The Matan Show - Matan Finally Confronts Hans Niemann About The Cheating Scandal

Episode Date: April 19, 2026

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Hello everybody, welcome back to the podcast for today's guest. We have Hans Neiman. Please welcome in. Can you come see in the middle now, please. For today's co-host, we have my manager, VARFluoring. Welcome in VARFluaring. VARFlorin. Can you explain the meaning of that name?

Can you explain the meaning of your name? But VARFlorin sounds like a nickname. No, that's his legal name. Viral Flooring. Viral? VIRAL. Floring. You grew up in America.

You shouldn't talk like it's your third language. Viral flooring. No, but you have a bit of a night. accent viral like you know how things go viral yeah that's his legal name yeah he makes things go viral mm-hmm mostly floors he makes floors go viral and then the floors explode because they're so viral gonna explode no they explode on TikTok they get millions of views and then the floor explodes okay I understand so can you please pull the mic close to you and then introduce yourself to anybody who

might not know you and all that one I'm a Hans Neiman I'm a chess grandmaster I'm the number 12th ranked chess player in the world. I've been the US Junior Chess Champion, I've been the national chess champion for the high school. And I had a Netflix documentary come out, which is play. I hope you most people see me in. What do most people know you from, though, obviously? You know, mainly from chess, there was a, I defeated the world champion when I was 19 years old and Elon Musk made some jokes about it. Can you hand him his little toy ball? He missed the shot so bad he fell off the table. You know, I actually used to teach chess to children in school.

So I acquired an amazing degree of patience, which I think would be useful for this podcast. You acquired a degree of patience? Yeah. Visit BetMGM Casino and check out the newest exclusive. The Price is Right Fortune Pick. BetMDM and Game Sense remind you to play responsibly, 19 plus to wager, Ontario only. Please play responsibly.

If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or someone close to you, please contact Connects Ontario at 1-866-531-2,600 to speak to an advisor. Free of charge. BetMGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with Eye Gaming Ontario. It's like a metaphorical thing, though. By spending a lot of time with children. Okay. Are you trying to call us children? I feel like you're only a couple years older than me, but...

No, no, no. No, I think it's just an important thing in life, I have patience. Yes. Would you rather have a million dollars or a million frogs each worth $10 million that you can only sell in a million years? I would want the frogs because I could take a loan out against the frogs and take cash out of the value. Why would they give you a loan with cash on the value if they can only sell it in a million years too?

Because there's still some relative value. But the relative value is very low. You know, I like frogs. Okay, so you, I didn't say you couldn't use them for other things. I just said that you couldn't sell them. So you used a 10 million frogs? A million frogs each worth $10 million. I could, you know, I could, you know, I could, you'll have $10 trillion.

I'll send those frogs to, you know, to war. Everyone that dies, you now lose $10 million. I lose a frog, not $10 million. $10 million because they're each worth $10 million. And $10 million. in a million years. Does shoving a little bids up your ass to cheat in chess make you gay?

If someone did that, it might probably mean that. You're kind of speaking on yourself here then. I think you'd have to ask Elon Musk. Why would I ask him? Because he's the one who made the joke which started everything. I think it was some random commenter on Twitch

who made the joke. It was a random commenter on Twitch who made the joke. It was a random. Random comment. Joke with like some of these in between them because it's like it's a real joke. Well, it was, yeah, that was something that the news took seriously. It was never a serious accusation. But I saw this video where they scan you with the metal detector and they really checked your ass.

Yeah, that was quite weird from the organizers. So clearly they took it seriously. It wasn't really. No, they scanned everyone. Like you turn around. No, but specifically they scanned your ass. No, they scan all of your body from behind. They did that.

They do that in every tournament that you play. It was just that clip out of context looked like that. No, no, it wasn't out of context. I can show you other clips of them doing that to everyone. But what's your chest rating, Matan? I'm curious. Well, I actually used to play on the computer. I had 4,000, but I wasn't taking it to...

4,000? Yeah, I mean, it wasn't too high. Divided by 2, you mean, or divided by 3? No, 4,000. I mean, last time I played, because the ranking system didn't make sense. You had 4,000 80s? No, 4,000, Elo.

And you didn't make sense because they wouldn't give me players at my level. They gave me a guy 3,000 and he sucked. So I kind of stopped playing. Yeah, I'm a bit higher than 3,000. No, you must be way higher because I was 4,000. I was number one in the world online. You mean the computer was number one in the world online? No, unfortunately not.

No, yes, it's my brain. We're fucking right. I'm glad that we're on an intellectual path. In relevance to what I just said, though, what's the problem with cheating and chess? Isn't it a game about being smart? Yeah. I mean, at the highest level, I wouldn't say there's a lot of cheating. It's certainly an intellectual battle.

But some people are able to get passed. In the highest level tournaments, there's a lot of security. So, you know, as you said with the scanning, there's cameras, there's, for example, when you watch the game live, you're seeing it on a 30-minute delay. So when you're watching it, a lot of the relay of the moves are not being publicly... But is it really wrong to do it? I get that you're saying it's hard to do it. I mean, obviously, yes. But it's a game about being smart.

Well, I mean, conditioning and training yourself is a aspect of any sport. But it would be very smart if somebody was able to cut their hand open and insert some maybe like a piece of metal. Well, if someone did that, they would be scanned and caught. It's under their skin. But the scanners that they use, they use two different types of scanners that scan for frequencies. And there's a... Okay, but let's say they scan somebody's skin and they go... I mean, they have a...

What are they going to do? They're going to rip their skin open? I mean, I would say that the... What if the guy just claims he broke his head and he had to have... No, I might... I think that the thing is when it comes to sort of over-the-board chess... Maybe you could use my idea here, actually. You know, I've done pretty well on my own, so I think I think I'll be okay.

And what's your most racially controversial political take? Um... I love Mexican food. That's not super. controversial I'm just looking for something racial something nasty I'm gonna gonna get back to you on that I'm gonna what is yours what is what is yours what is you're the interviewer you're the guy being interviewed I could you maybe give me some inspiration after you I just you know I'm a I've been all over the world

I've been to you know but had the opportunity to travel like maybe 60 different countries and I think I have one actually. Okay. Despite what the people around me say and what my friends' opinions are, I actually do think black people should be allowed to use a public restroom. I'm sorry. Everyone's allowed to use public restroom.

I think they should be allowed, despite what my friends think. The friends here? Whatever you want to infer from that. Well, personally, I find public restroom is disgusting. so, you know. So send the blacks to them? No, I think that we should make public restrooms. I think we should make it so you have to pay for public restrooms.

In Europe, they have a thing where you pay like one or two euros, and it keeps them. So the homeless people, they just cheat on the street? In New York, yeah, you have a lot of, a lot of that, yeah. No, in Europe? No, in Europe, there's a bit more, they're a bit more communist and socialist, so there are less homeless people. Okay. You can go into politics if you'd like, if you want to skip. We can go into politics?

Yeah, maybe later. I mean, I just asked you your most racially controversial take and you didn't want to go into it. So you don't really see. I, uh, in politics. Yeah, you know, the thing, my most, nothing comes to mind. I'm sorry. That's a lie. If you've been all around the world.

What about, I'm sorry, what about me, you know, uh, like, uh, what about, that's no republicular things I've done? Like, makes, makes you think that I have such. a voracious. Everybody does. Everybody does. Everybody does. Did you ask George Santos this question?

I don't think so. Why him specifically? He's a politician, don't you think, that he would be more inclined to have a... He'd be more inclined to lie because he's a politician. That I agree with. I never get a real answer from him. That's true.

You're not a politician, you're a chess. Not yet. Not yet. I don't think that would go well for you, but I guess if you're like trying to go down that path to not have any bad clip three surface, I guess this is a good way to answer. Yeah, well...

Do you think the stress from playing chess is the reason your hair is falling out? You know, that's an amazing question. I've actually thought about this. Because you have an unbelievable hair line for your age. Yeah, you know, I can see the beginnings for that as well. No, look at this. It doesn't even start anywhere.

Yeah, how old are you? 18? I'm 18, but when you were 18, I saw the beginnings of it. No, the reason why I would say that my hair grows quite quickly. But yeah, I did have a very... Not quickly enough. I mean, I shaved my head completely bald. I mean, like a bus, like a military bus cut last January.

And this is growing back in the span of three months. So it's certainly growing. But it's not growing back right here. Yeah, I agree. I agree. I agree. I agree. I agree.

But thankfully, I look max in other ways. I don't think so. I think I hide among you for sure. Shall we... Did you get the implants to your legs or no? No, but should we stand up? But then you're not look maxing. You're just...

The most important person that I have Magas, Hikarro, and Magnus. That's all I really care about. But they have a lot more money and prestige than you, so it doesn't make up for it. Prestige, yes, but money now. You look Jewish. Am I wrong? You know, my background is very diverse. Some Jewish in there?

I would say that religion is a... Seems like a Jewish answer. It's a spectrum. You know, your belief in God is between you and God. Are you Jewish? Matan is very Jewish, right? No, it's not. It's actually German because of how the names work in the lineage of it.

You don't look German. Well, that's a problem, I guess, with not my genetics. My genetics should make me look German. It's unfortunate you don't think so. Okay, we'll follow up on that because you brought up Magnus. Do you think you could legitimately beat Magnus Carlson in chess if his brain, fingers, eyes, and ears were removed? I've beaten him so many times in the normal circumstances.

Legitimately. I understand that you can make these jokes, but to the viewer who's not aware, you know, should be aware of the context that... Well, a lot of my viewers probably don't watch chess. Yeah, they might, you know, maybe they saw a Netflix documentary, they heard of the scandal.

Did you just speak English? What the hell did you just say? You said, blah, blah, blah, blah. Either they've watched the Netflix documentary. Okay. So perhaps they have some context, or they read the news about the scandal, or they saw, you know,

chess YouTube videos are quite popular. There's Gotham chess. Other people might watch him. but according to the official chess federation according to the chess mafia I've been innocent so I don't believe it you don't believe it no well I mean listen they came up with it too late you added way more than enough

time to take whatever out of your ass there was in there yeah yeah and you are smart enough to not try that method again but you know the thing is it's not a very serious sorry Joe Mama Joe Mama He fucking got you

You are quite the intellectual Quite the intellectual It's hard to believe that you beat Magnus Carlson in Chess When you just got Joe Mammad by a guy with an IQ of about 48 I think 40 is flattering Okay well that just hurts your case more I just honestly such jokes You know I weren't really in my

I just couldn't have expected such a joke Do you have security or... Oh god. That's my own manager. What would the security do? They would defend him. He was the one paying their bills. Have you ever thought about any manager?

It's not allowed. I'm not allowed to get into that. Anyways, you never answered my question. About Magnus, if you had no ears, no eyes, no brain. Well, the thing is, is that I beat him so many times. Legitimately. We don't have to go over to get. Yeah.

I mean, according to the... official record every every every every one run was legitimate it's like if you you know if Tom Brady came here and you said that he didn't win legitimately or another I guess him deflated gate okay maybe you could you could make this jokes with him actually use the worst yeah that's yeah you're right he's the first he only he only came to mind you must be a cheater unfortunately not unfortunately not now it's interesting because a lot of the the great chess players now while they're did what when you watch Netflix documentary was that your conclusion

that you cheated what because you know if you think about what about because if you look at in the Netflix documentary you know you said you watched it if you look at the two chess dot com CEOs they both admit that there was no evidence and that I won the game fair and square and those are people who have a serious financial incentive to to to say that I was not you know to to to not proclaim my innocence and also Magnus in the documentary also said that I was completely innocent So I understand I would say you put it like that

No I would It was a little less clear about it They proclaimed Yeah no no here's the thing He did not When you make you know The thing is is that You know you're a young guy

You're 18 years old When this happened to me I was 19 years old Yes And it's important I understand comedy But it's also important To be to have some tact

And empathy over Things that can destroy people's lives You know Because there are There are jokes That you can make That can be unjust

But certain things You know They really tried to ruin my life for something that was false, you know? So, well, I feel like if you're offended by what I'm saying, even if I am joking, that's more of a U-issue for coming on this show. I'm not offended. I'm just trying to give context to the viewers, but you can, I, I didn't, you know, it's

okay. Well, listen, it's just hard, hard for me to, to think about it because they did also say you cheated in 150 games. So that's not, so they released a report, which is it contradicted in, you. their own report, one of the leading... Well, it doesn't matter because if you're saying that there's a people with the... Then you can't use them for one thing and not the other. So either they're correct or not.

No, I'm more so saying that... In communities across Canada, hourly Amazon employees earn an average of over $24.50 an hour. Employees also have the opportunity to grow their skills and their paycheck by enrolling in free skills training programs for in-demand fields, like software development. Development and Information Technology. Learn more at aboutamazon.ca. In that specific report, if you look at the timing of the report, they only went public about this report, which is false.

The majority of it is false. The report is false. Yes, it's completely defamatory. Why would I take you seriously? You only get to take them seriously when they agree with you? Yeah, but don't you think that if they said that I was innocent in that game and they're, I mean, I'm happy to disregard them saying you cheated in 150 games

if you'll also disregard what you like when they say it. It's not about that. It's that the fact that they, you know, in their report, in the documentary, they said that they wanted so badly for it to be true and they knew it wasn't. No, but they have no reason. But that, you know, you're mixing the words a little bit.

In that specific case, they have no incentive to lie. Because they're... Well, did they say that you didn't cheat before, after you sued them for 100? million dollars they they released the chess dot com report shortly before i filed the the the the lawsuit but you know one important thing about that report is those accusations to clarify or on online games and in the report they claim that i admitted to all those things yet they show no documented admission and i've discussed you're saying you didn't even admit it to though never even cheated in

online chess no when i was 12 years old there was The only instance that I've ever cheated in an online chess event, and let's separate. Online chess is not rated, not ranked. It's not a part of the official chess. I was 12 years old. It's like, you know, and the other instances were not in games or any money on the line. I feel like you've been going on for about four minutes now and you haven't even got to the beginning of what would seem like the conclusion. No, I mean, the entire thing is very nuanced and there's a lot of backstory.

I mean, that's why, you know, the Netflix documentary is an hour and a few minutes long, and there's a lot of different, you know, aspects of it. But the main summary is that you have to understand the timing of when I beat Magnus, it's been unequivocally agreed upon between all top players that, you know, that game was legitimate. There was nothing suspicious. You know, many, many top players have given interviews in support of me. Even my greatest attract. Well, is it technically illegitimate to put shit in your ass and then have it a little good to be a beep to let you know

to move because if that's legitimate, then me and the top players agree. That never happened. And there's never proof. That was never a serious accusation. Like that was, you know, all the media talked about it, but it was never, I mean, if anyone actually thought that was a serious thing, it's intellectual. People didn't actually accuse you of that. I just like to believe that that's what happened.

If you are, I mean, I guess that's just people are just obsessed with A.B's, I think that's a reflection or projection of their personal, personal. I think that's a great. argument. I think you could say that the first guy who suggested it was obsessed. I would say... Everybody else just liked the idea of it. I think it, you know, and the idea, it's a crazy story that could be, that is, that I understand is humorous. But the whole concept of people actually believing it is honestly quite stupid. Anyone who actually believes that like that happened, I question their intellect.

Are you calling them stupid or someone? You're thinking they're in the like, that could actually be a good thing. You question how you're so in a lecture. I mean, the way I used it, sort of had a negative connotation. Oh, I don't understand connotation, so. We'll move on.

Do you plan on going to college, Maton? No. Did you finish high school? No. What did you drop out? Effectively, yes. At what year? I forget what it's called

the second year of high school. I was 15. So you're a sophomore year. Yes. And is that, in some places, it's legal or not legal? Did you take a GED or did you graduate? I did online school. Online school, okay. But I didn't even complete it. I just said I was going to do online school. Yeah. We'll move on. Hey guys, start for the interruption. I have to let you know that today's

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today's episode. If chess is similar to fighting in the sense that the more people you're versing, the harder it gets, how many re-shirts could you beat it once? In one game or simultaneous games? One game. If they're, I mean, if they're all stupid, yeah, an unlimited amount if it's only one game. But usually when you say that in chess, you mean like a simultaneous six, but you play 10 people at once. So like you have 10 boards in a circle. No, no. I mean like there's, let's say a thousand re-hards all try to, I think collect.

gang of a lot of bad or made it find them bound yeah collective re-h-h-h-h-h-h-h-never never equals genius is it actually going to help them or get lower because in a fight it will help them that's what i'm saying let's say you get a ufc fighter and you give them 50 re-s they're going to have a tough time beating them yeah and re-hs are pretty crazy so i could imagine that they're even harder to to fight because they that's what i'm saying so in chess if it's the same logic the more people you versed once the harder it gets but it's an it's an intellectual game so there's no physical advantage i think that those If you reversing 100 normal people, it would be harder than one normal person in chess.

I don't think it would make a difference. I think it would make a difference because one guy would obviously just have less ideas going on about the game than you. If it's a normal person who doesn't have experience with chess, I don't think it'd make a difference. For example, I could play you with chess completely, you know, blindfolded. I mean, I'm the underwater world chess champion. And what does that mean? So. So-

To hold your breath the longest? No, so we play chess underwater And the board's underwater And you have to dive, you make your move And then You play chess underwater Are you the champion of that Because nobody else is willing to do it?

No, I actually beat the number two player In the world Who is that? Fabiano Caruana. Okay. So yeah, you can actually refer to me as Underwater World Champion, if you'd like And you can refer to me

As the champion of blacks But you won't do it. Why are you the champion of blacks? Because Do I have to explain it to you? Oh, I'd love to... I don't think I have to explain it. I think I would like you to just...

I would like you to just regard me as that. But I need some context. No, you don't. Do you think those square watermelons taste normal or like square? You know, I actually had the best watermelon in Kazakhstan in a city called Eralsk. That has nothing to do with what I just asked you. Perhaps I have more of an interpretive understanding. Have you seen those square watermelons on Instagram?

Yeah. Do you think they... Square? No, I haven't. Okay, well, those are square watermelons. Do you think they taste normal or like square? I don't know. I don't know. I think watermelon and... And curate, who do you know.

That's a black joke, but that still doesn't have that much to do with what I asked you? I'd have to try it. A cowboy rides into town on Friday. Stays two days and lives on Wednesday. How is this possible? You know, I think such intellectual questions. Questions are beyond my comprehension. It's a riddle.

It's barely a question. I just, I should stick to chess. You don't have an answer for me? Honestly, no. Think about it. I'll read it again. I'm speechless. A cowboy rides into town on Friday.

Stays two days and leaves on Wednesday. How is this possible? I have no idea. I have no idea. Because the horse is named Friday and then it leaves on a horse named Wednesday. Oh, wow. I'll give you another one. A cowboy rides into town on Friday.

stays two days and lives on Marcus. How is this possible? Marcus must have been very generous. Who is Marcus? A good friend of his, I suppose. What are you talking about? He left on Marcus. I don't know.

I understand what you're talking about. Perhaps it's the IQ gap. I think my IQ is probably way higher than yours. Why haven't you pursued something more intellectual? I feel like this is as intellectual as it gets. Chances for people who think they're intellectual. A real intellectual would pursue real things. Chances for people who want to look like they're intellectual.

What do you consider yourself? Business, the man who makes money. So for you this is about money, it's about comedy, is an art. Not art, it's like business. So this is purely a money-making endeavor. Yes. Why are you moving away? No, no, because he moved the mic.

Okay. So how is the money-making going? It's going great. Maybe. Next year I'm going. on track to make $13 million. And what's the majority of that from? Is it sponsors or endorsement?

Windows. Bulletproof windows? What is that? Why bulletproof? I didn't say anything like that. Because these windows in here looks so nice. I mean, are they custom or? They came with the office. That was just there when I got this space. Okay. Amazing.

I didn't know you had such an intrigue on windows. No, I just appreciate that, you know, the finer things of life. Are you the type of guy who would put a weight in your fish? I actually did see that. I did see the weight of the fish. The weight of the fish? I honestly, I really, I don't like boats. I get quite nauseous on boats.

I'm not really into fish. It has absolutely nothing to do with what I ask. No, I couldn't know. I couldn't imagine myself. I'm saying because it's a cheating tactic to win the game. Something you're probably, you might be well first in. Unfortunately. Actually, you are.

You did cheat in the online games. I can say that with a fact. Yeah, when I was young and in irrelevant games with no money on the line. Well, I didn't cheat in chess when I was 12 in irrelevant games with no money on the line. So technically I'm a more... Did you cheat on your homework in school? I didn't do it. Did you...

Oh, yeah. I guess I guess you're too shay. Yes. You weren't expecting that answer, huh? I didn't expect this intellectual battleground. Who's winning so far? I think we can let the viewers decide. Well, they're my viewers, so they're going to be very biased.

But, yeah, I suppose they will be... Outside of the fact that any of the ones who know, you probably don't like you. Adding a double bias. I disagree. Double points for me. Do you have any friends? Very few. Why is that?

Is it because you're so busy with chess, or is because you probably have some form of autism? You know, the autism I've thought about... Have you ever been tested? Have you? No. Perhaps you can go get an autism test together. I'm kidding. Of course I've been tested.

They test you when you're a baby and I didn't have anything. Yeah, perhaps an extra checkup is... Because autism is for people who have a messed up brain and I don't have that. I wouldn't say. I think it's an advantage. I think some types of autism are a great advantage. If you want to feel less bad about eating a live cow than maybe. But if you want to interact with people on a normal social level, then no.

Well, that's a spectrum. There are people, obviously, who are more socially isolated because of autism, but it gives you unique abilities. Like, a lot of chess players are on the spectrum. Oh, yeah, definitely. That's why I asked that question about if you had any friends. I have some friends, but mostly within chess, and I try to stay focused on competing. Holy shit. Are you Rick from Rick and Morty?

Can I get a picture? Sure. You got it, man. Great. Thanks. Who did he think you were? Rick for Rick and Morty. It's flattering.

What's the relation there? No idea. Did you shove the a little beads up your ass to cheat? Or was there another reason? I've never used the a bit. I don't think I'm ever going to try it. Give me a break. Let's just interact with it like you did.

Let's just say you did. But why are you so obsessed in the a bit? Why am I obsessed with it? I think that you keep asking you about it. Because that's what you're known for. but I've seen you use that argument on everybody you go why are you obsessed with the abides It's like because that's what you're known for

Everybody's really believe that that happened I think it's You should look in the camera and say Like and then we'll you can see if that's something So you can sue me? No but I wouldn't sue you Don't worry why because it seems like you have a great Great lawyer and manager who'd You know fight those lawsuits pretty well

I don't I think he has a different way of handling legal troubles, but not one that's favorable towards you. Yeah, just like that. Yeah. But you and Magnus now are good friends. Sure. Have you spoken with him since on any personal level? No.

And who do you think is a higher IQ between the two of you? I would say myself. Yes? Have you taken an IQ test? I have, actually. And what did you get? When I lived in the Netherlands, I took an IQ test to get into a school or you have to get a minimum score to get in.

Okay. And I scored the highest possible. The highest possible? Yeah, so they... That's probably the dumbest answer I've ever been given when somebody's lying about an IQ test. Give me a second to explain. So basically the highest they'll give you is a 145 plus.

And then they'll estimate what the score... As a matter of fact, that's actually the most awesome answer I've ever heard. What did you score on your IQ test? The highest possible. Well, like, this school is as well known. that one's called the Leonardo school and you have to take a IQ test after DiCaprio after DaVinci similar so you know

similar impact in the world but yeah the score is similar names yeah and Leonardo and then a D and you know contributions to the world but yeah that score was a 145 plus and then they estimated it to be in the 180 180 range so why didn't you just open with 180 because that you know the highest official score is 145 plus and then they estimate it past there but they don't give sense you know have you taking another and I took that touch the test in Dutch my second language well isn't it mostly about

squares and stuff no but there's also a speaking port because when I took it a long time ago yeah I did it and mind you I was 11 years old and I got a I think it was a 260 and I didn't even have to have a therapist with me when I did it and well well you should start playing chess maybe I'll teach you well I feel like if I have a way higher IQ I don't need you to teach me I feel like I could get the hang of it pretty quick you could just you could just start using

and you'll be great in no time no but since I have such a high cue I don't need to but considering how often you mention it I think it's something that you could be you're very passionate about I like the fact that you have this come back when Pierce Morgan you know I was gonna say I saw I saw the interview and you said you

it seems you told him the same thing is me it's a bit weird when you know it's not true I understand But it's a comedy show. It's a joke. No, it's a business show. It's a business show. But I like your comeback because you're telling people every time they ask you about it,

you say it seems like you have an obsession with it. But the funny part to me is that I'll probably never mention it again. But anytime anybody talks to you for the rest of your life, they'll probably be thinking about it. Or they'll think about that I'm the world chess champion. But that's not true. It's a matter of time. I doubt they're going to be thinking that you're the world chess underwe.

water champion or whatever the hell you told me about. That's more of an exhibition title. It's much more likely they're going to think about you shoving stuff up your ass. Unfortunately, because of how the media is, you know, that was a big story. But I personally... Well, you can put it any way you like, but that's the reality. To some degree, that's the unfortunate reality that was peddled by the media and unfortunately by Elon Musk.

But I personally believe that when I become the world champion, one of the greatest chess players of all time, that my achievements will... We'll overshadow that. And obviously, as time goes on, people, you know, will realize that it was just a joke and that, you know, the seriousness of my real achievements, you know, will outweigh the unfortunate. There will still be that blemish, even if you get what you like. It's certainly, but, you know, the blemish, I really had no control over. Everything kind of just spun out of control from Elon's tweet that... You seem to be blaming Elon a lot.

Did he do anything besides just make a tweet, but he just has such a large audience? He has such a large audience that if it wasn't from, if it was from anyone else but him, no one would have taken it seriously to that degree. So, yeah, generally I'm a big fan of Elon Musk. You like Elon? Yeah, other than that. He's actually, I agree. He's extremely cool and he's not a liar and he's extremely good at Diablo and Path of Exile too.

Yeah, the Diablo is a bit of controversial. You think he paid someone to boost his accounts? It's like asking if you put that stuff in your ass. Yeah, that I disagree with. But he does do, you know, has a great positive impact in the world. Don't you think? Don't you think he's developing humanity? Maybe in some ways, but not by...

I don't think he really cares to help humanity. I don't really think that's his ultimate goal. Well, I think Neurlink has a very positive thing from... I completely agree, actually. I think the idea of being able to control those worthless people and get them start working time, let's have it do it. But don't you... For example, one of the first Neurlink patient

was able to play chess with his mind. See, that's worthless. How about he picks up pieces of wood and starts putting houses together? Well, that's why he has the robots he's making. What do they call it again? Yeah, he's making... He has this new robot company.

But then why does he need to make Nourling? No, I agree. I agree. Some of the AI stuff is a bit scary, but generally I think he's a net positive for humanity. If women are truly as smart as men, why are there no women currently rated in the top 100 chess players?

I would say that there are less women who play chess. Can't be that much of a difference, like one per hundred. There's no way. The thing is, you know, when you have separation between men and women sports, there's less of an incentive for the woman to, let's say, you know, the number one, let's say the best chess player of all time was Judith Polgar, and she was actually number six in the world competing with men. She was probably cheating.

definitely not she got that high up and it was a woman it's for sure actually well she was raised in a very special way her three sisters were very talented and her father was a psychologist actually Netflix documentary about her called the Queen of Chess

you know perhaps you and her share the same 260 IQ but I would I don't have a 260 IQ sorry 280 or did I I have the highest possible yeah that would be a good clip

that'll be fun But in terms of women's chess, I mean, a lot of sports there's usually a difference. But in chess particularly, there's far less women. Their brain can't handle knowing that there's so many pieces. And a lot of the pieces have different movesets. I would say it's more. Their brain starts to go. Yeah.

I would say more that it's because when, if you were the number one woman's player, the women's world champion, you don't have much motivation to push farther than that. Why? Because you already, because you have. there's no chance. No, because you have sponsorship, you have, I mean, if men and, so, you know, boys and girls are in different

sections for youth tournaments, like the under 18 World Championship, there's different sections. So I think, and you also have a woman's titles. So there's a woman grandmaster, there's a woman international master. So, if you remove some of the separation and you... It's interesting they have to separate it. Well, most sports

are separated, right? But chess being... But most sports are physical. Yeah, chess is obviously on his physical, but there are some aspects, It's not physical at all. I mean, playing chess for six, seven hours. I guess maybe you'll play worse if you just ate a bunch of shit and you have a headache. I would say, you know, if you're overweight and you're not in good shape, your brain doesn't have a lot of energy. No, that's exactly what I just said.

I feel like it's a lot less of a factor than basketball. Obviously, not as much as the typical physical sport, but, you know, people who are healthy, you know, healthy brain is healthy and healthy body's healthy mind. So I would say that you shouldn't under. Is that proven? I think that's just so that you have to pay to see the. doctor otherwise they'll be out of a job I mean people who mental and physical performance are closely tied I know a guy not one of those warts on his hand or whatever it's called that thing where there's a huge bump and it's bleeding all

the time and the doctor said he had cancer and then he will die if he doesn't have his surgery immediately but the guy actually was able to take it off himself and save himself hundreds of thousands if not close to a million dollars that's that's great for him no I agree some some some of the doctors want to scam me so a a lot of the guy died immediately after and that's when you're friends. Not anymore. He died. Horribly painfully. Screaming in agony. Okay. His last words where I should have went to the doctor. I'm going to assume that's a joke. No, not at all. What was his name? Do you have trouble telling if things are a joke because you have some form of autism? No, no, it's

just, I assume everything is a joke because of how the context of this podcast. Because of how you were raised, because in the beginning you assumed everything wasn't a joke, so now you're all the way I would say actually if you can maybe you have another podcast with other chess players You'll find that among chess players am actually normal on that scale Yeah, because you're not really a chess player you're a normal guy who is able to figure out the best way to cheating So you're really just like a normal guy like me but I'm really actually like the highest possible I don't think I can fist bump on that you're fucking shutting me down Are you pro-choice pro-life or pro abortion? Don't they

contradict each other? Pro-chose and pro-abortion are the same thing, no. Pro-choice is giving the woman the choice pro-abortion is making mandatory abortions. I think the gift of human life is a beautiful thing and should be encouraged. So you're pro-life? I think that, you know, having children is a blessing.

But if somebody has unfavorable genetics, then maybe... So I wouldn't be in favor. I don't think anyone is in favor of eugenics. I'm in favor of eugenics. Is it illegal still or no? And most of the world, I would assume it's illegal. Perhaps in some less developed countries it is.

Well, less developed countries probably just haven't thought about it yet because they're concerned with growing a tree. But in developed countries... No, I mean, yes, less developed countries have more flexible laws and maybe dictatorships are more corrupt. Well, they just don't have any laws at all, really. Yeah, sure. In like Somalia, the focus is...

Give the lemon if you eat it, if you'll end up like Eve. Well, yeah. I mean, not everywhere in the world is as lucky to be as developed as America. It's not a luck thing. It's basically eugenics if you think about it. I wouldn't say that. I would say that. This is quite the political podcast.

You wanted to get into politics yet. I'm saying a bunch of stuff and you won't give any opinion. You're barely signaling you're like, I'm sort of pro-life, but I won't give a take on it. But I want to talk about politics. But you won't say anything. I mean, that was mainly because of your sort of... The racial question really caught me off guard. That was quite the opening.

Similar to the question I just asked about women, do you think the average chess player could beat a WNBA player at basketball? Chess players are incredibly unathletic. Okay, but I'm talking about WNBA. No. No? No. I think they should set that up.

I think that would actually be a very interesting. interesting match. But yeah, probably the best high school men's basketball team in the country would beat the NBA. Well, that's not even a relatively serious question. Everybody knows how that would go. Yeah, no, I agree. One of the lesser five-star high school male basketball players has probably done more dunks

in a game than in WNBA history. Yeah, no, I agree. I agree. So what about chess players like you? Because you actually don't seem horribly unathletic. Maybe. Seems like a little less than the average guy, athletic season-wise. Yeah, if I spent a lot of time, maybe I could kind of fit in.

No, right now, like obviously. I actually just played basketball in Paris. And like a pick-up basketball game, and it went pretty well. But I am not too confident in myself. You know, despite all the nasty things I said about you so far, and that being my general opinion, I will disagree with you here. I think it would go well for you. Thank you.

How many points do you need to become a grand wizard? Of Clash of Clans. No, of chess. Clutch Royal? No, chess. What's chess? I don't get the joke you're doing here. You're pretending not to know what chess is?

Personally, I'm a Grand Wizard of Clash Royal, so I can say that, you know, I reached about 6,000. I'm the Grand Wizard. I reached about 6,000 trophies in Clush Rell, which I think makes me a Grand Wizard. A Grand Wizard wouldn't be thrown off by a racial question. The Grand Wizard of Oz or the Grand Wizard of Compton? Of Compton? I don't think there's Grand Wizards in Compton I think ideally they would like no Compton

You don't like Compton They produce such great athletes like Serena Williams And Venus Williams I don't even believe in them Are they real? But going back to what I said How many points will become a Grand Wizard? You have to reach 2,500 points

So right now what is it? Is Magnus? What is he, the ultimate wizard Ultimate Grand Wizard? He gets to walk around in the robe? Hmm No, but that's a good idea I'll suggest that. What would happen if he did that?

Would they disqualify him? There is a dress code, actually. So if he showed up in a KKK outfit, he would be disqualified. It depends on the country. I don't know. In America, definitely. Okay, America, it's obvious

because that's where it's formed. But like in France, what would they do? You know, considering this wet cloth, like, it seems like, you know, this is your KKK outfit. No, no. I'm not a racist. Then why do you have this white cloth?

What do you use this for? This is a green screen. You think in the actual episode is just going to be white cloths? But it seems like you would take this. It's going to be like flying dragons in space. I felt like you would put the white cloth over your head and you could have a great outfit for your next...

I get it. It's what I was saying about Magnus. Would you consider yourself a comedian? No, business. Business? Do you think Long Neck would be able to beat you in chess if his brain was multiplied by 50 but not in a metaphorical way?

he literally has 50 brains somehow connected to his body that are somehow working, would he be able to beat you that? Who's longneck? The Rick and Morty guy? That was... Oh, the long-knorty guy. You're the Rick and Morty guy.

The famous guy with a super long neck? Yes. On social media. I think I've seen him. So he has 50 brains, but they're all the same level of brains him. I think we should have a neural ink, copy his brain 50 times, and test it out.

Isn't that actually a good way of cheating a chess in the future? a neural link? In theory, yeah, it might be a concern. Is that actually a real concern? Has anybody ever considered that? Or did I just come up with a revolutionary concern? I've seen people make jokes about it before, but I think that, I don't know,

chess players are very paranoid about everything. So I feel like to be worried that it would mess with their mind. A lot of chess players don't drink. I think almost no chess players do any drugs. They're very conscious of not trying to mess up. When we're done filming in a second, because I have to film with Longneck. He's my next guest coming in in like two minutes.

Longneck. Yeah, you'll meet him in the hallway, you know, on the way out of here. When we're done filming, will you reveal to me how you did it? Or is that something I'll tell you. I'll tell you the truth, which is that I didn't do it. I get it was still filming, but like once we're outside. I recommend everyone watching Netflix documentary and decide for themselves. Is that a self-promo or is that a promo for Netflix?

I can't tell whether to bleep it or not. It's a promo for Netflix I'll think about it I'll decide in post well that's it I have to film with Longneck now but thanks for coming on I should have expected it