The Majority Report with Sam Seder - 3555 - Kidnapped By Israel; Medicaid Coverage Cliff Looming w/ Chris Smalls, Katheryn Houghton

Episode Date: August 7, 2025

Today on Emmajority Report Thursday: MSNBC reporter Eugene Robinson walks Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent into admitting that the tariffs are paid by the American importer and passed onto the American consumer. It is a tax. We are joined by former Amazon Labor Union President Chris Smalls to discuss his recent experiences being detained and abused by Israeli officers for his role in the Freedom Flotilla Coalition. Reporter for KFF Health News, Katheryn Houghton joins us to discuss the newly legislated federal Medicaid work requirements. Brandon Sutton and Matt Binder join us for the fun half. Boomer Chris Cuomo is fooled by the most obvious AOC deepfake and then instead of apologizing doubles down on his own stupidity. Katie Miller, wife of Stephen Miller and staffer for Elon Musk has started a lifestyle podcast for women and one of her first guests is Mike Tyson. Washed up 90s actor Dean Cain is making recruitment videos for ICE as they eliminate the age requirements. Al that and more plus phone calls and IMs   The Congress switchboard number is [phone]. You can use this number to connect with either the U.S. Senate or the House of Representatives. Become a member at JoinTheMajorityReport.com: https://fans.fm/majority/join Follow us on TikTok here: https://www.tiktok.com/@majorityreportfm Check us out on Twitch here: https://www.twitch.tv/themajorityreport Find our Rumble stream here: https://rumble.com/user/majorityreport Check out our alt YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/majorityreportlive Gift a Majority Report subscription here: https://fans.fm/majority/gift Subscribe to the ESVN YouTube channel here: https://www.youtube.com/esvnshow Subscribe to the AMQuickie newsletter here: https://am-quickie.ghost.io/ Join the Majority Report Discord! https://majoritydiscord.com/ Get all your MR merch at our store: https://shop.majorityreportradio.com/ Get the free Majority Report App!: https://majority.fm/app Go to https://JustCoffee.coop and use coupon code majority to get 10% off your purchase Check out today's sponsors DELETEME: Get 20% off your DeleteMe plan when you go to joindeleteme.com/MAJORITY and use promo code MAJORITY at checkout. SUNSET LAKE: Right now at sunsetlakecbd.com, Use coupon code “Left Is Best” (all one word) for 20% off of your entire order. Follow the Majority Report crew on Twitter: @SamSeder @EmmaVigeland @MattLech Check out Matt’s show, Left Reckoning, on YouTube, and subscribe on Patreon! https://www.patreon.com/leftreckoning Check out Matt Binder’s YouTube channel: https://www.youtube.com/mattbinder Subscribe to Brandon’s show The Discourse on Patreon! https://www.patreon.com/ExpandTheDiscourse Check out Ava Raiza’s music here! https://avaraiza.bandcamp.com/ The Majority Report with Sam Seder – https://majorityreportradio.com  

You are listening to a free version of The Majority Report with Sam Cedar. To support this show and get another 15 minutes of daily program, go to Majority.fm. Please. The Majority Report with Sam Cedar. It is Thursday. August 7th, 2025. My name is Emma Vigland in for Sam Cedar, and this is the five-time award-winning majority report. We are broadcasting live steps from the industrially ravaged Gowanus Canal in the heartland of America, downtown Brooklyn, USA.

On the program today, Chris Smalls, president of the Amazon Labor Union, will be back with us to talk about being detained and abused in an Israeli prison after trying to deliver aid on a flotilla to Gaza. And later in the show, Catherine Houghton of KFF Health News joins us to talk about the effects of Medicaid cuts and work requirements. Also on the program, many of the long-awaited tariffs take effect today. Yes! Finally! They range basically at the bottom from like 10 to 15 percent to even higher than that. Including Trump announcing 100% tariffs. Love that word on semiconductors, not produced in the United States.

Making Apple CEO Tim Cook grovel at the dear leader's feet, gifting him a golden statue. Because please, please, please give iPhones a carve out. In Brazil, Lula responds to the 50% tariff by rejecting Trump's shakedown attempt as a humiliation. Trump wants a new census five years early that excludes undocumented immigrants. A reminder that in the Constitution, even the founding fathers, well now I know this was to give slaveholding states more power,

but they said slaves counted as three-fifths of a person. Trump wants no counting of undocumented immigrants. The New York Times reports that Andrew Cuomo and Trump have been chatting on the phone, Trump is also threatening a military takeover of Washington, D.C., because Doge staffer Big Balls got beat up by two 15-year-olds. That's not a fake headline. The administration begins stripping federal workers of union protection, starting with 400,000 VA employees. An Alabama auto plant has a union election that. has a union election this week, a milestone in the UAW's push to organize in the South.

At least four Palestinians have starved to death over the past 24 hours. Dozens more killed by bombs. Boston Consulting Group, the firm behind the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation that's been shooting hungry Palestinians, is developing Trump's ethnic cleansing plan, moving Palestinians. to Somalia is what F.T. found in their reporting was in their newsdeck, or not newsdeck, slides for their proposal. And lastly, Texas Democrats staying in Illinois receive a bomb threat. All this and more on today's Majority Report. Welcome to the show, everybody. It's an Majority Report Thursday. Hello to Matt. Hello to Brian. Hello to you guys. Let's just start here.

So the tariffs that have been long awaited, many of them take effect today. We're going to be seeing increased prices throughout the rest of the year, but there are some estimates that say that the worst of the price increases could take up to like eight months to make their effects felt. What we're seeing now in terms of increases are in part due to the fact that, not, it's not directly the tariffs, but it's the freezing of economic activity that has resulted from the constant daily back and forth and uncertainty created by this bizarre tariff negotiation that is mostly about Donald Trump's ego and having countries and companies come to him. That's why he's excited about Tim Cook groveling at his feet. He is trying to consult.

consolidate his power and loves the idea of the world's biggest countries or companies coming to him and having to bend the knee. And we're orienting our economy around the whims of this particular guy, which is just a part of the authoritarianism that we're seeing ramp up. And this fight with Brazil is particularly insane because I'm going to repeat this for people. We had a trade surplus with Brazil. Trump has been saying this is all about deficits. We have a trade surplus with Brazil. We sell billions more to Brazil than they sell to us. We had last year a over $7 billion trade surplus with Brazil and over $90 billion in trade.

we trade energy steel iron and more with brazil but the commodities that come back in our trade relationship are 100% going to be affected by this particularly beef so the united states has been increasingly reliant on Brazilian beef it's up to a quarter a fifth of the beef that we import into this country and it's like hamburger meat ground beef so we're going to see burger prices likely increase in this country. We also import seafood from Brazil, tuna, things like that. I was reading in Reuters, I think, that the United States is something like 70% of fishing exports for Brazil, so this could basically bankrupt that industry down there. Coffee is another big one. Like, part of this tariff insanity is some of these commodities we can't even grow and make

here. We can grow some coffee in Hawaii. But for the most, part, we've got to import coffee. And this is going to affect coffee imports as well. So this is also interestingly kind of a bit of a gift to Lula domestically. He's had a rockier second time around here. And there's been some inflation issues down in Brazil, of course. But he's getting a polling bump from some of his fights with Donald Trump. He, there was a poll that Bloomberg News took down in Brazil and showing that he's ahead, ahead of his 2026 race. So with that in mind, here is Brazilian President Lula talking about Trump and their negotiations. And this is a translation over his actual words.

So what is happening? The civilized way for two heads of state to negotiate is to have the will to take the decision along with Brazil. He could have communicated with Brazil, he could have called, he could have proposed the negotiation, but we received the taxation statement in a completely authoritarian manner, and we are not used to negotiating in this way, not like this. In that moment, we still have a lot of people in Brazil trying to talk with Americans. We believe that a country that has 201 years of civilized diplomatic relations will not throw that away because of the intemperate attitude of a president. Distemperated of a republic.

Let me tell you something. A president cannot humiliate himself for another president. I respect everyone. I demand respect towards me. I love respecting people and love being respect. and love being respected. And I've got to be respected. So that's him, the quote that's making the rounds is the humiliated,

humiliated quote. And we've seen that, like Mexico, for example, despite Claudia Scheinbaum being on the left, has largely escaped some of Trump's ire here, in part because she approached the negotiations from a position of strength, both in her tactics but also in the fact that Mexico has enormous leverage here. Brazil has leverage too because Brazil is one of the world's biggest countries and we do have a significant trade relationship with them to go back to what I said and we'll keep repeating it.

We have a trade surplus with Brazil when Trump was saying that he was supposed to only be targeting these deficits. It's insanity. But good thing Americans don't like hamburgers, right? The Republicans have been saying for years that Democrats want to take away meat from you. Trump wants to take away your hamburgers because he's pissed that Lula de Silva

and Brazil is prosecuting his friend for trying to do a coup. This is the America first guy. We're going to raise prices for imports from Canada because they dare to recognize a Palestinian state. And Trump's friend in another country is in some legal trouble, so we're going to raise your country.

coffee and beef prices for America first, right? Coffee, beef, and fish takes me out completely. Oh, I mean, time to move. So, like, this is going to be really impactful. And they're struggling to get out of this. Like, when you ask Americans, too, in public polling about tariffs, it is overwhelmingly unpopular. Over something like 70 to 80 percent of Americans are concerned about the

tariffs. It's quite difficult for them to message around this, especially because a guy like Scott Bassan here is a typical Wall Street, money, money guy. And everybody in his orbit is pissed about this kind of thing. Here he is this morning on MSNBC. Also, it's evident that they're even going on MSNBC to have to make their case here. That's how worried I think they are. One, about the markets, because the markets are freaked out. And two, about trying to sell this to people. Here he is on MSNBC

kind of being cornered here by who's this anchor? I'm not sure his name. Eugene Robinson. Eugene Robinson, there we go. Great speaking voice. I'm not really familiar with him, but he's on Morning Joe, so we probably don't have a ton in common politically. Regardless, this was a great kind of subtle way that he cornered

Scott Basson here. I'm in a changing world. Mr. Secretary, there's one question. I've got to ask you, because there has been some confusion. So we've got a tariff of, what, 50% on Brazil now, I think. And so if someone here, an importer, wants to buy Brazilian products today or tomorrow and import them, they're going to pay 50% to the Treasury. And so who writes that check?

well a couple of things first we could have substitutions so there's very little that only comes from Brazil you know that it could come from Argentina it could come from but assuming it does come from Brazil say or it or it comes from any country with a tariff who writes the check to the treasury well the check is written to the person who receives it at the dock the US just just just looked it up quickly. Argentina accounts for around 1 to 2 to 3, 1.5 to 2.5% of the beef imports to the United States.

Brazil, a fifth to a fourth around that. So this isn't like any other country can replace this trade relationship. But just go back like 10 seconds. Tariff, who writes the check to the treasury? Well, the check is written to the person who receives it at the dock in the US. The check is written by the person who receives it. So the tariff is paid in this country by the importer, is that right? But the Brazilian exporter could decide that they want to keep market share. They could lower their price so that the full 50% of the tariffs

say, you know, and you're right. They can eat part of the cost. Which is what we've seen. Uh-huh. Okay. Okay. But the check is written by the importer right at the dock. Yep. And then, you know, the, the importer can pass it on or not. Okay. All right. So they move on from that, but that silence and that gulp, the importer, the for-profit

company that has no morality and is just interested in shareholder value and profit and that kind of thing, they could decide to pass it on or they could decide to take less money for themselves and eat it. Which one will these companies decide to do? It's really hard for me to figure out. I mean, like we've been talking about, it's going to wipe out anybody but the largest corporations which have money to play with on this sort of thing. Exactly. And even they're pissed about it because it will, it's going to be impactful across the economy. When we're talking about the situation that Trump is setting up right now with

tariffs, which are inflationary because they increase prices because even though Besant is trying to lie his way out of it, it is passed on to the consumer. So it's a compounding sales tax, which is already a regressive tax, because it proportionally impacts

people more, the lower their income is, because the price of a good is the same for everybody. But if you have less money, it's more of a tax on you proportionally than if you have more money. So tariffs are going to increase, basically, sales tax, or that's how they will function.

So it's going to be passed on disproportionately to lower-income Americans, disproportionately to middle-income Americans compared to upper-class, and as you go down the list, that's how it's going to work. And what this lunacy protectionism is doing as well is also just continuing to strengthen and Brazil's relationship with China. We're going to see this across

different countries with economic power. India is a big question in all of this. Modi is in a more precarious political situation. His party took a hit last election cycle. How does he manage this? Ideologically, he and Donald Trump,

of course, are close together, but he has to think about his own self-interest here. Trump's been alienating him. Edward Lewis and the FT has a good piece on basically how Trump's entire term so far has been a big gift to China and from the taking credit to for the ceasefire between India and Pakistan which in Modi's like no and and also like a

terrifying Taiwan which is where we get all of our semiconductors yes which is I'll just people should check out the map how close Taiwan is to China and like what would happen if say we drove Taiwan more into China's hands like and we're worried of We're worried about them taking it by force. We might just be forcing them to have a better relationship with China through our insanity. Yeah. And all this is about American capitalist impotence. And we're trying to let Trump's trying to lash out thinking we're going to be able to make Japan drive Ford F150s.

Like, I don't know. It seems so self-defeating to me. Because, I mean, I don't even think it's that well thought out. It's it, he, it, this, forgive this. sports reference, okay? But people will have to deal with it for just a second. Right now, the Cowboys are having these insane negotiations with Micah Parsons, who's the best defensive player in the league. And Jerry Jones reminds me so much of Trump. He keeps delaying these contract negotiations, and the more they delay, the more expensive it goes, because the cat

beats going up and up, and the player gets more leverage. And they, the outcome is largely irrelevant to him. It's because he's like, in his 80s, he's an old kind of, you know, slimy business guy from back in the day and it's the negotiation and like the feeling of empowerment as an old businessman and the deal making process and the back and forth that's almost like I don't know fetishized by these guys it's like their golden hours where they get to feel important again and have all the and have the the the negotiations come to them and they can control everything and it's like Trump is doing that with tariffs the outcome is a relevant to making the dear leader feel like he's the most powerful person on the planet.

I would use a different metaphor. It's like a toddler who realizes that all of the adults get really concerned about paying the toddler attention when they grab their phones. Right. So like grabbing a phone or like going to an expensive vase. That's basically this tariff thing. And ooh, all the world leaders and a lot of them are caving to him. Lula, I mean, and Scheinbaum also the Trump negotiated a trade deal with Canada. in Mexico so it's hard he's kind of constrained a little bit by that and deciding to go at the entire rest of the world i mean it's it's insanity and just generally speaking congress is to blame

for this it should not give him the leverage to do this the justification for it is for emergencies which are about fentanyl which is a joke the idea that or and uh illegal immigration or whatever like these aren't real concerns congress should take this um these uh abilities out of his hands. And unfortunately, they wanted to give him to Obama as well for the TPP at the end of his term. But Congress needs to step up and be in charge of what's going on in this country in terms of like what industries are going to benefit and all that other stuff. But yeah, we got some ads.

That was part of the leverage that Chuck Schumer, our good friend that this program gave away. In a moment, we'll be talking to Chris Smalls, a former president of the Amazon Labor Union co-founder. First, a word from some of our sponsors. Magic Spoon is one of my favorite sponsors. I love having Magic Spoon in the morning, in part because I love cereal, but I don't love the junk that comes with some of the sugary cereal. I also love having a high-protein meal in the morning. And Magic Spoon solves both of those problems with high-protein zero-sugar cereal and treats,

reinvented from your childhood so you get to have that nostalgia without some of those trade-offs. I really enjoy the treats I had some of their bars that I just ran out of recently that are really good as well. They're like

cereal bar, granola bar things. They're phenomenal, but also the cereal is great as well. You can get it at some grocery stores. The one around the corner from my place has them. Every serving of Magic Spoon has high protein, high protein cereal, has 13 grams of protein, zero grams of sugar, and four grams of net carbs.

They come in nostalgic flavors like fruity, cocoa, and frosted. Magic Spoon's high protein treats are crispy, crunchy, airy, and an easy way to get 12 grams of protein on the go. They come in mouth-watering flavors like marshmallow, chocolate peanut butter, dark chocolate, et cetera. Both are great on the go, pre- or post-workout, and as a midnight snack. get $5 off your next order at magic spoon.com slash uh this is the wrong code i think it's a different show than ours so um that's okay i'm going to see if the ad it do we know the code for magic spoon we'll put it we'll put it in the description it'll be in the show notes it'll be in the show notes uh let me just check

if i have it in my email here because it's funny that the nope it's the same one, the incorrect show. Anyway, I think it's majority, but I'm not exactly sure. Either way, you can get $5 off if you put the coupon below in the description. Look for MagicSpoon on Amazon or in your nearest grocery store.

That's magic spoon.com slash whatever's in the description. It might be majority for $5 off. And lastly, delete me. Delete me is a service that I can say I can recommend really highly because I've used it, I

started using it even before I started working here and before I even knew that they advertised with us. Delete me makes it easy, quick and safe to remove your personal data online at the time where surveillance and data breaches are common enough to make everyone vulnerable. Data brokers make a profit

off your data. Your data is a commodity. Anyone on the web can buy your private details. This can lead to identity theft, fishing attempts, harassment, and more, but now you can protect your privacy with delete me what do data brokers do well your name your contact information social security number home address even information about your family members could all be compiled by data brokers and sold online thank you to delete me for sponsoring the majority report delete me

is essential for me it protects my family it protects you know even my friends people who uh sometimes they're a little bit of some crazies out there who aren't exactly you know balanced and they want to look up personal information and reach out and stuff like that, delete me, they protect me in that area. And I don't know what I would do without it, honestly. Take control of your data and keep your private life private by signing up for Delete Me. Now at a special discount for our listeners,

get 20% off your DeleteMe plan when you go to join DeleteMe.com slash majority and use promo code Majority at checkout. The only way to get 20% off is to go to Join DeleteMe.com slash Majority and enter code Majority at checkout. That's join deleteme.com slash majority, co-majority, 20% off your delete me plan. Link will be below in the description wherever you're listening to or watching this. Quick break, and when we come back, we'll be joined by Chris Smalls. We are back, and we are joined now by Chris Smalls,

former president of the Amazon Labor Union, founder of the Amazon Labor Union, who was recently released from an Israeli prison for his role in trying to block or break the blockade in Gaza as a member of the Freedom Flotilla Coalition. Chris, thanks so much for coming on the show. Thank you for having me. I appreciate it. Yep. And I know you're on the go. so I really appreciate you taking the time to speak about your experience. Talk about your decision to go on the flotilla. I know this is the second flotilla in this iteration.

The first one made news with Greta Toonbury on the float on the flotilla. Why did you choose to try to break the blockade? Yeah, thank you. I mean, well, for one thing, people thought that the Madeline with Greta was the first flotilla. That was actually mission number 37, I mean 36. The Hyundai was mission number 37. This initiative has been happening since 2008. And, yeah, the goal is not to deliver humanitarian aid, but to absolutely break the illegal seeds that Israel has imposed before October 7 for over two decades.

controlling what goes in and out of the borders, including food and medicine and prosthetic parts, which we were carrying. I chose to go on there as an American labor leader. Of course, as you mentioned, for founding the Amazon Labor Union. American talent is killing half a million Palestinians in less than two years. I wanted to definitely spread awareness about that, but also connect the dots. You know, Amazon is not only

participating in the genocide, they invested $7.2 billion into Project Nimbus, which is essentially the Iron Dome for the I-O-F. And these labor unions in America for the last 21 months have been shipping arms to Israel

every 15 months and manufacturing weapons. They pass zero resolutions, and they're not only participating, they are complicit as well. And they had to blood on their hands as well um can i i've heard some of your critiques of the the longshoremen and uh other uh labor leaders that have not uh stepped up to oppose this genocide um can you expand a little bit on your critique there and while you felt it was important to connect the dots

with uh labor and organized labor um and the genocide of Palestinians I read an article not too long ago where there was some type of meeting amongst some of the labor unions. And they audacity of them to say that the Palestinian liberation is outside the scope of labor, which is insane for them to say when they say injury to one, the injury to all that doesn't screw Palestinian lives. and for the Palestinians, their trade movement has been a part of their resistance since the first NACLA. You know, they always had trade unions involved in humanitarian aid or just civilian life. I've been fortunate enough to meet plenty of Palestinian presidents for trade unions.

My sister, Susan Salam, that's based in Jerusalem, the Palestinian president for women. And I know for a fact that working class issues, this is hand in hand. it doesn't mean that we exclude people because they're Palestinian. It's ridiculous. And that's something that's really shocking that's coming from, you know, institutions and unions who once stood on the right side of history when they went up against the apartheid in South Africa. And how did it come together for you to get on the flotilla? And if you could just speak about how long you were sailing and what it was like when you know how you prepared for what you would imagine was an inevitable likely israeli interception of the flotilla and what it was like when they boarded

the ship to take you all into custody yeah so for me i was from my journeys around the world i've been in company with some of the folks that were on the madleam and i was able to to get in contact with the co-founder of the Freedom Flotilla Coalition, Hueta, who actually, this was her ninth time aboard the Flotilla. She also survived the 2010 massacre when Israeli forces jumped on board and killed 10 of the volunteers. So, yeah, I had a phone call. I had 24 hours, really, to make a decision.

And I didn't hesitate. I knew that it was an important initiative, and I think the time is now. and that's how I was able to get on board and we spent some time training of course before we set sail so we spent about two days in Saracusa, Italy then we sailed to Gallipoli

we did some more training with other volunteers and other coalitions and then we set sail which was about seven days on the Mediterranean and it was very difficult at first we had to make adjustments of course 21 volunteers on the small fishing vessel that was built from 1968.

It's not an easy journey. And, you know, people I know are excited. They want to get on the next one because of the things that we accomplished. Even if we didn't make it, we definitely inspired people to get involved. And, you know, I just say this, though, to my comrades who want to do it, it's not meant for everybody. I don't think that anybody should have to do what we have done, which is put our lives on the on, you know, not knowing if we can make it back home or not. And when they aborted, they onboarded the hundella, just like the Madeline.

They come in the middle of the night. They cut communications off. We had to ride with them for about 12 hours to the port of Ashad, which is the immigration authorities. And that's when things got violent with me. They handed, we handed over, they handed over everybody to the authorities. and I was met with a violent attack from seven authorities. I was thrown to the ground. They put their knee in my back.

They twisted my arms behind my back and they had three guys on each side levitate me while one was pulling my hair and using my chains to choke me. So, you know, I experienced something that the other passages and volunteers didn't. And I know from my own personal experience dealing with the authorities out there that there's no way people can tell me Otherwise, that this wasn't blatantly designed by race, bigotry, our hatred for people of color. But there's no way people could tell me that Palestinians can live peaceful amongst the Israeli regime when they have such a hatred that I've never experienced in America in my life. Well, you were the only, I believe, from reading a black person on the flotilla of, you know, over 20 folks who were trying to deliver aid. and it appears that they singled you out, right? I mean, that's what you're saying

and brutalized you in particular for that reason. I heard you on Democracy now mentioning they were saying some horrible things to you as well. What else happened during your time in detention? And how long were you in an Israeli prison? I was there for five days. I was one of the last to leave. and not only did I experience this

historicism, but my brother had them from Tunisia. Also, also a person of color he's a Arab. We both were the last to me. They could have sent us home on any given day, but they chose to save us for last because they also were not just trying to physically abuse me. They were trying to

psychologically abuse me as well. And also with the others as well, they knew that we were on a hunger strike. So they pretty much was weaponized in food by trying to give it to us, knowing that we wouldn't take it. They even brought the wardening and set food in front of us. They even raided us twice with the raid unit for no reason, made us strip. You know, and it's just some of the things they did and said were just disgusting. You know, I've never once again experienced any type of hatred like that on any level in my 37 years in America.

And as far as, yeah, me being singled out, they definitely passed along the message from the IOWF because I did give them a piece of my mind, you know? I took a long journey out there, and I definitely told the IOF to their faces that without those guns and weapons, they're nothing. They're nothing but peons and they're scum because these are killing machines that have no remorse

and they think they're doing something notable. and I definitely gave them a peace in my mind on the way out. I mean, that's the other thing that is just like I can't wrap my mind around is what goes through the heads of these people who are clearly immensely brainwashed, but it's also a deeply racist society that encourages that racism as a part of like education, the militarism, and even in, in, of course, their treatment of you. And you can see how there's a reason that Mandela showed solidarity with the Palestinians

throughout his life, for example, because the struggle of anti-racism is indelibly connected to the Palestinian liberation cause. Absolutely. And I, even though I experienced what I did, it's still just a fraction in a glimpse of what Palestinians have to go through, not even close. And that's even more shocking. And one more thing is that I could tell you that the average age of the commandos that on boarded the hundella, they might have been 20 years old, 21 years old.

They were young kids and they definitely were brainwashed. And it was sad to see that they could be any average college kid walking around. And you are an American, obviously. What, did you have fears that the Trump administration, for example, would just say, see you later, you know, like, it's immensely brave for you to be doing this in part because, like, this administration clearly would not have your back, it appears, if the Israeli government put its foot down. Yeah. I mean, that's something that I knew when I signed up for. I knew that I wasn't going to be able to count on this administration. And they proved me right. The embassy did not show up. You know, everybody else's embassy showed up for them in person to check on their well-being, to make sure that they were safe. And ours didn't. I spoke to the counselor over the phone. He never showed up in person. That was at the port of authorities. And he promised my safety. But this was already. after I've been assaulted, so he failed already. So it was just a shame to see and take note that our

U.S. Embassy, once again, our taxpaying dollars, is going towards a government and administration that don't really care about Americans at all. It was seven of us. We were one-third of the crew. Lastly, Chris, because I know you've got to run.

I know that there are, you mentioned some folks on the flotilla who want go back. What can people in our audience do to help your comrades on the flotilla, other efforts to break the blockade, and what would your message

be to our audience about some of the efforts to try to put pressure on Israel in this way? Yeah, I would just say what I mentioned before, you know. It's not meant for everybody to do. We shouldn't have to do it. I honestly encourage everybody

to fight in their own way. You know, Everybody has a lane to fulfill and a role to play. And whether it's protesting, what it's demonstrating, if you want to do direct action, sure. But once and foremost, we just got to keep the people of Palestine and the people of Gaza foremost. We have to keep their stories and keep the hope alive for them. Right now, what we're seeing is so inhumane as a father, as a son. civilian as an American taxpayer citizen, we all need to be outright and we need to hold these government officials accountable along with these entities like the labor unions and

the corporations as well. Chris Smalls, founder, former president of the Amazon Labor Union, recently released from an Israeli prison where he was abused. He was trying to break the blockade in Gaza with the Freedom Flotilla Coalition, Thanks so much for coming on the show today and taking the time. No problem. Thank you for having me. Of course.

All right, guys, quick break. And when we come back, we'll be talking to Catherine Houghton about the impact of these Medicaid cuts and work requirements. Be right back. Thank you. We are back and we are joined now by Catherine Houghton, KFF, Health News, Montana correspondent covering health policy and politics, access to treatment and the business of health care in the state. Catherine, thanks so much for coming on the show. Thanks for having me. Of course.

So let's just start a little bit, I think, by talking about the Medicaid cuts in general and the one big, beautiful bill and what the cuts entailed. I mean, it's the largest cut to the program since it was created. I don't know how many decades ago, over 50 years ago at this point. math off the top of my head is in the strong suit, but it's basically gutting the program. Is that your assessment of it? Well, the story that we're looking at is really focusing on the work requirement component of it.

And so it's setting up a lot of new hurdles and rules that people who are enrolled in Medicaid are going to have to work around. And we know based on what we've seen in other states that have done this, though there are a few and some of the examples are short-lived, we know that that does cause people to lose access to their coverage and often because of paperwork problems or confusion on how they actually prove that they're meeting requirements. So we know that there will be a drop in the number of people enrolled in Medicaid because of these work requirements. And just broadly speaking, some of what the federal changes that are coming down the pike will do will require people

to show that they are working 80 hours a week. So, or sorry, 80 hours of more. month. And so that can translate to an actual job or that can translate to school or there are other kind of small list of exemptions that people may fall within. And so there's still a little uncertainty of like the rules that they'll have to, states will have to live by to implement checks on that and see whether or not people are meeting those reporting requirements and how they'll actually stand-up reporting requirements on a state-state basis. And so these work requirements, you wrote about that and how there were already over a dozen states that were trying to implement work requirements for Medicaid prior to the passage

of this bill on the federal level. What was the status of many of those efforts? And how does that impact it now coming from the federal government? the paperwork, the red tape, all of that. How do those things kind of come together? Yes, yes. So I would say, so we found, and I think it was 14 states that either have plans in the work to implement their own form of work requirements or have announced their plans

to implement work requirements. And so a lot of these examples are states that have been trying to work towards this for a really long time. Like you said, I am based in Montana. I know that lawmakers here had approved work requirements in 2019. And so for a lot of reasons, states, for the most part, have not been able to do that. Some of that is because of court cases holding them up, delays in the first Trump administration to actually go through that process, or the Biden administration blocking such efforts.

The states that we were looking at, many of them were trying to implement rules that, again, lawmakers had already established years in the past. Some were moving ahead quicker now that President Trump is back in office saying like, you know, we're going to get, we're going to get a green light for this now. So we might as well keep moving forward on it. In Montana's case, it's really interesting because it was the first state to release a draft plan for its own form of work requirements after the federal government had defined its standards. And after President Trump had signed work requirements for this program into law. July. So it's an interesting kind of case study of how states may be shifting. And so as far as

how these things intersect, there's a big question mark still, I think. And so in Montana's case, we see that the state largely aligned its plan with what the federal government has already laid out as the blanket rules that need to be put in place by end of next year. But there are some areas where the state puts a little tweak to the program. And I think there's uncertainty. and whether or not that will be allowed. And so we're seeing that with a lot of state plans. There's a lot of overlap. The goal is the same.

If you want access to coverage, you have to prove your working. But at the same time, states have their own little forms to what that could look like. And there's a lot of questions of whether or not that's going to be allowed. Why are states attempting to kind of have put their own spin on it or flavor? Is it because this legislation was in the works prior to the passage of this bill? or are they trying to be more draconian than the federal government? What's the motivation? So it varies.

I would say a consistent theme is a lot of these efforts were already rolling in place years back. And so they're trying to follow through. These are state Medicaid agencies and a lot of cases trying to follow through on what lawmakers already established as their set of rules. You have some states that, and it's interesting, Montana actually kind of softens what the federal government would require. And by that, I mean, they have a longer list of people who would be exempt from work requirements. The federal standards do lay out some exemptions, people who are medically frail, low-income parents.

But Montana's list actually goes longer in trying to kind of buffer vulnerable populations from having to do these reporting requirements. For example, they lay out people who are fleeing domestic violence wouldn't have to meet the requirements for a time. people who were without housing wouldn't have to meet the requirements for a time. You also have states, though, that are going stricter. And so I think Arkansas is one of the examples of that where they actually say no exemptions. You have Arizona that has said that they are going to largely align with the federal standards when it comes to work requirements, but they're trying to implement different pieces that maybe are kind of tangential to that.

And so an example of that is with Arizona, they're trying to create a life. lifetime cap on how long somebody can tap into Medicaid if they are capable of working. So there's a lot of variety in whether they're going softer or stricter than what the feds have established. And the roadblocks that they ran into prior to this, right, were the courts or the Biden administration kind of holding it up. Is that do they now kind of have a legal basis to do this? Does that change because the federal government, the bill that pass has created an opening for some of these work requirements? Like, I'm just flummox as to how the states think they have the ability to even tweak this at all, given the fact that Medicaid

is, you know, enshrined into federal law and the Affordable Care Act with the Medicaid expansion, states have the opportunity to opt in or not. It's, you know, it's, you know, seems odd that they're trying to now try to work around it? Sure. So I guess important context is that states have been able to put their own twist to some Medicaid programs for a really long time. That's through something called a demonstration waiver. And so the idea behind those waivers is if there is a policy gray area, states can apply to the federal government and say, hey, we want to do something kind of wacky with this. We want to do something innovative with this and see if it works. What is interesting?

here is work requirements used to be a gray area. It wasn't outlined in Medicaid prior to this new law that's coming in and placed late next year, but it's no longer a gray area, right? The feds have said, these are the rules, these are the base, this is the baseline, this is the floor. So I think states, the federal government did leave the door open for states to apply through these waivers to try to stand up programs sooner than the late 2026 deadline. I think that the big question we hit after that point is if states are trying to do their own twist to it, is the federal government going to view it as a policy gray area now that there are standards? We did contact the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services to ask about this, and the summary is kind of we'll see as well, which is what we were hearing from a lot of sources. But I think the language that we were sent was something along the lines of, we're analyzing to see how these state waivers are going to interact with our new federal standards. So again, a lot of question marks, I will say now that there are federal standards,

those states that are trying to push ahead and stand them up sooner, but are following the federal standards are probably less likely to face court issues or court challenges. But states that are going a step beyond like Arizona with the lifetime cap that they're considering or that they're seeking, they're going to be more open to litigation. And that was based on health policy law experts we spoke with for this story. I'm a little bit shocked about Arizona. Don't they have a Democratic governor still? Katie Hobbs is still in power and they're looking at additional work requirements?

The legislatures are wild. So I think you have to look at the whole mix in government. Okay, fair enough. So you also had another piece where you spoke to somebody, a man who goes by James in the piece speaking about how with these work requirements and with this attack on Medicaid, it's going to be quite difficult

for James to hold on to his health coverage. And there's a quote in your piece saying, I don't want to be a fraud. I don't want to die. Those shouldn't be the only two options because he's basically considering having to not be entirely truthful because otherwise he's going to lose some of his health coverage, right?

I mean, this is the bind that this is putting some people in. It's interesting. James' experience, he's actually already not reporting accurately, and that is because Montana requires that if you fall outside of the range to qualify, so for people in our state, that means if you make more than 21,000 plus a year, you no longer qualify for Medicaid. and that's known as the coverage cliff. So James has already hit that. And part of the reason why James hit that

is because Montana no longer requires eligibility or allows the eligibility to extend for a year. Instead, you have to report within 10 days if your coverage has changed. And he has a low-wage job. That means that his hours change week-to-week and means he can bounce in and out of qualifying for coverage. So he's not reporting when he falls out of coverage.

out of qualifying for coverage. The federal rules mandate that if you are capable of work, you have to prove every six months that you are meeting the requirements to work. That is a shorter window than what some states are considering and what some states have in place right now. A lot of people are advocating. Folks who kind of study the safety net system say, hey, coverage should be a window of a year.

Once you qualify, you have it for a year so that you have time to adjust if you do get a pay rate. increase the new federal standards mean that that window will be tighter which means people will fall off that cliff sooner or could fall off that cliff sooner um and the the there are a lot of people and i think um james might be included in this who uh have to basically or there's been there's been reporting that they're saying no to promotions or to hire paying jobs because those jobs don't guarantee health care. And then you would fall out, make too much money to qualify for Medicaid. This is like a pervasive problem that existed even prior to this assault on the

program. This, yeah, definitely a longstanding problem. James was an example where he initially said no to a pay increase. And then realized he wasn't going to be able to save up enough money to afford rent in town. It's an expensive place to live. And he was transgender. And he was transitioning outside of an addiction treatment program that came with housing. And so he initially said, hey, I don't want that dollarish wage increase because I'm scared to lose Medicaid and then realize that meant he may not be able to find housing. I just want to, there's this graph that I cite frequently on KFF about the number of people, the proportion of folks who are on Medicaid with what their,

It says work status and barriers to work among Medicaid adults here. This shows the proportion of people working full-time. This is from data from two years ago. But 44% working full-time, 20% working part-time. And then these were, you know, excuses that are given or that you can file when you're applying for Medicaid, not working due to the caregiving, illness or disability, school attendance. You see there that only 8% of the... that pool sites not working due to retirement inability to find work or other reason everybody else is

either working or caregiving uh have a disability or illness or are going to school so that that 8% is the apparently the the group of people that are uh responsible for all this waste fraud and abuse according to the federal government but my understanding and i'm wondering if it is for you on the ground is when we're talking about fraud or Medicaid fraud, it's usually on the provider side. Yes, and so there's actually a federal agency that is watching this, and the cases of fraud that they've identified is on the provider side. It's really hard to know how often that's actually happening with individual patients, but most often the system's really confusing. So researchers I spoke to about that idea have said more often, people are

aren't tapping into the program when they are eligible because they don't know they're eligible. The system's so confusing, it's hard to kind of work within it to commit fraud. But James, not being entirely truthful if his income is higher than the threshold on one week, that would be what is they would consider basically a fraudulent usage of the program, which is insanity because this is, like, how can you fraudulently try to maintain your health insurance? It's not like this is a cash payment. It's not like you can sell your Medicaid card to somebody else. This is somebody that is just trying to hold on to the health insurance that they have.

James is a really interesting example because he is what, he's an example of someone who the system is working for, right? Like a year ago, his body was breaking down. He was really unhealthy. He was not able to keep steady work because of his reliance on alcohol and his addiction to alcohol. Now he has a steady job. He's going back to school to become a licensed addiction counselor. He is doing well, and he attributes that to his access to Medicaid and says if Medicaid goes away, he is scared. So he is interesting and that he is both, there are people who say there's no waste, fraud, and abuse.

He's an example of someone who's breaking the rules and he knows he's breaking the rules. At the same time, he is kind of the story of the hope for a program like Medicaid. What do these work requirements look like in practice? Sorry, there's a dog in the hallway. What do these work requirements look like in practice? They clearly, I think, set up way more barriers to people access. Medicaid. But, you know, I'm wondering with this added paperwork requirements, you know, both from the federal level, but also now these over a dozen states that you write about,

what does that look like for people trying to get access to health care? So right now, the U.S. has one state that has active work requirements, and that's Georgia. And those rules have been in place since 2023. I've had colleagues who have been following that for years. We have a co-worker who's on the ground there who's really been tracking this. But what my colleagues have reported is that Georgia's experience shows that implementing work requirements can be really costly for states, really confusing for enrollees or want to be enrollees, and can also have ripple effects into other programs that state Medicaid agency staffers are also working in. So if someone's trying to tap into

food assistance or staff assistants. They're often trying to reach the same people who are managing Medicaid and trying to answer whether or not people are meeting work requirements. And so we've seen with Georgia that they're actually, they're one of the states that have a waiver that had already gone to the federal government before these national standards were established that tries to roll back its program a little bit. Initially, Georgia wanted to do monthly checks on whether or not people qualify. The requests that they have in place now and are still waiting to see if the feds say yes or no is to do that every year. So again, that's switching from month to month, which I don't believe the state ever actually implemented because that's a big administrative

burden to annual. It's cost and time for states. And it was a colleague of mine, several colleagues were following this and had said at one point there was a report that George was released that actually said they're having a really difficult time actually evaluating whether or not people are meeting the requirements which of course is like the reason to do work requirements is to see whether or not people are meeting that bar unless your true motivation is to keep more people from using the program right I mean like that that's essentially what what happens at the end of the day is when you create all of these barriers, like, you are, you just spoke about how there are so many people that

don't even know that they qualify. Well, what happens to people who do know that they qualify, but they have this incredibly burdensome paperwork situation that might, you know, make it difficult or perhaps they're worried about, you know, constantly having to file paperwork or interact with the government in this way? Like, it is designed to be confusing. Arkansas actually showed us, so it was, I believe, 2018 that Arkansas had stood up its work requirement program. And it was interesting. A judge initially deemed that that program was illegal, but before that happened, there were 18,000 people who lost coverage. And reporting from coworkers in my newsroom showed that, and reporting from a lot of places, actually showed that a lot of people were just tangled in the system. They didn't know how to report their hours. They didn't know they were supposed to report their hours.

or they weren't able to reach help when they were trying to because there was a logjam for caseworkers. Well, lastly, Catherine, what is your kind of estimate for the short-term immediate impact of some of these work requirements, like, or you're maybe not numerical estimate, but what do you think is the likely outcome with many of these states? and what we're going to be seeing in the next coming months when it comes to people kind of being jettisoned off their health care. Sure. So I think that it is interesting. States have until again the end of next year to try to stand up these programs. I think we're going to see a number of states asking for extensions to that because in some cases, every state is coming from a different place

and what they're tracking. So some places have systems that maybe could work to track this or a good starting point to track this, and others are starting from scratch. So I think we're going to see a lot of variety in whether or not states are ready to try to do this, whether or not they're trying to do it early or push it off a little bit longer. I think there's going to be, it's going to be similar to when states were doing Medicaid redeterminations. So after the emergency protections were lifted during the pandemic, you saw that the nation, every state, had to re-evaluate whether or not people qualified for Medicaid,

and that big administrative load on states meant that they were overstretched in a lot of places. And so you may see longer waits for people to access caseworkers to talk through their application or the problems with Medicaid. You're going to see states trying to juggle an awful lot to catch up to what the standards are supposed to be. Well, Catherine, I really appreciate your time today. You can check out the coverage of all of this stuff at KFF Health News. Really appreciate it. Thanks so much for coming on the show.

Thanks for your interest. Of course. Well, with that, folks, we're going to wrap up the free part of this program and head into the fun half where we will take your calls. We will read your IMs. This show relies on your support. Go to join the majority report.com. Please. You can support us that way.

us independent, keeping us thriving and doing the show, Monday through Friday, every day covering this awful new cycle. Matt. Finally, we're allowed to talk about Sidney Sweeney in the fun hand. Look, I am a sick, sick person with pop culture. I enjoy it. I like dipping my toe in. But I am, I just, I don't understand why this, why anyone cares, like this white,

blonde girl from Idaho is a Republican. There's like so much I would love to know about being a 21 year old girl. Oh, I guess. No, I know why people are interested. Look, she's, she's hot. Just leaving it at that. Why do we have to care? Why do we care? Why do

we care? Can't people just be hot and we just leave it alone? Great. She's, that's it. I think it boils all down to thumbnails on YouTube. I think Charlie Kirk right. Sydney's on his thumbnails. Oh, okay. Yes, I mean, that's why we'll talk about the Chris Quom.

That's when we will talk about the story because it's actually funny to make fun of Chris Quom I'm getting fooled by a deep fake of AOC talking about how hot Sidney Sweeney is, which is really just- She was offered a tour, sushi and poker with the boys. Like, we get it. You guys want AOC and Sydney-Sweeney to make out. And that's basically what this is about. And I have to engage in this is apparently politics? I feel like I'm in middle school again. Look at them in conflict. Meanwhile, if you make $21,000

in a dollar, you don't get health care. We've got to talk about Sydney, Sweeney. What if they're physically fought? That's what this is, basically. I'm at like a 14-year-old boys sleepover, but apparently it's Congress or something. Try a 65-year-olds.

Join the MajorityReport.com. Matt, what's happening on Left Reckoning? Yeah, we had Kylie Chonels. on about her new book, Coercion, and the sort of synergy between abortion restriction and abusers domestically and at the state level. Great interview, great book, you know, recounting the horrors that we've been living through since the Rover, leaving the Roversus Wade era into this post-Obs era. Kelly covers as good as anybody else.

So check that out, patreon.com, so I left reckoning. All right. Well, I guess we'll see Matt Bender and Brandon Sutton in the fun half. People are testing you today. I know. Yeah, we're having some technical, we had some technical issues, but we will survive. Yeah, I guess we'll just... Watch Harry Emden.

See you in the fun out. Okay, Emma, please. Well, I just, I feel that my voice is sorely lacking in the majority report. Wait, look, Samma's unpopular. I do deserve a vacation at Disney World. So, ladies and gentlemen, it is my pleasure to welcome Emma. to the show. It is Thursday.

Yeah, I think you need to take over Sam. That's cool. Sir, I'm gonna, I'm gonna pause you right there. Wait, what? You can't encourage how much to live like this. And I'll tell you why. So it was offered a twerk, sushi, and poker with the boys.

Twerk? Sushi and poker with the boys. Who was offered a tour? Yeah. Sushi and poker with the boys. What? Twerk. Sushi and poker.

Uh, Tim's upset? Twer. Yeah. Suzy and poker with the boys. was offered a twerk, sushi, and... Ah, that's what we call it, bids. Twerp, sushi, and ochre with the boys. Right.

Twerp, sushi, and old... We're gonna get demonetized now. I just think that what you did to Tim Poole was mean. Free speech. That's not what we're about here. Look at how sad he's become now. You shouldn't even talk about it because I think you're responsible. I probably am in a certain way, but let's get to the meltdown here.

Dwerp, oh, sushi, and poker with the boys. Oh my God. Wow Sushi I'm sorry I'm losing my fucking mind So it's offered a twir Yeah

Sushi and poker With the boys Logic Twerk Sushi and poker with the boys boy boy twir

I think I'm like a little kid A little kid I think I'm like a little kid I think I'm like a little kid Add this debate 7000 times A little kid I think I'm like a little kid

I think I'm like a dude I'm losing my fucking mind Some people just don't understand So I'm not trying to be a dick right now But like I absolutely think the US should be providing me with a wife

and kids. That's not what we're talking about here. It's not a fun job. That's a real thing. That's a real thing. Willie Walker. That's a real thing. That's a real thing.

That's a real thing. That's a real thing. That's a real thing. That's a real thing. Ladies and gentlemen, Joe Rogan has done it again. Offered it to work. That's a real thing. I think he might be blown out of proportion.

Real thing. That's a poker with the boys. That's a real thing. That's that poker. Let's go, Joe. Twerp. Sushi and poker with the boys. Take it easy to.

Twer. Sushi and poker. Things have really gotten out of hands. Sushi and poker with the boys. Elusional. Twer. You don't have a clue as to what's going on. Live YouTube.

Sam has like the way to the world on the shoulders. Sam doesn't want to do this show anymore. It was so much easier. One of the majority report was just you. Hey, you're happy. Let's change the subject. Three. Rangers and Nick are doing great.

Now, shut up. Don't want people saying reckless things on your program. That's one of the most difficult parts about this show. This is a pro-killing podcast. I'm thinking maybe it's time we bury the hatchet. Left is best. Trump. Violet twerk?

Don't be foolish. And don't fucking tweet at me and don't get changed. The way Emma has cucked, all these people. That's where my heart is. So I wrote my honors thesis about it. Oh. Sorry, good. I find it.

I guess I should hand the main mic to you now. You are to the right of the unflung policy. We already found Israel, dude. Are you against us? That's a tougher question. I don't have an answer to you. Incredible theme song. I bumblers.

Emma Viglin, absolutely one of my favorite people. Actually, not just in the game, like, period.