The Liz Moody Podcast - Advice Ep! Friendship Divorces, Fertility Struggles, & How To Start A Business with What’s Gaby Cooking

Episode Date: September 2, 2024

Gaby Dalkin of What’s Gaby Cooking and Liz answer YOUR questions about things like parenting, fertility & IVF, making friends, starting a small business, finding confidence and better body image, and more. In this episode of the Liz Moody Podcast, I’m joined by Gaby Dalkin, the creator behind 'What's Gaby Cooking?' and a New York Times bestselling cookbook author. We answer listener questions covering topics such as managing money envy, balancing social media's impact, handling friendship breakups, and finding joy in small, intentional moments. Gaby also shares her insights on fertility challenges, tips for new parents, and entrepreneurial advice for starting a business.  00:00 Intro 00:52 Tackling Money Envy 02:52 Navigating Social Media Comparisons 04:10 Friendship Divorces and Personal Growth 07:28 Parenting and Relationship Dynamics 13:24 IVF Journey and Fertility Struggles 19:24 Navigating Trauma in Relationships 22:14 Finding Community as a New Mom 27:21 Handling Insecurities and Criticism 32:00 Starting a Small Business 35:45 Final Thoughts For more from Gaby, you can find her on Instagram @whatsgabycookin or online at www.whatsgabycooking.com and www.dalkinandco.com. You can purchase her newest book, What's Gaby Cooking: Grilling All the Things, where books are sold. To join The Liz Moody Podcast Club Facebook group, go to https://www.facebook.com/groups/thelizmoodypodcast. Ready to uplevel every part of your life? Order my new book 100 Ways to Change Your Life: The Science of Leveling Up Health, Happiness, Relationships & Success now!  This episode is sponsored by: Seed: go to seed.com/lizmoody and use code LIZMOODY for 25% off your first month. Himalaya Wellness: learn more about stress-supporting Ashwagandha supplements at himalayausa.com. Pique: go to piquelife.com/LIZMOODY for 15% off plus a special gift. The Liz Moody Podcast cover art by Zack. The Liz Moody Podcast music by Alex Ruimy. Formerly the Healthier Together Podcast.  This podcast and website represents the opinions of Liz Moody and her guests to the show. The content here should not be taken as medical advice. The content here is for information purposes only, and because each person is so unique, please consult your healthcare professional for any medical questions. The Liz Moody Podcast Episode 261. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Hello, friends, and welcome to the Liz Moody podcast, where every week we're sharing real science, real stories, and realistic tools that actually level up every part of your life. I'm your host, Liz Moody, and I'm a best-selling author and longtime journalist. Let's dive in. We have got a quickie little advice episode for you today, 30 minutes of fun, chatty conversation that quickly goes deep because, after all, this is me that we are talking about. I am joined by my friend Gabby Dolkin. She is the woman behind What's Gabby Cooking.

She's the writer of about a bigillion New York Times best-selling cookbooks. Her most recent is called Grilling All the Things, and it is the perfect book for your end-of-summer barbecues. She's also the co-founder of Dalkin & Co. Alongside her husband Thomas, they make some of the most incredible spices and seasonings that make every meal so much better. Today, we are answering the questions that you sent in about money envy. We talk about parenting, fertility, fructive. friendship, friendship divorces, which is such an interesting conversation, managing insecurities, starting your own business, and so much more.

Gabby is so joyful. I love hanging out with her. I love talking to her. She is so much fun, and I know that you're going to absolutely adore this episode, so let's jump right in. One super quick note, I know that 50% of you listening to this episode do not follow the podcast. Take a second now to hit that follow or subscribe button.

It is the best way to support the podcast. And it makes sure that episodes show up right in your feed. Go ahead. Do it right now. I'll wait. Trust me, you do not want to miss out on any of our upcoming shows. They are jam-packed with science and stories that will change your life. All right. Let's get right into the episode. Gabby, welcome to the podcast. Hi. How are you? I am so good. I'm so excited. I have some really juicy advice topics to get into. I feel like you're going to have some very interesting opinion. So let's just get right into it. We have. I'm having really crazy money envy. even with friends who have rich parents or higher paying jobs, etc. The economy is obviously exacerbating this, but I would love any tips on how to work through this internally.

Oh my God, that's a great question. Listen, what's the saying? Comparison is the Thief of Joy. I think it is so hard to move beyond that because you're like, oh my God, this person's in Italy and they're here and they're that. And you're like, I want to do all that too. But you can't let that noise get in the way of your own joy. So how do you move past that?

I think you have to really be intentional about what's making you happy and spend the time doing those things that don't cost a bazillion dollars. And also remember that what people are putting on social media, while it looks incredible and I'm sure it costs an arm and a leg, it doesn't mean that they're happy on the inside. So finding what it is that gives you joy that doesn't cost a lot of money or things you should invest in and then you try and block the rest of it out. It's so hard to even know, though, like what are the things that are going to make me happy? Because we are so bombarded with the external messaging. Listen, social media is a drug and I am actively trying to scroll less and just consume less because I think it's really easy to compare yourself to everyone else and it's not

a healthy mindset. How are you doing that? I set aside times. Obviously, what's got to be cooking is very digital. I'm still responding to every DM. I'm responding to all the blog comments, TikTok, blah, blah, blah, blah. But like if I'm around Poppy, my phone's not around. I'm not looking at it. and I try and just block out times to do it. So I'm not constantly doing it for 12 hours a day. Do you ever get jealous? Sure. People were drinking sprits in Italy all summer long and I was pregnant.

And I'm like, that looks incredible. But that's just not my reality right now. I'll do that one day. Yeah, it's interesting. How did you know what a good life looked like to you? Like, how did you figure out what your dream life was? Oh, my gosh. Wow.

That's a deep question. I think it was a lot of trial and error. I know who I'm happiest around and I try and build my life around being around those types of people. It fills me up. I think I exude more happiness when I'm in those kinds of situations. So I'm very thoughtful about that. I've also had a handful of friendship divorces, if you will, that I have done intentionally because I'm leaving situations and they're not filling me up and they're making me feel less than or whatever it is.

And I'm like, these are not the kind of people I need to be around. It was becoming a mom. You have less time for all the bullshit and you're like, I don't want to be around that person. Do you tell the person? No, I mean, I probably could handle it a lot better. Well, like, I've had three friendship divorces. Two of them I was like, this is not it. Like, there were things that happened and I was like, I'm done.

One of them I just kind of ghosted. But like my life's better because of it. That's so interesting. So if you're out there listening and you have these people who are continuously making you not feel good. Like you're saying, I did that. I cut them out and I'm happier for it. It's good on the other side. And our time is valuable. Like we're busy. We're working. Some people are parents. You're trying to see your friends. You're trying to see your partner. Whatever it is. You're trying to take care of your mental health. It's not worth it to spend time with people who aren't like making you feel better,

like making you feel happier. I look at almost every situation like that now. I will say I relate to this person a lot. I have a lot of money envy myself. A hundred percent the thing that pushes on those buttons is social media and the more time I spend on social media directly, the worst I feel about the house that I live in, about the car that I drive. And then I'll step back and be like, wait, I don't care what kind of car I drive. Literally at all. I want a big screen so that I can like see the maps. And that's it. And a seat warmer. I think a seat warmer is the most luxurious thing on the planet. I have a seat air conditioner. We have that too. We got that in this car. It's my first time I've ever had it. I never use it because I'm always on the warmer. But my husband likes it.

That's fair. But also, you don't live in 175 valley heat in the summer. But I still would have it on. But I just like, it makes me think that I care about things that I do not actually care about when I step back. And so I do think almost being a detective for your life and saying, what are the times that I actually feel really filled up, that I actually feel really happy? Maybe sometimes those times cost money. But I think about this with travel all of the time. Social media is having a really negative effect on travel because people are going to the same places. They're destroying a lot of the local culture and completely.

just overwhelming it to a point where it can't handle the capacity. And then also they're just like going and taking photos. And that's what they're looking for out of the trip is to show off the trip rather than experience the trip. Well, that's why you have to remember that social media is not real. Like these people that are doing that kind of stuff. And if you talk to the locals, they will say exactly what you just said. Like all these incredible small towns in Italy are just like over. I was talking to the driver in Italy. And he was like, people ask me to drive them to this one cliff to take a photo over the ocean and then drive them back to the hotel. They're not exploring. They're not doing anything like that. They just want this one specific photo. That's not real to me.

You are painting a picture on social media that is not your real life. Are you really happy? That's what I mean when social media is not necessarily real. And we're going to do a whole episode for how to minimize your phone usage, how to break up with your phone. So look out for that if you're listening because I do think that's the number one thing here. I really do think it's the number one problem and being a detective for like what actually fills you up in your life. Okay. I'm having a baby soon and everyone everywhere tells me your life will never be the same. Your relationship with your partner will never be the same. Is this true? How do you deal with this? Such bullshit. Listen, I am not someone who made my identity being a mom. I think that is a lot of people's identity.

For me, going through 175 years of fertility problems and 10 miscarriages, I learned very quickly not to put all my importance into A, being pregnant or having a family, being a mom, because I didn't know if it was a reality for me. People would ask me, how do you handle miscarriages? How do you handle all this disappointment? It's because I had all these other incredible things going in my life. I had an amazing partner. I have an amazing job. I have amazing friends. All these different things that all fill my bucket in different ways, none of that got lost when I became a mom. Like Thomas and his relationship is better than ever. And I actually think we're probably less bored now. We would wake up so late on a Saturday. I can't remember what that feels like. It was so

nice, I think back in the day. But I don't like, it's so much more fun now. So no, I don't think it's, I don't think you lose anything. If you don't want to. If you want to, if you want to just change your life entirely 180 degrees and just do that, go for it. Be my guess. Like, I think that does make a lot of people happy. I have friends that are like that. It's just not who I am. Do you have any specific tips for making sure you don't lose anything other than that diversification of identity before you actually have the kid?

Well, I definitely think that is important. But when you have a kid, your first couple months are touch and go. You're in the fucking weeds. Your boobs hurt if you're breastfeeding, it's dark. But there's an adjustment period and just know that you're coming back to yourself eventually. It's going to take a minute to figure out a routine, get your kid to a place where they can sleep through the night and you're not totally sleep deprived, find a nanny, find a preschool, find daycare, whatever it is. But just know there is a point on the other side where things get better.

And your relationship with Thomas is actually better? Yeah. Thomas and I work together. We parent together and he's my husband. Like we're in it together all the time. Our communication has gotten so much better since having a kid, two kids. There's no room for not communicating. If something's bothering one of us, you have to be super upfront about it right then and there because there's too much else going on to dwell on it and let it fester or anything like that. So we've both gotten really good about being expressive of what we need. Specifically, what did you use to get wrong about communication? And can you share a specific communication tip that you guys employ now?

If I would get upset with him or he did something that bothered me, I just wouldn't say something. I'd just let it sit inside me and I'd go to bed and I'd think about it at the next day and I wouldn't really worry about it. And I would be like, who cares? We're fine. We're going to go out for dinner in two days and we're going to move past this. Now, if he does something that's upsetting, like, when we were going to bed, it was like 9.45 and he brought up some work stuff. But I was like, I don't want to think about this at 945. How dare you bring this up before I closed my eyes? And I told him, I told him right then and there. These are the conversations we're having in bed or while I'm brushing my teeth. We're going to have these conversations either first thing in the morning when we wake up before Poppy wakes up or we're. once we get her to school, once we're sitting down at our desks and starting to work, this is not okay. And he was like, you're right. Like, that was zuffed up of me to bring it up because now you're going to be thinking about it while you fall asleep. I'm going to think about it. We're very open about that communication. Did I say it in the nicest way? No, I was probably a total bitch. But we're okay this morning. We talk a lot about parenting and like how things we say will affect Poppy and how we handle different situations or we'll see something from a friend. who's parenting and we're like, let's not do that because I think that is going to cause more

therapy for that child later in life. That's unnecessary therapy. We try and stay toe to toe about that. And then you said that kind of one of the things that you took away from your experience with infertility, with 10 miscarriages, with IVF, all those things, was not to get overly attached to this identity as a mother. What else did you learn from that experience? Oh my gosh. It's my favorite topic. I love talking about fertility. I learned that science. is incredible. And the fact that we have access to that is a gift. It's so cool and that there's quite literally nothing wrong with you if that's what you're going through. If you keep miscarrying, you can't get pregnant, there's nothing wrong with you. It's just bad timing or your eggs aren't

where they need to be sperm's not whatever it is. You're doing everything you can do. And maybe that's just not the way you get pregnant. I didn't think we'd get pregnant naturally either time. So I was like, cool, IVF's a great option. Let's figure out how to make this work for us. Okay, I have an IVF question in a second, but I do want to say to anybody listening, what I like about what you're saying is I do think there's a lot of scary stuff online about becoming a parent and how it's basically going to destroy your life, destroy your time, all that. And so I do want to like linger momentarily on people who have positive stories about it because I do think that I love the honesty. I love that we've created a safe space

for all of that. But like, is somebody who hasn't had kids yet? I'm like, is this going to absolutely destroy my life, which is what I think this listener is worried about. I think I'm too positive sometimes. Like, I think it can sometimes be annoying. I just don't dwell on things. Is my life harder now that I'm a parent? Sure. Like, is it more financially stressful? Yeah, like, those kids are expensive little things. But you just roll with it. We talked about friendship divorces. There was no time for that kind of negative energy in my life after becoming a mom. And that has in turn given me energy to put into Poppy or nameless child number two, who I have not named yet. It's also like our brains are so powerful. You just make room for new things and keep going. Yeah. Okay. I'm starting the first round

of IVF on Monday and I'm nervous but really excited. Can you share your best tips? Congratulations. That's huge. IVF is amazing. So hopefully this person listening found an incredible doctor who speaks to them in English rather than science because like I said, science is amazing, but that's not how most people interpret words. I would say to give yourself a ton of grace to keep yourself busy, but not too busy. Like don't just stay at home for the next 10 days worth of shots. Go out and see your friends. Keep your mind busy because if you're not keeping your mind busy, it's a lot to think about doing shots for 10 or 12 or 13 days and then doing a retrieval and then waiting five days to see which made it to the blastocy stage and all the ones that fertilized

and all that kind of stuff. So you've got to keep your mind busy. I found that when I was doing my two rounds of IVF or my retrievals, staying busy at work, giving my body grace, self-care, massages, facials, all that kind of stuff was great. When you think about strength and resilience, like your ability to feel energized, to recover well, to stay strong as you get older, what do you think that actually comes from? Most people say, working out or good nutrition, and yes, of course that matters. But there is a biological foundation underneath all of that that most people are completely overlooking. I have been diving deep into this lately with the team at timeline and what I've learned has genuinely shifted how I think

about my own health. Every single movement that your body makes, every step, every workout, every muscle contraction depends on energy produced at the cellular level. And at the center of that is your mitochondria. Here's the thing that nobody tells you, certainly not. nobody told me, starting around age 30, our mitochondria naturally become less efficient. More get damaged, more become sluggish, and over time that impacts your energy, your strength, your recovery, and your resilience. Most of us respond by pushing more. We're like noticing these things and we're adding in more protein. We're trying to fix it with more supplements. We're trying to do harder workouts. And those things do help. But timelines research suggests

that we also need to be supporting the cellular machinery underneath. And that, is exactly what their supplement, Mitopure, does. It contains urolithin A, which helps your body clear out damage mitochondria and support healthier ones so that your cells can produce energy more efficiently. Because this is happening to your cells, it's going to impact your entire body, your immune system, your muscles. One study found that taking mitopure increased muscle strength by 12% in four months with no change in exercise routine, it's going to impact your energy, your sleep, your skin, Your cell health impacts all of this, and urolithin A keeps your cells healthy. Timeline has done over 15 years of research and testing on this one product, urolithin A, which, by the way, most of us lack the gut bacteria to synthesize naturally.

That's why many of us need to supplement it to get the benefits. This has become a staple supplement for me. It is my top way to support how I want to look and feel as I age. Support your cells and how you age with mitopure gummies from Timeline. Visit Timeline.com slash Liz and save up to 3.3. 39% on your mitochondere gummies. That is timeline.com slash Liz. When it comes to wellness, you're going to get the best results by focusing on the big needle movers. A lot of us spend a lot of time trying to optimize that last 1%, which creates a ton of

stress and it actually doesn't help our health that much. At the top of the needle mover list, sleep. And one of the best ways to optimize your sleep is to optimize your mattress, which is why I love avocado green mattress so much. First of all, this mattress is, is so comfortable. I have the one with the pillow top, which is medium firm, and it's just a dream. I miss it when I travel. It's better than even the fanciest hotel beds. Having a mattress that supports your joints and your body and feels good is going to help you get more sleep and better quality sleep. But then, on top of that, avocado mattresses are made with certified organic cotton, wool, and latex, and they are made safe and green guard gold certified. They're also Okotech certified,

which is the gold standard. I look for it in any mattresses, sheets, or towels that I buy, which means the materials have been rigorously tested for harmful substances. You can actually look for the Okotech standard 100 label right on the product, and I love this part. It includes a traceable certificate number and the name of the testing lab so you know exactly what you're getting. There are no toxic chemicals. There's no harmful off-gassing. It does not smell like it's going to kill you when you unbox it. This is what I mean. I'm not going to swap out all of my clothing, which is that top 1% of optimization, but by making sure that my mattress and my bedding are as good for me as possible, I literally reduce my exposure during a third of my life, which is a huge needle mover for a one-time

swap. I will also note, and this is a me thing, but I sleep super hot and avocado's materials are really breathable, and it makes me sweat the least of any mattress that I have slept on. And avocado is a certified B-Corp and a 1% for the planet member because caring for yourself and caring for the planet do not have to be separate things. You can get up to 20% off organic mattresses and more by shopping Avocados President's Day sale right now at avocadogreenmatress.com. That is avocadogreenmatress.com. No code needed. Okay, we have another question that's, I'd love help on how to feel genuinely happy for friends who are expecting while we are going through our IVF journey. They asked us to host their shower

on the day that we found out our last transfer failed. And I'm trying to be supportive in this exciting time, but it's hard. That's brutal. Do we think this person was open about their struggles? When we were going through it, I was very open with my friends of what we were going through. And it gave me freedom to like, it was okay to be sad. And I think people asked less of me during those moments. I also found it really liberating to talk about all the miscarriages on social media with my friends, with other. medical professionals, all that kind of stuff, because it normalized how much of a bummer it can be. If that was me, I would probably be super honest and just say I'm not in a place where I can do this right now. Like, I have to take care of me first, and I'm so excited for you and I can't wait to celebrate you because one day I will get there, but I can't host this. Did you have a hard time being happy for your friends if they were getting pregnant and stuff when you were going through all of this?

I don't think I had a problem being happy for them because quite literally all my friends had babies while we were going through this. We were the last ones for sure. It just always stung a little bit when someone was like, I got pregnant the first time we tried. And I'm like, fuck you. How does that work? You're so lucky. But I never resented them. I was just like, God, that's so nuts that you can have sex once. And I've been having so much sex and I can't get pregnant. Like, it's wild to think about that. But again, I remember I'm not. doing anything wrong. It's just not the right time for us right now. Is there a better way they could have told you they were pregnant? Everyone was pretty gentle with me because they all knew about it.

If somebody was listening and they want to be gentle with their friends when they're telling them they're pregnant, what would you recommend? I'm an advocate for being really open with your friends if you're going through some fertility issues upfront. So if they do get pregnant randomly, they know where you're at. I think that's really helpful just so they can also gauge where your heads at. Maybe you're acting funny at a dinner party. Let them know why. In today's world, I will tell them early and I'm like, this isn't a guarantee. All my transfers failed, by the way. But like we did a transfer and hopefully this sticks, no celebrating. But here, I just want you to know where we're at. Like, I was just kind of upfront about all that. When did you feel given all

of that, like you could celebrate when you got pregnant? I waited to announce both of my successful pregnancies until I was well past 20 weeks. Until you do that 20 week appointment, nothing is guaranteed. I know too many people who have had to terminate after 20 weeks because they found a birth defect that would never have lasted past being in the womb. For Poppy, I didn't really celebrate until we had her. I was very nervous the whole time, but not anxious. I just knew it could end. Is there anything that you did to comfort yourself during your pregnancies to make yourself feel like not on edge the entire time? I, surrounded myself with really amazing doctors who told it to me straight and I saw them a lot.

When we got pregnant with Poppy, it was in the middle of COVID, I went to the doctor all the time. And I would go in and look at the doctor or the nurse or the ultrasound tech. And I'm like, if there's no heartbeat, tell me immediately. I want to know. First thing, if you see something funny, you tell me. So I was always bracing for that. I just wanted an open communication between whoever I was talking to because I want to. to know what was going on.

And then you said that having Poppy has only made your and Thomas's relationship better. What was the impact of all of the fertility struggles on your and Thomas's relationship? That's a great question. When we got pregnant the first time, which was years before Poppy, we went to my parents' house and told them, and we filmed it. And we're like, oh, my God, this is going to be one of those moments where everyone's screaming and jumping around. And my parents were like, okay, there was no emotion.

We're so excited for you. You think you're six weeks. let's celebrate once you get past 12 or 13. They're doctors. They know. And it was the greatest gift they could ever have given us because we knew right then and there. This is not a guarantee. They know more than we know. My mom went through miscarriages. I come from a science background. Thomas does not. So him seeing that from my parents was a real gut check, like a real like, oh my God, this isn't a guaranteed type of thing. And I think it really helped him come to terms with the fact that this is just a numbers game. And I think he did a lot of research when we started miscarrying

to inform himself about why you miscarry or what that means on your body. And we talked a lot about if he was okay, even though I was the one going through all the medical stuff, I made sure to ask him how he was doing emotionally and mentally and all that. But that's what built our relationship, because we went through that for so many years. Is there any advice you would give to somebody in terms of that type of trauma, making a relationship stronger, being able to say that's what built our relationship instead of we grieved until we drifted apart. Thomas and I, when we would go through something as traumatic as a miscarriage that was eight, nine, 10, 11 weeks in, you're kind of starting to be a little positive, but like it's late in your

first trimester, which is still quite early. We would every night after a miscarriage or after a DNC go out for dinner and like have a great bottle of wine. We really tried to lean on each other and still celebrate other things happening in our lives. I think leaving room for joy and you can feel the pain of the hard things and you absolutely need to to process it, but it doesn't also mean that there can't be joy in other things. Correct. And I'm of the mindset that you wake up every morning and you choose to be happy. It is easier to be happy and smiling than it is to be upset or sad or hold a great. or something like that. We both really lean into that in our relationships with each other,

relationships with our friends, our business, all that kind of stuff. It's a choice every morning to wake up and be a sunny person. A lot of people would push back on that. They would say it's really hard to be happy. It's much easier to feel miserable. It's much easier to feel the weight of having a job that I maybe don't like, having the world be so heavy, all these things and you say it's easier to choose to be happy. Why do you say that? And what would you say to somebody who says, no, it's not? It is easier to laugh and smile. It quite literally takes less muscles in your face to smile than it does to frown or grimace or whatever it is. That's just how my mom raised us. It is your choice every morning, how you want to start your day. And do I have jobs

sometimes that I hate? Sure. But I'm lucky that I have a job. So like that's a really incredible silver lining that I can always remember. What was your line like that when you were going through the miscarriages? Like, this is hard, but what's the sunny part? I have incredible doctors that I know I can lean on. I have a family who supports me. I have a partner who supports me. I have a job that gives me a lot of joy and I get to work on super cool projects. So like I said, I think the fertility piece of my pie was a big piece of my pie, but I had all these other. things happening that I could really be excited about. Planning a fun weekend adventure with one of your girlfriends to the beach, whatever it is, doesn't have to cost a lot of money, but it's something that

you can look forward to and that will fill you up. So you're not thinking just about, I just had my seventh miscarriage. Like, what is wrong with me? Nothing. It's just the wrong time. I love that. Okay. I'm about to have my first baby and I'm the first of my friends to do so. What is the best way to make new mom friends and find community among other parents. Just get out and walk. You're going to be so bored inside. You have to get out. You have to go to the park.

I think it's a huge benefit to getting your kid, A, outside, be around other kids to, like, be social, whether or not they can lift up their head or not. They're just, like, in nature with other humans. And the park is just a great place to meet people. Walk around, go sit there, put out a blanket and have yourself a little picnic with your newborn. and just like you have to leave your little cocoon. You are in like maybe the most celeb-packed mom group I've ever seen in the world. Can I ask how that happened?

It was during COVID. I don't know if we would all have done it if it wasn't COVID, but we were all, Hillary wasn't a new mom. May-May is her third. Hillary Duff. You may have heard of her. We all had babies like January, February, March of 2021. One of my girlfriends, Mandy,

asked if I wanted to join this class. We got close because we were both pregnant at the same time, not public. Like it was the middle of COVID. We were both a little nervous. How did you even know each other in the first place? We had met through mutual friends years prior. We were just never super close. And then becoming moms, I think, just took us to a whole new level because we just love each other. But she was like, do you want to come to a music class? And I was like, well, who's going to be there? Like, this is scary. And she's like, well, we're going to do it outside. But it's me. Hillary Duff, Megan Trainor, and a bunch of other people, and I'm like, wait, these bitches are singers. They're singers. And you want me to go to, and at music class, for those of you who don't know, you sing to introduce yourself. What? Yes. When I tell you. Hello, my name is, oh, my God.

Hello, hello, hello, I'm glad you're here. I'm goby and poppy as my dear. You sing it. I am tone deaf. My child tells me to stop singing in the car. I am truly tone deaf. And I was like, you want me to come to a music class with Megan Trainor? Are you high?

But it was an incredible way to meet people who are going through the same thing. Yeah. I was going through it. So yes, here's the deal about the celebrity thing. It's L.A. So many people live here. And if you really think about it, there's nothing that you go through that they don't go through. They're just doing it a little bit more in the public eye and they're making a lot more money than all of us.

but they're just normal human beings and they're going through problems just like the rest of us. But, you know, singing in front of them was terrifying. Were they like angels as they sang their thing? No, but like were they on key? Yes. And when we graduated from music class to gym class, nothing made me happier. Oh, you're like, we're in my domain now. Let's play tennis.

We just don't have to sing anymore. Thank the Lord. That's so fun. And you guys have all stayed really close? Yeah. Do you have any tips for, I think a lot of people have like that initial entry into moms. But how do you actually form this like cool type mom group where you're all really supporting each other? Well, I think it's a really beautiful thing to do is because you're supporting each other through this crazy year long like transition period into becoming a mom, which is like wild. But for us, what we've done is one of us has continued to like host some sort of class. I host taco party. Like I host parties where the kids. can all come over and swim and then we feed everyone and stuff like that. And it's so nice to give the kids a little bit of social stuff with people they're familiar with all the time. The parents have gotten close since that. Do you do it in like a standing cadence type of way? Like once a month? Well, music class was once a week every Sunday for gym class. And now we've transitioned to every Saturday for swim class. And I host that. So like I make it into a whole thing and there's food and there's

fruit and there's drinks and the kids run around and they play afterwards. So like when you become a parent, you realize that like the weekends are the hardest part because there's no school or child care. So how do you fill your day? So having everyone to my house for half an hour, 45 minute swim lessons from eight till two with the teacher just in the pool focusing on one or two kids at a time, you make it to nap time. And then you're on the home stretch when you wake up and it's just time for dinner and you can go watch some TV and go to bed. I also do think that standing dates in general are like the biggest life hack because the decision fatigue of like calling. and scheduling and when are we going to do this? And we build relationships over extended hangouts over extended periods of time. And so I think just saying like every Sunday this, everyone's day this, it really transforms

relationships. I'm a big believer of it. Also like if I text a girlfriend and I'm like, when do you want to hang out? And they're like, well, we have a free day in July. I'm like, I can't. Like if you can't hang out next week, like I'm not planning July right now. One, I would challenge anybody listening to do one once a month standing date at a minimum. Like we all can pick one date a month, do a book club, do a, do a.

dinner night, something, a game night. It can be really easy and chill, but I think it changes everything. I agree. And it's so much to look forward to. Okay. I'd love to know how you react or handle it when someone points out a flaw or something that you dislike about yourself. I have a stain on my front tooth. So I get people letting me know I have lipstick on my tooth. It's such an insecurity for me. So I just say thank you instead of telling them that it's a stain. I'm probably more confrontational than most. Which is funny because that's not how I was raised. but I think being online has made me confrontational. So I have a Lisp.

You do? Oh, yeah. People love to point it out occasionally. And here's what I tell them. My Lisp is because I'm lazy. And my mom and dad, like, they clocked it really young. And they're like, we'll go to speech therapy. And we went twice.

And I was like, I'm not doing these exercises. I was probably seven. And I was smart enough to be like, nope. But here's the deal. If you're making fun of someone's speech impediment, you have no idea how they got that. Like maybe they were an accident. Maybe something happened during a dental procedure and someone clipped something. They couldn't control.

You have no idea what happened to that person. Yes, mine happens to be laziness. And if I really slow down and think before I speak, it can go away. But that's not who I am. Who cares? That's what makes me unique. I'll never name my child something with an S. But like, I don't, it doesn't bother me.

This is a little bit of a diversion from the question. But people used to ask me, when are you having kids? I really enjoyed starting to throw it back in their face. Oh, I'm trying. and trying for X number of years. I've had this number of miscarriages. Like, you can't ask that anymore. So to me, people pronounce my name wrong. I will correct them on national TV. I'm just not afraid of throwing it back there. I'm genuinely confused how master class gets literally the absolute top people in every single field to teach every single one of their classes. I use it when I want to

learn things directly like the cooking class from Thomas Keller has all of the wisdom that you would normally have to go to culinary school for. But also, I'm being honest, this is like a use case I don't hear a lot of people talking about. I'll just watch it for entertainment when I want to do something that's far more interesting than scrolling. Christina Aguilera taught me to sing. Shan Boodrum's Art of Mastering Confidence and Sex Appeal class is 10 out of 10. There's menopause classes with leading doctors. There's script writing with Mindy Kaly. Literally, you name it, they're on masterclass. And it is such a good way to get off your phone, but have something that's like not quite as long or get into is a TV show or a movie and that it just keeps you entertained and interested,

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That is branch basics.com and use code Liz Moody. Do you have any insecurities about things in your appearance, things about how you're perceived in the world? I mean, sure. And how do you deal with them? I don't know if I have a good answer to that. I'm so fortunate that I was raised by a mom who didn't impresses. any of that upon me. And sure, she might have had some insecurity about her body, but she never let me see them. And so I never thought about anything like that. And I'm trying to do that with

Poppy. What are you doing with her specifically? Because you're raising her in L.A. around people who are very appearance focused, who we live in a world where tons of people are getting plastic surgery. People are getting Botox in like their teens and 20s and things like that. So what are you doing specifically to have her not be focused on those things? Even given who some of my my friends are, like we're not a very appearance forward group. Like, sure, everyone can turn it out for an event or something like that. But if you saw what everyone looked like and what I rolled out a bed for swim class looking like, it's nothing exciting. So you're modeling that too. You're saying, like, you don't need to have a full face of makeup to be allowed to go out in the world. Correct. But, like,

makeup's fun. And if you want to play makeup with your little kiddo friends and paint my face pink, let's do it. As far as body stuff goes, Poppy sees me naked all the time. We talk about how cute her little tushes. We're just like very build you up and nothing is weird. I just try and keep everything really positive for her. Did being raised as an athlete make you think more about your body in terms of like strength versus how it looks? Or does that cause its own problems? No, that's actually a really great observation. Yeah, my body was my tool for a very long time. I played tennis in college. So being strong, continuing to be strong even today is really important to me. To have a body, no matter what it looks like, that functions is awesome. That is such a gift.

Have I ever been super skinny? No. Do I always have like five or seven pounds because I love to eat chips and guacamole? Yeah. And like, that's fine. I would rather be happy eating that chips and guacamole with three margaritas than not eating that. So final bit of advice for this person who has a stain on their tooth. What specifically should they do in the moment? Do you think they should say it's a stain? No worries. Yeah. I was born. with it. Who cares? Or I drank too much coffee and I have a stand on my tooth. It's part of who I am. It makes me who I am. That's what I say about my list. I love it makes me who I am. All of these little quirks, this is one of my least favorite things about the veneer world that we live in is I do think

that everybody's face is starting to look more and more the same. And all these little quirks, like I love Kirsten Dunst's smile because I have a little like snagletooth too and she has a little bit of one and I'm just like, oh, that makes her face her face. Yeah. And I think there's a lot of examples out there when people are changing their face and then they all of a sudden don't look like how they looked and you're like, you were so cute before. Like, why? Invest that money into a trip. That veneer shit is expensive. It's expensive. Okay, so it makes you who you are. Yeah. And I love that. I love that. I think you've got to really celebrate yourself. Okay, I think we have time for one more. I'm thinking about starting a small cookie slash granola business, but I'm scared. Do you have any tips for

stepping out of your comfort zone and trying something new? Yes. A, I think you have to go for it and you make it a side hustle until you no longer need it to be a side hustle. But B, for people who want to start a business, especially in the food world and the consumer world, it is the most work you will ever do in your entire life. And so you can't be afraid of that. It is an incredible amount of work starting a cookie company and in like wild work. Plus you're going through permitting issues and health regulations. You are going to spend more time not doing the baking. you're going to be doing all the business stuff.

So just be prepared for that and be ready to hustle for years before you see a payoff. Where do people start? I've looked at people starting businesses. I'm like, where's literally the first step? Like you develop some food product in your house, but then do you have to go find a packer for that? It depends on what it is. Like there are different places that have cottage laws. So you can quite literally make cookies in your home and sell them if you get the right product.

For us, starting Dolcan and Co, we had a ton of learnings because we had partnered with a big company to do the first round of it. And then we took it all in-house. But it took me two years to get Dalkin & Co. Up and running before I could sell a single product because I had to find the manufacturer. I say, this was very Thomas. We're 50-50. Manufacture the fulfillment center.

Who's going to ship it? Soon after we launched, we had to switch that because we were having too much breakage. We had to find a designer. We had to invest some of our own personal money into it. There's so much that goes into it. before you can actually start seeing a profit, it was a real passion to get it to where it was. If somebody wanted to start a food company, like any sort of actual package good that they're sending out, at the minimum, what do you think they should be ready to invest? It depends on the product.

But I think the best place to start would be to find like a co-op or something. Like I know Portland, Oregon has a bunch of incredible co-ops where there are six kitchens. One of them's rented out one day for the cookie person. One's for the granola person. one's for the person making tinned fish, whatever it is. Go there and find other people who have started similar businesses to you, not necessarily the same. If you want a cookie, maybe don't talk to the cookie person because they might not give you all

the intel, but talk to the person doing the granola and find out their pain points because that's what you need to be ready for. What were your biggest pain points with Alken & Co? Well, the shipping was one of them. We went with a big 3PL company that would pack our products and ship them out. And it was too big and they weren't caring about the packaging. We ship in glass because I don't want to use plastic. So there was a lot of breakage for the first couple months.

And we found a different 3PL service who is a small business and cares very deeply about consumer packaged goods and does only food. And we've had almost no breakage since. But that was an expensive mistake to make because we had gotten up and running with one. And then we had to switch over to the other. You have to ship all your product. That costs money. like it's not necessarily a cheap fix, but in the long run, it solved a lot of problems for us. I will say that is a business lesson I had to learn the hard way this year is to budget for mistakes.

Like budget for spending your money wrong and know that that's not an exception to the process. Spending your money in ways that you are going to regret later is literally part of the process. Correct. And like you're not going to regret it later, but you're just going to be like, that was $10,000. I could have spent doing something to like move us forward. work, not just keep us on par. Yeah. But that's part of the process and you need to go in knowing that you're going to need more money than you think and you're going to spend money in ways that you're going to be like,

oh, I wish I'd known better, but that's like literally part of it. Yeah. Can you leave us with the best piece of advice that you've ever received? The best piece of advice anyone ever gave me is you have to ask for exactly what you want. And if you can't articulate what it is you need and want in that moment, no one's going to give it to you. So you have to think about what it is you want and you have to go out there and ask for it. And if someone says no, find someone who says yes.

I love that. Can you take a second and shout out your products, your books, anything you want to draw attention to? Dolcan and Co. is our CPG line. It's all seasonings. And some new things we're launching probably within the next couple of weeks. It's almost one year old. It's very exciting. And we have a bunch of cool things happening for holidays.

So that's something I'm super proud of. And my fifth cookbook came out this summer called grilling all the things. We hit New York Times bestseller, and that's my fifth book. And if I'm truly as unhinged as I think I am, I think I'll probably start writing my sixth one any day. But yeah, those are the things that I'm really excited about this year and some other fun in-person event stuff we're launching for 2025. Ooh, fun. I want to come to one. Come.

I just feel like being together in real life, it's so much better than being online. Like, I get it. We all have to make videos and post pictures, but like you can't beat in-person. You can't beat in-person connection. 100%. Well, thank you, Gobi. Thanks, Liz. That's all for this episode of the Liz Moody podcast. If you love this episode, one of the best ways that you can support the pod is by sending a link to your friends, your family, your partner, your coworkers, you name it. You're helping grow the podcast and you're helping the people you love change their lives. If you're new to the podcast, welcome. I'm so glad that you're here. Make sure that you're following the podcast on whatever platform you like to listen on.

you're going to go to the main podcast page. That's the one that lists all of the Liz Moody podcast episodes, and you will see the word follow under the logo on Spotify. And then there's a little follow with a plus sign button on the top right of that same page on Apple Podcasts. This way you will not miss out on any new episodes. They will appear right in your feed every single Wednesday and every single Monday. Okay, I love you, and I will see you on the next episode of the Liz Moody podcast.

Oh, just one more thing. It's the legal language. This podcast is presented. solely for educational and entertainment purposes. It is not intended as a substitute for the advice of a physician, a psychotherapist, or any other qualified professional. The number one rule of habits is to make the things that you want easier and the things that you don't want harder.

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