The Last American Vagabond - IMA: The Fast-Approaching Digital Control Grid

Starting point is 00:01:06 Welcome to another IMA panel, the Independent Media Alliance. Today we are discussing a fantastic article by Catherine Austin Fitz in regard to the coming digital control grid. Now we've all been doing a lot of work and a lot of different ways discussing sort of the building, you know, I mean the great reset essentially. Every single data point around that conversation that seems to have continued under the US government of today.

Starting point is 00:01:29 And so we wanted to discuss today the different points of where that's been building, what we can see, and talk about the possible solutions around each one. So thank you all for being here today. We want to kick this off with Catherine Austin Fitz telling us about her article and then we can go through the point. So go ahead, Catherine. Nope, you're muted, Catherine.

Starting point is 00:01:52 Still muted, Catherine. Yep. Okay. Here we go. Thank you, Ryan. And thank you for pulling us all together and gathering us this way. I recently published an article called, wait, let me just get back to it. You threw me off there.

Starting point is 00:02:07 Oh, I'm sorry. Wait a minute. The fast approaching digital control grid, a checklist of Trump administration actions to date. When Trump, right after he was inaugurated, he did a press conference with several big tech billionaires and announced initiatives, the Stargate Initiative, to put together data centers all across the country and combine it with MRNA injections. and it was clearly a major step forward in building an AI engineered control grid. And he announced energy policies that would support it.

Starting point is 00:02:48 And so I put together an article literally in the first couple weeks that showed all the different things the Trump administration was doing to build a digital control grid. And what I discovered with that article was that many people, you know, but they see the individual pieces, but they don't see how they come together in a control grid, which completely overruns the U.S. Constitution and changes our fundamental governance structure, including moving control of fiscal policy and taxation to the central banks. And so ever since that article, I've been tracking and just amazed both at all the things

Starting point is 00:03:30 they're doing to build the digital control grid, but also all the things they're not doing, doing, if you were serious about reverting the corruption in the last four or five administrations, they're not doing any of those things. So, or I should say not, they're not doing very many of those things. They've done a few things that, in my opinion, you know, create great headlines, but they're minor. And so I put up a new piece where I just extended the old piece and I had, I went sort of through my summary. And then I went through different categories. The first, let me just describe the categories. The first was money. The second was the war on cash. The third was financial disclosure, which to me is a major, major issue. The fourth was

Starting point is 00:04:18 digital IDs. We've never seen an administration more aggressive on digital IDs, which we know is the next big step to building the control grid. And then digital payment systems. And then finally, let me go down, the internet of bodies, and that gets into the MRNA, telecommunication systems, changes in assets and how federal assets are managed, and finally, energy, because we know that the digital control grid is unbelievably energy consumptive, and then finally looking at both budget, Federal Reserve, and some other minor things. And, you know, by gathering everything together, it was funny, I kept asking, people kept asking me about why do you think they're building the digital control grid. And Ryan, literally the list got so long that I found myself doing

Starting point is 00:05:08 interviews and, you know, forgetting to mention one. So I thought, okay, I need a checklist. So this is Catherine's interview checklist or that's what it started out at. But as you can see, there is extraordinary number of items. And this is not an accident. People say, well, we're sure Trump doesn't know. Of course he knows. This is obvious. Anyway, so my hope is that, that because there are so many real solutions, you know, but they all require us getting out of the pendulum between what I call the political version of your food choice as McDonald's or Burger King. You know, your political choices are not, you know, one part of the uniparty versus the other part.

Starting point is 00:05:53 You know, we have real choices, but we have to just leave the, you know, the pendulum between the different parts of the Uniparty behind. And my hope is that this will help people see. the different parts of the digital control grid coming and understand their time is much better spent. You know, instead of watching TV and being entertained by Donald Trump, it's much better spent stopping the real ID or working with state legislators to do things to protect financial transaction freedom. Anyway, so that's my introduction. I really appreciate all you guys coming together to talk about this because anything we can do to help people see how these different pieces

Starting point is 00:06:32 snapped together in a literally a digital concentration camp. And the more people who create friction and refuse to go along, the better off we all are. Couldn't agree more. And since we got everyone here now, we can go through the quick roundabout here. We have Jason Burmiss today, Ian Davis on the top right, Steve Boykinin, Kit Knightley in the middle, Catherine Austin Fitz, Derek Rose. And, you know, in general today, Catherine, is any spot that you'd like to start on in regard to the list? Or should we just start with the top with money? I would start down because we sort of go inside out. But let's start with money and essentially destroying, you know, ending currency as we know it. Yeah. Well, as you write in the basic summary, an all digital

Starting point is 00:07:14 currency and monetary system is essential to institute a digital control grid. So different than the actual digital monetary system around it all, the specific digital currency dynamic. And you mentioned the genius act, which I was looking over a second ago in regard to the, you know, kind of like the stable coin, the legislation that's going forward. So anybody want to jump in and kick it off? I mean, obviously, can I just mention one thing on the Genius Act? So Trump has made a big deal about, you know, we're not doing CBDCs and we're canceling CBDCs and people think that has meaning. But if you look at the CBC, it would have been done by the Fed. So primarily the lead would have in the New York Fed. And if you look at the Genius Act, it's just saying all the guys who own the

Starting point is 00:07:58 Fed are going to create subsidiaries and do stable coins, which is, you know, is basically programmable money with less oversight by Congress. So it's sort of, you know, meet the new boss, same as the old boss. There's, you know, it's a different version of CBDC. Right. But worse, as you're pointing out, there's less oversight. So it's the same problem, but far, you know, just a worse version of it, which is such a way this always goes, or they give you, something everyone wants to push back on. Usually you get like a less bad version that you accept. This just seems like a worse version, but it's more of a kind of a shell game.

Starting point is 00:08:31 So anybody want to jump in on that topic? You know, digital IDs like, you know, the way it all can that. Or I was specifically, sorry, back to digital currency in particular and how we see that going. Any thoughts jump to mind for anybody? Well, you've seen the rise of Brock Pierce, right? Jeffrey Epstein's good buddy and Tether kind of taking a major foothold. and what is going to become, not necessarily like CVDC, but the face of U.S. stable coin going forward. And there's been, what, $700 million invested in another round of several hundred million dollars invested, all the position tether.

Starting point is 00:09:14 And again, Brock Pierce, in this particular position of leverage. and we're kind of finally seeing like the merger of PayPal Mafia and cryptocurrency all wrapped in with a nice tight federal bow. And did anybody vote on this? Was anybody asked about this? Did anybody give an opinion to where it may be in the contrary of no, I would rather not have my entire financial system? be on a blockchain where at the whim of some bureaucrat, I can have my entire life shut off. I don't think any of this occurred, but it's still happening. And the people that are assembled here and a handful of more people are about the only ones willing to say anything at the expense of algorithmic reach or, you know, the expense of our shows or whatever else we're trying to put out.

Starting point is 00:10:14 Yeah. I go ahead, Jason. Well, you know, I'm not sure who's feedback that is, but there is some feedback. I would say this. I mean, right now, you know, we're in the first three months of the administration. I think it's pretty obvious, or it should be to most people, that inflation is going nowhere. And I really don't know how it could really go anywhere after they printed all that money up during the COVID-1984 nightmare. I think that the talking points of going into Fort Knox and the New York Federal Reserve are great. I don't think they're ever going to come to fruition.

Starting point is 00:10:52 I also believe that most of us kind of saw the headbutting of Powell and Trump in these rates. And all the while, what's happening right now, gold is exploding as a hard asset. Silver is doing very well and Bitcoin is back on the rise. and I would imagine with the right economic turmoil and headline, we could see Bitcoin actually not go to a million. You know, those people are always going high, but maybe reach a high of 120, $125,000. What does that mean for the next, you know, market in crypto? I think you see Ethereum and all these meme coins explode.

Starting point is 00:11:28 In fact, Trump, I just saw a report today, is going to be having a meeting with the top holders of his meme coin, right? Remember when Trump came out? And that just exploded. So I think there's going to be a lot of exploitation on that level as they move more people into the comfort of using this device on the blockchain. For instance, Venmo, PayPal, you can buy Bitcoin on there right now. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 00:11:55 And I'm sure that's going to go into more and more crypto. I think they will hedge their bets. And kind of like we talked, even before the administration took place, we all know that a digital currency is part of the plan. So that's going to be pushed forward. I mean, to imagine it would not be when Peter Thiel was such a huge part of the push at the very end of this administration getting in. You have Vance, et cetera. I don't know what the public's going to think about it.

Starting point is 00:12:24 I mean, I think if you keep it so people can still afford things and you still have the rhetoric on television, unfortunately, I don't know how we get back to a pushback on that. I don't believe anybody here thinks that we're going to get an honest audit of the Federal Reserve, et cetera. I'd love to see that. There's been talks of Ron Paul. Those talks went away very, very quickly. So unfortunately, you know, and in this very first part, Catherine talks about an AI and Cryptozar. You know, one of the things that wasn't really highlighted in the article that's extremely concerning to me is that, well, AI is a buzzword.

Starting point is 00:13:04 we've not taken out the government fascistic aspect of AI in that the chief AI officer, artificial intelligence officer program, is still going. And that means that our government is literally involved at the Defense Department level on every company developing both software and hardware in this regard and essentially decides how far it goes. I mean, all these companies are being audited by the government. and again, the only ones that are beyond this audit are government agencies. It says it right in the CAIO doctrine.

Starting point is 00:13:41 Anybody can read right now. So that's extremely also concerning when we're talking about cryptocurrency because they are going to end up going hand in hand. You know, I don't want to take too much more time, but unfortunately in this regard, I don't necessarily know how you slow this down. And instead, I think that people are going to have to, navigate it by, you know, multiple investments in multiple things and really hard assets and

Starting point is 00:14:09 resources like actual physical property like you've done, Ryan, you know, owning your own home, owning your own piece of land, knowing your neighbors, et cetera, creating your own barter type systems, which still do exist in pockets of the United States outside of these big cities that they don't want to tell you about, even in the big cities as well. So that's kind of my thoughts on the monetary system. I would love to believe that we're going to have some kind of quote unquote golden age and economic boom. But I only see really that economic scale out up if people start adopting the digital grid, right? Then they'll give them a little bit of a bone to encourage other people to get on the train before they pull the rug out. I'd like to jump in real

Starting point is 00:14:54 quick if I can. Can you guys hear me okay? Yeah, cool. Yeah, Catherine, thank you for putting that together. I was just looking over. I hadn't had a chance to look at it before today, but I think it's a great summary of everything going on and for people to really get a grips of the role that the Trump administration is playing. I just wanted to add two things. One, just for a brief moment, to say, I told you so, and go back to some articles that I wrote at The Last American Pagabond prior to the election. And a lot of people didn't want to listen, pointing out all the connections of Peter Thiel, the connections to Elon Musk, of course, the military industrial complex, et cetera, et cetera.

Starting point is 00:15:34 And thankfully more and more people I think are listening. Of course, there's the diehard mega folks who aren't going to hear anything we're saying regardless. But I do think even those who are optimistic and skeptically voting for Trump or, you know, just didn't like Harris or whatever, felt this was the only choice they could make are now starting to see a bigger picture. I'd also like to point to, I don't know if you already have it pulled up, Ryan or not, but we just published a new article I wrote at the last America Vagabond yesterday called the Palantir, Welcome to the Palantir World Order, which kind of picks up on the threads that you were pointing out, Catherine. There's just one area I did want to mention just

Starting point is 00:16:07 in terms of the finances. I found a report from ProPublica talking about Peter Thiel, a Peter Thiel funded company as well as connected to all the usual players, and Dries and Howards, and David Sacks is in there. The company you guys may have heard of called Ramp, which is a financial company. They focus on doing AI software for businesses, kind of helping them analyze their finances. And I've seen more and more people using this company,

Starting point is 00:16:34 but ProPublica is reporting that there have been four private meetings recently with Ramp executives and the Trump administration's appointees to the General Service Administration, which obviously focuses on federal contracts. And you look into who Ramp is. Of course, they're funded by Peter Thiel through the, the founders fund seven different rounds. They also have Keith Robos, I think it's how you say his name, Kozla Ventures, with also Thrive Capital, which is, of course, Joshua Kushner, Jared Kushner's

Starting point is 00:17:02 brother, Trump's son-in-law, and then 8VC, which is a venture capital firm funded by Joe Lonsdale, who is, of course, another co-founder of Palantir with Peter Thiel and Alex Karp. And so the General Service Administration, which handles federal contracts, is now potentially going to partner with Ramp, which is a total Peter Thiel cabal fund company to start handling some of their federal contracts. It's just another piece of that puzzle of how this, you know, the teal acolytes and those connected in that whole universe are getting further ingratiated there. I also want to point out, we did report it last American vagabond months ago, and I know we talked about on our previous panels here, the role that Howard Lutnik is playing. Steve mentioned. Brought Pierce.

Starting point is 00:17:46 But Howard Lutton as well is a big component of this and a big piece of the puzzle. His connections to Tether. Of course, him as Commerce Secretary. Again, I say it half jokingly, but also like I told you so. We told you so. The information was all there. So no big surprises for me. But hopefully putting it together in this format that you have Catherine as well as the article I just put out,

Starting point is 00:18:09 which similarly tried to just summarize all these different areas that we're seeing Peter Thiel connected companies and, of course, Pallentere directly. Palantir partnering with the IRS, SpaceX and Palantir saying they're going to build the Golden Dome over America, Palantir helping ICE find immigrants and probably more people in the future. And then as I mentioned, the payment platform, also Peter Thiel is getting involved with nuclear energy through a company called General Matter, which is starting to partner with Department of Energy. Yeah, so just there's so many examples.

Starting point is 00:18:41 And of course, that doesn't even get into Israel and the connections there. So, I mean, even going beyond just the focus of the digital aspect, which is obviously a big cornerstone to the puzzle, we're seeing Palantir and Peter Thiel and the whole PayPal Mafia all up in the federal government various contracts in different ways. Most definitely. And I think there's a surveillance point where I'm going to definitely bring a lot of that in regard to Palantir in particular. It's a total information awareness, like obvious kind of development. And excellent points in general. To the actual ramp point you brought up. And I was curious if Catherine or anybody else what your thoughts are on this,

Starting point is 00:19:15 because I had this pulled up in the overlap to the digital currency conversation. Now, any real financial dynamic like this would be one more way they could kind of coerce you into that. But I wanted, Catherine, anybody else had given any thoughts on this program. So I just wanted to jump in because and pick up on a couple things that Derek said. One, if you look at, if you and I were, if this group of people were to go into the U.S. government and say, we're going to get to the bottom of where the fraud has been going on and stop it. We would have gone to HUD and DOD. If we said we're going to build a social credit system to control,

Starting point is 00:19:53 what we would do is we would go to the Treasury payment data, the Social Security payment data, and the IRS payment data, which is exactly where they went like a heat-seeking missile. And we would basically download that data and provide it to our... partnership between musks's AI company and palantir and if you read the wired reports that's exactly what they did so you know at one point Naomi Wolfe said that's a trillion dollars worth of data and in fact if you look at high quality payment data of that kind you know i don't think that's an

Starting point is 00:20:31 unreasonable estimate so um so if you look at the data game they are clearly building um uh you know the control grid and Palantir's role in this is critical, which is why I'm so glad you guys have published this recent piece. I also want to mention something else. Does everybody remember when we would send over pallets of cash to Iraq? Okay, stable coins working through mobile payment systems are the new pallets of cash that are going to go global. So this is just like one company used to tender for the stock of another company in the market. The U.S. is planning using stable coins, which, of course, bring more money into the dollar and the dollar market share.

Starting point is 00:21:22 They are literally, through the mobile payment system, is going to try and tender for as many citizens worldwide as they can get into the system. And if you look at some of the planning, not only do they plan to send out the stable coins, but they're planning on issuing. It looks to me like massive amounts of credit. So literally everybody around the world can borrow money in stable coins and then they get you on the stable coin platform. So it's going to be, and they think they can get billions of people moved into the dollar channel through stable coins. And if you look at their sort of vision of where the dollar system is going to go, it's absolutely critical.

Starting point is 00:22:07 So this is a completely global game. The other thing I wanted to mention is right now, inflation was caused by the massive injection by the Fed during the going direct reset. But the thing that is pushing inflation now and is going to continue to push it is de-globalization. De-globalization is very inflating of the real cost of goods sold. But it's happening on the real side, real asset side of the balance sheet. And I think part of what they're hoping to do is match it with this unbelievable flood. of stable coins and credit that they're working on, which is a, I mean, if you think we're in a ridiculous debt bubble now, where do you see this? This is going to be something else.

Starting point is 00:22:52 I want to just to be on Thiel, just quickly, because you mentioned the nuclear aspect of the investments. We also have to remember that Thiel was essential in the rise of Facebook. You know, obviously Palantir is concerning. You mentioned Alex Car. Bilderberg's coming up literally, I think, within the month over in Switzerland. I'm going to be keeping my eye on that. But one of the things that has been downplayed is the fact that we've had meta now announce that they're building a data center in Kentucky, almost the size of lower Manhattan. And they'll have all the energy in the world, again, to run these AI data centers.

Starting point is 00:23:33 Well, it's meta, it's Google, et cetera, that have now invested in these mini, new plants that they are going to have supposedly on site. So they plan on powering these things with many plants around these areas. Remember what I just said. These centers are the size. Go watch the map overlay of Lower Manhattan, how big this will be. Think about that for a moment. That type of technology is now going to be fast-track, not for you and I, not for cheaper power,

Starting point is 00:24:06 but for AI-driven authoritarianism. I mean, that's a legit point that no one seems to be talking about. And again, Theo was essential in the come-up of Zuckerberg, Facebook, meta, everything. And just one more point on social media. You know, we had that executive order and I was very skeptical of it in the beginning. I think we did a forum on it where we're going to stop the censorship of social media. Where's that? That's not real.

Starting point is 00:24:36 Even yesterday, I posted, you know, I've got dead kids in my feed every day. I don't know if you guys saw it, but twin girls, four years old in Gaza, dead. I reposted it. I said, hey, you know, when am I going to stop seeing dead kids in my feed? I had people. And now, they weren't in the United States of America, but they're not allowed to even watch that video in Europe and places in South America. It's just they comply. And that's ex.

Starting point is 00:25:04 That's supposed free speech platform with his musk or not. friend. So I'll stop my little tirade and I will allow somebody else to comment. Yeah, you're going back to what Catherine was saying there about the global nature of this. And obviously we're talking

Starting point is 00:25:20 about the impact of people like Teal and Musk and Anderson and people like that in American politics and, you know, their impact and leverage in the Trump administration. But if you go back to, I think it was 2009, Teal wrote an article where he,

Starting point is 00:25:36 about his ambitions to create, and this is a direct quote, a new world currency. Well, if you, if you, it was 2010 and we just played the full text of it on the show yesterday. Yeah. So,

Starting point is 00:25:50 so the notion of creating a new world currency with using dollar backed stable coins, I think that if you, you can look at a plan, I think, that was, that was at least being thought about in 20, in terms of making it a practical plan. And something that I always refer to as a speech that Mark Carney gave at the G7

Starting point is 00:26:15 symposium in Jackson Hole in 2019, where he spoke about this notion of what he called a synthetic hegemonic currency. Now, shortly following that speech, that's when Facebook, which obviously Teal was, you know, instrumental in. And I think, I think Zuckerberg, when Teal left the board of Facebook, of Meta, but when it become meta. I think he was quoted as saying that he considered Teal to be a mentor in business, in industry and in life. So Zuckerberg was obviously impressed with Teal.

Starting point is 00:26:53 And this notion of this synthetic hegemonic currency, Carney said that there were options on the table. So, you know, I mean, things like central bank digital currency, but also. So in particular, a stable coin started by Facebook in Facebook called Libra, which then became DM. And that stable coin, funnily enough, Facebook itself in an SEC filing, I keep saying Facebook, but I can't remember quite when they became meta, but in an SEC filing, they openly stated in that filing that they didn't think that the Libra project would be. work because they realized that the regulation wasn't in place to allow it to work. So also when you think about there that people like Teal that have got a, they're very close to people that that are obsessed with this notion of something called accelerationism,

Starting point is 00:27:54 which is wrapped up in this notion of something called the dark enlightenment and all this. They believe in creative destruction of markets. They think this is an important tool to be deployed. Well, if you look at Libra, that looks like an aggressive attack on the monetary system in terms, if you consider the monetary system to be a market, that was an aggressive attack on that and certainly on the traditional role of the central banks in terms of them being able to issue money. That, you know, that created the framework for the regulatory process. and you know we had people like teal and and zookerberg were meeting with trump in the first year in the first his first administration in private for private meetings when zookerberg was being quizzed about libra in front of the world and certainly in front of the senate and you know in front of various committees they were having private meetings and lo and behold shortly after those meetings um

Starting point is 00:29:03 the DM project, which it had become by then, suddenly became, it was initially it was going to be backed by a basket of currencies and it was backed after these meetings, it was suddenly going to be backed one to one peg to the dollar to the US dollar. Well, when you look more closely at the notion of interoperable currency, which is what the bank for international settlements has been absolutely obsessed about for many, many years. years, we've already seen things like what a team at Warwick University. They've already onboarded in the US using from Fiat to a stable coin, a US DC stable coins, so this is circles. And then off-borded at the other end in France, directly in euros, in real time, across borders, with very, very, very low transaction fees, with a transaction. that absolutely tracked exchange rates between by 0.02%. So that 0.2% was more than saved, you know, was more than covered by the, by the extremely cheap transaction fees.

Starting point is 00:30:20 So that so they are building, I suggest, and I think that the US move towards US dollar backed stable coins is very much part of this. they are building a global network of interoperable digital currencies. And I think when the more that you look at it, when you think about what Carney might have been talking about when he was talking about a synthetic hegemonic currency, is that rather than having, and he was very much concerned about protecting the power of the dollar as well. And clearly with people like Teal backing things like Paxos,

Starting point is 00:31:00 which is a one-to-one US dollar custodian of its digital stable coin. Things are moving in that direction, and it would seem that, you know, that in all likelihood, a US dollar denominated stable coins are going to be the dominant kind of currency in a new model of international monetary and financial system, which is going to be wholly synthetic. and therefore control. So, Ian, let me ask you a question.

Starting point is 00:31:34 It looks to me like they're building this parallel track with stable coins so that they can bypass a lot of the national controls in the current banking system. So you're looking, in a funny kind of way, you're doing same old, same old, you're just skipping all the different hobos. Is that fair to say? Yeah.

Starting point is 00:31:56 I mean, I think things are still up in the air. I think there was a, there was a notable exchange between August and Carston's and, I can't remember her name now. She's an academic. Lagarde? Oh, no, no. Oh, I know what you're talking about. She was an academic.

Starting point is 00:32:17 And he was saying that, you know, if we're going to have these stable coins that are backed by US treasuries, why shouldn't we just, you know, you see. BDC, wholesale CPDC and, you know, trade assets as we normally have, but just use wholesale CBDC. And her response to him was, well, why should we bother with this third party? Why do we have to trust central banks with all their strange biases? Why can't we trust Paxos, you know? No, so I'll tell you why. right now under the law, the Fed's problem is it cannot do CBDC without authorizing legislation,

Starting point is 00:33:02 and it still is under the rubric of Congress, and it's one of the reasons they're trying to get a constitutional convention. It's one of the reasons they've been trying to wiggle out. But right now, the Fed has too many disclosure obligations, and Congress still has jurisdiction. And that is a real sticking point if you have to go get legislation and admit what you're really going to do. And stable coin is a way to do the same thing because it's the owners of the New York Fed are going to control all the stable coins. It's just, you know, it's just, and there's one layer removed between congressional oversight and you can have a lot more secrecy and wiggle out of Congress.

Starting point is 00:33:42 That's why. Yeah, no, definitely. I mean, if you think about the implications of what Trump was talking about in terms of freedom cities, So this notion of these deregulated, anything goes sort of free for all development zones where the multinational corporations can research and develop to their hearts content. Then, you know, companies like Tether will be able to do whatever they want with regard to the development of their stable coins within those freedom zones, literally beyond the jurisdiction. Well, it seems like from what they're. they've suggested beyond the jurisdiction of the federal government if they establish these quote unquote freedom cities. So they are they are trying to create a privatized, a totally

Starting point is 00:34:36 privatized international monetary and financial system. I think. I think I think you're right. The question is whether these sustain these development zones, whether prosper dynamics or not, are are actually just another part of that same agenda and they're just being, you know, presented that way. Like in Prospera, using Starlink with the same, you know, teal funded. You know, I think it's kind of like trial balloons for the same problem. And it's the, they're using cryptocurrency. It's all kind of the same thing. But I think you're right. The way you can see this developing is clearly from a globalist perspective. I want to point out that from Facebook and Libra. Like, imagine if that was Iran that did that, you know, where they just

Starting point is 00:35:16 allowed this to go. You know, it's clearly being allowed. And I think it's interesting to what Catherine was bringing up in her article. The Genius Act itself, as I think you were kind of alluding to, clearly highlights that only the federal entities are the ones that allowed to now do this. And they're just kind of taking control of the dynamic within it all. And I think that in coupling that with the real ID national identification, you know, all that you, it's just I don't know why people can't see how this is developing whether or not they want to admit that this is their plan. It is the same agenda, which is kind of like the larger thing we're talking about today. I don't know if Kit, you wanted to have any comments on this before we. I did. I just was going to say that if you look at the history of the central bank digital currency issue, like it explodes in 2020, and I think it was quite interesting.

Starting point is 00:35:59 We got to the point in like late 2020, early 2022, where basically something like 150 of the 194 global nations are all developing their own. And the sticking them out on this issue was weirdly enough, usually the United States. All these countries were publishing reports saying digital currency is going to be great. and Congress would publish it was saying, yeah, but it might not be so great. And I think there's lots of issues that go into that. I think some of it was a fear from like the empire head nation that it would undercut their legislative power. And some of it is the odd position that America is in like economics wise where they use a lot more cash than a lot more Western countries do. And so you have the sort of transition rebranding, as Catherine said right at the beginning.

Starting point is 00:36:49 Basically, they're going to do a central bank digital currency. They're just going to, they're going to call it something else. And as Ian pointed out with the interoperable issue, they're going to do a global currency, only it will be called 150 different things. It's very much a question of linguistics and branding more than anything else. Yes. Well, let me also just really jump in. I think also technology. And what do I mean by that? You know, if these people had their way and Catherine talks about the internet of bodies pretty extensively in the article, they would love the Sam Altman World Coin brand where in order to actually transact on this thing, you give up your biometrics out of the gates. So while you're right, I do believe it's going to be, you know, 150 different things. I think that, they're going to integrate different types of technologies. And just like you see with the consolidation of everything,

Starting point is 00:37:45 they will weed out the ones that are less sufficient and less surveillance. And then ultimately try to get even beyond what Altman is doing with WorldCoin. Yeah. And usually some rationalization by, you know, demonstrating why the ones that don't spy on you are not working as well, the efficiency dynamic and, you know, justify it in that way. And there's also the question of how you get people to go along with it as well, because like I know just from if we have something called the digital pound in this country,

Starting point is 00:38:15 we don't yet, but we will. And if we have it and you have to give up your fingerprints or your thumbprints or your retina scans or whatever to use it, people will be much more likely to give that up for a digital pound, which is an extension of something they know than for a global world coin, which is a brand new thing they don't. So you sort of have to use that language to get people on board. This is a digital dollar. It's like the old dollar and you need your fingerprints. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:38:38 It's the same with they've got this notion of what they call vendor agnostic. So with digital ID products the United Nations certainly in the World Bank like to use this term vendor agnostic

Starting point is 00:38:54 products. So it's independent. The creator of the product is independent. It's not part of any kind of collected network or anything like that. Despite the fact that they talk about everything, interoperable in terms of its

Starting point is 00:39:10 shipping readable messaging exchange systems so already they've started talking about ISO ISO 2022 compliant digital ID products so even though they're all produced by different people and then they

Starting point is 00:39:26 look different they say you know somebody might be using real ID somebody might be using a European driving license or whatever they're all made by different companies IDMIR or whoever but they all have an exchangeable machine readable data so that that can be exchanged. And the World Bank have already toyed with this ID-4D idea of having a universal ledger for all digital ID,

Starting point is 00:39:55 which would just simply gather up this data from all digital ID products. Well, with regard to stable coins, there are already stable coins that have been issued. And I was struggling to remember the names of them, which are using the same kind of what we might call vendor agnostic technology, i.e. that they're all built on platforms and on blockchains, which have, but to an agreed standard in a mixed in a, and I think Swift have already spoken about, you know, the stable coins that could adopt this into interchangeable or into off- Since 2023, yeah. Yeah. So it's a, it's a, it's a. another ISO or standard for machine readable digital interchange, you know, information. And there are stable coins that are already compliant with that. So this notion of a kind of global network of vendor agnostic digital currency products all working together. And if the

Starting point is 00:41:02 Bank for International Settlements gets it way interchangeable across borders, instantaneously, you start moving to a situation where, you know, I mean, I question whether even what the value of things like a reserve currency would be in such a system. The reserve currency is based on what's already been stolen, Ian. Like, you, I mean, you know that. You know that. It's based off of what's already been thieved. And then going forward, anything that's described as a stable coin,

Starting point is 00:41:36 just means regime approved. It doesn't mean that there's any actual stability to it. It just means that, you know, the overarching economic sphere that's been in control for the last, you know, many centuries is still in control. That's all a stable coin means. Yeah, Catherine, I know you wanted to chime in. Oh, I just wanted to mention one of the things you see

Starting point is 00:42:05 that's very interesting. So we have lots of collections of short videos up at Salary, and I put a link in the chat to the financial transaction freedom videos. It's about 100 short videos, starting out with the famous one of Carstons, basically saying we can make the rules

Starting point is 00:42:22 and force them centrally. But the second one is Neil Cash Carey, a former treasury official who used to be, or is now president of the Minneapolis Fed. I don't know. Can you play it, Ryan? it's only a minute.

Starting point is 00:42:38 You're muted, Ryan. The Carson one? No, the second one. Okay, go ahead and keep talking. I'll grab it. Okay, so what you're seeing is the more and more people start realizing how this stuff really works. You're finding all sorts of people with very successful careers or wealthy in America saying, wait a minute, if we don't have our fundamental freedoms, they can take all our assets. and they're starting to realize that they're on the menu.

Starting point is 00:43:07 And here you have a president of one of the 12 Federal Reserve Bank saying, Americans should never do a CBDC. And for the reasons, you know, the same reasons I'm sure he would know why they should never do, you know, interoperable and programmable stable coins. Anyway, if you want to play it, Ryan, it's just a minute and it's very impactful. Yeah, I just noticed in the chat, Jared, do you want to comment before if you have to be on here? I can wait until after, Catherine. Okay, let's play this first.

Starting point is 00:43:35 Asking anybody, anybody at the Fed or outside of the Fed to explain to me what problem this is solving. I can send anybody in this room $5 with Venmo right now. Right? No, seriously. So what is it that a CBDC could do that Venmo can't do? Is that it? No, that's not it. Is there any reason it stopped? Hmm. No. I don't know what. Let me go in. It seems to be playing in the background. but let me remove it really quickly and add it again.

Starting point is 00:44:09 See if that works. I'll bring up Derek's article if you want to talk about this, Derek. Oh, sure. Yeah, I don't want to intrude, but I wanted to go back just briefly to the point that Ian was making about the Freedom Cities. This was reported earlier in April by Reuters about, of course, Ken Howary, who we pointed out months ago,

Starting point is 00:44:28 is connected to Peter Thiel. And, you know, they've got him now in the position of Ambassador for Denmark, which is, of course, part of their desire to make Greenland part of the U.S. as they build the tech native North America. This report is just showing how, I think you mentioned, Ian, did you mention Praxis? I think he did. I did it, but yeah. Okay, well, so this ties into some of the companies and some of the things you were talking about.

Starting point is 00:44:53 Praxis is one of the companies. There's also another one called Promos, I think it is, and Pronomos, Pranamos capital. And this is tied to Andreson. It's tied to Peter Thiel, tied to Lonsdale. Again, the whole PayPal Mafia. But what this article is just talking about is that these discussions are already ongoing, and that whole cabal is already one of the places they're planning to do it, and this may be one of the reasons besides resources they're so interested in Greenland.

Starting point is 00:45:20 Apparently they're already in discussions. According to the article, Praxis co-founder Dryden Brown told Reuters that companies have already approached them about helping them to establish a so-called Freedom City in Greenland. And yeah, this is just part of that overall move. So whether or not it happens in the U.S. or Trump and his team really do try to take control of Greenland in some capacity. These ideas are being discussed. And it's the same people tied to Prospera in Honduras, which Ryan mentioned. You have what's his name, Friedman, the grandson of Milton Friedman's involved in that.

Starting point is 00:45:55 Patty Friedman, I think. Joe Lonsdale, Peter Thiel, Elon Musk, of course. So, yeah, these discussions are ongoing. And I just want to insert one other thing before I do have to head out in just a couple of minutes because I was reading some of the comments and I know that people in all of our collective audiences maybe know some of these details, if not all the details, if not all the specifics. And they're, I think, counting on us in some ways, maybe unnecessarily, to also think of solutions. You know, what are we actually going to do about this?

Starting point is 00:46:25 Because we're describing a world that each of us know there is no existing within it and still maintaining freedom and privacy, that there has to be alternatives. this is what I've tried to focus on quite a bit. So I just want to encourage everybody who's listening to this to take heart that, you know, the Independent Media Alliance is about trying to raise awareness and talk about things that you might not be hearing from others in the mainstream alternative media. But we're also very much aware of the need for solutions. I know Catherine's focused on this as well over at Solari and others have. So, you know, we don't have the perfect answer for you and your life necessarily.

Starting point is 00:46:58 Everybody's got different resources, financial situations, desires, et cetera, et cetera. but absolutely we need to resist these systems as much as possible, whether that's at the airport, whether that's real ID stuff, whether that's just checking out at an Amazon store at the airport that they want you to use, you know, touch-free, everything.

Starting point is 00:47:18 You just have to resist these things in all the ways you can, big and small, including using cash, including rejecting the systems that they're trying to put before us. And I do think local community is super key on that because I don't know if any of us can do it in isolation. it's going to take us coming together. I don't think there's very much hope of any sort of political solution

Starting point is 00:47:37 to prevent what we can see is on the horizon. So if we're not going to wait on that and not just trust the plan, then we need to count on ourselves, count on our communities, our churches, whatever it is you got, your own family, extended family, and really start having these hard conversations. So find the people near you who care, who can see what's going on and start having those conversations and then more importantly, start coming up with an action plan.

Starting point is 00:48:01 or where's your red line in the sand? You know, what are you willing or unwilling to do if it means maintaining privacy and freedom into the long term, not just for your life, but for the coming generations? Because if you don't know where that line is, then the next thing, you're just going to accept the digital IDs when they roll out. You're going to accept facial recognition to the airport. And then before you knew it, all the things you've been watching podcasts about and watching documentaries about for years are going to be your reality.

Starting point is 00:48:25 And I don't think anybody wants that. So I just wanted to throw that in there. I'm glad you brought it up there, which is what's funny. we discussed before starting that one of the central parts of today was to discuss the solutions. What's funny is we haven't even gotten past point one. It just showed you how much information there are around so many different things. And so we can just use that as a segue. I'll play the rest of that clip hopefully that plays for you, Catherine.

Starting point is 00:48:44 And then we can talk about the potential solution. Okay. Specifically for the digital currencies. We'll see if this plays. Asking anybody, anybody at the Fed or outside of the Fed to explain to me what problem this is solving. I can send anybody in this room $5 with Venmo right now. No, seriously. So what is it that a CBDC could do that Venmo can't do?

Starting point is 00:49:07 And all I get is a bunch of hand waving. I get a bunch, well, maybe it's better for financial inclusion. Maybe it's better for cross-border remittances. Maybe is there any evidence that it is? And they said, well, what about China? China's doing it. Well, I can see why China would do it. If they want to monitor every one of your transactions,

Starting point is 00:49:23 you could do that with the central bank digital currency. You can't do that with Venmo. If you want to impose negative interest rates, you could do that with the central bank digital currency. You can't do that with Benmo. And if you want to directly tax customer accounts, you could do that with the central bank digital currency. You can't do that with Benmo.

Starting point is 00:49:39 So I get why China would be interested. Why would the American people before that? Good question. What are you not, Catherine? Okay, so here we have the president of one of the 12 federal reserve banks in 2023 at Columbia saying we should never do a central bank digital currency. So I think one of the reasons the Fed has been slow walking this,

Starting point is 00:50:01 number one is they have to get legislation, and they can't get legislation without telling the truth about what they're really up to and having a debate that they wouldn't win before the election. But the other thing is you have many, many people throughout the institutions of the United States. They don't want their grandchildren to be slaves. So I think, you know, the more, the more knowledgeable people get about what's really going on, the more you're going to, you're going to see real friction in the system. And that's positive.

Starting point is 00:50:36 So I agree. I'd love to jump to just solutions and to the very end of the article to kind of piggyback on what Derek was talking about on kind of, it's going to take more than one person and many people coming together. and then Catherine in the chat talked about states being able to change things. So here I am in Iowa, and one of the things that just visually and verbally bothers me that I actually share with my nieces, they see me physically get angry, is when I see the spraying in the skies, right? I don't include them in much, but when I see that, boy, that makes me angry. As you know, I put out a film in 2013 called Shade the Motion Picture going over the Bioend

Starting point is 00:51:19 engineering, the geoengineering, Bill Gates, all this stuff. And here we are. So the reason I bring it up with solutions is kind of a frustration point as well, but people coming together. Here in Iowa, just about two, three months ago, my state senator, a representative named Jeff Shipley, who have had lunch with is a very good man, actually brought legislation, anti-geoengineering legislation to the House, to the state. And people got to speak and the whole nine and they tried to ban it. Now, my friend Todd McGreevy, he runs a print publication here called the RC Reader since 1994. And he spoke there. The Democratic opposition came to speak. Todd was very familiar with this gentleman. He was kind of surprised that he was here. He's wondering why he was there. Well, he had his whole little

Starting point is 00:52:10 canned speech ready to go. And that can speech goes like we've heard so many times. times. There is no evidence that this is actually happening. But if they are doing this to protect me from global warming, I want to be safe. So in basically a paragraph's time, they go from it doesn't exist to if it's good for me and I think it's good for me, we're going to do it anyway. So to me, yes, we can change things as a state, but we're still in the baby steps. of something that everybody in the world can look up and see. And, you know, I was on with Gareth Ike a couple days ago. And right before the show, what does he bring up to me?

Starting point is 00:52:55 The United Kingdom and European legislation that they're going to begin to block the sun openly. And I'm like, hey, join the party, pal. They're just doing it here for 30 years. And nobody's seen. And I even said, I've said this to other people. And I wonder, if I were to run for governor of Iowa and win, Could I stop this? Or is it just so far up the military industrial complex where I'm just going to get a big F you?

Starting point is 00:53:21 I don't really know the answer, but I do know the, again, the answer that Derek and Catherine talked about are at least the first steps in trying to change this overwhelming system. And I'll leave it there. Well, you have to stop it where it starts. And we have a little bit of proof of this out here in California. there was a pilot program out of Harvard in 2022 where they were like, let's just spray you know, silver iodide into the atmosphere. What could possibly go wrong?

Starting point is 00:54:00 And a bunch of people went, no, you can't do that. So they said, okay, we'll relocate the program to the deck of the USS Nimitz in the Alameda Bay. And then we'll spray silver iodide into the atmosphere and all of the people in the immediate like alameda county area were like what are you doing well you know what you see why would you do that yes got you can really quickly let's do just since the beginning of the conversation let's bring it back to the focal on digital on on digital currency and we can and but there's a good point to bring to the broad point of

Starting point is 00:54:37 you know in a general sense how we can effectively create change in anything like this I think it is important to highlight the fact that I think, as you're highlighting, Jason, almost all of these, in my opinion, supersede the idea of even a federal government. That's my personal opinion from a globalist sense. It really is looking at that. But I'd like to get some solutions focused specifically on the digital currency dynamic. So the Americans or anybody else in the world who is feeling forced into the idea of digital currency, what are our proposed solutions for finding a way around that?

Starting point is 00:55:05 And Katzen pointed out from a state perspective, states rights, that's one way to look at it. But anybody else want to jump up for that? I think, you know, it would support, you know, something that Catherine's spoken about a lot. And that is just carry on using cash. Just refuse. Just use cash. I'm not even carry on using cash. Make a point of using more cash.

Starting point is 00:55:26 Let me just come in for a second, though. If I want to go to the UFC tomorrow in Kansas City, Missouri, zero cash. I don't even get a ticket. So, listen, there's more cash in the venue. Jason, this is not zero or one. Jason, it's not zero or one. If you look at how cash works, if you use and insist on cash every time you can,

Starting point is 00:55:50 wherever you can, you push it back. It's not zero one. So I'm not saying don't go to the UFC. Although it's a good idea to say to the UFC, guys, what are you trying to do, bring in digital slavery and push back on them? No, really?

Starting point is 00:56:02 You're right. I got to tell you, I have watched so many people in our network. work. Get off the couch. They knew nothing about state legislators. They do nothing about the local school board. They know nothing about, they have gotten legislation passed. They have gotten bills passed protecting cash. They have gotten debanking stopped in their states. They have gotten so much done. If everybody would just get off their couch and pick the one thing or two things they could do and use cash whenever they could and stop financing and supporting the people doing it.

Starting point is 00:56:37 this stop going to work and building the control grid. There would be an absolute revolution. It is nobody wants to get off of their couch. That's not true. There are, there are a tremendous number of people getting off their couch. I work with them every day all over the world. They get off the couch and you know something they're having fun.

Starting point is 00:56:58 They are having a good time. That's how we find each other. These are all really important things to digest with all this. And I completely agree with everything you said, Captain. but you know in our conversation of the past, I'm much more, I tend not to lean into the legislative direction because I feel like it's harder. But I agree. It doesn't have to be the legislative direction.

Starting point is 00:57:17 Everybody has to do what gives them energy. So, you know, you could be starting a farmer's market. You could be gardening. You could be whatever you need to do to build local resilience and to network with other people that create local resilience and shift the money and the time and support out of the other, the pro-centralization team into decentralizing. Everybody should do what gives them energy. No, that's what I said. I agree with you. It's my point. But I mean, just explaining, prefacing what I'm about to say by the fact that's why I tend not to lean that direction.

Starting point is 00:57:48 So I, that being a good thing to do and I agree to be doing it. However, I think in my opinion, the primary directive is direction from like a Lark and Rose, Derek Rose kind of perspective, is to act in like, spend, you know, vote with your dollar in that sense. So I would say, don't go to the UFC, not because you don't like it, or, you know, you don't want to support the UFC, but that's how you vote in this world right now, right? You don't go or whatever else, and that's what Kathleen is saying. You prove to them that that's more about important to you, you know, but also. You heard Ryan Christian just pirate that like a regular American.

Starting point is 00:58:22 I love to go into the business. Honestly, my first, you know, experience was this was about a year and a half ago. And like I said, this is in Kansas City, Missouri, Red State, by the way, everybody. where I went to Illinois. And it was just before they were going to have the DNC there. I went to the venue with cash in my hand thinking I could get a physical ticket. When I went to the booth, they said no, no, no. And they did me do it through a text message and a QR code would not accept my money.

Starting point is 00:58:55 Then inside, I can't get a pretzel for money. It's every major league baseball event now. It's every like every major. sporting event is like that. No cash. You have to have a QR code, have to download the app. It's like you're, whether or not you're being conscious of it, you're being hurted into this digital control grid. And it's going to take a whole lot of people to go, hey, wait a minute, that's dumb. No, I'd rather not. I'd rather not do that. This seems completely ridiculous. before anybody's going to bulk,

Starting point is 00:59:39 but we got to make them bulk. We really do. What's ironic about that, of course, is that what's going to remain still a cash business is going to be black market weapons and drugs. Those are only created to launder money for the federal government in the first place. So they can't completely kill cash

Starting point is 01:00:02 because they need it. Yeah, Catherine had a point. Go ahead, Catherine. Okay, so I'm just moving over to put this in the chat. We have a section up on our financial transaction freedom website called Turtling for Cash. And a wonderful subscriber in South Dakota got legislation passed in the state legislature this session saying that school sports events had to take cash. And because I agree, the sports is a big place where the... All right, let me stop, Catherine.

Starting point is 01:00:39 Let me stop you. Because I do a platform elite cost me about $3,000 to $5,000 for a private, this is private. And in the CBK Sports Center, now when they really want to get you, and they do, and you say that there's an ATM right there. Now, most of them are cash twice this year. If I wanted to go to the volleyball tournament that I already pay for, they have a QR code. It is a two-day pass.

Starting point is 01:01:05 No, no, Jason, I understand that. What I'm telling you is fine rules. I know, I know about how difficult it is. What I'm telling you is I know you can raise the percentage of cash you use in your daily transactions if you want to. And it matters. You don't have to do it. It's not zero or one. Okay.

Starting point is 01:01:28 You do thousands of transactions a year. Okay. The other thing I want to bring up, Just because you're in Iowa, and I told Brian, I wanted to bring this up, I just did a wonderful interview that we'll publish in two or three weeks with Pat Militech. Oh, Milite. Good buddy of mine. Yeah, so who was a UFC champion, and he has a business called Soil Savers, which I think could rock the world, because he's figured out basically how to spread probiotics on your land that can heal a lot of chemical damage and a lot of toxicity. and it's quite remarkable.

Starting point is 01:02:02 So they're, you know, that's a friend and a very smart guy. And we actually went and saw a film together last week. Soil saviors, again, that goes back to even the geoengineering and what we're putting in our bodies

Starting point is 01:02:15 and what we're breathing and eating. Right. But that could be, that could really help. So Pat likes to just do it. He doesn't want to go deal with the state legislator. So, you know,

Starting point is 01:02:25 so his thing is to just do it. And it's great. But, you know, imagine. We got a bill passed in Tennessee, the first state that stopped geoengineering. When Daniel Goodrich brought that legislation to the state, I said, you got a 1% chance of getting this fast. And she got it passed and signed into law, and I'll tell you why. I was there three weeks ago, and they're still spraying.

Starting point is 01:02:47 Of course, because you can't enforce unless, you know, I'm going to slap you guys around the head here. So she took it. I said, you got no chance, but, you know. Sometimes it takes seven years of breaking down the walls to get a good enforcement going in Tennessee. So some guy from California came to lobby against the bill, and he starts lobbying about how it will cut into his profits. And suddenly all these legislators said, oh, my God, I thought this was a conspiracy theory. And he completely freaked them out, and they ended up passing the bill. Now, it's a first step, and it needs many more steps.

Starting point is 01:03:28 but they can only enforce unless you take off and land in Tennessee. Or different layers of the elevation. But if you look at how we get things done in Tennessee, you know, you pass the first bill. That's like 5%. You pass the second bill. That's 5%. And it takes years.

Starting point is 01:03:45 And you've seen, you know, Frank Nicely, who is the master legislator in Tennessee, he would take seven to 10 years to get something really done. And it would take multiple layers of legislation. but that's part of how you educate people and get them to really change, but you've got to start. Yeah, which is my point is that obviously is important, and I agree. We have to keep doing that, but I'd rather try to get more immediate action going while we're doing that too. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:04:11 Right, so absolutely. Absolutely. I just put in a link to our article. I want to stop CVDCs, what can I do? And it's the same. We've done a whole bunch of shows with Twyla Braz on Financial Rebellion on CHDTV about how you stop the real ID. And I think the most important thing is stop right now is the real ID. Well, why don't we use that in a transition since we really have only, you know,

Starting point is 01:04:36 gotten to the currency part of this. And I doubt we'll get to every single data point. So I say what we focus on is next to that real ID focus because that's connected and then the Stargate kind of infrastructure of it all. So on the idea of the digital ID, real ID, say back kind of like ecosystem that's being built, I mean from a U.S. perspective, but it's happening everywhere as well. anybody want to start on that any thoughts jump people think minds i just like to ask the question out there how do you describe it to somebody that wants to have voter ID and explain to them that you don't necessarily need a federalized quote unquote real ID what you need are state IDs at the base

Starting point is 01:05:14 that are not involved in that system because i think that we all want people to be citizens of the united states that vote and have a system for that and i don't think that we're anti-identification but when it gets to the federal level and whether or not you can travel and the embedding of these different RFID and eventually biometric systems, obviously that's what we want to push back again. So, Jason, why is the registration process not, you have a registration process wherever you are. You registered a vote. That's it. That's your system. But you know they usually do it through the DMV. And you know, they also lie to you all the time and tell you that if you don't get this specific identification. I mean, why does anybody think you need another ID to protect, to protect election fraud?

Starting point is 01:06:02 I mean, election fraud is a problem, but it's got nothing to do with the absence of IDs. How do you convey that to people? And then when you go into states like New York or California, et cetera, that are inherently corrupt, even Illinois, which is right, I mean, like, it's a mile away from me. Yeah, well, you're right. But, I mean, obviously those ones, to me are more. important because it doesn't allow you to take charge at the local level, right? For your senators, your congressmen, your state senators, a lot of that. And, you know, I don't believe that New York is necessarily a blue state. You know, as much as I don't like Lee Zeldon, I have a hard time believing

Starting point is 01:06:39 that Kathy Hokel won in a free and fair election, right? So how do we get a system of quote unquote voter ID that is essentially federalized? And I'm not saying you can't do this, but convey it through state IDs. You know as well as I do in New York. I mean, they push you right through on that. I was showing my buddy, my, you know, it was the enhanced license that got me into Canada or Mexico. And, you know, my, my Iowa ID is a little bit different, but I did get the federal one that has the star in it. Most people don't even, yeah, most people don't even know that you have an option to opt out of that and just get a regular state ID. So is this just, not after May 7th, as I understand. Yeah, is this just, we have to get the information out,

Starting point is 01:07:24 and then we have to just actually enforce the laws that are already on the books and express that to people that we don't need to save. I would say, if the question is, how do I show someone that wants digital ID to stop voter fraud, you know, what would be a good thing to show them, to explain to them why that's not necessary, maybe show them that video of Elon Musk speaking about six months ago, saying how important it was that all voting was done with a paper bureaucracy, because that would cut out the potential for voter fraud. So while he wants voting process itself to be done using manual counts,

Starting point is 01:08:09 as in human beings checking bits of paper that someone's put across him, because he considers that to be far safer than using any kind of digital system, Why not then, if that's his idea, why does he not also advocate having, you know, traditional types of registration done through a human run bureaucracy? So, you know, for years and years, we have paper driving licenses. So why don't we? If the issue is security, then what's wrong with paper driving licenses? They seem to be far more secure than digital driving licenses.

Starting point is 01:08:49 is. Hold on, Jason. Hold on. Let me jump in a sense. I want to get in for that first point. So the idea here is that I agree with you. It's important to highlight that, you know, like people I'm sure disagree.

Starting point is 01:08:59 So we shouldn't say everybody. But anybody who wants to uphold the law in this regard would say that you have to have an ID to vote and that has to be verified. That's obvious, right? So I think we agree with that. The point, though, is that this is a manufactured problem to justify the solution they want. And we all know that's how it works, right?

Starting point is 01:09:12 So we're dealing with something in regard to, you know, the point is, as Catherine was alluded to, there's laws in the books already. And, you know, I'm not a state of civil. the ideas we're forced to live in this regard. And so that's what we're discussing. But the point is those laws are on the books that already apply to this problem. So the idea is the issue of immigration has been applied to rationalize why we need something new. All we need is the current enforcement. And I'll point out Democrats who are actively avoiding that or arguing that we shouldn't be. And so that's the problem, not that we need a new layer of things for them to ignore,

Starting point is 01:09:40 right, to justify the new digital ID. So that's the bigger thing for me. So I just want to lay that out there because I think the solution being presented is a bait-and-switch. But let me just say this also because, again, you know, I voted this year and I'm in Iowa. And yes, again, I had an ID. But then we talk about paper verification, right? And the polling was not paper. So now they've brought in this new system where I sign on a pad with my finger that looks almost nothing like, you know, my actual signature. But that verifies me.

Starting point is 01:10:11 And then I get my paper ballot. So, so it, you know, again, we have so many things to do to push back. I want the paper system all the way through, right? So in other words, the ballot I get, I don't even think I sign that, right? So that doesn't have my signature on it. So it would be very, very easy to go in there as somebody else with something, you know, they barely looked at my, I don't even know they looked at my ID. I'll be honest.

Starting point is 01:10:36 I think I said my name. They asked me my address and maybe I handed somebody my ID for a second and then I digitally signed. I'm with you. I want all paper all the time. I want physical identification. et cetera. But again, I think the issue is even with that, are we going to have the same type of corruption in these states where this absolutely happens? Because we still have,

Starting point is 01:10:57 you talked about the machines, we still have the damn machines counting these things with fractional voting. You're right? You know, like that's a whole not. I don't know that the SAVE Act does anything to stop that. But I would ask, what is the solution to get to? I mean, we're so close to the midterms right now. Forget about, you know, 2020. 28, 2026 is right around the corner. And at least in this country, I think that that does make a significant difference. So I'll open the floor to anybody that wants to retort to that. Well, I just, I'll just add before anyone else jumps in that I think the point again is that, you know,

Starting point is 01:11:32 not that I necessarily agree with the laws in the books, but the laws that are there to be enforced would already address the problem. And that's kind of what we always keep seeing is that they're just like, like even with every, I mean, I don't want to lurch into some larger conversation, but the idea that they're putting things forward and trying to solve the problem. when the problem is just simply already acknowledging the law that's existing. And I think that's a constant game that's being played. So I think we all agree with that problem, but the solution should not be a digital ID or really the real ID compliance or really the bigger point for those that don't think it's digital ID, a national identification. We've all talked about that as a conspiracy topic and how tied that is and with new role order, all these different conversations. So it's interesting

Starting point is 01:12:08 that it finally gets pushed forward by the people that would otherwise be calling it out, which is how this always seems to go. So that's, I think, important. parallels gun laws, doesn't it? People say we need stricter gun laws because of criminals using guns, but there are already laws to stop criminals using guns, and they ignore them. So you bring in strict a gun, you bring in strict the voting rules, and the people that break the voting rules will just break the voting rules. I mean, they ignore the rules already.

Starting point is 01:12:34 New laws aren't going to make any difference. Right. I think that's the clucks of it is that if you're, like you're addressing with Jason, is that, you know, what's going to stop them, nothing? And corruption does not stop because of a new law class like you're talking about. They're already corrupt. So they're going to find their ways around it as best they can. That's why just the point is to acknowledge that they're violating that instead of trying to go around it.

Starting point is 01:12:53 You know, and that's how government works, it seems. But, you know, so I think that's, before I go to the next part, anybody else have any comments on that discussion point? Okay, so let's jump in then to the next, the point that, you know, the connection to that, which is the, I guess the larger database. You know, as you wrote in the, and I'll bring it up for it to kind of set the point, as you wrote in the article, financial data and payment systems. and artificial intelligence. So again, there's so many. And you just wrote it to the summary, to build a digital control grid,

Starting point is 01:13:23 digital IDs must link with programmable money and interoperable systems across multiple platforms, integrated with social credit and surveillance systems, and that is Stargate, essentially. So kind of what we already go in over in a lot of ways, but any other points to start that off? You know, the only thing that I would say technology-wise that wasn't covered in this article,

Starting point is 01:13:43 I would say is the artificial scan that is constantly being put up by the Defense Department in SpaceX, right? So, you know, we talk about in this, the doorbell cams and that type of surveillance. But when you look at what Starlink really is, it is that global digital information skin. And, you know, the ride-along program on SpaceX used to put up the blackjack satellites. I know that Derek actually did a couple of extensive pieces talking about the new spy satellite network that has been directly created by Musk. So if I were to just like interject anything into this,

Starting point is 01:14:20 it's that we have the militarization and the surveillance of space going to an extremely new level. And what they're selling the public on is Katie Perry going 60 miles up to the Carmen line and the idea that we're going to Mars. Like Trump literally said it, I think, two days ago again, that we better get to Mars before the end of our administration. but none of that's real. Like these rocket systems are defense department programs,

Starting point is 01:14:49 and they fully want to integrate this information system, this information skin, into not just the Internet of Things, but the Internet of bodies. And let me just say this about the Internet of Things. We are starting to see that mini-revolution in the United States of self-driving cars. Phoenix is a big hub for this, and I did not know it.

Starting point is 01:15:12 My buddy went out there a couple weeks ago and took one of the robot cabs. They're everywhere there. So we're now starting to see the automation steps of this control grid come into fruition, at least on a smaller scale. And I think a lot of that is going to be driven by the technology that is in the sky and really not talked about that much. I mean, even when you think about the people that were sitting there at the inauguration, Bezos is sitting there, right?

Starting point is 01:15:40 Well, Bezos also is another one of these guys, Amazon, are building these artificial intelligence information centers and trying to opt for this nuclear technology as well. So this is a big part of the fourth industrial revolution that people aren't talking about, the surveillance in the sky, the integration with AI on the ground and then utilizing what I think will eventually be these mini nuke plants in order to do so. Yeah, the world the World Economic Forum have already spoken about what they're calling the trillion dollar opportunity of Earth observation satellite industry. So a kind of leading technologically on that is, you know, companies like Satellogic that Lutnik is invested in. So the idea is that, you know, we think about satellites kind of observation in terms of its, you know, physical observation like some sort of camera looking at the grounds and you can see an image of something. something. But they're talking about using it, using it for harvesting data, particularly from the internet of things, internet of bodies, bringing this together into one kind of cohesive system that will take data globally from all these devices that we're using, monitoring our energy

Starting point is 01:16:59 usage. I mean, there's already, they, you know, the idea of the cryptocurrency powered smart home has already been developed. You know, so we are moving towards a point where things like the Earth observation industry is going to be a key player in kind of the management and collation and the AI analysis of that data. So the AI analysis of the data that they're going to gather on a global scale, you know, will be worth in itself will be worth, well, the World Economic Forum, call it a trillion dollar opportunity because obviously,

Starting point is 01:17:35 I mean, if you're developing any kind of industry or any kind of technology, then that data will be extremely valuable. Now, we're already seeing companies like X moving into selling their user data. So they openly trade their user data. Now, supposedly, it's anonymous, but nonetheless, you know, the data that has been harvested by things like the LLMs that are harvesting up all of our kind of interactions online, and it is everything. It's every comment we make. It's every, it's this video. It's all being gathered and harvested to train these LLMs. And once those LLMs are trained,

Starting point is 01:18:14 then they're going to be used for, and similar AI systems are going to be used to analyze the data that is gathered by things like the Earth observation satellite systems. So, and I think that one of the things that they're doing at the moment is that there are a number of competing technology, that they're playing off against one another to see which one comes out on top. Now, a lot of that will be down to investment, but a lot of that will also be down to, you know, kind of technological efficiency as well.

Starting point is 01:18:44 So when they, when they've got a cohesive system and a winner emerges, then that will be, you know, the kind of, a kind of monopoly on the, on the data that they are gathering. And then they've already talking about the concept both in the, you know, both financial and digital ID of this notion of the universal ledger, which will be, you know, a centralized ledger of all data. So, you know, I mean, that is the ultimate kind of centralization of authority if you've got access to that data. Funnily enough, it's being sold to us as decentralization. So all these, all these new systems that are coming out are being these competitive systems that are decentralized.

Starting point is 01:19:31 and there's all these vendor agnostic companies that are competing because it's just a kind of free-for-all that's going to enable a brave new world. Unfortunately, the nature of that decentralisation is, if you like, creating nodes on a blockchain network that is going to enable the centralisation of particularly the analysis of all that data. That's what they're constructing. I just wanted to mention one thing because I don't see how this vision works in terms of energy consumption unless you bring out breakthrough energy or you depopulate or both. Or both, yeah. I mean, they're already talking about in order to meet the projected and it's the international IEE, I can't remember what that stands for, But their last kind of assessment report of where we would be by 2050, I think currently the total global use is something like 26, I'm going to get this horribly wrong, 26 million gigawatt hours per year. And that's going to double to, you know, more than 50 by 2050, which they've calculated is the equivalent of adding a nation like Japan to the energy consumption to energy.

Starting point is 01:20:56 consumption every year between now and 2050. So that's the scale of the of the energy increase, the energy generation increase that we would need if this was actually going to happen, which means, as you quite rightly say, there's only two parts of that equation, Catherine, isn't there? There's either got to be a hell of a lot more nuclear power stations or some sort of fundamental energy breakthrough or less of up. They've had the breakthroughs. They just haven't applied them. Well, it's not just less of us, but we see multiple people talking about how they're going to be lived to 145. We saw the president's son-in-law say his generation was going to be the last to die or we're going to live forever. So, you know, so that's even more

Starting point is 01:21:50 environment of stress. Let me just mention one thing. I was looking. at a group, so I have a investment screen company. I was looking at a list of the stocks that had performed the best over the last year, just out of curiosity. One was a software company. I ended up going in, and it turned out that one of their lines of business was digitizing the forest. So they were planning on spraying sensors, you know, like on the entire Amazon and collecting data on every living thing in the forest. It was called Internet of Forest, And I just said, you know, these guys have every ruse you can think of to create the suck up data. It's unbelievable.

Starting point is 01:22:31 That's insane. I've never heard that. I mean, that's just that has to do a search for the Internet of Forest. You'll pick it up. Well, I was going to make that point, actually, before I go to something else is that what's interesting is the Internet of Bodies is actually the old conversation. Right. So this is from 2019, right? And so they're talking about the Internet of Bodies, the Internet of Things with the interconnection.

Starting point is 01:22:50 Like, we're beyond even this. Right. Right. You're not a bio-nanno things. And like, so we're getting to the point to where we're still being pointed to something. It's always like the deflection, right? They give you what was happening 20 years ago while they're moving on to something else. And I think that's what this really is. Right.

Starting point is 01:23:03 You can't do what you're talking about with the trees without something like smart dust. Right. Yeah. That's wild. And so that really shows you. So let's bring that to the larger kind of what I see is the Palantir or whatever you want. I think Palantir is the obvious point or Oracle is obviously involved, but the total information awareness, CIA overlap, Pallentier where we're seeing this all-encompassing, as we've been highlighting in every aspect,

Starting point is 01:23:25 this consolidation of information, of surveillance. I mean, I've got many things pulled up of, like the IRS overlap, the immigration OS they rolled out, you know, all these different massive consolidations of controlled surveillance and information. So let's kind of end on that general point. I don't know how much time you have, Catherine, if you want to start. So I've got one minute. So, you know, I think it's a little bit like the, you know, the old stories of the gold rush, where everybody sees an opportunity to make money by centralizing and creating more data and centralizing. We do know, I've been told many times that the guy who has the best AI is the one who can provide

Starting point is 01:24:04 it with the highest quality, the most highest quality data, because it really develops on the data. And so, you know, this is part of a gold rush. And, of course, it's allowed because carrots and sticks, it takes you where the centralizers want to go. but I do want to point out that, you know, whether it's the energy question or many other questions, you know, I just see that the centralizers have enormous problems. This is going to turn into one of the greatest cluster you know what's. I mean, it already is.

Starting point is 01:24:39 And I think that's why what Derek said about, you know, focus on the actions you can take and building local resilience and just doing it every time you can just do it. if enough people do that, it has tremendous opportunity because I think their vision, as an economic matter and as a matter in alignment, it just doesn't make sense. You know, this is way too psychopathic to work. So I just, I mean, I can see why everybody's rushing for the gold rush, but at some point, just remember the guys who made money on the gold rush were the guys who made the blue jeans. Right. Anyway, gentlemen, it's always a pleasure.

Starting point is 01:25:22 Thank you very much, Ryan, for doing this. I can't tell you how much I appreciate it because the more we can help people see the overall picture, I think the more people who will start to, you know, look for real solutions and back out. Anyway. Absolutely. And great work on this and looking forward to the next one, Catherine.

Starting point is 01:25:42 So thanks for joining. Have a great day. Thanks, Kevin. I would just like to add, on top of that, you know, in the interesting, what Catherine said, doesn't that make you worry that maybe this is the worst version that hides the one that comes, it's usually how that feels, right? Where it's like they're showing you this crazy ideas that people go no to that and then quietly roll out the one that's a little less bad behind it. You know, I don't know, just any thoughts on her

Starting point is 01:26:05 last point there. You know, I'm in obviously with the internet of body stuff, you know, that's something, you mentioned smart dust. We're in year 20 plus of that being like used by the military industrial complex openly, barely talked about. And I think that that's a big problem. I would encourage people to go read a book now. I think that's about a decade old. I think it might even be 2013. And that is first platoon by Annie Jacobson. And that story actually revolves around smart dust. And its utilization by a unit in Iraq to target a quote unquote terrorist threat that they end up at the last minute not killing based on this technology that would have been the wrong one. I do want to talk about AI-based killing because we've been mentioning Palantir and we've been mentioning Peter Thiel. Probably my clip of the year so far is when Peter Thiel gets asked about lavender and the Israelis using that to target, what is it, 34,000 quote unquote terrorists.

Starting point is 01:27:09 And Thiel is extremely, the most uncomfortable I think I've ever seen him in my life on video. his face gets beat red. He stutters. He stammers. You can see the inflection in his voice and the way his jaw is moving, that he's very uncomfortable with that question. Because when you do peel back any of the basic layers of who they targeted, it was basically people that were in group chats, right? People that knew people that were supposedly, quote unquote, Hamas terrorists. And then you look at the overall military targeting. We have to remember, you know, the IDF utilized the technology. that blew people up in broad daylight in public in non-military situations. Is this what we want to promote with Palantir and Lavender? And even more crass, and I would say openly militaristic, is his right-hand man in this Palantir

Starting point is 01:28:05 project, aka Alex Carp. He's the one going to the consumer electronic shows. He's the one talking about these things, very, very blasé. and I think also about six months, he just bragged openly. This thing was going to be utilized globally, and they're the ones that have oversight, period. And you know as well as I do. That doesn't mean the quote unquote United States has oversight. This is a company that is heavily embedded in Five Eyes, which means what?

Starting point is 01:28:36 Israel, the United States, the United Kingdom, really are allies as well on top of Australia and Canada. right? Because when we talk about what's going on in Yemen, do you think Palantir is not involved there? I mean, come on. Together, basically, in every field of war that we can see right now. And that is extremely problematic, not just because it's being utilized overseas, but because it's also being utilized domestically. And the question is, how much more implementation of that are we going to see now that we've legitimized this idea that even gang members in the United States are.

Starting point is 01:29:14 are part of terrorist groups. People accused of being gang members in many cases without any due process or verification. So that adds to that point where you can just go, this is what I think it is. And people are literally going, that's enough. The president can decree that you're something with no due process and get rid of you or like you're saying, maybe a drone strike. This is why I've always said we don't just block criminals are criminals, right? This terrorist word is utterly been overused, not just through the Trump administration, but even before that, we've kind of placated to this idea of domestic terrorists, right?

Starting point is 01:29:49 There's a whole subsection of conservatives that want to call Antifa a terroristic organization. It's like, whoa, buddy. You know, again, if an individual or a group commits crimes, that does not necessarily make them terrorists. And when you take the word terrorist, you are taking out, like you said, all of due process. And that is even just go back to the word criminal, though, right? Because it's the same principle, right? Whether you're accused to being criminal or a terrorist, the point is, whether it's an illegal alien or anything else under the Constitution, therefore, due process to prove those things. And so I think this is a really good overlap to what we're talking about with this Palantir or whatever else.

Starting point is 01:30:24 Or disgusting surveillance, identification, you know, cataloging of information that then is used against you in ways where potentially, as we're seeing, as Trump has floated five times now, the idea of sending Americans to a foreign prison, you know. And so this obviously comes, and we don't have to get into that larger conversation. unless you want to, but it clearly overlaps, seeing as how Palantir is using justification of highlighting people in immigration and surveillance, and it's all building in the same direction, even if people agree with the outcome of this or how they're

Starting point is 01:30:53 doing it, which I think is flatly unconstitutional. But it's an interesting thing about the conversation about what the Doja's been doing is that I can't remember who wrote the article, but they described it as post-human. Because they were using AI essentially to decide whether some was efficient or not and then and then potentially firing them based on an AI

Starting point is 01:31:17 AI made decision which which is which is if you apply that kind of same thing to you know the notion of whether or not somebody is which they are doing the notion of whether or not somebody is quote unquote a terrorist or whether they should be deported for alleged criminal activity based upon an AI assessment of a available data, then we are moving into, it is not unreasonable to say that we are moving into a post-human world because, because, you know, those are the kind of decisions that surely must be taken, as you were saying, Ryan, and following a due process, not based on AI's assessment of a due process. And one thing I think that we are in very much danger with all this conversation

Starting point is 01:32:06 about AI is overestimating its actual capability. Yes, or lying about it. Yeah, because I mean, we are, we have been told that it's capable of so much, but it's also incapable of a tremendous amount, things that human beings can do in a split fraction of a second AI is nowhere near capable of doing. So, you know, we are being kind of led into this idea that ultimately there will be a singularity, there will be this point where AI becomes sentient. There's no reason to think that that isn't something that is on the horizon at all. What we've got is massive data harvesting

Starting point is 01:32:49 and analytical programming of programs that assess that data. It might be highly complex and it might be able to mimic things like human speech, but it's not some sort of amazing, you know, of aid to the kind of forward march of humankind. It's quite the opposite. So, you know, we, you know, where there's no reason why we would ever want to even contemplate the idea of a post-human future. Why would we as human beings ever contemplate that? Yeah. It's a great reset. I mean, the maga great reset or whatever's happening now. Right. There was a couple points that I did want to jump in on what you said because I think that when you're talking about, you know, exiling criminals or rounding them up, you know, first of all, under the guise of immigration, I'm much less sympathetic

Starting point is 01:33:42 to people that aren't United States citizens, and I'll just put that outright. However, if you're going to deport them, you don't send them to Guantanamo Bay. Okay. And for me, that is a big issue that you have a black site involved in any of this process, right? And I do not like the legitimization of something that should have been shut down, which should never been reactivated in the manner it was post war of terror, you know, a facility that still holds Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and the other accused 9-11 member 20 plus years later and the public had some kind of a problem and outrage that they might have cut a deal with them when we didn't see any of the evidence presented, when we didn't see what was going on in these military tribunals, when you can outwardly say,

Starting point is 01:34:29 obviously they did not get due process in the case of a fast trial as we're 20 plus years later. And now bringing that into the immigration process, one like you just said, is heavily automated. You know that it's heavily automated. You're 100% right with Doge. And I think that people need to understand that process has been going on for a very long time. And actually, there have been specific units in NASA. I used to play videos of the guy talking about this, how like every eight, to 16 months, they would bring people in with the next level of artificial intelligence.

Starting point is 01:35:06 And essentially, these people would train half the amount of the staff by those people that would then be let go in favor of this automation and AI promise. Right. And when we look at AI, the next realm of AI is going to be essentially driven by quantum computing. Microsoft just announced their first commercial quantum chip, if you haven't seen it. There are new breakthroughs with Google and NASA in AI. They've been working on this in two plus decades. And as far as he talks post-human, I think one of the next pushes in the quote-unquote transhumanist movement

Starting point is 01:35:46 is to integrate human biological tissue into a lot of these operations to dehumanize us further via organoids. Are you guys familiar with the organoids? Are you guys familiar with the organoid movement right now? I don't know. But I'd like to jump in back to the first point you made. We can come back to that because I think we can end with this general idea of this overlapping transhumanist kind of direction that seems to go in.

Starting point is 01:36:10 But I think it's important that these two things are together because Ian's point with the artificial intelligence, the idea of how it's being automated, where it's going to a point to where we can then, like even as Eric Schmidt said in a podcast like years ago, paraphrasing that one point we'll get to a future where AI is making decisions that may seem immoral, but it'll know better. That is what he said in a podcast a while back, which is horrifying is that we need to establish now that these basic fundamental Right. Sending someone to El Salvador or anywhere else, let's be clear, illegal immigrant or American, there's no basis in law precedent of any kind.

Starting point is 01:36:41 That's illegal. Now, we can have that discussion going forward. It seems to you agree with that, whether that could change. But right now, that's the reality. But sympathy is not required to have somebody to have their constitutional rights acknowledged, right? So an illegal immigrant, let's make this clear for those watching, has consequences. constitutional rights, most importantly due process. That's been ruled on by Supreme Court in the countless times, Reno versus Flores. Scalia himself said it was fair amount that in, in regard to

Starting point is 01:37:06 deportation in particular due process was paramount. Judge Knapp's been talking about this a lot. The reality is you can just ask Rock and generalized, you know, it'll tell you that. The point is that it's weird we have a conversation today, people out there in line, not saying anybody here, is arguing that immigrants don't have constitutional rights. I find that insane because it's simply not true. So bringing back to the point about how it's being used, this is what I think is important, is that they know people have been conditioned to be less sympathetic about certain circumstances. So they use that to get people to accept the undermining of their rights, rather the lack of acknowledgement. And so all that together is super important because we're being edged into a

Starting point is 01:37:42 position where AI is going to start making those decisions based on the precedence that they're making now. And I think that's wildly dangerous, right? So I think that that larger conversation needs to be had about the manipulation of these things that are fundamental now for the technocratic society that they're building around us as we go forward. So take that wherever you'd like. And that's just considering that the AI system works as it's supposed to work. And I use technology all the time and it doesn't. You're in this automated system, you're a comma or a type of a way from being convicted of a crime that you didn't commit, but somebody with the name very like yours did or something like that. And this is something nobody is willing to really think about,

Starting point is 01:38:19 is that there are limits to competence and there are limits to capabilities and that itself is a threat. There isn't just a like a malignant, deliberate, proactive threat. There is the threat of a system that doesn't recognize the importance of the human element. Yeah. Well, I'll have a more thing to it in general is that, you know, see, again, where it's going, is that if we're at a point where a power structure can simply go, you are this thing, right? You are an illegal alien, let's say, and be able to remove you without process. How can that, why couldn't that just happen to an American?

Starting point is 01:38:49 And you go, oopsie, you know, now he's away because there was no process in which they had to prove that was the case. Now, these are very basic fundamental things that we're losing sight of in the world today. And I think it's designed to get us okay with that before we have this massive shift into something where, you know, we're now dealing with machines or algorithms or whatever we're talking about as James discussed algocracy, right, which is where this is going. But to bring it back to your larger point, Jason, is that the overlap to all of this, this transhumanist technocratic future that they're definitely pushing us into, all the points on her article showing how. this is happening under this administration, but to be clear, it's not unique to partisanship. It's been going on for a very long time. So let's end on that. You know, organoids brought up and at different points around that. Yeah. So, you know, I just kind of want to end on, you know, I talked about, I often talk about the other end of transhumanism, right?

Starting point is 01:39:37 Like human beings merging with technology, whether that's brain computer interfaces or other types of tech. They've now kind of reverse engineered that. So what organoids are is that, is that you take mitochondrial stem cells and then you grow artificial brain tissue that is then integrated into traditional electronics. And I know this sounds totally wild, but they've already again been creating these things for over half a decade. In fact, you can get a kit. And I played the like I played the stem cell lab kit. Here's how they do it. And it's a lot of CRISPR tech and things like that. Boys Life magazine.

Starting point is 01:40:17 Listen, if you go watch the video, the music, I am bobbing and weaving. It's very much like that. So I had a conversation with Greg Autry of NASA about this because they're also utilizing this technology on the ISS. Here's how commercialized

Starting point is 01:40:33 it's become. And I had no idea about this guy. I'd never heard of him before. Alvin Lucier. This guy was a very experimental composer where even in 1960s, in a public forum, he had electrodes put onto his brain. And from his brain waves, he was able to conduct a full kind of like orchestra.

Starting point is 01:40:58 You know, is it super impressive? It's somewhat. I mean, the drums are going. You know, it's something to behold. He's been dead for four years. They did this process where they took his stem cells, created the organoids. And two weeks ago, they had a live concert of. supposedly, and I don't know how much Hocom this is.

Starting point is 01:41:19 It's a private video if you want to actually watch it, but you can see the post and there's news articles on it where this dead person, his, you know, mitochondrial stem cell brain tissue had its own concert, four years post-humus. So I think they're going to try to legitimize this technology with the quantum technology and the other things moving forward as they try to integrate other. into the machines. And I think what this does is this dehumanizes us further and it puts less and less emphasis on our biological realities. That's all I'll say about it. Yeah. I mean, I definitely think we all see different parts of that. How soon, you know, it tends to be that they

Starting point is 01:42:03 make it look like something that's 20, 40 years away, but it's going to happen in a week, you know, but we have to just pay attention to these things, right? Because these are definitely, I would argue, I guess, at least in the narrative, but the presentation is that that's a little bit more on the fringe of the conversation, but that usually my mind means that there's more that it'll be happening than anything else. You know, it's just paying attention to how alarming these things are and how much is tied in with these central players in the background, in the different studies. Like even going back to people like, you know, Charles Lieber, Bob Langer and the COVID time frame, you know, the stuff they've been working on like Jason's talking about

Starting point is 01:42:33 goes back a long way. And it does dovetail with things like nanotechnology and top of the genetics and, you know, and I actually think we're well beyond that today. That's what we're seeing like 10, 15 years ago. So yeah, definitely worth conversation. You guys have a lot of anything you want to do. Yeah, I mean, I think the, you know, when you've got someone like Thiel, who's, you know, very close to this notion of the dark enlightenment and very close to Yavin, it's tempting to think that our futures that they may have in mind where we meld with technology will be somehow beneficial for us. I mean, on its face, they would argue that we need to do this, this neo-reactionary movement is very much part of, would argue that we need to do. We'd argue that we

Starting point is 01:43:14 need to do this in order to be able to cope with the singularity that they say is inevitable. But when you look more deeply into it, whether the, you know, one of the kind of foremost thinkers in that neo-reactuary movement, a guy called Nick Land calls us technoplastic beings. And the reason that he wants us to become technoplastic beings is so that we can pay our sovereign rent. Because in the in the post, in the post-singularity world that they that they warn against, but are hell-bent on creating, that, you know, one of the problems they'll have with new kinds of industry

Starting point is 01:43:52 and new kinds in an AI-controlled system, you know, with perhaps more limited employment, is how do we, how are we, the people who they, who Nick Land calls inarticular prolls, Teal calls us the unthinking demos, how are we going to be useful? So we merge into, into this system, that they've got in mind, basically as kind of like subroutines in the overall program that will be

Starting point is 01:44:19 running their technocracy. So what they, I think it's important to stress that the people that are pushing this, we might call them the neo-rachshenaries or the technocrats or whatever you want to call them, they despise humanity. They are of the traditional eugenicist, useless eater persuasion. that's how they envisage where we will be in the future. And I think going back to something you said, Ryan, about this kind of notion of bait and switch. So let's take the issue of digital ID. I think a big part of the Trump administration's success

Starting point is 01:45:02 has been because in terms of election success and in terms of the popular support that he's enjoyed is because people thought that, you know, he represented something he could call it techno populists, where they're standing up to the global overreach of things like the Weft and, you know, the UN and these kind of organisations, which Americans are fed up of being under the kind of rule of groups like the World Health Organization and so forth. And so he makes all these bold statements and pulls the US out of organizations like that and out of the Paris, boards and all this kind of things and much, much fanfare and everybody agrees. But the problem is, if you're, if you're a globalist that wants to sell digital ID to a population, it's pretty easy

Starting point is 01:45:53 if you, you know, let's say that what, if we use the traditional kind of political kind of spectrum that we're given left and right, let's say that you've already convinced the left that they need to adopt digital ID in order to stay safe. They need to adopt digital ID so that their carbon and footprints can be tracked. They need to adopt digital ID so that they don't, you know, they don't die of a disease if they cross a border. This is, this is, the cell has already been relatively successful for the traditional left that I would argue.

Starting point is 01:46:27 How do you get the liberty-minded, small-sea conservative, traditional right on board with that? Well, you just sell them the same product, but instead of saying that it's for protecting the planet, you say it's to fight illegal immigration. It's the same product. It's just a different sales pitch. So that's really how I see what's happening is happening.

Starting point is 01:46:52 It's, you know, the notion of the freedom city. There's no difference between the notion of a freedom city and a 15-minute city. One comes from the globalist, so-called quote-unquote globalist elite, and one comes from the new neo-reactionary elite. elite, but it's the same thing. A 15-minute city in a free city are the same thing. So, you know, it's people, people get on board because they, they're behind the person that is selling them the idea. Not, not that the idea is fundamentally any different. It isn't. This is why I tend to think the, in least in this country, but really anywhere in the world,

Starting point is 01:47:31 the false binary, which doesn't always have to be too, despite the name. Like, you know, the idea of that concept clearly is the biggest, block to any real change, like especially in the United States speaking as American. Like it is so obviously like you're talking about. There are people that would otherwise be pushing back and then they flip the script and they do it a little different way. And then, you know, and it continues to oscillate like that. And right now with this administration, which I see is no different than the previous,

Starting point is 01:47:54 just the continuation of a different way for new flavor is doing all that through it with all these different agendas, whether it's bringing down the failed thing we all start to see to, you know, make it a look as if change is happening to really just replace it with something worse or the repackaging of the same problem with the different cell. It's literally everywhere. And that's why it's so important for people to look beyond, you know, not their ideals and values that they may see as conservative or liberal, but like the larger politicized team sport politics of it all because it's, it is, you know, you think about the woke mind virus.

Starting point is 01:48:24 It's a partisan mind virus. It's literally in our face everywhere. That's my opinion, speaking for myself. But, you know, I think that's a very good point to kind of wrap on in general. But you guys, any other points you guys want to include on that? I was just going to rattle off some things on the article before we wrap up today. And we're not only thing to shout out, nothing else, guys? All right.

Starting point is 01:48:42 Well, I just generally point out, you know, make sure, what's funny as we started, like the point was, and I don't know why I didn't immediately recognize this would not happen for how much we have to talk about, but to go through each one of these data points and discuss the issues and also the solutions around them. But, you know, we got to the digital money part of it. And there's plenty more, as you notice, in the war on cash, digital monetary systems. financial disclosure, the Doge overlap, the failures so far of the different things that haven't happened, Real ID, Stargate. And then, of course, you got into Internet bodies we briefly touched on it,

Starting point is 01:49:15 but the assets part, which we didn't get to, which I looked at Catherine's work. It's really important to understand how this, you know, the Lutnik part of this and the financial side of it is playing out in regard to the tariff overlap as well as she highlights and they'll kind of lie around it. Also the energy discussion, as she points drill, drill, drill, baby energy policy from Trump. but also the budget in general, which is what I was just saying about the tariff overlap and how it seems to be offset by other actions that are being taken. And, you know, hey, maybe it'll end up positive, but to wonder whether that was always kind of the plan is the point. But then she also has others at the bottom, election fraud, organized crime, weather warfare, geoengineering, as we were roughly before. A well-written article, and I would argue she herself would point out that this itself doesn't even truly address the real scope of this problem.

Starting point is 01:49:59 There's many other points we could include. But thank you all for joining today. and you know anything else you want to leave on the way out in general i just i think it's in you know a good time to discuss these things thank you for being here i'd also just say she did throw in the epstein files and i think a good assessment there uh you know there's a whole another ball of corruption that i mean people should be being prosecuted for the evidence that they're going through and since we're not seeing that look i don't think we're going to see those files in full because if we did obviously it would have to be preceded by real indictments

Starting point is 01:50:33 real criminal trials and then prosecutions for that evidence to come into the public arena. So I would just encourage people to read this, but realize, like you said, no matter how extensive it is, I mean, we just talked for two hours on a lot of points that were not even included in this. And we could have gone on for a much longer period of time. Yeah. I'd just like to reiterate what Catherine said as well during our conversation earlier. And that is that it's not an all or nothing situation that we find ourselves in. we can make decisions every day in our lives that move us towards the destination that we want to go in that may mean accepting some inconvenience and it may mean you know not being able to do things like

Starting point is 01:51:17 go to a sports event or something like that you know it it might mean those kind of sacrifices but you but it all amounts to what matters to you what do you think is really really important and if you think that sacrificing your freedom is not important, then fine. You know, that's that, that's, that's, that's a choice that you make, but then you have to live with the consequences of that. And I, and I think that, you know, it's going to be very difficult. It's something Steve was saying, billions of people are not suddenly going to start, you know, not not using, not using their cards and not using the, you know, and not using all the modern conveniences that they've become accustomed to. That's, you know, that's a lot of using.

Starting point is 01:52:01 not that's not going to happen but I think if pockets of communities start building and funnily enough we can piggyback on something that has been suggested called the network state because there are there are aspects of the network state that was written right belarjali serifazan that that there might be something to that so creating creating pockets of communities that that communicate with each others like nodes on a network, but that exchange goods and services and trade necessarily outside of the system, that kind of thing could start building some sort of resistance to what is happening. But more importantly than that, for the people that are involved in that kind of thing,

Starting point is 01:52:49 personally, you're already making a stand against the kind of encroaching tyranny. So it's not all or nothing. We still have to use our cards if we buy something from Amazon, but we can use cash. You still buy from Amazon? Just before they go. Yeah. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:53:14 But, you know, so we can make a difference by focusing on what we do every day. Yeah. Yeah. I would also like to add to really just bring something back that Catherine did say before she left. She says she doesn't think it's possible that they can do what they want to do. And I would tend to agree. And I think it might seem sort of passive compared to other solutions. But I genuinely think as much I pointed out incompetence as a threat.

Starting point is 01:53:46 Incompetence is also a source for optimism. I simply don't think they have the ability to do the system they want to implement on a full wide. scale and have it be foolproof. I'm a big believer in the War of the World's defense, which is essentially this they will be rejected. Like in, I can spoil alert of the world's, but in the end, the aliens are killed by bacteria from this planet, not by us. They just can't live here. And I don't believe that this system can exist. I don't think it can be there and not have people simply slip to the cracks and be left alone. Yeah. And I don't And I really do. I see it all the time. People will simply go on without it.

Starting point is 01:54:30 I certainly hope you're right. And I do think it's worth, you know, at least leaning into in hopes that's the reality. But, you know, I think the problem is whether they're trying to change the reality of our world, our existence, in order to make that be able to be possible. You know what I mean? Like we're watching a transformation of the human species, if at least the attempts they're in in the long-term plan. So I think the whole point is that in every possible way that we can, if you recognize this problem, it behooves us to try to make a difference in our lives. If it's the smallest things, whether it's voting with your dollar or speaking out about

Starting point is 01:55:00 this, starting your own show, or completely pulling out of society, you know, all these things are things out there to consider or just, you know, talking about these things. I will. And the Catherine point with Steve, again, you know, it's interesting. It's easy to fall into the idea of the belief. And maybe it's right that no one's going to do that. You know, people are lazy. They don't want to do it because we know that's a part of large portion of this conversation.

Starting point is 01:55:21 But I do always lean in even if it's just wishful thinking. And I do think I see the writing on the wall. everywhere. I think we all do, that at least a growing number, rapidly growing number of people are beginning to question general, like basic fundamental things of the control structure. I think, again, that's largely why this is a time for them to transition to something new. So I think it's worth leaning into that. And I think we should give humanity the benefit of the doubt in a lot of ways historically. I think people are better than we get me credit for. And I think that the system knows that, which is why it's always presenting itself as good

Starting point is 01:55:51 and altruistic and fighting for freedom and liberty when they don't have to, right? If they believe we were all bad, then why would they want? You know, I think it shows the game. But I'll end with in general about where we are now, you know, that I think what keeps happening is the partisan game flip-blops. And one side points to the other, one side points to the other, and calls for accountability, never wanting the full accountability. So right now, as you this go forward,

Starting point is 01:56:13 I think a lot of people are like, you know, why is Bill Gates or Fauci or anybody else? Or as you pointed out, all the different things that we know of Epstein or all the net, they were telling, oh, these people are stealing social security numbers. Why are anybody in jail? There's so many different points, being made about things that you claim you can prove. And this isn't unique to trip. This is a

Starting point is 01:56:29 partisan thing. The idea that clearly there should have been something happening by now. There should have been something happening in Biden's ministry, but it doesn't. It progresses. So that doesn't mean you have to completely dislead yourself or break all the views you have, but just recognize what that shows you that ultimately that this is not going, at least right now in the direction that they're always telling you it's going to and at least ask why that may be. And then go through Catherine's article and hopefully you'll put the dots together. But thank you all for tuning in today. And I'm looking forward to some more IMA panels coming up soon.

Starting point is 01:56:58 We have the website still being built from Odyssey at the moment. And, you know, it has been delayed a bunch, but there's a lot going on there. So hopefully that'll be out soon. And from TLAB's side of it, thank you all. As always, question everything. Come to your own conclusions. Stay vigilant.

The Last American Vagabond - IMA: The Fast-Approaching Digital Control Grid

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