The Late Braking F1 Podcast - Guenther Steiner LEAVES Haas F1 Team

Episode Date: January 10, 2024

The LB trio discuss the breaking news that Guenther Steiner has departed from Haas F1 Team after 10 years as Team Principal, and is to be replaced by Ayao Komatsu. They also compare their Top 5 most UNDERRATED drivers in F1 history, before finishing with a game of F1: Higher or Lower... Generation Logistics are looking to find and engage the next generation of logistics talent - people like you! Find out more here: https://generationlogistics.org/ FOLLOW us on socials! You can find us on YouTube, Instagram, X (Twitter) and TikTok SUPPORT our Patreon for bonus episodes JOIN our Discord community JOIN our F1 Fantasy League BUY our Merch EMAIL us at [e-mail]   & SUBSCRIBE to our podcast! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This podcast is part of the Sports Social Podcast Network. Thank you for listening to the Late Breaking F1 podcast. Make sure to check out new episodes every Wednesday and every Sunday. And welcome to the late breaking F1 podcast presented by Harry Ead, Sam Sage, and me, Ben Hocking. It might be the middle of January, which usually means we're struggling for topics. But thank you very much, Gunterstiner, and thank you very much, Has, because we've been given breaking news, Sam. How about that?

Breaking news. In January. Chewbacca? That... Yes. He's arrived on the late breaking podcast. Is he the new team principal? I don't want to speculate.

Also, because it's being approved, who is the new team principal also? Yeah, bloody hell, he's off. But, I mean, we'll get on to that in a minute. Just want to ask, how is everyone? Everyone all right? Do you all right, Harry? I'm okay.

Your room's very warm. I've had the heat. on. You've lived in a lovely warm furnace for the day. I haven't had it on all day. No? Not an animal. Joe, folks, a amount of times that I'd say I'm up on Harry in the middle of winter is in shorts. I am in shorts now. I know. You give off that vibe.

It's a short, you're like the weird PE teacher that wears shorts forever. The thing is, we and Sam know exactly who we're going to right now. Yes, exactly the same person. Yeah, without doubt. And what a shout at him out on the podcast. No, I joke. Yeah, it was very... It was part in time.

Ben, how are you, mate? Are you in shorts under there over the desk? I am 100% not in shorts. I'm in nothing. No, I'm definitely in full trousers. You can see that on YouTube. Yes, Patreon. Exclusive.

Yeah, I... The only fans you just launch. That's the only fans that's coming, all right? We'll get on that sooner, rather than later. Yeah, I'm in a mixed mood because I like the fact that Gunther Steiner and Hass have done this ahead of time, so we get to talk about it. So that's the positive. The negative is it has somewhat undone the schedule I did a couple of days ago,

which annoys me a little bit. But the positive does outweigh the negative in this scenario. I agree. I mean, I think, I don't know if Harry has caught up, but I think we're all very well prepped for topic two. I'd say a good 66% of us are prepped for topic two. 66% is more than no percent. And that's what most things are.

I'll let you work out who is. It's definitely me. You are the 66% of you. Ben. Oh, beer of breaking late. It's going to be fun. Yeah, that's coming up at some point as well. But we'll get on with the serious stuff before we get there.

F1 higher and lower is making an appearance later on in the show. Logan Sargent's comments about the gap between F1 and F2 being a little bit too large. What was going to be the primary topic for today, which is our top five most underrated drivers in F1 history. We'll see what our lists look like a little bit later on, because that has been usurped by Gunter Steiner and Humber. Hass because he doesn't fancy anymore or maybe Hass don't fancy him anymore. We don't really know. He has departed. Does that mean he's been fired? Maybe. Does that mean he's left on his own

volition? Maybe. Remains to be seen. But what we do know is he's gone, which is first time in 10 years. I mean, he's been their only team principle. He's been there 10 years. And it seems as if a disagreement in the long-term strategy of Hass between Gunter-Steiner and upper management has forced this change. So Sam Gunterstina obviously has become got a bit of a cult following. He's become a big personality within the world of Formula One, but leaving that to one side and looking at him from a performance

perspective, do you think this is fair enough? I think it's late, if anything. I think this is come far later than it ever should have done. And their most successful year in Formula One, it came in 2018 where they finished fifth in the championship. They've had, what, I think eight or nine drivers across their entire time here. And none of them have particularly excelled.

The staff don't seem to be fully... Sorry? Gutierrez. That's correct, yes. He did drive... He excelled? He got a point on something, didn't he? Great.

I feel like this interruption is really worth it. I will not have one of Toto Wolves' henchman, Estabon Gutierrez. He's slanded like this. Okay, folks, we're going to let Ben get angry about Espan Gutierrez on his own in the corner while I carry on with my points. Haast as a unit when they arrived in Formula One haven't provided anything other than hilarious entertainment at laughing at their downfall and their failure.

I mean, let's not remember the... Let's not remember the... Let's not remember. Honestly, three beers would do that to you. Yeah. It might be better not to remember, to be honest. Because I was going to bring up the Australia pit stops that happen when they were on for an absolute cracking result

and they manage to actually muck up both cars in one single Grand Prix. And the only thing that Gunter has really delivered is DTS performances. Yes, he's a star of the screen. but is he a star of the track? No, I don't think Hars have gone to achieve anything. And every year that they've struggled, have they come back with a new philosophy, have they come back with something that excels?

Have they made the jump that someone like Ascom Martin have made? Have they made the slow performance up the grid that Williams have made? No, they've done neither. And they have sat in the back three teams and something like eight of their 10 years that they've existed in Formula One. And Hasse as a brand are solely relying on

Gunter Steyner for leading that point of view. drivers are mediocre, average at best. The engineering doesn't supply anything special. The branding is dull and boring. Jing Haas apparently doesn't exist unless he's on the other end of a phone. He might be the banker, for all I know, because he says the same amount in Formula One. If anyone knows you know. Well, I don't want to reveal.

But Jing Haas could be the banker, Hall of Famer. And Gunther Steiner is the face of all that calamity. And honestly, it's like being the front man for a comedy road show that delivers jokes and nothing else. because their performances have been lackluster. They haven't achieved. And when you talk about bringing value to Formula One, when you talk about keeping sports, sporting teams like Andretti out,

brands like a dretti and having to challenge the likes of Audi, and Haas are parading around like there's some kind of big show in the sport. It's a walking joke. It's hilarious. So, yeah, good to Stangas should have gone years ago. I know that he's got a cult following. I know that a lot of you listening think he's hilarious.

And he is hilarious because that means he should be a team boss of a Formula One sporting team, bloody hell no, get him out of there. Let him do his own cooking show around Italy or something because that I would watch, it would be fantastic. But to watch him run a Formula One team, he's achieving nothing. And if Othmar couldn't get to 100 races,

I don't know how good to us. Hey, maybe Othma finishes the job here at Hasse, picks up at race 41 and sees them through to a victory in a few years time. He's got too much babysitting to go. And he hires for Alonzo and Oscipiastri. Got him. Full circle. Harry, what did you make of this breaking news?

Questioning the 10-year thing? Because... It's not 10 years. Because it said that on BBC Sport, I think, but... 2016 is their first year. It's not 10 years. Anyway. I wasn't questioning you, Ben,

because I've seen it elsewhere. But... It's 8 years. How many years is it? You just said 9 or 8 years. It's 8. I've just worked it out. It's 8. Okay.

It's 8. Kirstie's now saying 10 again. Where are you getting 10 from, K, K, K, dog? What is you getting 10 from? Yeah, it started 2012. Do you know what? This is a grey area

and this is what I'd like to continue talking about not the fact that he's gone. Like their grey livery. Dull, fraudulent. I trusted the BBC on this. That was a mistake. Anyway. Okay, team inception started 2014.

Thank you, BBC. You haven't let me down. That is weak. I'm not accepting it. Sorry. Harry disagree. I also agree. Me and Harry are together on this.

Good news. I disagree with the BBC. Correct. Anyway, I also agree again with you about, I think we said this before. It felt like if anyone else was running that team, they'd have been gone a long time ago. Long time ago.

Yeah. As you've already mentioned, Otmar, didn't get a year and a half and he got the boot. He was halfway up the bloody grid in comparison to half. Yeah, so this is, I guess, unsurprising. The timing of it is surprising because, you know, testing's actually not that far away now. The season isn't that far away.

It's six weeks. It's technically next month. Yeah. Testing is a month away. Also, something that I've either completely forgot about or didn't even know about. First two races are on Saturdays this year. Yes, they are. But yeah, the timing of it is very odd because we're not that far away.

And I guess, as it's already been mentioned, they've already confirmed the replacement, whose name has already escaped me. Oh, God. That one. whose pronunciation gets me every time. He used to be Grojean's race engineer. Is that that guy? I don't know if he was ever Grosjohn's engineer.

He was the technical director or whatever his role was specifically. So he's moved up. Confirmed. It's not a new person. It'll be within the team. So I guess that's less of a shift. But yeah, the timing is not ideal.

It feels like they all came back from Christmas and then, don't know, looked at the car or put it in the sim. As far as I'm aware, Gunter-Steiner's contract ended at the end of 2023, and it was just a case of they didn't renew it. He didn't renew it, they didn't renew it, so he's gone. It's not like, in that sense, it's not a firing. It's more just the contract ran out, and that's that.

I don't know whether there was confidence from both sides that a deal was going to be had, and it just never happened. I don't know. It's the most harsh way to fire someone ever. to basically forget on both sides that a contract renewal is required. I guess they didn't forget. Someone sneakily said, I'm not going to set up the reminder on the calendar alert system.

Sure. That's how I feel it's happened. Just a bit run-through of Kamatsu, just so everyone's aware. He began his career for BAR in 2003. He started with the brackity of two seasons and moved to Renaud in 2006. Then he worked at drivers as Nelson P.K. Jr., Roman Grosjev of Italy Petrov. And then some time moved on, which I'm not getting on really quickly, because it's a lot to do.

After being at Lotus, he then departed Lotus with Grosjeun and moved to Huss, where he became the trackside engineering director. Well, if he was at Renault and 06, they were pretty good then. So I'm going to call that one. He's had a relatively okay career, yeah. Great. Hasse's going to win, then. He's only got a month. That's fine.

Well, the point was there, if, as you say, it wasn't a firing, it was a non-renew. maybe they've known about this behind the scenes for a while because they didn't just decide this today. So maybe this is not quite as, the timing's not quite as odd as it seems. But yeah, to announce it at this point is a bit strange. Any other Formula One team,

if they're going on it for a while, we've gone before the end of the season, this would be his last season. We're seeing him out of the bang, you know, well done him. And they've made of the change before. Franz toast. Right?

There's a literally example on the plate. French toast has been served up warm for you. off, he's not staying. To demonstrate what's going on. And they haven't done the same for Gunther at Haas, which tells me either something went wrong

or they forgot. Good. Well, Sam's saying that they forgot. So that's it. They are fraudulent. Did that mean they forget things? Oh, I don't know. Pretend.

I mean, there's not even much point to me adding on to that because that's the definitive answer. They forgot. But I'll give it a go anyway. Before I say what I think on I do have to say with the lay breaking awards that we hand out in the December of every year, I do think we need a new category, which is the Slow News Award,

which is awarded to someone who in January really helps us out. So, you know, Lewis Hamilton's contract situation probably would have won it a couple of years ago. Ben Sulean probably would have won it last year. This year maybe Hass won it. Just really helping us out with the content. So we appreciate it, Hassan Gunter-Steiner. We really do. I need to win something.

Well, exactly. There's always a first for winning, I guess. But what do I think about this? So whilst I agree with some of the points that you make, I think I liken this situation to your house being on fire. Good. And you've decided to act by throwing out a bit of cheese that you think might be mouldy. Now, maybe you're right.

Maybe the cheese is. mouldy and it deserves to go, maybe you're wrong and the cheese is actually okay and it deserves to stay. But it doesn't matter because your house is on fire and the cheese isn't contributing to that. I weirdly understand everything he's just said. That is odd isn't it? I'm morphing into Sam with food analogies. I'm majestic. I think you could put anyone in that position and they wouldn't have done much better. I think the issue comes further up the top from Gunter Steiner. I think if you honestly put Ross Braun in that position, put Toto Wolf in that position, put Christian Horner in that position.

I don't think that team gets better than eighth last season. Like maybe they do a bit better with a better team principle. I'm not here saying that Gunter Steiner was great at his job or even good at his job. The point is, I don't know because Haas have this weird obsession with thinking that they can compete despite not investing anywhere near as much as their rivals. And as much as I hate to admit it, My good friend Sam Say has called this team impostors for a long, long time. And with every passing day, he's more and more correct.

They are absolute impostors. They have the gall as well to turn around at new potential teams and ask, are you bringing in any value? Where are you bringing in the value yourself, Hass? Come on. I don't think Gunter Steiner, which is a weird thing to say, given he was in his role for somewhere between two months and 10 years that we can't decide. It's a weird thing to say

I don't think he ever got a fair shot and you're probably thinking how on earth can someone be in a position for that long and not get a good shot? But honestly, if you enter someone into a jousting competition for 10 straight years and give them a harry bow as a weapon,

you would still think after 10 years they haven't been given a good shot because they haven't. Honestly, Gunterstein, a good boss, bad boss, I don't know. And quite honestly, I don't care. I think best of luck to the new team that are going to come in and do their best here. But until Hasse realize that F1 is a numbers and a money game and Gene Hasse's wallet is the

determining factor on whether they can compete or not, they aren't getting it anywhere, regardless of who's in that position, who's in the driver position, who's in the technical director position, doesn't matter. It comes higher up than Steiner, I think. I think you make some really good points. there are some levels that I disagree with you on, but what your analogy, sir, because they were sublime. Wow.

You know, really were fantastic. The Harry-Bow one really got me. But I do think that a real leader has the ability to see the weakness within his team and do something about it. And, you know, Gunt has been there long enough now that he had to have stemmed the tide a little bit.

They have barely achieved better than eighth place more than once across eight years. years of actual racing and they of course have had 10 years of good to leading that team before even joining the Formula One team if we're believing this inception in 2014 team principle nonsense. No, good. But my point here is it comes from the top down and whilst the money comes out of Gene Haast's pocket, their advertising has been appalling. They barely had a title sponsor that's been, you know, reputable at all. Rich energy were a part of that team once upon a time. it tells me time and time again that from the top down which Gunter is a part of,

that there is an intrinsic weakness of understanding where strengths lie and where weaknesses lie and which direction you should be following. You barely hear of changes within the team. The drivers are safe but dull. The team livery alone is safe but dull. And I just think that realistically, whilst Gunter, of course, has not had an arsenal of cash at his disposal, I do think Christian Horner, Toto Wolf, Braun would have been able to have pinpointed more weaknesses than Gunter and have pulled out over eight years of racing, a more consistent and decent racing team. This absolute heap of poo in a bin bag that apparently calls itself a Formula One team that traips itself around all these grigs.

It's an embarrassment, this racing team. They've done nothing more than be at the back of the grig for eight years. time after time after time, and Gunter is incredibly responsible for those performances. All Gene Haast does supply the cash, and there are other ways to make cash. It's not just out of jeans pocket. He has been not good enough. Eight years, more than long enough in that role. Get him gone.

Three beersamers and Aggie Sam. Correct. Special thing it's about Haas. I'm getting my Jews, all right? I've been going on about this a long time. It's rolling. Here we go. One that slipped under the radar today, given the Gunter-Steanyu's use, is also

Simone de Restes also left, Has, I saw that earlier. Yeah. Yep. It's all go wrong. It's Ferrari, right? Yeah. Well, they need it as well, so they need help.

That, I mean, bouncing between those two teams. Oh, well dear. It's not often we give credits of Ferrari. But even, you know, even in Ferrari's down years and when they're not performing as they should do, they're still, they might not be doing it very efficiently, but they're piling in the cash.

that they are doing their utmost to get to where they need to be. And that can be applied for Red Bull, for Mercedes, for McLaren, these other teams that, you know, they all have these down spells. But, you know, McLaren is a good example because even when they were having a poor time beginning of last season, we could see the changes they were trying to implement. Like even if things weren't going well, but you could see the efforts made to try and make something happen. That's my main problem with Hass is that there's just nothing structural that

changes year after year. And the one time, like, drive a lineup wise, they try to do something different in terms of two rookies. They just go back on themselves. It's just a case of doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. And like I say, do I think Stein is a good team principle or not? My point is, I don't know.

And I just don't know if anyone would have done a better job than that. I appreciate that Hasse as a brand has not evolved as it should do. And I think some of that does fall on good to Steiner. I do also think some of that stands with Gene Hasse, though, when you're looking at title sponsors, title sponsors don't necessarily go for losers. And if you're a loser in F1, it's probably because not enough money is being put into you,

which is definitely what Hasse's problem has been. So I'd still think more often than not it goes back to the very top. But yeah, I'd take on board your points about Steiner as well. Anyway, let's see a change in Hasse. Because I don't want to go another year calling on Impostas. I'd rather see them... I quite enjoy it. I would rather see them put every ounce of sweat and blood they can

into being a success and failing, but knowing that they have tried constantly than what other this rodeo that they've got going on there has been. Because I guess it's a bit of a joke, personally. Harry, what are your thoughts on the supposed, you know, difference in opinion of the long-term strategy of Hass? Is this a case of Gunterstststor? has a certain ambition that

Jean Haas is not willing to pay for. Is it Gene Has has this ambition that Gunter Steiner thinks you need to pay more otherwise that's not achievable? Is it the Gunterstiner is not the man for it? What do you think the reason for this disagreement is?

If you look at the direction they've taken Huss in there, between eight and ten years. Two months, 12 years. I think it's 25. 10 year life. They've had two directions. So, well, you know, that they've taken lots of parts, they got

to get lots of parts from Ferrari, although I think that's decreasing. In their first phase, you know, 2016, 17, and I'm thinking particularly 18, when obviously the car was actually okay for a bit, and 19, it was almost like a carbon copy of the, of the Ferrari, and

that was their, that was their whole strategy. It should have been forced when in the 18. Exactly. It almost worked. It didn't work. And, you know, if they had finished fourth, who knows where they could, were that extra money, who knows where they could have gone. But that strategy didn't pay off. So then they went for the different, we'll bank it all on the 2022 reg strategy,

been off 2021, we'll come back and do it properly ourselves. And that's gone equally as bad. It's like they were working on Play-Doh or something. So the problem is, we don't know. We're not on the inside. We don't know whose strategy that was. I'm again, I'm still back that Gunter, it was time for Gunter to go. But you're right, Ben, in that it's such a messed up way of managing a team because I think

it's clear that he would have wanted, he's been around the block as Gunter. He used to work for Red Bull and Janko way back in the day. So he does know, he knows F1 more than Gene Has does. He's an engineer, right, at half? Yeah. And that's what worries me, because that's their biggest weakness. engineering transformation. But my point is,

um, there's clearly a disagreement in how they want a team to go. It seems like Gene wants to carry on as they, well, it doesn't seem like that. I'm assuming. Gene wants to carry on as they are in terms of he doesn't have to spend more money on it. And I guess he spent quite a bit, but still not enough.

Whereas I would imagine Stein is saying, no, you need to do, we need to do something different or pour more money into it or hire different people, etc. and they're a big old fallout. No, I don't know that. That's libelous. I don't know that's true. Well, they forgot.

Libelus Ede. That's what they call them on the streets. Ellie. Well, we'll end with libel. I think that's the appropriate place to end this first segment. I'm sure there will be more fallout from this news in future episodes. But after the break, we're going to be taking a look at our top five most underrated drivers in F1 history.

Five. Does it work, does it? No, keep it to three. Okay, something a little bit different on this episode of the podcast because we're going to go through our top five most underrated F1 drivers ever. And we have no idea what each of our three lists look like. Well, I think we know what our own list looks like. But I don't think we know what each other's lists look like.

So I'm interested to see, do we have any. agreement, or do we have a lot of disagreement? And just to say, we're going to do top five overrated on an upcoming Patreon episode. So if you enjoy this segment, make sure you get over to Patreon. And at some point later in the month, we'll do our top five most overrated. So, Sam, I'm going to give you the honours. Three beers, five drivers. What have you got? Oh, this sounds like a great podcast. If we knew five drivers. Yeah, we can get the beers sorted. And have three beers. I don't go through,

meas. Okay, in at 5, that's how I come doing the top 40 of the radio show. Sure. In at 5. I've got Chris Damon in the fifth place

as the fifth most underrated driver on my list of all time. I've done a little note section for each one here. I've said here that he was incredibly fast and incredibly unlucky. He never managed to win a race and only had 11 podiums

and yet so many people at the time thought he could go on to greatness, even possibly winning championships. Yeah, I think a lot of people, especially today, newer fans, you have maybe arrived in the last 10 years, barely, I've even heard of Chris Heyman. Before, you know, Chris Aeman was a classic pre-DTS driver.

You've been fake fans. No, but I said 10 years here, I do think, you know, and it's okay that, you know, you maybe haven't gone back and learned. But anyway, starting 19 of his 96 races from the front row, five of those from pole, is driving was sensational. And Degretti once said, he's so unlucky that if Chris, If Chris Hamer became an undertaker, people would stop dying.

It says a lot. It says a lot. It's a great quote. That's one of my favorites. So, yeah, in a five, Chris Amel is my fifth most, like a great driver. He was a sensational talent. He just never managed to actually achieve anything. Question, do we have to do these in an order?

I've got them in order, but I don't care if you do. We do. Ben says yes, so yes, the boss man I suggest. Second question, and more a point I need to raise. I currently have 12 drivers on my list. What? Why have you got 12? Stop at 5?

No, no, but I was just writing them down and then I haven't narrowed them down yet, so I'll work on that. Why are we so bad at numbers? We don't know how long interstein has been at Hasse. It's a real weakness. We can't count to 5. It's a real problem.

Well, you can count to 5, Ben, we just don't stop. Oh, yeah, that's the problem. We get to 5, but there's no stopping at 5. Ain't no stopping us now. Okay. Do you want to... How are we going to do this? We're going to 5-5-5?

Or... I thought we do 5-5. 55, but sure. I'm happy to do that. Ben, why don't you go and let Harry have a minute to work out everything six and below? I don't have an order to put them in. I value them equally as underrated. Fine.

Just going to put that one out there now. Ben, you can still go. So on the fence all the time. I'll be crushing. I'll buzz in some of your answers because they've got me. Okay. Firstly, Chris Aymann is a great show. He didn't quite make it to my list, but he absolutely was in contention.

I think that's a very good show. Number five for me is Alan Prost, four-time champion, although it should be said that he did score more points than at the centre in 1988, but due to a rule that was in place back then, you only took your X number of results forward into the championship consideration. So Senna won the championship that year. But some of the stats around how close he was to winning more than five is ridiculous. He was 12 and a half points,

which back then is the equivalent of about a first and a fourth, that's how close he was to being an eight-time champion. And he was 29 and a half points. Again, that's about three wins from being a 10-time world champion. He was in championship contention nearly every year of his career. In fact, he was top five in the championship in every year apart from his debut season at McLaren. And he might well have the greatest list of,

teammates ever. At least if you're looking at range, you've got John Watson, five-time race winner. You've got René Arnoux, he's a seven-time race winner. Eddie Cheever, Eddie Cheever's the weakest teammate he had. He had like nine podium. Louder, three-time world champion, Kecki Rosberg, world champion, you're handsome, one of the best drivers, never to win a race. Senna, Mansell, they both speak for themselves, lazy, and then Damon Hill, another world champion. So that's, That's five champions, either future or past, that he competed against as teammates. And all of his teammates combined had 137 wins. He always had it tough against teammates.

And he always performed against them. So I think even though he is regarded as a top 10 driver and one of the best, I still think he's a little bit underrated. I completely agree with you. He was actually sixth on my list, Ben. And that stat or that opinion of he has the hardest list of teammates of all time, I completely agree with. I did that history episode about Sanger and Prost.

I actually found it incredibly remarkable just how good Prost actually is and doesn't get talked about enough because people love the culture and the atmosphere and obviously the tragedy around Senga, but I think Prost was almost a bit of a victim of the sad loss of Senga that he kind of gets overlooked a little bit

because of what happened. As tragic as it was, Sanger was phenomenal. He was so good. And what are they calling the, what was it the professor is his nickname? because he's just so calculated with every single thing that he did, such an intelligent driver, even to the point of taking Sengar off, of course, in Suzuki,

was a calculating move. He's brilliant. It's absolutely phenomenal. Who's in at 12, Harry? In a number five or number one or two, three or four. Good. I've gone for Nico Rosberg. Nice one.

He always get, look, I know he's only one time, one time champ. One time. The man gets overlooked. so often. First off, and I know Schumacher wasn't at the peak of his powers when he came back in 2010, but he still was a seven-time world champ. And Rosberg saw him off in every season.

They were teammates together. And then he was like, oh, thank God that's done. And then they get Lewis Hampton, who I guess at that point was only a one-time champ. Bag of big, bag a bum. But still a tough teammate. And Rosberg gave him a run. Every year they were teammates.

And in 16, obviously, he beat him. But there were, I think we look at it now, it's easier to see it now than we did then. I think you see what happened to Hamilton after Rosberg retired and where Hamilton went on in his success. You think, oh, yeah. And also how Valtrey Bottas struggled to match Hamilton in the same way, you go, oh, wait.

With Rosberg and Hamilton in those dominant Mercedes years, it was rare that we had a weekend where they weren't battling each other. Within five seconds. Yeah, they weren't next to each other on. track. And I think maybe we didn't appreciate that enough. So yeah, Rosberg for me, who knows, I'm not saying he would have won more championships, because obviously Hamilton still would have been around. And as I mentioned, he went on for the phenomenal run of success after, from 2017 onwards. But Rosberg still would have picked up wins, definitely, if he'd suck around. So yeah,

Nico Rosberg for me. I'm not going to comment too much because he might be appearing on someone's list later on. And I don't want to sound like a broken record player. Tasty. Well, you're going to have two broken record players because at number four, I've got Nika Rosberg. There we go. Yeah, I won't add too much to this

because I agree entirely with Harry's points. But just to add a few things in. Lewis Hamilton, many people view him as the greatest qualifier of all time. And if you don't, you think he's one of the best qualifiers of all time. In their times together at Sades, Lewis Hamilton beat Nika Rosberg in qualifying 42 to 36. Not much in it. Not much in it over the course of four years.

And I would just say as well, I know Harry you've questioned how many he could have gone on to win, and I think it's a valid question. I'd almost go back in time. I'd love to have seen Nica Rosberg in a genuine contender of a car in like 2010, 2011, 2012. I think he'd have been in the mix. It's 2010 year, I don't think this is his best year at Mercedes.

It might be. But that car didn't deserve to be on podium. And he got it on the podium a couple, couple times maybe that year. Yeah, he was sensational. So, yeah, I won't say anymore because the rest of my points are very closely related to what Harry said. Who's number four for you, Sam? I've gone for Crazy Giannalee. Nice.

In it number four? I'm a fan. We all know I'm a fan. But I do think this guy is one of those drivers that had. such raw potential and aggressive driving style that if he had been in the right car and made maybe better decisions, it kind of has echoes of Fernando also of moving to the wrong place at the wrong time and not getting any further success. I've got some notes here that said, you know, he won his first Grand Prix in Canada. His raw pace and aggressive style were fantastic to watch,

but he turned down that dominant Williams drive for a appalling Ferrari at the time. And I know obviously driving a Ferrari, any Ferrari is an honour, but it possibly could have been a world champion in that Williams. And the second time around, he gets off of a Cook Ferrari seat and goes for Prost GP. And as much as the driver himself was phenomenal, that car was absolutely atrocious. It was one of the worst cars we've seen of the era.

I just think he's one of those drivers that if history altered its path by like a degree, I think a lazy could be a multiple race win, possibly a world champion. I just don't think people who maybe again are new to Formula One I haven't learned

about the 90s and the late 80s have learned just how quick and how aggressive and strong a lazy was behind the wheel

just think he was incredibly unlucky again a lot like Chris Ayman and that's why I think he's underrated is just he dig so well

in cars that were just so, so bad and should have been at the front I really do think he should be fighting at the front for a lot of his career.

He is maybe exhibit A when it comes to how quickly and how close things can be to being completely different. Because as you said, I mean, he won and Canada, it was only race win. And I think a one-time race winner could have easily been a world champion with that one move that he went in a different direction for. Number four, who's also one, two, three and five for you, Harry. Good, Harry. You welcome. I've gone for Martin Brando.

Oh yeah, good shout. Martin Brandl, for those of you, I don't know. Used to be a racing driver. Very good one. Again, a similar vein, I guess, to Lacey. I'm not saying Martin would be world champion. But before F1, he was in F3 with Ettencena and battled him to the championship.

There's a historic episode on those two as well. Nice. And then they both ended up in F1 together. They both were also backmarker team. Senor and Tolman. Bruntle in a Legerald. That's the one. And then from there, he sort of

just had a series of not amazing teams. His best shot, or his best chance, was in the Benetton in 1992, where his partner was Schumacher. And he didn't beat Schumacher, but I don't think he disgraced himself, but Flavio Britori still fired him.

Chishap. Compared to some of the other teammates, Schumacher. And I think that, and I'm pretty sure read the sport that Flavio the next year in 93 because he retired, he hired an aged Ricardo Petrazi to replace Brondel and then Petraezy was awful in 93. And he was like, oh, Martin, mate. What have I done? I've made a mistake. Oh, I've fallen.

Hang, I cannot get up. Verbatim there from Flavio Brito. Yeah. Yeah, so I think he was treated cruelly in that one because I think he should have stayed at Ben-on-ton and, you know, given where Ben-Otleton, ended up 93 and then into 94 probably would have picked up a win, I guess, which alluded in this whole career.

It did end up at McLaren in 94, but then it was powered by a Pojo engine. Pojoe-Maclaren, a weird combination. Which was terrible. That's Peugeot for anyone that doesn't speak Cornish. Projo. Yeah, and then after that wasn't much better,

he ended up in, then it was Lijia in 95, 96 ended up in a Jordan, that famous Australia crash. But he just, he needs, never ended up with a good seat. But he went off and did other, like, sports guy racing, Le Manson won that. But never ended up with a great F1 seat. And I think what could have been?

Again, I'm not, I don't know whether he'd say world champion material, but in a, in a different life, in a different universe, he's, I can see him winning multiple, multiple races. Because I think he had the talent, but it just never, never happened. No, his junior career was phenomenal. And he went toe to toe with Sena. And I think Sena went on record and said that Bruner was one of the fiercest appointments he ever actually went up again. through his career to get into Formula One. And also, if I'm not incorrect, Ben, you might be able to correct me here. He suffered quite a severe injury.

And it meant that a lot of the time he was had on his leg. And a lot of the time he was driving the car with one leg or a lot of drivers at the time were driving it with both feet, whereas he was having to juggle it with one foot because of damage to his left leg. Yeah, himself, of course. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's going to hinder your pace, isn't it, right?

When you're having to do something that every other driver isn't. I'm not saying that changes your whole career maybe, but it's still something you've got to get over and he did. He was a really phenomenal driver. Number three, Sam. Let me pull up the list. I'm sorry. I'm really sorry. You've not done any number four, but... Yeah, he's yours.

My number four was Nika Rosberg. Oh, yeah. Sorry. I was apologising because I didn't do the intro right. Three! Because echoing. Lovely. Anyway, sorry, folks. Sorry for headphone users. I'm sure that is always awful.

Third place, I've got Carlos Reuters. It's a great show. And I'm not going to keep it too long, but just a little tidbit of Roystman. 1981, he went into the final race one, one point clear of Pek. His gearbox failed on the second lap,

only the second lap. He did the whole race missing fourth gear, falling back through the pack. PK managed to hang on to fifth place, which I think at the time gave him two points, which meant come the end of the race, he won the championship by one point. Royterman, of course,

never actually ending up winning a championship. but he is third on the all-time list of drivers who have won races and not championships. I think 12 race wings to his name. And back in the early 80s, that was a phenomenal amount of wings who would have taken without picking up a championship. The guy was a machine

and he's really unlucky to have not picked up championships, that alone more race wins than that. So, yeah, Reuters sits third on my list. Another one where race for Ferrari and Lotus at the wrong times. Yeah. in that, you know, Ferrari won the championship were louder in 75,

nearly did in 76, and then did again in 77, and then Andretti wins the championship for Lotus in 78. He raced for both of those teams in the 70s, just never the right year. And like you say, Williams very nearly pulled it off in 81. But yeah, I think that's a good challenge. Again, that was another one that nearly made my list.

Number three from you, Harry Ead. One or two or four or five. Who knows? Um, wow me up so much. Honestly. Honestly. Even I've got a proper list together with notes.

Um, number, whatever, I'm going for Robert Kibitzer, Bobby K. Bobby K. Um, we are all aware of why his career was,

well, F1 career was cut shorter than normal. He obviously came back in 2019, but it wasn't the same with Williams. But Robert Kibitzer was, was, you know, in those late noughties,

early teenies, he was, He was on fire. That driver was on, and he was a hot property, and who knows where he could have gone. I know he was, you know,

only with Lotus or Renault, whatever we were calling it then, before his accident in 2011. But I'm sure he would have been, there was always rumours about him being linked to Ferrari. Yeah, Hevel. And, you know,

I could have seen that happening, whether that would have actually resulted in anything. I don't know. But, yeah, Robert Kibitz, I still maintain he could have, maybe should have won the 2000. late World Championship if BMW actually kept developing their car. Cheers BMW.

But he obviously took that win in 2008 in Canada. Big massive wallies. That's them. That's them. Good Lord. Begg was packing for a minute. We all were. No.

Not at all. But yeah. Robby Kibitz, he, I just, I feel like it's forgotten how much of a little superstar he was when he rocked up. Because he only rocked up in 06. It was similar time to when Hamilton and Co joined and Vettel. And yeah, he was a part of that group, that Hamilton Vettel group,

and I think he would have gone on and been in those, you know, those championship battles away obviously didn't happen, but maybe like 2010, 11, that sort of that sort of era. So, yeah, it's something going for. The insurgents of Hamilton, Rosberg, Vettel, Cubitsa, all arriving within the space of 24 months of each other might be one of the golden generations we've ever seen in Formula One. That is a phenomenal pool of talent.

it's a good grief. You have that from time to time, don't you? You have like, Reichen and Alonzo, Montoya, stretch. And then you've got that stretch. And then I think we'll see in years to come. Norris, Russell, LeCler.

That might be the next one. Yeah. Bobby Kay, great shout, though. And he, that black and yellow Renault is like imprinting into my mind as Bobby Kay. And that's probably, I don't know, she'd mention this. His 2010 season in that Renault, he was phenomenal. Like he was making it do things it shouldn't have done.

Yeah. I would argue. We were doing underrated seasons. Yes. That would have been right up there. I would argue he might be one of the fastest drivers to have been cut short that we've ever seen in Formula One. Yeah. He was phenomenally good.

Third from me, I've got Dan Gurney. So we're going back to the 60s for this one. Actually, I mean, he debuted in 1959, but is more competed in the 1960s. won a race for Porsche in 1962. And he competed very well, very early on in the sport. He was at Ferrari in 1959, competed against Phil Hill and Tony Brooks. Phil Hill were future world champion at that point.

Tony Brooks, multiple-time race winner, competed very well against them as a rookie. This is what got me, got him the nod for me, though. He moves to Brabham in 1963. Of course, at the time, Jack Brabham was owner and driver for the team. he beat Jack Brabham in 1963. He beat Jack Brabham in his own team at 1964. He did it again, three years in a row in 1965.

What happens in 1966? Dan Gurney goes off and makes his own team, Eagle. Jack Brabham wins the championship for his own team. If Dan Gurney had stuck around one more season, based on the three before it, he'd have been in with a very good shot of winning that title. I think this is an instance where, and he never really got close again after that.

Eagle just never really took off in the way that he would have wanted it to, like obviously Brabham did and maybe McLaren later did. But, yeah, Dan Gurney for me, was one of the best drivers of the 1960s that can never quite get there. And I think most of it is just based on him leaving Brabham at the wrong time. And he invented the Gurney flap. And he invented the Gurney flap. Maybe his biggest claim to fame.

I think it is because they still use. them now. What a guy. This, Dan. What a gurney. I'll tell you what we're going to do. We're going to take a short break and then on the other side, we'll round off our list with second and first.

We've been four thousand. We've been waffling on for ages. I know. We've got so much to get through yet. I might have to cut something, I reckon. Sorry, guys. Yeah. Okay, let's finish off our lists.

Number two, that's also one. Three, four, four, and five. Harry. I've gone for Jankala Fizzichella. I think it's a brilliant show. All right. It's almost on my list.

Fizzy. Yeah. Pretty eighth or ninth on mine. Yeah, Fisichella, he obviously picked up a couple of wins in his career and he,

and you know, Fernando Alonso did him over. He loves fresh air. Quite, yeah, and obviously the famous defending fresh air in Sizu Kro 5. But Fizzy was mightily quick.

And again, just maybe not in the right teams of the right time. time. He was in the Benetton. He started in Jordan. He started in Jordan slash Benetton in early days. Benetton became Renaud, but then he went off to Jordan again. Then he was a salver for a year. He just dotted around those sorts of teams. Obviously, went back to Renno when they came good in 05 and 06, which obviously helped him to some wins. Not forgetting his 03 win in Brazil. Yeah, with it in a Jordan. But then, you know, and after Alonzo left it, he sort

of assumed team leader at Renault for 07. But unfortunately, car was crap. Terrible. Then he went off to force India. Car was also pretty bad, apart from one race in 2009. Yeah. And then he finished off his career by signing for Ferrari,

which as an Italian at the tail end of the career, you can't say no to. He's had a great time in the endurance racing. He's, and he's made a good career off the back of it, to be fair. Good for him. But yeah, again, just never really, it just never

really happened and I also loved it if in any interview say oh Giancala how was he race for you and he go I'm not very happy I'm not very happy I'm very happy

my dad used to do that to me all the time and as a kid I did not understand where that was coming from is your dad Giancala Physical yes my dad is she goes shock Daddy Physi Daddy Physi Sam Sage is a pseudonym Also I think you probably could have one

is it 98 Belgium with the huge implosion at the start. And obviously, Dill was like, it's got to stay behind me because if he tries to attack me, we might crash in this rain. It's Ralph Schumacher, mate. Ralphie.

Yeah, in mind. We've got the same person. I have a brilliant memory. Fiskela crashed out quite badly in that one. Sorry, Fiskele, we're going to ignore that. You're brilliant. Ralph Schumacher and Fisichella do often quite merge into one person

based on that careers. Both are my dad. I don't know. The problem for me is, I can't. You've already said the clean, the Japan incident where he lost the race. He never should have lost. The other one that's like just implanted in my brain is the one of Canada where his engineer is just exasperated at why he's not quicker. He was also a reno. You can't be this slow gigalo. Why can you go faster? You were so confused about why he was so slow. I don't think I can get that out my brain.

I love that. Number two for you, Sam. A personal favourite of mine slots in number two, and that is Juan Pablo Montoya. Oh, here we go. Yeah, Mr Chunky himself. And it all comes with love. He's large with love.

He won the CART championship and Indy 500 in 2000, then moved to Williams in 2001, of course. And I think when he had that duel with Schumacher, and I won at Monza. and then won the race. I think he really kind of arrived on the scene of Formula One.

Finished third in the championship twice behind those Ferraris. One seven races combined with Williams and McLaren and then left as quick as he arrived in 06, Sting old Montoya. And honestly, I think,

I joke about David Coulthard. I really do think that Juan Pablo Montoya might have been the one person at full pace to take it to shoot me in that period of time. Why are you so angry?

You're full of absolute one. George Michael is full of. absolute wham. Thank you very much. Montoya was a phenomenal talent, and I just think people don't give him the respecting ourselves. Yeah, I mean, I can't disagree with that. I'm a bit of a Montoya fanboy,

so... We love him, yeah. If there's anything I would advise people to do within watching racing, just go watch Montoya in that cart championship year that Sam alludes to. He's just... Guy special. He's a special boy.

I was watching just scrolling through TikTok today or yes no it must be yesterday and it was something came up and this like guy in a junior formula was like oh no like he's a racing driver and he he was like POV when your car breaks down before the start the race it's a coter actually and then it then it cuts to them in the garage and it's like but these legends are helping me out and this is people like you know mechanics getting the car ready and it just pans across and one of them is one Pablo Montoya what a legend I was like why sure it's underrated man I was like, why are you there, Mr. Junkie?

Why is it not there? It's everywhere. Maybe it's more than one of him. Like the Claudia Winkleverse. It's loads of one Pavlopal Montoya. It's going to go. There's so many people's head to listen. No one goes.

Lawy or Winklevers is. Let me go. Something like. Number two from me. The man who be sitteth under a tree. Rick I felt. I've got it. Number two, who might well have been the inspiration for this topic after we talked about how

underrated he was in a recent episode. Some of these names have already come up today. Jean-Alaisey, Kimi Reichenen, Felipe Massa, Mark Weber, Jacques Villeneuve, Robert Kubitsa, Heidfeld, beat all of them across a full season. You would never think it, but Heidfeld beat all of them across a full season. Yeah, he's gone up against some pretty good. driver. So, I mean, between those drivers, I just mentioned, that's six race winners and two world champions. He beat them all. And I know Kubitsa's been given some credit already on this episode,

and very rightly so. Hydefeld beat him three out of the four years. They were teammates. Again, Kubitsa was special and you wouldn't think much of Nick Hydefan because he's just so underrated and just gets on with his job. And you look up at the points table and you're like, oh, damn, all right, Nick, fair play to your son. He just accumulates, points that you don't realize. Again, I would have, my anger for BMW going into 2009, knows, no bounds, you've already referenced this. That championship should have been BMW Salbers, and it could well have been Nick Heidfelds, but they threw it away. Big, massive wallies. I don't disagree. So I've got Nick Heinfeld at two. It's great to see the man who sits under

a tree, get the love he deserves. which brings us on to the number one spot, apart from Harry, it could be number five. Go on, Harry. Rinse and repeat, mate. Nick Heidel. Nick Heidel. Is it really?

It actually is. I'm not saying he's number one. He might be. He might be number two, three or five, four or five. But he's in there. And that's the most important thing. I wouldn't say too much more.

Nick Heidfeld just, yeah. Another unlucky drive. in that he just never had the car to do the, do the business. I think you mentioned Reikening, that 2001 year, because that was both their first year in F1 with Salba. So Salba brought in an all-rooky team for 2001, and everyone, and they're both really young, and everyone was like, what are you doing?

And then they were really good, both of them. Did Heidefeld do a few races in 2000? Well, we might have done on the back end. That's a good point. But I think you're right in full first year. Yeah, anyway, first four year. But you're right. he was more obviously Reichenen stole the headlines but he was more than a match for Reikinen and

yeah man who sits under a tree just unlucky like you say in the same way qubits of what was with the BMW thing so was Heidfeld in that and you're right they should have they should have 1.8 slash they shouldn't have bullsed up 09 and 109 because the amount of money BMW were spending putting into that is unreal but anyway it didn't work out for him he had a of a, bit of a, a patch at Lotus.

Oh yeah, you finished a Lotus, right? Um, where they got rid of him mid-season. They replaced him with Bruno Senna.

Obviously, I don't know. What he doing, mate? Anyway. Lovis did a lot of things wrong. That finished. Oh, no,

then he went to Salbro for a bit after us. He did some, like, odd races. But yeah, that was pretty much it. Anyway, then he goes off to Formula E. It's going to win

the damn opener ever for Formula Re. Oh my God. And Nico Bross. on the last lap assassinations him. Literally goes, not today. If you've not seen it, though it, it's going to Google first formulae race, Nick Heidfeld, Nico Prost.

It's, it's, it's, it's Hydefeld trying to overtake Nico Prost on the last lap. And Nicotprost is just like, nope. It's just murder. And Heifeld ends up in the year. He's fine. But it's dramatic. Oh, I forgot about it.

Nico Prost. He deserves more. Yeah, so like he could have, like he could have won the inaugural, I'm not say, I don't say he'll be champion, but, you know, just misfortune. He deserves it.

Do you know what? It's not on my list. Because I bloody rate him. I think he's sensational. That's why. Fair enough. Yeah. Who is number one on your list, so?

Well, I alluded to it earlier, and there is a driver that I haven't mentioned, who you both have mentioned, and I think the most underrated driver in Formula One is Nico Rosberg. I think the man is phenomenally good at winding everybody up for a start. but he was also bloody brilliant on the racetrack.

He went toe to toe with statistically the two greatest drivers of all time in Formula One. He managed to get a world title. He won multiple races and outclassed and albeit aging Michael Schumacher in his second sting. But if a long-so can drive this quickly in his 40s, then Michael Schumacher can drive that fast in his 40s

and Rosberg demolished him. Score one double the points. Over three seasons out qualified him, 43 to 15. Something you like stats about things over three. seasons. At this one moment, yes. I also really liked the Cubitser and Highfield one over four years, but that's the only two I'm going to allow ever. Moving on quickly, a lot of people forget the Rosberg Leg, most of the 2014 season. I think it was kind of snatched away in Abidabby on the last race.

And then one 2016, which was, yeah, albeit partially due to reliability. But it should be remembered as a driver who regularly beat the two greatest drivers of all time in Formula One, not as a guy that like a title because of a gearbox failure. Also, a lot of people get, obviously, Ayrton's Sennett gets given the name Mr. Monaco and as did Graham Hill. Nick and Rosberg,

what are three times on the bloody bounce? He's so good there. Yeah, unreal. He was, even when he wasn't in a race-frey car, as you both spoke about earlier, I wanted to jump in, but I need to save some ammunition for my point.

He was so good, even in the MIG field cars, even in the cars that weren't regularly race-winning, he always exceeding expectations, so consistent, barely ever bullsed it up. He was great. I had great hair.

Random spontaneous hot take Nico Rosberg Best Monaco driver since Schumacher I don't think you're wrong either It's fair He was very good there Hamilton and Vettel were never

That good Brilliant there No It's not their track The Stappan's only won it twice Yes So he's not capped that off yet So yes I would agree with you entirely

Let's round this off My number one Elio de Angeles going back to the 1980s for this one. So yeah, spent a good time at Lotus

from 1980 through to 1985. He had three teammates or three full-time teammates during that stretch. Mario Andretti,

Nigel Mansell, Ait and Sena. All world champions, all very good. Here's what he did. 1980, he was up against Mario Andretti,

who he beat 13-1. in terms of points, that's pretty good. He then goes up against Nigel Mansell, because Nigel Mansell comes in in 1980 towards the end of the season, and then they do five seasons together as teammates. He beats Nigel Mansell 77 points to 38.

So he essentially has double the amount of points as Mansell has in that team, and he out-qualifies Nigel Mansell, 45-16. Nigel Mansell, who goes on to win a championship, Nigel Mansell, who's seen as a very, very good driver, And the doctor. Annie, and he's a doctor. I can't remember where that's come from now.

We were talking about Dr. Palmer, and I had to guess what driver was the doctor. And I think it was Nigel Mantel. Anyway, did a very good job against Nigel Matzol. And then against Etton Senna, he did a very respectable job in 1985. Senna comes into that team. Senna wins 38 points to 33. Pretty close. So I think if you are regularly beating Nigel Mansell,

beating Mario Andretti and coming very close to beating it in Sena. And of course, the tragic thing about DeAngelis is we don't know exactly what he could have achieved. Obviously, his career was cut short at the beginning of the 1986 season. I think he was only 28 years old when he died. So he had years ahead of him as well. So, yeah, he's my number one. It's great, shout. Yeah, he was in my 12.

You really hedged your bets. Just put every drive. You know what? If I had a top 12, he'd be in it as well. Yeah. Well, that was a great 15 minute chat. I think it was longer than that, wasn't it? I think it might have been, yes.

Just a tad. You know what's underrated? This segment. It's a great segment. I hope so. I've always been wasted a lot of people's times. Oh, should we just do the game and get out of it? Yeah.

I think so. Don't worry, folks. The Logan's, I know everyone's desperate to hear about Logan's thoughts on F1 versus F2. But we will get to that in another episode. That's the hook, I hope. It's thrilling. Yeah, we'll take our last break.

We'll get on to F1 higher or lower after this. I really need a wee. Do you want to go for a wee, mate? Yeah, good to run off. Tell us your fillings. We'll just keep lower or recorded. I'm going for a week. Talk on to yourselves.

Okay, here we go. F1 higher or lower. Is that fast? F1. That's a great job of execution. using the F1 at the end of a song that one. Those two are a league of their own.

It's because you sing them. Very badly. You made the connection. Out of tune. F1, higher or lower, Sam goes up against Harry in this game where there are six questions. Each question has a numeric answer.

If they guess the number correctly, they get two points. Don't up it very often. but they do get two points if that happens. If they don't get it right, the other person has the opportunity to say, whether it's higher or lower than the initial guess. If they're right, they get a point.

But if they're wrong, the person who guessed first gets the point. So, Harry, would you like to kick us off? Not really. Okay. I am relying on your answer being yes. Okay. Yes.

Could get saved with this podcast. You all right? Number four, please. Higher. Five or six, right Michael Schumacher. We've already spoken a little bit about Nika Rosberg's time at Mercedes.

We're going to talk about Michael Schumacher's time at Mercedes. How many points did he get in his three years there? Could you imagine if this was the qualifying record and not the points? I've read it out on the show. That would be quite funny. He got... He got 200.

Exactly. It's a nice round number. It's not right there. I mean, it's not correct, but it would be. really nice if it was. Is it higher or lower than that, Sam? I'm going to go lower. It's correct.

200 was a very good guess because 197. Oh! It's a shak. I know how that feels to be about one off, though. I get that a lot. Yeah, never mind. Which means Sam leads.

What number would you like? I'll have six, please. Number six. and I'm only counting, you'll see what I mean in the moment, I'm only counting Jordan for this, not any team that's followed them. How many podiums did Jordan have? Seven.

They did not have seven podiums. They have higher or lower than that, Harry. They have higher or lower. They had higher. They had higher. You are right. They're 19. That's a lot higher.

19 podium. Holtz be like 11. Why did you say seven then? Well, after I knew it was not that. I thought it was going to be like 11. Seven, but I think it's 11. Tell my brain works. I know I'm wrong, but I'll go with the wrong answer.

The first one came in the Pacific Grand Prix of 1994 when Rubens Barakello got that one. They had six in 1999. That was their best season. And then the last podium Jordan got? Tears. No, US GP-2005. Tiago Montero 2005 USGP

but yes 19 podiums for Jordan overall back to you Harry one good for one please yeah that's all right you can have one

okay so Zandvort as an F1 circuit has had essentially two stints in F1 how many years were there in between their first stint as an F1 circuit host

and the second stint when it returned not that long ago. Some of these questions, honestly. Ranted. Yeah. It's like that mouldy cheese you had to throw out of his house earlier. Their work, because it was on fire. There were 37 years. Why have you got a making educated guess?

That's the aim of the game. That's annoying me, though. Stop playing the game properly. Sorry. It's not 37. Hold on. Let me work out what year that was. So if we take off seven from 2024, that's 2017,

and then about 30 years, that's 1987. So I'm going to say it's higher, more. Tis lower. Why did you work out from 2024? I know. Wasn't it from 2021? Oh. From first time.

That makes sense, isn't it? Listen to the question helps. 37 was again a pretty good guess actually it was it was 35 so that's a lucky mate yeah I feel for you oh dear but this time you do get the point for it well done so we're at 2 1 back to you Sam I'll have number 5 please oh I said that last time do I know no you've got 5

5 is fine well done me so good oh this is a horrible one oh yes to be honest I'm a bit of me these these are all a bit horrible The 2023 Alpine, obviously notoriously amazing car, it was called the A what. Oh my God. Is he having a laugh? Everyone knows this. I don't even know what my staff now and I knew this. So that's what number it's planning changed.

Do you know? Not a clue. Is it one of those weird numbers you got a weird brain bank up there? Okay. How long have... Did they reset it when they were Renault? Did they, when they changed Traupine? Did they start at the A110?

Because that's the car of theirs. I go for the A115. Well, A1... Yeah. I got a clue. No, I just... This is a horrible question. I'm so sorry.

It's not 150. Who's shocked? They're all lower than that, Harry. Put your arm down. Higher. Yeah, it's right. The A523. I actually had the, I had the, I had two, five, four in my head, that's weird.

I had a 190 and now I went 80. Why? Because A15 feels logical because the amount of years that maybe they're kind of being recognizing themselves. Why did you keep doing this? We still wrong again. So why is it the 523? Why is it the 523?

I've got no idea. No idea. Ah, year 23. Fifth year they've been happening. Oh. Oh, that's good. That's a good shout. That'll be why.

Is it fine? They've only been Alpine for three years. Yeah. Alpine. Oh, so close. Don't understand their own understandings. Even though that was wrong, Sam, that was very well foretell. It's not because it's wrong.

23 makes sense. 23. Yeah. Okay. We're at 3-1, so it's either going to be a Harry winner or a draw. I have lost this. We're back to Harry. Number two.

Please. Yeah, this one's horrible as well. Great. How many career points has Fernando Alonzo achieved? Oh, you don't know this? You've got tattooed on you, I'm sure. Changes it every time he races. He's, can you imagine?

He's got... You back again, Harry. Come on. You got a podium again. It was a bad year for me. I got the 15. He's got 1834. It's not 1,800.

34. But is it higher or lower than that, son? That feels like a great guess as well. I'm going to go, it's higher than that. It is a bit higher than that. 2,267. So I don't think that was a bad guess. No, I think the solid's well done, mate.

Only 400 off. It does me. The draw is still on. We're at 3.2 to Harry. Going into question number three. I'll pick number three, me, Lord. This is my favorite record in the history of F1. The 2005 Bahrain GP lap record set by Pedro Del Arosa.

Yeah. How's that still standing? How quick was that lap? 149.0.01. 149. It's a long lap. Yeah, but okay. High, well, it's not higher or lower.

It was quicker or slower. All right. F1, quicker. That's a new game. I'll go for slower. You, sorry, sorry, I was just singing everyone, quick. I didn't mean that. Slow, can I, oh, no, wait.

You say slower? Sorry, I meant, I meant less time, so i.e. quicker. Oh, right. Okay, sure. Sorry, yes, to clarify, quicker. Closer to zero. Yes. He was quicker than a 149.01.

Good. 17 and a half seconds quicker. Yeah, yeah, you know. I didn't know. Sounds being boring. Also, the current lap record is what. one, 127,

isn't it? So it's not too far off. The injurious say, if it had been that circuit. That's what I

thought it was. I did that once. Yeah, but I thought that's the record he yelled. That's why I thought it stood forever.

It is a bit of a weird one how that still stands. There's only, I think there's only one lap record that has lasted longer and I can't even remember all that is,

but it's quite up there. There are a monster one? I know because I was right going to beat that, is there a monster? Someone beat it recently. How does, how was that Bahrain one still?

I can't understand. No. I can't understand it. I feel like there's got to be a reason. I'm going to look it up. Those 2000's cars weren't very fast in comparison than what we have today. And like they didn't, you know, they were last of the V-10s,

but it had a groove tires. They didn't have the downforce they have now. What, did he miss a bit of the track? I don't get it. And no disrespect to Pedro Delarosa, who was very solid. He wasn't even their regular driver. He was standing in for Mr. Junkey,

who had a turn-ins-ins-ins. tennis. Yeah. Dennis injury. Anyway. It's one of the most bizarre records, isn't it? This track has got so many records.

So Pedro Delaroosa is taking it on the 15-turn track, 2005 to present. Outer circuit, which is the 2005 to present was George Russell. That's the 55 second one. That's the one that has

silly little corgars 11. The endurance circuit, 23 corgues, is a long cert 158. The paddock circuit is by Jason. and Bright, he's got 10 turns, and the Oasis in a circuit has got eight turns. And the original

Grand Prix circuit has 15 turns, and that's Michael Schuickr on a 130. Yeah, because I think in 2004, the turn at the top of the hill was like a hairpin. Yeah, and not what it is now, right? Yeah. Oh, that's very good. Well, Pedro, well done. What I'm a G.

Do you remember the whole confusion between Pedro de La Rosa's name and Paul de Rester's name? That's hilarious, isn't it? Yeah, he was presenting. Pedro de Rester There's some similar letters involved Was it? It's been a weird episode

On the Pedro Delorosa front Just final thing here Ben, sorry If anyone wants to have to go on YouTube And search up Pedro Deloresa Driving a Jaguar roadcar At Barcelona Why, what does he do? We'll just go and watch it

Okay, I will That's a beer we're breaking We're doing that next But for everyone else Go and watch it because it's sensational Okay, folks, anyway I thought you were... No, we're getting out of here.

I was going to be the Pitsonia. We're... Oh, is that who I mean? Oh. I don't know if it's the same thing as well. I thought it was Pitsonia. Sorry to normal list because I have tried to end this. We've not even...

We've got one more thing to do. I know. I'm trying to get us on with it. Go on then. LB question of the... That's 2024. Nice. Nice.

Yeah, we're back for 2024. It's the LB question of the week. And our question this time out was, What would be each of our jobs if we worked at the FIA since no one else wants to work there anymore? That's a very good point. Yeah. I was going to kick off with the most like while on Instagram because it deserves it. Young Yosef says, Harry Frederick, Sam, Ian, Ben Anderson.

Got the job done. Ian the cat. Ian the cat, of course. Nothing to do with the FIA. No. Loads of great shouts for things like, so Chris Adams here said, Sam, sausage, Catering, Ben, Sprint Race Coordinator, and Harry the Fernando alongside Rangler, which I would absolutely love.

Matt here said, Sam would be the Angela Cullen to Michael Massey. I don't know what that means. What does it mean? Nope. No idea. Good. Any favourites from you lot? And the blue guitar who says Sam would be the sandwich filling consultant in brackets,

the SFC. That's great. There were a lot of sandwich references. There are a lot of sandwich references. Well, we brought up that upon ourselves. Yes, true. And I'm happy to be known as Sam Sandwich. Doing question of what?

Yeah. That really made me laugh when I read out that Harry would be, oh, I liked this one as well. Harry, this is from Liam. Harry, sandwich filling one, bang, sandwich filling two. Sam, the bread. Hashtag, show me your feelings. Show me your feelings.

I love it. Just having a look on Twitter. Someone did go on about, Harry having to, this is it, Sam will have a sandwich stand with a bang, tell us your fillings. Ben will be in charge of correcting any penalties handed down by the FIA.

He will have a head set on so he can communicate the proper penalty to each team and driver. The FIA headsets will not actually work. Harry will be in charge of testing all the barriers to find the best ones to sit on, which I thought was just fantastic. Sam and Ben would be stewards because they have opinions.

Ben lasts till the Austrian-grown and has to be on leave because of a burnout from the track limits. And Harry on the fence would be race director, perfect for dealing with team bosses and F1. That was from HICO on Twitter. Nice one. Ben, executive of the Sprint Races Elimination Committee. Sam is head of the Culinary Arts Department.

Love that. And I'm a general supervisor of goes around and tells people, what are you doing? Walking up to random people trying to do their job. Toto. No. Why are you doing? I'd pay for you to be in that role.

Obviously, it'll be the most decisive thing you've ever done. Oh my God. Tree Torn. Sam would be the company jester. I would be the company cook, but all I know how to make is gammon or meals in the microwave. And then Ben, I shudder to think what a small amount of authority would do

to this power-hungry Sith Lord. This is something minor mail room. Clark, maybe. Oh, God. I am the FIA. Execute order. FI.A. 69.

Harry will be appointed a skewer. The usual fength sitting makes him a good candidate. Ben will have to go gargingly before being appointed a thing due to his time as intrancy in Principal Alping. And Sam would ultimately be fired for trying to whine and dying with Casillium. Oh, God. Oh, God. Again.

I'm got on that ending. And have a nice time. Why? Dying, have a nice time. This has been going on forever. Can we end? I would love to end this stupid show. Oh, Lord.

I should leave it to you then, Moe. Good. All right, join the Discord. The links in the description. I promise you is a lot more organised in this podcast. Because Bing, you can follow us on social media, late breaking F1.

There are the funny bits available on there, but you can also watch all of this shenanigans on YouTube. Please subscribe. We're trying to hit 10K at some point before a Silverstone Grand Prix occurs. I'm going to take a guess at what year? No, I don't. I think we never said.

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because you're giving us your lovely mullah and we really need it. So thank you to all those that already do support. Got to pay for Ben's Blind. We do. He's getting a customised blind and that is a million dollars. We're about... It's coming in two days. Wee!

Can't wait. That's going to be an hour episode. Reviewing the blind. Right. We're breaking. Let's go. Sunday sorted. I think that'll be it for now. Give us a five-star review

because Harry will be very happy boy. Again, thank you to everyone who has responded to the last plug because we've had some sticking up your butts on there. Hilarious. That's on iTunes. And it was even better because one of them,

the one you said was the title Stick It Up and then the review was Your But. I adore it. Thank you. My favourite moment of the week. So good. That's it for now. Sorry for this mess.

In the meantime, I've been Samuel Sage. I've been Ben Hocking and I've been Daddy Fizzy. Keep breaking late. I love you, Daddy. This podcast is part of the Sports Social Podcast Network.