The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk - 003: Maurice Clarett Built A 6 Figure Income After Spending 4 Years In Prison

Episode Date: April 11, 2015

Episode 003: Maurice Clarett: How He Built A 6 Figure Income After Spending 4 Years In Prison I was absolutely captivated by Maurice.  I could have spoken with him for hours.  I believe in the past he has been misunderstood.  He is a thoughtful, intelligent guy who has genuine ideas on how to help college athletes be better prepared for life after their college. “If I had stayed at Ohio State, I would have won 2 Heisman’s.  My body of work speaks for itself.” – Maurice Clarett That’s just one reason I had an awesome time interviewing today’s guest on The Learning Leader Show.  Welcome to Episode 003 with the thought provoking, Maurice Clarett Subscribe on iTunes or Stitcher Radio. The Learning Leader Show Some Questions I Ask: Why do you feel that Ohio State did not prepare you for life after football? Is it the players or coaches responsibility for the student athletes to be prepared for life after football? What is the story behind the infamous ESPN the magazine cover story and article titled “One and Done?” What would have happened if you had stayed at Ohio State for 2 more years? Why didn’t it work in Denver? Were drugs and alcohol a factor? What specific things can college coaches and administrators do to help college athletes be better prepared for life after sports? What is your current relationship like with Ohio State?  Coach Tressel? In This Episode, You Will Learn: About why Maurice originally committed to play football at Notre Dame The story behind the ESPN story “One and Done” and how they misrepresented Maurice Maurice feels as though he would have won 2 Heisman trophies had he stayed at Ohio State through his junior year Specific practices to help college athletes be better prepared for life after football The moment he felt he truly belonged as a Buckeye The details behind the making of the great ESPN 30 for 30 “Youngstown Boys” How he’s now making a 6 figure income The details behind being arrested multiple times and spending 4 years in prison How he’s turned his life around and is now helping others Much, much more… Continue Learning Go to Maurice's Website Read Warren Buffett Follow Maurice on Twitter @reeseclarett13 You may also like these episodes: Episode 001: How to become a master connector with Jayson Gaignard from MasterMind Talks   Episode 006: Hal Elrod Tells You How To Be Insanely Productive Before 8:00 AM  Episode 009: The Creative Leader’s Guide to making money by thinking outside of the Box with Jason Zook (SurfrApp)   Did you enjoy the podcast? I was fascinated by Maurice.  I’ve followed him since he was in high school winning the USA Today National Player of the Year in North East Ohio.  This was one of my favorite episodes. Who do you know that needs to hear this?  Send them to The Learning Leader Show! Episode edited by the great J Scott Donnell   Bio: Maurice Clarett has traveled throughout the nation speaking to universities, businesses, non-profits, faith based organizations and high schools. His life experiences have led him to be one of the most sought after speakers.  Maurice had a massive amount of success at Ohio State becoming the first freshman running back to start, being named Big Ten freshman of the year, and setting the freshman rushing and touchdown season record. He was also instrumental in helping Ohio State clinch the National Championship in 2002 with two pivotal plays "the strip" and scoring the go ahead touchdown. This was Maurice's only season at Ohio State due to a series of events that took place in his life (These events be seen in the ESPN 30 for 30 documentary "Youngstown Boys").  After much success on the field Maurice had trouble finding that same level of success off of the field and found himself serving 7 1/2 year prison sentence. It was there that Maurice began to take that work ethic and discipline that brought him so much success as a football player and began to focus it on himself as a person. He began to educate himself through college courses and reading books in his topics of interest such as the economics, finance, and business. His growth became evident to those around him as he would share what he had learned and began motivating those around him. It was this type of leadership that permitted him to be released 4 years early.  Upon being released Maurice went right to work in developing what he has envisioned. He wanted to create a platform that would allow him to connect, educate, and empower people in their life and/or profession. Maurice soon found himself connecting with the nation’s top business executives with the most notable being Warren Buffet. His ability to connect with his audience in a practical way leaves those who hear his words feeling inspired. Maurice believes that when you compound positive reinforcements in your life, over time, you begin to receive the benefits from them.

What do you think your career or life, this is a big what if, but what do you think your life or career is like if you stay at Ohio State for a few more years and play versus what happened? Like I said, I don't get into the hypotheticals a bunch. You know, I think, you know, I think I could humbly and respectfully say. I probably just, my aim was to do at bare minimum what Archie Griffin did. I wanted to go win two Heisman trophies. And I think with the team we had, with my skill set and the coaching that we had,

I think that it was very possible. And I really believe I could have won a Heism coming back to next year. I think that we could have won a championship coming back to next year. And I think we could have, if everybody was healthy and things weren't right, I think we could have did it for three years in the row.

Are leaders born or are they made? Our host, Ryan Hawk, believes that leaders can be made through determined, focused work on learning the art and science behind the makeup of other successful leaders. Now it's time to inhale knowledge and exhale success. You're listening to The Learning Leader Show with Ryan Hawk. Welcome to The Learning Leader Show. I'm Ryan Hawk.

Tonight's guest, another really, really special one to me. It's Maurice Claret, former great running back at Ohio State briefly with the Denver Broncos. We talk a lot about Maurice's life and everything that's led up to this point at the young age of 31, including how he planned to win at least two Heisman trophies like Archie Griffin did. Also, we detail the process for college. student athletes to be better prepared for life after football. Maurice talks a lot about that and his plans. I asked him when he specifically felt he belonged at Ohio State and you'll love his answer, really, really interesting stuff. Then also the story behind his famous ESPN cover story titled

One and Done. Maurice gets into the details behind how that whole thing came about. I think you'll really find it interesting. Without further ado, it's Maurice Claret. There's a lot to get into. And so There's a number of different directions we could go with this, but I'm going to start with what's most recent in the news. And this is regarding some tweets you made when Chris Borland decided to retire after his rookie season with the San Francisco 49ers. This is close to home for us because he's an Ohio guy actually from where I'm from Dayton, Ohio, and played his college ball in Wisconsin. And then Sam Fran, a guy that we really look up to. And you had some really, really well-thought-out, thought-provoking comments on it. that I know a lot of people have asked you about

and just wanted to see if you could comment on that further and why you felt the need or what made you prompted you to speak out about him. It originally wasn't me speaking out. It was just more just lending my opinion towards something I see a lot of college guys struggle with. A lot of guys seem to hold on to their sports, their respective sport for a lot longer than they should

because there's no backup plan. And so initially when I seen him on ESP and he did it, I was like, hey, just from a subconscious level, I was like this guy must have had a backup plan to walk away from a situation like that. You know, for a lot of people in America, you know, everybody dreams of playing the NFL or the NBA and make him tremendous amounts of money for a guy to walk away from it. Being at the peak of his career, he just had a different definition of how he wanted to live his life, what he thought success was, and it just pretty much made sense. And so from that standpoint, people just kind of retweeted it or whatever.

And I just kind of took different legs. This one asked me, like, why do you feel that way? And so I just began to dig into it, you know, just how guys in college, some guys take the education part serious. They take their finance classes. They take classes that actually developed them into a skilled profession, and they take that run and take that path. And they have another group of guys who happen to take more lollipop classes

or classes that don't assist these guys outside of their respective sport. in that case, these guys hold on to a career that doesn't support them being old in many different facets. So my thoughts and my tweets that came from that foundation. I go around and speak to a lot of universities and I see these athletes firsthand,

even from my own experience, when I was at Ohio State, just some of the classes that I took that didn't assist me outside of playing and just really speaking from experience and really raising awareness. if you take the game or if you take your academics a lot more serious a lot earlier than your transition post your career isn't as painful to try to transition into the next level of your life and just more or less that's where I came from when I said it.

Do you think that your time at Ohio State did it not prepare you properly for life after football? It was such a short time and I can't speak in a hypothetical term because who's just say if I wasn't there longer, things wouldn't have played out differently. You know what I'm saying? I can only speak in the context of the 13 months or 14 months I was there. And so in the time I was there, I was say I didn't take full

full advantage or the big picture and the statistics of guys actually making it. That wasn't expressed. You know, most guys don't even know 1% makes it, and that's statistically proven. So out of every 100 guys, one guy maybe go from this university

and go play professional sports. and then even with those guys gone, they'll stay on average from three to four years, you know what I'm saying? And you won't make enough money unless you're Sam Bradford or somebody with the signing bonus that has changed your life where you'll be able to take the money

and the interests off this thing or be able to make some sound decisions and sort of change your life. It doesn't happen. And we leverage so much time eight hours throughout the day spent playing football and going to the football office. And yet at the same time,

we leverage so much of that, our whole body, our whole soul, our whole future, and we sort of foreclose our academic future. You know what I'm saying? And then when we're done playing, you'll have guys that just will stay and hold on because they don't know how to do anything else or they haven't trained to do anything else. And for me, with guys, with the university officials and people in student academic support

services, when you have these people, their salaries come from properly educating or they're supposed to properly educate these people who they go get from these various neighborhoods and various cultures, I just think the responsible thing to do. doing all of it is to raise awareness and raise awareness towards these athletes coming in and just really set them up to the point where, hey, I'm going to educate you no matter what. And if you're not going to be educated at this level, then you have to pass on. I mean, you have to move on or get better.

Just as you should get better on the football field. You should get better in the classroom. And we sometimes stress the former and not the latter. Yeah. What are the specific things you think could be implemented right now for college? I mean, I played college football as wide, so I know what you're talking about. But what are the specific things that a coach or administrators who are paid a lot of money could do to help all of their student athletes as they're still called, even though we know it doesn't seem like a proper term.

But are there specific things that you have in mind that could be implemented today? Yes, I personally believe, just, you know, so you know as well as I know. We probably come from, I know your brother. We came in together, right? Yep. So we come from two different cultures, two different backgrounds, socially, economically, the entire person. process, right? So in understanding that, let's not hide it. Let's say, hey, if Maurice Claret didn't play football, he probably couldn't come on his campus academically, but since we're bringing

him in and we're benefiting off him, or a lot of guys like him, a lot of guys from the Glenville area, a lot of guys from just inner city communities, right? You get them from South Florida, you get it from Texas, you get them from everywhere. Can we create some sort of personal development program from year one to year five? We have some of the best psychologists, sociologists, economic majors, and all these people who understand. life and we're in the world and behavior can we develop these people intellectually outside of the game just to make them better individuals right that's just flat that's just hey can i develop this guy because he's coming to my university he'll one day have a family he'll one day represent

our university in the community we want just got to talk better act better that entire thing right i think you can do that from a standpoint i think if you want to any academic department you ask them to formulate some curriculum uh for the athletes that they were required to get in from day one today to week five, I mean, not week one, week five, year one, to year four, five, however longer guys at the university, I think that that would help significantly just because you're exposed to something other than just football information from an academic standpoint for guys who are underperforming. I think you shouldn't shuffle guys like myself.

I took an officiating golf, officiating softball, and a woman studies class, right? And no one says a word, but if I miss a practice or if I drop a pass, somebody screaming down my throat. you know what I'm saying? So you need to have these conversations like, why are you taking these classes? And you need to even ask your position coach, ask your head coach. Would you allow your own children to take these classes? And 100% of the time, the answer will be no.

So if your child wouldn't be allowed to take these classes, why would you recommend these things to me, understanding that there's no future involved in me doing this thing long term? And so from an academic standpoint, just as you make requirements and you set expectations from the athletic level to perform and do better. I think these same things should be done in an academic realm. You know what I'm saying? You shouldn't send guys just to agriculture classes.

You know, I've never seen a farm. I've never been on a farm from ages 118, but they'll send me to an agriculture degree and knowing I'm not going to use this are an African-American studies degree, understanding that I don't plan on furthering research in this department. And there's nothing wrong with those degrees if that's your life. If that's what it is that you're passionate about. But if these things only help me to become eligible on Saturday, and they're going to do nothing for me long term,

then it's an injustice or it's something silent that goes on that's not spoken about. You know, it's kind of like this, like when the Penn State thing came out and everybody found out that the guy was raping the kids, right? That was very wrong because it was wrong with just many levels, moral levels. He shouldn't have done it. And he was sort of, it was a crazy act. But in regards to education, right? I feel like guys are being raped from an educational standpoint, an academic standpoint,

and I feel that is just as wrong because this has a long-term effect, psychologically, socially, academically, financially, and just on so many other levels. That's where the passion comes from to speak about that. Wow. Do you think, you know, because I remember that time, and it's been some times as I played almost 10 years in college. Both my facts. Yeah, I know. And do you think, though, some of it, because I remember the maturity level of,

just myself. And you're right, I think we come from two completely different backgrounds as far as where we grew up, our parents and everything like that, which is why I love college sports and I loved playing because I got to interact with people from completely different backgrounds from me. But do you think some of that is on the player, though, or is on us as the so-called student athlete in the fact that we should say we need to be proactive in our desires? Because I remember when I play, I played at OU, so just down the street from you. And I was, even though I played in the Mac, all I was thinking about literally 24-7 was playing in the NFL. I knew I had to stay eligible, and I got decent, you know, I got good grades because I did go

to class, but I wasn't really, I wasn't super focused on class. I was focused on watching film, on lifting weights, on getting ready for Saturdays, on making sure that I was putting myself in the best possible position to make it in the NFL. And then I never did, right? I played arena football, but never made it in the NFL. So do you think part of that is on the player too, or is that on the administrators and the coaches? It's a process, right? So the awareness level needs to be raised, right?

So if you want to get better as a quarterback, right? They bring a million tools in to make you more aware of coverage. They make you more aware of formations. They make you more aware of situations, tendencies and everything else, right? And we'll invest endless amounts of resources into that, right? But that skill set are what they're talking about is only valid until you're 30 years old. You know what I'm saying? If you're lucky, right?

Right. Look at your brother. Your brother is, I don't know if he got picked up by anybody yet, but he's only 31. Yeah, the Bengals. You know what I'm saying? And I can respectfully say, within the next five years, his career will probably be over, right? And so everything he's learned up into that point, it'll be over.

You know what I'm saying? And so from an awareness standpoint, I think that same responsibility comes from an institution that you have to put a heavy emphasis on the academic process. Like, okay, that's cool. You want to be an NFL football player. That's cool.

You want to make a thousand throws. Cool. You want to make a thousand tackles. Cool. You want to make a thousand yards. But the reality is, right? The reality is that 1% of you guys will go. So since we generate our salaries, our families income, the way we're allowed to send our school, kids to these private schools, you all, we benefit and go get better coaching jobs from you guys.

We owe it to you to make a better effort at educating you guys. And like I say, I always say this, universities, right, they ran off of donations. Traditionally, they ran for donations. People donate money, right? Small business owners, entrepreneurs, big time institutions, right? So you have 100 athletes on your campus or 125, how many of our football players you have. You have a direct connection to some of the most affluent business people within your town, right? So just as much as you have to come out to your voluntary workouts in summer, I think it should be also voluntarily that you have to go get you an internship with somebody and really discover what it is that you want to do,

how it operates, how it acts, and just so on and so forth. You know what I'm saying? I know I'm speaking in a few different areas, but these are. just my thoughts, my collective thoughts of how you transition these guys. So I think you need to also have guys understand what success looks like, right? Or to be able to define what is being

successful because when you talk to most guys who come from inner city situations and you ask them, why do I play football, right? The whole thing is, yes, I love it, one, but two, I'm trying to live different than I've lived before. And then I take it a step further. And I say, okay, you're trying to live sort of a suburban lifestyle, something more secure, where your kids are in better schools.

You want to drive a car with your choice and all those things, right? and the guy will tell you yes, right? But then I say, okay, if you go to any prominent suburb, if you went to Dublin, upper Aldenna, if you went to, excuse me, Olin Tangi, West of your, all this stuff, right? If you went to those houses, you wouldn't see many athletes, you know what I'm saying what you would see is hardworking people who have built lives, who have skilled professions,

and these people are living the lives that these guys want to live, right? So I think that you're wrapping around and just having guys redefine what success is and things of that nature. I think those are just steps or things that you can do to shift the consciousness or the shift levels of awareness early just for guys to prepare early. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Duptailing off that a little bit is the debate between paying college athletes, specifically the revenue generating sports like football and basketball. I'm curious as to your thoughts on paying them and one, if we should, I think a lot of us are in agreement that players need to be compensated in some.

way, shape, or form, and how do we do that? Just like anything else in America, you know, like, just as you have different values with professional teams, you have different values with college teams. And I think it's like it's almost that simple. You know, everywhere in America, based upon your skill set and based upon what you contribute, and based upon your responsibility, you're compensated off of that. You know what I'm saying? Exactly.

And I think like, but in college where you have so many smart people, so many intellectuals, So many people who can figure everything else out, they can figure out the statistics of an NCAA March Maddenous bracket and your percentages of winning and all that, right? But sometimes when it gets to the process of actually paying the people who generate the money, we just get this big brain fart or nobody wants to deal with it, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. And, you know, so you're talking about millions of dollars, right?

Billions, yeah. Billions, I'm sorry. Yeah, thanks for correctly, right? Yeah. Even if you took 10 million dollars away and distributed it, right? you say, okay, maybe we can't go get these cool weights or some cool postage or signage for our weightlifting room, and we can actually distribute it to the players who actually need it and who help us generate it. You know, it wouldn't be a bad thing.

Even if it was 5 million, you know, we're not talking about billions and trillions of dollars that you're going to attract capacity. It is actually to be compensated for their skill set and what it is they do. And then they say, okay, these guys get an education. That's a big argument. And then I'm saying, like, no, they're not getting an education because you're graduating them with B has degrees, you know what I'm saying? Yeah.

So then when you attack that and then you bring that conversation up, now we're in a new space. Now let's investigate the degrees that these guys actually get. And let's have a case study long term and where these guys going, what they're doing and their interaction with their university and stuff like that. And when you actually look at the bigger picture, it then goes back to show them like something fundamentally is wrong, you know what I'm saying? And if it's my hope that you can just have all these guys. one day just sit down and say, hey, you know what, we're not playing until we have some

intelligent people come together and figure this thing out. You know what I'm saying? Once you stop the money, once you just stop the entire process, and from that standpoint, you know, then guys will sort of wake up or things will be reconstructed. But until then, man, you just have the same cycle of behavior going on until leadership change, you know what I'm saying? Until the leadership with the NCAA changes. Yeah, I also think about the likeness of the players.

So I vividly remember going to Ohio Stadium seeing, I can't even count how many people wearing number 13 jerseys. I remember one game, I think you guys were playing against Penn State, your freshman year, AJ's freshman year, she guys are the same age. And sitting actually, I think, right next to your mom. And everywhere you look, they're wearing a 13 jersey. And obviously all of those were purchased, whether it's online or in the university bookstore. and I know you obviously didn't get a penny of that. What do you think about players being paid on others using their likeness, aka your number?

Yeah, it's very simple. It's your lightness, it's your energy, it's your sweat, it's everything. You know what I'm saying? And of course, I believe it should happen, and I think it's right. You know, you're being compensated for your labor. But the only thing that makes the NCAA so strong, and the system's so strong is because there's no alternative league to go to. If you had a different league, like if you had these sponsors to come in and you say, hey, okay, we're going to generate or start this entirely different league and we're going to put you all on the field and we're going to play and we're going to film and we're going to get this stuff to colleges.

We're going to have coaches come here and do it. Then the NCAA would have to change because top talent will go or can go to where they will get paid. But since we don't have that system in place, you know, we're just left with this on the option. It's kind of like it's really a monopoly. You know what I'm saying? It's really just a monopoly of guys just being exploited. But when you don't have any other options, man, you know, just this is what it is, you know what I'm saying? Completely.

Yeah, completely. Now, this is always great stuff to talk about. I appreciate you get into it with you because you have a great vantage point and lived it and just made a lot of news to why you were doing it. I'm curious just about some of your time out Ohio State. We transitioned a little bit. And what's your current relationship like with Coach Tressel? Oh, we're real cool. I actually talked to him last week.

Real good. He's at the leadership role up there in Youngstown State. I don't know he does a lot for the actual university, but just for the community in general, sort of the prize, sort of the bondage. He's trying to connect with the community and university, and he's only been up there, I think, like a year now or year in June or July, something like that. But it's great, man. It's great to be able to have an impact or influence on my city through just a different level, just a different level from an image. in the straddle standpoint. He called me up. He said, hey, I need you back up here so we can kind of

help some guys throughout the city. And, you know, it's just cool to have that opportunity. Once things kind of slow down for me, I'll be able to do that. What do you think about how it went down when he, when he had to, was forced to resign, you know, through the tattoo thing and Terrell Pryor and all those, all those things. I got to believe you guys were talking at some point. What do you think of how that all went down? I can sum it up and just say nonsense. Yeah. It doesn't even merit enough of my energy to try to dig into it because it's all nonsense. You know what I'm saying?

I'm pretty much like that when something is full of nonsense, I don't even try to get into it and talk about the tribute matters of it. You know, it's just like this. Like if somebody, it's like a person going up for a dunk and another person coming in and hacking them and it's a flagrant file, right? And you as a fan sees the referee and he doesn't call a flagrant file. You know, say you was a fan, you're like, hey, this is kind of crazy. You sit there and seen that guy. This is some nonsense, some BS, whatever you want to label it. But you don't have to, you don't have to describe it.

You see what it is. And so in his situation, it just was obvious that it was some nonsense. And, you know, it's just crazy how you can try or they try to ruin a guy's legacy or his integrity and just how guys made a spectacle out of nothing, you know what I'm saying. Have you talked to any of those players that were involved at that time? Yeah. I was talking to Boom. Obviously, you know, man, boom,

our moon, man, boom, are real close. But, you know, there's nothing more than that. Yeah. It just, yeah, I remember that when all of it was happening, we just, I was just crushing because he's one of the guys that I was fortunate to get to know a little bit and just seemed like just such a genuine, real guy who cared so much for his players that you just love seeing that in a coach. Absolutely.

You don't have many like that anymore. I know, I know. Are you still close with, with coach? Coach Urban Meyer in the program. Do you, I mean, how affiliated with, are you with Ohio State? I haven't been down there probably in a year and a half. I still talk to some of the guys on the team. I know them and see him in passing.

But, you know, just a different regime, a different set of people to come in. And, you know, I respect him. Like, he was the first guy I committed to when he was actually coaching at Notre Dame. I'm actually to Notre Dame because of him. Really? Yeah, he left. Yeah, he was a lot more aggressive than he is.

wide receivers coach there because I remember he was recruiting me a little bit out of high school. Hey, he was either wide receivers or offensive line coach. I'm not sure. He was something over there, but the initial connection came from him obviously being in Notre Dame. So we were cool. I was able to see him one time in a way room, but you know, life gets so busy and, you know, you would love to go down to university every day, but just sometimes his life is just too crazy. And, you know, you're ripping and running and you're going around the country. I'm speaking in, and just definitely different of entrepreneurial ventures I'm involved in. So, you know, I'm not down there as much as I would like to be, but I know I'm in respect and I'm glad what they were able to do this year.

What was the recruiting process like for you? Obviously, you're the national player of the year in high school, storied career. It could have gone anywhere you wanted. What was the process like for you? That was simple. I was going to any university that was kind of in driving distance because I hated flying. Really? Yeah, I hate flying.

Actually, it was crazy just to see those people pass away over in France. It's more than 150 people down on the plane crash, stuff like that always. Yes, one is sadding, but two always affects me and gives me more reason why I hate flying. But I didn't have any intention of going anywhere far away just because I didn't want to get on the plane. Excuse me, and I committed to Notre Dame at first, and the whole thing was like, hey, I don't know how college will work out athletically, but, you know, at least if I graduate with a degree from Notre Dame, I'll be able to situate myself with life. But then after Urban Meyer kind of got cut, it was the same time that Jim Trussler came to Ohio State. prior to Jim Trussell coming to Ohio State, Ohio State never offered me a scholarship. Really?

Yeah, no. John Cooper never offered me their scholarship. And so even then, Troussel didn't offer me a scholarship. I went to my coach's office and I told him, I said, hey, can you get our coach Trussell on the phone? And he was like, what for us? I'm going to just tell him, I want to commit to Ohio State. And this was in the summer transitioning like springish summertime. And so he called him, got him on the phone and said, hey, Coach Tressa, I'm coming to commit to Ohio State.

He's like, oh, that's cool. He said, you know, we didn't offer me a scholarship. And I said, you know, after the season, y'all will. And he just kind of chucked on a laugh. He said, hey, if you want to come, you can come. And so then that next year I go out and I run for all those yards. And, you know, it was a good decision on my part for him, you know what I'm saying? Wait, was that before your junior year or senior year?

Before senior year, junior, senior or something like that. I don't know, like, you know, people, you know, the years seem to blur together. Yeah. I was like, I was going to say, I just, the only reason I asked is because that just seems absolutely crazy to me that you wouldn't have had an offer by then. And so especially with everything that happened, you know, your senior year, you were as decorated as you were, the career you had. Yeah, you know, it just happened. And it was after my junior year. Okay.

Transitioning into my senior year, that was kind of the time period. Wow. That's incredible. And then so you get recruited and then you decide you enrolled early at Ohio State. Is that right? Yeah, so I went to enroll early at Notre Dame and I set it up and did all my summer school classes. and that wasn't able to take place. And so I went out and I went down to,

and so I went out to Ohio State early. And so it was the first time, like, all this graduating early trends started from me, intentionally, are initially trying to go to Notre Dame early. Okay. So a lot of guys growing up kids, especially if they live in Ohio, they're saying, and I remember this for our family as well, it was like, hey, you know, we might not be able to go to Ohio State,

but if they offer, I'm going. You know, I'm an Ohio guy. I want to go to Ohio State. And so, like, you know, you kind of set up, the coach, Tressel and now Coach Irmaier, setting up borders basically around saying nobody's getting out. But it sounds like you didn't feel that way because you initially were willing to go to Notre Dame.

Yeah, I mean, I just didn't have the offer. You know, they had a lot of young guys here. They had three running backs in the previous class, Jaja Rowley, Maurice Hall, and Ladeo Ross. So I can get it from his standpoint. He's like, hey, I have three here. There's no need to offer this guy. But, you know, it was cool.

It happened, you know what I'm saying? I wasn't mad at him. Yeah, okay. I was going to say, again, I was surprised to hear that I assumed you had every offer you wanted going into your final year to say I can just make that decision. So you go to Ohio State then and you have just, you know, an incredible year. It's one of the best years in the history of Ohio State, both for you as well as the team winning a national championship. Was there a specific moment during that season? Maybe it was the first game against Texas Tech.

I don't know. But I remember watching it. from my locker room, actually, at OU, seeing you run for all those yards. But was there a specific moment where you said, I really truly belong as a Buckeye? Just the offseason, the offseason really convinced me that I belong there, it convinced me who I was, it convinced me my talent. And, you know, but the first game was sort of like the public validation.

You know what I'm saying? I played on the fourth team, my entire offseason. You know, a lot of, a lot of rock and all the grun reps. I had the third and fourth scout team. Wow. before on the entire offseason. Yeah, I actually didn't get to starting nine until two weeks before the season. And so with that being said, but just the amount of work I put in,

and I've seen the skill level of guys, and I've seen my separation, my attitude, and my mentality. I just knew I was different. Like, you know, you can almost say the same thing about your brother, because your brother used to play behind me on special teams in the Agap, Russian. We were Aged at Grush. But anytime we competed, me and AJ sort of competed together all the time, and Bobby at the time, Bobby was the same age,

wasn't as aggressive as your brother. I can't wait to tell him that. It's the truth. I mean, I don't, I don't, I don't, you know, there's no offense or no, no personal attack. But AJ was more of the disciplinarian, the silent guy. And he probably was the equivalent, what I was to the offense. He was the equivalent on defense. Actually, AJ got in his first player, one of his first plays.

I was tired on special teams. This is the Ken State game. Yep. He was the backup on the A-Gat rush, so I came to the sideline. I was like, hey, man, AJ, I'm tired. I don't feel like going out there. Can you go in for me? So AJ gets to running on the field, and Coach Snyder's going crazy.

Like, who put AJ in? Right? So I backed up to the back of the bench, right? So AJ goes in and blocks the punt. And so he came to the sideline. And like, we smiled at each other. I said, man, you can stay for the rest of the game. The next week came by, and Coach O'Nner was like, hey, Maurice, you know, we're going to put AJ there.

I was like, cool. I didn't want to be on special teams anyway. That's weird that you would be on special teams, especially with all the work, you were getting a boatload of carries at that time, too. I mean, from game one, like I said, I remember. Yeah, thanks to AJ for my relief. After that, yeah, he was the, you know, he was that aggressor.

He was that guy, you know, and for a large part, I think, respectively to everybody else, I think his presence really catapulted or ignited those other guys' careers, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. And they probably won't tell you that, but I tell it to him, you know what I'm saying? He happened to be so good, and defenses kind of had to scheme around.

You've got to see that from his longevity in the NFL of what he was. You know what I'm saying? I always say to myself, like, if I played defense, I'll have been more like him, but I was like that on the offensive side of the ball. And, you know, it was cool. You know, it was cool to see. It's still cool to see him still playing. I know we started out.

And knowing I first met him back in the senior camp, the top 50 seniors in town. Yeah. And so the entire camp, they wanted me and AJ to go at each other. And it was just like the funnest thing in the world. But, you know, those guys know, we had a ball together. Those are cool stories, man. I love to hear that.

So, like I said, you get into the year and you're having a huge year, like Heisman-type talk in the one season that you have. And what do you think your career or life, this is a big what-if, but what do you think your life or career is like if you stay at Ohio State for a few more years and play versus what happened? Like I said, I don't get into the hypotheticals a bunch. You know, so, but, like, you know, I think, I think I could humbly and respectfully say, I probably just my aim was to do at bare minimum what Archie Beirfram did.

I wanted to go win two Heisman trophies. And I think with the team we had, with my skill set in the coaching that we had, I think that it was very possible. And, you know, I really believe I could have won a Heisman coming back to next year. I think that we could have won a championship coming back to next year. And I think we could have, if everybody was healthy and things were right, I think we could have did it for three years in a row. And, you know, I respect everybody's game level,

but I don't really think that there was another guy who ran the ball like me. You know what I'm saying? And I'll tell Eddie, I'll tell Archie. But, of course, they've had careers and things played out a bit differently. But, you know, in regards to, you know, I can just put film in. You know, I was just a different guy when it came to running the football. And I think I would have went down as the best or one of the grades. I still think even with the season and body of work in the way that we all judge running backs.

I still think that they can mention me as one of the greats who ran the football. But, you know, it didn't happen and life happens the way it is now. But those are just my personal feelings when I do decide to deal with the hypotheticals. But I know how hard I worked. I know my mentality on the field. I know the motivation and the inspiration and the way I made my teammates feel by just from going so hard. I think if you sat down and you had a conversation with your brother and you asked him about me, I think he'll tell you that just my mentality,

towards that season would ignite in those other freshmen. I made those guys believe that they can do more than what they did are more than what they were capable. I just made you guys believe more. So I was furious in the sense, and I think that he will admit it to you

because I used to see how those guys look at me, San Antonio and Troy and Bobby and what's his name? Slago came in later. But they can't deny. You know, we can all go about, you know, some of the bad things that happened in Ohio State.

but when it came to inspiring those other guys, you know, saying it was something special, man. We had a special thing that, you know, obviously didn't play out. But, you know, it's all good, though. You know, life happens. Absolutely. And ESPN ended up bringing that famous story of you on the cover with, you know, kind of toss in the jersey. And it looks like they took it out of context probably. But I'm curious about that specific story and the pictures and everything that came from it with.

I think it said one and done with a question mark and all of that. Yeah, absolutely. No, what the way it happened was they said, hey, can we just catch up with you on your freshman season? And in the process of catching up on the freshman season, they said, what was this? Contagos said, say, like, hey, let's do an interview. So they said, let's do the interview. We get down to an interview.

We talk about the possibilities of going pro, because obviously, me and LeBron, we're connected at the time. And so in that spirit, he wrote the story from that spirit. So he had an idea of where he wanted to go or the information or content that he was pulling out of me, but I didn't know how he would frame it up. And so we go out to the field and we're shooting pictures. and the media director, Steve Snap at the time, he was there.

And I was smiling the whole time. I didn't want any angry shots. I just had nothing to be angry about because I was a kid happy to be doing a store with ESP in the magazine. To end of the shoot, they said, come to the tunnel and come behind his brick wall. And this was to add that context or flare. And they said, can you please make a mean face? You know, act like you're mad. And so I act like I was mad.

Then we were walking off the field. They said, hey, how about you throw your jersey to the media director? So I was doing, I was storing the jersey towards a professional guy who had done this for 30 years, you know what I'm saying? That's what they forget to tell everybody about, right? That he was instructing me to do this, right? So that story seems to get lost and the kid seems to look like an idiot, right? So I was throwing it to him, not understanding what they were framing up, but this guy sat with me from the interview all away until the actual happening. And so then when it came out, they said, one and done, I had no intention of doing that.

so I had to defend the reality that wasn't one I placed upon myself or one that I was interested in not doing. You know, and I was like the, that was the synopsis of what kind of took place. Man, did that create a lack of trust with the media? I can't imagine that happening to an individual. Yeah, I mean, so you're, imagine, just imagine someone was going around and they were accusing you of stealing something, whatever it happened to be. They were accusing you of stealing anything, and you didn't do it or someone was

accusing you of rape or someone who's accusing you of anything, or whoever the individual or institution or the person who is delivering the information, of course, there's a level of distrust because you understand at this point that once you put your words out there, you really don't have control of how they're... See, you know, this day and age, you can get on Twitter, Facebook, you don't need a third party to talk for you, you know what I'm saying? In large part, the media is kind of lucky to be hanging on, you know what I'm saying? Because people can sort of speak for themselves.

it's easy to talk to people themselves and they can put their information in the proper context but in that day and that time we didn't have those resources or those tools you know even if you wanted to ask me something you would have to come see me face to face or we'd have to talk on the phone. It isn't like now we can just sort of speak to the world

initially, you know what I'm saying? Yeah. Link of a night. I just can't, I remember when the story came out and I saw it and I was like, wow, this looks kind of weird. It doesn't make sense talking to AJ a little bit about it. I'm like, this doesn't make sense at all. But sometimes I wonder why a news organization

would do something like that because it's just like, I think Sports Illustrated did something like that with Michael Jordan when he played baseball, and he still doesn't talk to them. He still won't talk to them to this day because they said something bad about his baseball career. And so for them to completely take that story of you out of context and kind of force you to make a mean face

or throw the jersey and then take it out of context, they're risking you never talking to them again and probably people in your network never talking to them again. But you have to understand the bigger picture. And I understood it more when I did my 30 for 30 with them, right? Yes. So ESPN is a machine. And so they don't have personal feelings towards anybody.

They have analytics on wouldn't drive stories, right? The lower, the more trivial, the more controversial, the more shocking the story is, the more connects with the common mind, right? So you don't have a lot of people who can think, who can talk intellectually. you have more people in which Warren Buffett likes to call it the living like mentality, the process of mindlessly imitating others, right? So you have this. And most people connect on that level.

You know what I'm saying? We can, I put it like because I can go save a baby outside right now from in front of a moving car. And it wouldn't make as much noise as there's Brian rape case and wherever it happens to be. You know what I'm saying? And one is heroic and one is honorable. And another one is demeaning and degrading. and it's beating up a superstar that, you know, we can take down. So these people understand that, and that's why they're a big billion-dollar machine.

And so I just was another guy in the process. So I don't hold any personal feelings. I just gained an understanding on the events that took place, and I took my personal feelings out of it and say, hey, you know, it happened. And I get wiser. And from that, you give the information to the next guy, and he doesn't fail. But you learn, you know, so there isn't nothing to be mad about in the long run. I just learn from it and move forward.

The 30 for 30, but Youngstown Boys was so awesome, man. It was one of the best 30-for-3s I've ever seen, and those are all really, really well done. How did that come about? Well, initially, they came to me with the idea of wanting to do a story about Ohio State, and they had seen me kind of get my life back in order, and I was in Omaha at the time. When it came to me, they was like, hey, let's go ahead and do a story about Ohio State. And so I just rejected the whole thing. They had intentions or they thought I was angry at Ohio State,

and they had an intention of trying to create a story about a series of events. And so I was like, hey, you know, my life's a lot bigger than that. There's more life lessons. There's more about relationships. There's more about decision-making. There's more about childhood. And just a series of things. And they was like, okay, cool.

Let's see if we can find you a different director. So about eight or nine months went by, and, you know, eventually I ran into the right directors. And these guys, I think they were good for the story because they had no understanding of football. They had no understanding of the dynamics of the game, the politics of the game, and they were just interested in storytelling and speaking more about just universal ideas and universal truths in regards to just growing up in relationships and people and how they affect you and how things play out and how you overcome adversity and things of that nature. And so that's how it came to be. You know, we shot it and, you know, it was cool. And, you know, it's been a blessing to my life and moving forward. Yeah, I loved it.

It was awesome. We've seen it multiple times. It's really, really well done. I thought it was, I just liked this. see the as people progress, you know, in your life to see, see how it goes. And it makes me think a little bit, you know, this is a changing gears a tad, but so you do get drafted, right, by the Denver Broncos and Mike Shanahan. It's, I believe, the third round, right? And, and they bring you in, and ultimately it doesn't work out. And I'm curious from, from your perspective as to, there's probably

a number of different reasons as to why, but why do you feel in your mind it didn't work out long term in Denver? The biggest thing, just being separated from the game for so long, just developing a different mentality and a different lifestyle. For the two years that I set out, there wasn't any ambition to be sort of that guy anymore. You know, so I had to be from the process getting kicked out of school. And I was in California, you know, from being around football players,

you're always around them, you're always competing, you're always getting better. But switching gears from that and just going to live as a regular human being, just not having that environment or not having the people, the coaching, and just that locker room feel around me. You know, my interests became different. I began to rip and run the streets, began to rip and running inside of nightclubs. It just started to enjoy life from a different perspective.

And really just I was venting, all the partying, all the drinking, all the drug, and all those things were just levels of me venting from how I felt about things not going out or things not working out the way I wanted to. So when Denver drafted me, obviously they were trying to get an undervalued stop. You know, he understood that, you know,

had I played, I would have been a lot better than what I was. So they were trying to rekindle that fire. And there were times at practice, there were times I would take on John Lynch and me and him would go head-to-head and Al Wilson and DJ Woods. And he had these guys like, hey, man, you know, if you get this thing together, you can really be something special in this league. But so many bad habits are lack of interest in wanting to be a teammate and stuff like that.

All those things ultimately affected me. You know, you had these days where my body wasn't up to par, my hamstrings were pulling, my lower back was hurting, my groin was hurting. but these are things that were happening because I didn't train appropriately when I was out of football. Like I'll get on a treadmill and run and just do bare minimum.

You know what I'm saying? And long before you know it, Coach Shannon set me down a couple of times and he was trying to help me to get together. But, you know, it's all a maturity level. You know, I just wasn't as mature as I am now. And ultimately, you know, he just had to let me go. You know, he gave me a few different chances

that weren't on camera, that he just tried to sit me behind closed doors and talk to me. But I wasn't receptive of the information at the time and ultimately let me go. What was that like? What was that moment like for you? I was just humbling. You know, my entire life I've been, ever since I've been playing football since the ninth or 10th grade, I've always been, if I wasn't the best, I was within the top tier of guys playing.

And then to go out and knowing your mind that you can't get things together was hard. You know what I'm saying? Just Mieter is trying to get my life in order. It was hard to manage it. But, you know, you develop those things or you develop that level of maturity and responsibility in college. It was just so many things I missed throughout the process that ultimately will help me go. But, you know, you're depressing and you're stressed because somebody told you, someone has told you that, hey, you can't play this game anymore. And it's really that simple. And you want to play.

You have the ability to play. You've put so much into it. And, you know, you can't play. So, you know, you have to take your ball or your skills and go home. You know what I'm sad? Yeah. And I think all of us have that really, really tough, tough moment where the thing that you've loved, for most of us your entire life.

For me, it was back to second grade and when I got done playing after my second year in arena football league. And you have to make that transition now to say I'm not, you know, I'm not going to be playing football anymore. And it's crushing, man. It's like depression. I still think of it.

And I got to believe then the effect it had on you probably then creates you to, for some of us to spiral and do some bad things. So I'm wondering if that's the type of thought process you were having once once it happened. Okay, so what do we all do? We go through this process and we play this thing until we can't play anymore. And then after that process, what happens?

You revert back to what it is, you know, be it if you educated yourself in college, or be it if you just kind of was the same guy on the street. And in my case, growing up, all I did was just kind of rip and run streets, hang out, sell drugs, or doing to the best of my ability. And that's what I basically revert back to because there was no education in that process. You know, back when we were younger, it wasn't a big drive to, hey, go to the NFL. It was go to college, get an education because the NFL might not work out. You might need something to fall back on.

You know, you didn't have the, you had a lot of money with Michael Jordan. Michael Jordan was an extreme case of making money, but the NFL didn't have guys. He didn't pay millions and millions and millions and dollars the way they do now. And so in my case, you know, I just didn't take that process serious. And basically, I just went back to the streets, you know what I'm saying? Yeah, and at that moment, then that's when you started getting into some trouble. Yeah, I got in trouble, came back to Columbus. I got a robbery case in 2005, transition to 06, and then followed by that,

I caught another case in August, which was the gun charge in the police chase. And from that standpoint, you know, that's when life kind of came to a halt, and I was in the county jail. Yeah, and so, but it sounds like, I mean, from everything we've seen, you've done a phenomenal job of bouncing back and rehabilitating yourself and to where you are today. So that's what I love to talk about a little bit is how you've learned from past mistakes and then are now helping other people maybe before they make mistakes to learn. It sounds like that's what you're inspired by today. Yeah, just as inspired just through personal experience.

You know, I went to prison and in the process, I managed to educate myself. Like I said, I've read and probably studied over 200 books, you know what I'm saying? Just various book reports and notes I've taken. And I actually took some coursework at Ohio University. It was acing and rock and rolling. Nice. Yeah, down in prison. They had a correspondence course I used to take.

And just doing that and just having a different perspective on life, you know what I'm saying? Prison, prison for me was a blessing in disguise, you know, so that I could have been dead. I could have been in jail for life for some of the things that I did prior to going to prison. but four years I spent in there was really a blessing, gave me a new perspective, a new outlook on life, initially upon my return. And just growing, it obviously gives you the compassion and empathy to want to help others in their process, in their struggle. It's what fuels me to talk about educating guys. It's what fuels me to let myself know or let other people know that these guys will go back to a community one day.

and if these guys haven't taken advantage of this process that they'll be just another story like me. They probably won't go to prison, but they won't actualize all of their potential. And so, you know, even with young kids growing up in the neighborhood, trying to teach them about different ways to make a buck rather than selling dope or selling weed or pills or whatever a guy happens to be able to want to sell at that time,

those things just motivate me, man. They motivate me to, just my personal experience is motivate me just to want to share them. You know, just life isn't over. You know what I'm saying? I'm a young guy. 31 years old. I was able to take myself back up from the ground and build myself up to a six-figure income now. I'm just through entrepreneurial ventures I'll go through and speaking and I'll keep on

getting better and I keep on doing more and, you know, it's not over. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, man. And now, and the power of fatherhood too, we talk a lot about this and you're in that position now. What's it like and what are the things you try to teach your children? It's basic. And obviously I have a daughter and she's more attached to her mother. than she is me. And that's very understandable. But just the basics right now. It's more or less being disciplined, doing your schoolwork, having high expectations.

I think the expectation thing is actually more, it's more of more than anything. Just expecting more of your kids and sort of what she sees her parents doing or she sees me doing in regards to how we take care of family, things like that. Those things are important, right? I made an issue or a point to just take my daughter the other day when I was going to look at it. a few semis, you know, so I'm getting into the transportation business. Wow. And just wanting her to see firsthand, you know, how you handle business. Even if she doesn't understand everything, she can vividly see in her mind, my father,

went to go do this, you know, and when she hits 18, 19, 20, 21 years old, to understand that my father built something that should be successful at the time. And so she can have an opportunity to step into it if she wants to or just be able to go off into her own ventures and what it is that she's doing, you know what I'm saying? So, one, I'm a real big on discipline. and real big on just her from an academic standpoint. The expectations are extremely high in her performance and what's expected from her from that standpoint.

But obviously, too socially. Everybody loves her she's always smiling and rock and roll and I enjoy talking about her. But the ultimate measure of any couple, of any parent is just the measure of how you raise your kids and what they turn out to be. From right now, she's had the time, she's had the ability to skip

the first grade. Wow. Due to her being just a little bit advanced, and she's up and making straight honor rolls where she's at now. So that's more important. You know, Ohio State stuff in the fade, just as it will with anything. You know, it was a moment in time. We entertained some people.

They happen to laugh. They happen to smile. They happen to enjoy those moments. But there's a long life to live after the game. And everybody has kids to raise and a life to live. And, you know, those things are a bit more important to me now. than they were in the past. And, you know, I'm just living every day like everybody else.

I love it, man. That's awesome. The kids are a powerful thing. I know it for sure. Hey, Maurice, I really, really, I don't want to take up too much of your time. So I really, really appreciate it. And I want to have respect for what you have going on. The fact that you sat down and spoke with me today.

I learned a lot. I know a lot of people will. Very entertaining. Where can people can find you and find what you're doing? You know, they can follow me on Twitter or recent. Claret 13. I'd have a blue check if you don't know how to spell Reese R. Claret on Instagram. But, you know, if they want to get in contact with me, it's Maurice Claretonline.com.

And, you know, I go there if you choose to. It was, like I say, good talking to you. I got to catch you with your brother. I haven't seen your brother in over probably 10 or 12, 13, 14 years. I seen Bobby, I seen Bobby during my 30 for 30 thing. Bobby's doing well. Yeah. Yeah, it's cool.

We see a bunch of these guys, man, just doing well. We were kids together chasing a journey to dream, but it's always good to reconnect with them. It's sort of ribbon this. You know, I just have visions of my mind of how age you used to look as a kid, you know what I'm saying? I know it's crazy to see everybody grow up, man, have families of your own and progress and get better, you know? Absolutely. But thanks for having me all nice talking to you and much success to what you are doing. I hope this thing grows as big as you want to grow, and you get more people on to speak their truths and help contribute to what you're doing.

Thank you, man. That's very, very thoughtful and nice. I really appreciate it, man. And hopefully we can talk again, man. Yes, sir. All right. Thanks, Maurice. All right. Thank you for listening to this episode of The Learning Leader Show. I absolutely love doing this show, as I hope you can tell by the passion that I bring to it on a daily basis. If you enjoy this episode, I'd like to ask one thing of you. You could go to Ryanhawk.net. It will launch the show in iTunes. iTunes. iTunes is the best way to grow the show organically. And a couple things that you need to do once you're in iTunes. It's to subscribe to it.

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