The Life Of Bryony - Lou Beckett on Parenting Hell and Being Too Tired for Sex

Episode Date: February 9, 2026

This week, I’m joined by Lou Beckett – mum of two, history teacher and wife of comedian Rob Beckett – who shares a hilariously raw take on what it really means to be the default parent. Lou talks about carrying the invisible labour and mental load while Rob is away, the identity freefall of stepping away from work, and why women are still expected to “have it all” while running on no sleep. We get into birth trauma, breastfeeding guilt, and why feeding your baby formula is not a moral failing. Lou explains what it really means to be the default parent, why schools always ring mum first, and how resentment quietly builds over time. We also talk about being completely “touched out” by kids hanging off you all day, and then being expected to switch into sex kitten mode the minute your partner walks through the door. This is a funny, deeply validating conversation for anyone who has ever thought: I love my kids, but I am absolutely done. BOOKS DISCUSSED IN THIS EPISODELou’s Book, Lessons from a Default Parent: Surviving the Front Line of Family Life (Without Losing Your Sh*t), is available to buy from 12th February 2026.WE WANT TO HEAR FROM YOUGot something to share? Message us on @lifeofbryonypod on Instagram.If this episode resonated with you, please share it with someone who might need it – it really helps! Bryony xxCREDITS:Host: Bryony GordonGuest: Lou BeckettProducer: Laura Elwood-CraigAssistant Producer: Sam RhodesStudio Manager: Sam ChisholmEditor: Luke ShelleyExec Producer: Jamie EastA Daily Mail production. Seriously Popular. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Now this week's guest, Lou Beckett, is a mum of two, and as the wife of the comedian Rob Beckett, she's a key component of the hit podcast parenting hell. But today she's giving us her side of the story as she shares about what it's like to be the default parent. That's the one who juggles all the invisible labour, mental load and general chaos of life when your other half leaves you holding the fort. It's much harder work to be a good parent than it is a bad one. So if you're working hard, it's because you're being a good parent. It's because you're putting you all in it to do it well.

And hang on to that instead of going, oh my God, I'm working so hard and I'm still shit. You're not. Yeah. It's just there's a balance to everything, isn't there? My chat with Lou, coming up right after this. Lou Beckett, welcome to the life of Brian. Hi, thank you. Lessons from a default parent.

I want to talk to you about this book and the genesis of this book. Yeah. Okay. So your husband is someone called Rob Beckett. And he presents this podcast that some people may have listened to or parenting hell. Yeah. Which is basically him and his mate, Josh, just whanging on about how awful parenting is, right? Yeah, started in lockdown, I think, so they could go to the end of their gardens and, I think, escape for a little bit.

And then not parent. Not parent. While talking about parenting, I'm quite frustratingly for Roseny. Because we were like, you're just trying to get out of it. It did quite well. So now I can't even complain about it that much.

Well, it's done really well. I can. But you did write this blog post a couple of years ago, which is what has sparked this book. So it was like, I imagine it's like you're sitting there going, hang on, I'm actually the default parent in this situation. Can you talk us through? what happened? I think that that blog post was a culmination of a couple of different things.

It was obviously Rob's got an outlet for all of his feelings and the things, you know, he's got an outlet. He goes to work. He's got his podcast, all of those things. And I love being a parent and I love the choices that I've been able to make. I'm very grateful for them. I was able to stay at home when I wasn't very well and then I've been able to stay at home with the girls. but I think I hit a bit of a wall about a bit of a wall full rocking in the corner breakdown at the end of the summer holidays where like I've been parenting

pretty much full time for eight years and when Rob's away he is away like it's feast and famine when he's home he's super present very engaged we'll do all of it but when he's not there he's just not there and he's not there for quite a long time like you write in the book about how the last year he was away 120

nights of the year. I think we're knocking around 180, 190 now because obviously more things got added in. So yeah, it's... Most of... It's a good half of the year. And it's not all the time, but when he's not there, he's very much not there.

So it's worked for us, me being at home and staying with them because for me to go back properly, I would either need a lot of childcare that when Rob was home, we wouldn't need it at all. And there'd be all three of us just kind of sat looking at the children going, oh, too many cooks here. But yeah, I think I've been parenting for a really long time. I hadn't gone back to work, so I'd lost that anchor of who I was pre-mum.

And I didn't realize how much of me was wrapped up in kind of teaching and my career and how much my identity was part of that. And then I'd gone for this job interview. I thought, I'll go back to teaching. The girls were old enough now. They're in school. Really lovely job came up like two, three days a week. And I was like, lovely, I'll go and do that.

And I really, I think I was quite naive. It sounds like honestly the worst job interview. I just went on and on and on. I was like, let me leave. I wouldn't employ me either. Just let me go home. It was a girls' private school. It was a girls' private school.

So you're a history teacher. I'm a history teacher, but I taught. So my last job where I was kind of full-time employed was a boys comprehensive in Thamesmead, which is very different to a private girls' school in the challenges that I loved it. And I really felt like I did some of my best teaching and made a difference for the cliches that come with that.

But when this job came up, I was like, oh, it's around the corner. It's challenging in different ways. You know, the expectations are different. It's more about results and stuff. But I thought it would be really nice to go in and just teach and maybe not have so many of the behaviour things that maybe I had in my previous school. At a boys stay school.

Yeah, yeah. or there'd be less hands in pants, if nothing else. Right, right. That sounds lovely. I was well ahead of the curve with like the ditto sprays and the, and the dettle wipes because I dettled everything in my classroom. Right. Like every pen I handed out, they'd be like, miss, it's so offensive

because I'd be spraying it with my dettel aerosol. And I'm like, you keep your hands in your pants. Yeah. I'm not touching that until it's been dettled. That is, which I think is fair. That is, is that, is just teenage boys, is it? Yeah, I asked them once. I was like, like, for why?

Why? And I was warm. And I was like, ugh. Okay. I was like, do you know what? It's also warm. Your pockets. Doesn't need to be inside the like the waistband of your trousers.

But they all do it. If you look at men as well, they all just stuck their hand in. I don't know. Maybe it's comforting. I'm still. Okay. Okay. I'm going to confess something here, okay.

Which is that at night when I'm in bed, I quite like, it's not like I. It's not, it's not like I'm like wanking or anything. Although there's nothing wrong with wanking, obviously, at night in bed, in your own bed. But like, I like to just hold my vagina. Okay. In my pants sometimes. Fair enough. Why have I just said that on a podcast?

To each, their own? Hang on. So we've already, so you go off and you think, right, I'm going to go back to my career as a history teacher, but I'm going to go to a private all-girls school. was looking for something part-time because I thought then if I needed, especially because obviously teaching works really well once you've got kids in school because roughly the term times and stuff would marry up. And I thought I could do this level of childcare with breakfast clubs and after-school clubs, like the wraparound care, I could get my girls into that and then

I could go and teach for these few days. And I thought it would be a nice entry way back in. What I didn't have, and I really should have done in retrospect, is that the application deadline and the interview date was only a few days, like between the two. So I didn't have enough time to go back into a school and kind of sit at the back of a classroom because I've been out of it for like eight years at that point. And I think that would have really made a difference because I, it was just teaching interviews go on for so long as well. I've never really interviewed for other jobs. I've worked in pub and shops and library and stuff, but other than like proper career jobs, it's only been teaching. So I don't really know how other interviews work, but teaching interviews

He's like, you teach a lesson for an hour. You have a tour of the school for an hour. You interview with the head of department. And then you sometimes have an interview with the head as well. So it's like it's a four hour process. And unless you go and hide in the toilet and pretend you need a wee, there's no chance to like regroup and calm yourself down. And I very much did not calm down all day.

I couldn't start my own PowerPoint at the beginning of the lesson. Complete. One of the kids had to do it for me. And I was like, I did this yesterday. How can I not? Just couldn't find the button. Couldn't find it. Couldn't start it.

It was, and then they give you very basic data on the kids that you're teaching because obviously they can't give you loads because of data protection and so on. So you get kind of rough levels of where they're out so you know where to pitch the lesson. What they hadn't told me was one of the girls at the front lip breeds. Right. So I'm marching all around the classroom thinking I'm being like in with the kids. And I like to move right. I don't like teaching from the front.

So I'm moving all around. I'm talking to him and I keep pulling this girl up. Talking to her mate. or I think she's talking, she's actually trying to find out what the hell I'm talking about. But no one told me. So then at the end,

they were like, oh, you know, you did actually need to stand at the front because somebody was lip reading and I was like, tell me. Tell me that. Yeah, in the one-on-one interview, they asked if I wanted a moment

to calm down and catch my breath. I was like, cool. So it didn't go well. No, no, it didn't. So then you get home, I didn't calm down for a good few days, I don't think. I'd reach like a level of panic.

You know, you just can't calm your breathing down. And so, like, I'd done a reasonable job, I think, but I don't think I would have employed me either, given my performance. And I was really frustrated because I was like, it was a lovely school. And it was the right kind of part-time that I was looking for. And I just didn't feel I'd done myself justice. And I was annoyed at that. I was like, even if I don't get it, I don't feel like I've shown them what I can do.

And then, like, normally you find out on the day, and it took three or four days. And I was like, let's just call it here. Like, I know, you know, we all know. just say I've not got it and then I can kind of draw a line under it. But I, so I was at my girl's swimming lesson. So they were both in the swimming pool. And I got a phone call saying I hadn't got it, immediately followed literally within a minute from Rob saying that they'd signed their podcast with Spotify.

And I was like, please, this is such a career milestone. I can cry. I couldn't bring myself to tell him that I hadn't got it. So I waited a couple of days because I just couldn't. And then I went and sat on the fire escape of the swimming pool. and cried. It was a real low point. So you make the point so often in the book as it's like this, who am I? And but while also making the point that, well, you are, you are the default parent and that is work in itself. But we kind of live, don't we, in this world whereby, and there's a

great chapter in this called, can I have it all? And I was reading it and I was thinking, women are expected to have it all. That question is asked of us in a way of that it just isn't of men, partly because we assume that they can have it all. But also they're not, you know, it's this expectation on us to have it all. I'd say men aren't doing the same all that we are. So because nothing, because of the outrageous unfairness of the biology of it, for the most part, if you're doing a kind of standard heteronormative relationship,

having babies, blah, blah, blah. That right from the off, my body is doing something that, do you know, like I am making and birthing this child and then being responsible for keeping it alive. Whereas for them physically, I don't want to speak for all dads and stuff, but like, for them nothing really changes physically. They kind of carry on and then there's a baby. As opposed to what I feel like for me, everything changed,

physically, emotionally, kind of everything. And it just went on and on and on. And I don't feel like I ever regrouped properly after having them. And this is what you chose to write about that day. So after you'd have this sort of breakdown on the fire escape. Yeah. After that real high point that I'm sure they can probably find on the security cameras at Virgin Active. But, you know, I guess like sometimes the best of times come out of the worst of times.

Yeah. So you decide as you write about the frustration you feel. in this blog post. Yeah, and I wasn't even going to put it anywhere. I just, I've always been better at expressing myself through writing than sometimes speaking. It's why Rob often gets long text messages after we've had a slight argument, because I think of better ways to win that argument that I must tell him afterwards. Yes, because I would have won that had I been able to paragraph it out.

Right, right the argument. Really, really hammer home what I was trying to say. But, yeah, it just, I wanted to get. it out and it felt really cathartic writing it and then Rob read it and he was like you should put that up. It was like just just pop it up and see what other people think. And then it just, it went somewhere that I didn't, I wasn't really expecting because for me it was writing it that I'd felt quite cathartic and quite validating. And I just got message after message after message from other people in all different situations because I know mine's not unique but

in the terms of the work that Rob does and obviously I'm very lucky in the life that I live as well and I know that but it was really validating to hear from lots of other people in all different situations and also at different stages of their parenting like people who are 40 years in going still the default parent and they're all grown-ups I'm still doing it and I didn't realize I was doing it like it was just very very validating and then yeah it publishers asked if I could, you've whined for a thousand words. Can you whine for 60? And I said, yes, I can.

I absolutely can. And you have. I did. It's not just whining, but let's talk about what your definition of a default parent for anyone at home who's still like, I don't understand. What would you describe as a default parent? It is the parent that does, not just does everything or thinks about everything, even though you are doing that, it's the parent that almost not by.

design, by by default, as kind of assumed responsibility for almost everything without there really being a conversation necessarily about it. There might have been a conversation about going back to work or the hours that you do or the childcare that you need. But that assumption of responsibility, that permanent assumption of responsibility that you're in, unless you've booked to be out, you're in charge unless you've specifically handed over. and it's normally like an individual task or an individual day. It's that a permanent assumption of responsibility. Well, it's like you came in here and the school had called you about a child not feeling well.

And you said, well, I know both of our numbers are on the forms because I've made sure of it. I've added Rob's email and Rob's number to everything so that we can both be called. And I know they have to phone one of us first. But it's always the mother. It is always the mum. Always the mother. It's always, yeah, I get those phone calls. And I was like, what I should have done, I wouldn't in case she'd like falling down the stairs or something.

He's just not picked it up and see if they phoned wrong. Yeah. We should go on strike. Because the default parenting is I was reading your book and I was thinking that would be really powerful. I read a book, a novel recently about a load of women that went on sex strike. And I thought, maybe we'll just go on like, you know, we don't have to go on sex strike. but on sort of like just responsibility strike. Yeah, just withdraw your labour.

Yeah. I did consider that in the book. And I think what, there would be a real pain process to push through where everything was chaos. Yeah, everything, it would, you'd have to. And it would be, and almost the level of chaos that I think would come almost wouldn't be worth it. That, like, constant phone calls from the school if they don't have kit, homework, choose.

Like, it would be, but it's. tempting. It's really tempting to like just not arrange, like when I go out, if I just didn't arrange anything, they would have to cope. She says, they might not. So, so, so, so yeah, as you say, you know, the default parent is not always the mother, but is mostly the mother by design, right? And I wanted to talk to you about kind of where it's, it starts immediately from this process. of pregnancy, birth, breastfeeding. And I, reading your book, was taken back. You know, my daughter will be 13 soon.

And I was taken back to that sort of like the weight of responsibility that immediately, we talk about mumgill and it's kind of there. It's stitched into the very fabric of society. Because, you know, the way that we are during pregnancy, like, are we taking the right supplements? Are you doing hypnobirthing? Yeah. Did you do hypnobirthing?

No, I did not. No, I remember one yoga class and they were like, Golden Thread breathing will get you through labour. And I was like, will it fuck? Now, I went into my first labour. I think I like I approached most of parenting, and most things probably, with a kind of naive optimism that I might be really good at this.

Yeah. I reckon I'll be really good at this. Because my colitis, I'm very used to, whole body cramps and inflammation and so on. And I've got quite a high pain threshold for cramps. So just for anyone who doesn't know, Lou has colitis, which means sometimes her body, and this is a direct quote from you in the book,

tries to poo you to death. Yeah, basically. And when we've run out of poo, it's blood and inflammation. It's just, it's like chronic inflammation of the colon. And when I'm in a flare, my body just wants everything out. It's an autoimmune thing, so it just attacks itself. So you thought you'd be quite good at the grisly, gory stuff of labour? I'm very good at cramps, like whole body cramps.

So I was like, that's labour basically, isn't it? Yeah. And no, no, it's not. What was your first labour like? I'm getting cut. Look, I'm taking my shoes off and I'm getting comfortable now. Sorry, I should have done this. go for it.

Put your hands down your pants. Tell me about your first labour. Well, my body's kind of getting default response to things to paint, I think, is to empty itself. So I'd thrown up and all the things to the point where I was very dehydrated. But I was kind of coping, but I was just very dehydrated. So I was a bit out of it in between contractions. I'd gone into hospital once. They'd sent me home because I wasn't far enough along.

And then my mum came round. So it was like me, my mum and Rob in our flat. And my mum was a nurse. So when she says something, I kind of trust her with it. So I'm like, oh, you know, you know what you're doing. And she was like, I think you need to go in again. You're not, you know, you're not keeping anything down. And you've still got most of labour to go.

So you're going to struggle. So we went in and she was like, oh, you're not dilated enough. And I was like, no, no, I know. But I was literally kind of out of it between contractions. And so then when they tested me, I was very deep. dehydrated, something to do with ketones. I'm not, I think that's what they were looking for. So they sent me up to the labour ward just to go on a drip, but like not to, they were like, you're hours away. You don't have a frame of reference for this pain. I was like, I'm in pain,

give me drugs. I did want to go into the birthing pool. So they were sort of like telling you that what you felt was not real. So invalidating, because I know I've not done it before, but I am also a fully grown adult and I understand pain. And I'm like, if I'm in pain and you have drugs to stop the pain. It feels like we could marry these two things up. Yeah. If, like, yeah. This is the place to be, guys. Like, we are there because I'm in pain. And it just, I wasn't expressing myself properly. It was off, it was obviously mine and Rob's first late, but we didn't know really what we were doing. But I just didn't feel like I was being listened to. So I'm a very petty person. And it turns out that my body is equally as petty.

So they put us in a room and she was like, we'll be back to check you in a bit, but you'll be hours. Out. And I went two to ten. in about an hour and a half. And then when my waters went, there was maconium in the water. So I was ready to push. It was mokonym everywhere.

And like the midwife hadn't been back to check me in that time. So my mum pressed the button and then started opening cupboards to find in-co pads to put on the floor to mop up the water. But yeah, just out of pettiness and spite, really. I think I made everyone panic

because then I had to have a doctor in because obviously she had put in the waters in case she hadn't swallowed any of it. But in case they've swallowed any of it, they need to be monitored afterwards. And I was already pushing when she came back in. She was like, oh, oh, okay.

And I was like, I told you. I told you. And I was like, can't I have an epidural? She was like, too late. I was like, boom. But the second time around, I did get an epidural. It is absolutely bloody fantastic. I definitely had an epidural because I, I,

my water's broken and then just literally nothing happened. Oh, okay. So it was kind of the reverse. Also, I haven't been allowed any alcohol or drugs for like nine months. I was just like, give it all to me. Give it all to me. All please. And I remember them saying to me,

I was so sorry, but after I just went on for a few days and I, and I, and I had gone in, and I'd gone in like you, naively optimistic with some like almonds and walnuts. And I remember the midwife going, get this woman some fucking Percy pigs.

And after, I don't know, after a few weeks, they said, I think we're going to, they said push. And I was, by this,

stage of proceedings, Lou, I was like, you fucking push. Yeah, I've got nothing left. You fucking push. I've been... I've got nothing left. Leave me alone. On a diet of Percy pigs and almonds for the last three days. And they were like, this baby is not coming out this way.

They were like, we're really sorry. And the baby was distressed. And they were like, well, really sorry, we're going to have to give you an emergency C-section. And I was like, why are you apologising? Just get the fucking thing out of me. Let's just get from A to B. Yeah.

I don't leave alone. I was just happy. I was just delighted that the child was like removed and put on my chest and was fine. That's all you want really easily. Yeah. Just fine. Just fine. Just want to get from A to be.

I know. And, you know, I didn't care that I'd have to be, I'd had to be ripped open. Like I just, they were like, oh, you won't be able to drive until six weeks after you've had a C-section. And I was like, well, I couldn't drive before I had a C-section. Like, I'm good. So this is amazing. I'm going to get my license. Six weeks.

The health visitor turns up with a leaflet and a licence. Sorry, I'm turning this into like a therapy chat about my own like labour. But anyway, so your first label was not how you planned it. All was well that ended well. Do you know what I mean? I was healthy. She was healthy. She was fine.

She was teeny tiny. But she was like five eight. She was full term. But she was proper little squidge. But yeah, all was well that ended well. I just didn't come out of it. feeling, I mean, I don't know if anyone comes out of it, feeling empowered and all the other kind of earth mother adjectives.

I, I didn't, I just didn't feel like I've been listened to. I completely missed the opportunity for pain relief, which I think I really needed, because we're not there yet, you don't have a frame of reference. And that has really stuck with me. Yeah, that's, hasn't it? Just piss off with your frame of reference. Because, like, I'm in pain. And so, like, yeah, second time round, I went.

I was a different hospital as well, so we'd moved house. And they couldn't have been nicer, but I was such a horrible mega bitch. When I got there, I was like, I'm not leaving. I'm not going home. This is what I want. I don't want to look at the birth suite. If you try and send me home, I'm going to sit downstairs in Costa and reception. I'm going to scare everyone with my grunting.

And she was so nice. She was like, well, let me have a look at you. Oh, you're three. Let's call it force. And we can send you to the labour ward. I'm going to wait outside the door because I'm going to grab the anysotist when he walks past. Are you sure you want the eptoral? I was like, yes.

And she was like, I'll grab him as he goes past. So he doesn't miss, because if you miss your window of opportunity, I was like, no, we've missed that before. Get him in here. And when I've never done like drugs, when that epidural hit, I'm like, oh, I get it. I get it. I get what all the fuss is about because this is bloody amazing. I had like an out-to-body experience. I was like, it was gorgeous. I had a nap. I read a magazine. Oh, God, does you making it sound like a nice holiday? But this is the thing. When I was, when you, when you, when we, when you talk about it. about that whole process of like birthing and this major, major thing that happens to our bodies. And then they're like, here's a baby, feed it. And, you know, just, and, and, and it's awful.

But biology, that is incredible. It is the worst preparation to look after and keep alive, the most defenseless, precious thing you've ever had after nine months of pregnancy and labor and giving birth and all of that. And you go, Sorry. I'm not physically capable of doing this. What do you mean? Can we talk about breastfeeding? I am going to use this as a therapy session because you had a difficult experience with breastfeeding.

Yeah. Your first child, didn't you? And I, like you, thought, I'm like, this is where these are going to come into their own. Like I imagined I was going to be like feeding. all of South London's Yeah, I was going to be like The one of those wetness with like a kind of freezer full of

Yeah, yeah, I was like Look, watch as I come into my own now And my baby Took one look at these And turned away screaming in horror It was like the first person to turn away screaming in horror from my breasts basically

And I've never encountered that before And I just couldn't latch on It was awful And I remember feeling so much guilt about the fact that I couldn't breastfeed. Yeah, I drove myself mad. It was like I have failed as a human and as a woman. And once again, it's because of my body. There's something just wrong with me.

And everyone else is doing it and everyone's telling you breast is best. And if you just go to this cafe, if you just go to this class, if you just try this, if you just do something else, if you just work a little bit harder than you are, you'll be able to do it. There was always, if you just, and I'm like, stop telling me to just. The onus being entirely on you. Yeah. There's always something else you can try.

And I'm like, no. I remember getting to the point where we paid like quite a lot of money to a lactation consultant, right? Yeah. And she came round. And my daughter was like just crying the whole time because she was absolutely fucking starving. And she took what and she said, this is a clean flat in South London, right? Yeah. She said you have boiling water, you have sterilized stuff.

Give this baby formula. Yeah. And it was like, and I remember at the time, the response to that from some of the other mums at the time, it was like, it was like she'd come around and suggested that I give the baby cocaine or something. Yeah. It's almost like you can't say it. Like, it's got to be a little dirty hidden secret. Like, it's fine. It's not just fine.

It's brilliant. Like, it's brilliant. I was saying, I was talking to someone before. I trust science more than I trust. I know what I eat. Like, I know what that breast milk's made of. Yeah. I trust a pot of science.

Salt and vinegar crisps and full fat coke at that point of pregnancy and just after labour. I was like, and also my body couldn't do it. I don't know if it was me or her or the combination of both of us or I also, I left hospital before she had latched. I just, I think after the experience of giving birth, I just wanted to leave. So like someone came to try and show me how to breastfeed her and she was swinging her. her head round. Like, you just let their head find, and I was like, hold her head, hold her head, like she just kept swinging. My daughter's head round. And I was like, can you just give her back, give her to me, I just want to leave. And I wasn't completely, I mean, considering I'd just been

like Legger's of Kimbo in front of what felt like half of Lewis in hospital with people coming in and out, I also really wasn't comfortable just sat there topless while a complete stranger swung my baby's head around trying to smack her head onto the right bit of my boob. And I was like, just give me my baby, let me go home, I'll sort it out. And we never sorted it out at home. But where I think it was so hormonal, I'm so tired. And I know, and like breast is best. And then every time health visitor came round with the midwife team, it was always like, have you just tried or have you tried this position? Have you tried that? There's a breastfeeding cafe that's open to it. And I was like, two weeks before Christmas, it's freezing cold. It's dark.

I've just had a baby. I don't want to go to the arse end of Lewisham to find a breastfeeding cafe to sit topless again in front of a bunch of people I don't know. Like, I just needed somebody. I needed an outside voice to go, it's okay. This isn't working. It's perfectly fine. You're driving your mental and physical health off a cliff to just give her a bottle of formula.

Like she was little. She needed formula, really. And instead, I pumped exclusively for three months. And I was a bit like you. I never produced a lot. I was never more than one feet ahead, so I could never, I just never felt like I could relax

because I had to pump. So I'd like pump for an hour, and that noise of that machine haunts me. If anyone's listening right now and they're in that period of time, you know. Just stop. If you love it,

and if you love breastfeeding and it means loads to you, do it, more power to you. I'm not, because I know that you have people with very, I wrote something on breastfeeding. I did a little bit in Rob's first book. No, the parenting.

One of the books about breastfeeding. And then I wrote that into a blog afterwards. And their comments. The breast is best. The eye of the Breast is Best Brigade. I know that. I can read. I get it.

That's why I tried to kill myself doing it. But I couldn't do it. And actually, we were all much happier and healthier. Absolutely. Once I gave her a bottle of formula, and you can give them to someone. else. You can go, this baby is yours. You feed it. Mum. Well, you look like you've got empty arms. You have her. Also, looking back now, actually, I'm really grateful. You know, at the time I was like,

I'm a failure. But looking back and reading and thinking about it, looking back and thinking about it from the framework of default parenting, not being able to breastfeed was quite an important fundamental early break in the default parenting in our household. That is so liberating. Yeah. To be able, too. That like, oh, they just want you. Oh, I think they can smell milk. They can, mm-hmm. No, you take a bottle, take them in the other room and feed them.

It's, yeah, I think even if you're breastfeeding, I'm quite a big advocate. And again, to each of their own, do what you want, like, no shade, whatever. But even if you want to pump a bottle, to just be able, for them to have, be able to take a bottle. And I know, I say babies get confused between, maybe they do, maybe they don't, Maybe they're just, I mean, they've got no developed frontal loaves. Babies are in a perpetual state of confusion. They don't have a fucking clue what's going on. They didn't exist three days ago.

They're just, they're just, just, I tell you who's not in charge, the baby. You're in charge. Give them your tit. Give them a, give them a bottle, whatever. Are they happy? Are you healthy? Are you sleeping? Just wonderful.

If they're fed, fed is best. And I had someone when we were in the throes of it, go, but women have been doing this is what your body was designed to do. Women have been doing this since we were in caves. I was like, yeah, but you know what happened in caves? Babies died of malnutrition. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Women died in childbirth and babies died.

So, like, we have been doing it, but not everyone made it out. Yeah, yeah, exactly. So if I've got a little tub of science that I can feed her, and I'm not crying and she's not crying and everyone's happy, let's just do that. Let's take the pressure off a little bit. Like, do what works. for you and give yourself permission to do it because I just I just needed somebody.

I'm like Rob loved giving them a bottle. He felt really involved. Like he could do something because I think he felt quite helpless at the beginning because it was like, couldn't just tell them jokes. He'd just be like, hey, have you had a really good one? He's like, they're not laughing. Yeah, not. Tough audience, baby.

Really tough crowd. Half a crowd. But I think that is true. And if anyone is listening now and they're at a stage where they're feeling that kind of guilt and it could be about breastfeeding yeah it could be about it could be about anything it could be you know because at each stage of parenting there is a different thing oh there's always something it's like you do you yeah you do you and like just stop i mean just yeah the worst thing you can do is kind of sit and be googling on all the forums and and also like you don't i've said like my

mental health and my physical health as well i was felt like i was on the edge of a precipice like i didn't have postnatal depression, but I wasn't right. Well, Rob thinks that you did. Rob thinks I did. I had more than baby blues, but I don't know whether it was just, I wasn't right. And would you mind going back to that time how you felt? I felt completely at sea, just both with myself, I think as it has to, because you're now responsible for a baby and they're yours and you've got to look after them and that's brilliant. But your identity completely changes. And I think Rob went back to what he had taskmaster booked in on like day six or something

after we had her. He wasn't at a position in his career where he could have really said, no, I'm going to take a six-month break or whatever. He kind of had to keep that momentum going. And for me it felt like he kind of just got to carry on with his life. Physically for him nothing had, he hadn't had to, and I'm not a nice pregnant person. I don't glow.

I don't love it. I'm sick and angry and spiteful for nine solid months. There's like a really brief four-week period in the middle where like I'm pregnant enough that I look pregnant and the rest of me feels quite small by comparison and I'm not sick and then we tip over the other side. So like I don't enjoy it. So like I'd felt, I just felt completely at sea.

I physically, mentally and I didn't know what I was doing and I didn't feel like I could do it because I couldn't feed her. And I wasn't sleeping. and I didn't and it felt like everyone could do it and I felt like I couldn't and it's really really I don't know

I just I just struggled with not feeling like I was doing a very good job at almost all of it because you can't get what you need probably is three weeks to go and recover somewhere and sleep and regroup and your hormones settle down and your tiredness but you don't get that

you're on like that treadmill you said this really quite moving thing actually about being a default parent and about being a mum, I think, generally. Which is that if you had a job and you felt like you weren't doing it right, you would leave it and you would, you know, you'd get another job or you'd ask for some sort of advice on how to get better or improve or go on a course. And you said that like parenting is just like, it's just feeling like you're not good enough at your job all the time. All the time. Yeah. It can feel really demoralising when you, especially when,

and I know comparison is the thief of joy and we shouldn't do it, because everyone is making compromises somewhere. You know when you see like mums out or other people in the school playground or in the baby groups or whatever, and you go, my God, you look so put together and your baby is gorgeous and you're breastfeeding and you're wearing white jeans and you've washed your hair and everything just looks like it's working. I don't know the morning they've had.

I don't know what it's taken to get there, but it's... Cocaine probably. Nine nannies. But it's that thing where you go, my God, everyone else seems to be doing it. And I'm sure that they're not. But I just, I've never felt so inadequate for so long when I was working the hardest I've ever worked. And that's a really hard thing where you go, I'm working so, so hard and it's still feeling like it's not enough. And it was enough.

I can look back now with a much clearer head, much clearer eyes and go, oh, that was fine. That was good. It felt like hard work because I was working hard. And that's like, I think somebody said, it might have been Rob actually, but let's not credit him with it. It's much harder work to be a good parent than it is a bad one. So if you're working hard, it's because you're being a good parent. It's because you're putting you all in it to do it well. And hang on to that instead of going, oh my God, I'm working so hard and I'm still shit.

You're not. Yeah. It's just, there's a balance to everything, isn't there? Yeah. It's really, that's the first time I'd really kind of thought about that. And how much that can impact your self-esteem. as well, as you say, like your entire life has changed. And especially as a woman, who am I?

Most of us, even though there's been massive changes in parental leave laws and stuff, it's still predominantly the women that take the time off. It's still the women whose careers are sort of halted. Whereas you say, you know, your taskmaster is not Alex Horn or Greg David. it's this kind of like, you know, it's this baby at home. And when the thing you give all your time to gets old enough and then it just tells you it hates you. Because that's the stage I'm at now. How old are yours?

Eight and ten. So we're starting the, my oldest has put a little note up outside her room, which is knock first. Wait. I was like, oh, God. I feel like, hello, morning. Can I come in and find your uniform? Like, yeah, no, we're just. I think, and maybe, maybe I'm just deeply praise driven,

but I think where I've done, I've always done a job as well where there's very empirical, tangible, these are the results they've got, these are the kids that have got into sick form or gone off to uni or Ofsted come in and, and give you a little grade. But I kind of felt like I was like, someone tell me I'm doing well.

Someone tell me I'm doing well. We do live in a society now where everything is very metric and data driven, isn't it? It's like, you know, social media, likes, followers, all of that stuff, views, you know. And yeah, and parenting is the one thing where you just don't, the only feedback you get is resoundingly negative. It's like being trolled the whole fucking time. Because you cannot please everybody. No.

There's a real, I'm going to bring down the ire of people on me. But there's that, I go do it. You know, we just go like. The truth will set you free, Lou. You don't have to be a martyr to it. Saying you don't love all of it doesn't mean. you don't love your children or that you don't love being a mum or you're not lucky to be a mum. I love my children.

I love being a mum. I'm very lucky that I've had two, been able to have two children when I wanted them and make the choices I have. But you're also allowed to go, that bit's a bit rubbish. Or this bit was a bit hard without everyone piling on and making you feel bad. And whether that is in the very big thing in like the comments or websites or whatever, or just there's always somebody in a little mum's group or a baby group or mum in the playground that goes,

but aren't you lucky? Yeah, I am. But just having a really bad day, Sandra. Can I be allowed to have a bad day, please? Like, please. Can I ask what your view is on, as you've got older, I feel like one gets better at their boundaries,

don't they? So talking about other parents, I have had to detach with love from things like WhatsApp group, Yeah, PTA school. I'm the class rep this year. You're the class rep. Are you mental?

No, no, no. Under duress. I'm also setting a new standard for whoever takes it over next year because I feel the standards were too high. Okay, hang on one second, because I thought I read this book and you were like, I was once co-class rep in the first year my daughter started school. And now I'm like, have nothing to do with it ever again. And you have gone and become class rep again. I'm not PTA. That is a bridge too far.

Okay, so we got levels here. Yeah, so there's PTA. PTA is the top. And they do all the kind of events and organized stuff. And they don't want voices. They just want labour. Yeah, okay. So I get tapped out of that.

I'm not doing that. Yeah. And then there's... Take my money. I refuse to participate. And then there's class rep. Yeah. Which is like, I feel is like, you do it really so that your child feels that

mom is a parent. Involved. Yeah. Well, it's meant to be. My understanding a class rep was that instead of emailing the whole class, the teacher can tell one parent and I disseminate the information.

And then you also do Christmas presents and end-a-year presents. Yeah. That was always vouchers. That was always vouchers. Yeah. Always vouchers. They don't want plant pots.

Stop it. Like vouchers. Palm pots? You know the ones that kind of, Thank you for helping me grow. No. They don't want it. What's the worst thing you got as a teacher?

Oh, secondary boys. so it very rarely got presents. Well, no, I got, when I left, they bought me a bottle of gin and they made me a big card. That was really nice. I got wine and chocolates, which, if in doubt, always. Because if you don't drink, you can re-gift it. Yeah.

And everyone likes chocolate. And if you don't, you can re-gift it. Yeah. So, hang on. So let's go. So you are class rep this year. Yes. Okay.

I did class rep in one year. When it was time to hand over, we suggested that perhaps some. dads might like to take on the position of class rep. And guess what? They did. They did. Actually, Rob's been class rep and there was a mutiny and a coup.

So, hang on. No, I'm not letting you go without telling me. Rob Beckett was class rep. More to prove a point. He was like, so God bless the ladies that have done it before in my daughter's classes, but I think they've set the standards way too high. So they've developed like a Almost like a Sunday night bulletin

Of what's happening each day that week And what the kids need And when things are due And I mean they've What? I refer to it daily But now I'm class rep for my youngest class Because the lady that's done it the last couple of years

Really wanted to step down And no one else is like tumbleweed She'd asked a few times And it started to feel really awkward And then I'd had like three glasses of wine And I was like, I'll do it As long as we're all accepting That the standard is going to drop massively

I'm not doing a weekly bulletin. She did too good a job, basically. Yeah, she set the standard way too high. And I was like, I'm not doing that. So I just, I have reestablished a very low bar where I pass on emails. I organise the Christmas present. I'll do the end of term one as well, the end of year one. And as and when I remember things, I will go, oh, I think they need well, he's on Thursday.

Someone double check it for me. But Rob, Rob was, has he spoken about this on the podcast? Yeah, I think it's in, so he. Or in the book. He was like, he's got this big thing about unnecessary work. He thinks a lot of the work I do is unnecessary. It's unnecessary. Thanks.

And it is. I understand what it means on a technicality, but a lot of what I do just makes everyone's lives nicer. Yeah. So they have more fun. Things are better. Things are nicer. Things flow more smoothly because I've done that extra work.

Packing a lunchbox and buying snacks in advance of a day out. So you don't find yourself at Chessington with two hungry, aggie children. and you're trying to find something they'll eat in the middle of and everything's £400, and they don't like it. So it is unnecessary, technically, but it makes your whole day easier, that kind of thing. And Rob is the same with class rep. He thinks it's a lot of unnecessary work

and people made it more complicated than it needed to be. So he, in a little fit of, I'm going to be the super dad, I'm going to be the dad that does it, volunteered to do it. And then we hit like November, and I said, you need to start collecting money for the Christmas presents. And he was like, I don't need, they don't need Christmas presents. I was like, that's half the job.

That's half the job. Like, come on. Like, there's two things you have to pass on the emails. Yeah. And you have to do the present. And I said, that's basically it. And so I did it. Because obviously, I'm still on the WhatsApp as just, like, one of the mums.

So, no, Rob still claims class rep. He's like, I was a class rep. I was like, you weren't, you weren't really. You were very much a figurehead position. He was the one that they wheel out. to they go, still alive! No power struggles yet. So can I ask you quickly what your view on WhatsApp groups is?

I'm a lurker. I like watching the drama unfold or... I've also, I made it a policy quite early on. From my teaching days, the amount of stupid questions that parents will ask teachers and then they don't feel embarrassed about. No, there's a lot of them in this book. I'm oddly stupid questions or in name things that they've already been told three times. I do the same as that on the class WhatsApp or the year group WhatsApp.

So I'm like, I'm not answering a question that you can find the information to. It's three messages up. Yeah. I'm not doing it. Yeah. But I do like lurking. I like reading the stupid questions. I like reading the arguments.

Someone's car's parked on the double yellows and we can't get. And that turned into a hole. And I was like, booked. Yeah. But I won't participate. I try not to. to involve myself. Because once you reply once,

look, can it, Luke, can you? No, I can't leave me alone. I want to kind of come to you for tips on driving as a default parent. Because this doesn't need to be, you know, this doesn't have to be something that we're constantly seething and resentment about, right? No. No.

But first I want to ask you, before we do that, I want to talk to you about being touched out. Oh my God, yes. I am totally. Because I read this and went, oh yeah, you talk about the default parent, you're very often, you spend the whole day with toddlers, kids, whatever, touching you.

And then your husband comes, or your partner comes home from work, the non-default reappears. Yeah. Disney dad, Disney mom, whatever the, you know, and then they want to have sex with you. And you're like, absolutely fucking not. Well, they even want to sit too close to you on the sofa.

I'm like, I do not want anything else touching me at all. And it sounds mean. But you just, I get overstimulated and touched out. And I don't have anything else to give. Like, especially when they're little. And for anyone in the throes of it, it does pass. Or it doesn't pass, but it changes, it adapts, it evolves. You get used to not ever having sex or other heart.

I just think as the kids are less on top of you because babies are so physical and then toddlers are really physical and I just, I need like some resetting time I think at the end of the day I need to be like totally I don't want the dog on me I don't want anything

It's not great to refer to your husband I don't want the dog on me But I think you just You've done a lot of emotional labour that day managing children's feelings and emotions and needs And actually if for a little while you don't have enough capacity

to manage your partner's emotional and physical needs. They're a grown up. They're going to need to suck it up a little bit. Like, without bringing the normal men brigade down, like, you're not babies. Yeah. Don't expect us to pander, do you? Yeah.

Like, I get it. They come home from work and they want to have a bit of recognition or affection. It sounds quite basic, doesn't it? A bit of affection. But, like, just sometimes you just don't have anything else to give. and that is okay. It doesn't last forever. Communicate through it.

But, you know, you don't owe anyone anything. If you're touched out, you touched out. Yes. And now, okay, so let's get on to your tips for getting through the resentment of being the default parent. Anyone listening to is like, okay, I hear what you're saying, but my husband won't listen to me or he doesn't even accept. the role that I, you know, that I have this role, that what I'm doing is work. Yeah.

So a lot of the book is me talking about my own experiences. But I've also, I did try and find some stats and research to back it up so it wasn't just me moaning. So if you're feeling like you're getting less sleep, it's because you are. We've got the Harvard Sleep Institute of got the figures of how much more. It massively, there's a sleep gap between moms and dads. There's a sleep gap. There's a leisure gap.

Yeah. where the leisure gap of even when moms are having their leisure time, they're thinking about, they're worrying about, they're still doing the internal mental labour. So your leisure time isn't even as leisureful as your partners. There's the free time leisure gap is something like half an hour a day, which doesn't sound very much, but it really adds up over the course of a year.

So I think that I found I was able to communicate with Rob much better because I wrote it down. He's read the book and I think he understood a lot of what I was saying because often when it comes up you're already emotional. I'm already cross.

So it kind of comes out as a really aggie bicker. Almost maybe approach the situation when you're not cross. I know it's hard you don't want to start an argument where you're not in one. But try and take the emotion out of it a little bit

because you can communicate so much better. I think you also need an internal mantra. It can be whatever you like. I've got a little Buddhist phrase that I'm sure I pronounce wrong because somebody I fancied years ago was Buddhist, so I did the only sensible thing

and promptly got into it as well for a six-month period. Right. I do really still like the kind of principles of it, but I say Namioho, Rengokyo, and I say over and over and over. What does that mean? Absolutely, no idea.

But it's really stuck. It's stuck in there. Anyone at home knows. But my friend says, I love my life, I love my life, I love my life, you just grab something where that's all you're thinking about and blank the rest out.

And then I just look into the middle distance. I can see my children out of the peripheral, my peripheral vision. And I just go into the middle distance and say whatever you need to in your head to just keep yourself. Not actual thoughts, just something. Can't. Yeah, to keep your. Minds, I love and approve myself exactly as I am. Yeah, like that.

I love and approve myself. Exactly. And just into the middle distance, just like this. I go, I don't know. There's probably some child psychologist somewhere going, no, no, you must show them. them your emotions and you must engage and I do. But when they're losing the plot and they aren't reasonable, they don't try and reason with them. Wait until they've calmed down. Same with husbands. Yeah, I was going to say, I've got this. Just let them calm down. And my experience of

teaching in boys' schools, maybe let them eat something. Much more reasonable once they've eaten. Simple souls. They don't develop. Let them put their hands in their hands down their pants. Go out for break. Have a biscuit. Come back. Everyone's much. more reasonable. That's my whole behaviour management strategy. And that's called big tub of biscuits and just like, do you need a biscuit? Shall we all take a moment?

And have a biscuit. And eat something, yeah. Boys are hungry, man. They're just hungry. I feel like this is just good life advice for everyone. Like, shall we take a moment and eat something? If there's a cross child or man or woman. Yeah.

Eat something. Take a moment. Have something to eat. Come back to it later. Regroup yourself so that you can go in less emotionally. Because I don't, maybe other people can. I can't communicate properly when I'm cross or hungry or sad.

My favourite thing is respond instead of react. Oh, I like that. Yeah. Have a biscuit. Yeah. My head a year, tell me once that I don't, there's nothing wrong with shouting in the classrooms, but don't shout when you're angry.

Oh. Only use it when you are totally in control. of your response. Got you. So if you need to raise your voice to make a point, absolutely do it. I'm not necessarily saying

with little kids. I'm not saying scream with your three-year-old, but only do it when you're not angry. But I was obviously teaching teenagers, but yeah, she was like, raise your voice, but just don't do it when you're angry

because you've lost control. You want to be perfectly in control when you're raising things. Maybe I parent, like I teach. Well, I have, I have, I feel I've learned a lot. from my time with you today. Thank you so much for coming in

and making me feel better as a default parent. Lessons from a default parent surviving the front line of family life without losing your shit. It's out this week. Thank you, Lou, from one default parent to another for that hour of therapy. I would love to know what you think about our conversation.

class reps, the PTA, on whether breastfeeding was a load of bollocks for you too. Come and tell me your thoughts over on Instagram at at Life of Briny Pod. Lou will be back on Friday for our special bonus episode, The Life of You, where she'll be sharing the three things that keep her grounded when family life feels like a never-ending to-do list. In the meantime, don't forget to subscribe, follow, rate and rave about us to your friends.

It really does help. but most of all, keep being you. I'll see you next time.