coming out.

Sure. Yeah. When the warrior fought Hogan at 6 and Toronto, at the same time, I remember me in high school, it felt the same way when like when it was Sugar Ray Leonard and, and Hearns going at or something. It was, it was massive. So you're right. Everybody bought into it. Nobody knew what was going to happen.

It's like people would say, oh, it's, it's, it's, everybody knows the outcome. It's scripted. It's this, it's that. And you're like, I don't know, man. You can't really tell it. You're right, though. People bought into it.

way more than now because there was there was because the secret k-fib was held a lot more i think still yeah and they were box office attractions and i think a lot of that has to do that with the fact that there was back then only three or four paper views a year i mean that that made them very special events you know that that obviously changed because the business model and the way we consume entertainment has changed but boy those first few years when there was just those four big paper views yeah all of them and especially like a ressalmania all of them were mainstream attractions. Let's see if we're on the same page.

So Booker and I are on the same page. Let's see if you're on the same page. Greatest WrestleMania match of all time. This is funny. This is asked so much and talked about so much just amongst my buddies and guys in the back and guys in the locker room. And I remember having this discussion with,

I think it was Al Snow, and he was asking what the best match of WrestleMania 3 was and all of us are Savage Team Mode. It's maybe the best WrestleMania match of all time. And he goes, well, I disagree. He says the best match was Hogan and Andre. Because Hogan and Andre is what brought all those people to that place so those guys could have a good match.

And I'm like, okay, that's one way to look at it. But yeah, asking from an in ring, I mean, for me, I don't know if I could pinpoint it on one, but a couple I'll give you. Savage Steamboat is kind of a canned answer from people of mine, but that's still one of my favorites. You can't discount Hogan and Rock because, that match personifies what pro wrestling is, I think, better than any other match because

never in a match have the fans been more invested in two characters, not wrestlers, two characters. And that match proves that because the place was on fire for that match. Another personal favorite of mine because I was there was the Brett Hart, or Shaw Michaels Iron Man match. Oh, wow. You were that down? Yeah, I was there. I was in the crowd, Mania 12.

And I know a lot of people don't like Ironman matches. I at the time was just so obsessed with good wrestling and technique that, and those were to the best, arguably to the best ever. And so I have a soft spot for that one. Yeah, like so in Ringwai, another one I was there was, I was actually employed by the WW at the time. So I watched it kind of from the crowd was. Shaw Michaels versus Kurt Angle, which was first time those guys ever gotten green together.

And remarkable, outstanding match. Just two of the best storytellers we've ever had the privilege of watching. I agree. Those are all great ones. Savage Seymbo to me is still, you know, whether I'm definitely part of that can't answer because I just, I watched that match maybe two, three times a year. Is that your number one? Is that your number one?

Easily. It is just some of the best storytelling and just a masterclass. Just a masterclass. I love that. I love that match so much. And you have to turn Savage babyface after that because how do you keep him heal? How do you keep him heel at that point after a match like that, after what he just did? And it was made a lot of sense of why then he got a title run after that.

Sure. Yeah, there's so much. But I think that that, and it's funny you mentioned, heart and the one that you're at the iron rematch i actually really i like ironman matches when it's people like that that are doing them right so that was a great one i always the one that i had never seen because after i left um w i took a break for a long time and and i and then after because i started a show called movie trivia schmodeown which infuses movie trivia with with with wrestling and um and i started watching again and i went back and watched a lot of the stuff that i had missed

in the past. And I had heard all this stuff about how Taker and show Michaels was the best of all time. Great match. Yeah. I mean, just a great match. And I don't know if maybe if I was watching, if I had seen it when it was going down, then maybe I would have felt different. But I said, it's a great match, but it still doesn't touch Savage and Steamboat for me. Yeah, I agree. I neglected. I completely forgot about that one. But yeah, those both of their matches were phenomenal. And again, it's like to the best, to absolute. icons. Yeah, that that's certainly up there. It is. All right.

So switching away from wrestling for a second, we were talking about it, where I had asked the stuff that you are watching and you're a Star Wars guy like me, Cobra Kai. So you're watching a book of Boba Fett right now? I'm watching Book of Boba Fett right now. Are you all cut up?

No, no, I'm all cut up to as of last Wednesday, the Broku and all that. So spoiler people. Yeah, that's a big space for anybody and check time codes. We're going to talk about spoilers here in Book of Boba Fad. As you ever watched it by now, man, it's your own fault. Come on.

100% I agree with you. But you know, you know better than anybody, Frankie, how the internet is. So, yeah, man. So this is, to me, I don't have an issue. There are a lot of people who do saying that it's the book of Boba Fed. And yet he's, he's only in so far four episodes out of the six. So what's going on? And blah, I said, I'm watching a Star Wars show.

That's the main thing for me. And it's like, and it's too. And they already said, in interviews that this is Mandalorian 2.5. I don't give a shit. You want to tie it up at the very end of it as long as it's put together. I just got to see Luke Skywalker and that and that deep fake stuff was nuts. It looks so good. Did you enjoy it?

Absolutely enjoyed it. And I had probably five, six people, Wednesday morning, text me. Have you watched BubbleFit yet? People that I talk about Star Wars. No, no, no, I haven't. People I saw later in me after me. If you watch it, no, I haven't. Text me with you.

I'm like, I have to watch this. And so I was assuming something big happens. And yeah, when I saw it, a big pop, obviously. And I was just thinking, like, watching it, how remarkable it was. And, like, just imagining what we could do now. Like, it's like the possibilities going forward with, with Mandalorian and Boba Fett and the Canobi show. Like, just anything's possible now. It's unbelievable.

And the book of Boba Fett, like again this is spoiler but you know we see him crawl out of the pit and like that's something I've been reading about since I was a little boy like or reading in the novels or hearing about or reading in comics and to finally watch it it's it's it's it's like that comfort food I was talking about watching 80s right it's so cool it's even out I mean how you neck you got watching it there's a course and that's and it's also why again blue in the face to the people who've been listening to the show that I've said like I I prefer Star Wars television over Star Wars movies all day long because I just think that there's the what you just said every.

Oh, he was tired of hearing him in two. So I'll wait and see he comes back. But while I wait. Yeah. Sorry, man. Sorry, man. You back? Yeah, sorry, bud.

Where did you go? Hold on since you don't have a photo on it. Let's see where to go. I have. I can hear you. you're in you're in audio only right now okay let me let me yeah if you if you sign out and then come back in you should be good one second sorry man you're all right you're right there we go sweet all right cool here we go all good so um so yeah when it comes to for me it's star wars um television i'll take it over

movies all day long and i know to some people that's blasphemous because it's it's star wars it's what started the movie craze in general and the big blockbuster too and i and if you can and and look if a star wars movie comes out i'm going to be their opening night to watch the damn thing but i'm just saying week to week to week i can watch the stories build and spend more time with the characters inside the galaxy what you just mentioned before frankie with the fact you see him come out of the the sarlac pit and that's week one you don't like that then you get next week one week later you get another big episode and then it's an episode you don't like well a week later you get Luke sitting on a hill with with grogo so I mean yeah I and I agree with you and I have this is a

controversial take but I've said to my circle of buddies that are Star Wars guys and the the Boba Fett and the Mandalorian stuff has been in my opinion the best star war stuff since the original trilogy uh I am of the opinion that Favro and Faloni if those guys in an alternate universe would have had their hands on the the sequels, I think they would have been much more defined, much more story-driven, and ultimately better. That's how much of a fan I am of the new stuff that they're doing. I don't think that's a controversial opinion. I think that's starting to become the majority, to be honest with you. Yeah. Yeah. The big word is what you just said before with what you guys

are doing in AEW. Plan. It's all about a plan. If you have a plan and the passion and everything too, that's what works. There was no plan with the sequel movies. And I know people, some people who love the movies and that's awesome and that's great and there's some great moments throughout it but there's you cannot argue whether you love it or don't like it there was no plan there's clearly a shared universe plan in TV

that last episode was I agree with you since Jedi one of the best things of Star Wars we've seen in a very long time because it because it honored what happened to the past it foreshadows what's going to happen in the future it honored canon I mean it checks all the boxes yeah it just like like these these shows they've been remarkable it's i'm so happy that i live in a time where i can where i can see

these stories told and not just read about them but actually will see the visualization of them yeah you see the announcement the it was a kind of a leak um by accident by one of the um disney plus executives last week that that it looks like canobes coming out in may i did see yeah i did see a quick little blur for that so i'm on board i'll be there i'll be like dude like like with everything I can critique and talk about Star Wars, but whatever movie, whatever show, I'm going to be there day one. I'm going to be there. I'm going to watch it. And I'm probably going to enjoy it.

May I criticize it or give my thoughts on it later? Yes. But I'm going to enjoy it because I'm a Star Wars guy. And I'm grateful that George Lucas created all this stuff at the beginning. Yeah. So do you read all the comics and the novel and stuff too? But not all. Like when I was younger, I read a bunch of the books.

I read the solo books. the latest resurgence of the comics I got into a little bit, but I'm so bad about staying consistent with reading because of just time and stuff. But I've tried to keep up as best I can. I've watched most of, like I watched all of Rebels. I thought that was really well done. I haven't watched the bad batch yet. I've got to get on that.

But like all the live action stuff, I'm there usually on Wednesday afternoon watching. Rebels is definitely one that is as good one to be caught up on because if you look at what's going because look at everything that just went down with that scene with Asoka and Luke right like you know that's going to play in people are thinking that maybe it's going to be like a retelling of those Timothy Zon novels when we were kids like after Return of the Jedi that was the only kind of Star Wars that we had were those novels right people think there's going to be kind of a retelling now where throng's going to ultimately be like the Thanos of the heel yeah yeah like the major heel so he's going to be the one

what through a soka series and then maybe Luke gets involved inside of of it and the way that they are placing everyone through this thing. So yeah, the connectivity of it is what's getting me for sure. And I just on this channel, I just posted an interview I did with Faloni in like 2017 or something. And he talked about that. He talked about the connectivity and how important it is to not treat it like

inside baseball stuff and not because that that's the problem, I think, with a lot of executives sometimes that they go, oh, well, the mainstream fans are not going to, it's going to be over their heads and they're not going to care. They're going to care if you make them care. Right. And I think what those guys have created in the Mandalorian and the Boba Fett, it has something that the prequels, I'm sorry, that the sequels were lacking and that's soul. I'd even go so far as to say that the prequels

as criticized as they are, I think they at least have a soul to them that I don't necessarily think was in the sequels. There's a lot of aspects of the sequels I liked. But it just the soul of Star Wars is is so in these Disney Plus shows that it's, it's gotten me more excited than I'm as excited now going forward as it was when I heard the announcement of prequels coming out in 97 or whenever I heard that news. They were able to get the excitement back for sure because after, after Last Jedi came out, it was definitely a big divide with the Star Wars community. And for the first time in a long time, it feels like people are,

the majority of people are starting to get really excited about it again. And that was that was that went away for a little bit. And I'm glad it's back. But the other thing, speaking of Star Wars and the stuff that I've, I think has Star Wars. I think has wrestling all infused. And that's Cobra Cod. It's so good. And I, and like I said, and I know that we, and we talked about it kind of coming into it,

that you have a band. Tell me about gutter candy real quick. So gutter candy is my band. It's something else I do. Something else I like to do creatively, where I, kind of an 80s and 90s hard rock radio tribute band but we also have a lot of originals just very much influenced by guns roses motley crew romans stuff like that i'm a metalhead at heart but uh this band just we're a we're a fun act we're like kind of in the vein of a steel panther

we have a pretty unique stage show a lot of comedy thrown in there but at the end of the day we're a really kick-ass fun band to watch live. All right. So the name of the song, obviously, if you're a karate kid fan, is No Mercy. And before we get into all of it, we're going to play this song here. Frank was so kind of to let us play the song.

Here it is. Here is No Mercy by Gutter Candy. There you can't be number two. The mixes. This is don't joke. Don't you want to stay. First thing. She'll go lose a kid by the truth.

There you go. ladies and gentlemen. So there is no mercy by gutter candy. And thank you for for letting us play that. I appreciate it, man. Hey, thanks for playing it, man. I appreciate that. Full disclosure, we, we, I say we, myself and the lead singer, Jersey Dagger, are major, massive karate kid and Kobra Kai fans. And we wrote that song. When the show first came out, we're like, let's write, let's write a song about that series and about the movies. And let's write it as if they're going to included on the show. Like if like you like the idea is like that song could be an infomercial for Cobra Kai like the way the phrasing and the lyrics and everything for familiar with the movies

in the show. We wrote it just 100% to go like hey here's gutter candy here's a song we wrote please use it. Oh sorry has uh has uh has john hurwitz or any of the guys the creators have they heard it so I I chat I'm friendly with John on Twitter and we have chatted back and forth and I uh god it's been so long maybe a year or two ago I uh I told him that we wrote a song and and he uh he had put me in touch with the musical director and I was awesome yeah and I tried to and I don't think I was able to get get my message through to her or not so I might I might try again because I mean I think that if you listen to a song I think it it's putting like a montage behind it's just so 80s it's great it's that right it's that's got the feel of an 80s of an

80s action movie song. And it's just like you could put, I could visualize scenes from the seasons of Kobra Kai and the movie in without music playing in the background. And those, I mean, and those guys, I mean,

they just have such a great sense on. They're the best, man. It was so funny because today, um, at the time of this taping, uh, there was a fan that tagged me and John on some post and there,

he made like shirts of cobra kai and it was like in the street fighter design, right? With all the, but it, Instead, it had the, it had all the characters from Coburkeye. And, and I said, this is why John is so good at what he does and how connected is his fan base. He wrote back to the guy and he's like, I just purchased them.

And it's just like, like there's so, yeah, there's so many people out there. And it's hard to keep up with, with everybody, especially with that show now, too. That show is like such a massive hit. John is so connected. And so are Josh and Hayden as well, too. But they're so connected to their fan base. So I'm sure, like, like when you said that, you know, you got in contact with. with him like it doesn't surprise me that he's that he's listened to it too he's just such a good

dude yeah very gracious to even get back to me because i mean i i'd sort of dialogue with him when the first season came out he got back to me and which was really cool and yeah those guys that show's so well done because you could tell again going back to something having soul heart and soul like that show has it and uh for me personally i was always a defender of karate kid three like that was always with amongst my circle of friends was always like yeah karate kid but three's really bad and I'm like no bullshit three is awesome I said three has terry silver the single best heel in the history of cinema is a bad boy karate mike barns it's like it's so I so see what happened in this last season it's like ah it's like recompense for me it's like I'll look at this

like and that and all everyone's coming on terry silver's back I'm like oh yeah all terry silver's back all the guy you thought from part three that wasn't the good one like it's like redemption it's it they really i mean his his characters was just out of control good in this last one and and i and i mentioned to them when i i had him on this uh recently and i and i said to them that what i see like they sing my songs in this thing they have it's wrestling it's star wars do you see the wrestling in paris and you see all the heel turns and baby face turns and shit that's going down like all the time and it's like wrestling writing 101 yeah swirves yeah There's swerves and, and, and, you know, baby face turns and baby face turns and baby

first turns you think are going to happen that don't. And it's got, it's got just enough camp mixed with enough heart and action and, and soul and feeling and just, it's, you know, this last season I thought was, for me personally, I thought it was maybe directed more towards a little bit of a younger audience, which is cool because that's probably the audience they're trying to reach because they introduced a lot new young characters and stuff and a lot more stuff and like involving high school dances and stuff like that. But again, it's like I'm enjoying this as a man in my 40s as much as I enjoyed karate kid

when I was a young, eight-year-old kid or seven-year-old kid, whenever that came out. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely, man. I mean, that's what they do so well in the show is that they're, what they did, the smart formula, the first thing that they did was being able to do exactly what you just said. And that's take those people who saw it when they were a kid and all the lure and all that stuff that you really loved about it, get the nostalgia going,

and you got those people, right? And but what then you need to do is then you have to get that younger generation. So you have Miguel and Robbie and Sam and Tori and all of them. And then you're like, oh, so, but my daughter can watch it. It was 10 years old now. She can watch it and be into it. And there's that just that perfect blend. And because of these things that they're able to do, like you can have a really

goofy scene in there that's just bizarre and you're laughing about it and how over the top and cartoonia might be. And then the next scene, you get something. like Miguel coming in and thank and and telling Johnny that he loves him and I you know I love you too and then he calls him Robbie and it just breaks your heart like there's there's so many moments what they found inside of this it's it's not conventional television it really isn't and it's it's it's it's it's why it's my one of my favorite shows in television right now yeah I could agree more and those guys and this is a credit to the writing they've created a show that you

don't yeah it was sold as being a part of the karate kid universe but I'm sure a lot of kids that are watching this have never seen any of the original films. But they're still enjoying and loving it because it's that good because they're invested in Miguel and they're invested in Robbie and they're invested in the characters. Again, it all goes back to story and characters like everything else. Pro Wrestling, Star Wars movies credit. It all goes back to story and characters. And these guys have created very cool new characters, mixed them with some iconic archive characters and created good story. It's really it's real simple, but it's not if that makes sense.

But these guys, like you said, they have the formula down. It's total sense. And the thing that it, you have to, and this goes back to the Star Wars conversation as well with Faloni and Favro. If you care about it, you have the passion for it, the audience will see that and they'll feel that. If it's just a job and there's no plan to it, you'll get, you'll get sloppiness and you'll get, and you'll get the fans who right away like this, that's what these guys have done. They said it. This is their Star Wars.

They've said it many times. I saw that these guys were on your show a while back. I watched that episode. It was great. And I know, I think they said that they already have the next season filmed. Yes, they have,

they have number five. Well, the one they just wrapped. They just wrapped it. I mean, well, because remember when they did, the last one,

it was during the lockdown and everything too. So it was just, the things were just all over the place. And they were able to pull off a really good season. I can only imagine what's going to happen with this one. Barnes is coming back. That's, that was my question to you.

I was like, do you think we see Mike Barnes and I think yes also going even further than that because you go back and you look at the original movies and it's like is Hillary Swank a possibility. So I think that's I would love to see it. I think that's less likely to happen in this season. I think definitely had conversations with her. If it is, it's like very similar to what they did with Elizabeth's shoe and like a tag or or they cheat her at the end of the this season.

But if Mike Barnes, I don't probably eat my words. Mike Barnes doesn't show up in this season. I will do, I will jump off the top rope and land on my face with no one in the ring. I do that. I do that even if I do that for reputation. You get paid for it. Right.

Yeah. I do. I do. I do now. Yeah. No, but yeah, I agree. I agree. That's,

I mean, that's just looking at the story where it's gone, that just looks like the natural next step. But it's like, you know, and I think, they're almost out of characters. But then you can go back and like, his name's escaping me now.

but Daniel's friend that he meets at the apartment from the first movie that he goes to the beach with. Like you could bring him back in it. Freddie, Freddie, that's it. Yes. You can bring him back in a role. You know, you can bring there's still the other members of Cobur Kai from Johnny's, the original Kobra Kai. That's right.

Well, that's what they said. And the guy said that too, they said if anybody, they called the Miyagiverse, anybody that's ever been in it, they've either talked to or talked about or thought about bringing them back, right? So it could be Michael Ironside from the next karate kid. It could be, you know,

it's all these different. different places. Everybody wants to see Dutch come back, but, but Chad McQueen has said that he just doesn't want to do acting anymore. But, but, but the one thing is, though, they did say he was in prison, right? And Greece is in prison. So maybe if, if there was ever a time to get Chad McQueen and Dutch back, it's, it's this season. Yeah, which is, which is funny. I remember when they said that, I think they said that on the episode with the, uh, with the other with Mike, where the one where he had cancer and everything. Yeah. Yeah. It's funny. If you, if you know that, original movie, Dutch

was kind of the jerk that would end up in prison out of all of them. I always hated that character. Just a smug jerk. They were all jerks, but he was like him especially. He was fantastic. It was a great hill. Franky, look, man, it was really a pleasure talking

you. We should definitely do this again. But let me know, like what's going on with, so what's, do you have your next match kind of planned out? What's going on? Just I'm there. I'm with AW. I'm there every week. Oftentimes, you'll see me on the dark or dark elevation or any of the shows. I'm there, part of the team, and couldn't be happier to be there.

So just if you're a fan of wrestling, watch A.W. Rampage on Fridays, watch A.E.W. Dynamite on Wednesdays. Awesome. Thank you so much for joining us. And also, guys, make sure, please, and go check it out because you can get the gutter candy song, No Mercy. I listen to it on Spotify, but you can get it, I'm sure, on Apple and everything else, too, Frankie. All streaming outlets, yes, sir.

All right, and make sure you follow Frankie at Frankie Cazarian on Twitter. And I will put all the links in and also put the link for No Mercy in the description. But, dude, once again, thank you so much. And hopefully one of these days when you're in town would try to get you in an episode of Shmodown. That would be amazing. I would love to, man, say the word. Yeah, this has been a lot of fun. It reminds me our old mutual friend Ken Knapsok.

Yeah. I used to have his podcast. And I used to do that a lot of times. So it's cool. It's cool, man. Anytime I can come on and just check. about stuff like this, 80s wrestling and Star Wars and Karate Kid. It's just a conversation. It's cool. And I really enjoy these type of interviews.

So thanks for having, man. Of course, brother. Anytime you hit me up and we'll do it again. But guys, please check up, check them out. Frank Kizarian, AW, and we will catch you next time. But before you do it, guys, show a little bit of class. Will you just a little bit? Announce. That's all I'm asking for. Subscribe. Notifications, all of that. There's Patreon.

And don't forget about podcast, Apple Podcast, Spotify, anywhere podcast or found. make sure they can do that. All right, hit the comments. See you next time. Peace.