The Lazy Genius Podcast - #114 - The Truth About Your Enneagram Number

Episode Date: June 24, 2019

A few months ago, I asked you to send me questions you have about the enneagram on Instagram. You guys went hard. So we’re going to talk about it in two parts over the course of the summer. Today’s episode covers the basics of knowing your type, how to figure out what type you are, and how the enneagram is a tool to becoming a truer version of yourself. Resources You May Find Helpful The Enneagram Institute is hands-down the best resource on the Internet about the enneagram. If you don’t know your type, start by reading the type descriptions on this website to begin ruling out what type you aren’t. This episode of The Liturgists podcast is a few years old, but you guys, it’s so good. The hosts talk to Ian Cron and Suzanne Stabile, the authors of The Road Back to You. Speaking of The Road Back to You, that is the best place to get your feet wet if you want to start reading a book about it. If you’ve finished The Road Back to You, and you’re looking for more personal growth, I’d recommend The Sacred Enneagram by Chris Heuertz. It is my personal favorite of the bunch. And if you’re wanting more of a textbook experience, check out The Complete Enneagram by Beatrice Chestnut. I’m taking a summer break for the next few weeks, so there won’t be an Instagram LIVE this Thursday. Don’t forget about our thriving community over on Facebook. I’ll be back with new episodes on July 22. Download a transcript of this episode.   This podcast is hosted by Kendra Adachi and executive produced by Kendra Adachi, Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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about the things that matter and lazy about the things that don't. Today is a very exciting day. It is episode 114. Know your Enneagram type. If you're unfamiliar with the enneagram, no sweat. We will get to that. This is an episode just on the basics of knowing your type. I will do another episode in the middle of August that will be more about the other aspects of the enigram like wings, stances, centers, arrows, which might all sound super ridiculous if you're new to the anagram, but that is okay. This episode is simply about figuring out what type you are and how the enneagram is a tool to becoming a truer version of yourself. There are so many elements to this thing, and I see a lot of people put them in the wrong order. The aneagram is complex, super old,

and an incredible tool in your personal growth. And because of how rich and nuanced it is, it cannot be contained in a single podcast episode or two or even an entire podcast that runs for years and years. And it cannot be reduced to a couple of simple definitions and then we just go about our merry way. So I am a casual student of the Enneagram. I am not a trained expert.

That is important to know going in. But for the sake of today, I want to share the basics of the Eniogram. what it is and what it isn't from my personal understanding and experience. I definitely want to give you tools and knowing your type, but even if you already do know, this episode will be helpful for you and how you see the entire process of digging deeper into the anagram because it is a deep well for sure.

Before we jump in, I do want to let you know that this is the final episode on the podcast before my summer break. I usually take a few weeks off during the summer just to be with my family and schedule some rest, which we should all try to do, by the way. Rest doesn't always just happen, especially if we're not great at practicing it on a daily basis. So schedule it. And I am for the next three weeks. I will be back with a new episode on July 22nd. So if you're keeping track of the day, there you go. All right. Let's talk about the Enneagram. First off, what is it? I hesitate to say it is a personality typing system because that is

too limited. To me, the enneagram is a system that helps us name how different people see the world. And this is really key. The aneagram is all about motivation, not behavior. It's why you do what you do. That's why it's not really a personality test because so many tests are based on behaviors, not on motivation. Why is this helpful? Like that difference between what we do and why we do it? think about your own experiences in relationships. How often has a spouse or a parent or a kid or a boss done something that made you upset? The action or the behavior it made you mad or hurt. For example, it's Saturday morning and you're looking forward to a day hanging out with your husband and your kids, but your husband heads outside to mow the grass and hose down the porch and pull weeds

from in between the cracks and the steps, and you're mad because you wanted to hang out as a family. He's apparently choosing yard work over that time, and you stew, and you wonder if he even sees you. Come to find out, his motivation for doing all of that yard work was because you have seemed overwhelmed lately, and he knows how much you love sitting on the porch. And he wanted to spend time on that space so that you would have a nice place to sit and rest. You see it, right? The action isn't really the problem. We can look at what someone does and assume the reason they did it. We make assumptions on a person's motives and only judge the behavior, but motive is crucial. Why someone makes a choice is often more powerful than the choice itself. It helps to see each other better, knowing these motivations. Without

the Enneagram, most of what we have to go on is what we see others do. But with the enneagram, we have a language to understand why people choose to do and say the things that they do. It's like those Claritin commercials where the picture is kind of blurry and then it clears up once the lady who's like playing soccer takes her allergy pill. To me, that's what the an aeneagram does. It helps us more clearly see situations and relationships for what they actually are. Behaviors are super important and they can cause harm and joy and all of it, but it's an incomplete picture to just focus on behavior. The Enneagram offers a a more complete picture because of that language around motivation.

So as you explore what type you might be or process what you hear other people saying about the enneagram, it's so important that you give far more weight to motivation than behavior. If you try and figure out your type or even worse try and type someone else based on their behavior, you will be frustrated and your understanding of the anagram will only go so far. I think that the popularity of the enneagram right now has made it kind of reductive. All the types have been reduced to a certain set of stereotypical behaviors. And we've lost what makes the enneagram a powerful tool and personal growth. Motivation.

We need to understand how we see the world and recognize that not everyone sees the world the same way. So you probably already know this, but there are nine different types. a lot of them often present with similar behavior within the type. For example, fives are often introverts and they leave parties early if they go to the party at all. Nines, though, they're also often quiet in social settings too. Now, sevens are on the other end. They're usually described as like the life of the party, but I know a seven in real life who's really reserved in social situations. No behavior is universal for a specific type. So it's vital to recognize that reducing the nine types to stereotypical behaviors is using about what two percent of what the

intigram offers. It has so much more power and value than that. For example, I have heard and read in multiple places that people think Michelle Obama is a type one. Now the first time I heard that that made me incredibly happy because that's the type I identify with and I love me some Michelle Obama. Ones are usually organized and systematic about life. They tend to value things being done the best way possible and with excellence. They're often referred to as poised and dependable and kind of like with a strong backbone, so to speak, they love for everyone to be alive and who they are and be the best they can be. But other types can present those behaviors. They can be organized and poised. Other people can pursue excellence.

Other types can root for people to experience growth. Ones don't have the corner market on those behaviors. The difference is in the motivation. So after reading her memoir, Becoming, I would bet money that Michelle Obama is a three. A three's motivation is to achieve to gain value from what she does. Threes are driven by ambition and image and they take a lot of stock in what other people think of them. They want to be seen as valuable. Now we all do to a degree, probably, but that is at the core of what motivates a three. That is the bottom line of how three see the world. Now as I read Michelle's book, I did not see her motivation. I did not see her motivation coming out as a one's motivation at all. She didn't care about perfection or being right

or good. She cared about pushing past people's expectations of her and proving her value, proving that she could do what they didn't think she could. She would rather be seeing doing like many good things than doing one great thing. That's a three, you guys. People look at her poise and her achievement and they put those behaviors in the box of a one. But your behavior plays no part in your type because behaviors can be all over the place. Your core motivation, however, the absolute soul-centered reason why you choose to do what you do

is what makes the enneagram work. You have to know why you do what you do, and you can't assume someone else's type based on what they do. I asked a while back if anyone had questions about the enneagram, and most of them were around how to discover your type. More specifically, what test is the best to take.

Do not take a test. I repeat, do not. take a test. Tests are based on the answers you give, obviously. But who knows what your headspace is at the time you take a test? Sometimes we answer personality tests based on what we wish we were like, how we think others see us or messages we've heard since we were a kid. We look at what we do rather than the reason we do it. You'll never get an accurate enneagram test result that way. So many of you were like, I get a different answer every time I take it. And that does not surprise me. simply because I believe that identifying the number on the enneagram that you most resonate with,

it cannot be simplified to a 60 question test. So here is how I would encourage you to find your number. And I recently heard my favorite enneagram guru, Suzanne Stabil, say this on her podcast. So I feel really good about offering this is my preferred approach, since it's her approach to. Go to an Enneagram website, I'll link to one in the show notes, and read about all nine types. Just read the overview and then begin to eliminate which types are definitely not you. You'll likely eliminate four or five, which is like a solid half of the types. Then read a little more about the types that remain and eliminate again. Keep doing this until you land on the one that makes the most sense.

And remember, motivation is the key, not the behavior. You're going to resonate with behaviors and several types. But honestly, that's irrelevant. Pay attention to what motivates that type. You might feel the motivation of the two that you want to be loved deeply, but you have so many behavioral qualities of a one. And that makes it confusing, especially when your exposure to the Enneagram so far has been like Instagram accounts

that are funny and sometimes insightful, but they focus on behavior way more than on motivation. What's important gets lost. So remember that motivation is really the only thing that matters here. The place that you can find that, it's where each type has a basic desire and a basic fear, both of which they hold hands pretty well. For example, the basic desire of an eight is to protect themselves

and be in charge of their own life. And their basic fear is being hurt or controlled by other people. Many eights present pretty strong behaviors, like taking charge in a group, saying exactly what they mean and not beating around the bush and kind of moving away from vulnerability. Those behaviors don't make someone innate.

But an eight might often demonstrate those behaviors out of the motivation to stay in control and not let anyone too close for fear of getting hurt. There's a difference there. So look at the motivation of each type to find out what type you are. And just a quick heads up,

finding out your type and really looking at your key motivation and how you see the world is jarring. If you are not ready to do some major soul searching and get hit with your own junk, you might want to save the enegram for later. It cuts to the quick, y'all. It is really hard to read. But when used properly, it changes you. It can't not change you. You might have narrowed your search down to maybe two types. And one of those types, it just feels icky. and gross, so you pick the other one. It's likely that it feels icky and gross because it's hard when our junk is written out in black and white. It is super discouraging. I knew pretty well that I was a one early on because I very much identified with something called the inner critic that only ones have.

It's a voice in your head that tells you how you're doing everything wrong. Now, you might think, well, I have that voice. It's my mom or my dad or that teacher from third grade or whatever. That's not an inner critic. From what I understand, the inner critic is a voice that comes from within you that is often your own voice that speaks constantly about how you're doing everything wrong. It is incessant. And when I read about that aspect of being a one, I was like, well, yeah, doesn't everybody experience that? No, they do not. And I didn't like that. I didn't like that that was part of who I was. I also did not like resonating with how judgmental ones tend to be, especially when they haven't done a lot of personal work in recognizing a pattern of judgment. Because ones see things through the lens

of perfection, of the ideal, of the way that things could be, we can come across as very judgmental. Everybody's doing it wrong. If you grew up with a one parent, you probably felt that really acutely. Nothing you did was good enough because it wasn't perfect. Your parent was always telling you the right way to do something. When the way you were doing it seemed just fine. it's a really hard energy to live with. And I say that as someone who is a one. And that's the point I'm trying to make. At first,

you might cringe at some of the descriptions of your number. It's uncomfortable. It's really uncomfortable to see what you thought was hidden in your mind, just laid out for everyone to see. And that's another scary part of naming the number you identify with, because once you say it out loud to another person, especially someone who is familiar with the eneogram, they know your deepest insecurity.

that's why in general it's not awesome to casually ask someone what their enneagram type is because they might not be ready to share that kind of vulnerability with you yet. It can also be discouraging to share your type with someone whose only exposure is maybe from an Instagram account and they simplify your personhood to a meme. Like, oh, you're a four, you're so moody and a perfect little snowflake. That is reductive and unkind. The irony of that actually is that the,

the main motivation of a four is to be understood. They want to feel personally significant in the world. And when someone reduces them to being moody and artsy and withdrawn, that confirms the very thing they're trying to avoid being misunderstood. So just be careful about reducing types. Be careful about asking someone what their type is and then having an immediate reaction to it. Be careful about casually typing others in conversation. Whether you're typing somebody that you know or a famous person you'll never ever know, the way that you speak of that person's type will most likely be heard by someone who shares that type

and the way you reduce them to a singular behavior or negative quality, even about a stranger. It can be really hurtful. The anagram is a tool. It is a language, but we're all still people. We all need to be sensitive to the humanity around us.

and remember that our words make a difference in how we feel about ourselves and how we encourage other people to feel about themselves. So that's kind of the heads up on the difficulty of naming your number. There are a lot of layers to that, and it's just important to recognize that those layers exist for us and for others. Aw, isn't something we need to travel for. It's something waiting for us in everyday life, whether in a city street or a moment with a work of art. I'm Dr. Keltner, host of the Science of Happiness podcast. Join me for Cities of Aw, a special series on how our public spaces can spark awe, wonder, and enhance the quality of public life. You can find us wherever you listen to your podcasts. One other important thing about the Enigram is that your number doesn't change. There are some differing opinions on whether you're born as your number or it develops as you're a kid, but ultimately your number is your number. It does not change.

that's why looking at motivation is important. Your behaviors might change over time, but ultimately the way you see the world does not change. Now that leads to a question I sometimes get where people wonder if they should look at how they were as a kid or how they are now. If the number doesn't change, then what number is true? Is it the one that they experience now or the one that feels right to assign to how they felt during those formative years? Okay, so another what I'm about to say, an answer to that is going to sound a little nuts, but hang on. Personality is a construct. I know I sound like Matthew McConaughey in that first season of True Detective when he's talking about time being a flat circle, but really, from the

perspective of the enneagram, personality is a construct. The way that you see the world or the type that you identify with is actually a lens you develop. as a kid to help you cope and survive in the world. This is why I personally think that you're not necessarily born with a type, but that it does develop super early on. I'm not going to bet my house on that belief or anything, but I really find it super interesting that so many people who identify as ones are firstborn kids. Not all of them, obviously, but a lot. A lot of ones had a parent who was unpredictable and their affection or their affirmation, or they were just just trying to figure it out because it was the first kid.

And so ones took it upon themselves to be perfect in order to receive the value that they were so desperately looking for from their mom and dad. My way of seeing the world through the lens of perfection and being good is not a true lens. My deep desire to be good and to be seen as perfectly in balance is not based in truth. It doesn't lead me to truth. It leads me to performance. and perfection. All nine types and their basic desires are lenses meant to help us all cope. They were

early ways to help us be a person in a world that did make sense. Our personality then is essentially a construct. It's a coping mechanism. Now, we have all experienced being in relationship with people who are, like, and in how they are and who they are, and they say things like, well, this is just the way I am, deal with it. But nothing is how we are because in some ways everything is scaffolding around those fragile, tender parts of who we are that we want to protect. And we've all developed different ways of doing that. The Enneagram's intention is to illuminate the fact that personality is a construct and that we don't have to live through that lens. We think it has the last word. A lot of the the current popularity of the eneagram, especially in those memes that are like tiny snippets,

you know, it would make us think that those motivations and behaviors are the last word, that it's just the way it is. But the opposite is true. Knowing how you see the world and recognizing it as a coping mechanism, as a construct of protecting yourself, it helps you see that the motivation doesn't have to have so much power. I identify as a one, but that doesn't mean I'm doomed to a life of perfection and order for the sake of perfection and order. A lot of people will tell me that I don't strike them as a one because I let a lot of things go, that I tend to be happier than a lot of ones. In fact, I was reading an article on apartment therapy recently that said something about

like what every enneagram type should do when they wake up in the morning. And ones, you guys, are supposed to hold a smile for 30 seconds, like force a smile. and my immediate thought was like, why on earth do they think ones don't smile? I smile all the time. But the construct of a one is to be solid and stable and dependable, not someone who has fun. That's for the seventh, right? Those poor ones, their lot in life is just to try and be perfect, those poor things. No, you guys, no. The purpose of the Enneagram and any kind of personal growth at all is to become a truer version of yourself, not a more memeable version of what whatever fits inside your personality box. People are just too rich for that to be the case. So as you explore what your type is, recognize that what you read, it is not necessarily an

excuse to always be that way. Being a one isn't a permission slip for me to be judgmental. Being a two isn't a permission slip to give up on knowing what you personally need. Being a three isn't a permission slip to focus on being impressive. None of these nine types are permission slips to stay attached to this specific way of seeing the world. In fact, it is a permission slip to let go to recognize that there are other ways to see and be seen. Now, as a one, I now recognize that my lens of how I see the world is goodness and balance. I long for situations and environments and people to be good and true and to feel balanced and in a certain order.

I can recognize when that desire is deformed, though, when it comes out, like, distorted as perfection and judgment. But when I hold that lens separate from my own wounded mask of self-protection, from the personality I constructed in order to keep myself safe in an unpredictable world as a kid, that lens of goodness and balance, it can be incredibly beautiful when offered to others and to myself. That's why I love this lazy genius space so much. I feel uniquely positioned as a person to speak into the lives of people who long for systems so that life is more efficient. But in order to leave time for what matters and to see the tremendous freedom and just being who you are. It isn't about a system in order to do it right. It's about

seeing systems as a tool to lead you in the direction of being more of yourself. And then if a system doesn't do that, then don't use the system. So when I say the personality is a construct, don't see that necessarily is that like who you are is disappearing. Being aware of your lens, it helps you see the parts of it that aren't helpful, that disconnect you from life. And then you can start to see the aspects of that lens that make the world a better place. That's why no number is better than another number. You might wish that you were a different number because we're human and probably all feel that way a little sometimes. But that's putting our protective construct at the center of our story,

rather than putting the truth at the center of our story. It is easy for me to be annoyed that I identify as a one when every Enneagram Instagram account basically tells me I have a stick up my butt all the time. But that view is too narrow and so incomplete. Yes, I sometimes have a stick at my butt when I'm having a bad day and I'm holding on to protection and not connection.

My protection comes out as control and judgment. A type 6's protection comes out as being defensive and isolating and suspicious. A type 9's protection comes out as complacency and stubbornness over strangely unimportant inconsequential things. Does that mean that a 6 is just a suspicious warrior who is good in a crisis, but that's it? No, you guys, of course not. But knowing that that is your lens as a 6, knowing that you do retreat into yourself

and become defensive and rebellious when you feel unsafe, can help you move down a path of awareness. Then, when you feel yourself digging in your heels and avoiding people who want to know who you are underneath your mask, you can take a deep breath and remember that your lens is just that. It's just a lens. It's not a rule. It's not part of your bone marrow.

But you're also not left with nothing. If you're a six and feel that protective mode happening, you can remember that your lens of security and safety, it makes you trustworthy and loyal and a friend that everyone longs to have. You're not doomed to a life of worst case scenarios, but you can see your lens as a gift and let it move you down a path of health instead of comparing yourself to others and wishing you are more carefree like a seven or more assertive like an eight.

No number is better than another number. We all need each other. And the more we recognize how we see the world and that other people see it differently than we do, the more compassionate and open will be as people. Because we realize that there's just not one way to see the world. And all the ways are valuable. We recognize the value.

And we soften towards people who are different than us. Has anyone noticed that I've been talking for a long time? And I have not gone through the nine numbers yet. Because the nine numbers are secondary to the point of the enneagram. It's personal. It is a journey. It is about your motivation. and your deepest desires and insecurities.

I don't want any of us to feel diminished to that singular thing when we're all incredibly complex. And even in the language of the Enneagram, there aren't just nine types, but there are 27 types. Each type has three subtypes, nine times three equals 27, which we will absolutely not get into today. But despite what I've said about how individual we are and how this is super personal,

it is helpful to recognize that there are a limited number of core ways that humans see the world. Knowing which one motivates you and understanding your own personal lens and the lenses of the people that you love is life-changing. Truly. All right. So once you know your type, what do you do? We'll get into those details in a few weeks because those details matter and they can lead to massive personal growth and a rootedness in who you most deeply are. But for now, here's my answer. Just pay attention. Notice how your key motivation shows up in your everyday life. Be aware. When you feel tense, see if your lens has something to do with it. When you have a misunderstanding with someone, see if your lens has something to do with it. Don't try and find a ton of

answers because really there aren't any. It is such a journey. The Enneagram, it's not a book that you can finish. It is not a class that you can get a grade on. It is a lifelong beautiful process. So just be patient. Take your time. Start by being aware. It's okay and I think actually really good that you don't know yet about subtypes and wings and stances and orientations to time. Knowing too much too soon, it can strip the enneagram of what it's best at doing. Helping you see how you see. So stick with this one thing this key motivation, naming your type, knowing your basic fear and your desire of that number that you identify with, and then pay attention to how it shows up in your life.

And remember that if that lens is a construct meant to protect you, maybe you can start to shift how you see. You can start to connect rather than protect. You can give yourself permission to see differently. As a one, it's not that I'm a perfection. always and I have to fight against that every day. That's my natural way. No, being a perfectionist, it was a lens that kept me safe and helped me make sense of my world. I don't need that lens anymore. I don't have to be subject to its superseding power over how I live and how I see. I can notice

when I feel a push for perfection and then pay attention to why. Am I wanting the dishwasher load of because I'm tired of my effort at home, not being seen by my husband? Or is it because I really don't want to wash dishes and I will do everything I can to get every last bowl and play in the dishwasher so I can go sit down? Maybe I just like the satisfaction of finding the best way to do something like loading the dishwasher and then I move on to the next thing. Sometimes it shows something really deep. Sometimes it doesn't. Just pay attention and be gracious with what you see. You have been living with this particular lens for your entire life. You can't undo it in one podcast episode. Be patient and gentle and don't lose it when you slide down an unhealthy road. We all do that all the time.

Just pay attention and stop trying to fix yourself. Growth will come, but not if you are gripping tightly to an ideal and being unkind to who you are now. That's not the point of the or of being a person in general. So find your number and then sit with it. Live with it. See how it lands in your daily life. The longer you tape, the deeper it'll sink. And then the more we can all move into the world as our true selves and be more

compassionate to ourselves and others and not reduce each other to a list of like three bullet point behaviors. And that's all I have to say about that. Thank you for coming to my TED Talk. I hope that this episode has been an encouragement to you, no matter where you might be on your Enneagram journey. I will put some resources in the show notes, and we will dig a little deeper in August.

Like I said, for now, this is the last episode for a couple of weeks, and I look forward to seeing you all again later in July. I hope you have a beautiful little middle of the summer. And if you're new to this podcast and you, I don't know, maybe you're feeling the pressure of the summer energy, a little bit. I have a ton of summer resources for you, especially if you're home with kids, and they are all on the home page of my website. So if you just go to the lazy genius collective.com, it's all right there. I'll have a link in the show notes, but be sure to check this out if you're new

and you just want some encouragement during the summer season. Sometimes we need that. Thanks so much for listening. And until next time, be a genius about the things that matter and lazy about things that don't. I'm Kendra, and I'll see in a few weeks. You ever felt like you were living just a B or B plus life? It's so dangerous to live that. More dangerous than a B minus or a C plus life? Because when you're living a B or B plus life, you don't change it. You think it's good enough.

Is it? I'm Susie Welch. I host a podcast called Becoming You. People think, okay, an A plus life is not available to me, but there is a way. We are all in the process of becoming ourselves. Listen to Becoming You wherever you get your podcasts.