The Late Braking F1 Podcast - Could Verstappen really LEAVE Red Bull?!

Episode Date: March 17, 2024

In today's episode the boys discuss whether Max Verstappen really could leave Red Bull?? They also talk through whether Ollie Bearman deserves a full time seat in F1, and chat through Helmut Marko's comments about Daniel Ricciardo's skay start to the season. >>> Don't forget to check out our friends NordVPN on our discounted link here: https://nordvpn.com/lbf1 FOLLOW us on socials! You can find us on YouTube, Instagram, X (Twitter) and TikTok SUPPORT our Patreon for bonus episodes, historic race reviews & more! JOIN our Discord community JOIN our F1 Fantasy League: SIGN UP & create your team, and JOIN our league (join code: C3PHEQHPU04) BUY our Merch EMAIL us at [e-mail]   & SUBSCRIBE to our podcast! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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It's been a while, hasn't it, Sam? Oh, I've not seen you two for days. I can't remember the lot of joking, folks. We literally just recorded Wednesday's episode. We're all wearing exactly the same clothes. If you're watching this on YouTube, we do look exactly the same. We don't have any other clothes. True, we can't afford them.

We're trying desperately to do this full-time. So clothes are non-optional. If you'd like us to get more clothes, why don't you subscribe to our Patreon? It's a good style. Welcome. Welcome. We're going to talk about Formula One today, folks. I promise we won't be silly. How can you promise that? It's such a lie. Speaking of not being silly, and this is obviously Sunday's episode that we're recording on a Wednesday.

Sam, what has happened in the world of F1 over the last few days that we've obviously missed out on? Well, obviously, Haas have unlocked a superpower to make them the most incredible car in Formula One. And it's known as the Eagle Wing mechanism. It's patriotic and it really delivers freedom to the people. I had no idea what that was going. Honestly, I started that sentence and I hope to find the end along the way. Yeah, Sam is Michael Scott. Well, that's for a long time.

I mean, I can't believe that Oatma has now had his 10th child. No. I know, I don't know. Would that not be 10 through 18 now? He's not on the next nine. He's only nine at a time. His nine times multiple applications are brilliant. Oh, dear.

I can't believe the news that Liam Lawson is now racing for, for R.B. It's pretty crazy. Yeah, I know. See you later, Ricardo. Just so we're all clear. Especially my one, are entirely fabricated.

And we are just making things up. Out of the three, I think yours is probably the one we know that isn't, it's the most fabricated. That feels wrong. Has to find a superpower. I like it.

Cool. The Eagle Wing. Cool. This is going well. What have you said about not being silly this episode? Anyway, we've got comments from Helmut Marco relating to Daniel Ricardo to talk through a little bit later on, our thoughts on Olly Berman and his possibility of getting into a seat next year, or indeed,

maybe later this year, who knows? But we're going to start with Red Bull. And specifically, Christian Horner and his comments relating to Max Verstappen. So Red Bull have said that they will not force Max Verzappen to stay if he wants out. So obviously Max Verstappen and has a contract with the team until 2028, but his future has been a hot topic over the last couple of weeks. In Saudi Arabia, Max Vastapa made it very clear that if Helmut Marco went, that he could also follow him out the door.

He said, I can't continue to him, which is, sounds beautiful. What's the banker doing? So sorry. What, okay. Okay, folks. We might have to cut this out.

Obviously, that was that bad. I'm just going to level with you. what happened there is my camera's not plugged in. He's still recording me. My camera's not plugged in. I tried to plug it in. And what I did was I knocked the camera onto the soundboard. It stopped recording, started recording again,

and then played the phone jingle. It's really great. Good. To round off, this is what Christian Horner had to say regarding the situation. He said, it's like anything in life. You can't force somebody to be somewhere just because of a piece of paper. If somebody didn't want to be at this team, then we're not going to force somebody against their will to be here. That applies whether it's a machine operator or a designer or somebody in one of the support functions that runs through the business.

What did you make of this, Sam? It feels like this is almost a bit of a jab back. I don't understand what's going on at Red Bull. Cast your minds back to four or five months ago. We're just, you know, we've finished the end of the 2023 season. Red Bull have had the most dominant car in history. Max Verstappen's had the most dominant season in history. He's broken the record for most race wings in a row, most points scored. So many records have fallen, and Red Bulls cement themselves in the history books properly.

And now Christian Horner goes through a scandal. Helmut Markham might leave. Adrian Newe might be going to Ferrari. And now they're openly saying that the best driver in Formula One right now, oh we won't we won't try and keep him if you wants to go which I understand his point of view right you don't want to force someone into a place they don't want to be because arguably they won't be at their best

but at the same time that's what you sign a contract for you might have some bad years you might have some ups and downs internally culture might not fit what you're looking for and it might need to change but the fact that you don't want to keep hold of this kid who is so blimming good at the Formula One.

I don't know. I get it. I get what you're saying. But it also is trying to feel like reverse psychology to me of kind of a, look, we're not going to force him to stay here. Max, you should try and leave wink, wink, wink, wink. I'm looking at the camera, folks. If you've got shown YouTube.

We definitely don't need you to be here, but we want you. We don't need you. I don't know. It's all so up in the air. It's incredibly confusing. And I just feel like Red Bull politically are in an absolute fire at the moment. they cannot find the exit, they cannot find the fire extinguishes, and they can't put themselves out.

And this just feels like another massive blow to Red Bull, that if they do lose Helmut Marco, as much as, you know, I don't think he's had the best opinions across his life, if they then lose Max Verstappen, if they lose Adrian Newey, and if Christian Horner has to leave, which maybe he should or shouldn't, but the success that they, as a four, have brought to this team, is phenomenal. So any pillar of that section to go is going to be bad,

But if you lost all four of those over the space of six months, Red Bull would be knocked back to the dark ages, I feel like it would not be a good time. So, yeah, this is just another brick in the wall of misery that I think Red Ball is off track at the moment. That is an excellent saying. Thank you. Yeah, I like that. How crazy do you think it is that winning is not able to unify this team? I mean, it's the number one thing you want to do in any sport.

you want to win. And it's not like it's not like football, soccer to Americans, where you have 11 players on a team with a bench and reserves and then coaching staff. You know, Formula One, and Red Bull as a team is such a strange dynamic where you race entirely

for yourself and at the same time you race as a team. And you're 50% of the output on the track. Sergio Perez, Max Verstappen. They make up 100% the output. So losing someone like that when you're winning as well to go, I don't want to do that anymore.

I'm one of two people that can do this every single week, and I don't want to do it anymore. It's a crazy decision to turn around and just go, now, being the world champion again, not enough for me. Which, I mean, I respect Max Verstappen that he's so confident in himself that he's going to go, actually, you know what, I'm just going to happen.

I don't want to do it. Don't care if I'm winning. I don't want to do it. I massively respect his ability to walk away from something that is so successful if he's not happy and it's toxic for him. what do you think, Carrie? Do you think that the team would let it get to the point

where Vastappan would actually leave? Like, would they, surely they'd see this off. I haven't baffled by this entire thing because when have you ever heard of a team that are doing, I guess in any sport, they're doing that well. I mean, they're not just winning. They're absolutely smacking everyone about at the moment. And they have done for the past 18.

months. And yet it's not enough, because of the chaos going on behind the scenes, it's not enough potentially to keep your star driver. I know the rumours about Adrian Newey, you know, whether they're actually any, any foundation to them or not. I saw something today that he is just, yeah, well, I was going to say the same thing. Yeah. So today that he's not actually going anywhere and he's coming about the track side in Australia. Japan. Japan. So yeah, so there's obviously a lot of this, as we've touched on before, there's a lot of hearsay going on. But the fact that whatever is going on is enough to even have broached this conversation is utterly baffling. And you can have a situation where two teams in the space of a few months lose two of the best, well, the two best drivers in F1 right now.

Louis Hamilton and Max Verstappen. That's crazy. That's ridiculous. Considering the success of both of those have had with those respective teams. So I know for very different reasons, obviously. But yeah, it's just, I don't know. It feels like there's a, maybe it's a tactic, I don't know. But from Christian Horn, a bit of an attitude of we don't need Max Verstappen or Adrian Newee.

I'd argue you definitely both of them. I'd argue you need Adrian Newey more than Max Verstappen. I know that seems a ridiculous thing to say. But Red Bull will continue without Max Verstappen. It obviously will have to without Adrian Newey. but if you're going to give one up, you keep the guys been making your cars win all the time,

not necessarily the driver that's in it. So maybe that's what he's going for here, but it's just utterly bizarre that it's even come to this situation where they could say, yeah, we'll let Vostappan go. Vastappen, Max, Vestappen, off to Red Bull,

leaving Red Bull is, I didn't think I'd ever, I mean, I'd probably said the same thing about Hamilton leaving McLaren back on the day, but these two, Red Bull and Vestappen seem so intertwined that it just doesn't seem to make any sense. I think he just wants to partner up with his best friend Pierre Gasly at Alpine and reunite

that combination, leaving Ocon free to, of course, claim the Red Bullse. So I think that's probably how it's going to play out. Yeah, in your war modes, you need tactics. And the tactic is to read the stabbing of the best seat and take it for his own. You know, by the way, that even if this room is, there's nothing to this, you know that Fernando Alonzo is on the blower to Red Bull and be like... No, he's already there. He's at the factory.

If he... The moment he leaves, lads, I'm in. Hello. Hello. Hello. Hello. Hello. Hello. At the door. Hello. Let me in. Hello, it's the seat mine, hello.

Literally brought his own seat fitting with him. You see a meeting with Briatore and Toto Wolf today. Yeah, was that actually real or I've seen? I don't know. No, but was at the same time? I think it was. I think it's a real photo. No, no, no.

There's a picture of Alonzo at the same cafe, but people are saying it's the same time, but actually whether they were two separate occasions anyway. Breitori is still as manager, right? Very much so. Yes. and I imagine that Toto and Briatore probably have texts going about.

I mean, it's Fernando. He wouldn't let it not happen. My source tells me that the photos are very legit. My source is one, Kate Middleton. Oh, where is she being? She's great. She's photoshop in it. We all like to dabble in Photoshop occasionally.

Oh, Lord. I mean, I'd make sure reggae to myself. Luckily you don't do ours on away Oh wait I feel like what you're saying in terms of Vastappen potentially if you were to leave

and comparing it to Hamilton and his decision Hamilton leaving Mercedes might be you know what I'm going to say it is it is the most seismic move in F1 history I don't think this would top that

in that regard but it would be way more shocking like it would be way more short. Like with Hamilton's one, it makes sense. Mercedes haven't been winning for years and he's always wanted to race for Ferrari at some point in his career, it's a childhood dream. It all makes sense. This would make, from an on-draq perspective, no bloody sense in the world. It would make absolutely zero sense. I think the Stappan has made it pretty clear on where he's at based on his comments and him essentially tying himself at the hip to Helmut Marco.

And I'm not sure how much influence that had on, you know, Helmut Marco, it was at one point during the weekend, suspected that he was going to be suspended. And then they kind of walked back on that, not quite sure how much Vestappan's comments had to do with it. But, yeah, I think Vestappan has both explicitly and implicitly been very clear as to what side of this argument he's on through his chats over the weekend. At this point, it feels like both sides of this. It's just so much posturing going on, right?

There's a lot of political posturing to the point where Yoss and Max are threatening to go elsewhere. I'm 100% of the belief that it is a play. It is a ploy, a play, a tactic, and nothing beyond that. And honestly, I think here, Christian Horner is calling their And he knows exactly what he's doing, Christian Horner. He knows what he's doing when he's comparing Vestappen indirectly to, what did he say? Designers and, I mean, I've got the quote here, designers and machine operators and somebody in the support function.

There's a reason he said all of that in his quote. And it's very much to tell Vastappen, you are another cog in this wheel. You might be an important cog in the wheel, but you're a reason. are just a cog in the wheel. And actually, I'm aware and you're aware that Vastappan plus Red Bull is an amazing combination that keeps on winning, but which of the two combinations will work if they're separate? Would it be another great driver plus Red Bull or would it be Vastappen in another team?

And the winner out of those two would be, as great as Vastappen is, the winner of those two situations at the moment would be the other driver going into Red Bull because quite honest, the car matters, doesn't it? The car and as much the driver, of course, matters as well. If Verstappen went to Mercedes this year and someone went in and, say, Shao LeClaire for whatever bizarre reason stepped into Red Bull, my money would be on LeClair and Red Bull. And I feel like this is Horner's way of just telling him that's the way it is. It's still a very dangerous game.

Don't get me wrong. You know, there is the whole Adrian Newey part as well. But yeah, I think this is Christian Horner almost with a bit of a, he's been on the defensive for multiple reasons for over the last few weeks. This felt like him coming out and jabbing back a little bit, I think. It's a lot of buffooning, isn't there? A lot of, you know, gorillas walking around with their chests puffs, puffed up to try and look like the big man in the zoo, in the jungle. And the issue is,

we don't know what they're trying to attain by being the big man in the paddock right now. Is it that they want each other gone? Because Christian Horner doesn't want Max Verstappen gone, regardless of what he says. And I thought his comments were quite scathing, quite harsh. Just say to Max Verstappen, you're like a designer, you're like a machine worker. You know, It's very, it's quite dismissive of the level of natural talent that you have to have to be someone like Max Verstappen. But equally, there are maybe six or seven drivers I could name right now at the click of a finger that would go on to win titles after titles in that Red Bull car and would snap it up

at an instant. And okay, they might not lead a race by 24 seconds every single time, but they can lead a race by 15 seconds every single time, and they're still going to win those races, and they're still going to take home 25 points. So it's a very, very interesting and tricky situation, and I weirdly feel like it won't be Max Verstappen or Christian Horner that's settled it. I think it might actually be someone like Helmut Marco, who is the one that makes the deciding vote or the deciding voice with their feet and walks out of the door or stays and sits down and stays planting. It's a very bizarre but fascinating situation to what chung-fold.

funnily enough, ever since you said it the last time we spoke about this last week, where you compared Red Bull to the Roman Empire, yes, the more and more I believe it, because, you know, the Roman Empire was at its strongest when it was fighting others, like whether that be the Samnites or the Carfaginians or whoever else, they were at their best when they were fighting opposition. and when they struggled was when they didn't have a common opponent and they just broke down internally. And it feels like this is very much the same way in that,

I don't know, if the likes of a Ferrari or a Mercedes really stepped up to the plate on the track and this team were able to unify and get behind this common enemy, I don't know, I'm not just saying that would resolve anything, but it's almost like they don't have anything to be distracted by on track that might actually be hurting them. at the moment. Yeah.

They feel so bizarrely confident to be able to play out all this drama in the public eye, because when the results go your way and the shot floor keeps working, the big bosses can have arguments and nothing seems to go wrong. But there's only so far you push that, as with the Roman Empire discussion there. You know, it only takes one crush out to turn into the Ottoman Empire and the Holy Romans, and you suddenly have a civil war going on that ends in your absolute destruction. So this is a lot of history chat for a Formula One podcast. We're going to touch on the Russian Revolution soon, aren't we, Harry?

Oh, Stelip his necktie. Here we come. Sleeping. At your mouth. Come on. Come on. Go on. So get the reference.

Literally no one, but the three of us. This is like our origin stories. This is how we bonded. We met in history class, folks. We really did. Right. We'll take our first break at this point. On the other side, we're going to be chatting Olly Bermann.

Before we get into our chat on Oliver Berman, Harry, I have a question for you. Oh, there we go. What could it be? Please do, Ben. So, hypothetically speaking, let's say, I really enjoy this podcast. I won't name the podcast,

but I really enjoy this podcast. And I would like to show them my appreciation by some sort of, I don't know, star rating, let's say. How would I go about that? Well, Ben, I'll tell you. And you might think, oh, I should write them a letter or I'll send them a tweet or I'll send them a DM on Instagram. I mean, all of the above. You can't.

You welcome. P.O. Box is coming. Hey, it's getting closer. Anyway. Hey, when this comes out, days closer. No, do all of those things. But the things that we, the thing that really, really help us, a five-star review. Please leave us a five-star review on wherever you listen to your podcast.

I mean, it's mainly Apple that it helps us on. But you can do it on Spotify and you can do it on Apple and other platforms. You could give us a thumbs up on a YouTube video. And I subscribe. And I subscribe. 10K before sourcing. No, seriously, the five-star reviews, as I always say on this little ad hoc bit, they really help us

and every time we do a plug you guys deliver with some sensational reviews so thank you as we again as we always say it can be you can write anything you want as long as it's nice and not defamatory

but as long as those five stars attached to it then we don't mind so please keep up the good work I know there's always every time we do this there's always like one that comes through it's like oh Harry's begging finally paid off so if that if that result each week, each time we do it, then I'm not going to stop. So, yeah, please, five-star reviews.

And the words that you can include this week is my pump and mickle. That's good. Equally, Caesar in a race car. Yes. There you go. The Red Bull Empire. No, no, no mind. So any of the above, but five stars, please. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Madcock. because Harry is begging you. That is one of the niches references you've ever known. That's a great song though.

It's a great song. Begging you. I reckon we should put our loving hands up and move on to the next segment. Put your loving hands and give me five stars. God, this is a bad episode. Right. Oliver Behrman, obviously got points on his debut

at the Saudi Arabian Grand Prix. We don't know for certain yet as to what will happen when it comes to Australia. I think the plan is that Carlos signs will be back in the car by that point. So if we at least go ahead with that assumption for now, that it will be just a one-off race for Behrman, but he does have multiple free practice sessions throughout the year with the Hasse team. Jock Clear, who is the head of the Ferrari Driver Academy,

has said based on the Saudi Arabian debut of Berman, that he has proved he is ready for a full-time seat in the sport. Sam, I mean, it focuses a lot on HASS here, as that makes the most sense, arguably. But do you think generally that Bayerman is ready, either at the beginning of next season or maybe even before that, and it should Hasse be the ones to pick him up? Yeah, I mean, let's not realistically talk about before the end of this season, because in all realistic chances, that that isn't going to happen regardless. It's not like, and we don't want it to happen for reasons that are, you know,

I'm not very nice. For example, let's say Carlos Sines has another problem. and they can't raise for the rest of the season. We just don't want that to happen. So in all realistic terms, he won't be in a seat until the end of this year, start of next season. But do I think she should be in a seat?

100%. The amount of positive comments, not just from this podcast, not just from you, our listeners, but from the whole F-1 community and the professionals that surround that, that praised Olly Bearman like they should. The amount of times that it was kind of,

we didn't know it was an F-2 driver. We were unsure, you know, the level of support, as Ben, you made the point of, if you were to hide everyone's names, you just put the constructors and where they finish on a grid and you go pick out the rookie, you couldn't. He held himself so brilliantly across that entire Grand Prix weekend with only one practice session. He displayed so much maturity, great skill, got overtakes done, was really good in raw pace, lots to learn, of course, but hey, that's the point of being a rookie. You develop, you grow, you change. Oscar Pliastri is doing

from last season to this season, or Logan Sargent is, hopefully, doing from last season to this season. That's what you do as a rookie and as a young driver. He deserves a seat and there is a real growing problem in Formula One that drivers like Olly Behrman, and it's not just him, because you look at the likes of Liam Lawson, who had that opportunity last season, Taylor, Taylor, Taylor, players of the game like Felipe Drogavich, who's still a reserve driver. There's so many names that you can come out with that are options here that have had to go elsewhere to IndyCar, to Super Formula, to WEC, like Mitch Schumack is doing, of course, where the seats don't allow for you to, one, take time to adjust to get yourself ready

for a Formula One drive over a couple of years. And secondly, a lot of the time, you can simply get a seat to prove yourself in the first place. So, yes, Ollie Bearman does deserve a drive, especially at end of this year. I think he's earned himself that opportunity. And I'm sure over the rest of the F2 season, even after he's missed a weekend due to being in the Jeddah Grand Prix, he will prove. himself across that championship as well very much so. He deserves a seat.

Haast feels like the logical option. I'm unsure about the Salba relationship anymore because, yes, they take Ferrari engines for now. But of course, Audi have recently announced that they're going to up their commitment to 100% buyout now of Salba from the sport. So it will be Audi owned, which means Audi engines. They won't have a relationship with Ferrari anymore. So it feels very unlikely that Ferrari can use that engine power to muscle their way into getting one of their reserve drivers a seat for a couple of years.

Hars, on the other hand, might enjoy a larger discount of an engine supply or some parts that they take off whilst also getting a driver for free, for example. It might be a nice way to reinvest their cost cap spending elsewhere. That might suit them, especially if maybe KMAG or Hulkenberg, feels unlikely right now, but one of those two, go on to have a bit of a shocker of a year, or they want to turn themselves to have a season pro and a rookie. sometimes cash off the track is worth more than a driver that can finish

12th place, not 14th place. Hars for the main option. The other option that feels like a possibility, which I think could be a bit of a shock, but it's definitely possible, is if Logan Sargent continues to run down this route of not really achieving what I think James Vowler probably want of him at this point,

maybe that secondary William's seat opens up, and maybe there is some discount for Williams to take on this young driver for no cost and they can save on salaries and investments and maybe sign-house some sponsorship or something like that goes their way. But otherwise, it will just be wonderful if there are more teams in the sport

to allow for more seats and then we wouldn't have to have this debate. There's also been a lot of talk in the F1 sphere and there's a lot of drivers hogging seats that shouldn't have them anymore and maybe we'll get onto that in a little bit, but a lot of people just sitting in them and not doing a lot with them anyway.

But yes, you should be in a seat. Hars feels like the most logical option. More seats, more teams. I'll never catch on. Dream on. If only someone was willing to fill those seats, anyone got Michael Andretti's number or... Why would you bother calling him?

He's got prepared already with an engine supplier and a full facility. I don't think he's interested. I would embarrass the sport, in my opinion. This is sarcasm, America. Yes, a lot of sarcasm. What do you think about Behrmann's chances for a seat next year? Do you think he's ready, Harry?

I'm wary of the Nick to freeze effects that we experienced in 2022 but I'd say yeah give him some give him some more time in an F1

I think he's ready he was very impressive in Saudi as I've said already but I'm not going to say he's the next greatest driver in F1 but I think yeah

I think he proved in it I guess the difference between the Nick to Free situation and the one we had with Bearman Nick DeFries got chucked in a seat that was in a car that was very good in a straight line and he was racing at Monza.

Yeah. DeVries was also, I don't know how many years exactly, but like eight, nine years older than what Behrman is, I think. Precisely. Precisely. Like a season's champion, I shall add. An actual champion. So, you know, an easier prospect than Berman had, which was Saudi which has all of the corners. And he had, well, he driven an F2, but he hadn't driven an F horn car around there before. So I think based on that, yes, yes, I would think he's going to deserve a chance next year.

Put him in a house seat. Again, no offence to either of these drivers, but the two hash drivers are a couple of placeholders at the moment, waiting for the next thing. And me, no offense to KMAG or Nico Hulkenberg. Holcomburg actually think he's been driving excellently since he came back with Hasse so he's probably one I'd keep

but let's be real that's kind of what they are at the moment and I think some Hass you can have a rookie and an experienced driver doesn't work one or the other

you can do that although to be fair I'm not sure why I was saying this because Olly Berman will be new so Gene Hasse won't employ him he doesn't know him I don't know him so nope

That's why they're making them do so many free practice sessions. They're just not sure. It's not actually, it's not the track time. It's just getting to know, Gene. Every single time he's got to have a brunch with Gene. It's just to be cute. So they're like, Gene, can you go and get some fresh coffee from just down there? And all he's stood by the machine.

Hi, Gene. Hi. Remember me? Who are you? I don't like you. I'm you driver. You're new. Who's this boy?

Oh, dear. Anyway, so, yeah, I think it's, I think it's, other part. I think he proved himself in Saudi, to be honest. Yeah, get him in the scene next year, Has. Come on. I think the performance itself, Saudi aside, because pace-wise, I think we kind of know he's got good pace, right?

Based on his junior career. I think what stunned, maybe that might be a step too far, but what surprised me a bit was the maturity that he was able to display, given how young he is and the situation that he was put into, it would have been very easy for that weekend to implode for him. And he just didn't let that. Not only did he not let that happen, it never felt like it was going to.

Like he, there were a few instances in the race where, you know, he stuck a wheel up the inside on an overtake attempt that wasn't quite there. But there was a lot of maturity for a driver that quite honestly he doesn't have the right to be that mature, which should give teams like ass and anyone else who might be considering him a lot of confidence because I don't want a single one driver out,

but just to use like Yuki Sonoda as an example. Like Sonoda, we often talk about his maturity and how it's still got a little ways to go. Guys, five years older than Nolly Berman. And Berman, it felt like he was very set from the off. you know, I think it would be, I think it would be a mistake for Hasse and Ferrari

not to get him in the Hasse seat for next year. It feels like a no-brainer. Obviously, we know with when Charles LeClair came into the sport, he had one year at Salber before moving on to Ferrari. So you could argue, you know, Salber got a very good year out of him, but only got one year,

which is the downside to this sort of loan move that Hasse would be doing. but I think given LeCler and Hamilton will be the partnership for Ferrari next year, we don't know how far exactly Hamilton's going to go into his career, but that could be the line-up for three, four years, depending on how far into his 40s Hamilton wants to race. Alonzo's proving it can be done,

meaning that Hasse might actually get a good number of years out of a developing prospect like Berman. It might not be, like in the case of Leclair, a one and done deal where you have a good season with them, but hey, Ferrari's calling, off you go. That seat might not come about for a while yet for Berman. So I do think it would be foolish for Hasse and Ferrari not to take this on. Similar to what you say,

I mean, Holkenberg seems to have impressed more at this point in their respective like time together as teammates. I think they should have the rest of this year to, you know, see where they're at. want to call it this early, but I think at least one of them should not make way because it shouldn't be on the driver, but I think Hash should make the decision to employ him if, you know, if the free practice sessions go well, which I think they will. With the F2 side of thing, Sam, do you think there's still work for him to do there to convince a team like Has that he should be taken? Like, does he have to hit a certain point in the championship or does the F1

experience override it? No, it doesn't override it. I do think it plays a massive part. I do think it is a great step in the right direction, but he can't now go back to F2 and crash the car at every race session, for example. He needs to still have a pretty competitive Grand Prix, because at the end of the day, F2 is the proving ground. It is the natural prequel to Formula 1. And if you can't handle yourself to some degree in F2, then I'm not saying it's to be all in F2. I'm not saying it's to be all I'm not saying there aren't exceptions. You look at certain champions and runners up and things like that, and they don't always come to fruition in Formula One, right?

Nikita Mazepin, for example, he was pretty competitive in F2, not very good in Formula One. I hate to say it to him, but Mick Schumacher is an F2 champion. I don't know if he's really deserving of any further time in Formula One. It does happen. But equally, you look at the amount of drivers that have come through Formula 2 and won or come second or third and massively impressed

and what they've gone on to do. You know, Miko Rosberg, Lewis Hamilton to name a McLaughler of the classics from his GP2, more recently, Charles LeClerc, Mando Norris, George Russell,

Alex Album, these drivers who have really done well, Ocon, Gassley, you know, Max Raskop has skipped it. But my point is, to do well in the junior formulas tends to point to the fact

that you're going to be quite good in the Formula One. So, yeah, I'm not saying he used to go and dominate and not say he needs to go win the whole season. If he were to finish, I don't know, third in a close title fight and also had this F1 experience, I think that's enough with Ferrari behind him,

with Hart's backing, that he will get a drive. Equally, if he finishes 7th or 8th, and someone like Kimmy Antingale, for example, absolutely wipes the floor in the same car as him as his team, mate, questions might need to be asked. To be fair, you know, Berman was nowhere in F2 last weekend at South. I was, it was like he was invisible.

Really, yeah. I'm not sure he, I even saw him start the race, actually, I come to think of it. He was barely insistent. Yeah, he could have not been there, and I don't think anything would have changed. Harry, if you're Hasse or another team, what do you want to see from Berman

throughout the rest of the F2 campaign? I think just more of what he did in Saudi, just consistency, because I said this, before. He didn't drive, and again, I mean no disrespect to F2 drivers here, but didn't drive like someone who was in F2. You made the, you know, comparison to Sonoda and the, you know, beneath for maturity. Berman looked like he was, he was already grown up. He looked like the complete package in that sense. So I think that, obviously, got to still be fast, which he's already showing, he took

Paul and Saudi in F2 before he got called up to the Ferrari seat. But yeah, I think just they don't need another, they need another, they need a, right, so you have a rookie, they don't need a slow one, like Mazapin, and they don't need a quick one who crashes, well, I guess not always quick, but like McKenaca did, quicker. So you're being generous there. They need one who's quick and consistent. And from what we've seen, I think, Ben, and it. is that, or at least that's what he demonstrated in Saudi.

So I think more of that for the remainder of the year to, to, and the same for when he's in the practice sessions as well with Haas. I think that will seal in the seat or it should see it in the seat, but it's, you know, it's Haas, so they'll probably employ someone else. Grosjean's back. Yeah, I agree with you both. I think there is still work to be done when it comes to his F2 campaign. it's still very early in the season.

I almost think the FP sessions, like the free practice sessions, will matter just as much, if not more, just because of how many he's doing for HASS to the point where we know all the teams have to fulfill their two sessions per year quota of these drivers. But in a lot of those instances, if you are just coming into the car for the first time,

there's a lot of climateization that's necessary to the point where you don't get a lot of accurate running. but I think it might be like five sessions or so that the bearman's got for Hass this year. After the first one, there's less of that time that's required to get him used to the car. He's already raced in F1 now

that actually there can be some real representative running that Has can see and make their decision on. So yeah, it's still work to do, but he, you know, it would be a surprise if it's thrown away from here. Okay, let's take our second break of this episode. On the other side, we've got comments from Helmut Marco on Daniel Ricardo. Ben, do you ever forget how many breaks we've had in an episode?

Probably. I forget all the time, so I'm glad you remember. I'll pretty forget now. And we're here for our first break. Hello and welcome to the late break. Very good. Okay, welcome back. Moving on to our next topic regarding Helmut Marco and some comments that he's

made about the two Menardi drivers, Daniel Ricardo and Yuki Sonoda. He said, at least Sonoda is very good in qualifying, based on these first couple of races of the season. There's a lot of state this season for both Yuki and Daniel.

Yuki's qualifying performance was very good and Ricardo has to come up with something soon. Now, Helmut Marco is not exactly against interesting comments, as we know, Harry, but what do you make of this? I look, they're not been,

there's not been the greatest start to a season for Daniel Ricardo, but it seems a bit premature early doors to be start saying this. I don't know. He was obviously there for half of last year, although I missed a bit because he broke his hand. He's not, I guess he's not wrong. Ricardo does need an answer to this. He can't carry on like that if he wants any chance of a Red Bull seat.

But it just, it feels like Marco piling on the pressure, fairly early doors. He normally wears a few races before he does that. We've had two. So, yeah, I don't know. It seems to say, is how in Marco, you know, he's a lot onto himself. But it seems quite harsh, I'd say,

when I saw this, it's quite early to be making these sorts of comments. What do you think he does need to show, even if it's not soon? what do you think he needs to at least start to show and by when? I think it's just a bit quicker. I think the speed is the main issue. And it was one of the things that hampered him at McLaren.

And it seems like it'd come back when he obviously was in Red Bull reserve role for a bit, did that test, came back. And last year, once it wasn't like it didn't blow our socks off. there are a couple of good races in there. I'm thinking Mexico being one of them, where it was like, Daniel Ricardo's back. That's old Daniel Ricardo.

So these first two races have not felt like that so far for him. And yes, Sonoda, especially in qualifying, as Helmand Marcos says, has been pretty clear of him. So in the races, I think it has been closer. I know it worked against Sonodian in Bahrain. Obviously, the team orders.

In Saudi, there was a point where Ricardo actually wasn't that far behind. I know he spun on his own at the end. It wasn't that far behind Sonoda in that and that P-11 battle or P-10 battle. So I think the races are better, but definitely, definitely, qualifying needs to pick up ASAP. Yeah, and I think Ricardo said something along the lines of being a bit confused as to where that qualifying pace had gone when it got to Q2 in Saudi Arabia,

which is potentially more worrying that he doesn't know what the issue was, than if he did know what it was and could fix it. What do you make of the comment, Sam, and what do you think Ricardo needs to show? I think the comment has come too soon in the season. I do think it's harsh, should be bringing this kind of analysis up after only two races.

Equally, I don't think what Helmut Marco is saying is incorrect. If he had delivered this maybe after race seven or eight, and we'd seen similar forms throughout all the races that we saw from the first two, then I would very much say, yeah absolutely spot on I think there's some nostalgia around Daniel Ricardo

he brought such good results and marketing and vibes and attention to the Red Bull family and it still does right for a lot of the audiences a lot of the people absolutely thrive on Daniel Ricardo as a character as a person and he is a larger than life character

that he's able to sell himself off track enough maybe on track with how he used to drive that maybe gets to swing slightly further than what some of the quiet and more reserved drivers might get away with. Now, Daniel Ricardo, this is going to sound maybe a little bit scathing. Dangar Ricardo hasn't exactly been great for a while now. His last properly good time out was the last season he did at Renault,

which was quite a while ago now, and it was the previous generation of cars. I think he struggles with the new ground effect cars. I don't think he's able to drive these how he would like to drive them. that don't seem to suit his driving style. And I think he needs to do a lot. I think Daniel Ricardo is in a bit of a hole at the moment. I don't think he just needs to start beating Sonoda, you know, qualifying ninth if Sunnoa was 10th

or finishing 11th if Seno was 12th. The difference is for Daniel Ricardo, he's in his 30s and he's driving for a junior team where the entire aim is to get yourself into a Red Bull seat. Regardless of what R.B are coming out and saying, oh, we want to be more competitive, or we see top fives coming, whatever. The point is to get into Red Bull.

That is the point. And to prove that he's able to do that, you need to be dominating Yuki Sonoda. If Yuki Sonoda is in 11th, you should be in sixth or seventh. If Yuki-Signola finishes 10th place, why aren't you fighting for fifth? And I really mean that you need to be extracting

so much more out of that car to prove that you are a step above, a whole head and shoulders, not literally, above Yuki-Sinoda, I mean in ability in terms of course because if you're going to drive for what is the championship winning cup, if you're going to dethrone Sergio Perez,

which is the seat that they're all going for, you've got to show above and beyond ability. And I just think, whilst, yes, it's harsh to come up with these comments so soon from your own team, you know, family, he's not wrong. He's not wrong. And Daniel Ricardo does need to not just step up,

but jump up because I do think if this wasn't Daniel Ricardo, if this was Daniel Kiviat, I don't think he'd be given this chance again. I don't think he'd be allowed to circulate in the rebel family again. I just think the time will have come and gone. And I think maybe Daniel Ricardo's time is

coming and maybe has gone at this point. I love him as a bloke. He's a great personality. I don't think he's got what it takes at the moment. He's going to have to show me a hell of a lot this season to convince me otherwise. Yeah, I mean, that's why. I think the rest of this season will prove that one way or the other. And we will have a pretty definitive answer, I think,

very soon. Again, I agree. I think this is a little bit early, but I don't think it will be too much longer until we start to get a real picture of where he's at. I think in reality, you know, the second Red Bull seat, while Sergio Perez is doing the job and the job is finished second behind the snap and it's very difficult to see Ricardo, or really anyone else, having a case because he doesn't, it's similar to what you said something, he doesn't need to find an extra gear on what he's shown the last two races. He needs to find four extra gears. It's not even close.

Sergio Perez is at the moment at least doing the job where he's not giving the team reason to move on, which is what he was doing for a good chunk of last year. It was almost, you know, Ricardo was sat on the sidelines for a lot last year. But the whole reason the conversation came about was because Sergio Perez was giving. Red Bull reasons to look elsewhere. He's not currently doing that, which means someone like Ricardo, realistically, probably needs to perform

at a level similar to the likes of, dare I say, like Alonzo and LeCler, to properly prove that he is worthy of the risk, which would be the shift away. We can question Sergio Perez's results all we like, and we certainly do when they're not up to scratch. But, you know, he's there. He's the safe option.

he's the known. Whereas Ricardo, if he can't prove it in the sister team, the junior team, why would they risk it? Why would they risk it? And I guess the other issue for Ricardo is that what Red Bull need to see is not necessarily one-off performances that demonstrate pace

because we've already referenced the Mexican Grand Prix from last year was a great result for him. But at the moment, it's looking a little, a little bit like a standalone. Red Bull are not going to promote based on a standalone result. They are going to promote based on consistency. And the only way you can demonstrate consistency is over multiple races. So you better start sooner rather than later. Otherwise, time is going to run out for someone with, even with legendary patients like Checks Notes, Helmut Marco.

I don't know. Again, it's early. But to your point as well, Sam, he needs to show that he's capable of being in that Red Bull seat. Because if he's not, what reason would they have to keep him around? As you say, they are, even if they say otherwise, they are the feeder team for Red Bull. And there's no point keeping a driver around who's going to be turning 35 this year, unless you think that that old talent that he had displayed a number of years, years ago is still there somewhere. If he isn't able to demonstrate that with a full season under his belt this year,

when is he going to show it? So it really is, how much Marco said something along the lines if it's a big year for both of them, it really is, it's kind of do or die when it comes to the sport for him. Yeah, agreed. Okay, let's move on to our last regular topic of today, which is, a comment by Alex Albin regarding sort of the state of this season I'll read you the quote directly

when he was talking to F1 in some ways it's a bit of a shame to see comments about Max and it being a boring season because it's totally not that at least from my perspective because you take him out of the equation you have one of the best grids

the best fields, the tightest grids ever in Formula One and even if you include Max still it's the tightest field in Formula One it's hard because it's the leader so everyone focuses on the leader but the racing at the back is so intense we pitted two laps too late in Bahrain

during the race and we lost six positions now I mean a good opportunity to get a slight diggy in there for that not going very well but I think you know it's an interesting point as a whole Sam what did you make of it I think he's exactly right I think we made this point in the wink wink nash nudge Wednesday's episode although it definitely didn't record about an hour ago

that if you were to go back and watch a mid-2000s Grand Prix or even an early team's Grand Prix there were cars at the back and not just talking about one team I'm talking about three or four teams of the 10 or 12 folks, 12 teams that we had back then that were multiple, multiple laps behind come the end of a race,

not just 50, 60 seconds off of the leader but some teams would finish three or four. laps down. And that's on pure pace. No, no DNFs, no DSQs. No, that's not the right thing. No reliability issues, what I'm trying to say. It was just pace. They were that much slower than the race leaguers. And the pack that we have, partially made because of the cost cap, developmental changes that allow for design to catch up, it is allowed for the overall grid to be much closer. Last season, every single team scored points, right? That doesn't happen that often across the history of Formula One. Yeah, not just one lucky point.

It was solid, right? They were regularly fighting. If they weren't scoring points, most often, one of those cars at least were being 12th, 13th, 11th. There's a chance that they could have scored points if something, one thing were to happen for them. So, yes, I totally understand his point

that the midfield fight is super, super exciting. The issue is you don't tend to watch sport to see what happens in the midfield. I don't watch the Premier League to see who finish his intent. You know, that tends to not be the objective. So unless you are a die hard fan, like us, like many of you listen to this, who are able to sit there and appreciate the skill on show from midfield drivers,

the ability to outperform a car, how someone might outqualify something, or how a strategy could completely shake something up, which are very, very interesting in their own right. If you are very new to the sport, perhaps you're a very casual watcher, and you think, oh, I haven't really got a lot of time, I'll tune into a race. I'll give it a go. It's my first couple of these in the sport. I'll give it a go.

And all you are able to comprehend, which is understandable, if you're learning and it's very new to you is driver up front, wings by 15 seconds. Unfortunately, Alex's album, that is as important as an old school viewer as a new viewer. It has to be exciting from start to finish. So there are many exciting aspects within Formula One, but the most exciting part of any sport is the fight for victory.

And if there isn't a fight for victory, I can understand why many casual viewers are starting to switch off their TVs. I do understand that. But equally, he's right. There's a lot of fundraising going on, and that should be appreciated. Yeah. Yeah, I think I understand that point. You know, I was thinking that battle for 12th that we essentially had for Kevin Magnuson trying to hold everyone up behind him.

It was thrilling. I found it really entertaining. But also, it wasn't Carlos Seines trying to hold on to the win in Singapore last year. That was one of the most phenomenal Grand Prix I've seen in the last three seasons. And that would have been great for any position in the points, right? but it hit different for it being first. Yeah, completely agree. That can't be put aside. What were your thoughts on the comments, Harry? Yeah, I agree with him.

I take the point that it's obviously not for the win, but, and again, this is coming from someone who's watched F on for a long time, but I think, I get 2021, whilst it was traumatic and excellent in terms of a championship battle, it's just, I feel like it's ruined a lot of expectations. about what Formula One is and how it's kind of always been.

Yes, obviously we want the fights to be out of the front. Of course, like, I'm not denying that at all. But F-1 is, there are 20 cars there. It's not like you watch a football match or a rugby match or whatever, where there are just two teams and they just play each other and there's a winner. It's always been about there's more than one story in a race in, in an event. So, and to Albon's point, I think where F1 is, and we sort of talks about this in the other

podcast, we did an hour ago, I think F1 in terms of how close the field is, and it may not seem like it, given how dominant Red Bull are. Actually, the field spread is so close now versus what it used to be that you get these great fires, as you say, scrapping for 12th place, which, again, I know to someone who's more casual view, I'll be like, well, who cares?

But it's, it's what F1 is. You go to a F1 race to watch the racing and the racing doesn't just happen for the first, second and third.

Racing happens all throughout the field. And I think, I'm not blaming, I'm not blaming newer fans or casual fans for this. I'd actually put the blame on

the way F1 is broadcasted or, or promoted in that, I think they need to be, they do a bit, but they need to be way more done to, promote those sorts of battles, those midfield battles and

and try to give it as much excitement as a battle for the lead. You're never going to, it's never going to be because it's not a battle for the lead, but it deserves more airtime. It deserves more hype for what it is because, again, like I say, that's what Formula One is about. There are 20 race cars on the track and they're all having their own battles. And it's something that I always notice, I always notice, but I notice when,

if we're at an F1 race, you see it at Austin, there are loads of battles. Lance Stroh, absolutely planted one on Daniel Ricardo in Austin. We were there, we saw it live. Nauty. No, you didn't see on the TV.

Never, just never shown. And it's that sort of stuff that I think F1 misses a lot, that if they got right and got it better, then I think you'd keep more casual fans or newer fans engaged for longer. because a lot of the time we end up we end up watching cars that are nowhere near each other

because they're nearer the front rather than focusing on battles because they're even if they're near the back. Yeah, I completely agree. I mean, this isn't to say that people shouldn't complain because we've got great battles everywhere else.

That's not the point. But equally, it does deserve that attention. And if you were, to take Vastappen and maybe Red Bull as a team completely out of the equation, you could throw a blanket over the other nine teams. It is that close. At the moment, I don't think I can very accurately put together a sick through 10th order. There really isn't a lot between those five teams. And let's, I mean, last year, let's just say Red Bull doesn't exist. You would have had four periods of time last year where four different teams were the

best team on the grid. Astor Martin would have been the best team to start the year. McLaren probably would have been the best team to finish the year. And there were also periods where Ferrari and Mercedes were the fastest teams, given they finished second and third in the championship. But you would have had four different stretches where there were four different teams on top. That doesn't happen in an F1 ever. So if you do strip Red Bull away, it is so close behind. I think about even like seven, eight years ago, right?

You remember when it was a very definitive order of Mercedes. Mercedes, Ferrari, Red Bull, midfield, last few runners. Force India were often leading that midfield and they would sort of occupy that fourth best team in F1. If they were as far away from first place now than they were back then, they'd probably be last. Like they would be 9th or 10th, my guess would be. They definitely wouldn't be fourth, which is proving the point really that this grid is

so condensed, particularly in qualifying. think the issue at the moment is it doesn't quite translate to the race itself, but at least in qualifying, this grid is so close pace-wise. It is just the insane ability of Vastappen, Nui, and that Red Bull team that have somehow extracted every single inch out of these regulations to the point where they do have such dominance. I think even, like you say, Harry, I think 2021 has maybe misled people a little bit. Even so, the period of the period. of dominance that Red Bull are having right now, it is getting to the point

where I think it's unprecedented. As dominant as Hamilton was in some Mercedes years and Schumacher was in some Ferrari years, I can't remember the stat exactly, but I think Vestappan's won like 20 of the last 21 races now. Yeah, he's about to his second 10-ing-a-row stretch. I have that he's done nine in a row again. Yeah, Australia is 10 in a row if it wins it again.

So it's probably 19 out of 20 then rather than 20 or 21. But it's, even Schumacher and Hamilton did not reach that level of dominance individually. So, yeah, it is really, I don't want to say the fight for first or the lack of a fight for first is masking how great the sport is, because you're right, we absolutely do need a fight at the front as well to really cap it all off. But as Albin says, we shouldn't let it take away from some of the other entertaining action that is happening.

I dare say it, and I don't want to blow even more smoke up the young man's backside, but If he were to put, if this whole saga at Red Bull goes ahead, and Max Vastap and leaves Red Bull and goes to that empty Mercedes seat, for example, you've got to remember just how close everyone has been to, sorry. Oh, I'll go, caught up. I'll have a drink. You go. Sam's dying. Sounds making such a good point.

He's dying. Oh, cricky. I'm still dying. My point is everyone's so close to Perez. that we don't know who will have won the title the last couple of seasons and it's just Max Verstappen who's driving that car so brilliantly

that it's made it seem so much more dominant than it actually is because like you said Ben with the second place car swapping over so many times Sergei Perez not being the top level driver that we that could be in that car aka Max Verstappan we don't know who's going every race

we don't know who's going to every championship so in future if we have another three seasons but Verstappen has gone to Mercedes there's every chance that we can have four or five different teams when in multiple races in the season. It is one little thing that changes like that that can absolutely change the face of Formula One.

Yeah, I'm sure this one will divide people. So I'm really interested to hear all of your comments and thoughts on this. You can get in touch with us at the usual places, like breaking F1 on socials, getting the Discord. Let us know what you think on this. Is Alex Almond got a point? Or is it simply, we need a race out front?

for F1 to really take that next step again. We're going to take our final break of this episode. On the other side, we've got late faking. Okay, everyone, welcome back. Here we go. It's time for late faking. This one make faking game where one answer is fake and the other one's all right.

So help me, Christ, I'll make my decision in a second, Sam, you're going to have to wait because Ben made this game so hard. And I'm down by fine. It was Sam whispering that along to the tune. Sounded excellent. Oh, I hope you can all hear me just moutic along. Okay, late faking.

So Sam goes up against Harry in this game. There are six questions available to them. Both they'll take it in turns where I will give them a question and there will be four answers. Three of those answers fulfill the category that I say. But one of them, one of them's a little minks. It doesn't belong. And it's the job of Sam and Harry to figure out

what that one is. So, Harry, you started a bit back and forth, didn't you? So we can have Sam start late faking. Lovely. And I'll have a number one, please, Ben. Good stuff. Now, three of the drivers

have had a DNF at some point in the last 10 Grand Prix. Who hasn't? Okay. Oscar Piastri. Charles LeClair Esteban Okon Valtry Bottas

A reminder of the rules Is this the one if I get it wrong Harry can steal it No good No stealing it Okay so let's run through it again So it was Ockon LeCleur

Bossas and who Piestri Piaastri Okay so Lecler definitely did He went out in Brazil Um Or

Pupa Pupa I'm going to say that it was Piastri that didn't DNF. It is not Oscar Piestri. Piazri retired from the US Grand Prix, as did Esteban Ocon. Valtry Bottas retired from the Brazilian Grand Prix. Charles LeClair has been disqualified,

hasn't started a race, no DNF in the last 10th. Oh, that is so cheeky. Oh, that technicality. Aw, a legend he recommended you. That's a niche British reference. That is really niche. I love that. Right.

Harry, what another would you like? Number two, please, then. Okay, four drivers. Three of them have won the Indy 500. One hasn't. Okay. Emerson Fisipaldi. not going to be F1 drivers.

They're all F1 drivers. Emerson Fittipaldi. Yep. Your favourite, Jacques Villeneuve. Jim Clark. Nikki Lauder. Nicky Lauder.

Nicky Lauder? I don't think he's one, is he? Nicky Lauder has not won. The Indy 500. You're absolutely right. As far as my way, never beat there at all. Fitzapaldee won in 89.

I think Vilnerve 1 in 95 and Jim Clark. I should have written these down some point in the 60s. So that is 1-0. Over to you, Sam. I'll have number four, please, Ben. Oh, okay. So I'm going to give you four duos here, so two drivers.

Which of these podium duos has only happened once? So they've only stood on a podium together once. The other ones have all been multiple times. So you've got Fernando Alonzo and Daniel Ricardo. You've got Lando Norris and Carlos Sines. Chau LaClair and George Russell. And Lewis Hamilton and Nick Heidfeld. Oh, I'm...

I always feel like I get tricked on these because I feel like the Lewis Hamilton and Nick Hydefeb one feels like the obvious one, because it's with the crossover of their periods together. That, screw it. That's what I'm going to go with. Louis Hamilton and Nick Hydeford. It's not Hamilton and Hydefeld.

You know what? I'm actually bored playing in this game, so I hear it, it's not. At the end of each time, I'll answer it. I'm sick of it. I'm sick of it. It isn't Hamilton and Hydefeld or negative, Sam. No, don't hear that.

I got it wrong. Hamilton and Heidfeld shared a podium five times. Leclair and Russell have shared a podium so far four times. Norris and Sines three times. Alonzo and Ricardo just once they've been on the podium together. And you can ask me which race that is and I'd be able to tell you, I don't know. Hungarian GP 2014. Oh, what a legend. He's definitely just looked that out. I know that. Because Ricardo and Nick the win off him right at the end. Cheaky point. That would be a good historic race review to do for Patreon.

That would be actually. That's a good shout. I'm sick of it who found out as a historic fraud. It hasn't got a good memory. Unless it's about Roman Empire. Yeah, in that case, let's go. Let's go, baby. I'll tell you all about the phalanx. On the Napoleonic Wars, apparently. Oh, yes. True.

I played my boga part. Nice. Sorry, this is really, really niche. I love Sam's greatest there. of history have nothing to do with the areas of history we studied. We studied some of the most boring parts of history. Oh, yeah. I mean, the Russian Revolution was real dull.

Nothing going on there. Lots of it was boring. Just give me the war against the ghoul for the bloody Roman Empire, okay? It's far more interesting. Honestly, Visiona Gradsky in his agrarian reforms are just rolling in his grave. Give me Alexander the Great Subvation of India any day Good Lord

Right Who's turn is it Ari's your turn one Number five Yeah You'll give you four engines Three of them

have won at least 100 races in F1 So you've got Mercedes Renault Honda and Ford Cosworth Oh, I love a little cosy

Okay So one of them is not one 100 Yes, always one less than 100 Correct Honda Honda is the correct answer Mercedes have won 212 Grand Prix

Ford Cosworth 176 Renault 169 And $169 and Honda 89. Sam, what number would you like? Three. I'm going to give you four drivers here. Three of them have raced over 150 times in F1. One of them hasn't.

Kevin Magnuson, Nigel Mansell, Mika Hackanan, Ronnie Peterson. I'll have a day off. Can I have four Cosworth? The correct answer is Ford Coswell. Yay! Love a Cozy.

I do. I love a little cousin. It's like Nick going for a car in the UK, folks. I don't know if America causes Cosworth's Cozies. Cozhe. Cozette. As if you're from Manchester. Right.

Ronnie Peterson, Kevin Magnerson, and two other chaps who I've forgotten. Mika Harkinghamson and Manso. Yeah. I'm going to say Ronnie Peterson You would be correct to say Ronnie Peterson

Ronnie Peterson only 123 race starts The other three Hackan in 161 Magnus in 165 and Mansell 187 Sorry to my neighbours Which

leaves Harry with Number six, please. He's got it. He's been listening. Thank you. Thank you. Four teams, three of them, have never won a race. I want you to name the one that has.

Jaguar. Surtees. Shadow. Lola. Her name was Lola. She was a showgirl. Yes. It's a very mangalose song.

Sorry. Okay. Surtees. Is it shadow? Yeah. No, bulls. You're a shadow of your former self after that question. Confirmed, Harry Ead washed.

Ah, bulls. Well, that seems like an appropriate end to this episode. It could be the review of the episode, in all honesty. Sam, if you wouldn't mind getting us out of here. Folks, whether you drive a cousin or any other car in the world. Remember to give a five-star review. No, absolute meaning at all to any of that. Thanks for listening. It's a big or bizarre episode. Join the Discord, the links of the description. Patreon is available. We can have even more content that sounds very much like

this absolute ridiculousness. Watch it on YouTube, late-breaking F-1 and follow us on social media, late-breaking F-1. The handle is the same everywhere. We can love you and leave you, and we'll be back midweek for our Australia preview, where we're going to be talking all things about the Australian Grand Prix. We're giving our bold predictions. We'll be making our kind of poll one, two, three shouts and we'll hear from you the Discord list about what you think is also going to happen in the GP. So make sure you're shooting in, hopefully, it'll be a banging episode slash GP weekend. Anyway, in the meantime, I'll be Samuel Sage. I've been Ben Hocking, having Harry eat. And remember, keep breaking late.

Boy, point. Thank you.