The Kristian Harloff Show - Is Ezra Miller Destroying Warner Bros 10-Year DC Plan? - The Big Thing

Episode Date: August 12, 2022

So much going on with Warner Bros at the moment. David Zaslav is making major moves with Batgirl, HBO Max and more. He has inherited an impossible situation with The Flash however - there is a report now that there are three options that WB can explore and the crew of Capes and Cowls talks about it. We also discuss She-Hulk, Green Lantern show continuing, the class of The Batgirl and who will show up in the Black Panther sequel. Join Kristian Harloff, Winston A. Marshall and Coy Jandreau in the first in-studio episode of Capes and Cowls. #warnerbros #ezramiller #DCEU #TheFlash #blackpanther STORYBLOCKS: http://www.storyblocks.com/BIGTHING SUPPORT US ON PATREON: https://patreon.com/schmoedown Ask Kristian questions for next time! https://facebook.com/harloff Become a Patreon of the Schmoedown: http://patreon.com/schmoedown OTHER GREAT CONTENT: REVIEWS https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSJdE28YyUT368qY7sfE0nKE4c04CqGvu TV REVIEWS https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSJdE28YyUT1LU-t2Z9AD5UJDiWW4pS_E STAR WARS SHOW https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSJdE28YyUT0XmfpbblkF9PY7uO2qhbN6 THE BIG THING PODCAST https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLSJdE28YyUT3KAwbzDsv6mdR-gwUiydQg - CM Punk Interview: https://youtu.be/R8Js8uj6GfE FOLLOW KRISTIAN + FIND HIM ON CAMEO https://cameo.com/kristianharloff https://twitter.com/kristianharloff https://facebook.com/harloff https://instagram.com/kristianharloff Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello everybody, Christian Harloff here from The Big Thing, from the Christian Harlov channel, from Sith Council. Guess what we're going to do? The Big Thing Patreon officially launches on September 1st. Now here's what membership is going to get you. You're going to get exclusive episodes of The Big Thing, Sith Council, the rewatch series, plus weekly editions of SEM live, Brett and Kate's Playdate, and much more. So you can sign up now at patreon.com slash schmodown and drop a comment and tell me what perks you want to see as we grow the community. So check out the Big Thing weekdays on Spotify, Apple, anywhere. Podcasts are found.

We appreciate it. We'll see you next time. Happy Friday, everybody. It's good to have you. I'm happy to have you. We're all happy to have you. It's Capes and Cows. It's the episode of The Big Thing, Capes and Cows.

This is our comic book content show on Fridays with myself, Winston, and Coy. It's my first show back from vacation with people in the studio. I'm excited about that. So we're going to have some conversations. conversations today. Man, we got a lot to talk about. We haven't really talked about all the stuff that Zoloft has done. Yeah, I don't call him by his real name. He hasn't earned it yet. So I'll let Winston and Koi do that. I call him Zolov. So Zolov did a whole bunch of things. We'll see. I don't even know if the guys agree with me on my take. They might love him. I have no idea.

We'll talk about them. Talking about him for sure. And it's all relevant because there's so much happening with the Flash. And again, I talked about that yesterday and the big thing about the three potential options of what they're going to do now with Ezra Miller's the Flash. Want to get Coy and Winston's take on what they think about it out of those three options. Maybe they have different options. I'll present mine and see if they agree. Our main thing, as you saw on the topic today, Black Panther. Wakanda Forever.

That movie's coming out soon, man, and that trailer took down the internet. So the question is, who's going to show up in this? We've got theories. Holy bullshit. I have no theories. I'm going to listen to the theories. And you guys can say how smart the people I have on the show are. Green Lantern, still getting the show.

And that's the gist of it. There's going to be so much that we talk about. We'll cover a little bit more. So, again, I didn't get to talk to the guys about the back girl stuff, the Supergirl stuff, the HBO stuff, all of it. We'll get to that more. And if you have it already, if you're brand new to the channel, please subscribe to this channel. Let us know, we're trying to get the 70,000, man. We have a really, really busy week.

This is like the combo for the storm. Next week you get, oh, yeah, and we're going to talk about Shee Hulk, because you get, She-Hulk. That's coming out. So we're going to do a little preview of She-Hulk. It's well on today's show. We got She-Hulk and then Lord of the Rings and Game of Thrones and Andor and Cobra Kai and Black Adam and Black Panther. It doesn't stop starting next week. So we're excited about it. Apple Podcasts, Spotify, the numbers keep going up and that's because of you guys. So make sure you keep doing that. Help us out. Links in the description. All right, let's get to it. It's Cates and Cals. It's me. It's Coy. It's Winston. Let's do it.

Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen. It's capes and cows. I got the man, Coyce Andrew, here. Winston A. Marshall and me. So it's good to have you guys back. Yeah, man. Welcome home. Yeah, it was good.

It was relaxing. I was saying on the show yesterday that it was the first time. I'm like you guys where I got to always be working, but I was like, I'm laying by the pool. I'm like, should I make a video? I was like, no, stupid. Just sit in the pool. You burn out. man I need to take a break like I haven't taken time off since February yeah I'm starting no I'm

feeling it like I'm winding like yeah you got to take a break you know what you know what I've started doing though with with my breaks is I'll do light work so I won't I won't work work but like for example because I've been writing a bunch like I'm I'm working like a feature and a pilot and a whole bunch of sketches um I'll just take like a notebook and just jot notes down but I won't like go your brain you know by my last 48 hours off is February 8th and 9th The last time I took two days off and I know. And, like, my body's starting to deteriorate. But I would assume you might read a comic for fun at that point

instead of, like, reading the stuff you have to read. I try, but it's hard because as soon as I take time off, like, right now I'm four weeks behind on comics. So I owe 210 books, roughly. So, like, basically, what? So if now this week on Wednesday, there's 60 new books coming out. So I'll be at 270 if I take more time off. So basically, like, the reason I can't take time off is, like, it's cumulative, right?

Like, all the knowledge I need to have, it doesn't, go away when I take time off. So when I come back, I'm just doubling down. That's why I always have so much respect for all the Shmodown competitors who do what they do, what they were doing at full time. And speaking of which dimension, October 1st, which happens to all sweet of my birthday, is the last. That's bittersweet. Yeah, I know.

It's the Schmodeown spectacular. And it is the, it's going to air on, well, I can't say where it's going to air yet. And that's probably a little bit of a spoiler. I have a lot of, I have a lot of big announcements coming up that I can't, you guys know some of it, but I haven't been able to tell. the audience, anything yet. I'm hoping to do that sometime next week. That's my goal to be able to explain a lot of stuff that's going on.

And part of that, as I mentioned to you guys, Patreon. Patreon.com slash Shmodown will be the Patreon for a big thing overall. So people who are already part of the Shmodown that don't want, they only want Shmodon content. Past September 1st, I should tell you, should probably drop that because we're transferring over everything messy in line, bring it over.

There's going to be more rewatches that the three of us will do on Patreon. A lot of that live there. We're still going to do Wii watches on this channel, but we also want to make. sure that we have enough of it. So we'll be doing it on the on Patreon exclusively as well. There'll be Q&As. There'll be a lot of stuff. And I'm going to be in there so much more in being active with you guys. So there's a lot of big changes coming. That's just one of them. But any, let's get into this stuff because there's so much to talk about it. And I actually want to

start with this whole thing going on. I talked about it yesterday on big thing, but I got to get the guy's take on it. All right. So Ezra Miller obviously has been, I feel like gets in trouble every other Thursday. But they finally arrested Ezra Miller for something. And I said it again, guys, yesterday that this to me is like the Al Capone thing where did so many crimes. Taxes. Taxes.

So they got Ezra Miller for like stealing liquor or something. Yeah. It was just a way to go, okay, enough's enough, buddy. A big enough crime being the small crime. Right. But here's, so here's the overall report is that Warner Brothers Discovery has to make moves to do something about Ezra Miller with three options being weighed up at the studio, including potentially scrapping the movie altogether. So the controversy surrounding Ezra Miller

continued to mount. It's becoming increasingly apparent that Warner Brothers Discovery needs to do something about The Flash. This is from comic book movie, by the way. This week alone, the actor has been charged with felony amid reports that child services are attempting to retire the three children of a woman residing at Miller's farm for their own safety. It's obvious the studio can't continue to ignore what's going on with the actor, who uses they, then, pronouns. The Hollywood reporter has now revealed that three options are being mulled over. Here it is. The first is that Miller will seek professional help, something the studio has heard could be the case. After they return to their farm in Vermont with their mother from there,

the hope is the actor can give a tell-all interview explaining their recent behavior later doing limited press for the press and avoiding any further negative headlines. A second, Miller doesn't seek help. The movie could still be released, but the actor would not factor heavily into marketing or publicity. They would also no longer be cast as the Scarlett Speedster leading to someone else playing Barry Allen of future projects. The third scenario, and this

would be a last resort. That if things worsened with Miller, the Flash will be scrapped and never released. Miller plays multiple characters and is in nearly every scene, so we're shooting their scenes with another actor is impossible. All right, so so much of it, we don't know

where it's going. And you saw the Dolly thing, right? Yeah, they already pull, yeah, but the Dolly's easy to do. But what's interesting? They just pulled their name. So he's playing Salvador Dali in a movie coming out at Toronto, like film festival. And he's not, they're not not in it, but they aren't mentioned in any marketing now. Right.

Right. So, yeah. Well, that's, so that's the thing. So the, and I'm just going to present it and then throw it to you guys because they heard my take on this yesterday. Okay. So the first, my initial thoughts was they're in a lose, lose. Now, I'm not, I'm not a Zola fan. I think everything he's doing is in his bedside manner is atrocious.

I think he's, I think he's terrible, to be honest, so far, so far. But not an easy situation right now because in option one, Ezra Miller's mom takes them to a help, seek help, get help, and go out and say, okay, I'm better now, I'm doing this, I'm accepting my behavior, goes out, promotes it, does the movie. Problem with that is, same. Look at this, Will Smith. Will Smith goes out, does it, does an announcement.

Nobody takes them serious. No one says, that's, that's, yeah, but the reason you did that is this. Same thing's going to happen here with Ezra Mill. The only reason, the difference in, what's the difference between Will Smith and Ezra Miller here? Difference is, Will Smith didn't have a $200 million sitting in the camp. Yeah. Huge, huge. And Will Smith took the, to me, took the time to process it without having to be told to.

this feels like they're literally being instruct. Yeah, and if the writing at THR is like they could, it already feels like a ploy. That's not a good sign. That's bad optics from the jump. No. No. So that's,

so that's, so option one's not, option one, it's like, okay, let's just get the movie out, figure a way to get it out, and then we'll say you're sorry.

And I believe you. And maybe then we can move forward and see how it goes. The problem also with that is, as I said in the beginning, the guy, Ezra Miller gets in trouble. Every Thursday. in a different state.

So I'm sorry, I'm sorry. Oh, I just did it again. But see, and I actually tweeted this out as a joke, but I seriously mean this. Ezra Miller is the greatest comic book villain of all time. To reverse flag, honestly. Honestly, because I joke because the other villains we've actually seen on screen, Thanos, Kilmonger, as far as story-wise go,

the fact that every single week something happens, and nobody is stopping this is insane to me. Well, remember, but. stories. Yes. It's, it's, it's again, they don't know what to do because they, this is, it's okay. So to answer your Christmas, it's, it's not as insane as you think it is because, but it's, think it, you got to think of it, not in moral terms of what you should do. Think it in business terms. If I say to you, Winston, me, you and Corey just, we made a movie. And it cost us $200 million to make. Okay. It costs us $200 million to make. And by the

way, once we make it, we're going to spend another 150 on marketing. Right. So this is about 350 million that we have in our in the can right now. Okay. Coy goes out and gets hammered and does something. Every day. And in a different state. Right.

And peeze on an old lady. And you're like, wait a minute. But he's now because now he's just doing it all over town. And you're like, what are we going to do? The guys won't stop peeing all ladies. And me and you were talking that. Everyone starts tweeting at us. What are you doing about Koi?

What are you doing about Koi? And we're going, what do we do? Because if we don't address this soon, they're going to have our heads plus, what do we do? Would we cancel the $200 million movie? What do we do? And this goes on for a year.

More so. More so. It started with them choking that lady. And we don't know. We don't know what was before that. But we don't even know what that was. But that was never addressed by him. That's the crazy part.

That should have been the start. The addressing, they're never addressing. it, I agree with you. It's crazy. But the, the understanding of what the hell do we do? And the videos are really oddly disconcerting. Like, all the videos where they pop up and

they intimidate and threaten civilians. If this is a 30, listen, if this is a $30 million movie, this movie is scrapped. Oh, it does not exist. But this is the tent pole of D.C. That's left. Right. Because they haven't finished Aquaman yet. They haven't finished. Black Adam is a rock movie, not a D.C. movie.

And Shazam is very intentionally a smaller film, which I think is a benefit. I personally think Shazam being a, now, and I say mid-budget, I mean mid-budget for ten-pole. I'm not saying it's mid-budget, but a mid-budget film is, I think, one of the best assets to Shazam. You've got the Rock movie, which can be huge.

You've got the Shazam movie, which can be mid-budget. One of the things I liked about the first one. Aquaman isn't done yet, but it made a billion dollars. Their big tent pole is arguably this movie going forward. They can't not release this. Right. Well, this is the problem. So I want to get back, I want to throw this to Winston after I bring this up.

Because I'm still in the run. Well, this is the part of Zolov. So Zolov is out there talking about everything that he's done so far to me in the last week and a half has been wrong. It's been completely wrong. Now I don't, now we'll get into the back girl conversation about why you cancel the movie. If you decide you want to cancel that movie because it's not good movie, it's your business, you can do what you want. But to say basically in a business jargon, the movie stinks and we don't respect it and we think it stinks. You're slapping everybody in the face over.

So many artists. So that's part of it. But then, then he goes out and goes, guess what we're going? going to do. I'm bringing Alan Horn in because he's the guy who was responsible for Marvel. Right. Not camera five. We're going to bring him. He mentioned Fagie, him and Fagie and Iger, but and

Alan Horn is a Hall of Fame executive. There's no doubt about it. But nonetheless, we're going to bring him in and we're doing a 10 year plan with Marvel. Never mind the fact that I said we're going to put out Joker and the Batman and all this stuff. Never mind that. We're putting out a 10 year plan and we're going to and the flash is still coming out. He said that. And we like it. We might

do some changes to it, but we like it. It's coming out. And then he got gets arrested. Or Ezra Miller gets arrested. Within a week. Within a week. And then it's like, oops. Shut up, Zoloft.

Don't talk. Don't say nothing. And because now what Zolov has done is saying, this is going to be a 10-year plan and it starts with the flash. Because the problem is, if you, now, what are you going to, if you pull this movie, we're still an option one here about him going. And, and, and, and you have Miller. So let's go with you, Winston.

So Miller, start with option one. Sure. You put Miller and he goes through the training. He decides he wants to do it. He apologizes. Humbs out. He says, okay, everything's good. Does all the interviews, does limited press.

They're still part of the DCEU. And then you just cross your fingers that he's never, that they're never going to mess up again. Good option? No. Sounds good, huh? No. I honestly, I honestly think the best option is option two.

Okay. Let's go into option two. Option two is you leave Ezra alone. they do no press. No press, and then you recast. And then you recast. So you basically do, you Bruce Banner it. More or less, and I would even say this,

I know that they, and by they, I mean, Warner this time. I know that they are saying that we've already dumped 200 mil into this, so we don't really have anything else. Real talk. If Grant Guston, I know he's tired, it's been nine, he's about to do season nine

serious finale of the flesh. If he's interested in jumping to the movie star status, then put a post credit scene because it's a flashpoint. And it's already canon. We've seen it in the show. We have seen it. If that's the case, then all of a sudden now, that's the face of the flash and you move on going forward if that's what Grant is interested.

If he's not fine, do it some other way. It doesn't matter. And I cannot, I cannot imagine that doing a post-credit reshoot of the recast costs more than maybe five to 10 million. And if you've already dumped 200 into this, like you know what I'm saying? You've now absolved yourself of all of this nonsense that Ezra Miller has given you and you move on because I don't, I agree with you.

I don't think Option 1 works because I don't believe at this point that Ezra Miller means. It doesn't seem like it. And even if they did mean, I don't think they'd be able to control their behavior. It doesn't seem like right now. Because I was the one saying, listen, I don't know Ezra Miller, but we should say this person needs help. And I still feel that way. No matter what they do.

I still feel that. I still feel that way, but I think that we're at a point, $200, $300,400 million, you gotta let Ezra Miller go away. One way or another. I personally would go with option two, and I would make it very clear.

The tricky thing is we're in this industry about as deep as it gets with commentary and with the things, short of writing, which you're also doing, but short of being the people making this stuff, we know more than most folk. Right.

I don't know how many people in the middle of other, jobs, the middle of other jobs, the middle of other careers care. Right. I don't know how much they care about. And how much they're even locked into this or know anything about it. We know about Ezra Miller because we're plugged in. I don't know how much they know or care.

I would. True. I would say anybody that genuinely cares about these movies. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, that knows about this. But I'm saying, I'm saying, like, the hardcore fans. Oh, 100%. There's no way. But that's this much the iceberg.

I'm talking about the iceberg. I don't know how much Warner Brothers cares about us because we're all going to be talking about it. We're doing it right now. Right. So my, that is already a thing. So people like, again, my, my friend back home goes and sees every comic book movie does not know what's going on with this. And that's what I'm saying is like those people. It's the car, the hardcore. You know the thing that I think would be interesting and it's going to tie into what we're about to talk to with back girl? Yeah. I would make the argument that any group that you're right about maybe like middle America or just like,

like, like folk that just live in their life. Just people that see movies. But I'm telling you, I have had random black folk that don't give a goddamn about comic books. Well, they're like, wait, wait, wait, wait, you're canceling Batgirl with like... No, no, no, but you're still talking about people who are... There are still people, dude, I'm telling you,

like, you're, you don't... What Koi's saying is 100% accurate. No, no, wait, boy, we're in such a bubble. There are people who don't even know Backgirl got canceled. People didn't know Back Girl was getting made. Exactly. Like, we're in... So it's hard for us to look out.

She also shows you, I was in Florida. Okay, like... California is in such a bubble. of everything. I'm very proud to be, I like to live here, everything too, but we are living on another planet

when it comes to how, what we think is happening and I'm telling you, like, can you just, the normal world does not know what the hell's going on

with Ezra Miller. I'm telling you. I understand what you're saying. What I'm trying to tell you is specifically that like black folk, Latino folk, like, of course,

someone that's like, whatever, it's on the screen, fine. But anybody that's remotely because of stuff like Will Smith. Because it's above and beyond.

You're literally seeing a situation where you had like a person to color, did something effed up and rightfully so got punished for it. But then you end up in a situation where it's like, okay, wait a minute. This dude is committing multiple crimes. Right. So I see what you're saying. So he's starting to be used as an example to also for people. So for people who are not in this business,

they're still paying attention to social media to say, well, wait a minute. Well, Smith got this punishment. How come this person is? And then the person who's not watching movies a lot goes, Wait, what's going on now? So I'd say that's another 5, 10%. So we're still talking like 10% of us, 10% of people that are learning about it,

and then 80% of people that don't care, they just want to see the Flash movie. And my concern is this Zeslov is... Zolov is looking at the overall market as a business man. Everything we've heard from him is very like business, business, black and white, this, this, this. I think he's going to look at the 80% bottom line because of everything we've heard so far,

he might not care about optics. Of course he doesn't. Because if you cared about optics, you wouldn't have been like, I haven't got an option for you. I haven't got an option for you. That's my option, right? But option three is scrap the movie. You can't do that. Yeah, I have 200 million.

But what's interesting is I like some of, and I don't know Zaslov. I don't know what his long-term goals are except for his ideal 10-year plan. But what's interesting to me is I don't disagree with some of the things they need to do. Right. It's just the expression of the bad side manner. That's it. So, because I see why he inherited a deficit of problem. But I think the way he's talking about art as content, there's a huge difference between entertainment and content.

If we don't like it, we're scrapping it. And then he gives this fake ruse of because the fans deserve better. And that feels disingenuous just like, as your Miller apology would. Right. And that's the whole thing. It's like I, Winston came in before and said, you know, we were talking about Zoloff cutting everything. And I said, I don't really, look, if Warner Brothers says we looked at it because the thing is, yes, does it suck that we have? We had this Latino actress who has this lead role and apparently was really good in the role.

And does it suck that she got this stripped away from her? Yes, of course it does. But we also don't know. What if this movie was Catwoman Part 2 and it was that bad? Now, the argument is, well, they released Catwoman. Different time. If they look at it and they go, this movie is so bad, we don't even want to put it on HBO Max.

Now, to not even put it on HBO Max, I don't know. But you don't make any money for it on HBO Max. I know. Well, you could get subscribers because maybe the interest behind it. But the tax break. So a Catwoman was, was coming out when the studio was whole. Right.

This is a rare opportunity for a major company to get a tax draft because of an acquisition. Yes. If you inherit something while you're taking over a company and you get so like it never sees the light of day. If they're released a few a max, it wouldn't, they wouldn't get that money.

If they released on YouTube, right. So it makes sense why they did it. Business-wise, it makes- But I hate that because it's, I know, I know, I know, I know, but you can understand. But again, it goes back to the bedside manner. It's then coming out and saying,

we're not making anything that stinks, because that's pretty much what he said. That's that optics. Yes. So here's the other thing that he should have done, and that's part of the problem. Fine. You want to cancel it because the movie is really bad. Okay.

You better have a goddamn backup plan as to what you're going to do because what that looks like. He says he does. But then you need to announce it. But he thinks he did. He thinks with that 10-year plan, he thinks he told you what it is. Hell no. I know. I know that.

You better tease that shit because again. Because the Supergirl gets canceled also. Now they said it's just pushed back and develop it a little bit more, right? And there's other things. but they said that James Gunsting's still safe. Peacemaker's good. And they said Blue Beetle still safe. Which is my big way.

Like I Blue Beetle's huge. Because that's because the stuff that's in development, he can have a control of and say, okay. Right. Like this is this, yeah, move stuff around and make it fit our plan. So I,

and I get that. Again, it's just the way that he's been handling stuff. And then the HBO Max thing, I said up top, I was like, that, oh, man, they're canceling HBO Max.

I was like, they're not canceling it. They're just taking discovery and put it in there. And I'm like, wait. They're trying to, fix something that's not broke. They're already pulling movies. Right. That's not what I mean. But that's what I'm saying. There's 30 to 45 day window is gone. Which is stupid. And that's dumb. The fact that you pulled random movies off of HBO Max without any warning,

at least tells somebody if something like that's going on. But again, let's say you throw up a bat girl and everybody has said that she has been phenomenal in the role, at least announced, look, the movie isn't working out, but Leslie is so amazing. We have stuff for her in the future. They did. They did. They did. They did. They did specifically said that Leslie has got, I don't know if Warner Brothers specifically said it, but from the reports that everyone was saying that from people involved in the Warner Brothers system was that they looked at it,

thought she was phenomenal, but the movie itself was goffish. And that, but again, no one specifically from Warner Brothers said it, but that's what the report said. I would have loved to have heard an official statement. Hey, unfortunately,

this film doesn't. I don't know. I don't know. And I also would have loved to have heard that the directors work. Because the directors, I enjoyed the hell in him as Marvel. And I think it looks really bad

that these directors coming off a major run are then getting shelved and everything else. Because it was Brendan Fraser's comeback movie, which everyone's excited about. It's Michael Keaton back. Brendan Fraser was in Firefly. He was the bad guy, dude. I didn't know he was Firefly. See, the fact that the movie

was this far done and then, yeah, like, I love Doom Patrol, but I love Doom Patrol, but I want to see it. No, no, he was also in the affair. Oh, that's smaller. Yeah, like, you know what I mean? This was a big, a big role. I word a toy of Brendan Frazier. So, you know what I mean? And so between all of those ingredients, you needed a statement

that says we were very excited about the director work. We were very excited about Leslie Grace. I needed something that was about apologizing for scrapping it. Bro. It would literally be like if a doctor came into a situation, a brand new doctor, you had somebody else, you're dealing with like a life-threatening

disease. They were all going to go, well, we're just going to cut everything off. And, you know, we got a plan, but good luck. In 10 years. And what's hard for me is like, they're in the perfect storm, right? They're getting rid of a movie that the people that were invested in it are very excited about, but other people might not have

heard of so I could see how they'd write that off both literally and mentally. And then they've also got a very tricky PR standpoint where people are in danger, it sounds like, which is not healthy to have to deal with. And that's not really fun for anyone. No, they inherited a mess. And here's, but here's what we can all agree on because we've seen it a million times. And I, and I'll be the first to say it as well, as much as I'm giving Zoloff shit. If this 10 year plan works out and it saves the studio and whatever he decides to do with the flash turns out to be the decision. decision, you're going to hail this guy as one of the best executives of all time. Although it was a rough start.

Yeah. And he didn't come in too hot, but look at the moves that he made. And I want that for DC. I think that that's what he is hoping for and understands because he's running it like the president of a country. Right. Right. He's running like these types of decisions and in the matter he's doing it is very similar

to the when you watch politics. It looks very similar. And he's what I will give him credit on is that he's got a plan and he's doing what he wants to do. You might not like it. I don't like what. he's doing. And the 30 to 45 day is a big argument because I've seen a lot of people.

Can you explain that? What change happens? So 30 to 45 day window for what was so special about HBO Max was when a lot of these movies, like Top Gun is still not out. Right. Paramount. Right. It's still not out.

There's no streamers. What I'm saying. Paramount Plus doesn't have that yet because they don't have that window. But there's no, there's no window. And it's also because they wanted to leave it in theaters. Right. I understand that argument. But one of the main reasons that the first reason HBO Max had so many people to join was

because of the day of release in theaters and then the day of release on HBO Max. I get why you cancel that. I understand that once as the, that was a, that was a pandemic specific thing. So once that starts to, once people start going to the theaters, I don't like it because I like watching movies at the comfort of my own home right away like everybody else, but I get it. In the 30, 45 day. And people who argue that, oh, it's 3445 day, you can, you can go see in the theater then. They don't have children.

So one of the main reasons And why HBO Max is so attractive To people with children Is that if a movie comes out That like Elvis Elvis was the one that was just canceled In the 30 to 45 day My wife has been dying to see this movie

She can't see because she's with my kids I saw it because I did it for a screening Right She wants to see it and now it's like Okay she gotta wait more And then more movies come out More TV shows come out And it starts to get buried a little bit more

And you gotta wait for it But it's like that movie's still in the theaters Is what people say But still But you're exactly right who has the time on top of the fact that if you go and look at box office, that drop off is crazy. Unless you are a top gun,

it's not still pulling in that kind of money. People are making a top gun argument. Well, look at what top gun? That's the exception. It's a unicorn. It's a just past Titanic. Bro, that's literally being like, hey, my son is real good at dribbling.

He's going to be LeBron James. No. James is LeBron James. Once in a generation movie. Right. And the way those people are arguing is, well, wait a minute. If they would have put it on streaming after 30,

45 days and would have made that money. again, unicorn, because it's one of those things, if it's one of these movies that keeps, is making a lot of money and Elvis, like Elvis being an example, if Elvis was making like so much money still, and up there like with Titanic. And they said,

all right, we're holding back on the 30 to 45 day. I get it. I think it should be case by case. I agree. I think they said it was going to be. I think that they did say it was going to be, but I mean,

I don't know. I just, I think that it's also one of the reasons people sign up for HBO Max. It's certainly one of the reasons. And I think show business, it sucks, but it is a business. And it's evolving. And it is changing every day because this is a new frontier. But if you've got a $100 million movie, you're not going to make that back in

HBO Max. I don't care how many subscribers you have. If you're paying $6 a month for a service or I don't know what to cost right now. You're going to make it back in the theater. Exactly. So I think it should be a case-by-case conversation with, hey, if we don't drop off a certain amount of, if we're making more than $10 million. I would wait until next year, though, when it starts all over and they go, okay, look,

here's what we did for 2021. Here's what we did for 2022. 22 or three. We're adjusting as time evolves. Or even put, if you want to do that, maybe push the window. So instead of 30 to 45, call it an even 60. It's two months. Or maybe 60.

60's long. It's two months. But also maybe like a 10 day pay per view. Something that you could access the movie from your home. Well, that's what that's what Disney did for a while. That's the try. I don't like that. That has been a model.

I don't like that because it's for me. It's like, well, why do I have your service? I also have to put more money on it. Because to make the movie money. I know. I get it. So then they're already tiering these out anyway. Make it a tier that instead of paying 15, you're paying 20 a month,

and now you get those paper. 45 day. And then whatever, do what you want. Yeah, maybe there's an ad. And that way you feel good about you've paid for it. It's done. Well, that's what I mean. And there's also other things that are being cut.

Like, HBO Max is not done with the news that's going to come out. There's going to be more. I just thought HBO Max, it was one of my favorites. It was too. It was blockbuster and new stuff. I feel like they're just. That back catalog is one of the best. It's not the best.

What's wild to me, and I love that John Oliver already went at their throat for this. but HBO has been like the name has been synonymous with just killing it. You know what I'm saying? They have a very strict rule of like TV, it's HBO. Exactly. They don't put anything out second. If somebody else is working on a similar type of project and they get it out first or like then it's done.

We don't care. Exclusive comedy shows. They're very them. Very similar to the way Disney will. Disney will work on something for five years. And if it doesn't hit their quality, they go, we'll scrap it. So for them all of a sudden to be so off. Just off base.

It's not all of a sudden, though, because it's, this guy has only been in power for a little bit. Yeah. So it's not all of a sudden. It's like the stuff I've always been saying about him that I understand is that he inherited a mess. Now, across the border specifically DC. Well, I don't know about the other movies, but DC for sure. I mean, you look at, I'll give you DC.

But that's, I mean, dude, that's a big part of their business. I know, no, no, no. I know. But I'm saying now you're effing up HBO too. I know. Yeah, yeah, yeah, true, true. Now, but the thing is, whatever his plan might be, it's just not all, it's not all, it's not all of a sudden when he, if you come in and is, if you made your money off discovery, right. And it's like, okay, I want to build that up. And I want to start to try to push that. Now, again, his right to try to figure out if that's going to work. I think, well, it's the same way that Disney puts in the discovery, not discovery, not discovery. National Geographic and their thing.

If that's the case, if it's HBOM, that's not what I'm hearing's happening. I'm worried that we're hearing so many different things from so many different directions instead of addressing it, we're hearing word of mouth, like they're getting ready 70% scripted content. I keep hearing numbers that are like, who said this? And then, and what scares me is like, Discovery makes a lot of money

because it costs $7 to make one of their shows. And people, we watch them for like years. It's just like, yeah, throw a camera on this guy building a house and then the house falls apart in a week. Like, that's not, but that's the other bedside... That's content not art. Right. But here's the, here's the other bedside manner part of it that I thought

I was talking to Winston about before you got here. And I talked about it yesterday, which is bad. But look, he knows what he also did. He released a graphic that said, Yes. But he said HBO Max is for the dudes and then Discovery is for the word. But here's the thing. If you look, we all have channels and we all can see our demographics.

And I said this is this channel. Our audience is predominantly male. because of what we talk about, right? That does not mean that women don't like it. Right. It means that for the audience that we're reaching, dudes, there's a lot of women that comment on these videos. It's a lot of women who are very passionate about it.

So I'm not saying that they can't say Zoloft goes, all right, guys, listen. But if Zoloft goes in and says, look, here's our numbers. It looks like this is heavily male audience, right? Let's be aware of that. Don't release that. Yeah, that's all the things to release. HBO Max,

but also not having an event diagram, having a separate, right. I understand when Spike TV did it. I get it back in the day. The man show? Right. Are you saying the man show?

No, no, no, no. I get that, but if you're on top of that, if you're going to do that, don't just say male skew, female skew. If you do that, say HBO Max, we find that it's 55% men watching and 45% women for discovery. It's 60% women and 40% male.

If you do that, then at least I'm looking at an actual hard number. Yes. And not just women watch shows with houses. And they're watching. Make it a then diagram. So at least our subconscious is like they are acknowledging that like I like some stuff. Women enjoy.

That's the point is the bad side manner of it all. It played wrong. Again, understood what they were trying to do. Here's our numbers. This is what we found is more. But it's like, no, of course you're going to piss somebody of it. People who are hardcore fans and think about, you know, think about someone like Amy. Yeah.

Amy, who, Amy Dallon, who's sitting there and going, okay, I wonder what they're going to do. Yeah. Amy loves this stuff more than life. Amy, sitting there and they go, no, Amy, your, H. Prime Max is not for you. Discovery is go watch the Lions. Dude, yeah. You know, it's funny. My dad, my dad, there's this book that he's always talking about. It's about the different ways of like leadership.

Yeah. And it's what, charisma based, intelligence based, name based and money based. And they talk a lot about with like presidents of United States why they get elected and stuff like that. So a lot of talk was talking about how Al Gore would have actually been a really great president, but his charisma sucks. Like real talk. He doesn't know how to talk to people.

That's why TV back in the early 60s, that's why Kennedy. The next in the room versus people watching on TV. A huge moment. It's the same thing with this guy. It might be that he's the smartest dude in the room and his plan makes perfect sense. But because he doesn't know how to talk to people, he might end up screwing this up. I think one of the reasons Marvel is as huge as it is, is because it's the first time I've seen an executive to the level of Kevin Faggie, have that level of ability to host.

Like he knows how to deliver the fans. Kevin Feige. He's effectively a host and an executive and a producer and a comic. But you know what Kevin Feiggy also, this is another major thing that Zoloft did wrong. So Kevin Feige also was very much in communication with Alan Horn and Bob Iger. Yeah. Very much so. Walter Hamada didn't even know what the hell was going on.

And Walter Hamada getting fired like in a press release. Well, he didn't get fired yet. Isn't he finishing up Black Adam? Because he wanted to walk. Yeah. No, he didn't get fired. Okay, that's good. Because what happened was from the report is that they made this 10-year plan.

He's like, wait, well, what? Yeah. What's happening now? The guy who runs D.C. Yeah. It's going. And D.C. was in one building until very recently. It's like, go to the next floor.

Talk to your fellow. Right. Hamada's like, I'm leaving. And they're like, don't leave. Just wait until least Black Adam. So maybe, again, you look at it politics-wise. Maybe there's a certain power structure, hierarchy.

But if there's a position, like, if you come in and you're and you're like, well, that person was in beforehand. I don't really like that person. I'm not going to confirm. I'm not going to talk to that person. And then that person goes, well, I'm pissed off. We'll finish that and then I'll find somebody new. I'm going to stay optimistic because I do think if we, like you said,

if we zoom out in five years and we look back at this as when the shift happened. It could be a huge win. But until they get the narrative to people that are in it, like we are, like I can see how people that aren't as inundated with this, they don't know about a press conference call. They don't care about investor calls. They wouldn't even know what those were. mean for a company because why would they?

They don't need to. For us, though, we're going to stay concerned until Blue Beetle drops and it has a cohesiveness until they know what they're doing with flash, until these things. And I think we should say, I wouldn't even say cautiously optimistic. I'm going to say neutral because I'm concerned, but at the same time, something had to change.

I'm just worried that the way they're deciding about this change is scrap this, scrap this, have these Venn diagrams, have a PowerPoint presentation, discovery, get rid of American Pickle. These things look Love that movie. These things look like the worst case scenario. Right.

Do you know what I mean? They literally are, hey, you and I talked a month ago and we say like, what could happen, this would be the list of the worst case scenario. Right.

Like this would be the... We're almost in football season, bro, and my brain is straight up like, two minute drill, you're on your own like 10 yard line and you start off with a false start. Like you look really, really bad right now,

so you better score because... You know, sports is a great example. I don't know a lot about athletes. I know, you know, my Patriots, myself. I know my teams. And I'm a fair weather fans

where like, they're doing well. Yeah. Like, I don't know enough. If an athlete is going around causing crime, I probably hear about it at a point, but I don't follow it. But if an athlete is suddenly like felony arrest, there's kids on a farm, like, I'm going to start hearing about it. And I think that was Winston's

point earlier. Yeah, so what I'm saying is, I think that we're hitting the iceberg shift to where like, if LeBron James had kidnapped somebody, I'd have heard about it. But that stuff, though, coin? But would that affect the game? Right, but that's, but this is affecting the game. That's the question. But this is affecting the game because, because they, what,

they've said now when Zolov came out and he's like okay 10 year plan flash it's a go and then Miller gets arrested and he's like shit so he goes what do we do now and then we'll hear the options and this is basically what the options that we're hearing so then allow me to present option for which I think is it's a very expensive option and they're not going to do it but maybe this is the best option the option is when you look at they know that they're going to lose money potential. Now, the option two of recasting with a new scene is probably your best gamble,

red, you know, red or black, and you might, you might make some money or you might break even, maybe, right? My option is going to cost you over $200 million, maybe more. However, what it allowed you to do, if you're going to, it's going to try to help your 10-year plan. If Flash is the one that joins it, that starts it all and moves, and you know that this, they love it. They said from the test screenings and everything, too, it's, really good. If the script's that good and Affleck's there, Keaton's there, then recast the fucker now. And do a,

do a, um, uh, uh, Christopher Plummer, Kevin Spacey. That's a full new movie. It's a full new movie. Yeah. And you shoot the whole thing. Understand that you're going to lose because if you do option three, you're just losing $200 million. And if you don't put an HBO max, same thing. It's right off. Right. But it's, I think it's five percent. So we're talking. You're still make, you're still massive loss. Yeah. So If you're going to make a massive loss, I don't think three should even be on the table of option three. Your two options should be the one that you guys are saying is option two,

which is probably the one that is most likely. Or this one, where you reshoot the whole movie, you recast with somebody new, who make a new star and you sign whoever that new person is, I think you got to go past Grant. I like him, but I think you go past him to build a new star,

make him a little younger. We shoot the whole movie as it is, bring in Ben Affleck, bring in Keaton. And look, We know we're losing a lot of money. Yeah. But this was,

this was on the old regime anyway. And what's hard is if you're losing that money, it needs to then be a $780 million. Bro. Because I hear of Rackconic for two. Yeah. I know. At this rate with all the bad press,

you need to hit a billy, bro. Yeah, just to be even. And what's hard is, like, you know, they're building a new universe. I don't know if it makes sense

to have anything associated with the old stuff. If, if they're resetting versus rebooting, I've heard both language tossed around. What I would do since there's comic canon for it is due crisis and in Infinite Earth. I would literally just have one last big movie, beat Marvel to Secret Oars, have a giant cataclysmic event and the CW flash, bring Stephen Abel back, bring Henry Cavill back, end that universe and then start fresh with the last scene be the new justice. Well, did you hear you hear you hear kind of what was rumbling around last night that they're going to.

You were in my four year old's room? A lot of farts. Whoa. She was, dude, she was she was farting on the plane like letting off these big horrible farts. I thought it was a lady next to me. Oh, my God. And I said to her, I said, Macy, I said, were you farting on the planet?

She's like, yeah. It was so bad. Would you guys eat? Everything. You're on vacation. Jeez. Yeah. But it was bad.

Real-time sound sense. So that's what was rumbling last. There was there was talks that they're trying to potentially make Black Adam the Thanos of the DCU at this point. Hierarchy of power is about to change. I've been hearing about it. I, that sounds like such a bad idea. What's hard is, okay, so I think the strength of the DC films is that they feel so different on purpose.

They let directors have the freedom that phase four is now letting Marvel have, right? Like Sam Ray, we've talked at Nauseum about Sam Ramey getting a Sam Ramey film, how, you know, each of these movies is feeling different. I think that's a strength because the comic books feel different. I think they should have a Justice League universe as well as a Matt Reeves-esque Batman universe. I'm saying nothing connects to Matt Reeves Batman. And I'm saying, I'm not saying Robert Pattinson's what they were doing, though. But I'm saying they need to keep that element of it as well as. How do you put Joker 2 into this?

You don't. That's what I'm saying. It's like you need a DC Black Label, which is a different line of comic books. You keep things separate. You can't connect it. You shouldn't. But you can. And the easy way is because it's freaking comic books, you just go, that's Earth 58.

That's what I'm saying. Keep them separate. And that's why I'm saying Black Adam is going to be a rock movie. I think it can mix with Shazam, but I don't think it should mix with the rest of this new stuff. Because Black Adam is always going to have... They're 100% doing it. They even said they shot a new post-credit scene. Yeah.

But I just think it's going to start to feel... I think the strength of Marvel could be the weakness of DC where people are waiting for connectivity and that doesn't feel right. Well, I mean, the funny thing is the other thing you could do is you could still let them connect but not make it a focal point. So if there's a point at which all of a sudden, almost like a Spider-Verse, we end up with the rock in Matt, Reeves' Batman World for half a second, and then we're gone, fine.

That's kind of feels so weird. Think about how. It would, but again, remember, with Spiderverse like that, I know because it was a comedy, all of those spider people are completely different. Did you see DC's Super Pets? Not yet. I enjoyed it. I've been so busy as a good.

But there's a great post-credit scene. I can spoil it for people. If you haven't seen it, you're going to get spoiled on Super Pets. There's a Black Adam post-credit scene. That's cool. With him live action? No, no, no. just in and basically black adam's dog comes into the end with black adam and to superman and his dog

oh that's cute it's it's a cool little scene but it's a great great scene but before we move on um i do want to tell you guys also um no not about that that's great though uh story blocks and you guys have been hearing about story blocks and i'm so glad that so many people have been trying story blocks and i'm getting a lot of positive comments if you're getting those comments if so if you are getting it and you are liking it, please let me know. I want to know about it in the comments, please. Video is the most effective way to capture an audience's attention, and as a result, modern storytellers are always challenged

for creating more video content at a higher quality, involving more voices in the process, and distributing on more platforms than ever before. So for creators, you know that some of the barriers that you face are meeting output demands, there's time, there's budget, knowledge, creative inspiration, passion, burnout, mental health, it's all there. Storyblocks makes it possible. creators to keep up with the growing demands for modern content so you can bring all your

stories to life and stop sacrificing your vision due to time, budget, or resources. Now, what I really like about story blocks in general, there's so many different access plans that they have. They have an unlimited access plan. It gives you unlimited downloads of over the one million assets in their library. You try out multiple options quickly and find the perfect fits so you can create more and spend less without sacrificing quality. You choose a plan that works for you from their selection of flexible subscriptions that scale to give you all the content and tools you need to focus on creating and not just worry about budget. Now, if you go to bigthing.com, no, that's not true.

I don't have a website. Storybox.com slash big thing. There you go. Storybox.com slash big thing. And I would try the unlimited plan, man. People are really enjoying it. I hope that you enjoy it. And for people who have been asking about over and all, how do I help the show?

How do I help the show? I really like the show and I want to help the show, support the show. find something that we are talking about sponsor-wise that is right for you. Now, I think a lot of creators that are watching this show, StoryBox is perfect for you. So check it out. The links in the description, storybox.com slash big thing. Okay, I want to move on past all this because there's so much. It's incredible how much it is.

And so there he is. There's all love to give him this big speech. Wakanda Forever, Black Panther. Now, originally I was going to lead the show and I was even going to title the show. this, I might just do a separate piece for it, but we talked about the other stuff so much. It'd be silly for me not to make that the main topic. It's unprecedented, man.

It's never happened. I know. Has there ever been a movie that's had that much porn into it that's in this much turmoil? No, no, I know. And there's never been a studio acquisition quite like this because when Fox and Marvel happened, it was in like a flow.

Like it worked out-ish. New Mutants, notwithstanding. New Mutants was like 80 million compared to 200. Like, you know what I mean? There's just so much. And we'll probably get back into it before the show's over because we still will potentially bring up the back girl stuff as well too. But, Wakana forever, that is coming out in November. People are very, very excited for this film as they should be.

It is the sequel to the very popular Black Panther. And so I'm going to really leave this topic. I'm going to pitch it to Winston and Coy. But I know that Coy, you're talking about who you think could potentially show up because there's always these things where you have these post-credit scenes and maybe even inside we know that Namor is coming in and we know what that could potentially set up the X-Men.

So I'll throw to you first, Corey. Who do you think and why will show up in the Black Panther sequel? So I think Namor is going to be a bit of an anti-hero like he is in the comic books. I was about to slap you. I thought you were going to say, I think Namor's going to be in the film.

I think, sir, I think, guys, can confirm here. He might be in the water. Namor quit. No, so I think Namor is going to be an anti-hero and I think we're going to see a lot of interesting geopolitical ramifications of Wakanda getting a new leader, what that looks like from the rest of the world,

whether the Atlanteans see that as weakness. We see that flooding scene in the trailer. We see all these things. And why that conflict arises, I think is going to be a lot bigger than just like bad guy. I think that'd be a very weak way to introduce Namor, which they wouldn't do. Namor being the first mutant,

I do think that's going to be a long-form element. Is he officially the first mutant? In the comic book, he's the first mutant. Okay. So. Isn't an apocalypse technically, but Namor claims it as the first one? Yeah, Namor's arrogance, good call. Yes.

So basically, I think that's going to be a lot like Miss Marvel, where it builds greater macro into mutant hood. But what I think is going to be interesting with Black Panther is this is, if not the most mature, one of the most mature of the MCU properties. And not in the Deadpool sense, which is maturely immature, but like truly a grandiose epic that I think is going to bring us Dr. Doom. Because I think we're going to get Latvaria. I think we're going to get more.

geopolitical elements if there's more than one rival nation. So I think Latvary is going to be introduced, and I think through that we get Dr. Doom at least a post-credit scene, which I think is going to bring us into phase five, where Kang is the villain of phase five, where we have a lot of timey-wimey goodness, but I think we're going to find out near the end of phase five, going into Kang Dynasty,

that Doom is either working with him or pulling the strings, and I think we're going to have a phase five and six overarching Doom story. I think the only way to make Doom as interesting as he needs to be and as ominous and bigger than Thanos is by having him pull the strings for a longer time. I also think Doom shows up in Agatha Harkness. I think we're going to have an element of Doom's mom. So I think you introduce him as soon as this November

and play literally a five-year game. So let me ask you a question then when it comes to that because if they are releasing that, then there's two ways. It either means, and I'm curious which one you think it is, it either means that they've cast Doom already and that we'll find out who the actors is playing it through the post-credit scene or it's going to be a Thanos situation

like they first did. The mask. Like he just stands and it's just going to be in the mask. It's going to be in that like iron mask or whatever the hell he's got. And you do it that way where you see the silhouette of him and you do it that way. Which way do you think it's going? I think they've already cast him. And I think that either we're going to find out in the post credit scene or maybe a D23.

It's kind of like what they do with Harry Styles. Yeah. I think I think it's going to be like, hey, I'm here. I'm already established. I think that Doom, his first appearance, we should hear him. Like I think we need that. It's more powerful than just kind of. Exactly.

So let me, so you're saying Doom. Yeah. Winston, so you've got, you've got this movie coming out. Do you think that we're getting any big cameos and will it be? Because they were already shown X-Men and well, they already had the theme in X-Men

and his Marvel. So what do you think? I've got, I like the Doom. I like the Doom nod. My three guesses are that we're either going to get Sue Storm because we're essentially giving this moment

of we're going to, introduce each one of the Fantastic Ford something because there's rumors that the thing might show up in She-Holk. Yeah. So then this is an opportunity because Sue's sort of relationship with Namor, you could potentially tap into that. Or I think you might get either of the two rumored other mutants that have been talked about in either Juan Carlo Esposito or Taryn Edgerton

in that you might get, because now you're introducing mutants yet again, Right. You might get a cameo from either one of them that officially announces that cat. Because sure, we've been talking about it, the fact that news has been coming out rapidly about either one of them potentially playing somebody. There is this not, especially with Juan Carlo being like, well, they talked about Professor X, they talked about Magneto, they talked about Dr. Dumas, what was the other Dr. Dume? He said Dr. Freeze.

Dr. I was like, sir. Yeah, I'm also wondering, like, how serious the conversations were if someone didn't correct him like, um, Mr. Freezes. But I, but knowing one Carlis Pesito and how seriously he takes stuff like this. Oh, he did. I think he might be misleading on purpose. I think he did it on purpose. Yeah, he's a smart guy. I would not be surprised if you get either one of them to pop in as whatever character they've been cast at. I mean, the Taryn hasn't been tied to anything other than Warverine. I know there's a lot of fan casting stuff, but these conversations are getting kind of

serious. I think one of them shows up. I hear rogues in a, I'm, the rumor is rogues in the Marbles. It would make sense. So it would be interesting of rogue, you know, post-credit team leading in the moments. So they're really starting to place in the X-Men. So I think that, yeah, look, from what I've heard from you guys and what you guys have been saying, like, when it comes, like I don't know enough about Namor was, and like I said, and you don't have to correct me because I'm going to correct myself, that I was like, oh, Namor's kind of like the Aquaman. Like, well, actually, it was before Aquaman. So I found that out through 7,000 comments. So, so that being said, what I have been paying attention to is the way

the Marvel always kind of spices things up as they're leading into things. They've already been throwing this X-Men thing. They threw in the first kind of nod that you really got was in Ms. Marvel with the music. And now they just played in the show you anymore. And if they're going to probably stick to the idea that this guy... I imagine they'll at least refer to him as a mutant. Yeah.

I think they definitely will. And I also find it funny. I think about it. Every single one of these films post credits, let's see. Maybe not Shang-chi didn't introduce anybody new. But... Didn't they, though? They did the Wong thing making him effectively an event.

Like, they did the Avenger kind of a semblement. But no one knew. But right, but Eternals, you ended up not only with Ebony Store, but Blade. Yeah. As well as Star Fox. And they also brought back. Well, they also brought back. It wasn't a post credit.

You're talking post credits specifically. Well, they decide that they're going to introduce somebody new and move along with that. There wasn't anybody in Spider-Man, right? Am I crazy? The symbiate. The Simbiate got left behind. Yeah, that's a new character. So that's a new character.

Multiverse of Madness. You ended up with... Yeah, exactly. And then... Eternals? At Turtles, we had two in a turnerals. So at this point. Thor.

Thor. And then Thor, Hercules. So with all of that, I genuinely think, building, building. I think,

like I said, Doom is either post-credit or in the movie, and then I think we might get an X-Men in a secondary post-credit. And I love your sister. I'm telling you, the way that they set this up,

though, right now, it is getting me more excited for an MCU X-Men film. Because I love the X-Men films. I mean, one, two,

days of future past. Like the whole, though, and because they've set up this multiverse, it's not taken away from anything. So when they start up this new one, I'm really excited the way that they're kind of piecing it together. So I do hope that they do start to explain more of the X-Men mythology inside of it.

So I think it's going to be Professor X that's going to show. Yeah, because or Reed Richards, I don't know. I don't know. I think it is going to be connected to either X-Men are fantastic four. I think you're both right. Yeah.

So that's our- I think it's a long game to phase six. And I think phase five is going to be a lot more cohesive because of people being like, phase four is just joined it. I'm really wondering if phase four was meant to be longer and then they just wanted to have like everything. Because these phases seem so much shorter now.

Five, five and six, we've never mapped out this far. Right. So, I mean, I think we'll see a D23, them spell out a lot of phase six, but I'm also wondering if they like insert new dates.

I'd also be curious if they're like, hey, we've got these eight movies. It's actually 10. Like they just like, and like add some stuff. Yeah, I think we're getting a lot of stuff for it.

It's a few weeks. That's going to be a big episode of capes and cows. It absolutely, absolutely is. All right, well, let's move on, though, too, because we covered, we don't know how much time left, then we covered two stories. Which, well, you know, look, they're a big stories. They're a big story. Yeah, like unprecedented.

It were big stories. We talked about that character. We talked about that character. All right. Well, just, I guess, carry out. We spoke about Bat Girl throughout that story in general. It's just a shame. It is because she is a really good actress.

She's a really good actress. And I think that what the rumors were that after, after the film was, what I will say about her, is that she, unlike Zoloft, had great PR etiquette. The way she handled it, yeah. She handled herself so classy. Now, there are a lot of people. There are people that we have worked with that are so horrible on social media. It's so horrible that if they're upset and angry, they go,

and they tweet out crap. And they get themselves in, and nobody wants to work with them. Why do I want to work with that person? And she has every right to be upset. Yeah. She has every right. The guy who runs the studio basically said that the movie that she was involved in was garbage. And yet, even though there's some people saying around the side that she was great in it.

Yeah. It's so hard to hear. And I can't imagine putting on the suit and losing it. Of course. It's got to be heartbreaking. But the thing with her, that she did so well. And unlike a lot of people who's screaming yell and feel like, well, you know what? Then I'm going to get you through social media.

Yeah, she didn't do it. Yeah. She didn't do it. She took the high road and she said, no, this, I'm so proud of everything we did. And it's like, oh, I became a massive fan of hers like that because that's how you handle yourself today on social media. You don't yell at people. You don't feel like, oh, I'm going to get you with something now, too.

I don't like the way that you did this if we're working together and now we're not working together. Well, I'm going to get you and get all the mob behind you. She didn't do that. Yeah. She could have. And she probably would have had a lot of people going, oh, you know what? Yeah.

Get them. She didn't do the get them. She didn't do the get-eming, good for her. Good for her. What is she done prior to this? I'm not supposed to-ray. No, not West Side Story. No, no, no.

In the Heights. Oh, thank you. The other musical, I mixed those two up. Sorry, Stephen Spielberg and. No, no. Obviously, that was big, but like she isn't a household name yet. No. And from somebody that's been in this industry is, I mean, we all have in different facets,

something's not a thing until it's a thing. Like, even with the contract signed, even with shooting, until you actually see yourself on the screen. She got paid. She got paid, so that's good. That's good. And I've been in that situation too. I know, I know.

But it's like you get paid, you shot everything, and then you show up and you're like, I'm in half the episode. It's more important to be a thing than the money. Let me throw this though at you guys, though, too, because the way that she handled herself, and the directors handled themselves well, too. Yeah, I was going to say the directors, they got insulted pretty direct. And they did it. They did as well.

So I don't want to take it away from them. But there's just something about her, because she was kind of the first one out at the gate in the way that she did it. Here is the, here is the thing. people aren't really talking about. Let's say, let's say the movie was awful. Let's say it was a terrible,

terrible movie, right? And that it really shouldn't see the light of day, right, as far as it. And the tax write off is, this,

the way that she handled herself might be the best thing ever because it doesn't matter how great of a person is. If she comes out in that movie and that movie's garbage and it's terrible. Hallie Berry seems great.

All right. And it's like, and that movie comes to, and how, but Hallie Barry had a career. Hallie Barry had a career. Hallie Barry had a career.

Hallie Berry was okay afterwards, too. Even though, yeah, she carried around to stink for a little bit. But she's Hallie Berry. Right. This girl doesn't have a career. So if the movie's that bad, comes out and it could take her career. It doesn't matter how good she's in the movie. Right.

The movie stinks. So maybe for her, it was a blessing in disguise. Again, I haven't seen the movie. It could be a phenomenal movie, just from the things that you're hearing behind the scenes. The thing I took away from it, I just became a massive fan of hers because, like I said, there are people that you don't know that handle social media. it terribly. There are people that we know that handle it terribly that use it as a weapon. She did not do that. She chose not to use it as a weapon. She used it as a beacon of, of hope, of

positivity. So the way that she handled herself should be a lesson for everyone. That was such a classy way to do it. It's the opposite of the PR that we're feeling about Warner Brothers. Yes. Because we're feeling like Warner Brothers isn't advocating it. They did it wrong. They're not communicating. She's communicating. She's being positive. I love her. I love her. I love her. want to hear from Zazlov and the team that is being assembled something that feels more coherent than an investor call because an investor call is a voicemail effectively and we're not going to experience anything like that. I want to see graphics that aren't men and women separate. I want to feel like what's going to like fandom. I don't know that there is a fandom. They're not doing one now.

But I mean like I don't know if there is going forward. It's already been announced. When? A while ago. It's not, it's nowhere on the books. I promise you. I just read something about it. You said a while ago. You would have like a month. I talked to someone recently that would know and they said there's no plans yet there's not a yes or a no it wasn't a definitive no. What's hard is this the end of the year soon

like and not, I know it's the middle of the year but you have to plan out New York Comic Conno now and stuff effectively. So it's approaching the end of the year. We're talking about Wakanda forever. You need to have this. You very well might be right that it's not happening but I don't think there's been a definitive.

It's not. But I think they need, I would love if D.C. came out for again, the people in this top 10% of the iceberg of awareness to have something thing to discuss that feels like a Hall H announcement. That feels like they need this flip the switch and say like here's what we're doing. And I want them to take their time.

You don't need to tell me who your new Superman is, but I want to know what's happening. And I think that's fair to the bad press to just kind of flip it. So we have stuff to talk about that isn't because I don't want to shit talk. I want to feel good about the movement. No, no, you're right. It's specific. So I just misread this. It's specifically that they have not, they have not announced it at all in an account and with

essentially no calendar dates. Right. That's the mess. I don't think it's going to happen. I'm just saying it didn't definitively. They didn't say it was going to go. Sure, sure, sure. All right.

So I guess we have one more thing we can talk about here before we move on. What's this one? Oh, well, shoot. I can do that too. How much time you guys have? You guys got to go out here and say? All right, 10, 15. All right, let's go.

Because I do want to cover these things. We've got Shee Hulk coming up. Sheeulk's going to be a, she Hulk starts it all next week with Shehulk and then Lord of the Rings and then Andor or Game of Thrones, sorry, I missed Game of Thrones, but all four of those come up. Boom, boom, boom, then Cobra Kai. Yeah. And then you just start going. Sheeulk kicks it all off.

Yeah. So I just mentioned recently, when I was in, when I was in Florida, I was talking about, this goes back to the idea, like, you would feel that in our circle, everybody knows about Shehawk. Everybody's seen it. They're like, well, what is it? I was talking to people that just watch Marvel, watch, I'll say, well, what my, my, brother.

Like, yeah, well, what's the tone of it? And then my, my friend, my childhood friend, his girlfriend, watches all this stuff. and is like, oh, I kind of heard of what is it? And I said, it's kind of like Allie McBeal in Marvel. And she's like, oh, that sounds like kind of right up my alley. And she watches all this stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. A lot of the audience finds out about it either the day before it comes out

or after it's come out. Right, right? And so I showed the trailer. My one friend who was like a crumudgeon, a self, and it's like, nah, I'm over Marvel. So he didn't like it. I knew that he wouldn't. And he knew he wasn't going to watch it before you watch it.

My brother, who likes more of the lighthearted, fun stuff. loved it. I thought the trailer was great. She loved it, right? So they both loved it. I watched the trailer again. I hadn't seen it in a while. Thought it's a really good trailer.

It really is. I'm still out of those four of those shows that I mentioned, it's my least. Sure. Because you guys know me, like I don't mind humor in it. People always... As long as that joke,

Joe, Joe, Joe, Joe, Joe, Joe, Joe, Joe, as long as it's balanced. And this already looks like what I will say about this show that I completely... It's telling you what it is. Yeah. It's not... Thor surprised you, and Thor said,

oh, no, no, no. This is a full. on, this is a Saturday Live movie. That was never a thing. She Hulk, this is the first time you've seen it. And then I saw some, I was watching some animated. I was going through and watching animated. And it seems like that's what it was.

That's the character. It seems like, she rose people, she breaks balls. Like that's what it seems. So I'm like, okay. So they're basically doing what made the comic popular. Right. I still don't love the CGI yet, but we're not there yet. But also, and I appreciate the studio coming out and backing their, their,

They essentially were like, look, man, a show like this takes time. It was time to put a trailer out. And they're not out here like sweatshop working people, but they are working insane hours. So like if we get to the actual release and it looks like this, fine. You want to roast somebody. You want to come out on. That's one thing. But the team is working nonstop up to that point.

So it's kind of effect. And we had to put something out. And at the end of the day, She Hulk is going to inherently be harder to get right because the uncanny valley because she looks more like a human than the Hulk does. The Hulk has different features. That big huge blockhead. Yeah. So the Hulk is basically a Hulk and she Hulk is a green woman that's tall.

And then the secondary thing is the models have been done for Hulk and Abomination for years, putting them and remastering them. And that's going to be years of development versus months. And then like you said, she is a green hulking woman walking around, right? Captain America, you put a costume on him. You got to do a little bit of like stuff. But same thing with Miss Marvel. Yeah, you got to do the light effects,

but you don't have to, you have to fully change her. And by the way, Hulk was not easy to get for a while. People forget. Hulk was, first two, those first two bad,

I mean, people were not loved, like the Ang Lee one and other stuff as Hulk was coming out. They were like, oh, they were going to get it right. And now they got them right. So I'm aware of that.

Like, I just don't know because, and I was even talking to someone recently that's saying how Hawkeye was like their favorite, I think it was the same two people I was just talking about, how Hawkeye was like their favorite show. It's one of my least favorite. And it's not,

that show is pretty consistent. for the most part. I just, like, I didn't like the way they did Kingpin. I thought they did him dirty. And I think that there's just, oh, and then we'll, we'll end with that. Speaking of Kingpin and Punisher and all that, I saw your little tweet exchange with the fans about that one.

But, but, uh, but, uh, but, uh, I will, I will say that I am curious about she Hulk. People are like, well, why are you going to watch it if you, if you're not, if you don't think it's going to be good? I didn't think, uh, Wanda Vision was going to be good. I loved Wanda Vision. Yeah. I didn't think there's a lot, there's a lot of shows that I don't think

crap for loving Loki and like that's not what a lot of people love it's my favorite. I didn't think that I was going to like the same man. I love the first episode of the same. Oh, I haven't started. My homie devoured it in like 36. I would have probably tried. I watched it with my I watched it with my brother. He was on his phone. My, my, my, his, his, his, his, his fiancee and I watched, watch, we, watch, we, the three of us were sitting on the couch and like, we were watching it. And I, and I saw my phone. I didn't be watching it. I thought she was sleeping. She's like, no, I'm watching it. Oh, great. She was really into it. So,

we're uh i i love i love that show i was like you guys know me i'll go into this if i think it's going to stink and if it's great i'm not just going to say something stinks right i if she all turns out i could come back here in two weeks and say dude that first episode was hilarious yeah that was a really good show are you guys going to have seen any before next thursday do the screen did the when are they're out are they out of yeah i don't know i got to check i got to check my account then i'm okay so i'm i'm doing a reaction with the real rejects starting it tomorrow. What the same?

So I'll have seen it. She Hulk. I'll have seen at least one or two next. I probably have it. I got a look. Okay. Thanks for letting me know. And it premieres on Monday.

It does it this Monday come in? No. In a couple days. I thought it premieres on the third. No, no, the premiere. Oh. Yeah, yeah.

So if you guys want to go to that, you can see the first two. Got it, got it, got it. Okay, anyway. So she Hulk's coming out. The thing that I was going to mention with the, so I saw this thing where Rosario Dawson was at some some Comic Con or whatever.

C2, whatever. it was. Yeah, is that what it was? Yeah, I think so. Okay, well, and she was there. And what the hell is that? It's a Chicago Trade Expo, I think. Chicago Comic and Entertainment Expo. That's what it is. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I remember. Okay, yes. I've never been. That's clever. I never put that together until this moment. So she's walking and some fan or something the day before says to her, that tells her the Punisher got confirmed, whatever it was, right? So she's on stage and she had mentioned to the audience. She said, well, the Punisher, I just found out yesterday that the

Punisher is going through. And John Bernthel. John Berthel. I'd love to work with him again. So everybody didn't, they're like, oh, my God, she just confirmed it. That hasn't been, that hasn't been confirmed before. And then she walked it back and said, no, no, I just heard that from a fan. Rosario Dustin's one of my favorite.

And she is self-proclaimed terrible at this. She's spoiled stuff with Asoka. She's got to stop talking to it. Because she doesn't get that Tom Holland PR, but she got that Tom Holland PR. Yeah. I'm not saying, I'm not saying that she's lying. I very well think that maybe was a fan. that said that to her, but even if that's the case, don't, don't say that.

Right. You got to, you know, she knows well enough. She's not what that sentence is. She's not a rookie. Yeah. She should, at this point, she should go, hey, is this, because Josh Horowitz interviewed, who's the actor that's playing Kang? Oh, Jonathan Majors.

Jonathan Majors. Jonathan Majors was on the carpet with Josh. And Josh, it was right after they announced the Kang thing. He hadn't heard about it. Jonathan hadn't heard about it. So he's on it. And Josh says to him, you're in, you're in Avengers now. you're doing this and you're going to be doing that.

You're going to be an ant man and you're going to be in all this. And he's like, what? Like he's not saying anything. And then his publicist is like, they announce it. And he's like, all they announces. Yeah. I mean, that's how you handle it. That's how you handle it.

The funny thing is, too, I'm not saying that Rosario hasn't been doing interviews for a long time. I know she has. Jonathan Starr is rising right now. So you know he's paying attention to all. And he doesn't want to mess anything else. He's going to be the big bad. And like what I, so I ran into John, I remember I told you guys a couple of weeks ago.

I intentionally, I don't want to be the person that accidentally finds anything out. I avoided Punisher like the plague. Like, I didn't want to talk about Punisher. I talked about the comic book. I talked about how much he clearly read certain arc. You talked about the books. I didn't want to hear a single thing that would make me liable for information. I don't want to accidentally have.

Because I don't want to be talking to you guys and be like, yeah, you know what he's coming about? I don't want to be in Rosario Dawson's Spock. And that's why I tweeted like, I wait for a secondary source as best I can because A, it's true and she shouldn't have said something. or B, it's not true, and she shouldn't set something. And no matter what, I don't want to be getting Rosario Dahl. I don't want to cause more stress for her.

She seems lovely. I don't want to retweet something that's going to get her more pressure. I totally get it. So who knows if it's going to happen. And I do happen to think he's going to be back. I think so. But I like that I think and don't know so. Yeah, exactly.

All right, that was, I think this is the very last thing right here. Green Lantern, I guess, is still, they're going forward with a show. Do you know anything about this point? Yeah, they cast a few people as various lanterns about a year and a half. half ago. And they are like, you know, the TV, you know, cast members. And I think it's not Hal Jordan. I think it's like other lanterns. I think they need to go John Stewart as the lead. I think that seems to be the plan. It seems like they were, like they cast a guy as Guy Gardner, they cast other supporting core. But it sounds to me like they're going to do an actual space cop show,

so I have plural cop. But I think John Stewart as the lead is what they're doing. I would love that. I would even love a scenario if they either A, I mean, I would love just John Stewart all the way through. But if you either A, want to make. each episode follow a different lantern. So if it's like this one's guy, this one's John, this one's Jessica. And then you're Magnolia and they come back together. Absolutely. You could do that.

Kind of like for me, I was going to go animorphs. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Or season one or book one of Greenlandon is John Stewart. Season two is God. Like, you know, I think that either one would be. And then they intertwine like they come back for smaller rules and that way you build out the universe

because I think what they should be looking at with the greater DC universe, this tenure plan is what the strength of Marvel is is the cosmic and local. What the strength of Marvel is is everyone does feel like they can mesh. We saw with Gardens the Galaxy. When that came out,

I loved it more than I expected, but I also was like, wait, is this gonna fit with Iron Man? Like, how will they do this? And then the strength of Marcus and McPhieling and the Russo brothers is they balance those tones, I think the best.

I still think the best Thor is Infinity War and Endgame Thor because it's a mix of Tyca and Brannock. And I think that's really important. What I think DC needs to be looking at is, hey, we want to make sure our movies feel different, but cohesive.

We need our space cops. We also need Superman to be the Boy Scout that we haven't really gotten to C&B. We need Batman to be amongst gods and know that he's a human, so that feels tangible. I think if they're going to reset or reboot, they need to focus on tone more than anything else. So if they're starting this Green Lantern show, they need to go, okay, this is what we're doing? How does that relate?

Blankety, blankety,ety, blankety, they need someone to go, what is the tone I want people to feel and how can that work for this other thing when they meet? Yeah. All right, listen, so so much that we've talked about here today, we got the Greenland. Do you have any thoughts on the Greenland? I mean, just that. I genuinely hope that John Stewart plays a prominent role.

And again, I would absolutely love a situation where we're just following different lanterns either episodically or season-wise. I think that that would just be a really smart move because everybody has their favorite lantern and they're all very different. I would like to explore them all. Like, Hald Jordan's fine.

But for me, he's kind of the most boring personally. He's the golden age take. It's just like any other golden age character. They were writing heroes to be approachable. they didn't have the characters established enough to add the nuance in depth we expect so the characters don't get the chance to be more interesting. And he could be interesting later on

when he starts doing some evil stuff, but like Kyle's more interesting to me. Kyle is my favorite landing. Kyle, John, and Guy are all more interesting than Haljoin. You're speaking German to me, but you'll find out. But I want to learn German.

That's why we're here. That's why we're in Caves and Cals. Nine. Nine. That's how many lanterns I want. That's right. All right. We had a lot to talk about here today in Cape Cajal. Good episode.

This is kind of our first official episode. It's our first official episode, by the way, in studio. Yes. So we did it. Here we are. So if you're brand new to the show every Friday, unless we do the rewatch, by the way, Cape Seals will be on every Friday with me, Winston, and Coy. If you haven't already to do it, subscribe to the channel. As I mentioned, you guys, going to have some big announcements coming up very, very soon. Help us get the 70,000. The Shee Hulk reviews will be coming out next week. We're probably going to, if all of us see it, maybe we'll do a full-on episode next week on She-Hulk. If not, we'll definitely be covering it. next week for sure. Podcast feed, Apple Podcasts, Spotify,

anywhere, podcasts are found. Make sure you do that. Leave your comments. Help us out on the algorithm as well. And that's it. Follow Koi, follow Winston, and we'll see you guys on the flip side. This is capes and cows.

Peace.