The Late Braking F1 Podcast - Is Alpine's Gucci partnership the start of something bigger?

Episode Date: May 31, 2026

Gucci is coming to Formula 1, but what does its new Alpine partnership mean for the future of the team and for F1 as a whole? Plus, Ben and Sam discuss McLaren's 2026 prospects, Mohammed Ben Sulayem's latest governance proposal, and another edition of F1: Back (...and Back). Get involved in F1 Fantasy this season! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Join the Late Braking league⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and see if you can beat us... LEAGUE CODE: C6Y6R4ZUY02 Want more Late Braking? Support the show on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Patreon⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and get:Ad-free listeningFull-length bonus episodesPower Rankings after every raceHistorical race reviews& more exclusive extras!Don't forget! You can also gift a Late Braking Patreon subscription—perfect for loved ones or your own wish list. Choose anything from 1 month up to a full year of top-notch F1 content: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.patreon.com/latebrakingf1/gift⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Connect with Late Braking:You can find us on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Instagram⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X (Twitter)⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠TikTok⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Come hang out with us and thousands of fellow F1 fans in our ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Discord⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ server and get involved in lively everyday & race weekend chats!Join our ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠F1 Fantasy League⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and see if you can beat us!Get in touch any time at [e-mail]  Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Thank you for listening to the late-breaking F-1 podcast. Make sure to check out new episodes every Wednesday and every Sunday. Everyone, welcome to the late-breaking F-1 podcast presented by Sam Sage and me, Ben Hocking, back for another Sunday episode. No F-1 this week, but Sam, we're starting to get into a bit of a run of F-1 after this week. We seem to have had like five races in five months, and we're now just going to be hit with them one after the other. And you know what? I'm okay with that. Yeah, I don't like running at the best of times,

but if I have to run into anything, it's a number of F1 races, because that means we have a good time. And that's the only time I'm having a good time when I'm moving fast and sitting down on the sofa. So, yeah, I'm looking forward to it. And look at us, we've managed to complete a whole intro without complaining about the heat.

I wasn't actually going to mention it. I feel like I've reached too much about it. Yeah, well done. Pat on the back, we really are the best of people. I'm not sure about that. Yeah, we're going to prove that we're not the best of people in that we've got Monaco coming up. up next week and we never have anything bad to say about Monaco.

But before we get there, we've got plenty to talk about. On today's episode, we've got a game of F1 back and back coming up later on. Sam got hags. The newest hit game show where Sam cannot lose. We've got Mohammed Ben Suleim and possibly removing term limits. We've got McLaren a bit of chat about where they're at at the moment early on in this 26th season. But we're going to start with some news that came out this week. I haven't had much of that recently.

news being that Gucci will enter Formula One next year as title sponsor of Alpine in a multi-year deal worth an estimated $50 to $60 million per season, although bonus clauses tied to performance could take the total value up to $50 to $60 million per season. The team is expected to be rebranded as Gucci Racing Alpine F1 team with new black and gold branding featuring Gucci's logo, which will feature prominently on the 2027 car. Gucci won significant car branding presence, though LPN aims to retain some of its own blue identity. The partnership will also extend beyond the car to include team apparel, paddock gear, and performance products for staff and drivers.

This one, at least to me, Sam, kind of came out the blue. I was a bit stunned by this. Came out the blue indeed. But in terms of partnerships and the way that they work with the sport of Formula One, the level of luxury it is, the high value, the customer base, I think Gucci fits absolutely perfectly. It's a no-brainer. And you look at incredible collaborations

between sporting brands around the world and high-class sporting outfits or fashion outfits. It fits perfectly in that mould. You've got PSG at the moment who just won the Champions League. And they've got a kit that's coming out at the moment

that's mixing Jordan, Dior, Nike itself, and of course the PSG brand. And that's obviously pinnacle Paris, it's fashion. It makes sense and it works. It's almost a collector's item. I think the same thing can be said here.

I think Alping have just elevated themselves by being the blue team with the pink bit on the side, if you're a new F1 fan, and you kind of don't really get the livery to now being this kind of fashion assassin almost where they just look absolutely gorgeous. And how many times have we said that black and gold is a livery works so well? You have to look at the Lotus, right? The John Player's Special Lotus to be iconic.

Now, if they can make something even 50% as iconic as that, then we've got a great livery on our hands. And if you know me, you know that I absolutely love livery watch. So I'm very excited. Pimped by F1 started early. Yeah. Bring up. And Goochee, if you want to get involved, just I'm going to all right with that.

Let me know. Oh, yeah, I'm looking forward to this. I think just from a spectator, from a person who enjoys F1 and the world that we're in, I'm really excited by this partnership. I think it's a really natural fit. And I'm glad it's happened. I think it's really cool. Sam says, hit us up, Goochee, to sponsor Pimp My F1 in 2027.

In completely separate news, Gucci and Alpine have one 2027 Pimp my F1 with an unprecedented score of 100 out of 10. Well done, Gucci. Great job. Entry to the sport has gone well. Yeah, I was pretty stunned by this. But on a second look, I guess it does make a lot of sense.

Gucci is owned by Kerring. I'm not sure if that's the correct pronunciation of the parent company. The CEO of that parent company is Luca Domeo. Luca Domeo, for those of you who can't remember or don't know, was the former CEO of Renault. Reno being the parent company of Alpine. So once you start to connect the dots, makes a lot of sense.

Bad news for Alpine and for Gucci is that if Luca Domeo is involved in this in any way whatsoever, this thing will be over in three months and we won't ever see the car. And there goes the Gucci sponsorship for us. Never mind. Hey, I've always been a big fan of Luca Domeo and his hiring and firing strategies.

I think it's a sign of where not only where Alpine is right now it's where F1 is right now to have claimed a title sponsor as lucrative as this. I was looking back 10 years ago, we reviewed the 2015 Hungarian Grand Prix

as part of our Patreon Historic Race Review series that you can watch on Patreon now. And you look back at sort of 10, 11 years ago there's only two or three title sponsors on the grid. full stop. And in between now and then even, we've had some pretty shoddy ones, if you think of, and I mean no disrespect to any of these companies that I am severing ties with and never getting

on the podcast as a sponsor. But I don't think you'll be too disappointed by these names, but you remember Moneygram and... Moneygram is still, I don't remember them. They were going on the grid last year, weren't they? Yeah, it wasn't that long ago. But like, you look at Rocket as well. That was... Flexbox. Flexbox. And we don't even need to go into the whole William story. rich energy, nonsense. You say black and gold

can work on a car, it can if it's not led by that Muppet. Yeah, no, where there is a great sponsor, there are Teton, not so great sponsors. And there are some, I'm getting a shout out on another show here, but Donut Media do a really good job, actually, of documenting some of the most ridiculous sponsors in Formula One across the 90s.

Now, some of them are just completely fabricated as well, and it's really fascinating to hear about things like, you know, Nigerian princes coming along to sponsor F1 teams that never actually happened. It's quite fascinating. So it's a delicate world. It's an exciting world, and it can lead to brilliant things. And as you mentioned, the evolution of what is sponsored in Formula One has grown monumentally,

and arguably the last five to seven years, we've seen a real increase. Where there were teams like Ferrari that would never have a title sponsor, HP, now sit proudly alongside that famous name. And they pay, I think it's upwards of $90 million a year to be involved with that project. So it's huge money for the teams that are involved. Yeah, and you look at it's not just HP. You look at what we're likely looking at in terms of sponsors next year as well as Gucci. You've got HP, you've got MasterCard, you've got Visa, you've got Oracle, Atlassian.

You've got Revolutes as well for Audi. These are all quite reputable names that we didn't really have in F1 10 years ago. Gucci themselves being described as the first luxury brands, whoever be a title sponsor in F1. And again, I would draw your attention to Moneygram and say that's probably a true brand too. But it's a real statement. And it's a sign that these companies that previously wouldn't have been interested are now getting involved. Gucci is part of this sort of media release mentioned that the average age of F1 followers now is 32, which I like.

Yes. Because that makes us young. Come on. We bring it down. But I mean, 10 years ago, that number wasn't 32. like those brands that are trying to activate a younger audience, there is actual reason for them to be involved in F1 now. And it's also demographics as well.

Gucci, by their own research, are saying that around half of new lists, new watches of F1 are women. So there is, again, if you are, and I don't know what you would say, Sam, but Gucci to me kind of feels very targeting men and women roughly similarly. Like, it's... You look at me, it screams Gucci, so I get what you're saying, why you would direct this question over to me. But yes.

It's probably 50-50-ish, right? It feels like... I mean, fashion generally, I think, is still very much a woman's game. I do think that, you know, you go down the high street, you look at websites. It is the collections for women are wider when it comes to clothing. I think men definitely also have different buying habits. For example, women will buy in a balance of the season,

men buy during the season because we're so short-minded. But if we need an umbrella, we won't buy a while it's discounting and get ready. We'll wait until it rains outside. then go into a shop and buying umbrella. But I do think that Gucci are correct in saying that you look at the luxury collabs that have happened around Formula One. We were just talking about the most recent Jackie Shewitt collab that came out. It's high prices for high quality items.

And Gucci are tapping into that. I'm expecting replicas of race suits. I'm expecting people to dress up like race engineers. You know, you see these rip-off Ferrari jackets coming out everywhere. You see team jackets being made by people on Etsy and things like that, where they want to feel like a part of a team. This is a gateway for Alpine to have some merch everywhere you go, but for Gucci to be the face of that merch.

I really think it's a great combination of brands. I'm going to have to give credit to Tony Cowan Brown for this on Instagram as her real. I managed to spot something that I hadn't. And I was wondering if you'd seen this as well. Gucci have put out, at least at the time of recording, they've put out three separate posts about, their F1 sort of venture. Right.

Three posts on there, two of them, two images and then one video. There's one thing that connects all three of them. Exclude the caption and just focus on the image in the video. There is not one mention of Alpine anywhere in all three. Again, in the caption they do mention it obviously, but there's no, neither driver is featured in any of those three posts. There's no Alpine team members. there's no Alpine car.

The name of Alpine's not there. And I think it's very telling because they're there. Gucci are here for F1. They're looking to capitalize on F1's name. Alpine is a means by which to achieve that. They aren't trying to capitalize on Alpine's name here. It's just a vehicle. Literally is.

Do you also think contractually when Pierre Gassi wins the first race of 27, he has to come over the radio and say, it's all Gucci, baby? Yeah, I stopped listening when you said win. Fantasyland. What I do think is interesting about it is the value of the deal. Of course, rumoured to be upwards of $150 million over what the four, five years, three, four, five years together. It is quite small in comparison to competitors that, yes, sit above them in the table,

but the overall value of Formula One has increased so much that you think they might be able to bring out a little bit more cash. We brought out HP at $90 million. Oracle, I think are $100 million a year, give or take. And Master Carf McClare is sit around that $90 million as well. Now, I know these are title wicking teams that are regularly come across this, but with the way that F1 has grown so massively, it's got the Apple deal recently that's coming as well only last year. You would think that it would be a little closer to deals that were made around 2022,

2022, 2023, and yet they seem to be able to gather that much cash income from Gucci. Yeah, it's interesting, because it is still quite an advance on what they've got at the moment with BWT. I can't remember where exactly that number sits, but I think it's about maybe 50% of what Gucci will be. So it's a real advancement for Alpine. But yeah, you're right, it still sits below some of these other bigger teams. And maybe that is related to the team's success. I'm not too sure.

What do you make of maybe Gucci's other intentions outside of just being the title sponsor? They're saying here they're going to be involved in activations. They're going to be involved in products for the team, for example. What do you make of their involvement there? Makes social sense. If you get to spend this much money to be discommitted to the overall journey, I think, again, as you mentioned, they're not here for Alpine. They're here to be recognized as Formula One.

And you've seen how brand sponsorships can evolve. Sergio Perez, of course, a couple of years ago, brought in Kit Kat as a response of himself personally. Now, look what's happened to Kit Kat. They're now the official chocolate provider of Formula One, and you could buy tiny little Formula One Kit Kat cars that you can get in packets. It developed. We're not, but I love chocolate. So Kit Kat also, you know, and if you do form these relationships, you start to involve you in the conversation,

If Gucci could be the first luxury clothing brand to really establish itself as a home name of Formula One, a name that you directly recognize one next to another. Who's to say that in four or five years time, when Formula One's around ago, we want a luxury clothing provider to have merch that rolls out across all stores globally. Well, Gucci are really involved. It makes an actual fit here. The same with being at the race. If you've seen how you can activate at tracks, right, it's the same at all sporting events.

You get pop-up stores. And I say we've been victims of this ourselves. You know, us lot have turned up to pop-ups. We bought merch, right? You were wearing an Austin shirt just the other day. I was wearing my can of a shirt the other day that I bought at Austin. But the point is you turn up and you buy things. We bought hats.

I've got big jumpers that I bought there. People will buy this stuff if it is cool looking and it represents the sport that you love. And I do think it's a really big opportunity for someone like Dookie to pick up their pop-up store, put it down at every race track around the globe and go, come in and buy. Yeah, there'll be some Alping merch in there in the corner in the back over there. there, but also... In the bargain bins, like... Yeah, yeah, yeah. Behind the...

See, it's just around the back of the shop. It's just there. But in the shop itself, there's a lot of Gucci stuff that you could pick up. It's got a little F1 logo on it as well. And I do think that that's what they're wrangling to appeal to. Yeah, I feel like if this is done correctly,

Gucci could be the blueprint, possibly, for other similar brands to get involved in F1. I wouldn't be surprised at that at all. And I'm not surprised. by what Gucci is saying here about how they'll be involved in F1, because if you are Gucci and you want to enter the sport, like they operate on prestige and luxury and a want to, you know, be seen as associated with Gucci.

Like, you can't then turn up and then have Alpine looking the worst team on the grid. Like, I don't just mean out on track, which they have been in the past. They just mean, like, how they actually look. They're an image brand now. Right. Yeah. And they are saying, they will make sure that Alpina sort of kit it out in whatever they're planning to do.

Like, they are going to have to look the best because if you are Gucci, that's how you thrive, is by looking the best. Colopinto's going to look so bloody good, man. The drip on Collipto. He's already got the Riz, and now he's going to have the drip. It's going to be ridiculous. The man can't be stopped. The Riz drip.

Best winter of all times are going to tell you to the best life of all time. My God. Fair play, Franco. I wanted to ask you as well about Alpina a bit more generally, because Alpine have been rumoured to be thinking about selling the entire team maybe for a few years now. Nothing's properly materialised. We've got news just over the last couple of days that apparently Mercedes are no longer interested in that 24% stake that Otro Capital currently owned because the asking price is too high. But do you think this move in particular towards Gucci, does that make the team easier or more difficult to sell?

I actually think it's more difficult to sell. I think such a prominent brand who are looking for stability. They want, as we mentioned, they want to be in here for the long haul. This could be a template for how other brands work. You don't want a team that's going through a turmoil that's got share prices dropping that looks like it's a bit of a bargain being in the corner. Gucci never want to be associated with being the cheapest thing on the market. And I wouldn't be surprised if a big part of the sponsorship conversation was,

how are you planning to handle a potential sale of this company if we were to still be around and would we be put along with it? because if to be a title sponsor, someone like Gucci, imagine if a brand that they internally disagree with comes along and buys that team, it will fracture the entire point of what they're looking to do. I do think that this is adding a real layer of complexity, an increased cost and longevity to what the overall move is with buying out this team. So I'm not surprised that Mercedes has gone, we're no longer getting a good deal to pick up maybe a little secondary team on the grid that we used to have with Williams when they were struggling.

We're now getting a fully fresh off one team that has got proper sponsorship, long-term plans and two drivers that are currently doing a really good job on the racetrack, it's suddenly become a bit more difficult to invest in Alpine because they're doing better, which weirdly is quite a odd direction to being. I could see it going both ways, to be honest, to give my best Harri-Ead impression. Thanks, I can see you. Yeah, because the whole idea of Alpine selling is to be able to develop an attractive proposition for someone coming in.

So that includes, it's a real package. It includes the engine, which obviously is now Mercedes. It includes the infrastructure. It includes things like the Driver Academy. And it includes a title sponsor in Gucci, which if someone is considering investing in Alpine, that's suddenly become a lot more attractive to them. Gucci is a big get in that regard. But it could work the other way in that Gucci, I know they're not maybe hitting the numbers

of Oracle or HP, but they are paying quite a bit more than BWT currently are. it actually means that Alpine, who aren't anymore creating their own engines, who have a title sponsor that are giving a good amount each year, it's becoming cheaper and more attractive for Alpine to stay in the sport because they can take advantage of being associated with F1 without the costs that they were maybe incurring in 2024 and 2025. So I can actually see this one going both ways. It'll be interesting.

I also think that this will open up the door for many other teams to start having a luxury clothing provider. As we've seen, every tiny thing gets sponsored. Everyone has a fitness drink. They all have, you know, certain sportswear providers where you have Adidas or Puma or Castor or someone like that. You now will have, I think, luxury outerware providers coming in. You'll see a Prada, you'll see a Louis Vuitton or someone like that.

I mean, I asked them as to Martin Cabos, I think, you know, it will start to become a regular platform for Formula One. Let's take a quick break. On the other side, we'll just wrap up this chat because there are a few comments from Flavio Buretoria wanted to get to in regards to the lineup rather than Gucci. and then we'll also get into some chat about McLaren. Welcome back, everyone.

Just wanted to finish up on some Alpine chat because outside of this deal that Flavio Briotore was very instrumental and putting together, he was also asked by the race about the team's driver plans for 2027, who will be those first Gucci drivers in F1? Briotori said, we don't know what's going to happen with Mercedes. We don't know if Mercedes will pick up Max or whatever,

so let's see what we have in the house before we proceed. classic Flav giving both of his drivers a real pat on the back. Like, we've got you. No, we'll just see what happens elsewhere. Also, the phrase in the house, he's already talking like he's part of the house of fashion. It's like, you know, in the house of Gucci, who have we got that could come in?

The absolute audacity from Flav to be like, wait and see what I'm at saying is first. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Everyone, hold on a minute. Just wait to see what goes on with George Russell and Kimi Antigelli because their first stop after getting booted from a title winning team will be obviously here. This is obviously where they're coming next,

the next best thing. I'd go back to F2, man. What are you doing? What are you going? You've got a good thing going. Pierre Gasly is one of the most underrated drivers on the green. He scored points in every single

Grand Prix so far this season. And Franco Colopinto is hanging two best race weekends of his career back to back. Why are you demoralizing the guys? I mean, I don't know it's not winter anymore. But stop putting Franco down. He's doing a good job for crying out that. I can't believe. I mean, it can.

It's flav. but I cannot actually believe that he's come out with this and said, I'm just going to wait to see what goes on on Mercedes first. Like, that's a natural thing to do. I don't know if Flavio Brutori genuinely believes, like, if Vestappan went to Mercedes and one of Russell and Antonelli became available, they're like, oh, we'll take whichever one they lose, because Alpine will be the obvious next stop.

Mercedes power unit, obviously. Like, there's the connection there. Yeah, that's going to happen. Or if he actually means something like the domino effect of, if they then went some, whoever was the loser in that situation went somewhere else, would that mean someone else becomes available? And I understand why he's not fully committing to going early on this. Like, you would rather be...

There is a trickle-down effect that this could actually happen. But even then, why do you think that drivers of a better calibre than what you have now would be so readily available to come to Alpine? I think he's in a good spot with what he's got. I think he is as well. And to be honest, I think he knows that. But I understand why publicly he's being more coy about this right now, because, again, I don't think he wants to unnecessarily scare off people who might be considering Alpine as an option in the future if they need it. I think maybe the difference between Briotori and all of the other 10 team principles, because Flav technically isn't one himself, I think everyone else is maybe thinking the same thing as Brioatori in terms of like, let's just see how everything plays out, don't want to commit.

anyone else would probably come out and say, look, our two drivers are doing a great job right now. Love what Pierre Ghazli's been doing. He's contracted until the end of next year, or maybe even two years from now. Franco Colopinto is at his best couple of races in the Alpine in the last two races. Really happy with where we're at. We're going to keep going.

Look for that consistency from Franco as we go throughout the summer, and then we'll make decisions later in the year. Most would say a better worded version of that. But you nailed it. Flavio would say something like this. Yeah, I know. I know it. You just think, I think Flavio, if you were to look up the definition of treat them mean, keep him key, it would just be Flav's face.

Because I think it does kind of work for the business he runs where you're almost like, oh, please, please, please, please, please, you know, that time that he hugged someone, it was like the best thing ever. You think it's just that one time Flav hugged you because he likes you. It's such a difficult relationship to have with this guy. I just, you know how to please him. Yeah, I do think as well, he might just be keeping colop into. on his toes because that's the kind of manager he is.

We've got Monica coming out next. Very true. He has also had some words of encouragement as well for Colopinto outside of this quote. I have seen some positivity towards him as well. So important to mention that for some balance. It's not just all bad. But yeah, very interesting. Let's move on to McLaren, shall we?

Because after Canada, McLaren trail Mercedes in the Constructors Championship by over 100 points. It's 219 to 190. six right now. So even with Mercedes not having a brilliant weekend with a retirement of one of their cars in the main Grand Prix, it's still a pretty massive deficit at this stage in the season. They're obviously defending both titles this year, Sam, for the first time in a very long time. Are either of these titles still possible? It's hard to be so optimistic for them right now. And I do think there's a number of reasons why. But the positive I want to go with first is the chassis, the car itself. It looks like,

like they've got a really well put together car. And after a really tricky start to this season, where some of that points deficit, you'll remember, is because they basically didn't have a car running in two of the first Grand Prix, especially. So they lost out on a huge number of points. So the gap wouldn't actually be a bit smaller if the car was able to actually get itself out,

or piastro wasn't in the wall in Australia. But that would bring the gap down to what we're thinking, 70 points at best, maybe. The negatives here are, everything that Mercedes has going well for it, contractually, McLaren are under the same obligations. So when McLaren are good,

Mercedes are good. And slightly better. Yeah, but if something were better to happen to Mercedes, especially their power unit, which of course, the ADUO system's coming out, the compression ratio is now in effect.

They'll have to bring different engines, of course, to satisfy the rule set where the compression ratio, at all temperatures, has to be 16 to 1 or 18 to 1. This is massively affecting Mercedes and potentially Red Bull. McLaren are also affected by this,

as our Alpine, for example, as are Williams, we will see a shift in performance. And this will be another hurdle that someone like McLaren will have to overcome, whilst teams like Ferrari will not have to overcome this. They will not have to deal with this problem. They will get a benefit from the ADEO system. They will get a benefit from what happens to change in the compression ratio. Their chassis is as good as the McLaren car already.

So I think whilst they may overcome the hurdle that Masekies are also stepping backwards, other teams will step forwards. And I think unfortunately, due to the start of this season, it feels very unlikely that McLaren are going to have enough to muster any difference between those other two teams around them. Yeah, the points deficits themselves, I don't think should scare McLaren too much right now. We've seen a bigger overhaul before. Yeah, even though it does sound pretty scary, like that Constructed's Championship is well over

100 points. The driver's championship isn't looking much better. They were 87 points down in 2024 after a 11. 11 rounds. And they were leading the championship after 17 rounds. So these things can turn around quite quickly with a few DNFs at an upturn in performance. And obviously, the 24, they went on to win that Constructors Championship as well as last year. So even though it is over 100, right now is it 113 after five races. It's by no means over. I mean, we've still got as many as maybe 17 races this year could be a couple more than that, depending on what they do with the calendar.

And I think where we're at in terms of the regulations as well, you've already mentioned ADUO and what might happen there. There's so many different things that could still happen this year. There's opportunities for all of these teams to improve their performance right now. We're still very early in that development cycle means that there are maybe bigger waves of performance or upgrade performance. We've got the cost cap in effect. We don't know how each team is doing versus that. And then, of course, we've got the relatively new news that in 2027, it looks like we're going to have a slight change in the engine formula. All of these teams are going to have to dedicate something to that.

And it's going to be a team-by-team decision as to how much you do on that this year. And whatever you do on that this year is going to take away from your ability of the current car. And McLaren, you could say, it may be in a slightly advantageous situation there in that Ferrari, Red Bull and Mercedes, of all running their own power units, they are going to have to, you would think, put quite a lot of effort into that. McLaren might actually be able to take one step back from that. Maybe we don't need to spend the same amount as those three teams,

and we can actually spend a little bit more on our current car. Maybe that's what they need in order to get closer to Mercedes. So in terms of the Constructors' Championship, I know it's a big deficit. I don't think it's over yet. Driver's Championship might worry me a little bit more because we've had, Lando Norris has had what,

one did not start and one did not finish so far this year. Piastri's had two did not starts, which means Lando Norris currently 73 points down on Antonelli, Piastri, 83 points down. The conversation at the moment is about whether George Russell can even overturn the deficit he has to Antonelli, let alone the McLaren. So that feels like the bigger challenge to me.

Yeah, I agree. I think where there is only two teams, realistically, maybe Red Bull if they really keep picking up the performances, but can stop McLaren from picking up their Constructors title. With the drivers, it's actually four, maybe five drivers that are in the way here, and they're all incredibly competitive because the cars are so close. And on their day, those drivers are just as good as the McLaren drivers, if not some are better.

The Stappan on his day, we'll beat them both, I think, quite comfortably. Lecler is as good. Hamilton, on his day, can be as good still. Russell and Anthony only have both proven they can be as good, if not better again. So it's not just passing as a team two units. It's both of those people against each other, passing other five drivers to try and maximize their points. It's so easy to lose points is the point I'm making here,

that overcoming that massive haul that Kimi Antingelli has managed to pick up is just so tough. It will require several DNFs and a real turn down in pace that isn't engine related for Mercedes to be able to give McLaren the advantage. And that is the problem with McLaren being a customer of Mercedes. Everything that affects Mercedes affects McLaren. They need to spend so much more in their aerode development, their chassis development. So we've overcome the lack of output from an engine.

It's a lot of cash and a lot of hope to get that right. And they're always on the back foot in terms of this, I don't know, knowledge transfer. I know that's something we've discussed a few times this year about how, whilst they have exactly the same power unit as Mercedes, they don't have the same knowledge out the box as Mercedes because they are just being given something. Part of being a customer. Yeah, exactly. but it just means that whilst I think they have made quite good strides on that in the first five races, because they're definitely stronger now than where they were in Australia.

Every time Mercedes bring something of an engine upgrade, Mercedes are probably going to benefit from that straight away. McLaren are going to have to take maybe a race or two to fully get 100% out of it, and that can be the difference in these championship challenges. In terms of the two drivers, where do you think their heads will be at right now? We've obviously got Lando Norris fresh off of his first driver's championship last year, but struggling a bit this year in terms of having that did not finish, having that did not start. He was competitive in Miami, but that's probably the only race so far this year that he's been in contention for a win. Similarly, Oscar Piastri's had some really horrid luck so far this year.

Had a very good race at Suzuki, but outside of that hasn't really had a chance to challenge for a win. Where do you think they're both at? I know that Lando Norris wakes up every day. He looks in the mirror and he says, says to himself, you're a world champion. That's what Landon Norris does. So I think he's fine. I think mentally he's quite strong.

Well, you know, I've got heard of anyone before. I guess write that myself. I think that he is mentally quite strong. And I think he's also very McLaren. I think he is one of these drivers, much like the Claire with Ferrari, much like for Stap and with Red Bull. Now Russell, you'd argue with Mercedes.

I think you would see him there for a long time. And I think he's ridding out the lows already, right? 17th thing of D&F in Bahrain, only three, three, four seasons ago, they've rowed it all the way up. And it's still a better situation than it was a couple of seasons ago. And your luck comes and your luck goes

and your time will come and your time will go. Then if you're there long enough in theory, it will come back round the gang. I think Norris is happy to run that team. Piastri, on the other hand, we already heard murmurings of a potential move if the opportunity arose over the winter period.

There were conversations that Mark Weber, his manager were speaking to Ferrari, or speaking to Mesaegas, or speaking to Red Bull. So we know that he is not 100% mentally aligned with McLaren. He's open. The door is hijar, you would say,

to a potential move. And I do think if it continue to fall out of love in terms of the performances and the relationship that he has with McLaren, there might be a, hey, this regulation with McLaren is working for me. I want to step away. I want to do something else.

If we saw someone like Verstappan leave the sport entirely, I think Piastri would jump up to be one of the favourites and take that Red Bull seat off of him. I know Piastri over the Canadian GP week, Ken, just to say that he went out of his way to kind of address these Red Bull rumors and shut them down to at least say there hadn't been any contact at this point.

Doesn't mean there wouldn't be in the future, obviously. But for now, at least, I think he's committed enough to McLaren and the team as a whole. Lando Norris, I think if he wants it, like the championship should give McLaren some breathing room in terms of if he can't compete for a title this year, having won that title last year, and you're right, he has been on that full journey of McLaren really ever since what he was, he was their development driver back in 2018 or so. So you do go back quite a few years and you think of where McLaren were at that point. They were just starting to get out of the Honda deal and get back to some.

Those shots with him next to Fernando Alonso as a mere boy. Yeah, but Norris was making Alonzo tea or something, wasn't it? I think it was, yeah, maybe an espresso or something like that. Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, he has been on that journey. So I would be surprised if he bailed out of that super early. I'm still like on the back burner got this take that I can't fully commit to, which is I don't think Norris is here for a long time in F1.

Yeah, you've said this a couple of times. I can't put any fact behind it at all. It's just one of those where it's a hunch. I'm going to disagree. I think he will be one of those drivers. I think for at least another decade, we've got Mandel Morris. No way we remember we've had this conversation. We can go back to it.

I can't remember more than two predictions at a time. Outside of this, I also wanted to chat about Zach Brown, who he was asked, he was at the Indy 500 at the weekend. He was asked about McLaren sort of having their own engine in F1 and whether that would ever be a possibility and what the conditions would need to be. He said, if a financially viable engine formula is introduced, we would definitely consider developing our own power unit and technology.

What do you thoughts on that? That one caught my eye. I am fully with him. I think that actually they should let's do this sooner rather than later. You just have to go back through the last quarter of a century of titles to realize just how powerful it is to be in control of your own power unit. And if you're not in control of your own power unit, you are the direct and only customer of an outside supplier.

When I say outside supplier, I mean the person giving you the engine may not be yours, but they are not also racing in the sport at the time. So Ferrari, of course, pick up the first few titles with their own engine. Straight after that, it goes to Renault with a Renault. And then, of course, it's Ferrari again. And then Hamilton picks up an engine at McLaren, but they have a Mercedes engine. Mercedes-on in the sport at this point. After that, it goes into Braun.

And who were Braun's engine, the only one being, of course, they were running the Honda, or was it the Mercedes? The, sorry, the 2009. Yes. They're 100 left. Yes. There you go. And then we move into Red Bull, of course,

who were running the Renault engine for those four years. Of course, Mosegis again, back to Mercedes engines. You see the flow here that actually McLaren, in the last couple of times that they won the constructors, were pretty much the only time where their provider was also running alongside them on the grid. It's incredibly rare that a constructor, factory of engines is beaten by a customer who is also on the grid at the same time.

So I do believe that if McLaren want to have long-term domination, long-term top-tier success, and they're not constantly actually around this second, third, fourth place, especially when Mercedes are involved, they will need to look at having some self-sustainability and bringing either an outside provider, whoever that might be, you know, currently it could be like a Toyota, a BMW, whatever it might be, or they're going house and they create it themselves. I think if they're going to do it, doing it now for the new era. a Formula One, which will be 2030, 2030, 21, it's the right time to potentially do that. They've got to think about it now. Even if they don't go ahead with it, they have to think

about it now because whilst, yes, McLaren have shown recently that you can win as a customer team in F1, the conditions for them winning were very specific in that the engines were frozen in 2020, 2021 or whatever it was, meaning we had multiple years of engine performance essentially being completely balanced. And F1 became purely a game of can you do a better job on Aero and chassis compared to your rivals. But that's quite rare. F1 is no longer in that space because engine development is back. And we know that in 2027 it will be changed a little bit again. And there's a good chance that they don't choose to freeze these engines whatsoever until the new formula again in 2030 or 2013. They're probably not going to freeze that formula for at least

four or five years. I know we're guessing here and we're going quite far into the future. There's a very good chance that the conditions McLaren won the championship under last year aren't around for another 10 years, if at all. And I don't think if you're McLaren, you can just bank on that particular situation. They do need to think about whether the talks of the 2030-2031 engine being a lot cheaper, if that is the inn. We've seen with Red Bull, who have kind of done a similar thing. Appreciate it's not exactly the same because there was that transition

from Honda over the last couple of years. But Red Bull's power unit isn't exactly well off the pace right now. It's in the mix. And maybe that gives McLaren the encouragement to go ahead with this. I could see it happening. If I was McLaren,

I could have very close fixed eyes on Audi and Cadillac. Audi, of course, developing their own engine. It'd be interesting to see how quickly that comes up to proper pace and kind of like a course bringing their engineering in a couple of years' time, if that gets off the mark and it is competitive, it shows you it can be done. And I do think McLaurin, they need to look for an outside provider long term or start

producing their own within the next decade. A couple of more things just before we go to our second break about the Indy 500. Firstly, congratulations to Felix Rosabeth, who won his first Indy 500. Well done to you. His first oval race win. How ridiculous is that? Yeah. Excellent. He's been a brilliant race a few years as Felix.

He's done a great job in Formula E. He's been everywhere apart from F1 essentially, so it's great to see it win such a high-profile race. Secondly, we had Lando Norris and Daniel Ricardo, I think both attend the Indy 500. Lando Norris was asked, would he ever consider doing the Indy 500? And didn't exactly say no. I think it's becoming a much more eye-opening

and available opportunity for Formula One drivers. I think Fernando Alonso has done a good job at paving a recent path for people doing both. I also think that the fact that we saw Erickson pick up his Indy 500 wins shows that F1 drivers can have success there. It's not a given. You really have to make sure that you are on top form and a bigger luck goes your way. You get the right team, but it can happen. Why not? It's one race, and it's one mega race.

It's one of the best races in the world. Why not look to try and compete in both? And I miss the days where you have drivers, kind of being in two different respective formulas at once or two different modes of formula at once. And it's kind of gong. It's a bit of a bygong era. So I would love to see more drivers do 24 hours in the mall. I'd love to see more drivers do the indie 500.

Go on, no, don't give it a go. If you've got a car in there already, give it a try. I think as well with these drivers that are in F1 or who are maybe considering doing this at some point in their careers, there are more and more people around them that have gone and done it and are thriving. Like you mentioned Marcus Erickson, but you think of so many drivers that sort of come up, via the European formula system, even those that don't make it to F1,

like Marcus Armstrong's out there now, Christian Lungard's out there now. You've got, I mean, Alex Palo has come from the European sort of system quite a few years ago. Takumasato, who's raised in F1, the list is endless. Grojean's there, you know. Mix there, yeah. Soon enough, you're going to get enough peers around you that you've raced against to think, because there is still a bit of a notion of the maybe danger of the Indy 500 and it is still there. Don't get me wrong. I mean, we saw what happened with Alexander Rossi,

of course, just over a week ago. But I think maybe just seeing so many others around them doing this might prompt. Ricardo's always said in the past like he's not interested. I think he should have committed. I actually think it would have been a sensational career move for Daniel Ricardo to do a couple of seasons in India. I think he would have built up a massive fan base. His personality suits it. It's wild, which he suits brilliantly. Also, I think he'd thrive on the actual circuits rather than the ovals as well, it could be a good challenge for him. Yeah, well, we'll see who's the next to make that jump. We're going to take a quick break on the other side.

We've got comments from Mohammed Ben Suleim. Flav and Ben Suleem. Flav and bang on the same show. Damn, yeah. We don't space them out. Both at the same time. All the good stuff. Yeah.

Welcome back, everyone. I hope you're ready. FIA President Mohamed Ben Suleem is proposing a removal of term limits for the position as head of motorsports governing body. The move would enable Ben Suleem, who was re-elected unopposed in December as a result of election rules that prevented anyone else from standing, to continue as president beyond the current 12-year limit. The plan to change the FIA statutes will be discussed and voted on at next month's

FIA General Assembly, where it is expected to be passed by members. An FIA spokesperson said a proposal has been put forward to establish a consistent approach to tenure across all FIA bodies, similar to what currently exists for the world councils and the Senate. Asked by BBC Sport why it was decided to abolish term limits for all posts, rather than instate them for those that don't currently have them, an FIA spokesperson was unable to provide a specific answer. In another change to the statutes, the rules for FIA presidential candidates have been made stricter, a requirement for candidates to demonstrate sufficient experience within an FIA member or an FIA,

by a body will be added. Oh, what's your reaction here, Sam? There are a lot of things I want to say that I don't think are appropriate for a podcast. That's all right, so. Okay, good. It screams of world dictatorship. It's giving world dictatorship, you know?

It is giving dictatorship. It's giving, you know, I want to run the show and I don't want to take away my fun little toy from me. And so to do that, I'm getting a bend and changing old to the rule. The line that you already came out with that no one was able to run against him because they didn't meet the sufficient election requirements, which are also some of the most stringing and ridiculous and difficult requirements going. Can I just remind people exactly what that was? Because you needed one person from each of the FIA's regions, which are roughly, I think, continents, you need the support of one person in order to stand. there's only one applicable person in South America

who has the surname Ecclestone who supported Mohamed Ben Suleum, meaning no one, literally no one could stand against Mohammed bin Suleum. So if that person decides that Ben Sillim doesn't go to run anymore, or they go, actually, I don't like you, Ben, you can't be the runner anymore.

He's out. In theory, that's how it works, right? You can keep that person sweet and you've essentially got the job done. It's just, it feels a little corrupt It feels a little dodgy and it feels quite dictatory. And those are three things. I don't think I would ever want to have associated with me going for any kind of position of power.

And surely, where's the satisfaction of not beating anyone? Being like, I'm the best guy for the job because all my peers think on the legitimately winning because you do a good job. He's the type of guy that thinks that is winning. Like, you know the meme of the guy with the bronze medal and he's just like going crazy about that? That's Ben Sully. Apart from their aunt. There's no one else in the meme. He's the only one.

The people on the meme are F1 drivers on the podium, but he's also put himself on, and he's like grabbing their hair or waterboarding them or, you know, spraying the champagne of first place. There'll be a rule suit where he gets to spray the winning champagne before the winner. Just back off, man. Honestly, just... I hate it so much.

Just f*** off. I'm bored of you being so involved in... Like, I get that you're the FIA press through some de facto... but just back off a bit. Ben, give us your thoughts on this situation. I will happily give you my thoughts on this situation. This is so messed up, man. You know, I'm only half joking when I say this.

I wish Ben Sulean would just come out and say, I want to be a dictator. Because at least at that point, he would be honest. Like, that is his intention here, rather than he's taking people for idiots when he makes changes like this. Like the situation is, and just to reiterate what's going on here, some of the roles that he's talking about here already have term limits like the one that he has.

Some of them do not. His solution is therefore abolished term limits for all of these posts. And he's taking people for idiots to the point where you could imagine the conversation being like, so that benefits you as well, doesn't it, Mohamon? Oh, oh, yeah. That benefits me. I haven't thought of this. What an unintended consequence of this move that I was making for really good reasons.

I'm so selfless. I haven't even thought about how it might hurt or benefit me. And then you go, why didn't you just like introduce term limits for all every single post, including, you know, the ones that don't have it at the moment? Sorry, what's, what's that? I can't, I can't hear you. Going for a tunnel. Is that my love?

Can't it? What's that? Break it up. No term limits is what you're saying. Yeah, agreed. Agreed. It's like the royal family of the FIA at this point. That's not going to be started the royal family.

I know. He's crowned himself king. He took all these little princes and no one can be removed. Oh, man. After the farce of the election as well that you referenced to, like, where no one could stand against him. Like, he doesn't seem to have, the annoy thing, he doesn't seem to have any notable opposition

that will start, as has said in the report from the BBC, like it looks like this will be passed. And I know we've had, because they're terrified. They are terrified to stand against him because they lose their careers if they stand against him. Yeah, and like outside of a few members, like, I'm not saying no one stood up to him, we've had Tim Mayer who wanted to stand for president last year.

He couldn't. Carlisleck Senior tried to. And Dave Richards, he's said some things before. But like, there's never been enough of a push to go against. a lot of what he's saying, and you can just push these things through. There's a rug in the FIA reception room that's got those three people swept under it.

Yeah, right. There's a reason that term limits exist in these bigger posts. Like we have it with UK Prime Ministers. With most governments. Yeah. We have it for US presidents, at least for the next year or so.

Like, it's, we have it for a reason. We have it for a reason, right? And it's not just a don't like Mohammed Ben Suleim, therefore, don't want him in the role. It's like when you have this turnover of people at the top, the whole point is you get fresh ideas. You get, it's just an injection of, I'm not saying an injection of youth, but an injection of like creativity.

Culture, right, like different thought process. It's how we stay innovative. And it's why, you know, good team principles in Formula One teams, they can be voted out. They can be out ruled by stakeholders and shareholders if they're not doing a good job. If they do do a good job, they get revoted. singing. It's how these ideas and people retain. This will sound like an awfully cringy sentence that belongs on some

Instagram post rather than on a podcast. But like, our differences as humans make us special. And like, that's the whole point. I've actually got that in my kitchen. Right. Yeah, yeah. It's perfect for something as soon as you walk into a door of a 60-year-old mum or something. But like... It's also underneath, don't talk to me until I've had my first coffee. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So yes, apologies for that. But there is some truth in it in that, like, are the,

Our differences are what, like, we can bring something different to these roles. Like, if you get the same person doing the same job over and over again, there's just the lack of, I don't know, incentive to get these things done. At what point does it become a lack of interest at all, and it's purely self-absorbed? It's purely a, yeah, I'm the top dog. It doesn't matter. I don't just do anything. I don't need to change it or I don't want to because I've got the post permanently.

You can't get rid of me. I mean, it's like, when you've got term limits in place, You have reason at least to like, you know that you're not going to be here in four years' time. Like you've got, you can set deadlines for things and people work quite effectively with deadlines. Bamab bin Suleum can go, all right, I'll get to that at some point. Don't really matter, does it? Like, we don't want that for the progression of sport. Do I mention 20-togging-9 for V8s?

That's all right, isn't it? I'll get there eventually. I do also want to congratulate the spokesperson here who's actually outside of what I mentioned about not being able to give an answer for why they wouldn't, just add term limits to those roles that don't have them at the moment. They gave a few examples as to other sports and how they don't have term limits, one of which being the NFL. So Roger Goodell has been the commissioner of the NFL for 20 years this year. So he's been in post for a long time. It's like that that's the example we're running with. Let me play you a quick clip about what happens any time Roger Goodell steps out in front of people.

Thank you. Come on, you can do better than that. Let's go. The heckling back is good. Any time he presents the NFL draft on a yearly basis, it's literally a running joke that he gets booed every time he steps out. So him being the example of someone who's been in a post for a long time isn't the best one in the world.

I really admire the fact that they don't hide the booing. Right, yeah, yeah, yeah. Just fully out with it. Last thing on this one, Sam, is that they want to be able to, if someone wants to challenge Ben Suleum in the future, they want that person to fight to the death. Might as well. Demonstrated sufficient experience.

Bit vague in it. Literally the final point I want to bring up. What does that mean? I've got sufficient experience as a podcast host. Doesn't mean I can go and run BBC News. You know, oh, you've been on camera for a few years. Yeah, my little Sonya that sits on a desk. What does that mean?

What does it mean to be demonstrating any kind of experience? experience for a sufficient time. What's a sufficient time? A week, a year, a decade, a millennia. I don't know. Maybe only the Galactic Empire could dethrone Vagelium. I'm not sure, but it does feel like it's purely subjective based on what he wants, when he wants it and how he wants it. And once again, it screams, dictator, your little weirdo. Oh, boy. Ha, got him. Jeez, never know what words come in next. Yeah, it is really horribly vague. And it can just be interpreted in the way that he wants. And this is why these things in combination really annoy me.

It's like, yes, you've demolished sort of term limits for those roles that have them at the moment. Okay, if you've done that independently, maybe you can convince me that's for good reasons. But you've done it at the same time as making it more difficult for people to stand against you because they need experience. The way in which they get experience is to get these roles. The way in which they get these roles is by these roles coming up for re-elect. They don't come up for re-election anymore because you've demolished the term limits. Like, it's all one after the other. It doesn't make sense.

Awful, awful dominoes. Yeah. Awful, awful dominoes. Yeah, it's just making it more difficult to gain experience. And then at the same time saying you need that experience. It's the same as like those entry-level jobs that ask for like 15 years relevant experience. But it's a base-level job. Yeah, yeah.

Can you be a social media manager? You need 25 years experience. Social media is only inventing 15 years. Right, yeah. Exactly. That's what feels like he's doing. So, well, I'm Mohammed Ben-Suliam. You haven't really got a lot of attention on the podcast recently, but you've come back in a big way. Yeah.

If you ever come on the show, have a chat? I don't think he'd want to be here. Probably not. I don't think I'd want him here. One-on-one. Go on one. One-on-one. Yeah, I'd like to see that, to be fair.

Yeah, and Gucci. You're welcome. Gucci, Mohamed Ben-Suliam and Sam Sage. That's an interesting. A nightmare block rotation. That is a nightmare forlum rotation, no doubt. Yeah. Okay, that one, well, let's take our last break on this episode,

on the other side, something that can only go better. F1 back and back. Welcome back, everyone. Excited to bring back everyone's favorite sort of game. It's time for F1 back and back. F1. Back and back. Yes.

Adapted from our usual. back and fourth game where Harry and Sam go up against each other on a particular category. We've decided to very cleverly adapt that game here to be F1 back and back. Cleverly is a kind word. Yeah, I'm not sure if that's the most appropriate word in this situation. But I've got a category in front of me, Sam. There are 21 correct answers. And we'll just see with three lives.

Drivers on the current grid. I only got to nine. We'll see how far you can get with three lives for this. particular question, okay? And play along at home, see how many of these 21 you can name. Again, give yourselves three lives at home as well. I want you to name any driver who has been in the points 100 times in their career. So, not scored 100 points, how many times they have been in the points. Finish in the points. Yes. Okay. All right. Where are we starting? We'll start Lewis Hamilton. We'll start with Lewis Hamilton. It's a good place to start. He is number

one on this list, having been in the points 339 times in his career. Flammary, that's quite good. It's not bad. It's not bad. Let's go Michael Schumacher. Michael Schumacher is a correct answer. He is third place on this list, with 221.

Okay. Max Verstappen. Max Verstappen is on this list. He is currently sixth on 201. Great. Sebastian Vettel. Sebastian Vettel is on this list. 219 puts him in a tie for fourth place.

Brilliant. I'm missing second place. Yes. Whoa. That is surprising. Nico Rosberg. Nico Rosberg is on this list. He is in 15th on 133.

Great. Okay, good. Got either in. Rubens Barrichello. Rubens Barrichello is 13th on this list with 140. Great. That's second place. It's going to be an obvious one.

Maybe at Prost. Prost. this list, but he is in a tie for 16th place, 128 times he's been in the points. That's criminal. That is. Senga. Sena is your first strike. Sena has not scored in 100 races.

Very unlucky. He is the 23rd answer on this list, 96 times. Bit of a red herring. Yeah. Mika Hakenen. Mika Hakenen. It's a strike number two. Oh, gosh.

83 times. Good Lord. Okay. He's been in the points. I've got to pull this together now. Sergio Perez. Sergio Perez is a correct answer. He is seventh on this list, having scored in 188 races. Fernando Alonso. Fernando Alonzo is that second place you were missing. 275 times he's been in the points.

You know what? With his recent career, I am surprised that he's that far up the list because he's barely scored on a point if it was like in the last decade. Kimmy Reichenen. Kimmy Reichenen is in that tie for fourth with Sebastian Vettel with 219, which means you now have got the top seven answers. Brilliant. A famous thing that's all I try and ever achieve. Oh, yeah.

Mark Weber. Mark Weber is a correct answer. He is 20th on this list with 112. Oh, I don't like there's someone below that. That feels risky. The one below is on 100 exactly. Really? Is that why you went down to 100?

Yeah, yeah. worked out quite nicely. Where do you find these statistics? You count or he's by hand? I'm not counting these by hand, no. I just have some weird fact archive chamber that I need to discover. Daniel Ricardo? Daniel Ricardo is a correct answer.

137, but Sim 14th. Okay. What positions are I missing? So you've got 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. Right. And then 17, 18, 19, 21st. Botas? Bottas is 11th on the list, 145.

Massa. Massa's on this list. 165 puts him eighth. Okay. Kaltard. Kaltard is on this list. Well, aren't they? Glad on D.C.

121.18th. Not even last on the list, mate, can't you? Sensational. Six answers left. Okay. There's going to be some glaring, obvious ones here. that I should be guessing. Mansell?

Mansell is not on the list. 82 times. Why have you done this to me, Dr. Nige? Dr. Nijge. Give you one more, one more life to play with, so if you can get any more of these, any of these six. I've got to think about it properly now. I was trying to go through some,

are there world champions left on there? Jensen Button. Jensen Button, yeah, Jensen Button. 162 is in ninth. Okay. Any other world champs? Yeah, two of them are world champs. Good. I'm really glad there's as many as two that are world champions on there.

Right, we've done Schumacher-Alonkso-Riking, Hamilton, Vettel, Stappen, Rosberg. Norris? Norris is a correct answer, 128, puts him crucially ahead of David Coulthard into 17th. Charles Leclair? Charles Leclair is correct, 142. He's 12th. Three left. How many other currents have we got?

Two of these three are current. George Russell. No, not Dr. Russell. 92, he's on. Wow. All right, go ahead. Give us the others. The other two current.

In 10th place, Carlos Sines of 159. Fair play. In 19th, with 120, is Nico Holkenberg. And then on 100 exactly Nelson P.K. Ah, there's a reason why I didn't remember that one. A pretty good effort there, though. There were quite a few, like, close ones there. Other close answers, by the way, if you had these at home.

Gassley's on 82, Ralph Schumacher on 90, Gerhardt Berger on 94, and Esteban Okon on 97. Come on, Esteban. He's almost there. Get over the line. We'll do it next year and you'll be on this list. No, he'll be at 98 or something, would he? Like you're going forever.

Well, that's it for back and back. But that's not it for the episode, because everyone, look to the skies. You might be able to see just in the distance. It's got a little jazz The air jingle going this year, okay. It's the Father Christmas of Jazz. Go, that'd be terrible.

That's not good. It's me, the Father Christmas of birthdays. Father Christmas of birthdays loves the end of the month. That's where he comes alive. He sleeps for twanging high to 30 days of the month. He eight this February. Anyway, yeah. So as a perk of Patreon being a top-tier Patreon subscriber,

You are permitted to, should you wish you use it, a birthday shoutout on your birthday month on the main show. And to activate this, you need to be a top tier member as mentioned, and you need to message us on Patreon with your whatever name you would like use. The date could just be the month. If you don't wish you could disclose your birthday, which we understand. Or it could be the full thing. You let us go and you'll hear something else. So if you are a top tier subscriber and you haven't sent this in and you want to use it, please make sure you do. Of course, June will be coming up next month because that's how calendars work.

There you go. Educational. Oh, happy birthday from May to Dietz, Twyler, and Bianca. Oh, ho. Brenton on May the 3rd. Happy birthday. Cole, aka the Wizard King. I know him well on May the 4th.

Happy birthday. Ho, ho. Charlotte May the 5th. Happy birthday. Oh, ho. Abelash on May the 8th. That's a great name, by the way. Happy birthday.

Dan Bow Smith on May 15th. Happy birthday. have you organised these in date order? They're not usually in date or no longer. This is great. They have been all year. Have they really? Oh yeah. Maybe they weren't before. Maybe it was losing my mind. It's a lot. Sensational improvement to my list.

Richard May 20th, Happy Birthday. Subalicious, May 21st with Barry Kaye and Carissa. Same birthdays, happy birthday. Happy birthday to Henry Aeree on May 22nd. Happy birthday. Liam on May 22nd also. Happy birthday. My mum's birthday is in there. So happy birthday to Mama, Father Christmas of birthdays.

Happy birthday. Happy birthday. For May 26. Oh, oh, Ian Go, and happy birthday, May 26. And Sam, the best name of full time for May 30th, 100 birthday. And a little baby special show. Oh, little baby birthday. Tiny baby buff day to Jensen, who was born on May 29th, who may be related to a member of this show will be a future patron-subscriber. Happy birthday to McGregor family. That is an amazing. Congratulations. It's an amazing moment.

And we wish you all the best. So, helping birthday to a little baby and to all of our subscribers and like. Thank you so much for the support. It really helps the show, and we massively appreciate it. I like to think that the father of Christmas of birthdays

was taught that the word birthday is actually spelled B-U-F-F-B-A-Y. It's not getting it wrong. That's how he says it. Buff-day, yes. Everyone has a buffet. It's buff day. It's buff day. And you must be buff. To have a day. It's the worst part of this. That was show. It really is. We're going to get out of here. We've got an episode, of course, coming up midweek. It's our Monaco preview. My favorite episode of the Hongo. I take it back. The Sunday of this week will be my favorite episode of the whole year. Yeah, it's Monaco, folks. For some, a thrilling endeavor. For others, a nice time to catch up on some sleep, you might lose. But either way, we're going to be here.

viewing it. I'm sure it'll be wonderful. I'm sure the best of my Echo GP we've ever had and someone might overtake someone on the racetrack maybe. That'll be good. You'll never know. Join us anyway because I'm sure you'll get a barrel of laughs or anger or a good time. I don't know. It'll be good fun. And we appreciate your support massively. So thanks for listening. In the meantime, I'll be the same the stage. And I've been Ben Hocking and remember, keep breaking late. So right. That's all right.