The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk - 245: Maria Taylor - ESPN Gameday, Embracing The Grind, The Value Of Versatility

Episode Date: February 19, 2018

The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk: Episode 245: Maria Taylor - ESPN Gameday, Embracing The Grind, The Value Of Versatility Maria Taylor is in her sixth season as a host analyst & reporter. In the fall of 2017 Taylor will enter a new role as co-host on ESPN's College Gameday and sideline reporter for ABC's Saturday Night Football.   Show Notes: How to quickly build rapport with the people you interview? Be prepared with a purpose, truly try to learn about them as a person (quickly), it's not just about their sport or their job.  Care about them as a person Being viewed as an athlete -- "It's helpful working in the sports world that they know I played sports" "As an athlete I was always a perfectionist, I always over prepare."  -- Maria sending her producers a copious amount of notes -- thoughts on situations/games/ideas How to earn promotions quickly? "I never said no to anything.  I was never too big for any game." Maria did high school football games, ACC digital.  She's traveled everywhere, stayed in bad hotels, etc. "You have to be comfortable in the grind, you can't get discouraged." "If I'm not doing something (work wise), I feel wrong." Why Kirk Herbstreit is the best in the business -- "He's the most invested person I've ever seen.  He's always the most prepared person." Adnan Virk "Always show up." -- "They remember how you made them feel."  Be conscious of that Balance?  It will never be perfectly balanced.  Think of it as a stew - vegetable and beef... Certain bites are vegetables and other times it's beef.  That's work-life balance.  There are moments where it is all work, all day, every day.  There are other times where you can relax at home.  It's never a perfect 50 50 balance. The story of Maria making the decision to be a sports broadcaster as a junior in college at Georgia... And then also earning her MBA as a backup plan! She grew up loving sports.  Her dad played college sports. Maria was recruited to play both volleyball and basketball at Georgia. Our mutual feeling about the structure of being "in season" and how the routine helped us get better grades. The first 90 minutes of Maria's day: Start the day with gospel music (worship/faith) New York Times daily podcast Joyce Meyer podcast Why do multiple jobs? (Gameday, sideline reporter, women's basketball studio host) To diversify -- "I don't want to just be one thing.  It's an opportunity to flex different muscles." "I try to investigate to find the best answer" "I like challenges" Person most enjoy interviewing? Nick Saban.  "I try to steer him off the line he's trying to stay on." Receiving coaching as a broadcaster... Who provides it? SEC network producers Feedback is just as important to what you put into your body.  It needs to be healthy and helpful -- "What are we filling our minds with?" How to handle "Twitter haters?" "Sometimes I'll put them on blast..." What is an ESPN Gameday production meeting like? A cast of characters - (listen around the 43:00 minute mark to hear the inside scoop) Winning Edge Leadership Academy Helping young women and minorities in broadcasting Focused on student athletes Doing a retreat in Miami The sense of responsibility Maria feels as an African American woman "Being black.... Half time spent assimilating and half time spent helping your people." The Jemele Hill story at ESPN... Maria's reactions Social Media: Follow Maria on Twitter:  @MariaTaylor7 Connect with me on LinkedIn Join our Facebook Group: The Learning Leader Community To Follow Me on Twitter: @RyanHawk12 More Learning: Episode 078: Kat Cole – From Hooters Waitress To President of Cinnabon Episode 216: Jim Collins -- How To Go From Good To Great Episode 179: How To Sustain Excellence - The Best Answers From 178 Questions Episode 107: Simon Sinek – Leadership: It Starts With Why

I will say that in the beginning, and I tell this to young broadcasters that are interested in getting into it, I never said no to anything. You have to be comfortable in the grind and you can't get lost or discouraged in it. And every time I got a job and it didn't matter what it was, I was overly amped about it. And then eventually things just started coming in, like you would run into someone on the road while you're at a Division III championship that knows someone at Comcast and that person knows someone at ESPN. end and that kind of paved my road. It was this idea that if I'm not working, there's something wrong. If I'm not doing something to make myself move in the direction that I'm interested in moving in, then I'm not helping myself. This episode is brought to by Gusto. Gusto is making payroll benefits and HR easy for small businesses. Modern technology does the heavy lifting so it's

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slash leader. Welcome to the Learning Leader Show. I am Ryan Hawk. Thank you so much for being here. It is Mindful Monday. Text learners to 4-4-222 in order to join thousands of other fellow learning leaders from all over the world. Text learners to 4422. Now on to tonight's featured leaders with the great Maria Taylor, best known as a reporter for ESPN's College Game Day, also on ABC Saturday Night Football Sidelined Reporter. In addition to that, she's an analyst in the studio for ESPN College Basketball, an incredible double duty.

Maria also was a two-sport star at the University of Georgia where she played volleyball and basketball. Incredible story she has. A few of the topics that Maria and I got into. The keys to being promoted quickly and how this applies to all of us. And then her tips to build rapport with someone like national champion head coach Nick Sabin. This part was really interesting. And then her process to prepare for the many different roles that she has at ESPN and beyond. You'll find this talk to be enlightening, thought-provoking, and it will provide you with a perspective that may be different from your own.

And you'll hear me realize this at the end of the conversation, and I treasured it. It was so good with Maria Taylor. All right, Maria, thank you so much for being here on The Learning Leader. show. Welcome. Thank you so much for having me, Ryan. I'm excited to be here. It's hard to get this scheduled given the fact that you are one of the busiest people on TV. I mean that in a good way, because I know busy come to use as a bad word, but you're actually doing the work on TV, whether it's football, basketball, on the field, in the studio. I'm amazed at the amount of work that you are doing on a daily basis. It's funny because ever since I kind of started in sports broadcasting,

your schedule is so crazy. I just freelanced in the very beginning. So it would be like, like, oh, I have room to do a volleyball match here. So I'll do that on Tuesday. And then I have room for a basketball on Friday. And my schedule would always fill up so big and heavy. And then at the end of the week, I'd be like, man, I can't believe I just did, you know, four or five events. But now it's become so much a part of the process for me that it seems really normal.

You know, one day off is like enough for me to recharge at this point. And the travel and all that, do you just get used to it? Or how does that play into your psyche and your makeup? up. As long as I'm not sick, I'm totally fine. But I will tell you, I think I had an Arkansas, Alabama game earlier this season. And it was kind of midway through. First time I'm doing game day and the game. So there's a lot. There's more travel than usual. And by the end of the game, I'm interviewing Sabin. And I tell them before, I'm like, listen, my voice is going out. So just make what you can out of the question. And my voice is like cracking to the end. And I wasn't

able to work that week until Saturday because I had like laryngitis or something. I was on steroids. But normally I'm fine, I swear. I don't get sick like that. I'm glad you brought that up. I wasn't going to go here, but I'll do it now because of what you just said. So I get a sense from watching you on ESPN, whether it's game day and you're walking and interviewing the coaches or players. But I get a sense that you had this ability to build a very quick rapport with your interviewee or the subject, so to speak. What is it?

Is it just in your innate personality or do you have specific process in place to build rapport quickly? with a Nick Saban, right? One of the most intimidating guys on the planet or Jalen Hertz or Tua or any basketball. Like, what is it, do you think, that allows you or puts you in the position to build such quick rapport? It's funny because part of it I do think comes naturally, but part of it I'm very, I come in with a purpose when I first start talking to that kid. So I remember, like, we had a Clemson day where we went and we wanted to do a feature

on the Clemson defensive line. But, you know, when Christian Wilkin sits down, my first question is, isn't going to be about defense. It's like, so what classes do you have today? You know, and, oh, I see you're wearing like these boots or whatever. That's kind of weird. Like, you're wearing sweats in those duck boots. Like, tell me about what's going on here. You know, like, I try to, I want them to know that when I talk to them, it is not just about the fact that they can perform a certain sport or the fact that they have a strength in athleticism or whatever. Like, I want them to know that I actually care about who they are as a person and would like to get to know them

whether or not any of that information ever makes it anywhere. Like, I don't care. Like, I want to get to know who you are. And I think that it's valued a lot of times. I do the same thing with coaches. I want to know, oh, so how's your wife doing? I know a lot of coaches wives. How is your family doing? When I see them on the field, I'm just as excited to see them as I am the coaches. And so you're kind of building this relationship and this rapport that extends past the field of play, which creates a trust, one. So they might give you more information in the long run. But also they're just going to be more open and you're going to end up having those fun conversations and those moments on air that you don't always get, you know?

Yeah, so getting into your story, that's just evident, and it shines through when you're watching on TV, but you are a stud athlete yourself, and I wonder if that's part of it, too, that helps you, a two-sport star at Georgia basketball and volleyball, which in itself, I don't know, I mean, I played one sport in college, and it was really tough. I don't know how you were able to play two,

but do you think that plays a role as well, that they look at you and they see, well, she's like one of us. I mean, she played, and there's just a thing. I even felt it with the other athletes at school, male and female. I remember because we would do events together. I graduated from Ohio University where I played football, Maria. And just there's this, it's like a fraternity, I would say, with the athletes

where maybe it's because you both have these full-time jobs that people who don't play college sports don't have in a different way, right? You're earning your pay, right? You're earning your scholarship through playing your sport. But I get that sense too, but maybe they view you not necessarily as an ESPN personality, but they view you as an athlete. Oh, 100%. I think, and I'm 6'2. I'm 6'2. I've got broad shoulders. I got big hands. People point it out all the time on social media. I wear a size 11, which is a 10 and a half in men. When you see me, I'm just as big as half the receivers on Alabama's team. I'm just not as built as them. And so I get that question a lot. Oh, so where did you play and what did you do? And it's like an instant kind of connect. there. And I think, too, I ask some questions that are different. You know, like when we're talking to a kid and he just rolled his ankle, I'm like, okay, so is it, does it hurt most during takeoff or is it lateral movement that's bothering you? Like, can you not start and stop? And when they hear that they're like, oh, okay, like, you've got, you've been injured before and had to play through it. Let's talk about it. So it totally helps. I mean, you're so right. And I'm so thankful for that experience. I've always said, I would have hated being a regular student in college, even though they had a lot of extra time. And it seemed like it was, easier. It's just not a road that I would have wanted to go down because we learned so much.

You know, you know how it was. You feel like you walk away with so much from being a student athlete. One of the things I mentioned you as before I hit record was that my preparation process for a podcast conversation is very similar to when I played football and how much film I watched and study of the game plan and study of the team that we are going against and understanding stress points and strength of the defense and how I could attack as a quarterback. And so I think what I learned from the field and from playing was the importance of preparation and how that helped, I would say, any type of nerves or anxiousness was the fact that I try to prepare, overprepare for everything, whether it's a big speech, a podcast talk with

Maria Taylor or a football game. Are those some of the things where what are some of the key things you've taken from your athletic career that's led you to have such success really in a short period of time since you've gotten to ESPN? I think that's a huge part of it. As an athlete, I feel like I was always a perfectionist. So whatever my last performance was was not my best performance, and it could always get better.

And I feel the same way as the broadcaster. But I overprepared. I might talk maybe one time or whatever in a game, but I will have talked to as many players as I could during the course of the week or at shootarounds and coaches. I like to send producers notes of the stories that I'm interested in or things that have intrigued me before games happen. And half that stuff might not even get in the broadcast. It literally may never make air, but to me it's like kind of a cool thing.

And it's something that I would like just the entire crew to know. I remember one time I had a boss come up to me at the Women's Final Four last year. It was my first time working a championship game. And he was like, who wrote all these notes? Do you get those from the researcher? And it's like, no, I did. but it's just you don't want to have any excuse for failure or I don't want to walk away and be like, man, I could have done better just by trying harder.

And I don't ever want to walk away from a situation like that. Like maybe I just didn't handle a situation well. It's live TV. Something came my way that I wasn't expecting. But if it's an situation where dang it, I could have been more prepared for that, then I'm really going to kick myself. And I just don't want to put myself in that situation. I assume that's part of the answer of this next question.

But so many people want, I think, the job that you have. right. ESPN college game day is the best and by the way I went to the same high school as Kirk, Herb Street so I've got the chance to talk to him a decent amount. I love Kirk and obviously a huge fan of his work as well and he's maybe the best when it when it comes to a college football analyst but I'm curious so many people want that job they want to be in the studio they want to be on the field they want to be on game day and you earned that job rather quickly in your career what are some of the key and the reason I asked this is because There's a lot of people listening, Maria, that they want certain jobs that other people want,

their eyes set on whether it's broadcasting or business or sales or a CEO, whatever it may be. They have their eyes set on something. They really want it. And I think whatever you're about to say could be transferable to what they want as far as their career and doing it at a quicker pace than maybe others. So I'm curious, what do you think it was that set you apart from everybody else that allowed you to earn this position at a pretty young age and earlier in your career? I will say that in the beginning, and I tell this to young broadcasters that are interested in getting into it, I never said no to anything. So you could have called me and said, hey, we want you to do the NAA, you know, regular season game between blank and blank. And I was like, sure, yeah, where's it at? And I would drive to that game and I would do it, you know. I did everything from high school football in Georgia to the swag championship for women's basketball. I mean, there wasn't anyone in the arena. but the competition was awesome. You know, I've done ACC digital stuff.

Turner, I have done Division II and Division III Women's Basketball Championships. I've been in Grand Rapids, Michigan, you know, staying in what seemed like a motel, but it was named a hotel. You know what I mean? Like, you have to be comfortable in the grind and you can't get lost or discouraged in it. And every time I got a job and it didn't matter what it was, I was overly amped about it. And then eventually things just started coming in, like you would run into someone on the road while you're at a Division III championship that knows someone at Comcast and that person knows someone at ESPN. And that kind of paved my road. It was this idea that if I'm not working, there's something wrong. If I'm not doing something to make myself move in the direction that I'm interested in moving in, then I'm not helping myself. So it's been interesting now to be able to sit back more. And like I don't feel the need to climb as much like where's my next job? where's my next position going to be? And I got a call this past May about doing game day in the game.

And I was just happy doing my job and excited about what I was doing in college basketball when this opportunity came about. So it's interesting how it starts coming in once you let go of the rains a little bit. But in the beginning, like you just have to be willing and comfortable to grind so hard. And people, and by the way, you bring up Kirk Herbstreet, and he's a great example of it because I don't think people understand how hard he works. Like you said, he is the best in our business. I think he's the best analyst that we have across all sports. But he has a camera in his house, so whenever they want to talk to him on sports center something, he's there to talk about it.

He does our college game day. He's like the most invested person in every meeting that I've ever been in. He knows the most about every single school. He talks to every coach. He already has the information before it hits anywhere. He flies still. He goes home and is there for his son's Friday night football games. He's back for college game day.

He's flying across the country to do the game. and he never sleeps while he were on the flight. He's still watching games and trying to. When we land, he doesn't take a nap. He doesn't rest. He's watching all the games because he loves it. And so you think about, man, that'd be a great job to have. But his hair is on fire for the entire football season.

He's living the dream and he has a positive attitude the whole time. Not everyone's built for that. Like you have to be ready for situations like that. And never really taking it for granted. You know, at this point, you could Kirkman do it 20 years. He could kind of relax on his recliner. I don't get the sense that he ever does that. He seems to really truly appreciate.

He was on, I think, James Andrew Miller's show, origins, and basically said that, that he got his dream job at a pretty young age and now still thinks of it that way. And I think that's really cool. It's really inspiring to see that. And I have to imagine being around it for, like, you and David Pollock and Des, like, it has to be inspiring to see, like, the leader, I would say, well, Lee Corso is probably the leader. but, you know, Kirk as one of the leaders to say, man, like, that's, that's the approach that we should all have.

And, like, we'll be in shows. We'll go into a break. He's like, man, next time I think we can do that segment better, like, here's some ideas I have. We're literally in the middle of a show, and he's already like, here's how we can improve for next show. So, you know, like, in that way, that's how I think an athlete would think anyway. But he's constantly trying to progress and do better. And like you said, he could just kind of lay off the gas. Like, I've been doing the 25 years, whatever.

but that's not who he is and that's why he is where he is. Another part, you said the beginning of that response, Maria, that I think is interesting and helpful for people regardless of your profession. It reminds me of a talk I had with Adnan Verk, a colleague of yours at ESPN and Adnan is great. We just talked the other day. We're going to do another one because he was so interesting. He loves movies, which I do too.

But anyway, Adnan said, and I think he still subscribes to this method as you do, quote whenever there is an opening always show up always be there for your boss be known as the person who says yes when your boss calls don't tell them about the trouble it takes you to say yes just do it show up and i thought that was great advice from a from a person that he has i think that's been a key to his success and it sounds like a key to yours that if they asked you said yes where do i need to go do i need to catch a flight where do i need to drive i'm there and that has been one of the keys to you being successful. Right, because I mean, I think a lot of times people, our nature is selfish. So you're going to first think, okay, how is this going to impact me and

how will this put me in a tight spot and how is it going to make my prep more difficult or blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But I think you also have to be thinking bigger picture. And especially now that I work for a company, it's like, how can I help, I need to do what is best for my company. If my boss comes to me and asks me to do something, he's not just asking out of nowhere. Like, obviously this is going to help the company. This is something that they need for me and I am an employee one. And then I think, too, in the beginning, just showing a willingness to work hard goes a long way. People remember that. Like, this person has a will to be great. They don't mind overextending themselves. And that's going to go a long way. And it's about how you make people feel. I think people say it all the time. They don't

remember what you say. You might get on air and say something crazy. But they're going to remember, you know what, when I called on Maria, she came and she helped in a tight situation, and it was great. It was awesome. I had a time where I was doing a volleyball match in Gainesville. I got the call during the match to see if I could go and do a Clemson football game on Thursday. And I was like, sure, how do I get there? And as you guys know, I will know nothing about these two teams, but I will show up for this game. And I did it. What about this, I guess the word maybe is balance. So for the people listening who say, yeah, I think that's great advice that's got to show up. but I also have a spouse and kids and I need to be here.

And you mentioned how Kirk kind of flies back and forth to see the Friday night games. But it sounds like do you have this kind of myopic focus on career? Or do you think it's possible to be balanced and always show up and be there when your boss call? Every time I think about balance, I think of a speech that I heard at a conference. And I wish I could remember the lady's name because she was awesome. But she decided that she wanted to end up being a professor at Oregon. And she had kind of lived the dream, like worked her way up, the NFL ladder, worked in the corporate world and was very successful. And then at some point decided that, you know, she wanted to reel it back in and get closer to the family and focus on family.

But the way she described work life is like, she's like, it will never be balanced. It cannot be balanced. If you are at work, you are not with your kids. So there, there is an imbalance there. She said that she thinks of it as a stew. So it might be a big vegetable sous with some beef in it. So sometimes you dip your spoon down and you come up with your spoon and it's just full of beef and say maybe the beef is your family. The next time you dip it down, it might be full of vegetables and maybe the vegetables are your work.

It's all the same stew. You're constantly getting fulfilled and nourished off of it. It just might be at certain times you are taking bigger bites of one thing and that's okay. You need to be okay with that situation. but there's never going to be a true balance, but you can't penalize yourself for not being able to be in two places at once and recognize that in all aspects

and in some way, you are helping someone or fulfilling what you need yourself while you're out at work, you know? So I was like, okay, that's a great way to put it. And I do want a family, and when that happens, then I will readjust and figure out what needs to be held back

or what I need to spend more time in, or maybe that I just need to focus on one sport. You know, maybe that is something that I will end up having to do. But I don't think there's any such thing as balance, especially in sports when it comes to work life. Yeah, and there's a lot of travel. There's weekends, and you're working a lot when people, other people are not because you're working when people are watching TV, right? Saturdays and the weekends.

And your friends are off. You're just, you know I'm at work, guys, but on Tuesday, and you hang out? And they're like, no. Yeah, exactly. And obviously you knew that going into it. When did you decide that you wanted to be in sports broadcasting? I didn't figure it out until I was probably a junior in college. And I came to the University of Georgia, thought I was going to be a team doctor. And I took biology, hated it. Like, hated the class.

Then I took accounting because my family just kind of said, well, get into business. Everyone does business. And I took like finance accounting and hated all those classes. It's not inspiring to me. I don't want to go through the rest of my college career here. My best friend was in journalism. I took an intro to journalism class with her. I was like, this is where I'm supposed to be. This is what I'm meant to do. I remember people were coming to broadcast or games. I was like, if that's how I could stay around the game, I would be happy. So that's when I changed my major. And that's all I have shot for since then, basically.

Did you get your MBA? I did. And that was because I didn't think broadcasting was going to work. I was like, well, let me go back to school. I could be a teacher or something. Yeah. So did you grow up just loving sports or where does that come from? Yeah, I always played.

So I played softball when I was super young. didn't pick up basketball until about sixth grade, but my dad played basketball in college. And I've always been a very competitive person. Like it didn't matter if I was just playing a board game or something. And this was the best way to kind of be an outlet to it. So I'm not yelling at everyone at family game night. And just always enjoyed it.

I played a little bit of tennis too. I just, when we moved, I moved from Chicago to Atlanta when I was in sixth grade. And I realized that I really liked basketball because I joined a church league. took off basketball from there and then ninth grade picked up volleyball so that i could get out of basketball conditioning and then fell in love with volleyball too so what was it like being a two sport athlete in college like how did the recruiting process work from high school to college how did you because i had one teammate who tried to play basketball and football and it was a problem i mean both the coaches the basketball coach hated that he played football and the football coaches hated that

he played basketball because we'd have spring practice for football but there's also basketball and football season would run into basketball season. So how did that work with you with playing basketball and volleyball? What made you want to play both? And not many people do that, male or female. So I'm curious how that even came about. Yeah, I was recruited to play both out of high school. And initially what I told myself was I was going to pick a basketball school

and then I was going to pick a volleyball school and then choose which one I wanted to go to. So it kind of came down to Kentucky if I decided I wanted to play basketball in college and Georgia if I wanted to play volleyball in college. And when I finished with my high school career, I just was leaning towards volleyball. I was like, man, I just feel like the ceiling is much higher. You know, people are getting into the sport. I feel like it's an up-and-coming sport. And the athleticism that I have is perfect for this sport where a lot of, in basketball,

it could be neutralized a lot easier. So I went to Georgia, and then I get to school and realize, man, I really still want to play basketball. And Georgia had recruited me for basketball, too. So I just went over to coach Landers, and he was like, absolutely. We have like two ACL tears. Come on, let's do it. And I loved every second of it. I mean, you do end up missing the preseason.

I made it in like right before one of our last tournaments, basically before conference play. And the biggest thing was getting into the team chemistry, the flow of things. You have to, obviously, it's a different set of endure, a different type of endurance. So I would have to stay after and run on the treadmill. But in a lot of ways, I mean, you know how it goes.

There's spring football. Like you said, Ryan. And so there are times when you're still practicing, and it seems like you're in the middle of your sport. You're just not traveling and competing. The only thing that was different about my experience was I did travel during what would have been my off volleyball season. But I still have been practicing anyway, you know. For me, I got, if you analyze my grades in college, I got better grades in season than I did out of season. And I don't know if that was, I think it's because of the structure maybe that every day.

And that's why I try to structure my days now. I try to learn from those years in college because in season it was wake up, lift, sometimes meetings, but then class, and then obviously meetings, practice, and then study table and then dinner, late dinner, and then typically either more study or, you know, bedtime. That's it. And that was every day. And for whatever reason, that helped that structure help me get pretty good grades in the fall. Not that I got bad grades in outside of season, but I got, I got even. better during. What do you think of structure of college sports, especially since you're probably doing it pretty much year round? Did that help you? And has that helped you as you've left college? It 100% helped me. I totally agree with that sentiment. Like grades were better in season, 100%. Because your whole life is planned out. And sometimes when you're traveling on the road, a lot of times it's like, okay, well, now we have to study anyway. We have study hall on the road. And there's nothing to do. and they took her cell phones or whatever the case may be.

I will say this, and I wonder if you feel this way too, Ryan, like when my day is not structured, I feel like I haven't accomplished anything. So even though, like, sometimes you just need to rest or whatever or you just need to let the day come to you, but coming from our background where we're so used to things being regimented and there's a way to kind of measure the success that you've had or like how many reps you did here, da-da-da-da.

And so sometimes during days, I'm like, man, I just wasted that day away. And it's like, that's probably not true, but it's how I've been trained to feel. Yeah, it's really interesting. One of the things I found, so I mentioned you, I've interviewed and talked to 240, 250 plus of these really impressive leaders from all over the world and all disciplines. And one of the things I've learned that I've tried hard to implement is to block out time every day to spend time in that quadrant that is what we label not urgent but important.

And by that, I mean, that's time to have basically no meetings or nothing. It's really time to think. It's time to reflect. It's time to learn. It's time to read. It's time to listen to podcasts. And that's hard, I think, I'm getting better because I've just heard it so many times from so many really high performers in this leadership space that it's helped me.

But coming again from our background, I think that's tough because I'm not used to really doing that. Like, yeah, we'd have meetings and we watch film and we get ready for practice. But it wasn't just kind of blank time on the calendar. There was always something. Right. Exactly. And I think that's something that I've tried to change this new year is waking up, like,

even if it's just 30 minutes or an hour earlier to read or do something, like you said, it's not urgent, but it's something that almost I'm learning or it's building me up or it's giving me something else to think about. I think that's important. And because the reason I started doing it was I noticed that, and I love podcasts, I listen to them all the time, but I would be listening to him and I'd be thinking about 9,000 other thing and I'm like, where is the quiet space in my mind? Like, when did I lose it and how do I get it back? Because I want to be able to sit and listen to a podcast on a plane again. And I've noticed

that just extending my day a little bit allows me to have that quiet time later or quiet space in my mind. You probably don't have typical days. If there was one, though, what does it look like specifically the very beginning. You mentioned you're now, you're waking up a little bit earlier, but what does it look like? I'm a big ritual, routine person and developing great habits of learning from, learn from a lot of people who are masters at that. But what's your first 60 to 90 minutes look like of a day? And how do you, how do you structure your days now, given the fact that you have sometimes a chaotic schedule with travel and work? I'm curious to how you personally manage that. Sure. I think, first of all, when I wake up, I can gauge.

almost, okay, how am I feeling upon waking up? Because my day is already set in my mind and I know what's going to happen and I know how I feel about it. So if I feel like, okay, it's going to be a run ragged day, then I start my day with music and like let's just get on an energetic start, upbeat feel. And a lot of times it can be gospel music or something really positive that'll put me in the mind of say worship or faith or just something positive. Every morning I listen to the New York Times, they have a podcast called The Daily and it's usually like, say maybe 20, minutes, but it's something while I'm getting dressed, I feel like I'm being fed information that can be useful throughout the day or just keeping me on top of current events.

I also have a podcast, Joyce Meyer does it, and it's called Enjoying Everyday Life. And it's usually just like a constant kick in the rear end, but it's so faith focused. And so it's a lot about like, why are you complaining about life? Or if you haven't decided that you have a purpose and that purpose has already been decided for you, then every single day should be a blessing. and you should feel that way or something like that. So it's usually about an hour of between music, getting ready, and the two podcasts I start my day with, regardless of what's going on,

those are how I kind of start it. And then at some point later in the day, I'm trying to, again, find that open space to do it again. Like, I want to reset midway through the day. And there's usually some point, there's always an hour between shootarounds or something like that. When I have that option, I just want to use it properly. So how do you balance the, okay, you're doing game day, you're interviewing people, you're preparing for that, then you're actually doing the games, you're on the sideline, you're offering insight, you're preparing for interviews for probably at halftime and after the game.

But then you also are in the studio as an analyst. I mean, so this is just never happens, but you're, so you have a combination role that's unique to, I can't think of anybody else who does this, though, who has kind of the sideline gig where they're the expert. interviewer. You're also producing stories that show on ESPN, but then you also sit at the desk and analyze basketball for the company. How do you balance between those roles being, I think, quite a bit different. I assume there's a lot of prep, but I'm curious to hear your process and getting ready for those. I love, first of all, the dynamic of it all. And I tell people who are coming up in broadcasting, make sure you diversify kind of your talent space or what people will associate you with, I think that's important with the way that media changes every day.

So you don't want to be seen as just one thing. You don't want to just be a host and you don't want to just be an analyst and you don't want to just be a reporter because if any one of those things goes away, if studio shows start to fade and live events are huge, then you're going to want to have great sideline reporting skills and vice versa if live events become neutralized for some reason. And people just want to watch studio shows, you need to be able to handle that too. So I look at it as an opportunity to flex different muscles. You know how it is when you go and work out. Like one day you might be focused on the leg, but it's not just the leg, it's the hamstrings. The next day it's like I'm focusing on my calf. So I'm strengthening myself as a broadcaster by focusing on all these different layers of the actual craft.

So every time I go out and do something different, I'm like, oh, this is awesome. Like I want to be the best at this in this moment. And it's just different things. You know, when you are interviewing people, I'm not the most. important thing. Like the most important thing is that subject. And so it's all about me investigating what is going to get the best answer from them, what their interests are. How do I phrase a question? When I interview Coach Cal, I don't ask the same questions that I'm going to ask when I interview a Coach K or a Kirby Smart at Georgia or Nick Saban. They all require some kind of

different formatting. And when I'm in the studio hosting, I'm going to ask different questions to my analyst than I normally would as if I was a sideline reporter. And I have to come with way more information instead of seeking out information from my interviewees. So it's fun to just flex different muscles. And I really like challenges. It's another athlete thing, I think. Like I get bored very easily. So being able to switch gears midway through the year is awesome for me. Of all the people you've interviewed, who are the ones that you really look forward to? And I say that purposefully because It doesn't mean they're the easiest or whatever, whether it's Sabin or somebody else. Who do you really look forward to interviewing as a challenge and knowing that you can,

you're striving to get something good from them? I would say that Nick Saban's definitely one of them because he is viewed as such a challenge. There is just kind of like this perception that he doesn't like the media and he's kind of old and grisly around the edges. And I like that about him. I like the fact that he's like the process, the process, the process. And so when I go in, it's like my whole job is to steer him left just a little bit off of whatever the line he's trying to stay on. And I value that.

You know, I'm trying to, okay, let's see if we can get a little smirk out of that. Let's see if we can get him to tell a little bit of a joke. Let's see if I can get him to really go in on his team or maybe he's going to compliment his team. And that's not something that we hear a lot. So I enjoy that. And I also just enjoy time around people that, like, you can. tell that they, one, are touched, and two, they have an incredible process. Like, he is an amazing leader.

And he's kind of created his own space. Like, he is just on a level that no one else can even touch right now. And it's cool to be in someone's prime while that's happening. And I value that right now. I don't want to look back and be like, oh, I remember when I was around when Sabin was winning these championships. I think it now. I'm like, I'm literally witnessing history.

I'm on the field with history. I'm talking to history right now. I've heard, maybe you can confirm this, I've heard that, so he does segments on Game Day. He'll come on maybe if his team's not playing or his team's playing later and will obviously share his insight with the guys at the desk. I've heard that he's one of the most particular ones about getting feedback on his performance while on Game Day. Is that accurate? That's what I've heard too. And he wasn't able to do Game Day obviously this year because of the championship.

but hearing that it doesn't surprise me because that he's striving to be the best at everything. Everything. It doesn't matter if it's a one-off opportunity to be on TV. That's kind of just like the makeup and his nature. And I think that that's what makes him so great. And I think that's what he instills in his players so successfully that many coaches can't make happen.

Like he's created this aura of greatness that as soon as you step in this building, you're giving me the best of everything. If you are here to lay the sod down on this field, you are going to lay the sod down the best of your abilities. If you're here to clean it, whatever, everyone is held accountable to like the highest of standards around the Alabama football program. Definitely a commonality I found in those who sustain excellence is they have a process in place to receive feedback and direct coaching. That is part of like the 10,000 hour rule is not just obviously the deliberate practice, but it's the feedback is part of that deliberate practice. So for you, Maria, when you think about the jobs that you do and the multiple roles, who do you have in your life that offers and provides you feedback to say, hey, that was really good or, hey, this could have been better by doing this. I've also heard in broadcasting, this is tough at times because not everybody gets that feedback.

So what is it like for you and your multiple roles at ESPN and who provides it and how do they help you? I usually get it from coordinating producers. and one of them, he's my great friend and I also consider him a mentor. But his name is Steve Ackles and he works kind of over SEC Network football and basketball. And he was one of my first ever producers. So he was with me when I was messing everything up. You know, I feel like he believed in me. And he's like, oh, she's got some talent.

We got to figure out the kinks, but she'll get there. And so to this day, he'll send a text and say, hey, you're talking too fast again. Or, hey, I would take some of the stats out of your question and just get to the question. or hey, when you're interviewing Coach Cal, you know he's going to go one way. So open up the question a little bit, you know, let him take you where he wants. So it doesn't seem dismissive or whatever. And I value that kind of feedback. And I seek it out.

What I've learned about myself is, and I think I was this way as a player too, when I trust a person and I know that they have my best interest in mind, I will receive the feedback. Now, if someone comes out of nowhere and tries to give me feedback, I don't really know the person. I feel like they don't know me. I don't handle it very well. I really don't. Twitter's a rough place, but I haven't. So you know, I block everything on Twitter. I literally don't only see people.

I think that maybe it's like verified and the other one is if I follow you. Okay. I was going to say, do you, I mean, I know that can be tough. I've heard Joe Buck talk a lot about this. Like it can, he's admitted that he has to like abstain. because he just gets in his head. He was starting to look at it during games and it would mess with broadcast. But when you see unsolicited feedback from people that are not anywhere near your inner circle of trust when it comes to that,

how do you handle it? I try to just shrug it off. Sometimes I make it into a joke. And sometimes I want to put that person on blast, especially if it's on Twitter, Instagram or something. I'll retweet it and be like, oh, my God, thanks for your input or something. You know what I mean? So that other people can see that this is real. These are words that we have to hear.

And most people in their daily lives or in their work lives are not receiving a constant public criticism of them. And with broadcasting, a lot of what you do is who you are. So me as a broadcaster is also me as a person. I'm just Maria Taylor all the time. So if you're attacking me as a broadcaster, in a lot of ways, that can feel like you're just attacking me. So that is why I've had to block a lot of things. So similar to Joe Buck, I don't even want it to be in my mind. I don't want to have seen it.

And I can say I don't take heed into it or whatever, but I still hurt it. And it still hurts. That doesn't change anything. Yeah, you're human being. Yeah, we're human. And some people might have better shells than other. I know that I don't. So I took the step and I was like, I don't have to see it.

There's no reason for me to see it. Yeah, I think it's good advice. So for anybody, when you think about, I mean, at times, unsolicited advice is, obviously unfortunately often worth what you pay for it. And that can be a problem for people. So I think one of the keys, again, that I found, I tried to distill and synthesize what I've learned and then share that on this show, Maria, is that the commonality the great seem to have is they do have that core group. It's usually like a handful or maybe a little bit more of people who they really trust to give them candid, honest feedback that's just in the people. It's just in the people. And they're

in the sheer form of wanting to be helpful and wanting to be useful. And that seems to be, regardless, if you're on TV, it's, it's a little bit more because everybody sees your work. But in any line of work, to find that core group of people that are smart, that are thoughtful, that care about you, that are offering you that feedback to try to genuinely help you. Yeah. And I think you have to think about feedback or what you're listening to and what you're

hearing as just as important as what you put in your body. You know, we've had this gigantic shift towards like being organic and being very thoughtful about the things that we're eating and everything else. But, you know, what are we filling our minds with and who are we allowing to impact us and have an impact on us? And are those people important and do those people even value us? And I think that that's something that I've learned along the way that's really helped me. And I have a very small circle.

I was talking to one of my friends who, he's a researcher and he's one of my great friends. And I've always said that he makes me a better broadcaster because he can tell me. me what I'm doing wrong. He can tell me how to fix it. And he's going to help me find a solution. And he was like, I just told one of my friends, hey, you're probably going to see Maria at the Rose Bowl, but, you know, she has her people and she talks to her people. And she'll smile and say, hey to you, but I'm just letting you know. And that's so true. Like, I have my people and I'm okay with that. And I trust those people. And I'm going to go to them over and over and over and over again. If they point someone else and say, hey, Maria, I think you should talk to them about this

particular subject, then I will move and shift and talk to that person. But until they've gone, that trust and I don't see the point in bringing in a lot of different voices and constantly being inundated with information that might not be the most healthy for me. Shifting gears a little bit, I've been a big game day fan for a long time, watched it growing up when I was in college and since then, why does that show work so well? What makes it so, it's compelling television? Like, what makes it what it is? I think one thing that's interesting about that show is it doesn't change very much. And I think that in a time when things are changing a lot, people might value the fact that you can turn on ESPN on Saturday at 9 and the same show is on

with the same signs and the same fans and for the most part the same voices. And you know how it's going to end. You know how it's going to start. It's going to end with Lee Corso putting on a headgear. It's going to start with somebody's voice saying, welcome to whatever campus we're on. Here are these signs. You know what I mean? And I think that that's valued right now a little bit. I think that college football is a sport that is about tradition. It's about history. And so the fans, for the fans, college game day is a part of tradition. I also think this feeling of being a part of it, like fans can see people behind the show and be like, oh, that's kind of cool. Like you can almost see yourself as a part of the show. And I think that the voices that we have on it are very valued. Like the fact

that you can hear from Kirk Curb Street before every single college game happens on a Saturday. It's not many sports where there's one game a week, one game, you know, for the most part, and all of them that matter are happening on this Saturday. And you can hear from the voices and the leaders in the sport leading right on up to it. And I think that that's another reason why people love it. And it seems like there's just great camaraderie amongst the people on it. And if you guys don't genuinely like each other, then you do a good job of faking it. But it feels to me like I could picture a production meeting.

getting ready and it being funny and insightful and it would be just a fun meeting to be a part of. Do I guess you can lie if you want, but I'm just curious what it's like inside those meetings getting ready for the shows. Oh, they're hilarious. It's just like a nonstop comedy show of everyone busting each other's chops, you know what I mean, joking around. Everyone has like a funny role to play. What's your role?

David's the funny like all over the place. super hyper brother I'm like new kid on the block slash can you please put a heart on my rundown trying to be princess almost Corso is like everybody's

lovable uncle or grandpa whatever you want to call him just loved and revered Kirk is the golden boy that might actually be his nickname he's like the leader of this crazy motley crew Reese is the structured

and responsible one. Like, Reese is the one that's going to keep things on track, okay? So he's got all the information dialed in. Hopefully everyone shows up for the show on time. And Des is the cool kid. Like nothing he will ever do or say will not be cool. So that's what he's going to be. And you just go and have fun.

You being the new kid, how do they welcome you and help you? Oh, they've been awesome the whole time. I mean, Kirk has been great about giving feedback. Here's, this is what I said, what I've noticed when you're hosting college football live and here's ways that we can push and we can we can make this even better or how are you feeling? And what I've liked to is a lot of people asking just like how are things going for you? Sometimes I just have the battle like just people checking in. I like that.

Tom Rinaldi has been great for me. I think that he's brilliant at what he does. You need to have him on one of your podcasts because he is brilliant. Maybe you can help me out. I got you on that one. Okay. You would love talking to him. I love Tom Rolting.

Aldi. I'm a massive fan. Every time he talks, and you can tell him, I said, every time he talks to me, I want to take out a notebook and just start writing things down because I feel like I need to defer or refer to it later on in my life. Later on in my life might be an hour from the time that I'm talking to him. Gene Wojahowski is great. We really latched on kind of to one another in a way of just like, hey, I'm not sure how this works. Can you help me here? What does this look like? And trying to get used to the schedule and how things operate for game day. So everyone was really opening and welcoming. And I just, I was yes ma'am. Like, yes, sir, yes, ma'am, whatever you guys want me to do. I just want to be a part of this and not distract or disrupt what is already an amazing show. So another aspect, as if there wasn't enough to everything you do, Maria, I was doing a deep dive on Winning Edge Leadership Academy. And another thing that you have co-founded. And this is about, I believe I'll let you kind of share the story, but what you're doing and as a leader trying to help the next generation.

So I'm curious, what made you want to start this and do this now to already be thinking about the next generation when you're still, you know, at the beginning of your career, so to speak, you're thinking about how to help others and you stepping up as a leader for as part of this Winning Edge Leadership Academy? Sure, yeah. Well, the Winning Edge Leadership Academy is all about helping young women and minorities get into the sports industry. And I know that as an African-American female, a lot of times I'm in a production meeting

room or I'm in a coach's meeting. And I look around and I say, it is unfortunate that this meeting doesn't have a more diverse group of people in it. I want that to happen. And I've also seen the other side of it where I'm getting reached out to by men and women that are so interested in getting in and they are minorities or they are women and they just don't know how to make it happen. And I'm like, man, how do I bridge these two gaps? Because I do believe that both people's company priorities, teams have it as a priority, that they want to have a diverse workforce. And here we are with this incredible talent pool that I'm constantly being reached out by or two.

and I want to find a way to make sure that these groups are connecting. And so that was kind of the genesis of the winning edge, just trying to find a way to bridge the gap and be in networking. Just open up my Rolodex and help kids know that if they're interested in doing something, there is someone that's willing to fight for them or there is a support system. And this year we're trying to focus more on student athletes because I do feel like I go on these campuses. I talk to kids. I make money off of them being successful.

successful student athletes. And then five years later, I come to find out that maybe, you know, they're not doing as well as I would hope that they would have or, you know, NFL dreams didn't pan out and they weren't sure what to do next. And I just want to be able to offer them something to fall back on. And so we're having former student athletes and current student athletes come to a retreat in Miami where we're going to bring in industry professionals, you know, so if a kid wants to work in marketing, we're going to have someone that works in, you know, marketing for the dolphins or marketing for the spurs or for collegiate football so that they can understand what that looks like. If you want to work in broadcasting, obviously you can talk to me, but I want you to

understand that you can be a producer too in sports, and that's awesome. So we're just kind of like opening the floodgates and seeing what pours in, but we've had some great applications already from student athletes that are really excited about the opportunity. We've already had two cohorts of students in general. They weren't specifically student athletes. And some of them, we have one kid that's working at the University of Tennessee and player development there. We've had kids shadow me in Bristol come out to the women's basketball final four, come out to SEC basketball tournaments and work with the SEC. And conferences have been very helpful. Teams have been helpful. Coaches have been helpful and all see a need for this. And it's just fun to be on the ground floor

of building something like this because it helps give me another purpose. We're just flexing another muscle and it makes me feel like what I'm doing doesn't just go away after you turn the TV off like it has the purpose my platform has a purpose do you feel a responsibility as an afric american woman to help obviously you do it sounds like but where does that come from because like i said it would be easily justified for you to say i am super busy and i would love to help i would And I'll try to have calls and text and get you set up with interviews. But to take this really aggressive approach, which I think is, by the way, so cool. But do you feel this sense of responsibility?

Because people can look on TV and say, like, wow, like I don't like using the word like you've arrived or you've made it. I don't think we've ever arrived. I've learned that from JJ Reddick. You never arrived. You're always becoming. But in a way, you know, you've accomplished a lot pretty quickly. So you feel this sense of responsibility to help bring others along with you. 100%.

And a lot of what's been going on lately. So obviously I'm in a public figure position where I can't speak out on things that are happening in our society. So I feel like this horrible being black in America, someone said this before, it's like being a crazy person because you spend half the time trying to assimilate. And then you spend the other half of the time trying to support and prop up, you know, your people or who you represent on a daily basis just by waking up. And so I'm trying to find a way to just, in my mind, feel as though I'm doing something to give back to the black community. But I can't vocally say it to, because then I would ostracize or make, you know, the majority of people not agree with me or feel some type of way about me. The way around all of that is to start a nonprofit, focus it on minority development. And that's kind of my way of backdooring into the conversation.

I don't want to be a part of the conversation. I want to be a part of the solution. You know what I mean? And I've seen this as the best way for me to feel like, okay, I'm walking this line. Again, I think being black in America, you're just standing on a fence. If you fall off either way, you are there. You're stuck there. If I fall off to one side and black people think I'm too white, then they're not going to mess with me anymore.

If I fall off to the other side and white people think I'm too black, then they're not going to talk to me anymore. I have to walk on this fence, don't fall off. And this is the best way to balance all the worlds that I have to live in because it's, It's not just one, all the people that I have to be. You know, I'm a woman. Times up, that's great, but I'm still a black woman, you know, and that my times up looks different from yours. It's just great perspective for somebody like me, you know, growing up as a white dude, you

just don't think about that. And that's why I love having these types of conversations because, you know, you kind of realize how easy or even lucky at times because I don't, I never, I've never had those thoughts. You know what I mean? And I think of you, like, I'm literally visualizing you kind of walking on a, skinny fence of like worried about falling off on either side but it never really ends I mean does it I mean you're always going to be kind of thinking that way it feels like which is I'm concerned

because I think of people like like look at what has happened to Jamel you know max Kellerman or someone else a white man could have said some of the same things that she said but because she is a black woman that said it it's a rap for her like she was at the point of no return as far as everyone's going to assume that when she talks, she's only speaking black. Like, that's the only language she can speak. And I don't ever want to be in that situation. And I feel for her. And I think she's fine. Like, she's going to be great. She's going to make documentaries. She's going to be like the queen of the world and probably be a director one day. But I don't ever want to be in a space where I'm viewed as only one thing. But unfortunately, sometimes I, you know,

I would love to dig into one side of who I am of my identity. But I can't do that publicly. So it's interesting. Why? Because you. You see some of the tough moments she's went through or why you say I can't do that, but why can't you do that? One example is I, so I went to Missouri when the football team was boycotting the game because of racial injustice on campus. And I posted a picture with the team and I was like, I'm just proud of these student athletes for using their voice in the general sense because I don't think student athletes do that when they can and they should. and I had, you know, someone called me and say, hey, you know, just as a reporter, you probably shouldn't be posting pictures like that and da-da-da-da. And in my mind, I thought, if I would have posted a picture with the entire women's volleyball

team and they were making a stance for sexual harassment or injustice on their campus, no one would have called me. But because it is racially charged, it becomes this other conversation that people aren't comfortable with, and I can't be a part of that conversation. And I also feel that when I'm not saying anything, you know, the black community is like, oh, well, she's someone who doesn't care about the injustices that African Americans or minorities are facing because she's not speaking about it and using her platform for it. So there's just like this constant battle that's going on internally with me, but not just inside me. It's like the society is going on with this internal battle or whatever. So just trying to find other unique ways and outlets to be for everything, like be every part of it.

of me and let that be okay in this world. Like, how do I find my space where every part of me is accepted? That's what I'm searching for. Man, that is so tough. I'm really glad that we've had this talk, Maria, because I feel like I've learned a lot on a number of different levels from career building to what it's like to be you. You know, I think there's a lot of, there's so much depth there that I had high expectations, you know but I think you just killed it and so I'm so appreciative of you investing some of your time

with me here today and I'd love if you'd be up for it to continue the dialogue and maybe keep recording as we both progress I think it would be a lot of fun and certainly insightful and enlightening for me absolutely Ryan thank you so much for having me on and just know that this is a great space like I love that I'm even able to have this conversation with you because if it helps one person or it just helps me being able to express it, then it's all worth it. Definitely. Where would you send my listeners to learn more about you online? Sure.

I'm at Maria Taylor 7 on Twitter and Instagram. I also have a website. I try to blog to maria taylorTV.com. And if you want to learn more about The Winning Edge, visit the Winning Edge Leadership. Perfect. Well, like I said, I want to continue this dialogue. I'm fascinated by your work. I love your work and you do.

You're just really, really talented. And I can tell it probably comes from a lot of preparation and a lot of reps. That's how we get good at something, I think, and saying yes when they ask. So thanks again for being here. I love the message, and I look forward to the next one. All right. Thanks, Ryan. Wow, what an enlightening conversation.

I love having those with people that help share a different perspective from my own. That's how we learn. And Maria, it was so cool. We even talked a little bit afterwards. and went deeper on that. I should have recorded, but maybe for the next one. So I want to thank Maria for being here.

And thank you for listening. If you enjoyed it, I'd love it if you would write the review, rate the show, and subscribe in iTunes Apple Podcasts. That's write a review, rate the show, and subscribe in iTunes Apple Podcasts to spread the message to others. Thank you so much for being here. I absolutely love doing this.

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