The Kristian Harloff Show - Ahsoka Episode 4 SPOILER DISCUSSION! | Sith Council

Episode Date: September 7, 2023

Join the website here! http://www.thekristianharloff.com Ahsoka Episode 4 has had some major water cooler moments. What stood out in the search for Thrawn and Ezra? Who had the best performances and let's talk about THAT moment. Kristian Harloff and Mike Kalinowski discuss. #ahsoka #rebels #starwars #thrawn 

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Welcome back to Big Things Sith Council Edition, man. We're talking about Asoka episode four. Full spoiler discussion. I know, listen, one thing I'm going to tell you is that we're going to have a full-on debate here between me and Michael Kalinowski. Steph is not here. She's not going to be here until the strikes over. That's what people are you asking. I talk to her all the time.

I always check in. We love Steph. I can't wait to have her back. but she is decided, you know, she's decided rightfully so that she wants to, she wants to wait until the strikes over. Same thing with some of the other peeps on the show, and we can't wait to have them back once the strikes are over. In the meantime, we are going to get into the full discussion, myself and Mike,

and if you haven't already done it, please hit that button. We're at almost 91,000. We should hit 91,000 today, and we're hoping we're 9,000. We're getting to that 100 mark. We're almost there, but we need you guys to help us out. So show a little class, will you? Just announce. Hit that button.

Do it. the English so you do it. All right, everybody. It's me and Mike. It is the Sith Council Osoka Edition. Let's do it. It is the Sith Council. Big Thing Edition here, everybody. It's me, Mike Kalinowski. Yeah. And we're back. I have not asked you your opinion yet on this coming in fresh. Yeah, buddy. One thing I'll say, I think you're going to agree with me on this one is that I said, maybe. I think so. I said when you look at episode three, because we both thought episode three had a lot. We both agreed that episode three, I saw some comment that I addressed earlier today that someone thought it was a filler, episode three. I think you can say anything

you want about that episode, but if you say episode three is a filler, when you look at what filler by definition is, you're wrong. Filler means that it didn't further the plot. It was a side, it was completely, it was just there to fill time and they didn't, there was a break from the main plot and all this, which it wasn't. What I will say is, is after watching this, if you combined episode three and episode four together as one hour long episode what a monster episode this would have been much more so because it ends

at the end of episode three it just ends with kind of bailing on the cliff and then add it to everything that goes down in this one how much more of an impact do you think as a full-on episode as opposed to two separate? I don't know why they did that. Right? I don't know why. I'm watching this going... Disney. That's a Disney thing. Because if you think about this,

like this episode, can you not hear me? I'm talking to the mic. How about this? That better? Yeah. This episode basically was just, hey, we're getting the hyperdrive and we're going. And let's fight. That was it. And let's fight. Yeah.

Great episode. It's a great episode, Mike. Was it? It was great. Okay. Yeah, it was great. Okay. You're wrong.

Hey, according to the internet last night, it's the greatest thing in the world. It's perfection and everything else. So who am I to argue? Well, that's why you're here. This is what I like about you, though, too. What's that? People will yell at you today because you're going to be on the, You're going to be on the minority of this one, because this was a fantastic episode.

I know I will be. And I kid when I say, look, it's your opinion. So I disagree with your opinion, but it's your opinion. We got this a lot last episode. People are like, would it kill Mike to watch the few episodes of rebels that makes them understand these characters? And I go, I get that guys. I specifically did not watch rebels because I want to be the general audience going into the show, going, will I be lost? Will I be invested?

Now, that said, if you are a fan of rebels, I can see why you all are losing your minds for this episode. Oh, for this episode. for this episode. For those of us that don't know rebels, I'm kind of like, well, it's bailin, standing on a cliff again looking up. The amount of times they're just standing there looking up, it's mind-boggling to me. They're just mind-boggling.

I liked everything that was going on. They're just standing there looking at the cliff. Right, so before you go on your rant with the cliff, the fact, didn't you get empire vibes, though, from how they're, when they're on, like, the asteroid, you know, and they're trying to fix the ship. They're not on an app. They're on a planet.

Holy shit, man. You don't listen to shit. I said, don't you get Empire vibes. Yeah. When in Empire, they were on an asteroid trying to fix the ship similar to what they're doing here. You didn't get that vibe to it? No. Oh, okay.

Good for you. Oh, you're in one of these moods today. Fiery bitch today. Let's go. Let's not curse. I'll try. How about, you're not trying well. Hold on.

Let me have a little. Yeah, chew two pretzels. That'll help. And I'm on can. You know what's going to happen? Oh. someone's going to be listening in their car to this, and they're going to pull over,

and they're going to give the middle finger to the radio because so many different reasons for you today of what you are trying to accomplish and failing and succeeding at the same time. So you can like anything about this episode. Are we on the air right now? No. Are we on the air right now?

You need to say ready and action for me, and then I'm ready to go. I only do that for actors. I want to strike, because I'm not acting right now anyway. True. So did you really not like anything in this episode? No, I did. I didn't enjoy the episode. Fun Star Wars. Fun Star Wars. What's your problem? I don't, it's the hyperbole of Star of Star Wars. And maybe because, so the fans are pissing you off more than the episode. Well, hold on a second. First of all, I hate, we've talked about this. I hate that they have now

changed this to a 6 p.m. drop time on the East Coast because my feed blew up with the picture of the spoiler. Don't go on the internet. I go on the internet. I go on the internet for more than Star Wars. I go on for news to talk to friends all over the world. Take a break. No. Yeah, that's your own fault. I don't have to do that. I have no sympathy for you.

I know you don't because you guys have to get your pictures up to put up on these things and you got to do your Star Wars channels. Because I don't want to wake up at two in the morning. I am. So you're up. Sure am. So it doesn't bother you to do it. No, not at all.

This is a selfish, selfish thing you're talking about. I didn't say it wasn't. Okay. I didn't say it wasn't. Right. 100% selfish. Or we have some decorum online because I'll tell you this. I got people with this picture of Anakin.

I don't follow. No one that I followed retweeted them, liked what they did, and then I go on their profile, and none of my people follow them. So how are these people coming up on my timeline? You know that this is another thing you can do. You can mute everything Star Wars, right? Not if they don't put a Star Wars tag in it.

You can't. It doesn't matter. Yeah, it's fucked. I broke the rule. It screwed. Anyway, I liked the episode. I liked it. Okay.

It wasn't the greatest thing in the world like everyone's claiming it is. See, I, and I, Okay, go ahead. Keep going. And again, we have to preface this with I have not watched Rebels. So I'm sure if you're a Rebels fan, there was so much more about that that you are loving. And hey, that's awesome because not everything needs to be for people like me that don't know it. The only thing that I think that is relevant to anything you just said as far as Rebels goes. As far as Rebels goes is the end with the World Between Worlds.

That's what that was. That was the World Between Worlds. Okay. Right. Now, the question is this. Now, if they, episode five is going to be an entire thing of world between worlds. Now, they have the opportunity to explain it to everyone, like to people like yourself, because I don't disagree.

When she woke up and I said, oh, she's in the world between worlds. First, my, right after I was done, I was like, what are someone like yourself, you're like, I don't know where she is, right? You know what I thought? What? And again, because the world between world seems like it's been built off of other things that we're familiar with, it seemed to me like in Infinity War. when they are on Vormir and they die

and they're in that place that like he wakes up and he's like, I'm not dead, where am I? It's, we've seen this in literature, movies and television all the time. It's a gateway. The afterlife, the ether. So I knew what it was.

I don't know the significance to Star Wars. Well, and that's what they need to do and I believe that they will in the next episode. They've got to explain it because if you don't know what the world between worlds is and so in season two, she fights Vader. It's a great fight.

Does she know it's Anakin? She kind of has a pretty good idea for it. And then it's a pretty emotional. You should watch it on, it's a good fight. When the show's overall, watch it. Fine. And at the end of it, for a long time, people were like, well, people thought Osoku was dead. Because shit falls down and they're like, okay, what's, where is she?

And people kept asking, Pheloni, is she dead? Is she alive? And then they reveal, I think it's in, it's either in season three or season four that Ezra is able to connect to the world between worlds, and he's the one that at the last second during this fight, he pulls her out and brings her into the world between worlds and saves her life. Okay. So the thought is that somehow Anakin accesses the world between worlds, and he pulled her out

before she falls through to her death fighting Baylon. That's kind of what I would assume. Okay. But the question is, A, how does he access it? B, if that's the case, what version of Anakin is this? because the Anakin Skywalker, who eventually turns to Vader, didn't do that. Didn't have, there is a moment in, again, Clone Wars. Did you ever watch the Mortis episodes?

No. I don't know. I know you saw some episodes of Clone Wars, but the Mortis episodes had a period where Anakin actually, there was a, he saw the entire thing of where his life went and he envisioned and this is all Lucas stuff. This isn't, this isn't like them coming up with, this Lucas came up with us. And he saw the entire thing. and then his mind was that that experience was wiped from him.

Okay. Because so what if it inside of that afterwards, that version of him with time and space because it works so differently, if there's a version of Anakin that actually saved the Soka and takes her to a different play, I don't know, it's going to change the way that Star Wars perceives time and space, I think, in this episode and the next one. And as to people that don't know any of this, that's a big apple to bite into you. You've got to be able to explain it. You have to.

Episode 5, that's why I think it is a 95% guarantee that the entire episode will just be a world between worlds. Where is she right now? Underwater, just dying? No, she's in space. But how? So you mean they physically she fell off that cliff? Yeah.

He went into the world of Queen Worlds, pulled her into this pocket dimension. It's kind of like a mirror type thing that. Are we going to see his hands coming and catching her when she falls and bringing her in? I don't know. I mean, I think there was something, when you see the fight itself, in Rebels and whatever episode it was Ezra physically grabs her and pulls her

Well, I don't know that. Right. And that's the thing. You've got to be able to... That is why I agree with not only your assessment and a few people's assessment of if you don't understand if you've never seen rebels,

you don't know what the hell is going on right now. Like you've got to be able to explain that. Not in a bad way because I did understand. I was like, okay, she's on the verge of dying. This is some kind of after. life, what's going to happen? So I'm cool. But again, I'm kind of deep in the lore of nerddom where we see this all the time. How's the casual fan going to deal with it? Right. How is

Joe Schmoe? They definitely have to be aware of that. I mean, they definitely have to be aware. They're going to, hopefully. Like, and I think that that's why it's a longer episode next week. I think it's something like 46 or 47 minutes. It is a Dave Flonie directed episode. So that's got to be, the heavy lifting is going to happen in this separate. His episodes are always pretty full with lore And Diving deep into the You know

The core of what the show is about I saw a lot of comments from the hardcore Star Wars And I say that with love Because I know them through the Shmodeon mainly And they are so deep invested in everything that comes out They said that this episode was so deep In the dialogue of the lore I didn't think that

I was not like what is that Who is that? Except for that world between world stuff You didn't think the stuff with Baylon Talking about Anakin but it but it I didn't feel need I was at loss I was just like oh it makes sense yeah he would know him in the order and this and that like it wasn't like but that's that's not what they're saying they're just saying they're building the world out of history and stuff okay all of let's let us

talk about um what do you want to merrick though oh yeah this is this is the best because so when when initially it came out that he was like who you know I wonder who that is and then people just started going rampant rampant to who it was the theory that I liked, but wasn't sold on it, was the Star Killer thing, right? I liked it because I was like, it would be nice to see Sam Whitwer in live action finally. They finally bring that character in, they give them more to do. It would be great if they did it that particular way. But the other side of that was I was thinking, well, the only problem with that is you're going to really have to spend a lot of time explaining him. And then, this was Monday that we talked, Sam Whitwer

pretty much said, I'm not in the show, guys. He forgot that he even did voices in it. But he did do voices, and that's what people took the... That's what they took him. But then when, after he said that, I was like, I don't want it to be anybody. I want it to be just a random dude. And I love that that's exactly what it was. I love that so much. It's the, it's the, and I don't know why they do it.

It's like they take, like it was the Wanda vision, Mepesto. Oh, it was Mepesto? It's like, how about sometimes? And it goes back to the old Lucas where he got a bunch of the art. and goes, that's awesome. Yeah. Make that a guy. Right.

Put him in the background. And they just went with it. Yeah. Like, Obi-Wan had a bunch of people in the background of inquisitors and what. I know. I was like, is that going to be so in some of the skies? Just because he was wearing a mask? Well, they massed.

Look. You thought it was going to be Ezra? No. People out. Not you. No. But people out there thought it was going to be Ezra. You remember that.

It would have been. Of course I remember that. I don't even watch rebels. And I'm like, that is the stupidest thing ever. It makes sense. It just makes sense to be Star-killer. It doesn't make sense to be the guy from last Jedi Survivor. They wanted it to be.

Yeah. I didn't mind that theory either. Come on. I didn't mind it. But here's what I will say, though. I don't. I saw a comment that I see all the time and I see it from our peers and it drives me crazy. And I think it is so self-righteous and I think it is so lame when people go, why don't

you stop speculating and why don't you just enjoy what you got? It's like, no, you don't do that. If people want to speculate and people, and. Honestly, hold on, hold on, hold on. If people want to theorize and people want to say, oh, what if it's Star Killer? What if it's Ezra? What if it's this? I think that's fun.

I think that's part of Star Wars. What I don't think is, right, is if it doesn't happen and if it's the smoke, this is the stupidest thing ever, blah, blah, blah. Now I'll tell you this same, and the same thing goes for it. If Ezra would have been the, I would have been, this is stupid. This is dumb. But I still will say, though, I think people can have their opinions on it and be able to speculate speculation is fun. I can't stand the notion of, well, we have too many, you shouldn't have expectations when you watch movies. That's so, such a lame, lame point of view. I hate it. Do you? I hate it. I'm in

the middle on it because I do like the speculating. I think speculating gets out of hand, but then on the other hand, the way it fans turn on a show, if it doesn't turn out how they want. We're talking about two different things. We're talking about two different things. I agree with you. I think that you're you know that's you should be able to state your opinion and all say those same people if they're like look I was hoping that it was going to be Ezra it wasn't and now I'm just going to watch and and I'm not I don't love the decision but I'm continuing to watch it and that's it and if people say that and they can do it respectfully I think that's part of the game I think that it's like for a long time it's fun as it's it say like the same way that you and I would do you think that's it you think that's

anybody what do you think's going to happen with with so and so do you think that's going to happen we do that all the time and even whether it's on there or not in the air. I can't say I think it is the most self-righteous thing when people go just accept what they give you and just do this. I'm trying to think of whenever I was involved in a fandom where we're trying to guess the identity of what we thought was so much. You've never done it in DC? I'm trying to think of when I did because DCM kind of know the Lord to the point. Who do you think's going to play that person? You mean it's going to casting wise? Casting wise you just the same thing? It's a sure it is. And it's a same thing. That's not that's not a story already being told and we're like

If you look at the evidence, like I, again, don't know rebels. I would 100% tell you that wasn't going to be Ezra. I don't watch rebels and I know that's not going to be Ezra. They're not going to do that. He's not Dave Wallone, who these people love and everyone loves. Do you think this man would respect the law enough to do something stupid like that? But it also makes it when you watch this episode in general, it shows why you shouldn't and never even brought that up because the whole point, this thing was Sabine,

where she's equally the only reason they're going out there in the first place. It's not the fine Thrawn. It's to find Ezra. I got some thoughts on that. their whole message their whole mission is to find Ezra and there's this entire thing between Ernst and Asoko where she's

like we got to destroy this map like whether it's Ezra or not. So has Star Killer has never interacted with Sabine or Assoca. Star Killer? Whitmer's character, right? His name Star Killer? No, he hasn't even been brought in the canon. So why would they put him in that role?

Why did the fans think? I'm going back to it. Why would they think that yes, that's going to be awesome reveal. I think that the reason... There's no connection. I think that the reason why is because whether it's fallen, because the story was in non-in legends, he was recruited by Vader as a really young kid. Okay. And so, and he was, he was the, either the son or a Patawan, I think he was a son of a Jedi. Um, and he was brought, he was brought by Vader. So if there was this reveal that this young kid taken from the, it was, it would be very similar, I think, to like the Riva type storyline, right? Okay.

But the idea is, but the problem is you'd have to do so much explaining. And I think that the reason people were just excited, people want to see Sam Wittmer in live action. I think that's what it comes to. So do them, don't do them the disservice of sticking them some of their character. Well, they haven't. And that's, and I think that, but to go back to it, the other thing. But no, but the answer thing is like where it's such a major plot point where it's,

it is the, it's the whole reason that Sabine goes, or take that because I want to find my friend. You hated that. You know, like, I think, are we going to talk about that right now? Go ahead. Okay. Well, you know what, save it. I'll tell you why.

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One, two, any. Go and check them out today. They're in the link in the description. Always the pin comment. All right. You did not like Sabine giving over the map. Why not? I didn't like it at all.

No, I love it. I hate it. Go ahead. I'm not so like No I did watch when we The very first thing I ever did with For You was far far away And so we started covering rebels

So I watched a few episodes The Sabine character is vastly different now than she was then And again character growth happens Child to adult Yeah I get it I'm not a fan of her character No I don't like her Why

I just I don't know if it's The performance or the character He's not Mopey No, I'm not saying she's Mopee. But so the big bill, we talked about this last season, last year, last episode, Thrawn, huge villain. Like this is, this is Hitler level coming into Star Wars.

Thanos. Going to destroy everything again. You all know this. The world knows this, how bad he is. You destroy this, you don't find him. He doesn't find his way back. Here you go. You know, I'm sorry.

It's, but it's my best friend. Guess what? I love you, man. But if they're going to say, hey, Hitler's coming back with this map or you never find Harlop's like... What about his name, Bigelow? What about what if his name Bigelow? They would understand. What was Shannon? For the greater good.

Go to Shannon. That's the love of my life. That's different. Are Ezra and Sabine, love their lives? Maybe. But I just know them as friends. So... Well, this goes back to your point earlier. This is why maybe that Rebels fans will understand this move more than...

Which I think is ballot. And as a general audience, I'm like, you, dumb. than dummy. Because you don't know because you don't have the relationship built up. Again, yeah, fair enough. And again, so those you listening that are listening to me, I have purposely not watched rebels. Oh, I don't know this. I'm the general audience. That's a good point. But I also didn't like Hu Yang going, please stay together. And Assook is like, we're going to do it together. What do I do? Split up. How about Hu Yang throwing hands? Oh, he, I love that.

I chose violence and who I threw it back at him. That was fantastic. That was one of my favorite scenes because he knew that he couldn't keep up. And the effects were great. They were really great. I knew that he couldn't keep up. But he was doing good. He was doing good because he's been training with Jedi for years. And he's and he was doing right.

But then he was just like, all right. Help! Help! I loved that scene. David Tennant is crushing it. That effect, however they did that, awesome. It was great. Yeah.

And I think Ray Stevenson as Baylon was the standout for me in this. episode for sure. Ray Stevenson's always good. But for me, I'll up of this show four episodes in. And who's my favorite? So, no. Shin. She's great. Love her. She had to turn around this episode too. I love her. Yeah. And I think she's staying bad now, Mike. Oh, she ain't turning good. I think she's killing Ray. I think she's killing Ray. Stevenson. Oh, oh, oh, no. Yeah. Baylon. I think she's killing him because he's he's he's he's he's great i think smet said it best on line he was saying it's like he he's given off quagon vibes like yeah and in a different way but i agree the elder statesman that's like he's calm he's calm he's on the other side for bad guys where quaggon will be on the

side for good guys but i they're kind of like i looked at him in those eyes through that smet's had mentioned i's like there's something common but i do see him doing what's right everything is always with honor i would i would absolutely love if phelone just done dumped on everyone's head and the turn the cliche a little bit. And instead of, you know, if you're going to, everyone thinks that shin's going to be the one of turns and it's bailing, right? Because they have set that up. However, I would, it's not 100% bad.

I don't. I mean, he's got he has the whole thing with honor. He's like, hey, I kept my word. He keeps, there's way more things that he does. He's not a, he's not a mustache twirling villain. No. He has. That's what I love about him.

He's got depth. There's a line that he says at least one or two times an episode. And the ones, there was a few, this one where the. when he says, when she's like, oh, do I sense fear? He's like, experience is the first part. And then the other one, she's like, what's just, have faith. He goes, have faith.

I lost faith a long time ago. It's like those two things just give him so much more depth. And then like you said, when he tells Sabine, he's like, come with me willingly. And then I'll let you see a friend. And she does. And he's true to his word. He takes her on the ship.

It's so telling of what a great actor does with writing. Like because those they're just two lines experience. Yeah. You have a sphere experience. But you feel it. Depending on the delivery. There's such weight behind it. Yep.

And watching him as an actor. It's fantastic. But to go to give you another thing with that, whether it'll help you look at it or not. It won't. But the Sabine thing versus Baylon, right? Uh-huh. If she, if she destroys that thing. Right.

She's dead. I mean, she's dead? Yeah. Why? Dude, she shot at Bayland 87 times and he smacked it out of the way like a fly. Yeah. If she destroys that, you think he lets her live? He cuts her head off and, and what's her face is right behind and Shin's right behind, ready to choke her out.

He didn't let her choke her out because she promised to. Because she promised that she gave him the thing and he holds her word. She's dead. So there's no way out of that. Okay, so then maybe that would have been a better, she's got the gun to the thing. Bailen's like, I'm going to kill you. And then we're going to standoff. And then he sees her.

She sees Shin. And then she's like, this is a lose, lose for me. I got to at least. You don't think she knew that from shooting at it, 75 times? But it wasn't established out. Like from watching it as an audience member, I'm like, I was like, where's the way out here? Because Shin shows up after she gives it over. No.

What? No, shin shows up first. No. You should. Oh, you're right. You're right. You're right. Asoka's on the cliff.

That was another moment. by the way that I really like. I'm sorry. Asoka's on the cliff fighting. It was a great battle between the two of them because what I like about Baylon also is even though he's more of a chill villain than we've seen, he still fights with power and rage, right?

Like you've seen some of these swings that he's taken and he's got to soak up at the cliff and he has already said it didn't have to come to this is another thing. And they're fighting and then there's a great moment. You talk about just like acting through the eyes and just like maybe one little line. Rosario Dawson does a phenomenal job

when Shin shows up because she doesn't say any of this but you read it as she takes in that moment that Sabine is dead because Shin shows up. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And she's like, oh, she's like Sabine and the rage comes out and her. And she kind of channel some dark side stuff because she takes shin and she throws her into the rocks. And that was a great moment. So yeah, Shin shows up first and then Sabine's got no way out. Okay.

You know what I mean? I would have, maybe that maybe that was in the performance. I would have like to see a little more like I have no other choice right now. Yeah. It just seemed like, are you in? All right. Yeah, beat me rock, paper, scissors. Here you go.

I think that also, by knowing that she can find, Azra, knowing that maybe, you know, the other thing is she thinks, and this is, there's a explanation plus a bit of a critique on my end with this. So we know how close she is with Asoka. We know this. They have a strained relationship, but they care about each other. minus the no when she gets killed.

She doesn't seem to give a, she's not crying. She's not, or taking my rate minus the shoots, I guess shooting. She's not like, she was, seem to me she was more concerned with Hera when Hera was like in peril. Yeah, again, and again, I had said a couple episodes ago, I'm never going to critique, say, an actor's choice. Yeah. Because it's an actor and that's their choices and I don't know what was directed.

I just, I don't know if it was the writing in the, the character or does the performance with this with the actress i don't know if i don't it's not resonating it's not sabine is not working for me okay um i do think she's working for me but and i do think that was more so over directing who directed this one do you remember peter ramsie from into the spider verse oh okay p peter rams peter ramsie yeah uh he did a great job i mean it was there was a few times in the woods that you and i always bring this up there was a few times in the woods it was pretty volume heavy i think the whole show's volume heavy the whole show this episode i don't think they go on location at all No, I know, but I mean, I'm just saying noticeable.

Yeah, let me ask you this. And I know, I don't know where the choice comes from. This show seems so dark. Yeah. Not tone-wise, just color-wise. Like, I think in post-production, they made it, that it's a conscious choice to desaturate everything. And I don't know why.

Because it's, yeah, it reminded me the episode where we met Morgan Ellsbeth in Mandalorian where that it was all gray. But I took that as the plan. it. But this now planet looks the exact same. But you've got pink leaves on trees and it's like the lightsabers stand out a little bit. But I'm like, and someone online had done like a color pass on it. And their whole thing is like, I fixed it. And like, no, you didn't fix it. You change what you wanted of it and not what the filmmakers wanted. But I decided with what he did. It looked so much better. Yeah. I don't know what the choice is. And on the Disney side of why

they went with this because it just, that's a, that's a thing. That's not a Disney. That's not a That's why I said there's two things that people do all the time. I mentioned this before. When it comes to creative choices like that, that's a flowny Lucas film thing. That's not, that has nothing to do. The Disney thing, though, I did mention that I'm very curious about. And I said, I have no insight to whether this is true or not. But I do think that if they're like, okay, if Lucas films like, we're going to do six episodes

and we're going to do them at like, there's this episode's about 50 minutes. This episode's around 60 minutes. And they go, all right, Disney. I could see Disney saying, can you do eight episodes and split one of them into 2.30 so we can get the ratings, get the views, get the streaming numbers. That's a Disney choice. And that I can say, now, again, I don't know if that happened or not. They may have all just said these are 32, 3 because a lot of these episodes do tend to be shorter. But I wonder if that's because Disney asks for more episodes and that's the way they do it.

That's the one thing that I can see when people ask, like, why are these episodes so short? myself being the biggest advocate of that. I wouldn't be surprised if they have pitched, you know, shorter seasons, but Disney wants more. So they're like, well, instead of doing it with the budget that we have, let's just cut them into these little 33, 3.3. I mean, I still think it's you,

if you, the episode, the way the people would have been talking about this episode, if it was 3 and 4, I mean, they're already, look at the way they're talking about 4. If it was 3 and 4 combined together, I mean, it's a massive, massive episode. Think about how much we talked about Andor with the 1, 2, 3 punch,

with the knockout. We knew it was building. Like this is like, it seems like there are two episode, you know, punch knockout, punch knockout. Is it one episode? And it feels like one and two were so much. And that's why they showed one and two together. Well, one was like 50 something minutes.

And then, but, um, it just, but what I don't, but the other thing that I said that, but what I will say, even though it was a shorter episode, strangely enough, even this is like 30, anywhere between, I forget 34 or 36 minutes. I forget which one. It did feel longer to me. It didn't feel. like there are sometimes that I watch episodes I'm like that felt short this didn't feel

short there was they got a lot crammed in to those minutes where I think a show that does it really well and I know it's different when he can do science fiction and action and but like the bear the bear is a show that's anywhere between 25 to 32 minutes minus like one or two episodes that were longer but but they get so much done in that time period I think that to give credit where credit is due I think that they got a lot done in the short amount of time that was in this episode. Sure. I didn't feel short change.

No. And I think that, but yeah, agreeing with what you said about, Shin has been fantastic. I love where her character's going, and I really hope. Nuts. She got them crazy eyes. She's going more and more down the dark side,

and I love it. And it's like, that moment, which was great, I don't know if you liked it or not, but I love that moment where she's fighting Sabine. And they didn't, and I was so worried, they're going to know, here we go. She's going to get the force. And she doesn't.

And she looks there, she's like, you have no power. She's like, boom, boom, shoots at her like, Mandalorian style. I love that moment. That to me was very Sabine from the show. She's using blasters throughout the entire battle against the HK droids, against, like, against her. And she was starting to kind of get the better up of shit at one point than she had the smoke bomb her ass and take on. Yeah, it was, which was, which is great. But I love what she's doing.

And Morgan, oh, even what we didn't talk about is with this whole, when Hera and her buddy show up. Yeah. And like, oh, okay, we're good to go. And they're like, they're not, they don't have any fighters on that thing. And don't you love that, because you and I've always had the same critique of like the new stuff. It's like, okay, what do we need now? We need a big threat. Another death star.

And it's like, oh, no. This has the, that feel of like a big power weapon. Yeah. But it has nothing to do with destruction. It has the further of technology and what it's able to do. It's just, hey, we need a bigger engine. Yeah. That's all it is.

And for her, we need big engine for our ship. I loved that scene with Morgan when they're like, when the droids like they're blocking our past. She goes, ignore them. Yeah. Awesome. That was awesome because then she just fires right through them, kills like three of them. Yeah. And and then with Jason kind of looking over and going, I have a bad feeling, didn't say about this, said I have a bad feeling.

And that clearly is, is that it's going down. Yeah. Yeah, it's cool. You didn't like that moment either? No, I did. I did. I thought that was really cool. We talked about this a little bit before. Like, I'm curious why Carson showed up.

It seems like they like the actor, so we need an X-wing pilot. But I'm like, it makes the galaxy feel smaller to me. And we talked about this. They're like, so war's coming. I ain't going to be calling Luke or hot. Yeah, that was my question is, you know, and this goes back to the stuff that's tough. This is why you and I talked about this from Mandalorian, right before that reveal happened in season two. I said the Jedi's got to be Luke.

And I said, it's got to be Luke. I said, not for nostalgia purposes, not for a cheap pop, for the fact that it makes sense. Like, he would be the one that feels the presence of this youngling. It would be him. The same goes for it. And I know that it's tougher because of the deep fake stuff. And we'll talk about that in a second with the Anakin thing.

And it's tough. But why isn't Leah being mentioned? She's part of the council. Why isn't Luke's your first phone call? Luke is your first phone call. Okay, so let me ask you this to the people that do know these characters through Rebels 1. Has Luke, Han, or Leia ever interacted with Thrawn? Outside of the novels?

No. Laya, I think maybe. So we, because the novels are not canon. The novels inside of the new Thrawn novels, I believe Leia has had interaction with them. But the original heir to the empire, that doesn't count. That does not count. Okay. So Luke, Han, the... These guys have no idea, but they should have been there for all of his battles, right?

Well, no, he disappeared before Luke was discovered on Tatouine. So, um, and I can't my head. Yeah. And he, because when Throne, when Throne, it's, it's before the death star and all that stuff. So Ron, it, Air to the Empire was before the Death Star? No, no, that air to the empire. I'm talking about, yeah, I'm talking about rebels. So you're about interaction. Um, and I think Leah, the, Leah appeared in a couple episodes.

I think it was of rebels, but I don't know if she interacted necessarily with Thrawn, but I feel like in a novel she did. And Han, no, Han doesn't get, you know. So, Thrawn's been in exile wherever, during all of New Hope and all of that. Yeah. Okay.

So I think at all of them, Leia would know who he was for sure. But still, these were the guys that destroyed Vader and the Empire. Right. You called him, we got another one of these guys coming up, guys. There's a potential.

How do we deal with this? There's a potential, or mention them. There's a potential war. Where's Captain Solo? Where is General Leia? Where is Luke Skywalker? They're like, it was like what they did recently with, who was it? Oh, in the flash, when they were like, where's Superman?

Busy. Where's this person? Yeah. Just give me a busy. They're busy. You showed a little shot of it. Yeah. Why wouldn't you call those guys?

I mean, they're your first call. Even Luke says to Soka when she's leaving. You know, they've interacted. And he's like, what am I going to see you again? She's maybe or whatever it is. That's basically if we can get the budget for it is basically what it was. And it's like, or, you know, there is, it does lend a little bit more merit to the rumor of Kathleen Kennedy says no more Luke.

And I get that. I get the fact you're trying to distance yourself. Like I'm one of the guys. Let's do Star Wars without a Skywalker in it. But because of the time period you're in, it's the reason why he's the most powerful. Like DC says like, where's Superman? Yeah. You guys know he's in this. Where's your big gun? You got to get him in there.

It's the tough question because you will get people commenting on this video. Oh, we don't need Luke. You don't need this. For the idea of it, for the exhaustion side of it and the fact that every time you need it, you bring Luke in there, I get it. But what Mike is saying, when you look at the time period as far as how it would make sense, is that if you have these two Jedi or rogue, Balin and Shin running around the place, and Asoka goes, before we do anything, even before we call Sabine, let me see what Luke's doing.

But also, if you're building up to Thron is going to, and again, this is not any off topic. but so I think now now seeing where we were in this episode I think Thrawn's the last episode now I was gonna say the last two I still think he's and this is this is the setup you're right the setup set up now knowing what I've seen so far this is the setup for Poloni's movie of course it is a baloney's movie is the big battle and how do you not have Luke in that big battle it's gotta be you got to he is on the front line with his lightsaber next to Asoka it probably show up in a scene in the movie he's got to be in there like it's got to I don't see how you don't do that

How do you set him up as a character inside of your television universe in two episodes, or three rather, between BobaFet and that, and not bring him back just because Kathleen Kennedy goes, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. It's like you have to. You've got to fight for that. You've got to fight for that. And what you also need to fight for is good food, good food and keeping yourself healthy. That's right. Green Chef, AG1, both of them. I've been talking about him forever. Here you go.

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that the guy's stealing soda no that's barnaby um so anyway uh all right so going back to the luke Skywalker of it all right yeah let's talk about how he looked in boba fat as compared to mandororian season two dramatically different gotta go back. It looked like him. Okay, so the end, he popped up. It looked like a video game.

Yeah. And then he's in Boba Fed. And looks to this day, some of the best. It's just. Night and day. Well, no. The fact that we're kind of like, oh yeah,

back in BobaFet when Luke showed up. Those episodes. Why were they? I know. But nonetheless. None of the less. You had. Yeah, it's nine day.

It's so good. It's night and day. I feel like it's gone. It's, they've regressed this since then. I feel like you, right? Nailed it. I. So again, I saw the picture online and I will never go off of a picture of what I think of an effect is.

You know, you hear the voice. He turns around and I was like, what the fuck is this? Why does he look like this? It's like a video game. Why can they, okay, now they lost the guy that they brought on, the deep fake guy. He came in and left. Now maybe he did do this, but he's gone. And I don't know why.

That's a weird, like the fact that they champion bringing him in and then he was gone and we don't know what progress is he worked on. The same people that did the Indiana Jones stuff. Let me ask you something. there are so many makeup artists in this world talented that can make an actor look younger just with little tape little this little that some lighting and then he was in the dark you couldn't light him differently put him on the set and use some makeup on him that looked awful isn't it strange it looked awful you look at the Indiana Jones one and that one right yeah both de-aging the actual actor themselves right the one with Luke they put a mark hamill's young

face on a different actor right look better okay is that the trick is that the thing like or is it just i i i don't know what it is but look that old like he does he he's this you don't have to de-age him but like 16 years i was shocked like for there are some people who said it looked good look look first of all i will say this i love the choice i love the idea that he's back i can't wait to see where the next episode goes i think it's really smart to try to restructure kind of the time space thing and to see Anakin and maybe how he would have been outside of the uh the the costume and the beta like but but what i will say is the second i saw him in that close up shot like yeah it it looks like luke in mandolarian season two and it doesn't look good and i can't tell you why

it doesn't look right it's your eyes are telling you that it looks wrong that's what it is right your eyes are just going no it looks like a video game so now world between worlds is there a reason that Assoc is seeing that version of him? That's what we're going to find out, I think. Okay. Because I'm like, Hayden doesn't look that old. Like, just bring him in there. Have the makeup people do some makeup tricks.

Well, I think that's a wig so you can, when they have this like tape that they pull their actor's faces back to him with instant facelift, the wig covers that. Just put the actor on set. But I think that the reason why they went away from that is because, well, because when you went to, when you saw him in Obi-Wan, yeah, he looked 40, four years old, which, is not he's still a young man but he looks in one flashback scene yeah he looked either you didn't think they deage that one too oh they didn't deage that one if they did it did a terrible job they didn't they didn't they did not deage that one he was i mean i remember the scene i don't remember i don't remember

it standing out like oh that's not right i i couldn't when i look at something like the the michael douglas scene or the kurt russle scene in in the marvel stuff right i think they're michael dougain but it's like guardians two guardians two was great but but aunt man one was two Michael Douglas in that Fancy was fantastic. And it's like, where are those guys? I'll never forget that for me, the big one that worked real well was Civil War with Robert Dynne Jr. You think that one went well? He was 18 though.

They went from like 50 to 18. I didn't think that one was great. It didn't give me this vibe. Right. And that was a whole scene of him. Right. Marvel, whatever they do, they've got a really good handle on the de aging. It's the Michael Douglas and the Kurt Russell stuff.

That stuff kills. And I don't know if it's the same people. But, and again, those actors are vastly older than what they're supposed to be doing. Hayden is, what, 15 years difference? Like, yeah, I don't understand. A little step and a tuck on set with makeup. Yeah, they gave him a full computer face. Like, you don't.

Yeah, he had a computer face left. And it's like, just touch it up a bit. Take some of the wrinkles out. The wig alone will take, put 10 years younger on his life, making his hair normal, like, what it used to look like. And then you just do a little bit of the, like, the, but you can even do, like, a Photoshop type thing and just take some of the wrinkles out. Yeah. Like, put the little track.

dots and just like if he's got some bags of his eyes tracking dot and out there's like filters on instagram that's yeah yes yes not I mean you see I see these people on Instagram with these makeup tutorials where they're like crackheads and they look like playboy models all the sudden right why these people get out of the deep fake crap I think our brains but know enough to go that's not real I if if it hadn't been for the boba fat thing I would agree with you but the Bubba Fed thing, whatever they did there, I don't understand why they can't get back to that. But then on the other hand, they did that AI voice crap. Yeah, but they wouldn't have to do that for Hayden.

But they wouldn't have to do that for Hayden. Like, because Hayden's voice hasn't changed that much, where Luke's, like Mark Hamill's voice has changed significantly. James Earl Jones's voice has changed significantly. So I understand why they use that program. Even though I think that you probably for Mark Hamley, probably could have gotten an actor that could have sounded more like him because I'm with you. The AI thing for Vader works perfectly because it's mechanical.

But, but, um, but the rest of the, of it, I agree. But you wouldn't have to do that for Hayden. Because Hayden sounds, it's a weird choice. Yeah. I want to say it'd be cheaper to have the actor on set. Yeah, they probably really have. I mean, having them on set is, it's fine, but it's just I just don't understand. Like, what I'm hoping is, maybe it was just that episode, a full episode with Hayden looking like that, it's going to be jarring. It's going to be jarring. Because I think the next episode is just him and, uh, and Asoka. Do you really? Yeah. When you get into that trailer that we heard with him talking in the different I think we're going to get into a full I think the whole

episode is just the two of them through different scenarios and whether or not we see other characters throughout time and but I don't think we're I think this is going to be a different we're going to kind of go off the actual storyline not for filler but more so of a new wrinkle in the whole plot yeah what she's gonna have to do and accomplish well it's called the soak of the show so I'd be all down for seeing just her and him it should be because we have haven't and especially we haven't had a moment between them plus we've never seen Anakin and we've never seen live action and Anakin and Asoka together let me ask you this this is a rebels

question because from from the episodes of season one that I did watch of rebels I don't remember Osuka being in the show in rebels yeah she's in a few episodes and she's in a few episodes in rebels no she's in a lot of episodes she's I told you she fought Vader but she wasn't the main crew at the beginning no she shows up at the end of season one hera yeah Ezra canaan and Zeb Those were the five. Yeah. So, yeah, it's, it's because we're, it's tough because everyone's calling Rebel season five or whatever season six, but it's a Soca show and Asoka was a guest star on that show.

So it shouldn't be a rebels. It should be her. So I wonder if, you know, will people be upset that it's going to focus solely on her? I don't think so. I think, not, not if you're bad, no one's going to be upset at that. Who's got the main beef, Asoka and Thrawn or Sabine and Thron? Who's got the bigger beef? Hera and Thron.

So it's Heron and Thron. So that's the big beat. I would say so because Thron is really responsible for the death of Canaan. Okay. So it's. And all of them. They all have a good deal. Okay.

So now knowing what we know, why do you think they call the Asoka instead of? Not even rebels, but like a hint that it's a rebel show and not an Asoka show. What is the what is the impetus for doing that? Well, one, we don't know where it's going to go. Okay. Two, she's a big standalone character that the more popular out of all of them. Okay. That's it.

Three, Rosario Dawson. There you go. So you look at, you're taking story aside and not so much, but like you also got to look at marketing. And the company of Lucasfilm itself. 100% what can sell because especially after you have certain things where it's like we need a show that's going to hit. And I think that, look, what was what you can't argue here is when was the last Star Wars show that had the kind of water cooler moment than this did last night. No, it does.

It had even more so. I know we love it more so than Andor. Andor I didn't really have water cooler moments who just, we were just like, we're on the verge of an awesome Star Wars show. Right. You just, you just marvel,

you just marvel at the writing. And I should say this because I step, I have to step outside and look at the people that are the hardcore Star Wars, like that their lives revolve around Star Wars and talk about it. Like seeing how excited they were. Yeah. That's pretty awesome. It's pretty great.

And I think, look, I was getting text. from people while I was in in I was watching the nun part two when and I'm getting texts of people and and to be fair no spoilers but like Frank Janish what she just writes in capital star wars exclamation point because he was so excited about the the episode itself and it was like okay my brother's like did you watch us hokey yet and I was like what did you have been better if you have gotten those texts at three in the morning instead of a movie when you were watching a movie it ruined the nun for you no I'm just telling you it did it didn't it did no I didn't mind it all and

I also said, okay, now I'm going to go. I made sure what I did was I watched the episode before I checked any social media at all. Well, you're a great guy, aren't you? Yeah, that's right. Seal, pop it up, Seal. The singer? Sure. All right.

Is that what he did at his concerts? I don't know. Anyway, the last one before we go. What do you think happens next episode? We've got to leave it ready? Yeah, we've got to go. It's already time? Almost.

What are you think is next? I have no clue. Where would you see? Okay. So, you're right. I think they're going to do the whole episode will be in the world between worlds

and explaining that and dealing with that because they're just traveling. They're not going to arrive where they need to arrive because all of a sudden then, then you have to go on the journey of where they are located. Right. How close are we to him? That's a whole other episode.

Yeah. So the next, so we're four episodes in. There's four left? Yeah. Eight. Yeah, that's right. Eight.

World Between Worlds Next episode is getting their bearings in this area The crew will be trying to find them Our crew trying to get the hyperspace And that leads to do 7 and 8 is the Theron reveal Yeah so the current I mean so look that's that is a great question as well How are they I think that the world between worlds will be the entire episode Yeah

Maybe at the very end of it you get some get a little bit of where they are landing Because I think that somehow Asoka is going to be able to access where they are through the world between worlds that's going to be a lot of how does she get there otherwise i don't know right but that's going to be a they're going to i mean look philoni could change the entire fabric of star wars with these episodes and the way that it works because there's a lot of things that you could do and there's a lot of ways that you can go with and it's almost like a what if type show in in certain scenarios if you play with it has

the world between worlds is this time travel at all? Kind of. I mean, it's so. So we're going to, might be introducing time travel to Star Wars. Kind of. I mean, if, depending on how it's, it is. It depends on how it's executed because it is kind of time travely because what happens is by the time. When Ezra, this is like a year, two years later after Asoka disappears that he goes into the world between worlds and then he pulls her out and that's how he saved her. So it is time travel, you know, so it's just. nobody had to complain about when they were watching rebels. So the question is, how are they going to explain it?

And it's just a matter of execution, man. That's going to be something. It's going to be something. What did you guys think of the episode, man? Did you like it? Did you not like it? Are you with Mike? Are you with me?

Do you have your own thoughts? What do you say? Make sure you comment. Let us know exactly what you think. Do it below. And make sure you check out Mike Kalinowski on the Twitters and the X, whatever it is. And myself do the same thing. And then once again, people are always asking if you're able to support the show and if you have the means to it, please consider one of our wonderful sponsors here today.

I cannot emphasize how much it helps the show. And you're like, oh, you say that all the time. Is it true? Yeah, it's true. And if you've done it, thank you. If you can do it, please try it. And you will not be sad about doing it. They are awesome.

Rocket money, Rompel, Athletic Greens, AG1, and of course, Green Chef. So thank you to our sponsors. Thank you to Mike and thank you to you guys. We'll see you on the flip side. We'll be back tomorrow with Roxy and Brett on the big thing. See you next time. Hit that button if you haven't done it already. We'll see you next time.

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