The Late Braking F1 Podcast - Which F1 Drivers deserved more from their careers? | Episode 81

Episode Date: October 14, 2020

In this week's podcast, the trio discuss who they think deserved from their F1 careers, talk about Hamilton's path to greatness, and play another round of 'F1: Who Are You?'Make sure to SUBSCRIBE! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This podcast is part of the Sports Social Podcast Network. Thank you for listening to the Late Breaking F1 podcast. Make sure to look out for new episodes every Thursday and Grand Prix Sundays. Hello and a very warm welcome. This is the late breaking F1 podcast. Hope you're all having a great week to this point. And, well, if that is the case, we'll do our best not to ruin it for you. No guarantees, though.

My name's Ben Hocking and these two Muppets of Samuel Sage and Harry. Eid. How are you, gentlemen? Oh, hi, bro. What? I've never heard you speak for such a short amount of time, Sam. It was a Bert and Ernie sketch. It was the Muppets. I was fine. I'm now miserable. Well, there you go. So Ben said, we hope you don't ruin your week. And we already have with a really poor Bert and Ernie reference. At least I cried. Let's talk about Formula One.

Slightly closer to our wheelhouse. coming up on today's show, Lewis Hamilton, after matching the record for most wins in a career, we ask whether that achievement is enough to swing the goat discussion in his direction. And we're going to have a look back at his career. What has been his best season so far? What's been his best race so far?

We're going to bring back F1, Who Am I? We're going to have Sam versus Harry. I mean, it's a battle, battle to the death, pretty much. You might be overselling it, but, you know, it will happen. It will happen. But first of all, we asked a question on Twitter earlier at Elbreaking to get involved, if you're not already. Who is the best driver, never to have been given a car worthy of their talent?

Harry, kick us off here. Any names that spring to mind? Luca Bedouwer. Sure. Ricardo Rosset. Ricardo Rosset. Physicella. No, just go for a serious answer. I think this one was actually on our Twitter.

But Pascal Verline, he's a pretty recent one. I didn't actually rate him that much, but I think he definitely deserved more in F-1 than a manor and a salber. Sal was circa 2017. Yeah, he probably deserves. Look, at the end of 2016, I remember we were all teeing him up for, you know,

the teeing him up for the Mercedes Drive when Rosspa retired. So, yeah, and that went slightly downhill. But he still had a pretty good career in FE. Another one is a man we listened to almost on a weekly basis, which is Martin Brundel. I think he deserved more from his F1 career. I'm not saying he was the greatest talent we've ever produced in this country for F1. But he was a driver who took Senor to the wire in the British F3 Championship.

and he just never really got that break. He was partnered with Schumacher in 92, and yes, Schumacher beat him. But I think Brundle kept him pretty honest and probably deserved to keep that seat for 93 because Petrazi came in 93, and he was about 78 years old by then. I think Brondell deserved that seat more than he did.

And then he went to McLean in 94, thinking this could be it, and then they put a Pojo engine in the back of it, which kept blowing up, so that didn't work out. either. Yeah, I think he deserved more from his career. So my firm answer, I'll stick with Martin Brundle. But there are lots out there, I think. Yeah, I think given Martin Brundle's end of career, yeah, he's pretty, I'm pretty sure he's got a hatred for Peugeotot engines. I doubt you'll

have to see him in one. Anyway, good answer. Sam, have you got one of your own? Yeah, I mean, I agree everything that Harry said that those were very good options. I've had other ones such as I think Perez, you know, if he got in the right car at the right time, he could really have done some damage. It was a little bit unlucky with that McLarency. Highfield, man who sits under a tree, Quicknick, one of our very own favourites here at late break.

And I think if he got something a little spicier, you know, at the right time, he could have really been a strong race winner. Maybe you had a chance at a title. I don't think he may have ever won a title, but the fact he's never won a race. I think he's a real shame. Brundle is also a great show

also never won a race, amazingly. But for me, and I'm going down the route of never winning races, I'm going to start with a quote. It's quite a famous quote. I've done some research to find the quote, which is a rarity. The quote is,

if you became an undertaker, people would stop dying. And I think we all know who I'm talking about already. It's Chris Aeman. Now, that man was ridiculously fast throughout the 70s. I think at one point, I've got a stat here.

I think he got poll. I think it was at the French QP by pretty much over a second or around a second, which is mental. They had such bad reliability. The man had such sheer talent that he definitely should have won a number of races across his career,

if not possibly a championship if things actually went his way. But in my opinion, Chris Eamon was robbed of glory. And I think that the guy really could have been a hero of racing. But some people would just have bad luck. So he must have done something

in our previous life because it just never turned out the right way for him. But he's brilliant. It is brilliant. And I think a lot of the legends respected him and saw his talent. It just never got that final little bit to come his way. So for me, Chris is the main man who should have had a little bit more. I absolutely love that Undertaker quote about Chris Aymann.

It just sums him up absolutely perfectly. And I would agree that he is worthy of a place on that list, especially in the Ferrari in the late 60s, the French Grand Prix that you referenced, which might well be the focus of a video at some point in the near future. But yeah, I completely agree with that one. I've got a few names of my own. And actually, there were a few answers to this on Twitter

that I very much agreed with. So one of them was another British driver who didn't win a race, Derek Warwick, who picked up a few. podiums. I think he had four podiums, all of which came in one season in 1984. But, yeah, Warwick just seemed to turn up at the right place at the wrong time. He joins Renaud just as McLaren get that 1984 season. That McLaren was so dominant in 84, Prost and Lauder. No one else had a chance that year. But he moved to Renaud a year after they were definitely in contention to win championships

with Pross there. And he moves to Brabham a few years later after not being able to get anywhere with the Renault team. Brabham, of course, just, I think three years earlier or so had won the championship with Nelson P.K. But Brabham, that was as good as it got for Brabham. The late 80s and the early 90s were pretty horrendous for them. And Warwick had to go through that. And by that point, his career was kind of done and dusted. He spent a few years at, I think he spent a few years at arrows and footwork possibly towards the end of his career.

But it feels as if, like, if he just got that one break earlier in his career, his 84 season at Renault was really impressive. He did a really good job that year. But unfortunately, that was as good as it got. Never quite got the car that was capable of his talents. Elio de Angeles, for me, definitely worthy of a place here. This one's slightly different as a deaf kind of. This isn't necessarily a full career. This was sort of a half career that was cut short.

But De Angeles was third in that 84 season behind the two McLaren's. He only just lost to centre. People forget how close he was to beating Etton Sena across a full season at Lotus. Etton Sena won that year 3833. To go so close to beating someone like Etton Sena just proves to tell him that he was. and he passed away in 86 so we never got to see whether he could go on to win that championship

and whether a car, he could get into a seat where that car could give him that chance. Recent times, I mean, yeah, Sergio Perez, as you say, never quite had that car. People will argue he had that move to McLaren but by that point the McLaren was no good. Arguably he's had racing points and force Indians that have been better than that.

that McLaren was in that season. John Eric Verne as well, I think he deserves a shout. I think he deserved to go up to Red Bull over Danny Cavillat at the time. Vern beat Caviatt when they were teammates. And Red Bull went, we'll take Daniel. And Bordeaux. Bordeaux. Yeah, Big Man deserves some love.

Sebastian Bordeaux. What a guy. But yeah. That funny. but yeah, Jean-Hen Eric Vern. He's a quality, and he's proven it in Formula E as well. You know, as soon as he transitioned, he's proven how great a driver he is.

And considering all of the, you know, the Red Bull system hasn't been brilliant over the last few years. It's been a bit of a rocky road. But, yeah, he would have felt, he would have done a good job in there, no doubt about that. And the last one I'll mention is a bit of an outside pick, but Hans Joachim Stuk, who raced an F1 in the late 70s,

had great success in pretty much everything he did. He won championships in super cars. He won Le Mons of three times. Essentially, every championship he went in, he ended up winning. But F1 just didn't work out for him. He was stuck in March cars that were past their best. March were fairly good in the early 70s, but fell away in the mid-70s when Stook was there.

He was shadow and ATS he raised for, neither of which were great teams at the time. The only car he had that was reasonable was in 1977 when he partnered John Watson at Brabham, and he beat John Watson in that season in his first year at the team. Really impressive. But they decided to ditch him after that season because Nicky Lauder was joining the team after winning two of the three previous championships. Tough one on Sturke. I understand obviously why they went for Lauder, but they decided to partner him with John.

and Stuck never got a chance in that 78 Brabham which was not the best car thanks to the Lotus that year but it was it was fairly handy and he'd have had a chance in the fan car as well there might be a video about that in the future hint hint so yeah those are my ramble names there's plenty there to digest but if I had to pick one I'd probably go for I leo de Angeles I mean you could say he was schuck in the midfield but go on Thank you. Thank you. Oh, God.

One driver, who we love to bring up as well, just to quickly touch at him, crazy genre lazy. Oh, I know, my hero. Worthy ever mentioned, Sam? Yeah, 100% worthy of mention. Although he did have plenty of opportunity. It was more he made the wrong choice, I think,

unlike some of those guys mentioned, who were far better than opportunity ever presented for them. Fair enough. Do you think Jean-Alaise is part of the deserving to be on that list, Harry? Yeah, I'll stick crazy, crazy John Lacey on there. Don't look at his eyes. No. Don't make eye contact.

Yeah, although I do agree with Sam. Perhaps he made the move to Ferrari when he could go on to Williams, but hindsight is a wonderful thing. And as Carlos Symes is about to find out, the move to Ferrari is pretty irresistible. but yeah, far more worthy than just one win to his name was Jean Lacey, that's for sure. Yeah, I think we can all agree on that. So moving on to our next topic, which is Lewis Hamilton,

because of course he did match Michael Schumacher's record at the weekend. So 91 victories to his name, the exact same number as Schumacher gives him an opportunity at some point this season to go and beat it. I think it's fairly inevitable at this point, and it's a question of when rather than if. Sam, do you think that the record, or at least matching the record, does anything for who the greatest of all time, that discussion? I mean, sorry, I'm eating some chocolate.

I think you come to me yet. Oh, sorry. What kind of chocolate are you, Stan? Yeah, go on. I haven't bought it, but it is still a good one. It's Derek Cadbury's dairy milk, fruit and nut. Oh, that's a solid choice. It is, right?

I really enjoy how squishy the raisins get in the chocolate. I think Ben's about to disagree. It's the Nico Holkenberg of the chocolate world, really. It's just not worthy of that podium. Close, but not worthy of the podium. Let me video out on this soon, folks, comparing F1 drivers to types of chocolate. Just stay tuned.

On the actual topic of Louis Amitaine and greatest of all time, stats definitely have a long way to play in that decision. I mean, people look at Michael Schumacher and the first thing they think of is seven world titles, the only man to have seven. They did look at him and say the only man to hit 91 race wings. There's, you know, statistics play a part in what you do,

especially when it comes to sport, right? That is what governs time. So you can't compare the cars that they're racing. They're not relevant. The eras are too different. You can't compare the competition, all different drivers. Their teammates may have been up and down. Hamilton's definitely had harder teammates,

but Schumacher was definitely more dominant and able to construct a team around. him. These two drivers are by far, I think, now, heading shoulders about others. There are others up there for other different reasons, but in terms of the history of F1 and names that will be remembered as the most successful drivers ever, I think it's always going to be between Hamwards and Ishimacker. And I think you have every right to pick one of the other for every reason you want to. Goats can't be decided, I don't think. I think you can have a selection. I don't think you can ever say that one definitively is better than the other, because they'll

never race properly side by side or at their prime. We'll never see them at the same machinery. So yeah, you can say Senna, Prost, Schumacher, Hamilton, you know, whoever you're going to throw there, they're all worthy to mention in that conversation. But you can never get a statistical proper answer apart from these statistics, you know, the wings, the qualifying, the poles, the fastest laps, the races entered, the championships. And Scenario's cause a different answer to come out each time. So Schumacher is, of course, one of the biggest legends in motorsport. Formula One, sport across all time. And I think Hamilton in his later years

is going on to create that culture, that ethos, that outside influence and impact on the sport that Schumacher did have. I think his driving talent is also brilliant. I think he's a better sportsman than Schumacher. But then again, I think Schumacher is better at creating a team around him. Each have their own ability,

their own skills, their own merits. So, yeah, I think it helps Hamilton, again, to carry on being that discussion. But if you were silly enough to not have Hamilton in that discussion before, he got this record, then I don't go if I respect your opinioning F1. Harry, someone who doesn't think that Lewis Hamilton is the best driver around right now. Go check out that video.

Thank you for that one, Ben. Yeah, no problem at all. No worries. Do you think that the record does anything for discussing who is the greatest of all time? So the other day, Sky, if you haven't seen already, I've only seen one of the first. episode, but Sky are doing this race to perfection documentary. And Martin Brundle, one, episode one, says something about Hamilton. And he, is he top five easily? Is he top three?

Very, very possibly. But it's all subjective. And it's a, I like the way you put it, because it's such a, such a subjective argument. But, you know, as Sam said, the stats do not lie. He is now, he's a, but, you know, he's about to equal in championships. He's just equaled Schumacher's race. record. So at some point, statistically, he is likely to be ahead of Schumacher, in which case, that statistically makes him the greatest of all time. But as I said, it's such a subjective

question and topic that, yeah, whether people were, and myself included, will put them at the top, who knows that there will be people who put Sena at the top or Fangio at the top and they won far less races and championships than Hampton, Will and Schumacher ever did. So, yeah, does it help? I guess in a way, yes, because it's taking him on the way to being statistically the greatest of all time. The title Schumacher once held. So yeah, I guess in that sense it does help. But like I said, it's such a spicy topic, isn't it? That no one's ever going to agree who is the greatest of all time. Yeah, I'm of the similar thinking to Sam really that at 90 wins, Hamilton was well within

the discussion for greatest of all time. At 91 wins matching the record, he's still within that discussion. And at 92 and 100 wins or whatever you like, he's well within that discussion. But there is no way to get that definitive answer. Numbers as people who know me will already know about me, I love numbers. They're great. Statman. Stapman, as Sam likes to call me way too often.

But statistics, they have their limitations. You know, are we saying that Jean Alaisie and Pastor Maldonado are exactly the same in terms of ability? You know, they've got one win each. I'm not saying that, not by a long shot. Is Pierre Gazley better than Chris Eamon, one win to none? No, he isn't. And this is probably going to be your favourite one, Harry. Does that mean that Jacques Villeneuve is better than Sterling Moss?

One championship to none. I don't believe any... Good use of sound effects. Yeah, very good. I don't believe any of those are true. Yeah, if you were to just look at the numbers themselves and nothing else, it would tell you a completely different story. It links back to the first topic to an extent in that it is more than just,

numbers and there's a lot more to it. Sometimes drivers will get to be in the right place at the right time and sometimes it just won't work out for others. Some drivers have more sustained success. Some careers have been cut short and we're left wondering exactly what they could have done, especially in the case of like Jim Clark and Senner where they still had years left in them to win more championships. How many more would they have won? That's an answer no one will ever be able to give. So yeah, Lewis Hamilton is definitely in the discussion for the best of all time. And yeah, the way that Martin Brundle puts it is very good. You know, I would personally say he is in the top seven and where you put him in that top seven, it doesn't necessarily matter as

long as you put him somewhere in there. He is one of the best of all time. There's just too many factors to consider. You have got championships and you have got number of race wins as, you know, the record that has been matched this weekend. But you've also got to consider. how many races they entered, as a percentage, how many races have they won? You need to think about who their teammates were. And I would agree with you, Sam, that Hamilton has had over the course of his career

better teammates than Michael Schumacher. And where you are at the right time, as I said, that's so important. Where were your teams previously? We know how good Schumacher was developing a team. We know Schumacher when he went to Ferrari, it was far from the finished product. Lewis Hamilton went to Mercedes when it was closer to being so.

All of these factors combined will give us all our own answers to this question. And that's okay. But there's no definitive answer. There's no one person who can say that this is correct and that that isn't correct. Especially not Amazon. Especially, especially not Amazon. Just kidding. Hey, Keke.

I love you. I would personally put Hamilton still just behind Schumacher and Fancho. but I've got no problem if you've got him as the greatest of all time, to be perfectly honest. Just in that wonderful spiel there, Ben, where you made so many good points, you did refer to it as the best of all time. And I now have a wonderful image in my head that everyone refers to it as the goat, but you refer to it as the boat. To me, that's just fantastic. I mean, you know, I was born and raised in a fishing village, so... You're the boats of all time.

I guess it's only natural for me to go down. that path. Anyway, let's move on to something else Hamilton-related. Looking back at his career, he's had, how many years he had an F-1 now? Is it 14? Is this 14th year? He's been around a while when you think about it.

It just makes you feel really old. Yeah, crazy. I mean, all of those race wins, 91 of them, Sam, is there one that stands out to you as being the best? There's quite a few that stand out to be absolutely brilliant. Oh God, I can reel off so many.

2013 and the Hungara Ring was absolutely fantastic. The 2011 German GP the Urbegrin. We spoke about many times, actually. The start he got was fantastic in that race. 2008 again in Hockingham, Germany is a good one for him. But I think the absolute top one, the one that – there's two that I will always remember. Bahrain against Rodberg, one of the best on-track battles I think we've seen in the last decade of racing Rosberg. But up such a brilliant defence.

He went toe-to-to-toe with them all race long. And it was constant, F-1 back and forth. Undercut after undercut, round the outside, slip streaming, late breaking. They were so good. And Hamilton just showed his class by taking that top spot. But for me, the absolute best race of Lewis Hamilton's career is 2008 in Silverstone. the conditions were so awful. It's his homegrown proof

which makes it a little bit more special. It was only a second season in Formula One. And you just think that there were so many fantastic drivers who are unable to even keep it on the track. And he just flew around. You know, Weber's gone, mass has gone, drivers that were considered to be

so brilliant at the time. And Hamilton, only the second season absolutely dominated. And it was such a, a brilliant race. It was such an iconic race for a British driver at a British track to win like that. So for me, that is Hamilton's number one victory.

Harry, would you agree with that? All fantastic races. I want to say a race that's not an F1 race. Is that allowed, Ben? Yes. Well, I'll allow it. Okay. It's Turkey 2006. Oh, fair enough, yeah. I don't

think I've seen I mean, Hamilton's had some fantastic races, all of the ones Sam mentioned. But, yeah, Turkey, 2006, he, you know, this is, you take out the equation of Formula One cars being different, you know, varied in performance. He's in a GP2 car, as it was back then, nothing, with a GP2 engine. Thank you, Alonzo.

GP2. And he spins, I don't know what Laffer was, very early on the race, drops all the way to the back of the field, and then fights all the way back through the race. and, you know, GP2 races are shorter than F1 races. And yeah, he just made pretty much everyone look like a mug. I don't think he wins it. It comes back to second, but it's just a complete ridiculous performance.

But yeah, that's probably my favourite. But yeah, Silverston, 08, Barring, 2014, all very good. Hockenheim 2018 as well. Yeah, fantastic, Ross. A solid one. Yeah, and maybe Singapore 18, but purely for that collie lap. That might be one with the best collie laps I've ever seen.

Podunculus, isn't it? It's incredible to watch a board. It's the Sena Monaco 88 equivalent. Yeah, it's exactly that. It's the modern equivalent of that. Oh, it's so good. So, yeah. But yeah, he's got quite a few cheers for one, actually.

91 to be precise. Yeah, I mean, I'll throw another one in there, actually. Monaco last year. That was a pretty impressive drive. But I would agree with Sam as much as I dislike to do so. 2008 Silverstone, I think, is his best race. I think it was the race that really confirmed to everyone. Like, this guy has not only got the capability to be a world champion.

This guy's got the capability to be one of the best of all time. At least that's what it said to me. Because I think at that point in time, we'd seen what happened in 2008. seven. We could already tell that this guy was extremely talented, but that kind of a dominant performance just put him to that next level of, okay, watch out this guy. If he gets in the right place at the right time, as was the case,

he's going to make things happen. He could cover line and going back to him, qualified on pole because he is a qualifying God. But that lead didn't last very long. I think it was about four laps or so. And I don't think, I think apart from one last, Lap Lewis Hamilton pretty much led the rest of the way. He ends up winning by, I think it was just over a minute back to Nick Heidfeld in P2,

because of course quick Nick second in such tricky conditions. On a day as well where his main championship rivals, so, you know, Kimmy Reichen and struggles, Felipe Massa, I think he might have spun 86 times that day. He's still spinning. He might still be. Bless him, he really struggled that day. But literally the whole field was having difficulty. Horrible day, everyone's spinning around.

And Lewis Hamilton, he just kept his cool and he kept going. And being able to, back in the 60s in the 70s, winning by a minute was not completely out of the ordinary. I think Jackie Stewart won one race by quite a few minutes back in the 60s. but it very rarely happens in today's day and age. You very rarely see what races won by more than about 30 seconds. So to win a race in the modern era by over a minute, seriously impressive accomplishment. But yeah, like you say, there's so many more to choose from.

I mean, on that day, he really was the boat of all time. He was the boat, the absolute boat Lewis Hamilton. He sailed to that victory. I'm not even going to acknowledge. that one. It's so good. You're better than that, Sam. All right,

rather than best race, let's have a look at the best year of his career because again, there's quite a few to choose from. Sam, is the one that sticks out to you? Oh, this is actually, I think, a more difficult question

than the best race of his career. 2018 was astounding. That was the year, of course, that Boss hasn't got a single victory in the same car as Hamilton. And I think that's the year that Hamilton broke the points gained by any one driver in one season.

The man, I think that season was just brilliant. But I mean, 2007, it's his first season and he loses the championship by a point. And that's only because of the stupid mistake he made in China, he drove up into that gravel, which I wonder, will haunt...

If he ever wins this seven, I reckon that would haunts him forever. But fortunately for him, he's going to. The current season is also fantastic for him. It's so hard to pick because he is genuinely so brilliant. Pretty much every... I mean, he's the only man to ever win a racing every single season is ever competing in, which is just an astounding record.

I'm going to go with 2018, I think, but I reckon you could come through pick any other than 2016. Yeah, maybe not 2016. Harry, what season comes to mind to you? I'm going to go for... 2015 and I'm going to say this because knowing what we know now about how tough it is to be Lewis Hamilton's teammate especially current era Lewis Hamilton um Rosberg gave him a fair run for his money in 14 obviously 16 he won it in the end um but in 15 Hamilton Hamilton won it easily he won it by the US US GP and I know he's done that in recent years but then his

competitors been Botas or the Ferrari team, which you know, were good sometimes but not all the time. Yeah, and I think that he completely crushed Rosberg that year. Rosberg threw a hat at him. Oh yeah, that was funny.

But yeah, and I just think knowing what we know now about how good Rosberg actually was against Hamilton, which we maybe didn't appreciate at the time. I'd pick that one out as, it's not necessarily it's memorable one. It's a championship number

three, I think. But yeah, I think that's just he just, you know, crushed it. Oh, yeah. No one's going to stop him. I mean, no one can really stop him now, but, you know what I mean? Not even the goat's head, Errosberg. The one. I'm not even the what?

The goat's hair. The goat's hair. The goat hair of Rosberg. That's what popped his hat off. Look at this. I mean, now you've mentioned the whole cap incident at U.S. it just makes me miss the squabbling Mercedes, to be honest. No disrespect Bottas, but you'd never catch Bottas throwing a cap at Hamilton, would you?

I'd love to see it. They'd pretty high-five while it happened. Fair enough, yeah. Never mind. It was good at once. I think 2015 is a fair shout. to be honest, although I am going to have to regretfully agree with Sam again. I'm going to go with 2018.

It is a surprise. It is a surprise. I think 2018 is the only season where Lewis Hamilton and his team did not have the right to dominate, yet he still did. In 2014, 15, 16, the car was good enough that they should have dominated. 2008, of course, he won the championship. but he didn't dominate that season. 2018 for me is the one that sticks out is the Ferraris were, in terms of performance, I really don't think there was much in it that year. I think that was the closest.

And you can argue, you know, Sebastian Vettel's mistakes made it easier for Lewis Hamilton, and I would agree with that. However, Lewis Hamilton still had to maintain that consistency. In that, and Valtrey Bottas not winning a race that year as well, as well as say that that wasn't the best year for Valdry Bottas, which I think is true. It also says that, well, the Ferraris were pretty good that year, that he didn't have many opportunities to win races.

Lewis Hamilton still managed to come away with a dominant victory. I know it was fairly close halfway through the season, but he really sped away in the second half. And, yeah, I just don't think he had a right to have dominated that championship. Yes, I mean, his car was good enough that he should have always been in contention, but the way in which he won it, for me, is the one that stands out. And I think the question itself is obviously, what is his best year, and 2018 is the answer for me.

I think if you were to flip that question slightly and say, what is his most impressive year, I would then go back to 2007, because, yeah, I don't think it was his best year, but the fact that what he was able to do as a rookie driver in F1 is remarkable, it's one thing to be landed in a car that is as good as that McLaren was in your first season. Yes, there is an element of fortune to that, but you've still got to take advantage of it.

You've still got to beat a two-time world champion team. Okay, he drew with him. But the fact that he was even contending with someone who has just done that and has got all those years of experience in F1. So impressive. And he should have won the championship that year. It was his own mistake that was his undoing. So I don't have, and knowing what we know now in the amount of championship is he won, I don't have a great deal of sympathy, to be perfectly honest.

But it was a great year. And there haven't been all that many first season. that have been so impactful. I mean, besides Jacques Vilner, obviously, to get him in there again, Harry, in the last 25 years, in the last 25 years, there have not been many,

many debut seasons like that. So that would be his most impressive season for me, but best, yeah, reserve for 2018, like you say, Sam. Yeah, 2018, just for a bit of contact, Bostas got zero wings, Hamilton picked up 11. I don't know how.

many other seasons there being where the two drivers in the car that won the Constructors Championship have had a gap of that much and one of the drivers have won none and one of the drums of one of the 11, especially with no team orders available pretty much as well all season. It was so, and of course,

the Singapore qualifying lap. I mean, I'll watch it again and again and again. It's just fantastic. It is a good one, no doubt about that. Let's get on to what we will dub as the main events. We've got some theme music at the ready. Harry, go ahead.

F1, F1. Yeah, it's not quite F1 back and forth, is it? Nothing is. Nothing is. All right, to explain the rules of F1, who are you? So we've got six drivers, and I'm going to give the guys three clues as to who it is,

and they have to guess after hearing those three clues, who it is. They'll take it in turns, and the person who gets the most wins. You will have the opportunity to steal a point if your opponent gets it wrong and you get it right. So bear that in mind. And to keep things fair as well,

so I've numbered all six, one through to six. So, Harry, if you wouldn't mind going first, pick a number and that's the one you'll get. Three. All right, number three. Here are your three clues to who this driver is and play along at home as well, see if you can beat these two Muppets.

I debuted in F1 in 1978 for N's. sign. Oh, Jesus. I once called Nigel Mansell, an uneducated blockhead. And I took my 23rd and final race win at the 1991 Canadian Grand Prix. 19801, sorry, 1991, I missed it. Thank you. Sorry, I'm trying to work out myself. Well, I didn't know it from the first two, but I know it from the last one. that makes sense now why he would have called an Ida Mansell.

Was it? An uneducated blockhead. Is it the rude insult? I'm saving that one. Yeah, can he use that one again. It's Nelson P.K., I think. Are you going to have to stipulate? Is it Nelson P.K. senior or junior?

Right. Well, it's not the one he crashed into the wall on purpose. It's his death. Very old for his debut for R1on 1 in the last. late mid 2000s. Yeah. Well done, Harry. The point goes to you. Nelson P.K. is right. Sam, any number between one and six that isn't three. I'll go four.

All right. I debuted in F1 in 2012. My teammates in F1 were Timo Glock and Guido van der Gard. And I finished fourth in the first Formula E race. What? First Formula E race ever. Yes, ever. Several bad puns later. That's all right, Sam.

I'll let it out the pauses here. No, keep it in. It's embarrassing. Oh, I think it's Charles Peak. It is Charles Peak. Yeah, keep the pauses in for dramatic effect. No one wants to listen to pauses. Porzick now.

All right, so one all after the first two. four to go, Harry. What's the next number you're going to choose? One, please, Ben. Number one. I'm the only driver from my country to race in F1. I scored just one point in my F1 career at the 2004 United States Grand Prix.

And I raced for two teams, Jordan and Menardy. Oh, yeesh. Oh, God. is it oh god those like Minardi Jordan back

back of the packed drivers just merge into one floor but nothing it is no I don't

I don't know I'm going to have a punt at Christian Albers I'm afraid it's not Christian Albers which means it does go over to you Sam

if you know the answer oh bumgagner Well, I'll allow it, despite the less than perfect. Yeah, it is Joel Baumgartner. So 2-1. Sorry because of the name. Did he drive for Jordan?

He did, yeah. I love that car. All right. Sam, over to you for the next one. Two, five, or six? Number six, number six. Okay, number six. I was disqualified from every race that I started in my debut season.

My first of nine podiums came in 1992, and my career ended in 1996 with Jordan. I just Google that 2004 USGP. There was only eight finishes. Well, that's why he's got a point. Fair play to that man. Oh, why, come on, Sam, it's Jordan. You know Jordan.

I didn't listen to it. Ben, repeat, please. I was disqualified from every race I started in my debut season. My first of nine podiums came at the 1992. Sorry, came in 1992. My career ended in 1996 with Jordan. Oh, it's Brundle. It is, Martin Brundle, yes.

What a lad. Yeah, so he started his career at Tyrell in 84, and that car was disqualified from every race that it entered. I didn't know that. Yeah, for fuel reasons. Something along those lines. All right, you've got two to choose from Harry, 3-1 down. Number two or number five?

I go for two, please. All right, number two. In my two seasons in F-1, I competed with different nationalities in each. I scored no points in F1 and I was the fourth driver to race for Red Bull Oh, yikes. Is it Robert Dornobbs? It is Robert Dornobbs.

Well done. The Montgasca Dutch. I didn't know he did under two. What was he player? Yeah, he competed under a Monagasc licence, maybe in his first season. I can't remember which way around it was. But yeah, Robert Dunboss is correct,

which means Sam, you're left with number five. My first win in F1 was in August 2006. I was disqualified twice in my career, 2007 and 2015. And my last win came in 2008. Oh, that's some cheeky phrasing, I think, from Benjamin. I was going to have to try and think of race winners. in 2008. That's the only way I'm getting this clue, I think. Felipe Massa, because he retired, so he drove badly around the track, then he?

Yeah, Felipe Massa's correct. Yeah. He's qualified in Canada 07 and its home race in 2015. Last win was Brazil 2008, which I'm sure he remembers very fondly. Great win. Harry, you gave that one to me, by the way, with that cheeky phrase in line. Cheeky phrase. Shaky phrase. So, well done, Sam. Four to win.

He takes it back. The title comes to Croydon. Because where all titles go, eventually. They come to die. All right, well, I'm basking your victory, Sam. And whilst you do that, if you wouldn't mind getting us out of here for this podcast episode.

Yeah, you can imagine that folks, I'm looking at the microphone with a big Jeremy Clarkson's and smugface. If you're looking forward to see some more of that, go over to why you should try. channel we've got a good video coming out about our top seven drivers that we think currently are on the grid check that out it's a good one some spicy action there we'll be back next week all together lots of new content together for next week's podcast for the portemal portemal

portemarle yeah we're going to forward to seeing you there in the meantime i have been samuessage i've been ben hocking and i've been eric van de paul and remember keep breaking late podcast network.