The Kristian Harloff Show - Here is how 2025 can get Marvel and the MCU back on track.

Episode Date: March 8, 2024

Become a Patron!: https://www.patreon.com/TheBigThingShow Marvel Studios has faced its share of challenges but Deadpool 3 aka Deadpool and Wolverine comes out this year. With a lineup that includes Captain America 4, The Thunderbolts, Fantastic Four, and Blade all set for release in 2025, the stage is set for a monumental comeback. In this video, we'll explore how these upcoming blockbusters could mark the return of Marvel's golden era. From the potential plot twists to the integration of new characters, we dive deep into what these films need to do to reignite the spark of the Marvel Cinematic Universe. 🎥🌟 We also dive into the comments Zack Snyder made about Batman on the Joe Rogan show. Don't forget to hit the like button if you're excited for Marvel's future and subscribe to Kristian Harloff for more movie reviews, out-of-theater reactions, and the latest in entertainment news. Your support helps us bring you the most up-to-date and insightful content in the world of pop culture. 🔔💬  #marvel #mcu #fantasticfour #blade #deadpool3 #deadpoolandwolverine #zacksnyder #joerogan #batman OUR SPONSORS: ROCKET MONEY: Stop wasting money on things you don't use. Cancel your unwanted subscriptions by going to http://www.RocketMoney.com/BIGTHING VESSI: Elevate your spring wardrobe travel with Vessi's StormBurst shoes. Discover more at http://www.vessi.com/BIGTHING  Get your pair today to get an automatic 15% off your first purchase at checkout and be ready to step out in style, rain or shine! RHONE: Head to http://www.rhone.com/BIGTHING and use promo code BIGTHING to save 20% off your entire order. THIS EPISODE IS SPONSORED BY BETTERHELP: Visit http://www.BetterHelp.com/BIGTHING today to get 10% off your first month. OUTRO OUR MERCH STORE IS LIVE: https://www.teepublic.com/stores/the-... FOLLOW KRISTIAN + FIND HIM ON CAMEO https://cameo.com/kristianharloff https://twitter.com/kristianharloff https://facebook.com/harloff https://instagram.com/kristianharloff AMAZON WISHLIST: https://www.amazon.com/hz/wishlist/ls...

What's going on, everybody? Welcome back. It is Friday. It's the big thing. It's capes and cows. Bob Iger had a big conversation with his shareholders. I mean, he keeps saying that Marvel did too much. It was more about the quantity than it was the quality, the streaming, the movies out of, nothing was really contained.

So the new report is essentially, and he even says it, that. we're going to cut some stuff, and we have cut some stuff, kind of quietly. So we're going to speculate on what we think exactly was cut and whether it was a good move or whether it should be a good move in general. And as you saw in the title of this video, what should Marvel's plan be moving forward? And that is how many movies. That is who. That is the tone in general.

Because there's puzzle pieces are starting to be formed. The question is what's the full puzzle once it's completed? What's it going to look like? Zach Snyder was on Joe Rogan and he talked about a lot of different things. Man, he talked about fandom. He talked about breaking the Batman rule. He talked about a lot of different things. And we'll kind of dive into those comments.

The Flash, was it Grant Gustafon? How do you know? Grant Guston. Close. Grant Justin. Yeah, well, that guy played the Flash and people love him. Still, it's Garsgars Gars, Gusson. That's right.

And you know who else likes Gustafon? James Gunn. And so he's going to talk about the Gustafon being on the DC. Earth 2's Flash, Grant Gustaf. Gustafan.

You want to be a Gustafon? I don't even know Gustafon. It's such a leap from Gustav. Not even close. All right. So Gustafan will be in seven new Flash has been cast. It's Great Gustavon. It's just great with a mustache.

This just said, Grant Gustafon is now running DC Studios. That's right. And season five of Invincible just came out, and I've watched all of them. So that and more on capes and cows. So if you're brand new to the channel, hit that subscribe button. You get more factual information like the ones I just gave. Hit the button, do all you got to do.

Let's get into it. It's capes and cows. I'm ready, and so are you. Here we go. Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen, to capes and cows. It's myself, Grant Gustafon, Winston A. Marshall. And you don't understand my my junior year prom date Her last name was Gustafson

So when you said I had a full like what the Yeah She like and the funny thing was Her dad was trying to do that like that like thing that dad's love to do Where they're like oh you better have her home And like why did this man have when I showed up was sitting in a chair with a shotgun. He had written my name on the shotgun shell. And I'm like, oh, you don't understand how, like, I get you just doing the dad thing, but

there is a really weird implication of an older white man sitting there with a shotgun when a black dude walks into his house being like, so you're Winston. What state was this in? In Texas. Oh, yeah. He said it like. He like held that part back. He was like, he was in Texas.

Yeah, he's like, yeah. Yeah, that's kind of like handy that at this border, don't they? Wow. Can you believe it? In fact, surprise, you were surprised. That's what I'm saying. So, Grand Custafone back on the show next week. Anyway, listen to me.

The other thing I wanted to bring up, I wanted to give a big thanks to Paul Jarman because you see that new screen in the back. He did that bad boy. And I obviously thanks to Diesel Time, who did our old one and does amazing stuff for us and props obviously to Wicked Art who does the opening. But he sent that, and I was like, yeah, I kind of really love that. And the back of it pops. So I'm going to put that.

And I love the other ones, too. But I think it was a little change. I like that one. Yeah. No, it's pretty amazing. All right, guys. Let's get into this first thing with the Bob Iger. Here we go.

All right, Bobby. What's he say? Disney CEO, Bob Iger discusses Marvel Fatigue. Now, I talked about this yesterday. So I'm not going to read the whole report again, or the other day, rather. But Eiger was talking to, he was a speaker at Morgan Stanley Technology, and he talked about what was going down. And he said that you got to kill things that you no longer believe in and that it's not easy in this business because either you've gotten started, you've sunk some costs, or it's a relationship with either your employees or with creative community. And he said, it's not an easy thing, but you've got to make the tough calls.

We've actually made those tough calls, and we've not been public about it, but we've killed a few projects already that we didn't feel strong. Now, on Disney, when it comes to Marvel, because they also did Star Wars stuff, but we're going to cover the Marvel stuff. On Disney, they have Ironheart, Wonder Man, Eyes of Wakanda, Marvel Zombies, Your Friendly Neighborhood, Spider-Man. And there's no update on Vision Quest, and Nova is another one. So none of these that have dates yet. And then you've got the films, which is Shang-chi 2 or Armor Wars. So you haven't heard about either of those. Those are the titles.

So we're going to start with this. That out of all those, let's talk about the projects that we don't think you're going to happen. I'm going to give you my thoughts of what I don't think is going to happen. And then you guys say, yes or no. And I'll tell you, I said this the other day and I stand by it. Agatha is very lucky that this. That is afterward. Because that would have been scrapped.

I think Ironheart is gone. I think even though the shot stuff, I think Ironheart is gone. I think Wonder Man is toast. I think Issa Wakanda will stay. I think Marvel Zombies is toast I think your friendly neighborhood Spider-Man stays I think Vision Quest Maybe

Nova's toast Shunchi Chu will happen And Armour's toast But Ironheart could still stick around Because they shot stuff for it And they had like a full trailer At D203 Two years ago

Two years ago But it's been backed up And Not bad for Dominique man She was like grown now Yeah and it's also And the thing is too That that character did not pop the way

That they wanted her to In that movie The trailer popped, though. That was crazy. I remember loving that trailer. That was one of the highlights of the D23 presentation for me. I remember thinking to myself.

But that hasn't come out at all, right? No. No, no, people in that room have seen it. I remember seeing it saying, I don't know anything about her yet. I don't know if I, they're going to introduce her in Black Panther 2, and I'll see if I love her. And I didn't. I thought she was, I was like, she's fine. It was like, this is clearly a setup to a TV show.

And this was one of the things that Marvel was doing in general was that they were like, oh, yeah, we got a new show. We've got to set this pressure on this. But it's like, let people earn stuff before you give them TV shows. The weirdest thing about the Wakanda Forever appearance to me wasn't that she felt like she got forced into it. Because I thought narratively it worked at points, not all points, but at points, was that she was screen testing with Chadwick Bowesman. So she had been a part of that different version. So I'm really curious what role she would have played because more and more we hear that the Chadwick version would have been him mourning a loss of time, which makes it so sad.

Like the plot of the movie being so, you know, prophetic to lose. losing Chadwick in its own way. Like instead of us, instead of Chadwick losing time because of the blip, we lost time with Chadwick. And there's something really like sad about that. And I feel like that's the only way that Ryan Coogler could come to terms that was making the movie he made.

Oh, sure. So I'm really curious what her role would have been as a, as a mentee. Do you know what I mean? Like I don't disagree with any of that. The problem is, unfortunately, that's just didn't happen. Didn't happen. Yeah. And now as Bob,

because Bob Eager's comments from what, everything that he said about projects, I think they're making the right calls here that you've got to focus on certain things. Now, we'll get into what we think they should focus on. I'm a baby on Ironheart. I think Ironheart might survive just because of the volume. So yeah, before we throw it a winter real quick.

Tell me what you. Tell me what you think. I think Ironheart makes it, but it's more like a 60-40, and that's mainly due to I've got some bias and I really like that trailer. Wonder Man, I unfortunately don't think makes it as much as I love, yeah, yeah. That was plagued with the strike and also it was one of the really messier titles, comedy and those elements. Eyes of Wakanda, I think, makes it because they did announce a lot of stuff recently,

and Wakanda Forever did exceptionally well, and it's a beautiful property. Marvel Zombies, I think, has an audience, but it's not me. So I'm going to say no, but it's kind of the opposite of my Iron Heart. But if you're Bob Iger, this is the question. If you're Bob Iger and you're cutting stuff, I mean, yeah, but the question is, like, right now, what's the, what's pushing Marvel forward? Because that's what he brought. It's like, you can't just say, well, zombies are popular.

did dump what if. Like not, Gall and eyes in, like they just put it out. Remember like, what if came out and it was like, here it is. And we're like,

that's what I mean. So that's why I don't, I think they're going to, they're focusing on big IPs that they think can pop TV and. Spider-Man's the biggest IP they have. Yeah. So I think that exists.

Vision Quest as recently as two weeks ago or three weeks ago, Paul Bettney was talking about it. So I feel like that is a maybe, I'm going to go 50-50 on Vision Quest. I think Nova's dead, which is unfortunate. And then I, I personally think both,

Zhang Chi 2 and Armourers make it, but I think they call Armourers Iron Man for. Interesting. Okay, but you're not really, you haven't cut much, and... I cut Wonder Man, I cut zombies, and I'm maybe on Vision Quest. Right, so two. I think the things that are cut aren't announced yet. I think they had a lot more in the slate that won't get announced. I think they killed projects that they already had working.

Winston, what do you think? Okay, let me see the list. So I actually think that Ironheart and Armor Wars are going to get fused. I think that that... Together? I think that they're close enough in... in what your core hero is, and then you can have a situation of re-re now.

But wait, when you say that, though. It's a TV or movie? It's going to repurchase the TV, because they already shot all the stuff for TV. Well, and I, and I, so then I'm even curious in that regard, because, I mean, you're using all the same equipment and stuff. It's really just how you're going about telling whatever said story. So I wouldn't be surprised if maybe what they end up doing is

you don't use the full Ironheart show, maybe the way you did if you don't use the footage. But maybe it's like, we're going to take it, it was going to be eight episodes. It's now going to be a three-episode, like, mini-series to lead into Armor Wars as, like, a type of situation, and you just kind of compound it and make it a, you know, that type of situation. Because they already changed Armour Wars from TV to film. Right.

They just did that with Moana. And they, right. And they also said that Riri would have a place in Armor Wars anyway. It would be a, it would be a war machine-based film, but Rie-we would be a part of it. So like I wouldn't be surprised if they do some sort of thing with the two of them. Wonder Man's gone. Eyes of Wakanda and Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man. We talked about this when we went to the what-if thing.

They did a trailer. Those are coming out. I think that that's, we just haven't heard the date yet. It'll happen. Zombies, I don't think happens. Nova's definitely not happening. Shang-chi, too, as successful as it was, I think it truly depends on how long it takes for Simu to get better because he dealt with that ACL tear.

And so like obviously that will happen over time But he's probably got other projects lined up in the pipeline and stuff like that so that will like doesn't mean that the character's going to disappear But like whether or not you do that second film That might get pushed out for a long time And then other than that yeah our vision quest I know Paul Bettney just talked about it I don't know if vision quest is gonna necessarily happen Yeah I don't feel super strong about it I mean there's a lot of I mean You know McGregor was talking about Obi-1 too and how badly he wanted to do it that's not happening

And so I just think that if they're going to cut stuff down and they might, and you might be right also, Coy, that there's other things that they were like, well, this is coming along. We're going to do this. And then things we don't even know about and they just, they just gutted it because it wasn't coming along. The other things Mike brought up, he doesn't think Blade's going to happen. And I said, they're too far along in the process with this now. And if they scrap it now. It's what's been such a vocal people wanting it. But also we're in that very specific bubble of the internet where I don't know what the average person.

Like we always talk about it. Yeah. Like people that are like, clans. clamoring for this stuff, I've been clamoring, but I don't know if the average person even heard about it. That's true. It's a good point. Very good point that you could. But I think that there, I still, even because there is clamoring for it in the certain circles and people who want it and because they want to work with rehearsal. And they want to work with low budget. Yes. I think it's you don't cut the low budget potential new genre. Yeah. And so the other thing is that Bob Eiger was talking about and this is kind of moving us forward into this conversation plus what this conversation and what the title of this video is all about is, is moving Marvel forward

to get back to that place that they were in. And that is just, here's a big movie, there's the quality of the movie, and now there's the big budget and the big payback that comes with it because you put out some quality. And he said, what we've been saying, and that said, Deadpool is going to be that first one. Deadpool is going to be the one. Now, what they don't want to do, though, because they have not had a movie. I already know the answer what you're going to say, and I already know the retort.

They have not had a, what's the last movie that they had in the MCU that really delivered on, on box office and critical and fans? Guardians, Third. But it didn't tie into any of this stuff in the multiverse. It was, and we've talked about it many times over, that that movie is essentially the third movie of a great trilogy, but it doesn't, but it, nothing else. Yeah.

But it doesn't, but not, not to push the story forward, but it's tied to it. Sure, but I'm talking about like what, overall, the multiverse of what they're trying to do. So you're saying what was the last multiversal film that has tied in that was successful? Yeah. And you can say Dr. Strange and those things too. Wakanda forever or you could say Dr. Strange, even though. But I'm not so much to spot. If you said all three, then multiverse didn't.

But then I would say either Wakanda or no way home. Yeah, but even, yeah, right, no way home. No way home I think is the answer because Wakanda was still like because of everything that went down you're like everyone had the same answer It's like for what they had to deal with and what they had to endure They did it Loki but that's not a movie right That's a TV show I would agree with you but movie So it's and but you have to like but you have to go through your mind going oh that and what he wants to do is go boom boom boom boom It all ties again so Deadpool is the first one you gonna say one son

Just in the sense that I understand what he's saying. There used to be something specifically about MCU, like, properties period, mainly films. That if you talked about it, they were, like, revered. Like, there were occasional bad ones here and there, but it wasn't, like, consistently, and, like, people couldn't decide on it. Like, universally, everybody was like, oh, yeah, that Gardner's movie, that was dope. Oh, yeah. Winter Soldier, that was incredible. Oh, yeah.

Like, Thorough Dark World, it's not my favorite. More hits than misses for sure. Yeah. And so. And I think he's over it. And I think he now wants to make sure. Like he's he, because he talked about Deadpool and Wolverine and said it's going to be,

he believes it's going to be one of the more successful Marvel movies that they've had in a long time. I agree. And I think it's also going to, if they can do and capture the same kind of magic that No Way Home did. And you got two big movie stores at Ryan Reynolds and Hugh Jackman kind of leading the way with that one. You got a lot of the other,

the cameo porn, as they say, we'll be there, but it's going to be relevant to the thing in general. And then Deadpool is not The big question, though It's a big question But it's not the big question

The big question is What does the next movie That comes after it? How does that do? And that's what? Thunderbolts? As of now? As of now, it's Thunderbolts, right?

Now Thunderbolts That's before Captain America? I think so. I think Cap got moved Because all the reshoots They'd like months of reshoots No, no, I know But isn't Thunderbol's

just starting filming so in which case wouldn't Cap be done quicker? So Captain America is actually February, as Winston said, and then Thunderbolts is then in May, so. Which honestly, like, makes sense. And if you think about it, both A, because we've shot more of Captain America, you're doing reshoots.

So that's a lot quicker than Florence Pew has just reported to set, which was like a story a couple days ago. But then also B, with this idea that people are genuinely using February, not only as like the beginning of putting major films out, but we've seen for a lot of these past few years, like a major black film come out there and knowing that Sam Wilson is obviously the lead of this film. That also makes kind of sense.

You're doing like what you did with Black Panther the first time around. February. And trying to use that Black History Month, like, you know, and hope that you can pull the audience to show up for that. Absolutely. And I think right now they have Blade slated for November 7th.

Yeah, next year, theoretically be a three Marvel film year. So, yeah. And technically, you know, if you're looking at, it's not that far from July to February. Like Deadpool, you know, to cap is not that big. Not enough to where like, like, Dune 2 and then King Kong Godzilla, same studio, cannibalizing each other.

Right. It's not that. It's not at all. And I like a seven month. Like it'll feel like it used to where it's like, okay, we got time to recover. We can talk about the film. We can be excited. And then March, April, May, it's like three months between.

From July? July, August, September, November, January, February. What's in July? What's in July? May is. Deadpool. Deadpool. The July.

up until next February. I'm saying the gap between 2024 to 225. Yeah, seven months. I'm saying the next thing to the following thing isn't that long. That's right. That's right. It's not. And then the three in a row is like,

right, it's February and then you've got from February in 2025. Then you've got May. Then you've got until November, which you get a little bit of a break, if they stick to the, if Blade winds up happening. That's why I don't think Blade's going to get canceled.

I think Blade is going to happen. But three of them. Now, if this is where it comes, this is where I said the big question. If Marvel delivers on Deadpool and then people will go, okay, as Koi said, you got seven months to get excited. And then they can, now, Captain America,

the new one has gone through a bunch of different rewrites now, and they want to get this thing solid. Now, if they get this thing solid and it delivers in February, like, whoa, they pulled it off and then two in a row, then you start cooking. Yeah, and then you go right into a team movie, and it's got, you know, the buzz isn't high, but it does have David Harbor and known properties that people like. Like it may be not, you know, the biggest names,

but it does have a winner soldier. Has Harrison Ford in it? He's in Thunder. No, no, no, no. He's in Captain America. You're mixing stuff. Captain America is Harrison Ford unless he's going to pop up in Thunderballs.

I think he does. He probably will because Red Hulk a lot of times has been known to associate me with them. I think the gap in that poster is Red Hulk. Like visually. I can see that. I can sort of. But that's a great point, though,

because what that does now is that my earlier point, that's a through line. And if they continue, like, okay, because I haven't been telling that, why you got so, excited for Marvel films. Like, yes, you watch the standalone story and then there's something that just kind of just a little sprinkle to tie it into the next

one. And if they do that... I could even see, because if we remember now some of the connections that were already happening, so if you look at the fact that if you go all the way back to Falcon and Winter Soldier, that's where you're getting Jewel Louis Dreyfus,

Valentina, she goes and gets you as an agent who's in the Thunderbolts and all that. You can very easily, so again, That was Sam tied into that. You have his film, Red Hulk, as far as that goes, something must go wrong. And then that's an instance of her being like, and now we're activating the Thunderbolts and you go right into that. Well, then you've got your like, we've got a street level, not giant, you know, like the Winter Soldier is not as big a film as an Avengers film.

And I think the problem has been, there's only been big, big, big, big, big films. Like Thunderbolts is going to be the big version of the street level film, but it's not multiverse of madness. It's not, you know, love and thunder. It's going to be the big version of espionage. So I think it's smart to go back to a contained cap four contained being, you know, now $200 million. But, you know, use that cap four to go into your team version of that movie of Thunderbolt. And then your first movie after those two, boom, new genre with horror, with blade, with smaller budget. So I think it looks great going from giant spectacle film Deadpool into a sequel known property, lean into that.

And then the big version of that, Thunderbolt, and then you pivot into horror. Well, this is what I'm saying. This is like, this is there. When people say, wow, Marvel's toast. No, look, Marvel's had some missteps. and it's sloppy right now, but... I'm here with you. But the thing is, when you have Deadpool,

which pretty much will deliver, you think you will, and then if they can get... Now, it's not going to be an easy task, but if Captain America delivers and then Thunderbolts delivers and then Blade delivers all in one year, well, then people are going to be like, Marbles back, baby.

And people love saying that. Express. People are like, oh, we're so back, like that people love to say. So I think that'll help. Yeah. If you have it's like it's like anything sports analogy here you go you win if you if you're losing games and then your team wins three in a row You're like whoa. Okay. They're starting to play better now and that's that's ultimately what could happen and they only need to change the narrative of the people that talk about it like we do that's the narrative they need to focus on because at the end of the day

Three of the top ten world-eyed box office of last year were superhero films so it's not like people aren't showing up They're just not showing up in the same way and they need to change the narrative as much as they need to change the box office They need to be more consistent I just think that you know I mean everybody in the comments will be like, oh, quite a shilling for Marvel. But if you look at the world, the people are still going when they're good. People are still showing up. And Iger says as much in those comments. So as long as you get the narrative back, then you're in a good spot.

I think the narrative is just difficult because you're coming from a deficit. Absolutely. I mean, and it's not, and what doesn't help Marvel in this case is that every superhero thing has been in the bed, more or less. And so when everything outside of, like, say, the boys and Gen V, you know, pretty much is just not doing well. I mean, they're doing well, they're just not. It just depends. So like the Spider-Verse films, the Batman, Joker was a little further back because that was pre-pandemic, wasn't it? Multiverse made like $900 million.

It did, but what do Christians say? He said, critically received, audience received, and box office. That's what I'm saying, though, is you only need to fix the critical narrative in order to get back to good graces because you've already got the audience more or less there. Critics are never going to matter to comic book movies. It's fans. You know, we missed in 2025, by the way. Fantastic 4, which is July.

That is coming out, 2025. So they're getting four movies. That's four movies. That seems like too much. It's a lot. I think Blade will move. Look, don't get me wrong. If it's all going to slap, I'll give me as many as you want.

But I think when you're on the recovery, stop trying to. Yeah, but here's a problem. Here's a problem, though. You got to remember, the only reason I'm giving them a pass on four movies in a year is because they're doing one this year. The strike. The strike they were supposed to have Thunderbolts was supposed to be this year. Well, Wade was supposed to be this year.

Fantastic Four supposed to spend in 2020. Because I was like, yay, 224. And I'll be honest. I think that's the other thing that we're only now starting to truly understand how much the pandemic screwed up other things in life. So like the number of kids that are messed up from like not having that year of socializing and whatnot.

I know as a parent, you know. We're not also realizing how much this schedule mess around screwed up Marvel as well because the simple fact that you had this is the story we're going to tell on this order and then it's like uh-oh everything's gonna shut the okay we'll move this here because it's kind of done and move this over here and then you all have a year or two and then the strike

and then this oh shit okay wait okay well then we need to reshoot the and so moving that around and the Jonathan majors of it all yeah oh and no other studio had those level of forethought for 10 years you don't hear other studios like Universal probably had a map for the next five

years, but it's not like them moving stuff affected them as much because this is a puzzle. Because they're not connected. Exactly. You just tried to MacGyver a jigsaw puzzle. So now let's jump back. So now you've got, it's the same thing, but I don't disagree that four is a lot. And it's because the reason why it's a lot is because it's that old argument that I used to have on Jedi

counts all the time. And as I used to say, if they do it right, two movies for Star Wars could work. And then last Jedi and Solo comes out within the, around the same time. You're like, see, it doesn't work. It doesn't work when it's so divisive. But then you go back and you look at what Marvel did. And when Marvel was hitting with two or three movies and nobody cared because you were

excited to see the next one. But the problem is that Marvel's in a spot right now that you're like, okay, this is risky. And so seven months in between Deadpool. Yeah. Then, so let's do it again. Then you get Captain America in February. Okay, March, April, May, three months later.

You did, no, Captain America. Yeah, Thunderbolt. And then only two months. Two months later. Until a brand new franchise, but that's one of the most marketable. 100%. So, but only months. At the moment.

Yeah. Because then, then you get blade. They need to change their strategy to be, I understand that the summer is like the block, make it one a quarter. You're trying to shove so many into, you need this. February, May is, is second quarter, isn't it? Yeah, but it doesn't matter, though? You know why they're doing all this and have to put it out in 2024, right?

Because of 2025, because of that behind? Because Avengers comes out in 2025. Conceptually. In 2026. Yeah. 2025 is the four movies. 2026 is Avengers. And so you now have to get those four movies to tell your narrative to get to May of 2026.

And there's another Marvel movie that's supposed to come out in February, which is untitled at the moment. So that's the reason what you were just saying before, Winston. Push Blade to February because that again you're then tapping into a set before you either that there's two Blade is going to do well on its own if it's a good movie, but there's two things that ties to either horror or honestly because Blade is a black character. You're going to again be able to tap that audience. What's the February movie that's supposed to come out now is an untitled February movie? What is that? I think it was supposed to be Spider-Man.

Right. In which case you don't need it then. In which case you move it to summer. It's Spider-Man. But then that's before Secret-Rexam. Unless the end of Spider-Man. sets up Secret Wars, which I think it was. If it sets up, then you have a problem.

That's what I'm saying. Then you have a problem. Also, you guys just said it before. I mean, how does Blade come out November 7th when we finally have Halloween in a Friday? That's awesome. Moving a week. Moving of a week. It's right there.

Because this box office numbers traditionally have just been stronger in November than But not November 7th? Like, it's usually going to mean like, no. But I understand. Moving up all week. I understand what he's saying in the sense that like, yes, in theory, but people do so much stuff with Halloween already. And if Blade is going to potentially be R.

But if you have a four day weekend and you have an actual Friday Halloween and like you're not like four day weekend, I give it off. But if you have a Thursday through Sunday box office. I get it. But you got to remember obviously adults celebrate Halloween. We all get costumes and all that stuff. But like with kids and stuff, again, if it's an R rated film, if that's what they're going to end up doing with it, then you're running that risk of like, let's not.

Right now, right now, you've got for Halloween during that week, I guess the, right, that's This year. We're looking at it. We need next year. This is 2024, right? So we need 2025. So Halloween of 2025, this is what you've got coming up.

You've, I mean, there's nothing. Nothing right now. There's a Blumhouse event film. A Blumhouse event film. But the Batman trusts October 3rd. They can do Blade right after.

Go from the Batman. I think that's why they have November. I think the week later. I'm just saying people are tired of Halloween by November. Yeah, I know. I don't know. So, but it really goes back to that point that you guys made, though.

And that is that because of the, the narrative of getting to unless they move Avengers. If they move Avengers to 2027? Right. But if they move Avengers to 2027, then you can start. Christmas Avengers. Yeah, but what, when?

Because then you're fighting then you're fighting Avatar. And then in 2026 you're fighting Star Wars. You can, here's the thing. Oh no, we own everything. I actually think, I actually, but that's the thing. I don't think you could literally make a Barbenheimer situation.

Avatar and Avengers wouldn't eat each other like that. But there'd be no fun name because they're both avids. I feel like both people, I don't know. I literally think people would do the Barbenheimer thing and they would go and see both. I don't think that. But the Barbenheimer thing is different. Barbenheimer is Warner Brothers making money and then Universal making money the same time. This is, again, why I think it's ridiculous that you've got Kong and Godzilla going up against Dune in the same.

Yeah, it's foolish. Yeah. No, I guess it's what I'm saying is there was plenty of pie to go around. Barbie made 1.4 and Oppenheimer made like 900. You don't cannibalize your own movie, your big IP movie, especially if you Especially we're trying to come back from a loss like Marvel's narrative. If you walk into the middle tell Bob Iger, hey, let's put out the Avengers the same weekend avatar. He's going to go putting your rest.

You're fired. Somewhere else. But I didn't even say same weekend because I know that that was what happened with Barberheimer. But I'm saying that month, it's not that crowded in that you could put one at the start of the month and one closer to Christmas. I mean, that's a different conversation. But I mean, again, it's a matter of when people. People are really seeing these things. I think keeping it in May is the way to go because you look at the kind of money that

Endgame did in April May. That is one-a-quarter. February's first quarter, May's second quarter. But they are in a spot now because of the shared universe. They are in a spot now where they have to get all these things out in order to tell their story that they want to tell. I think that, unfortunately, Blade is the only one that they probably could say maybe we scrap it.

maybe we just, you know, use Mahershal Ali for something else and we scrap it and then we bring a new blade in after we finish the multiverse because it doesn't tie in as much or very well could. I don't know. And because it also makes sense to this going back to our beginning conversation now, now it answers a little bit more questions, right? Shang Chi, where the hell's that fit at all? He would have had to have been after secret, like especially at the time the director was going to do both. Maybe it wasn't Spider-Man. Maybe it was Shung-Chi. That's what I was thinking.

In February. So, Shung-Chi is potential that it could, but it also gets rid of armor wars anywhere near. Where are you going to put armor wars? Between Avengers, no. Nah. Where are you going to put that? Unless that's February. There's another Avengers movie in 2020.

Like, off-Winston's idea, basically. In February, you have cap four, and then you have armor wars the following year. Because if you do that, because you do armor wars, and especially if that's cheed-again, I know, some people are going to be like, why you always make a black thing? But, like, I'm telling you. In February. When you get out. us, Black Panther.

It has, they've genuinely been like, and it's a smart move. Also, cap four than Iron Man four. I like the synchronicity. Like if you've got your big IP on their fourth installment coming out two Februarys in a row leading up to Avengers. Yeah. I think that shows formatting versus like,

that shows chaos right now. So you guys, put your comments in there, man, like all this conversation that we had right now. Where does it go? What happens? When do the shows? Oh, the shows is another question too. Oh, actually I'm,

glad that before we screwed on, I'm glad that you said that. Because there's another report that a little while ago that said that they were going to focus more so on the street level shows now. Brilliant move. Giacchino is rumored for Midnight Sons. It hasn't been as firmly confirmed, but that is the Avengers of the street level. It's the supernatural stuff. It's ghost rider, it's punisher, it's blade.

It's anything that feels occulty, but as a team that's like more, yeah, it's like a darker. And so Giacchino, who made gold out of, you know, Wolfman. Yeah. Yeah, I think it was just like completely universal monster did I was like this is completely wrong world by night I knew I was wrong I knew it I paused so heavily because I was like why am I glishing Whereolf by night did so much especially with how they made everything look in the occult flavor If you bring in Ghost Rider if you can do it the red budget if you bring in Punisher and you have them trancher out of daredevil into something like that

Gia Chino I think is the guy so I think they should do street level Netflix shows leading to a team up But instead of defenders it's Giacino's midnight suns. That's the rumor Yeah. No, I mean, Midnight's done. Midnight Sons, yeah, just that supernatural team, I think that that would be, again, you're right, bringing in that darker element works. We've already seen you brought up Werewolf by Night and how successful that was. So there is definitely, but the problem is you need Blade. You've been, so many iterations of Midnight Sons have Bladed. But interest in the movie and then.

I get it, but when you did, I thought you're talking about Midnight Sons potentially happening, not next year. talking about. I'm saying they should have Agatha this year Halloween. They should have midnight sends next. Like 2020. But Blade has to happen first, I think. Yeah, no, no. That would be the following year. Well, we'd have to put it into production. 2026. But Blade is right now set for November 25.

So I'm saying you cannot release Midnight Suns before you have Blade out there. Yeah. I'm saying like October 26. Right. That's a whole like week or so. I'm saying, yeah, yeah. I thought you meant the actual date. No, no, no, no. I'm saying, 2025. October 26, 20, 24.

Winston. Coe's like, yeah, right, like right afterwards. And Winston's like, no, no, no, but he's got to come out first. Yeah, but like right afterwards. You know, the next year. The next year. Who's not first, Winston? Who's not first?

October 26. Like, I have a very, I'm tired of that date. I'm very specific and asking him out. You kept going on about October 31st. The next year. So I'm like, he's picking an actual day. Okay. So October 26th.

I was like, why is to October 26? Right. Five days later, Blade comes out. Right. Next year. It's very important to me. Right, next year. So, but I will say that I think that it makes a lot of sense to go to street level for sure.

Yeah, because it's, and it's, you know, when you look at, we just watch the trailer for Fallout, right? And you look at something like Last of Us and then you jump to the movie side of it and you look at something like doone. It's like Marvel, because they've had all this success and it just, it's because it almost seems like they've gotten, in Star Wars too, like they've gotten lazy with how they, the quality of it. Like being able, and you don't have to make it as like serious and, you know, that kind of weight of Dune or Game of Thrones, right? But you can make it feel important.

Important. You can make it feel like, you know, when you look at these shows, the latest Marvel shows, they look like, oh, we're trying to cut costs here, or it looks like they didn't really put a lot into the writing. And it's like, no, you know,

if you scale back and you do one show, two shows, and you can get like a Netflix type of Daredevil show, Or Star Wars, whatever, that's what you should be aiming for. I mean, I'll be honest with you. The other thing that people don't take it in consideration as to why some of these projects have not done as well as they have. So part of the thing that was being fought over during the strike was the WGA being like, you need to stop with these mini-room BS type situations where it's like, okay, we'll bring it.

Like Winston, you're going to write Blade if Blade was a TV show, right? And you're going to get Koi and Christian, they'll be able to help you for just the opening part, but then you're writing the entire show by yourself. The problem with that, especially as a TV show, that is meant to have a team to work all that out and massage all that out, instead of just having the one writer essentially do all of it. Now, it doesn't mean that you can't do that, but like, that tends to be more of a movie scope. And if you're going to, that's not what this is. You need a team to do that. So hopefully that fixes the problem with the strike now that you've set up the minimums for room.

It's true. And I also think one of the funniest things happens in movies also. and I will say that Koi and I had this conversation. I think like, and I talk to Koi about this, I think we were doing it. We did our version that never aired, right? But we were talking about how you, because a lot of times, and it's not just you,

but people will always say, depending on who the director is, well, it was studio interference. And studio interference, that's the reason why this movie didn't work. And I say sometimes you've got to be able to blame the director too. But Madam Webb, if you listen to Dakota Johnson, which was where the conference was where the conference, conversation came from. And I was saying that St. Clarkson did great stuff on Jessica Jones. And I was like, I don't know how this happened. I still think that it's directed poorly. Oh, yeah, but I, but I think that you

clearly from what Dakota Johnson is saying, that is not the movie that she signed on for. There was tons of studio interference. And you can't, she said, I think it should be handled by a writer, by a director, and there we go. That's to me what film is. I don't disagree with her. Yeah, well, again, I get that it's show business. But remember the show part, that the most important part is your delight. You're just finding a way to like sell it and make money off of it. So if the art don't it ain't artin Yeah. It's not gonna work like and so that I I completely agree with Dakota Let the team do what they need to do unless you have something that so blatantly is against what goes against what you do as a studio You need to let the artist do what she said in with she there was like meetings and you could see this happening

We've seen it happen in our business while the algorithm says this Oh, the conversation of this and well TikTokers interview and we pulled this and we did this and we did that and we did that and what we think that the audience of this demographic wants, it's like, trust the story. Trust the story. And it looks like from the comments, what Iger is saying, he mentioned like Oppenheimer. You know, he mentioned like there are certain movies you can do that people are like engaged in and these.

And I hope that that strategy sticks. I really do. And I hope that the strategy of just really focusing in on characters and good stories prevails. And then we say, because back to the point, if Captain America crushes, Thunderbolts crushes, Fantastic Four crushes, Blade crushes, Marvel's going to be in great shape going into 2026 for Avengers. The one benefit of there being potentially four is if Captain America crushes and if Thunderbolts doesn't, it's only two months later until Fantastic Four. Right. And that's a very highly anticipated. Do you know what I mean?

like I think the two months between those two is allowing Thunderbolts to like, yeah, now here's devil's advocate. Let's say Deadpool does well, really well, and then Captain America doesn't hit, and then Thunderbolts doesn't hit, and Fantastic Fort does,

and Blade doesn't. Ouch. Secret Wars, blow it up. Star over. I mean, you were essentially at this point, you are doubling down on every bet. You are like,

we're so in the hole, I gotta get back. So it's like, you know what? Fine. Split it. Split that two. Split all those and just see what happens. But I'm with you. If they have four, you can, you can miss, you don't have to hit with all four if you have four. You can miss one. That's why I'm saying Thunderbolts being where it is, because that's the only one I'm worried about for the audience. Yeah, but you can miss, but you can miss with one.

You can miss, well, you can miss with one, but they can only be one of two. Yes. I think you can miss Thunderbolts or Captain America. Right. You can't miss with Fantastic Four and you can't miss with Deadpool. No. Oh, I thought the four you were including was Blade in there. We're just saying Deadpool is its own.

Yeah, well, I think Deadpool, I mean, we're counting on. Since we really don't know Blade, you're talking about those four. Yeah, I'm talking about those four. Okay. Because if you get to Blade and anything is, like, you, by the time you get to Blade, it's like you're going to know if if those movies all hit and then Blade doesn't do well at that point, it's like, okay, that sucks. They had so many problems.

It sucks that they had all those movies. but they've set up enough. And we made it for half the budget. I guess I'll tell you, though, that the Lord knows that this is one of those weird things. This is, I'll bring it back to a sports analogy. You had a situation way back when Tony Romo first became quarterback for the Cowboys where it's like, all right, they just need to make this field goal and then need to hold them for like 60 seconds.

We'll have this play. We might have to do it on whatever, right? He fumbled the field goal. So if somehow Deadpool doesn't do it, this might be a wrap. Oh, we talked about that many times on this show. That's a great point to bring up again. And to reiterate it, we've talked about it many times and to echo what you just said.

If Deadpool bombs, it's over. It's over. It's over. It's so much stuff. It's over. Because that is your layup. That is your field goal. That is the sure thing.

It's your whole narrative. On top of that, too. And it's a bankable character that, if it doesn't do well, shows you where the audience is. And that has succeeded twice already as an R-rated film. Right. And you're adding Wolverine. Like you're literally, this is your, now.

You talk about varsity players. You're like your team. You're bringing your all-stars out. Now, the chances of it bombing are pretty slim. Very slim. This is the highest viewed trailer like of all time. People loved the trailer. People love the character.

People are excited to get some more than back. So the chance of it bombing, you don't want to put that bet in Vegas. Now, making, you know, a billion dollars, that's the bet that I've got. I've got it with Roka. I've got it's got to make at least $750. Roka's trying to change this bet 8 times. What's he saying?

No, he's, first of all, we made a bet on, thank God it was on air. And I said, he said, he wouldn't, I suddenly make a billion

and he said he didn't even think it would make 650. I said, I'll give you 7.50. That's how confident I'm, at least because the other two movies have made 760. He thinks it's only going to make 6.

I think he thinks more now, but like in that comment, that's what he said. And then we had talked about one point that I didn't think June was going to make $100. million for the weekend, right? And I didn't think it would cross a billion.

We talked about it, but we didn't make a bet on that. So he writes me a text. He's like, looks like I'm picking out my steak dinner now. I'm like, did Deadpool come out? He's like, no, dude. I go, what the hell are you talking? We didn't make bet on June? He's like, yeah, we did.

I said, I wouldn't have bet on that because I want Dune to make a billion dollars. And I want it to do. So then someone in the audience gave me the time code for the actual video. And I go, take a look. Like you literally said, because he's like, no, I said it would make a billion. And I said, no, you didn't. You said it wouldn't even make $6.50. He said, our bet is for a billion dollars.

He said, our bet's for $7.50 because I gave me an extra $100. And then he's like, oh, okay. So because it's on. And Kalanowski's another rat. It's like, we got a bet. And he said, he like, yeah, they're the worst. When it comes to bets, the worst. But anyway, okay.

Tons that we talked about. Tons. You didn't even get to any other stories because we talked about this so much. Give your thoughts on all of it. Make it a debate. make it a conversation. That's what we want to do here. Because the more you put the comments in there,

the more we get a chance to answer you back. If you insult, Coy, he'll definitely write you back. See you there, message board. I've been so good. It's been months. You happen. You've been good. But no, for real.

Put your comments in there and we'll have a conversation with you about it. And I'll tell you what. Let's get to our good friends over at BetterHelp and Rocket Money. Here you go. All right, guys, this episode is brought to you by Better Help. So Better Help. I've been telling you guys about Better Help for a while now. We've had a lot of people that they've been helped out by. So this is why the big thing is sponsored by Better Help, because what's the first thing you need to do? If you had an extra hour in your day, would you go for a run? Would you take a nap? Would you read a book? Would you show up for a friend? Well, the problem is a lot of us spend our lives wishing that we had more time. The question is time for what. If time was unlimited, how would you use it? The best way to squeeze that special thing into your schedule is to know what's important to you and make it a priority. Therapy can help you find what matters to you so you can do more of it.

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Thanks to Skyrizzi, there's nothing on my skin. And that means everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizzi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasisis. Visit skyrizzi.com or call 1-866 Skyrizzi to learn more. I'm proud of Koi because I actually saw him on Twitter the other day. Someone tried to come for him for like liking something. And he did go after the kid, but then right after it was like, he would be like,

hey, your podcast is trash. But best of luck, God bless. I was like, not you, not you beat me in his ass and going, God bless. He went, he like, carefully structured that tweet too. He's like, you're a 40-year-old doing a podcast. I know 40-year-old is doing a podcast. That doesn't have any subscribers. everybody has to start somewhere

everyone was happy to a point because I was like I'm like wait a minute without an audience it does the followers you're like that's fair that's fair that's fair I understand we're always watching

yeah oh dude I was I was proud that was my first clap back in months I had to make sure it was good I was walking back from the gym and I was like I got 10 minutes that's literally why I debate sometimes I'm like do I text him do I tweet him back because there was another one that like

I guess people were something was coming up about TikTokers like being at red carpets or something like that. Oh yeah, yeah. And then you put something of like, just because you have followers doesn't have talent. Yeah, exactly. And that was a whole debate.

And someone was like, well, if you have an audience, you're going to reach more people. And I was like, correct. Correct. But then if you blow it. Then you are only embarrassing yourself to a larger scale.

And there's a skill. That's never going to change. You know why? Because they don't care about skill. They care about eyes on a property. They see someone famous and therefore it works for them. It's marketing. Is exactly what it is.

Oh, no. I hate it. So what happened was, that clip of the guy that you're talking about that asked the most ridiculous quote apparently he's a really nice guy but he asked a ridiculous question was it the one about gay gay son or thought daughter no it was like to like kiss your friend no not kiss your friend it was oh it was to show a sex scene with this one he is this one i saw was the one with it was that might have been that was five that day yeah the one that i

saw was chalemay and austin butler yeah and basically like hey you guys are friends um what's it like you know to be uh how do you do it do it where you are friends in real life, but then you've got to be a bad guy in this. Like, how do you do that? And Shalemae just had an answer like, I'm an actor? But he answered it as the best as he could.

But that video. Everywhere. Everywhere. Probably the one that I saw, the version I saw had like $8.1 million or something. Guess what? Everybody was talking about doing. So guess what the studio says?

Woohoo. Let's do that again. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And every time I see one of those flags from once journalist being held by someone that's going to be like a joke is,

Yeah, you think they can't. Oh, no, no, they're getting their money. They're kind of content that's going at as far as it's like, well, that's simple. That's great. We don't need, especially because it doesn't make your star look bad. It makes the people that you hired look bad. And that's not enough for you to then hire him. That is invited him.

Yeah, they allowed him in. And that's the, but even that, that's what I mean. The butt of the joke isn't their stars. Right. And you have actually made the stars look smarter because they go, what the, what am I dealing with here? I just, my whole issue with that, man, is just, I think about, like, um, um, um, any of the people that I've known that have done this kind of stuff,

I think about Josh Horowitz and how, like, well, he does. I think about all of the great interviewers that are out there. And when you keep doing this whole situation, like, it's embarrassing. You know what? Actors don't want to do press now.

Exactly. And, like, I literally work with certain actors that want to work with me because of these other idiots. Like, I get requested by certain actors because they know they've got to do with 90% that stuff. And then the 10% real.

Horowitz is another good. Harowitz and I become, like, pretty good friends now, right? So like the thing with him is what he's done brilliantly is he shifted to be able to use the kind of assets that some of these influences stuff too. Because he had a YouTube channel that had, I don't know, like 800 subscribers, right? And then he and I were talking and I was helping him out with his channel as well too. And he structures out his channel. And I said, dude, you do what you do.

Just do what you do. And now he's at like 70,000, right? Because he puts out clips and he's the best. He's the best. And people love talking to him. And he's got a lot of connections. So now what does he also have? Now he also goes, yeah, well, my video with Henry Cavill just did a million.

So, you know, I was already good with you guys. But now my interviews are doing even better on my own without MTV. And Cavill feels like, oh, I can have a real conversation, not just like listening to these TikTokers make up as an eye. And Cavill is an example of someone who doesn't do a lot of interviews, but always does interviews with Josh because he feels comfortable with him. He knows the kind of questions he's going to get. And Josh is not a softball interviewer. Josh goes, you see most of the big scoops that you see as far as an interviewer goes is from Josh Harwitz from his podcast because it's not that they feel just safe. They feel like comfortable and they're having a conversation and that's the type of stuff I wish that we could see more of like and I've talked about this too like that's my style. I love doing that with interviews. I don't try with the studios anymore because I know until the channel gets to like, you know, 500,000, a million subscribers. Then I can say to, hey, I want somebody.

I can only look interviews that I'm personally have relationships with to grow to that point. Yeah. But it's not a big thing to me. It's like, okay, I'll be able to, if I get interviews, I love doing them. Yeah. But I'm not going to go out of my way to try to do them

because it's like you got to, you have to, you have to jump through hoops right now in order to do it, especially if you only have like, you know, there are great writers out there, great writers who don't have an audience. They have like, barely. And they're like, well, yeah,

you want an hour with them to do this. You want 50 minutes? Well, maybe we'll get you to the jump. junk it, but we don't know because we got Louis Louie over here. Yeah, a billion things on TikTok. But I guess I totally understand that. I guess what I hate at this point is that you have,

I understand that then having whatever sort of TikTok stuff, that is quote unquote the pipeline. Yeah, there should be a balance. There has to be because what... It might balance one day. The pendulum is just right now and the extreme other. The only one that I think has balanced right now is you are seeing less situations of like a TikToker or an Instagram star.

being able to platform that into like an acting career because that when that talent does not show and then it's like oh nobody's watching this show this person doesn't work that's different versus if I there's there's enough TikTokers that are that high up or YouTubers that are that high up with those numbers I can throw them in for one doing thing and say I'd never need to invite you again but I got what I wanted and there will be another one you can throw in and it it won't hurt you right but if you throw it you throw somebody into a TV show that you've now put millions into that would that that could implode I think also you need to be careful of this actually causing a problem like I don't remember what it was but I remember someone like asked a red carpet question and it made the talent like visibly uncomfortable it was it was the gay son thought daughter that was that was going on is would you rather have a gay son or like a thought daughter that's like you know on the streets like for the streets and it was like what what I didn't actually see the clip I just saw the stills of it and I was like that's different though like if you make your talent it goes back in the shift in this business in general and I remember that like mark Ellis and I for people who found this channel

recently and don't know. It was part of a review channel with Mark Ellis doing Shmoh's No. And we were the first YouTube reviewers ever certified on Rotten Tomatoes. I remember when I was, because I had connections from working at Warner Brothers. So I was like, I need to get into press screenings. How do I get into these screens right now? Because we were going into the movies on the weekends to see three movies and we were sneaking into movies.

I wasn't paying for freaking shit-ass movies. Bad movies. I went to like, so we would go back to back to back. And that was like our Saturday or Sunday, you know, and I could do that before I had kids. And so I was like, well, let me try to start getting into screening. So I started to find the contacts and do it that way. And then I remember getting accepted to a few of them, but they were like, well, you're on what? You're on YouTube?

You're in 2009, 2010? And they were like, no, I remember this woman at Sony who was just like, yeah, no, it's just print and everything. There was no influencers. There was something to this stuff. Like, no, we just had print. And then I remember eventually we got into it. I remember sitting, and I think I've told the story before, but Mark and I were at the true grit screening. This is 2010.

It was our first real press screening, and we looked over, and it was he and I, and we were looking, and there is Alonzo Duraldi and Leonard Moulton. And I look at Ellis, I'm like, what the hell are we doing here? I'm like, how the hell do we get in here? And I think that, like, and then I remember feeling like, okay, we really accomplished something here by going to the, screens and we would meet all these people from these different outlets and then I remember one time being at a at a this is probably two three years ago or maybe four years ago and that audience changed and it was I started seeing people get invited to screenings that were influencers that were Instagram and TikTok and I'm

going whoa it's a different business now because they want people to walk out and just be on their phone and like a report right there they want that word enough and that's why I'm moving into like more cons because that's a long long-form conversation like I get to have and want to have, but nobody ever gets to see it. Like, that's what's hard is like, but I care more about the conversation than the audience. Like, I don't like the term influencer. I think it's really detrimental to society. So I'd rather have the conversation that no one gets to see but the 400 people, the 700 people in the room,

than have it be for 10,000 people, but be asinine and stupid. Yeah. Because if assonine and stupid is going to sell, I don't want to sell. Yeah, I get it. It's like there's so, I mean, there is a lot. There's a lot. And I remember I had this conversation before I saw Dune 2 with Simon Thompson and Jeff Snyder, and they were talking about

and Jeff wrote the whole thing on his news blog but you know it was also funny speaking to Snyder if you notice like how there's always like new players in every game right

like Snyder when he went out in his own Snyder's been in the game for a while but like he went out on his own he's got his newsletter and now he's one of those guys you see when you're seeing breaking scoops he's like these rogue agents

because it's usually Hollywood reporter and variety where there's Boris Kit and whoever it might be you know you see these people who have been doing it forever and then there's like these rogues out there and the ones that are now you get Snyder, but then there's this who's the new guy, the Daniel R.P.K.

guy. Yes, his in there. And then the Richmond, I guess, the other guy. But the way you become a rogue player and successful rogue player is you get accurate scoops. Yeah. And these guys have been doing that. So it's interesting to watch that field change as well. Like all the fields are

definitely changing. Even here are the stuff that we do. And even when I was talking to somebody recently about YouTube. And when I started back into this channel, I was starting to go off the old rules. And I'm like, well, let me go into 2000, how I used to do it with Ellis. I put a review up and I do this. And I remember, and I've talked about this.

But what's the one with Ryan Reynolds that he did with Sean Levy recently, where he's the video? Free guy? Free guy. So free guy did a, and I said, I want to review this. And I reviewed it. I remember Schmo's, no, we would miss a movie and we wouldn't see it for like three, four months. And then we would put a review out. And like, oh, and it still do 20 to 40,000, you know.

And I'm like, oh, I'll do that. I'll put a review out. people are interested in my reviews and it ate a big pile of shit. And that trash is the whole channel, which sucks. Like that the algorithm now is like, I didn't put it out a Dune review because I couldn't put it out Thursday. So therefore if I put it out like Monday, like it's not. It tells you basically what the algorithm that says is like people don't, especially

with the way AI is working and everything too. They're saying people don't come to your channel for for reviews. Yeah. Now that's how I feel the algorithm feels about like my when I do reactions. When I do reactions to shows and I do reactions to things, it does not show up for people on it. I think that I did a couple of them. They ate it and nobody pays attention to it. But to go back to that, I was like, well, how do I, then what do I do then?

I got to be a little bit more accurate on it. I got to find a little bit more with tags and understanding and thumbnails and things. And Greg Alba was on the phone with me, like, I don't know, maybe it was when I was still at Skybound, but we were on the phone, he and I, like, every day for, like, it had to been between seven to like 10 days in a row. Wow. And he would just like, try this, do this, make sure if, you know, you do it, and gave me the best advice ever and I've stuck to that and my channel has grown because of it and continuously and he's

helped me out and I've told him every single time and I always try to give him whether it's public credit or any time we're in a meeting I talk about it because you've got to be able to shift and pivot I still still see people doing stuff in our space the things that they were doing back in 2016 2017 still and I'm like if you try to keep going down that road and I'll say you got to try if they asked me I wouldn't put that up I wouldn't do that at this point because it's going to hurt your channel. And then that channel, because the next thing inside of that segment that you do, it could be a really good video.

And no one's watching this. And that's what's so hard is people don't understand that like, oh, review this for us. I can't review that for you. Like, that'll mess up the channel. Like, it's not just, I'm not ignoring. It's just like this is the way it is now. It is. And I saw some people like, you know, would be, and we talked about this,

would Roka and I were on the live stream. And somebody's like, because I took my apes trailer out of the, I had it. and I took it down because it was like 4,000 less than, and like, well, we wanted to see it. I wanted you to see it. But the problem is that the next time I do reaction, it's going to be. And if we're doing reactions like live,

like we're talking, like if we're trying to grow a new thing, we can't have the detriment. Yeah. I mean, you almost have to, and I've seen other major YouTubers do this. If you're going to do that,

you almost have to have the auxiliary one and you want to speak on it. Like if you're going to be like, hey, if you want to see X, Y and Z, go to the auxiliary one and then just let that live there. Or put it on Patreon. That too.

But that's why I started doing, like, so I only do the one UAP thing on Tuesdays for the show. Because I'd put a couple separate pieces, and they didn't do as well on Monday or the two, and I'm like, yeah, because this channel is really, it's one show a week, I think, for UAP stuff for me, because it was Tuesday I didn't have a show on. I like doing it on Tuesdays.

And to me, that makes sense. but if I keep doing that type of stuff, then it becomes, well, what's the channel? The algorithm won't know what? But it's all, well, this audience doesn't know. The audience says, well, what's the channel? Yeah. So I started a new channel.

I did the, where it's just UAP news that I am, the UAP show stays every Tuesday, but I do it. And it helped the algorithm over there because it's like, well, that's what they're coming to this channel for. They don't come to this channel for that, except on Tuesdays.

On Tuesdays the show does well, because that's when it's really crazy. And I think there's a lot, I really do think there's a lot of AI involved in it now, that even more so they're like, oh, well, he put up one of those shows. People go to that channel for that. Oh, he put it up on Monday? Nobody cares about that.

And it's crazy. But anyway, we dove down a whole new hole. And I think that what we'll do is we'll just do one more story after these words from both Rhone and Vessie. I love Vessies. I love Vesies. I love them. They're the best. Just slip them on and they're waterproof.

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It's time to find your corner office comfort. Vessie. So, John, I got these, I got these new shoes. And they have like, it's like rain wear. It's really, really, it's incredible. I love, they sent it to me a while ago, but I'm so excited to tell about it. And like the, for us, we, I want to tell you that Bessie has like this innovative. It's like footwear and it's designed for spring weather.

It's great. So stormburst vestsies are the ones that I really want to kind of emphasize. And they're your go-to for every setting, city streets, outdoor adventures, enhancing your style and activity with ease. So you can, whether it's snowy trails, wet streets, morning, do walk. So whether you're facing unexpected snow or slippery past, it's so crucial in general to have these. Like I'm planning a move. I've talked about this, but it's been raining a lot in L.A. and I've been wearing my vesees everywhere.

And you guys seen it. I've been wearing the one, the one hoodie that I have that they sent me. I love it. It's one of my favorite things. I love these. But I've worn it on, in so many different videos.

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and be ready to stay. and be ready to step out into style. It is great stuff. I love Vassi. Really, really enjoy Vassi. That's right. Listen, what did you do? Did you put in the Vassi?

Did you get some new clothes at Daron? What you should? If you did not, let in the jokes on you. Ha ha. I would tell you, use those codes. Go into the description. You find it. You got out of there it is and click on it.

And what do you do? You help me? Help you. That's what I did. It helped me help you. That's right. Moving on. I could have used some vetsies last night.

Damn. Yeah, you should have. They were awesome. That damn ring. All those vessies. All right. Let's do this then. All right.

Before we get the hell out of here, Zach Snyder was on Joe Rogan, and he talked a lot about Justice League. He talked about toxic fans. He talked about breaking Batman's no kill rule. Now, this is a summary from comic book movie. This is Mark Cassidy. Zach Snyder appeared on the Joe Rogan experience

and discussed a range of topics, including his experience working on Justice League and the perception that the majority of his fans are toxic. Rebel Moon director, Zach Snyder, was a guest on the Joe Rogan experience and the divisive filmmaker discussed a range of topics, including several of his DC-based products. Snyder touches on his experiences working on Justice League and Batman v. Superman Donna Justice

and how the studio's insistence that he made certain cuts led to his reputation as the director's cut guy. He also mentions that he found it very difficult to secure a PG-13 rating for BBS because the ratings board simply didn't like the idea of Batman and Superman fighting. Speaking of the Dark Night, Snyder weighs in on the debate surrounding the iconic DC comic heroes no kill rule. He said if you don't test the morality of the character, then it's dead.

It can't evolve. It can't move. It can only answer question that doesn't break canon, and that's not the way to treat these legendary characters. Snyder also delves into the negative perception of his fan base, and while he acknowledges that there is a toxic element, he praises their passion and the fact that they save lives by raising more than 600,000 for the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention. after his daughter, Autumn, took her own life, which is still the absolutely awful.

And every time I hear, like, and I, yeah, my heart breaks from every time I hear that. But it's a debt. But anyway, so the statements in general, it's like, look, the guy definitely, every time he talks, there's always come. A headline. There's always, it's always a headline. And, but I say the same thing about him that I say about, like, Matthew Vaughn at this point. I want Matthew want to stay the hell out of spy movies and do that and do your own thing. Bring your vision to the world in other ways.

And I want to see Snyder do the same thing. I know he didn't say in this that he's going back to superhero movies and everything too. And people will say, well, Rebel Moon. People didn't love Rebel Moon. I still don't understand with Rebel Moon. Why the rated R cut wasn't released first? They're really trying to engineer a Snyder cut. And it's such a bad move.

I don't get it. But, Coy, you know, all these comments in general that you hear, What stands out? My biggest issue is the Batman no kill rule comments where he's basically like, well, that quote delving into morality, yes, but you can do that without breaking the one thing, the character stands for it. If there's no kill rule, why is the Joker alive? If there's no no kill rule, how does Batman have Arkham Asylum need to exist because he's

just taking people out? Like, you delve into morality by looking at the no kill rule. You delve into morality by going like, what's that threshold? To just take it away isn't delving in morality. It's going like, what if I make a new character? It changes the essence of the character. Yeah, like what if Batman's Uncle Ben didn't died? He didn't care about responsibility.

That's not Spider-Man. That's a new character. So my issue isn't, like I've always said that I love Zach Snyder as Ellsworld. That's the point of an Elseworld. You make an Elseworld to go, what if? Not to go, this is the character. I've always seen his universe as an Elseworld, and that's how I enjoy them, but it's not the character.

So I think, especially with this comments, he kind of doubled down on, yeah, I make elseworlds, I make the Snyder cut. And that's why I'm okay with the Snyder cut, because it is his, he's his universe and his world, but it's not the DC universe. He didn't make DC characters on screen. He made his movies. Snyder's versions of it. Yeah, just like I've always said that Brian

Singer made really good mutant movies. I've yet to see him make an X-Men movie. Yeah. God damn. I'm excited for an X-Men movie. I think we're going to get some great X-Men movies. But he's made some mutant movies. That's a quote. What about first class? Not Brian Singer. No, no. I think Matthew Vaughn made a way better X-Men movie. Right, but you

said we haven't seen an X-Men movie. From Brian Singer. From Brian Singer. I think first class, is the closest for an X-in film we've ever gotten. I don't think that you need a heroin addicted Xavier and Kitty Pride to suddenly a power she doesn't have. Like, I think it has elements that are good.

That was the weird part is having Kitty just manifest powers that don't make any sense whatsoever. Like, it is a very good movie that follows Matthew Vaughn's great movie. Like, I think Logan and Days of Future Past and First Class are the best three. I'm with you.

But Days of Future Past is a lot of the foundation that Matthew Vaughn games. X2. X2 is a really good way to get people that don't know or like comics to enjoy the mutants. But it doesn't feel like an X-Men movie. It's a really good approximation of days of future past, but it's very similar in that these are ways that he perceives a certain type of thing.

But hearing you say that, though, I get so excited for just the idea of getting another X-Men movie. Dude, it's so soon. We're at the show soon. Yeah, well, X-Men 97. Yeah. Oh, I can't wait for the movie. Which is great. I'm just, we're all talking about X-Men again.

No, I agree. Like a new live-action X-Men. Like, that's where, that's, we could have talked about it back then, but that's the future of Marvel. No, no, I agree. Yeah, when are those dates? I know. To circle back to what we were talking about, I think, you know, the one that stood out for me as well was the Batman comment. And it's specifically because the two things with Batman and with Superman above all else, a Superman story of how hard he can punch something is not interesting.

The most interesting Superman story is Superman is presented with something. It's not what he can do. It's what should he do. I would buy his Batman argument about the no kill if he is broken. and he's now just killing without any sort of regard and then you actually present him with something that makes him remember his morality his humanity and he's like I've been screwing up I have to go back to that if he had actually done that then I will give him that argument of like testing what happens what happens when you're really broken but that's not really what happened it's like yes we know

that a robin was clearly killed but then he was just indiscriminately and we never really address it he just yeah just kills to kill and that's crazy to not actually explore that. Well, for me, I, the one that always stood out was the Superman one, right? It was odd, yeah. I didn't mind it as much. And I'll tell you why. Because for, because that was kind of going on what you were just talking about where

Superman wasn't on a rampage killing people. He, in that moment, in that moment, took this guy out because, and it pained him to do it. Like, Henry Cavill, some of the best acting he's done so far when he has to do it. And one thing about Superman is that it's his humanity. Sure. And the idea, like, when he does it, it's like he's human and he does it at this moment. Like, he's not running around just blasting people with his eyes. He has to do it in that one moment.

And I was like, that is that one moment that we've never seen Superman do that. And he had to do it. I didn't mind it. I guess what bothers me with that is because Superman also kind of doesn't really kill that often. No, I know. And it's very rare. And it comes in particular moment. So, for example, he killed.

Doomsday because it's like, oh my God, if I do not kill this thing, as a rap. He was about, Zah was about to kill all those people. Well, I get, but it was what? It was like, it was like a family of like three people. Whatever. I understand it. What I said? That's my fan.

Winston's line is three. He's like, what? Time out. Time out. Time out. Time out. Time out. What I mean by that, what I mean by that specifically, and that's kind of the point they

set up a little bit in the next film in Batman v. Superman. Brod has destroyed all the Metropolis. And all of us, like, now, and Galitz, Winston's troll the problem is, like, how many people are on that track? Three? I got to do it. But he had an opportunity. The difference is he was trying to save everybody in the city, but he couldn't do it.

I think what you're trying to say is, like, there's no escalation if he does it immediately. Like, Doomsday wouldn't matter if he kills him because he's already killed Zod in the first movie. I'm like, okay, this is that, is that? Thank you. That's kind of what I was trying to get at. So it's just as far as that, because who's the family of three? No, this is mess. No.

I say all of this. I say all of this to say. The rampage that all of these heroes kind of went on just murdering people. Because like even then to that point, well, then why didn't you kill Luther? If that's the case, if you're just so willing. And he's the one that released this monster. And Luther kills so many people. But that's what I mean, though.

The thing is in that moment because, you know, whether you like the Smiths or not, they're about to get whacked with the lace. And he's like, there's nothing I can do here. The only thing I can do is... But it opened a floodgate. Because then what ended up happening, he started then indiscriminately killing. You're telling me that when all of a sudden now Lois is kidnapped,

you're telling me when he punched that guy through the seal, that dude is dead. And it's not just that. You have a situation of then at the end of Justice League, whether it be the justice or the Zach Snyder cut. He just behead Steppenwolf like it's no big deal. Like I'm saying, you set up this precedent of like, no, they'd just be killing.

That's just what happened. And then it's Superman. It's Homelander. And Homelander only exists. Because Superman doesn't do a thing. It changes the character. If there's a rule and then you're like, what if the rules are pencil? Okay.

I see how I presented the family. It was just a bit. But the only time we ever see Clark cross that line is it's like, no, no, no, no. This is like universe ending. I have to kill darks. If I don't, then this, that's a wrap. It's why I didn't like Toby McGuire as Spider-Man as much as other people did, because when he makes out with Gwen Stacey in front of Mary Jane, he's not in the symbiate suit.

He's not corrupted. So by the time he puts on the symbiate suit, I'm like, oh, so he's just been a dick. Oh, the first time. Yes, when he's hanging upside down. He does the kiss she knows matters to her in front of her. And he's like, ah. And then he puts on the she's like, I'm a bad guy. Now I'm like, you've been a dick, bro.

Like, you don't get to grow as an arc if you've been a dick. Like so the black suit is interesting in the comic books because it's like, what if he didn't have the responsibility? He literally puts on the black suit at one point because Kingpin gets Aunt May so injured he thinks Aunt May is going to die. So he takes off the red suit and puts on a cloth approximation of black suit to murder fools. he's like, I'm broken. This is how I felt in the black suit. That doesn't work if he's in the red suit. Like, eh, what if I just take a close?

Because I guess the other thing was on, and I think the reason why it bothered me, this is his first major test posted because the only reason he didn't go and save his dad is because his dad said, no. Right. But his first main- Another classic Superman scene when he can't defeat a tornado. That dog's more important than Pock Kent. If your first major test.

I'm not Man of Steel over. I don't know Man of Steel, but this set up a precedent for everything that came after it, And so if your first test as like I am now announcing myself to the world as a superhero is, you know what? I know. I understand. Well, either way is the, I understand kind of where he was going with it particularly, but I think that you explained it very well in that you do change the DNA of the character by doing it as much. So there was a lot. There was a lot.

Look, we talked about as we were going on the air, we're like, well, this particular thing we should talk about. we really thought about the breaking down of where the MCU could go. And then we also wanted to be able to talk about some of these comments. So make sure you put your comments in there. Let us know. Start the debate. If you haven't already, hit that subscribe button. I'd like to thank both Winston and Koi for being here today.

We'll start with Winston. Where can I find you? You can find me at the Swaggy Blurt on all the platforms, man. Come check out Breakfast AM News. And then the world kind of just kicked my tail. We'll put it that way. So instead of being able to do individual breakdowns for the 10 best picture, I am doing a big one coming out on Saturday to cover them all.

So if you want to check that out before the Oscars, please come check that out on my YouTube channel. You can find me at Coydandro on YouTube, on Twitter, on Instagram, on TikTok, and I think what I'm going to do is something similar. I'm going to batch. I didn't get to review Dune, but I want to, so I'm going to go rewatch Dune, and I'm probably going to do it as a batch of. I think Dune might be a five-star film for me. So I've only ever given like 28 of those. I might do reviews of my five-star films over on my YouTube. So come check it out.

All right. So do that. Check out both those guys. And then you can look at us, whether we're Apple Podcasts, Spotify, if that's how you listen to it. If you are interested in more news on the UAP phenomenon, make sure you check out the new channel down to Earth with Christian Horloff. It is running now. And we do daily news videos. So check it out.

All right. Thanks for joining us for myself, Winston and Coy. We'll see you later. Bye-bye.