The Late Braking F1 Podcast - Verstappen beats Hamilton by 1 SECOND in Austin! | 2021 U.S. GP Review | Episode 155

Episode Date: October 24, 2021

Well that was a nail-biter! Lewis Hamilton just lost out on victory to Max Verstappen around the Circuit of The Americas, followed home by Sergio Perez in third. As usual, the LB boys are here to break down all the talking points from the U.S. GP.JOIN our Discord: https://discord.gg/dQJdu2SbAmSUPPORT our Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/latebrakingTWEET us @LBrakingSUBSCRIBE to our podcast! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This podcast is part of the Sports Social Podcast Network. This podcast is part of the Sports Social Podcast Network. Thank you for listening to the Late Breaking F1 podcast. Make sure to look out for new episodes every Thursday and Grand Prix Sundays. Hello and a very warm welcome to the late breaking F1 podcast, reviewing the United States Grand Prix won by Max Verstappen ahead of Lewis Hamilton, and extending his championship lead to 12 points from the 6th that he came into the weekend with. My name's Ben Hocking, Sam Sage and Harry Ead reviewing the Grand Prix today.

Well, it's late night, late breaking, as we've just coined it before we started recording. It is 10 past 10 here in the UK. We're not expecting much sympathy based on our luckiness as Europeans for most of the calendar, but we are still committed to getting the review podcast out as soon as possible. Sam, are you going to be even crazier than usual? Yeah, I mean, don't cry for me, Argentina, but we'll push on through for the rest of the hour or so. It is late night, and if you're in the Discord,

you'll know there's a late night with Sam conversation topic there, and it's always wild, so yes, when I'm a little bit tired, and I've had a few sugary teas to keep me going, things like to get cranked up to 11. So expect the party to get starting, as Miley Cyrus once said. I'm interested to know how many people from Argentina were indeed crying, before Sam said that. Answers on a postcard, please.

But until we get the answer to that question, we will discuss some more Formula One related topics. Of course, related to the Grand Prix, that happened today, or just happened as we're recording it right now. As I mentioned in the intro, Max Verstappen taking the win over Lewis Hamilton. It was a strategic battle,

two-stop races all round. But Max Verstappen, getting the undercut on both occasions, ultimately managed to win out, even with a late onslaught by Lewis Hamilton. The surge at the end, not quite enough for the Mercedes man. So the championship now, 12 points in it with just five races to go. Looking at this Grand Prix specifically, Sam,

do you think that there was scope for Mercedes to avoid the loss here? Yeah, 100%. Louis Hamilton, at the start of the racing, everything he needed to do, he was aggressive. The launch off the line was absolutely fantastic. And he takes P1. He's commanding the race at that point. We know that Lewis Hamilton has the ability.

to lead. You know, that Lewis Hamilton is, you know, he's the seven-time world champion. He can make those strategic calls. He understands how a race unfold. So it feels like once again, Maseguis have been so reactive to a situation that Red Bull have just capitalized easily. Checo being there, thereabouts. I mean, he wasn't really present for the top two fight, but he was still just that

little bit of a nuisance, you know, Checo, the disruptor Perez, as we'd like to call him, was just enough to disrupt the flow of Lewis. Hamilton and the Seseese strategists, because I think it calls to a big of, you know, uncomfortable nature when it comes to making a strategy call. I don't think they knew where to bring him in. I don't think they wanted to call an undercut to get stuck behind Perez. Yes, they got a faster car in the straits,

but first and third sector played into the Red Bull hands, very much so with the slow cornering speeds. Hamilton went on that charge, and I think there was only so much Hamilton could do. You know, the ties, Max is a great job of serving his ties at the race. I think Mercedes strategist just didn't. call this one right, but I do think that Red Bull had the better car for the race. I think Max Verstappen showed that one nicely, and it came out on top.

Brilliant race. Incredibly close. Vastappel were worthy winner, Hamilton, but a great fight, less than a second material at the end. It was a really, really fun race to watch, both strategically, on track, throughout the whole grid. But yeah, I think this could be one of the final nails in the coughing for the championship here at USA, which is such a home hunting ground for Mercedes. Harry, do you think that Mercedes could have avoided the loss here?

Do you think Hamilton could have won this race if they strategically played it slightly different? I think it's just such a trickle one. I think if against anyone else, Hamilton overtakes wins that race, easy-peasy. I think they had the right strategy. I think Red Bull did call it too early. We saw Perez's pace, specifically towards the end of the race, he really dropped off and were struggling. towards the end. I know he didn't have any of water, bless him,

but LeCler was closing in fairly rapidly on the dried up prune that was Sergio Perez. But, yeah, so I think Mercedes did have the right strategy here. They made the right call for Hamilton. I just think Vestappen managed to hold

on to his ties that much better. So, yeah, I don't think there's much more than Mercedes could have done, but sounds now laughing on on camera here folks about a tweet that we've done sorry that is very

unprofessional and distracting but anyway Big Shack in the house for reference yeah I don't think there's anything anything more than mistakes could have done here a couple more out that I've seen it now we've gone we're gone Oh, dear.

Folks, if you wonder what we're laughing at, go and check out our Twitter at El Breaking. Harry, you must have done it now, Ben's just seeing it. The way that Big Shaq was on the podium, a big up to Big Shaq was on the podium, and it looks like he's won the race, and it's just the way he stood there. It just cracked me up.

It sent me, so I'm giggling at the old way through. It's not professional, it's not what you've come here for, or is it, I don't know. Either way, I'm having a proper giggle over it. Late night. with late breaking is off to a good start. Yeah, anyway, the conclusion is my point. I think Mercedes did make the right call here.

I just think Verstappen managed to manage his tires well enough to hold off that Hamilton, Hamilton fight towards the end. And like I say, I think a couple more out, so maybe Hamilton hasn't. But it's the way that Verstappen managed those tyres and managed to keep Hamilton behind in the end. Yeah, I think, I actually, I mean, we've, you, Harry, on this. I don't think Mercedes did too much wrong here. And actually, I would place more of the emphasis on what a great job Max Verstappen did versus what Mercedes strategist did or didn't do. I mean, in the first instance, Lewis Hamilton off the line, you're right. He did everything

that he needed to do. I still have to question the fact that the inside line is, you know, second place gets the inside line into that first corner. It still doesn't quite make sense to me. And based on the fact that second place has been leading on the first lap, I think maybe four of the last five or four of the last six races at the US Grand Prix, it should testify to that. You know, as long as you can get a marginally better start, as long as you're on the inside as Lewis Hamilton proved, you've kind of got the corner.

And at least for British commentary, they raised the point that if it weren't for Sergio Perez being the driver in third place, it likely would have been even worse for Max Verstappen, and he probably would have dropped behind whoever was behind him. As it turned out, Sergio Perez was more than happy to concede the position and let Max Verstappen go on his way. Given how close Max Verstappen was able to stay within the Mercedes pace, you know, it was pretty much one second all the way throughout that first stint,

albeit a relatively short stint. I think it proved to me that Red Bull probably had the car to go out and win that race today, and it was going to be on Mercedes to reverse that. even though it was Lewis Hamilton in the lead. I was felt with basically two attempts of the strategists to get it right, that Red Bull would get it right at least one of those two times, and Vestappen would be able to claim the win as a result of that. So I think the emphasis was still on Mercedes,

even though Hamilton was in the lead. But you've got to give the Red Bull strategists, you've got to give them credit here. This is almost the complete opposite to how Spain went. It was a very similar race to Barcelona, all those moments, months ago, very similar to Paul Ricard as well, the French Grand Prix. It was a real strategic one where you could tell even a few laps into the race where they're separated by one second, you could tell that by the end of this Grand Prix, they're probably going to be separated by a very

similar gap, regardless of what happens in between. And ultimately, Red Bull, they managed to establish a couple of things. First of all, track position is key at Cota because they knew that as long as Max Verstappen was good enough in that first sector, which he was, then it wouldn't matter that Lewis Hamilton had the advantage in that middle sector. We saw it towards the end of the race, where Lewis Hamilton was getting closer, sort of one second or so behind, and then Maxwell Stappen would just extend that gap in that first sector due to the dirty air, and he wouldn't get DRS as a result of that. So I think they were able to establish how important track position was. They were also able to establish that that medium tire, even though it was better than soft

tire was a long way of how good the hard tire was. So they got rid of that very quickly in that first stint, and I think they paid dividends from that. But for me, the key here, as already referenced, the key was Sergio Perez, the disruptor. We mentioned this on the preview podcast. Sergio Perez needed to be the disruptor. And that's exactly what he did. He lost a lot of his pace in the second and third stint.

I'm sure we'll get on to that. But the most important thing was for him to be in touching distance. within that first stint. It meant Hamilton could not go much longer than Max Vastappen. It screwed up the strategy from that side of things. And ultimately, that might well have decided the race, just Sergio Perez being there. So I think Red Bull have done a good job

from a whole team perspective. We'll get onto the Vastappan performance in a second. But I don't actually lay too much blame at the feet of Mercedes here. Sam, where you... Sorry, go on. I was just going to say, the point where I would lay,

I don't know really if you can lay blame at them at this point so I guess maybe if you have to do it, you have to do it. It's the engine change for Bottas. That's the problem for me here. Bottas, we were singing his praises, more than we've done so in a long time. Even I was on the Bottas hype train. And Bottas just could not go.

It feels like that Mercedes is just so bad of following any car. Regardless of what it is, and as you've already mentioned Ben, but scaffolding is able to sit less than a second behind Hamilton for the whole of that first. stink, which is almost unheard of at the front in the last kind of generation of F1 cars. Usually the dirty air is too potent that if you can't make a pass nice and quick, you start to drop back on the tyres over heat.

Bottas couldn't get past anyone again. He was stuck behind Sunoda. He was then stuck behind Norris. He was then stuck behind Sons. He was then stuck behind possibly Ricardo going forward. Bottas cannot make any inroads. They changed that penalty before the race. No advantage was given.

I think Mercedes have absolutely blowing it here, thinking they've got a much bigger advantage than they actually had. And I think that's what's cost them. the Bottas is not there to be the disruptor, as Michael Biffa might call him, then it means that they've fallen short and they are losing out big time on that top three attack. So I think that's where Masegis have cost themselves this race weekend. I don't think Bottas, unless it comes out that Bottas essentially needed a new ICE, his sixth of the championship. I don't know why he needs to take that penalty right now.

The Iceman, as he's been donned this weekend and rightfully so for all of those extra component parts that he seems to have taken this second half of the season. Yeah, I mean, that's where my question was going to be directed, because it seems as if that was actually the thing that cost Mercedes more than anything, was that five-place grid penalty that Bottas had to endure as a result of that change. Perhaps they were thinking that Istanbul could happen again. You know, they saw Lewis Hamilton make up the places in Istanbul. Maybe they just figured that the likes of Mercedes, sorry,

the likes of McLaren and Ferrari won't pose too much. of a threat here and Bossass can just saw back to the front and it just it didn't end up that way whatsoever and part of me thinks that it actually is quite track dependent I think it is slightly car dependent as well you're right in that the Mercedes has never really been brilliant in those sorts of spots but I think a lot of this as well is to do with the track because really even though there were a good number of overtakes that happened but the majority of them were were tire specific like either two stoppers making moves on one stoppers or one stoppers making move on no stoppers, or in some instances where the tyre difference was a lot in terms of tire life.

There weren't actually many overtakes that took place where it was a fair even fight, should we call it? So, yeah, an oversight from Mercedes, I agree with you on that. In terms of the strategic battle, Harry, you say you don't think Mercedes did too much wrong. where did Red Bull win this then Do you think it was at the first stop? Do you think it was at the second stop? Do you think it was a combination of both? I don't know

because like I said earlier I think their stops were slightly too early The first one I think was fine But that second one I know Vastaffin's pace was dropping off And he's been caught But I think it was too early to call it

And Christian Horn was playing a bit of poker face On the pit wall When Sky went to him And he didn't reveal although their tyres are pretty knackered. See, I don't know whether their strategy was the thing that won it. They obviously thought track position was important, and in the end that did pay off.

And we saw with Bottas and Hamilton, they couldn't get past. You know, I know Hamilton didn't quite get in real DRS range, but, you know, track position in the end, on a track where you can still overtake relatively easily, as we saw, or there's at least a chance, track position is still key. yeah I guess in that sense the strategy was

the better one but I still don't think it was optimal to use an F1 phrase but like I said earlier I think it was Verstappen's tire saving in that third stint to be honest that got it for him when Hamilton started to close in when you have seconds per lap or a second of lap or whatever I was convinced it was game over from there

but I think that was actually the time when Vestappen was trying to save his tires for those last years last few laps and it obviously paid off. So, yeah, so I think that's probably where Red Bull wanted, to be honest, and yeah, like I said, don't discount the disruptor, Sergio Perez, because

he was just kind of in the way, at least for the first half of the race. So all in a pretty good team performance, but like I said, I think it was the Vastappen factor. If anyone else had been in that car, I think Hamilton would have won that one. Even with Red Bull taking the win, Sam, do you think that they went too early on that

second stop. Make no mistake. It was not the strategy that won this race. It was the brilliant performance from Max Verstappen. Harry's already said exactly how I feel.

You put, I think, anyone else on the entire grid in that Red Ball and take Bastappan out, I think Hamilton catches and passes. Bostappan managed his tyres. We've always praised Hamilton and Perez for the way that they can manage their tyres,

the way they manage their rubber, the way they've got so much to give at the end of the race. You know, we saw Ocon's tyres after the one stop at Turkey. They were absolutely shredded. and Hamilton's were fine. There was only about 10, 12 lapsing it.

Hamilton was literally driving what looked like new slicks by the time that he got his off. We also seen Perez as well manage to bring tyres through that shouldn't happen. But for Stappen, not famed for perfect tireware, never bad, dang it, but not famous for it. And today, his management of speed, of traffic, of ensuring he had the right gap at the right time,

that is what got them this wing. The strategy was fine. It was suboptimal. It was early. I do think they could have a forward in maybe another two or three laps before that second stop and Gustavin would have been able to hold on as well. They had the better car and Max was definitely on top form today and I think that is what won in this race.

It was not how good the strategy was. It was how good Max Verstaffin was. I know the instinct of nearly everyone was that Red Bull went early on that second stop. I actually think they made it spot on. I think they were right to pull him in when they did. Now, what you could have got was a situation. Let's say hypothetically, Lewis Hamilton does get past Max Verstappen towards the end of this race. And we're having a very different discussion here.

And we are definitely questioning. Did they bring him in too early? Did they ask too much of him on that last stint? I think if that had happened, Red Bull could live with those consequences. What I don't think they could have lived with is if they had gone too late on that second stop, Lewis Hamilton had got the undercut and Lewis Hamilton had won the race as a result of that. If they were caught napping, that's inexcusable for me.

They saw what happened in Spain. They saw what happened in Spain to the point where you can't labour the point. You can't wait for these things to fall into your lap. You have to go out there and make it happen. Yes, they asked a lot of Vestappen, but he's a world-class driver. That's why they pay him the big bucks. He delivers when they need him to. So I think they were right to make that call when they did.

again, the undercut was powerful here. Lewis Hamilton had closed up to him within a couple of seconds. What you're then asking is if Lewis Hamilton makes that move first, if Mercedes pulled the trigger, they ask him to go into the pits, you are then asking probably Max Verstappen to pit the next lap and you are putting the pressure not on Max Verstappen, you're putting the pressure on your pit crew, essentially saying if your pit stop is longer than three seconds long,

this is going to be close and he might well, lose out. And if he loses out, then essentially they're in the same position that they were in the first stint where Hamilton's just ahead of the Stappen, but they're on same tires, you know, one lap difference. That is inexcusable. They could not have got into that position. They took the battle to Mercedes. They said that we're not going to get caught out by the undercut, even if it's too early, because Max Verstappen, we know how good he was. And to focus on Max Verstappen for a second, it was an exceptional drive what he did out there and dare I say it, it was the drive of a champion.

Regardless of whether he actually goes on to win this season or not, that was a champion's drive what he was able to do out there today. You're right, the management, what he was able to do. You felt, you know, Lewis Hamilton was clawing away at the advantage and suddenly you're questioning, has he left enough? Is there enough in those tires that he is going to be able to hold him off? And the answer was yes, he had managed it so perfectly. that he knew that Hamilton didn't have a chance.

As soon as he got inside that two seconds, really? The advantage evaporated. He was excellent and that was one of his best drives ever from Max Verstappen out there who's sensational. And with that, driver of the days, how about it? Sam, who've you got? Many contenders. You know, it was an epic race up and down the field.

You know, we saw the likes of Fernando Alonso decided to not leave any of the space. and we saw Sebastian Vettel Claw as way from the back row of the grid into the points again, which is just really, really fantastic. So for me, the only three that are in contention, the four are in contention for Stap and Hamilton, LeCler and Betel, I'm going to give it to Charles LeCler. He absolutely dominated. I made my bold prediction.

We'll talk about this in a minute, that science was going to beat LeCleur by 30 seconds, and LeCleur must have heard this. Good friend in the podcast, in Sheller, he must have listened to me and say, you know what? I'm going to take you up on that one, Sam. I'm going to ruin your bold prediction, and he did. he was phenomenal. He got out the traffic, he was consistent, the place was so much better and the other three behind him. Another fourth place for him. So for me, Charlotte Clair really

showed what he's made of. Goddlerc came through here at Coeter. I thought it was brilliant. Driver of the day from you, Harry. Yeah, Sam's kind of mentioned the contenders for me. Shout out of Vettel for his back of the grid to the points, although that was gifted by spin-y-kimmie um but spin-riking it? yeah

spinning likein oh god oh no how's that only just become a thing anyway um but for me

if you hadn't said Lecler I'll just had Lecler but I'll say Vestappan but Lecler and Vestappen want my two

two contours for driver the rate driver of the day but yeah like I've already mentioned about Vestappan I think

he was the one who won that race today. So, yeah, I'll go for Vastappen, but LeClaire was being, he's been God LeClaire all the weekend, to be honest. P4 on the grid, and then he wasn't far off that podium spot in the end when, you know, that Ferrari doesn't deserve to be there. So, but yeah, first happened for me. I am loving the regularity of God LeCler in qualifying, where there's not really much to choose between him and Sines. In a lot of cases, Sines is beating him in Q1 and Q2. and then with three minutes to go in Q3,

Charles LeClaire's like, all right, I'll turn up. And then he goes and puts in a great laugh and ends up key four on the grid. I'll turn up now. Yeah, it seems to happen a lot more these days. Only two contenders for me. For me, there were two drivers

that were miles above everyone else out there today, and they are the two that you've already mentioned and given the award to. Leclair and Vastappen, I'm going to give it to Max Vastappen. I really do think that was an incredible, incredible drive, a really mature drive that I don't think he would have been able to deliver a couple of years ago. So, and, you know, we can't really look at one result as being

championship defining. But if we do get to the end of this season and Max Westappen does end up winning the title, we can look at this one and say, yeah, this was a stake in the ground for sure. Can I also just give a gongary shout out? Because I forgot, I forgot poor little Yuki, who actually got ninth place and picked up two points. And I have, thought was a right little little legend on the track today. Holding up the top guys was tough to get past. He would make some good moves,

kept it clean. This is what we said for Yuki. You need that consistent race. I feel like this was the best one he's had for a while. So just want to shout out to Yuki. He was only three years away from eighth place. I don't care. I don't care.

He got points. I'm not quite as complimentary about his race as you are. But fair enough. Worst driver of the day, who have you got, Harry? I did consider BOTE's here but actually I don't particularly blame him

I don't think he should have been put back with that penalty anyway so I'm not going to give it to Bodies but seems an obvious one but I'm going to give it to Mazepin because he was a minute and 20 behind Mick

which is that's his teammate you know we've said it before there were for those two they just got to beat each other but it's not even close so yeah

I mean at one point Alonzo retired from the race and it took about a lap and a half before Mazavin overtook him. So, yeah. You reckon he celebrated it. He was over the race. Yes, come on. He was like, super happy. Great move, Nikita, great move.

Yeah, so sorry, Nikita, but not sorry. Sam, are you going for? I also was considering Botties. I'm not going to give it to Botties because I don't. do feel like, there's something in that Mercedes car that does make it, I don't know, so difficult to cut through at certain tracks. And he was all right. He was, he was not great, but he was, he was all right. Also, Norris, I actually feel like deserves a mention here. For all that we've seen from Landon Norris, he was, he finished about 10, 15 seconds behind his teammate, Daniel

Ricardo. He lost out big time at the starting and they got the pace. Carlos, science managed to beat him, even though I think Sykes had a lot more of a hectic racing, a worse strategy. So, I think Norris deserves a shout, but I know it's lack of variety, I'm going to agree, Nikita Mazepin, get off the racetrack. I don't care how much money you got, I don't care who your dad is,

and how much money you can funneling, you are pants. Get out the sport, go to have some practice, because you are rubbish. Well, I had two contenders for driver of the day. Take one, and you've got

how many contenders you've got for worst driver of the day, and unfortunately, there is a very distinct lack of variety on this podcast because it is again Nikita Mazepin. You shouldn't finish. Just Ben's top tips don't finish a minute and a half behind your teammate. You can have that one on the house, Maz.

No worries. I don't know what to say at this point. In a season where there have been a lot of low moments, this might have been his worst race weekend, which doesn't bode well considering it's towards the end of his first season. I mean, apart from Bahrain, which, as we know, famously went very, very badly, that might be the only one that is in consideration. But at least with Bahrain, you can say it's his first race. Fine.

Here, you don't have that excuse anymore. He didn't even spin. The one bright, I don't want to call it a bright spark, but he did only end up like a few tents behind Schumacher in qualification. which is closer than he's got on a few occasions, but all the way through practice and the race itself was pretty dismal, so I'm going to give it to him. The FP3 didn't actually do a meaningful time.

He kept through, kept getting deleted, so. It looked like that was going to happen in qualifying. I got a message from a friend that said, is Schumacher going to lap Mazurpin? And I'm like, oh my God, it almost could. They're only about four corners away from each other the wrong way around the bloody race track. Yeah, I reckon it must be about, only about 18 seconds, I think, would have been a lap or so.

They were doing about 145s, 144s. So, yeah, dangerously close to happening. Oh, dear. Moment of the race. There was a lot going on this weekend at Austin, which is probably a good time to mention, you know, Austin, the race weekend itself. 400,000 in terms of attendance, it seemed like the hype was firmly in Texas. this weekend. But a moment of the race for you, Harry. A lot of contenders here. A lot of contenders. Kimmy Spinney, Spinney Reikinen, could be one of them.

That's not a moment. I was just gutted because he was on such a belting race at that, up to that point. But now I'm going to go for the one that I called out first in our little private group chat as my moment of the race, which was Fernando, don't need to leave any space. Alonso. his move on giovanni just love it just love the blatant he's just baiting the stewards doesn't care anymore doesn't him and the stewards don't get along i mean alpian and the stewards they definitely don't get along um but yeah alonzo absolutely sending it from uh somewhere near washington to talk to yovinawani uh was of sight of the hold didn't make the corner still held onto the overtake

and then Giovannazzi holding on to the position at the same corner and then having to give it back just as Alonso had to give it back to him it's just comedy complete comedy

I think my favourite bit of that was the fact that Alonkso so blatantly celebrates over the radio after making he's a wise guy he's a two-time world champ everyone do the dance

you know the man knows what the track is and where to make a legal overtake yes! Yes! get in there. It's like, you've just passed him while you're in another continent, Fernando, for crying out loud.

Brilliant. Alonso doesn't live to race anymore. He lives to just point out the flaws in the track limit system. And that's all he turns up for nowadays. 90% of the greatness of this race revolved around the Alpha Romeo drivers and Fernando Alonso, honestly.

Oh, God, I could just watch them all day. You're fantastic. I'm glad you brought up Kimmy Reichen and spinning as well, because we discussed this just before we went live, how Kimi Reichen, and this is about the fifth time he's done this this season. He's had a terrible qualifying. He's then actually had a really good race

where he's been able to get ahead of his teammate. He's done a really good job, and then a few laps to go when he bins it. And everyone's like, oh, well, yeah, Kimmy's not very good anymore. It's like, no, he is still pretty good. just, if only races were like 80% rather than 100%, it'd be fine. Maybe he's trying to justify his retirement.

He's like, well, I don't want people thinking I'm too good to stay. Oh, rubbish. I've done well again. He can't be bothered with questions of, do you want to actually stay, Kimmy? He doesn't want to handle that. I mean, that's fair. Well, you've already mentioned quite a few contenders. Which one's getting it for you, Sam?

I mean, that Fernando moment, also with the Alpine, FIA Michael Massey chat like some angry ex-girlfriend or something. Is that okay, Michael? No, no, it's not okay. Right, so ours isn't okay, is it Michael? That was up there

by far, but for me, the moment of this is what I was giggling at earlier, like a child is Big Shack, standing between Max and Lewis on the podium. It's out of place. He's taller than Lewis off the bloody podium, which is a layer.

He looks like he's won. He looks like he's superimposed onto the podium. It is comedy gold. Comedy gold. I love it. I don't know why he rode in on this giant, weird, long horn bone car,

either. Is it the only car he can fitting? I don't know. He's clearly very tall. That for me, Big Shack, just as a person, is my moment of the race. It was fantastic.

He stood there like someone's dad. His pose. Yeah. Well done, son. Prong of you. Honestly, 7'2, big diesel, Shaquille O'Neill coming in on the long horn car

is the most American thing I think I've ever seen in my life. If it wasn't for my moment of the weekend slash race, which was for no reason, a fire-breathing octet, in the middle of the surface. I admit I wasn't concentrating that point looking at my phone and I just looked up at that point

and there was just fire on the screen and I was like, oh my God! And then there's like, oh wait, it's just an octopus. It's Austin, Texas. It's understandable. Big shack, that's a big track, dig a big clap. You're right, though. There was so many contenders here for a moment of the race. before we move on a quick review of our quite excellent bold predictions from the weekend well let's let's start off with sam so good news in terms of so sam's bold prediction was that carlos signs would beat charles leclair by 30 seconds or more good news is it was more than 30 seconds

bad news is it was the amount that chau leclair beat carlos signs by not the other way round um got that wrong so wrong on that one harry's bold prediction was that Fernando Alonzo would finish on the podium. Really close one there. Could have gone either way. And my bold prediction was that Botas would let Hamilton win on the final lap of the race. The problem is for that bold prediction to become true, Bottas would have had to been leading, which he definitely wasn't.

So a very bad weekend all round for bold predictions. But there were a few in the Discord that did better than us. So well done to you. Yeah, I think that someone in the Discord literally decided to. you're the opposite of my bold prediction to smite me. That tells you the type of reputation I now have with the predictions in there on the Discord. Folks, if you want to put your bowl prediction in for the next race, Discord link is in the description heading over.

Over 200 people in there now, and it's crazy. Everyone's having a great time. In fairness, going directly against us and delivering the opposite bowl prediction. I've heard of worse tactics. Put it that way. There are plenty of worse ways to go about it. Really should. Let's move on to Sergio Perez because he finished on the podium for the second race in a row and only the third time this year.

So it does seem as if he's picking up a bit of form. Time-wise, a long way away from the top two by the end of proceedings. But he was close enough to play a part in the tactical battle in the first round of pit stops. So looking at what he's been able to do the last couple of races, Sam, do you think that Red Ball are somewhat vindicated? Do you think they should be encouraged by the decision that they've made to stick by him in, 2022. I don't think you should ever base anything on just one or two races, but he is 100% showing the right signs.

I think there was a chat between, I think, I can't believe I'm saying this between, I think Paul de Rester and Brundle or something like that, and they were talking about the fact that they spoke to Perez during the week, and Perez said that he was no longer trying to go down the same route of car setup as Max Verstappen, and he was just trying to be a bit more independent with how he learned the car, and he was becoming more comfortable with things, and all of a sudden, it seems like he's come to life a little bit. And I think a few Vastappan fans, just for a moment, especially on the Saturday, suddenly saw Perez being Nort's point Norton and thought, hang on a minute, Perez is qualifying and he's doing it well. This doesn't happen. Vamanos, Perez. Yeah,

the man was, he really stepped it up today. I mean, he still wasn't there with the top two, and it's very funny how quickly Max Verstappen and Lewis Hamilton can make everyone else look average. It's hilarious. But, as we've already said, Perez, you know, the disruptor absolutely did what he needed to do today. He made it hard for the Seagis. That's exactly what Red Bull need from the number two driver. They don't need Perez to win a race. They don't need Perez to do the championship. They need Perez to make the Segey's life bloody difficult and to pick up the extra points so they can take the league in the constructors and so on, so forth. Perez has had two really, really strong races. If he can finish off the season, the same way that he's starting it in Turkey

and carrying it through, he is fully. justified that seat for 2022. He's on the right track. I am loving where he's going with it. Keep it up, please, Perez. I don't want to see a slump next time around. Harry, what did you make of Perez's second consecutive podium? Do you think Red Bull can be relieved

or at least slightly relieved by the decision they've made? Definitely slightly relieved. He's, like we said, the disruptor, he's doing the job that they need him to do finally. I don't know it's been a bit of a struggle for him this year, you know, bar the

winning Baku has been not the greatest season for him. But, you know, I've heard that he's starting to go a different way. I'll set up to Vestappen, and that's evidently helping him, especially these last two races. And, yeah, that form he was showing Kauly yesterday. I thought at one point he was going to be on pole, and maybe he had that little sprinkling a rain not happened towards the end of Kuali. Maybe he would have him.

But, yeah, I think he did what they needed him to do during the race, especially in that first stint. He wasn't there towards the end, admittedly. whether that was to do with the lack of water on quite a hot day in Texas, you know, remains to be seen. But certainly within the first half of the race, he was there being in the pit, well within the pit window of Hamilton, you know, five seconds behind or whatever,

which was giving Mercedes a bit of a headache. So as long as he continues that form, I mean, let's be real, he's probably just tearing us up for a win in Mexico and then Mexico City will implode if he wins. That would be cool to see. But, yeah, if he keeps this going, this sort of form where he's at least being annoying at the start of the race before Hamilton and Vastappen do what Hamilton and Vestappen do and just pull away from everyone else, then that's exactly what Red Bull need.

To be honest, it's what, I was thinking this, if they had someone like Bottas who sometimes wins and beats Hamilton or beats Vastappen in this case, that's not what Red Bull need. They need this sort of Sergio Perez type person who is, really on the pace, but not too much on the pace, and can be there to be annoying, but then drops off towards the end. That's like a dream scenario, I think, for them. So, yeah, as long as he can keep that up,

then it's exactly what a Red Bull want, and they'll be vindicated by keeping him on for another year. Just to clarify your position on something, you will be happy if Mexico City implodes. I don't mean literally. I mean, with joy, and celebrations as Sergio Perez wins at his home race, obviously. I like Mexico City.

Not that I've ever been. Again, I'm going to make this plea. I'm going to make this plea to our listeners. There's thousands of you. If any of you are millionaires and you would like to help us out and fly us to Mexico City for that race, please get in touch. How? When we...

Literally every podcast episode, we insult a new nation. in some way. We are running out of nations for someone to want to help us. I didn't insult Mexico City then. I just said it would be great. If it's imploded. Are there any millionaires

from Singapore that would like to get in touch? Don't think we've insulted you yet. By questioning if there are any millionaires in a nation, you have therefore insulted the nation. I think who listened. to this, not just generally the population.

Oh, God. Oh, dear. You can tell me tired, folks. It's very evident, isn't it? In terms of Sergio Perez, because we were talking about him at some point in time, you know, two straight podiums,

whereas there's only been one for the rest of the year, that's got to be a good sign, right? And you're correcting what you say that, yeah, he doesn't need be winning races, as long as he can do what he did today and disrupt, being the disruptor, that is enough. And I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt, because there was more encouragement from this weekend that there was discouragement by a long way. You could say,

well, he ended up 45 seconds, I don't know how much it was in the end. He ended up a long way behind the top two by the end of proceedings. Lecler was eating into the gap that he had towards the end of the race. You know, you could look at those and say, that's, that's a bit worrying. But I'll look at the first stint. So the first stint they were on, even keel. Everyone was on the medium tires that had been going for a couple of laps. His pace was good. It was good enough. The second stint, he had to go back onto another set of medium tires that were used mediums. I know he'd only done one lap on them, but the medium tire, as was shown throughout, was not a good tire versus the hard tire. So I'm not surprised to see him drop back in that second stint.

And in the third stint, given the heat in Texas, given that he didn't have any water, I'm willing to give him a pass on that. That that's, is at least a leading contributing factor to why he wasn't on the pace and the third stint. And ultimately, look, Max Verstappen and Lewis Hamilton are far better than Sergio Perez. They're far better than 99% of drivers that have come into the sport. That's all right. Red Bull are aware of that. It's not a shock that, oh, we signed Sergio Perez and we thought he'd be as good

if not better than Max Mustafa. They were under no illusions what Sergio Perez was when they signed him. And, you know, that's absolutely fine. He's there to do a job. He's showing far more signs of doing that job in the last couple of races. And now suddenly, it looks as if constructors championship-wise, he might be able to help them out a bit. Maybe they could take him both championships.

It's on the table at least, thanks to his recent round. Now, in all seriousness, we have, We have mentioned the Reichen and Alonzo Jovenazi situation already and suitably laughed our heads off at it. But there is a serious point in there somewhere and that is that Kimmy Reikinen and Fernando Alonzo went side by side through turn one.

Kimi Rykenen forced out wide was able to get the overtake done on Fernando Alonzo. He wasn't then asked to give the position back. So our question is should there be a look into the rules as to what is and isn't allowed when you are off the track or rather forcibly put off the track when side by side. Sam, do you think that Reichenen should have given this position back? And what's your view on those situations more generally? So I'm going to talk about the situations more generally first and then I'm going to use that logic

to look at the incident that we saw. So when two drivers are coming together are of course will-to-will on the track and one driver goes off the track. You at least look at the reason as to why the driver is off the track. Let's take Alonkso versus Giavanazzi first. Alonso, when going down into the hairpin on the back straight, he completely missed his breaking point, didn't he? And overspeed, you carry it all the way through, he shot straight across the track.

Giavanazzi did a very good job to be aware of it to not get in the way. And Fernando Alonkso technically used that overspeed from off the circuit to come back on the tracking home, Agventagas manner and clearly celebrate an overtake on Giavanazzi. Now, that event when Alonso went off the track and made an overtake stick using that momentum was entirely of his own doing. No one was put him under pressure, no one forced him off the track. He did that himself. He used the off track running that we have here, if there was gravel folks, who wouldn't have that issue, to getting a momentum advantage, right?

The difference, I believe here with the Riking situation is that at this point, if Hanu O'Lonkso is doing the defending, Kimi Riking was attacking at the moment, Alonkso went down the Ying. Kimmy Ryking around the outside. Fernando Alonkso, for the man who is famed for saying all of the time you must leave of the space, decided that that was no longer a proverb that he would follow in life, and he continued to just keep driving the car to the edge of the track. Now, in my opinion, it's not Kimmy Reikung's fault that he had to go off the track there. What was Kimmy Reikung going to do? Stop the car, literally stopped the car and wait for lots to complete the corner before he was able to carry on.

I don't think that's fair on Kimmy. Kimmy tried to go around the outside. he was more than firing up alongside. Alongso was fully aware that he was there as we saw because he kept opening up the steering wheel. On board footage showed that. I feel like Kimmy has every right to stay there and keep on the fight.

So I believe that security needs to look at these off-track incidents, such as we look at actual penalised crashes or pit-laying incidents right, they need to be a case-by-case basis. And there needs to be a penalty or rule structure that allows for this to be consistent. If you go off the track because you've been

forced off the track and you carry on fighting wheel to will, then it should be the aggressor that's forced you off the track that pays some kind of penalty, warning, whatever it is you might want to do, whatever you see fair. But if it is someone who is, like Alonso the second time, deciding to go straight off the hair-pying around and then sees the position of Giovannazzi, then again, Al-So is the person who's taking advantage of this through no fault of his own. So Kimmy should not have paid fault in the first instance. Alongso in both times here, should be the one that is looked into either with a warning or the penalty and I believe you should be giving a very strict time principle to hand a position back as well. It's not kind of a,

or let's have a debate or let's have a conversation over the radio whether it's a good idea or let's text Michael Massey and be really grumpy about it. It should be message of the stewards you have until X place on track to give this back or you will receive a five second penalty or a drive-through penalty or something like that. That's how I think this gives to be handling a case-by-case moment. Fernando Alonso managed to do both. Both sides of the coin wrong today, which is very unusual for Andrew alongside, but he was definitely in the wrong in my opinion. And I do think this needs to be handled on a case-by-case basis. I do want to think it is a one rule suits all occasions. Kim Raikin, in my opinion, what's not

in the wrong, he deserved to fight alongside. Harry, we saw Alpine or heard Alpine over team radio to Michael Massey on this one. Is overtaking allowed off track? No. So why was Reikin and then allowed to do it. They question the rules there and then. Do you think that the rules are right? And do you think they should be changed? Well, the problem is the ambiguity between the different situations. And I think the only way you're going to stop that is just being complete, you know, one rule,

which is you can't overtake off the racetrack. And the problem is because it's co-turned and there's just run off everywhere that isn't grass or gravel. And I totally appreciate sounds point that he, Raglan has every right to be there. But, you know, as long as it's not blatant, I think if you are the driver defending and you've got the inside, the inside line, the high ground, so to speak, you have every right to kind of walk the driver out to the edge of the track. I was watching Toron car today, which is kind of where this has come from. And it happens on about every corner. But, but, you know, it's kind of, fair game because if you're the driver defending on the inside and in front

and someone's trying to come around the outside, why do you have to give them space enough to get through? So, yeah, so I think, yeah, it's the ambiguity between these different situations where they're trying to judge it case by case, which is what is causing the problems. I just think, did you ever take off the track? Yes, we have to give it back. I think you do it like that, one blanket rule and get on with it, or you just put grass and gravel back,

and then that problem will never exist ever again, unless someone brings a rally car, which is probably not going to happen, unless it's Kimmy, maybe. But yeah, that's kind of my take on it, because, I mean, I get what Lonza was doing. Like I said, he's just trying to bait the stewards for a reaction, but it's just too inconsistent. in Bahrain, you know, Vastappen versus Hamilton.

They didn't ask Vastappen to get out of the way, but he overtook off the track and Rebel realized it was going to be under investigation, so you had to give it back. And he was off the track because Hamilton squeezed him off the track. So that's why he was there. So, yeah, I think that should be the case all over. If you're off the track, you can't overtake. I'm actually going to take one element of both of your arguments here to give you my view.

So I actually agree with Sam like 95% of the way there. The only thing I disagreed with what you said, Sam, was that there isn't a way to judge this on a non-case-by-case basis. I believe that there is a blanket rule as suggested by Harry that can be applied. The only thing is I think there is a blanket rule that can be applied, but it's going to go directly against what Harry just said. I think my view is if using this situation, my view is if you are forced off track

when you're side by side and you make the overtake off track, fine, absolutely fine, because you've been forced out there. If you don't want him to overtake off track, don't force him out there. Simple as that. And you'd soon find that people would actually

stick within the confines of the track knowing that they're going to be punished if they force these drivers wide because they then have the liberty to go and overtake off track. Now you're right in what you say with the gravel and the grass and that's probably the best solution overall. 100% agree with that.

But if that was grass and gravel, let's take Red Bull Ring as an example. Alonzo has just put Rikin in the gravel and Alonzo's been given a five second or ten second time penalty for it. So if there isn't any grass or gravel there, should the actual result be that Alonzo can just run him as wide as he wants and then if he forces him off track, then, hey, he's kept the position because there's nothing he can do at that point. As soon as you run him off track, you know he's in a position where he can only file back in behind you.

So every driver is going to surely do that at every single opportunity, because why wouldn't you? That's the easiest way to keep your position. I think that if you're side by side, if you are judged to be side by side through a corner, regardless of inside outside, if you are forced off track, fine. go ahead and make the overtake because the only reason you're out there in the first instance is because the driver that you're fighting against has decided to put you out there. And again, I think that this would actually ultimately resolve itself very quickly

because defending drivers on the inside would soon learn that they can't do that anymore and you'd actually get more side-by-side racing through corners as a result of this rather than the inside driver just chopping off the other driver and forcing him off track. I appreciate that's a long way from what the rule set is at the moment but that's my view on it I have no sympathy for Fernando Alonzo in that scenario none

I think the biggest key rule on this is that you know we're always told you leave a car's width that needs to be applied to every single scenario Kimmy Riking was following up alongside you leave the car's width if you drives around the outside of you then Kimby's absolutely done your son and I think um I don't think Fernando likes it much as we are massive Fernando fans, I think he was outdriven a little bit on the wheel to wheel

by both the Alpha Romeo drivers at one point. Maybe he needs to go back to a racing hash drivers at Turkey. It'll be fine. Put. Oh, it's not been a great couple of weeks for Fernando, as it? He's had a good season overall, but not a great last couple of races. Yeah, we were really singing his praises recently as well.

Maybe we should stop doing that. Damn. Always happens, doesn't it? As soon as we start to give credit to a driver, be careful. That's why Bossas didn't do very well this race. We were giving him credit after. The fact is rude for Mexico.

Yeah. Mazepin's going to win in Mexico if we use our strategy. Moving on to last topic of the day, which is looking at the McLaren versus Ferrari Scrap. Another chapter in that one, and it's still incredibly close between the two teams as we head into the last five races of the year. But one of the highlights of today's race was how well Daniel Ricardo did,

beat his teammate, and in terms of pace, they're pretty good. So, Harry, if you're looking at McLaren versus Ferrari, Ricardo's always been the big question mark of the four drivers in terms of form this year. Given what we've seen today, is this actually quite uplifting for McLaren going into those judgment races? Yeah, I mean, there was a, I don't know if this is maybe watching Sky of the weekend. and there was kind of chatter about how Ricardo is still really struggling against Norris. And I don't know, I felt it was slightly unfair. You know, he won in Monza, fair and square on that one.

Sochi, he had, I know Norris was leading, but he still in the end beat him and finished P4. And I think he was actually having a solid race. Last race wasn't great. But then, again, this weekend, he's been on form again. So I think it is beginning to come towards him. Again, he did win a race. but he kept forgetting it.

I know it's a bit of an anomaly, but he did win a race. So, yeah, I think it is encouraging. I think Ricardo's starting to come into the, you know, the zone that we expect him to operate in here. And yet today was another example of it. You know, LeClau was in a class of his own in that battle. But, yeah, I think Ricardo looked like he had the advantage of on Norrisal weekend,

which is, you know, arguably the first, maybe second time that we can say that's happened this year. Monsa being the other time so yeah McLaren have got to be encouraged fair play to them I'm not saying to suggesting they were going to sack him or anything but you know for keeping

the faith I think we've we've all recognised that Ricardo maybe takes a bit longer to adapt to a team but once you get him or adapt to a car but once he gets in that zone he's pretty damn good so fair play to for Macca for sticking with it

and sticking with him because a lot of other teams rebel might have got rid of him. So, yeah, I think it's encouraging, definitely for the rest of the season, but also going into 2022. I think the situation between the two teams

is that they absolutely need Ricardo to be on a similar form to what he had today. Otherwise, McLaren will not win this battle against Ferrari, even though they actually hold a slender lead at the moment. I think Ferrari have come into too much form coming into these last few races that they need their two drives. And to be honest, even if Ricardo is on form, that might still not be enough, but you've at least got to give it that chance.

And Sines and Leclair, we had this discussion coming into this season, who has the strongest lineup on the grid. And I can't quite remember. Sam might well have given it to Leclair and Sines from memory. But they were definitely a part of the conversation. And that has proven to be. They are both brilliant drivers. You're right. Signs was slightly screwed by his strategy today, but in terms of pace, LeCleur was fantastic. Signs has been great all year.

And if you haven't got too strong McLaren drivers, given how good that Ferrari car's been recently, it's going to be a real struggle for them. It's going to be a struggle for them one way or either way, but it's going to be a massive struggle if they've only got Norris up there. So there have been a few more encouraging signs recently. In my view, it's not all going to come together until 2022. to. I think the car is just in terms of his driving style,

that is definitely playing a role in this. So I don't think there's going to be any way he can completely erase everything this season and be on pace. But as long as he can do enough like he did today, that should at least give him a fighting chance against Ferrari. What do you have used on it, Sam?

I know obviously they're incredibly close in the constructors, but the points are really starting to come together between each driver. And considering that we've almost not written off Ricardo, because you can't write Ricardo off. He's absolutely incredible behind the wheel of a Formula One card. But he had a very slow start in comparison to his teammate. There's only about 43, 44 points between them now.

Obviously, Ricardo's picked up that wing. I think Norris has got the most podiums of anyone outside of those top two teams on four, I think it is. And the gap is closing between Ricardo and the Ferraris as well. I think there's only about 20 points between Riccario and the Ferrari. So Ricardo is buoyed. The form six to the summer break is massively improved. I think the biggest issue for McLaren is not Riccago, it's not Norris, it's Charles LeCler and Carlos Seitz. I know that sounds like a really obvious and silly thing to say, but those two

are phenomenal this season. I think that Ferrari has been tough in certain elements. I think Lecler is doing a brilliant job. I don't think anyone expected Carlos Sikes to be this good only three quarters of a way through his first season with the new team. The fact is, what, six points behind, Charles Lecler, who previously beat Saraski and Vettel, I think anyone expected. Carlos Science has been that competitive that quickly. I think he has got more pogims than any of the other ones, apart from Norris. I think he's just behind Norris and Perez now. So, science is on it.

I don't think it's Ricardo that's the problem. It's science that is their problem. I think McLaren will have had this sewn up, actually, if science is adapted so quickly. So I just can't see McLaren holding on to this at the moment. I think Ferrari have got the momentum. They've got the form. Science is so comfortable in that car now, the pace that he's delivering race after race. even if it's not always going his way.

He's still pulling out really, really strong performances. He beat Norris today, of course. I am really, really impressed with both those Ferrari drivers. I mean, Ben, you were right. I did say at the start of the season that I believe they have the most competitive line up on the grid, and I think they're displaying it. So, yeah, Norris has had a couple of tough ones over the last three or four races. Riccardo is improving.

Obviously, got that win, which is fantastic. It's just whether they can now put it all together. It seems like it's always one driver of the other, whereas with Ferrari, they're so close together on points because it's always both of them, being consistently good. Never incredible, never perfect, but always very good. And I think that that is going to be enough

to carry Ferrari over the line against Macquarang, not Ricardo now finally improving at the end of the season, unfortunately. I've got to say, and I agree with what he's saying, Sam, but Ferrari still show signs that they can bals this up

with that five, seven, six second pit stop. Ferrari can always find a way to mess things. Don't you worry. Don't you worry. They'll find a way. They always do. Oh, they're reliable if nothing else. All of this, I don't want to jump the gun here,

but all of this talk about the end of the season and where teams will start to finish, we've got a really good idea now of championship positions. It's making me excited for all of our review podcasts of our predictions coming into the season. That could get very tasty indeed. I don't think I'll ever have been this wrong on the predictions. I think I'm the two-time champ at the moment.

I think I'm going to be last, I think. You are the defending teammate wars champion two times in a row, after you, of course, stole my crown after I won the first two years. Harry, love you, man. The Checo Perez of late-breaking predictions. I mean, I've actually got, this is very me, I've got a spreadsheet with all our predictions on it, so I'm ready to go for when we do get to that.

Um, who knows? Who knows? Maybe this is Harry's year. Who knows? I think that that's going to do it for our review podcast. The one thing that I need to mention that hasn't been mentioned to this point, but it's definitely important.

Nicholas Latifie, we need to give him credit because he is the man who has done something that no one else has ever done before. He has found a way for Lance Stroll to have bad starts to. races crash into him. He's cracked it. Lunch strong. You see, he seems to make up six places every single race, but not

not if you're the wrong way around, as Latifie managed to find out today. I was in a half sandwich. A lot of sandwiches going around recently, aren't there? A lot of sandwiches. Yummy. I do like a sandwich, to be fair. Oh. It's 10 past 11 folks here in the UK.

I think we are at our end now. But we will be back. We will be back slightly fresher midweek for another podcast. You've got a lot to look forward to. Sam, at some point we're going to get a segment in there for you where you are going to have to forcibly read out positive things about Valtry Bottas after he proved you wrong and took a race win. I can't wait for that.

Yeah, I think we might open that up to the Discord as well. then maybe submit a few statements as well just to really chuck on the paying. I think it's what I deserve after such a ridiculous, clearly ridiculous prediction. How can I make such an audacious prediction? But shall we, shall I get us out of this one, Ben? Go ahead.

Folks, we will have a midweek podcast, of course. There's no race. There's no race next weekend because it is Halloween time. This is Halloween. Scary for us all, all of us Formula One fans who don't get a race, of course, next weekend. We shall all cry in the day.

darkness and the scary world. But we will be back midweek. We'll be talking all things Formula One. There's been a lot of debate, a lot of interest. Please join us. Please hit the follow button. If you are new to the podcast, you haven't. Join the Discord, the links in the description.

Let us know what you thought of the race. And go and check out the Big Shack tweet that is over on our Twitter at Elbreaking that saw us given like small children because we are just that silly and that tired. Thank you for listening in the meantime. I understand the same. I've been bad, Hodgton. I've been Harry 8 And remember

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