The Last American Vagabond - What The Hell Is Happening w/ Charlie Robinson (6/18/26)

Starting point is 00:00:00 control exactly what people think, and that is our job. What the hell is happening? What the hell is happening? Our homeland. The world is our state. What the hell is happening? What the hell is happening? What the hell is happening?

Starting point is 00:00:17 The best on the planet. What the hell? We could step up the passion. It's happening. It's happening. It's already happened. The madness of the new cycle. Spinning the wheel of chaos.

Starting point is 00:00:29 It is happening. Thursday, June 18th, 2026th, welcome to another episode of what the hell is happening with Charlie Robinson and myself, Ryan Christian. A good time for this, I would argue, for a lot of different topics, one of them being obviously the very confusing, even for those paying attention to Iran war conversation, the memorandum of understanding, all the nuance around that topic, some free speech conversation today. How are you, Charlie? Let's get into all of it. I'm good. I mean, listen, it's very clear. We've won the war 37 times. What part of that don't you understand? Why is it so confusing, everybody?

Starting point is 00:01:09 Well, you know, what's funny is it's like, it's not even like, what's the word for it? You know, because you could make these real. I was CNN was just doing that, a reel of Donald Trump and how many times. And it's like, it almost makes you not want to do that. It's like, but we were doing that well before it was like, you know, it's like kind of evolution of being allowed to be discussed at the right time. But it's very low-hanging fruit to see how many times he's been doing that, which is why for me it's been so kind of confounding.

Starting point is 00:01:32 not that it's happening, but why would he keep doing that? You know, why would he keep? And I think right now, I mean, maybe save for Friday and or whatever, whatever the next step is, because that's even being disputed right now, maybe we'll see a little bit more insight. But like, I think it's pretty clear that it's because he failed. I think that's where we're at. And that ultimately it's about him trying to redefine what, you know, loss as win in a Trump

Starting point is 00:01:56 world. You know what I mean? That's essentially where we are. Do you share that view? It's the Roy Cohn strategy, though. always declare victory, even in the face of overwhelming defeat, and never back down. So he's, you know, I mean, if you, if you say, well, what were the, what was the outcome of the war? What were you, what were you looking to get with this, this new arrangement? Well, we were looking to get the straight of Hormuz open. Okay, well, was it open before the war? Oh, yeah. All right. And now we have to pay $300 billion or somebody is, I don't know, the reconstitution fee, $300 billion. Did you need to spend that before? No. So it's a, it's a, it's a failure. I mean, when, when victory looks like a, of a shittier version of what reality was just five months ago,

Starting point is 00:02:48 that's, that can't be a victory. I mean, I guess after you get your ass whipped, your, your, your idea of what constitutes a victory obviously changes. And I think given how things turned out, this probably is a victory considering how much worse it could be if they continue the fight and lose and, you know, have the shortages and everything that winds up happening. So, I mean,

Starting point is 00:03:15 it's, it's laughable that he would ever call this a victory considering where, where the baseline level was. But I suppose in retrospect, after getting hammered in ways that they didn't think was possible, and then also, you know, it's pretty, that's pretty obvious to everybody who's driving the bus on these decisions, because

Starting point is 00:03:36 you can see who's very grumpy and very unhappy about the outcomes of these, of this settlement that the Israelis are, are universally angry about, about this. So, so, I don't know, I mean, whatever victory looks like in the aftermath, maybe what victory looks like is that the general public now is, is, is aware that the president of the United States, States is not in control of the country anymore if he ever was. But it's pretty obvious that he's not. And maybe that's the real victory in all of this is that people see what's going on. Yeah, that's a fair point. And definitely there are some positives to even a failure, like from a public perspective to be able to see through these things. But I, and I have some different

Starting point is 00:04:23 skepticism around that, the divide. I do think Israelis as individuals are pretty frustrated. But I don't know where the government stands on this. And I do think they're generally speaking, Israeli government is very unhappy with the outcome. That's not to say that they're not jointly playing this the way they want us to see it, you know? And I know you think about that the same way. It's just, you know, it's hard to take it at base value, you know.

Starting point is 00:04:45 But overall, the whole thing is embarrassing for everybody in every single position, you know, every side. All the except one of the actually back to the silver lining point that I think is nice is that some of these people that have been out there, parroting everything that's being said, they're being more fully seen by everybody right now than I've ever known, like the, you know, new media people without putting individual names on it all the time. You know, the people out there that are repeating exactly what's being said. Seemingly, Jesse Waters is being one of those people now just doing the same kind of tactic.

Starting point is 00:05:15 It's really standing out as obvious to people who are now, the line has been crossed for them. Like I was saying people that are close to me who have now suddenly decided to see Iran as that line that's been crossed. why was that not the COVID vaccine? Why was it not other thing? Who's to say? But that has been a huge line. And so these people are now turning around and going, but that guy, Eric and whoever they're all,

Starting point is 00:05:34 they're screaming, we just won still. And I don't, you know, that's a, it's just, it's an important moment, I think. Before we get into all more of the Iran general conversation, let's talk about a couple of other things because I think that will, me, I'll speak to myself, pull me into that conversation for the next three hours because it's so important. But let's talk about a couple of things.

Starting point is 00:05:52 Free speech. You mentioned Austin Franco. and I think that is an interesting one in how it's playing out. Before that, though, let's just touch on something that you and I briefly talked about beforehand, this actually, that I just think it's pretty wild that it's not being given a lot of attention. Certain groups it is, and I'm glad to see that. But as Jeffrey Tucker pointed out, and here are the actual contracts, the U.S.

Starting point is 00:06:15 government, Donald Trump's administration right now. Not only are they, like I've covered before and you covered before, already kind of played a ruse with the idea of stopping MRA shots. They're just simply leaning into the state. self-amplifying COVID MRNA shots, including the 2026 community shot that's still being given to children and adults. But this is new. These are two new contracts for adult and child COVID-19 vaccines in June 2026.

Starting point is 00:06:38 What are your thoughts on that? I'm just, I mean, it's kind of crazy. We're still doing this? Yeah. We're still doing shots for kids for COVID. I mean, for next year, I, you know, well, I'll tell you, there is part of me that just says, if you still want a shot, go get them. Knock yourself out, dummy. Go out there and inject your brains out if you want. I mean, if you can't see through this at this point, I don't know what to tell people. You know, it's so, I think there's a barrier that people put up in their brains when they have, let's say, they've committed. They've taken them. They thought they were a good idea. And now they have to make a calculation. Do I live with regret? And now my, my mindset. is I should have never done that. I feel pretty bad about it, but I'm honest about my current

Starting point is 00:07:30 situation. Or is it a sunk cost? You can't get in a time machine and undo it. You might as well just double down and be all about it, right? Well, I'll take the boosters too. I'll take the next round. I mean, don't you know? I mean, I would never do that. You would never do that. But the psychology is such that a segment of society will convince themselves rather than admit that they'd been had. They will convince themselves that, no, no, this was the right thing after all, and that everybody else is still crazy and they'll wear the masks forever and they'll get on the revolving door of taking these injections for their health forever. And they'll just never allow themselves to unpack the possibility that they could be wrong about the whole thing. And that, you know,

Starting point is 00:08:18 So for those people, good luck to you. But for the others, I do have sympathy. For those who are waking up, you mentioned it earlier, that, you know, you'd think that COVID would be the thing that would wake people up. And, you know, maybe, you know, you'd be right for a segment, right? But you'd think they'd wake everybody up. And, you know, of course, you'd be disappointed there. So maybe, maybe people need to see this.

Starting point is 00:08:41 Hey, you know, guys, they're still doing the injections, not just for adults, too. they're doing it for kids. And in light of everything that we now know, we've been screaming about it before it even happened, of course, but whatever, even the normies now have access to more information that they ever had before. If you're still making the same calculation, I don't know. I mean, maybe you're just captured or maybe you just don't want to know what you don't want to know. I think we always know that there's a group, a segment of the population that's going to be in that. And even within that, for a very. degree of reasons, whether it's fear or pressure. But I, you know, especially today, because like during

Starting point is 00:09:22 COVID, what did we see one of the most, one of the biggest things that people at least retroactively can see that it wasn't as all encompassing as we thought. People were, you know, like we just said, you know, I think the largest group was pressured into doing it. And they framed them as being compliant, you know, is that ultimately, you know, this is a position. I got, I just lost my train of thought I've been doing that so often lately. But back to the shots, you know, the ultimate thing that, you know, we're dealing with these shots that are still being pushed out there for, children for women. And oh, that's what it was. It's not so much about the, you know, I don't know what degree of people are falling for it. So I don't want to assume. I do agree. It's probably too

Starting point is 00:09:55 many. But for me, the story is the fact that this first, this administration that's framing themselves as fighting all these things are still doing it. That enough is that's my first point, is there's still people that are, I guess, lying in themselves. I think it's a minority that this administration, whether RFK or Trump, are still on their side as I think Mary Talley Bowden, who's, you know, a huge proponent of Maha, who is now clearly calling it out, is saying, you want proof that RFK is not your side, it's right here, you know? And that that's what I think the main part is to reach those that need to see it, but then just secondarily that at all of government perspective,

Starting point is 00:10:28 that this is still happening and that we have to fight this. I don't know how many people are still falling for it, though. You know, because remember at the tail end of that, we saw that even the people that have been like diehard booster takers were suddenly, what was the last uptake? It was like 20-something percent among health care workers. nobody's believing it anymore. So I think this is more about something different, you know, but again, like at that larger point, why would they even do it? If they know no one's taking it,

Starting point is 00:10:52 what's the point there? You know, I'd have any thoughts on that? Is there a deeper agenda you see within it? It just seems like a bad move politically, you know? Well, I always, my mind always goes to the possibility that there's a deeper eugenics component to it and that these shots may be created in the U.S. and ultimately approved for use in the U.S. but may walk out the back door and be deployed in sub-Saharan Africa because we have a long track record of doing that. So maybe it's a payoff to Pfizer. Maybe it's not going to be.

Starting point is 00:11:22 I mean, I don't, I'm trying to give them the benefit of the doubt here for some of this. I mean, like, listen, maybe you guys are just under contract and you have to fulfill it and you're going to buy them and destroy them, which I don't think they're going to do, but maybe. I'd be open to that, but if this is just a continuation of the same program, but it's targeted for people who still didn't get the memo, or they're going to scare them the next time around. You can always scare people. Sam Tripley described it as we live in a haunted house.

Starting point is 00:11:57 And I think about that sometimes. There's always going to be another boogeyman that'll get these people to, you know, winter's coming in a few months and they'll dream up some new reason that they need to push them on to people and people have short memories and they'll forget or they'll feel pressured or they'll have to for their jobs or something and ultimately they'll get used but maybe maybe maybe if this is some sort of tail end of the contract could be something that just gets made, produce, put in storage somewhere and doesn't see the light of day. That'd be the best case scenario. But still, you have to ask, why is the government feel so comfortable about doing this and making it

Starting point is 00:12:43 known to the general public that they're spending all this money? I mean, you could, I mean, God knows there's a list of things you could spend a billion dollars on that would be way more effective. We've done that, you know, they clearly don't care. So it's just frustrating to see it. And, and of course I think maybe even the more frustrating side of it is that

Starting point is 00:13:07 we read these articles and we're not even sufficiently outraged anymore because we've read so many of them that it just kind of piles up and it's like

Starting point is 00:13:19 it's another BS contract it's another Pfizer giveaway it's another or whatever whoever I don't know the Pfizer Moderna you insert

Starting point is 00:13:28 big pharma villain here. It's just another one of these contracts when it should be the other way around. They should be paying the people for poisoning them. Why is the government paying them? You know, I mean, it's everything about it is backwards. Isn't that the crux of the point right there? You know, the idea that you, and this is the same thing with like Mark Zuckerberg being at the UFC event or anything else. Like that's the guy that we all were told was the villain. You know, it's like that why at this moment in time, the like more than any other side of this, the Republican side of the whatever we want to call

Starting point is 00:13:59 during COVID-19 on that, you know, the not left-leaning side of the conversation were screaming about how Pfizer, more than anybody, had to be held accountable. We have Brooke Jackson's lawsuit that they, by the way, that Trump's team is also fighting. I always forget to include that, or fluoride or whatever. They're fighting everything that we were, you know, so they're pushing back on that. You know, and now they're giving Pfizer, the group that we know is involved, plenty of ways that I mean, are fraudulent. Do I need to bring up the lawsuit tracker? I mean, you know the billions of dollars that they expect. And now Trump's team, and it would be no different from Biden's, let's be clear, are giving them over a billion dollars to continue to do the thing. Like, you can argue COVID shots

Starting point is 00:14:35 alone is a travesty. It is a challenge, is a, you know, double crossed. But to give it to Pfizer, you know, and we could go off this all day. The point's made. But it's just like, I just hope people who need to hear this can let this be that line for them, whether, you know, along with the other thousand lines that are crossed already. But it's just sad because I, where's the consistency? Where's the consistency? Right. If you were, if you're, if you're, you're, you're, you're, Maha or MAGA or whatever, and you were rightly calling out the shots back in when the Biden administration was threatening people when he was, he was, he wanted to use OSHA and he wanted to use all these tactics. And you were saying, this is nonsense. We shouldn't be doing this. We shouldn't be doing the vaccines in general. We certainly shouldn't be pressuring. Why is it okay then when your team does it? And, and if you can't see that and you're unwilling to admit it, just, just, just. just say you're you're part of a cult then because you're exhibiting cult like behavior. If you're unable or unwilling to change your mind about this, when you see that your side is doing

Starting point is 00:15:37 the exact thing with the exact company. It's not like, oh, it's kind of like they're working sort of with a Pfizer. It's Pfizer. Right. It's the same company that you guys were all up in arms about. So where is it now? Why don't you hold your own people? Are you, are you afraid of them? Is it because they're your team? And they must be operating on some. other dimension and you just don't, you need to trust the plan and you don't know we're really secretly going to get Pfizer. We're just going to give them a billion first. It's all part of a plan to then extract 10 billion. Oh, shut up with that. You're not doing any of it. You're giving it away. You're scared. You're scared of Pfizer. You should be. They'll have you killed. That entire industry

Starting point is 00:16:19 has a long track record of smoking people who spoke up against their criminality. And so maybe they're scared. Maybe they, maybe some of the people closest to it, or have changed their tune about Pfizer because they've been pulled aside and informed, hey, shut up about Pfizer. Or, you know, all those microbiologists that go out on walks and never come home and things like that, you'll be one of them. Yeah. It's, I mean, it's definitely unfortunate that it's not called out more within that, but we know why, because the captured sphere of media is, is one of the most important parts of maintaining all of that. But I still am of the mind that the majority of people are, I mean, at this point, I'll even go as far as to say starting to call all of it out. I mean, and I feel like

Starting point is 00:17:03 we've been watching this for a very long time. And I think it becomes more and more clear as every day goes by. But it's like the, the normy, whatever, the non-politically invested that don't have a job in politics, that aren't, you know, that they're just people watching this that are unhappy, you know, that are calling this out. At one point, it was like worried and unhappy because everything's going the wrong way, but still afraid to call it out. You know, and I think we're past that. I think people are just absolutely fed up, and this is about desperately maintaining the illusion that Americans still support this government.

Starting point is 00:17:33 Maybe I'm stepping out too far. That's where I think we are, man. And I think it's pretty crazy on, oh, go ahead. You have a comment? No, well, I mean, I. Free speech point, but what took everybody so long? Yeah. We agree on that, man.

Starting point is 00:17:46 But, you know, I also want to be clear, though, that I mean, I'm not, we, I could be wrong. We could be wrong. Like I could be, you know, seeing it as larger than I think it is. But at the end of the day, it's the same as like the transition of power, like the, you know, the governance aspect or the freedom cities. Like I keep saying, these aren't hypothetical points. These are literally happening. It's how I interpret what those literally provable things mean.

Starting point is 00:18:08 But what's weird is we can discuss those things and people dispute that those are even there or provable. It sounds confounding, you know, but it's, that's, I guess that's the power of the propaganda machine, you know. We're getting to the point where they're now acknowledging that those things are. there. Yeah, well, barely though, right? And now there's a secondary narrative for why it's like some, you know, it's always mudding the waters. But I am still just convinced that most people are, are just kind of like seeing through not only the corporate media, because that was a long time ago, but now starting to recognize the trap, the secondary trap that was the independent false mainstream media. I mean, I'd like to believe that. I think we see it every day. And to a point

Starting point is 00:18:44 about that very idea, this is one of those moments, I think. You brought up Austin Franco. this is something that Steve and I just recently talked about as well, this clip actually. And so this is, you know, and I got a few other points to include around free speech and what this administration, and please don't ever take that as unique to this administration, just where we are right now. I think all of them do it are taking actions to suppress your ability to speak up with everything else we're talking about, you know? So you want to comment on it first. You want to play the clip? Play the clip.

Starting point is 00:19:12 This is just Fox News, but it just kind of blows my mind that they can be sitting there as the, you know, the Republican side of this, believe you. claim to leave in free speech, absolutism, and basically cheering on the idea that this guy had his life ruined. A little precursor for those that don't know. Simply, simple point is this kid was in a job interview, or I think it was digital, but relevant for the point, basically just says he doesn't want to work for this person because they're a Jew. Now, I think this is such an important point for this conversation because I've often covered this before as people who would say free Palestine and be framed as hating Jewish people, which is the same ultimate point

Starting point is 00:19:47 when it comes down to the principle. Well, this is actually better because this kid stated that. Now, whatever his actual opinion is, you know, there's a reason to why he might say that and not think it, but it's irrelevant. He stated he wouldn't be cause of that person's religion. So it comes down to the fundamental point. Are you going to allow this person to be penalized because you think that opinion is wrong? That's the only world in which this makes sense because that's free speech and he has a right

Starting point is 00:20:08 to think and feel and act and say, you know, outside of, you know, he has the right to think and say what he wants, right? I mean, this is what we all pretend. Here's what Fox News had to say. One of those owners of that company, Emily, that we just watched. He said, I felt bad exposing him because I thought he could have made a mistake and he really doesn't believe that wholeheartedly. I'm glad we know this individual's name. I'm glad he was exposed.

Starting point is 00:20:29 Indeed. And the brothers are so generous and graceful, certainly more than I am because I do want his life to be ruined. I agree with you. It is a permissive structure. And parents, what are your children putting out there? What are the people that have been in your household putting out there online and to their friends? What has been fomented because clearly there is a discontent? somehow this person learned that there is an audacity that you can have with this anti-Semitism.

Starting point is 00:20:51 That's what I found so shocking. Guy and I toured Poland together last May and I, whenever I see things like this, it harkens me back to our trip where apparently there's been no evolution since World War II, that that deep-seated cultural hatred that's been allowed, that's been fostered, has somehow reignited here among the youth. And it is sickening. Cornell needs to take greater steps. So do parents, so do online forms. forms and somehow this 65 pound vessel of hatred needs to know that not only is this not okay but it's not acceptable socially now look the point at the end of the day is it people have

Starting point is 00:21:28 right to think what they want you can say that person deserves to have their life ruined it's about the actions being taken the doxing of his name from level the people like in palat joe lonsdale from palatier you know like high level people who went out of their way to in many cases you can clearly argue break the law by by using information that should not be public or, you know, should be, it is private and making it public because they decided he deserves to have X, Y, and Z. You know, and it's a, it's the whole kind of side step of the right of, you know, F around and find out. Yes, as that as a, as a job, of course, they have the right to not hire somebody. I'll always stand by that. I don't care what your logic is.

Starting point is 00:22:01 Your business, you can decide who you want to work there for any number of reasons. But the idea that they're trying to say that it goes beyond that, that this should be attacked and exposed and highlighted from a power, from a position of authority. This is fundamentally unconstitutional. right? I mean, and it comes down to a, anyway, go ahead. You're the one that want to talk about this. Well, I mean, it just, it proved his point more so than anything that, that, you know, wow, I, you know, I don't want to work for this group of people. Why? What would happen if I work for this group of people? Well, I mean, they might do something unreasonable to me. Exhibit A, they go and do something completely unreasonable. And he just, there you go. This is, you just proved his point of why he didn't want to work for you guys because you do stuff. like this. And then you say that you don't. And you always are the victim. And you can, and nobody can ever criticize you because if they do, it's just, it's a double standard. And it's frustrating to call it out. That, that, look, I don't, the people on Fox News, I don't, obviously,

Starting point is 00:23:01 I don't put much stake in, in what they say or what they think. She, you know, she doesn't know World War II history the way she thinks she does. She, she, she actually, could benefit from from watching a couple podcasts about what really went down but whatever she's regurgitating the official narrative of what happened in poland um but this is not a surprise she knows who pays her bills who who writes her paychecks she knows what she can and can't say she's doing a dance to show everybody she's on their team anybody that gets on the wrong side of that team won't work in media it just won't so she can wear the little cross and go to bat for for the other team if she wants to. But I think for the people who are now watching this, the boomer,

Starting point is 00:23:52 the baby boomer generation has, was fully indoctrinated, but with the relationship between the United States and Israel being a certain way. And the younger generation, they didn't, they didn't bother to indoctrinate them or couldn't, but they don't see the world the same way. So they're, they don't see these barriers as lines that they can't cross. A boomer would never say something like that. But some 22-year-old kid who's, yeah, maybe the world's changing. You know, maybe also, if you don't want the world to have nasty things to say about you,

Starting point is 00:24:35 maybe don't slaughter tens of thousands of children and put it on TikTok and then do dances about how it's great and how you're proud of it and how it's nothing and how these people, insects and all that. So like maybe people have a different opinion about this group because of their behavior. Have we, but of course, Fox News is not going to have that conversation. They're not going to say, well, why is this guy? They, what radicalized him? What radicalized him? They didn't ask that question. Why? Where is all the hate in his heart coming from? Well, I'm glad you asked that, Jessica or whoever you are. Here's a long list of what this kid's seen at Cornell for the four years. He's,

Starting point is 00:25:15 been there. He's watched everybody who's from another country be treated much better than he is. He's watched his administration completely go anti-science with masks and vaccines and all of that stuff. He's watched the wheels come off the university. I'm sure that kid is a different perspective on the world than the baby boomer generation, certainly everybody at Fox News. So I think the world is changing and they're all gassed by it. But I think it shows that you cannot put this genie back in the bottle. It is out. People are talking about the behavior of this group, the country in general,

Starting point is 00:25:52 but the people inside the country in particular. And there are surveys about how many people, what percentage of Israelis believe that Gaza should be completely ethnically cleansed. You brace for the stats and then you hope that it's going to be like 10%. And then you see it's 70 and you go, well, like, maybe, maybe, maybe general sweeping generalizations are in order here. Yeah. To be clear, though, and we have to have this conversation. You know, the idea is that that's indicative of the state of Israel, right?

Starting point is 00:26:25 That's, there are Jewish people all over the world that do not believe what Israel is doing is right. Now, that percentage we can debate all day long, I'm never going to disagree with the reality that the vast majority of people in that state for whatever disgusting reason decide to think the Palestinian should. shouldn't exist. And it's not something that should be debated. Like Abby Martin has done documentaries to go well before October 7th, making that very, very clear. But, you know, the point, though, is I agree with what you're saying, but I think it's important. And, you know, whether we agree on this or not, I'm sure there's, you know, there's definitely room for this to be discussed. And I can always acknowledge that this is my opinion. And I could definitely be wrong. But I think it's super important to acknowledge, as always, and we've talked about this, the very large group of

Starting point is 00:27:04 Orthodox Jews and others that in the world, Jewish people that do not believe that Zionism represents, them. That exists and we all know that. And so it's important to always point out that even if it is 99% of Jewish people in the world, it's not all Jews think this. That's important. And you know what's 100%. And I was out, I was in Europe the last two weeks on a boat trip. And I, and one of the people in our group, a lady who I didn't know was, she and her husband, we got into some pretty, pretty deep conversations. And she said, listen, I have to tell you. We are in a very small percentage of people. We are anti-Zionist Jews.

Starting point is 00:27:44 We're very proud of being Jews, but we're anti-Zionists, and we do not like the things that have been happening in our name. You have to understand, we're hated by everybody. You know, we're hated by our own people. We're considered to be, you know, we've left them. The Christians don't understand us and don't trust us. And I thought, oh, interesting. And, you know, so it was, so that was a reminder, again, to me,

Starting point is 00:28:08 that there are people, you know, obviously, I'd say 70% or whatever, the stats show, you know that there's another segment that's going, this is gross, we don't want this. Of course. We always know that. It's just that those numbers are less, those numbers are more catastrophic than I wish they were, you know. It's a smaller and smaller group that's opposed to it in a larger and larger group that is cheerleading. And it's not even necessarily limited to Israel, obviously. I mean, we find it here in America. A lot of Americans are like, why don't we just get rid of all of them?

Starting point is 00:28:45 Why don't we just bulldoze all of them? And you're like, this is a really bad look for all people involved. We are talking about human beings, after all. And we're talking about kids. And then they show the pictures of the little bombs that look like soccer balls. You know, and you go, like, how am I supposed to reconcile this? Like, I want to give you guys the benefit of the doubt here on some of this. And I want to say that there's a segment of your society that is opposed to this.

Starting point is 00:29:11 And I know that that is true. But man, it's getting harder and harder and harder to hold that line. When I keep seeing even more disgusting behavior from Ben-Givir, again, he's saying, we cannot stop destroying the houses in Lebanon. We can't. We can't stop it. We have to continue. And it's like, that's been going on since well before October 7th.

Starting point is 00:29:33 Right. But again, my opinion, and I think this is statistically shown, is that we're talking about Israel outside of that country, it's a very different conversation. Now, it's a big of people, right? But what I think we're talking about is the political Zionist Jewish conversation versus just people who are Jewish in the world. Now, it's a very difficult thing to be able to have some kind of metric to show what the average Jewish person who maybe doesn't even go to Temple believe is one way or the other about Zionism. And the same thing with like a Christian perspective. We tend to take the political Christian right and like, you know, that's the,

Starting point is 00:30:03 but there's a ton of Christians who do not believe that they align. with the political version of what that is. And so it's very important to think about that. My opinion is that that's dramatically changing in the world. Is that people all over the, when you have people who like Seth Rogan for crying out loud, a very prominent mainstream person who previously was basically telling all the lines of all the talking points

Starting point is 00:30:24 has come out and said, I was lied my entire life about what Israel is. You know, he's changed, at least recently stated over the last year changing opinions about what those things are. It's sort of like the two-party illusion, Republican, you know, Tucker and these people who are suddenly, pulling away from it, but yet the team still wants to frame it as we all think the same thing. That's not the case right now. And so when it comes to this conversation, I think we're talking about

Starting point is 00:30:45 Franco making a point about, no, it doesn't matter what he says. I don't want to work for insert your religion here. He should be allowed to say that. It doesn't matter about what people think about it. But what's frustrating is that I think it then becomes the use of why we need to shut this down. And Trump's team is doing that for Terrell and the rest. He's the one that said, tell me where this guy is and we'll get him fired wherever he ends up. That's Trump's administration. That's just make sure people know that. What's important, though, is that I personally think that people like that are being misled by the larger people in this conversation who are using that trap. We've talked about a lot saying it's the Jews doing all of this. And then they see the

Starting point is 00:31:22 people like Netanyahu and the rest telling you they are the state of the Jews and we're committing genocide. But then when they point to that, they're called racist. But that's the Zionist trap. And so whether he knows that or not, that's up that I think it matters. But he's still allowed to say and think what he wants. But I think it's important to highlight that problem because right now, kind of the way you were framing it before is that the people are noticing this group. I don't think that's the, I don't think we're talking about the Jewish religion and people who are Jewish. I think we're talking about Zionism. And I think that's a very important distinction. I know half my audience, half my audience doesn't agree with that. But I'll always point that out.

Starting point is 00:31:53 And I think the more this goes forward, I think we're going to see that played out. My track record solid. I think we've seen these things ahead of time in a lot of these larger conversations before it's sort of allowed to be discussed. And time will be. tell, you know. Overton window is moving. It's moving. And people are starting to have conversations that they weren't having years ago. And some of them are on the edges of what's acceptable. But that's how change happens. But again, it's like, I think people who say, you know, boy, you're going really hard on this group. I mean, like you've never had before. I said, well, I wrote about this group in 2017 in my first book. I mean, if you're going to write about

Starting point is 00:32:32 control structures. I have to write about them. Why am I going hard in the paint all of a sudden now? Because they're murdering children. In a factory scale. And that has shifted them up to the top of the pecking order in terms of groups that I would focus on because of what's going on. When they stop the murdering of all the children, then maybe I'll focus on something else. When you're saying that, are you talking? about the Jewish religion? Are you talking about Zionism? I'm talking about the the crimes of the Israeli government, the IDF, the the the the the the hiding of it by the American Zionist media like the pretending like it doesn't happen and and the suppression of it on social media and all of that,

Starting point is 00:33:24 all of that. You know, the religion is like a convenient shield that's dragged out from time to time and used when you get a little too close to the truth. It's, oh, you're attacking the religion part. It's like, well, it's there, though. So your point is there, and it is a part of this. There's very prominent Jewish people who are very Jewish, who very much support this agenda. I just always think that's an important that there's, you know, it's, I think my opinion is it's the Zionist political agenda that is causing that to be what's happening. But again, that's my opinion. You can't, you can't, I mean, right now you can point the leading Israeli human rights group, Betselam, who is literally calling it a a a um what's the term they use a a you know a something of a Jewish supremacy something

Starting point is 00:34:07 I'll actually bring it up while you're talking but it's important to see that that's the Israeli human rights group who is making the point that Jewish supremacy is definitely a part of that conversation so they can't beat a couple you know we've talked plenty times yeah I find it important every time and I think that people do uh that the average person out there is still maybe a little unsure of what Zionism is right that it sounds like you're attacking somebody's religion because you think that that's, you know it's connected to Jews and somehow, some way, but it's, you know, political Zionism, as Joe Biden says, you don't have to be Jewish to be a Zionist. I'm a Zionist and I'm proud of it. So, you know, it's not necessarily religion specific,

Starting point is 00:34:49 though definitely skews heavily one way, but it's, it's an idea. It's a supremacist ideology. And the people like the Joe Biden's and Donald Trumps of the world who aren't Jews but are part of this whole Zionist group, I believe that they think that they're part of the group. But I think if things were to get, you know, if the shit really hit the fan and they needed to kind of sort through everything, I think they'd be discarded because I don't think that they're, I don't think that they're real. I think that they're American Zionists or Christian Zionists or whatever that is. And I don't think that the, the, the, pure, hardcore Israeli Zionist would ever consider those people to be equal. I think that the supremacist component wouldn't allow it. That's interesting. And so you think that's because they're not Jewish in their minds. Because it's interesting to me. And I wouldn't even disagree with that. I think, excuse me, there's definitely a major part of this that is it kind of become, you know, it's sort of like they bought into the lie, as I would see it. You know, they believe in that side of it. but we have to remember that Herzl and plenty of others,

Starting point is 00:35:53 like the founding group of people were either, you know, atheists for the most part, whether, you know, secular or not secular. They ultimately didn't believe in God. And that's in their journals. And so that's an interesting thing. So if it did become that, that was the illusory part of it. They founded it on something else. It's just interesting to me.

Starting point is 00:36:10 But I mean, this is, we can go on this conversation for hours. We're ultimately pointing at the same thing. And I think the real point comes down to the fact that Franco had the right to say what he wants. now the job could fire him for that or rather not hire him. But it's the way that the system reacted and very much did unconstitutional things. And this is coming from the team telling you they care about free speech. The rest of that conversation I always find important just because it's, I find it to be a trap. But I hope we can all kind of put that aside regardless and say either way, he had the right to say those things.

Starting point is 00:36:42 And people say no, there's the problem. People really are fuzzy on free speech. they they say it's one of those things that sounds like sounds good to say that you're in favor of free speech but when you really get tested on it when somebody says something that makes you feel extremely uncomfortable or you is perceived by people close to you as being a threat and then you don't act proportionate to the way they want you to respond to that you know look that this is a we're we're playing games with words a lot in this society right now. And, and, and, and, and, and, we're, we're, we're, we're also living in a, in a, in a, in a, in a, in a, in a, in a, you know, and, and, and you're, and you may have, it, you know, it's, and you may have, it may have, it may justify, you've seen a

Starting point is 00:37:49 video about how one group is taking advantage of a situation and that you fires you up. And you may be well within your right to feel the way you feel about it. But ultimately, when we pull back enough and see what's going on right now, it appears that the message has been sent out. Just get them fighting with each other about literally anything, other than the Epstein files and what's going on in Iran. Like, just get them talking about anything. I don't care.

Starting point is 00:38:17 black and white street bike takeovers sunbaters in miami beach get them fighting about anything right but but black versus white especially jews versus everybody uh muslims versus everybody like just make it all world cup bring the world cup people in treat half of them great treat half of them poorly get them fighting you know love the scots treat the iranians like garbage you know and and you just get everybody's kind of churned up and in and busy with nonsense and that that is kind of where we are in respects and it's definitely working you know the old red and black ant jar analogy you know what I mean like it's it's clearly there the hand shaking everything and it's you know and these are meaningless points but that's why they pick those points because you care about them but just

Starting point is 00:39:11 how easily how clear it is that they're using things that you care about to get you fighting your neighbor and as opposed to the person who's actually keeping those things from you, as I would see it anyway. Data centers are important to talk about for sure, but also for every minute you're talking about data centers is another minute you're not talking about what's going on in the Middle East. You're not focusing on the COVID situation. You're not reading the article about Pfizer, getting the billion dollar contract. I mean, you're focusing on something else, anything else. other than the real big issues that are happening right now that we can't seem to sort out. So, um, that's not though.

Starting point is 00:39:53 Before we move on, that's actually interesting. So because this is an important kind of like I for one have been, I'm going to, I mean, we've talked about data centers and AI and stuff a million times, but I want to do another segment on kind of the update of where they are. But I sense from that that you feel like maybe there's a little bit of a like a head fake in that. Is that what I was something in that? Well, no, no, I actually do think data, that might have been the wrong, uh, topic to bring up because I do think data centers are important and I do think we should talk

Starting point is 00:40:19 about them. It might find something else that it's a little bit more trivial, just that we're, that we're, you know, discussing. No, I think data centers are actually quite worthy of discussion. I know. I know. I've talked about that. The reason I asked though is I wondered if maybe, despite we both think that's very important and clearly a part of a larger agenda, but is there something in that that you feel is like, because, for example, this is why I was thinking about it. The China thing seems to be sort of a lie, largely anyway, you know, that we're so far ahead, 12 times the senders, 45% last I checked if all of these are in the United States. And so that seems to be like a lie.

Starting point is 00:41:00 And so I wondered if maybe you thought there was something else there that was more of a, you know, I don't know, anything in there. That was just an example of used. No, I just, no, I mean, I just, I think, well, I mean, I think the data centers are are worthy of discussion, but also, see, the more you get people talking about something and talking over and over again, the quicker you can get them to kind of burn out on it as well. And you can get it kind, I don't, I want to say through the media cycle, because it's not so much just like a breaking news story, but, but you can just get to the point where people go, well, we've, we've talked about

Starting point is 00:41:33 data centers enough. What's more is there to talk about? Let's talk about something else. And, and so maybe the sooner you can get them through that cycle of a, of, of, a feeling. feeling like they've been focusing on it for so long that like let's pivot to something else. Maybe that could be something. But the, and I, you know, I don't know what they're doing with announcing data centers, but then maybe not building all of them. I don't know how much of that is designed to kind of make you feel like it's overwhelming. Like, don't even bother because, yeah, you want to shut down this one. There's 5,000 more that are on the drawing. boards and have some sort of approval. Sure, go chain yourself to the fence at this one down the

Starting point is 00:42:16 street that you think they're going to build, but they're just going to build one one county over and they're going to be building them for, I don't know. So part of that, part of the story makes me feel like they're trying to get you to a point where you feel a little hopeless about it. Yeah. Or maybe, you know, muddy the waters with projects that are never meant to happen. So you don't know which ones to focus your attention on. Either one of the, those points make sense to me. Yeah, it's a, yeah, I mean, I clearly that's right now an important story that we should ignore, but it will only become more and more relevant and important as this continues to grow. I agree with Catherine. I think that's just a, that's the processing centers for

Starting point is 00:42:53 the control grid. You know, I mean, that's what we're dealing with. Again, that's not even like a disputed point. It's just about the way I frame the facts. Because what you're talking about, it's a data center. Go ahead. If it were just a data center where you were sending all of your, your data, then don't we have one in Bluffdale, Utah for the NSA? Right? You have, you built one big one. Why can't you just build one big one if it's just for that? If it's not just for that, and it has to be spread out everywhere, well, then it's not a data center. It's for something else. It has to be because, because it, the math wouldn't, you, you'd just build one big one or a couple of medium-sized ones, but you wouldn't build 5,000 small ones if it was actually for that. If it,

Starting point is 00:43:38 There has to be some other explanation. Yeah. Well, I mean, it's why I think it's clearly what we're talking about, that this is the, you know, you're talking about real-time data processing to a degree that we've never even fathom before, like an entire society. That's what that's for, guys. I mean, it's like, and if you dig into this, that's not even disputed. It's just about framing it as, you know, whatever it always ends up being, that, you know, we'll be able to, you know, predict the weather better or whatever dumb thing they want to feed you, you know, it's like, cool, convenience. But in New York City, when they were, when the, guys were trying to front run trades on Wall Street and they wanted to put their servers as

Starting point is 00:44:14 close to the data center as possible so that they could get the information like a millisecond before somebody else. So I think there might be some kind of benefit in their minds. There must be some sort of benefit to it being close in proximity to people. Well, think about it. That makes sense because if we're talking about AI, you know, whether we're talking about something beyond we're dealing with now or not, it's about the, you know, doing things to a that we've never, you know, humans couldn't do. And so you're, but that millisecond will probably mean money, clearly. If you're talking about millisecond transactions happening with everything like that's, that's pretty crazy, you know, and so none of these things I think are taking into account

Starting point is 00:44:52 the effects it has on people around them, on the communities around them, clearly, you know? And that's why you look at the bigger plan, whether left or right, it always ends up driving you into population centers and, you know, that's, and it's just be data centers as far as the I can see is how these people envision the world. But the one unique component of it that I find interesting is that usually when it comes to some new device situation like this, you have people that are for it and people that are who are against it. Who is really for the data centers? That's what I don't. It's not, and normally it's kind of, it might not be 50, 50, but there's certainly a group that's for it and there's certainly a group that's against it. And now it doesn't feel like they're,

Starting point is 00:45:36 there's any group for it. I don't know how you could be. I mean, you see the city council's getting doing the votes and then running out the back door. Clearly, the people aren't happy about this. Somebody's being paid off. Somebody's being incentivized to make this happen. But in, but it's, that's in one respect is makes it a little bit more unique is that I don't know how you're, I don't know how if somebody who would say, I am a big supporter of data centers, I would be interested to know, great, what is it about them that you like? That's the benefit. Right. Because I can't think of anything. Well, I mean, I jokingly said because they probably own stock or something. You know, it's like, right. Besides that. But like, okay, there's a data center.

Starting point is 00:46:21 So we've got one in my community, let's say. What does that do for the community? Oh, well, you know, you get your energy at one tenth of the price. If something like that, it'd be like, oh, okay. well that, but that's not it. You probably pay more. Again, what is it that I get from it? And the answer is you get nothing. There is nothing. So I don't know who could even possibly be supporting it outside of people who have a ownership stake in it. So it makes it very astroturfy to me that there's even two sides to it. It feels like there should only be one side. Like, we don't want these period, end of story. Get them out. But it's not happening. Yeah, this is important to see. I think this speaks to the same kind of illusion that I'm highlighting.

Starting point is 00:47:06 You know, so you have self-interest is what you're kind of touching on there. And that's what I keep highlighting in the larger two-party illusion thing I think is breaking down is that people will fight. That's one of the most reliable things you're going to see in any of these conversations. People will largely act in what their self-interest is. And there's varying degrees of why that doesn't happen, social engineering and lies, whatever else, team sport politics. But that's the minority in my opinion, right? So I think what you're highlighting is that you have a thing that's in the interest of the power structure. And then people that gravitate around that power structure, right?

Starting point is 00:47:36 And that's a minority of the larger conversation, the people with investments and the people that build them, the people that will be involved in the surveillance companies, the people that politically benefit from whatever Trump does that day. Like, that's always there. But the majority of people, like you're highlighting, either fall into that because they want to choose a side or whatever. When it comes down to it, the majority are like, well, there's no benefit to me. That steals from my community.

Starting point is 00:47:59 And then, of course, you got a political side. It'll just be against it for no reason. So I think you can pretty easily just by basic, like, deductive logic, see that most people are not in agreement with that right now anyway. And so what I think it shows you is that this is the illusion, whereas the team sells you on what we all think, what all Republicans want, only Democrats hate it. And the truth is it's just not even close to the reality.

Starting point is 00:48:20 And I think Republicans right now, just like I think Democrats during COVID are starting to see that very illusion. I think that's a very positive thing. But you make, that's a good point to see an end. you know go ahead do republicans support data centers not that i can see like because you're interesting is you've got republicans largely pushing back on what like let's just say before right now what they would have perceived as the great reset right like that that's what we that was the larger pushback there look there's a grouping i think of people that will side with whatever trump says or whatever

Starting point is 00:48:48 the the team sport politics is pushing but that's my point is that if you're out there supporting this like you're highlighting it just a podcaster why like outside of the whatever trump says like there's real benefit. You know, what are you going to make money? No. Is it going to sell? You're right. There's no real outcome there. I think that's very obvious. But again, we'll see as we go forward. You know, months from now, now we'll be able to see. You might expect, like, then the left would support it, right? Because if the right doesn't, if the right is saying, no, no, no, we don't like this, then the left has to support. But then the left isn't really supporting it either. So it's one of those things that is truly unliked by, by, but it is, it might be bipartisan.

Starting point is 00:49:25 And so if, and it is always tough to find common ground. What if data centers turn out to be the common ground that unite the right and the left? Like, hey, we can go back to Haiti and each other tomorrow. If we don't focus on these data centers, we're all going to be in the camps together. Like red team, blue team, whatever, or war or, you know, realizing Israel's not America for. Like, these are very clearly the majority of Americans see the problem. Like, how long have we been talking about any? poll either side as far back as you want to look that Americans go, we don't want more war.

Starting point is 00:49:59 A long time. And so this is what I'm trying to highlight is that this, you know, it fluctuates based on category for sure, you know, where there's a little bit more support. But if you generally look at all this stuff, I think it's pretty consistently clear that the majority of Americans are not agreeing with almost, you know, most of the large agendas coming from the two-party illusion. I'm telling, I mean, I, you know, I think that's pretty clear. But to go back to some of the free speech parts of this coming from Trump's administration. I wanted to add a couple more points to that, just to add to not just the, you know, attacks on this one kid for what he had to say and what his opinions are.

Starting point is 00:50:32 You have things like this. This is Rick Scott. And I'll play the clip first. And this is Glenn Greenwald saying the, you know, Florida senator from a Republican Party, demanding a musician's concert be canceled because people might dislike what his, his opinions are. Stand up and vocally reject the hate that Kanye West pushes. stop this concert, we're telling everyone that anti-Semitism is okay.

Starting point is 00:50:56 There it is. No, it's not okay. As long as you, we make- But constitutionally protected and not illegal, but okay. Some money and somebody, somebody said that to me, oh, it's, if they cancel, they'll lose money. So what? You made the bad decision, fix your bad decision. This puts an even greater target in our Jewish community, more than anything Kanye West could say or do himself, call if they allow this, then what's the next event? Because of him present. It's not named. the anti-Jew concert. It's like this is because he's present. That's it. You're,

Starting point is 00:51:26 you know, you are now personified anti-Semitism. You know, that's just insane to me. And if they're not held accountable, if you're Jewish in this city, in this state, how do you feel? You feel like a second-class citizen that people don't give a damn. We have a clear moral duty to reject hate at every level. What are your thoughts? Reminder that Rick Scott stole several hundred million dollars from a health care company on his way out. he is a criminal and it's really funny to hear him go on and on and on. But I mean, I'm not surprised in the slightest.

Starting point is 00:52:02 This is, this is what you do. This is again, Kanye came out and said, I have some problem with this group of people. And this group of people do crazy things to you if you speak out against them. And they go, oh, that's nuts. We would never do that. And then they proceed to do all of the crazy things that he said they were going to do. proving his point once again it's it's tough because these are flawed you don't want to you don't want to go stake your reputation on Kanye West either right you know it's like you you say it's it's his right to

Starting point is 00:52:35 say it do you think it's disgusting do you think it's this do you think it's that like look I don't think Kanye West is a genius like everybody else does I don't think he's a musical genius or whatever I think he's a I think he's a clown but he's got the right to say it and you guys behaving as in a response to it like this, when I say you guys, the government, the Zionist component of the government, whatever,

Starting point is 00:52:59 you name it. Whoever set up the press conference, the guy working the camera, all of them. This idea, it's like, it's such a one-sided street. You know,

Starting point is 00:53:08 because if the same thing were done and it were Palestinians, they'd be up in arms, it'd be the exact opposite. So you get a chance to see the inconsistencies, the immorality of a guy like Rick Scott, who's in no position to lecture you on morality at all. And obviously, this should be obvious by the

Starting point is 00:53:26 fact that he's in Congress, but beyond that, his path towards getting to Congress is dark as well, which makes him perfect for it, soulless, empty vessel who will go out there and say whatever needs to be said by his master's. So I'm not surprised. It's happening more and more frequently. I don't think this is a good tactic. I don't think this is a smart tactic. I think that this this winds up creating more is the stricane effect. People start asking questions about, well, what is this? Boy, I mean, Kanye West is saying some crazy things. He's always been saying crazy things.

Starting point is 00:54:05 Didn't you listen to his albums? But now the response to Kanye West, this is even crazy. Or let me examine this. And so now you've got a whole new batch of people who would have never even been down this path in the first place, who are Kanye West fans who are now starting to ask questions. why is everybody so angry at Kanye? And they go, they start to dig in. They go, oh, I'm starting to see things. So, you know, I'm not trying to give them ideas on how to run this situation better. But if you don't want the world to examine what's going on, maybe don't make big deals out of things that aren't a big deal. Because you're, you become the boy who cried wolf. And you get to a point where some, everyone just goes, oh, yawn, here comes the, you know, oh, everybody's anti-Semitism. An anti-Semitism. semi-again, right? Is this, are we going to get the lecture? We get this every year from Rick Scott. Like, we're done. We're tuning it out. So they, they're not doing themselves any favors by

Starting point is 00:54:58 harping on situations that are non-situations. Yeah, I think it's clearly, I would argue, to some level, some pressure by design to create that very overreaction to aim, I argue, in the wrong direction. But what's interesting, though, what I was going to say before to your point is that this is a good example of where it is, it was literally the Jewish community in a lot of very politically motivated ways, which you could still make an overlap. But I think the point was you had people who responded to go after it for that reason. Like there was, I think, Zionist elements of it, but that's the very point to be made is that there's people who, you know, you can't let him say that in some people were, you know, Jewish coalitions

Starting point is 00:55:33 and whatever else. So that's very clearly an overlap to what we're saying. I just think that's worth pointing out because that was just a reaction of people who were offended by what he had to say. But then you can see the government and authority and power, like what Rick is doing right there, utilize that whether they believe in that or not. That's for you to decide. It's ultimately about controlling your speech.

Starting point is 00:55:51 It's sort of like taking, you know, in fact, a good time to play this clip. I forgot about it a second ago of Donald Trump making this exact kind of a sentiment about, you know, what free speech. And, you know, if you disagree with them, you're stupid kind of an idea, is that this is what they've always been doing. They love to feign the idea that they believe in your rights, but then ultimately use some kind of an argument for why it doesn't apply in the moment when they want to apply it, left and right. I'm sure you've seen these clips. Because we're losing a lot of people because of the Internet. And we have to do something. We have to go see Bill Gates and a lot of different people that really understand what's happening.

Starting point is 00:56:23 We have to talk to them maybe in certain areas closing that internet up in some way. Somebody will say, oh, freedom of speech, freedom of speech. These are foolish people. Well, they're also correct. We have a lot of foolish people. And I think you should get a one-year jail sentence if you do anything to desecrate the American flag. Now, people will say, oh, it's unconstitutional. Those are stupid people.

Starting point is 00:56:46 Those are stupid people. It's also correct. You know, that's just the same old thing. You know, and who knows if he knows that or not or cares, you know, it's just about a fundamental understanding of what's constitutional, what's not, you know. But MAGA will unfortunately embrace that. And they won't be intellectually honest about it. And that's a frustration.

Starting point is 00:57:07 Or I should say they have not shown a willingness to do it. Maybe, maybe when, maybe that'll be the turning point where you can get this group to finally say, you know, free speech is free speech. You've got to be able to extrapolate out what will happen just in the next administration. You have to. That doesn't even, that doesn't sound like it's too much of a task, right? To just think, what would happen if instead of your guy having the magic power, the Gavin Newsom had it, or Kamala Harris or whatever, whoever's coming in the future, how would you feel about that? If they can't. put themselves in that position, maybe they're just intellectually stunted and they'll never be

Starting point is 00:57:53 able to see it. And that's, you know, you're just, you're at the end of the road there. But why people can't see if you grant government's special powers during extraordinary times, they will continue to create extraordinary times to retain that power that you've given them. And then they'll hand it to the next guy who I assure you is going to be even worse because he didn't even earn the power. He just was given it. And of course, the governments, they don't learn how to actually govern. They govern through executive orders and decrees and things like that. Emergency use authorization, emergency powers, you know, whatever, when God forbid the

Starting point is 00:58:36 World Health Organization come in and start declaring pandemics and things like that and granting these magic powers to the state, they're not going to give them back. And so if you can't understand that even, that's dangerous for even your team to have these magic powers because they will not stay in the hands of your team. They will be given to your sworn enemy who will come into office next and will use them against you. I agree. I agree.

Starting point is 00:59:04 And I think that it's obvious and it's something we've been saying for a long time that you, if you, I know, it won't end up in this person's hands alone. It'll be in the very hands that you think we're defending against. But see, that's exactly why I. argue that I think this is so like to the to the point from before. And again, my opinion, and I like having these discussions and I want to make sure it's clear. This is how I see it. And I could definitely be wrong. But I think the same kind of point back to the self-interest is that I think what we're talking about is the majority of people who believe in the Make America

Starting point is 00:59:33 Great Again movement who are now uncomfortably, undeniably aware that that's not what Trump delivered. Some of them may choose to still support this, but I don't think that's most people. I don't think most people choose to act against their own self-interest. And so I think with things like that, I think what you're dealing with is the fake MAGA, the fake Patriots, the ones out there using all of this to make you believe that's what they think. And I think most of them are aware that right now, like they might have been quiet about those statements before, but now I think whether it's Iran or COVID or whatever else that

Starting point is 01:00:01 most people in this supporting team are now angry that they're not getting what they were promised, my opinion, right? But I think what's to your point about free speech is that that's the people who believe for that he's right about that, even though they can be shown the opposite. Those are the, that's the fake MAGA movement. There's like the people who support the COVID shots of the fake Maha movement, not the ones that originally supported him, but now call him out because he didn't do what he promised. Go ahead.

Starting point is 01:00:24 Well, in that big group, that new group that's had the awakening, that's, that's aware of the COVID shots and is aware that they might have signed off on Trump's statements in the past, but now things have changed. What happens to them? because they're not going to the left. That's not an option either. They've broken away from the right, but the left doesn't offer them anything that they're looking for. Had they offered them,

Starting point is 01:00:52 they would have been there a long time ago. They just don't want what this current thing is. And I think that opens up an opportunity for somebody to come in, some charismatic person to come in and say, I told you he was lying to you. And of course, the left is just made of lies. They exist in a sea of lies.

Starting point is 01:01:14 So don't even listen to them. But I told you that guy was no good. And you said I wasn't being loyal to the cause. Who's right now? And that person will come in and grab that entire group of people that were leaving, that are uncomfortable with what Trump has become. And finally have admitted to themselves that they've been had, maybe after voting for him on three separate occasions.

Starting point is 01:01:38 But they've come to that realization. Those people are free agents. Somebody's going to want to get them. And whoever controls their minds, whoever offers them a path towards news or a politician that they like, a massy type, you know, somebody who's, I mean, there's an opportunity there. Yeah.

Starting point is 01:02:02 No, it's a good point. And I think that's what I'm worried about. I'm hoping if that's ultimately where this goes, that enough of these people are listening to work like ours and are going to say, okay, I'm not just going to fall right into the next hamster wheel that they present me, right? Whether it's Massey, who even I would argue has right now a pretty solid track record of standing by what he said he's going to do and falling through. You know, and that's the case, but I'm still going to be skeptical like I think we both are because we're jaded when it comes to government in general, obviously so and should be. But I worry about that.

Starting point is 01:02:32 But I'd like to believe that we're at a different moment in time. At least I'd like to fight for that, you know. But you're right is you're going to get this, the Elon Musk and his America party or whatever. these kind of next steps will be and hope and some people will fall for that. But see, that is the whole thing is you take, all they need to do is dilute the change just enough so it doesn't actually take effect. And that's, that's the sad part about this is that that's not as difficult as it may seem. No, and that is, that is the, I just put together a macroaggressions episode called the Nudge Unit. That, that's, when it comes to these psychological campaigns, the,

Starting point is 01:03:05 the perception that some people have is, oh, well, if, if the government was working on my brain, I'd know because I used to feel, you know, I'd feel this way and now I feel totally different. No, no, no, no, that's not what they do at all. They just move you just two degrees off of your original course. Over time, that's enough to take you far, far away from the true mission, right? It's just enough to bump you out so that you believe one incorrect statement in a paragraph of, you know, of trueness. You believe one part that's incorrect and that is all it takes to screw. your entire worldview up. This is the direction that coming with the nudge units. They did it with COVID. They're doing it now, not just limited to the UK, but it's also happening in the U.S.,

Starting point is 01:03:49 but on immigration to get you to feel a certain way. All these, the situation in Ireland, the situation with the NOAC kid in the UK, all of these have the fingerprints of this new Nudge unit on it. So again, they're managing your belief systems. But for people who are, expecting that to look like, you know, them grabbing your head and turning it. It's not like that. It doesn't, that doesn't work. It has to be more subtle. It has to just bump you a little bit off of what you believe right now. And if they can do it that way, then, then you don't even know you've been manipulated. And it becomes your own ideas and your own thoughts. And so you're not deprogramming yourself. It's just who you are now. And that, that becomes almost impossible to, to deal with.

Starting point is 01:04:37 Yeah, that's the key is, you know, if you know you're being changed, then obviously that's not going to have the same effect. If you believe you're making those choices, you know, you'll fight for those things. Yeah, you will. Exactly the point. Yeah. Well, here's a few things I want to include on this, and I'll play a video that I think is pretty alarming. And then we can get into, you know, the Iran discussion.

Starting point is 01:04:56 But I just thought on this note, before we get into Iran, of course, things like this, I just point out is the woke right discussion, Lumer and the people like clutching their pearls at the Iranian team and others, by the way, doing the, shooter McAvon to the crowd. And look, let's just even say their intention was to pretend to shoot. It's, I mean, the insane reality or, you know, the fact that we could be in a point where the, the free speech team is screaming about how you can't let them be in the country because they did that, I just think it's worth noting. And I think that's, oh, and then, of course, here's an example of a different guy doing it, but that's okay, you know, because he's not Roni or whatever.

Starting point is 01:05:30 If you want to comment, go ahead, I'm going to jump to the next video. Keep going. That's fine. This one, I'll just read real quick. And this is just Patriot voice pointed this out. And this is, actually, I should have pointed this a second ago. He said, just to everyone's aware, at the present time in America, if you want to set up a protest against a data center construction in your town and call your local representative while doing so, that is now an arrestable offense. It doesn't matter you, it doesn't matter what you actually say on social media.

Starting point is 01:05:54 It is apparently up to the state, D.8, and local police arrested without a warrant or probable cause because they don't like what you said online and twisted it into it is a threat. And we've already, Basselor's been doing great work, Jason Bassler, on this, pointing out, you know, what they called them the deflock group. They called them terrorists because they're highlighting where the flock cameras are. If you protest, you're enslavement by the technocratic NWO and especially if you get others to join you, you will be treated like a criminal. And this is, you know, a video of them coming to this person's house and discussing it. And here's a clip I want to play. Big Brother is buying your life without a warrant.

Starting point is 01:06:30 This speaks to the loophole that I think we both discussed of, you know, they're not allowed. like they would stop them anyway, to directly surveil and spy. And again, I know they do that. But this is a way to scoop up data using FISA and other aspects through social media, scooping up all of your data, which is how this is, I think, is designed. So let me play this and then we can talk about it. Those memes about your personal FBI agent reacting to everything you do on the internet. Because of Chad TPT, that's about to be real.

Starting point is 01:06:58 You can't have personal FBI agents in real life because the FBI can't hire enough people to spy on every American. But AI changes all that. AI can replace human workers, so you could have enough AI to monitor everyone at the same time. And that might sound like a conspiracy theory, but the government is taking the first steps to do it right now. In March, the New York Times reported that the Pentagon was pressuring AI companies to provide AI specifically to monitor bulk data about Americans. Anthropic, the makers of Claude, refused, but ChatGBT swooped in and immediately took the deal. In just a few years, experts warned that every person could have an AI babysitter that monitors all your information in real time. So that's all your

Starting point is 01:07:39 texts, all your phone calls, all your health apps, your location, your heartbeat. If you ever attend No Kings protests, they recognize your face and put you on a list. If you text your mom that you're upset about ICE, they put you on a list. Or you go to a trucker convoy and protest the government. You go to a list, right? Left and right, it's always the point. If your mood changes during a Trump speech, they put you on the list. There won't be a way to opt out. You won't escape by having a VPN or not having a phone. The only way to stop this is to take collective action to stop AI babysitters from ever coming online in the first place.

Starting point is 01:08:10 Now, regardless of their suggested direction of choice, I'll include the clip. You guys can watch yourself. It's obviously an interesting and obvious problem, right? I mean, like I've talked about the digital twins. I've talked about a lot of that. I'm surprised I didn't even think about this kind of, you know, I mean, I almost don't even think it'll be that specific. but it'll be more of like a, you know, one AI for a group or an area or something. But it's the same kind of point, right?

Starting point is 01:08:35 It's like this focalized, like it's just I don't know why that wouldn't be happening right now. You know, you have any thoughts on that? It's funny how you could tell just by the look of the lady that she was going to be on the left. And right, and so all the problems, the examples that she gave were leftist problems. You know, you feel this way about a Trump speech or you go to a no king's rally. So it tells me that the messaging has to be different for the groups. You've got to have a right-leaning AI data center video rant about how it's going to do this and this. And those would be different.

Starting point is 01:09:09 Or that she's trapped, right? Like that she is lot. Like so that's how I would read it is that she sees the problem, just like we do, but doesn't see it in the right. Like so she thinks it's the only, like she probably sees that as Trump and his team against them as opposed to what I think it is Americans who are seeing it left and right doing it. So she's still trapped in two-party illusion. And whichever side we're talking about it, whether it was the COVID thing or anything, is that the point is that they see the problem. But be aware that they still may pull short when it comes.

Starting point is 01:09:37 Like hypothetically, this goes another direction. And suddenly they're going to start pulling punches for their team when it matters. That's the thing we point out about the team sport media. Is that what that's what they do? It doesn't mean, though, that the point is wrong, that the problem is wrong because he's right. Right. You would just, you're just kind of weaponizing their frustration a little differently by pointing out to her. all the ways it will impact the left and you'd want to do to the people on the right,

Starting point is 01:10:01 you'd point it out there. But then the problem with that is ultimately they would still have the blind spot that it's happening to both sides. And that's what you'd want them to figure out. But if you were being strategic about it, you might say first things first. First, let's just get them mad and understanding it about the things that matter to them, the leftist cause. No kings rallies or the way Trump makes your blood boil. They're, going to know that. So we'll get that. And then maybe the second batch of information will be, by the way, they're doing it to both sides and appeal to them at that point, if you even could or if it would matter. But it's funny. We see this as a problem that does not even need to be right

Starting point is 01:10:46 versus left. I mean, to me, it's not right versus left, but you see how they internalize it. Like you said, in her mind, it's most definitely the Trump team and his band of goons, targeting them specifically so that they can't go to no king. It hasn't crossed her mind that the Biden administration would do the exact same thing to the Trump rallies. And maybe it wouldn't even be viewed as a problem in her mind of that. It would somehow be, well, yeah, we have this technology, but at least it's in the hands of the good guys. That's how she'd sleep at night. And I agree.

Starting point is 01:11:23 But even to broaden it out. that Biden's administration would do her for any number of reasons because of the same point. It's like that's where they might miss that larger picture is that it's not, it's not Trump's team aiming at her because of her personal political beliefs. That's how each side seems to be seeing this. And I'm sure there's some level of that. But it's such an obvious larger point that we're always highlighting about just simply whatever the current focal point is being able to control the way we think about it,

Starting point is 01:11:46 you know, and censoring us if we disagree about whether it's Israel or Iran's foreign policy or, you know, whatever massive change is happening within this country. But, and on the same note, that's probably why a lot of people out there will choose to ignore that video because of that. But what's interesting to think about is that you could point to the No Kings rally and show that there was tons of Republicans or rather people that weren't politically oriented at one side of the other of the two-party illusion that went to those protests or the many examples of, I mean, you go down the list of things just like that and recognize that it's not, you know,

Starting point is 01:12:12 like I would say it like this. I think there's Republicans right now that are so like, and speaking out about it, who are outraged about a lot of things Trump is doing, who are probably more angry about Trump than what some of the Democrats, are saying about what Trump is doing because they feel like they were turned on because they were. They were, you know, it's a higher level of frustration when you have been tricked by him in the first place. Yes.

Starting point is 01:12:33 You know, I'm glad that it's being pointed to. But think about what she said, though, the focal point of the AI to sort of like personalize their surveillance of the individual and how that overlaps with like the digital twin point and the surveillance and the predicted programming and like pre-crime. I think it's happening now. I really do. he who controls the computer in the pre-crime division controls society because you can just make it so that your political enemies were plotting to get you and that you can create fake evidence and this entire thing is it's dystopian and crazy the fact that they're they're still unable to sort of see that it it sort of applies evenly is i think more of a just the two-party system has just warped people's mind I mean, they just, they really can't even, most of them can't even comprehend if you say, you know,

Starting point is 01:13:26 if someone asked me or what red team or blue team for me to say, I'm not on either team. It's like it doesn't compute to them. So what a, so, so in, so I guess in some respects, if you want the messaging to stick, you have to kind of understand how they're going to view it. They're going to view it as the red team is doing it to the blue team, right, which is because the red team's in, power. And then maybe a couple years from now, the messaging will have to change once the blue team's in power and they're doing it to the red team. And then you can say, see, this is how it works as well. But by that time, we'll all be in camps. Unfortunately, it seems that way. Here's what the current winning administration is doing. The U.S. Secret Service is testing a

Starting point is 01:14:09 mobile biometric identification app called Century that allows officers to scan the faces and fingerprints with a smartphone and compare them against government databases. Officials say it will not be used for crowd surveillance. I highly doubt that. I'm willing to bet you that it will absolutely probably already being used for that and requires safeguards such as training and consent. Probably not. But you know, this is the thing we get with them is that like, yes, that's what they state as the large general statement of requirement. But then there's a loophole or a narrative or a need or a national security risk and we have to do it now, especially with this administration. But civil liberty groups are raising questions about oversight, transparency, and the

Starting point is 01:14:44 expansion of facial recognition into day-to-day federal policing. Guys, it's already happening. Here's the article. I hope people check it out. I mean, this is where we're going. And if you think it's unique to Biden or Trump, left and right, you're not paying attention. No. And you have to fight for your rights when you go through TSA. I had to do it on the way to and from Europe where they want to scan your picture every time I'm opting out. I tell them I'm opting out. The guy tells me, you got to tell me earlier. Where? Where do you? I just walked up to you. And the very first thing I said is I'm opting out. I'm opting out. I'm opting. out. I don't know how I can tell it to you any earlier. Kind of scary. I think. But it's this authority. And he did, the guy did it with like this authoritative voice. Right. He was like he was trying to intimidate me. And I just remind myself that the TSA guys got their jobs because they scored low enough on the test to get hired. And, and they can debate me on that if they'd like. But I'll send him a copy of my first book where I pointed out that it's like

Starting point is 01:15:42 golf, low score wins when it comes to hiring those guys. You want to hire people that have no other options. So those you who work at the TSA and are hearing this, I'm sorry, but that's just the way it is. Oh, they know. They're very well. They got the test results. Well, to get into some, the Iran conversation, just a couple of things to start with. I think it's just interesting.

Starting point is 01:16:04 Vance went on this round over the last couple of days of pretty much one of the most embarrassing. Like he clearly with what we'll get into today. And I will add the potential caveat as always that things could change tomorrow in the 60 days. Like, that's always the reality. But we have pretty much the full picture of this, like I think we did pretty much since April, to be honest, of what the memorandum understanding, which, by the way, is not a deal. It's basically stated directions they're going to agree to. It's just, it's so much misrepresentation. But they sent Vance around to do this sort of like,

Starting point is 01:16:33 you know, propaganda campaign to just like talk down certain data points, most of which you can now prove are in fact in the memorandum that the U.S. gave to CNN and others. And so it's just weird to me. What I was going to laugh about is on this one with the view. They basically kind of called him out for being like trying to deflect rather redefine what Trump says. We all saw this clip where Trump says, I love inflation. You know, why? Because it's going to go back down. The ships are coming back in and it's going to, you know, like, whatever.

Starting point is 01:16:58 The idea that he didn't say that they go into on this is just kind of sad. But the point was simply that he can go on there and lie to your face and say, that's not what he meant or what he said. And you can literally listen to the clip. It's not even worth playing. It's the full thing, full context. It's kind of interesting that. So my point is that he went around trying to downplay things that we could prove.

Starting point is 01:17:15 So that's a huge part of this. So here is what Trump was saying in regard to the manipulating the stock market. I wanted to start with this in general. And I think this is somebody actually posted down here, funnily enough, you've seen this movie, the big short. They're talking to those morons. They're selling people on homes and basically criminal, basically, fraudulent activity, but don't even realize it. And they ask him like, why are they bragging?

Starting point is 01:17:41 It's like they don't, or rather, why are they confessing? And the clip is, well, they don't even realize. they're actually bragging to us. That's the sense I think I get from this as well. So here's what he had to say. So the one thing I didn't want to see is I didn't want to see economic catastrophe. If you kept this going, that could have happened. But all I know is every time we talked about the possibility of peace,

Starting point is 01:18:03 the stock market shut up like a rocket chip. It never went down. They didn't like it. The people, you know, the stock market is more brilliant than anybody there is, including the people on this stage other than me, of course. Let's see What does that statement even mean, though? Stock market's smarter.

Starting point is 01:18:23 It doesn't make sense. I don't know. What do you think, Scott? Is the stock market more brilliant than you? No, sir. Oh, that's a terrible statement. All right. The stock market is quite brilliant.

Starting point is 01:18:36 And every time we said something amazing, like we're going to settle, it would go up. And every time we said something negative, like guess what? We're not going to be able to settle. You would go down very big, Peter, right? Very, very big.

Starting point is 01:18:52 Peter, he were there. You were insider trading with us, Peter. You know that, remember? Well, just like, just the way, it's just something very, very formulaic about his weirdness, about where, you know, he recognized nobody responded to us, like, I guess, kind of a joke that was kind of real. And that's why he was like, Bucet, do you think you agree with the thing I said that means nothing?

Starting point is 01:19:12 You know, it's just this weird. But the whole point is that, yeah, so we could state. that things were happening that weren't and we could get a lot of things to happen. And then you could literally prove that Polly Market and the rest, there are people in his inner circle that were betting within minutes of these statements. You know, it's like, it's just, I don't get why he would, again, I think that first statement that does he even realize that what he's doing is criminal or that people recognize it for being criminal?

Starting point is 01:19:34 What do you take from that? He's past the point of ever being held accountable. So I don't know that, you know, criminality, he's been swimming in that. water for so long with these guys like that big short clip is that they don't realize that these are insider conversations that they're having and they forget to turn their insider voice off when they're having them. And next thing you know, they're confessing to the things that they're talking about because they've been in this pool with all these people for so long. They just assume like we do from time to time, I have to check myself when I'm talking to a normie and make sure I don't blurt out

Starting point is 01:20:15 something that's obvious to me, but will break their brains if I said it. And sometimes I miscalculate that. And that creates awkward situations. But it's not me confessing to crimes. It's not me confessing to manipulating the markets and things like that. You've got, you've got Lutnik sitting next to him just looking at him like, oh, no, I mean, we didn't do anything with the tariffs. I mean, Cantor Fitzgerald wasn't, didn't have a, a vested interest in this whole criminal racket of you slapping massive tariffs on and then us running the cash out operation that we were doing for them. I mean, it's a criminal enterprise. He's surrounded by criminals. Scott Besant is a criminal as well. I mean, what he did with Soros

Starting point is 01:21:02 with the pound 30 years ago, I mean, that guy should be let away in handcuffs for fraud. I mean, everybody on that list is guilty on that stage is guilty of some major, major crime. But because they're all and but they're all standing on that stage who's really guilty of anything right it's all of a guilt is only if you can take me away in handcuffs and they can't take any of those people away in handcuffs so they have lost the plot they don't even know that they're talking about criminal activity anymore because they're in a sea of criminals yeah i think what's interesting is that like from your point about trump that and this is kind of a read i had it early on this from trump and like maybe I guess maybe through the lens of that Trump's been allowed to be there so it can kind of fall around his ankles.

Starting point is 01:21:50 You know, that was the 2016 potential thought about whether it was design collapse. You know, that you get this feeling from a lot of them, Nome and Bondi and, you know, the rest that we're, you know, now kind of slightly pushed aside, but pretty much all of them, that they have this like sense that they are the outsider or like the one that always wanted to be on the inner circle or however you see that, at least in their minds, who has now made that. And now look and is acting like they think they've, you know, they see the rest of them. well, Obama did all this. They're all stealing and robbing and breaking. Why are you mad at me? Like, they don't realize that you're not supposed to yell it out loud. Like, how do you want to frame that?

Starting point is 01:22:23 You know what I mean? Like, that they don't realize that they're out of their depth, that they're, like, as if they're using the criminality before them. And they're, why aren't I allowed to do it? Like, they're that unaware. Like, I don't even know what their term would be for that. But that's what I don't know. Unsophisticated criminality.

Starting point is 01:22:35 Yeah, they, they, they, you know, say what you want about like the George H. H.W. Bush's of the world and guys like that, they were deep operators. They knew what they could say. and what they couldn't say, and they knew how to frame it in a way that sounded like the New World Order was like the greatest thing ever. Like, hey, we're going to have, you know, it's going to be like a new version of reality. They didn't get into the details. These people are amateurs. You know, I mean, Christine Nome didn't work her way up through 90 levels of government to rise to the top. I mean, these people are like selected out of a casting call. So I'm not even so surprised that they, they give it up from

Starting point is 01:23:13 time to time. But it's an end of empire kind of behavior where even the quality, you know, the quality of the theft is so low brow. It's the equivalent of them like stealing all the silverware in the White House and running out with it or something. I mean, it's so, it's they're chasing in nickels and dimes, you know, meanwhile, the Bush family is putting billions of dollars aside through banks and doing it in very nefarious, secretive ways. In the Trump crew sounds seems like um i don't know like the keystone cops i like it just they're just like a like a like a like a comedy or a comedy of errors or something it just didn't it doesn't feel like i'm used to the united states government being looted but by professional criminals and bankers and guys like

Starting point is 01:24:04 that this feels like a like a stick up job by some guy who's just out on parole or something just really wonky and, you know, amateur, it's organized. Sophomoric, right? Like, it definitely just feels like they're out of their depth, you know, and that they won't even seemingly realize that. It's a stealing silverware. That's a really good way to, that's a good analogy, you know, because they're definitely stealing.

Starting point is 01:24:28 They're definitely profiteering, but it's as if they're robbing from themselves, you know, like they're like, you know, or rather, think of it like some kind of a platform and they're literally stealing the pegs that's holding it up. Like, eventually, it's all going to fall around them, you know, but they're like, get it, get it quick as we get out of the door. It's what it feels like. Yeah. But let's get into some Iran conversation.

Starting point is 01:24:47 This is how I frame this. And I want your thoughts on this before we get into like the over the last couple of days and some videos I want to play. But the Trump's Iran deal is a, it's not even a deal yet. Let's be clear. It's an understanding of statements that are up in the air even until, you know, like even the idea of the nuclear stuff doesn't even get discussed until 60 days for now, according to Iran, is that it's a veiled surrender or a treat for the United States. You know? So before I get into why, I think that. you know, what are your thoughts about where this is and whether we can trust what's happening?

Starting point is 01:25:18 Well, it's, as you said, it's a memorandum of understanding. So it's, it's nothing, but it's a step in the right direction. Ultimately, I want peace. I want the supply chains opened up because everybody is, we don't need the economic component of this to be any worse than it's already going to be. So I'm, I want it to happen. But again, I know that, I want it to happen. Let's just assume that the Trump administration wants it to happen. We know Israel doesn't. And that's all you really kind of need to know is that they don't want it to happen. And they have shown that there is no line in the sand they won't cross, be it pagers or blowing up Beirut's port or genociding people, they'll do whatever. So if they feel that Netanyahu goes to prison, if this thing gets, if this thing really ends, then and Ben Gavira gets rounded up and whatever, their greater Israel project fizzles out if this happens, then I don't think that there's even any point talking about what's inside the memorandum because it won't happen anyway, because Israel will sabotage it because it's in their best interest to do that. and that if they

Starting point is 01:26:37 and I don't think they want to let the Trump administration off on this. They've come too far. And if it is a situation where they feel they're backed into a corner where they're quite literally going to be let away in handcuffs, then why would they hold any ammunition back? Why wouldn't they just launch everything they've got and kick this thing off again?

Starting point is 01:27:02 That is my greatest fear is that nothing, the mechanism that Israel has been using to make the Trump administration do their bidding, there's nothing that I have seen that has set my mind at ease that that mechanism is now no longer in place. I believe it is still in place. I don't know why it would. I mean, if it's blackmail evidence that they're using, maybe there's an expiration date on it. Maybe not. I don't know. But I'm not, I don't feel like whatever was controlling Trump a month ago has now been removed. There's nothing's changed on that part. It's just that there's more of an appetite to get this thing stopped.

Starting point is 01:27:41 But I fear that it's going to take everybody. I mean, if you've got one party that doesn't want this thing to happen, Israel, it's not going to happen. Yeah, yeah, definitely. I mean, I think what we're seeing is sort of a potential break of, again, self-interest. I think Donald Trump, whether, yet's a good point to make, whether it's a good point to make, whether it's blackmail or that he's in line with the agenda or whatever it is, there's no reason to think anything has changed except maybe that they now disagree on the path forward because of their self-interest, right? And because you're right, is it if it's blackmail,

Starting point is 01:28:13 then anything that's happening is still within that same playbook. There's still within that same field of play, right? So they can still apply that same pressure. I think that's a great point. But so, but even if it was something like that, hypothetically, they're going to release something that makes them look bad, I argue there would still be a line where that is, you know, is the juice worth of squeeze. Like, you know, it's like if you were about to lose, like let's say Trump was about to go to prison. Well, then maybe you want to throw those dice and see if maybe you can, you know, get a narrative that hurts. It hurts Israel to stop that from happening and they may still release something that may, you know, I think there's always a line right there. And so what I think

Starting point is 01:28:46 we're dealing with is that they were in line with this from the beginning. As I've said before, I think it's obvious that Donald Trump was convinced this was going to be in his interest, largely from Netanyahu. And that ultimately they said, you know, Iran's going to shut the straight down. It's going to, the whole world will be on your side. You know, all the different things, all the narratives, the minds in the straight, none of which actually happened. They stopped them for being able to get through and that hurt them immediately. And so they started their own blockade and different actions that made it look like a ram was still doing that. Now, up until that point, I think Trump was still thinking, you know, and still being told, we could bomb them.

Starting point is 01:29:16 Don't worry, we're stronger. We can do all these things. And so he stuck with it and still said the narrative or he got lied to by Whitkoff and Kushner. Who's to say? But at some point, I think it becomes clear that he recognized he has to find a way out of this. when I think he finally recognized, oh, we're not actually winning, right? Oh, we are actually losing. We don't have the munitions.

Starting point is 01:29:35 And we don't, you know, and then you got this, like, he, you know, we defeated their Navy. We defeated their, I think he thought those things. MS-13, like I love those moments where he thinks what he's being sold, right? That's what I think anyway. And so at some point he became aware of that, the old Charlie Kirk problem. I think he started recognizing that there's a Zionist interest that is against American interest and maybe there's a schism there. Now, whatever it is.

Starting point is 01:29:56 From that point forward, now we've got Trump trying to drive this in a direction of, some kind of an end. In that moment, I think it's obvious that Trump is still Trump. He can't just end up losing. He had now has to find a way to frame this as him winning. That's where we get uncomfortable frustration from Israel, saying, well, that's not what we want. I still don't know whether I think that Israel would ultimately allow this to happen because they're both losing anyway. And then, and then they can play the word divided game. Again, I'm not sure. But so that's where I think this ultimately comes down to. Now, we had the argument this was going to be on the 14th, 15, you know, the memorandum understanding.

Starting point is 01:30:29 Originally, it was going to be signed later than ultimately Israel bomb Lebanon. I think that was the 15th. And then that's what happened. Then Trump came up and had to stop that and said, don't bomb back when they were getting ready to. I'll give you three concessions. This is not getting a lot of talk. Donald Trump then said, we will immediately stop the blockade, which still has technically

Starting point is 01:30:47 not fully removed. It is slowly going away, but as a consent calm, they still technically have it there. And it will also immediately give them other concessions like that would take place immediately which one of them was money. As I understand it, they already sent three billion dollars, and the 12 billion is supposed to happen already, and another 12 after that. That's not the 300 billion. That's just money that they stole going right back. Now, the two caveats for me that are already an issue is that Trump, the blockade technically has not fully removed, but I think they're going to give that leeway up until 30 days, but that Lebanon, as you said, is still being bombed.

Starting point is 01:31:17 Those were two explicit statements that were on every single document that even the U.S. is now pointed to. Immediate ceasefire, including Lebanon. They've all signed that. there's no reason to think this won't stop unless Iran, for whatever reason, gives them that kind of a allowance to say, fine, we'll blame it on Israel. But they've stated clearly that they're going to hold them both accountable. So that's kind of where I think we are. Now, they had the point where they said we were going to sign it on like his birthday kind of a thing. And then Iran didn't want it to happen for Trump.

Starting point is 01:31:45 And so they kind of kicked it down, ultimately made it to a digital signing. Right now they're supposed to be meeting on Friday to sign it in person. It appears that that might not even happen. because I think Iran used that to make him think he would get this big moment and ultimately is saying, no, the digital one is fine. Makes me a little skeptical, though, of whether there's some kind of deviation happening there. But again, Friday, I guess we'll ultimately find out. But what we did get is Trump signing on paper in his own place and I think it was France. Then you have Iran allegedly, again, I'm just hypothetically signing it in there.

Starting point is 01:32:15 I think they did. And so one thing that's being kind of misrepresented, I guess, is that there was two versions, one in English, one in Farsi. and people are now claiming that he signed only in Farsi. I don't think that was true, but I guess we'll find out. Here is some points I want to get into to go through on this. This is allegedly the memorandum understanding. And what I think is crazy is this is the same stuff that Trump has been always saying is fake news. He even yet again said after the U.S. government, their entities gave this to CNN and others,

Starting point is 01:32:45 that he's saying this is fake news. Again, this is as of today, saying that the leaked document, which they refused to put out is somehow fake news, which I find really interesting, right? So he's saying that, no, no, $300 billion. That's not real. It's false. The media is lying about all this, but we can go through this if you'd like. And even according to Axios, which is supposed to be the insider, you know, Israel connected, it says exactly that. It goes into all of it. The $300 billion. Now, do you want to go through all this? We don't have to. I've talked about this on the show and stuff. The ultimate main points are there is going to be, and I think

Starting point is 01:33:17 money's already gone, billions of dollars of their stolen money that they give back. to them. Think about the, I brought this up months into this going, how embarrassing it will be for Trump if he ultimately does what he's been saying Obama did all this time, the stupidity of all that. $300 billion is supposed to be some kind of agreement, you know, that they claim is going to be brought from other Gulf nations, but I'm going to promise you it's going to be some degree American taxpayer dollars, that's my opinion, but still giving them $300 billion for reconstruction. All of this are things that he promised he would never allow, the idea of them having ballistic missiles, the idea of them allowing to dilute but maintain their nuclear program.

Starting point is 01:33:51 of these things are still on the table. I just I, and this is what we'll get into some of the clips we can play about even people like Ben Shapiro going like, this is an absolute travesty. Like he's lost every one of these things. Major players like that. That's that, that Zionism divide between the America First Movement, right? So so far, what are your thoughts? Well, you, you can never make Israel happy. I mean, they'll always be an additional concession that they wanted. There'll be something that you didn't get for them. So his, Trump's desire to make them love him, or to get the Ben Shapiro's and Mark Levens of the world on his side. That is, that's a fool's errand.

Starting point is 01:34:27 There's no point in doing that. You're, there, you can, you can give them everything they ask for today. Tomorrow they'll ask for even more. And if you don't give it to them, they will pretend that you never gave them anything and act apoplectic like,

Starting point is 01:34:42 like Ben Shapiro. Trump is a traitor to, I mean, all that stuff. Forget about how he completely caved. gave Israel everything that they wanted at the expense of America, right? All that just gets completely forgotten. Nobody will discuss that.

Starting point is 01:34:59 But God forbid he doesn't give them everything. It'll be a problem. Well, I mean, it's, this is an utter failure no matter how you spin this from what Trump set out as the expectation, right? That's the, this is what's so frustrating about this. And what I still argue, anybody who actually cares about their own interest is going to go, well, that's not what you promise. But you have this weird fake media thing.

Starting point is 01:35:22 Mainstream, all sides of it, it seems. I guess there are some levels of the partisan element going back and forth, but mainstream alternative, just kind of like towing these lines, lying about this wholesale. So here is, well, this is first an example of Israel claiming that they don't have access. This is actually the I-24 News. They confirmed that Israel requested the memorandum of understanding, but we're denied. There's a weird, that whole thing about no one being able to see it. Like, they made fun of Obama's deal for the same reason.

Starting point is 01:35:50 I don't know if I believe this, though. I don't know if I believe that Israel's been bothered out of this, but it's worth considering. It feels like something. I don't ever, when the Israelis say that they complain that they're not getting the full scope of the information, my question is, well, why don't you just tap into your spy networks that you have already everywhere? I'm sure you're getting more than what.

Starting point is 01:36:13 Maybe they're not giving you the detail to see it, but something tells me Israel's got their ways of seeing it anyway. Yeah. I mean, again, it just doesn't ring true to me. Like for that reason, obviously, too. But I think the whole thing is that they have been in unison with this in the entire time. And the idea that somehow that you wouldn't, I mean, right, you have access to religious, hardcore Zionists, all of Trump's administration that would probably happily. Or what about, you know, Huckabee. You know, like you're telling me he's not going to relay the information through the administration. He's in Israel for crying out lie. I just don't buy that. But it's possible. But so the overall, the larger point here is that all of the 14 points, where the same 14 points that we've been talking about since like just after April. The same 14 points that Trump recently said are absolutely fake like a month ago. The same 14 points he's now, I guess as of today, already arguing isn't actually true, despite the fact that even Vance will play you was on the rounds trying to like explain the $300 billion that Trump just said isn't even actually part of the deal. Or the nuclear discussion where they're allowing them to maintain a nuclear program per the information they've put out.

Starting point is 01:37:17 Or going back to the larger point about all of what they originally claimed. stopping their ballistic missile program, stopping their drone program, right, obliterating their nuclear, for all the things that, none of these things have happened. Here's what Jesse Waters just said. Everything's breaking Trump's way. Iran's nuclear ambitions are toast. Their military has been throttled. And their economy sustained a trillion dollars in damage.

Starting point is 01:37:40 Every objective. Absolutely the State Department expert opinion, right? I don't know why if we could take that at face value, but there's definitely damage. Oh, shoot. Iran's nuclear ambitions are toast. Their military has been throttled. And their economy sustained a trillion dollars in damage. Every objective Trump laid out on the very first day of the war has been achieved.

Starting point is 01:38:01 But because Iran's a police state and severely wounded, they're cherry picking from the term sheet and spinning that they're getting all this money up front as part of a PR campaign to save face. I mean, I'm going to play the JPC clip just because they think he does a good job, making fun. of this, but it's, it's, they're, this is why I think it's so obvious the Republicans more than anybody or for, they're speaking to you like you guys are the dumbest people in the room. Like, you can't read these things for yourself. Jesse Waters is the king of the red light, holy crap guys. Like, he's out there constantly spinning whatever is being stated. And it's just like, even the JCPers video, it's like, you know, well, so what you're saying is that if they do what the deal says,

Starting point is 01:38:38 they get this money. Yes, who's confused about that? That's what we're confused about that. No, no, no, no, they have to comply with the deal before they get, okay. So we're both angry about that. Like, it's just this game they're playing where they frame the thing that were, like, somehow you're confused because the money comes from somewhere else. Well, you told us they were monsters and terrorists and rapists, but it's okay that they get $300 billion to rebuild. You know, there's nowhere in which you can make this make sense within the corporate narratives. You know, it's hard to watch right now. This is them doing what we've always been saying over this last month's process. He's going to try to frame his win or his loss as a win.

Starting point is 01:39:12 It's sad, isn't it? But not surprising. That's how you. That's how you. you have to do it. The Jesse Waters of the world. I mean, could you imagine going up there and just blurting that out and saying the things that he says. But I think that it goes back to kind of that the Chomsky quote about the BBC when he's talking about it. Like if you felt differently, you wouldn't be in that seat. You wouldn't be Jesse Waters. You need, Jesse Waters or Ben Shapiro. They have to believe this on some level because if they didn't believe it, they'd have to get a different guy in there. You couldn't be.

Starting point is 01:39:48 I agree up until, I do think there are some of them that are aware. I don't care. I just want the power in the position. But I do agree. The whole point of manufacturing consent is that they actually buy it.

Starting point is 01:39:59 Like that Jesse is so convinced. I think Trump half the time is in the same position that anything bad about Trump is fake news, Democrat media that hates him. And so they just have this wall where, you know, and then they get the state department that feeds them nonsense. And he goes, well, that's the facts. And it's only Democrats that lie.

Starting point is 01:40:13 I think you're right. I think some of them just buy. into this and don't allow anything else to get through, you know? But what's interesting, though, and I think this is really, really, you know, conspicuous is what you got is suddenly people like Mark Levine and others who jumped into this and sudden, like on a dime, we're like, that's bad and we can't allow it. And we have to make sure this goes through Congress. You know, the thing that they didn't want to go through Congress when it started, but now they have to have Congress end it, all of them. Graham. And it shows you a divide between what Trump is doing,

Starting point is 01:40:42 which didn't Trump tell you what he does is America First? And you guys all agree. Now suddenly you're not doing what Trump wants, so you're not America First. Right. They're showing you the Israel first side of the America First agenda. Here's Ben Shapiro telling you that. Well, I've said many times the president deciding to go into Iran and to hit nuclear facilities in Operation Midnight Hammer and then to go after Iran's ballistic missile facilities, nuclear facilities, army, Navy, and Air Force in this current operation was the Signal Act of Political bravery, perhaps of my lifetime. That said, this MOU appears to be. just from the text, a disaster that does not achieve any of the actual signal goals that were set by the administration at the beginning.

Starting point is 01:41:21 There were effectively five goals that were set by the administration at the beginning. One was ending the nuclear program, not just nuclear weapons, no nuclear enrichment, zero enrichment. That is not in the deal. It's in the deal just allows them to dilute and maintain the program. That is not in the deal. And the president today suggested that ballistic missiles should actually continue to be held by the Iranians because the Saudis, our allies, also hold ballistic missiles. True. So our argument, well, if it's legal for everybody else, why is it illegal for them?

Starting point is 01:41:49 And then what we got argued down by Trump's team. Now it's funny how, you know, this is just so confounding. You know, we were independent media by and large, IMA, calling all of this stuff out for this now to be like weirdly debated like a new discussion between the, the Israel First America first part of the Republican Party. It's just fascinating. Of the support of terrorism, that is not part of the deal, anything that looks like an attempt to end terrorism. a permanent opening of the Strait of Hormuz toll-free. Not only is that not in the deal, the deal appears to have a provision allowing Iran and Oman

Starting point is 01:42:21 to attempt to toll the straits after 60 days. And then finally, the idea that Iran would receive some sort of sanctions relief after all of those things happen, we are already seeing from day one relief in their ability to ship oil out of Iran. In my opinion, the vice president of the United States, the chief negotiator on this particular project has not well served the president.

Starting point is 01:42:40 So what's interesting is that you have people out there screaming that we're wrong for believing we even know what's in the memorandum understanding, even though it's clear that it came from their government. You know, but what it doesn't, I'm not trusting Ben Shapiro, but what's interesting is these are people that are out there telling you as well that they've looked at it and they're angry about it.

Starting point is 01:42:54 So it's just like there's such an effort to ignore where this all goes. I just think I think that's really important. I'm glad that Ben Shapiro. I'm glad that Mark Levin are talking about this. The more they talk about it, the more clownish it becomes. People know how they feel about those guys to watch them immediately peel off and start

Starting point is 01:43:13 you know giving them giving their talking points it it just illuminate it's it's just yet another way that you identify the israel firsters inside his administration which i assume is just about everybody but but still it's nice to you know you when you hear lindsay graham go crazy ted cruise you know the usual suspects huckabee all the people that are under their control uh you it's it's expected for them to flip out at this i i'm i'm here for it you know of course i love anything that drives those guys crazy. I'm there for it. But I just don't trust that the Israelis are going to let this go.

Starting point is 01:43:54 Right. It's too much at stake for them. They're too close to their goal. There's too many people in their administration whose lives would be the end of the world. I mean, maybe even the end of their lives. If the war ends, you know, they end. And I just, I think that something bad. will happen instead to pull to put to put to make sure this does even regardless I don't care if

Starting point is 01:44:18 it's signed I mean you know Trump signing it and saying we're not going to do it do is it what is that even worth on the world stage anymore I mean he's he's he's a guy who's declared victory so many times and he's he said the craziest things I mean if if he signed something what are the Iranians going to put their missiles away I mean I wouldn't I'd in fact I'd bring I'd have them all on high alert because that's just about the, that's just about the time when something diabolical is going to happen from the shadows because you, you didn't do what you were, I mean, look, if we, if we're suspecting this and we're pontificating about this, surely the Iranians know the relationship that Israel has with Trump and they know that he's probably just a bit of a puppet and that anything

Starting point is 01:45:04 he says that doesn't have the full support of the Israelis might as well be written in pencil, you know, when he signed anything. Yeah. I mean, even Hankseth said that the blockade, because, I mean, to be clear again, as I can understand that it's, it's, they, you know, immediately begins to dismantle,

Starting point is 01:45:19 but may take a month is what he said. Well, I don't even know how that makes sense. Obviously, they're playing this game of like not really removing it, you know, but the point being is that he said, if they do, if they break anything, we'll be right back there bombing them.

Starting point is 01:45:29 It's like, okay, well, then you're not having, this is an actual piece deal, you know, or even a memorandum of understanding that might lead to a piece deal. It's clearly the same, do what we want or we're going to bomb you kind of tactic. And so why would they stop?

Starting point is 01:45:39 Why would they stop? But the real point is none of the deal even gets into any of that, you know. But holding that point, I think, which is important, we can end with that about, because you're right, that that is the real overarching point, that no matter what we discuss next, if Israel doesn't maintain what their part is or what the Iran has said is their joint obligation, whatever side they think they're on, you know, they're both accountable for whatever side does, bombing a Lebanon will make this not happen, right? So keep that in mind.

Starting point is 01:46:04 I think there is a caveat to where Iran might allow that to be a separate issue. because Trump has capitulated. That's possible. But let's come back to that. Let's go through these really quickly to show the information here. And then that we can end with that point because you're right, it does sort of kind of, it's the main point. So here's what he said in regard to the ballistic missiles.

Starting point is 01:46:22 So this is why Ben Shapiro is upset, right? Because he is very clearly deviating from what he was screaming about. Or Rubio, what the first thing Rubio put out after telling you was because Israel was going to do it and we had to do something was that we couldn't let them get ballistic missiles and drones. my point as always is even though everyone else has the legal right to to have them what what's the legal standing well there is none and here he is using these arguments i'm saying that if other countries have them it's a little bit unfair for them not to have some a ballistic missile is not the

Starting point is 01:47:00 same thing as what we're talking about what we talk to i mean what we talk to i mean what world can you i mean i mean again unless trump is actually at a point where he doesn't remember what he said three seconds ago certainly possible i mean how embarrassing that must be for him to come out there and say that when you've been harping, your entire administration has been harping on the idea of the missile program, not just Newk, but the missile program. It's embarrassing. You can't shame somebody who has no shame. And, you know, his mentality seems to be, well, that was then, this is now.

Starting point is 01:47:35 You know, whatever we're doing now is the right thing. Whatever I said back then, I said because I said it because it was back then. But this is now. And now it's okay that they are. a ballistic, it's like, well, way, way, way. You just went on and on about how they can't have them, how it's a crime, how it's a threat to the regions, all these things. Now you're saying the exact opposite, which is true, which is what we should have said from all along, which is, you know, it's kind of hard to, it's kind of hypocritical to say you can't have ballistic missiles when every

Starting point is 01:48:03 country around you has them and you clearly, you already have them. And so, what's he going to do? Give them permission to have their own ballistic missiles. I mean, it's, it's, it's kind of a crazy statement to be making anyway. But I like that he has to backtrack on this. It weakens him. It makes him appear even more hypocritical because you can pull up a compilation of him saying the exact opposite and show over and over again. But that tactic, I think, would work on people who cared who had to like a deep sense of self. I think Donald Trump is detached from reality. I don't know that you can shame a guy like that anymore with with look, you said the exact opposite a month ago. All he has to do is say, well, that was then and this is now.

Starting point is 01:48:47 No, that's a good point. Just to be clear, I don't care at all whether Trump, well, I shouldn't say that. It's probably some world in which I want him to feel bad about these things, but it's not, it's not, it's about average people being able to recognize how sad that is and how obvious that is. But you're right. He's a sociopath or whatever. They don't care at the end of the day. It's about, you know, really as you framed it, that's the best way, when you were saying it, the way, the best way to frame this is that Trump's a salesman who was put in there to sell whatever they want you to think in that moment. And so that's what you're seeing is he goes, oh, so we're supposed to say these

Starting point is 01:49:16 about that bad no matter what, it's bad, let me lay out the reasons why. And then 20 seconds later, now we need to sell them that it's okay. Okay, well, that's okay because everyone else has them. You know, even if he knows that, it's like, well, my job is to sell you on the, he is the press secretary for the globalist elites, you know, if it's just sell you on the idea that this is supposed to happen. And here is CNN, and things like this really, I think really reach people. is because people like us are highlighting

Starting point is 01:49:41 that it's not different left and right. At the end of the day, it's just about a flavor difference. And so here's your example where they all want to go after Iran. They just want to make sure it's done in the way they want to. Here is CNN, I guess, aghast at the fact

Starting point is 01:49:51 that this Republican says that Iran should have a right to defend itself. Think about the humorous, insane nature of that with all of it. Iran, Israel's right to defend itself, they said. Senator, are you okay with Iran having missiles? You know, I'm hesitating.

Starting point is 01:50:08 I prefer that they not. I certainly don't want them to have long distance missiles. I don't want them to have nuclear-armed missiles. I would prefer they didn't. But I don't think that's the key issue here. I think that they have to be able to defend themselves. And I just kind of come back to the big picture here is that the Middle East countries like this agreement.

Starting point is 01:50:28 You think Iran needs to be able to defend itself? I do. I think that they have to be able to defend themselves. Otherwise, we turn this into a forever war. You're never going to get them short of boots on the ground of surrendering everything. an unconditional agreement, if you will. But again, what I'm getting at here is this agreement has the support of all the, most of the countries in the Middle East. And I think that's going to give it more of a long lasting relationship, a long lasting success as well.

Starting point is 01:50:56 Well, the point I think is that the countries in the Middle East are being forced into supporting this. The peoples of most of those countries do not support the agenda, right? But just the idea that she's kind of like you, you think they have a right to defend themselves. It just speaks volumes to me. You know, the idea that that you will, first of all, isn't that the law? Like, what are you talking about? Like, so do we get to then pick and choose which ones do and do not have a right to themselves? Yes, we do.

Starting point is 01:51:19 Yes, apparently we do. The only answer is Israel is allowed to defend themselves. Everybody else is not allowed to. That's what she was going to say if we had run that clip, I'm sure. I could see it in her little pea brain, that little hamster on the wheel. She was going there. Do they have a right to defend themselves? Yeah, like, you know, Caitlin, like you've made the argument that Israel has a right

Starting point is 01:51:37 to defend itself. a hundred times on your shows over the years. Yes, it's the same concept. I know it's difficult for them to wrap their heads around it, but they just look at you like you're crazy when you say something like Iran has a right to defa how dare you? She had to ask the question twice. She couldn't believe the answer he was giving. And that is a sign that things have changed. The fact that he was he was even willing to give that statement. By the way, there'll be a ton of J Street lobbyists in his office hour after that that interview i assure you they'll be lined up to get in there to set him straight on on on on how he sees the world but that that is uh that's monumental that someone's actually saying that on

Starting point is 01:52:20 on tv these days i agree and then the true colors of the of the you know elite elitist media no matter what side they're on going way but wait that's that's a line too far we we're supposed to all hate ron you know it's so here is vans again one of the many different things of him going around this on the 15th saying one of the core parts of the agreement is that the international atomic energy agency and the United States are going to help Iran destroy the highly rich stockpile. Simply not true. Not that I think Chris Murphy is a good source, but he's correct. And it says this is not part of the agreement.

Starting point is 01:52:50 And again, we can go through explicitly all of the different points. And, you know, it's all, just so it's clear, the 14 points that have been going around over the last week, that's exactly what this is. In fact, most of these platforms to put them out chose to sort of like not include certain verbiage that was there to slant it one way or the other. And everyone's getting called out for that. It's just this is the world we live in. But his point is that he's making it up. Iran agrees to give up nothing of the nuclear program. And that is, in fact, the reality, as even Ben Shapiro was telling you that, no, it seems

Starting point is 01:53:18 the deal allows them to actually maintain it. And that is what is being stated. Here is Trump saying something similar around enrichment for Iran at the G7. Pretty tough in that. You know, it's also, it is a little hard, though, when you say that somebody wants it, other people have it, other adjoining states have it. And you're not letting them have it for purposes of electricity and things like that. So it's always weird.

Starting point is 01:53:42 Very sage wisdom from you, Trump. It's almost like we've heard that argument before. I just have to use a little comments, please. That's that he just asked for comments. I mean, good God. I know what you said, he probably doesn't care. You're probably right. But that is insane.

Starting point is 01:53:57 You know, I mean, that is an, that is, you've been screaming that that's not allowed no matter what, no matter what, no nuclear program. And here we are. You know, I mean, that's him trying to frame his losses to win. I don't know how else to read that. Yeah, but that's the Roy Cohn School of Always Declare Victory, even as you're backpedaling, right? You're just winning in ways that they haven't comprehended yet.

Starting point is 01:54:19 Yeah, I should have a way to frame that. So here is a clip of Vance, and saying, what's stopping Iran from building down the road? Now, let's be clear again, the evidence, not to say that I know for a fact, but all of the evidence from U.S. intelligence or any other international atomic energy agency, all of it. they've never had a weapon, they never sought a weapon, and they currently are not seeking one and don't have, you know, that's the evidence of the reality of it.

Starting point is 01:54:42 And so here is what he's saying in regard to the ask from people, again, from the left-right paradigm that is that this is now going to allow Iran to get a nuclear weapon. That's still within the lie, right? That's still the two-party illusion. But nonetheless, that obviously even if that was the case, that then don't they have millions and billions of dollars now to do that? Hoping this deal would prevent Iran in the future from getting a nuclear weapon. But from what's been put out there of the MOU, I'm curious how does the MOU reflect that in the future Iran will not, in fact, get a nuclear rate? What's stopping them from down the road to your point, rebuilding and restarting from where we were pre the war? Well, number one, they would have to get a lot of money in order to rebuild the nuclear program.

Starting point is 01:55:24 You're talking about billions and billions of nuclear infrastructure that the United States destroyed. Yeah, yeah. You mean like a $300 billion reconstruction program? Would $300 billion do it? I mean, and that's what everyone's pointing out. That's not like, you know, read the comments. I mean, just like, again, I would argue someone like Vance, that's probably difficult for him. You know what I mean?

Starting point is 01:55:44 Like he's the one being trotted out to look the fool for their agenda or Anna Polly Luna on the 16th saying this headline. It is inaccurate. Nope, that's literally what we're all saying. It is Trump team I is $300 billion fund. That's what they're now doing. At least that's what's went down that they both side, you know? Or here's the whiteout. For decades, American leaders ignored the Iran problem.

Starting point is 01:56:06 President Trump is the only president brave enough to do what should have been done for years on the 17th. They put that out. Give them $300 billion? Well, on that note, let's watch this clip, which I do think is hilarious. But, you know, I won't jump in just for continuity of it. It's about six minutes. But there are points within this that I would feel obligated to point out. You guys know my opinions.

Starting point is 01:56:27 You know, the nuclear program and of itself kind of a thing. You know the facts out there. But for humor's sake, let's listen through this because I do find it interesting and relevant that somebody like him who was a diehard supporter who still is very much on the Republican side. Or they're calling out Trump. You know, there's value there. Dude, we won the war. The war is over. Me steal.

Starting point is 01:56:53 Yeah. You were saying this war was stupid the whole time, but you can suck it because we won. Oh, you think we won. Oh, you think we won? Yes, you Jew-Haddy numskull. Well, how do we win? We have a peace deal, bitch! So, what did we win?

Starting point is 01:57:11 We won, like, the victory. Trump got us across the goal line. Do you know the terms of the peace deal? Yeah, like the straight of Alex Hermosey. That's open again. Did you know that was open before the war started? So we got that open again. That's a big W right there.

Starting point is 01:57:31 Did you know that part of the peace deal is Iran can start charging a toll for ships to go through now? They're probably doing that before the war. No, they weren't. And this new toll revenue is estimated to generate $10 billion a year for them. Who cares? Nobody cares. Well, whatever made you want to start the war with Iran, now they'll have an additional $10 billion a year to fund that. Dude, whatever. It's totally worth it for us to walk away the winners.

Starting point is 01:58:00 Because with this peace deal, Iran can't have nukes. Do you know they didn't have nukes before the war either? Nope. That's why we went to war. And them not being able to have nukes anymore, that makes the whole war worth it just for that. The director of National Intelligence reported that all of the intel agencies said Iran didn't have nukes.

Starting point is 01:58:24 So yeah, now they don't have nukes for real. We won. So according to you, them not having nukes, like they didn't have before the war, and the straight that was open before the war that only closed because of the war, being open again constitutes us winning? Is that what you're saying? He's winning big times. Full circle victory. Hey, do you remember that loser Obama and how he got bitch slapped around by Iran with loser deals? Like he even unfroze $1.7 billion of Iranian funds for them to just have. Trump was very critical.

Starting point is 01:59:00 of that. Do you know Trump is unfreezing $24 billion of Iranian funds for them to have? I think these are different circumstances and well with inflation and all it's hard to compare if 24 billion is worth more or less than 1.7 billion. Do you know how much money we've agreed to pay Iran for war damages? I don't know like seven, eight hundred dollars. Three hundred billion dollars. Oh yeah, I I heard that, but it's not that bad. It's not what you think. Iran only gets that money if they meet their obligations of the peace deal. Well, yeah, of course.

Starting point is 01:59:39 If they didn't, there wouldn't be a peace deal. So it's not like we're just giving Iran $300 billion. We're only giving it to them if they do what they say they're going to do. Exactly. So it's not what you think. No, that's my exact understanding. You don't think that's winning? Well, I don't understand how your mind works.

Starting point is 01:59:57 I mean, look, Trump was in a tough place. there was a war going on. A war that he started. A war was going on for whatever reason, and to bring about peace, he had to make some minor concessions. I mean, peace is all he wanted in the first place. And now we have a peace deal, and I'm sorry that you can't see it, but Iran lost, and we won.

Starting point is 02:00:18 Just to make sure I'm understanding you clearly, the US gives up $24 billion of funds to Iran. The US pays Iran $300 billion in war damages, and our military costs. to create those damages was $29 billion. The Strait of Hormuz is open. Still, only now Iran charges tolls generating $10 billion a year for them. And Iran can't have nukes. So that's the same as before the war. So we lose $354 billion and American lives. Iran gains $324 billion. And they charge a toll on the straight, so annualized over five years, that's an additional $50 billion.

Starting point is 02:01:04 So conservatively, Iran gains $374 billion and literally doesn't have to change anything. And this is what winning looks like to you? Yes, major victory, if you ask me. Just imagine you have a neighbor who's kind of a dick. Treats you bad. Oh, I have that neighbor. And you sign a deal with him where you pay him $300. $300,000 to not change anything he does.

Starting point is 02:01:33 And it costs you $29,000 in lawyer fees to draw up the paperwork on this winning deal. So the deal costs you $329,000 and the neighbor gets $300,000 of your money and he doesn't have to change anything. But he can kind of use that money against you if he wants. Do you think that'd be a winning deal for you? that exact deal with someone. Why? Because it's a winning deal. What?

Starting point is 02:02:04 Who told you that? Him. So. He told me it was a winning deal and I couldn't pass it up. God wanted him in this deal. God wanted it. Enjoy winning the way you are. You deserve this.

Starting point is 02:02:20 Thanks, man. So it sounds like you're admitting you're wrong in this peace deal is a win. Do you want in on this deal? Welcome my... and is, you know, J.B. Sears, he's going to advertise for you, but check out his work if you want to support him. But, you know, that's just, I mean, it doesn't even matter to get into some of the nuanced points. I think that's well done, you know, and it's that silly on its face, you know?

Starting point is 02:02:47 And it needs to be delivered that way to people to see the, how preposterous this is and how, if you're not careful with your media headlines and soundbites, you'll be, you'll be, you know, if you just take a 20 seconds here and a minute there, you'll, you might be thinking that there were some victories there. You might be spun in a way where you don't read beyond the headlines and examine it. I fear most, you know, a lot of people will, will think the same way. It's just, it's much easy. I mean, listen, Fourth of July is coming around. We're going to have the 250, if they're anniversary. Like, we don't want this negativity. Let's talk about the victory that we have. Let's talk. We're charting, of course, forward. We're not going to live in the past, you know? So, you can see how the media works. You can see how the Trump administration frames reality. It's just,

Starting point is 02:03:43 it's whatever they say it is in the moment. It's very frustrating to be an observer to this. I like, I think humor, Humor allows people to see things that they can't see otherwise. The wall comes down a little bit and allows them to laugh at the absurdity of it. I think it's a powerful tactic for exposing this. I think that that works way better than bullhorning somebody with the information to show it in a mocking kind of silly way, gets into your brain. and it allows you to see something differently because you're not actively pushing against it usually. So however it works, however we have to get the message to people, you know, appeal to them. Their logical brain for some people that will work.

Starting point is 02:04:33 Some people just, you need to mock them, make them ridiculous characters and the general public will have a hard time following them in the battle. Yeah, you know, I tend to just think it works the best for people that need to, you know, like you said, it lowers their guard a little bit, you know, because it's easy to laugh at the contradiction. And maybe you disagree with that. But it kind of opened your mind to what, you know, just to consider those things and otherwise you might have had that block in the way. You know, but it's just such an obvious absurdity, the whole thing. You know, you're taking things that you swore were going to be one way and then framing the opposite way as what you've always promised. That, again, only works for people who only care about the team. And I don't

Starting point is 02:05:12 believe that's most people. And as always, I think that's important to dissect that we're at a point now where the huge influencers like this are the ones who are now challenging Trump's narrative and not even talking about the ones who are now challenging it because of the Israel side of it. Like you're talking about the internal support side of this who are going, whoa, I mean, everything we've ever talked about it from COVID-19 shots to food dies and, you know, glyphosate, these are just failures, guys. Like not even just failures. It's not like they tried to go the right direction and didn't succeed.

Starting point is 02:05:39 They just literally double-crossed everybody and went the other direction. And in my experience, that's no different than any administration before this. It's just more pronounced. It's more in your face. It's more juvenile, sophomoric, amateur. And we're seeing it for whatever reason. But, you know, the last point I'll leave it with is the financial side of this, which I think affects America's more than anything, is the, you know,

Starting point is 02:06:00 this is speaking of the lies, you know, White House says, oil is flowing and gas prices have begun tumbling down now below $4 per gallon nationally, which I don't even actually think is accurate, but regardless, but regardless, this is where we are. And this is generally accurate, the idea of the idea of that. the oil prices. This has been a clipped screenshot that is from actually something put and put out. But, you know, the reality that you were saying that now that it's gone down to there, that somehow that's winning what it was down here when we started.

Starting point is 02:06:26 You know, I mean, that's just playing on stupidity, guys. And that's what a lot of people are doing like this guy, Gunther Eagleman going, oh, well, the left hates this. I did this thing. Like, who are you talking to? Like, the left hates lower gas prices? Like, what are you talking about? Like, this comes from this perspective of like, it's only against these team sport

Starting point is 02:06:44 yellers fighting each other for the narrative. It's like you live in a bubble, man. And the truth is it's not even really, you know, like that's the picture that matters. That's not where we are, you know. And so I'll leave this on the way out, a clip of this very well done juxtaposition. March 9th, Trump saying we're now totally independent of Middle East. We don't need their oil April 1st. It doesn't really affect us.

Starting point is 02:07:04 You don't really need it that much. June 17th. If I didn't agree to a memorandum understanding, we would have run out of reserves in about four weeks. That's what he just said on 17th. You know? So where was he lying? So he was lying in one of those, right? So because he's now said contradictory statements here.

Starting point is 02:07:23 So we've established he's a liar, which is he lying about? Is he lying about the current one right now? Is he just telling you that because he took a beating and now he's got to spin it some way? So, I mean, it's tough to take, it's tough to take him seriously with something like that. It's tough to take a Gunther Engelman seriously too when he frames it as the left is somehow going to not want to save money on transportation costs, that that seems like maybe the wrong angle to go through. These people will just lie to your face if you allow them to. If you don't push back on them or challenge them, they will just pretend that you believe everything that they say simply

Starting point is 02:08:00 because they're the one saying it. It's really quite something. Well, and as we cover today, right, the salesman angle is right there, you know? So it's a great way to look at it. Who's to say? because we can point to there there is a discussion to be had about the oil in this country that's untapped to some degree but but is that more of an illusory thing than not and he was he admitting that somehow on top even with that we've diminished to such a degree that we were going to run out and that he's using that now to rationalize the moment or is he lying about that or do you think that the deal that nobody wants is actually the right deal to may who's to say but the point is that he will tell you on whatever the need is regardless of the facts and regardless

Starting point is 02:08:37 of american interests i mean if there's anything provable in this kind of conversation, it's that right there. So I hope people can come to terms with that, whatever you think that means. And it's not left, you right, guys. It's about understanding about the power of, you know, the authority, the controlling structure that is trying to put you in a place of subservience and, you know, just not allowing that to be the reality and using two-party politics to keep you confused. As always, brother, I love talking about this stuff with you. Looking forward to the next one. Any vital thoughts on the way out? No, I hope people will keep their eyes open, you know. This is a bit of political theater, of course.

Starting point is 02:09:10 Once you understand the tactics and the verbiage, it's easier to decipher, but as you say, you know, question everything, you know. Absolutely. It's the best, it's the best strategy. It keeps you sharp, challenging your own beliefs, make sure you don't have your own biases there. And, you know, so question everything come to your own conclusions, right? Absolutely. Yeah, and in regard to the Iran discussion going forward, you know, I mean, we, like you said, question it. Because at this point, hopefully what we highlighted at least, you know, one thing very clearly is that you can't take it what they say at face value ever.

Starting point is 02:09:47 And every single time, all the 50, 60 times he said we won and it's over and they're weak and we did the, we can clearly see that wasn't true at this point, right? So it's like, what happens next? Is Iran going to, Israel going to continue bombing Lebanon? Is that going to spin the deal out? Is that going to, or will Iran carve that out to allow Trump to concede in this and then focus on Israel, that'll be an interesting spin, but we don't know. So take what they say with a pound of salt at this point because they've been lying to you that you're, I mean, our entire lives, let alone just in this recent kind of weird development. But if this does lead to something that

Starting point is 02:10:19 ends people, you know, the ongoing war and the bombings, even in one location, that's a positive step regardless. And so hopefully we can remain skeptical as this goes forward. So thank you, Charlie. Looking forward to talking you next time, brother. And as always, everybody out there, question everything. Come to your own conclusions. Stay vigilant. It doesn't really affect us. We have so much oil. We have tremendous oil and gas, much more than we need. We're now totally independent of the Middle East, and yet we are there to help. We don't have to be there. We don't need their oil. We don't need anything they have. I'm going to get bad press. I know that. Now, if I did the opposite, if I went out and continued to bomb them for another floor, just bomb the hell out of them.

Starting point is 02:11:02 I'd get bad press on that. No, there's nothing I can do. But what this does is it allows the ships to go. If we keep bombing, those ships won't be going. And you're talking about $500, $600, $700 million a day. It's a lot of money, a lot of money. That's why the world is okay. It's liquid, it's fine. Also, we run out of reserves in about four weeks.

Starting point is 02:11:25 You know, there are reserves all over the world, and we would really run out. And there'll be a time when you wouldn't be able to get it, and you want to see Bedlam? So for all those so-called geniuses that want to show them, how smart they are.

The Last American Vagabond - What The Hell Is Happening w/ Charlie Robinson (6/18/26)

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