The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk - 325: Ron Ullery - Demanding Excellence, Delayed Gratification, Winning Titles

Starting point is 00:00:00 When I talk to young people a lot of times, I tell them, I'm never, if you are unsuccessful, when you've got to high school and college and whatever field you want to go into, look in the mirror because the competition is not real stiff. If you just have some foresight and some strong work ethic, you can do whatever you want after you. When you enter the adult world, you can literally do anything you want because most young people don't have a whole lot of foresight. It's like right now, I want to do what's the best thing for me to do right now and not be looking at. ahead. Real quick before we get to this episode, I want to let you know that we have opened up tickets for our once a year personal excellence workshop. We did this last year and received

Starting point is 00:00:41 incredible reviews so we wanted to do it again this year, but make it even better. In addition to the topics that I personally teach on, I have reached out to the subject domain experts within my network to be with us in the room and share their expertise. Things like how to harness your personal and professional flywheel to build an incredible career. Secrets from a professional keynote speaking coach. How to become a learning machine. How to utilize the mindset of a professional athlete in the business world and so much more. This workshop is ideal for you if you want to interact with intellectually curious and

Starting point is 00:01:23 interesting people. If you want to accelerate your personal and professional growth, if you have an open, mind and are not afraid to be challenged. And if you are currently leading a team or have a desire to at some point in your future, for more details, go to Ryanhawk.me. This event is intentionally kept small so the experience is intimate, engaging, and interactive. For more details and to get your ticket, go to Ryanhawk.combe. Welcome to the Learning Leader Show presented by Rixie and Meyer. I am Ryan Hawk. Thanks so much for being here. Text, learners to 4-4-2-2-2 in order to join tens of thousands of learning leaders from all over the world.

Starting point is 00:02:12 Received Mindful Monday updates what I'm reading, watching writing, thinking about carefully curated content to help you become a more effective leader. Text, learners to 4-4-2-2-2. Now, on tonight's featured leader, this was an absolute thrill for me to sit down in front of the entire Springboro High School football team and coaching staff and record with the legendary coach Ron Ulary. Coach Allery has had as big of an impact on my life as any person I've ever met. He was my offensive coordinator at Centralville High School for my four years as the quarterback of the team. He's coached high school football for 43 years, currently the offensive line coach at Springboro. A few of the topics we discussed.

Starting point is 00:03:01 the importance of setting extremely high expectations and the key to getting people to live up to them. Then delayed gratification, voluntary hardship, and sacrifice, why all are imperative to sustain excellence, especially today. And then the framework for continuous improvement and the importance of Coach Allerie's daily mentoring conversations early in his career. Again, this was an absolute thrill to sit down in front of the team with a hero of mind. Please enjoy with Coach Ron Allery. First I have to say for all you guys, I can vividly remember the feeling in between the first practice to the second practice. So I do feel for you. I would be in a state of depression right about this moment. So the fact that you're here with smiles on your face, excited for the second practice, I really appreciate that. And I hope we make it work. your time. Coach Allery is, other than my family is the sole reason that I was able to get a

Starting point is 00:04:10 college scholarship. Lifting me to levels that I did not think were possible. If you look at how good I was going into high school versus how good I was when I left high school. So when you talk about impact, nobody in my life outside of my family has had more impact literally on my entire life than Coach Allery. So that's why this is special to me when Coach Wilhelm brought this up. I thought, well, let's do this in front of your guys. This would be a lot of fun to be able to hopefully have him share some knowledge, maybe in a little bit different setting than normal than just probably crushing the offensive linemen like he did when I was playing. But I couldn't be more excited.

Starting point is 00:04:50 And I like to get it started just by giving coach a big round of applause. All right, thank you. All right, let's get into a coach. So I've interviewed about 350 leaders from all places in the world when it comes to industry. industry, coaches, CEOs of billion-dollar companies, and I'm always fascinated by what they deem is excellent. So from your perspective, you've been around guys who played multiple years in the NFL, pro bowlers, Super Bowl winners, you've played a big role in developing them.

Starting point is 00:05:23 When you think about the commonalities among people who sustain excellence, they're not good for a little bit, but they have the ability to sustain it over time. What have you found that those people have in common? Well, obviously there's all different levels of leadership. There's all styles of leadership. And sustained excellence is always kind of intriguing me. Watching the New England Patriots, watching the Green Bay Packers back when they were winning championship after championship, the Dallas Cowboys, the Boston Red Sox, the New York Yankees,

Starting point is 00:05:55 the Chicago Bulls back in the Michael Jordan days. That amazed me because if you're in athletics, I think, and maybe even more so when you get to the level of your leading in athletics, you understand how difficult it is to win. You're sitting up in the stands and you're yelling down there and say, why don't you do this? Why don't you do that? It looks really easy.

Starting point is 00:06:13 When you're watching on TV, it looks even easier. But when you're right there and you're trying to be successful day after day, year after year, week after week, it is tough. So that really intrigues me. And I think even though there's different styles of leadership, you think of your head coach in high school Bob Gregg. He was like a Vince Lombardi type. Right?

Starting point is 00:06:33 I mean, he was demanding, militaristic, driven, was going to drive you. Did some really, really crazy stuff. At the time, at first I didn't really understand what he was doing and why he was doing it. And later on, I understand it fully. And I realized how good of a coach he was. That's one extreme. And they were very, very successful guys like that. Maybe out of fear.

Starting point is 00:06:53 Maybe out of fear, maybe out of a whole lot of other things. The other end of the spectrum, I think, is Tony Dungey, a guy like him. Extremely soft-spoken. A guy that played for him with the Colts, one of the other. time told me that Tony Dungey never swore, never raised his voice, never yelled at anyone. And I asked him, I said, well, how did the players react to that? And they said, they loved him and they would play unbelievably hard for him. They had so much respect. And I asked him why. And he didn't hesitate. He said, because all of us do not want to disappoint him. It's almost like he's your

Starting point is 00:07:23 father, your grandfather. We don't want to disappoint him. So we played really, really hard. So I don't know that one leadership style is better than another. But I think he's a lot. But I I think you mentioned common traits between leaders. I think they have to be organized, and I think they probably are, because they have to set a plan. They have to have a plan. Otherwise, the people you're directing,

Starting point is 00:07:44 you can't be throwing darts at a board. There's got to be a plan of how you're going to get to where you're going to go, or where you want to go. And then after that, I think they've got to have a tremendous work ethic. Because I think all successful leaders ask the people they're leading to do a whole lot to reach the goal they're together trying to reach.

Starting point is 00:08:00 And if you want them to follow you, I think you've got to exhibit the same work ethic or more. Otherwise, I think young kids, especially, going to look at you and say, you're asking me to work that hard, and you're not, and you're showing up late, or you're not showing up at all, or you're not prepared, or whatever. So I think those things are, I think also,

Starting point is 00:08:18 some of the guys I mentioned there and the people that I'm thinking of as I talk here, I think they have extremely high expectations and they're unwilling to ever waver from those expectations. Like they have the expectations, maybe way up here, and just because guys won't reach them, they don't lower down here just to feel good about it.

Starting point is 00:08:37 They keep them up there, and they keep hammering and hammering to reach those expectations. I think those are the biggest things. Probably humility, too. If you don't have some humility as a leader, I think that the people you're leaning are going to look at you and say, hey, this is all about you. And it can't be.

Starting point is 00:08:52 You've got to make sure that they realize it's all about them, and you're just in a position to help them get there. One of the things I went to your Hall of Fame induction at Centerville, and that was something, that I really was, I took away from your talk. You walked up there with no notes and just, I like poured out your heart and you said that what I learned from Coach Greg was the fact that essentially he had this ability to raise the new normal as I would, if I had to really think about it. Meaning, I felt almost invincible by the time I got on the field. I was talking

Starting point is 00:09:26 with Coach Wellheight about this, about sacrifice and discipline and why you do all these hard things in the off season, it's to get that feeling, right? To generate that feeling of, I'm almost invincible on Friday nights. Can you talk a little bit about that mindset of preparation, discipline, of sacrifice when it comes to playing? Sure. I think, I learned it from Bob Gregg because of the, some of the things he asked you guys to do, he asked all of us to do, were not the norm.

Starting point is 00:10:00 They were extremes. And what I learned, and like I said before, at first, I thought, why are we doing this is crazy? Some of this stuff we're doing. It might be conditioning. It might be weight room stuff. It might be practice stuff. It could be anything. But then I learned that the reason we were doing it was he was trying to instill in you that you, there's another level up there.

Starting point is 00:10:19 There's another level above where you think individually you can go. And I 100% believe that for all people. You may think your level of what you can achieve is right here. It's not. It ain't even close there. way above it. And by doing things that you never dreamed you could possibly do, I think that gets instilled in you, and then you do them. You're like, wow, I never dreamed I could do that. And unfortunately, today, I think we're in an era where mediocrity and average is okay. I think

Starting point is 00:10:50 too many people accept just mediocrity, that's okay. I was told to mow the yard, I mowed it. Did you mowed it? Good? I got it mowed. Why is that? What's changed? Well, I hate to be another person that another older person is ripping on technology, but I'm going to rip on technology here. I mean, I think literally today, not just young people, and I don't blame young people. I blame us. I blame us for bringing this on. They can, literally, if they want to, they can lay in bed all day, have their phone over here, have their Xbox over here, have their laptop on their lap, have their iPad over here, have a TV on Netflix up here, another TV with like 250 stations on it, and they don't have to get out of bed. They're just to get out of bed. They

Starting point is 00:11:31 They are totally entertained by everything here. They don't even have to get out of bed to eat. They could door dash it. Door dash and leave your door unlock, say the doors unlock, would you bring them in my bedroom for me? They just lay there and they bring it in the bedroom. They might even feed you. I don't know.

Starting point is 00:11:44 They could probably do that. And you never have to do anything to fill your day or entertain yourself or expand your mind at all. You're just laying there. And that's an extreme example I'm giving. But I think that's part of it, that we're just okay. I'm just punching the clock, I'm just getting the job done, and I'm not striving to be elite or excellent anymore. And there's another level.

Starting point is 00:12:09 There's definitely another level up there always. That's one of the, I think, the cool things about football, though, right? I hope it still plays that role as that, Aege and I talk about this all the time, where we hated a lot of it in the moment, like some of the really hard stuff. That's why I mentioned being, like, depressed in between practices and those types of feelings. However, as I look back over the many years since I've finished playing, nothing I've done since then has been as mentally challenging as it was as what I was put through for those four years at Centerville High School. And that's what I'm grateful for. And that's what I think of message for these guys too when you think about like, man, this is hard.

Starting point is 00:12:49 Or all my buddies who play basketball, they play games all the time. And we only get 10 Fridays a year guaranteed. and but but football can set you up literally for the rest of your life and it seems that you as a coach have understood that and knew it before we did and that's part of the process of of why we do things that are so hard yeah I think you hit the nail on the head I I think and again I learned this had a great mentor and and coach Greg and I didn't miss a thing he did because I was so amazed at at how I mean the guy was an excellent no genius in football, but he realized that's really not the most important thing in coaching

Starting point is 00:13:32 football. He realized that and probably if I could name one thing that I got from him more than anything else, and it deals with the topic we're talking about right now, is I think young people will live up to your expectations or down to your expectations almost all the time. And so it's up to me or any coach or a captain of a football team or whatever to place the level of those expectations. Just like you think of some of the things you did, running 4440s or maybe a four-station,

Starting point is 00:14:03 10-minute-per-station, crazy championship circuit of agility and non-stop stuff. And you're thinking 40 minutes of a circuit straight or circuits in the wait room of 42 stations or whatever, you think there's no way I can do that. But I watched and I watched and you guys responded every single time to no matter what expectation he put up there, you responded.

Starting point is 00:14:26 And I'm sure, I'll tell you story about your brother, I think also if you lower the expectations down here, that's where most people are going to go. They're going to stop right there if that's the expectation. If you have a weight workout, when a weight workout's over and you say it's over, most everybody, if not everybody, leaves. And that's okay because that's what the workout was. But I remember, guys like your brother, the reason they excelled so much in my mind was they reached that expectation, and then they exceeded it. They said, I mean, how many times he would come back?

Starting point is 00:14:58 Workouts over, everybody leaves. You turn around, there's AJ. He's going through like another workout. I've told the story many times when, I don't know what year he was at Ohio State, but I think it was right after the Michigan game. They had played Michigan on Saturday, beat him. The next morning, Jerry Ritzinski,

Starting point is 00:15:16 who was an altar football player, went on and played lineback at Ohio State, and I think he's with the Browns. Yep. He played. Now he's in Ohio State. Still Ohio State, like, commentator for football and sports and stuff. He had called me about something. He was writing a story about something. He calls me on Sunday and says a

Starting point is 00:15:31 I went into the Woody Hayes facility this morning day after the Michigan game and Jerry wasn't playing anymore. He went in to get a workout in and he goes as I was I think it was seven o'clock. He said I got there at seven o'clock. I'm going to the facility and AJ is walking out of the facility. He's already got a workout in. They just beat Michigan the day before and his mind was on how can I I now get better. And the next morning, he's in the weight room getting better by himself. He's coming, I don't know, he was by himself, he was leaving by himself. And my response to Jerry when he told me that, I said, that doesn't surprise me a bit, knowing AJ, I said, as a matter of fact, I would venture to say it's not his last workout of the day, today. Because it didn't matter what expectation you put on a guy like that, he decided I'm going to do more than that. And, you know, he's blessed with great athletic ability, but he that and this guys like you, you were the same way.

Starting point is 00:16:26 You're great athletic ability. You could be a great high school football player and just perform here. But you guys became elite high school football players because you went to there and beyond. Yeah. Over. I think part of leadership, as you mentioned, is you have to go first, meaning we, I think we would look to our coaching staff initially to see how you acted on a a day-to-day basis and the fact that I don't I don't know if this still

Starting point is 00:16:57 happened so maybe it's a risky topic to bring up but this thought of like we would try to beat you to the weight room or beat you a agent I would when he was a freshman and sophomore I was a junior senior and beat you to the weight room the locker room whatever is this does this still happen today or no meaning and we always knew we I gained more confidence that my coach was going to out coach the other coaches because he worked he outworked them and then that created this feeling in me that, well, I have to do the same thing. And then as a leader, as the quarterback of the team, my teammates saw that and they followed.

Starting point is 00:17:33 It all started here, came to here, and then came everyone. And that's how you average 50 a game or do whatever the things we did. What's that mentality that you have of like, I'm going to be here first, I'm going to outwork everybody? I'm probably already smarter them anyway, but I'm still going to outwork them. Those are kind of words, far from smarter than anybody. but believe it or not it really has nothing to do with being the first person there. I'm crazy, okay? There's no doubt.

Starting point is 00:17:59 You're crazy? I'm crazy. Crazy as far as going in places that early. As far as, but that's everything. It's not just coming here. My wife who's sitting back here will tell you it kind of annoys her sometimes. I mean, if I'm going to the airport and my flight leaves at whatever time, I want to be there like three hours early. And it really has nothing to do with being first.

Starting point is 00:18:18 It has everything to do with making sure I'm prepared. I don't want to be the weak link. I want to control what I can control. If I'm going to the airport, I don't want to get caught in traffic I don't want to get caught at the border across from Canada, the United States, and they pull me over and take me inside and search my car. Now I'm late for a flight. I don't want to get to the airport and the line's too long at security. I'm always I just always want to prepare so I'm not the weak link. So in relation to football, it's just and for me to prepare, I got to be in kind of a quiet place. I became a morning guy. when I was in college because I was a math major and it was tough math was tough and you're taking very high-level courses and I had three roommates and every night my roommates are going out and doing whatever college students do and they're having a good time and I'm at the library I'm studying calculus because I had to because I knew my mom and dad if those grades weren't to their liking they were they'd pull a plug on me so the only way I could do

Starting point is 00:19:16 both have the best of both worlds if I want to go out with them at night I had to get up early in the morning. So I would get up early in the morning. It was three o'clock if I had an exam to study for, five o'clock. If I had a nine o'clock class, I had an assignment to turn in. And I just got to the point where I kind of liked it. That's quiet. There's no distractions. And then when I had had young kids at home, I didn't want to go home and take lesson plans home, take, be preparing for football practice the next day, grading tests, because I wanted to have time with my kids. So I would go in early in the morning. And then when I became the athletic director and head football coach the same thing. You can't watch film in the middle of day because there's too many things going on with your job.

Starting point is 00:19:54 So I would do it that way. I just don't want to be the weak link. I want to make sure that I'm doing everything possible to do my part. So even if I do screw up, it's not by lack of preparation or lack of work. Yeah. One of the themes that I found amongst all these interviews I do is that people who are willing to delay gratification and even voluntarily put themselves in hard situations are better long term.

Starting point is 00:20:23 And I think I pulled that from my time in high school, those four years, starting as an eighth grader in the summer, of being able to delay gratification because there wasn't people cheering when we worked out. There were little out of boys, but other than that, there wasn't much. How do you instill that in a program with these, guys to say you have to understand what we're doing in May what we're doing in

Starting point is 00:20:49 June and July and right now what you're about to go do again is going to make us better in October in November moving forward but that because I feel like that might be something that has changed as well because it is it's so easy to get it right now as you mentioned that the ability to delay gratification is almost a superpower with with people today in all walks of life and certainly here I think with young people yeah I agree I and to answer your question I think it's really really difficult because instant gratification is whatever by once now especially young people that want instant gratification if I got a work you know

Starting point is 00:21:27 if I got a job at McDonald's and they won't get me off Saturday to go to the concert I'll just quit because I want I want to be able to do that right now if I can't get set my schedule take my vacation when I want I'll quit and and and I foresight if I had to say there's one thing that maybe you know people always ask you, how are players or how are high school kids different now than they were 40 years ago or whatever? And I think they are different, but every, you know, over the course of a decade, everything changes and things, it's not necessarily a bad thing. Everybody's born the same, but then over the course of however many years they've lived, we as adults have changed their

Starting point is 00:22:01 lives for them. And I do think that right now probably they may have a little bit less foresight. And then you should, I go back to everything's right in front of them. They have instant access to news, to entertainment, to anything they want. They have instant access to it right now. Whereas, you know, 20 years ago, you didn't. You know, if you wanted to watch a ballgame in Dallas, you had to go to Dallas probably. It wasn't going to be on TV here. If you wanted anything, if you wanted to see somebody in concert, you had to check the calendar and see when they were going to be an area because you couldn't just pull it up on your computer and live watch it and stuff like that. So I think foresight, and that's why when I talk to young people a lot of times,

Starting point is 00:22:43 I tell them, I'm never, if you are unsuccessful, when you got to high school and college and whatever field you want to go into, look in the mirror because the competition is not real stiff. If you just have some foresight and some strong work ethic, you can do whatever you want after you, when you enter the adult world, you can literally do anything you want because most young people don't have a whole lot of foresight. It's like right now, I want to do what's the best thing for me to do right now and not be looking ahead. I, uh, I 100% agree. And I think that's why I, this inspires me to be in front of a group because I, I really feel like there's such an opportunity for younger people that's right here. But I know when I was in high

Starting point is 00:23:26 school and somebody was saying this to me, I wouldn't, I probably wouldn't listen. I I listen to my coaches, but I don't know if I would listen to a guy like me up here. I hope it kind of seeps through and maybe gets amongst the team. And that's another topic I want to bring up is that. So I was fortunate to play as a freshman at Centerville, played quarterback. And what I've found since I played and then went on to the business world is that I've been on winning teams and I've been on losing teams. And the biggest difference between the teams that win and the teams that lose is that the players had such ownership and were empowered by their coach and they held each other accountable. And so I would ask you about this now, Coach, of I was as a ninth grader, as a freshman, I was scared to death of my offensive line.

Starting point is 00:24:17 They would punch me in the chest and the face if I messed up, if I blew an assignment, if I didn't do what I was supposed to do. I was literally scared. You probably saw it my eyes that it was just a sense of relief if I happened to score a touchdown or do my job. But that was powerful, man. And I took the same when I got older. I didn't like hit people like that. But I felt like I could hold people accountable as I got older. And that's what made our team.

Starting point is 00:24:47 How is that now? Is that how it is? If it's not, what do you say to young people say about the, empowered teams of you holding him accountable instead of you having to hold him accountable yeah I would say it's not nearly like that I know what you're talking about and and they may think you're exaggerating a little bit I know you're not that it was extreme back when you played where and it can I think it came from guys you're talking about the offensive line because you were

Starting point is 00:25:16 the quarterback and if all of a sudden you were misreading play and they were doing their job and working really really hard and you did it over and over and over, they got upset because they're doing their job and you're not making a place successful because you keep making a mistake over and over. And it's not nearly that way now. It's a different culture, different era we live in, but I still think it has a place, maybe not hitting each other or anything like that, but I don't think the only way to motivate people is to put your arm around them and say, come on, come on, Billy, you're doing a good

Starting point is 00:25:46 job, just do it a little bit better the next time. It gets to a point where people are motivated a different way. I remember Coach Greg saying one time, he said, you know, with a player, he said, you can, when they make a mistake, you can tell them what the mistake is, you can demonstrate the right way to do it, you can have a player demonstrate it, you can show them on film, you can hug them and say, please do it, you can kick them in the rear figuratively and say, you got to do it. And the final straw is, if you still won't do it, I got to put you on the bench. You're going to the bench and you're not going to play.

Starting point is 00:26:22 So there's all kinds of ways to motivate. And I know some of the guys you're talking about there. And the thing, I strongly believe you can, and we're talking about players, treating players, but same with coaches, coaching players. You can coach them as hard as you want. Literally, as hard as you want, you can coach these guys, and they will respond as long as they know you care about them. That's it.

Starting point is 00:26:46 And those offensive linemen cared about you too. They were fighting to protect you, fighting to get you yards. They really cared. Yeah. So you would, and you responded. You responded to him. So I coached a coach defensive line when you were there, I won't mention his name, he was a wild man,

Starting point is 00:27:03 typical defensive line coach, kind of. He was kind of crazy. But I tell you what, he fought for his players. He stood up for him. And we played a game at home. And at halftime, he always took his guys outside the back door, the locker room. And they met out there on these benches.

Starting point is 00:27:21 on Monday morning, my principal, I was a teacher at the time, came to me in my classroom, and said, hey, I got to talk to you about something. He said, so-and-so at halftime, I went around back. He went back around there to have the principal to have a cigarette back there. He said, I went back there, and so-and-so was ripping his players to death, berating them, screaming at him, et cetera. I said, well, okay, do you want me to say something? He goes, I think you should.

Starting point is 00:27:48 And I said, well, okay, before you tell me I should say something, I want you to know. that those players will do anything in the world for that guy. They will run through a wall for him because they know he cares every bit about them as much as he's yelling at them there. So I think you can do it. I think players today can still motivate and get to a point and nothing else happens.

Starting point is 00:28:08 I encourage him. I said, sometimes you have to take a kid aside and you one of your teammates and you say, we don't do it this way. There's a different way to do it in my expectation as a senior is you do it the way that we do it here at Springboro. and there are no options to do it other ways. Yeah, I think my dad had a great quote in passing.

Starting point is 00:28:27 We were actually, he's helping me write a book and talking about leadership and managing and how to hopefully get your team to respond. He said, you know, it's a lot harder when you care. And it's so simplistic, but it's so true that when you care, and I think of like as a quarterback, you're a quarterback, right? I think as a quarterback, if your teammates know how much you care, then it kind of opens up the doors to do those types of things.

Starting point is 00:28:53 When I finished playing football after college, I played in the arena league for a little bit and got my first job in sales and I got a job as a manager a few years later. And my whole thought of the framework for the team I wanted to build was how can I build a team like our senior year season where we won those first 11 games and how can I build a team of people in the business world

Starting point is 00:29:18 where you're not going to be physical, obviously, but hire people that are going to hold each other accountable where I am just kind of steering the ship, but the team is going to be run by the players. And I'm going to empower them to do that. And that was the process that it worked the exact same. It didn't happen overnight. It took time.

Starting point is 00:29:37 It took good hiring and firing in some cases, but of saying these people care about one another and they're able to hold each other accountable because they cared so much. And so I think that whole thought process around caring is, it sounds simplistic, but it's true. And it leads me too for you. Agent and I talked about us a lot as well.

Starting point is 00:30:00 I mentioned this because you're a topic of conversation quite a bit because we both played for you. You were as head coach for two years, my Alvin's coordinator for four. I'm certain you've had opportunities to coach in college and maybe even professionally if you wanted to. Why high school kids? Why stay in the high school area and not go for bigger?

Starting point is 00:30:20 I mean, we've played in college. You're a better coach than any college coach I've ever had. So I played at two different schools for a lot of really good coaches that won a lot of games. I'm curious why this level, why stay here? It's making a lot more money at high school than you do. I know it's the opposite, right? It's simple to me. When I was in high school, I loved the high school atmosphere as a student.

Starting point is 00:30:46 And when I graduated and went to college, I knew that I wanted to go back to high school and I wanted to teach and coach. Because I just loved that age. I loved everything about high school. And I just had to decide what I was going to teach. And I figured that out. And once I got into high school, I loved it even more than I thought I was going to. And it's taking high school kids and trying to mold a football team or whatever your coach, sport your coaching, is hard because you take whatever comes through the doors. There's no going out and recruiting.

Starting point is 00:31:17 We need a linebacker. Let's go find one and bring him in, see if he'll switch schools or anything. You just take what walks to the doors every year, and you do the best that you can with that. So it mainly was I just, I love that age. I love this age. I still do to this day. I love everything about these guys. And so I never really, if I was going to coach at a different level, you know, there's no security in coaching in college of the pros.

Starting point is 00:31:41 You're not going to coach one place for 20 years or anything. So your family is going to be a different level. moving all over and all that and and your coaching guys that maybe have a have a different motive for what they're doing have different goals than you do and they're more individualistic than high school kids hopefully are so it's basically just as simple as that I really and I'm doing what I love doing and and I can honestly say I don't I really don't I've said this many many times in talking about my career is I you know this is 43 years for me of doing this stuff

Starting point is 00:32:14 And I've, whether it was teaching, being an AD or a coach, I've never once felt like I had a job in my, never once. I've never had trouble going to bed at night because I knew I was going to love waking up in the morning and go doing what I was doing. Whether it was teaching math, I loved that. Being an athletic director, I loved it, coaching whatever sport I was coached and I loved it. So, you know, I just think it's important to have a passion for what you're doing. And if you find that, why change? why offensive line? Why is that your specialty area?

Starting point is 00:32:47 Well, it wasn't always my specialty area. As long as I've known you, I guess. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I never longed to be an offensive line coach. I started out, I was a skill player when I played, and then I was coaching quarterbacks and running backs, and one year Bob Gregg said during the season, he just looked at me in office one day and said,

Starting point is 00:33:07 you're coaching offensive line next year. And when Bob took, told you to do something, you weren't going to say, well, you know, I don't think I'm going to do that. You just said, okay. And I think I was similar to many, many coaches in football. Unless you played offensive line, I think most football coaches would say the position they would feel least comfortable coaching is offensive line, because I think most football coaches know the least amount about that position unless they played it. And that was me. I never played it. And I didn't really, as I'd coached, I'd only coached about five years when he told me it gave me

Starting point is 00:33:41 the non- ultimatum demand, this is what you're doing. So that off-season, I'll tell you, was probably the biggest learning off-season I ever had. I went anywhere and everywhere and talked to everyone I could find who had some expertise in offensive line play. And every person I talked to who was coaching them would leave me with this. They would say, you are going to love coaching offensive line. And here's, and I thought, yeah, right, this is going to be a battle. but I learn real quick why.

Starting point is 00:34:12 I mean, offensive linemen, offensive linemen sitting in here are not going to like hearing this. They're going to like hearing part of it, but they're really not going to like hearing the other part. I truly believe on a football team, that position is by far the absolute hardest position on the field to succeed at.

Starting point is 00:34:27 And it's also the most impactful as far as winning football games. And I think most defensive coaches would say that. If the offensive line can control the line of scrimmage and keep the defense on the sidelines, so only have to come out, you know, they can get well-rested. Defensive players love it. When they can sit on the sideline, get real-rested, and come out, ablazing, they love it.

Starting point is 00:34:46 So the offensive linemen, most important and most difficult job, and at the same time, they're the least athletic players on the field, by far. The least athletic, at least talented. So you're asking them to do the most important job that has the most impact in the game, and they can't jump as high, run as fast. sometimes they fall over bags when they try to walk over them, all these things. So it's a tremendous challenge.

Starting point is 00:35:14 And I love challenges, and I love seeing them succeed. I mean, that's last stop. Offensive line is the last stop. There's no, you know, a linebacker's not cutting it. He becomes a defensive end. A defensive tackle's not cutting it. He becomes a guard.

Starting point is 00:35:27 Yep. An offensive alignment's not cutting it. They're probably maybe on the field goal team, maybe nowhere. Yeah. So I just love the challenge there. of helping them succeed when it's really, really hard. Yeah. Earning respect is a big deal to me.

Starting point is 00:35:44 One of the things I talk about with leaders is how to build skills and earn respect and credibility. Because if you're looking around your teammates and you want them to follow you, they have to respect you. And I think that's something that you've exhibited really well and it helped us as players earn the respect. of our teammates. And I think that's the stock answer, as you know, you have to work really hard. But I'm curious, what are some ways, in addition to being an incredibly hard worker, can you earn respect from your peers? And the reason I ask is, not just for these guys, it's for them 10, 20 years from now. They can take the same things that perhaps you're going to share with them as earning respect of their peers and their teammates into their life after they get

Starting point is 00:36:32 done playing football. Yeah, obviously they've got to work hard on it. I, in speaking to my offensive linemen, especially the seniors, when I'm talking to them about, you have to exhibit leadership qualities, you've got to be a leader, et cetera. And by the way, that's one of the terms I think we throw around as football coaches all the time, leadership along with mental toughness and discipline that we never really define to the players. I know when I was a player and you were talking about discipline and leadership, I was like, well, I don't really know what that means.

Starting point is 00:36:59 But when I talk to my offensive linemen, I say, you can't ask, especially the seniors, You can't ask anything of anyone else in this group if you're not willing in already doing it yourself. Don't ask him to go harder. Don't ask them to show up earlier. Don't ask them to do extra. Don't ask them to have a better attitude unless you are doing it yourself.

Starting point is 00:37:19 So I think you have to care that much about everyone else in whatever group you're leading. If you're a captain of a football team or senior leader of a football team, I think everyone needs to know that you passionately care about them and the program you involved in. I think that's probably at the top of the list.

Starting point is 00:37:39 That has to be, you can't just do your job. We always tell seniors when they become seniors, doing what you did last year as a junior is not enough. You've got to do more. And I know a lot of times they're thinking, what do you mean? More, I busted my tail and did everything I could last year. That's not enough.

Starting point is 00:37:55 If you want to be a leader, it's not enough. And if you don't have leaders within the team, I think it's really tough to have success. I just think, you know, answering your question, summarizing, I just think you really have to care and it has to show how much you care about people and you have to do at least as much and probably a lot more than everyone else is doing to get them to follow you. I played for one year with your son, Brent, who is now the head coach at Centerville. I'm curious, not only, I don't know the topic of conversations if you guys don't talk about folks.

Starting point is 00:38:30 I know there are some relationships where you won't because you're both in the same performance. or maybe you do. I'm curious for those listening who maybe want to be a coach or maybe some of what you say could relate to people in all areas of what they're doing regardless of age. What are some of the like general pieces of advice that you give to somebody like Brent, your son, who is now a head coach high pressure situation. I realize you guys play against each other. So it's kind of interesting in that regard. But what are some things you share with them? to be honest, I don't try to overwhelm him with advice. If he asks, I give it to him. But I know I have told him you have to formulate things you believe in. You have to come up with you have to have strong beliefs on what you're doing in a leadership position like that, especially in a place like that where there's a whole, you're under a microscope. And formulate your beliefs based not on what you did in Ohio State or what you did in high school

Starting point is 00:39:26 or what me and Coach Greg did and you saw us do, formulate, or what you did when you coached at Dublin Kaufman, formulate them based on what all that stuff and what you truly believe. And then stay true to that. I mean, absolutely stay true to it. Block out the outside noise. Don't let it influence you at all.

Starting point is 00:39:43 I mean, I can think of times where there was a ton of outside noise when I was coaching there and negative outside noise for this reason or that. And you just got to get to the point where you don't even hear it. You have to block it out and make it meaningless. So those are the main things. You know, football things, we talk at times about things, and I usually give him bad advice so he coaches bad and we can meet him.

Starting point is 00:40:10 I mean, that's my strategy. One of the things, too, over the course of our four years together, you adapted to the skill set of your players really well. Prior to me getting there, there wasn't guys who could throw very well. I got there, we could throw, we opened it up a bit. And I obviously appreciated that ability to adapt and evolve, even over the course of just four years. It leads me to the question of your, I guess, framework for continuous improvement, adaptation, the way that you view how to operate. When I was these guys' age, I didn't think about that at all.

Starting point is 00:40:49 I just showed up and did whatever you told me to do. But I do think kids are smarter now. They're more advanced now. They can create some sort of framework for their own continuous improvement. What's yours? What's your framework or your thought process around? I'm going to be able to continue to adapt and improve for the times. Yeah, probably in a nutshell, just listen and learn.

Starting point is 00:41:11 You know, listen and learn, see and hear both. I probably, not probably, without a doubt, I think I'm a better learner today than any year of my life. You know, when I started out coaching, I thought I knew everything. And then once you start coaching, you realize you knew nothing. I mean, you're looking around saying, man, I had no idea that it was this involved and this is how you coach and this is what you have to know and this is the time you have to spend and you learn really, really quick. So any chance I get, like when I was coaching with Coach Greg, every single morning before

Starting point is 00:41:46 school, I would go down in his phys ed office, taught phys ed, and I'd get there about, I knew he got there about seven. I'd get down there about seven, ten, and we'd have a half hour to 45 minutes. We would sit and talk. He'd be eating these donuts from Bill's donuts. Like clockwork, he was a machine. He'd be eating them, and we would talk about everything, everything.

Starting point is 00:42:04 Tons about football, but more about people. He was a master about human nature and motivating young kids and stuff. He was a master. And I just was like a sponge then taking that in. And to this day, if there's people I think are great leaders or know a lot more than me, which is most people, I'm going to listen to them when they talk, and I read more today, not books.

Starting point is 00:42:26 I wish I did read books, but Mom never made me. But I wish she would have made me read books and play the piano. I would love doing that today. But I will read any topic that intrigues me. I'll have my iPad out, and I will search and I'll find, I'll read about that topic or that person to find out. So it's just, I think the main thing in continual learning is realizing that you've never arrived.

Starting point is 00:42:52 I mean, I think too many people succeed in anything, and once they've succeeded, they think they've arrived. It's like, here I am. Now I'm always going to succeed, and it just doesn't work that way. And when you're young, you don't realize that. You think, hey, I got the job I wanted. Life's cool.

Starting point is 00:43:10 I just live the rest of my life now. I was lucky to have JJ Redick on my show, and JJ just signed a good deal with New Orleans, and he was going back to Duke to talk to. their players and he saw seeing literally right across the front row all these McDonald's all Americans you know like literally every guy on the team pretty much and he's getting ready to give us talk and he looks down he sees right here and the guy's got a big tattoo right here and it says arrived and he goes hang on a second like I'm going to throw out my prepared remarks you've

Starting point is 00:43:41 never arrived you're always becoming and that became like his ethos for life and that's how he's lasted as this undersized little white dude shooting threes for 14 years in the NBA of this mindset of no matter what happens player of the year all state scholarship offers doesn't matter I'm always becoming I think it's a great mindset I think that's a great point that you can literally do whatever you want to do I mean you can do I mean I'm a big fan of JJ Reddicks from this point on since you just said that I think that's so important that people realize that that don't rest on your laurels you somebody's out to take your spot and it's always going to be that way I don't care what field you're in it's always going to be that

Starting point is 00:44:27 way and you never know when your spot's going to go to someone else or whoever you're working for is going to say hit the road we want somebody new so yeah yeah you're always becoming that's great coach uh did do you have questions or do you want to open up to the guys i'm not sure how much time we have or i want to make sure we hit okay do you have a question or do you any of the guys want to want to get going here I probably got a question for you. Okay, yeah. So you've interviewed a lot of people at a young, young age.

Starting point is 00:45:04 Yeah. Somebody, like you said, other than your parents, as you have studied leaders and you've interviewed them, and you've studied about them, preparing to interview them, what do you find is a challenge for a leader when they have peers that they are leading? so many times as a young person and a coach, they're putting in a positional leadership

Starting point is 00:45:27 because someone hired them to do it or they're paying to do it. But when you're leading your peers, suddenly you find yourself in a position where I think I can lead this group. No one has told me you're the leader. What are the challenges associated with that? Yeah, I think there could be challenges

Starting point is 00:45:42 from a friendship perspective. Because I remember, I went from my freshman year to my sophomore year. All of my friends played freshman football. And I didn't. I played on the varsity team. And then they came up, And there was just a brief moment of disconnect.

Starting point is 00:45:55 I remember Coach Greg and Coach Oliver pulled me aside, though, because as a freshman, I did probably what a lot of young guys did. I didn't say a word, right? I called the play, no huddle, and then I would call the cadence and then go. They said, you've got to find your voice. I probably don't even remember telling me that, but it's time. It's time for you to find your voice. That, as someone who was a little bit more naturally introverted,

Starting point is 00:46:16 was a tough thing to do. And tough because I did worry about perception. I worried about friendship. how is this going to go? Can I treat my friends like some of these older guys who I'm scared of, but they're lifting me to levels? That's becoming my responsibility. I have to voice that.

Starting point is 00:46:33 I'm going to do more, as coach just said, than just execute my role. If somebody is not doing their job, it becomes part of my responsibility to let them know that I expect more of them. And I do think there may have been some tradeoffs where they weren't necessarily, we weren't, I wasn't necessarily best friends with everybody. I think I was a good teammate. I tried to lead. But off the few of my best friend, honestly, was my younger brother. Coach probably knows that. And that was because that just, I don't know, a brother's type of a friendship where I focused more probably on leading, holding people accountable, trying to lead with my actions first. But if somebody didn't do their job, it became my job to let them know. And though, if they did do their job, I need to tell them.

Starting point is 00:47:27 I need to hug them. I need to love them. I need to tell them that to make sure they know that I appreciate their work, especially the O line. My dad was always good helping me. We would always have those guys over. We'd made sweatshirts.

Starting point is 00:47:39 We had all these different things. I tried to show my appreciation and love for those guys because they never really got any notoriety, even though they were one of the main reasons that we were so good. So it's a little bit of both, of showing the love, showing that you care, but also I think I prioritize more being a leader on the team than I maybe did some of the friendships. And I don't necessarily regret that, though. I think that was the proper move.

Starting point is 00:48:09 And I think it probably helped our team. I mean, I don't know if you have thoughts on that. Yeah, I was thinking when you were talking there to tag on to your question there about leading your peers, Coach Will. We talked recently about I got a call from someone who was Kirk Herbstre just turning 50 years old Maybe he has already now. I'm not sure when his birthday is, but and this person was saying they were they were putting some stuff together to give him and they want to know when did he become a leader do you remember in high school when did it the light bulb go on and he became a leader and I think they were surprised when I answer because I said as a sophomore Kirk was a JV quarterback very very introverted didn't didn't speak much I mean I taught him in class to, he's sitting in the back and if I look at him, he'd say, he'd go like this, meaning please don't ask me a question because he did not want to speak ever. As a junior, he was a very good quarterback, no leader at all. Our team was really good. We were the number one team in Ohio,

Starting point is 00:49:08 in the ratings in Ohio, at the end of the season, we were 10 and 0, but we never got better the entire year. We just kind of plateaued after the first, the first game we beat Princeton, who was one of the top two teams in the state every year back then. We beat them and we stayed right there all year. We had no leadership on the team. And Kirk would refuse to take the bull by the horns and beat a leader. So we get beaten our first playoff game. Got beat by Dayton Dunbar.

Starting point is 00:49:33 That was a good team, but they shouldn't have beat us. So we come to fast forward to his senior year. And we had many talks with Kirk about you're the guy. You're a national recruit now. You're the man. Everybody in this room is looking at you. to point the direction. We go out, we lose game one,

Starting point is 00:49:52 we lose game two, we're 0 and 2, we go up to Wayne to play, we're getting thrashed in the first half, and he scrambles because the offensive line is pretty much blocking no one. He scrambles to the sideline. He gets driven out of bounds into the track, up at Wayne, and right then, Kirk had it.

Starting point is 00:50:11 I mean, he literally lost it. He got up. We were in a huddle back then. He ran out on the field. The team was in. in a huddle. I vividly remember this. He is physically punching people in the huddle. He was done with this abuse that our team was taking. He was physically punching people, yelling at them, screaming. I'm thinking, who is this guy? And from that point on, we lost that game. We were so far

Starting point is 00:50:37 behind. We lost that one. We won the next seven. By the end of the year, I think we're the best team in the area. I don't think anybody was close to us. And he became a tremendous leader then. And he went on to Ohio State, and by the time he was playing in Ohio State, he was a great leader, and he's transformed into, obviously, tremendous college football personality is the best in the business. And you would never believe from knowing how he was his freshman sophomore and junior year in high school that he's even the same guy. So my point is, there's different ways to lead your peers. Some of it's taken, as I saw many times as a head coach over there, after practice, a senior with his arm around the player, walking back to what you know is the jungle of just. just weeds and bushes. And I knew he wasn't walking back there,

Starting point is 00:51:21 you know, to play checkers or anything, but they were just going back to talk. A senior was taken back there and say, look, we don't do things this way. You have to up your effort, change your attitude, and do things the way we do them here, and then we're all for you. So there's all kinds of ways,

Starting point is 00:51:37 and Kirk's just one way. My point, you have to step out of your comfort shell many times. You want to be a leader. If you want things around you, it'd be better, then you gotta have leaders. from within the group it's much it's much easier to follow just this and I think leadership is a choice it's less fulfilling though too absolutely less fulfilling but it's it's a it's an intentional choice to say yes I want that

Starting point is 00:52:01 responsibility I'm choosing that and you have to make that choice daily say I want to continue to be in that position take the good with the bad yeah go I'm gonna follow up your question so so I think when we're talking about leadership and holding your peers accountable. I think in this setting here, we commonly are thinking that's a finish through the line, that's the sprint. Well, that's hate. You better be alert for the snap count because that's a mental thing. You've got to be locked in. Or know your assignment. And those are things that obviously are burdened to people in the room. But you said something about friendship. And there was a little trade off here at times.

Starting point is 00:52:35 Yeah. So you're away from the football. This is a case of setting. We're out socially. We're in the locker room or we're in school. It's something that you know that your players are potentially going to be involved with. And if I take a stand against this, because I know it's not what's best for our team. This goes bad. This isn't going to be good for anybody. It's not going to be the popular opinion.

Starting point is 00:52:56 That tradeoff big time now, right? Yeah, I mean, this is something that I think probably did cost some friendships for me personally, is that we just made, I say we and my younger brother made the conscious choice that we just weren't going to engage in drugs and alcohol as athletes and felt like. And so, you know, I've seen some high school friends recently, and there are at times, I'm like, oh, you know, it would have been cool to hang out with them a little bit more. But it was never, I just, at the time, I never felt like that was going to benefit me in what I cared about most. Like I said, there are priorities in life.

Starting point is 00:53:30 And that's why I don't ever want to act like it's all perfect. Like, you have to choose. You have to make choices. And I think I prioritized being as good as I could possibly be. Because I also knew I was not near the best athlete on my own team. So I had to do I had to try to maximize everything I had and I didn't want to do anything that would potentially get in a way of that and I also felt a responsibility to my teammates. I didn't want to let them down and I felt if I part took in some of those things, even though some of them may have and I didn't, I felt like that was me not upholding my responsibility to them to get everything I could out of what I have been given still more than most, right? very fortunate, but not good enough to where I could just show up and you roll out the ball

Starting point is 00:54:17 and play like there are some guys now, you know, and I felt like, and I was grateful too that I had coaches who lifted me to levels that I didn't think possible. I would have never dreamt of starting even as a sophomore, let alone a freshman, and then having some success. That wasn't just, I just never thought that was possible. So that was part of it too where it helped from a prioritization perspective of saying, well, I'm just going to do everything I can when it comes to this. Yeah, you keep saying that the easy thing is to follow. The tough thing is to lead, and that goes with this topic too.

Starting point is 00:54:50 I mean, it's easy to just jump on a bandwagon and say, yeah, I'm going to follow you guys. That's the easiest thing to do. The toughest and most mature thing to do is say, I'm not going to do that at all, and not make adults make that decision for you. And it can be done. I mean, it can be... Personally, one of my sons, my oldest son had a lot of friends. I found this out later when his friends.

Starting point is 00:55:10 were over after he was out of college even and they said in all through high school your son he would never party with us he would never go out with us well he didn't know that he didn't say he would never go out he would never party with us and they would tell me about that say we go out and you know we do this and that and the other and he wouldn't partake and I said that true and they all said yeah absolutely and there's no reason for him to lie to me then he's he was like 24 years old at the time and I said but he was always with you I said yeah they all said yeah he was always with us he went with us and stuff but we got to the point where he we He was going to say no and we loved the guy and he was a good buddy.

Starting point is 00:55:44 So we just never, never even offered him or anything. He was just hanging out with us. He might go home early. He might not. But we just quit, you know, he had as much fun as we did. He just didn't do the same things as us. So no is an option. It's definitely an option.

Starting point is 00:55:58 I feel a little old making a statement like that. I don't know about you. Like you guys are like, all right, all right. They're rolling their eyes now. But I do, I agree though. I mean, it's a choice. It's a choice. And I don't know what it's like to be in high school right now.

Starting point is 00:56:10 So I do empathize with that a little bit, but I do know that it's a choice to be made. And some people choose to make it, and they need to. And it's right there for you. But I also realize it's probably hard to be a high school kid right now. Mr. Martin, our principal, is a question. Okay. He's a huge Chicago Bears fan. And knowing that you and your family, you're going to packers with AJ,

Starting point is 00:56:35 did you ever get tired of meeting the Bears or something? I think the first home game I went to they played the Bears. I wasn't always impressed with their fans, though. I was like, these guys, Lambo is a different animal because it's such a family environment. It's different to going to a Bengals game, I feel like. It was in family environment. The fans actually got along at scene for the most part. But, no, I mean, we became massive Packer fans for nine years, and still are, I would say,

Starting point is 00:57:03 because some of the guys that we know, well, there's only a few left, maybe one, actually, that were there when AJ was there. And so, yeah, and so other than him, that's kind of it. NFL's tough business. But, yeah, it was obviously like the luckiest, coolest thing for us to be able to go for that many years and have all those experiences. But, again, it started with the foundational work ethic that he created, I would say, AJ, going from his eighth grade to freshman year because he saw with these guys,

Starting point is 00:57:34 Coach Greg, Coach Allery, the foundation. they laid and just kind of, you'll ask him, I just followed what they did. That's all I really did. And he really kept his mouth shut for a few years, because he didn't have to say anything. You just show up and kill people and play well, and it was neat to see him make our team so much

Starting point is 00:57:51 better as a proud, proud older brother for two years. Well, I think he stayed quiet until about his junior year at Ohio State. Yeah. I can remember getting the call from, I can't remember who was Jim Haycock, their defensive coordinator, or I don't know who his linebacker coach was at that time.

Starting point is 00:58:07 Mark Snyder or Luke Fickle, I can remember. But getting a call, them wanting to talk about A.J. And I thought, well, did something go wrong? Is he heard her? And they said, no, we just want to know why he won't speak. And they said that, and I think that's when they went to him and said, you have to become more vocal. You have to. You're the leader. Everybody's looking at you. People are saying everybody needs to be more like AJ on this team. They want, they will follow you, but you've got to speak up. So even if it's not, if you're not comfortable, everybody's not speaking up sometimes I think you just need to try it because you'll be surprised how many people follow you yep agree other questions we good you guys now

Starting point is 00:58:50 are getting closer to the to put strapping the pads back on so but now I just want to say coach thank you for the opportunity it's cool to be good for me to get to do this in a formal setting with coach all already someone I I look up to I was asked one time is there any guests you would ever be nervous to interview like Elon Musk or the president or anybody. And I say, no, absolutely. There is literally, I feel prepared. There's nobody.

Starting point is 00:59:14 And then I said, maybe one. Maybe one. And like, really who? I said, Ron Allerie, my high school, Alvin's a coordinator because I always wanted to impress them, and try to live up to these lofty expectations. So I would say that. But thank you, coach, so much for being here.

Starting point is 00:59:30 Thank you guys for being here. This was a lot of fun for me. I really appreciate it. Well, thank you. And before we close, I want to say something about you. I want to tell you this, but I think this is very pertinent to you guys. This guy, he graduated from high school, went to Miami to play. Unbeknownst to him, they had signed Ben Rafflesberger at the same time.

Starting point is 00:59:49 Okay? A pretty tough guy to compete with there. Ben's not too bad of a player. And my point is, he wanted to be, Ryan wanted to be a college quarterback. That's what he wanted to do. That was his goal. He wanted to play quarterback on Saturdays. And he could have easily just kind of said, well, hey, Ben's,

Starting point is 01:00:07 the guy here and what you found out was they started putting you in slot receiver and running, you know, you catch a couple passes. You might run a trick play, a double pass or something like that. So his option was, and if I remember you told me, he said, I love everything about Miami. I love the coaching staff. I love the players. I love the school. I love the facility. I love the football. I hate Saturdays because you're staying on the sideline. So his choice is accept it or be motivated enough to go get what he wants to do, play quarterback on Saturday. So he made that conscious decision and you can do that. If you want something bad enough, he transfers to OU and starts for what a couple years there, finished his career at OU, had a good

Starting point is 01:00:47 career there. And the same thing happened with him, I don't know specifics about it, but in his career. He was working at Lexus Nexus here in town and had a good job and had chances for advancement, etc. But he wanted, and you were dabbling in stuff like this a little bit, but this was your passion. Yeah. That you really wanted to do it. So he could have kept going and getting a paycheck and making a good living and stuff, but he wanted to do what he had a passion for. And he decided, I'm going to make the move. And he's doing a great job. If you ever watch any of these podcasts, they're very interesting. They would be probably really pertinent to the classroom at times. If you have a project or something, you want to do anything on leadership for a classroom,

Starting point is 01:01:30 you could probably use his website and write your paper right off the website there. Or you get your presentation be amazing. So my point is if you want to he's a great example of somebody that I know as a freshman he wanted to play varsity football as a freshman he wanted to start when his brother was a freshman he wanted his brother to start you remember that much easier because he was a lot better than me but yeah I mean and he even lobbied then yeah he lobbied when AJ was not starting his first game or two I can't couple games they coached him in and against Troy he made a few tackles and coached he goes he's never coming

Starting point is 01:02:06 off the field and I said yeah all right we're good to go let's go now let's put them on offense too let's put them on offense yeah and we did yeah yeah we did we're stupid not too yeah yeah yeah so much for your attention and care and thank you coach this is a thrill for me to get to do thank you so much thanks guys thank you very much appreciate it thank you what a thrill for me to have the opportunity to sit down with the legendary coach Ron In front of his team and coaching staff at Springboro High School, I'm so grateful for the opportunity. He's still the one person that makes me nervous. I want to live up to his lofty expectations that I know he still has for me.

Starting point is 01:02:50 And it means a lot to me when he tells me he's proud of me. I love that guy. And it was a thrill to get a chance to deconstruct some of his excellence in front of his team and learn more about his mindset and process for kids. continuous improvement and how to exhibit leadership and mental toughness and discipline and the fact that you can't ask anything of anyone else if you're not willing and already doing it yourself. I got to witness that firsthand. The first guy there, never wanting to be the weak link, letting other people down, being the

Starting point is 01:03:26 most prepared person in the room every single day. I learned that from him and have implemented that into my life because of seeing him do that every day for four plus years of my time at Centerville. I'm so grateful. I hope you enjoyed this one as much as I did. I would love it if you would spread the message. Tell a friend or two, perhaps one that has never listened to a podcast, that this one with legendary high school coach Ron Ulry could be useful,

Starting point is 01:03:54 regardless if you play sports or not. I am so grateful that you, the great listeners of the Learning Leader Show, continue to give me the opportunity to do what I love on a daily basis. I will forever be grateful. All right. Talk with you next week. Can't wait. I want to let you know that we have opened up tickets for our once a year personal excellence workshop. We did this last year and received incredible reviews so we wanted to do it again this year, but make it even better. In addition to the topics that I personally teach on, I have reached out to the subject domain experts within my network to be with us in the room and share their expertise. Things like how to harness your

Starting point is 01:04:37 personal and professional flywheel to build an incredible career. Secrets from a professional keynote speaking coach. How to become a learning machine. How to utilize the mindset of a professional athlete in the business world and so much more. This workshop is ideal for you if You want to interact with intellectually curious and interesting people. If you want to accelerate your personal and professional growth, if you have an open mind and are not afraid to be challenged, and if you are currently leading a team or have a desire to at some point in your future. For more details, go to ryanhawk.

Starting point is 01:05:17 Me. This event is intentionally kept small so the experience is intimate, engaging, and interactive. For more details and to get your ticket, go to ryanhawk.me.

The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk - 325: Ron Ullery - Demanding Excellence, Delayed Gratification, Winning Titles

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