The Late Braking F1 Podcast - Will Lewis Hamilton not return to F1 in 2022? | Episode 171

Episode Date: January 12, 2022

In our second podcast of 2022, we're discussing whether Lewis Hamilton will walk away from the sport, talk about a potential contract for Sainz at Ferrari, and play F1: Higher or Lower...JOIN our Discord: https://discord.gg/dQJdu2SbAmSUPPORT our Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/latebrakingTWEET us @LBrakingSUBSCRIBE to our podcast! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This podcast is part of the Sports Social Podcast Network. Thank you for listening to the Late Breaking F1 podcast. Make sure to tune in for new episodes every Wednesday and Grand Prix Sunday. And a very warm welcome to the late breaking F1 podcast presented by Sam Sage, Harry Yee. And me, Ben Hocking, the winter of despair continues. There's still no F1. I've had enough of the winter break now. It's run its course. It's time to get Formula One back.

I mean, Sam, you're probably an expert in this. How do you simulate F1 in your day-to-day lives? I'm thinking like shopping trolley races. Like, how do you get by? Well, I was upstairs in the kitchen. Yes, my kitchen's upstairs. I'm that confused. I live in a flat. We have two floors. It's very odd.

And, of course, often you tend to service something in a kitchen. And whilst making a cup of tea, I had to do the undercut, putting the tea bag in the mug to get to the kessel. first, got the jump on the other tea creator in the house, and managed to get back down the stairs into the spare room. Of course, you join the podcast. It was very efficient. 2.3 seconds on the pour with milk.

You know, you have to... You know, how darey the crowd chimed in. Obviously, you have to make the most of this. It's hard to fill that level of competition until Formula One comes back. I'm surprised how much I immediately miss it after the ridiculous drama that is still going on on social media, everything related to the finale but i'm immediately like let's just do another race now thank you that'll be good i mean abdabia was quite literally a month ago today uh and that that doesn't

feel that feels about a year ago already but to answer your question that you gave to sam ben i just following in nick knolls on twitter now that's it's true late f1 apparently he's not very happy about something that happened at abidabia i mean i didn't catch the race myself but i hear it was a little bit controversial. He's only done about 15, 30 tweets about it so I think you

might catch up. I heard he's starting a new show FIASOS. That would be coming out on F1 broadcast soon. We've got the niche British reference in early. Thank you for that Sam. I'm sure it won't be the only one.

Massively appreciate it though. We're going to try and fill the F1 void for you ladies and gents. Positively or negatively, I can't promise anything, but we're going to fill the void nonetheless. We're going to be talking Carlos Sines, potential contract talks with him at Ferrari to extend his stay with the team. Oscar Piastri, as we know, will not be on the grid this year, but as reigning Formula 2 champion, we'll be looking at teams that might want to prize him away from the Alpine program. And F1 higher and lower makes a reappearance later on. Sam, looking for revenge after his loss in F1 order please last week. Will he get that revenge remains to be seen?

But we're going to start with a topic that we almost definitely covered last year and we're not suffering with deja vu. It's just that it's come about again because all the way into the lead-up into the 2021 season, we were talking about Lewis Hamilton, is he going to race this year because his contract wasn't settled at that point? The good news is his contract is settled this year. So we thought we might actually avoid this topic this time round. Hard luck. We haven't got that. Lewis Hamilton, is he going to be there in 2022?

A lot of questions asked whether, after what happened last season, he's actually not going to be competing an F1 this year after all. Sam, if you had to put a percentage on this, how likely do you think it is that Lewis Hamilton will be there in that first race in Bahrain? 100%. I think it is pure trickery, pure trickery. pure games. I think that

both Lewis and Marseis think what they're doing. Lewis, I think also deservingly walks a bit of a break from social media.

I don't think he's just playing you know, you blink, I don't know what the game is. What are they call it the Wild West where they have the

a shootout right? When they have the you pull your gun draw first. I got you, yeah. Yeah. I like a you blink I blink.

I think that's a good thing. A. okay a staring contest. But yes, you blink, I flink is the new game. I think Mercedes and Lewis know exactly what they're doing. I think that the silence is almost quite deafening in terms of the pressure it's putting on the FIA.

It's causing so much of a stir in the media. Just look at Nick Nolz's Twitter, everyone. You know, the people are still talking about it over and over and over again. Journalists everywhere are writing about how the FIA have to do something. Lewis Hamilton's not going to come back. The biggest star in Formula One, people are claiming everywhere that Lewis Hamilton is bigger than Formula One itself. Now I'm not going to put my opinion on that matter, whether I believe that's the case or not. But there are enough people going around saying that he is that it warrants being spoken about.

And I think that they know what they're doing. They are playing a very, very clever game. They are trying to get a decision made and cemented in the books and sorted before any Formula One activity happens for 2022. There's also being screenshots, I guess is the right message for them, of the FIA board going around, where the single-seater governing person is no longer Michael Massey than it was in 2021. It has only got one game now, not two.

Michael Massey has been removed from this whole board area, which is very, very interesting. And I think they're just looking to get as much justice as possible out of the situation. I think I think Mercedes would be panicking a little bit more.

He's on the website. You know, he's appearing on their marketing materials. He's in adverts for them. There's too many other things going on that involve Lewis. I know it's contractual, but you know, they have a lot. of love for him. I think they allow him to be a little bit out of the loop if he chose to be out of

the loop. Lewis Hamilton's not going anywhere. He wants at least one taste in these cars. And I think he knows full world that Mercedes have got the car to potentially challenge again. They didn't develop properly in 2021. I think they're going all out again for the new era. They did it last time with the hybrid area. They're going to do it again with this new closer racing era of Formula One that were expected to see. So yeah, Lewis Hamilton will 100% be at the first Grand Prix and at testing, despite what happens with the FIA. No doubt whatsoever from Mr. Sage. Harry, are you up around 100% as well?

I won't go for the full 100 because I am famously wrong literally everything I'd say. But I'm going for 95%. I think he'll be there when it gets down to it. And whether it is a scare tactic or he is, as Sam said, just simply taking a break from everything, Yeah, I think he'll still be there. He's just taking some time off

and making the FBA, excuse me, sweat a little bit as we get nearer and near towards the season. I love that he's literally said nothing since Abu Dhabi. So there's nothing in a month, basically. And now journalists are picking it out the air that he might actually not be coming back, which is just F1 media summed up. We love a gossip.

We love a rumor. I love that they picked it out from the fact that he said nothing. So, yeah. But I think he'll definitely think he'll be there when we get to testing. I mean, imagine if he didn't do testing and just came to the first race. That would be bantled, wasn't it? Imagine that's the point. Yeah.

See you later. Cheers. I'm angry now. Yeah, exactly. So, yeah, I think it'll be there. And I don't think whatever the FIA decides. side will determine it. But it'll be interesting to see what comes out of this hearing.

But like I said, I don't think it's going to affect. And, you know, in the end, I think Hamilton is a race and he loves to race. So I think if he's satisfied that he can go and do that still, then he'll still come back. And any disillusionment he has from Aberdabie may be carried over, but I think he'll still, the love of racing will still override any disillusionment. have from leftover from that last race. I like how you've already mentioned it, Harry,

that his disappearance on social media, whether that be temporary or permanent, it seems to have caused journalists to think, well, he hasn't said anything. Maybe he's not coming back. I dread to think what they were, where they were like 20 years ago when social media didn't exist.

Were they all flapping about in February? Like, none of them said anything. We might not have a calendar this year. None of them are going to do anything. Said a word. Look, social media quietness and not racing in F1 this year. It's like that good old meme where you've got the no correlation graph whatsoever. One does not lead to the other in any way, shape or form.

Let's put it that way. You've said 100% Sam. Harry, you've at least given it 5% for he's not coming back. I'll go with you, I'll go with you, Harry. It's 95% 100%. He's going to be there. I said the same thing last week. I know a lot of people seem to think it depends what the FIA investigation comes back with,

like what they determine. I don't think it matters whatsoever what they come back with. I still think he'll be there one way or the other. I think those who expect the FIA to turn around and admit that they made these crucial mistakes. I think you're kidding with yourselves just based on everything the FIA have ever done. You know, whenever the FIA have been under duress

from a decision that they've made, it's always been a case of they've doubled down. They've never gone back on their word. They've never gone back and said, well, actually, you know what? First time around, we made an error there.

We'll hold our hands up on that one. That's not an FIA tactic. We saw what happened in Brazil. They made the decision not to investigate the Vestap and Hamilton incident there. After the race, they were left with the decision. Do we admit our error?

or do we actually say, no, you know, what, we back ourselves in that spot. They took the latter of the decision. So I'm pretty sure for this FIA investigation, they're going to come back and say, well, they acted within the realms of what they believed to be. And they will use those sorts of words to cover ambiguity and vagueness. But, yeah, I don't think they're going to admit fault. And I don't think it matters what is in this report, because it will still result in Lewis Hamilton.

racing this year. And ultimately, him not racing would go against everything that I've seen and witnessed from Lewis Hamilton. Lewis Hamilton has had a lot of success. In terms of pure race wins, he's had more success than any other driver on the grid ever. So he knows what he knows what he's doing when it comes to Formula One. I know, I appreciate that's not a bold statement. It's not a bold statement, but he knows what he's doing. Even so, now, folks, when you see that. Yeah, please do. Even so,

he has faced adversity in his career. If you think back to 2007, what happened there? You know, he loses out on the championship on the final day. What does he do in 2008? He comes back stronger and he wins the championship. 2016, he loses the championship to

Rosberg. I know Rosberg wasn't there in 2017, but what does he do? He comes back and he wins the title again. And I appreciate those situations are not the same as this situation, but it's still being knocked down. It's still losing out. And his response to losing out before has been to get back up and fight it. I've got no reason to believe that's going to be any different this time. I think he'll act in exactly the same way. And just imagine if he doesn't race this season. Of course, it's new regulations. We don't really know what's going to happen with the cars. Could you imagine a situation where Lewis Hamilton goes, you know what? I'm not happy with the FIA. I'm going to sit this season out. And then George Russell coasts to the championship because, Mercedes have dominated the regulations. Lewis Hamilton sat there like,

I don't think I played this one very well, to be honest. Could have had a title there. That's not going to happen. He's going to leave it open. He knows that Mercedes might well have nailed these regulations, and if so, he wants to be the person that benefits from it. And I don't think he's going to allow the FIA to get in the way of that. And just one final point on this,

because as we know, I was very vocal at the time, how much I disagreed with the decision made by Michael Massey on that last lap in Abu Dhabi. And I still think that's the case. Nothing's changed there. But I also believe that there was no bias against Lewis Hamilton in particular. I don't think it was biased against him. I think it was biased for entertainment. I think if they were the other way round, if Vestappan was leading and Hamilton was chasing,

I think they would have made the exact same decision. I don't think they made the decision because of who Lewis Hamilton is. I don't think they made the decision in the name of trying to get someone else to win the championship. I think they just made the decision because they wanted a last lap of entertainment for the fans. Agree with it or disagree with it. I very much disagree with it. But I don't think there was any bias involved from a human level. I think it was purely from an entertainment level. So actually, heading into this year, and like I say, I think the same situation could unfold the other way around

and they'd still play it the same way, there's no reason for Lewis Hamilton to believe the FIA are out to get it. him. I think the FIA are incompetent, but I don't think they're biased. That's not necessarily a compliment FIA, but that's how I think it goes. So if it was, say, a Senna-pros situation, where there were definitely reasons to believe that the FIA were biased towards Prost versus Senna, you know, whether you think it's true or not, there were definitely legitimate allegations there. I don't think there's anything legitimate here. I just think they're trying to, they were trying to get the best finish to a season possible, fairly or unfairly. So I don't think Lewis Hamilton is going to take a season off or retire.

I think it'll be back in Bahrain. And that's good for the sport. That's good for Lewis Hamilton. And we can put this to bed now. Something that's a message for everyone. To the world of Formula One. Let you all know. That you said there, Ben, was about how he responds after not winning a championship.

notably what we saw after the Rosberg in the stadium, right? I think the grid, those who he might end up going up against, should be very wary about driving against Lewis Hamilton. Because if there's something that we see in Lewis Hamilton's career, it's that when you irritate the man, when he becomes angry for the next race, you know, we saw it in Singapore 2018,

he got a lot of stick from journalism about where he was in the world and how he didn't care about Formula One. He put that pole lapping around Singapore. We saw it with Brazil, right? He got the penalty, you had to overtake 25 cars over two races and now I think we're going to end up seeing

a very, very determined revenge-seeking style Lewis Hamilton for the 2022 season so if he has got a front-sitting car I think we could see something quite formidable in the form of Lewis Hamilton should of course he come back there is still a sitherto of hope that he

might appear and by Scyther I mean it's a 100% chance folks he will be here don't be silly yeah I agree of you. It's just Lewis Hamilton has never shown a, I'm going to take my ball and go home approach

to anything he's done in F1. So why is there a reason to believe that he'll start now? The FIA come back and say they acted legitimately, they might well do that. Is Lewis Hamilton really going to go don't like that? Going to go home now. Add enough of this.

It just doesn't seem in his nature. Maybe he just wants to give Esty Goetz a chance. Overstoft. Van Dorn? Always. I saw rumors that Holkenberg were going to take his seat, he should he stand down? Can he just take any available seat that F1 has?

He doesn't care of that man. Yeah, I'll do it. Bit of a spoiler for next week's lead topic then. We don't usually do this. If Lewis Hamilton doesn't return to F1, who should take his place? Should it be Nika Holkenberg, Stoffel van Dorn, or Esther Bunguttieres?

Let us know your thoughts in advance, because that's definitely one we're going to discuss. Oh, dear. And with that, let's move on from Mercedes to Ferrari. Carlos Sines has been in the news the last couple of weeks after a very successful first season with the team in which he beat Charles LeClair, talks about him getting a contract extension are about.

Bonotto's commented on it publicly. Carlos Sines has commented on it publicly. We'll have to see how those negotiations go. We'll start from the perspective of Ferrari, the team and then we'll move on to Carlos Sines. Sam, what do you think that they should be looking for in terms of how long this deal is, when they should let to get this wrapped up? What's your thoughts on that? Firstly, it feels like there is a trend in Formula One around when contracts are being handed out and how long these contracts seem to go on for. I think the biggest example I

can think of most recently is Esteban Okon, of course, with Alpine. And we're discussing obviously that seat when it comes to Piastri later on in the podcast, but we all gave our opinions a few races after that contract a big sign that maybe they signed him for too many decades and he maybe wasn't ready to be signed for 47 years at the Alpine scene. Now, Carlos Sines has been brilliant. I think we all agree these were absolutely brilliant in that Ferrari. Whether you believe that, you know, Lecler was up to the standing, he should have been or not, or if it was unlucky with some D&F that he received or not, he put up a brilliant display

against Shaula LeCler, who for the most part of the season was receiving the God Lecler title. Of course, he is now being reduced to Moses Leclercels until he can reinstate that god-a-gler. I forgot about Moses Lecler. Until he can reinstate that title. Now, Ferrari, I don't know why, firstly why they need to rush this. Cites isn't going to go anywhere else. You know, the road to Red Bull is full.

It's a queue out the door around the corner where a couple of years ago, we were saying they didn't have enough people. It was empty in their waiting room. And now they've got a waiting line around the corner, like when you try and get your bloody COVID jab. But, you know, Mercedes is well. I don't think they're going to be nicking science off Ferrari either. So, realistically, science hasn't got anywhere to go.

And I think Ferrari should understand that. Now, that means I think you can at least wait until the summer break of this season to make sure he's still performing as expected. I think he will be. But have some patience. Now, what do they need to look for Carlos Sines? Consistency. Carlos Sites has always brought.

that wherever he goes he managed to pull out a very solid result he's never been the guy that pulls out a breathtaking result that you go you know like Perez when he used to suddenly pop up in third place regularly for racing point or for force India or when um the likes i was going to say holkenberg that's not funny um when lecler would suddenly you know he was in first place at silverstone all of a sudden and if he got overtaking he wouldn't be in first place anymore because that's how racing works in the ferrari point um you know just wanted to take a blog for a So I think consistency is key. I think Carlos Sites has always delivered that,

and I'd be very shocked if he doesn't. Not being attacked by his water bottle. That seems to happen at least once a season for Carlos Sikes, where he ends up almost drowning in his helmet, the poor lad. Get that fixed. But I also think they're expecting Sikes to step up again and make sure that with the fact that this is his second year integrating into the team,

he's able to carry on being either incredibly close to Shalaclure or even beating Shalakl. I don't think that is a stretch for Carlos Sites with what we've seen from him. His ability is strong. He puts some brilliant performances. You know, he needs to take another step up, get used to the machinery again, of course, and really integrate further into the team. But if he carried on the trajectory that he is on currently,

I don't see why they would need to look anywhere else for another three, four seasons, maybe. I would give him maybe a two-year deal with an optional extension of another one year should he start taking boxes very early on. And I would do that from summer in 2022, another two years. on top of that. I think they have the outside question, of course, of what they do with Mick Schumacher. They see Mick Schumacher as maybe not the next Michael Schumacher in terms of the levels of success that they're expecting. I don't know if they're expecting another seven-time world shambling out of poor Mick. But in terms of consistent driving and marketing potential, Mick Schumacher is

an absolute goldmine. And then Ferrari are aware of that. They go for well what they've brought themselves into and they go for what they're trying to procure when it comes to Mick Schumacher and a Ferrari. Unless LeCler fails to impress over the next couple of years, which I can't see coming, science is the man that will need to step aside. The door will need to open on the science's side rather than the Clare's side. So you also don't want to tie yourself down too much with holding onto science for too long. So that's why I only go for two years. I were trying to get Mick in a team that is Ferrari powered, but slightly further up the grid if possible. Alpha, someone like that, if possible. And then you've got to make that switch. If that's what they want to do. So for me,

strong consistency matching Lecler cut the years maximum see where Mick is see how LeCler is doing making other decisions as you go forward we don't need like a four year deal

and it doesn't need to be giving a January take your time with it don't be silly Ferrari alright then I agree with one thing you said and I disagree with the other I agree in the contract length

I think two years would be spot on further on from this year is what I'm saying there. So I think two more years after this year would be perfect for him. The added security has always helped Carlos signs in his career. So I think it would help him again if that deal was wrapped up. And yeah, you don't want to go too far into the future to the point where you don't know what the lay of the land's going to be in a few years' time.

You don't quite know. You can make predictions, but the further you go into the future, the less clear things become. So I think a couple year deal would be. absolutely fine in that respect. I agree with you on that. I disagree with when it should be done. I think it should be done as soon as possible because I think Carlos Sines has actually got the leverage here. I think Carlos Sines has proven himself more than Ferrari have proven themselves. Carlos Sines came in and did a fantastic job last year. He was up to speed almost straight away with Shail LeClair, beat Shal LeClair. He was competitive with him all season. He did a very good job. Ferrari are the unproven one. Ferrari, we don't know what.

they're going to show up with in Bahrain. They might show up and have the fastest car and win their first championship in 15 years. They might also turn up in a tractor. You can't tell with Ferrari. And to be honest, based on their recent history, I'd be leaning more towards the tractor. So I think, and this is going to sound like a burn to Ferrari, and that's because it is. They shouldn't give themselves the chance. They shouldn't give themselves the chance to disappoint. The only way they could go is that. Like, if you, if you, if you, if you, sign Carlos, you know what, mate, we'll give you your two year deal. You did a great job last year. Stay with us for a couple more years. Get that done before you can prove in Bahrain that you

don't have a good car. I think that's a great idea because when Carlos Sines comes along in Bahrain and realizes, I've got to drive this for two years, this isn't going to work out. Doesn't matter. You've already signed him up. So I would get this done as soon as possible just in case you haven't quite nailed the regulations because, you know, it wouldn't be the first thing that you haven't got right in the last couple of years. Let's put it that way. If you wait until the summer, I feel like you then open up and they're not quite there. Let's just say they're still a little bit behind Red Bull, still behind Mercedes. Maybe there are some other teams in the mix. Who knows? I think you then do give the opportunity for other teams to start trying to poach him.

And I know you said Sam that you don't think there are any other avenues. And you might well be right. I think there is at least a chance at a couple of these teams. Just because Carlos signs has been around the grid so much even for such a young career, that he's probably got a few people in different teams right now where the connection is almost already there to try and get them back. If Sergio Perez continues to be iffy in that Red Bull seat, maybe they look towards, if they're that convinced that Gassley isn't going to work for them,

they're going to need someone and maybe they think of return for Carlos Sines is on the cards. you know when lewis hamilton doesn't come back in barrain they're going to need someone maybe they go with carlos signs uh so i'm i'm not certain that there won't be potential seats for signs and i think the longer again it's just that risk is that what if they don't have a great car someone else does have a great car and signs realize as well look what happened in 2014 Mercedes nailed the regulations from the off and they held the advantage for quite a while after that if ferrari are already um you know behind when they get to Bahrain,

they're probably not going to catch that up overnight. It just runs the risk that actually Ferrari lose a lot of leverage in that situation and signs gains it. What do you think, Harry, both in terms of contract length and also, would you go with the sign him up early or would you wait a bit to see how he performs? Yeah, I agree on the contract length. You know, a couple of years should be fine. and from a Ferrari point of view, as Sam said,

they've got the lights of Mick Schumacher waiting in the wings, but to be honest, he's not, if he's going to be ready, I don't think he's going to be ready for a couple of years anyway. So if they want to keep signs as an interim, he's a good interim to have, to be frank. So, yeah, keep him on for a couple of years. And I don't really have much else to add on what you've said. I think Ferrari are going to want to sign him ASAP.

maybe signs from his point of view would want to wait and as you said I think the ball is in in his court but yeah I think Ferrari will be pleasantly surprised with how well it went for them last year in terms of with signs that they'll want to snap them up as soon as possible so yeah it's a tricky one it's not often you get the driver who's got the leverage happens obviously in some cases lewis hamilton he's often got quite a lot leverage that's happened probably um But in this case, yeah, it's clear that the science has probably got the advantage over his team in negotiations. So, you know, we can try and see what happens. For the record, I hope they don't build a tractor.

I really want Ferrari to come back at some point. A non-trackter car would be great. Can they build both? I would quite like to see a all just a Ferrari tractor, like Lamborghini make a tractor. Genuine tractor. Could you make a tractor? Bright red? I think it would quite cool.

Just giving the 2020 car. It's close enough, isn't it? You could use it as... 2020 car wasn't that good. You could use it as the car that retrieves the Ferrari that breaks down on the racetrack. Good idea. In fairness to Ferrari, they didn't have any reliability DNFs last year. So I don't even ask...

I mean, everything else is their problem, but that might not be their problem. Street circuits. Street circuits are their problem. Reliably slow. Stop crashing into walls and red flagging the session. and also, Charles LeClaire just remember that Austria should be treated as every other Grand Prix. Does he think he's driving a Hot Wheels car or something, just around Austria? He thinks he's in like a little matchbox thing. Mate, it's the same size as every other tracks.

I'm crashing into people. Moving about to the other side of the garage, because I think that's where we started, Carlos Sines. Sam, you've spoken about it from Ferrari's perspective. What about it from science perspective? because obviously he's moved around the grid quite a lot. There's already a number of teams that he's been on. Do you think that him's getting this deal sorted, getting that long-term security?

Is that going to help his performances? 100%. And I think this, actually, you say that Sykes has the leverage. I don't know if he sees it too much as him having the leverage. I think it's easier to see from an outside perspective. I think when you're the driver sat there and a tricky playing field that is Formula One, where people are begging for seats left, right, and centre.

There are so many drivers out in the wings that are hungry for any drive that they can get their hands on. I don't think it's as sensible as we all think that to go, I'm happy to play Mr. Basra here, and I'm going to wait you out for a bit. When you've got to drive at Ferrari, you're guaranteed to have a car on the grid, right? Ferrari aren't going anywhere. You might not be winging races every single weekend, but you're going to be in a secure place. You know, you're going to a team that's been built around you, and you know that you're kind of a togetherness.

that is at Ferrari that maybe you don't get with some of the lower teams that like Haas, for example, that financially aren't in the best place and could disappear off the grid should they not get some proper income. You don't want to end up in that situation. And Science currently isn't in that situation. He's very, very secure with the team that he's with. It also feels like Carlos Science is very at home when it comes to Ferrari. It feels very comfortable. I know he obviously had like that fierce, horrible rivalry with Landon Norris that drove him to be so successful at McLaren. You know, Drive to Survive to have a brilliant job documenting.

that. But when it comes to Ferrari, it just feels like he's very in sync with Ferrari. He feels very similar to the culture that he was raised with. I feel like as a person, he matches it well. So if I was Carlos Sites, I wouldn't be looking elsewhere. I would be committing myself to the team, having the team build a car around myself, my driving style. We saw how good he became with McLaren. He's carried that over from McClara to Ferrari. Now, if you carry on that extension, that building, that management, that development, I don't see why you can't make a regular race winner out of Carlos Sikes should you build the car that actually obviously can go on to win races.

And I do think Ferrari might be quite good this year. We'll get onto teammate wars in a few episodes of time. But I think Carlos Sites can be a real threat. And if I'm Carlos Sites, I sit there and put my faith in the team. I go, right, Ferrari, you've got it wrong for 15 years. Now's the time to turn it around. You can do it eventually. This is going to happen.

I beat the Clare already. I feel good here. I don't think he's got a worry. And I think right now, why not take the security in a time that is very tricky in a new area where you might fall flat on your face? You don't know how well you can go drive these cars. So for me, enjoy your time at a team like Ferrari, sign on the dotted line and pay off you an appropriate contract, and make the most of it. Commit yourself to it because you never know, is the grass greener on the other side or are you going to end up in a bin? So, yeah, Ferrari is.

Words to live by. Thank you, Sam. Yeah, I think, I don't know whether Ferrari ever bought this, but I certainly did and others did as well, but Carlos Seins, there was the potential for him to just be a bit of a stopgap and to be that driver, solid driver, who keeps the seat warm for someone like Mick Schumacher just for a year or two. And he's completely flipped the narrative on that because I have to be honest, even though Mick Schumacher hasn't had a proper chance yet, and I'm hoping this season, for Hass's sake, that he does get a bit more of a fight with some other teams.

But I cannot foresee a situation where Ferrari think, I don't know if I want to give signs that extra year because we don't know how Schumack is progressing. I couldn't see it happening because of how much signs has impressed since the beginning of last year. I think he's done a great job. And in terms of the teams, like team lineups last year, there was a case to say that Ferrari had the best team lineup of the lot.

Certainly a case for it. Not necessarily one we'll do this year, but with teammate wars and drivers' predictions and everything. But I'm sure we'll give our thoughts at some point on who has the best line up, who has the worst lineup and everything in between. But for now, shall we move on to someone who won't be on the 2022 grid? And that is Oscar Piastri, reigning Formula 2 champion, Formula 3 champion two years ago, but no seat on the 2022 grid for him. He's going to be doing some work for Alpine, as he is still part of the Driver Academy there throughout the year. But the question is, should any team outside of that,

not for this season, but potentially for next season, should they try and prize him away from that program? Harry, do you think that there is any team that might be in that spot? It's difficult because I can't really think of any instances where junior driver programs, I mean, there are some, but were they in with a shout of poaching another driver? Because it kind of smacks of, you don't like the rest of the drivers in your own particular junior driver program

and you want to get someone else's and that you made a mistake at the early stages. So I don't think it's something that happens very often, but you've got to be looking at, I'm sure the other teams are going to be looking at him and going, well, he's a free agent and he's just won the F2 championship and has been fairly impressive

this year, or sorry, last year I should say now, 2021. And Alpine aren't doing anything with him for this year at least. And, you know, if Alonzo decides to stay until he's 63, then they're not going to do anything with him for a while because, as Sam already mentioned, Opa and is signed up for decades. So, yeah, it could entirely happen where, you know, Alpene have to let him go because they can't give him a seat. and Oscar Pestry wants to see it on the F1 grin and deserves one

so if another team comes a knocking then he may well decide to up and leave which I think from Alpine's point of view would be a bit of a shocker so yeah it's an interesting one it's not necessarily something we look at all the time the politics and stuff behind junior driver programmes but it's an interesting one because you know the F2 champ I don't know how you would ever implement it, but the F2 champ should be on the F1 grid next year.

Sam's doing the two-time world champ dance, folks, for anyone who can't see him, which is everyone, because it's just us three. Literally everyone. Literally everyone. Yeah, I don't know how that gets implemented, but, you know, it's happened before, and you feel that a driver of Piastri's talents

should be on the grid, at least in one of the teams, so it's a shame. But, yeah, I would not be surprised if another team does try and, poach him. Whether he decides to leave, he might want to be loyal, but wouldn't surprise me. Could you imagine the conversation between an Alpine employee and Fernando Alonzo trying to get him to move out of the way for Piastri?

Good. He's going to go well. Excuse me, Fagando. You know, I just do that classic sit in the McLaren car and do the ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha. You know how Ocon signed up for the next three decades, and we've got Piastri waiting in the wings? Yeah.

Do you think maybe? That conversation would go horribly, guarantee it. What's your thought, Sam, in terms of Oscar Piastri and whether any other team should try and poach him? I'm going to go as far to say that Oscar Piastri might be a bit of a generational talent. He has displayed the same level of ability that I have seen in George Russell, Lando Norris, Charlotte Clare. Those are the people that we have tipped to be future world champions. And he's the first driver through the junior programme.

Since, you know, I think the Russell Norris group fully emerged and proved themselves, that I think, wow, you are something special. He, you know, he absolutely wants the F3, went into F2 of first time of asking, no problem whatsoever and as a team you've decided to not put him in your car you signed Asgman Okun up for 47 years because he defended like a lying

or he won a hungry or whatever it's going to be you know and yeah fair play to Okong he's a relatively good job last season do I think it was good enough that he deserves a contract that long that might put out a driver like Oscar Priastri no I think it was a silly idea from Alpin and they should have maybe kept their cars to their chest

because Okon definitely wasn't going anywhere any time soon. In terms of other teams that might have their eye on Oscar Piacry, I think they should have their eyes on Oscar Piacry very much, so I do think there are multiple teams that are going to be looking his way. We'll work away from the back of the grid up. Williams, for example, Nicholas Latifi, should he not perform anymore, or the money should dry up, you never know. I think it makes total sense if Williams can somehow strike up a deal with Alpine to get him in the car. Why not? You know, he's a driver that's got development. I don't expect Rumi to be fighting at the front of the grid in the next couple of years.

I hope they make improvements, but I can't see them winning races. It'll be a very good proving ground for Oscar Piatry. The same goes for Alfa Romeo. Should Guan Yu Zhao not impress? Should, again, the money not come back in? Should he be so woeful that they are clearly missing out on so many points? Then, why not? Why not try and pick him up?

Yes, he doesn't have the same level of funding as Guan Yu Zhao does, but I'll tell you for this for free. Any F2 driver tends to have a lot of funding if they're making it into Formula One. somewhere someone is sponsoring them um so alpha you know also alfred one of those teams are absolutely strapped for cash either you know they're they're pretty all right they're pretty comfortable moving on from them sebaskin betel doesn't look too happy at the moment retirement maybe in the next year to two years why not why not try and pull him away put him in the

car you can have a talent there for the next 10 or 15 years should he be loyal should he want to stick around with a car it's obviously a very famous brand as astin martin you never know he might commit to that finally Mercedes Lewis Hamilton is not going to turn up for the Bahrain Grand Prix this season

and because of that as confirmed by us tonight breaking news yeah yeah we conge you with the 100% earlier so Hamilton's maybe got

what two years maybe three if he wants to carry on he might do this year ago yeah I've had to go in the new cars thank you I'll leave it there

they don't have an immediate replacement in line that makes total sense I would say they could possibly poach lando norris from McLaren but he feels very very comfortable there not the first time Mercedes have taken a young Brit that could possibly go on to win championships at Mercedes

um you know they could possibly pick up putting Nick DeVries in the car who I think unfortunately is now being out of it for a little bit too long to maybe jump in and do the job as expected van Dorn wasn't exactly mega when he was at McLaren either I know that obviously he's a possible connection for them um Ghazley is the only other option and gazley doesn't really know what he's doing and he still seems like he's involved in that Rby family because he's not moved anywhere else. But why not, if you're Mercedes, sign Piacquer to your young driver program,

stick him in your G3 class or something like that, spawns him to do something else for a season, see how he goes. I can't really see another immediate option for Mercedes that's on the cards that they couldn't try. So I think other teams should be keeping on him. I think actually, if he carries on the impressive ability that he's already displayed,

which I have no doubt that he will, I think he's got plenty of options. I think it will be a massive, ridiculous loss if the current F2 and previous F3 champion cannot get on the F1 grid. What is the point in winning those championships if it doesn't get you a spot on the grid? It's silly.

So yeah, teams are definitely going to be keeping their eyes on them. I want to go back to, I think probably the first thing that Harry mentioned, a point you made, Harry, that you don't necessarily see too much in the way of poaching other teams junior drivers because it's almost an admission that you've failed in your job, that you haven't done a good enough job with your own junior program to promote one of your guys,

which might well be a factor. I have to say, any team that goes ahead with the strategy of, I know our guy is worse than someone else we can get, but I don't want to appear wrong, they aren't going to be in a good spot. And a team that will be in a good spot is a team that is admitting, we got it wrong. All right, we've got these three drivers in the junior program,

and you know what? None of them are jumping off the page. And there's this guy who's in another program. We think he's special. We might be able to get him. The team who goes, yeah, I think we got it wrong with our three guys. We want that guy. That's going to be the successful team.

So I really think that any team that might have an opening here should absolutely go for it with Oscar Piastri. Because I do agree with what you said, Sam. there is a very distinct chance that he is a generational talent and I think he has got more promise than anyone who's come through in the last couple of years. And the thing is with the Alpine deal, I've spoken at length about the Ocon deal

and how much I didn't like it at the time, still don't like it now. As long as the Ocon deal itself. Exactly, right? I'll still be going on about it in its 73rd year. But we'll be dead. The main problem I have is that with Ocon I think you've got a really solid driver,

but you've got someone who I believe is not world champion material, who's not generational talent like Piastri could be. And I appreciate this analogy is probably going to work better for Harry and Sam than it is for people who can't actually see me, and I can't even claim this analogy is my own. But if I was to hold out my two hands, and I was to take my right hand away, so I've just got my left hand here,

and there's nothing in my left hand. You can see there's nothing in my left hand. all. Correct. And I was to tell you, my right hand, which is now off screen, there's a million pounds in my right hand. Now, you might not, and I've got to give you the choice, do you want the left hand, do you want the right hand?

Now, you might well think Ben is lying about what he's got in his right hand. There is no way he's got a million pounds at all. But you can see my left hand, there's nothing in it. So you might as well give it a go. You might as well try for the right hand. There might be something there. If it's nothing, you haven't lost anything. That's the Piastri and Ocon situation.

With Ocon, I don't think you have a world champion. With Piastri, you might also not have a world champion, but you don't know it yet. Oh, it wasn't a million pounds. You don't know it yet. Do you know all I know that that analogy isn't mine, it makes sense. We haven't gone to a supermarket or something like that yet.

Yeah, I'm sorry, I couldn't get a supermarket reference in there. But yeah, that's why I don't necessarily love the Ocon deal. just for the length of time more than that, I don't mind them keeping him. I just think it's the length of time that doesn't make any sense. I'm actually going to go a completely different direction team-wise to what you mentioned, Sam, and I actually think that Alpha Tauri and Red Bull should be keeping an eye on him, because not that I dislike some of the junior drivers coming through, I think Yuri Vips could be fine, I think Liam Lawson could be fine,

but I don't think either of them have the potential that Oscar Piastri has. I think if the, and I appreciate the irony in this, If Yuki Sonoda isn't performing sort of midway through this year after he's had a year and a half, I wouldn't be against Red Bull making a bit of a plucky play and saying, we'll buy Piahtri from you, LP, we'll take him and we'll replace Sonoda midseason. Now, I appreciate the irony that we've been complaining at Red Bull for doing just that sort of thing for the last few years. But I think a year and a half for Yuki Sonoda, given how underwhelming his first year was, I think he's been given enough time after one and a half years, quite frankly.

So I wouldn't be against that sort of move if they were confident that they need to get him now before someone else swoops in for him. I was going to say when you were talking about the people who are in charge of junior driver programmes who won't get the better driver for embarrassment of being wrong. To be fair to Red Bull, you might not like it, but that's not them. because they just get rid of their drivers willy-nilly. Doesn't matter. They go for the ones they think are good. They might not get it right all the time

and they're pretty savage but they do they do go for it I guess. Is it started bringing it? Oh no it's just Alex Albon's tears after he heard of that what you've had to say. And Danny Kfayat's and Pierre Casley's

and Christian Cleans. He's been employed as a janitor to clear up the tears. Robert Dornobbs. Scott Speed. Leutsteen are all raining down on us with her tears. Oh, Wittentonio. Scott Speed isn't crying. He's too busy cheating on

eye racing, isn't he? Scott... Still bad, isn't he? It's a bit of a throwback, isn't it? Also, that Toro Rosso, as it was back then, was hideous, by the way. Oh, it was awful. Utterly awful. I have to say, and I appreciate we've gone well off topic here, I do miss the Toro.

I do miss the Toro Rosso from a few years ago. The proper light... The light blue. one. Yeah, like it looks like a reverse coat can to get blue and silver and silver and red and white or something. Well, I think it's time. We are a fair way into the episode. I think it's time to bring about what is undoubtedly the worst jingle that we have in our playbook. It is higher or lower. is F1 higher Is F1 lower

Is Sam faster Is Harry slower F1 higher F1 lower F1 Oh God I hate it Honestly it would be

It would be bottom tier But I feel like the end F1 just brings it up one or two that last f1 can someone please make a tier list of jingles please uh put in the discord uh if you want to join the discord the link is in the description over 300 people talking f1 all the time someone make a tier list of the of the terrible terrible jingles don't worry hang on them again i'm being good i feel like someone is actually going to do that and i can't wait um f1 higher or lower just to give you an idea of what this game is if you haven't listened to one of these before i'm going to read out

something and Harry and Sam will take it in turns to guess the number of the stat that I give. So for example, I might say how many times has Dave Benson Phillips raced in Formula One? And Harry might well say, Harry might well say, oh, he raced an F1 10 times. And Sam then has to guess higher or lower. If Sam's correct in that one, he gets the point. However, if he's wrong, Harry gets the point. it's fairly simple and you'll pick it up soon enough just to clarify actually on that one

Dave Benz & Phillips never raced an F1 despite being a late breaking hall of famer despite being a Hall of Famer never raced an F1 that's a shocker just like my fire alarm and Big Shack Big Shack's been on the pokey more times than we have both

true that be true oh dear okay actually more times than you as well so you know. Oh, savage. That's brutal, Sam.

Time out. To be fair, I just told him he might be kicked from his seat for Oscar Piastri so I can't say anything. But, Hirolet, there are eight to choose from. And like I said earlier, Sam, you are looking to get a win back. So I'll let you go first on this one. What number would you like? I'll have number one.

Why not start the start? All right, let's go with number one. I want you to tell me, How many podiums Kimmy Rykinen has had at Spa? So far. So far, obviously, yes. Because he's coming back, obviously. Up until the year 2022.

Well, if you said the year 2050, I might have had to extend my numbers. But as you said, 2022, I'm going to go with seven. Seven is incorrect. Just I forgot one part of the game If you get it spot on You do get two points But Sam's guess of seven is not correct So would you like higher or lower than that Harry?

I'll go with lower And Harry is on the board first of all He's correct with lower It's five Surprisingly he's had four wins there But only one of the podium outside of those wins That's why I said seven I thought he's had more than three wings

But he must have also been on the podium But there we go We're starting off of being wrong There's nothing changes. He either wins. Or he doesn't. He doesn't do anything. That is racing, everyone.

That's getting tweeted. Yeah, not... This might not make you feel any better whatsoever, Sam. But I have to say, if I was going for... I probably would have gone for exactly the same guess as you. So, we'd have been wrong together. That does make me feel better. As you are the stat man.

I feel good. All right. One-nothing, Harry, you lead. What number would you like? Two, bees. Number two. Jim Raffman, great friend of the podcast. Oh, yeah. He doesn't quite know it yet.

But he has a record in F1. He has the most positions gained in a race. So from qualifying position to end position, can you tell me how many positions he gained? I don't even know who he is. It's a good start. Sure. He gained 27 positions. It's not correct.

Higher or lower, Sam. F1 Lower Beautifully sung horribly answered It's Harry's point again Are you going to get it wrong Why does he get a point again

Because you guessed lower It wasn't lower Oh yeah of course I forgot the rules Of the own game The reason you might have heard of Jim Rathman Harry is because this is going back

To the days when the Indy 500 Was part of the calendar And he went for like He went from 30 second to second in the race. At the Indy 500. You cheeky boy. Yeah. Sneaky one there.

You can have any number between three and eight, Sam. Which one would you like? Oh, I'll go to the end. I'll have number eight, please. Number eight. So there are two pretty horrible ones in this. This is one of them. Good.

Because it involves math. It's still a 50-50. It involves maths, basically. Best team of all time, if I was to say that, you would of course say, oh, well, the Renault team of 2005 is the best team of all time, Alonzo and Fisichela, of course. I want you to tell me combined how many race starts they've had. What, Alonso and Fisichela across their whole careers. A number of race starts for Alonzo, ever, plus number of race starts for Fizichela, ever. Oh, for Christ's sake, what's the point?

um um uh and we see this a lot I'm gonna go with uh pluck it out the sky

8774 875 that's a joke by the way it's a joke answer before we accept that one oh that's proper got me

can I get serious Of course you can. Go on. Thank you. About... 873. I wasn't going to say that as well. Sorry.

Sorry, everyone. About, I'm going to say, 373. 373. Harry, would you like to go higher or lower than that? I'll go... I'll go higher. It is in. Indeed, higher. It is

562. So Alonzo has 333 as of the end of the 2021 season and Physicella had 229. So higher was the correct answer. Oh, that was funny.

I wasn't ready for that. Alonzo's done like 70 years in F1. It's great. Esteban Ockon will be on that. He'll be there in his own right. Number three down to number seven, Harry. Which one would you like? Number three, let me go in order.

All right, this is the other horrible one. This might be even more horrible. Oh, no. So, Robert Kubitsa. Robert Kubitsa, baby pole. We love Robert Kubitsa here on the Lake Breaking podcast. Mini pole. Mini pole.

He holds a record in F1, does Robert Kubitsa. And it is the number of days between successive points finishes. So he had a points finish However many days Until his next point finish Question is How many days were there in between Those successive points finishes

Well that is ridiculous So 2010 And then it must be up to 2019 I can't do that math in my head I'm going to go for 3,931 You might be shocked to know this Harry That's not the correct answer

but would you like to go higher or lower than that, Sam? Did you say 3,931? Correct. I'm going to say it's F1 lower. Sam is on the board. It is indeed lower. You were in the right thousands, just the other, the wrong end of it. 3,178 was the correct answer there.

874. You've got... Almost. Close enough. You've got rid of the horrible ones now. The rest are all lovely. Sort of. Love, good. Sam, what number would you like?

How are you going to go in order, so I'm going to annoy him and go five? Oh, number five. You went to eight, so you've already annoyed me. Don't worry about it. Got to do it every week. Since the start of the hybrid era, how many times has lewis hamilton been out of the points since since the start of 2014 that includes retirements doesn't include secure i'm gonna go with 12 it's not correct higher lower harry i might go with lower

since the start of 2014 he has only finished outside of the points nine times wow that's redunculus and just to i mean just to add another thing into this eight of those were retirements the only time in the hybrid era he's finished outside of the top ten and finished was indeed back you last year so wow that's mad a bit of a mad style that one number four six or seven harry which one you like four please ironically this one is about esthervan o'con he can't stay away tonight

how many times has he started a race in f1 oh when did he join he started at race I'm still not over him replacing Rio Harryanto by the way well undeserved

yeah true Rio was given Pascal Perlain run for his money in that manner. Absolutely cheated out of the seat. Anyway, biggest rigged job in F-1. Get rid of your Abbey conspiracies. That's where the real conspiracy is. So he joined

2016, but he was midway through. He might have done about 10 races. Ting. Is that your final answer? 19. No. He left the end of 18. right and he's done

oh I don't know he's done 73 races he has not done 73 races has he done more or fewer than that Sam higher or lower

oh I have a feeling that Harry's really close with that I'm gonna go because Harry's really bad I don't remember in the length of the 2020 season I'm going to go higher oh yeah I didn't even count

the 2020 season. Every time it comes up, he doesn't count it. I just forget it. It existed. I don't know off top of my head how many races were in 2020,

but if you included it, you probably would have been very close. It was higher. 89, so you were 16 out. Damn, no, it's 17, right? She should have been one out. You won out.

Oh, bloody out. Number six or number seven, Sam? I just got to be number seven. All right. Number seven. Best driver in F1 history off the top of your heads. I'm not giving that a thing.

Right now. Pedro Lamy. Close. Charles Peek is the correct answer. Charles Peek of motorsport. Charles Peake holds a record in Formula One. Unfortunately, it isn't a great one. He holds the record for most

times he's been passed in a season. Oh. How many times would he passed in that season? Is there a cryptocurrency a war for that? Make it happen?

Most times pass. How many times be passing a season? It's got to be pretty savage. I'm going to go with 93. Not correct. Higher or lower,

Harry? I'll go higher. Sam takes the point. It was a Pretty good guess I would say. I wouldn't know where to start with this one. It was 70. So I'd say that's a pretty respectable guess.

Which I've got to be honest, early doors, it didn't seem like this was going to be much of a competition, but it's now Harry 4, Sam 3. So there is the chance for the draw if Harry doesn't get this one right. The last one is about Max Verstappen, Harry. Number six, please. Just in case you were unsure.

Okay, hang on. Sorry, repeat that one again. Number six. Right. Okay. Yes, please. This one's about Max Verstappen. I want you to say how many podiums he's had in F1.

Oh. Oh, I don't know. He's had. Oh, God. Right, don't forget 2020. 2018, 2019, 2021, 2021, 2021, 2022. Sorry, sorry, he's had 47. He has not had 47 podiums.

So Sam, for the draw, it's a 50-50 choice to make sure you don't lose. No, my God. Higher or lower than 47 podiums for Max for Staffen. Oh, my God, this is not fair. Oh, Michael, no. Oh, my God. If I lose this, have I got a pair of both headphones? in my table.

It's on 50-50. Why has it got to be a 50-50? They used to be a great TV program called 50-50, by the way. I don't think I'll remember it. Schools used to play against each other. More British. I'm shorting for time when I try and think of the years. Big up, Angelica.

You know what? Go big or go home. Higher. So, Sam notoriously gets these 50-50 questions wrong. And so much is on the line for this one at 4-3 down. Has Sam finally got over his 50-50 troubles. He's only got and done it. Thank you, Max.

Oh, my good. Max Verstappen has had 60 podiums, meaning that after, I think, Sam, you were 3-0 down in this game. You've managed to salvage a draw at 4-all. because someone annotate the Arsenal badge onto Harry's face and the Newcastle badge onto my face please

and someone played the Czech Teote Coventry over me winning that final point It's a very niche football reference But it's important Who's Checteote Me Right now

He was a rest of peace by the way Yeah He's a lovely man And he unfortunately passed away very young But he scored the brilliant equaliser Newcastle the Arsenal Of course he did I think we've got

I remember that We've got our full fix of British references tonight, haven't we? We have not been short of that. I'm sorry, folks. F1 higher or lower, anticlimatically, ends in a draw. Anticlimatically, one, right? Is F1 higher? Is F1 lower?

Is sad faster? Is Harry slower? F1 higher. F1 lower. F1. It's just perfect. It rounds off the song brilliantly. The notes that are reached. We'll of course be back again next week, won't we?

But we do have a quiz coming up in the Discord. So Sam, if you wouldn't mind, chatting a bit about that and getting us out of here. Folks, if you do want to see both myself and Harry panic internally and externally for about an hour's period where Ben runs a quiz in the Discord. This is round two of the quiz. It went down brilliantly last time.

Then loads people get involved. It was a lot of fun. It's very well run, actually, because Ben Runs, it got me or Harry. But if you do fancy a bit of an F1 quiz, you fancy get involved with the community. Head down to the Discord. It's a great laugh. Everyone is really lovely.

If they're not, we'll kick them out, because we have the power to do that. Yeah, check it out. Why not? You can always leave if you don't fancy it. So that's going to go on. We've got some more Patreon stuff coming up very, very soon. We're going to go into more details in another poddy,

but there is another watchalong coming up very, very soon, which is cool. And you may have seen it on our social media channels at El Breaking for Twitter, late breaking for Instagram. The first merchandise has arrived in the LBHQ. We've got a couple of jumpers, a couple of hats. It all looks nice. So keep your eyes filled for something along those lines in the near future as well. Don't expect us to be organised, though.

I haven't got a date for you. I haven't enjoyed the podcast. It is nice being back in 2022. Not too much longer until the winter break is stopped, and we can fill the warmth of those endings. Formula One. But until then, we leave you left one higher and lower, and I've been sent to sea. I've been Ben Hawking. I've been checked. COT. And remember, keep breaking late. Do I have a million pounds in my left hand, though?

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