The Kristian Harloff Show - OUCH! Aquaman And The Lost Kingdom tracking to have low opening weekend on par with The Flash.

Episode Date: December 1, 2023

Become a Patron!: https://www.patreon.com/TheBigThingShow Welcome to 'The Big Thing Capes and Cowls' where we dive deep into the latest news from the superhero world. In today's episode, we're discussing the anticipated low opening weekend for 'Aquaman And The Lost Kingdom', which is tracking on par with 'The Flash'. We also delve into Bob Iger's controversial comments about 'The Marvels' and the lack of supervision that led to its failure. Was this an insensitive remark? We're breaking it down. And finally, we're talking about Michael Fassbender's decision to close the book on playing Magneto in the future. What does this mean for the franchise? Join hosts Kristian Harloff and Winston A. Marshall as they discuss all this and more. Don't forget to like, share, and subscribe for more superhero news and insights. Tune in now! #DC #DCU #aquaman #movie #reaction #bobiger #disney #xmen  Join hosts Kristian Harloff and Winston A. Marshall as they discuss all this and more. Don't forget to like, share, and subscribe for more superhero news and insights. Tune in now! AG1: http://www.drinkag1.com/BIGTHING ROCKETMONEY: http://www.rocketmoney.com/THING DRAFTKINGS CASINO: Get the app and use the code BIG THING! This episode is sponsored by BETTERHELP: http://www.betterhelp.com/BIGTHING OUR MERCH STORE IS LIVE: https://www.teepublic.com/stores/the-big-thing-kh-channel?ref_id=27393  

What's going on, everybody? Welcome back to Capes and Cows. It's Friday. Sorry, look, we only had three episodes this week. Give you three good ones. We had three episodes. We had some technical difficulties. But no difficulties yet.

As I jinx myself, starting this episode. But we have some things to talk about, and one of those things is Aquaman. Tracking to not do well. What does that mean? What's that going to be for the rest of the, in general, and he's going to pick up in 2024. Theaters are really relying on it. So how's that going to go?

Michael Fastbender, you guys know him. Well, he was a Magneto for a long time. He says he's got no interest in coming back. We'll discuss if we think he's BS and will he show up in Secret Wars. And Bob Eager, he's been in the news. We'll talk about not all his stuff. He's said a lot, but something in particular, the comic movie. So about the Marvels.

He said, Marvels are the main reasons that didn't do well. because it didn't have enough supervision. What the hell that means? So we'll talk about that. There's going to be no supervision with the kids running wild at Burbank, Flappers. That's right. We're going to be there. You guys are going to be there with us, right?

It is going to be Flappers this Saturday 9.30 p.m. in Burbank. If you're not there, it means you hate us. If you're there, it means that you're supportive. I think that's right. Or it just means you live far away. we get better things to do I don't know either way

we hope to see you there it's going to be fun it's going to be me it's Winston it's coy Brett Sheridan Kate Mulligan Chris Carr

and Roxy Shriar hosting and who knows maybe it would be a special guest or two you figure that out if you show up if you don't

jokes on you so Apple podcast Spotify anywhere podcasts are found it's capes and cows let's do it welcome back

ladies and gentlemen to the big thing it's me Christian Harlaw Winston A. Marshall. Corey is screaming at people on Twitter, so we are here right now. He was able to make it today.

So he'll be back. He'll be on the show on Saturday, though. It'll be on the show. Man, it's in two days. I know. Well, for tomorrow, actually. It's tomorrow. It's tomorrow.

Yeah, so it's going to be a fun show. We taped, Winston and I had taped a show that we were going to air yesterday, and then we lost it after about. It was one thing, because the same thing happened when I was table with Marisol and Adam, but it was only like 10 or 15 minutes. This was like a 40-minute show.

We were already like 35, 40 minutes in it. I think the thing that sucks, we talked about such good stuff. We talked about the state of the box office. We'll do that again. Yeah, we're talking about that. I mean, we started talking about Taylor Swift and what she was able to pull off.

We started talking about Michael Jackson's penis. Like, it was just so much stuff. Don't say we. It does, it does suck, though, because Winston had basically compared I can't even do I can't even say the whole thing

because it was like so it was just such a great bit segue it doesn't work I'm so bummed I'm so bummed that I just can't and I'm so defeated that I'm not even upset about it that we lost all that stuff but we are going to talk about

I think this we'll go right into this Aquaman thing all right Aquaman and the Lost Kingdom splashes down on box office tracking with numbers lower than the flash oof theater owner

are banking on Aquaman and the Lost Kingdom being a box office hit next month, but based on tracking data, the sequel will be the DCEU's latest and final financial failure. Josh Wilding, a comic book movie. This won't have been the news that Warner Brothers was hoping for. According to deadline, Aquaman and Lost Kingdom's three-week tracking is currently pointing to a four-day opening of just $50 million when it opens on December 22nd. Not helping matters is the fact that Christmas Eve is now on a Sunday. so there's at least a slim chance that the sequel will find its sea legs when Christmas is over.

In 2018, Aquaman splashed down was 67.8, but eventually grossed 1.1 billion worldwide. There's at least the chance this follow-up will take off, but it will have to do so without the near 300 million haul its predecessor accumulated in China. Reviews will be crucial to Aquaman and Lost Kingdom success, and Warner Brothers has yet to pull the trigger on its last-minute marketing campaign. For example, we're expecting heavy promotion from lead star Jason Momoa at least one more trailer. Tracking's been all over the place this year, but when it comes to comic book movies, they haven't fared well. Guardians 3 opened a 12 million beneath expectations with $118 million, and the Marvel's debuted with $47 million, despite any projections of more than $70 million. In the Flashes case, that was aiming for $70 million, but debuted with a mere 55. If Aquaman in the Lost Kingdom also fails short, could be a disaster.

However, the DCU is being rebooted by DCU, and Mamoa has already pretty much confirmed that his time as Arthur Curry ends with this movie. While that is going to lessen interest from moviegoers, it's not as if Warner Brothers will be banking on the sequel being a box office hit in order to pave the way for a three-equal. So, yeah, there's a lot here. We talked about it the other day with Mike and myself

when we're on, just saying that the theaters really need a big movie in December. Normally, whether it was when... People also forget that Star Wars in 2015 really started the kind of Christmas trend. Not that there was not big movies used to come out. But it wasn't like this. This was the only movie, Star Wars was the only movie

at that time that had ever crossed $100 million opening weekend. No movie had ever done that in December. And then a ton of them did, and obviously Avatar destroyed last year. And Spider-Man the year before that? That's right. And there's no big movie that's No Way Home been two years? It's been two years, man. Oh, my God.

There's no big movie right now like No Way Home Avatar. And now this one, people are like, it's like, hey, guys, Aquaman's coming out. What do you guys think? But either way, though, this is not good. No. And it's also because of the same thing we've been talking about, a million times over, mediocre movies, and the point to make is this,

and you said it when we did the recording of this thing, is that the streaming is a major part of this. But with that comes if you know that, if you know that your streaming is going to be a reason why people are not going to the movies as much, change your stuff. Make it interesting. If it's going to be an event, make it an event.

It should be from next. on, like, people are going to be annoyed by this, but it should go back to what it was pre-pandemic. A movie should not come out on streaming until it's been almost a damn year. Because by doing the, that's the only way you're going to get people to go back. I get you trying to recoup something. Oh, man, look at Barbie. Barbie, people went to see Barbie, and Barbie came out two and a half months later. Barbie, to my knowledge, still isn't on. Are you sure?

Yeah, you can get it on streaming. Okay. So if it's a rented stuff to be, you can get it. But I would almost make the argument that you should be playing that like you could have a loose game plan. And you go, if it does money at the box office, we'll drop it a little earlier because we've made our money. And if it doesn't, then it's got to wait. I understand that what used to happen a lot of times is like you would end up with like the HBO's, the stars, the show times. You would be like a, oh, if you didn't make it in the box office, maybe we can throw it to them for a licensing real quick and try and recoup something.

I think you almost have to go the opposite because you unfortunately have broken people. You have told them that they don't need to go to the movie theater because it will be at their home. See, I think it's, I think there's a portion of that, but I don't, I think more so is streaming. It's the fact of, again, using the family as an example. A family of four is, has subscriptions to Disney Plus, Max, Amazon, and Paramount. So right there, that's close to anywhere between 70 to 90 bucks. a month, right? So if you have all that and then a movie comes out, that people go, well, do we want to go

the movies this weekend? Well, what's out? Do I want to drop another hundred, maybe close a hundred bucks with parking, snacks, theater tickets, all that stuff? Do I want to drop that? Or out of the money on spending on all those different apps, do I find something and we order a pizza and that's it? And that, because that, because if you look at something like Barbie, Oppenheimer,

insidious, red door, five nights at Freddy. That's the one thing I was going to say. We have got to get back to, because it's not just don't spend $300 million on the box office. That is, that's a non-starter. Obviously, we got to get back to not doing that. But I think I look at Five Nights at Freddy's, which they actually drop simultaneously in the theaters and on streaming. Which is bizarre because that normally, it kind of negates the point you made before. It does.

But it also shouldn't be something that they start doing all the time. Never. It didn't even work for a lot of times. The only reason that that worked and this is what I was going to get. It's not even Halloween. It's the fact that that fan base is very, like, you're playing specifically to them. It did not cost a lot of money to make that movie. Right.

Because that would drop off the second week for sure. The fans saw it. They all saw it. It made like 35 or 40 mil, which considering I think it was like a, $15 million budget or something like that and you really didn't have to do too much advertising because that was a movie that those fans have known about that forever.

I think of the blackening, which I believe also had like a $5 or $10 million budget and cleared like I think $50 million by the time it was over. The risk is so much lower. And it's like, and again, Mike and I did this whole thing on Disney where you showed like the stuff that they had and the money that they were spending when Chepec was there

and also that Iger probably greenlit before he left the first time. And it's like, like the budgets and there was one victory, which was Guardians, one victory. The others were either major losses or maybe broke even or made a dollar 50. You know, it's like barely. It's like it was very disappointing because if you looked at a few of them that didn't do what, like something like the like, let's look at the marvels, which just the Marvel's

cost like $250 million to make, should have been significantly lower. Indiana Jones should have been significantly lower. The Haunted Mansion, for some reason, costs $150 million, a little lower. That movie should have cost like $60 million. Then it would have made a profit. Absolutely.

Or it got close anyway. The only way that you could really do a Barbie or an Oppenheimer, and I do believe, I know they played off of each other. We talked about that too in the lost episode, but I think Oppenheimer really got a boost out of Barbie because people were so like the Barbenheimer movement. It was a marketing thing. It was an unexpected marketing thing that they were lucky.

Like synergy that works. But all that being said, you're talking about something original. You're talking about something that had big names tied to it. So whether this is a Christopher Nolan movie, I know there were a lot of stars in it, but the main draw there was Christopher Nolan. Or in Barbie's case, it's Greta directing it. It's got Issa.

It's got Marco Robbie. It's got Ryan Gosling. And it's got Barbie. And it's got Barbie. Yeah, right. So you had a situation where this became an event thing. The reason why you would see something like Spider-Man do what it did, major property, done well, culmination of something.

Connected to Marvel. You know what I'm saying? Villains. Or not villains, the Toby. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Avatar. Already one of the bigger movies that's out there. A lot of that tied to the technology, tied to James Cameron, all of that.

A top gun tapping into that nostalgia was a good movie. They're all good. But that's why you go back into what's happening with Aquaman. Because if it was really, and this would they say as much? If they come back and it's like this movie, it's fantastic. It's great. But the problem was the lead up to the movie. And a lot of these things, the writing's on the wall.

We've been talking about this movie and the potential problems of it for a long time. when you're already on the defense, two months out, that's a problem. And James Juan was, like, defending it and go, no, no, no, we didn't have to do reshoots. We didn't have to do this. It's not good. No, and then there's the rumor that James Gunn at the last, like, was, ordered like a fifth round of reshoots once he saw it. It's like that kind of stuff. It's like that's, you're dead before you even start.

What's interesting is that I understand when you're a big business, you're going to move with big business energy, but. Look how the rest of the world is moving specifically America as far as inflation. For all the rest of us to go, I got $100 to spend across anything that's not essential. I'm going to be very frugal with how I spend that money. For them to still throw $300 million at something, they have to think the same way that we are. Because you got to understand, we're not in this excess. Because pre-inflation, people were just throwing their dollars at things. We don't have that.

Well, Disney was also hitting a billion dollars a lot. Because... For some of the reasons that you're talking about. But they were... And the movies were better. Yeah. And the movies were better. And so, and what we did talk about was with, like, Taylor Swift,

and that concert movie that she did, it cost her like $20 million to do, which is like a night of parking at the Staples Center for one of her shows or wherever it was. SoCal. SoCal. SoCal. SoCal Stadium.

So, but... And she put it all together. There was the whole tour from the LA shows, whatever it was. Fans went out to see it, and they supported it. It made a lot of sense. And it was also because the same analogy made before, the family who knows that they're Taylor Swift fans, they know exactly what they're going to get.

They get the theater experience. And it is what it is. And you understand why it made more money than Shazam. It made more money than the Marvels. It made more money than a lot of these movies. On top of the thing that I think that's so interesting, and I didn't even think about this when we talked about this, first time,

Taylor Swift's tour specifically wasn't just like a celebration of like midnights that she just dropped last year. It was her heiress tour, meaning, guys, I'm going to take you on a journey through the entire thing. So you look at No Way Home, which was a journey through everything.

You look at end game, which was a journey through everything. This is the ability to tap into that nostalgia, give you something new. And it felt like you were rewarding fans, especially because she hadn't been on tour since, what, 2019 because of the pandemic. Yeah, sure.

And so when you put all that together, it was the perfect recipe, and especially for if you couldn't make the tour, you went to the movie. And especially now with the way that things are shot and the surround sound and all that, it made a lot of sense that it did what it did because you know what you're going to get.

A lot of these superhero movies, you don't, it's weird. You know what you're going to get, but you don't know what you're going to get. You know what I mean? I remember the analogy now how I got to Michael Jackson. I'm not going to do it again, but you know what you're going to get.

You know what you're going to get. It's like that's the whole point is that when you go, you look at the, you hope. If you're going to spend the money on it, you're like, I don't know. Am I going to come out of here happy or am I going to basically be disappointed again? And that's the problem is you also had. I watch a series of YouTube channels called like The The Theorists. They do a game theory, film theory, food theory, style theory. And they actually were breaking that down about like Disney's in trouble and things they should like turn around.

They were talking about with like YouTube videos, for example, when you're asking your audience to trust you, a lot of that ends up being like if you were withdrawing something from the bank, if you're constantly making withdrawals and you're not actually depositing things in, eventually your account's going to go into the negative, right? So in this case, it was this idea of just like, just withdraw, withdraw, withdrawal, withdrawal of all this stuff

that people don't necessarily want to see, or it was bad enough that like you could get away with a bad movie every now and again. Right. You cannot get away with subpar. Three of your five movies are bad. Yeah.

That does not work. No, and it's also, it's just, and it's what we'll talk about in the second was one of the things that Bob Igar, Bob Igar was like addressing

because he knows the stockholders like, what's going on, man? Mm-hmm. And he had to, like, he's dressing a lot of these different things, whether you, whatever you're, a lot of people,

a lot of backlash on what he said, but he's in, he's in, he's on defense right now. And he needs, they all are. They really need to pick it up. for sure. Can we actually, because it's capes and cows that he was referring to back girl, can we talk about the Zazlo?

We'll talk about that also. But I think that when it comes to Aquaman, this movie is going to be in trouble in the same way that all of the projections that they'd mentioned in that article were actually under what they were supposed to make. So I think, because you've been generous to these things, and like, you know, because I think you thought Marvel was going to do like 75, 80. I thought that it might tap into that Barbie Taylor Beyonce audience. And what's so interesting was seeing a lot of podcasts be like, bro, where were the ladies on this? And part of it was like you couldn't do the marketing. It's the Bill Bird WNBA Joe. It's 100%.

Because what's so interesting and a lot of people have like been acknowledging this now that like they're allowed to go on press tour. Like Imman Volani is crushing. Everybody is in love with her And if they had been allowed to do that I do think you would have seen... How much more money do you think they would have brought in? Through marketing.

Through marketing? What did they pull 40? What's that? Opening weekend? What do they pull 40? Something 43 or something. I genuinely think they would have at least at 70.

And the reason for that is genuinely the number of women that I know they were like, I didn't even know this came out. I would have seen that. And then they go see it afterwards go, I really like that. I think you're being generous because maybe another, maybe another 10.

And with that, they still, even if, even if the movie would have made an additional $100 million, they still would have lost $100 million. I'm not saying that they wouldn't have. It would have helped. There's no doubt about it. But I did see people on Twitter going, oh, if they would have been able to promote, how much more money you think they would have made guys, even if it went, even if you're right, even if they made an additional 20 or 30 that weekend, still.

major loss. Absolutely. I'm not saying that it's not. We have agreed that these movies are two, the budgets are way too big. Inflated. That should have only been saved for a no way home and Infinity War and game. Like the end all, be all. We are finishing this up. It should not be for your average movie. It's one of the things that Iger does address. So when it comes to Aquaman itself, I'm going to say that this action, this movie opening weekend is 48 million. That's what I'm to say. Dude, I mean, I guess Christmas helps a little bit. I'm, I've been scared off now, and especially because the DCU has been biting it,

I think, harder than Marvel. I'm going to say it's only going to pull 38. Because it's tracking it, like, 50-something. I think it'll pull 38. It's going to be that low. Because I think, I think, knowing that this is going up against WACC, they're both the same studio, but it's like two or three weeks earlier. I get it, but, like, family, right?

Family stuff. Wanka, color purple. Like, because I know that. Most of the black people I know, they're like, I ain't going to damn aqua man. I'm going to color purple. 100%. Like, you know, I just, I think you throw the lack of trust for the DCEU and everybody

being like, I'm already looking at Superman legacy. I don't care. I think that you had a little bit too early. Like, I think Mamoa being on SNL certainly is not a bad thing. It should not have happened last weekend or two weekends ago, whatever it was. It should have been closer in December when it's about to drop because I think it's already going to be out of people's minds. That's true.

Yeah. I just don't have faith in a lot. of what's happening. And I also think more so than anything. It's not just like a lack of trust. People are tired. And like I'm not going to spend my time doing something when I'm already so exhausted between everything happening in the Middle East, between inflation, between all the trials

that are happening with majors and Trump and everything that's happening. I'm going to go do something that I know is going to bring me joy. And if I don't think that. But you know, and you know one of the reasons why you don't think that? there's no buzz around this movie. Nope. There's no buzz around this. And if there was buzz around and excitement,

think about the excitement that we had for like no way home. Think about the excitement that was there for like Avatar. It's like it's just not there. There's no excitement for whatsoever. And especially when you get reports like this, because reports like this, and you have to have them, it hurts the movie because it's the same reason

I think that it hurt the Marvels, because the Marvels was tracking for like 70 million. And then these tracking, they're like, oh, it's going to be disappointing and tracking at 70. And those people who saw it going, I don't know, maybe we don't want to see this.

And then they pull their tickets back and they don't see it. Dude, you know, it's funny because I think about Avatar and I was shocked by how much money it ultimately made because truthfully, especially when you think about

how much actual buzz Top Gun had, how much actual Buzz Spider-Man had, I felt like nobody was talking about Avatar and I was like, where is this money coming from? Like the people that love Avatar, Love Avatar, but I just didn't, not in the news, not on social media.

It was just the people that went, went, and I was very confused by it. I think that what Avatar proved is that Avatar was the consumers film. It was the average person's movie, Blockbuster movie that you didn't have to be like in the know to see it. It's like, oh, let's go, we want to go see a big movie. What's out? Avatar's out. Oh, yeah, yeah. It was such a big, and it goes back to what you were saying before.

those films are event films. You feel like when you go, it's like when you see Avatar in the theater, you're like, you have to see that movie in the theater. You don't have to see it in the theater. You do have to see it in the theater. And the only thing that bothers me,

and again, if people flame me for it, whatever, I just don't rock with Avatar like that. You like the second one, though. I did, and I've since re-warning. I've re-watched it, and I'm feeling the same way about it that I did about the first one. But that's my point, though, right? You re-watched it on TV.

Yeah. Everybody felt that way about the first one. I didn't. I love both the movies, but everybody said the same thing. When you see that, then that's why the movie does so well in the theater. Because when you see it in the theater, you're like, whoa, it's such a spectacle. And then when you see it on TV, a lot of people go, that's fine. And I love them on TV.

I love the story of anything, too, but the emotion of the power of what that thing's doing on the big screen, it's like. A thousand percent. And that's what's so crazy to me is because, but the difference is, and this is where I think we have to find a way to thread that needle. Top guns still, like, Mavericks still plays well on a small screen. Sure. Yeah. A lot of these movies that are hitting those billion dollars numbers aren't like the, I

don't know, how the final Jurassic world made a billion. No, dinosaurs mean? Dinosaurs, because it's like, I know, I know. I get it. But it's like, but it's one, but it's the same thing where you don't have to be kind of tied in and committed to anything. you just go to the movies. It's a built-in IP.

I get it. It's not like me going, I think more like how the hell did that happen was the first Aquaman or Captain Marvel, even though Captain Marvel made it because of the in-between of like Infinity War. That's not a movie you would think would make a billion dollars. The first Aquaman is the most profitable DC-EU movie of all time. And it's like that you would never predict that. So there are times that you're like, whoa.

And the other thing that stood out to me though was that the first thing that's first movie that made a billion dollars didn't hit 150 million 200 million that's opening weekend it only did 67 which is crazy not far off from the prediction of what this is supposed to make opening weekend but the question is does it have legs and it's not opening in China that was I was going to say I'm so curious with all these movies that have hit a billy I'm very curious about how much of an impact China really does have like that Because, like, the same thing. I really enjoy the fast movies.

I actually have not seen nine or ten. I need to. But, like, I never understood prior to, because I only watched them all last year or the year before that I finally was like, I'm going to sit down and watch them all. And the first few, like, I love two. I saw two as a kid for whatever reason.

Three was fine, but I never saw anything other than two and three. Do you know much that movie cost the last one? Too much. Take a guess. 275. 350. Are you kidding me? And it made a made,

It was this year, wasn't it? Yeah, and it made money, but it lost money. The amount of money that it made, you looked at it, you would look at it, and you would go, wow, that's a lot of money. And it's not when you have to do everything. No, because they were hoping to do the... My God, dude. It made, over, I'll tell you right now, that movie cost like $350 to make without marketing. It made $704 million.

So you made no money. And you made no money. You made $0. Which is crazy. And did they break it up into like a part one, part two? Just like they did with Mission Impossible. They're going to do part two. Because Mission Impossible didn't make any money.

They spent too much money on that. And that one hurts because... Yeah, that one's not bad. That one, wasn't that a situation where because of the pandemic, that was when Tom Cruise lost it on somebody because they were... Yeah, but they lost money because of the pandemic for sure. And I thought the way that he actually handled himself was for that. He was losing on somebody because they were fucking... No, no.

I know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But they also released that movie, I think, like a week or two after Barbenheimer. Yeah, which was not, well, what are you going to do? You don't, you don't, but you didn't know that that was going to happen. And what are you going to do? You're going to last minute pull everything? Well, wait, but that's, that goes back to this whole conversation with Aquaman, and there's no buzz around it.

There was tons of buzz on Barbie. And Althonheimer, too, like tons of buzz. I remember walking around with Ellis at one point, and him going, you know, movies really going to start, firing off and people are gonna see this movie, hand over fist is Barbie. He's like, everyone's talking about this movie. Everywhere I go, everyone's talking about Barbie. And it was months before it came out.

And that is when you know. That is when you know. And there's no, like, I think Deadpool has a shot to do. I think people are excited about Deadpool. I think so. That's the type of movie that I could see doing the type of buzz that we're talking about. You know what's interesting is,

and a lot of it I think also ties to the fact that, and we've discussed this a number of times, We've gotten into such a culture of hating on things that the only stuff that actually has a tendency to do well at this point are the ones where people are actually being positive. There is not a single bad thing that was said about Barbie going into it. People were just hyped to see. They were excited to see.

Same thing with, again, going back to Top Gun. Everybody was like, dude, it's been 30 years, 40 years. I'm so excited to see this. And it was good. So if you couple the positivity with that, Because again, I keep tapping back to Infinity War end game because that was kind of the end. That was not just for the MCU as far as like there was a big shift after that. Yeah.

People were anticipating it. And so it did good things. They played the long game. I don't think anything that's really come out this year that we're like, how did this get so bad? There was more negativity. Like there were people that were anticipating the flash, but there was more negativity behind, what about Ezra and everything? doing. And what about the fact that, like, Zazov was canceled all these movies? And what about the fact that the universe going to exist anymore? But that stuff is more so within our community. That's not,

that, that doesn't stretch out to, like, the casual viewer, the question that's like, the casual viewer, in particular ones that you just brought up, because the casual view doesn't, isn't talking about Zazloff or really Ezra Miller as much. But I will say, there's still stuff going on that it's not resonating with them. And it's the, it is the same reason why I think Aquaman, and people like if you're going, especially you're in a holiday season. Hey, do you want to go, we just spend all this money on Christmas dinner and on the holiday dinners and on gifts and all these things. Do you want to go spend money on Aquaman?

Most people are going to go, I don't think so. No. I don't think so. I mean, as charismatic as MoMA is, there's only so much that will take you. So anyway, I'm very curious if you guys are going to go check out Aquaman. Are you going to see it or are you going to wait for it to hit Max a month? month later. So let us know exactly what you think in the comments for sure.

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and five free AG1 travel packs with your first purchase. Go to Drinkag1.com slash big thing. Drinkag1.com slash big thing. Check it out. This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. I know that the end of the year, the end of the year season, it gets tough for a lot of people, man. There's a lot going on for a lot of people. It is one of the toughest times of the year.

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So the link is in the description. I always pin our sponsor. as our top comment. Okay, speaking of comments, Eiger, man, talking about some stuff. Here you go. Okay, Disney CEO Bob Eiger

says the Marvel's box office woes are a result of a lack of supervision during the filming. Mark Julian over at comic book movie. Disney CEO, Bob Eiger, is causing quite a stir online as his statements regarding the Marvel's box office performance is being interpreted as a thinly veiled shot.

at director Nia da Costa. Appearing at the New York Times deal book summit, Bob Iger, making waves with the MCU online community with statements regarding the Marvels. Some fans are taking Iger's comments as a not-so-subtle jab at director Nia da Costa, stating that the Captain Marvel sequel lacked supervision during filming. The Marvels was shot during COVID, he said.

There wasn't as much supervision on the set, so to speak, where we have executives really looking over what's being done day after day after day. It's no secret that Marvel Studios president, Kevin Feige, keeps a tight grip on the overall narrative of the MCU's trajectory. However, it's a lesser-known fact that Feigey's team of executives essentially acts as his eyes and ears on set, members of the executive-level team, including Lois de Esposito, Stephen Bussard, Nate Moore, and several others. It seems Eager stating that the COVID-related protocols kept Feige's eyes and ears off set, and that's how Marvel's got off track. Some MCU fans coming to DeCosta's defense are pointing out that no.

one is suggesting Peyton Reed needed supervision on Ant Man and the Wasp, or that James Mangal needed someone looking over his shoulder on Indiana Jones and the dial of destiny. Iger could have pointed out to a number of factors that led to the film's underperformance, including the actor's strike and their inability to promote on the film, or small but vocal faction of MCU fans who spewed vitriol across the internet. They were never going to support a film starring three women. The Marvels is currently on track to end its theatrical run at roughly 300 million worldwide, from a production budget of 219.

It is certainly a gigantic misfire for the once unflapable MCU, but it's not exactly great PR for Eiger to throw DeCosta under the bus. His timing recently has been abysmal. His timing is terrible, and there's certain ways that, this is right after this movie comes out,

and what he should have done in a situation like that, if you're going to say that, you've got to mention these other movies that they mention. You have to give other examples because that... Oh, God. Because that is the thing that I think does piss me off about it is there are plenty of other films that bombed. I get this is the most recent one.

That's why, but it doesn't give it an excuse of... But it is why, because it's because what happened with the Marvels? It just came out of the latest big bomb. It falls in line with whether or not we have time to talk about it with Zazlov being like, It took courage to cancel black girl. Just be aware of what you're saying. Courage.

It took courage. There's a gamble is what he meant to say. It's a gamble. It's a gamble because we're going to lose some money on it too. It's not courage. You're taking away jobs from people. It's not courage. Literally, this is going to be an extreme example here.

But it's the difference between being like, oh, yeah, you know, Winston is black versus, oh, yeah, Winston is colored. Like one of those means. the same, but you're gonna get smacked in the mouth. Right. And so it's like, instead of saying it took courage, it's like, look, it was a risk. It was a risk to do this and we know we were affecting people's lives, but we had to do something drastic. You say that, no one's gonna get mad at you.

They're gonna be like, damn, I really wish you hadn't canceled it, but fine. Say, look what I did. Look what I did. It took courage for me to eliminate jobs. It took courage. It's like, it didn't think courage. Dude. It was a tough decision.

It was the CEO that laid off everybody still got his bonus and then started to and crying about like, this is so hard for me. They don't pay attention. Just drying his eyes with cash. They don't pay attention to what they're saying. And like, so you look at it with Iger, what Iger's doing, right? And he's saying he's going, okay, there's a lot of problems and I'm going to address it. Because there's other things that he said to.

And he said things along the lines of like when he makes a public statement about, well, we're not going to do these. There's one thing when you're sending messages, but it can't dominate the whole film. And again, there's something inside of what he's saying I get. But dude, look, first, this is right after the South Park thing happens. So it's going to look like you're like, oh, oh, maybe they were right. That's probably, plus, there's always been political messages inside of all movies.

But it's a matter of, again, it's how you say things, and you can say things to people. And when you're doing public stuff, it's like, look, if he said the same thing, behind closed doors, look, I'm all for messaging, I'm all for, but let's make sure if we're going to do it, It fits within the narrative of the story. Let's make sure that it fits. Let's make sure that everything is working in how we want to do this and that we can tell, we can send messages,

but we're also telling the story and developing and it doesn't look like we're doing just that. You say that and you go, I see where you're coming from. But when you make a blunt statement like that, it does seem like you're trying to appease people because even the people, it looks like you're trying to appease, like even they're going,

well, took you long enough. Guess that South Park episode got you going. You don't win. Who do you try to win? I really wish that the Igers and the Zazlaws for as much money as they pay talent to do stuff. Go hang with like, I mean, Carlin's not around anymore, so you can't do that. But go hang with Chris Rock. Go hang with, you know, you controversial to say sometimes Chappelle.

Go hang with John Stewart. Go hang with these dudes that make their living talking to people and like delivering a message to somebody in joke form or in editorial form. and learn how to say this stuff. And it's weird because Iger was never that guy. He's been stepping in. He's been retired too long. No, no, no, it's not just that. Remember, he was the king of the castle

because everything was, he was Midas. Yeah. He ain't Midas anymore. Yeah. And that's the whole point is that these things, and look, he came back to a mess, but he's also part of this thing now where he's looking, and the thing where he's saying

about Nia Dacoste, it's like, it's very similar to what I just said about the messaging thing. And you said it too. You got to watch, you got to be careful what you're saying. Because I don't think, I don't think that he's wrong in the fact that not just Nita Costa, but the whole set and the whole thing probably could have had some more people giving notes. But as they mentioned in this article, Soak it in Indiana Jones, which it's certainly, I mean, I've been criticizing that movie from the start.

There's way too over budgeted, overhyped. Ant Man and the Wasp, all these different things that were, said he should have made a statement and gone, look, I know that we've had a lot of missteps. There's been times where we maybe get a little bit too much creative control to all of the directors. All of the director. What it reminds me of is it's like one of those situations where it's like if the whole team, like it's a basketball team and the whole team screws up, right? Yeah. And maybe this is like the whitest basketball team of all time.

You just go, and Winston, I'm only black guy here. why you're coming for me? Right, right. So, yeah, it's like, you just, you've got to, you've got to be able to read the room. You got to understand this. I don't, I, I understand. It's your latest bomb.

People are looking at you going, hey, what's going on? Think, think. If you're going to, you're going to single out, you're going to sing out your black female director who already was getting thrown under the bus for leaving a set early because her movie kept getting pushed that you told her, hey, it's going to be here, now it's going to be here,

but you know you're working on that other thing, and then, oh, she left early. And it's like, and you're ready throwing her under the bus and the movement, because here's the one fair thing, though, that people will, that people have to understand. Doesn't matter. The director always gets to finger pointed at them when a movie bombs.

Here's my only problem with that. I hear that, because I was actually about to then use our one sports analogy for the day. for those that are football fans or that you're not, the Kansas City Chiefs for the reigning Super Bowl champs, they have, because of Patrick Mahomes and Andy Reid, they've been on a tear for years.

They're not doing great this year. They still have a winning record. They still are up there at the top, but their receivers have been terrible. And they lost a game they had no business losing, and it was the receiver's fault because they dropped like seven passes that game. Patrick Mahomes didn't go,

yeah, my receivers are out here in these streets, just dropping passes. Patrick Mahomes go, I could have thrown that ball better. I could have worked on my timing with them. them, like, we've got to do better as a team, but it's the buck stops with me. That's what I need these CEOs to do because it's your team. You are the quarterback. Right.

I don't care if, like, Nita Costa's your wide receiver and she dropped the ball if that's what happened. And it's like, it does seem like they're pointing the finger at her, which at the point, well, like, again, the director always, no matter whether it's right or wrong, the director always went in good, in good movies that have bombed pointing on your fault, right? It always happens, but to say it in the way that he said, this particular thing, wasn't reading the room, wasn't paying attention to kind of, in general,

how that's going to be looked at. And I don't know, man, it's just like, yeah, you would assume that he would be able to choose his words a little better for this particular circumstance. Because Marvel in general, that's what he should have done. He said, look, if you're going to try to be, because I think what he's trying to do is like, look, I'm just going to be honest.

I'm just going to be so honest. They'll be really honest then. And this is what you used to, because he said certain bits of this, Okay, guys, look, we've spent way too money on this stuff. We're not in the place that we used to be. We were spending a lot of money beforehand. The $300 million, gone. We're going to basically do, we're going to have to scale things back a little bit more.

We realize that one of the reasons we were is when we built up and did these shared universes, we get all these stars at the same time. We got to cut back. We've got to make bigger things. We've got to make smaller movies, but with better stories and better character. Because this whole thing about the supervision thing of, well, she didn't have supervision. you didn't have dailies? You didn't have dailies?

Dailys for people who don't know what it is. It's like every day you get these clips of what's going on. So if you're like, oh, I didn't know they were going to do a big musical act, why didn't you watch your dailies? Right. You know. You know what I'm like so curious about is because what would we say was like a Disney movie that like did well? This year?

Just Guardians. Guardians, right? Okay. Based off of two movies that did. a third movie in a franchise. You know what would have made more sense to do is to, instead of focusing on what didn't work, go, you know, what we need to do,

what we really need to focus on, the things that we know are winning for us. Abbott Elementary on our TV side is crushing for us. That show does so well, not that the strikes over, I'm so excited to see more stuff like that come out. Guardians of the Galaxy 3. That's the kind of like character development.

That's the kind of adventure that we want to see Marvel get back two. You know what I'm saying? The only reason why they wouldn't do that. Why? Because gun is gone? This gun is like, you know, I'm playing on another team. There's, they had, they must have had one more success this year. So if even if that's, was that the only one? That's it. Everything else either barely, or it was another studio. Again, there were a few, there were a few, I mean, maybe one of their, their, their Fox movies. I don't know if they even had any of their Fox movies that did good, but the, but any, because I'm thinking about it, because what, across the Spider-Verse did well, Barbie did well, Oppenheimer did well, those are

all different studios. Yeah. So the big movies that they really... And universal. Yeah. Yeah, they have... The only ones that, again, people can debate is whether it just lost a little money,

broke even or made a little money, little mermaid, which might have lost just a little money. And the other one was elemental. Might have made or lost a little money. The rest of them... Then the way you do it again is you go, you know what did really well for us?

Abbott Elementary, we love that show. It's doing really great. We want to see more like that. Loki. The people have been critically acclaimed. It's been a great job. we've been doing that. There's something magical happening

with those kind of realms we want to focus on. And then we saw things that worked with Elemental and that worked with Little Mermaid and that worked with Guardians and you can throw it in there now and not make it the focus. We need to look at those things

that work and we need to make that we need to expand that. And we understand that some of the problems are. We've been throwing too much budget into this and so we got to take a look at that as well. But those little things, why our audience is connecting?

We got to remember what made us special in the first place. You make that stuff. statement instead of yeah people out here just not being supervised just doing whatever they want it's just it's silly and it's the same way that he just he he was he's desperate right now he's on the offense he all they're all they're all they're all right it's unbelievable all right look there's a lot to be said about this let your voices be known um I think we're going to try to hit one more thing I'm going to try we may not be it's going to be a shorter show but I do want to

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Michael Fastbender asked if he's going to return. Josh Harwitz actually asked Michael Fastbender, and he said, you know, I think we had a great run. I enjoyed it. By the time, Dark Phoenix was over, I was like, you know, I was lucky. We had a fantastic run of it. I enjoyed the time, and then it came to,

I think it's a natural conclusion. So when it comes to this real quick, and then we just kind of end on this, do you think this is him going now? I don't need to come back to you. Do you think he's going to show up in Secret Wars? Do you think, if they bring back everybody that they say is going to be right, that's not the most, it's going to be the most, it's going to be the most,

he won't, Deadpool, you think? He either be in Deadpool or in Secret Wars, and then that's the end. And I think that, I think part, part of the reason why is people have teased left and right, but none of this, we have nothing other than the stuff that's, we know that Logan is in it, and we know, obviously the Deadpool's back in his own movie. I would put money on the fact, especially since we're talking about Deadpool kills the Fox universe type situation. He will be back for that, whether it's just a cameo,

the size of like first class with Hugh Jackman being like, you know, we're making a team go F yourself. It might be something that simple with, but I hear what he's saying about like, I'm not doing more movies, movies as many or something. But I'll do a cameo. I don't know. We'll see.

I mean, there's anybody that should show up in any of these movies now. So I'm curious what you guys think. Do you think the Fastbender will show up? Will Magneto come back? It will be just a different Magneto once. they finally bring them back. Again, shorter episode here today. Thanks for bearing with us.

I know we only only got three episodes out this week, but we'll be back in full force, I think next week, for sure. So make sure you comment, leave likes, all that stuff. Winston, where can they find you? You can find me at the Swaggy Blurt on all the platforms, man. I've been doing my reviews of Scott Pilgrim takes off. So please come and check that out, show some love. And then obviously on social media as well.

And then Game Time with Roker on Tuesdays at 11 a.m. Pacific. And you can see Winston. myself, Coy, Brett, Kate, Roxy, Chris Carr, all performing Burbank. So make sure you head out there on Saturday night. Come see us, man. Apple Podcast, Spotify, Anywhere podcasts are found. You brand new to the channel. Subscribe right there.

All right for Winston. I'm me. You're you. Bye. Thank you.