The McShay Show - A Two-Way Travis Hunter Scouting Report. Plus: Indiana–Ohio State Expectations and Best Bets With Chris “The Bear” Fallica.

Episode Date: November 19, 2024

Welcome back to another edition of ‘The McShay Show’! The guys kick off with a deep dive of Travis Hunter’s tape on both sides of the ball and debate whether he can be the Shohei Ohtani of the NFL. Then, they’re joined by Fox Sports’ Chris “The Bear” Fallica to preview Indiana–Ohio State and talk best bets ahead of Week 13 of the college football season. To finish the show, Todd and Steve answer questions from their first Asked and Answered mailbag. (0:00) Welcome to The McShay Show! (1:50) Travis Hunter vs. Utah: 5 Rec, 55 Yards, 3 Tackles, 1 INT (6:10) Prospect Profile: Travis Hunter (Cornerback) (13:55) Evaluating Travis Hunter's CB Draft Stock (20:40) Prospect Profile: Travis Hunter (Wide Receiver) (32:35) Evaluating Travis Hunter's WR Draft Stock (35:30) Will Travis Hunter Play Both CB and WR in the NFL? (40:20) 2025 NFL Draft Top 5 Pick Projections (46:25) Chris "The Bear" Fallica Joins the Show (50:10) Week 13 Matchup: (5) Indiana vs. (2) Ohio State [-12.5] (54:45) Todd's Odds: Indiana vs. The SEC (57:08) Expect (3) Texas to Make the CFP? (1:02:45) Projecting the Final 12 CFP Teams (1:09:00) The Bear's Top 10 Power Rankings (1:11:35) Previewing Week 13 Matchups (1:13:10) Heisman Futures: Hunter [-330] Jeanty [+340] Ward [+1400] Milroe [+3500] (1:15:30) The Bear's Favorite Futures and Week 13 Picks (1:28:40) Mailbag: Asked and Answered (1:29:40) Mailbag: Where Would Bo Nix and Michael Penix Jr. Rank in the 2025 Draft? (1:32:45) Mailbag: Evaluating QB Prospect Traits (1:35:55) Mailbag: Historical Comps for the 2025 O-Line Class (1:38:40) Breaking News: Jets Fire GM Joe Douglas The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Host: Todd McShay Guest: Steve Muench and Chris “The Bear” Fallica Producers: Tucker Tashjian, Mark Panik, Conor Nevins, and Daniel Comer Social: Eduardo Ocampo Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

It's a Tuesday edition of the McShay show. We've got a fun one lined up today. First of all, we want to do this project, right? Everyone evaluates Travis Hunter, the Colorado star Heisman favorite right now as a cornerback slash receiver. But if you look at history, it's probable that he's going to have to choose one position. So I tasked my guy, Mench, go study him as a cornerback. I tasked myself, study him as a wide receiver.

We're going to give you an evaluation on Travis Hunter, both positions. We're going to separate it. talk about where he could wind up in this NFL draft. In addition, asked and answered. We're going to debut this segment. We need more feedback on this show. We talked about it the last couple of weeks. We need your questions.

Sent out a tweet and ex post, whatever you call it. Got a lot of great questions. We're going to get to a handful of them today. I'm going to make that a consistent thing on the Tuesday, Thursday show. And then finally, the bear, my guy. I'm so excited to have Chris Felica, who's now with Fox. he's got bare bets his podcast he's going to join the show he's going to talk to us about all things gambling college football previewing the game he's going to in columbus this week indiana versus ohio state it's a

monster matchup and also just go through the college football rankings and and we'll preview the college football playoff and what we think the rankings should be mentioned it's going to be a fun one man it's week 13 in college football week 12 in the NFL and just 156 days until the NFL draft. Mentsch, you good? I'm good, man. All right. Play those tunes, man. How's your assignment? How to go, Munch? I mean, when you're watching a guy like Travis Hunter, it's pretty easy, right? Not bad, right? Feels like stealing. It's not work anymore. So I just mentioned it. I feel like everywhere I watch, everywhere I listen, everywhere I read, it's when we talk about the 2025 NFL draft, it's always Travis Hunter, wide receiver cornerback, right? But I was going through this,

match, right? Charles Woodson, one of the best two-way players in college football history, won the Heisman, you know, a monster final year at Michigan. Do you know how many receptions he had in 18 years in the NFL? Zero? Two. Two. Okay.

Another guy, Champ Bailey. Phenomenal, two-way player, Georgia, special player, right? Played 15 years in the NFL. You how many receptions he had? More, right? I don't know, though. Yeah, he did have more. Four. Yeah. Yeah. You doubled up, just like I thought, man.

Nailed it. And then Dion Sanders, who's obviously coach Prime, he's coaching Travis Hunter. They're basically family, right? I think might be the most applicable combination. When we think of Dion, we think about the versatility, not just football and baseball, but, you know, in the NFL, the return. Well known, well known in the return game, which is no longer the thing that it was back in the 90s or, you know, so, so, but his value at wide receiver was, was there, much more so than

Woodson, much more so than Champ Bailey. He had 60 receptions in the NFL, primarily a corner, one of the great all-time return guys, but, but is that a route in today's NFL that's going to factor into the evaluation for Travis Hunter? No. And, but he did have 60 receptions in the NFL. But the interesting part with it, like Champ and Chuck and Charles Woodson, they played both ways in college. Dion didn't. Dionne looked at just to double check to make sure I was wrong. Dion at Florida State did not have a single reception. Right.

The all-time great return men and obviously a phenomenal corner. I think he's still in the top five in college football history or Florida State history. I think with 14 interceptions, I want to say. I forget what the number was. It was 13 or 14, yeah. Yeah. My point is that Dion didn't play both ways in college and how. had more receptions, but still was only 60 receptions.

So very limited impact. So with that is the backdrop. And with Travis Hunter being six foot one and 185 to 191 pounds is what I've seen the range for his weight. Right. With the shoulder injury he had earlier this season, with the nicks and bruises and missed time he's had over his career, not massive, not huge. Right.

But conditioning, does he have it to do it in the NFL? Well, yes, but skill-wise, can you as a player commit to a position and be a lead at that position while also doing it on the other side of the ball? History has shown us it's no. The answer is no. There can be an impact, but it's not going to be the impact that he's at Colorado. Okay. So I tasked you and tasked myself with let's treat it as separate entities. Like when we're evaluating players on tape, it's the helmet, it's the jersey number, and studying them what their skill set is.

Who are they at this position? Right. So let's separate Travis Hunter, pretend almost like he's two different human beings, two different evaluations. Who is he as a corner? Right. Who is he as a wide receiver as it pertains to the upcoming NFL draft? And we've got the, we broke down the traits. we're going to go through this year's wide receiver and cornerback class.

We're going to go through last year's and try to place them where we think at each separate position. So the floor is now yours, Mensch. You evaluated him solely as a cornerback. And I want to hear what you're. And obviously, I've studied the tape as well. You've studied the wide receiver tape. But for these purposes, I'm going to let you, you're the area scout. You're the cross check.

You're coming into the GM's office. And you're going to break down what, what he is as a cornerback, right? And so that's where I want you to go and tell me what you think of him. So the first thing when I look at corners, I want to see them impressed. I want to see how they match up one-on-one in press. And no surprise here, considering who he plays for, he is a fundamentally sound press corner who is physical.

He's lean, you mentioned it, but he's physical, he's tough. He can make it hard for guys to get off the line. He can turn and run with guys. He can mirror receivers release. So right away, he can match up and press. The other thing I want to see is, how are the ball skills? And you're going to get into this as a receiver. I'm guessing you gave him elite ball skills?

Does you give him an elite ball skill grade receiver for McShea? He's going to have elite ball skills for a corner. No question. You know, what's interesting to me is I went back and I want to see every interception a player makes in the year. He has three so far this year. So let's go back and look at the three. You know, the one he had against Colorado State is beautiful.

runs the route for the receiver, snatches the ball out of the air. The two other ones, I think, really bring it, talk about the next trait that I want to talk about, which is our instincts and recognition. And just to interrupt you real quickly, if you're watching this on YouTube,

watching the video podcast version of the podcast, you'll see here, this is his cornerback specific traits. We do this for every position. We've done it with the quarterbacks. You'll see it wide receiver later. But these are the cornerback specific traits. First one, instincts recognition,

most important. And people overlooked that they want to see the length, the speed, and all those things are critical. But the best corners in the NFL, the guys who translate the best, have elite instincts and recognition typically. And just ripping through this and you can go in more detail. But you've given him a grade of one, meaning that's elite. One is elite. Two is above average to good. Three is average.

Four is below average. Five is marginal. And you've given him the first three traits, instincts and recognition. one, elite. Cover skills, one, elite. Ball skills, one, elite. Run support, three, average. So go ahead, pick up where you left off. So I'll just, you know, looking at those two picks, there's one from Utah, there's one from UCF. We'll talk about the Utah because it just happened this past weekend. It's not, it's, you know, he's not making a one-on-one play, but what he does is, he disconnects from the receivers that he's covering, he tracks the ball, he stays in the play. I think this is

about Travis Hunter as a football player, by the way. He's not just a talented kid, man. He's a really good football player. I think he loves the game. He stays involved in the play. He easily could have just stayed on the receiver that he was covering. But no, he disconnects from that receiver, tracks the ball, ball gets deflected, pulls it out of the air.

There's another interception. UCF game. He's sitting there baiting the quarterback to throw that ball. He is just staring down that quarterback and then explodes off his back foot and makes this great diving catch. Kind of, again, all these things lead into one thing. leads into another. Can he play other systems than just the press corner? Is he just a press corner? No. He could play zone. He is just as good in any of those other looks that you want to give him because, again, his instincts, his ability to read receivers, his ability to read quarterbacks.

One of the most impressive things about this time, you know from where Richmond, when you play in college football, they come in the week of the game, and I'm sure it's the same in the pros. I didn't play in the pros. They come in the week of the game and they throw a 20-page game plan in front of you. This is who you're going to face. He's good at this. He's bad at that. This is the look we expect to see the formation. I as an offensive lineman at Richmond had a hard enough time absorbing that and having

Frank Leonard all over me about it. I can't imagine playing two positions and having just play, have a game plan at two positions at that level. Yeah, the wide receiver, the install for each week. Yeah. I can't, I cannot imagine. I think it speaks to how intelligent he is as a football player. It's something that cannot be overlooked.

Yeah. I completely agree. To further your evaluation, ironically, coming into it and coming into this year, I kind of always thought, like, cornerback was his primary spot. Yeah.

He was just kind of just relying on athleticism. And we'll get to wide receiver. I think there's more polished to be done at corner in terms of technique. and certain things that you need at the cornerback position, then there is a receiver, which is really surprising to me. I wrote down in my notes. I think he's at his best, actually.

He's not a physical tackler. I think, and you put that in your breakdown of the cornerback specific traits. When you look at three-run support, significant drop-off from all the other traits there. I don't think he's a great tackler. I do agree that he's, so it's kind of this, not a contradiction. but it's interesting in that at 185 to 191 pounds, he is physical in coverage.

And most importantly, he's at his best in press. But inconsistent as a tackler, not great in support. You know, some of the things you see out of with the Jets, I'm having a- Sauce Gardner. Sauce Gardner, right? Sauce Gardner, it feels like it keeps getting worse. But I think sauce is kind of, I'm not saying this.

This is the NFL comp for him. But I'm saying some of the frustration that Jets fans have with Sauce is that he's great impressed, great one-on-one, he'll blank you're number one guy. And let's face it, that's where you make your money. But there's been so many plays and so many mistackles that have led to big plays for the opponent. And you kind of see some of those issues there. His lack of size and the tackling issues are concerns, only 185,991 pounds.

Yeah. And durability, durability, because at receiver, you're going to take hits at cornerback, durability, like the shoulder injury we saw against Kansas State, right? Right. Durability is going to show up to me. I'm more concerned at cornerback than I am wide receiver. And now if you're talking to playing both and playing 120 snaps or something ridiculous, even a hundred and 18 game after 17 game season and grown ass men.

every week and getting targeted and having to go initiate that contact with your shoulder. You know, like, that's concern. The durability is more concerning at cornerback than it is a wide receiver. So where are you as a cornerback? I mean, we can look at this year's class. We can look at last year's class. If you're falling along on video. Yeah, we got the, we got the graphic right here for last year's class.

First of all, can I say this? How in the world if the Eagles get those two players at those spots. You didn't even have to finish. Quinny on Mitchell should have gone. I think he was the number seven or he was the number seven player on my board, I think. Yeah, he's the number 10 player on my board. Yeah, we both had him in the top 10 to 12.

Yeah, to go at 22. Come on. I actually like Hunter better than Mitchell, though, to be honest with you. Mitchell had an unbelievable lead up to the draft. He's playing really well now. Yeah, I do. I think because really, you like Travis Hunter as a cornerback prospect more than Quineau Mitchell. Yeah, I have a slightly higher grade on him.

Yeah. Interesting. I do. Okay. I think they're right there. I think they're in the same conversation, to be honest to you. Okay. So, yeah, I would have him slightly ahead.

I, you know, if you look at the year before, the guy that he kind of reminds me of that was the eighth player in my board that year was Christian Gonzalez out of Oregon. Yes. Who's playing for the Patriots now. He's got that kind of a vibrant. And kind of similar complaints living here in New England, like, unbelievable in coverage. He's like he's almost surpassed the expectations and the expectations were high in coverage. Right.

The missed tackles. Also missed some time last year, I think with a shoulder injury interesting enough. Obviously, that's not an apples to apples thing. But he just reminds me of. Go ahead. So, yeah. And then if you're looking at this year, yeah, there's a lot of, go ahead. I was just going to say.

ironically, like, we go back sometimes in years and we're going back to 2024 and 2023 to try to stack them to give a perspective on where they are. But interestingly enough, like, I would argue if you put the three cornerback classes together, you know, Witherspoon was 2023. And he was right. Was he five? He was five overall. I think he was.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, he was fifth overall. But I would argue Will Johnson. And I know this year he's kind of. Yeah. He was a little up and down early. He had a couple great games. Hasn't played a lot recently. Yeah. You know, has he checked out? Remember we talking about Derek Stingley like that? I was just going to say Derek Stingley. He's all right, right? I think he's doing just fine. Doing just fine. I think the Texans are okay with that.

Yeah. But Will Johnson, I would argue, is up there. It's not, I'm not going to sit here and say, Will Johnson has better grade than Witherspoon. Like, we're not there yet in the process. But he's up there with the elite. cornerbacks from the last two drafts. So I think it's all, like now it's, in your opinion, based off of Will Johnson, all the tape I know you've studied, if I told you, there is no wide receiver, Travis Hunter. Right. It's just you get, you get a cornerback who, yeah, maybe we'll give you two catches like Charles Woodson or four catches like Champ Bailey through his career or even 60 over, you know, more than a decade career like Dion.

So if I were to tell you, you're just getting the. cornerback Travis Hunter, is he higher than Will Johnson, in your opinion? No. I still have Will Johnson. I mean, this is, but again, this is how good I think that Will Johnson is. It's not an indictment on Travis. Not at all. I mean, this class is good.

I mean, you look at Benjamin Morrison out of Notre Dame, like these three corners and there's questions about all. We just highlighted Jada Baron from Texas. Yeah. You're looking at the top of this class. There's some questions because of injuries, even Revel out of East Carolina. Yep. Look like he was going to be that.

Quinyon Mitchell kind of arc where he's just going to explode this year. He's going to test super well. He's got some good tape. He's another guy to get to keep an eye on. But getting back to the Will Johnson, a little bigger, a little more physical. And I think that's kind of what separates them more. I think he's a little bit of a better run defender. Same kind of instinct.

Same kind of cover skills. I see almost the same kind of plays from him. And when you look at that UCF pick, Will Johnson does that really well. I think he had a pick six early in the season on a similar play where he's like, No, no. You got that guy. You can throw it to him and just explodes off the back foot and you're going the other way. So Will Johnson, I think, is an elite corner prospect. I have both of those guys in my top five overall, by the way. So, I mean, that's what we're talking about. We're talking about this is a class that I think could be, you know, could compare to 2022 when Stingley, I think went four and Gardner went five or something like that. They both went very early. And I had Gardner ahead of Stingley at the time. It hasn't really worked out.

that way recently, but I think it's a similar class. All right. So that's him as a corner. Yeah. So we're talking potential top five pick as a corner, second corner back in this year's class, stacks up with the top corners that we've seen in the last two drafts. Right. Let me clear my throat before we.

It's silly. I think he's a better wide receiver prospect than corner prospect. I agree with you. And I agree with you all that, like, about not seeing it coming into the year. I thought that was his second position. You know, it's cool that he can do that. It was going to be a great add-on,

and maybe we get 20 snaps out of him at wide receiver. I think when you look at, let's get into him as a receiver first. Let's start here, okay? Let's throw up the graphic for the wide receiver position specifics. I went two on routes, meaning above-average good, but not elite. And I say that, and I want people to hear this when I say it. he's there's no wasted motion he doesn't have to gear down to get in and out of breaks smooth

and crisp as an athlete accelerates to top speed and a flash really threatens you as a cornerback so he has all the traits to be a great route runner in the NFL and create separation with his feet and quickness right i i think there's still room for some polish i think there's still room in terms of like an NFL route tree i'm not saying he's not running it but there's a lot of screens and drags and like just kind of getting to an area i do love his instincts versus zone finding soft spots knowing you know working back to his to his quarterback which i think he's improved upon this year i didn't think he was always great at that last year uh but i give him a two because and again couching it a little bit he's really quick and and crafty getting off the line of scrimmage

i don't think that's going to be the issue but what i watch consistent consistently too often, let's put it that way, defensive backs that are able to get their hands on him and kind of muscle him out of his routes, take him off his track, right? Right. And I think that that's a problem that's only going to improve with continued bulk and strength

without losing speed and explosiveness. He's just, he's got it. I think he's strong for his size, but he's got that lean, lanky frame. Right. You know, like Garrett Wilson when you watch him, like so great in so many areas, but there's too many times where you feel like he's getting

muscled a little bit when the ball's in the air. You know, that kind of separating him from, like, he's one of the elite receivers in the NFL, but from like taking that next step. I think, I think when you study, Travis, if he can improve his size and bulk and strength,

it'd be more sturdy as both a route runner. And when the ball's in the air kind of contest and catches, I think that's an area he can prove. But you see the rest of this, ball skills, one, elite. Like there's, I don't see many body catches on tape. I see, I see a guy. What separates like the two grade versus the one grade for me, guys that are able to pluck the ball and already know what their first move is.

It's like the focus on the ball, but like the body's moving while the eyes and hands are still, right? It jumps out when you watch them. It's like that's, you know, when you're trying to explain to someone that trait. you want to show Travis Hunter. He's the teach tape. It's a hand-eye coordination that's different than other guys. There are plenty of receivers. We see double catches.

We see ball getting to body. We see fighting it at times. We see they really have to go secure it. The elite guys, it's like, yeah, I know I have to complete this process, get complete A to get to B. But it ain't that hard for me, you know? No. That's why I give them elite ball skills.

Big play ability. Again, I think his lack of elite size and elite strength, like down the field, he gets muscled around on some of those jump balls and all that. But in terms of his run after catch that, when the ball is in Travis Hunter's hands, that's when he is a special different football player, period. He does a lot of things great. Travis Hunter does a lot of things great at wide receiver. He does a lot of things great at cornerback.

But when that football is in Travis Hunter's hands, that's when he's different. man. And he also has speed to get over the top. So big playability while, you know, his numbers don't jump out and all that. And he doesn't have like three deep ball catches every week. He is a weapon on offense. And then I couldn't agree more. And then talk about good. Sorry. When we talk about those instincts too. One of the things I really like about him is the way that he attracts and adjusts downfield. And there's something that I've noticed about his game to get into the weeds a little bit here. is he is leaner. You're right.

He's got to get some more body armor, a little more durable. He's got a bit stronger, so he's better in those 50-50 situations. But he does win 50-50 balls. And the reason I think is because of the way he tracks, the way he can adjust while the ball is in the air. And he's really good.

And North Dakota State would argue that he got overly physical on some of those routes. Too bad, wasn't called. He does a really good job of moving defenders and getting inside leverage to get to a ball without extending. And that is an instinct. That is not something. It is, when you were moving at that rate,

telling a player, teaching a player how to do that, I don't know how you can do it. That is something I think. You either have it or you don't. You don't, right? And he has it. He knows how he will, he'll like use his hands to move a guy,

but never get caught fully extending. And it's just another element of the instincts of the ball scales. It all kind of wraps up when you're looking at a player as a whole. But just something, again, that's jumped out to me that I think is super impressive. Yeah, I'm just going down my pros and cons. I've watched three more tapes. Last year I watched every target that he had from 2023. This year, I picked three games, Nebraska, Arizona.

I also had watched a lot of tape getting ready to do this door tape. So it was some repetitive. And then this past week as well, Utah. So some of the notes I wrote, and we've covered a lot of it, but just ripped down, like explosive with ball and hands, best trait, reaches top speed quickly and elusive. I put an exclamation next to stop start. Love his stop start ability, right?

Yeah. Versatile. I love the fact that, like, you don't, you don't even, it's not like an event when he's playing inside or outside. He's just like he's playing inside or outside. He's playing the left side or right side. He plays on the right, probably a little bit more of the left. I don't know the numbers, but he can play both sides of the feet.

It's not like he's pigeon hold to one thing, just an outside receiver, just a slot. He's just, they move him around. creative getting off the line of scrimmage i told you that just how so quick he is and also he has a plan it's not like guys we're just like he has a plan he knows how he's going to go and it's a different plan frequently smooth and efficient routes not many wasted steps great instincts versus zone which we covered hand plucker can climb and adjust that's something i didn't talk about climb and he's got vertical man i can you see it and it's easy vertical it's easy timing yeah and easy vertical and then speed to get over the top.

Now, the cons, two things and one's nitpicking. I'll just get it out of the way. My goodness, does he need to tuck the ball away sometimes? And he's gotten away with it. I don't do it. I don't have his fumble numbers or anything, but like I see on tape sometimes where I'm just like, you know, but it speaks to his instincts.

He knows when to protect it, but he will not get away with that as frequently in the NFL. But much more important, to his evaluation as a receiver, he needs to improve his play strength. It's the same thing at corner and wide receiver. And we just talked knocked off routes, struggles on some contested. I just, that's where he's going to have to improve if he wants to take his game to another level. Right.

So with that is a bet. Yeah, go ahead. Can I address the X trolls that I'm guessing may respond to this video? Yeah. Or this, this pod is, yeah, I know that, I know that Travis got beat over the top. Utah. I know that happened. I felt like there was a couple plays and a couple balls in the Texas Tech game that he could have got and he didn't come down with. He is not, it's important that these, these are not perfect players. They're like the tape is there's going to be plays where they're,

they're not at their best. He got caught flat footed and off coverage. I don't think that's the best look for him on when he got beat over the top against Utah, maybe peaked into the backfield. I'm not overly worried because you don't see it a lot. One bad play, you know, this is a, we're always looking at the body. And what can he be? Right. So yeah. And this this is what makes this a unique evaluation, bud, is

we're studying this tape. And this is why I wanted to do it where you just go and evaluate him as a career. I go and evaluate him as a wide receiver. But the thing that I didn't even think about that I'm thinking about now is when I go

evaluate Tederoa McMillan, Yeah. When I go evaluate Luther Burden for Missouri, Isaiah Bond for Texas, or Jalen Royals for Utah State, some of the other wide receivers in this class, when I go evaluate them, I'm not thinking about, oh,

they also played 68 snaps on defense today. Right. You know what I mean? Yeah. So, like, when I was doing it, I wasn't even conscious of the, like, oh, he's wearing down. Oh, he doesn't look like he has a sentence. Right. Which is unbelievable. Unreal. Because

I'm watching plays in the third quarter or early in the fourth quarter where he's played over a hundred snaps in that game. And so as a, because the scouting process is this. The area scouts will, and you break up for every organization, you break up area scouts, you know, northeast, Midwest, West Coast, Southwest, southeast, and how would the different teams kind of do it differently? Then you have like a top 100 scout typically, right? And so it's their process in the, you know, they get,

sometimes I call scouts in April. And they're like, yeah, I'm not even, like I'm done with my meetings with the team. Like I'm on to next year's class. So it's like 13 months, you know, and obviously it goes beyond that. But 13 months focus on these players. But they start the evaluation.

They get a go. They bring it to the team. Then they have cross checks, you know. So now, now if I'm in the Northeast Scout, I'm going to cross check a, and cross checks are done by position. So we'll talk to a Northeast Scout who's done that whole region,

all season long, who now is in charge of wide receivers and offensive alignment, or whatever those two positions are. And so now there's a second check. But then at some point in the process, when the NFL season is over, the coaches get involved. Right. So the general managers are overlooking it. The college scouting directors overlooking it.

They're building up the report. They're getting all this information in and starting to stack the board. But then the college, then the NFL coaches get involved with the organization as we get to like the senior bowl as we get to the combine. And so when I think of it. about those meetings. And I think about corner, you know, defensive back coaches banging on the table. Because you got to remember, they're like, no, I want Travis

is a corner. And then there's wide receiver, you know, coaches banging on the table. And but, and I can hear them now in those meetings that we, we have a hundred amazing stories of the yelling, the screaming, the fighting. Yeah. The bickering, the backstabbing. But, I mean, come. No, I know.

If we could share any of those, we could do like 10, podcast series on how many amazing stories bravo would make a show out of that so but i can hear the receiver coach now being like hey can you imagine what i can do with him if i just get him as a wide receiver yeah and he's not his mental focus is not on both positions all week and his physical focus is not on both positions and then in game he's only playing 60 snaps for us versus 130 or 140 and so that's when it's going to get real interesting. And I say that because you're always evaluating the entire picture as a prospect, and they're always having to push the conversation forward, what can he be?

Right. And to me, like the what can he be is so intriguing because you can take half of his workload off his plate. Yeah. And you can bring him in. It's a tie into that. Yeah. You see all of those things, right?

I agree with everything you're saying. It all makes sense. It's all true. This is a dude that turned down the FBS to go play for Coach Prime at Jackson State because he felt Coach Prime was going to make him the best football player that he could be. Yeah. You know, all these kids are like, oh, I think we're still throwing a million for it, if I remember correctly.

Whatever. All these, tell me if I'm wrong. You're not wrong. You're not wrong. You're not a million. That all these other kids are what Power 5? school you go into. You're going to Jackson State, really? You're going to go to Jackson State? He turned down the FBS because he felt like this was going to be the place that made him the best player.

That's why, you know, when you hear Coach Brime talk about this kid, I mean, you understand why when you look at the arc and the relationship and the way it's developed. There's a commitment to one another that is very unique. It's one of the best stories in college football in my mind. Yeah. And so I just, I look at this and I think to myself, all right, so when we get to that process, because we just told you the numbers on Charles Woodson, Champ Bailey, even Dion, who probably was the most prolific both sides of ball, just 60 catches in his long career, right? Yeah. Teams have got to look at this, which one is he playing?

And I just keep going back. First of all, not that this necessarily matters, a cornerback has never been drafted, number one overall. Right. But you also going to go back to Kishon Johnson's, the last receiver selected with the top overall pick and that was 1996, okay? Yep. The wide receiver position,

we just threw up a graphic here. Last year, Marvin Harrison, Malik neighbors, Romo Dunes, Dunesay, Brian Thomas. That was a really good, you get all the way,

Xavier Worthy, what he's done with the chiefs, Ricky Purcell, Pearsall, who obviously got shot. Yeah. Like, just an unbelievable story. The fact that he's back on the field and has his first touchdown catch.

a couple weeks ago. To me, it really comes down to, I would still have Marvin Harrison ahead of Travis Hunter. I would have Malik neighbors. It would be right there where the discussion would be absolutely ahead of Rome, absolutely ahead of Brian Thomas and all those other guys. Oh, wait, love Roma Dunzee. Love Roma Dunesay.

Again, let's keep this in perspective. That's how good this kid is. Right. So the discussion for me, I had, We weren't working together last year. I had my little sabbatical, we'll call it. But I had Roma Dunesay one notch ahead of Marvin Harrison. So, and both with, like, exceptional grades,

and they both had great seasons in different regards and all that. But I think he's in that category. I would probably put him just the tiniest notch below those two guys. But also remember, that's pick four and pick six, Harrison and neighbors, respectively, in a draft. that had Caleb Williams in a draft that had Jaden Daniels, right? And so this year, there is, like, Shador, his teammates, probably going to be the first quarterback off the board,

but we'll see how, and we've already done the show on that. We'll do many more on where Prime, is that the Raiders? Let's look at the draft order right now, okay? Jacksonville is picking it number one. Ironically, not ironically, but interestingly enough, cornerback and wide receiver, top two needs. If the draft were held today, Tennessee is the number two pick. Quarterback, in my opinion, they may not agree.

They may want to be more, have a longer leash on Will Levis, but wide receivers outside of quarterback, their number one need. Cleveland, quarterback, but then wide receiver. Vegas could be, it seems like the most likely landing spot for Shador. But if it's not quarterback, it's wide receiver. It's going to be quarterback in Vegas. You've got to believe. And then the New York Giants quarterback, you've got to believe.

too. This is going to be fascinating when we get to the quarterbacks. But my point is you look at all of those teams, Jacksonville, Tennessee, Cleveland, Vegas, Giants. If the draft were held today, the top five teams picking, quarterback is a top need for all four of them with the exception of Jacksonville, one. But after that, it's wide receiver and or cornerback as the next highest need. So he's going to one of those spots. And if you go back to last year's class with those quarterbacks, right, With Caleb Williams, with Jaden Daniels, with Drake May, the receivers got bumped down just a little bit, but only for quarterbacks. Yeah, so three in the top ten.

And so, yeah, three in the top ten. And wide receiver was four and six. And so even if you have him rated just a notch below those top two guys, we're talking about him going somewhere in the top five. Right. Let me ask you this. You're the GM of the Cleveland Browns. and coach prime and Travis Hunter and their team are looking at what Otani's done with the Dodgers and the Angels. And they think, look at the, look at this like phenomenon in pro sports.

And we want Travis Hunter to play both ways. We want him to take the Otani route. And we're going to go to a team and say, if you're taking them, we expect him to play on both sides of the ball. how does that affect your your thinking i love the show hey otani comparison right and the reason i love it is because i think it shows the modern day athlete modern day sports medicine i think quarterbacks last had a hard time saying healthy a little bit though he has and and and so the quarterback staying healthy into the 40s like well the entire league is is is protecting them to a point where it's beyond frustrating for a lot of people who love this game.

Right. So I don't think you can factor that in. I hear what you're saying, and I think it's fascinating. Right. But I'm also, then as the general manager, or is the owner talking to an overzealous general manager, I am going to go back and say, I want to show me his injury history. Yeah, the medical is going to be big. This is the way it's going to be big.

And I don't even think he has, I don't think there's anything, I don't think there's anything in his medical history, you're worried about being something that's recurring. I mean, I know it's not, but I also know, but yeah, but I also know that when you've got a shoulder injury this year, like that's going to only be accentuated, heightened, if you will, at the next level. So and here's my thought too. And I'm just, we're just free flowing here. I love this conversation because it's so unique, right? Like this one college, one university, Colorado is providing us with two storylines that you almost never see in the NFL draft. I mean, I just, you go back.

We're talking about Dion. We're talking about Champ Bailey, Charles Woodson over 20 years ago, right? NFL royalty. We're talking about Kishon Johnson is the number one overall overall pick. 1996. We're talking almost 30 years ago, okay? Right. Then we're talking about Chidor.

We just said on the other podcast the other day. We said it had been 20 years, right? 2004 was the Eli Manning draft with Ben Rothesberger, Philip Rivers, right? 20 years. So we're talking like decades for all of the storylines and one and Colorado coming out of Boulder, Colorado, these unbelievably unique storyline. So I just, but my, my thought on this is I feel like, and correct me if I'm wrong, I'm just going to throw it out to you, I feel like if you're going to play corner,

in the NFL, that's got to be your primary and throwing you in at wide receiver with with a handful of play installs every week in a very specific defined role each week is how you do it. I don't think you're a full-time wide receiver and you come in for 15, 20 snaps a game at cornerback and do that. And maybe I'm wrong. But it'll be fascinating to see how these NFL teams that know a lot more than you and I have a lot more resources than you and I, how they view. it. But to me, it's all right. If we're going to try to do both, we got to get cornerback right. Because if we don't get cornerback right in terms of his technique, his polish, strengthening him up, bulking him up and having him out there as the primary, like taking away the number one receiver

every week. If we don't get that right, it's a freaking train wreck. Two or three big plays a game could change an entire game. At wide receiver, we can kind of pick our spot. So if you're going to try to play them in both, it's got to be cornerback primary, wide receiver, secondary, and kind of increases role over time. Do you agree, disagree? I do agree. I think it's really hard to play corner part-time. I mean, it's what you're saying. I think it's really difficult to play corner part-time. On offense, you can have packages and you can have, you know, certain plays installed that you can really focus in on 10, 12 plays a game that he can do. Defensively, I think it's a little bit of a different, more of a different animal. So yeah, I do agree with you. I do hope that if,

and we don't, I mean, tell me if you know something, I don't know, we don't know that that's the route that they'll take. There's no reason to believe that's the route that they'll take that they say that he needs to play both ways. But I hope there's not a GM out there who thinks that they're going to take Hunter and then try Coach Prime in that team and be like, no, actually, we'll just go play them at receiver now that we drafted them because that, I mean, all the drama, for lack of a word, or entertainment that's going to go on with all of this is just going to be, I mean, it is going to be fun to watch. Let's just wrap it up here.

Unlike last year's class, we just talked about three quarterbacks going very early. Unlike most year's class, I don't think that's going to be the case. I think Shador's, they're going to wind up picking their spot, and it probably will be somewhere in the top five, but we got a lot of time between now and then. Right. But when you look at it, and we just talked about no cornerback has ever gone number one overall. Right. Kishon Johnson in 96, what is that, 28 years since a wide receiver has gone number one overall. I do think the wide receiver positional value is higher than it's ever been in the NFL, so it wouldn't shock me.

But when you start talking about the number one overall picking, again, as of today, it would be the Jacksonville Jaguars, but any of these teams picking at the top, and they may have a quarterback need, they may want Shador, but they may not be allowed to get him because it'll hold out if they draft him. So the potential to be the number one overall pick are who you stacking them up against in this year's class. Throw in some names if you want. But I'm just looking at the board. And we haven't even had these meetings yet or discussed this. And you're doing your own board. I do my own board. And that's just the way things are right now.

But Will Johnson at Corner would be up there among the names that potentially could be, you know, top three, four players in the draft. Abdul Carter, Malik Williams, the edges Penn State, Georgia, respectively. I think you would have to include up there in this year's class. Beyond that, like I know Mason Graham, you absolutely love him. He's not going to go. I mean,

that's a whole other argument. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm saying. Kelvin Banks, some people think is great. I don't see a number one. You know what I mean? So like,

I don't see a lot of Texas. Yeah. I don't see more overall. Then we're getting into guys like Malachi Stark's. It's not going to be a safety goal. So like that's kind of it this year. There's a lot of depth in it. a lot of damn good football players in the 25 draft.

And I'm not just saying that to keep excitement going for the, like I'll just, we'll shoot straight here. I don't mind. But when you talk about a typical top five class where you've got guys like fighting at the end trying to get like climbing up 40 yard dash, who worked out best, who had like,

you know, all those who are the best senior bowl. I don't see a group where you've got a bunch of guys that truly belong as the number one, number two. overall pick and if you were to compare him to other years drafts. Couldn't agree more. So the reason I'm saying this is he very well could be the number one overall pick.

Travis Hunter very well could be the number one overall pick as a wide receiver or as a cornerback that can also contribute at wide receiver. And if that's the case, we're talking about making history at corner, which I think it's more likely to be wide receiver or it being 28 years since we've had a wide receiver taken number one overall. and for a class that doesn't have elite prospects at the top like we normally have, that's a pretty cool storyline. That's amazing.

And I don't want to, so I'll, instead of putting you, I always put you on the spot, I feel like, I'm always like, well, would you take him first overall? I don't know if I would take him first overall right now. We really do have to see how this plays out because the edge defenders, I think, positional value. I think, you know, and again, we'll see how the rest of the season goes and how everyone tests. But you're right. there is a legit.

I mean, there is more of a chance for a corner to go or a receiver, whatever you want to call them, to go first overall than we've seen. And I don't even know how long. Decades. Yeah. It's amazing. Let me wrap it up with this. And I looked at this up earlier in the year.

I don't know that any corner has been paid. But Jalen Ramsey, when I looked this up early in the year, was the highest paid cornerback per year in the NFL, 24.1 million per year. Right. there were 12 wide receivers at the time, and I think it might be more now, 12 wide receivers at the time making more annually than Jalen Ramsey. So if you're talking about coach prime, you're talking about business decisions, you're talking about advising and deciding where he's going to go just like he's going to try to

decide where Shador goes. You got to believe the push from Travis Hunter's camp is he's a wide receiver. right and if you want to use him a cornerback that's fine but he's getting picked now the rookie contract is a rookie contract it's a five-year deal is a first round pick and and if you're the number one overall pick i haven't looked it up like the last but it's around 38 million guaranteed yeah but if they want him to get paid you know like 30 plus million a year whatever the numbers are after that first contract and negotiating it you know four years in it's going to be at the wide receiver position.

Imagine if this was the old days and they didn't have the fixed contracts and what this would look like. Oh, gosh. Oh, man, that would be fun too. Oh,

you know, they'd be pushing to pay him as a corner and a wide receiver. Yeah, right. Negotiating before the draft trying to get the deal done. Yeah, I mean, it's,

this is fun. This is, I mean, yeah. Colorado providing us with two of the best storylines we've seen in, and two decades in the NFL draft. And it's going to be fascinating to see how this all plays out. The McShay Show.

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Medge, I got to tell you. just seeing this guy's face come up on our screen makes me smile this is the bear everyone knows him as the bear chris felica how many years i mean we spent so we never like we're on the same team traveling on the same team but with college game day i was early in my career doing game day radio just jumping in on the bus watching games with you and herbie and faler and in the gang uh the NFL draft my favorite match my favorite thing about bears we'd be in the weeds you know I've become a lunatic I'd become a lunatic draft weekend you know like and so every once in a while it'd be up there like this it's the fifth pick coming up and like something would pop in my head and and bears over

there and he's doing providing unbelievable stats things that you don't wouldn't even think about and I'd be like bear and maybe like commercial break get out they take that head side of go over and like bear what if the and he my man would have like like um You know, I don't know. Name me a horse or race track, you know. Usually that weekend was you, it changed to like derby weekend like was the following week after the draft. Correct.

It was typically like the, the closing weekend, did Keenland to the opening. Yeah, I remember being Keenlin and being like fucking bear, man. Like you're watching Keenlin right now. And we got, we're on the seventh pick. Yeah, second and give me a note that would be, you know, that would carry the whole segment.

So there was one year, Todd, the year that the draft was in Cleveland, there had awful weather that was going on. Like Kirk and myself and, and Darren, like we flew from the draft right into the Derby and went right to Oak's Day the following day. It was great. Yeah, it's just grinding on those private planes going to, going to the horse race. I do remember spending time with you at the Derby one year, too. So we have a long history.

We appreciate you joining, bud. I love what you're doing. I mean, you were an absolute staple behind the scenes and then in front of the camera for a long time in college game day. You've transitioned. We had the wonderful thing, man, you know, the vast majority of our relationship has been work and talking ball. But also, like, when I was trying to figure out the next steps after ESPN,

you kind of know who the people you trust and rely on when you make the phone call to them. Like, where are we? You know, what's going on? do you think I should do? And when the call is reciprocated and you're on the phone for a half hour, 40 minutes, just talking about life and career and family, like, Bair's one of those guys, a very small group. And I've appreciated you, Bear, throughout all of this. That's what friends are for. And it's, it's interesting you say that. Because, I mean, not that we were kind of in a similar situation. Like, when you leave ESPN, you kind of find out,

like, who your, like, real friends are. And it's been, it's good. It's been, it's been, great to maintain a lot of relationships that I, that I have really maintained. And it's been somewhat, I mean, I don't say, I mean, they're not, there have been a ton of people that have completely fallen off the face of the earth. But you know the difference. It's good to see that the relationships and the friends that you thought were real and genuine and not just work related have continued to be that. So yeah, it's, it's certainly eye-opening. And I benefited more from, it was more of a take relationship from you over the years with given your role and making me look good. But I,

I'll be honest, the last few years, I've given back a little bit with those NFL drafts. You certainly have. Here we go. But I certainly appreciate that. It was a very, very good April this year. Good, good. But I can help with that the travel budget. All right.

So let's dive into this, man. You're heading to Columbus this week. You know, an awesome, awesome matchup and really intriguing matchup. Let's start with that game. We've got a lot to get into the rankings. I want to talk about some early positions for college. football playoff and some lines that jump out and several different things. But this week specifically, we've got an Indiana team that's not only winning every week,

but like handling teams. But I look at them from an NFL draft perspective and the difference between Ohio State when we're talking about like 20 something guys you've got to evaluate and potentially like eight, nine guys in the top 100 versus Indiana that just, they don't have that and not even close. I'm curious, like, what are your thoughts and takes this week, just specifically in the game? We'll get into rankings, but what are your thoughts and takes kind of entering this game this week going to Columbus? I think the first thing, noticing that Indiana coming off of the idle week, they are extremely well coached, and Sig has a long track record of success where he's

before. I would expect Indiana to come out and be prepared and play well and probably hang around or early on. I would think we'll have a decent game plan. But ultimately, I just, I wondered, like you said, long term. And Ryan, Riscilla even hit on this on his show earlier in the week, like, kind of the teams that have the better players are shockingly, the better teams. And that's kind of where I am. A couple of weeks back, I might have been concerned about this game for Ohio State, but the Indiana-Michigan game was a little eye-opening for me, because it's a little eye-opening for me. That was the most NFL-ish-type team that Indiana was going to play defensively, and they had trouble moving the ball all day long.

And won a very close game. And good, they won the game. But that, I think, drew a lot of concerns for me about Indiana and their ability to what are they going to do against downs and that Ohio State secondary. Right. That's now healthy. And then on the flip side, I was concerned about Ohio State going to Penn State about how how is their offensive line going to fare? They're moving people all over, and they play great against Penn State. And I think Ryan Day and Chip feel a hell of a lot better about that unit right now,

being that they answered the test at Penn State, and they came away with the experience in a very tough environment. I ultimately think Ohio State does pull away and win this game convincingly, and that's going to ultimately be the decision for the college football playoff committee moving forward. What does – what type of loss does Indiana need? I saw the boss to go there last month and nearly won the game. Like, are they going to be measured against that? So I would expect Indiana to come out and play and play well early

and then ultimately the depth and just the quality of Ohio State ultimately went out. What do you think the number is? I mean, if Indiana loses by 10, are they all right? If they lose by 14, does it get sketchy? Exactly. That's like the number I think right now is 10 and a half or 11. So like a cover, I think that that's the expectation that they're going to go in. Yeah.

10 or 11 points away. I think that would be fine. Like, I think if it's anything less than like a two, like, I think if they lose by 17 or something like that or maybe like 30, 40, 42, 24, something like that. I think that ultimately will be viewed as a good, a good result for them. And look, I hate it because it's like this, like you're kind of choosing one way or another like, you're either like pro Indiana or completely. anti-Indianics. Not that. Like if you were in college football, all one-lost records are not

created equal, how do you judge a team that's rolled through the 106 strength schedule in the country? Compare that to a Georgia team that's played the toughest schedule in the country, and they're a in two. So that's what we're up against in college football. And look, we're not knocking Indiana because we think they're terrible.

It's just you're probably not as good as that 10 and O mark says. Yeah, it was interesting. I asked our folks at Fandul, right, to give us hypothetical neutral field odds. I know you do a lot of this and we all study this, but against all the SEC teams, because let's face it,

like there's, there's Texas and then there's kind of a clump, right? And it'll be interesting to see on tonight's college football playoff reveal what the committee has decided in terms of where those SEC teams are ranked. But you've got to imagine they're going to be clumped pretty close together, right? Right. And so I asked the folks at Fanduel,

and they said, they said Indiana would be dogs at all of these top teams, right, except Texas A&M and South Carolina. So against Texas, it would be Texas minus seven and a half. Alabama minus six and a half. Georgia minus eight and a half. We'll get to Georgia in a minute. Tennessee minus two and a half, Ole Miss minus six and a half. So it's interesting to see all of those are six and above except Tennessee, which would

will only be two and a half. So with that as kind of the backdrop there, if they lose a game by seven, 10, seven, 10 points, hang around, look respectable in it, but like clearly Ohio State's a better team. And then you look at, and I know the committee isn't looking at,

you know, the odds for these, but I think we all agree that these SEC teams with two losses, they're just better. Yes. And what you would say when you just, Prior to that, like, how were these SEC teams going to be clumped together? The fact that the folks of Fandul, and I think a lot of people probably do still have Georgia power rated the highest of all these SEC teams, you're probably going to see, like, despite the fact that Alabama and Ole Miss beat Georgia,

I think you'll probably see Georgia the highest ranked of those, of that cluster of teams as well. You had an interesting tweet yesterday. I didn't want to cut you off, but you can build on this. Georgia has three wins versus the current AP top 20, Texas, Tennessee, and Clemson. Then you go on to say the current AP top five has combined for three wins, you know, alluding to against AP top 20 teams with Oregon accounting for two of those. Yeah, and that's the amazing thing. Like I've even brought up like people or mentioned like, like what is Texas done to kind of command this high.

We think Texas is really good. You watch them and you think they're really good. But their best win, like, Vandy record-wise, like they're getting, I think, so much bump off of a win over a Michigan team that wound up not being very good early in the year. So, like, I wonder, and I even saw on Fandall the other day, that there was a yes, no playoff market on Texas. Like the no was plus 680.

And I took a little bit of that because what happens if Texas goes to A&M? Look a little bit. Wow. And they lose. And you have a certain chain reaction of events where certainly Texas A&M will now go ahead of Texas. Georgia obviously is going ahead of Texas. And Texas doesn't have a win to really hang their hat. Do I think ultimately it will happen? No, but I don't want to take a swipe at our former employer, Todd.

But they have this like playoff mathematical predictor. and they have like Indiana at like 94% in Texas at like 97%. I'm like I'd love a yes-no playoff market on, say grab a little swipe with the no with those numbers. Yeah. Always looking for an edge. I just, I think it's fascinating with Georgia. Let's go back to Texas real quick.

The resume is one thing. And mention I had been talking about this for a couple weeks now. their defense is elite. Like I'll put them up there. Their elite. Ole Miss's defensive line is probably the best in the country. Tennessee's defensive front is the deepest in the country. There are a handful of elite defenses in the country.

Texas is right up there. Okay. So, but with that as the backdrop, this offense is struggling for Texas. It's not just about strength of record, strength of schedule, who they played. Like, I'm seeing an offense that is not what we expected it to be. And we kind of gave it. him a little bit of a pass because Quinn Ewers was coming off the injury and he's working back, but then the by week. And they look, they had big numbers against Florida. But if you look at it,

I haven't seen this like Sark, Quinn Ewers, high powered offense. And so on tape, I'm seeing a team that's concerning as well. Is it more like I know early early in there obviously losing all of those running backs may have had some type of an effect on this. But is it more offensive line play? receiving, like we thought the receiving core was going to be great. And certainly, I don't think they've been as dominant and as explosive as we thought, right? No, they haven't. And I also, I just wonder, I wonder how much Sark has kind of held back and just kind of grinded through some games and is waiting to kind of unleash things against opponents where

they need it. But at this point, you'd expect to see more, I guess is my point. And I think, too, I'm glad you hit on the defense because that was certainly a problem last year where they were getting up a bunch of big pass plays. We saw that in the semifinal last year against Washington, where panics and those receivers just ripped them apart. But you hit on, I think, the most important thing, while we have all these resumes and strength of record and strength of schedule,

ultimately it does come down to, in my opinion, like, just who are the best teams? Team A, Team B, they play, who is that? Look at their schedule. Look at their efficiency metrics. look at their NBA play, all these indicators of team strength. And that ultimately, I think, at the end of the day, and on December 5th or whatever the day is, like you think 11 and 1 Indiana is one of the best 12 teams in the country,

and they're better than 10 and 2 Tennessee or are they better than 10 and 2 A&M or whatever? Fine, put them in. But just don't always look at that record and think that ultimately is going to be the best indicator of what team is better. Well, it's like Florida State last year. I mean, they ultimately, I mean, it's devastating what happened to those players and you feel for those players. It's ultimately the correct call that they are not the same team without Travis Jordanette quarterback. They got the better teams in.

So it'll be interesting to see how that unfolds, though. Yeah. And that was the important thing last year with Florida State and what happened was because the committee really had never used those bylaws and rules that they had in there. about being able to, things that will be affected are injuries, head-to-head results, cluster, like they never really were in a position to have to use that. And you kind of saw it coming when that happened because you, you know, like, okay, Alabama had that loss to Texas, but now what happens if Alabama wins the SEC? If you take Alabama who wins the SEC, you got to take Texas because Texas beat him.

And it really, it was unfortunate, but I think in the end of the committee did do the right thing because you not only look at what Florida State was last year without Jordan Travis in that ECC championship game, kind of what Mike Norvell has become at Florida. So like his record at Florida State in the last couple of years without Jordan Travis's starting quarterback is pretty alarming. Right. We've got a problem brewing, though. If Indiana plays a close enough game and you can't knock them out of the top 12, like,

if there's four teams, I'm not a math major, but if there's four teams from the Big Ten, It's spinning. If there's, there's, there has to be a, an ACC champion. Yep. Right. There's got to be a big 12 champion. Notre Dame currently sitting in there if they take care of business, right? Everyone's ruined for us in a couple of weeks.

Exactly. And so, and then you've got the, the non, you know, power four conference champion, the highest rated, you know, from the other conferences, and which currently is Boise State. if that's the case i'm looking if texas beats texas a and m you're looking at a situation tell me who you're keeping out to put indiana in is i guess i guess where i'm going with all this who are you keeping out to put indiana in from texas alabama georgia tennessee old miss when all of them you can say well well we beat them they're in we beat that you know like they all have a win over one another who do you keep out it's probably going to it's probably going to come down to a battle between in Indiana and whether that's right.

Look, and how about this? Like, what if Alabama winds up winning the SEC? And like Tennessee beat them. And Tennessee would be the odd team out because Indiana is 11 and 1 in the committee wouldn't want to drop them completely out. That would be a bad situation. Oh, wait a minute. And the committee, look, the committee should not be penalizing teams that get to a conference

championship game and lose. Like if Texas loses to Texas A&M, that's a different story. If Texas is 11 and 1 and in the SEC championship game and loses, that should not really, I mean, they're cash grabs, their kind of exhibitions, you get a conference title, congratulations, but you should not be penalized. That should be a seeding opportunity, not something to kick you out. Exactly. So like that ultimately, and I think this is part of the reason why Tennessee fans were so upset at me last week for saying

that Nico had a concussion and my guy was saying he didn't know if he was going to be playing. Like I think they kind of saw it coming last week. Like, oh, shoot, we're a double-digit favorite on the road at Georgia. George is going to be amped up to play their first home game in a month. It's a must win. We're going to lose. We're going to be 10 and 2. We're going to be left out.

It was like the defeatist nature was coming out. And unfortunately, it's kind of a self-fulfilling prophecy because I think ultimately that's kind of the situation that we can see. But hey, who the hell knows what's ultimately going to happen? Florida is playing much better right now with LaGway a quarterback and give Billy Napier credit. They can maybe beat All-Miss this week. What happens if Alabama goes on the road and they run up against Venables defense?

And the same thing happens. What happened with Alabama against South Carolina? And they struggle to move the ball. Like something crazy is going to happen. I call it the Thanksgiving effect. Every year we have the answers right now. The very clear picture. And then I'm like on a plane going from visiting my

my mom in Ohio and family and like, and I'm getting ready to get on a plane and I'm looking at a sports bar as I'm walking by to go to go to the terminal. And it's like, wait, what? Old Miss is down 14. What? You know, like this time of year gets wild. So the conversations we're having now are probably not going to be, you know, identical or maybe even close to the conversations we're going to be having in a couple weeks. That's why we love this sport. But it's also, I think tonight's, the committee is going to have to kind of plant a flag tonight.

And that like, where do you, where are you putting these SEC teams? How, you know, is it above, or any of them above Indiana or Penn State? Like, give me, am I, I know all of this is on Indiana, but like, what has Penn State done? Played Ohio State to what we expect them to do every year under James Franklin against the top. And could have lost that game by 21, by the way. Yes. And it is their offense didn't score touchdown. Like going in, the fumble going, it was, yeah, that was to be like game right there.

Power doesn't fumble the ball up. But I think like they beat USC in overtime in a game they probably, I don't want to say, should have lost, but easily could have lost. They, they uglied up a game against Illinois on their home field. And in one, like the fact that Illinois is ranked now, I guess maybe that has something. But I look at Penn State, and I'm like, it's funny, because people talk, someone asked me the other day, like, what are you most looking forward to in the playoff? And with the preposes of, like, you've always been a four up to the 14th playoff. But now with the expansion, what are you looking forward to the most? And I would love to see these SEC teams, whether it's Ole Miss, Alabama, Tennessee, Georgia,

whomever go north and play Penn State or Indiana or Ohio State in a cold weather type game. I would love to see the opportunity for like Ole Miss to go to Penn State and play a first-round playoff game. Remember that bowl game last year that wasn't too pretty? Yeah, yeah. So, like, I don't, again, Penn State and people, that's the first response I get from people when I bring up the 106th ranked schedule from Indiana. What is Indiana done? Having played a team that's getting a point in the poll. Like, people are always like, what about Texas?

What about Penn State? I'm like, yeah, that's kind of the group I'm clumping together there. When I say like the rest of the top five, like has no wins or three wins against the top 20, like in Texas and Penn State don't really have any either. So, but Penn State is one, like they, they are the postered. child for hollow calories. We know what they are. I love that. I can say that. But it's like we know what they are every year. They're getting all out and they're going to beat all these teams. And it's funny. I'm really curious to get the vibe there and stay college. Like if they go 11 and 1 and they're one and done in the playoff again, like I would think they'd be disappointed. That being said,

they need to be careful this week on the road, I think, in Minnesota. That's a tricky game this week against a six and four now right yeah that's got they've gotten better as yeah he's gone on so uh i wouldn't just write that off as an easy win for uh for penn state laying close to two touchdowns i think on the road i'd respect the hell out of the committee if they came out tonight and it was oregon one ohio state two and then you go texas bama georgia tennessee old miss in some order and then had penn state in indiana or indiana penn state after that i would respect the hell out of them but I don't at all expect that to be the case. You know what's so funny.

Someone asked me yesterday, like what I would have was a top 10. Like if I, it's someone that you know and who we used to work with a couple of these people who are involved in the old game day chain. They were like just humorous with your top 10 teams in the country. And here's what I, here's the order I went.

I went Ohio State, Oregon. Ohio State, Oregon, Georgia, Ole Miss, Alabama, Texas, Tennessee, Indiana, Penn State, Notre Dame. That's how I went. Ohio State over Oregon, huh? Yeah, I'm on board, man. I mean, thank you. I mean, Oregon's didn't in the game.

It was by a point on their home field in a mat. Right. They're going to play again in two weeks, so ultimately it doesn't matter. But I think if you're power rating these teams, I still think you're power rating Ohio State is the best team in the country. I don't hate it, man.

I'm with you, like Oregon OSU one or two, but after that, Georgia, Mississippi, Ole Miss, Alabama, Texas. I can see that Tennessee, Penn State, Indiana, and Notre Dame, is that right? Indiana, Indiana, Penn State, Notre Dame. Indiana, Penn State. Just because, hey, at least they have,

it's not like Penn State, like, just talking about it. not like Penn State's beating anybody yet either. Yeah. I'm with that. Yeah, you're not buying Notre Dame, huh? I don't know what to do with them. I don't, that's what I'm saying.

I don't either. It's like they're running out. They're scoring points now against all these bad teams and they're going to blow out in the army, I would think, again, this week. It's like, I can't for, again, it's just a bad, my wife and her family are probably going to hate me now forever because they're a Notre Dame family. I can't get that Northern Illinois game out of my mind, despite the fact that they were their scoring.

and 50-something points against everybody now. Yeah. I know it's not a top-10 team, but you got any thoughts on that BYU, Arizona State game? I like Arizona State. What is the job that Kenny Gilliham has done this year. I mean, they got through some games without Scataboo,

which I think was amazing. It's so funny because I think back to the beginning of the year and like one of the biggest narratives and win total plays that I heard was Arizona State under, Arizona State under in conference play. I picked where they were. And they have been great. Levin's played great at quarterback. As I said, Scadaboo has been someone that a lot of people nationally are just finding out.

They have not had the best Big 12 schedule. They fortunately played a bunch of the bottom teams as well. But, hey, they are there. They control their dead. They beat BYU this week. And they're probably going to wind up in the Big 12 championship game. Hopefully against Colorado. I thought you were to ask me about the group of five teams because that's another.

hot and button topic that I've taken some incoming on. Like, I think Tulane is... Tulane, yeah. Tulane, I mean, with you, use and in Mensa, the young quarterback, who probably won't want to say probably won't be there, but I know he will probably be a very large transfer portal, NIL,

target. suspect target for a lot of people next year. Yeah. Summerall's defense is really, really good. They are a wagon. They are beating the hell out of people. They're off before they play Memphis. We know they're going to be in that AAC championship.

game against Army. I think they're better than Boise. I know a lot of people don't feel that way. What's Boise got left? Boise's got, what, Oregon State left on one of their games? And then they had, what's the, they have one other conference game before Oregon State. They got, Wyoming this week, Oregon State. And then, who know, everyone thought it was going to be a rematch with UNLV in the Mountain West Championship game. But Colorado State, undefeated. They're an underdog at Fresno, and then I think they have Utah State maybe in that final game. I can't remember who exactly it was, but it was. That's right. Yeah.

Like there's-selfishly, I want to see Ashton Genty against like Ohio State, you know? Yes. Oregon or whoever it turns out to be. And I think we all do. And again, that's another and another thing with the sport. It's like, how do you compare what Genty is done as a running back me he had a great game against Oregon, absolutely. But like the weekend, week out, like you're playing some of these defenses and some of these teams as opposed to what a Travis Hunter is doing on a weekend where what Cam Ward is doing having to carry that offense and that team on a week and week out basis in terms of the Heisman trophy. Genkees is going to be in New York because I think he's going to be listed on a bunch of these ballots.

But I think ultimately, I think we're looking at a situation where Colorado gets the Big 12 championship game. He wins. I think there's still like a legacy award situation for Dylan Gabriel. If Oregon winds up winning the Big Ten, and they go undefeated. I think Gabriel could get some votes of Hunter. It doesn't get there. And I think the other guy still to potentially keep an eye on is Jalen Miller.

I think if they beat Oklahoma, they win the SEC. Colorado loses a game here. Oregon loses a game here. You're looking quarterback of the SEC champion. So I think we're probably down to one of those three guys in terms. of the Heisman. Our friends. It's tough to imagine where Alabama would be without Milro.

I mean, he is that offense. Yeah, yeah, I mean, yeah. So, yeah. Our friends at Fanduel right now, it's, it's Travis Hunter minus 330. Wow. And Ginty is plus 340. He's lost some steam recently. Let's just be honest.

And nothing, nothing necessarily with what he's done, 159 this past week. But I think those huge numbers early on, the Oregon game, like, really propped him. up, but you can see it starting to fade. And then you're ready for this bear? The next highest is Cam Ward at plus 1,400. So if you think, I'm a, you're the one who makes all the money on this. You ready? Milrose plus 3,500.

Maybe get a little 30. See, in the state of Connecticut, I can't bet these highsman markets. What about when you're in Ohio this week? When I'm in Ohio this weekend or layover in Detroit, got to get some. Maybe I draw, maybe I make the drive up north on 91 and head across the Massachusetts border and sit in a, off the side of the road for a little while. Yeah. I'll get you a restaurant recommendation.

And by the way, like, for those listeners who think he's joking, like, don't put anything past my man. All right. We can't let you go without trying to win a little bit of money here, right? What? I don't, and I'm part of my ignorance here, but right now, are there like some early positions on the college football playoff? Like what can you play right now? Is there anything you're interested in terms of like national championship or how does it work? I haven't seen any, I mean, the make-miss stuff, I think is pretty much out there. And the prices right now, I think, are a little, a little too ridiculous. And like I said, unfortunately, I can't pull them up right now.

Yeah, because the geolocating wouldn't allow me to do that. I would, I don't, like, I don't know what the, like, I took a stab the other day when I was out of state at Indiana, no, a Texas no, just in case something ridiculous happens. I would bet Alabama maybe to win the SEC championship at plus money because I think if they were to get to the game, if they beat Auburn, they beat Oklahoma, I think that will be close to a pickham game in the SEC championship against Texas. and you probably not be able to be in a position where you could get off of that a little bit and guarantee a profit.

I would bet Tulane if there's a money line price or an odds to win the conference title against Army. I think Tulane is a really good play. What about this week? Any lines? I know it's early. You've got the injury reports and talking to people. But any lines jump out this week. Obviously, Ohio State, Indiana is the biggest game.

you'll be there for that with Big Noon kickoff. We're excited to see that. But any other games stand out to you at this early point? Yeah, I'm going to take Kansas plus the two and a half against Colorado, just because we've seen the way this Kansas team, the offense a couple weeks back against Iowa State, the defense last week against BYU played great. Jalen Daniels has played so much better over the last month of the season

than he did early on. And again, it was just a matter of time. talking about it last week with Joel Cloud. Like they were 0 and 5 in games decided by a touchdown less. And ultimately finally won't one last week. BYU would have been 4 and O. I worry about that Colorado offensive line. Seeing them in person, I mean, they're better than what they were last year,

but they still are not a great unit at all. And if Scher has to run around and isn't able to make some plays and throw some balls up to a wide receiver court that might not have a Jimmy Horn Jr. back as well that that could be a problem how cool is it by the way you're going to get you have the high's been favorite and potential heisman winner now playing on the NFL stadium at arrowhead where you got patricka homes and patrick prohams in the two-time yeah super bowl that's a pretty cool uh so subplot of i hadn't even thought about that to be honest yeah me neither great point and uh and i'm gonna play a irsuna state minus the three against b yu i think as u uh is for real

and I think BYU's bubble first last week. Right. I'm thumbing through some other stuff. I'll give you a minute to look. I don't think any, I've never mentioned this on the show before, but I'm kind of on a hot streak right now, man. Two weeks in a row, I've won our college. You won't shut up about it.

Nice. I've won the college football pool the last two weeks. But the last two weeks, man, the last two weeks, so we do a live show here. Everyone, please come and join us after the primetime game. We're live on you. tube. We started kind of mid-season. So just kind of catching our steam there. But we tape till like one in the morning, right? And so we have the pool and there's always the late-night

game. There's always the late-night game out of seven games we pick. So I'm done here. One a.m. I kind of just stumbled downstairs. I'm like done for the day, long day. And the last two weeks, what, like, what a joy. I've been against BYU the last two weeks. And it's been like, Remember two weeks ago, it was Utah. They wound up winning that game, but Utah covered. But it was the sack with the holding call at the goal line. And they drive down and they kick a field goal. They win, but I win too, right?

And then this past week, the most obvious outside of Georgia, which I pounded at the same game parlay, Georgia in the under, Mention was one of those suckers taking Tennessee in the points last week. But the other game that I loved was a lot of gambler. It's the Corso thing, man. And I go back to, he's brilliant. And he was way ahead of his time. Like, somebody knows something.

I'm going with the somebody's. How is this team with a losing record in Kansas only two and a half point dogs against an undefeated BYU team? And guess what? Somebody's one. Somebody's know something. I went back and looked and I even tweeted out last week with the database that I have. Since 1978, there were 66 games. where you had a team nine and over better against a team with the losing record.

Every single one of them, it was 66, was a double-digit favorite. And then you had BYU who was two and a half against the three and six. Like the housemakers knew. They know the power ratings. They know the differential and close games. They're not looking at the overall one loss record. They're looking at their power ratings. So they knew.

Two SEC home dogs for you. By the way, I'm going to take Oklahoma. Get your pet and paper out, people, if you're watching or listen. This is gold right here. Go ahead. I'm going to take Oklahoma against Alabama, 14-point home dog. I mean, Oklahoma is down hard, but last time we saw it. It doesn't seem high enough, right?

No. If I would have guessed, I would have like 20. Everyone's down on OU. They need one more win in their final two games to get bowl eligible. They got Bama at home. They go to LSU. They blew that game against Missouri last time they set foot on the field. people talking about Venables is he going to be back.

The defense, I think, is still pretty good. This would be just like Venables to make a four-quarter fight. I can see that. Exactly. I mean, the Ole Miss game was close to in Oxford for 2614. So, I mean, they covered a big number there. And then I hate myself for this because I don't think Auburn is very good at all. But I'm going to take Auburn getting points at home against A&M.

I wonder about the A&M running back injury was a massive loss for them. Huge. I think the Aggie's defensive line is good, but again, same thing. You got people pointing out UFrease's SEC record. What's the number in that game again? Two and a half, A&M minus two and a half. That's it? Number 15.

It stinks. Yeah, when it stinks, it's right. Right. And this is a night game. Yeah. Night game. offense got right in a sense against bad you all monroe lost a bunch of close SEC game i the line sticks so yeah give me a give me a give me o you and give me and give me auburn plus

the points all right i mean if you're out there watching or listening and we took we took a hard we took a hard swipe at fan duel i mean we're not trying to put them completely out of business because we need them write checks for this show but like you know let's make it a fair fight here Oklahoma plus 14, Auburn plus two and a half, and Kansas plus two and a half. I hope you're wrong on Canada. I think, like, I get your reasoning. I'm with you. It stinks, so it's probably right.

But how badly. Just like, no one's rooting for anyone here, disclaimer, all that. But like, how much fun would it be that the Big 12 representative is Shador, Travis, Coach Prime, Colorado, the run they've been on, right? And I don't want to, I don't want to take a swipe at Fandul either. but I took a swipe at him early in the year at Travis Hunter at 60 to want to win the Heisman. So I got that little digital stamp in the phone right now. Wow. I hope they wrote the check for the to sponsor this show.

Man, here's one of the stories like you don't believe that. You don't believe him. He's dead serious. So I was talking about. I was out in L.A. working the summer of soccer for Fox with the Euros and the, and Copa, I was out there for five, five and a half weeks. And out in California, you can't play.

But prior to leaving, I had got a great deposit bonus offer for Fannie. I sound like I'm promoting Fandle here, which I kind of did. They gave me a great deposit bonus offer. So I'm like, you know, I'm going to make this deposit off. And like, I'm so literally, I flew 9 a.m. from L.A.X. our flight L.A.X. Phoenix got out off the plane in Phoenix, literally walked 30 steps from the gate in Phoenix to the Delta Sky Club, sat in the Delta Sky Club for six hours or so. I think the flight was getting back to L.A. was like a three o'clock flight. So literally six hour session in the Sky Club watching whatever it was and making bets in there. I was a time where I bet Hunter, 60 to 1, I made a bunch of cross-bort parlias that wound up hitting capital. I basically was finishing up with the Vander Schoffley to win the Open Championship and that hit.

So I had some good stuff there. I had a couple of more that I made. It was worth it, huh? It was well worth it. Now I'm sitting on not on the Hunter ticket, but I'm also sitting on some cross-sports that are live to Ohio State and Georgia winning the national championship along with raving. chiefs, Eagles, bills, Niners to win the

Super Bowl. I am naked on the Lions. Oh, really? That worries me. I kind of felt like everything when I went right for the Lions last year, and I'm not one of those guys who likes to bet the trendy team or so. So I am naked on the Lions, so I'm going to be in a situation here where if the Bucks or Bulldogs wind up winning the college football

football championship. I'm going to be scrambling if the Lions get to the Super Bowl to be able to. So everyone in America wants the Lions to win the Super Bowl, who's not like a hardcore fan, except you? Correct. Mench. If I'm dead, if Oregon or Alabama, whomever else, it's over. International champ. But yeah, if we're sitting there like Lions versus Bills and how awesome would that be, by the way, if we get lying in the Super Bowl, like I will be all in and Josh Allen.

Yeah. Man, I've worked with his wonderful wife. His wonderful wife. To say that he's married to a saint is the understatement of the year. Yes. She's so funny because

I remember this, I remember that the Eagles Chief Super Bowl a couple years ago. And she can get a sense. Like she will always ask me before a big game. Like who are we rooting for? And sometimes I'll say, yeah, no one.

And like, in that instance, I was like, we're rooting for the chiefs. Oh, like, like, what is like, how much are we rooting for the chief? And I'm like, you know, the European vacation we want to. I was just going to say how does this affect vacation? So that's what you need to do, Todd. You need to put it in like, present it that way. Yeah, you want those new custom drapes for the last. living room. There you deal. What you want to

vacation? There you go. It has to be tangible stuff. It's an incentivizing program that we're on, you know? Exactly. I love this, man. You know how much I respect you, how much I appreciate you for everything over the years. We'll continue to bother you and have you come on this show, an absolute friend

of the show, the bear. Check them out. You know, you know where to find them, but Bear Betts on Spotify, the big noon kick coming up. Huge game this weekend with Indiana at Ohio State. And on Twitter, it's at Chris Falika, F-A-L-L-I-C-A, at Chris Felica. He got to check his notes every week.

I love Metsch. He's like, and I set out a tweet early in the year, like, if you're not reading this and you're a college football fan or a gambler, like, what are you doing? Like the notes, like the note he just gave with like, you know, whatever it was, 60-something, double-digit or 60-something teams that are 9-0 or better. Like, every week there's nuggets on every top game. It's something like makes you think and puts it in perspective. So check him out on on X as well. So I got a good one about Houston this week, potentially being shut out twice and

getting to a ballgame. Close us out with it. Well, no, you'll have to wait until. Oh, good. He's a pro. Pros, pro. Appreciate you, brother. Take care, guys.

Great talking to you. Thanks, man. Well, Medge, we promised it. So we got to deliver, right? Asked and answered. For now, we'll call that the segment. We've said all along we want to get everyone involved in the show. It's been a month.

We've finally got our kind of feet on the ground. secure it a little bit here. Some want know what we're doing, but I'm sure we'll continue to revise and hopefully get better over time. But we've got to get the audience more involved. I've said that from day one. This is going to be about engagement.

I can't be at stadiums anymore, engaging with fans at the NFL draft. We'll be there. We'll be there at the Senior Bowl. We'll be there at the Combine. There will be engagement there. But we've got to do it in this medium. And the way to do it for now

is to ask questions and to get questions on Twitter is where we started today. So I sent out a tweet. I sent out an ex post today. And we got a lot of great responses. We can't get to all of them. This is the first time we're doing asked and answered. But please keep the questions coming in.

I'll send reminders every week. And we want to get everyone more involved in the show. So here are a few that we got from this week's response to my post. First, and I love this handle, from Save Me Michael Pennix on X. What's going on there? He asked the question. You ready? He or she asked the question, I should say.

where would bow nix and michael pennix junior rank in the 2025 nfl draft class same tier as cam ward and shodore question mark what do you think uh i well i have shoddor in a different tier than cam ward at this point so and i think that if you're putting penicks you're putting him in that second tier with cam ward and i think carson back after that game has kind of moved himself back into that conversation so i would have the ward back um pennix conversation I'm not going to be the guy that says, oh, I actually really like Bownex now because I had questions about Bonix. He was a guy I thought was maybe more of a second round guy. I was surprised to see him go early. And obviously, he's played fairly well.

I mean, I haven't watched a ton of Bonix Broncos tape, but they're doing well. It was the perfect marriage with Sean Payton. The perfect marriage. We said it from the beginning. If that's where he lands, he's got a better shot there than probably the vast majority of any of the other places he could go. So he would be one tier underneath those guys with the queen ewers of the world in this class, in my opinion. And again, good for him. Well, let's remind everyone.

I mean, last year, the first three picks of the draft were Caleb Williams, number one, Jaden Daniels, number two, Drake May number three, obviously to the Bears, commanders, and patriots, respectively. Then the surprise pick, if we're being honest, of the entire first round, was Michael Pennix, Jr. Being drafted by the Falcons 8. then J.J. McCarthy, who wasn't mentioned in this in this ex question, that he goes 10 over all to the Vikings and has sat due to the injury. And then Bo Nix 12 to the Denver Broncos. So the way I looked at it was kind of a tier of its own with Caleb and Jaden, a second tier of Drake May, but always thought going back off the 2022 tape that he was kind of in that conversation, but let's call him his own tier.

And then I thought Pennix, JJ, Bo were kind of in that third tier, if you will. Okay. So to me, and I've said this from the beginning, I'm not starting the conversation at Caleb, Jaden, or Drake. I'm starting the conversation with that third tier of quarterback. So I would say Shadour, quite honestly, would the conversation would be between Pennix, J.J. and Bo. And if I'm just going back off of last year's, I,

I think Cam Ward maybe you'd have the conversation with Beau. Shadour probably more with Penickson and JJ from last year. Yeah. Okay. And Carson Beck, I'm just really excited to see what the rest of this season looks like from Carson Beck. Because what we're seeing the last couple of weeks is what we were hoping to see all season and it wasn't the case. But we're building towards something it feels like something really special or really good from Carson Beck down the stretch. And as I've said all along, Jalen Millrose, the absolute wildcard.

this group and we'll we'll handle that conversation as we go but really good question from save me michael pennix on x second question from dally fc on x what's the biggest trait you look for to know whether a quarterback will be successful at the end of the next level my goodness we can and we will have many a show on this exact topic right physical traits though let's start with this The more I'm in this business, the more I agree with parcels. And I think the goalpost is moving. But especially in today's transfer portal, NIL situation, with quarterbacks getting the opportunity and being paid for that opportunity to stay in college and make a lot of money and develop.

I like the number one thing for me before we even get into the traits is you got to play ball. More ball is better. Jaden Daniels is a perfect example. You can go to every single class. Like Jaden Daniels came in the league with, what was it, 56, Bo Nitz, 65, whatever the number starts, ridiculous numbers that we normally don't see because of the landscape of college football. So playing ball has become critical in the development of these quarterbacks. Very just succinctly or very simply, I think the two traits that are the most important,

not arm strength, not mobility. Those are very important in the evaluation. but if you don't have the mental makeup, the decision making, the instincts, the feel for the game, all the intangibles that go into this. If you don't have that, you're going to struggle at the next level. And if you don't have a certain level of accuracy, it has to be developed. And the thing that's been different in evaluating quarterbacks from Lamar Jackson to Josh Allen, even Cam Newton to a certain degree, like we've seen quarterbacks improve their accuracy. Jalen hurts.

We've seen them improve in the NFL. But with all of those guys, it better be accompanied. If the accuracy is not where it needs to be and it has to be improved in the NFL, it has to be accompanied. Not it better. It has to be accompanied with mobility. Right. That's what I've seen at least.

Yeah. It's a really, it's a great question, but it's a difficult question because there are really a cocktail of factors for every position. let alone quarterback, the most important position on the field. But I am with you. If you're asking me, you have to have, you know, it's a heightweight speed league. You used to tell me that all the time. You'd be like, man, it's a highweight speed league.

Because you do have these baselines for everything, right? But if you're starting with what's the most important, it's the mental makeup. And that's why it's at the top of our reports. I mean, we spent a lot of time going through those boxes and saying, you know, a lot of back and forth. Kevin Weidel was with us at the time. A lot of arguing, not uncommon for us as a group, going back and forth about it. And that's why mental makeup made it up top. I mean, that's the, that's your basis. And you, like, fans might be like, oh, so Oregon's dealing Gabriel's going to be a first round

pick because his mental makeup so good. No, he's mental makeup so good that it might, it might give him a chance to overcome some of the other weaknesses or concerns. You know what I mean? I do. Final question today. And we'll get to more as we go. Keep the questions coming. As I said, asked and answered is going to become a staple on this show. But from Anthony Brown on X. This is what I'm going to, I'm going to defer to you, Mitch. I've done enough talking today. How does this offensive line class compare to the last three offensive line classes? I think maybe the best way of saying this is on November 19th at this point in the process, and we have a lot of work left to do. I am concerned about this group. I mean, coming into the year,

I think there was three offensive. And I'm going to start with the offensive tackles because I think when you're talking about draft class, you're going to start with the office. offensive tackle. I agree. I think there was three coming into the year that people were excited about. Will Campbell out of LSU, Kelvin Banks Jr. out of Texas, and Emery Jones Jr. out of LSU. It has not gone well. And when I say it hasn't gone well, it hasn't been a complete disaster, but they have not played like, when you watch Joe Altz on tape, you were like, this guy is a lock for a top 10. And he's been a lock as a starting right tackle for the charges. Tackle class, it doesn't even come close to what we saw last year.

When you, I mean, there were guys like Tyler Guyton is getting drafted late in the, in the first round. And there were some concerns on Ted. He's a physical freak. That guy getting drafted late in the first round speaks to the depth of that class. So it's not even quote. It speaks to my theory of this is a height weight speed. Yeah, it definitely does.

So I don't, to be, to answer this question quickly, I guess before I get deeper into this, I don't think it compares as good as any of the last three. I think this is the weakest class we've seen in a long time. And again, we have a long time ago, but people are talking about Will Gamble potentially being a guard. And that was unthinkable

coming into the year. So I have a lot of concerns. I have a lot of work to do in that area, but right now, I mean, I like the guards, Donovan Jackson out of Ohio State, and especially Tyler Booker from Alabama, really good players. But if you're looking at it, if you're one of those guys, if your team needs an offensive line in the first round, we're looking for a tackle.

We're looking for a franchise tackle, not a really good guard. So I'm not very optimistic or excited about this group yet, but again, a lot can change. It was a good jumping off point. I'm glad we got to this today. We've had a jam-packed show. One more thing to get to, but a reminder, you can find me at McShay-13 on X. You can find Steve at Scouts Inc. M-M-M-C-H. And if you just send us questions, we'll get to as many as we can.

We'll keep doing this throughout the draft and beyond. One last thing, Munch, we just got breaking news a few minutes ago. And I debated whether to even touch on it today. We're not a breaking news show. It's not our thing. But we are a NFL draft heavy show. That's the emphasis here in a lot of ways. In addition to the breaking news, have very much.

with a GM being fired in the NFL. It's also a close personal friend of ours. And so, you know, always having to walk the tight rope, if you will, between professionalism and our friendship, in this case, especially with Joe Douglas for the New York Jets, has been fired. That news just broke. I mean, literally minutes ago, just broke. And I contemplated in my head as we're going through those questions,

whether to address it or not, I'll say this. We'll get more into it. it in future shows. We're back on Thursday. And we will absolutely have Joe on when he's ready to come on at some point because we want to talk to him, not even necessarily about the firing, but everything that he's been through, the challenges of being a GM, the exciting parts of being a GM, what are the next steps for Joe, one of the most beloved men in the NFL, truly. I'll say this. And I have not spoken to Joe today. Again, this just

broke a few minutes ago. There's no need for me as a close personal friend of Joe Douglas's to defend Joe Douglas. His work and his track record and his resume and the product he put on the field is defense enough. Okay. Joe will be just fine. Joe may Joe take a director of personnel job somewhere for a couple years and become a general manager after that. Joe may just be people in the league recognize Joe's ability. Joe's ability as a talent evaluator. Joe's ability as a leader of men, Joe's ability to run an organization, okay?

People also realize that Joe was in a very difficult position. So while Joe is going to be just fine, and I have no doubt about that, the Jets won't. The Jets won't be. And I've had to keep my mouth shut for a long time, six years, five and a half years now. Because he's in his fifth and a half year on a six year contract.

my same contract deal done my former employer the same exact time so i know the same exact timeline joe will be fine the jets won't and the reason i say that is woody johnson is among the worst owners in the national football league and if you don't believe me because i'm close friends with joe douglas believe bill bellichick and all the comments he's made and if you don't believe bill because of his acts that he has to grind with woody johnson and his history there then believe the product that's been put on the field. I'm telling you this. If the Jets can't win with Joe Douglas as the general manager

and with the talent that is on that roster, the Jets can't win, period. It's an ownership problem, folks. And I've kept my mouth shut for too long, and I won't get into a whole lot more today. I need to regroup and have conversations and kind of formulate my thoughts. But I think it's important just my initial reaction that, it's an ownership problem.

And there are certain decisions that are just made that doesn't matter what the general manager wants. There are certain decisions that are just made that you got to get on board with it because one person pays the checks and one person oversees the whole thing. And so if you're a Jets fan, you know exactly what I'm talking about. This is not news to you. And I feel bad for Jets fans because they legitimately, the organization legitimately put the people in position, put the,

the staff in position, put the general manager and the scouts, the guys that have, I'm not worried about Joe. I do feel for a lot of members on that staff that you and I are friends with. And I know that they're all going to be just fine and they'll find landing spots. And the good news is in this league. If you're a good scout and you do your job and if you're a good college director or personnel director, you're going to find other landing spots. Everyone's going to be just fine.

but I do feel badly for all the the collateral damage here. But I also know, and I also feel badly, truly, because we're friends and we look out and we care about all the fan bases in the National Football League because it's our lifeline, right? Yeah. I feel badly for Jets fans because if it wasn't going to work with this regime

with that talent on the field, I just, I don't see a, I don't see much of a future in terms of where it's going to be. And I don't know how you, you know, ownership is not going to change for a while, is my guess. So how do you overcome this? And the answer is you probably don't. Right.

I mean, look, coming into the year, they're such high expectations. And now all of a sudden it's, I mean, you look at that roster. I thought that was a roster that can compete for a Super Bowl. Now all of a sudden it's Joe's fault that they're not playing well and they haven't been able to come together. It's just. Well, it's always everybody else's fault with Woody Johnson. Right.

Let's fire the head coach. and it's not getting able to bring it. They were lucky to get him. Like, not to get into this too much, but like they were lucky to get him in the first place. Like, and I mean that. Like the Juts were, the Jets were lucky to get Joe Douglas.

Joe Douglas had options. And he had options because he's so freaking good at what he does. And he learned under one of the best, arguably the best to ever do it in Ozzie Newsom in Baltimore. And he went to Philadelphia and they won a Super Bowl there. Like this Joe Douglas, forget the fact that we played college football with him at Richmond. We've known him for 25, 27 years.

Just focus on the resume where he's been. The Super Bowl championships with Baltimore, learning under the best to ever do it. Now, Eric DeCosta, what he's doing with the Ravens, year in and year out. Well, his bosses there were Eric DeCosta, and most importantly, Ozzie Newsom, right? So he knows what he's doing.

Goes to Philadelphia, personnel director, whatever his exact title was there. Yeah. What do they go do? Same thing. When a Super Bowl. Hoy. the Lombard. My man knows what he's doing, okay?

Right. And so we'll leave it at that. Yeah. Yeah. We'll leave it at that. And we, hey, we knew this was coming. And quite frankly, I'm not going to speak for Joe. I have not spoken to Joe about this yet. Like, I don't know that he wants to see everything through. And he, and he was damned and determined and put every ounce, like the conversations I've had with every ounce of his fucking life into this, right? Doing it the right way, the way that he was brought up in this league, doing it the way Ozzy would do it, doing it with his touch on things. Like he put everything into this.

And again, he's going to be just fine. But, and I know that like this is not the result he was looking for. But I also know after six, and this is not from Joe's mouth. This is my, this is me. This is Todd McShay talking. After six years of trying to do all the right things and doing it the way he knows the Super Bowl can be won and to have this as the result and to have the interference. my guess is I don't want to say it's a relief but my guess is it's like all right now I don't no one

ever wants to get fired but let's start looking towards some doing this somewhere else where we have a chance yeah I hope he takes a break man I'll be regroups a little he's earned it yeah he'll be just fine all right didn't expect to get to that but we did and I'm glad we touched on it and we appreciate everyone listening watching joining the show again spread the word man we're just we're a little engine that could. We're trying to make this thing run. And we appreciate everyone who's listening, who's downloading, subscribing, liking, and mention it to, you know, passing the word along. And we will be back with you on Thursday. See it. Munch. See it. Must be 21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino,

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