The Late Braking F1 Podcast - The Late Braking F1 Podcast: 24/10/19

Episode Date: October 24, 2019

Verstappen is looking to make it 3 Mexican Grand Prix wins in a row, Ben and Sam predict whether this will happen. Also, how do the guys think Alfa Romeo has performed in 2019? And who is Vettel's best teammate? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Sports Social Podcast Network. Thank you for listening to the late-breaking F-1 podcast. Make sure to look out for new episodes every Thursday and Grand Prix Sundays. This is the late-breaking Formula One podcast. We're previewing the Mexican Grand Prix, a Grand Prix in which Lewis Hamilton could well claim his sixth world championship. Harry Ead is on his holiday, so I'm joined only by Samuel Sage. But of course, you have the personality to fill two people,

so we won't be lacking for opinions. That's what my tombstone is going to say. Has the personality to fill two people? Yeah, yeah. I would like to see that happen now. That would have to mean that I go after you. Well, yeah. I mean, that's more likely I'm a thousand years old.

Anyway, less about my personality and more about the Mexican Grawlbrew, which is always super, super exciting. Ben, you posed a rather interesting question to kick us off. Will Max make it three in a row? I actually want to hear what you think, because you always come up with the most fantastic a point of view. So hit me with it. Max three in a row possible?

I think it's plausible, but I think it's a long way from a foregone conclusion. If you look at this season, Red Bull, whilst Max Vestappen has stayed in the hunt for third place, it has been a case of Red Bull have not really had the fastest car at many circuits. In fact, you could probably argue it's only Austria where Vestappen forced his way back through the field, where they have had the best car. even Vestappan's only other win, which came in Germany, was not due to pure pace. Mercedes would have wrapped that up in a one-two finish if it was down to just pace. Of course, not taking anything away from Vastappen, but just talking about Red Bull's performance

throughout the year. But of course, they have done historically very well at the circuit, partly because of their own strengths, partly because of Mercedes apparent weakness at the circuit. They take advantage of that every year. and if that continues on, there's every chance that Vestappan does get involved and does take another race win. I feel like his wins at the circuit, particularly last year, were overshadowed thanks to, you know, Hamilton winning the championship, obviously, when Vestappen's performance in itself was very impressive. I think it could well come down to Ferrari versus Red Bull this weekend, and I'll be interested to see what you think about that in a little bit because Mercedes, you don't often discount them. and we always say going into a race weekend Mercedes should be there or thereabouts,

but this could well be their worst circuit on the year. And they are not very confident coming into the weekend at all. And essentially, from Hamilton's perspective, he doesn't need to win the race. So there's not necessarily going to be a situation where he is going all guns are blazing. And if he's in sort of P4, P5, similar to what he was doing last year, he's not going to take an unnecessary risk. He's going to wrap up the championship. So I think it could be a Ferrari versus Red Bull weekend.

And I think the deciding factor, I think there could be two sort of keys to victory for Vastappen. Number one is, can Red Bull negate Ferrari's pace in the first sector? Can they do enough to keep in touch? Because those first two straits, Ferrari should theoretically have a massive advantage. Can Red Bull make it a slightly less of an advantage so they can claw back the time later in the lap? And also, can Albin be a factor? I think that will be really important because we've seen so many times this season and in previous seasons where if it is two teams going against each other, whether it's Ferrari Red Bull, Mercedes Ferrari doesn't really matter. The team that has two drivers at the front going for the win against the team that has only one driver generally prevails because they can split strategies and suddenly as that alone driver, you have to make that decision.

Who do you cover off and pray that the other driver hasn't picked the strategy to win it? if Vastappen is out in front by himself and he's got Leclair and Vetter behind and Albin's non-factor, he can't hold up one of the guys say, then suddenly Leclair and Vessel could split strategies and Vestappan's win comes into question. So, yeah, I think Ferrari, Red Bull, both in contention. Mercedes, if they can get their act together, it's a bit of a weird one, Mexico. Always very difficult to predict, but Vastappan, yeah, in the hunt. Very interesting indeed.

Yeah, Max B'Berfeng is always in the hunt. I mean, there's no, make no two ways about it. Max Verstaffin has incredible raw pace. of where he is on track, what car is driving, what he's doing. He's always one of the fastest men you're going to see at any track, regardless of the performance of the car he is in. Now, Mexico, like you said, it's an odd one. Mexico is at such a high altitude.

I think I saw a fantastic statistic. Mexico is higher above sea level than the Birge Khalifa because of the way that the track is positioned in Mexico, which shows you how thin the air is. Now, Ferrari do fantastically well where it comes to warm conditions, small amounts of airflow, and of course, that power unit is just unfathomably fast in comparison to both the Mercedes and the Honda power unit now. Mercedes don't do well in hot conditions, as we saw in Austria, the cargoes crumbles.

They need airflow to their power units to really utilize the full performance. And I would say that Mexico is a little bit like spa in the sense that sectors one and sectors are pure power sectors. And that middle sector is all about your chassis, your aerodynamic build, your ability to utilize, cornering speed, acceleration, and getting through kind of this really, you know, tight, twisty section. And that stage section, those two corners in the middle that are very fast, left, right hand is suit Red Bull down to a T. They are brilliant corners for Red Bull chassis. Ferrari on the hand, absolutely likely fast in the straight, as we've said. And I do think that

unlike last year, where Red Bull were on an upwards trajectory, Ferrari on a downward trajectory. It's almost swapped over. Red Bull are the weakest of the three teams. We'll always do one in Mexico. I think they're going to do well again this weekend, but I think it's tougher for them. Ferrari are the strongest they've ever been in this era at this point in the season. The Stappen has got the ability to make it throwing a row. I don't know if he's going to have a clear in Vessel when they're in this going to improve Ferrari at the moment. It is so rapidly quick, but I think they won't be able to negate the first straight that we have, that bit after the first little less, and then that final longstststile.

straight into the stadium section. I think that's enough time for them to gain to make the balance difference. And the difference is, if you haven't got straight line speed around Mexico, it's really tough to overtake because that middle sector is not easy to pass in unless someone makes a mistake. So I think that Bostappan, yes, he'll be on the hunt, he'll be there. Hopefully other album is back up who we've seen grow, race after race after race. You know, that qualifies session in Japan. They set the same lap time, which is just incredible pace from album, considering that he's only

being in that car for five races. He only being in Formula 1 for what? 17 races. It's incredible, incredible stuff. But I do think that Ferroegas have the overall stronger package. I think it's going to be tough for Max. And I don't think Mercedes is going to be too bothered. I think Hamilton will be Bottas, coming anywhere.

It doesn't matter. Hamilton's got it locked in the bag. So I'm seeing it more go to Clarol-Bettles way than I am Maxes. Something that was announced today is that there will be an extra DRS zone in place rather than just the two main straits towards the beginning of the lap. And you did reference how Red Bull should be quite strong in that middle sector, but it is difficult to overtake as you go through those snaking corners. Now that there is going to be a DRS sort of range at the end of that section,

do you think that could help Red Bull or do you think this will help Ferrari? Because of course, you know, they are straight line speed kings. Sorry, just before I say, it's a really small DRS zone. Yeah, it's a tiny straight. It is a really small, I think it's smaller than the straight between Magus Beckett's and Chapel and Stowe in Silverstone. I think it's shorter than that straight. And that in full long. Yeah, it's considered a small straight for DRS.

Yeah, this is tiny. This is really short. So I don't, I think it's going to help to follow. I think you might get a better advantage if you're behind going into the stadium section because of DRS to then get on the back of someone down to start, finish straight. I don't know how many moves we're going to see between actual closely matched cars down that one straight. But if it gets you in a position really to overtake for a slightly slower car on a straight line

down that start finish straight, I'm all for it. I'm happy to see more front doors opened on the. the back of cars to allow teams to pass each other if it means we get some good wheels to all racing in that stadium section because the atmosphere in there is electric so cars going side by side in there sounds all good to me now obviously if red bull are on it this this weekend we are looking at max fastappen and whether he can take the victory or not but of course alexander alban is in the other seat sam do you think there is any chance if they do have the car that alban could well claim his first podium in f1 and if that was the case do you think that

would cement his place. If not, it's not already cemented for next year. So I think I've made it relatively clear, but I'm a fan of album. I really admire his talent, his personality, his levelheadiness in the sport. He's coming to the sport. He's really kind of carved himself out of place. People have a lot of respect for him despite being so unremowned at the sport. He hasn't really got a lot of experience.

He's very experiencing a Formula One car. And I really have a lot of faith in him. Unlike Gassley, I always felt a little bit shifty about him. Same as Cavillat, another man with a longer pace. but I don't know if I really trust him at that front end. Albuon, on the other hand, it's just improved and improved and improved. I think, yes, there's every chance he gets a polling in the next guy.

I would not count him out. If he qualifies at the same place as Vastapen around Japan, the drivers say that is one of the hardest tracks to go around on the whole Canada. He's matching Max for Stappen. That's quality, in my opinion. Yes, I think he can do it in Mexico. I think if he hangs on to the back of Max and then maybe has a better strategy because he's the second driver, as we said 2B1, maybe against Ferrari.

There's every chance he makes it into that third. third place, maybe even a really strong racing, you can have a good challenge for the wing. But I actually would not count Album out at any opportunity in this race. I really think he's got the place to surprise a lot of people here. Yeah, I think Albin still has a long, long way to go in his development, but he is showing signs that he has got potential to be a solid driver in Red Bull team. And you referenced the lap in qualifying in Japan. I actually said after the Japanese Grand Prix, I think that was the lap that sealed Albin in

that role for next year. It seems weird that one lap would be the deciding factor, but I think everything else he's shown plus that lap, because it's something Gassley could never do, match for Stappen and qualifying. I think that lap has actually got him the seat for next year. And if he was to get a podium here, it would just be a cherry on top of the cake.

And of course, it would be a great movement for Albon, who would be enjoying his first podium in F1. I don't know if it's going to happen. I don't think he's quite there yet. I think it will largely depend. If Red Bull come into the weekend with the best car, by a considerable margin, then yes, he probably will. If Ferrari and Red Bull are close, I think the other three will probably push him out.

But he's in the fight at least. So be interesting to see how he gets on. And talking about the top three, what is your prediction for pole position and then the top three in the race? So poll position, I'm going to say is Sebastian Vettel. I have not said it like that. Like Crofti says it, sorry for all those who know how to say it properly. So, pole position is Sebi Vett. I think the win will go to Charlerlerc.

I think second place will go to Saddaskin Vettel. And I think third place will go to Max Verstappen. I have all of those in a different order. I'm not going to introduce any new names into the fold, but I'm going to mix it up a bit. I'm going to say that Charlotte Clare is going to be on pole position. Of course, Ferrari have got pole at every single race since the summer break. So I don't see any reason to switch that around.

But I am actually going to pull for Max Verstappen to win this race for a third year. Wow. Ahead of the two Ferrari guys. I've got Sebastian Betel finishing second and then Charles LeClaire, the pole man, finishing in third. That's very, very spicy. Now, one thing we want to hear down in the comments. It's something we always like to do in these previews, of course, is your bold prediction. What crazy, crazy thing is going to happen at this race weekend?

If you've got one that's ridiculous, we want to hear it the comments, we'll drop a comment on it, we'll show that you are the bogus man that watches late breaking, or woman, excuse me for that. Ben, kick us off. Bold prediction. What do you think? My bold prediction is probably not the most bold one I've ever done, but I'm going with this. Nika Holkenberg is going to qualify and finish in sixth place, and at the end of the race, he is going to make some sort of passive aggressive statement towards Renaud that they should have kept him. Well, that is incredibly specific. I mean, we are tripping major nut sack right out of that. happens. That is so specific that I mean, I can't see it not happening. Why would you not take the

opportunity of success to go, oh, your Muppets? I like it. I like it. I think mine is less bold, which is because yours is so ridiculously specific. I think that both Mercedes cars will finish outside the top six at the end of the race. I mean, that's really bold. It hasn't really happened this season, is it? So, just to clarify that one, so when we come back to this next week and it's a technicality. If they both retire, do they both have to finish the race? Well, I was not really too bothered, but if we're going to really go full hog, I will happily stake my hat on them both actually crossing the line physically on the last lap outside the top six. Wow. I mean, it's bold enough as it is if they both retire. We don't see that very often,

but wow, that would be crazy. That really would be crazy. And of course, it would push the championship on for at least one more race. Yeah, it keeps it interesting. Yeah, and of course we would like to be outbolded in the comments, so do get those bold predictions in. Moving on to Alpha Romeo. Now, there has been a slight rumour. I don't think it's too developed at this stage, that maybe they aren't too happy with

their position in Formula One and might consider leaving at some point. Do you think that Alpha have a right to be disappointed with how this season has gone? and do you think there's any truth in the rumour that that could lead them to leaving the sport at some point? I would be massively disappointed if Alfa-Mayer left the sport, especially this early. They've only been a lead team sponsor, whatever, for one full season. Of course, last season they were paired with Salba. They were Alpha-Maila as Salba. And so I would like to see them give it a proper crack.

At least stay till the first end year of the new era, because Alpha-A-Mayer, are such a historically brilliant team. They've got a lot of backing behind them. I'd be incredibly shocked if financially they couldn't afford it. They don't sell that many cars regardless. So I don't think that's the issue. I think maybe due to the fact that they're best friends, big brothers, little brothers,

how do you want to call it Ferrari. I now starting to really win races and step it up and maybe they're being overshadowed. I wonder if they secretly hoped they could join Formula One in a couple of seasons be fighting with Ferrari. It was going to really going to happen to start with. But I would really like to see them stick around.

I really like Alfred Mayo. I love the look of their cars. I love the passion. I love that we've got another Italian team there. So, yeah, I'd be really disappointed with the left. I think it's a little bit of a silly, a bit of a snapshot rumor to go, they're leaving just because they're not doing,

they're not doing badly. You know, they're firmly midfield. They're fighting with the racing points. Occasionally they'll get into the points. A couple of years to develop. What more do they expect? They not going to be champion. So I think they'd be silly to leave for a start.

I think they've got the money to carry on. They wouldn't have done it if they thought, oh, no, if we lose a few, car sales will have to leave the sport. That seems poor in terms of financial planning. And I think they're great to have. So keep around. I really hope they're sick around. And in terms of 2019, how do you evaluate this season? Of course, only a few racists left to go. Currently sat in eighth place, exactly where they finished last year. How do you think they've got on? The tough thing for Ralph Romero is almost the resurgence of McLaren is McLaren have turned it around

massively. McClaren are now the midfield team to beat, where, a couple of scenes ago, as we all know, they were lingering massively in the field. I don't think that consistency is a good thing for a new team. And despite their racing historic privilege, their legacy, they are a new team in Formula One. And they need to remember that consistency is good. They've now overtaken Haas, who have come up, then come back down again. Racing point, they've got absolutely massive funding and are starting to regrow. So I don't think that's an issue, beating Williams comfortably.

And they've just got Renaud and McClure on in front of them after that. So I think it's okay. I think they need to really focus. focus on 2021. And if they get their eggs down and go not right off the next season, they're not put full effort into it. I think they can really do well come to new season. They have got the resources more so than some of those other independent teams.

So I really think that their season is fine. I don't think they should be too harsh on each other. They made some good driver choices for this season. I think they have got the name, the presence, to sign some good drivers going forward. They just need to be a little bit savvy with that. And hopefully not commit too long into the future with, I think the names they've got now because we're going to move on in a minute.

to Benzag's at his point to discuss their driver line up. Then what do you think about alpha a mo? Yeah, I think it's actually a really good mixture of, well, not a really good mixture, but it is a perfectly balanced mixture of it has been a bit of a letdown year and also what were they expecting? I think it is a combination of both. In terms of it being a slight letdown, they must be slightly disappointed that they haven't kicked on from last year. Of course, focus back to a few years ago that they were not scoring any points whatsoever. And last year was a real, you know, they pushed through the barrier last year and they managed to get to nearly 50 points. So it was a massive step in the right direction and they must have been at least

hoping that this year would have been the year where they kicked on even more and looked towards the top of the midfield rather than scrapping it out for seven-eighth place and it just hasn't materialized in that way. And with the power of that Ferrari engine and this applies for Hasse as well, they look at how well Ferrari are doing on the straits and they must be thinking sort of akin to Mercedes at the beginning of the hybrid era where if you had a Mercedes engine in the midfield, you were pretty sorted. They must have been hoping for something very similar, and it just hasn't happened for them. But there are certain aspects to it that, you know, what were they expecting? They are bringing in a brand new lineup, which is a really difficult thing to happen because you've got two new drivers starting completely fresh.

Okay, Kimmy Reikinen, of course, has a huge amount of experience more than a lot of it. anyone in F1, but he's still adapting to a new style, a new culture, and the same goes for Antonio Giovanni as well. So you'll notice with the likes of Renault, even though that their lineup has transitioned a lot from Magderson and Palmer, they've never transitioned, they've never swapped both drivers in a season. They've sort of gradually changed one at a time. And I think there's a real reason for that is because you want to keep the knowledge within the drive a line-up at least on half of the garage. And with Antonio Giovenazi in particular, this is a guy who has not been in a full racing series for a number of years. You can't expect

him to in the first few races immediately be scoring points in the same way that they were last year. You have to at least expect some sort of adjustment period, which I think has happened because he has been getting better as the year has gone on. You could argue how much better. That's an argument, but he has been getting better. But surely they should have taken that into account. And I think the midfield, it's just how the midfield is. You spoke about McLaren's resurgence. That's absolutely right. And the volatility of that midfield is recognisable.

You've got teams going up and down, Hasse gone down, Renno staying up, McLaren going up. Toro also have managed to pick up a streaky podium this year. And suddenly a few results like that. And an alpha are where they were last year. They might beat their points total last year. It's probably going to be quite close. So yeah, maybe a slight letdown year, but at the same time, Alpha, like, come on, you weren't going to be fighting the top guys. So, yeah, maybe their automotive sales have not spiked in the way that they wanted to.

Maybe they're not getting quite the amount of attention from Formula One as they anticipated. I don't think that was ever going to happen within the short time they've reentered into Formula One. They've got to give it a few years. And 2021, that might well be the break they need. Yeah, I think commit full resources. is you're right. It's not going to be an instant turnaround. Formula One is not make your own car and put it on the track. It's not a racing series so they can put one of their cars out on tracking advertise it, so to speak, like QT3, where you've got the likes of the McLaren.

They're running their own build car. Of course, it's going to attract attention. BMW are in there, Ferrari are in there. That builds right for a certain model of car. Formula One isn't about that. You are an enterprise, a brand. That's what you're doing Formula One and you try to drive for automotive success. It's put Mercedes and a Pegasool in terms of how good they are.

at engineering, what do you think it's done for their reputation being in Formula One? It's elevating it hugely. Alpha man needs to stick it out. They need to give it more time. And I'm going to say controversially now, they need to change their entire driver lineup than the next two years. Wow. Well, that is the point that we're going to get on to.

More specifically, Antonio Gavanazzi, whether he deserves a place next year. Of course, Kimmy Rykinen at 40 years old, he is still contracted next year, but he might well move on to Paschus New after that. but please expand on that point. You want them to completely go in a different direction within the next two years. Does that include Antonio Gervinazzi being kicked out of the seat at the end of this year? So at the end of this year, I think, again, they need to focus more on the car and development of the car

than they do the drivers for the end of this era. Like I said, the end of this era isn't particularly important. And if you're a top team, you might be able to snatch one cheeky championship, often the saying is that I reckon Ferrari are desperate to do. But Kimi Raijin, I think we'll retire from Formula One come in the end of this era. he's had a great series. He's had a fantastic time in Alpha, May. I think he's had a couple of his best races we've seen since his return to Formula One.

He's done a really good job. And his knowledge is almost, you can't put a value on his knowledge and his experience. It is incredibly large. It's a wealth of knowledge. Giovanni had this reputation coming through F2 and F3. He was considered to be a bit of a young prodigy, you know, young driver, young Ferrari Academy driver, had a lot of people talking about him. I remember hearing his name when I was growing up in terms of learning the overall world of Formula One.

And that was one of the first names I'd ever heard in terms of there wasn't an F1 driver at the time. And I was like, oh, who's this Giavigazzi fella? And he's just not good enough, in my opinion, to be sat in a team of that prestige. There are drivers hanging around the outside of Formula One. There are people like, I know it's never going to happen. But the likes of George Russell driving on Williams at the back of the grid. And there will be other drivers like that who deserve a chance at point scoring at wheel-to-wheel battle. and I don't think Sheevangax is good enough.

He has improved. He has improved. And he's beaten Kimi Riking on a few occasions. Not the hardest thing in the world when Kimi Riking is not his prime anymore and he's 40 years old. So, as always, probably doesn't really care too much about what happens to him. But Chiaving actually needs to be better. You know, he was LeClaire senior. He was the first of that group to come into Formula One and expected to do well.

And hasn't ever really massively impressed me. The same as Gadsley, really, hasn't ever really impressed me. I was going to stand by Gadsley's work. Giavenatsi for me is a long-term option for Alpha and Mayo. They have many other connections, many other possibilities that I think they could learn to grow, develop and help them in the team. I just don't think he's worth keeping on after 20-21. Keeping the stability now.

Ease out Rikin and bringing someone new, then ease out Giavanazzi, bringing someone who, like you said. Or maybe they'll get lucky. Maybe they'll have a full McLaren switch up, bring signs and Norris and have the best time of their lives. Who knows? But regardless, I can't see Giavanazzi being in a lot. that seat or deserving to be in that seat unless he turned into a frippin wonder kid over the next 12 months.

Yeah, I think he deserves the seat next year for two reasons. First of all, there is that progression that we've spoken about. He has got better as the year has gone on and that is completely understandable thanks to how long he's been out of full-time racing. He's got back into full-time racing. He really struggled in the first few races at this year. You can even argue the first half of this race, first half of the season. But the last five races, he has scored points on two occasions to Kimmy's none. And he is out qualifying Kimmy quite consistently. And you absolutely do make the point and the right point that Kimi Reikinen is not, is not world champion Kimmy. He's not 05, Kimmy. He's not O three, Kimmy. He's not that level of driver anymore. So beating him, whilst it is still,

you know, it's still impressive if Jovenatze comes in and beats Kimi Reikinen by a few times in a qualifying session, it's not what it would have been, say, 12 years ago. I think he deserves the seat for that progression. And I think that's what I'm looking for in the year. Because if this is a long-term plan, if he had got no better as the year had gone on, if he had got a few points at the beginning of the year, but there was nothing really to indicate it was going to go even better than that, I would consider getting him out of there. But I think he's probably on that upward trajectory. Now, where is his ceiling? Is his ceiling as high as some of the other young drivers in F1? Probably not, but you need to give him another year to at least find that out, I think. I think you give

him due diligence in that respect. And the other thing is they haven't really got anyone who is absolutely primed to be in that seat next year. If they had, say, Charles Leclair, who was waiting in the wings this year, and he was in line with an alpha seat next year, then I would absolutely say, yeah, sorry, Antonio, pack your bags, income, shall, because, you know, Charles, we know from his junior career that he was always set to be a very, very good Formula One driver. And they just don't have anyone, not necessarily who's good enough, but who's ready. You could argue that Robert Schwartzman in the Ferrari Driver Academy will probably be in a Ferrari affiliated seat at some point. But he's not ready yet. He's only racing F3 this year. And similar with Mick Schumacher, if you want him in

Formula One, he probably needs another year in F2. So I don't think there's any point in rushing either of those two drivers. I think you give Antonio a Givnazzi another year. He ends up being really good. Fantastic Alfa. You've got yourself a driver for the next few years. If he doesn't end up improving much so long, you can bring in one of the other two guys. I think that gives them the flexibility

to work either way. It gives them both options. I completely agree with you. You're right. He has improved and he has scored points. While beating Kimi has got the same thing as it once was, and we compare him to those other younger drivers that have come up through the F2 series. You need to look at his age. He's not a

young driver, by today's standards, anyway, he is 25 going on, you know, now coming to all 26. He's a standard age driver. I think you put him up against Perez. I think you put him up against Ricardo. I think you put him up against even maybe Caviar or Gasly. I don't know if he beats them. And that's what concerns me. I don't think Gio should ever be more than a second driver in an F1 team.

And I think the only reason he stays is yes, the progression. But I think it's because there's no one ready, as you said. And I wouldn't be surprised if we see a full 2021 switch to bring Swartzman and Schumacher into the lineup as Ferrari young drivers and give them two, three years in there to see how they do. For me, he's just not got that raw talent. But I generally do think he's got a place in racing. He's a fantastic driver overall, but maybe got in a top seat in F1. And finally, today, moving on to Sebastian Vettel. He was asked about Charles LeClaire as a teammate and whether he is the,

whether he was the best teammate he's ever faced. And I think quite rightly, Sebastian Vettel said it's probably too early to say from Charles' perspective. But that does open up a pretty wide debate because he has had a few pretty good teammates. Sam, who do you think is Sebastian Vettel's best teammate? This is a massively tough question. Because if you don't remember, Vettles hang out a few teams minutes, just run through it for you quickly.

He's at Kibitza. He's at Heardt, He's at Heidew, He's at Bordeaux, Weber, Ricardo, Riking, Leclair. Those are his teammates since starting in Formula One. We can write off a few of those. Let's see for a start. I mean, he's not going to be the pinnacle of Nettles teammates. The other one that I think we can write off, surprisingly to some, maybe. Mark Weber.

He beat Mark Weber in every single seat in that they race against each other. So for me, that's a given. And the other one is Nick Hydefield. Never ever got a race win. Quick Nick was quick, but not quick enough. Now, that leaves us with, I think, five obvious options. So, Astic Bordeaux wasn't ever good enough to get through to that Formula One, even though you and I've been, we think completely different of that.

We think that he should have had a long and illustrious Formula One career, but not to be. So, Kubitsa, Ricardo, Riking and LeCler. I don't think Vettel ever raised Kimmy when Kimmy was at his best. I think if Vettel was in the same car as Kimmy in 05, I reckon there's every chance that Kimi wipes the floor with Betel, you know? I reckon there's every chance that Kimi destroys him. So I don't think it's Kimi either. I do think, though, same case for Robert Kubitsa, that actually Daniel Recrucich, is the best teammate of the same time that Sebastian Vettler's ever had along the side of him.

Daniel Ricardo wiped the floor with, with Robert Kibbizza, with Sebastian Vessel. Daniel Ricardo came into the team pretty much the same time that Zavati Vettel was king of that team. You know, he'd come up from the junior program. Daniel Ricardo wasn't a really particularly known entity at that point, only been in the sport a few years, mainly into a or so. And it's such a fantastic job against a four-time world champion, beat him comfort for it. And Monsa is the race that springs to mind. He actually sold him the dummy and went clean round him.

You went clean round a four-time world champion or one of your first seasons in a major F1 team. Charlotte, Clure has not had enough time against him yet, I don't think, although he's rapidly becoming one of the best teammates' Vettles had. But for me, Ricardo is the one that currently stands out. If you were to put them current form against current form at that point in their career, I think Ricardo had him. And I think Ricardo at that point was the best teammate that Vetter was got. And until LeCler, maybe does another season and really shows off,

For me, Ricardo is the best that Bessel had. Yeah, I think this largely comes down to how do you phrase the question? Because if you are asking simply, who is the best driver that Vettl has been against? The answer is Kimmy Rikinen, because he's the only world champion of the lot. But of course, as you say, he was not at the peak of his powers when Vettel was against him. And do you phrase the question, who is the best teammate that Vettel has faced in that period of time? In which case, I think you're right that the answer isn't Kimmy. And I'm also agreeing with you to discard Mark Weber as well.

He had nine race wins in five years where I think he had either the best or the second best car. And that's just not enough compared to what Vettel was able to do. Vettel took more race wins than that in one season, alone five. Just a disclaimer. They had 94 races together. 94 races. Yeah. So I can't give it to Mark Weber.

Robert Kibitzer, nothing to do with his talent. It's tough to call them teammates. I know they technically were, but I think in terms of longer established teammates, in which case, I think I have to agree with you in terms of Daniel Ricardo was the best teammate that Vettel had to face at that time. It's really surprising how well Ricardo did when he managed to move up to Red Bull, and he wiped the floor clean. It wasn't even close that season.

Ricardo immense talent had that one that's still his best year in F1 I think he was really sensational that year and he's got he's got the wins to prove it as well he's got seven wins so if you compare that to Weber he's got two fewer victories when let's Red Bull never he's never had the fastest car he's very rarely had the second fastest car let alone the fastest but I will say this I think Charles LeClaire is the most talented teammate that Vettel has ever had. And I include Kimmy in that. I think LeClair has the potential.

Potential might be the better word than talent. For just raw potential, raw talent, Jarl LeClaire, I think, is above them all. The guy has six pole positions this season and how many opportunities has he realistically had for pole where Mercedes weren't so dominant in the beginning of this year? It's not many at all. he's already got double the amount of pole positions that Ricardo has, which is bewildering when you think of it.

I think Leclair, yeah, you have to say that in terms of career achievement, of course, it's Kimi. In terms of at the same time, it's Ricardo. If you're going on pure potential, I'm going with Claire. Yeah, I think you're exactly right. It's phrasing the question. And I think if you were to line peak Vetterl up on like a bar chart and then put peak Kubitsa, peak Ricardo, peak Kimi, Peak Weber, peak LeCla, I think LeCler is the clear winger in terms of just that absolute raw ability. He has turned off at that Ferrari team and he's done so, so well.

I think the pole position you're right. It's Lewis Hamilton levels of raw pace on a Saturday. If he carries on the way he's going, records could be broken once again by this young man in terms of a Saturdays qualifying pace. And even back in Bahrain, when they clearly didn't have the best car, he was holding off world champions. He was holding off his teammate.

mate, he was holding off, you know, Bottas and that Mercedes. He was the composed Ferrari there. Vetter was the one spinning like a table top. LeCler was one that would have won that race if it had not been for an engine failure. And he could have been another 25 points clear at that point. So I think you're right in saying that Charlotte Clare, if you were to put all their careers against each other,

in that time, Charlotte Clare will be the most impressive teammate that Sebastian Vetter has had to face up against. And kind of going on to this topic, segueing nicely. we have referenced this before but the whole dynamic between Vettel and LeClaire now we've had a bit of time to experience that when they have been winning which I think is the number one indicator as to whether a relationship is going to work when the pressure is ramped up do you think there's a long-term future for the two of them within Ferrari? It's really difficult because I think Sebastian Vettel is clinging on to emulating a Michael Schumacher at Ferrari kind of career. I think he desperately wants to be a German man to win in a Ferrari. I think there's a lot of history there. There's a lot of love for that affiliation, that relationship.

And I think maybe next season might be Vettel's last chance to win a title with Ferrari if they get the car right. I think there's a big of a kind of a master apprentice relationship at the moment. If the season ends and the club beats Vettel on points this season and they go into next season, I think at that point they stand as equals in in. talent. Vetter has not the peak of his career anymore. We all know that as much as I love Sebastian Vettel. He is not as good as he once was. Charlotte Clare is on the up. His trajectory is almost a vertical line in terms of how good he could get. And they are at that point where they might next season swap over. And I think LeCleur is going to start putting his foot down. I think him,

come on. This is my team now. Let's still get around me. Vettles had his chance. He's at what, five, six years of that Ferrari team now. So let me be your number one man. I'm going to turn this around. So I do think that this season will be fine. I can't see a long-term future after next season because I think Vettles are a little past it. LeCle is coming into it. And I don't think Vettles achieved what he wanted to achieve at Ferrari. I wouldn't be surprised if we see Vettel maybe take a step away

if there is a driver ready in 2021. If there isn't, I think he's a number two driver from there or how. I mean, we already see that Leclair is ahead of Vettel. It is close. We have to mention that. But Leclair at the moment is ahead of Sebastian Vettel in the standings in Leclair's first year at Ferrari. It's really impressive what he's been able to do.

And I think Sebastian Vettel, for the most part, has also had a pretty good year. I think he's arguably, I think he's been better this year than he was last year, even though, you know, the positions would tell you otherwise. I really think he's had a good year. But LeClaire is just sensational when it comes to qualifying. And I think he will continue to have that advantage on a Saturday.

And the only way in which Vettel is going to be able to remain competitive with Leclair when he gets more experience next year is if he can draw on his many more years of experience in pressure situations, which hasn't necessarily been his forte. So if he can hold his nerve, perhaps in situations where Leclair might lose his call, I'm not too sure.

But yeah, the tide is definitely changing and Vettel just has to do enough to make sure that tide doesn't completely change by next year and hopefully Ferrari give him the car to actually go and potentially win a championship or at least make a claim for one. But yeah, I think that will be very exciting to see at the end of this year and next year. Mexican Grand Prix this weekend, of course, looking forward to that. We'll be reviewing the race on Sunday.

So make sure you keep your ears, eyes and ears peeled for that one. Until then, Sam, get us out of here. Yeah, it will be a late one on Sunday, but hopefully you'll stay up with us to watch. But if you have enjoyed what we've brought you today, then we'd love to get down in the comments. Let us know what your thoughts are on the topics and the videos, and we'll hopefully have a nice conversation with you about the sport that we will love and care about so much.

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