The Learning Leader Show With Ryan Hawk - 506: Buzz Williams - The 9 Daily Disciplines, Constant Improvement, Loving The Process, & Being on Team Bus One

Episode Date: January 2, 2023

Text Hawk to 66866 to become part of "Mindful Monday." Join 10's of thousands of other Learning Leaders and receive a carefully curated email from me each Monday morning to help you start your week off right. Full show notes at www.LearningLeader.com Twitter/IG: @RyanHawk12  https://twitter.com/RyanHawk12 My Guest: Buzz Williams is the head Men's Basketball Coach at Texas A&M University. He's coached his teams to eight NCAA Tournament appearances in 13 years as a head coach. In 2020, Buzz was named the SEC "Coach of the Year." His teams have won 20 or more games in five of the last seven seasons. Buzz's teams have four Sweet Sixteen appearances. Buzz is known as a coach who helps his players on and off the court. He teaches regular life development sessions to his players called "Get Better 101." Notes: Buzz has nine daily disciplines. "Your decisions reveal your priority." Train body at 5:30, get steps at 7:30, write 2 thank you notes per day, write children a note on their favorite color note card every day, read a book a week, weekly date night with his wife, and on non-gamedays is 7 meaningful texts.  "You can be whatever you earn the right to be." Team Bus 1 - The core group of people that make up the team. Those that sit on the bench and play in the games. In order to climb the ladder, you must go one step at a time. You can't skip steps. There are no hacks, no shortcuts. Being able to delay gratification is a superpower and creates the opportunity to make a big impact. It's the ability to show up each day and take one step at a time. "It's supposed to be hard. If it wasn't hard everyone would do it. The hard is what makes it great."  "History rarely remembers the critics. It remembers the contributors. So contribute!" "Energized leaders can evoke energy from within others. But when the leader lets up a little, followers tend to let up a lot." "The reward for passing the test is earning the next test." "Being a boss is a job. Being a leader is something you earn." "Goliath is not there to kill you, he is there to introduce you." "Pressure is a privilege." (Billie Jean King book title) "Basketball is not the source, it is the vehicle." "While we are leading, our rate of learning must be at least as fast as the rate of change." "Your patience when you have nothing, and your attitude when you have everything are two things that will always define you." "You grow up thinking winning is the scoreboard at the end.  But you learn there is so much that goes into the business of winning. Winning is the details-the discipline. The business of winning happens every second, and this business doesn't turn the lights off." "There's a ceiling to talent. There's no ceiling to someone's hunger & to someone's drive to be the best. How hard a team works, how hard they play, how together they are- there's no ceiling to that." Many times in life what's invisible is what's important. "True love does not have an agenda." Team Rules: Always tell the truth, no matter what Always be on time... 6 = early Be a great teammate... It compounds Never do anything to embarrass you/your family/your team/your school If anything is potentially a problem, please call Buzz What Buzz looks for when recruiting a player: Character IQ & EQ Work ethic - Do they want to work? Consumed with process Insatiable drive to get better A great teammate Life/Career advice: Never be without pen and paper. Take notes. Read more than you think you need to. Write down everything, about anything, all the time. Build trustful relationships. Seek to give to others and add value to their lives. Never turn down an opportunity to learn or work.

We have a new offering. My learning leader circles are full for 2023. So I called a friend for help. And I think this could turn into one of the coolest collaborations I've ever done. Matthew Dix is a 57-time Moth story slam winner and a nine-time Grand Slam champion. He works with leaders from Amazon, Microsoft, Salesforce, Slack, Harvard, and so. many more. Matt's recognized not only as one of the greatest storytellers in the world, but also one of the greatest teachers of it. And now he's going to lead a learning leader circle. I am so pumped for this. If you're curious to learn more about him, you can check him out on episode number 430 of the Learning Leader Show. I re-listen to it this morning. It is an absolute masterclass on becoming an effective communicator so if you want to give better

speeches to run more impactful meetings to become a better storyteller to raise the level of your overall communication skill and so much more than this circle is for you now space is limited because as I mentioned my circles are over capacity and so there are some members that have already joined this circle it will fill up fast If you want to commit to improving what I think is one of the most important skills that a leader needs to develop, which is that of being a vividly clear communicator and a great storyteller, then go to learning leader circle.com to apply.

That's learning leader circle.com and apply right now. Welcome to the Learning Leader Show, presented by Insight Global. your host, Ryan Hawk. Thank you so much for being here. Text, Hawk to 666866 to become part of Mindful Monday. You, along with tens of thousands of other learning leaders from all over the world, will receive a carefully curated email for me each Monday morning to help you start your week off right. You'll also receive details about how my book, The Pursuit of Excellence, will help you become a more effective leader. Text, Hawk to 66866. Now, on to tonight's future leader. This was a treat, the great Buzz Williams, the head men's basketball coach at Texas A&M University. He has eight

NCAA tournament appearances in 13 years as a head coach, has won 20 or more games in five of the last seven seasons, and was named the AP SEC coach of the year in 2020. But the most important, Impressive things about Buzz, as you'll hear, have nothing to do with wins and losses on the basketball court. Buzz has become an amazing mentor to me on how to live a fulfilling life. A few of the topics we discuss, his nine daily disciplines and why they are critical to helping him become the leader he's capable of. And then the five team rules, what they are, why they're important, and how you can implement the same for your team. And then the four must have characteristics to become a member of Buzz's team. And I admire how vividly clear he is on the intangibles needed to build a great team.

Ladies and gentlemen, this one is amazing. It's the great Buzz Williams. Coach Buzz Williams, man. It's so great to have you here on the Learning Leaders Show. Welcome, man. I'm honored to have a chance to be with you. I mean, that sincerely. I'm one of your biggest fans.

You have no idea. I haven't listened to all 500, but I've listened to many and have notes on everyone that I've listened to. I really appreciate that. It means a lot. To start, though, Buzz, I want to talk about time in your life years ago, when you were a bit younger and you needed to make some money to go to college. I heard the story about you would wake up early in the morning and your dad would drive you to a donut shop around 5 o'clock in the morning.

And one day you got hired by a guy who was essentially a handyman who would pay you $4 an hour. And this handyman that happened. One of the jobs that he asked you to do was to help him essentially replace a roof. And your job was to carry shingles up a ladder. Can you tell me that story and what you learned from that handyman? Yeah, it was just a variety of anything. You know, my dad would drop me off there at the intersection, the only intersection in the town that I grew up in.

And I was willing to do anything. I was just trying to save money so that I could go to college and ended up hooking up with the handyman, as you called him. And he did a variety of things, and he had a roofing job. And I was just the gopher. I couldn't do any of the real work. I was a late teenager. This was probably,

Ron, the summer of 88. So I would have been 16 years old. And, you know, bring the shingles up the ladder, you know, bring the nails up the ladder, whatever it was that he was needing

so that he could stay up there and do the real work. And I tried to carry too much, in essence. was getting bored. I thought I had figured it all out. And I fell off the ladder with all of the shingles and everything that I was carrying and just destroyed it all. It just went everywhere. And he came down the ladder. He was very upset. Of course, I'm trying to pick everything up. It's scattered throughout the yard. And he said, if you never learn anything, you should learn

one step at a time. And what I was trying to do was I was trying to skip a step. And he said, if you're going to get to the top of the ladder, the only way that you can get there is one step at a time. But you can fall to the bottom in one step. And so I've remembered that as if it was yesterday. And obviously there were a few more words used than the summary version that I just gave you. but I've always remembered that.

And not that I knew that my career was going to turn out to what it has become, but for sure, you can only be where your feet are. You can only go inch by inch, life's this inch, one step at a time, and you become so, or I become so anxious if I spend my time and energy on the future and at times become depressed and angry and resentful of things in the past, and can you be tough enough just to concentrate on right now? I saw you had shirts made with that statement as a mantra. In order to climb the ladder, you must go one step at a time.

And I think somebody on Twitter asked you, hey, Buzz or Coach Buzz, can we buy those shirts? We want to get those shirts. And you said, no, those shirts are only for people on Team Bus One. What is Team Bus One? Yeah, yeah. The shirts that you're talking about, Ryan, we call them quote shirts. we do 12 a year and we have done that now for

we've done that now for 10 years and so there's a lot to a quote shirt but a quote shirt can only be received by those on Team Bus 1 and a quote shirt is only when there was a lesson for your life it has nothing to do with basketball it's just similar to the story that you're talking about

I was telling them a story and it turned into a quote shirt. And each year we have a theme and each year we have a logo to match that theme. And so this year is our fourth year at Texas A&M and our word is foresight. And that's the ability to do now what you know will be needed in the future, to be able to think ahead and to be able to do your work now. And so on every quote shirt, we'll have 12 of them this year. The one that you just mentioned one step at a time was quote shirt number five for this year. So this is year four, quote shirt five. Last year was year three, your roots, your fruits are determined by your roots. Your roots determine your fruits. And so the number is always somewhere subliminally in the

logo. And so we don't refer to years. For instance, this is the 100. an 11th team at Texas A&M in the 22, 23 season, we never used those words with our team. This is year four and it's foresight. Now, obviously, it's year four since we've been here, but it could be a freshman on our team that joined our team in year four. And so, you know, when a kid finishes his career, he will have 48 quote shirts.

but if you ask him which year, he's only going to say it was foresight. It was roots determined by your fruits. And the same can be said from our time at Virginia Tech, etc. So the only people that get a shirt are those on Team Bus 1. Team Bus 1 are those that will sit on the bitch, those that will be in uniform and or wearing a suit. That's who is on Team Bus 1. my family is exempted from Team Bus 1. If my family is able to travel with me, I'm married.

I have four children. If they go, they get a seat on Team Bus 1. But other than that, everybody else is going to be on the other bus. And so that kind of gained traction a little bit last year towards the end of the season in our run. And I just referred to everybody as Team Bus 1. If you get on the bus that I get on, Team Bus 1, then that's who you are. If not, we're going to rent a different bus for everybody else. You've made it an accomplishment.

You made it special to be a part of Team Bus 1. And I feel like you could do that outside of sports as well. There's other ways you could implement Team Bus 1. I was thinking about it immediately when you told it to me when we spoke over the phone. Was that intentional? this team bus one mentality something that you've really thought about well i don't know that i necessarily thought of team bus one the words but i think uh anytime there's exclusivity and anything uh it creates in in certain respects it creates an uncertain unspoken pride

and uh if you're on team bus one uh that probably means that that there is a level of responsibility that comes with that. It probably means there's a level of consistency in your work that comes with that. And it's not for anyone. And I do think that it translates, I don't think that it has to do with sports. But I think anytime you can create exclusivity as if you have to earn this right, it's not something that's given. I do think that that creates pride, the good kind of pride, not the bad kind of pride. And when it comes to being disciplined, after watching so many of your videos now and really studying just the way that you behave and hearing you tell me, I'm blown away,

can you walk me through your nine daily disciplines and why these are so important for you? It's evolved and it's morphed. And I also know that, Ryan, I'm very, maybe too much in regards to my calendar. I just believe that time is our most valuable commodity. And I'm highly sensitive to how I use it. I'm highly aware of how I'm using it, who I'm using my time with. I believe time is similar to money. You can spend it, you can waste it, you can invest it.

And I think many times you can see parallel qualities in how people handle their money is similar to how they handle their time. And in my career as a head coach, I've been paranoid about dead time. I want to eliminate all dead time. Because within all of the categories that I want to be responsible for and have a positive impact in, there's not time for dead time. And you have to find ways to use your time to do undistracted work because that's the only way you're going to move the needle.

And so my daily discipline, have nothing to do with the itinerary of my day. So we're recording this this morning. I have this 90 minutes blocked out. That is one thing on the itinerary of my day. But it's not going to alter my nine daily disciplines. And then I, from an accountability standpoint, I track those per month.

I track those per year. and then I compare them to previous years and corresponding months in hopes that with each passing week or each passing month, however I'm viewing it or studying it, that I can improve. And I fight really hard to do those daily disciplines probably at times when I shouldn't, but it's just the habit that I've created. in the belief that I have in those priorities. What are they? Sir, I'm going to read every day. I read one book a week, and I've done that for a long time. So one of the boxes says 25 pages.

I read more than 25 pages, but how it started was when I was trying to get in the habit of reading. My goal was to read 25 pages. I have a quiet time every day. I write in a journal. I pray. I have a devotional book. I read the Bible.

When I was recruiting as an assistant, if I was recruiting Ryan, I would get a piece of paper and write Ryan Hawk and his information, draw a circle around it. And then almost like the spokes on a wheel, I would draw a spoke up. Okay, his mom is Miss Hawk. Here's her information. His brother is AJ. Here's his information. his high school coach, here's his information, his dad's information. And then all of the rinds that I was recruiting on Mondays,

I would call, write, email text, whatever applied in that era, everybody at the top of the spoke. And then on Tuesday, the one to the right. And then on Wednesday, the one to the left. And that was my day as a recruiter. So when my boss asked me, hey, how are things going with Ryan? Well, if he asked me on Monday, I'm going to talk about whoever was at the top of Ryan's

list or will on Monday, sphere of influence. So as I became a head coach, I realized that I couldn't spend as much time recruiting, but I had developed a really good rhythm and routine in the consistency of building relationships. So I realized that as a head coach, I need to broaden my, my relationships, people that could help me, people that could teach me, people, donors, administrators at the institution that I was that I needed to build a relationship with, deans, et cetera. So there's 120 people on my sphere of influence list. I change that 10% every month. 60 of them are based on my growth, my development. 30 of them,

are based on the institution where I'm employed. And 30 of them are based on no matter where I'm employed. If I'm a coach, these are 30 people that I want to have a relationship with. And again, this was circa 2009, WCET, right, call, email text. So four people a day, four, it's from me. It's not junk mail. It's not a mass text. an individual touch.

That would be one. I read a book several years ago about a guy who had an incredible trajectory to a CEO position. He lost it all. He lost his family. He lost his career. He lost his job, lost his money. And was in a one-bedroom apartment and started writing thank you notes. And he started writing thank you notes because he realized that on his assent, he was so selfish.

So I write two thank you notes a day. I train six days a week. I allow myself to be off on Sundays. And then based on the season, for instance, we play on Saturday. So Thursday, tomorrow will be a two-day box. And that's too much to explain that many of your listeners don't care at all. but what my process is two days before relative to our opponent. And then on Friday, one day before there's a box that is specific to things that I want to memorize.

Then the day of the game is these charts that I work on specific for the game. So there's one on there. It's no cheat. Basically, I try not to have sugar so that I can stay on top of my weight a little bit or my body fat percentage, whichever you prefer. So all of those things, Ryan, are just the discipline, whether I'm the basketball coach at Texas A&M or whether I'm an assistant for you that I believe are important to me. How do you have the energy and the stamina to do this every single day? Yeah, I don't. And I also, Ryan, I think that's where my struggle is as a leader is, you know, we all have the same pie chart relative to our time.

And so we all have to decide how is it that we're going to use that chart. And it's similar to coaching. It's similar to what you do. It's similar to, in my opinion, every podcast that I've listened that you've done, every leader is trying to figure out how to use their pod chart. And, you know, like literally late last night, I had not written my children's letters today. And I mean this in a sincere way. This is like a huge deal for me to be on this podcast because I say no to. all of this sort of thing, but that you would ask meant a lot.

So I got my haircut this morning at 6.30. And on Wednesdays, I don't lift weights, but I walk, run 15,000 steps. I'm doing this podcast, and then I'm going to speak at a luncheon before our coach's staff meeting. And late last night, as I'm getting my stuff organized for the day, I'm like, oh, I haven't written the kids yet today. And it was because I was traveling, recruiting yesterday, and normally I do it in advance. And my wife, Corey, she said, I think it'll be okay if you don't ride them. And I go, it would be fine. But I can't not do it.

It was a commitment that I made to myself going into my 49th birthday. Is there something that I can give to my kids every day between 49 and 50? that if when I'm gone, they have something that I gave them. And then I got to 50 and they're hanging them all over their room. They're hanging them on their door. My son in college files them in like this like box, like Ron Holiday research box. And I'm like, yeah, I can't, I can't not do it. But I do think that that is my struggle because there's not much.

margin in my day. And then when I'm so locked in on whatever my priorities are and or my itinerary, I think the thing that I have to be more aware of, and I'm aware of it, is how can I have white noise? How can I have blank space? And my personality is there's something that I can do. There's some way that I can help. And I think that as a leader, the more you serve those that follow you, the more that you invest, the more that you love them without an agenda, the more they'll allow you to lead them.

Energy is normally not the issue. It's, am I giving my energy in the right way? How do you relax? I love being normal. if I can just be at home, if I can go on a walk, I know this will sound maybe condescending. I really like when I don't have to talk, when I don't have to be, quote, on,

that's nourishing to me. I love to exercise. I was very unhealthy early in my career as a head coach, and I hired a strength coach who changed my life. And by him changing my life physically, I realized the impact of the change mentally, the change emotionally. And so I don't have a hobby per se,

and I don't think that that's healthy. I have tried to find hobbies, and I need to try to find some more because I'm over thus far. But just being with my children and my family and not having to do anything and being able to be myself, I enjoy that the most. I've found when studying people who have sustained excellence that they certainly have periods of times in their lives when they're, myopically focused on a singular task. And it feels like that's you, but you're also able to, given your discipline,

able to still be very connected with your family, despite the fact that you obviously care a lot about your players and your staff and your school and ultimately as a coach, you got to win games. So it seems like you fall into that bucket of people who are laser-focused. focused on the task at hand and don't really have time for golf or whatever the hobbies at some.

What do you think about that? Yeah, I've made my two sons play golf. My son was a senior in high school. This was the year after COVID, his senior year in high school. And now my youngest son is a junior. And I made them play golf. And in their sports career, despite me being a coach, I've never made them do anything.

I don't tell them how to shoot. I don't tell them, hey, you ought to try this. I just want to be their dad. And now I have made my youngest daughter, who is in eighth grade, play golf. So my youngest son's a sophomore in college now, and it was probably this past summer. He said, hey, dad, why did you tell me to play golf? Like, why did you tell me I had to play golf? And I was like, yeah, you're not going to see in me an example of an outlet.

I think there are some positives, I hope, in my example. But I'm very aware that one thing you're not going to see in how I live is let's go hunt. Let's go fish. Let's go play golf. Let's go to a car show. You're not going to see that. But I think there is a place for that in your adult life. And there wasn't a golf team in the country town where I grew up.

But I think if that is a habit of something that they learn to play or do, I think it's good. I think it's good for when they have sons. You can take, I'll go play a round of golf or I don't play around. I play three holes. I'll go play three holes with my sons. I'll go play three holes with my wife. But I do, I don't say this egotistically.

I think a portion of my skill or talent, and I don't know that that word necessarily applies, but one thing that I do think that I'm good at is I can stay focused. I can stay locked in almost like it's not really a talent. it's more like, are you tough enough to do it again? Can you do it again tomorrow? More endurance-based than talent-based? You know, like, can you do this tomorrow?

Yes, sir. Can you do it again the next day? Yes, sir, I promise I can. Okay, what about 300 days from now? Can you do it 300 days in a row? Yes, sir, I can do it. But that's not based on talent, in my opinion. But there is some level of talent that comes from the discipline,

required to do it over and over. Everyone has a different definition of success, and the definition of success probably changes as you mature and as you evolve. But I do think the word time is a part of the definition or should be because a lot of people can do things for a year. Some people can do things for a few months, but very few people can do. something of significance over a long period of time. Whether that,

whether we're talking about sports or leadership or just being a great dad or a great husband, to me, in my opinion, it has to include a sustainable period of time. Mayor Eric Adams is on here and he said, I may not beat you with brilliance. I'm going to win with endurance.

And I really did. with that. It feels like you do too where it's not necessarily about the brilliance or even skill I've developed, but I am willing to show up and do the work each day. I'm willing to do the do work when nobody's watching so that when people are, we perform at a high level. It's the things we do daily consistently over and over buzz. I talk with people trying to start podcasts to write books all the time, try to help them out. And that's the biggest, it's the biggest issue that you could imagine is they'll most people are excited to get started on that project. They're excited to write the book.

They're excited to start the podcast. But the endurance part is where we fall short for the most part. And I think that's one of the skills I've worked to develop too throughout the course of this. Is this the ability to endure, especially on the days when you don't feel good. And I think that's something that you live by too. You know, I think it's, I think whatever this word is, is it discipline, is it toughness, is it consistency, is it tenacity? Tenacity as a mindset, if that's the word we chose, I think it's a great equalizer. I think it's a great equalizer in life.

Are, am I the most talented coach? Absolutely not. I'm not even the most talented coach on my staff, much less in our conference or in college. But I don't even view the metric of a good coach the way most people do, because I didn't grow up thinking, yeah, that this is what my career is going to be. And so my lens, just like anybody else. It's all about where you sit. Where you sit is what you see. So where you're sitting right now, that's the lens in which you see things. And it's the same with me. It's the same with everybody.

But to me, whatever word this is that we're talking about, that's, to me, that's a gift. That's a talent. That's a skill. and it's an intangible skill, but, you know, we don't, we don't see things as they are. We see them as we are. Okay, well, I don't see myself as like an SEC coach.

I don't, I don't even, those words never even enter my mind. And it's not because I'm being silly. It's not because I'm trying to be humble. No, I don't even think of that. How can I help those around me? And then how can I do it a little bit better? And at some point, if I'm charged with being responsible for helping, then I have to find a way to help myself.

And in my figurative diet, if I am starving myself, eventually I'm going to starve those that, I'm charged to lead. There's so many examples of you caring and loving on your guys, your team, beyond what you see on the court. I just watched a 32-minute video of you teaching your guys how to introduce themselves. And it has nothing to do with basketball. I don't think there's a single thing about this video.

And there's tons of others, by the way, about you with your team. It looks like there's, you know, probably the people on Team Bus One is my guest is who's in this meeting room. Yeah. Good words, Ron. Good words. Yeah, yeah. These get better videos. And it's not like you're just saying, hey, you know, give a good handshake and walk around. It's like very overly detailed about shoulders back and positive body language and the web of your hand into their hand. I mean, it is insane how awesome this is that you do this for your guys. Can you talk me through? I mean, feel, feel free to go. through that one too, but just talk me through your mindset towards doing these get better sessions with your team to help them as people, just to be great, solid people, not necessarily have anything to do with playing basketball. It's a small percentage, probably too small a percentage. And my staff would say it's for sure too small of a percentage of time, do I spend talking to our guys about basketball.

I think the most important currency is people currency. And most of the time when people talk about currency, they're probably talking about money. But there's energy currency. There's relationship currency. There's time currency. And in our program, the most, important currency is the people. And so if the most important currency are the people,

if I'm deemed the steward of the people, then my job is to help those people grow. And it's somewhat of a paradox, but I believe that their talent is enhanced because of the environment that they're in. And so we spend an inordinate amount of time. The quote shirts are those quote shirts, you can only get a quote shirt during the season. Those quote shirts don't happen in the off season.

In the off season is when we teach Get Better 101. It's a class. At Virginia Tech, they were called Tech Talks, as in Virginia Tech. At Marquette, they started as life lessons. I just think that I am living a dream bigger than any that I could ever have thought of. And I'm overly grateful. And I'm very aware in this industry and how it's changed, how fragile that is. But it is, there were many coaches before me, and there will be many coaches after me.

me everywhere I've been. But while I'm there, I want to try to help. And if the only way that I try to help is shoot it better, run faster, jump higher, if that's all that they gain from the experience, then I felt that I've done a disservice to my commitment to their family. And there are times, Ryan, that our players want me to quit talking about life. But I've been doing it just long enough now that some of those guys that I coached 10 years ago, now they are married, now they have children, and now some of those things are coming out. So it's not as if while here they completely have this metamorphosis. But I do think that it begins to happen.

And I just think that in the end, because of how I've been blessed, that's part of my responsibility is to try to help others. I got the last two months of your calendars from your member of your staff. And one of the quotes that I really identify with, Buzz, is the reward for passing the test is earning the next test. And I'm sure we're aligned here because to me, someone's like, well, what do you want to do or what do you hope to do? And I said, well, and this may sound weird, but the reward I get is that I get to keep doing this. Like, that's, that's the reward. That's what

I want. And I don't know if that's, like, not thinking big enough. To me, I think that's, like, as big as it gets to say, like, I get to do this cool work. I'm speaking with Buzz Williams now, and we're having an in-depth conversation about life. This isn't about basketball. It's about life, right? About leadership and about learning. Like, it doesn't get any better than that. And so to me, the reward, the reason why, yes, you have to do some things to kind of support the business, to make sure you support your family, the reward is to, you get to keep doing this cool work. And I sense that that's how you feel about what you're doing. The reward is that you just get to keep doing it.

Team rule number three for us, we only have five. Be a great teammate, dot, dot, dot, in all caps, compound. And I teach them what compound is. most 18-year-olds are probably not aware of compound interest. The first time they ever heard the word compound was when they were in third grade and their teacher was talking to them about compound words. Two things put together. Well, that's the same saying in this topic, in my opinion.

You get this test and you're going to continue to get this same test until you pass it. And once you pass it, then you're moving on to the next. Mountain. And so, in my opinion, your answer to others is chock full of wisdom. You just mentioned your team rules number three. What are one, two, four, and five? Yeah, they're all real simple. Team rule number one, everybody has to be able to articulate it perfectly, including grammar and punctuation. Everybody has to be able to write it the exact same way. And so if you ask, I mean, you could, first of all, you could ask any player, anybody that gets on Team Bus 1 has to be able to do this.

So you could ask Josh. I know you know Josh. I know you know Landry. They could, they could answer all of these questions. I'll text them after all. I promise you they know. Team rule number one, always tell the truth, comma, no matter your emotional state, period.

Period. Secrets are lies, period. Team role number two, always be on time. Dot, dot, dot. The number six minutes, equal sign, early, period. I told you team rule number three. Team rule number four, never do anything to embarrass you slash your family. slash your team slash your school. And then team rule number five,

if anything, comma, is potentially a problem, please call Buzz. And that is that one, Ryan, is technically Team Rule 10. It's a long story on how that one

got bumped to Team Rule 10, but that would take more time. But years ago, that was Team Roll number five. It seems, though, to have a team that is, you have so many like the daily disciplines and the consistency and the messaging and the rules. I found though in order for people to really live these out, you have to be relentless and vividly clear in your messaging. Like it's a constant. It never ends. The players can recite them without even thinking.

They're unconscious. They're asleep and they're still saying them. So as a leader, again, that takes a lot of energy. And one of the quotes from your calendar that I identify. with and think about it. It says, energized leaders can evoke energy from within others. But when the leader lets up a little followers tend to let up a lot. I think this is a life skill, a leadership thing for sure, Buzz. Can you talk about the energy you bring and why it must stay up? And if you let up even a little bit, followers tend to let up a lot.

The complexity to being a leader. is much broader than I think that it was years ago. And the complexity is how can you help each person relative to where they are? And I think that some of that is IQ-based. I think a lot of that is EQ-based. And I think that, you know, the, the, the, ability to be self-aware is becoming a talent. And when you're leading, not only do you have to be self-aware of you, but I think you have to be self-aware of who you're trying to lead and how you can lead

them. And the energy required to lead a variety of different people, you have to have to have energy for them. Because if the energy is only for the group, it's kind of like should a teacher teach to the top of the class or the bottom of the class. And I would say everybody has thoughts on that. And so most of the time the teacher teaches right to the middle. So then the mean stays the same. And does the bottom ever really raise up? Is the top ever stretched?

In my opinion, no. And so I think that your energy introduces you before you ever say a word. And everybody has different thoughts on what energy is. Is it your body language? Is it your ability to have eye contact and listen with your eyes and listen with your ears? Is it just like what you're doing now? Like all of the all of the podcasts that I listen to of yours, they're on my phone. And then Josh sent me a text yesterday and said, coach, I just wanted to remind you that this podcast is on Zoom.

I didn't know. But I should have known because I've heard several of your guests mentioned during the podcast about you taking notes. But it never clicked. Oh, well, I guess they're doing that on Zoom because I'm just listening to it. And so I think that's energy. Energy is being engaged. Energy is there might be something that rhymes

going to say that I need to take notes on. Energy is how you grow. Energy is how you learn. Energy is energy can be a virus. Energy can be an influencer. Energy can be a good thing or a bad thing. And I think that the leader has to set the pace on that energy. And if the leader is going to set the pace on that energy, similar to what I said earlier, that leader has to find out and figure out how they can fuel themselves. Think of all the leaders in the time that you've been studying leadership and the time that you've been writing books, hosting seminars, doing all of the things and what this business for you has turned into.

And think of all of the ones that, I don't know if burnout is the right word, but they got to the end and they were like, okay, I'm done. I'm out. this i don't have anything left i'm bankrupt i'm exhausted whatever words would be used but it was because along the way to some degree they probably didn't know how to fuel themselves and so it's just like this is my opinion it's just like a good speaker the speaker that can only have one

speech once he makes his tour because he was good at it he'll get another round the second round, but he's not going to get a third because they're like, you just preach the same message. You know, like good preachers, you can tell they just got it out of the oven and they're serving it hot. But if they keep serving leftovers, you're like, I don't want to go to that church. He said the same thing. You know, and it's like you have to have that fire in your eyes as a leader where you're convicted by not only what you say, but what you do. Your words in your life have to match up. And in my opinion, that is your energy. You are in the business of identifying people to put on the team. You have to go recruit kids. And I know it's changed a lot over the years, but change is

inevitable. You've talked a lot about change and why as a coach and as a leader, you have to be embracing that and your ability to learn has to outpace the change. But I'm curious actually about what you look for in a kid. When you're, obviously they got to be able to play basketball. They got to be able to shoot and score and play defense and hustle, right? But what do you look for in a player outside of the, let's say, table stakes or they can play? What are the other intangible elements of a person are you looking for when you recruit a kid? The first thing for me is character.

I'm not really good around bad people. I don't think they understand what I'm saying. I don't think it's translatable. So character is first. The second thing, and I've changed the order on this throughout my career. The second thing is IQ and EQ. I think when there is a high IQ and a low EQ,

there's always going to be a fracture in leadership. Somebody that's really smart, but is very not self-aware or of others, there's going to be a fracture. And it's because of the disparity between the two. So IQ and EQ is really important. We have one specific player on our team now, Ryan, that he was recruited.

he's a good player, he's going to end up being a great player. And it's just beginning to blossom and everybody that kind of knows. They're like, hey, Buzz, we didn't know he was that good. And I go, well, he's not that good. He's good.

But you're only talking about his talent. What gives him a chance to be great is he has a very high IQ and he has an ultra duty almost same level EQ. So he's very smart, but he's very smart of what's around him.

So he can help his teammates figure out what they're supposed to do next before his teammates can think of it. And so his IQ and EQ you are really high. And he's a great human being. I think the third characteristic for me is their work ethic. Do they want to work?

Are they consume with the process or are they only wanting YouTube clips? Are they only wanting TikTok posts? are they only wanting IG story likes? So it's a different era. I'm not judging any of that. I'm not saying it should all go away. I'm not saying that. But is there an insatiable drive to get better?

Because if they have an insatiable drive to get better, they're going to want to work. That doesn't mean that, they don't TikTok, Snapchat, want to know about NIL. I'm not saying any of that, but they want to work because they understand there is no finish line. And I think when your motivation and your drive are to improve and you are smart and you are aware and you're a good human being, now you've got a chance. I could talk about a few basketball specific things,

but the fourth category that has nothing to do with basketball is, are they a great teammate? That's team rule number three, be a great teammate. Dot, dot, dot, all caps compound. And, you know, team rule number five, I know I didn't like end that very well on how I said it, but team rule number five is when a coach calls or text respond in the same manner. Like, team rule number one is tell the truth. Like a lot of those rules are character specific.

And I think when your character, your IQ, EQ, your work ethic, and now you're unselfish, now you're a great teammate. Okay, now you have a chance to have a great career because those things that are not in the scoreboard over time, if you're doing the things the right way each day and your daily habits, in our culture, you're going to get better. Is it harder to find those people now than it was in the past? I'm serious. To have all of those, because those are, you're talking about a really quality person here,

high character, high IQ, high I EQ, great work ethic, not caring in too much about the the stories and all of that, which I go to games and see the, see the guys filming. And sometimes the players are very aware to point to them or to put the three sign up right to the camera. Like they're thinking about what's the same. Some of those photographers are there because of that kid. Right. Like they're working for that.

So for you, these guys, right, they've probably been heralded since they were eight, right? They're playing AAU. They're all over the place. Like they grow up in this. Is it harder to find the person who's got all of those intangibles and is a great basketball player? Yeah, that's what I was having this conversation with one of my assistants. Two days ago, he's on the road recruiting because we only play one game this week.

And we were talking about IQ. Yeah. And my assistant, this particular one, he's very intelligent. And he has a very high IQ and EQ. you and we were talking about literally this question. We don't want someone that's not a bad, we don't want anyone that's a bad person because they won't even make it to the floor.

We want somebody that's really smart and emotionally aware. We want somebody that wants to be coached and that wants to work every day. Yeah. And then we want someone who's unselfish, who has a pure intent of heart, who will be a great teammate. Yeah.

Okay, well, coach, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, that, uh, that, that, uh, shrinks the pool really, I was going to say. Because we haven't even talked about his talent yet. Right. And I'm like, I know. But it's the same thing in, um, hiring, right? Yep. Yep.

Do you, do you want to hire an ultra talented salesman? Do you want to hire an ultra talented recruiter? Uh, even, do you want to hire an ultra, um, um, the ultimate tactician, but then they have problems off the floor. But then they have a hard time waking up every day. But then it's all about them all the time. I don't know that that translates to the team. I don't know that that helps the team.

It may help win a game because of the talent. but the sacrifices that went into winning that game, how much did that erode what you want your program to be about? And so, yes, sir, it has changed a lot. But some of that change, Ron, is not, I'm not saying that because of society or the children. I'm saying a lot of that has changed, Ron, because of how I see things now.

And I also have more evidence and I have more data. And I've also done it now for a while. If you would have asked me 10 years ago, well, I had coached 100 games as a head coach. And I'm not old, but I'm not young anymore. I've coached over 500 games now. And so I've seen the ultra-talented guy that it just becomes a disappointment

because it never translated. and there was not positive growth on a daily basis because of one of the four things that I mentioned to you earlier. And so I know that it restricts the pool and I know that it requires an inordinate amount of time vetting by our staff. And we're not going to hit 100%. This is not science that you're dealing with people. and their lives and their emotions and things that transpire. But I do think if you were to have a coaching clinic and someone were to ask me those questions, those would be the things that I would say are most important to me in who we recruit and in who we hire. And when I look for someone on staff, I have passed on many talented people.

and we have ultra-talented people on our staff now. But in relation to my energy and how I operate daily, if it's exclusively based on your talent, eventually you're going to become tired physically, mentally and emotionally, because of the pace we go at. And so if there's holes in your game, so to say, in one of those first four categories,

you're probably going to have a shortened experience or tenure with us. I just can't see being a part of your program unless you are 100% in. It won't last very long. Right. It's just too hard. There's too much. There's too much to it. I think the hard is what makes it good.

I think that is part of what makes you feel probably a sense of fulfillment for being a part of a program where it is hard. It is disciplined daily. You do have to be consistent. There are things you have to live up to. But, and I played for two coaches in high school who were like this, my head coach and office coordinator, Buzz, and this is why I love talking with coaches like you who remind me of them so much. It is life altering.

It changes the arc of your life to be impacted by people like that. That at the time, there were moments where I was like, God, what, can they just? get off my back. Stop. Stop. But now I love them. I truly, I legitimately love them for what they've done. And that's why I think it's cool that you take, you don't take yourself too seriously,

but you take the work very seriously as far as the impact you're having on kids and well beyond just them. And I think that's, that's pretty awesome, man. Well, the right way is the hard way. Yeah. It just is, is. But in the moment in time that you're talking about right, it's human nature, including mine. Hey, is there an escape valve just for right now?

Is there a way that I can come back to this at a later point? And, you know, it's like you want to live your life from start to finish. And if you're talking about start to finish, whether you're talking about the start, the dot in between the day you were born and the day you pass away, a lot of times people are talking about the length. You know, you want to live your life from the start to the finish. But I don't think it's just about the length. I think it's also about the width. And a lot of times this subject matter that we're talking about, it's not really the length that we're talking about. We're not talking about, hey, are you going to, are you a Juco kid and you're going to be here two years?

Are you a high school kid and you're going to be here four? We made redshirt you. You're going to be here five. In the transfer portal, you can transfer as many times as you want, regardless of what Twitter says. And you may be at one place, one year. You may be at three places within your career. You're talking about the length. But I think when you start talking about the hard stuff, like what you were saying as a

player you were like hey coach can you just freeze that for a minute bro like that's enough like just just just for just for today can you holler at my buddy and i was telling our guys we were playing a game at home two games ago we're winning we're going to win the game it's like the two media it's the third media time out of the second half and i'm meeting our group before they get to half court on the way to the bench. And I was revved up in a positive way with one of our new guys, who's only been around me for at that time seven games. And he was Ron Hawk at that moment in time that you're mentioning with your coach,

like, goodness gracious. Like, what now? And I told him, and by the time it gets to this portion of the conversation, we're now in the huddle. Amen, it's my fault. I just care so much. That's a blessing, but that's also a curse.

So what I'm saying to you, I'm not asking you to be perfect, but I'm saying this care factor, that's a stat. And I just, I want you to care about that as much as I'm caring to try to help you, care about that. And to me, that's the width. And that's where people struggle because, hey, coach, let's just do it again tomorrow. No, I tell you what, let's start over at stretching.

And let's start the practice over now. Oh, come on, coach. No, let's, let's just start over. And that's the width. And the right way is the hard way, but it's just human. nature, no matter who you are, no matter your gender, no matter your age, hey, you don't have to write the note to the kids tonight, but you don't have to do it every day. Yeah, I don't, but I do. And so I think that that's like, that's what you're talking about. It's the whip. Yeah. And that's the, that's the impact that you have on these kids. Because at times they're like, like me, you're too immature to understand. Sure.

And that's why those leaders can help you better understand and they impact you for the rest of your life. And I vividly remember Buzz being in period 16 of a 24 period practice and the coach saying, we're going to start at period one. We're starting this thing over like, oh, no, you know, but you learn a lot on those days when you go back to period one after period. We're starting with Indies. Period one.

Yeah, exactly. We're going to go walk through to go snap. quarterbacks and centers go work on snaps, you know, like that type of stuff. One more, I know you got to run, man, because you got a speech, but I don't even know how you're going to give a speech after just like pouring everything out right now for an hour and 20. I know. I've really enjoyed it. Thanks for teaching me. Well, hey, man, thank you.

People who are early in their career, maybe they're college grads. They're in the working world. And they want to leave a positive dent like you are doing right now. But they don't really know how yet. They're not really sure. They just know that that's what they want to do. What are some general pieces of life slash career advice you give to that person? I always say four things.

I always ask them to write it down. And then if they don't have pen and paper slash journal to write it down, I tell them you should never be caught without pen and paper anywhere you go the rest of your life unless you're in a shower. And to me, your phone doesn't count. because I think when you have to manually write something, you actually get two reps. I think when you just type it in your phone like it's a text message, it's not as powerful. So true. So the four things that I'd say are read, number one, read way more than you think you should.

Number two, write down everything, comma, about anything. comma all the time number three build trustful relationships for ten years from now comma but learn to connect the dots between now and then and on that point if i'm talking to him face to face I always explain to them that trustful to me means you never ask for anything. I think so many times in the initial plight, you're asking for something. And I think it needs to be the exact opposite. I think you need to figure out a way to give something. And so, for instance, on,

I'll say this to you. I've already added you to one of the 60 for January for me, because I want to build a relationship with you of the 120. But you're one of the 60 that are personal. So I didn't ask to be on your podcast. I understand how it all got connected. But because this is been our only interaction. I want to build a trustful relationship with you for 10 years from now. And trustful to me means I'm never going to ask you for anything. I'm not trying to get to know Ryan because he's an author, a speaker, a podcast host. No, I want to get to know Ryan and what can I do to give something to Ryan? And I think many times the reason why relationships fell

as it starts the other way. And I would assume this happens a lot to you. Straight up from the side door, a back door, through somebody else. People are trying to get to you to help themselves. And I always think that that never works over a long period of time. So trustful to me means I'm giving and never asking. And then number four is never turned down an opportunity to learn or to work.

I think a lot of people want to learn and it's selfish in nature. They want to learn to help themselves. which is not a problem, but very few people that want to learn also want to work. Hey, I want to work. Okay, well, you can come work over here and work camp and teach the second and third graders how to dribble. No, coach, I'm wanting to be a college coach. I understand. But you might need to go over there in the auxiliary gym because I might walk through there.

and I want to see if you even know what you're talking about. But I see a lot of people that they want to learn, they want to come to the coaching clinic, but they don't want to work. And the last thing on number three that I felt to mention, learn to connect the dots between now and then. As you're growing in your relationships that are trustful, where you're giving. Over time, if you are consistent in building a trustful relationship,

they will want to help you because they realize you're helping them. And over a 10-year period, you will be able to learn to connect the dots. Oh, this is Ryan. I met Ryan through Coach Eson. Well, I met Coach Eson through a strength coach. The strength coach asked me to get to know him, because Rob used to be on his staff with him. Well, I didn't know Rob, but I didn't know that back then that that would be the conduit to this. But if you're doing it in a trustful way,

how can I help you? Over a 10-year period of time, you'll begin to connect dots. And everybody wants it now, and it's not going to happen now. And sometimes it does happen now, but it's probably not going to be sustainable. I think having a focus on being a value-added resource

for every relationship in your life. I think about this with my wife. What am I doing to add value to her life every single day? Consciously, intentionally that with that number one relationship and then all others as well. And if not, if I'm not adding value to your life, Buzz, then I've not earned the right to be a part of your life. That goes with all friends, all relationships, anything, any client that may even pay me with.

Regardless, I tell all of them, too, I don't do contracts because you can fire me at any moment. Any second you can fire me and you do not have to pay me because if I'm not adding value, I'm not doing what I said I would do, I couldn't accept that. And I think it's whether it's relationships or its work or it's business or its clients, there aren't there aren't contracts. It's, hey, I got to keep earning it. I kind of like that approach. I think that's the right way to approach things.

And yes, you will get burned every once in a while living that way. And you certainly couldn't do that like in your situation where you work for a school. But for the most part, this being a value added person to others' lives and viewing it that way, whether it's the most important relationship you have with your spouse or beyond that, I think is the way to go about it, man. I love that. I love it. I know you're at time.

you got to go give a talk. This has been amazing. I certainly don't want it to be the last one both on and off the microphone, but I really appreciate it, Buzz. And you didn't come here to pitch anything. We just came here to have a conversation. And I learned so much. And I certainly want to looking forward to continuing our dialogue as we both progress, man.

I'm not very technologically sound, but I know how to pull my phone down where it will sink up so that whenever you release a podcast, It shows on my phone. I think you're changing lives. And the one thing that I've learned from listening to you, because 85% of your guest, I don't even know who they are, which is kind of why I like it. Yep.

And so, you know, I just click the button. And I'm waiting on you. Hurry up and say what you're going to say, Ron. Now, tell me who this person is you're about to have a conversation with Because I see their name, but I don't know who they are and I'm driving or I'm walking and I don't want to Google it. So tell me who they are. And then I'm like, oh, man, this is going to be good. And then I hit pause on your podcast more than any other podcast because my brain is very chaotic.

And so when I hear something that is a good morsel of wisdom, I hit pause. and then I say it out loud. And then I keep it on pause so that I can process what was just said. And I will say this, half of the time, it's not what your guest says. It's what you say to your guest. And I'm like, who, this is power

because it's not one-sided. Yep. And you can tell that you take pride in your craft. because you research who the guest is and you meet them where they are, which to me is a sign of a leader, an effective leader. And I think that the intent of your heart is only to help. And I believe that God blesses that. And I believe that you're impacting thousands and thousands of people that you will never have any idea. who they are. Similar to when

you called me to step this up when Rob was saying Ryan Hawk, I thought he was talking about a player. Yeah, I know who Ryan Hawk is, but I didn't know he was talking about the Ryan Hawk. Then he was like, you know, the podcast, I was like, oh, yeah, I know Ryan Hawk. I thought you were talking about

a basketball player. Like, I have the utmost respect for you and I wish you the absolute best and anything. that I can ever do, count me in. I'm there. Thank you, man. That means a lot. It truly means a lot to me to hear you to say that someone who's accomplished and is impacting as many people as you are and doing it with such heart and such intention, man. I look up to you a lot. So the feeling is mutual, Buzz. I look forward to many more of these in the future, man. Merry Christmas to you.

All right, man. You too. Thank you. Thank you. Buzz Williams has become a life mentor for me. I'm grateful. for his friendship and look forward to many more conversations in the future. I love the fact that I talked with a basketball coach, and I'm not sure we talked about anything in relation to actually playing the game of basketball. It was about leadership and learning and living a fulfilling life, trying to help others and add value. And that is, again, another reason why I'm so grateful to have this platform and this

podcast to be able to attract somebody like Buzz to want to come on this show. I hope you enjoyed it as much as I did a few takeaways from my note. The life advice, I wasn't sure what he's going to say, and of course, he just absolutely killed. First, never be without pen and paper, good idea. One, read way more than you think you need to. Two, write down everything about anything all the time. Three, build trustful relationships. This means we're seeking to give to others and add value to their lives first before asking for anything. Then never turn down an opportunity to learn and work. And I love the example he used about working the camp.

Are you willing to go to the auxiliary gym and coach the second graders? You're not going to start getting the prime perfect role or job. And this applies in so many areas of life well beyond just being a basketball coach. If you're getting a new sales job, are you willing to take the worst territory on the team? Are you willing to turn something around? You're going to learn, but you also got to work. And I thought that was a big part of it. That has nine daily disciplines, just being that intentional with what he does each day.

One, as I told him, it's got to be exhausting. But I admire how intentional he is about showing up each day. As he said, your decisions reveal. your priority and you can be whatever you earn the right to be then the last one in order to climb the ladder you must go one step at a time this is where we started the conversation you can't skip steps there are no hacks there's no shortcuts being able to delay gratification is a superpower and it creates the opportunity to make a big impact and I think it's the ability to show up

each day and take one step and then the next step and the next step. As I told Buzz, I try to help people get started with these ambitious projects like writing a book or starting a podcast or even launching a business at times. And I think one of the biggest issues is most do get started. They get excited. They're pumped and they realize that it's really hard to consistently show up with high energy and excitement and enthusiasm. to do great work day after day after day.

And so that's why I admire the endurance of people and try, I aspire to have that myself. Once again, I am so grateful for you, for listening and spreading the word and telling a friend or two, hey, you should listen to this episode of the Learning Leader Show with Buzz Williams. I think he'll help you become a more effective leader

and because you continue to do that and you continue to write reviews and rate the show, Hopefully five stars on Apple Podcasts. I get to keep doing what I love on a daily basis. And for that, I will forever be grateful. Thank you so, so much. Talk with you too. Can't wait.