The McShay Show - Mickey Loomis: Saints EVP & GM | The Decision Maker Series

Episode Date: February 11, 2026

Todd and Muench sit down with the Saints' executive vice president and general manager, Mickey Loomis, to talk about his draft strategy, his process for collaborating with his coaching staff, "always trading up," and much more! 0:00 Welcome to The McShay Show! 0:30 Saints EVP & General Manager Mickey Loomis joins the show 3:20 Collaborating with the coaching staff 4:45 Behind the scenes of the Saints drafting Tyler Shough 9:45 Mickey Loomis' style of roster building 13:15 The importance of prospect measurables 15:15 Saints success on drafting running backs 17:25 How evaluating has evolved during Mickey's tenure 23:50 Building out the Saints draft board 26:10 Saints food spread on draft weekend Learn more and join the waitlist at ScoutMotors.com The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Host: Todd McShay Guests: Steve Muench and Mickey Loomis Producers: Tucker Tashjian, Conor Nevins, and Daniel Comer Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Welcome into the McShay Show. We have the decision makers series that we're going to continue today. We're very fortunate to have Mickey Loomis with us from New Orleans Saints. How are you doing, man? I'm doing great. We're doing this because I've always felt like one of the missing components in covering football has been kind of the decision makers, right? We talked to head coaches and the players, and there's all. But I think there's a lack of information about the actual process.

Man, we're excited about this new partnership. this episode is presented by Scout Motors. Every new year, we do a lot of forward thinking and planning for what's to come. Just like the all-new Scout Terra and Scout Traveler, they're being revamped for what comes next, taking that classic 70s design and improving it with modern engineering, including plans for advanced four-wheel drive. So look ahead.

Join the wait list at Scout Motors.com, just like I just did. Concept vehicles, not available for sale, features and performance. specifications are preliminary and subject to change. Joining the wait list does not guarantee purchase. Visit scout motors.com for details. I wanted to start here with you, Mickey.

Tyler Shuck is a unique prospect in that he felt like he was in college for a couple decades, right? So he might be a little different than a quarterback who came out with three or four years. But just for, we have a lot of avid fans and fans who love the game of football, but maybe don't know the intricacies of the scouting process. When's the first report? Like if you went into the state system right now and look back, like how many years, when was the first report

and kind of walk us through how that escalates as you get closer to the draft? Yeah, that's, I'm probably not going to be as precise, but it's probably three years ago. Right. You know, because obviously they're eligible after, you know, three years out from high school. And, you know, Tyler started Oregon. And so we're familiar with him there, familiar with him at Texas Tech.

And then obviously, as last year at Louisville, but probably about three years ago. And I remember talking about Tyler a year before, two years ago. And one of our scouts said, hey, this guy's going to be under the radar because he's, you know, been hurt. This was before he went to Louisville. So he hadn't had a long string of starts and success without being injured. And so one of our scouts kind of felt like, hey, we might get a steal here. As an undrafted free agent or late. Right, right.

And then he went to Louisville, had a great season, and obviously climbed up the draft boards, and we were fortunate to get him. I'm curious too. So you hire a head coach who played the quarterback position, coached quarterback specifically, offensive coordinator, the collaboration process, right? Because at the end of the day, it's your decision and you have a scouting staff that you rely on and trust that you've put those individuals in place and you believe in your process. How does the collaboration work? Because you don't want to draft a quarterback, especially, that maybe the new coach is not in line with,

but you also want to make sure you stay true to your process. How does that work for fans that are kind of curious behind the scenes? Well, you know, I think every place is a little different. I would say this, is that I would never bring a player in that our coaching staff didn't want. So we're going to work out any, you know, disagreements or any little things that. that might bother them or bother us.

We're gonna get that worked out long before we make a pick. It was true with Jim Haslett when I started. He was our head coach. You know, Sean Payton was our head coach for a long time, Dennis Allen. It's been the same process for us always. I believe in getting our coaches involved. I believe in getting their opinions.

You know, we want our coaching staff to have skin in the game for any player that we bring in because we're gonna rely on our coaching staff to develop those players. And so, if they've got an investment in time and a positive opinion, then I think that's going to benefit us in the long run. When did you know that Chuck was the pick?

And did you feel any pressure? Do you even have to go up and get him or he wasn't going to be there? Well, you always feel pressure to go get someone. And look, I've got a history. Our team has a history of moving up and very seldom moving back. You're not afraid of being aggressive. No, because I just feel like, why would I want to go back? can get a lesser player if you believe in your board, right?

That's the principle behind that. But I do understand moving back and collecting more picks and taking more shots. So I understand that process. But for us, it's always been, man, we fall in love with somebody and we're going to go get him, make sure we get him. That was just a matter of, you know,

you make these assessments of whether he's going to be available because you want value for the pick too. You definitely want to. want the player, but you also want to manage your draft and use your assets accordingly. And so, yes, there was pressure because we all liked him. And so we had to wait a while. Yeah, I mean, if you- Forty-four, is that what it was?

Yeah, yeah. And if you move up, maybe you don't get a Quincy Riley later on. Right. That's the thing, right? Right. That's exactly right. Yeah. 40?

Excuse me. Yeah. Sorry, it must have been a long. It must have been a long wait. Yeah, it was a wait. And look, we had some. guys in our in our room that they were kind of you know maybe we should go up and get them and and you know there was some discussion about about whether that made sense for us and

how much do you look at the board too like these teams don't need a quarterback yeah yeah you're paying attention to that and you know now with technology we have all these mock draft simulators and you know we run through 150 of though you can run just like this you know and so we run 150 or 200 scenarios and there's only like one or two where you know he's taken in front of our pick and so there's always a snake in the weeds yeah that influences you but here's the deal you know GMs are not simulators right right and a lot of them are really good at keeping uh keeping their decisions close to the vest so um that it worked out then organizationally right we've seen so many different ways to to make it work and

that he's, Shuck isn't a top 15 pick, like a Mahomes or Josh Allen or a Drake May. But how, you bring him. I think if you remember right when Mahomes got taken, I don't think a lot of people had him in the top 15. No. No. You know, he was going to be farther down the line, probably closer to the 20s. And, you know, Kansas City had a conviction. Yeah.

I think Arizona was who they thought was going to take him. trade in front of us and they took they took Pat right so but but then you bring in Tyler as the 40th overall pick and organizationally it's so important then to support him properly and make sure you know you don't throw him into the fire too early but he's also he's not the youngest prospect to come out what what were those conversations like after you draft him knowing your situation with you and Kellan talking about how are we going to support him best yeah well I think in a perfect world, you take a young quarterback and you let them get acclimated and you let them sit and follow somebody else and develop.

I think history has shown that that's been the best method. I mean, a lot of these guys that have had a lot of success, you know, Tom Brady sat for a year. Aaron Rogers sat for, what, three years, Jordan Love. Patrick's sat for a year. Patrick sat for a year. A lot of them sat for a good amount of time. And, you know, on occasion, there's a guy that or two that, you know, start early and have some success early. But history shows that it's just better to get acclimated and understand the league, be able to take a deep breath.

There's a lot of pressure on these guys at that position. And so in a perfect world, we wanted to, you know, give him time to do that. Now, you know, Derry Carr retired, so we were in a little bit different circumstance. but we had Spencer like a lot of things that Spencer did, so we had the luxury of kind of letting that play out in training camp, and we won't with Spencer. And look, he did a lot of really good things. But it got to the point where, okay, let's see what Tyler can do,

and he's an older quarterback with a lot of starts in college, a lot of play, and so a lot of maturity. It's a little bit different circumstance with him because of the amount. amount of time he spent in college and it worked out. He had a great run of the last nine games. But I think that not starting at the beginning of the season was really valuable for him. Last one for me on Chuck.

So I've done a lot of research in the last several years on when you get your quarterback, which is the hardest thing you're doing this thing, right? And so now you feel like you've got your guy. What do organizations do that have been successful next year in the draft specifically. A lot of times we've seen a shift to, you would think, right? Like, let's get them a running back.

Let's get some wide receivers. You know, but a lot of organizations that have had success and it surprised me when I did the study, they kind of went heavy defense in the next draft. I'm not looking for you to give me answers on what you guys are going to do. I'm just saying, have you kind of looked at what's the best way to support them and what's our approach or is it just stay true to our board and, you know? Well, let me give you a long answer. for that one.

Okay. So I was hired in 1983 by Seattle Seahawks. Our general manager was Mike McCormick. Mike McCormick later became the president of the Carolina Panthers as an expansion team. But before he was the general manager of the Seahawks, he was a head coach of the Baltimore Colts. Okay. And before that, he was the head coach of the Philadelphia Eagles. And before that, he was a tackle, offensive tackle for the Cleveland.

Browns and in 1984 he was elected to the Hall of Fame as a right tackle as a tackle. Great player. So I say that because that's who I learned a lot about this game and about rosters and how to build a game and how to build a team and what can be successful. It comes from him. It comes from an offensive lineman. So you know what I'm going to say next, right? He's an offensive lineman.

He would say, Mike would say, and we would all say, hey, the most important position on any team is a quarterback. We all would agree with that. But he would say the most important room is the offensive line. Because if they can't function at a high level, then it doesn't matter how good your quarterback is because he won't be able to function. And I think the culture of most teams begins with the offensive line because they've got to be smart. They've got to be tough. They've got to be selfless. Great teammates. See something, say something. type of guys. And so that's why you'll see the history of our organization, since I've been the GM, we've drafted a lot of offensive linemen high. It's important to get that room right,

and we're building that room, right? We've got first round picks that left tackle and right the last two years. We've got a center that was a second round pick and a right guard that was a first round pick. And look, we've had some other guys, some worked out, some didn't. But we've got to get that room right to begin with. And that way, Tyler can develop. He can take time. You know, young quarterbacks are going to take too many sacks. They're going to hold on to it too long.

There's no different than that. But you know what that means? That means you off as if you've lost defensive linemen have to hold your blocks a little bit longer. You get a because you've got a young quarterback back here, you know. And so we're going to get that room right. We've got to play well there. And then we've got to be able to have a run game. and then obviously have a good defense.

And, you know, we played good defense last year. I thought our coaches did a great job, particularly after Chase Young came back, week five. You know, we had a real good defense from that point on. And so we got to build on that as well. At the risk of making Todd angry because he said just yesterday he's done talking about this. But it's been a big subject, especially with the tackles last year,

arm length, 34-inch arms. Everyone's supposed to have 34-inch arms to play tackle. You've had success drafting guys with shorter arms. I mean, Ryan Ramchak was one of my favorite prospects coming out of college. Kelvin Banks last year, you know, sub-34-inch arms. We talk about it in a way of, does it show up on tape? Is that, are there certain numbers or measurables? I'm specifically, I guess, with the offense tackles that you look at and say,

this is something we need to dig into? Or you're just tape-based, character-based? Well, look, the thing about measurables and not just measurables, but all the drill work, all the things that we time and test, they're important because we know that there's a range that 95% of our league is going to fall within, right, at any position. And, you know, I tell our guys all the time, we're not looking for exceptions because if we keep finding exceptions, we're eventually getting fired because it's not going to, there are exceptions for a reason. So we're not looking for exceptions. And yet you've got to look at the whole body of work. And, hey, a really good player is a really good player. And I would say that, again, we're not looking for exceptions that we want to have guys with, you know, 35-inch arms and the perfect measurables.

But they don't all have that. And, you know, another factor is, hey, what's the scheme that you're running? And sometimes the athleticism is more important than the arm length. Sometimes the ass and mass is more important than the speed or whatever it is that you're measuring. So I would say that those guys fit all the measurables except that one in those cases. Yes, I would agree. Is there one other one I can ask you about is the history of the Saints drafting running backs? Yeah.

And that's another thing you hear. You don't draft to running back so early. You weren't, I don't think you were the GM yet, but you were a part of the organization when the Saints drafted Deuce McAllister in the first round. Yeah, that was Randy Mueller was a GM. I worked for Randy. Randy and I were there together.

We had Ricky Williams at the time. And just that was, look, that specifically was, Deuce was a player that we had ranked in the top five players in the draft that year. And we're picking 21, I think it was, maybe 22. to right in that vicinity. I was like, you just can't pass this guy up.

I know we got Ricky Williams, but we can't pass this guy up. And so Randy made that decision, and it was a good one. I mean, Deuce, and, you know, Deuce is a good friend of mine now.

Oh, really? Yeah, my son actually played basketball together at the high school. Oh, that's great. That they go to. But he was a big, fast, and he's a pump return of the first year for crying out loud at his size.

There's 230 pounds around that, yeah. As I recall, he led the league in 20-plus-yard runs for the first few years of his career. And then he had a knee injury and his career was cut short by some injuries. But great back. We drafted Mark Ingram in the first round. And that was a good pick for us. Alvin, we were lucky enough to get in the third round. Early third, though.

I think people look at that and say third. I think the third pick of the third round. He was a guy that we liked a lot. You know, Sean fell in love with Alvin as... For good reason. Yeah, I mean, you can see why. Yeah, he fell in love with him when he went and, you know, Sean went to his, I think we had a private workout with a bunch of guys from Tennessee that year.

And Sean came back in love with Alvin because of his brain, because of how smart he was and the things that he could do. So, but yeah, we haven't... That's the offensive line. We've had a lot in the first round. Running back, not so much. I'm going to move this closer because we have a culture convention that just broke out in the middle of the... I'm curious, because you've been doing this for a minute, and you've had a lot of success.

I actually tried to reach out to some people who have worked for you, and I was trying to dig up some dirt and some things. There's some out there, I'm sure. You know, but honestly, everyone just thoroughly looks back on their time working with you and really appreciates how you've done it. I'm curious this with technology and the game changing and everything that's gone on when you look back to where you were. when you first got your, the GMJJF 2002, I think? Yes. Okay. To where we are now in 2026.

How have you evolved? Oh, good question. I don't know. I probably can't answer that. I'm sure there's a group of people who say I haven't evolved. But it's a good question. You know, obviously we have a lot more data available to us. So we try to take advantage of that.

but it's always just a tool in the toolbox. You know, I say, look, we have really good evaluators in our building. You have really great coaches in the league. And so we've got to trust what these people are expert at. And yet, the data that's available to us can either confirm or contradict, you know, what I see. And so if it confirms it, great. And if it contradicts it, well, let's dig a little deeper. and that's the way we treat it.

So I'd say that's one of the areas that has changed. I still think it's blocking, it's tackling, it's fundamental stuff. And look, it's harder for, I think it's harder for college coaches now to coach because the transfer portals and the things that these players have to go through now at the college level. So we probably need to spend more time on some of the fundamental things that we believe in because the game's a little different when it gets to the NFL as opposed to college game. And look, I think college coaches do a great job.

So this isn't anything against any of that. It's just our game's a little different. So we have to spend a little more time recognizing. And it's different for every player, right? What can they do? What do they do well? what are we going to ask them to do and how can we get them to do it better? And yeah, but that doesn't answer your question.

No, no, it does. It does. Because I think sometimes with all that change, some people can get away from their roots and get away from, like, at the end of the day, what's important. I think it's important to have a firm anchor with what you believe in and what you do while still utilizing what's coming along. There's only 32 of you in the world. It fascinates me, right? And how hard did it, like you look around the senior bowl, or we get to the Combine, and how many scouts,

how many coaches, how many people that are aspiring to be in the seat that you're in? And there's something special about that, right? If you were to look back and talk to your younger self, 20, 25 years old, right? Yeah. And give yourself some advice. Now that you've been through all these wars,

what would you tell that young, young man. Well, let me go to the other direction first. Okay. So, hey, when I'm 12 years old, I think I'm going to be a wide receiver for the Green Bay Packers, right? When I'm 16 years old, I think that I'm going to be a, I'm going to be the shortstop for the San Francisco, you know, giants. And then when I'm 20, I think I'm going to be a point guard in the NBA. Yeah.

And then when I'm 22, I recognize that I'm not going to do any of that. So here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to be a basketball coach and an AD at a small college. That was what I intended on doing. And so I say that because my 12-year-old self, my 16-year-old self, my 20-year-old self would all look at me today and say, you're a miserable failure. You ruined our life. Right. Look, I've been fortunate. You know, I've been in the league 41 years.

You know, yes, you aspire to become a GM when you're, you know, an executive in our league. But it's, you know, it's a lot of luck. You know, you've got to be in the right place at the right time. Things have to happen for you to get one of these jobs because, as you said, there's so few of them. And I love doing it because I love the people. You know, the work's great, but I just love the people that are in the NFL. They're high achievers. They're smart.

They're great people, great teammates, you know, scouts. Everyone's passionate about their job in our league. That's, you know, it's a great thing about it. We choose to do this. You know, I didn't choose to be here because I thought I was going to make a bunch of money. In fact, I thought, I can make a lot more money doing lots of other things. You know, I'm a pretty smart guy. And yet, you know, we make a good living now.

If you get to be a GM, you're going to make a really good living. And a lot of these positions in our league now, because of the growth of the league. When I started, there was 40 guys in the whole office, right? Now we've got 300, you know, so it's crazy. And we've got, you know, in our situation, we've got a basketball team as well. So it's, that's. you know, the magnitude of everything has changed dramatically. But it's still part of, hey, I wanted to be involved in team sports because I love the competition.

I love having a result on, you know, after game day, and I can say, look, we won or lost. And you're going to feel really low, as you guys know, you feel really low when you lose. But you're not going to feel high with the wins if you don't have the lows. And so that's fine. You know, it's part of the deal and get your blood going and keeps me going. I'm 69 years old. And, man, I have energy and I'm excited about going to work every day still. So I didn't answer your question, did I?

No, it's amazing. It's perfect. Two more, okay? And then we'll let you go. I know we've got a busy day here. I want to ask, we've had several different GMs and I'm kind of asking, because I think there's, for whatever reason, people are really intrigued, because we have 400 players that we wind up whittling it down to from like 1,300, you know, throughout the process.

I'm told, and maybe I'm wrong, I'm told your board at the end of the day, like when we get there for draft weekend, your board is maybe a little bit small or more condensed than some other teams? Is that true? How big is your board typically? And what's the process behind that? Yeah. It's a lot less than the, what is it, 276 picks? How many picks are there?

276? It's 250s. I think two-fifths. depending on how it's supplemental and all that, yeah. Yeah, so we have a lot less than that on our board. And Jeff Ireland, who's our colleague scouting director, this is a lot of his system as well as a blend of what we believed before he got there and what we've collaborated on since.

He's got a formula that you've got to have this many people on your board in the first round. You have to have this, you have to have this many for your next pick, and the formula has never failed. It gets a little nerve-wracking. I was going to say, you know, later in the draft at times and there's only like two or three names up there that it's a little nerve-wracking, but they've always been available.

So, yeah, because we're trying to get it down. These are the guys that we want. And the rest of it just kind of becomes clutter. Not clutter, that's not the right word, but you get the gist of what I'm saying. These are the guys, right? These are the guys that fit what we want to do. They fit the profile of what we want to bring into the locker room. And these are the guys we want.

And that's why we trade up, not they're back, generally speaking. Yeah. All right. Last one. And we've had Eric DeCosta, Howie Roseman, Nick Casario, all wonderful. You know, the time we spent with them was wonderful. But they absolutely have failed us to this point. I'm hoping that you don't.

You're in New Orleans. Those guys are all really top flight GMs too. Wonderful, but they failed us in this area. Yeah. I haven't gotten a great story about the spread for draft weekend. And you're in New Orleans. You haven't appreciated. We talked about Koshan before you came on.

Butcher we just went to the other day. It was amazing. I think you have an appreciation for good food. What's the spread? Who's in charge of it? What's it look like? How important is that to you? Because that would be a really, it would be high on my,

That's why I'm not a general manager, but that would be really high on my priority list. Yeah, well, I see Jeff Ireland over here. He's kind of taken over responsibility for the spread at the draft. Jeff, come over here. Come on, Jeff. Jeff, come on over here. But I would say this. The one thing that we have that's really unique is...

We're talking about the spread for draft weekend, the food. Food. The catering. Yeah. We generally have... We'll have a sushi day. Definitely a sushi day. Oh, I don't see.

Here we go. Yeah. Yeah, and with, who's doing that for us? Rockensaki still, yeah, Rockensaki. Shameless plug there. And we'll have another shameless plug because we'll have Drago's for the oysters, charbroil oysters. Yeah, this is by far the best bread.

Yeah, and then we'll have just a variety of norms. Little Tex-Mex, of course. That's my background. Yep, Jeff. Yeah. So, yeah, we're not wanting for calories. Because here's the, as you know, you guys know, there's a lot of sitting around during the draft.

What do you do? Nervous eating. Yes. Yeah, there's a lot of eating. So you guys care. Some thought is put into this. Oh, yeah. See how we see, see Eric, see Nick.

Like this is the answer I was looking for. I appreciate it. So we didn't get more time with you, but we're going to wrap up and let everyone get to get out to practice and meeting. So this has been wonderful. Yeah, great time. Thank you. Thank you so much. Appreciate it.

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