The Last American Vagabond - James Li Interview - Has The Epstein Story Broken The Partisan Mold?

Episode Date: July 20, 2025

Joining me today is James Li, here once again to discuss the development of the Epstein case, and the interesting way it which it seems to have broken down the partisan hold on many Americans. We discuss how the Epstein story has evolved, and how/why the Trump administration, for whatever reason, seems to be committing political suicide -- or at the very least taking a very unpopular action from the perspective of his primary base of followers. We discuss the Israeli government connections to all of this, and the possibility of infiltration of the US government by way of sexual blackmail. We also discuss the many other aspects of Epstein's life that are usually overshadowed by the focus on the sexual manipulations, such as his eugenic and technocratic endeavors.Source Links:(1) James Li on X: "Why is Trump protecting pedophiles?!! https://t.co/wZVUa8MveZ" / XJames Li (@5149jamesli) / XJames Li Interview - The True Nature Of The ADL and How It Spies On Americans For Israel(23) James Li on X: "Epstein Files!! 😡" / X(23) Five Times August on X: "So I follow… Trump knew Epstein but kicked him out of his club for his behavior but he never went to the island but he understands that very bad things went on there and in 2019 said we need to find out if Bill Clinton went to the island because it will tell us a lot about the" / X(23) Five Times August on X: "I don't know how to break this to a lot of you but... Barack Obama isn't going to be arrested. Same reason Epstein clients won't ever be arrested. Same reason Comey won't be arrested. Same reason Fauci won't be arrested. Same reason Zuckerberg won't ever be arrested. Same reason" / X(23) James Li on X: "Don’t fall for this political theater. Nobody is mad at anybody — they are all just doing the bidding of the powerful pedos in power. Either release the list… or don’t 😒" / X(23) Jimmy Dore on X: "Yes, now that she covered up the Epstein problem & fixed the Diddy trial her work is done:" / X(23) James Li on X: "Anybody else seen this rerun already? 🤷‍♂️🙄" / X(23) James Li on X: "“The lie is a signal — to those implicated to say no matter what we will protect you.” - @esaagar It’s clear at this point that we know they are lying. It’s also clear that they know we know they are lying. The question is: who are they trying to protect with their lies? 🤔 https://t.co/lcWLdN8bwM" / X(23) FBI Houston on X: "#BREAKING Derrick Barnum recorded the sexual abuse of a toddler and shared it online for other predators to watch. FBI Houston identified him, hunted him down, and now he'll spend the next 60 years in prison. There is no safe corner of the internet where child predators can hide https://t.co/v0osjMb564" / X(23) Saagar Enjeti on X: "Here's a list of Israeli Prime Ministers linked to Epstein: 1. Shimon Peres (introduced Ehud Barak to Epstein) 2. Ehud Olmert (Named as Epstein associate by USVI) 3. Ehud Barak (Connections too vast to paraphrase) 4. Netanyahu (Met with JP Morgan after apparent Epstein intro) https://t.co/X6yO7KMRxY" / XNew Tab(23) James Li on X: "⬇️ This video got my TikTok banned. We are not a free country!! 😤 https://t.co/SX7yVlQ1pj" / X(23) James Li on X: "🚨 Bombshell investigation: Is Israel spying on the world through VPNs?! 🧐 https://t.co/TvCoo5ymL1" / X(23) The Last American Vagabond on X: "@5149jamesli Whitney wrote about Carbyne and other companies used as fronts for Israeli intelligence in this article she wrote for The Last American Vagabond: https://t.co/4T2JTszisz "The Price And The Spy"" / X(23) The Last American Vagabond on X: "Stephen Miller everyone, White House Deputy Chief of Staff, and proud zionist:" / XThe New Trump Administration & The Technocratic/Zionist Coup Of The United StatesNew Tab(23) Jason Bassler on X: "So much for "peace president." Even though Trump criticized endless wars overseas and promised to end them, a new study shows Trump launched 529 airstrikes in just 6 months, nearly matching Biden’s 4-year total of 555. Still think he’s anti-war? https://t.co/UjcjjaukWU" / XMuhammad Shehada on X: "🚨80% of Gazans killed today were murdered at GHF sites by the IDF while waiting for FOOD Not in "battles", not in "surgical strikes", not in "Khamas tunnels"... just starving children, women & men lured into death traps with a false promise of food then gunned down sadistically" / XJeffrey Epstein Invested With Peter Thiel, and His Estate Is Reaping Millions - The New York TimesAmbrosia: the startup harvesting the blood of the young | Health | The GuardianBitcoin Donations Are Appreciated:www.thelastamericanvagabond.com/bitcoin-donation(3FSozj9gQ1UniHvEiRmkPnXzHSVMc68U9f)The Last American Vagabond Substack is a reader-supported publication. To receive new posts and support my work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber. Get full access to The Last American Vagabond Substack at tlavagabond.substack.com/subscribe

Jeffrey Epstein left some lingering mysteries. One of the biggest ones is whether he ever worked for an American or foreign intelligence agency. The former Labor Secretary who was Miami U.S. Attorney Alex Costa, he allegedly said that he did work for an intelligence agency. So could you resolve whether or not he did? And also, could you say why there was a minute missing from the jailhouse tape on the night of the Senate? Yeah, sure. Can I just enter a little second. Are you still talking about Jeffrey Epstein?

This guy's been talked about for years. You're asking, we have Texas, we have this, we have all of the things. And are people still talking about this guy, this creep? That is unbelievable. Do you want to... Welcome to the Last American Vagabond. I'm excited to have James Lee back on today to discuss what he's seeing going on in the world. He's doing a great job of breaking down, you know, the insights in what he sees and the different

political chaos today. He did it with last interview we discussed or we discussed his really great short mini documentary around the ADL. I really still recommend you check this out because it is just a you know, a perfect short caps encapsulation of what that entity really is and what it's tied to. Today we're going to discuss kind of what he's seeing around as obviously Epstein conversation, the Trump administration, Israel infiltration and just whatever else is going on in his mind. So James, it's a pleasure to have you back on the show, my friend. How are you? I'm doing good. Ryan, thanks for having me. Thanks for having me. on. Yeah, my pleasure, brother.

Just today, huh? Yeah, as always, as always. Well, and again, that, that ADL documentary, you know, and really clearly at a right moment for people to see, there's a shifting conversation around Israel, Zionism, and it's just, it's what's interesting about that topic, as I'm sure you keep

finding out and you saw with that investigation, is this stuff is very surface level. It's not like it's really even hidden that well. It's just that it's there and people are afraid to talk about it. And I think this whole, you know, thing is unraveling in front of us. It's an interesting and alarming kind of time at the same moment, you know. But before we get into some of the things that I wanted to get into that I think are relevant

that I want your take on, work that you've done, you know, something I've been asking people I have on lately just because there's so much swirling around day, you know, 30, 24 hours later, our entire perspective can change, right, with the way it's going today. So right now, what jumps to your mind? An investigation you might be involved in right now. What's kind of the forefront on what you're looking at today? Wow. I mean, that's a loaded question because I am looking into a lot of things.

obviously per your intro like epstein comes to mind for a lot of people right it's it's now that they're telling us hey this guy basically didn't even exist you know why are we still talking about this guy it only peaks a lot of people's including my curiosity of okay we've uncovered a lot about him what else is out there let's dig everything up what what could be related let's link some dots recently i've been looking into his ties to peter teal and one of the reasons why I'm looking into that is Peter Thiel has his hands all over government and the private sector. He's one of the most powerful and well-connected people, probably in all of America. And he, you know, to me, the stuff that I'm looking at is like there's a lot of parallels,

a lot of similarities. I'm not saying they're exactly the same. I'm not making assinuations that Peter Thiel is trafficking young children or anything like that. But there's certainly a lot of similarities in terms of their like personal proclimilaries. around sex and doing that kind of thing and having fun in that world, but also being tied into various intelligence, tied into business, high-level people, and having connections in high levels of government to say, hey, is this guy potentially Epstein 2.0?

That's a really interesting thought. I actually had to even consider that, like something that I've thrown around in the past that I don't ever think has been necessarily, like, definitively proven, but there's a lot to add to it is the thought of whether Charlie Manson might have been a representation of like an Epstein of his time. Like there's all the different interconnected points of, he has a little harrum,

he had the connection to the Hollywood scene, and, you know, obvious connections to intelligence. Very interesting thought. So to that forward point to today, is that another representation? That's a really interesting thought. I'm interested to see where you're going with that in the work. So, you know, any other thoughts to kind of add to that in regard to,

is it just like, before even answer, what's interesting is the technology, eugenics, transhumanism, technocracy, kind of elements of teal are very present in epstein which i'm sure you're aware of but don't get a lot of attention so is that the only real thing or are there any more to that side uh you know what what do you think makes that case right now unless you don't want to get into it because you're building let's not let's get into it no i think there's a couple of things there right the one is the the point that you mentioned which is a lot of people focus a lot on epstein's trafficking of

young girls on the sexual side of things the massages and all those things but to your point There is a huge academic project that Epstein is tied to with this kind of transhumanous thing. I think him and Peel were very sympathetic in that vision. And there were, I mean, if you look it up, there is accounts of people not just talking about how they were sexually abused during their time on Epstein Island, but they were talking about being experimented on. And one of the people, I don't know if you come across her testimony, right? Juliet Bryant, are you familiar with her? Testimony on... I haven't spoken to her, but yes, go ahead.

Yeah, so she's talking about being experimented on, in terms of Epstein Island, getting all kinds of science stuff, waking up in the middle of the night in a laboratory, and doctors and people like poking and prodding her. And you have to understand the thing about Peter Thiel is that he is out there in terms of, there's a lot of reporting done that, how he, like, injects young children's, not children, but 18 blood. and he does these like $40,000 operations procedures every quarter. So there's that linkage. Like, hey, what's going on here?

And then I think the thing that you just pulled up is like, hey, there's like some massive investments that we don't even know what they're for as far as like Teal and Epstein back in, I think it was on 2014, right? Epstein investing $40 million in one of these teal funds that we don't really understand what it's for. Is it what kind of projects are behind it? What are they investing in? So that's kind of the tie.

And you have to understand, Peel also is connected as to him beyond just the first, you know, after he became a criminal sex trafficker, then he came into the picture. So it's like, okay, you're associating with this guy after that. So then there must be something, there's something going on. I think there was a clip from Rogan that exists where Peter Thiel talks about how, how he met Jeff Free Epstein. And it was just like, well, he was introduced me as a really good tax guy. And he was really smart.

And the whole exchange was just really weird. Like, okay, so maybe he's good at taxes, but he's also a sex trafficker. And plus, he's investing $40 million, which he neglected to say in that interview that came out later. Peter's a bad liar. He's very transparent. I'm serious. We've seen the clips of him, like, trying to part through like even just like, what about Israel? and he's like shuts down.

You know, it's clear that he has these things. I don't know why he puts himself out there like that. But my thought is that was clearly a moment where he was, you know, aware of what was going on. And to your point, he was aware then. The timing is clear. Where? There's plenty of people out there that, you know, even that. I forget her name now was on stage after this became like the everybody knows point,

was like, we all knew he was doing this. I forget her name. And everyone's like, what did you just say? You all knew. You know, but that's kind of the sentiment. It's like everyone was afraid to say anything. But I think the point is that Teal was not just aware and not saying anything. thing, but he was immersed and overlapped with that.

Now, that doesn't have to mean, unless you're, you know, maybe you know more of your investigation that he's involved with those things, but obviously it's a valid thing to consider. At the very least that you're not concerned with those kind of proclivities. And that says a lot to me. Oh, and what we're thinking about this is. The point is this stuff is continuing today. We kind of think we're framing the Epstein issue.

And Trump is as a thing of the past, right? Oh, look at this creep. Like, we don't need to talk about him anymore. It's basically done deal. Like we've eliminated this guy. But these kinds of things are still going on without. Right. you know, a lot of scrutiny over like, hey, is what's going on with these experiments?

Are people being trafficked against their will, not maybe for a sexual reason, but for more of like science experiments? Is that still happening? Because there's a lot of record showing that it was once happening. And he's investing in all different kinds of these companies that do all sorts of things that, you know, there's just not a lot of oversight. And also he's really powerful. He's tied into basically every single major office in Trump's cabinet and also to all these different tech companies, he's guys his hand all over it. You know, and my worry is, you know, the U.S., I think it gives a lot in regard to being immersed with this administration, this government, but I think I'm more worried about what

they do outside without, like, even less oversight in their prospera freedom city in Honduras, you know, like things like that where it's like, I don't think there's any, like, it's a lawless reality as far as I'm concerned. And so I worry there's a lot more of that going on in the world. But you're right. Good, go ahead. Yeah, he has a bunch of these like islands that he's developing everywhere. And based on, I mean, there's no, we don't really know what's going on there.

Are there people there? Are there not people there? There's just not a lot of public information about that unless you're tied in and you get a chance to go there. So we don't even know if there's humans there. Are there people living on these islands? Are they for what he says? I mean, this kind of like utopia kind of thing or what the hell is going on here?

Yeah. It's a worrisome thing. I mean, that goes into the work. Like, I'm more worried about this kind of technocratic transition that we're witnessing. I mean, I'm sure you saw the attachment 201, bringing in. literal, I think it was Open AI, Palantier and Meta, all being their CTO became part of the military, like actual lieutenant colonels. I just talked to Brad Miller for, you know, he resigned in protest the COVID shot from 101st Airborne and just, you know, he was just ripping that apart and how

alarming it is. You know, it's like there's a lot of that happening. I'm worried about these as, you know, there's a couple names for them. Trump floated the Freedom Cities point, which a lot of people pointed out was just 15 minute cities with another name, you know, but, but that there's that prospera aspect or even in, even El Salvador in a way. Like the way that they're, because, you know, he's a proud Zionist, he's a technocrat, you know, Buckelay and what they're overlap with. I think there's got a lot of these trial balloons. And I think what we're seeing is sort of like this slow transition

into what they want to be this kind of technocratic healthcape, as I would describe it, you know, but that's a whole other aspect of this unless you want to get into that. The eugenics and experimentation, I mean, this was going on for such a long time. And we know this going back, you know, before, I mean, even like World War II, for example, my point is after World War II, the U.S. government, like, absorbed all of the worst parts of what they claim you were trying to fight. Whether it was Dr. Ishi in Japan with their biological experiments or the Nazis. I mean, it's just, it's so this stuff has continued.

Now, I'm of the mind that this stuff is not happening. You know, it's more about something like during warfare, for example. Like in Syria, there was many reports of just, you know, trafficking, organ sales, like things going on. I think the same thing happens in Gaza. So that's where I worry about with these things going on under the guise of, you know, war and other things that we don't see. You know, any thoughts on that? Yeah. I mean, there are literal reports of like, hey, are they.

experimenting on people in Gaza. Like there's literal reports of that happening right now. And I mean, I don't want to say it out loud here, but there's some stark parallels here of what happened, you know, between 1938, 39 and in 1945. So do we care about that? And I think that's where, you know, for a person like myself, you know, I think I'm sort of known for this like deep research stuff. But for me, it's like I'm coming it from from a normy American perspective to say,

okay, where, you know, my interest in this is like, where are we spending? all our resources as a nation, right? You can see you're walking around, you're wherever you live, and you see things are becoming more and more dilapidated. Things just seem to have gotten worse in the last decade, maybe even longer than that. And you're wondering, okay, so what's our government prioritizing? It seems to be, oh, we're prioritizing war in Israel, Ukraine, and we're investing and getting tied into all these tech oligarchs. It seems like we're doing a surveillance state. we're creating the conditions of, I would say, revolution. So it's like almost creating a need to manufacture this consent to say,

oh, no, we need all these agents on the round because, look, people are doing bad things everywhere. And to me, I'm like, well, they're doing bad things because you've kind of pushed a lot of people to which end and what else are they going to do. And so it's kind of like this perfect storm, whether it be on purpose or not on purpose, right? That's the conspiracy, whether this is being done. maliciously, but the end result is pretty much the same that, hey, we're going to get this surveillance state, whether we like it or not. And it seems to be that all the people in power, the powers that be are somewhat aligned in that vision.

We saw that during COVID, as you pointed out yourself, you know, kind of the lockstep of supposed adversaries, which I do think in many ways are adversarial, but when it comes to control over our lives, they're all happy to take what they can get, in my opinion, you know. But yeah, I think that this is clearly going, you know, sprinting in the direction of whatever you want to call it, whatever you see it to be. I think we all notice it right now, but the point, the way I would frame it, whatever you think is happening, that our government is doing things at the expense of Americans for their benefit, for their agenda. I mean, this is the confounding thing for a lot of MAGA right now.

And let's actually touch on that before we get into Epstein, because I think Epstein is one very clear example of something that seems to be fracturing. What I would argue is the most, you know, the grouping of people that really believe in the core values of this country, the Constitution, what we want, you know, but have been tricked, I think, into thinking that's what was happening, you know. But you can see this awareness developing and through that, you know, before we get anything else, what do you think about that with Epstein and the MAGA movement? And like, and for example, there's a few different points we've seen, even the immigration part where it seems they're kind of fracturing. You know, what do you think of that? Do you think that's real?

Where do you think it's going? I think it's real in a lot of ways. From the grassroots level, I think that's very real. I think it's, you have to separate MAGA from influencer MAGA versus like real MAGA, people who are not in media, people are just living their lives and believe in Donald Trump. I think there is a big chasm that's developing here. And the reason why I think is because over the course of maybe the last five, six,

seven years, there's been this like focus in terms of the conservative moving on like, hey, we need to be out there at the forefront of protecting children. And that's kind of their big cultural separator from the Democrats who are out there promoting like LGBTQ values. and trans rights and all this stuff. And then on the other side, it's like, no, no, no,

we need to get back to like the family values. We need to protect children, like, you know, we don't want trans. You know, whether you like it or not, it's like we don't want trans people. We don't want drag queens reading to our kids. So every issue is kind of like centered around, hey, this is our future here, children are the future. We need to protect them, whether it be like this issue with Epstein of like, you know, child sex trafficking, pedophiles and this kind of thing or like the abortion movement of like,

hey, these are real people, these are real humans, like protect the children. So a lot of issues like tie people together in that sense or the sports thing as well with the trend sport. We have to protect that as well. And this is all of a sudden the first time where, or one of the biggest issues out there that he's running on to say, oh, no, we actually don't care about this. And I think that's a huge incongruence to say, how could you be the party of protecting children if you, you're literally saying, hey, no, let's forget about this pedophile. Let's not put anybody in jail.

Let's not prosecute anybody. Like, is Galane Maxwell, you know, if she was in charge of a huge sex trafficking in ring, I suppose she was sex trafficking for somebody, right? It can't be just Epstein. Like, I know he was quite prolific in his activities, but, you know, there's a lot, there's a lot of other people involved in this. And so to say that it doesn't matter, I think that's a bridge too far for a lot of people and that's just pushing things.

You know, I think it's, the lie is just so bold. It's just too much. I've heard a lot of people put it that way. It's just like they know or they know that we know they're lying to them. Right. And they are still doing it. Yeah. Well, since you put it that way and I do want to get it.

I have the, you know, the point you made it with Sega and Tucker, which I agree. You know, it's interesting that everyone knows, right? It's very, very interesting and obvious. But since you put it that way, briefly go ahead to a point I want to get into the Israel overlap. But do, why do you think? I mean, this is what I get from people when you talk to, you know, somebody who believes in Trump, right? They see it. We're all noticing that.

They're very uncomfortable with this, but many of them still decide maybe because Kamal's worse, whatever the logic is, to stick with this. But the question they get stuck on is, why would they do this? It's political suicide. So it's almost like they can't get past that. And so they don't go any further because they just, there must be a reason that I'm not seeing kind of a thing. But so in your mindset, I agree with the logic that this is shooting themselves in both feet. You know, destroying any kind of credibility you had with your big, following, what do you sense from that?

You know, outside influence? Do you think they just don't believe what they're saying? Like, what does your read on that? So this is pure speculation, but there's, right, right? There's two main theories thrown out is that, like, Trump is heavily implicated in this. And he has personal stake where he doesn't want this information to come out. The other is obviously some kind of national security issue, foreign influence by CIA, Mossad, that kind of thing.

And the way I see it's like, okay. Okay, Trump, yes, he has this like thing with women, but the underage girls, I think that's just maybe a bridge too far for him to have crossed. We'll see, you know, if his information maybe comes out. That's not what I believe. I'm firmly on the line of, hey, this is possibly something to do with national security. They don't want this coming up because it's a big can of one because the CIA has already been implicated, not that many people know, but implicated in this kind of like pedophilic activity through their intelligence work. So all of a sudden, now you have more and more information coming out. You could really undermine the institution itself of our whole entire intelligence apparatus.

So once you start unraveling this thing, I don't think there is an end to it. So they said, hey, we just got to put a stop to it right now. And in terms of them doing it this way, I just think that sometimes when you're in command, like a person like Trump who is such a cult of personality and so many people worship him, that can sometimes get in your head and like, hey, I think I could just do anything and go along with it. That goes back to his infamous line of like, hey, I could shoot somebody in Fifth Avenue and people will still vote for me.

This is like taking it to the absolute limit to say, hey, what else can I? Can I just boldly lie to their face? Right? It's that 1984 quote where, what's that quote where basically the party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their most final and most essential command, that kind of thing where I know that you know that I'm lying

you, you just got to go with me here. And I think that's probably what's going on in my eyes. Yeah, that's very, I agree. It makes the more sense. Like, even the intelligence point, like, I could very much wrap my mind around Trump being convinced that doing this would be the end of what he believes he's fighting for. You know, and that, that guess that's in the vein of thought that Trump is actually fighting for what he believes is best for this country.

I very much questioned that today. There was one point at which I was pretty convinced that he was doing, he was being corralled and cowed, which I do think is a large part of it. But there's some things today that make me really question whether there's more to that, maybe even just blackmail and threatening, like, you know, we talk about with RFK, but clearly that does make sense that he could be convinced that this would, you know, bring down something that he's fighting for. But still, it's the contradiction to what you just described.

He is guided by his hubris. I think we all can admit that. And I think very clearly that doesn't make sense. Like the thing, there's a lot of examples where I just go, I don't think he would make himself look that bad, you know, like unless, again, there's a larger point to it. But what I tend to think is that they're, or at least largely considered, is that it doesn't add up to me that they would destroy every bit of credibility, every bit, you know, just for this push.

So I wonder if there is some element of this that is somehow trying to bring down this country, which is interesting because I see a lot of the thought process of that coming. Like even the Republicans before this point were quick to make that point in any, without any evidence about China. You know, a thousand year plan about the, you know, or 10,000 year plan about, you know, and that's good. We should consider that very much so. But interesting now that there's never been more evidence coming from another country

that it seems that most really don't want to acknowledge that or get into it, or at least on the higher up coverage of this. And so that's where I kind of go with it is that it seems that there's something happening here that is implicating a foreign country. And we know that's the case, at least in part, with Mossad. And so then it comes down to the point of, you know, that you were kind of making there, that it's not, the real point is not about covering up the sex trafficking. That is an apparatus around the system that it's about highlighting,

or rather keeping secure the blackmail network, I think, that keeps all of the sex trafficking. in place. Is that, do you think any, where do you think about that? Yeah, I think that's probably what it's at. And I think at this point it's gone too. I mean, you have people like Tucker Carlson who are out there openly saying that, hey, this is the thing for me. Some people are saying, hey, this Trump's life could be in danger.

Or he's playing some sort of 67D chess here where this is the real way to take down the system. I don't, I think this is clearly like there's no, no state deeper than kind of the intelligence apparatus that we have. built here over the last 70 years and it's really strong and it's really powerful it's really tough to take down and that's kind of where I'm sitting at and and I do think although I do think that there is going to be a breaking point when it's just too much for Americans to accept and there's only two out either one where we're going to get transparency and we're going to get accountability

or the other is just more censorship more top down surveillance you know when I think of the two directions it could go right if you look at let's say you know the alligator alcatraz right They're saying, hey, that's for illegal immigrants. That's a processing center. And I'm like, well, the people there, I can very much see in the very near future that it's going to be people who like criticize Israel that is going to be sent over there. And that's what it's going to be for because there's really no other way that if you want to keep the current world, you know, the order in place other than accountability or censorship. You choose one of the two and let's see what happens. And everything points to the second with all this like increase.

you know if you don't want to talk about ice like i don't know if ice is really there to deport people even though that's that's what they say it's for you're basically turning in and somebody gave me this great perspective um gregg stoker who's a u.s army ranger and he kind of opened my my eyes and he said hey you know at this point in the united states we don't necessarily have that power projection abroad anymore like it's not 2003 anymore and we can't just send everybody everywhere and take over other countries so like let's do that here at home. And let's continue the military industrial complex, but on a domestic level.

And very much we're creating the conditions for that need. Yeah, there was a document. I would bring this up lately and I keep forgetting what the time. I didn't find this out. But I think it was something like Baddefield America, but I feel like it's a show. But there was something like that the intelligence apparatus put out. And it got circulated, but I don't think it was meant for average people to look at. But it's simply highlighted, and it's not the first time that, you know, projecting in the future,

that the American people would sort of be their primary enemy. You know, and that's a common thing. I think that's always how the government's view this. I think the biggest threat to them is that they lose control of their population. That's the immediate threat all the time. And so I agree with him. And I think that this is, you know, it kind of a, you know, I weren't even to call it a come to Jesus moment for Americans to kind of recognize

like, okay, this is happening. You know, it's building. It is, you know, whatever the narrative is, it's, you know, offense is offense. Whatever you want to, whatever your, your logic for why it's there. It's about the people coming after you. It's like, well, it also keeps you in. it's clearly what this thing is. And so I'm just glad that people are finally starting to really call this out. And I'm glad you bring up the ICE and immigration point because my God, Trump, I mean,

it's six times now, six times has floated casually the idea of Americans being deported or put in prisons. And to be clear, he was talking about naturalized citizens in many cases, but he said, and born here in two different interviews. I mean, he said the homegrown comment, even though people say he was joke around, whatever. He said it, man, I mean, I do believe that. they do they do think that hey anything that goes against the project that we're currently building here is a national security threat so if you're out here criticizing american foreign policy no matter if you're an american or not you are basically a roadblock or barrier to us accomplishing this and we don't want that right so whatever we can do and for me it's like okay is there i mean for for the americans it's like okay we're supposed to have a justice system that takes care of this like deporting rotation should not be in the picture. It's like,

did this dude commit a crime or not? Is speech a crime is investigating, you know, the government of crime? Is that like, what's the, what are they getting people for? And that's, I think,

that's the kind of the big sort of scary question that we're going to have to face in the upcoming probably year or two. It's like, okay, how, how aggressive are they going to be here? Right. Well,

I think it depends on how much we put, back, you know, just like you were highlighting. I think it's kind of a give and take. And if we, as a populist, don't stand up in enough force. And I mean that in the sense of just being present, not violence, you know, they, I think the power structure as always, I just sure, I sure to talk about this that in the form of a protest, it's something like 3.5 percent, you know, there's a number even police have, the government too. But if it becomes, if it goes beyond a certain number, they know they just can't deal with it. They don't have enough jail cells, whatever it is. So they know they have to stand down. And that's the same point when it comes to any of these

things is if they recognize that not enough of us are together and pushing back, that that's when they can take advantage. And this is just a classic idea. So, I mean, it's about us as a collective as a population, rather, seeing these things, calling them out and stopping, you know, the partisan divided and all. The ice thing is just, you know, it's, look, there are people being deported that should be deported. They're here illegally. You know, it's like that's real. But there's endless examples, the majority in my opinion of people that are legally here, whether they have a green card, or, you know, or going to the process of one of them, which is, it's funny that this is what we tell people they should do. And then as far as I could tell recently, the biggest portion of people

that have been removed or arrested are those that are literally just going through the process of trying to become a U.S. citizen. It's just, it kind of just shows you that it's really just about the numbers and about presenting some kind of a win. And I want to make a point about Stephen Miller when we get past the Israel part because he seems to be the central architect for a lot of this. And he's a very, very obvious Zionist. And I think he's got some ulterior motives in all of this. But let's talk about the Epstein overlap because it really does connect to a lot of these parts, right? Even like the immigration aspect, even the aspect of foreign policy is real the kind of intersection of a lot of it so before we get

into the other you know kind of evolution of the narrative which is funny let's go the end point which is happening right now is this which i love that you should have seen files like it's such a funny it's not that obama and the obvious like is there anybody that doesn't know even democrats that whole russia it was a complete fake like everyone was aware of this not that it shouldn't be called out we know it should be somebody should go to jail we all agree with that but for them to jam this in your face now it just like you said it's obvious what's happening, even though that's important. So what are your take on that and, you know, Charlie Kirk and the rest of it?

Right. My take on this is that this would have been a bombshell finding if Epstein didn't exist or if they handled the Epstein thing differently, where it's like, okay, let's go after this because this seems like not so good. It seems like they're concocting something behind the scenes to implicate Trump and something that he didn't do. Let's, are you guys going to, is this just like a new cycle to distract people and saying we're doing something or are they going to go after Obama?

and say, hey, we should prosecute. Is there a crime committed here? That's kind of where I'm thinking of, like, everything now seems to be a distraction from that central issue of like, hey, are you going to bring people to justice that you promise? Like, you literally were out there saying all kinds of things starting from, okay, let's release the files, right, J.D. Vance, let's release the files. And then Pam Bonnie says we have 10,000 hours of footage of horrible things being done to children.

What we want to know, you know, we don't want to re-victimize like cash. Patel said, we just want to know, okay, who was on those tapes? What are those individuals, or who are those individuals, and what are we going to do to them? Are we going to prosecute them for their crime that they committed? Like, what's going on here? And all of a sudden, now to say, well, this is a huge hoax. The Democrats actually made all this stuff up. It's too far-fetched. It's not the right way to handle this. And that's why it's blowing up in their face, even though Charlie Kirk, I think that post in a vacuum is totally fine, right? That's a big bombshell, but everybody else in the comments is like Epstein files, Epstein files, Epstein files,

like you don't care about this right now. It's just give us those files because that's, that's the big obfuscation that's happening here. Everything else that Trump is going to claim as a win is going to be seen as a distraction. You need to handle this in order to move on to your other priorities. Even I think mass deportation, which a lot of people in the MAGA base are four, even that's now going to be seen as something that, oh, Oh, are you just trying to distract from the fact that you're not going to go after these pedophile? Because that's the whole narrative that's been building up for five years is that there is this like, you know, petro ring that's running the government. And now all of a sudden you say, no, that actually doesn't matter anymore.

We don't care about this. You're right. Oh, it doesn't yet. It doesn't exist anymore. I'm willing to bet like you said, if he would have just said, here's why it doesn't matter in the moment. He probably would have had enough support to keep that floated. But the fact that it became didn't even exist. It's like, you know, that's making on the majority of people being either wild,

blind following sycophants or too dumb to know that that doesn't make sense. But I don't agree with that. I think the vast majority of his base are good people. They want good things. And they came to that and were like, but wait a minute. Like, I can't even find a way to make this make sense. You know, like they want to. And so you're right.

It was a step too far. But that's why I ask, you know, why. Well, that's why I think it is probably to do with Israel national security because they could literally say, hey, we just can't release this right now because national security is at stake. That would obviously be a good reason not to, but it would also mean that we would have to reevaluate our foreign policy with one of our closest allies, quote unquote, and that there's just too many powerful forces to push back against that, right? Because I think the right way to go about things going forward is that we just have to reevaluate our relationship

with Israel. We just have to because there are many other allies in the region for us. It's not just Israel. We could ally, you know, we are allies with like Saudi Arabia. and Qatar and all these other countries that we can still get what we need in the Middle East. Because they're saying, hey, no, Israel, it's not just, it's not Israel. It's actually us needing to dominate that region or have influence in that region. I'm like, there's other countries in that region that we could be working with. Even Iran, we could, I mean, we worked with Iran, probably because we, you know, overthrew their government and installed one that we like.

But there are other countries that we can ally with that we could still sort of project our power abroad, if that's sort of their, vision to do that kind of thing you know i have my personal disagreements with that kind of imperialist idea but even even if that was your end goal there are other countries that we can we can go through to make that happen so i think that's probably the biggest force is like hey we just don't want any kind of opening for this to happen like we we can't have this israel u.s separation and all these zionist forces that you know i'm going to say are in government media all over the place that's forcing this issue.

Absolutely. And it's funny that's even contentious. It's a verifiable fact. And it's not the same as saying a Jewish person. It's frustrating that that has to constantly, you know, all the asterisk every time. But we know why? Because there's people that are weaponizing this idea on all sides. Christian Zionists, and atheist Zionists, which exists.

Yeah. And I was banned from TikTok last week for talking about, I mean, for insinuating that potentially our FBI director could be in a honeypot situation. And I was, it was a really nice, I would have to say that the video itself was not that controversial, right? I basically cited facts and what other people are saying and say, hey, make up your mind. Is he being compromised? Yeah, it's a good. I'll include it in the show notes.

It's a good video. And it's a valid question to ask. And the fact that they just banned your account, you know, it speaks volumes. It really does. Yeah. And I actually just got it back yesterday. But it was through, you know, connections and people higher up saying, hey, this is. is you guys got to look at this situation.

If I didn't have that avenue, I would still 100% be banned. And I don't know for sure. They didn't give me a reason of why they banned me, but that video was taken off because I had posted that. I remember last Friday, and within,

I was checking as like I had 50,000 views. And I remember going to bed, but right before I went to bed, checking again, I was like, within 20, 30 minutes, I had gotten, you know, from 50 to 140,000. I was like, oh, shit, this is taken off, going to bed.

and woke up, you know, just, you open the app up, it just immediately logs you out. Boom, it's done it. In the past, what I noticed is, you know, it's the same thing. If somebody out there had a TikTok account with three followers, they could say literally whatever they wanted and they likely wouldn't take their account down, no matter how bad, no matter how offensive, but it's because, and this is the same thing I noticed, the one, the very first time that I had a video that went over a million views on YouTube, you know, and also at a point when we passed 100,000 subscribers with the first one, you know,

it's like something switched into place. You know, it's like that it's about the momentum. It's about the reach. They just can't, you know, the power structures, varying power structures that don't want certain things out. That's what they'll do. They'll step in and shut that down. But you're right that the average person doesn't have the access to somebody to petition

the top, you know, and that's how that's what they bank on at the end of the day, you know. And I'm glad you got it back. I got, yeah. And it's always, or I don't want to say, but it's almost always to do with these kind of like Zionist forces. is similarly when I did reporting on the Georgia law enforcement exchange program where Atlanta pops are being sent to Israel for training. That video was also reported by the director.

I found out this through a public records request that another journalist didn't. And he just reached out to me and said, hey, by the way, I just want to let you know that your video and your name came up. And the director sent your video to the FBI saying that I was spreading anti-Semitic hate and very dangerous and things like that. And all I was doing was pointing out, hey, we have a bunch of people tied into APEC that's funding this cop city. And these police officers are going to Israel. They're doing all the training there.

They're coming back. They're implementing all these oppressive tactics on student protesters and people's free Palestinian movement. And we should really think about it. It's like, why should American police be sent over there? Like, shouldn't we be trying our own police? Like, what's this all about? Like, why is Israel tied into this? and why are we spending money and why are billionaires who are tied into APEC funding this kind of thing?

Like, it's an investment for them. So like what's the return they're getting? You know, for me, I kind of posited that it was because it's going to have an impact on the way cops feel in terms of their bias. And like, hey, this is where our allegiance lies. Like that's why we're going to act in a certain way. They're buying influence. Clearly, we just saw that. Like you just, I think you just said, in regard to Colombia and other places, we are watching the way that works, you know.

But regardless of the outcome, it's funny. It's just frustrating and obvious that you're reporting on a valid thing. The intention, the idea that by saying those things, you mean hatred, you know, it's just, that's first of all, even if you actually did, that's not a crime. And you're allowed to say and think what you want. At least that's what we pretend in this country. You know, but clearly that's not what you were doing. You know, there's a valid point to be made about this kind of infiltration and manipulation.

And all that aside, how about the fact that that government is literally committing a genocide in the heart condition of every law that we know, but it's okay. They train our police. You know, it's like that's, it's just, there's so many obvious reasons. But these are the things that are falling apart right now. You know, these mechanisms. Most people would just be afraid, like, those are scare tactics. ADL, Greenblatt, they've been exposed for this, your work, and many others.

It's about scaring people, anti-Semitism, violence, hate speech, and people just respond. They don't want, what they know what this, they've seen over the years what can happen if you don't bow to that. You lose your job. You get fired. You lose your personal life. And so people just cow to it. But today, things have shifted.

You know, any thoughts on, I mean, there's a lot of, I just have a funny, because I don't know if you came across this article this morning that's, that was basically calling out a bake sale or something for Gaza as ambient anti-Semitism, which I mean, that's just, I think that's starting to get into the satire range of things, right? That's starting to get very onion there for a long time in my mind. But I know what you mean. It's just, it's just the point to where I would call it desperate. It's an effort to just go, you know, what else can we do? They're succeeding with their efforts of, you know, as I would see it, spreading the truth about what's happening. And they just don't, let's just take that as a Zionist that's disagreeing with that. Just what can we do?

We can't fight. We can't assume violence. We'll get arrested. We have to call it hate speech, anti-Semitism. And it's not working anymore. You know, it just gets more and more cartoonish. And the obvious point is by doing that, you're protecting or hiding real hatred, real anti-Semitism. Well, that's what I'm saying is.

And I have a lot of Jewish friends because I went to school in New York. And some of them have personally reached out to me and said, hey, this is these videos. that you're putting out sometimes you know we feel like it's it's bad for the jewish community or it's crossing the line and i try to explain to them i'm trying to do this on behalf of protecting you know jewish communities because once you start getting tied into this stuff like there's no separating you know the anti-semitism because then you're you're literally saying oh the actions of a foreign country is tied into your religion and you don't have any control over what that country does really so you don't want to be tied into that you need to separate and and i try to explain

explained in groups like the ADL, they only care about Israel. They don't actually care about instances of anti-Semitism that are against Jews. Like the Nazi stuff, they don't actually care about those things. They will allow that to proliferate just fine. But as soon as anything is like, oh, this is a pro-Palestine thing, we got to shut this down right now. Right, right. It's hypocrisy at the end of the day. Again, even if you believe, which in most cases, I think even the ADL recently, I know,

was called out for, I think it was the 400% increased anti-Sysmal. Semitism was shown to be largely Palestinian flags and protest, nonviolent. You know, they just, and so that's the idea. They just will scream that against anything. But the point is even if it wasn't like that, the same point applies. We all pretend when it suits our interest that you're allowed to speak and think what you want, but obviously that's not the case. You can hate almost anything in this country except Israel, you know?

And this is where people are finally going, okay, I get it. I see it. It's not about what they're trying to make it out to be. That's why I've done a lot of, like a long time, but really a lot since October 7th. you know, Dan Cohen on the show, a Jewish person himself, you know, highlighting the lie of Zionism is Judaism. It is not the same thing. It is a it is a bastardization of Judaism. And there's people to disagree with that. There's also a very, very large momentum of Orthodox Jewish communities in the world that go, I completely agree with you, Ryan. So it's very clear that there's something shifting,

you know, but it's important that Americans at least try to parse through this. Don't take our word for it. Look into it. Look at James work. He does a good job breaking the stuff down. I'm going to go to a part that I, from five times August. And then we can, you know, go over a couple quick points of Epstein. Let's finish on that Israel point. He simply wrote this. I just think it's perfect. It's just, it laughs out loud.

I laugh out loud when I read this. I don't know how to break this down for a lot of you, but. Oh, wait, no, I'm sorry. Oh, this is the wrong one. Ah, I grabbed the wrong one. Well, I'll read this. For what I was going to read is just the absurdity. It looked like the same one.

He broke it down in a way that was the absurdity of the way it's gone with Epstein. Basically, you know, it starts where it is. you know, the evolution of it where we're going to go after them, then we won't, then it's a hoax. You know, like the evolution of it were just in your face, I'm not doing a good job representing it, but it just, you all know the story. This is a good point too. This is an interesting point too, and that powerful people, there's no accountability ever. And that's kind of the issue that they're facing is that it seems to be if you're in elite

circles, nothing ever happens to you. And it's just getting to be too much. If you continue to see, and this is from a cynical perspective, if you continue to see the erosion of your own community and you see them getting away with everything, it's going to end in something bad, right? Because I would say, hey, you can probably get away with this genocide stuff and we could probably still be arming Israel if we also had the same commitment to building our infrastructure in our cities, high speed rail. If we had, you know, power lines that are now underground instead of above ground that are causing fires all over the place. If we had that same investment in American cities and people were just kind of going about their lives and they don't see like a continuous decay, because that's something that's very disconcerting. When you're walking around your city and you're like, wow, this looked better 10 years ago. Now it looks like shit.

Yeah. And you're seeing all your dollars like, oh, another $7 million or $7 billion to Ukraine, another $27 billion to Israel. then you started getting, hey, what the hell is going on here? And especially with the Israel thing, where now it's like, oh, I can't even say that we don't want to, our money to go to Israel. And there was just that boat in the house, right, where like basically every single politician voted to spend more money over there, even the ones like AOC or Jasmine Crockett, who are supposedly anti-genocide or whatever.

They're like, oh, yeah, we'll continue to fund this. Then you started saying, what the hell is going on here? And that's the same, I think, with Zoron Mamdani in New York, right? That's, I think, what's propelling his. candidacy is like he is out there saying no no no I'm going to be a mayor of new york i'm not want to go to israel like why should i go there this i have jewish people that i want to serve here like i don't need to go to israel and i think people are starting to say okay that's becoming i think a litmus test going forth a lot of politicians is like are you somebody who is controlled or not

right if you're like the mayor of some random city in texas and you're saying oh no in order to get your funds released to to to help with uh flood release or rebuilding, you need to have a commitment to Israel that you won't boycott Israel. That's starting to not work out anymore. Yeah, yeah, it's becoming obvious, you know. It's becoming too obvious, yes, exactly. What's your quick thought on Donnie in regard to the legitimacy of it? Like, I'm very skeptical of politicians.

I just, it's going to be a very long road of consistently following through with what they claim, which never happens. I've never seen that before I start trusting any of these people or believing in them, rather, hoping that they do the right thing. But he has been saying a lot of things that I think resonate with a lot of people. Of course, the right is consumed. And I'm just as critical of a communist socialist or democratic government. I think they're all potentially leading to centralized power at the top.

That's government is bad. But the socialist aspect of it, the different elements he puts forward. But he's very clearly talking like you could call what he's doing America first. Right. And so it's interesting. So where do you read him right now in regard to that? Do you think he's genuine? I mean, I think he's a genuine person as far as I've seen, as far as like he believes in these policies, right?

I don't think he would be out there promoting these quote, socialist ideals if he didn't really believe in them because there's a lot of just feeling towards that term. So I don't think he would code himself in that way. I'm not, I don't necessarily agree with all those policies that he's proposing, especially some of the weird ones around like, let's say, like transgender rights and all this stuff. Right. To be clear, I wasn't referring to any of that. I'm just talking about the point you made about the Americans first versus is. I think he is genuine. I do think that there is going to be some co-opting that happens.

I don't know the degree of the co-opting, but I think he's already out there softening the position because he's trying to win over Democrats, endorsements and things like that. I actually think he doesn't need to do that because I think the Democrats are so weak at this point. Who cares about an endorsement from like Hakeem Jeffries? He's like, that's not going to make or break your campaign. It really doesn't matter. Or Richie Torres or whoever any of these New York guys are. That doesn't matter.

But he is softening his position a little bit there. I do think eventually if I know the Democratic Party like I do, they will all kind of go towards the center. They will all soften this position if you want to gain power. And we're seeing that with AOC. I mean, I've had a chance to dissect too much and then tweet about it. But like her vote against the or her vote to continue to send. money to Israel is a position to be a Democratic nominee for president the next cycle around.

There's no other reason to do it. You have to get in with the donors. And that's exactly what's going to probably happen with Zoran Mamdani as well. I do give them a lot of credit for taking down the establishment in a primary. And you can now see also very obvious how much the Democratic Party respects the democratic process, right? Because you have now two candidates that are running as independents who lost in the Democratic primary, right? Andrew Cuomo, and Eric Adams. And if it was the other way around, imagine if Mamdani had lost,

and he's like, I'm still going on. I'm doing an independent run. That would be, all the Democratic shills would come out and say, oh my God, this guy is so, you know,

he's, he's, he's fascist, basically. He doesn't respect, you know, democracy. And now you have two guys,

basically not respecting democracy in the process of how the party is supposed to function. And that's where, you know, for me, I'm politically homeless. I'm like, I don't want to ping pong back and forth

between the two parties. Like, is there one party? party that's actually just going to put the needs of Americans first and say, hey, let's reinvest in our communities. Let's rebuild our cities. Let's have like a nice environment so we can walk around and enjoy ourselves. Or how about just whatever you guys decide that I should do, right? Like the reality is supposed to be, right? Like not what I tell you we're going to do. You know, that's what's so funny about it is that people are so disillusioned by this process.

You know, it's that I'm not even of the mind that in most cases our votes even really translate to the outcome. Not that it shouldn't, but we've been stolen from. But it It's just so funny that we get to this point to where, you know, it's, we should just act on principle in everything, right? We shouldn't be voting on party line. It should be about whether the person you want to vote for in that moment is most in line with what you believe in. It sounds like you're the same. My perspectives, my principles, you know, my political standpoints for any different things. It are all over the map because it, because when you stand back and don't let the party guide you, that I think is how it's supposed to be.

You know, it's like you're being guided on what you believe in, not necessarily what you think the other team or your team wants from you. know, but yeah, it's just, I think honestly, actually one point, ask you that question, where do you think the country is in regard to that, in regard to, so let's just say, independent left and right. If you had to put a percentage on it, your opinion. I mean, I think 70% of people are in that bucket now of independent, but it's just what do you, what do you do when it comes time to cast your ballot as an independent? Do you still pick one of those two parties? Or do you go with a third party? And I think there hasn't been, I think, a strong enough endorsement or win for a third party to give people permission to say,

hey, you know, I think we can go outside of the Democrats or the Republicans. I think it's going to take one high profile, kind of, not even at the national level, but probably at the local or state level to get it done, to get people to sort of believe, hey, we can go outside of the two-party system. I heard Thomas Massey talk about this a little bit on his Theo Vaughn podcast, where he's like, The two-party system is kind of very much embedded in our government from an infrastructure point when he's talking about the back rooms. He's like there's two back rooms there. There's only a Democrat back room and a Republican back room.

Even if you're an independent, you're going to go into one of those two rooms. And so there's a lot of institutional infrastructure in place to keep a third party from going in. But I think that in itself is not enough because I think as long as you get a few people in there, I don't care if you caucus with the Democrats or the Republicans. The whole point is for the third party is to exercise. extract certain policies for your constituents to say, hey, I will go along with your bill here, even though I don't fully agree with it. But if you got to give us something. So without that third party interjection.

And that's what kind of happens in Canada with the, for people who understand Canadian politics, with the block Quebec law sometimes. Because that's like a Quebec-based party. So they're able to extract. And you almost always need them to form the government. And so they're able to extract certain things from the major party. to say, hey, we want like extra funding for Quebec. We want like language. We want, you know, whatever the things that they need for their Quebec, you know,

sort of identity in their in their province to say, we want these things. We'll give you whatever those things are. So I think that's kind of what we need to prove happens. And that I think the Democrats, you know, with the AOC and the squad, that's what they thought they were going to be able to do from within the party. It's that shown that they're not going to do that because they just want to rise within that Democratic Party. They don't actually care about the constituents as.

much. So we'll have to see if something like that translate. My hope is that at some point it will, but I might be too early on that call right now. Yeah, I mean, I'm at a point. I share your hope for that. And I would like to see something positive come of this. I just think we're, you know, honestly, I think we're at the point of like a dying empire stage. Like, we are collapsing inside right now. And I think the problem is that we, whatever we thought that could have been, if there was ever a time where the party system we have is ever, you know, we can see like you said in canada, UK, there's just more of the same,

but it's the same kind of false binary or whatever you would call it. You know, it's not, it's an illusion. At least that's what some people I would talk to feel the same way. But it's like I'm at the point now where I think we need to recognize that we might not even be influencing that system. And at least, I mean,

that's what I was trying to say last time. Yeah, there's some nihilism going on here. But I would say to that point, you know, we've gone through other, you know, tumultuous times like the civil war. We literally have the country rip it apart. and we are able to recover from that. So I would say it's always good to like kind of hold out not just hope,

but also put things in place where, you know, for me, it's like, hey, I believe in information. I want people to be educated. I think that is going to create a positive change, whatever that might be for you, that, you know, personally where you want to put your efforts. But I think there's always hope in an effort. It's like, hey, if I put it in the effort, maybe something will come of it because we've been shown in the past. Like, hey, there have been other times in the country look like it was really going to rip apart. But we've shown the resilience to come together.

And I think, hey, there is potentially something that could come together to, let's say, get these Epstein files released. Like, there's something that could happen to say, hey, we're going to bring some people to justice. Maybe it's not all of them, but maybe, you know, give us Bill Gates. Give us a couple people. And we're going to prosecute them. And we're going to restore faith in the American government. That's what is necessary, right? Okay, but see, here's my thought.

I agree with all. So just to clarify my point is, I agree. That's exactly what I'm saying, but from the people's perspective, not like, look, I share a very, I'm not a statist. I don't believe government has to exist, but I understand we live in a world where that is the current reality. And if we're forced to live within that, that, for example, like the Constitution, I think is important. But my point is that the government, the current government structure as it stands, I don't think is currently salvageable. I could be wrong, right? But I think that the problem is that we're trying to fix a broken system,

or rather like, you know, something that is broken beyond repair and all we're seeing is people continue to funnel into it, possibly from a foreign country that's keeping it that way to maintain this ability. You know, look at this way. It's the same way the U.S. government keeps states failed so they can take resources and, you know, we may very well be in that kind of position. And it's worth just considering that. That's all I'm saying is that, you know, maybe voting through a broken system that doesn't

care about your vote is not the only solution out of this. Oh, no, I'm with you 100% on that point. do things outside. I think more good for the country can come from like outside of politics than inside politics, right? There's there's things I'm working on the background right now that, you know, in its infancy, but I will share when I'm ready to share. But like there's things that we're trying to do as a community as as people with some influence, not the, you know, the largest platform.

But there's things that we're doing to like build in. Hey, how do we restore like Main Street in America? How do we restore these community values? And there's things and all of the things. that we're talking about within the people that I'm working with outside of government. We're not going to go. The answer is not to vote harder or to like get elected or anything like that. It's to build in the proper incentive structure and an infrastructure in place to make people

act in a certain way. That's, in my opinion, good for America versus like right now what I see is the country is basically getting strip mined where we're selling off parts here and there just to make it to the next quarter where we're going to sell off more things and with this the same with the debt i think in government i would like to see i think one or two things can actually shift people's opinion of it like for example if donald trump were to be able to let's say reduce the deficit if they passed if they would have passed a budget that was a surplus i think that would have gone a long way in terms of giving him the leeway to maybe get away with this epstein stuff to say hey i got this

this done for you. I'm restoring America. Like, this is a, we're on the right road here. I can't give you everything. Like, this is, this is bad, but I can't give you everything. People would give him so much more leeway. But right now, it's like every single thing that he's promised, basically, he's failing on in a lot of ways. And you just can't sustain that over a period of time. Because then now nobody believes what you're saying, like this whole Pam Bond, are you going to release the general, whatever the, the, what is it called the federal grand jury thing for Epstein? Like, who cares about it? There's no information in that.

That's obviously a ploy, you know, that's going to be the binder. 2.0, right? All the information in there we probably already know. It's funny is Paulina Luna was calling it phase three and I'm like three. Where's the second phase? Which is kind of funny. But rapidly go through these really quickly and we'll end with, we'll end with the Israel part because for the podcast, I'd mention these. I want to make sure they saw this.

So the first one was this was what I thought I was looking at first. It's just funny to read. It's five times August breaking this down. He says, so I follow. Trump knew Epstein, but kicked him out of his club for his behavior. But he knew, but he never went to the island. But he understands that very bad things went on there. And the 2019 said, we need to find out because Bill Clinton went there, right?

Because there's bad things that happened there because it will tell us a lot about the situation. But anyone who wants to today keep the story going is a bad person and a weakling because the story is actually made up. Boring and there's nothing there at all, even though Bondi said they received truckloads of files and there were over 250 victims that. But that's because Obama, Biden, Clinton, and Comey made it all up now. And it's actually complete hoax. But now they're going to unseal the grand jury testimony, even though it's apparently all made up. It's just like it is, you couldn't have written a better, a worse script. Like this is where I'm like, what I really think it through.

I'm like, how would, I mean, don't they have teams that go through these things? Like, it just felt ridiculous to me. And then here is the one that you mentioned. And I do think it's important. And this is about going back to the point about Obama. And I agree with this is this is what I was saying in regard to them doing this. It's important that we hit, like, and I agree, what they're showing you is obvious. But I don't think we were that can, I think multiple people were aware that Obama or rather just the U.S.

government was conducting this sci-op. But Obama, most importantly, and he should be go to jail for this. But I think a lot of them should for a lot of reasons. The point is that now, as you pointed out, it seems very odd. But I think it's interesting that this is where I think, it seems like we agree on this. I don't think anything's going to happen. I don't think Obama will go to jail like we never see anybody go to jail. And that's the real point.

He goes, I don't know how to break this to a lot of you. Barack Obama isn't going to be arrested. Same reason Epstein won't ever get arrested. Same reason Comey won't be arrested. Same reason Komi won't be arrested. same reason Zuckerberg won't be arrested same reason Bill Gates won't be arrested nobody you want to go to jail will go to jail you've been conditioned to perpetually allow very bad people to get away with their crimes in exchange for internet memes and unsound invites now it you could argue

that's a little black pill you know like it'll never happen I argue that we can like we're kind of both saying that we're fighting for to get to a place to where that can happen but as we stand now I agree with them I feel like that's where we've been kind of set this is something that Lumer put out cash Patel Bongino and Bondi with their memo and lack of transparency from office regarding the Epstein files. Source tells them, you know, bottom line breaking over the, the, yeah. So that, to me, that is like, they've already played that card too many times and it's not been true, where Trump is like acting like he's mad at Israel and this and that.

And it's like, oh, or Iran. And then, oh, it's like, oh, it was actually a whole ploy to, to be, to, to, to, to misdirect. So I'm like, oh, is this a misdirection thing as well? Are they actually mad or are they actually pissed off? Because it seemed like all of them had signed off on it. you know yeah yeah i mean i it does it feels very much like theater to me but i guess we'll find out um and you know bondy the the firing of comie's daughter it kind of in the same direction felt it i know what's weird about the russia thing too is that trump before this bombshell came

out the the gabbard files i guess it's being called is it he's been floating this right the the the reason epstein was a hoax is because russia russia they fake russia so it kind of felt like they were priming you for that you know it felt very contrived um and the same thing you said about Bondi says she's ready to move to tomorrow to unseal the ground jury and anybody seen this rerun before it it feels like we've seen this before you know you're the well i want to make a quick point about um because uh the the comie um the prosecutor i think she was also she like totally bungled the ditty um trial as well and that's kind of a parallel here where they're getting him on that you know i don't want to say small stuff i mean they're getting him on the sort

of the prostitution but they're not getting him on the reco charges because it's like oh if he's racketeering, then there must be people that he's racketeering with, and we don't want to get into that, right? That's the whole other thing. Yeah, it's just like that we didn't get. Exactly. So it's like, you know, no, no, he was just doing this. It was a very isolated incident.

Him, he's doing his, is, his freakoffs, and that's all that happened. And it's very much in the same, you know, very, very much parallel to what happened with Epstein is like just a narrow investigation. There's no other bad players. It's just him being a bad guy. This one's just did he being a bad guy. bad guy and nobody else was involved in it. And it's the interesting point of Trump coming out, which does feel kind of like it was a

clumsy reactionary statement that it was a hoax. But that, you know, now at least as it appears in the surface, you got just claims McWill's lawyers going, well, okay, well, if there's a hoax, then that means there was no trafficking, which then why is she in prison? You know, it's like that doesn't make. And so now her lawyers at least seem to be going, well, we want to, you know, appeal and they're pushing back on it. Now, that could be more theater than we realize, but maybe it is just incompetence and

clumsiness, you know, that you open the door for that to. come out i expect some kind of a backroom deal like usual that might let that not happen this is the clip we referenced earlier of sagar and and Tucker and the point being that we all know they're lying and this was a signal to the bad people that will protect you which i agree with i'll let's go past this for time um and just the interesting point of sager saying here's a list of israeli Israeli prime ministers all linked to Epstein all the way up to Netanyahu. It's, you know, there's an important overlap to all of this. But let's talk about, and I'll just briefly, since we're already about an hour,

let's go over this in regard to Israel. Here's your video, which I recommend you all watch of the point we referenced earlier of whether Cash Patel is dating a Mossad agent that you put out a great investigation around is Israel spying on the world through VPNs. We touched on something recently about that. It's alarming to see all these interconnections or the carbine aspect, you know, that, you know, or let me actually just play this clip, and then we can just finish on talking about all of this.

I put this out, Stephen Miller, everyone, White House Deputy Chief of Staff, and proud Zionists. I don't know if you saw this, but you might find this interesting. Issue of the Iraqi civilians, I think that as many of them should survive as possible, because the goal of any military conflict is to kill as few people as possible. But after Osama, who's saying, this hench,

I think the ideal solution would be to cut off their fingers. I don't think it's necessary to kill them entirely. We're not a barbaric people. We respect life. Therefore, torture is the way to go. Because torture people can live. Torture is a celebration of life and human dignity. We need to remember that as we enter these very dark and dangerous times in the next century.

I only hope that many of my peers and people who will be living in this country will appreciate the value and respect that torture shows towards other cultures. So he's drunk when he's saying this, right? I don't, I mean, I don't know. It's 2003, but the point is that it could be joking. Like that's kind of the sense to see the feeling. Yeah. Go ahead. What are your thoughts?

No, I mean, my first reaction is like, oh, he's just having a little fun in the back of the bus with his friends. And it seemed like maybe they're coming back from something. They probably had a few drinks. And he's just doing a caricature kind of situation. But there's a lot of truth in these kinds of moments because I have these moments myself, but with other different issues. But if you were to capture that, they're like, oh, wow, this guy is insane. But I think there's a little, he just believes in those kinds of things.

It's like there's, there's so many truths that come out in these kind of moments. If that was the old, if he had a life of peace and happiness, that wouldn't mean anything, right? But he could look at his track record. You could look at what he's doing. Like we said, he's the chief architect of the ongoing, you know, kind of like building police state of this country. You know, it's clear to me that there's more there. He's a very proud Zionist. He's actively in many ways I've shown.

I think I could point blank, say, acting for Israel's interest to the expensive Americans. You know, and so when you see these kind of things, not that those two things necessarily have to be connected, but it just kind of shows you a building problem of kind of's rampant lawlessness. This might makes right kind of idea that people like that have gravitated to the highest levels of power. You know, and so other than Miller point, I just think he is a very big problem for this country in a lot of ways, you know, all of that together.

You know, the VPN infiltration, Israel, Zionism, Massad, the, you know, the, is this country being infiltrated by a foreign power? Like, let's just kind of talk about that for the last five minutes about, you know, I mean, because you've done a lot of great work on that, that it seemed pretty clear that you think that there's more than people want to acknowledge. So I just want your thoughts and word that from last we spoke to what you see today. Yeah, absolutely. It just seems like over the course of history, there have been more and more of these types of projects that Zionists have used to try to say America is one. with Israel. Like, that's the biggest thing that they're trying to accomplish because the fact of the matter is, I don't think Israel could survive without America's support. I mean, you can see that through government, through the, like, the United Nations and how many times that United States

has used their veto power just on behalf of Israel. I think it's more than, you know, half of the vetoes of the U.S. has been on behalf of Israel. And all these other things, if you're tied into, let's say, the media or through technology companies, right? There's so many of these projects that are interrelated, and that's, there is a purpose to all this. It's to basically make it so you can't separate from an economic perspective. And then you add on top of that, this cultural element to it where all of a sudden, if you start to just say something to, let's say, hey, we should just maybe reevaluate our foreign policy. That's now a form of anti-Semitism to say, well, now you hate Jews and you want the second coming of the Holocaust, even though while they're, you know, at the same time,

Israel, you could argue, you know, some people say genocide. Other people are saying, hey, this is kind of a Holocaust situation that's happening. This is a very similar parallels that are happening. So I think that's the project that they've embarked on over the last 40, 50 years. And it's worked really well. But now, as the material conditions of actual Americans, like I said, are decreasing and getting worse, can you hold this together? Is this still tenable? Right? Because it's, because they haven't given it. It's like, why should we invest? so much in Israel. Why are they enjoying the spoils of, let's say, free health care and free colleges and all the stuff that Americans don't have access to? What's in it for us? Right? That's,

for all the America First people out there listening, that's the big question. It's like, what are we getting out of this relationship, right? It seems like sort of an abusive relationship where we're just doing whatever they want us to do and we're getting nothing in return. I think long term, I don't think it's tenable. I don't think it's tenable. without some sort of like extreme censorship in place. Yeah, which is what we're seeing, you know, in a lot of ways. And like the, I mean, it's just the joke somebody made Steve from A and Wake Up, you know, the snowflakes and the broflakes.

It's just like the right version of the same game. But, you know, it was slightly different. But I mean, even anti-Semitism was a part of the woke side too. You know, it's just about using these identity politics, censorship based on speech, hate speech and, you know, pronouns versus anti-Semitism. To me, it's the same thing. even like the build back better great reset big beautiful bill you know it's like you just see so many different parallels in the same direction of all these things you know it i think that what we're

kind of like grappling with as americans is that a lot of what we've been taught will we understand it maybe at one point being true is not true today you know like the thing the ideas we have but the whole the whole point is that i think at least i will speak for myself that i'm fighting for is to get back to that point i got the same sentiment from you you know to fight back to what we believe we should be. And that's, that's like the most quintessentially American thing that we can discuss. And that you, like you said, though, you talk about these things. And in many ways, you get called racist or anti-Semitic or hateful or an apologist for something out there that the government's fighting. You know, it's, it's- Or Chinese spy. I get the Chinese spy all the time as well.

Yeah, right. I'm an agent of the CCP. You know, I'm trying to infiltrate America. Because when I were talking about Israeli influence, they throw back, well, you're, you're a Chinese spy. So you're actually here on behalf of another form. nation. Well, I mean, the point is always for anything. And as I'm sure you would agree, like, people accuse me with the most ridiculous things. I'm like, sure, question that. Yes. That's how I responded. It's like, I might be a smile. You should look into it. Right, right. But the point being is like, okay, but now present your evidence. Feel free. Here's your fore. Go for it. You know, and the point is it's all insinuation.

Well, this and that, you know, nothing that's actual even evidence, let alone prove. But that's the thing is a lot of what goes on today in the mainstream alternative media is just insinuation, you know, team sport politics. And I honestly, think that the American people are getting tired, tired of all of it, you know, which I think was kind of where we are right now. I know. And that's, that's worrisome because, like, can you sustain a cohesive society if more and more people are becoming nihilistic, right? If everybody is sort of on the edge, what does that look like? Does it, I mean, I think last night there was a driver, I don't know all the details, but a driver that plowed

through 30 people in Los Angeles. What is he dealing with? Like, what made him go to those ends? Because for me, I'm like, if things are going well, I'm maybe, I'm standing home, man. I don't need to do that, you know, today. And it's like all these things, like with the Idaho firefighter situation where that guy was, you know, started a fire to take out, take out some firefighters. Like, what is going on here where we're getting more and more of those instances? And they're definitely not, you know, Iranian terror cells or whatever that people, you know, Laura Lumer folks are saying. It's like, oh, yeah, no, that's, that's an ISIS terror cell over there. or the guy in New Orleans,

oh, that was obviously a jihadist because of his Quran that's opened in his bedroom or whatever. I think we have, fortunately, people like you,

like the independent media ecosystem is just not the same as it was in 2003. So these tactics, this kind of information ecosystem is so different that it doesn't work anymore. You have the Candace Owens

of the world, Tucker Carlson, who are like, no, this seems wrong. I don't think that the analysis is correct and they're presenting their evidence of potentially a different theory of what's happening and enough people are listening to it now where they say oh yeah that that seems us or that seems off

and you're not getting this kind of like cohesive body in like oh yes iraq met weapons of mass destruction thing anymore i think even in this scenario i made a sort of a post the other day when um they were sending the usss nimmits into the golf and i said hey do you guys remember the u.ss.s. liberty You know, I'm just saying that it's a very big possibility that if something happens to it, false flag, you should consider that. And then there was some article that was written and says, no, the USS Nimitz will not be just going to be false flag operation. I laughed about that on the show.

The fact that it wasn't like it's not, you know, like it's not going to happen. It's like, how could you even make that statement? It's like, what an odd thing to say. You know, that was a neat thing to say. But you know, see, we told you it didn't happen. But it's like you could have never known that. Of course, it could happen. A lot of people are proposing underneath.

I think I just prevented a false flag from happening. Because if I just say it out loud, then it's like, okay, that's not going to, like, that tactic is no longer, it's off the table now. You got to do something else. Yeah. That's a good point to make, though, because obviously the point of a false flag is to not have it be, if everyone's going, this is what's going to happen. They're going to go, well, okay, we'll do it later at a different point, but that it ruins

the whole thing, right? But I think there's something to that, though, that, you know, because you'll never know for sure, right? Maybe it wasn't going to happen. But that's what we did. think are one of the important parts of what we do is about trying to, you know, present people with data points for them to come to their conclusions. And just just by putting it out, you may very well may have saved people's lives.

Maybe not. Yeah. I mean, really, though, you know, it's an interesting thing to think about. But that's why it's so important that we stick to our, our principles, our integrity. And we're honest and we do things based on the truth, you know, which is why I respect your work. I think it's important. Thank you. I appreciate that.

Right. I very much. You know, I think people like you have been at it for so much longer than me. I'm, I think I'm relatively green in this space. And the only reason why I joined it is from what I saw behind the scenes in the corporate world and through COVID, right? I know you did a lot of reporting on that. And what I saw behind the scenes of like, wow, these companies who are out there saying they care about science are making big time on scientific decisions. They're making financial decisions.

And I saw it firsthand. And it's not for the good of the American public. It's not good for health. And that's one of my big, you know, motivators in getting into this space. because I've got to be honest with you. I was making, you know, quarter million dollars, just making PowerPoint slides for Big Pharma. And that was a nice, it was a good life.

I make way, way, less money now. I've got to put it out there. So for people who say, oh, yeah, I'm in it for the money and this and that. This is not the way to do it. I'm going to be 100% transparent there. I'm glad you said that. It's just such a funny thing to our, I've dealt with that my entire career, which is funny where it's like, you know,

if you think I'm doing this to make money, you have no idea how this actually goes. It's like it is one of the most, I mean, you know, clearly there are ways. I mean, I'll point out that, of course, if we came on and we're just like, rah, right, we'd probably make a ton a lot more money or a lot, you know, but it's the truth in this industry is not profitable. And I think a lot of people are, you know, beginning to see that.

But it's just, I tend to think those are people trying to shout you back from, you know, trying to make a benefit from doing it the right way. That's what I think that is. Right. And I, and then that's something that I, it's a true North Star for me. It's like, I will always remember why I got into this thing is not for the money. So like when I make decisions, I, if there's anything that would compromise my ability to say what I want to say,

and I might be wrong in terms of what I'm saying in the moment, but if there's anything that compromises my ability to at least give my perspective on things, that's the day that I'm ending this venture because that's not what I'm here for. Like, I'm not here to become, I don't want to denigrate anybody. I'm not here to become another Charlie Kirk kind of figure who has been extremely success. And that's a person who's made a lot of money in media, but he's serving a particular purpose. I'm here in terms of just giving people different perspectives on what the truth might be. I don't know what the truth is, but I'm saying, hey, for example, the false flag.

I'm like, hey, this is something that happened in history. You guys should know about this. So in case they come out with more information, you should scrutinize that information to make sure that it's true. And that's my function here. And there's not a lot of money to be made, you know, calling out the U.S. military industrial complex or the imperial project. These kinds of things are very unprofitable and could get your TikTok. and platforms ban and all of a sudden, oh, my main source of income is gone. So over the last week, I'm like, oh, shit, I need to figure out something.

If I don't get that account back, I've lost 75% of my income. So what should I do at this point? Yeah, yeah. And see, that's the struggle, you know? And I think it's an interesting shift in all this, you know, where there, one thing I keep talking about, and like I personally kind of sends this in a, like Marjorie Taylor Green coming out and really make an interstatement about the amendment for not funding Israel. You know, I agree with everything she said. And I don't know what her intentions are.

You know, I'm very jaded when it comes to politics. I think we have a right to be. And I just said, I don't trust the intention. But I'm glad you're saying it. My point continues to be that if we see people saying what we agree, what we know is right, raise it up. Raise it up. Everything they do, don't then just blindly trust the next thing they say, but hope they have the right intention, but raise up what's important. Start to show people out there who are new to this, even people that are dishonest that they can gain more by being honest with the truth than they can by lying. You know, and I think that we can start to motivate people through those channels,

even if they don't do it for the right reasons. At least we show the, you know, people lean into this right direction. And I think we can change the field that way. I think we are. So hopefully we can keep that going. Yeah, absolutely. I think there's just to tie back with the Mundani point. I think people now respect the truth.

They respect people who just give their opinion about something versus somebody you could see, oh, wow, this is just acting against your morals and principles. So like, why are you doing that? Why should I trust you if you won't even act in with good integrity, right? At least I don't care how you feel about Marjorie Taylor Green's other policies. You may disagree with them, but she might be wholeheartedly. I think she's one of those America first. People would say, hey, I would rather have a white person working in this than a brown person.

And I think that's probably what she believes. And that's something I disagree with. But she's doing it from a place of integrity at the very least, even though I don't agree with that particular ideology. I'm saying, okay, she's there presenting those. views and here this clearly aligns with that was like hey this is not an america first bill like why are we doing this this doesn't make any sense for my constituents i don't want this but and my oh good good and i'm just saying like i would rather support politicians like that who are true to their ideology versus somebody who's just doing the bidding of their donors i i agree with that

and i actually to your point specifically of even things that we may not you know agree with or find detaste but if they you know that they're acting with what they believe in i would agree with that. But my point is, again, more so like, I actually don't, I don't know. My gut tells me, I don't think she really means it. That's just, I bet, again, but nonetheless, it's like, yeah, she sees the benefit. Because, you know, like, like I keep saying, it's like, so they're, they look around and they, okay, she goes, if I say this Israel is going to come after me. I may lose the next election, you know, blah, blah, blah. But if I can get this behemot of the majority that clearly sees this on my side, that's more powerful than anything else. You know, from a politician's perspective, and so good,

Let's motivate them to find the truth more profitable, to find it more, you know, better for their career. You know, and I just, I really do believe that. You know, and I'm glad to see more and more leaning that direction. So, you know, James, thanks for being your man. I really enjoy your work. And I'm glad to have this conversation. We should do it more often. I think your work is really, yeah.

Happy to come on anytime, Ryan. Appreciate you for elevating, you know, the stuff and sharing. I think that's important in terms of helping each other in this ecosystem. Yeah. That we're all in it together. That's how independent media works. It's, it's, if we, if we don't, you know, if we don't come together here, we're, they're, they're trying to pick us off one by one. I can see in this space.

They're like, oh, can we co-op to you? Can we co-op this person? Oh, yeah. I mean, a certain size, let's pick you off. So I think we can prevent that by kind of creating our own network to say, hey, no, it's better. To your point, right, we need to create an incentive to stay independent. It's like, hey, this is how you can build a bigger audience. This is, you know, cynically speaking, where you should be.

You want to create that cynicism where it's like, oh, it's better for me to tell the truth than to lie. Absolutely. Absolutely. Well, thank you, brother. And I look forward to speaking in the future. And as always, everybody out there question everything. Come to your own conclusions. Stay vigilant.