The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk - 295: Todd Herman - Using Alter Egos To Transform Your Life

Episode Date: January 28, 2019

The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk #295: Todd Herman - Using Alter Egos To Transform Your Life To read the full show notes, go to www.LearningLeader.com Notes: Commonalities of sustaining excellence: "Negative capability" (John Keats term) The ability to pursue your dream despite the fact that circumstance tells you it won't happen. Not losing faith despite the long odds Mental toughness - "The ability to be flexible & adaptable despite what the world is throwing at you." The OPP framework for goal setting: Outcome Performance - Resources Process - Who, what, when, where What Todd does? He's on a mission to give people smart thinking models.  He helps ambitious people. Revenue generation: He's built programs and systems and licensed it to sports teams He does sport science and peak performance coaching Grew up doing speaking competitions. Did 68 speeches in 90 days.  All for free.  Have to "get the reps" "This is how I know I've made it... I loved doing a free speech for four people.  I loved it!" "You must show up.  Continue to show up no matter what.  Even if nobody is there, show up anyway." "The answers are never waiting for you to sit still. The answers are out there doing it.  It's action that matters." How Todd developed strong mental toughness? Rough upbringing -- He was sexually abused at a church camp when he was 12 He retreated and developed mental toughness to deal with it Skills developed as an athlete that translated to life outside of sports: Preparation Routines Visualization/Imagery Why are alter-egos so powerful? They help you get into flow state and not get out of your head The Bo Jackson story -- "Bo Jackson never played a down of football.  It was Jason from Friday The 13th.  I was crazy out there."

If there's something that's skeptical, here's what I want to remind you of. You've already done this. You've already done it. Here's how I know. Because an alter ego secret identity is a part of the human condition. Every single child at some point in time pretended to be Superman or superwoman or Wonder Woman nowadays or it could have been a nurse or fireman or and everyone played those characters as kids. And then we start to be shaped by society to tell us to grow up and, you know, act your age. and we interpret that those games that we played are immature.

And yet that is a sign of the most mature self that you can is to leverage the skill and the genius that we're gifted with because it's truly one of the few things that makes us unique on this planet. If you have a business or you know someone who does, you probably know that small business owners wear a lot of hats. And some of those hats are totally great, but some like filing taxes and running payroll, for example, not so great. that's where Gusto comes in.

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Try a demo and see for yourself at gusto.com slash leader. That's G-U-S-T-O.com slash Leader. Welcome to the Learning Leader Show. I am Ryan Hawk. Thank you so much for being here. It is Mindful Monday. Text learners to 4-4-2-2-2-2-2. in order to join tens of thousands of learning leaders from all over the world.

Texts, learners to 44222. Now on to the night's featured leader. It's a big one. It's a big one. It's Todd Herman, bestselling author, coach, and entrepreneur. His training company has specialized for 22 years in mental toughness and peak performance. Strategies proven to work. He's worked with more than 100 Olympians, pro athletes, entertainers, and lead.

in business. His latest book is titled The Alter Ego Effect, the Power of Secret Identities to Transform Your Life. Few of the topics we got into. Todd defines what an alter ego is and how having one will benefit you. Yes, even for those who are already skeptical, I promise you want to listen. Then Todd describes the scripting technique, how to do this and why you should. then the OPP framework for goal setting and how this has been so helpful for professionals from all over the world. Ladies and gentlemen, it's Todd Herman. All right, Todd Herman, welcome to the Learning Leader Show, man. Happy to have you.

It's a pleasure, Ryan. Thank you for having me. I think we're like long-lost cousins, as our mutual friend Dan Martel said to me recently because we have so many people in common and it was bound to happen that they would all make sure that we got introduced. So it's cool that we're actually finally making this happen, man. There is a family slash chosen friend tree that we are, yeah, we're definitely coming from an epicenter of somewhere. I love it. I love it.

So to get us rolling, Todd, long time listeners know I am fascinated by leaders who sustain excellence. And you have spent a huge portion of your life surrounded by and helping leaders who sustain excellence. I'm curious from your perspective, what have you found to be the commonalities among those people? One is, I go to it right away and I talk to my pro clients. I work with a lot of pro athletes, Olympic athletes and leaders in all sort of public platforms. And one of them I go to all the time is the negative capability. Negative capability is this term that John Keats characterized or phrased back in the early 1800s. And it's this ability to continue to pursue your dream,

despite the fact that the circumstances and situation that you're in right now tells you that it's not going to happen. Right? It's like Walt Disney was someone who had phenomenal negative capability. He had everybody tell him that his ideas were unrealistic, it couldn't happen. And yet he used that as confirmation that, oh, I should absolutely continue to move forward on this because everyone thinks it's wrong almost. And so, you know, with an athlete, when there's two minutes left in the game and you're down three goals, if it's the NHL or you're down a couple of touchdowns in a football game, still do not lose faith that they can still make it happen. That is a big one. And I say it's a quality of leaders because people are so drawn to that like a moth to a flame. Because it's just, that's not the experience that many people have. And so when they get around someone who's like that, it brings people in. this optimism, this belief that regardless of the adversity in front of us, we will find a way.

Yeah, absolutely. What about, go ahead. Yeah, no. And so, I mean, that's, that's one of the ones that comes top of mind right away. And it's, because it's the thing that I, with some of the diagnostics that we use, it's the thing that I'm looking for is how much support am I going to have to give someone emotionally or just as a coach for people that's going to help keep, help them keep moving forward. What about those, Todd, right now who are listening that have started some sort of a business? It may be a side hustle. We have a lot of people who do that.

And there are actually times when you should quit, when you should stop. How to know the difference between this negative capability of, I need to keep going. I need to keep going. I got knocked down. I got knocked down. But I got to get up. I got to get up. The difference between doing that first saying, you know what, maybe this is not the right business.

or this is not the right thing for me, I need to do something different. How do you, I think that would be tough to know the difference. Yeah, no. So this goes back to, I mean, I get asked the question because I've been doing mental toughness training and coaching for 20 plus years here. And I always go to, okay, well, most people don't have a definition of what mental toughness actually means. And so mental toughness is not about the guy who can, you know, it's that square jaw look

that some people think of when it comes to toughness. Really, mental toughness is your ability. to be flexible and adaptable despite what the world is throwing at you or the circumstances you're in. So flexibility, adaptability, agility are all the qualities of someone who's mentally tough or a leader, if you want to put it that way. Right. And so, yes, maybe the way that you're going about starting a business isn't working out. That's okay. I mean, you can quit on that. but what we're not quitting on is the ultimate dreamer goal. I talk about in the context of, you know, when we're working with people,

the system that we use to work with people is I use this kind of framework called an OPP framework. And if you think of it like a mountain at the very top of the mountain, if it's a pyramid shape, there's this space at the top where the O sits and it's the outcome. It's the flag at the top of the mountain. It's the thing that we're trying to strive towards and achieve. Right. I'm not saying give up on your business. or give up on a business, maybe just the way or the business that you're trying to get into

doesn't work. Doesn't mean you've got to quit on the ultimate dream of being an entrepreneur. But then below that is the performance level, which is typically where our resources and our strategy sit. So our strategy needs to be flexible and adaptable. And at the very bottom, the process, the how, the who, the what, the when, and the where, that can be flexible as well and adaptable and be agile there. But still, don't give up on whatever that fundamental goal is.

So if you're going to be quitting on something, don't think that that was the outcome that you're quitting on. Chunk it up a level. What were you ultimately trying to strive and achieve and continue to go after that? So you mentioned briefly taught about what you do and what you've done for 20 plus years. I'll ask you the dinner party question. You're there. Let's assume that people do not know you. It's a friend of a friend of a friend and they don't know you.

They just see you there and they see this good looking guy with his glasses on and his pocket square. And they say, hey, Todd, what do you do? Then what do you, what do you say? That is like always a question that can trip me up. And I even talk about it. I've been on my About page where I say to people, you know, I get that you're coming here to put me in a box so that you can figure out who I am and what I do. But at the end of the day, like what I'm on a, I'm on a mission personally to give people smart. thinking models to help them achieve whatever it is that they're trying to strive towards

and achieve. I help ambitious people, period. I like that. Have you workshop that with Clay A Bear by chance? Clay's a good friend. Clay would probably find an even more eloquent way of saying it, and we've probably gone back and forth on this many times. But I always go back to, yeah, I just, I'm fascinated with, if I'm going to spend, you know, we all only have a limited amount of time in our days. And if I'm going to be giving up some of my time on my calendar, I want to be hanging around people like you. I want to be talking to people who are ambitious, who are excited about the things that they're doing, or even people who are struggling right now, but they're still ambitious. Like, absolutely. What I won't put up with is people who have given up

or they want to settle for the status quo or whatever, because I mean, I've been through some pretty tough stuff in my life and I still found a way to keep on going. even though it felt like many times I was operating with the emergency break pulled up with the, you know, foot floored to the pedal and, you know, maybe sometimes not going as fast as I wanted to, but I wasn't going to give up on this idea of who I am at my core. That sounds like a cool profession. And the practical follow-up to that, Todd, is, okay, but how do you make money? So what are the ways that you've been able to create a business and make money doing this, helping ambitious people?

Yeah. So it's really funny. And I don't think I've talked to you about this. But when people look at my sports business, they would think that I am a coaching and training company because I've built out programs and systems. And I've licensed them to training organizations around the world. That was kind of my go. What evolved into one of my go-toes was actually licensing my training. So whether it's the German Soccer Federation or the Danish Olympic team or.

whoever, South African Springboks, on the sports side of things, but the real part of my business, the stuff that sits below the surface that people would know is, I actually, we do a lot of sports science and performance studies around the world. And then I have all of this data on how elite performers think or people at the collegiate level, and we have it broken out. And then I take that data and we sell that information to large consumer companies around the world, Gatorade, Nike, so that they can use it to help understand their clients better so they can craft better marketing and advertising. That's actually one of the larger revenue generators in the business, is that. So I'm fascinated, and it's a great question that you ask, because I'm fascinated

with business models and how you can kind of create one that makes it really difficult for other people to copy or penetrate. And that's kind of the one thing that I've cracked the nut on is the licensing side of things and then also selling the data and information. to other people. That's really interesting. I think then the natural thought, at least for me, is how does one get started? What was it like? Can you take us back?

Yeah. And I don't know exactly when the beginning was for you, but take us back to the to the initial part as far as the, and maybe describe a little bit of the work that went into it because I think now, when people look you up, they'll say, wow, this, this looks like this guy lives an incredible life. this is awesome. He's lucky. He's lucky. Yeah. From knowing some of your story, I know that's not fully the case. Can you take us to the beginning

and the origins of how this got started? Sure. So I live here in New York City, the concrete jungle, the kind of center of ambition on the planet, which I love. It's a hard charging place and you meet tons of extremely interesting people here. But I grew up on a huge farm and ranch in Western Canada outside of Calgary, Alberta, literally the middle of nowhere, our nearest neighbor was about two and a half miles away from us. And I always felt like, you know, I'm extraordinarily grateful for that life that I got, especially because I was surrounded by parents who instilled really great character traits that are going to help you succeed. But I always wanted to be someplace around

many, many people. But anyone who knows the kind of farming community, we grew up doing 4-H. And that's like agricultural boy scouts to anyone who doesn't know what that means. means. And a part of 4-H is you've got to do speeches. There's speaking competitions. So I grew up at a young age kind of doing these speaking competitions and being around parents who held different public office and whatnot. So when I started my business in 1997, which was a initially I had won an award up in Canada for like a hospitality manager of the year. And I'd run a successful division of a restaurant and won an award. And I started helping other people. People started asking me, well, hey, can you help me with my restaurant? So I started a hospitality. That's one of my first loves. I love hospitality. But then quickly, on the side, I was also coaching high school football. And I was a college football player. I was a nationally ranked badminton player growing up as well. So I was a good athlete like you guys. And I started getting asked by people about mentoring their sons and daughters on the mental game because that was really my strength. I'm not a physically gifted person. I'm not six foot four and 240 pounds or something like that. And I was doing some little workshops with people for free on the mental game because I just loved it. I mean,

and you and I love sport. I always wanted to stay connected to it. And I started getting questioned by parents around helping their kids. And so I was like, yeah, sure, I can help. And they're like, well, how much would you charge? And I was like, $75 for three sessions, which I immediately basically put myself into poverty mode when I did that. Plus, they were in-home sessions. And I'll be frank, I actually stuck with that pricing for three years, I think it was.

I did that for. and had a ton of client. So again, to back it up, so people really understand how it all started. So I did that. And I was like, okay, well, is this even a business like mental game coach? Because I didn't have a mental game coach. I was good at it and I was good at teaching people because I was, you know, passionate about, you know, the sports or sport period.

And I'm like, is this really a thing? And so I was like, well, how can I actually figure out if this is like a gig? and I was like, well, the only thing I know how to do is speak. So I thought, okay, well, I'm going to put a timeline on myself of 90 days to validate this thing. And if not, I'm going to move on to something else that's kind of make me more of an income. And I did 68 speeches in 90 days for free around the province of Alberta. And I know the natural question is, well, people go, 68. How the heck did you get 68 speeches?

Well, this is actually how I did it. So I knew that there was two people in Edmonton, Alberta, where I lived at the time. that would bring me in to do a free workshop because a free is a great word in the sound of anyone who has a budget. And so I called them up and I booked those two talks. They happened within the first 11 days of that phone call. And one thing I asked though was I'll come in and do them free, but only if at least one of the parents of the kids in attendance will be there because I knew that kids don't have the wallet and the parents needed to be there because a kid going home excited about what you just had to say is going to do a terrible job of selling.

you to their parents. So that's what I did. And at the end of the talk, I did something that was smart in the end, which was, you know, hey, I know a lot of your parents that are here tonight. And again, what I talked about with people was the triune athlete, the mentally, emotionally, and physically tough athlete that when you align those three draws and pulls out all of their capabilities on the field so that they actually perform to their capabilities. Plus, it develops leaders that go beyond the field. And that's what we need more of in the world. You know, very long subheadline, but it worked. And so I got to the end of the talk and I said, listen, I know you a lot of your parents are here tonight. You probably have other sons and daughters that aren't in

attendance. And I just want to let you know that I'm doing these talks for free until June the 6th. So that was like 68 days from there or 45, whatever was. And so if you'd like me to come out and talk to them, just come up to me after. And I'd love to talk to you and get your information so I can, you know, set something up. And that's what I did. And it was exactly the same number almost every single time. One third of the audience would come up afterwards and say, hey, can you come and talk to my daughter's swim team or can you come talk to my son's soccer association? And I'd always say, hey, the bigger the group, the better for me. And, you know, did it work out that way? No. I mean, the third talk that I did when I drag my crappy little office depot flip chart in was to a sweaty

hockey locker room that had just finished. There were 12-year-old kids. They had just finished a hockey game and 13 of the kids left and four stuck around for me. And so I was in there. And honestly, Ryan, my thought when I was up at the front was, this is how I know I've made it. What? This is how I know I've made it. I've made it because I am here and I'm excited to talk to four people even though 13 are walking out. Like I didn't get caught up with the fact that 13 people walked out on me and didn't want to stick around and be interested in, you know, learning more what the mental game. I'm like, if I can, if I finish this just as excited, I know I can do this for 10,000 people as well. And you mean, you know you made it because you felt this. Yeah.

Excitment level of being there for four people. Yeah, 100%. I'm like, because, and plus I was like, I can't wait to tell the story of the day 13 people walked out on me and four stuck around. You thought about that. What you thought? You thought about that. What you thought about that back then years and years ago to this day saying total out of body total out of body experience for me and i mean even telling it now i get chills about it and what's great about that is that you know fast forward to just last year one of my programs that i have that's um online i had a lady in that who is literally just starting out her business she was over in uh germany and she heard me tell the story on a on the previous week's support call that i you know i take questions from

other people. And she had a workshop that no one had signed up for yet. She showed up for it. Zero people came to it. And she took a photo of herself at the workshop, posted it up on her social channels and said, excited about my workshop tonight, even though nobody showed up. And she came into the group and said, hey, guys, I didn't have anyone show up for my workshop, but I took the photo. I showed up anyway, because that's what Todd says is you show up anyway. And what was amazing about that was just beyond the fact that she showed up and she did it. But more than that, when she posted on her social channels, she had 15 people reach out to her and say, hey, I had no idea that you're doing workshops. Can I come to your next one? And I'm like, that's exactly how it happens. And so getting back to

those people who might be just starting out or they're looking at starting something new, here is what I always try to encourage people with. It's that the answers are never waiting for you while you're sitting at your desk, trying to plan it out perfectly. You're answers lie on the field of play by getting out there and taking action. Just stay true to the spirit of why you're doing that. Like I loved working with athletes. I loved the topic knowing that fully well, if I could help someone trust themselves more as a hockey player or trust their skills more or trust their preparation or whatever the case is, that's going to help them incrementally be better on the ice, which if that happens, who knows the dominoes will, that will drop for them because of that.

And so, you know, just to encourage other people is that it's the action that matters for you. And not so much planning things out perfectly because it just doesn't work that way. Why are you, I guess, and why were you at the time worthy of even being on a small stage or worthy of sharing what you know, or I guess the more blunt way of saying is, who do you think you are to be the guy to share this mental game stuff? Why are you an expert or a master when it comes to the mental game? Yeah, well, you know, A, I wasn't going out there and saying I'm working with pro athletes and Olympic athletes. I was someone that developed a really strong mental game because I needed it for survival purposes. And at a young age, I had some terrible stuff happened to me at the age of 12. I was sexually abused at a church camp. And it, you know,

tore me up mentally pretty badly. You know, still took many, many, many, many years of overcoming that. But I retreated into developing some mental toughness skills that I needed to just to survive. And then what I ended up finding through that was that it actually made me better as an athlete because sport for me was my salvation. It was the place where I would retreat to and, you know, be free of whatever those kind of demons were that were haunting me. And then when I got done playing at the college level, I sort of just discovered that these kids were, that were good already, were trying to layer on even more and more

work time. And I'm like, no, you don't need to work harder. You're already working hard. That's not an issue for you. You just don't have good preparation skills. You don't have good routines that you lean on. You don't use visualization and imagery skills as well as you should. And I would just teach them some of these things. And so it was out of practical experience. Plus, I was always devouring more and more stuff. But to your point, when I started that business, I was very insecure about how young I looked. I mean, it looked like I was 12 years old. And, you know, I've got a book that's coming out called the alter ego effect, which goes into, well, A, just the science of why alter egos and secret identities are so powerful, the history of them. And like I said, the science behind them,

but also it's what I used. I used it when I played football. And that moment when I was feeling so insecure, I remember back to when I was, you know, a young person growing up in my small little farming community that the smartest kid in my class, Mark, he had glasses. And in my sister's grade, the one below me, the smartest kid in that class, James, he had glasses. So at a very young age, you would, you just develop these beliefs that whether they're true or not, that's your lens on the world. And so I just had this belief that, oh, people who are glasses are smart. So I was like, wait a second, why don't I create an alter ego for myself to allow me to really move past all this resistance that I have around whether or not I'm old enough or smart enough or have

enough degrees to help people because it's stopping me from serving them. And so I went out to Lens Crafters in West Edmonton Mall, which was at the time, the largest mall in the world, and bought a pair of non-prescription glasses so that I could step into my, I called it my reverse Superman. Superman took off his glasses or put on glasses to become Clark Kent. I put on my glasses to become my Superman version of myself in business so that I could get out of my own way and step onto that field and do what I want to do. And in your book, The Alter Ego Effect, the power of secret identities to transform your life. I think there's a few key points I really want to talk about, but you tell a story that I think is worth, we're not going to go through the entire book,

You tell a story that is worth sharing here in audio format, in addition to everyone getting the book, that I'd love for you to discuss specifically when it comes to a guy that most people listening probably know named Bo Jackson and your time backstage with Bo before you were about to go on stage. I'll tee it up and then let you hit it. But I found that story to be really interesting and I was actually quite surprised. Yeah. So, I mean, so one of the things that people automatically, well, not automatically, some people do. do. Actually, the majority of people don't concern themselves too much with, you know, whether or not an alter ego is authentic or whether it's you faking it. And actually, that's a completely different way than what we're talking about the purpose of an alter ego is anyways. But this is a good

example of how an alter ego actually brings out your actual, what I call your heroic self. And so Bo Jackson and I, so I'm backstage at this event in Georgia, waiting to go on. And I'm in a green room, which if anyone has ever spoken before, really a greener. room is typically a crappy janitor's closet or some some some some some some random room or it's right back stage with nothing that's uh that's overly sexy but uh so i standing there kind of you know thinking about my my talk and in comes comes through the door this absolute physical specimen which is bow jackson and i'm like in my head i thought oh my god that's the guy that i played on tecmo bowl on nintendo a million times when i was a kid and he strolled right over to me and he said hi i'm

Bo Jackson and I said, yeah, I know who you are. I'd be a terrible person in sport if I didn't know who the one of the greatest athletes of all time was. And I said, nice to meet you. And then I had said, you know, I played you a lot on Nintendo. And he laughed and said, well, you're not the first one to say that. And he said, so what are you going to be talking about with the kids today? And I, or with the coaches and the kids today. And I said, well, I'm going to talk to them about, you know, really mental game strategies to compete and win. But specifically one that I'm going to talk to mode is using an alter ego or a secret identity to really untap their capability. And he kind of cocked his head to the side and squinted and he said, you know, Bo Jackson never played it down

to football his entire life. And I was like, okay, interesting. Tommy Moore. And he said, well, anyone who knows my backstory knows that when I was a youngster growing up, I was a really angry person and had a tough time controlling my emotions. And it would get me in trouble on the football field, you know, taking penalties and not being all that coachable. And so, one night I was watching a movie and I saw this character come on the screen that was just cold, calculating, methodical. And I thought to myself, wait a second, why don't I take that onto the football field so I can actually finish a game and not get into trouble. And that character that he saw was Jason from Friday the 13th. And that's what he did. When he went on the field, that's who he was

embodying to allow those skills that he actually had to flow through him onto the field and not kind of pull that, like I said before, that emergency break where you're kind of fighting your own resistance and stopping you from getting the result that you want. And for him, that's, that's, that's, that was his takeaway from Bojj, from Jason was cold calculating methodical. And that's the kind of great thing about alter egos is it's what's resonant to you about that story and that person. Like you and I can both think of say Yoda. And both of us might think he has some different qualities that, you know, we really like and appreciate. And that's the beautiful part of being a human being is that that internal storytelling mechanism is there as a creative juice that we can use to help us get past, you know, whatever, you know, issues we might have or concerns of imposter syndrome or concerns that were not good enough, not smart enough, not worthy enough.

Even past traumas like I had to go through to help us step outside of that. that narrative and that story and truly get out and do the things that we want to go and do. So, Todd, you briefly brought up at the beginning of that answer of this thought of authenticity. And this is obviously a big buzzword out right now, people being vulnerable and being authentic. That's just on and on and on. And I understand why it's a buzzword because it makes a difference. And so I think if there's anyone who's potentially skeptical right now, and in our pre-call, I even brought this up with you, which you know, who's potentially skeptical right now.

It's their saying, well, wait a second, Todd. I need to be my authentic self when I go up on stage and give that speech. Or I need to be my authentic self when I'm coaching or when I'm playing. And so how does an alter ego work alongside also being truly authentic? Yeah, yeah. So, I mean, first, I think people, we, there needs to be a shared kind of idea as to what authentic means. And authentic at the end of the day is truly kind of a term that or a way of describing it to people that people go, yeah, that sounds right to me, is that when you end your

day and you feel like the way that you operated in your day, the way that you showed up was a true representation of what you have available for people, the capabilities that you have, right? That's truly being authentic. Alter egos have nothing to do with you faking it on the outside. Really, the power of this, and this is what I talk about in the book, and why many people have gotten this wrong for so long. And again, I'm talking like there are hundreds and thousands and tens of thousands of people that have used alter egos throughout history. And some of them extremely famous that most people here would never have guessed, would have used one, have struggled with their own internal mental game, right and then they've tapped into this idea of an alter ego to go you know what i'm going to

circumvent those issues by tapping into some other characteristics and superpowers or traits that allows me to bring my myself onto the field and so you ending the day by going i left it all out there and whether or not you used an alter ego or whether or not you didn't it doesn't it doesn't matter to the world around you whether or not all of your skills showed up because of you leveraging an alter ego. That wasn't you being fake. That was actually being the most real you that you could possibly be. And in fact, the first person to ever mention alter egos was Cicero back in 44 BC. And the real definition of a alter ego is the other I or a trusted friend. And what's important about that is Cicero, who to this day is one of the most famous Roman philosophers

and statesman. He wrote that. a year before he passed away. So he wrote that at the peak of his wisdom, where someone who had been through life's journey and got to the point and finally kind of codified it. And same thing with myself where I used it and I didn't ever feel like I was being fake. I was actually trying to tap into the most real me that I wanted to be. I was just leveraging some other idea or someone else's idea to make that happen. And so it's it's not about, I mean, authenticity, you know, we get that off of, we get that kind of inauthentic feel when we feel like someone is just faking it to impress you. If you're doing anything in life because of the circumstance or the

people that you're around, you're trying to impress them, then that's definitely being inauthentic. This is an inside out approach. It's you deciding who and what is. going to show up on that field so that it gives you the best chance to make an impact, whether that's a football field, you know, the boardroom or the stage or the end of a sales call with someone. That's what matters. This really, I just thought of this. I didn't bring it up on our pre-call, but I'm glad you kind of went deep there for a second. Todd, I'll tell you, and I want you to maybe just give me your thoughts on this. So throughout my time speaking on stage, I have like a healthy dose of productive paranoia before every time I go up, right? Regardless

if there's five people or five thousand, it doesn't matter. And I remember I called my dad, I'm lucky my dad's one of the greatest public speakers I've ever seen, one of the greatest leaders I've ever, I've ever known. He's, he's the best. I called him one time after one of those moments. And actually the speech went well, but, you know, I think it could have been better. This was, this was years ago. And I said, I was explaining this to him. And he said, here's the thing. And my dad's probably the most humble person I know as well. And I think he's still, that in all and us kids too. He said though, there's one time though in your life when I feel like you don't really need to be humble. And I said, what do you mean? He goes, when you're about to

step on that stage to put on the performance of your life, to wow those people to help them, to serve them, he goes, at that moment, this is when you say, I am the baddest dude on the planet. He goes, literally I would say that to yourself. He goes, I say that to myself. I am the badest meaning I'm the man. Like in this, and he goes, he doesn't, he goes, I don't do it at any other time or any other moment. But right before I'm going up there to try to wow everybody and to help them and to really pour into them, I'm the baddest dude on the planet, man.

And I'm going to go make it happen. And I thought that's, this to me feels a little bit like what you're talking about. Yeah, 100%. Well, it's, it's, it's really funny because my, I have this kind of, I've got this big issue with the kind of personal development leadership world. And that's because, you know, I've worked with people for over 16,000 hours, Ryan, one on one. I'm not writing a book because I started my business last year and I'm trying to position myself as an authority so I can, you know, bring in more clients. I don't need more clients.

And so I know what really elite people in business and sport truly are doing in order to succeed. and and here is what they're not doing mostly. They're not doing what's inside of most self-help person involvement in leadership books because most people that write those books are researchers or they're regurgitating stuff that's been written out before, right? And that bothers me because it's sending people down a pathway of being average. Here is the true reality of people who sit at the very top of, say, athletics. their internal dialogue sounds like this.

It pisses me off that these people are even stepping on the field to compete with me because they're not even worthy of the same grass. It is such a mega super ego that they have. Now, again, just like your dad just said, that was internal to himself. He's not going to go into a press conference and say that, right? And that's what people need to understand is most of the stuff that's being, taught makes you sound great to other people, but it truly doesn't help you operate and win. That's a problem. And so I'm like, I'm peeling back the curtain. And it's Ryan, like I went

through that you, you know the whole publishing cycle here in New York City. We had 19 publishers interested in this book, which is if people don't know, an insane amount of publishers. And I'm not saying that because, again, I didn't invent alter egos gang. They've been around for millennia. I just simply codified a process in order to help athletes use them and executives and leaders to win. And so that's important. Anytime anybody is trying to seek out and get help from someone, ask yourself this. Is this person a practitioner or are they a researcher? Because researchers still, they can't crack the final nut because they haven't worked with people on the field of play and made their principles that they think are great being taken action on

or applied. What, um, I'm with you. I think that the actually putting it into play, putting into action. So most of the people listening to Todd are not professional athletes simply because that's just math. Um, most people are not professional athletes. And so they're working in perhaps, uh, I always like to paint an avatar because I think it makes it more real.

And I know it doesn't apply to everybody. but it does apply to a lot of people based upon the emails that I get. People that are either striving to be in a leadership role within a big business or they already are and they want to keep striving for more. That's the avatar painting of the average person who is listening, right? They're ambitious. They're growth oriented, more affluent. They're the type of people we like to be around. I'm very proud of them.

So how does the alter ego effect work for somebody like that? They don't play sports or if anything they play, you know, rec center basketball. They don't play this. So they're not athletes. So how do we translate this from the athletic world to someone who maybe is a manager who has 14 direct reports? They have a spouse and three kids, a house payment and two cars. Like how does it, that person that's listening right now that's driving to work, how does this apply to them? Sure.

So we all have these fields of play that we stand on. stages of life, right? We all understand that, you know, who I am at work and then who I am when I'm home with my three little kids here in New York City is a different self that's showing up, just different parts of my personality. The last thing, so going back to who I was when I first started in, when I was insecure and when I went and bought those non-prescription glasses, well, those glasses represented the qualities that I wanted to be in my role as a business owner or a coach and a trainer, which was I wanted to be confident, I wanted to be decisive, and I wanted to be articulate. Because when I take a look at the people who were in my world, those were the three qualities

that I saw that they had. They were decisive. They were confident and they were articulate, which was the three opposite that I had and was displaying at the time. I was not confident because I was insecure about my age. I was not decisive. I was terribly indecisive. and I was not the most articulate. I would say, you know, 400 words when 20 words would have done it. And so, but that's the last thing that my kids need. My kids don't need a confident, articulate, and decisive guy to come home to or to come back home with those qualities.

I needed to be, they want someone who's fun and playful. And so when I walk through the threshold of into our house or our apartment here in New York, there's a small little wrist bracelet that my daughter made for me. several years ago, and it had MS and C on it, the initials of Molly, Sophie, and Charlie, my three kids. And I leave it on a little hook at the front door. When I walk through, I always put that back on as just a reminder of who is meant to show up on this field so that I can perform to my best for them, right? And I just keep it in the context of performance because that's literally what we're always doing, right? We're acting and we're behaving in certain ways. And that creates a

performance. That creates results for ourselves. And so that's what I'm embodying. And then as an Well, who embodies that the best? Who is just incredible at, you know, being around children and raising them up to be confident? Well, Mr. Rogers. And so Mr. Rogers was, is the influence for that kind of self that shows up there. If I can be more like that, even if it's not all the time, if it's 10% more than I normally would have, then that's a huge win. And so there are moments of what there's what I call moments of impact that we all have. Critical points in, the important parts of our life. So if it's in business, it could be, you know, if you're really good at putting together a presentation and moving people along to get them to really appreciate the product that you have, but then when it comes time for you to ask for the sale or, you know, get them to put pen to paper, whatever the case is,

you kind of, you justify by saying, you know what, I'm the type of person who doesn't push people. I'm the type of person who just lets them come to the decision. I've got, we've got an amazing stuff and they've got to appreciate it. Well, really, based on how the top performers operate, that's not how they operate. When they find someone who needs what they have, they will not let them go until they have done business with them. That's how I feel. If I find someone that absolutely I can help, like I'm a pit bull on a bone.

Like, I'm not letting you go. Because I know that there's a lot of other reasons why someone won't take action, and it's not going to be because of money. some people are scared of change some people are just uncertain about whether or not they can actually have the same results as some of your other people so that's a moment of impact and so maybe the current self that's showing up isn't the best version of you well who could who could be your superman or you know many people use animals a grizzly bear or wolverine i've got a client here in new york city who's an extremely wealthy um fund manager and his alter ego is actually his grandmother.

Came from Europe after World War II. Her husband died during World War II, had four children that she brought over with herself, came over to classic rags to riches of $75 in her purse, raised her kids in the Lower East Side of Manhattan, and all four of them, extremely successful. Two of them, doctors, one of them is in banking, and the other one, or real estate,

and the other one is a professor at a major university, university. And this is, and my client is one of their sons. So extremely successful family. And when he thinks of those moments, because he was really struggling with leadership, kind of being a little bit more of a tyrant. And while his, his Nana definitely ruled with an iron ladle, he called it, she was, she was soft and tender as well. Now, he wanted to embody some of that, that toughness, but then also being empathetic. And anytime he's up against a challenging moment with his reports where he knows his default mode would be to come unglued, he has a frame of his grandmother sitting on his desk. And all he does is he has a slight little twist. He just twists that frame a little bit more towards himself, which we call activating the heroic self or activating your alter ego.

And that's who is showing up with him in that moment to keep him on it. to the person he most wants to be, right? We're all working on ourselves. And there's a great quote by Silver Age screen actor, Carrie Grant, where he says, you know, I became Carrie Grant or I pretended to be Carrie Grant or became Carrie Grant, but at some point in time, the two merged. A lot of people know the story of Beyonce and Sasha Fierce, how Beyonce's character on stage was Sasha Fierce when she would go and perform.

And she needed Sasha Fierce because she grew up in a gospel family singing church hymns. And now she's asked to go out in a young teenage group to sing provocative lyrics, wearing provocative clothes. That was something that was very unlike herself. And yet she's in the creative arts. And so she wanted to explore this side. And so she used Sasha Fierce as a way to get past that resistance. And so it's so easy for people to maybe dismiss the idea because of, well, It makes sense for an entertainer, like for Beyonce or David Bowie to become Siggy Stardust or an athlete to, you know, step onto the field as, you know, Jay Ajay, the current running back for the Philadelphia Eagles are now injured, but is Jay, Jay the train Ajai. His alter ego is the train. That's who he just wants, he wants to carry the team. Same thing as Jerome the best, the bus bett us. Like when Jerome Bettis, his alter ego was the bus because he wanted that responsibility of carrying the team. And a bus just came.

keeps ongoing and steam rolls over people. You know, you got, and you're one-on-one coaching with, with people that are executives, fund managers, athletes. Is this,

is this a big part that you're like from the very, from the jump? I even thought of, I don't know if it's possible and this may be a huge mistake, but is it possible for us to even live riff as, as if I'm one of your clients. Yeah. In a three and a half minute session or something like that.

But I'm just curious to hear like, what does it sound like? What does it feel like? Take us inside. We don't have to do it with me. or we could. But I'm just wondering, like, what does it sound like to, so that, because I still think there are skeptics here, Todd, because I try to, I try to, I'm a realist, I'm an optimist. I personally, I'm really getting into this, but I know there are people who don't. And I, and I know

you, sometimes, maybe it's just not for everyone, but I, I, I, I, I still want to go here. So, what does it sound like when we're, when you're having one of these sessions with these, these types of people? Sure. So, um, it's, I always talk about, how truth or building an alter ego is like the center of town. There's many streets and avenues and ways to get there. And so for me, it's a feel process in the book. The entire system is there. And even I say to people in chapter number four when you get to it that, listen, this is like a choose your own adventure type book after this after chapter three. Because if you're interested in, you know, how totems and artifacts work, like the things that we use to activate an alter ego,

then skip to chapter 14 or if you're interested in understanding, you know, the importance of, you know, naming the enemy so that we can bring form and substance to the thing that, you know, is oftentimes the one that stops us. Then go to chapter eight and read that. And so for me, it's, okay, so what is it, what do you want, Ryan, more than, more than anything that right now you feel like there would be some friction in making that happen? like what's that ideal like what's that ideal or extraordinary world looking like for you or what characteristics do you want to be showing up more like or with I think I think more it's taking what I've learned and gathered and synthesized and sharing it with others so that it can be impactful for them okay and so is there anything that's stopping you right now from doing that

Like when you think of how you're operating in your day. Well, it's funny. You know, I don't know. Maybe we can just build upon what, because I told you the advice that from my dad. And I really do that now. So I was in Lake Tahoe recently. And I was in the room and I, I always get there early to kind of hear the session before me or the speaker or whoever it is. Sometimes it's someone within the company, sometimes on this case, it was somebody within the company.

And I looked around. I heard there kind of, it was an engaging session where they're kind of group discussion. There was a facilitator and a leader. And my wife had me with me and I looked and I remember looking at her and I said, these people are really smart. Like this is this, this group is super impressive. Um, which, which is great. You know, I felt honored to be there and to be delivering my message there after this, this speaker.

But I had to remember then, all right, but you're here for a reason and you are the baddest dude in this room and had to literally write that down, say it to myself, get kind of hyped up and ready to go. like I would before a game. Like I would mean, I'm the best player on the field. And I'd say that before every game. And I knew it. And sometimes it proved to be true.

And I think that. And so I have some of that. So I don't know if like what you'd say would build upon that or knowing that kind of background to say, okay, all right, well, how do we maintain that or how do we make that even better? Yeah. So are there, when you think of the, why you said that there's really, really smart people in the room, what were the qualities of those people?

you thought made them so smart. I thought they asked really great questions, and then they also had answers to those questions, and then that those spurred more questions and more dialogue. And they're also talking about an industry that I wasn't super familiar with because I don't work in that industry. But it was a leadership team. It wasn't, it was all, it was a group of just leaders, people managers in the room, including the CEO of the company.

So I think that's, I just thought like, these is high level intelligent conversation. Yeah. So curiosity is, it sounds like is a quality that you think is, makes up an amazing, you know, or smart, smart leader. Yes, absolutely. Yeah. And, you know, I, I think that you already embody that. Mm-hmm.

Do you? I do. I do. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Um, are there any qualities or characteristics of people that you really respect already that, you know, um, you think you're like seven tenths of the way there to

developing or is there anything, um, so. So I don't love the introversion and extroversion talk, but I'll bring it up because I absolutely gain energy from being by myself, from not being around other people. And sometimes I think that is a problem. Sometimes I'm envious of those who I feel have that they're absolutely, my wife's this way. I mean, she is the opposite, is super extrovert. It gets huge energy from being around people. It is so good in a room full of people. Not, not, you know, I do that when I'm on the stage and they're kind of looking at me, but, but just like working a room.

She can really work a room where I'm like, where's the one guy I'd find Todd Herman, we'd go in the corner and talk for an hour, right? I'm not going to work the room. So I sometimes I thought, I got to get better at that. I'm just not very good at it. Sure. You know? Okay. So your wife does that well.

Yeah. And when you think of like, what qualities and characteristics is she displaying that's allowing her to do that so well? Very magnetic, energetic, huge constant smile, engaging. You know, people are drawn to her. So I think all of those things. Okay. And again, though, is that something that you want to do? I think it helps her a lot.

I think it helps others who are like that a lot just in life in general. I think so. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Anything else? Like, what are some of the other? So when I think of someone who's like that, then, you know, they're interested.

They're not interesting because they become, someone becomes interesting when they're interested in you. Right. Um, I think anyway. So dynamic is one thing. So I'm just like pulling out like verbs. adjectives that might be used to describe someone or something, some abilities or traits or characteristics that they're displaying. And all I'm doing is I'm trying to find those words.

And then eventually, after having like a list of say three, five or ten of these, then it would be, is there anything that you know that already embodies that possibly? Like is it, we all, well, is there, we all have movies and there's characters. that we really resonate. Like literally thinking of that person, that character. Yeah. Yeah. And so...

Like, what is it for you? What's your... I know you have the glasses and the kind of the Superman thing. Is that it or what is it? Yeah. So for me, it was like a composite of, well, because it's so easy for most people when they think of like an alter ego circuit entity. And especially with the current, you know, media that we have right now where superhero

movies are dominating the box office. And it's so easy for people to go to that. But the reality is oftentimes I say like superheroes are oftentimes the gateway alter ego for most people because they're so easy to go to. But oftentimes as an alter ego for some people develops, they go to something that might be more resonant in their past or a character that they like. I know that a friend of mine, his character, or the character that he likes to embody is Jack Reacher from the Lee Child novels. Yeah, Tom Cruise movies. Yeah, exactly. And really, Tom Cruise did not do Jack Reacher's service because I'm a Jack Reacher fan

and Jack Reacher is about 6'4 and 265 pounds and so. But that's his because he really, A, he loves the idea of acting that way, despite the fact that he doesn't feel like he's built that way. But he really needs, he needed that quality because it was that, that insecurity of worrying so much about what other people think of them because Jack Reacher could care less what anyone thinks of them. Right.

Like if you could, if you can find a way to sum up what that character is and does and thinks or his attitude in like one statement, I mean, that is truly Jack Reacher completely capable of handling himself and does not care about what anyone thinks of them. But is completely driven by fairness and justice.

and which which which which which is important because when you can find at least one or two of those qualities of that of that person or thing that truly do match up perfectly well with who you are now that's where the connect because that's where the connection happens right yeah so so who is this for you who what do you do well so for me like starting out when it was when i was doing my reverse clark kent and uh reverse superman and i put in those glasses i mean the the name that i would use for myself is richard now richard's actually my first name. And I was like, oh, Richard just sounds like a smarter name. It sounds like a very businessy name more so than Todd. But the people that I, or the, the qualities that I was trying to activate from other people, one was Joseph Campbell. I'm a huge Joseph Campbell fan, wrote the book The Heroes Journey, really smart intellectual guy. And I wanted to embody those things with, with the, with the content that I was creating, like really smart stuff. And secondly, was Abraham Lincoln, just as a leader, being able to, like, you know, navigate such complicated, complicated and complex things and get people to agree to things despite the fact that it was, you know,

somehow maybe running counter to their political whims or whatever. And so those were two, two important people that I was bringing to the table. And then the third one was Richard Branson. And this is when Richard Branson was literally just starting out. But I just liked his kind of maverick attitude of just go out there, just do it. And you know, you're coming up with a book much later called Screw It, Let's Do It. And that's what I needed. I needed that because I was over, like even though I wanted to embody the thinker, I was the thing that was killing me.

I wasn't taking enough action. And so I was just creating that. And all those three people broiled up together, became Richard. And that's who I was activating. And now here's the really important thing, too, is that, you know, even when I was playing football. My alter ego is when I was playing football was Walter Payton, Ronnie Lott, because I wanted to play like Ronnie or play like Walter and think like Walter because you was smart on the field on what I hit like Ronnie Lott, who was an amazing defensive player for

the 49ers. And then I'm a huge Native American buff. And I loved the idea of a tribe of warriors just going out onto the field with me. And my ultimately, my alter ego was Geronimo, broiled together amongst all these component parts. But before I put on that helmet, I had this kind of visualization that I went through in my mental movie room in my head where Walter and everyone were coming to the room and Walter would hand me the trading cards that ended up with stuff inside of my equipment. And he would say, you know, here you go. Use these and use us.

But don't for a second. dishonor who we are and how we play by not showing up the exact same way. Wow. And so that was my, and like, damn right, I'm not going to. And so when I went out there, I didn't go out there as Todd. I went out there with this tribe together with me to help me focus. And from just a scientific point of view, it's amazing how much it triggers then the zone and the flow state because what you're doing is you're tapping into your creative imagination

and you're not overthinking things on the field. The same thing can, and same thing, it doesn't, it's not can work. A hundred percent it works for business leaders as well who have those moments of impact, those opportunities where they have these experiences and these moments to make a big impact. Like when you, when you stand on that stage

and you're like, I'm the baddest, I'm the baddest person in the room. Now, baddest person in the room for you might mean that you're the most thoughtful, you're the most inquisitive, you're the most curious, you're the most tactful. You're the most like all that can be.

It's just that you're using the term badass and I'm not going to, I mean, that's why I'm so fascinated with the human mind and how people operate because badass to you is different than badass to me. And I'm not placed any judgment on it. And so for those other people that are out there, it's like, you know, you 100% already know that there are elements of your, your work or your life that you don't feel like you're showing up 100%. instead of trying to change yourself, which is a very, very difficult thing to do. Instead, tapping into a secret identity or alter ego to help morph that allows you to actually deal with the mind in a far more, it's like going in the back door. Because anytime you meet force with force, I mean, that's why change is so hard for people. But people are forgetting that everyone here that feels like there's, if anyone here,

Again, because again, there might be nobody, but if there's something that's skeptical, here's what I want to remind you of, you've already done this. You've already done it. Here's how I know. Because an alter ego secret identity is a part of the human condition. Every single child at some point in time pretended to be Superman or superwoman or Wonder Woman nowadays, or it could have been a nurse or fireman or, and everyone played those characters as kids. And then we start to be shaped by society to tell us to grow up and, you know, act your age. and we interpret that those games that we played are immature. And yet that is a sign of the most mature self that you can

is to leverage the skill and the genius that we're gifted with because it's truly one of the few things that makes us unique on this planet. You know, the ability and capacity to love does not make us unique because thousands upon thousands of other animals display that. But our creative imagination, the ability to suspend the disbelief of what we can and cannot do, and tap into another idea so that we can perform to the way that we most want to is something that makes us unique. You know, human beings can make a heaven from hell or a hell from heaven.

You know, it's your choice. This power, and like I say inside the book or on the audible, whatever, someone ends up choosing, if they do decide to, is that this is something that's way more deep and resonant. It's an inside-out approach. It's not about being fake at all. It's about actually being really your most true core self as you can be. Love it.

Just two more things. Do you have time for two more, two more quick things? Absolutely. When I think of visualization, which I was part of what you're talking about, I actually like to watch golf. And one of the guys who brought this kind of mainstream, if you watch golf, is Jason Day. Jason Day stands behind before every single shot. He stands behind his golf ball.

He holds his, with his right hand, he holds the left part of his left hand, the glove. on his left hand. He closes his eyes. He breathes and as he says, he visualizes the exact shape of the shot and where it will land. I know this, like I said, this plays into some of what you're talking about, but my question is not necessarily how we can hit good golf shots. My question is, how can we take what Jason Day does visualization, seeing the ball hit land on the green near the hole, right hitting the perfect shape of the shot? How do we take it from? what he does into our everyday lives, not on the golf course, not on the football field, but in the business world, the boardroom, the meetings, the presentations, whatever it may be.

How do you use visualization for something like that? Sure. So, well, A, visualization for, so even though we have this visual cortex and, you know, people are actually visualizing all the time, deliberate visualization is actually a very challenging skill to do. people for the longest time in the sports psychology world or whatever kind of leadership space, take it for granted that people are going to automatically know how to do it. And it's not. I mean, as someone who's taught this for, you know, 20 plus years, it's quite difficult.

Plus, visualization on the football field or the sporting field is a bit of a misnomer because people think it's really pictures. And really, it's about a full sensory experience. the more that you can get all of your emotions or all of your senses engaged. Like what he's what he's hearing is also, he's also hearing the sound of what that ball, because I mean, we've all, anyone who's played golf knows when you've hit a pure shot, I mean, you want to rewind that tape in your head and just played on a loop over and over because it sounds so amazing that ball coming off of your club perfectly. So you're hearing the sound of it.

You know, is there a smell that's associated with it as well? What's the touch and the feel, which is really important? especially in the sporting level. So then the process that I use to help people get engaged with that more is a concept that I call scripting. So if you have a presentation or if you've got something, you don't, you don't have to script out your entire day tomorrow. But is there some critical moments of your day that are happening tomorrow, meetings that you've got that are about bringing in revenue or, you know, you going on a stage, script that out. And you can script it out in one of two ways in the past tense or in the present tense as if you're experiencing. So how it might sound is if it's in the present tense is as my, as I walk into the, as I walk into the boardroom and I see our guests and my clients sitting at the table, I feel this immense sense of calm confidence that what we're going to present today is exactly what they want to hear. And as I go around the table and I shake everyone's hand and say hello and make great eye. contact to develop that nice strong bond and rapport, I can really feel like they're excited for the meeting as well. So when I sit down and I open up my laptop and get the presentation ready, and I start going through the first couple of slides, I can see and notice that two of our guests are

making some eye contact like, this is exactly what we need. And as I continue through it, I get more and more people on board and I can actually see people leaning forward as they're engaged with it. When I get to the end of the presentation and I look to them to see how it landed, I can tell that we're definitely doing business together and we're moving forward. And throughout the exchange of questions and answers that we have, I have all of the right answers for them and all of the right questions to follow up with to make sure that they're getting all of their questions answered. and by the end of the meeting as they send back the agreement with me and we shake hands to

move forward, I know that that source of clients or that client source is going to be a source of even more clients because of how we're going to wow them going forward and all the referrals are going to send our way. I mean, I'm just spitballing here right on the moment. So you can do a present tense or you can do it past tense where it's like, you know, as I as I look back over the course of the meeting that we just had with the clients, I'm so grateful that the prep work that we put in allowed me to show up so confident and calm with people because I could tell throughout that they were expecting someone to come hard charging in and try to oversell them and woo them with a bunch of hyperbole because that's what they've heard in the past.

And yet we were so patient through the process and we answered all of their questions throughout the entire presentation that I could actually see them get excited throughout that they had found the vendor that they wanted to partner with going forward. So anyways, that's the example. And so the point is that you don't think it. You actually write it down because writing is the doing. part of thinking. And the more that you write things out, it slows down your mental processing and allows you to really get engaged in what it is that you're writing out. That's why, you know,

because we can think so fast. And when we do that, we can end up not getting really kind of emotionally entangled like we want to in a positive script that we're writing. So I'm working with athletes and I'm saying, hey, when I, when my blades touch the ice, as I step onto the ice, I can hear them cutting into it as I make my first turn. And as I skate around and behind the net, my confidence is starting to surge even more and more as the wind blows through my helmet. And so that, if you're writing that down,

it's really engaging your visual mind and getting you closer and closer to what that experience is. And again, because the mind is very teleological, It wants to create the world that it has an experience with. So if you're always showing up to things unprepared, your mind will always default into whatever your normally emotional status. So if you're a really anxious person, you're going to be anxious. But if you've already given a picture to your mind as to what and how you're going to show up in a moment, it will go to that process most often. Wow.

This is really good, man. I appreciate it, Todd, especially kind of off the cuff riffing here for 30 plus minutes, both with me and then just just taking into the boardroom because I'm a, I think this is the woo-woo portion for some people. And I get that. I get it. My only, I think, ask of people would be just to try it, just to try it. Because I fully appreciate from a tactical perspective, like you've got to be prepared for that meeting. You can't just tell yourself that story, but then not even prep for the meeting. Obviously, that that's assumed that that that part is done.

We're talking next level stuff here. Because that's that's the assumption that we are making is you're going to do that part because that's just, that's a must. But then this take it another level. I've done this with sports and outside of sports. It absolutely works. Your science backs up all of your stories. Your work backs up. It's all over your book, the alter ego effect as well.

and that's why I think it could be impactful. But if you're looking, you're the type of guy too, and Clay has said this to me, so it's not original for me. But I think you're the type of guy who works with people who are probably at an eight and help them to get to the 10, right? I don't think you would probably do very well

with a two or a three and getting into a seven. I could be wrong, but I don't sense that. I think I get, I believe that you'd probably work with people who are already probably performing at pretty high levels. You're helping them get over the top. is what I sense. Yeah, well, I mean, my mentor, Jim Rohn said to me back in the deck, back in the day, and he always said that in his speeches in Jim Rohn was, you know, Forbes named him as one of

the top three business philosophers of the 20th century. He would say to me, he came from a farm family as well, you know, since passed away. He said, you know, Todd, when your dad goes out to the field and he plants the seeds at the beginning of the season, at the end of the season, he would be crazy to go out because there's going to be some seeds that produce 20 to 30 percent. There's going to be some seeds that are going to produce 70% for you. And there's going to be some seeds that produce 100% or 90% for you. Your dad would be crazy to go out and yell and scream at the 20 to 30% seeds and try to make them 100% seeds.

That's just the way that they are. Now, that might be a very cynical and skeptical way of looking at human beings. But from my experience, again, working with hundreds of thousands of people beyond the one-on-one coaching and with the training and stuff that we've done is that there are a lot of people that are currently planted in fields that they will only ever produce 20 to 30 percent. You put that seed in another field and they might produce a lot better than what they currently are. And so, yeah, I mean, I actually have. I've dealt with people that are at the 20 to 30, but my clients, you know, sit at the definitely the 80 to 100 percent mark. And oftentimes when you're working with pros,

it's the final few micro percentage points that they're looking to improve. Yeah. Well, Todd, I know, I went long. It's my fault, but I appreciate you continuing to add value throughout and even bring it as we went. The book's called The Alter Ego Effect, The Power of Secret Identities to Transform Your Life. I'm appreciative for you to finally put what was in your head down on paper, and then obviously coming here and sharing on my show, man. And I absolutely want to continue our dialogue. I know we will as we both progress, man. I'm excited to see how this book helps you blow you up even more, man.

Well, I'd love to hear from your readers if they take us up on it and they read it. And to your point, if there's one great other quality of leaders is the ability to be coachable. Again, to suspend your current thoughts as to who and what is truly right in the world and maybe adopt another idea. So thanks for having me on. I appreciate it. Yeah, man. Where would you send my listeners to learn more about? you online or by the book.

Yeah, Toddherman. Dotme is kind of my home base on the web. AlteregoEgoEffect.com is where we have more information about the book. And of course, links to all across the planet for where you can go and grab the audible or the hardcover or the Kindle version of it. And Todd, I've been doing the end of the podcast club for those who have made it this far. Thank you very much. We appreciate it.

I love for you all who are with us to reach out to both Todd and me on Twitter and give us one key takeaway that you've picked up. I'm at Ryan Hawk 1-2. Todd, you are at Todd underscore Herman. Give us one key takeaway that you've picked up from this kind of. I think choosing one will be very hard, but I still like to challenge you to do it. Todd, thanks again for being here, man. I loved it. And we're certainly going to talk more in the future, man. Thank you. All right, bye. Bye. Bye. Wow. That one went pretty deep. Wide range. as well. I really appreciate Todd's

ability and willingness to take that in as many directions at the depth that we did. I found it to be very helpful and useful. I hope you did as well. If so, I'd love it if you would write or you subscribe and rate the show in iTunes,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen. That's right to thoughtful review. Rate the show, hopefully five stars, and subscribe. It continues to give me the opportunity to do what I love on a daily basis, which is to have these thought-provoking type conversations with somebody like Todd.

I feel like I get better and better because of them, and I hope you do too. Thank you so much. Talk with you next week. This episode is once again brought you by Gusto. Gusto offers modern, easy payroll, benefits, and HR to small businesses across the country. They were even named Best Online Payroll by PCMag.

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