The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk - 187: Jeb Blount - How To Never Have An Empty Pipeline (Fanatical Prospecting)

Episode Date: January 23, 2017

    Episode 187: Jeb Blount - How To Never Have An Empty Pipeline (Fanatical Prospecting) Subscribe on iTunes  or Stitcher Radio The Learning Leader Show "Repetition is the mother of learning." In This Episode, You Will Learn: Common themes of the best sales professionals: They have high Emotional Intelligence AND Sales Intelligence A full pipeline The #1 Reason for failure is an empty pipeline Ultra High Performers: They prospect constantly -- driven to keep the pipeline full: it builds confidence Focus on deals they can win -- they are a good judge of win probability Have the luxury to choose the deals they work on High EQ -- they have the ability to manage their emotions Average sales people focus on a linear sales cycle... The ultra successful focus on the buying process, they shape the buying process, decision making process, and they are masters at influencing decision makers You CAN move from great to ultra performer -- with work Hiring process: The culture must support ultra high performers Using Sales Drive -- An assessment to learn if people will hunt. Must have intelligence/competitiveness, an optimism to hunt  4 Parts -- Interview process 1) Intelligence - must be able to connect the dots that don't seem connectable  2) Acquired Knowledge - desire to build knowledge, growing, learning, curious 3) Technology Intelligence - have to build new technology into your life 4) Emotional Intelligence - management of emotions, situational awareness Why the average sales person is good in an interview Examples of great "Turnaround Statements" A live discussion of the cold email I sent Jeb to get him on my show (really interesting part) You have 2 seconds to get their attention Hook in the subject line 1st sentence -- talk to them, not you. Relate to them. Don't write "Hey Jeb," write "Jeb" Situation -- bridge -- connect the dots, then ask Social selling Must have a great social profile Monitor what you say DO NOT tweet about politics or religion Connect with people in your industry on LinkedIn Continue Learning: Follow Jeb on Twitter: @SalesGravy Read: Fanatical Prospecting  Connect with me on LinkedIn Join our Facebook Group: The Learning Leader Community To Follow Me on Twitter: @RyanHawk12 You may also like these episodes: Episode 078: Kat Cole – From Hooters Waitress To President of Cinnabon Episode 071: Nate Boyer - Green Beret, Texas Football, The NFL Episode 179: How To Sustain Excellence - The Best Answers From 178 Questions Episode 107: Simon Sinek – Leadership: It Starts With Why Did you enjoy the podcast? If you enjoyed hearing Jeb Blount on the show, please don't hesitate to send me a note on Twitter or email me. Episode edited by the great J Scott Donnell The Learning Leader Show is supported by FreshBooks: FreshBooks is offering a 30 day, unrestricted free trial to my listeners. To claim it, just go to FreshBooks.com/Learning and enter LEARNING LEADER in the "How Did You Hear About Us?" section.

Your father's a really smart guy. When I was 24, I got hooked up with a guy named Roger McKee. He hired me to work for his company. And he kicked my rear end, but he's a great coach and a great leader. And when I got my first big promotion, he set me down and gave me some basic advice. And it was tremendous advice. He said, in every job, no matter what you do, your role is to make yourself obsolete. That's your job.

You want to make the people around you so good that they don't need you anymore. Are leaders born or are they made? Our host, Ryan Hawk, believes that leaders can be made through determined, focused work on learning the art and science behind the makeup of other successful leaders. Now it's time to inhale knowledge and exhale success. You're listening to The Learning Leader Show with Ryan Hawk. Pump for our new sponsor this year, it's Fresh Books. The working world has changed. With the growth of the internet, there's never been more opportunities for the self-employed.

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To claim it, just go to freshbooks.com slash learning and enter Learning Leader in the How Did You Hear About Us section. Hey and welcome to The Learning Leader Show. I am Ryan Hawk. Thank you so much for being here. Reminder, please join us in our Facebook group, the learning leader community. Simply go to learning leader.com slash group to sign up and we'll add you to further the dialogue. On to tonight's episode with my featured leader, bestselling author, Jeb Blunt, speaker, executive advisor, consultant, world class trainer, inspires people to take massive action and reach peak performance author of six books, including my favorite, titled Fanatical Prospecting, which deals with the profession of selling. Jeb recognized one of the world's 50 most influential sales and marketing leaders. Also a top 30 social selling influencer by Forbes and one of the top five sales experts to follow on Twitter. A few of the topics Jeb and I got into the common characteristics of ultra-high performers. Then how to hire and keep the most talented people in the world, followed by the key to writing cold emails,

a system that Jeb has perfected when trying to get a hold of influencers. So great. Ladies and gentlemen, without further ado, it's Jeb Blunt. All right, Jeb, welcome to the Learning Leaders Show. It's so fun for me to speak with another big-time sales guy. I feel like I'm talking to one of my brothers, man. So thank you for being here. And welcome to the show.

I appreciate it very much. You've got a great podcast. I'm glad to be here. And one thing I want to say to you is that, you know, you've got the coolest name ever, Ryan Hawk. I mean, you know, if you can't make money with a name like Ryan Hawk, you can't make money. Jeb, it's so funny that within the first 25 seconds you're selling, and I love it, man. I absolutely love it.

But thank you. That's one of the things that I have no control over, but I appreciate the compliment, man. A question for you, you know, studied sales professionals. You've written some bestselling books about it. You go around the world teaching others great methods from prospecting to creating opportunities to closing the deals. In your studies, what have you found that the best sales professionals all seem to share? What qualities do the best seem to all have? That's a fantastic question. In fact, we're in the middle of a project right now called SELZQ, and it's a new book that'll be out in

March. And it's available for pre-order right now. Yes, I am selling, and that is a book plug. And what we did with SELZQ, it's a follow-up from fanatical prospecting that's just been a blockbuster you know, worldwide sensation, a cool book, and I'm so grateful for all the people that have purchased that book. And in that book, and we started with a basic premise that the number one reason for failure in sales is an empty pipeline, and the number one reason for an empty pipeline is a failure to prospect. Pretty simple, right? That's, and that's basic. Like, if you don't have a full pipeline, I don't care how good you are, I don't care how smart you are. I don't care where you went to school. You were going to fail in sales. But your question kind of takes it to another level.

So what are these core characteristics of like the truly top performers in sales? So you and I were talking in the pre-show about sports and that you made the transition from sports into sales. And I look at salespeople to me like elite athletes. In fact, I believe that salespeople are the elite athletes of the business world. And so if you think about the way most people look at sales, we talk about top performers in sales. or we talk about the top 20%. And that's how most VPs of sales talk about it. It's how a lot of sales experts talk about it.

And I started thinking, well, who wants to be in the top 20%? What's the top 1%? Who are the salespeople that are absolutely crushing it? And this occurred to me after going and delivering a speech to a group of 250 salespeople, all of whom had made no less than 350,000. thousand dollars the previous year. These were the elite of the elite. And that followed up, I went to, I gave a speech to a group of real estate agents who were all booking more than a million dollars a year in income. These are the top of the top. What was interesting about the real estate speech was

that that was open to lots of people and the people that showed up were the highest performers. And I've coined a term the ultra high performer. Like, what does the ultra high performer do? So when I listen to your question, what's the, like, who are the best people? I started thinking about it in terms of ultra high performers. And so I give you a couple of things. One of the things that ultra high performers do is they prospect. They have a full pipeline. I mean, they're fanatical about prospecting.

And they're absolutely driven to keep the pipeline full. And the reason that that works for them is when you have a full pipeline, you have a lot of confidence. When you have a full pipeline, you can be super picky. Because what they also do is they are obsessive about wind probabilities. And you know this from being in sales. If you're dealing with a low probability deal, so if you're working on a deal that you're not dealing with someone who can buy from you, they don't have a budget, they don't have a buying authority,

they don't have a buying window open, they're not really engaged. They don't really, you know, they're not into you. You know, you've got a competitive contract that may keep you out. If you're working with low probability deals, the chances that you're going to sell a lot is pretty low. So what ultra-high performers do is they focus on deals they can win. And by the way, that's not much different than the, the way ultra-high elite athletes play the game either. So ultra-high performers are looking at every

deal and they're judging win probability and they're focusing on those deals. Because they have a full pipeline, because the pipeline is full, they have the luxury of choosing the deals they want to work on versus average salespeople who are in a lot of cases dealing with what's coming at them. They're also virtuosos with people. So they have what we call high sales EQ or cell-specific emotional intelligence. These ultra-high performers, not only are, they're fantastic at filling the pipe, they're fantastic at judging the win probability, but they're amazing with people. And they have the ability to manage their own disruptive emotions while influencing the behaviors of the people that they're doing business with. And finally, they understand, and they're actually playing

a different game than everybody else, that there are really three processes in sales. Average salespeople are focusing on the linear sales process. In a lot of cases, skipping steps because over eagerness, fear, uncertainty, doubt, they're allowing their disruptive emotions to get in the way. But ultra-high performers, they understand that there are basically three processes. There's the sales process. It's linear, and it matters, and you need to follow the steps. There's the buying process, and that's the formal process or informal process

that the company that they're selling to is using to vet a deal, and what they're great at doing is shaping the buying process to their sales process. So instead of being buying process puppets, like a lot of average salespeople, they bend the sales process in. That tells them when they're able to do that, that the deal has a higher probability of closing. And then there's also the decision-making process, and this is the individual emotional process

that the stakeholders that they are working with, either influencers or coaches or amplifiers or seekers or buyers or decision-makers inside the account are going through to make decisions. And they're masters in influencing those decisions by answering a few questions that those stakeholders are, those stakeholders are asking about them along the way. And when you combine all those things

together, when you take a look at the people who are truly amazing excels, I'm talking about people who are crushing it, making lots of money, that's what they do so well that average salespeople are not doing. And some of it is innate. I mean, some of it is a natural talent, just like anything else in the world. I mean, you know, having played sports in college, that there were people that you play with that just had this natural gift and talent for what they were doing. But there were also people who had a natural gift who really weren't living up to the potential. And I see that mostly in sales. I see tons of people out there that have amazing gifts. They have the ability to be incredible and they don't live up to their potential. And so I believe

that you can move from average. You can move from great to ultra high performance if you focus on a handful of, you know, key activities and key, you know, lever. You know, you know, lever. You know, these ultra-high-high-performers or elite athletes of sales pull. Man, that was a lot, and it was great. I love it, especially to get us going. A couple things I was going through in mind as you were sharing those attributes of the best, the best, the ultra-high-performers. One, I was thinking of specific people I know who do all of those things very well. They're the best of the best, the people that I've been so fortunate to work alongside.

And two, I was thinking of, okay, I'm thinking about the person who emails me who's in a management position and they want to hire ultra high performers. And they're thinking, well, this sounds great. How can I hire people like that? What are the questions I ask in an interview? How do I make sure I'm not being fooled? What can I do to ensure or to give myself a better opportunity to not fail? and the so important hiring process. So do you help others when it comes to hiring the best of the best?

We do. And between me and you and your audience, I mean, if you and I can figure this out, like how to go out and find and hire ultra high performance and, like, get the perfect formula for that, we're going to make a billion dollars. Right. So it's, you know, it's the answer. I mean, that's what, you know, most managers want and most leaders want. They want to hire ultra high performance.

So let's back up for a second and say, I'm a leader and I want to build a sales team of ultra-high performers. So there's a couple of things you have to keep in mind. It's unlikely that you are going to build a team and everybody on that team is going to be at the same talent level. I mean, look at, let's just take an NBA team. The NBA teams that are winning championships have a couple of superstars. and they have a lot of players that are on the team that are supporting those superstars. I mean, that's the truth. If you go to a football team, you've got a couple of people that are, you know, superstars.

If you lose the star receiver or the star, you know, defensive back or you just use the star running back or a quarterback, then the team can drift because you lose that top performer. It's very difficult to build an entire team. I've been on one of those teams once where everybody on that team was an ultra high performer once. and it didn't last for very long. We were together for a couple of years, and because we were so good, everybody ended up getting promotions,

getting pulled out, making more money. So it's a hard thing to hold that together. But that doesn't mean that you shouldn't strive for that. It shouldn't be something that you want to build. The thing that you have to pay attention to, though, is starting at leadership. If you have a culture that won't support ultra-high performers, if you have leaders that won't support ultra-high performers,

We can go out and find them and we can help you hire them. And when you put them on your team, they're going to leave. Because ultra high performers don't stay around very long in places where they don't like to work. And the reason is they don't have to. They can work anywhere because everybody's looking for them. So you have to start there. And so let's think about from a leadership standpoint what runs an ultra high performer off. If you think about ultra high performers and just go back to Ryan, go back to your experience,

I was one of these things. I count myself as one of these people. I was a prima donna. I was, I mean, I was hard on my management team. I pushed them. I mean, I drove them. I would bring in deals and say, you've got to change your, you know, what you're doing, working the company, you've got to change the way you're doing this product.

You've got to, you've got to stretch and reach. You know, I was, I was constantly making more money than the executives. I mean, it was, it drove the executives crazy. When I made more money than the CEO of my company, and we were a $10 billion company. So that's very difficult for executives to get their arms around when you see some salesperson out there making money. You can't have your controllers and your accountants and your managers and your leaders poking holes at these folks. You can't have an administrative team that won't support them. They're going to push and they're going to strain every part of the fabric of your organization when you have these people on your team.

No different than elite athletes do on professional sports teams. thing. So first of all, you've got to have leaders that recognize that. You've got to give people some space. You've got to allow them to be creative. You've got to be flexible. That doesn't mean that you can't coach them. It doesn't mean that you don't hold them to high standards. It doesn't mean that you don't lead them. But it does mean that you can't create constraints around them so that it forces them to leave. And that's what happens to so many sales teams, is they, you know, especially with startup companies, they start up and then they put all these rules in and all of their top talent. I mean, the elite people leave, and you have a bunch of mediocrity sitting on your team because the

mediocrity will conform. Ultra-high performers don't conform. So that's number one. The next thing is, if you want to build that team, A, you've got to have that culture. And then when you get ultra-high performers in your culture, you've got to go to your ultra-high performers and ask them to help you find more ultra-high performers. They know where they are. After you get that done, create a series of assessments.

So, for example, if you were a hunting sales team, like you hunt. We sell an assessment called Sales Drive. Sales Drive doesn't tell you whether the person is a great citizen. It doesn't tell you whether they're going to fit your organization. It doesn't tell you whether or not they're smart. But it does tell you, is this person going to get up every day and go out there and knock down any door in order to bring deals and put them in your pipeline? So that's one place.

You need to have a series of assessments, including Sales Drive, including maybe disk, including a sales EQ, including an empathy index, you've got to look at a bunch of things that allow you to understand, is this person both intelligent and do they have the competitiveness and optimism and drive to go out and win business? And we like sales drive as a first cut because it's 100% predictable on hunter-based sales teams. If you're an account management team, it doesn't really matter. But if you're a hunter-based sales team where your reps have got to go out and create demand and bring a new business, it absolutely stone cold works. But you've got to figure that out. And you need to create sort of a triangulation of, you know, of assessments. Then you need to have an interview process

that allows you to assess the four types of intelligence that are required for ultra-high performance. One of those is innate intelligence. So that's just IQ. So you need to know that they're the people are smart. Because I can tell you something, if you're not smart, if you don't have the ability to bring disparate ideas together to create solutions to connect dots that don't seem like they're connectable, working with customers and working with clients in a consultative capacity, you're going to fail in sales a day. If you don't have an above-average IQ, you simply just can't put it together, especially in complex sales. You have to have the acquired knowledge, and that's experience, and not just acquired knowledge that you've gained through education and

through training and through experience, but also the desire to continue to build your knowledge. So I'm looking for people who want to learn. If you're a person who's not reading, who's not out there listening to this podcast, for example, if you're not doing those things, I don't want you on my team because I need people around me that are constantly growing. And that's a trait of ultra high performers. You need technical intelligence. And that means our technology intelligence. You have to be comfortable with technology. There is a wave that's crashing over all of us right now. It's a technology wave. If you're not comfortable, with integrating technology into your life

so that you can spend more time dealing with prospects and customers in sales, then you're going to fail. I mean, when I hear salespeople say, you know, I'm not really good at a computer. We don't even finish the interview. It's just goodbye, see you later, because you can't be that way today.

You've got to be good at technology and you have to be good at integrating it into your life, not just good at watching cat that he is on Facebook. And then finally, you have to have emotional intelligence. So you have to have the ability to manage and control your own emotions and have impulse control while at the same time being able to sense and tune into and respond appropriately in, you know, situational awareness, for example, inside of the sales process. So your interview process should be set up to ask questions and

understand all of those those levels of intelligence. And that's going to mean, you know, from a recruiting standpoint, looking for the right people. And that's a, you know, that's a, that's, you know, a, that's, you know, a, that's, you know, a, that's, you know, a, that's, you know, a, that's, you know, to bringing people in, going through some initial interviews to figure out whether they're a fit for your organization, and then using a set of assessments to triangulate, and then making sure that you have an interview process that is disciplined, that covers multiple people that's focusing on those four levels of intelligence, and then finally you need to have a culture that when you bring these ultra-hyperformers into your organization is going to support them and keep them and retain them over the long term. because they're expensive and they're hard to find. And when you get them, you need to do everything you possibly can not to lose them. If you find a candidate who obviously has intelligence, they can connect dots, they have acquired knowledge, a desire to build knowledge and learn.

They use technology and embrace it. And they also have emotional intelligence. But for some reason, you don't like them or they don't appear to be likable. Do you still move forward with somebody like that? What are your thoughts on? This has come up in the past. I've had conversations with other sales leaders about this where they said, you know, he or she seems to have all of the qualities that we're looking for, but I'm not sure I just really like them. I don't know if I like their personality.

And that might fall into the emotional intelligence bucket, I realize, but I'm curious that your thoughts have you found people who hit all the marks. But for whatever reason, they just don't, you don't like them. Well, you're right. I mean, it could fall into the emotional intelligence bucket. So it could be your intuition telling you that you think they have. have emotional intelligence, but they don't. Yeah. Because if you don't like them, there's something about, you know, their ability to demonstrate

empathy, their ability to connect with you that's telling you there's a problem. Now, there's another problem with this. And I find this goes back to culture, right? So what I find in organizations that have a tendency to run off ultra high performers. In other words, they have a culture of mediocrity and the elites don't want to work there is that the managers that work there are also average and elite. And average people have a really hard time with ultra-out performers. So the manager says to me, I don't really like this person.

And this happens. I mean, this is part of my consulting practice, right? We run into companies to have this problem. And so we're looking at the manager and we're looking at this candidate and it's really easy to see. The manager doesn't like the candidate because the manager is intimidated by the candidate. Because the candidate is that good. and that's why you typically have a series of interviews so that you are having someone go through

multiple people and you don't have a I try not to have systems where one person can veto everybody. Some companies do. I'm not saying that either way is wrong, but I'm saying with salespeople, it's good to have multiple people looking at them. And listen, if your intuition tells you that the person is the wrong person, my advice is pay attention to your intuition. However, if your intuition tells you they're the right person, my advice is test your intuition. Because that may be your disruptive emotion clouding, right, your objectivity.

Because let me give you the flip side of this. Salespeople are awesome at interviews. I mean, they're really good at awesome interviews. And average salespeople are really, really good at interviews. and salespeople who suck are incredible interviews. That's how they keep getting jobs. They understand how to go into an interview, have a conversation with the sales leader

or have a hiring manager, flatter the hiring manager, make them feel so good. And if you think about this, if you're a hiring manager, think about a couple of your interviews where you hired a person and they didn't work out. And you don't have to tell anybody, just go look in the mirror

and be true to yourself and be honest. In those interviews, you spent most of the time talking and you walked away feeling so good about this candidate because they were amazing at getting you telling your story. And when you left, you said, oh, we're going to hire this person. You didn't know anything about them. So both sides of that argument are valid. And I think you have to do everything you can as a leader to make sure that you're testing your emotions,

focusing on objectivity. That doesn't mean that your emotions are. important. It doesn't mean that your gut and your intuition. Does it mean something? It's just tested to make sure that it's not being clouded by, you know, and by disruptive emotions that are, that will cause you to hire someone you shouldn't. With that said, some of the best people I've ever hired over the years almost flipped the interview around because they ask incredible questions. And they weren't pre-planned questions. They just naturally flowed within the conversation or they would stop and ask a clarifying question or just stop in general and ask any sort of question.

They didn't wait until the end of the interview like most people do, but it was just a, it became more conversational. And while, yes, it certainly flatters the interviewer. And I agree with you. I've found that the majority of the best do that extremely well. They are so thoughtful and smart on their feet that they listen very well, that they can, they can ask intelligent questions throughout the interview as opposed to just waiting to the end and saying and asking about vacation policy or something lame like that, I find those

people to be really great. So it's hard to describe exactly what you just said, but it's brilliant. Okay. So it's what you just described is the difference between a mediocre salesperson or average salesperson who gets the interviewer talking and flatters the interview. and a person who has relaxed, cool, calm confidence. They're smart. They're intelligent.

And they're carrying on a conversation with you. And you feel it. They're supposed to be there. And there's a huge difference in that. And that's why you want to always be testing your objectivity to make sure that what your emotion is telling you, what they're telling you is right. They're having a conversation with you as an equal. And that's what makes you feel so good about them.

But a lot of leaders have a hard time allowing their ego to get out of the way so they can have that conversation. Clearly, you don't. And that's where, you know, companies and sales teams end up with a bunch of mediocrity on their team because the leader can't allow themselves to be in an interview where the interviewee can be there as an equal. Does that make sense? Well, I mean, ideally, and my dad has been in sales as a whole lot. life and he's taught me this. So I'm very just, Jeb, flat out lucky. I mean, there's no other way to put it because he's coached me my entire life. You ideally want to find candidates who are smarter and better than you. And you've got to put your ego aside and realize that, as he's told me,

if you find people who are willing to work, who are more intelligent than you, who ask great questions, and you surround yourself with them, you will become rich and famous within that company and you will progress like nobody's ever seen because those people are the sole reason for your success. And the average to poor managers get insecure about being surrounded or having people who work for them that are smarter than them. And you just flat out can't. I mean, when you're fortunate enough to find those people, you've got to get them on

your team and you've got to find a way to keep them on your team. And I think if there's one reason for my success and people listening who have worked on my teams will be nodding their head right now. That's it. I mean, that's the reason because I've been able to find those people, keep them happy, keep them energized, support them as best as I can, and certainly throw the ego out when it comes to the fact that I realize that they know the product better than me. They're, in a lot of cases, better sales professionals than me. They're smarter than me. All of these things have led to the long-term success, and that's truly playing the long game, because I've certainly seen the managers who only hire people who are not at their level and that they are average for life.

Your father's a really smart guy. When I was 24, I got hooked up with a guy named Roger McKee. He hired me to work for his company. And he kicked my rear end, but he was a great coach and a great leader. And when I got my first big promotion, he set me down and gave me some basic advice. it was tremendous advice. He said, in every job, no matter what you do, your role is to make yourself obsolete. That's your job.

You want to make the people around you so good that they don't need you anymore. And he said that a lot of managers are afraid of that. Like, you know, they ask the question, if I'm obsolete, then they won't need me anymore. And what he explained is when you make yourself obsolete, the organization will always find something more important and more valuable for you to do. And he was right. And I combined that with some advice that I got from one of my other great coaches, great leaders, Mary Gardner. And she taught me the same thing your dad said.

You know, she would always focus on when I was 23 years old, I worked for her 22, 23. I worked for her at a company called Nutra System. And she always told me, you get paid for what your people do, not what you do. That's what she always said over and over and over again. So it took Roger's advice, make yourself obsolete, and took her advice. You get paid for what your people do. and I was, you know, 24, I was basically, you know, entry level working for Roger, like the bottom of the organization. And 10 years later, at 34, I was vice president of sales.

And I look back on that. And all I can say was everything that I did was surrounding myself with people that are way smarter than me, way better than me, giving them the ability to challenge anything that I did. And in my team today, it sells gravy. Same thing. Anything I do from the, from the person who's an entry level person all the way to the top, you can stop me and tell me. me I'm wrong. And we allow that. We allow that type of discourse because it makes sense. But by surrounding my people with people that were so good that they didn't need me and getting out of their way and letting them do their job, I always has something else to do. And what would happen is I would get,

I would get the opportunity to put my hands in this strategic plan or do this or work on a merger or whatever and meet people. And I always got more and more and more and more and more. So your dad's smart guy right on. And I agree. I'm like you. I got very, very lucky early on in my career to work for some amazing leaders who took an interest in helping me become better. And it's paid off for my whole life.

I'm who I am the day because of that advice and the coaching that I received from them. Wow. So, Jeb, if you're cool with it, I have a couple bullet point notes. and I'd like to maybe rapid fire through some of them. And your answers don't have to be short because some of them are more nuanced, but are you cool if we go through some of these? Absolutely. And, you know, I'm from the South, and as you can already tell, I can't give a short answer.

No, I can't even say hello in less than 15 minutes. Well, no, you can't say hello without selling. And that's awesome. So, okay, let me go through a couple of these. So, and this is basically from fanatical prospecting, some of the notes that I made from the book. Talk about turnaround statements. Could you give some examples?

Maybe if you want to introduce that to somebody who is not familiar, and then maybe an example of this happening. And if possible, could we use these examples from an enterprise selling perspective, meaning people who sell big deals, a million-dollar deals that take time, not necessarily just the transactional deals, but big relationship-type deals that take time? turnaround statements. Sure. So if you think about prospecting, but if we're looking at an enterprise level deal, it's not just prospecting. It's also next steps. If you're in enterprise sales, the biggest problem you have, the bane of your existence is a stall deal. You're in the middle of it,

and then things go quiet. So all a turnaround statement is is this. When you're asking for time, so when you make a prospecting call to a stakeholder and an enterprise deal, you're going to have a bunch of stakeholders. You're going to have people who have buying authority. You're going to have people who amplify pain. You're going to have seekers who are looking for information. You're going to have influencers that are either on your side that are agnostic or naysayers. And hopefully you've developed a coach or coaches.

So in an enterprise, you typically are going to have a wide array of stakeholders. And each of those stakeholders you're going to be prospecting into to grab some of their time so that you can qualify, discover, build familiarity, create an advocate for you inside the organization. So you're typically prospecting and asking for time. So, for example, you say, may I have a meeting and the person says, I'm busy? And that happens a lot in enterprise sales. Or they say, hey, we've already got something. We're not here.

We're not there. Whatever the case is. But they tell you no. So all a turnaround statement is using a series of three steps that allow you to, you, to deal with your disruptive emotion when you hear no, to take advantage of the way their brain works, to pull them towards you, and obviously to ask again, because typically when you ask the second time they say yes. The same thing is at play when you're asking for a next step. Biggest problem we find when we're walking to companies who are having pipeline issues,

other than the fact that they're not creating opportunities and putting them into the pipeline, is that deals are stalled in the pipeline almost always, 90% of the time, because the salespeople aren't getting to the next step. They're not asking for the next step. So if you said to a company, my next step is, I want to tour your facility. I'd like to go walk through your facility. Or we want to sit down with you and learn about this. Or we want to sit down with your team and ask some questions.

You'd be asking that question. You're typically going to get a brush off or a reflex response. So let's take, I'm asking for time, a reflex response there might be, well, I'm really too busy right now. So the first thing you want to use is something called the ledge. All a ledge does is allow your logical brain, your what we call the neocortex, right, it's a part of your brain that thinks to get control of your emotions. So when someone tells you no, it naturally kicks off something inside of you, totally involuntary called the fight or flight response. That happens in a part of your brain called the amygdala, which is where all your senses, come in in one time. And the amygdala then sends a signal and adrenaline starts rushing into

your bloodstream. Your blood begins rushing into your muscles to get you ready to fight or flight. And this is oxygen-rich glucose blood. The glucose-rich blood that's getting you ready to do something, to take action, to fight or run. And then what happens is you only have so much blood. So the blood is removed from non-essential parts of your body. One of those parts is your brain, which is why your neocortex, which is why sometimes when you get told no, you sound like this. You go, aba, aba, aba, ab, you don't know what to say. And the reason for that is the brain doesn't need you to think when it's trying to get away from danger. Now, you say, well, being told no isn't a danger, but the brain responds to two threats. One is a threat to your physical being, and another

is a threat to your social standing. And when you get rejected, it is a threat to your social standing. So the same sequence of events, the neurophysiology of it kicks off. So a ledge allows you the magical quarter of a second that you need to turn all of that off and get control over what you're going to do next. So when someone says, I'm busy, I say that's exactly why I called because I figured you would be. That's my ledge, right? And when I say, I figured you would be, that's called a disrupt statement.

All I'm doing is disrupting expectations. If you think about us as human beings, the way we operate in the world, we're, we're pattern monsters. When we, when in our environment, our brain is always scanning for danger and it looks for common patterns. When it sees patterns, it ignores those patterns. It's bored with patterns. And it's looking for the things that are anomalies out of place because those are the things that have the potential to kill us. So by saying, you know, when I say, I say that's exactly why I called because I figured you would be. They're not expecting that. They're expecting me to talk them out of being too busy. So they're expecting me to fall into the normal pattern of a salesperson. And so I follow

that up with, all I wanted to do is find a time that would be more convenient to you. How about Thursday at two? And that has about an 80 to a 90% effectiveness and turning around someone who says, I'm busy. You use a ledge, use a disrupt statement, and then you ask again. So let's take the enterprise sales rep who say you've met with a stakeholder and you want to get a couple of stakeholders together, Maybe you're going to do a demo of your product or your software. Maybe you need to do a tour of their facility, but you need to do some additional discovery. And typically in enterprise accounts, discovery is a long process. It could be, you know, three to 18 months, depending on what you're selling.

It's just in the discovery stage of the sales process. So I asked for that. And the person says, well, I don't even know why we need to, you know, do you need to go through our facility? Why don't you just put some prices together? Why don't you just put a proposal together? Why don't you just send me some information over? The way I respond to that is this. The ledge I use is this.

I say, I say that's exactly what most of my competitors do. That's exactly what most of my competitors do. And it makes sense. This is the disrupt statement because most of my competitors have a box and they expect everybody to fit in their box. But that's not how my company does business. What we do is we build the box around you. and your unique situation.

And all I want to do is ask a few questions and learn more about you so I can bring truly unique solutions to the table and you and your team can make a better decision for what's right for you and your company. How about Thursday at two? And in either of those situations, you're using that similar format, a ledge that allows you to deal with the emotional response to rejection, a disrupt statement that gets your prospect or your customer's attention and pulls them towards you. That's what we call it a turnaround versus pushing them away. And then asking again, which is the biggest mistake that sells people make,

they don't ask again for what you want. And what happens is we go back to ultra high performers and probability, it improves the probability that you're going to get what you want. That's pretty awesome. Okay. So what is the four-step framework for email? The four-step framework for email is pretty simple. Have you gotten any bad emails lately, Ryan? I mean, bad ones. Daily. Oh, my God.

They're so bad. And I don't know who's teaching themselves people how to do this, but it's terrible. So let's think about, let's see my emails real quickly. So with an email, you're sending an email, you have about two seconds to get their attention, to get the person's attention. And what you have to do is you have to hook them from the very beginning. Now, there are a couple of things that will hook a prospect. One is familiarity. They know who you are. So if I get an email from someone that I know or a company that I know, the first thing I do, and by the way, most people are looking at your emails now on small screen is I look at their name and I look at their company to see who they're from. So that's a hook. A lot of what you're doing in prospecting and marketing is creating that familiarity. If you work for a company that people don't know, you're not going to be able to have that hook. So if you work for a big company, you get that hook naturally. If you work for a small company, you're SOL on that. And that that particular place. So you've got to, you've got to work with the second hook. The second hook is the

subject line. So the first part of the four-step process is, is making sure that you have a great subject line. You want to hook them. And the subject line's got to get them to open up the email. And then your next hook is going to be the first sentence. And really, those are the things that matter the most. Like, does this matter, right? Have you gotten me to read? The next step, once you hook them is you need to relate to them. In other words, you've got to talk about them, not you. I get emails every single day where the very first paragraph is all about the company. Here's how big we are.

Here are the companies we serve. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. My brain turns off. I focus on me and you focus on you. Everybody out there is self-centered. So the first thing, next thing you do is you relate. So I hook them with the subject line and the first sentence. Those are the two most important parts of your email.

The second part of your email is relating to their situation, making it relevant to them. Then you do something called a bridge. All a bridge does is connect the dots between the situation that you perceive that they have. Their problems, issues, opportunities, pain, whatever you want to talk about, and how you may be able to solve their problems. So you're simply creating a quick bridge. And then you have to ask. You have to ask for something. you have to compel them to take action.

And typically you're asking for them to give you to someone else, or which I don't particularly advise, but maybe you do that, but you're asking for an appointment. And the best way to ask for an appointment is to suggest a time. So how about Thursday at 2 o'clock? That's a little bit harder if you're sending emails, you know, one email to multiple people bulk emails. But if you're an enterprise rep and you're sending emails to stakeholders,

you're sending one-to-one emails. So it's pretty easy. So you're asking for a time. And so first I go is I suggest a time. Then I say to them, or you can tell me a time that's more convenient to you. And then finally, a lot of people use these calendar programs that allow the prospect to go in and book an appointment for themselves. So third, I offer, hey, here's my calendar. If it's more convenient for you, you can just go in and see where I have space.

I suggest doing all three of those. If you leave any of those out, you may miss an opportunity. A lot of people lead just with the calendar link, and it's really offensive to a lot of people when you ask them to book time on your calendar. So do all three of those things. So basically, you're going to hook them, and the hook starts with your name and your company name. Some people have that going for them. Some people don't.

Then it's the subject line in the first sentence. It's the two most important parts of your email, because if you don't hook them there, you're done. then you have to relate to them their personal situation. Then you have to bridge from their situation to something that you can do for them that would create a compelling reason for them to book time with you and you have to ask specifically for the time or what specifically you want them to do. Do you remember the cold email I sent to you to ask you to come on this show? I vaguely, but I did respond to it.

You did. What made you respond? It was about me. So you do, I don't know if you remember, you probably get a ton of emails. I looked it up prior to this talk because I had a feeling we'd talk about emails. It's such a big part. And this is something I don't know, maybe just from my history and selling, I found that it's always a good idea to open the cold email ask. And I've done, you know, hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of these for my podcasts alone of telling the person that I'm

writing to specifically why I admire their work and how it's impacted me in a positive way. Because who doesn't want to know and hear how their work has impacted somebody else? And so it always typically starts. And I only write the emails to people that I'm really interested in. So it's genuine. It's very simple for me to write these emails because I truly care about the people. I admire their work. And so I always write something specific in regards to how that person has impacted me.

And I always make sure to ask. And it's a direct ask. And usually it's in bold. I asked them to be a guest on my show. And so I remember when you responded to me, it was, I was obviously quite happy because it's like I got a sale almost. It feels like that every time somebody says yes. The actual sale, I guess, is when we're doing the podcast. So right now, but you replied that you'd love to join me.

So I thought, wow, it's great when a cold call, I mean, a cold email works on a sales professional where they respond in the way that I want them to. So it was pretty cool. Well, let's take your email apart. Well, I'm going to give you some, I'm going to tell people why your email worked. I'm going to read it, okay? Actually, this one, I'm just going through it. It's not that good, but it's awesome. It's good enough.

There's some key parts here. First of all, it just says, yeah, it just says Jeb. It doesn't say, hey, Jeb or Hi, Jeb or Ho Jeb, it says Jeb. And the reason that works is because that's how a colleague emails a colleague. Inside a company, you're not going, hey, Jeb, and it drives me crazy. As soon as I see, hey, Jeb, I know it's someone prospecting to me. So it just said, Jeb, we're equals, and that's how your email should be addressed. Don't say hey or hi or ho.

Next, or hello. You said, I'm writing with an opportunity to share your unique message on a different platform. So the first sentence was about what you're going to do for me. It was about me. Okay? The next sentence I'm reading down is relating to me. I'm a big fan of your work, specifically fanatical prospecting. Okay, so here's the deal.

You got my attention. You had me at hello. You mentioned something specifically to me. You mentioned my latest book, Fanatical prospecting, and it flatters me that you're a big fan. So all of a sudden, you have me. And then you tell me about the podcast and you say, hey, I've done 180 episodes. You named some people that I know, like Seth Godin and Dan Pink and Gaynor Vaynerchuk and Simon Seneca, who I respect and know and say, well, geez, you know, that's credibility. So that's social proof that you work with people.

And you didn't like, it was people that I can relate to. So there's a difference in if you're an email, if you're sending an email to a small company and you say, hey, we take care of Microsoft and you're sending this email to a mom and pop company, you're not going to have any credibility. They don't even know how to relate to that. but you gave me credibility. And then it was nice. Hey, I want you to be a guest on my show. And I said, yes, it was great. It was solid.

But if you think about it, you began with that very first sentence was what pulled me in. And I read it. And the reason that I didn't, you know, off the top of my head go, oh, my God, you know, that was an amazing email was because it was so good, I didn't have to remember it. I just said yes. Versus I can tell you the email that I got this morning that pissed me off because it was the email that I'd gotten from a person. who'd sent me four emails in a row and each one of them was explaining why I didn't respond to the last one and every time they say that it makes me feel bad because they're calling me out because I'm not responding to their stupid email that I don't respond to.

Wow. Yeah. Yeah, so good, so good stuff and but one thing that you did well and I tell you, if you're listening to this podcast, I highly recommend it. When you send a prospecting email, don't write hi or hey or hello and then the person's name. Just write their name and put comma and get to the point. Well, I appreciate that. I figured when you responded with a positive response that you wanted to do it, that had obviously done at least a good enough job to generate that response and was happy to see that.

So thank you for the validation. And I obviously track the number of emails that I send and the number of people that say yes and the number of people that say no and the number of people that ignore me. But that's part of the juice of getting people. One of the number one questions I get, Jeb, all the time is, how do you get such great guests? And I say, because I am constantly prospecting. I wrote a whole post on this about the fact that I'm always prospecting,

always thinking, looking, feeling, looking for ways to write great emails. I mean, always. You have to always be doing it. I treat it like a sales job in itself to be prospecting for the best of the best, because I want to bring a couple things value to myself. I want to have intelligent conversations with some of the greatest leaders in the world, and I want it to impact others. And I'm not going to do that if I have marginal slash average guest on the show.

If that's the case, then nobody will listen and it will slowly die. I mean, that's a good point. Just as a plug for you, you're a hell of a good interviewer. And if you're listening to this podcast and Ryan ask you to be on this podcast, you need to do it because this dude's good. Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate it. Let's do one more before we take off. You got time for one more, bullet point here? Absolutely. Hit me again.

So let's talk about social prospecting and social selling. Can you share maybe some of the keys to the fact that, you know, the world is very social now and what are some of the key ways an enterprise sales professional could utilize social selling? Yes. So let's start with basic premise. Social selling is not a panacea. It won't solve all your problems. It is not going to keep you from prospecting. It is not going to create an inbound marketing channel that is going to bring you endless leads. To think so is delusional at best. So it's part of a greater strategy. If you're an enterprise-level salesperson, you know, the key thing, and this is, you know, almost preaching to the choir is

you need to have a good presence on social media. So you need to be there. You need to make sure, that your profiles represent your personal brand, that you're, you know, when people come to your profile to check you out, and they will, that they see something that they like. And for salespeople, this means that you don't have the luxury of posting vitriol. You don't have the luxury of talking about really anything other than sales. You can't talk about sports because you're going to probably offend somebody. You can't talk about religion because you're going to probably offend somebody and you can't talk about politics because you're probably going to offend somebody. I know that's tough to swallow and I love salespeople to say, well, you know, my

Facebook profile is my own personal space. Well, guess what? It is searchable on Google. And if it's searching on Google and you sell for a living, you need to change what you're posting. Nobody cares. Post pictures of your kids. Post happy, nice, positive stuff. But don't post stuff that's controversial. You don't have that luxury if you want to be an ultra-outperformer and sell. So that's number one. Number two is, go ahead. It blows me away, actually, that one point. Scott Harrison, CEO of Charity Water, he has, is built an incredible company, a nonprofit, you know, raised millions upon millions of dollars, immense success. And when he interviews a client, he'll go back and look through their last 500 or 1,000 tweets. And if they are cynical,

negative, you know, bringing hatred to the world. They don't even get a phone screen. He wants uplifting positive people who bring joy to the world. And I do too. And it always blows my mind. I can tell people at Ryan Hawk 12, you could go on my Twitter. If you see a single negative tweet out of the thousands I've written, let me know. I just don't, my dad has told me it is your duty as the leader to be in a good mood.

And that goes for socially as well. And I'm shocked when I see people write these horrible things about other people, even if it's, you know, political or whatever, it just blows my mind to see it out there. I don't get it because certainly when I have a candidate that I'm taking a look at, I'm going to search all of that. I want to see what they're really like when they're on social media, especially if they think that it's somehow private because obviously it's certainly not private. And that's a lack of intelligence if they think that it is. Well, that's a really, really good point because it, and I love what you just said there, because it's great advice. It extends beyond, you know, sports and politics and religion.

It's, you know, if someone, let's just say some star makes it screw something up, which just happened recently. And you go on Twitter and you start blasting away at them and you tell them that they're a schmuck and are you make fun of them, are you tease them, are you pile on with the rest of the world? It does. It makes you look petty and cynical and awful. And, you know, I'm blown away too. I'm blown away to people who have that much anger inside of them and that much, you know, negativity inside of them that their way of getting that out is to attack another human being on social media, especially someone that they don't know. And they say something nasty about them. And, you know, obviously we call these people trolls, but those trolls are, you know, they're everyday people. So you don't, don't. Don't. Don't do that. Same thing. I'm at salesgravey on Twitter. I challenge you. Go find something that I've written that's that's that cynical. I'm basically posting things that are good for people and I want to be happy and have a good time. And, you know, same thing on, you know, on Facebook. I try to be very

careful. And that's what I mean, that's a mean that there aren't days when I want to. I mean, I certainly, you know, I'm political. I've got an opinion about things. And, you know, I woke up this morning and there was an article on real clear politics. And man, I made me so mad it burnt me up. And I wanted to go write something about it. But I always stopped myself and say, my job is, like you said, is to be the leader, is to have a face that people want to do business with. So that's, that's one piece of it. The other piece is you need to connect with everybody, especially on LinkedIn. So if you're an enterprise sales group, you need a stakeholder. Before you walk out the door, you're sending them a connection because it allows you to engage them.

From there, once you build that audience, and I think this is especially important for enterprise salespeople, I have a, I've got the luxury of being able to post and like and, and share a wide range of articles and thoughts and videos that touch multiple people across multiple industries. I have the luxury of connecting with anybody that I want to. But the problem for you as an enterprise sales representative is you want to keep it really tight. So what I recommend is like when you're building out your network, be selective. That doesn't mean that you can't connect with people like Ryan or myself. But you just don't want to take all comers. You want to be very careful to build almost a niche group of people that you're following and paying attention to.

Same thing on Twitter as well. Try to create a niche group of people. And you can use list on Twitter to follow folks on LinkedIn. LinkedIn's changing a lot of rules right now. And there's a LinkedIn boot camp on sales degree of university taught by Kurt Shaver that if you want to check out some really good techniques there, it's there. But you want to try to keep it as tight as possible. keep it inside your industry so that when you are sharing articles from your company or you're posting things or you're doing things that that that that create the aura of you being a thought leader the right people are seeing it is not being diluted into a general audience and then finally what I use you know social media for more than anything is is research so I'm looking at stakeholders I'm doing the same thing they're doing to me I'm trying to understand who they are I'm trying to gather information before I go into a call I use it for pre-call planning. I use it to try to pay attention to potential trigger events that could open up a buying window. And there's a number of tools that you can use. But if you have a really tight niche, like if you're really focused on a tight group of companies, so especially in enterprise sales,

me, I've got one enterprise sales for up at a company that we advise that he has 70 total prospects, 70. That's it. And there's never going to be anymore. That's all he's got. And he's going to sell one or two of those a year. Now, inside each of those companies, there's probably 40 people that he needs to know and monitor. So we're talking about a pretty wide range of stakeholders, but because it's a small group, and this is especially true in enterprise sales, it's easier. If you're in business to business sales and you move into sort of mid-cycle to short-cycle sales, then the group of companies, the group of prospects and stakeholders are going to increase. But what I suggest for people on social selling, social media, if you're a rep,

is you need to schedule your social selling time, social media, social prospecting, social marketing, whatever you want to call it. I'm not a big fan of the term social selling, but you need to schedule that time before and after the golden hours. You should not be on LinkedIn in the middle of the day. You can do social media stuff at night while you're sitting down watching a basketball game or football or whatever you want to do. You can do it in bed before you go to bed. You can do it early in the mornings before you start your day. But once the day starts, all your activity should be customer prospect,

facing activity, either by phone or in person, that are video calls or what have you, you want to do that activity while you can actually speak to people. And, you know, I even have a couple of, this is a sort of off the subject tip, but I got a couple of my salespeople who have perfected voicemail blocks. They recognize that voicemail kind of takes time away from their prospecting blocks during the day. So at night, they, after hours, they take a list with them and they, they call and all they do is leave voicemails. So they leave voicemails in rapid succession. And the next morning, that generates them calls back. So because people listen to their voicemails when they come in in the morning. So just another strategy out there. But I think social media is important.

I think you need to be a part of it. But it can't consume you and it will consume you. It is so easy. And Ryan, I'm sure you've had this experience to promoting your podcast. And I know I've got a huge social media following. And it can absolutely consume you. And for me, personally, it wears me out. Social media, it tires me out trying to keep up with everything that's going out there and not disappearing. So as a salesperson, when your job is to make money by selling stuff, you just need to be very protective of the time that you spend on social media. And you need to focus on a little bit every day and the cumulative impact that that creates versus trying to do a whole lot at one time.

Absolutely, Jeb. I really appreciate the fact, man, that you've invested your time with me here in the Learning Leader Show. Thank you so much for being here. Where would you send my listeners to learn more about you online? A couple of places. I would go to salesgravey.com. And when you go there, you can, you know, check out our jobs.

But I'd love for you to check out Salisgrave University. I think you'll dig it. There's a couple of free courses that you can take. So you just sign up. You can take some free courses. and maybe Ryan one day is we can talk to you about putting a leadership course

on Salesgrave University. I think it'd be fantastic. You can also go to my personal blog and that's Jebblunt.com so J-E-B-B-L-O-U-N-T so for everybody that's not in the South and calls me Blount, you can call me that if you want to

but it's jabblunt.com there's a bunch of blogs and articles there. On Twitter, I'm at sales gravy. On Instagram, I'm at sales gravy. On Facebook, on my personal Facebook page, which I love for you follow me on Facebook and I post a lot of cat videos and happy smiling faces of family members and food. So, you know, it's kind of boring, but you can go there. I'm sales gravy slash sales

gravy on Facebook or if you want to go to my page, it's Jeb on Demand. And on Jab on Demand, I'm mostly posting articles and videos and that type of thing. And there are some conversations that happened there. And then on Google Plus, if anybody's still on Google Plus, you can find me there. But on LinkedIn, just my name, Jeb Blunt. on LinkedIn and I love when people connect me with on LinkedIn and I get to follow them and they can follow me so you can catch me in any of those places. And if you want to send me an email after this, my email is pretty simple. It's Jeb at salesgravy.com and send me an email over and I always tell people, look, if you send me an email, I don't respond immediately, hit me again, be persistent

because you can imagine I just gave my email out on a web, on a webinar that's, or excuse me, a podcast that's going to go out to 112 companies. Countries, I get a lot of emails. I get about 1,000 a day, but I do like to get emails from people who have something to say or question asked, so I'm open to that as well. Good, and if you listen to earlier parts of this podcast,

you might get some tips on how to write an email. They're going to be helpful. So thank you so much for sharing, Jeb. And in closing, the law of business, according to you, and I completely agree, my dad's actually told me this. The law of business, nothing happens. until someone sells something. Everything in the world needs to be sold. If salespeople didn't exist,

the world would come to a screeching halt. And it's the greatest profession in the world. And thank you so much for being a leader in this industry, man. I'd love to having you on. Thank you very much. All right. Thanks, Jeff. This episode of The Learning Leader Show is over, but we have plenty more to keep you locked in until next time. Head over to LearningLeadershow.com for more information and to request your favorite entrepreneur, CEO, world-class athlete, or anyone else that inspires you. You can also talk to Ryan directly by reaching out to him on Twitter at Ryan Hawk 12.

Thanks again, and we'll see you next time on The Learning Leader Show. Pump for our new sponsor this year, it's Fresh Books. The working world has changed. With the growth of the Internet, there's never been more opportunities for this self-employed. To meet this end, Fresh Books is excited to announce the launch of an all-new version of their cloud accounting software. It's been redesigned from the ground up and custom built for exactly the way you work. Get ready for the simplest way to be more productive, organized, and most importantly, get paid quickly. The all-new fresh books is not only easy to use, it's also packed full of powerful features.

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